Futility Closet - 160-The Birmingham Sewer Lion

Starting point is 00:00:00 Welcome to the Futility Closet podcast, forgotten stories from the pages of history. Visit us online to sample more than 9,000 quirky curiosities, from rebel misspellings to a palindromic minuet. This is episode 160. I'm Greg Ross. And I'm Sharon Ross. Birmingham, England faced a surprising crisis in 1889. A lion escaped a traveling menagerie and took up residence in the city's sewers, terrifying the local population. In today's show, we'll descend into the tunnels

Starting point is 00:00:38 with Frank Bostock, the 21-year-old manager who set out to capture the desperate beast. We'll also revisit a cosmic mystery and puzzle over an incomprehensible language. This was suggested by listener Peter Smith, who says this sounds right up your street. September 26, 1889 started like any other day for Frank Bostock. At 21, he was rather young to be manager of a traveling animal show, but his mother was the owner and her faith in him had paid off. The Bostock's menagerie, known as Wormwell's, now visited every fair of any importance in England and had established a reputation for quality and professionalism. Traveling menageries were very popular in the 19th century. They offered some excitement and a change of pace for country people at a time when established zoos were still new and often socially exclusive or inaccessible to ordinary people. Today,

Starting point is 00:01:36 Thursday, Womwell's Menagerie was about to start a three-day run at Aston, a suburb of Birmingham, in connection with the local celebration of the Michaelmas Fair. The opening day already looked promising. The weather was fair and large crowds were already beginning to gather. The show's newest attraction had just arrived that morning, a remarkably fine specimen of an African lion, as Bostock would later describe it, well-formed, well-grown, with a handsome head and shoulders covered with a fine darkish mane. Several naturalists had praised it as a typical king of beasts for his haughtiness and dignified bearing. For all its grandeur, Bostock said this lion was one of the greatest worries and anxieties I ever had. At four

Starting point is 00:02:16 years old, it promised to be a great investment for the menagerie, but he had been warned it was a very difficult animal to manage. It had killed one man and wounded several attendants by seizing them through the bars of its cage, and Bostock wrote, kindness had no effect on him whatever. Bostock believed that disciplining the lion would have aroused his wild nature, so all they could do was keep him perfectly quiet, see that he was not irritated in any way, and was made as comfortable and happy as was possible with good food, a clean house, and another lion for companionship. At the moment, this second lion was segregated by an iron partition, as they weren't sure how the two of them would get along. They intended to transfer both lions to a much larger cage later that day,

Starting point is 00:02:54 so that they'd have more space and comfort and a better opportunity of being seen. Just before the show opened, it was decided to move the new lion from a cage on the right side of the collection to one on the left. This required the use of what were called shifting dens. These are movable cages on wheels. They got the lion into a shifting den and rolled it over to the new cage, but the lion wouldn't leave the shifting den to get into the cage. As they were trying to get it to leave the shifting den, it leapt suddenly into the new cage, but the force of the leap sent the shifting den rolling backward on its wheels, which opened a gap between it and the cage. A man was there who could have closed the cage, but he was new and didn't understand how the doors operated. Before he could close the opening,

Starting point is 00:03:32 the lion saw its opportunity, and it leapt over his head and into the menagerie, loose. Bostock ran at once to protect the camels, which would have naturally attracted a carnivore, and the lion came right after him. He happened to have a sweet broom in his hands, and he hit it sharply across the face as it advanced, stunning it. It drew back and roared, frightening the animals, and then set off toward the elephant wagon at the other end of the tent. Here there was a gap between the wagons, and the lion saw this and darted through it into the open fairgrounds, where, in Bostock's words, he was as free and untrammeled and as much at liberty to get into mischief as in his native wilds. Bostock immediately gave chase, accompanied by several of his men. Unfortunately, there were already hundreds of people in the area, and they started to shout in terror and rush into one

Starting point is 00:04:14 another, which excited the lion and hindered their efforts to capture it. The lion quickly cleared the grounds and dashed away down the Aston Road toward Birmingham, whose population at that time was 200,000. There were crowds of people on the road and on their way to the fair, and Bostock said the majority of them certainly looked scared, but the lion darted past them without stopping. Bostock hurried after him, expecting at every moment that it might leap upon someone, but he was afraid to use his revolver for fear of hitting someone. The lion made for Aston Brook, which is a small stream or gully into which the sewers of the city flowed. When the pursuers reached the brook, some onlookers told them that it had jumped into the

Starting point is 00:04:50 water and disappeared into one of the sewer openings, looking up at the crowd of people and roaring at the top of his voice. It was apparently badly frightened, not just by the noisy crowd, but by several dogs that had been put on its track. In about 20 minutes, everyone in Birmingham knew what had happened. Worse, as the lion made its way through the sewers, it stopped at every manhole and, Bostock said, sent up a succession of roars that echoed and reverberated until the very earth seemed to be full of weird sounds driving some of the people nearly wild with terror. Bostock left two men at the sewer entrance with instructions to shoot the lion if it reappeared

Starting point is 00:05:23 and hurried back to the tent at his wits' end. He was worried both that the lion might kill someone and that the crowd might break into a riot. Recapturing the lion seemed practically impossible. The sewer is extended for miles and even now people kept rushing in to report hearing it at this manhole and that. But something had to be done quickly to calm the crowds. One of Bostock's men reported that there were now a hundred thousand excited people on the fairgrounds, and that unless something was done speedily, there would be trouble. After thinking miserably for a quarter of an hour, Bostock came up with a plan. He wasn't proud of it, but he argued later it was really unavoidable under the circumstances. He told three men to transfer a certain very quiet lion into a shifting den and to cover the whole den

Starting point is 00:06:01 with a piece of canvas. Then they drove this to the brook with as many ropes, pitchforks, and pistols as they could carry, and set its mouth against the sewer opening, and opened it. Now, attentive listeners will be thinking, wait, didn't he just release a second lion into the sewer? The answer is yes, he did, or he might have. It was a calculated risk. He later wrote, I knew perfectly well that the lion would much prefer to remain in his cage than to enter the darkness of that evil-smelling sewer, and so it proved. While they were doing this, one of the menagerie's lion tamers, Marcus Orenzo, a man Bostock said was as daring an individual as one would meet in a day's march, prepared to enter the sewer himself. He armed himself with a revolver, firecrackers and Roman candles, a frying pan, and a thick stick. A frying pan? You can't be too

Starting point is 00:06:47 careful. Then he and his assistant were lowered into a manhole several streets away from the cage. They also took with them a large boar hound named Marco, who was trained to defend a man if a lion attacked him. The lion tamer's instructions were to make his way from one manhole to the next, making as much noise as possible. He did this, firing the revolver and setting off firecrackers and Roman candles. When the crowd had heard several minutes of this racket, he fired two distinct revolver shots. This was the signal. The men in charge of the shifting den closed the cage and removed the canvas, and the crowd saw a lion in the cage. Immediately, they shouted, they've got him, they've got the lion. They drove the cage back to the

Starting point is 00:07:24 menagerie, with Bostock and the attendant seated on top, followed by a cheering crowd. When they reached the exhibition, some of the crowd actually carried the lion tamer shoulder high into the menagerie, and the lion was returned to its normal place in the tent. Bostock wrote, over 40,000 people filed into the show that afternoon, and they kept coming until we were positively obliged to refuse admission to any more. Everybody wanted to see the lion that had escaped into the sewer, so we had to placard the cage with a notice stating that the animal seen in it was the one which had escaped and been recaptured. But of course it wasn't. A riot had been averted, and in fact money was pouring in, but Bostock could only think of the original escaped lion, which was still at large somewhere in the sewers and just as likely to kill or injure

Starting point is 00:08:01 someone at any moment. This would be terrible in itself, but now it would also bring on the wrath of the crowd who would realize they'd been tricked. What if the lion started roaring again? Yeah, he brought that up too. That's all it would take at this point. Yeah. Even if it stayed in the sewers, if it betrayed its presence, that would be enough to tip the whole...

Starting point is 00:08:20 Give the game away. Yeah. Right. So still in an agony of anxiety, Bostock swore to men to secrecy and set them to watch the sewer entrance where the lion had disappeared. They were armed with revolvers in order to shoot the lion the instant it reappeared, and Bostock arranged that they'd be relieved periodically. That night, Bostock secretly visited every manhole in the city, but he heard nothing. He spent a sleepless night wondering what to do.

Starting point is 00:08:42 He couldn't think of how to get a lion out of a sewer without anyone knowing about it. Even if it remained where it was, as you said, one roar would give away its presence, which would cause a greater riot than before. The show opened again the next day, again to great success. He wrote, Everybody in Birmingham, I should imagine, came to see the lion that had been down in the sewer, but Bostock could only think of this guilty predicament he'd set up for himself. He kept fretting in this way until 5 p.m. on Saturday, when the city's chief constable walked into the menagerie. Bostock knew this man well by sight and had often spoken to him. The constable admired the lion and then went into Bostock's office to compliment him on his courage and pluck. This made Bostock feel even worse than before,

Starting point is 00:09:18 and he finally admitted the truth. At first, the constable couldn't believe that the lion had not been caught and was inclined to blame Bostock. But Bostock pointed out that he had probably averted a panic and that, as he said, my own liabilities in the matter were pretty grave possibilities to face. And the man began to feel sympathetic and offered his help. Bostock showed him the guard he'd put on the sewer opening, and they agreed to make a venture to recapture the lion at 2 a.m. on Sunday morning. The menagerie would close as usual on Saturday night, and everyone would go to their lodgings. Then at 2 o'clock, men selected for the work would quietly reassemble at the tent. The chief constable promised to send some policemen and workers familiar with the sewer.

Starting point is 00:09:54 Altogether, about 200 men showed up, armed with what Bostock called a most miscellaneous collection of weapons. Pistols, guns, rifles, crowbars, clubs, and carving knives. No frying pans this time. Not that we're aware of. All of them were sworn to secrecy. Bostock reflected that having so many armed men seemed to reduce the danger of a single lion unless one man shot another or the lion managed to corner one of them. They stationed policemen and sewer workers at every manhole within a mile radius

Starting point is 00:10:21 and then set up the shifting cage again at the mouth of the sewer. Empty this time. The lion tamer, Marcus Arunzo, who had pretended to corral the lion on Friday, wanted no part of an actual lion hunt, so Bostock found himself descending into a Birmingham manhole in the middle of the night, accompanied by three men and the dog, in search of an unseen and probably very hungry lion. Yeah, and not only do you have to worry about the lion,

Starting point is 00:10:44 but I think it would be a really real possibility that someone might shoot somebody else, especially if it's dark and they're frightened. They're all terrified to begin with, and no one can see anything. Nineteen years later, Bostock remembered the scene. He wrote, when we should come upon the fugitive, we moved slowly forward in the darkness and slime. They had gone some distance through the dark when suddenly the dog gave a sharp bark and a growl, and they realized he had scented the lion. Bostock says they crept along further until they saw two gleaming greenish-red eyes in the darkness ahead, and we knew we were face to face with the lion at last. Bostock sent a man back to shout the lion's location to the others, and at this a number of other men, mostly trainers, lowered themselves into various manholes nearby so that they had the lion

Starting point is 00:11:28 surrounded. Now Bostock and his companions just had to drive the lion backward to the cage, which was only two streets away. They began blowing horns and firing blank cartridges and Roman candles, as the lion tamer had, while moving slowly forward. They had managed to press the lion forward some distance when it stopped, seeming reluctant to move any farther. They were advancing cautiously nearer when Marco, the dog, got too close and a great fight erupted between him and the lion. The men could only look on, unable to intervene and aware of their own increasing danger, until the dog finally retreated whimpering back to Bostock, who sent him back with one of the men to be taken care of. He wasn't badly injured, but the lion was now angry and Bostock realized he would now have to engage the lion himself if they hoped to drive it

Starting point is 00:12:08 forward. After some thought, he took off his jackboots and put them on his hands and arms, then approached slowly to within 18 feet of the lion. It gave a growl but didn't move. Bostock's assistant was just behind him. If the lion decided to attack, they would both be killed. Inch by inch, Bostock moved closer to the lion until he could feel its breath on his face. To protect his head, he told his assistant to put a pail on his head. Then he summoned all his courage, lurched forward, and struck the lion across the nose with one of the jackboots. To his surprise, the lion did nothing. It seemed unwilling to attack, but also unwilling to retreat down the tunnel. Bostock was wondering what to do next when the pail fell off his head with a clatter that echoed down the tunnel, and at once the lion turned around and disappeared.

Starting point is 00:12:49 This happened so quickly that at first they couldn't understand what had become of it, but as they began to move forward they discovered that there had been an eight-foot fall close behind it, which explained why it had been so reluctant to retreat until it was frightened by the pail. They clambered forward and had reached the bottom of the drop when suddenly they heard the lion roaring terrifically ahead of them. On catching up, they discovered that it had caught its hind legs in a slip noose that some of the men had dropped from a manhole just above. Now it hung over them, suspended head downward. Quickly, Bostock ordered that other ropes be let down, and they were able to secure the lion's head and forepaws without any injury. The cage was

Starting point is 00:13:22 placed over the manhole, and they hauled up the lion. Bostock later wrote, and in this most undignified fashion, the king of beasts was dragged out of his prison and finally landed safely in his cage. I should say this is, it was probably even more undignified than that. The various accounts of this whole adventure differ a bit. And I think maybe what happened is if you remember the cage had originally been set up at the opening to the sewer and they hadn't been planning that these slip nooses would be used. So one account, actually two accounts, which I think are more accurate, are that when the lion was first pulled out of the sewer, they had to trap it under a bacon box, which was a bit too small, so its head was still sticking out.

Starting point is 00:13:58 But ten men were leaning on the box until they could go and recover the shifting cage. Oh, my goodness. It was all very undignified, but they did catch the lion. Back at the menagerie, they realized the lion was in a terrible state. It had been in the sewer for nearly three days and nights with no food or water unless it had drunk the sewer water. It was wet, cold,

Starting point is 00:14:14 and covered with filth. They gave it a bed of dry straw and did their best for it while the menagerie began its journey to the next town, but they found it was too ill to be exhibited, and after a few weeks it died after wasting away almost to nothing. Everywhere they went for nearly a year, people thronged to see the lion that had escaped into the Birmingham sewers. Bostock showed them the bogus lion, the decoy lion that they'd

Starting point is 00:14:35 presented in Birmingham, and this became the biggest draw of the whole menagerie. In Birmingham, the news eventually leaked out of the dramatic events that had transpired on Sunday morning, but one of Bostock's men explained that this lion had escaped only for an hour or so during the night, and the alarmed residents accepted this. So, Bostock wrote, I got the lion out of the sewer, as the people of Birmingham supposed I did, only their praise and applause were a little previous, but I hope never to have such another terrible experience. He never did. After a long career working with dangerous animals, he died quietly of the flu at age 46 in 1912. Sitting atop his grave in London is a sculpture of a stone lion. Futility Closet is supported primarily by our amazing listeners.

Starting point is 00:15:26 We just wouldn't be able to keep putting in the amount of time that the show takes to make if it weren't for the donations and pledges we get. If you'd like to make a one-time donation to help us out, you can find a donate button in the supporters section of the website at futilitycloset.com. And if you'd like to join our Patreon campaign, you can get access to outtakes, extra discussion on some of the stories, more lateral thinking puzzles, and updates on Sasha, our very hardworking mascot. You can check out our Patreon campaign at patreon.com slash futilitycloset, or see the link at the website. And thanks again to everyone who helps support the show. You really make this possible.

Starting point is 00:16:10 support the show. You really make this possible. Stu Cazares and Eric Waldo wrote to let us know that there have been some recent developments on the wow signal. Eric wrote, hello podcasters and podcat. In episode 32, you talked about the wow signal, a strong signal that was briefly detected by a radio telescope in 1977. The signal was said to have characteristics that would be used by an alien civilization trying to make contact. There's a new theory to explain the source of the signal. Antonio Paris at the Center for Planetary Science believes that a comet and or its hydrogen cloud was the source. He claims to have found signals on the same frequency emanating from other comets, including one that was at the location of the WOW signal. I can't vouch for the accuracy of Antonio Paris or the Center for Planetary Science. In his experiments, the signal was not as strong as the original WOW signal,

Starting point is 00:16:55 although he suggests possible reasons for this. According to Wikipedia, Jerry Emin, who identified the original signal, disputes Paris's conclusion, although it gives no citation for this. So nothing definite yet, but it might be worth keeping an eye on. The WOW signal was a 72-second radio signal picked up by the Big Ear Radio Telescope at the Ohio State University in 1977. It was significantly more intense than anything else in the sky that night, and it covered only a small range of frequencies, similar to what you'd find with signals that aren't natural in origin. Adding to the excitement about the signal, it was at a frequency of about 1420 MHz, which is in a region that is relatively free of noise from other objects, and which researchers looking for evidence of extraterrestrial intelligence had been interested in, with the idea that it could be used for interstellar transmissions. The WOW signal was only picked up that one time, and all subsequent attempts to find it again have failed.

Starting point is 00:17:55 Over the years, explanations given for the signal have included intermittent natural phenomena, secret spy satellites, and, of course, aliens. But now, Antonio Paris, an astronomer at St. Petersburg College in Florida, has recently published a paper arguing that the signal was made by a comet called 266P Christensen that was only discovered in 2006, and that would have been in the right location the night that the signal was found. Paris contends that under some circumstances, some comets can emit radio waves from the gases surrounding them

Starting point is 00:18:28 and has demonstrated that two other comets emit radio signals at the frequency of 1420 MHz. But not everyone is convinced of Paris' conclusions. Emin notes that because the Big Ear telescope had two feedhorns, there should have been two instances of the signal, about a minute and a half apart. Emmons said that the fact that there was only one instance means that the signal didn't last long enough

Starting point is 00:18:53 for it to be picked up by the second feedhorn. Parris notes that he can't explain the lack of a second signal, but said, there is some data out there to suggest the issue is at the telescope end and not the phenomenon itself, meaning that possibly there could have been a glitch in the Big Ear telescope. This is disputed by staff who had worked with the telescope, and unfortunately the telescope itself was destroyed several years ago, so it can't provide any answers at this time. Other astronomers, such as Seth Shostak from the SETI Institute,

Starting point is 00:19:24 also dispute Paris's conclusions on the grounds that it's not likely that comets would emit as strong of a signal as the Wow signal was. Yeah, it's been a few years since we did that story, but I seem to remember that's one of the striking things about it is it was very strong. Right. And so the fact that the comets don't seem to be admitting quite as strong of a signal although you know supposedly paris says he has some explanations for that i'm not enough of an astronomer to know what's difficult here is that everybody kind of has a bias right like paris wants to be proving his new theory and the people that worked on the original big ear telescope are a little biased to

Starting point is 00:20:03 say well no the telescope couldn't possibly have picked up something wrong or there couldn't have been a glitch or a problem with it. And the SETI people, well, they're dedicated to searching for extraterrestrial intelligence. So it seems to me they have a bit of a bias towards wanting to believe that the original WOW signal was made from aliens. So everybody's got kind of a bias. So it's hard to know what to think. So overall, I actually liked Stu's summation of this new hypothesis for the signal. so everybody's got kind of a bias so it's hard to know what to think yeah so overall i actually

Starting point is 00:20:25 liked stew's summation of this new hypothesis for the signal he said of course this is disputed and can never be 100 validated but at least this is not a forgotten event that's true we can take that comfort that people are still working on it after our episode last week alex bowman's wrote after two rather gruesome episodes i was surprised that you turned all family-friendly with air dish as a subject. But then you rapidly switched to Japanese cannibalism and somebody got stabbed in the lateral thinking puzzle, not to mention all the people dying in the air crash, so I knew everything was well. Perhaps you should change the name of the podcast to Fatality Closet, though. I worry about that sometimes. I never thought of us as morbid people, but the longer we do the show,

Starting point is 00:21:11 the more we talk about death somehow. Well, that just seems to be one aspect of life, and there seem to be a lot of interesting, grim stories, right? Yeah, it tends to be a compelling story. So we're making a bit of a name for ourselves, but we've only killed a lion so far today. But of course, we still have the puzzle to get through. So we'll have to see. Alex also had something to say related to the naming conventions in India that we had discussed in episode 154.

Starting point is 00:21:36 He said, in Korea, the rules are also very strict. Typically, people address one another by their position in the hierarchy or by seniority. This also affects the verb forms you use. Within the same generation, you call someone who is older than you older brother or sister, respectively oppa or oni if you are a girl, and hyung or nuna if you're a boy. Interestingly, there seems to be a trend to use English names to bypass this convention. And Alex sent a link to a recent story in the Washington Post titled, Why Korean Companies Are Forcing Their Workers to Go by English Names. Traditionally,

Starting point is 00:22:12 in South Korea, it would be unthinkable to call your boss or even your co-workers by their first names. As Alex said, instead you would use their position in the company, such as manager. A post on a popular Korean blog was rather explicit on the importance of using honorifics rather than names in the workplace, saying, dropping your pants and urinating in the person's briefcase would only be a little ruder than calling him or her by his or her first name. So that's pretty serious. But some companies have recently adopted policies of having all their employees use English nicknames, the thinking being that asking Koreans to use their bosses' or coworkers' actual names might feel too impolite, but that calling them by English names might tap into a different cultural mindset. Thus, Koreans at these companies are choosing names for themselves, such as Sophie or John, or in some cases, more special names such as Unique, which was chosen by one

Starting point is 00:23:05 employee interviewed by the Post. Companies that are involved in tourism or trade or other globally focused industries are more likely to be shifting to the use of English names, as are small startups or other companies that are trying to create a less hierarchical environment. In more traditional Korean companies, employees don't feel free to share their own ideas. Decision making is often obstructed by layers of hierarchy, and project leaders are chosen for their titles rather than their expertise. So one Korean employee likened it to the military, where you must follow commands rather than do any thinking for yourself. But not all Koreans are happy with making changes, though. Some continue

Starting point is 00:23:45 to attach position titles to their co-workers' English names, afraid that to not do so would be offensive. And others don't want to use an English name. As one said, using an English name even though you are not American is a little bit strange. Your name is from your own mother and father. And many Korean companies continue to embrace the more traditional system. Kaibol, which are massive family-owned business conglomerates, are notoriously rigid. These companies tend to have strong government ties and dominate the Korean economy. In these organizations, employees will receive raises and promotions on a particular schedule based on their age rather than merit, and workstations are arranged according to the employees' positions.

Starting point is 00:24:29 Employees at these companies typically work 12-hour days, often over weekends and holidays, and feel that their identity is tied to their position in the company. So, as the Washington Post says, such employees don't see much reason to want to be called Fred or Sally instead of the director title they have been dedicating their lives to achieving. Also on the subject of using first names, we heard from Johnny, who has such a daunting last name that I'm not even going to try it. Johnny said, please tell Sharon that she can attempt to say my name however she wants. I found out when I was an adult that I had been pronouncing my name wrong all my life anyway, but I just couldn't muster the courage to even hazard a guess. So I'm just sticking with Johnny. wrong all my life anyway, but I just couldn't muster the courage to even hazard a guess. So

Starting point is 00:25:05 I'm just sticking with Johnny. And Johnny wrote about something we had discussed in episode 133 about the large number of Norwegian soldiers that had had the same name in one regiment in the American Civil War. He said, Hello, team. Recently discussed same names in the regiment in the Civil War. Well, it still happens today in the British Army. The British Army has regiments of Gurkhas, and due to their limited amount of surnames, they use their first names on the name badges instead of the last name. Love the podcast, and it is something I look forward to on my commute on a Monday. And I don't know very much about the culture of the Gurkhas, so hopefully they are comfortable with first names. And I wonder if it's similar to the Korean companies companies and using first names might make the regiments a little

Starting point is 00:25:48 friendlier or less hierarchical, although it being the military, I would guess probably not. Thanks so much to everyone who writes in to us. We really appreciate getting your feedback and comments. And if you would like to send anything to us, you can send it to podcast at futilitycloset.com. And please take pity on me and consider giving me some help with pronouncing your name. It's Greg's turn to try to solve a lateral thinking puzzle. I'm going to give him a strange sounding situation, and he has to try to figure out what is going on, asking only yes or no questions. This puzzle comes from Stephen Jones. A teenage girl speaks to people, but she cannot understand them when they speak back to her, even though they are speaking the same language.

Starting point is 00:26:39 Wow. There goes my first question. Cannot understand them. All right. When you say she speaks to them, you mean just verbally says sentences with some intelligible meaning? Yes. And they understand what she's saying to them? Yes.

Starting point is 00:26:57 So that's all normal? Yes. But when they speak back to her, is that how you put it? Yeah. She can't understand them. Does that have anything to do with actually just hearing the sound that they're making? No, she can hear them fine. Do I need to know anyone's specific identity?

Starting point is 00:27:12 No. Or occupation? Yes. Oh, do I need to know her occupation? Yes. The girl's occupation? Yes. Really?

Starting point is 00:27:19 Yes. So this is true? Yes. Okay. Are there people? Do I need to know more about the people? No, not really. Okay.

Starting point is 00:27:32 She speaks to them and they speak back to her and she can't understand it. And her occupation is important. So she's doing her occupation when she speaks to them. Yes. Is she surprised by the fact that she can't understand what she's what they're saying no it seems like i had to be able to guess that right off the bat if i thought of it like that's enough um okay would you say the people she's talking to are i don't know how to say this patrons Patrons or clients or customers of hers?

Starting point is 00:28:07 Some of them might be. Yeah, some are and some aren't. Are they subjects, like she's testing them in some way? No. Okay. She's doing her job. Is she doing it alone? No.

Starting point is 00:28:19 So are there other people involved? Yes. This is going to come down to guessing what the job is, and those are notoriously tricky to guess. Well, that's not the only avenue. You could try to work on how it is that she's not understanding

Starting point is 00:28:38 the people, even though they're speaking the same language. Is she asking them questions? Not necessarily. Would you say they're responding to what she's saying? Some of them are. Are they in the same place? Yes. She says something and at least some of them respond to what she's saying.

Starting point is 00:28:59 Yes. In the same language? Yes. Okay. So when they speak, they're speaking just as you and I are now. There's no technology in between them. There's no barrier. I would agree to all of that. They could both be sitting at a table like we are right now.

Starting point is 00:29:15 Possibly. I like the puzzle. She says something and they respond. She can't. Can't understand. It means she can't interpret the language. Correct. She doesn't have any deficits of any kind that prevent this.

Starting point is 00:29:33 Correct. Or disabilities. Correct. All right. What occupation would you have? She wouldn't. Okay. So she's not, let's say she's not doing her job and someone spoke to her in the same language that we're talking about. Uh-huh. Would she be able to understand them? No.

Starting point is 00:29:55 But there's no impairment. There's no. There's no impairment. Problem with her hearing. Correct. Do I need to know about the surroundings? Just the environment they're in? They're like in outer space or something and she can't... No, no, no, nothing like that. They're in the surroundings of where she would be to be fulfilling her occupation, yes. And many of the people around her are also doing the same occupation. Can they understand what they're hearing, these other people? Some of them, probably, yes.

Starting point is 00:30:26 I would think most of them, yes. They're doing the same job that she is? Yes. Does this involve interpreting or translation? No. Other people around are doing the same thing, and there's no barrier, there's no impediment. Correct. Physically.

Starting point is 00:30:43 Right. There's no impediment physically. You want a hint? Yeah, it's coming down to her occupation, I'm afraid. Well, my hint is going to be that when she's speaking, she doesn't even understand what she's saying. Well, maybe that helps. Is she reading what she's saying. Well, maybe that helps. Is she reading what she's saying? Not at the moment. Not at the moment, but it's a script she's memorized?

Starting point is 00:31:12 Yes. Is she acting? Yes. Acting in another language? Yes, exactly. This is about actress Tara Strong. Early in her career, she performed in the Toronto Yiddish Theater. She didn't speak Yiddish and memorized her lines phonetically.

Starting point is 00:31:28 Oh, my God. But this would result in awkwardness when audience members would try to tell her in Yiddish how much they loved her performance. So she was acting in a language she literally didn't understand. Correct. Oh, my gosh. That's impressive. Yeah. Thanks so much to Steven for that puzzle in which no one even came close to dying.

Starting point is 00:31:46 Excellent. Not even close. And if you have a puzzle you'd like to send in for us to try, please send it to us at podcast at futilitycloset.com. That's our show for today. And we did manage to get through an entire episode without killing anyone. You'll have to come back next week to see how long we can keep up that streak. And just a reminder to check out our new store if you might be interested in various items adorned with the Futility Closet Penguin. You can find a link to that on our

Starting point is 00:32:15 website at futilitycloset.com. If you're looking for more quirky curiosities, check out the Futility Closet books on Amazon, or browse around the website to read more than 9,000 Selkuth Omniana. At the website, you can also see the show notes for the podcast with the links and references for the topics in today's show. If you have any questions or comments about the show, you can reach us by email at podcast at futilitycloset.com. Our music was written and performed by Doug Ross. Thanks for listening, and we'll talk to you next week.

Futility Closet - 160-The Birmingham Sewer Lion

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