Front Burner - Supreme Court changes ‘tear the fabric’ of Israel

Episode Date: July 28, 2023

Despite months of mass protests, Israel’s far-right government pushed through a law weakening the country’s Supreme Court on Monday. Under it, the Court is no longer able to strike down some government decisions. Fears over the effect this and other planned changes could have on Israel’s democracy have driven hundreds of thousands of demonstrators to the streets, and a growing number of military reservists are refusing to report for active duty. Allison Kaplan Sommer is a journalist at Haaretz and host of Haaretz Weekly podcast. Today, she discusses where Israel goes from here, whether the country has fundamentally changed, and what this all means for Palestinians. For transcripts of this series, please visit: https://www.cbc.ca/radio/frontburner/transcripts

In the Dragon's Den, a simple pitch can lead to a life-changing connection. Watch new episodes of Dragon's Den free on CBC Gem. Brought to you in part by National Angel Capital Organization, empowering Canada's entrepreneurs through angel investment and industry connections. This is a CBC Podcast. Hey everyone, Tamara here. So before we begin, I just want to let you know that we've started putting the show on YouTube every day. Lots of people are listening to podcasts there, so it just made sense. You'll still be able to find us on all the podcast apps, but if you want to listen on YouTube, just search for the CBC Podcast channel and hit subscribe. You can also find Commotion there,

the arts and culture podcast hosted by friend of the show Elamin Abdelmahmoud. Okay, that's it. Hope you like today's episode. That is Israel's opposition chanting shame. Walking out of parliament on Monday after the passage of an incredibly controversial law weakening the Supreme Court's ability to strike down government decisions. Led by Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, the country's far-right government pushed ahead with the vote, despite months of protests against the bill

that saw tens of thousands of demonstrators march from Tel Aviv to West Jerusalem. This march, this mobilization to Jerusalem, to West Jerusalem is a historical moment. Demonstrators blocked a road leading to parliament. Doctors went on strike, malls and gas stations shut down. And since the law passed, protesters have vowed to keep going, while a growing number of Israeli army reservists are refusing to report for active duty. I came here today to sign, to convey the message that I will not serve the dictator. I will not serve in a dictatorship. Alison Kaplan-Summer is a journalist at Haaretz

and host of the Haaretz Weekly podcast. She's in Tel Aviv, and she joins me now to talk about where Israel goes from here, if the country has fundamentally changed, and what this all means for Palestinians. Hi, Alison. Thank you so much for doing this. Thanks so much for having me. So, Alison, there was so much resistance in the lead up to this vote,

months of demonstrations, which I know are still continuing. And for them, how does it feel in Israel right now, now that the law has been changed? Well, it's been very disheartening. You have to remember, these are people, some of whom, you know, gave up their lives and many, had their lives interfered with. Imagine demonstrating for seven months every single Saturday night and not having a Saturday night to yourself. Sometimes demonstrations were two times a week, three times a week. They really put their heart and soul into this fight. I'm so, so sad. I'm here for three days protesting and do everything I can. I sleep in a tent and I'm, my heart is broken. I really feel that, I don't know, I feel my future is lost. I feel my kid's future is lost.

I feel... So on one hand, they're very bitter and angry and discouraged that this law, which is knocking down the reasonableness clause, was passed by the Knesset. On the other hand, when they step back and put it in perspective, it could have been much worse. You have to look back on the series of events. The government introduced this package

of reforms, as they call them, the legal overhaul, at the beginning of the year, early January, and expected for all of these laws to be passed by April. But only one of that whole package of laws has been passed, and it's not even one of the key pieces of legislation that was a sort of a victory for this protest movement so um while they're discouraged they they also see that they have made a change and that things would be much much much much worse if they hadn't done what they had done i'm i'm hopeful because you know you see the beauty of this country and after many years where we were kind of seeing that things are going in a wrong direction, but feeling that maybe we are the only one who feels this way.

And where is everybody? All of a sudden you see that, oh, my God, here is everybody. They are all here. So obviously that perspective isn't shared by everybody. For people who support the law, it's seen as what was needed to reign in the courts. So for Israel's nationalist right, this was a big win, right? What's being said on that side of the political spectrum? Well, it was a partial win. And indeed, you know, the leaders pushing this legislation, they celebrated in the Knesset when the law was passed, they took selfies.

But, you know, those are the leaders and those are the most extreme forces. Honestly, on the right, among the non-extremists and the Israeli public more or less votes right wing, there is still a lot of worry about the terrible division and strife and chaos that this decision to watch this judicial overhaul has caused, how it's going to hurt the country economically and in the security arena. If you look at the polls, many, many voters on the right don't believe that this is what they signed up for when they voted on the right wing. So while there is jubilation that they did get a piece of this overhaul passed, I think there's a lot of hesitation as to whether or not to forge ahead with the rest of the plan to undermine the judiciary and take away its power. And maybe if you could remind us, how was this law sold to the public and how has the government justified it? The law was sold to the public on a couple of levels, essentially. And this is not new. This is something that a portion of the Israeli political leadership has been

arguing for a long time, in that there are elites that are controlling the agenda, that are keeping Israel steering in a center-to-center-left direction, and they include the media, the civil service, and the judiciary. The judiciary in its rulings, which often, you know, over and over again overturns decisions by the Knesset saying that they violate human rights, that they violate principles of equality, that they are undermining pure democracy in Israel, that they are reversing things that the elected representatives of the Israeli people want and want to happen. And they argue that in order for true democracy to exist in Israel, the courts need to have this power taken away from them so that the prime minister and the legislature can do what they want.

Obviously, the other side of the political map doesn't see it that way, believes in checks and balances and believes that a strong judiciary is necessary in order to maintain a liberal democracy. So you've talked about the kind of power that this gives the Israeli government, but I wonder if we could spend some time talking about what they plan to do with it. And the idea that this is about Netanyahu trying to avoid going to prison, that's come up a lot. But there are also people who say the primary motivation behind getting these judicial reforms through is it's about making it easier to expand settlements and possibly annex and control the occupied Palestinian territories. What evidence is there of that? Well, the coalition is made up of three primary elements.

One is the Likud party led by Netanyahu, which is serving Netanyahu's interests. The other is far-right extreme parties dominated by settlers, the Otzma Yudit party, the leaders of which are Bitzalel Smotrich and Itamar Ben-Gavir, and ultra-Orthodox parties. That is the coalition. All three of these elements want to weaken the judiciary for their own reasons. Netanyahu presumably wants to do it in order to increase his chances of beating the charges of bribery and breach of trust that he's on trial for. If convicted, Netanyahu could face years in prison. He's charged with fraud, bribery and breach of trust.

Accused of receiving expensive gifts, including cigars and champagne, in exchange for favors. And for helping a media company so it would publish favorable news stories about him. Now remember that a key part of this judicial overhaul package is to control the committee that appoints justices. The justices that they appoint will presumably one day be hearing appeals in his case. So there's a clear self-interest there. The far-right Osmayoudi party makes no secret of the fact that they want to regularize Israeli control of the West Bank to be able to essentially annex it, pass laws that make it part of Israel and erase the distinction between inside the Green Line and outside the Green Line.

The court would presumably stand in the way of that. So that's their interest. And the ultra-Orthodox parties want official exemption from the army for people who study in yeshivas. They want to get their population exempt from military service. And again and again, the courts have stood in the way of that. And they also want changes in the laws that would make Israel more of a religious state. And a lot of these religious laws essentially discriminate on the basis of religion and discriminate on the basis of gender, which, again, the courts have a history of stepping in and saying you can't pass that law because it's discriminatory. So all of these elements of the coalition have their own reasons for wanting this overhaul to happen and wanting the judiciary to be weak.

My understanding is that the occupation, it hasn't been a big part of the conversation in these protests, and they've been criticized for not having a position on the occupation. Can you just talk to me a bit about that and why has that been the case? Well, there's a tension inside this protest movement against the judicial overhaul. inside this protest movement against the judicial overhaul. On one hand, if this overhaul was passed, the first people to be harmed would be Palestinians, would be asylum seekers, would be the weakest parts of society who are not well represented in the Knesset, who are not represented by the government. So it is definitely in the interest of Palestinians and Palestinian citizens of Israel to fight this overhaul. On the other hand, they have been actively discouraged from being public and prominent in terms of mixing the fight

for Palestinian rights and the fight against the judicial overhaul because the leaders of the protest movement want it to have as wide an appeal as possible. And you can't change facts. The Israeli electorate is leaning right, center and center right. And if you want to make an appeal to people who are on the right in order to join the fight against the judicial overhaul, you don't want it painted as a pro-Palestinian movement. You don't want Palestinian flags at your protests. And I would just add to that the fact that this battle against the overhaul is a battle to preserve the status quo. So if you're an oppressed group like Palestinians or Palestinian citizens of Israel, you look at today's reality and you say, the status quo isn't

so wonderful. Why would I want to fight for things to stay exactly the way they are? what I want to fight for, things to stay exactly the way they are. So let's talk about this idea on Israel's far right that the Supreme Court has been a hurdle for the government in this regard and that it needs to be neutralized. Is there evidence that the Supreme Court has historically favored Palestinians? Actually not. The Supreme Court has been extremely conservative in deciding when to step in and overturn a government decision, including many, many decisions regarding the occupation. Supreme Court. And people find it ironic that you have people on the left and on the far left at these demonstrations, you know, upholding the integrity of the Supreme Court because they fought against it in the past. But there have been a couple of key decisions the right has, you know, interpreted as the Supreme Court being against its interests. The most painful one was

the Supreme Court's support of Ariel Sharon's decision when he was prime minister in 2005 to withdraw from Gaza. That, in fact, though, was that decision was mitigated by the fact that the Supreme Court required the government to compensate settlers in Gaza who were removed with increased compensation. So, you know, they're vilified in the Supreme Court by the right, but essentially they've been more conservative and more supportive of the occupation than one would imagine from the rhetoric coming out on the right. But correct me if I'm wrong, it feels worth mentioning, I guess, that the Supreme Court is kind of the only institution that Palestinians can go to, right, to challenge things like settlements and to defend their rights and land disputes. No, absolutely. It is their only recourse. I'm saying that the Supreme Court has not always decided in their favor, but at least it's a place where they can have a hearing and, you know, presumably a fair hearing. As flawed as it may be to those who support Palestinian rights, it will be even worse when what the Knesset decides goes. And there is absolutely no recourse to challenge that. I mean, not only what the Knesset decides, but what the Israel Defense Forces actively do on the ground in the West Bank. Hi, it's Ramit Sethi here.

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I help you and your partner create a financial vision together. To listen to this podcast, just search for Money for Couples. So Netanyahu on Monday tried to calm things down, said he's going to try to have wide public agreement on the rest of the changes while the Knesset is in recess. So this is just the beginning, right? What else do you think we could see after Parliament comes back? Well, the map of the next few months, essentially, the Supreme Court has refused to freeze the enactment of this Reasonability Clause law that just passed. So it will be enacted and it will be enforced. There are several petitions against it, and the court has announced that they are only going to hear them in September until after the August

recess of the court takes place. I guess everybody needs a vacation here. So those appeals, which are all related to the legislation and government policy surrounding it, will happen in September, probably with the decisions coming in October. And then in October, when the parliament reconvenes, we're going to find out whether and how forcefully the government is going to try to push through the other pieces of the legislation that make up this overall judicial overhaul, which will change the face of the Israeli government. And the coalition government has the majority. So for the opposition, the only move here really is to push back against this in the courts or in the streets, right? Right. Those are the two arenas in which anything can happen. Netanyahu's coalition is very solid at the moment. There were threats. If this first piece of legislation didn't go through, there are presumably threats by the

far-right settler party, Osmayu Adid, that they will bolt the coalition. And people are saying that's what forced Netanyahu's hand not to negotiate and just to push the most extreme form of the law through. But nobody really thinks that the far-right party, that the ultra-Orthodox party, is that anyone is going to pull this coalition apart and force new elections. And so therefore, if you've got a solid majority in the Knesset, even if it's a slim majority, that's not a place where the opposition can make any change. And that's why the grassroots has been

so strong and so active here, because they are really the only ones standing between having the rest of the laws passed and not. And by the protest movement, I include the military reservists. I include the high tech sector, which is very worried over the economic implications of this. And yeah, that's what people are looking to. They're going to look to the court decisions coming up in October, and they're going to be looking to the streets. So you mentioned that Netanyahu, his hands are a bit tied by this coalition, and that's possibly why this was pushed through. And, you know, there's been a lot of suggestions that this is about him trying to avoid going to prison. But I'm wondering, does he have other common goals with the far right nationalists in his government who pushed this law through? in his government who pushed this law through? Well, he was determined to push this law through. He needed a victory before the Knesset session was over, but he presumably would have liked a more softened version of the law to be pushed through and have negotiated with the opposition

a bit in order to show the public that he's fair-minded because he's been tanking in the polls since he's been taking this extreme position. He personally, Netanyahu, if you look at his record, he's generally right-wing, but he's a pragmatist and he's generally liked to play it safe and essentially liked the status quo. He is leaning into these far extreme right-wing positions, I think, because he is being held hostage by the members of his coalition and he sees his political survival at stake and he's doing all that he can to stay out of prison. So some of the opposition to this has come from reservists who are saying that they're going to protest the changes by refusing to show up for active duty. And people get worried when there is a split

between the military and its leadership and civilian leadership. And I'm wondering, what do you think this could mean for the stability of the country? Is this something that alarms you and then people around you? Well, the dynamics in Israel between the military and the civilian sector are a little different than other places in the world because we have a universal draft. Essentially, almost every Israeli, obviously, excepting certain sectors like the Arab sector and the ultra-Orthodox center, are the army. This is a people's army. These military reservists we're talking about are, you know, people's fathers and brothers and heads of the high tech sector and lawyers and doctors. The military establishment is worried because of these reservists who, especially in the case of the Air Force, the Air Force ability to perform at the level that it performs depends on these reservists' willingness to volunteer, and they volunteer a great deal of their time. And so the military establishment is a great critic of the reform because the reform is causing a weakening in Israel's combat readiness

and ability to defend itself. Another reason the military is a key critic of the reforms is that when people talk about dragging Israeli military figures, senior figures to international courts like the Hague for human rights violations, the main argument against it happening, what has prevented it happening on a large scale for a long time, is the argument that Israel has a robust judiciary and therefore if Israeli military personnel do something truly terrible, that there is recourse in Israel. You don't need to bring them into an international court.

If you emasculate Israel's judiciary, then you're going to have a good argument for international prosecution. The floodgates could open and any Israeli military officer who travels abroad could find himself slapped with prosecution for war crimes. So that is why the military is extremely worried for a multitude of reasons about this move. So before we go, Alison, just to step back here a bit, I was hoping to get some big picture thoughts from you on the future of Israeli society. Where do you think Israel could go from here?

What paths do you see emerging? you think Israel could go from here? What paths do you see emerging? This is really causing an unprecedented political and social crisis in the country. It's a very, very close-knit society, even though we belong to different tribes. What has been the common fabric holding us together is starting to tear. The mantra has been Israel is a Jewish and democratic state. There's a tension between being Jewish, tribal, and being democratic, which is universal. And now these two parts of it are really, really pulling it apart. For the first time, this grassroots democratic liberal movement with no political affiliation has come up and taken over the streets and the hearts and minds of a majority of Israelis and the government and its base, the Orthodox Jews,

the settlers, they've been really caught off guard by this. The usual political rules no longer happen and there is no popular support almost to the proposed legislation. If you look at the frequency and the numbers of the demonstrations in favor of the legislation, I mean, they're trivial, pales to the hundreds of thousands of people who have gotten out in the streets and saying, we don't want this to happen. So the government is going to have a key decision whether it wants to listen to the people, to the majority of people who say they don't want this to happen, or whether because of the narrow interests that they represent are going to forge ahead and tear the fabric of Israeli society even further than it has.

Allison, thank you so much for talking through this with us. I appreciate it. Thanks so much for having me. me. All right, that's all for this week. Frontburner was produced by Shannon Higgins, Imogen Burchard, Derek Vanderwyk, Lauren Donnelly, Dennis Kalnan, and Joyta Sengupta. Our sound design was by Sam McNulty. Our music is by Joseph Chabison. Our executive producer is Nick McKay-Blokos. I'm Tamara Kandaker. Thanks so much for listening. FrontBurner is back next week.