Games with Names - "Super Bowl XXXVI" with Ernie Adams | Rams vs. Patriots

Episode Date: April 2, 2024

Ladies and gentlemen...we got him! Ernie Adams is in studio! The legendary Patriots' Football Research Director is with us to relive Super Bowl XXXVI between the St. Louis Rams and the New England Patriots. Ernie joins us on the couch (3:51). Ernie breaks down what made Vince Lombardi such an incredible coach (13:54). We dive into the origin story of Ernie and Bill Belichick's friendship (31:20). Ernie shares what he loves most about Gronk (1:13:50). We go back to February of 2002 (1:23:53). Ernie breaks down how the game has changed since this 2001season (1:29:42). We breakdown these teams (1:40:28). Ernie on Brady taking over the reigns (1:45:13). We get into this game (1:58:13). We play some player x big moment word association with Ernie (2:30:00). We score this game (2:35:33). We wrap it up (2:40:15). Support the show: http://www.gameswithnames.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hey, I'm Gianna Pradenti. And I'm Jermaine Jackson-Gadsden. We're the hosts of Let's Talk Offline from LinkedIn News and iHeart Podcasts. There's a lot to figure out when you're just starting your career. That's where we come in. Think of us as your work besties

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Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Keri Champion, and this is Season 4 of Naked Sports. Up first, I explore the making of a rivalry. Kaitlyn Clark versus Angel Reese. Every great player needs a foil. I know I'll go down in history. People are talking about women's basketball just because of one single game. Clark and Reese have changed the way we consume

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Sports. Up first, I explore the making of a rivalry, Kaitlyn Clark versus Angel Reese. People are talking about women's basketball just because of one single game. Clark and Reese have changed the way we consume women's basketball. And on this new season, we'll cover all things sports and culture. Listen to Naked Sports on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio apps, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Black Effect Podcast Network is sponsored by Diet Coke. History is filled with unexpected stories, and I'd like to tell you about them. I'm Aaron Manke, and for the past six years, I've been sharing history's most curious tales on my podcast, Cabinet of Curiosities, such as the surprising country that invented the croissant

and the wrestling champ who won the White House. And now these amazing stories and many more have been compiled into my new book. Curious to know more? Pre-order Cabinet of Curiosities, available November 12th, wherever books and audiobooks are sold. Learn more over at grimandmild.com slash curiosities. Do you ever wonder where your favorite foods come from? Like what's the history behind bacon-wrapped hot dogs? Hi, I'm Eva Longoria. Hi, I'm Maite Gomez-Rejon. Our podcast, Hungry for History, is back.

And this season, we're taking in a bigger bite out of the most delicious food and its history. Seeing that the most popular cocktail is the margarita, followed by the mojito from Cuba, and the piña colada from Puerto Rico. Listen to Hungry for History on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Bill and I met each other as high school teammates in 1970.

What was the scouting report of Bill in 1970? We were terrible. But there's so many times I've heard in the meeting room, me and fucking Ernie could do this. Yeah, we could try hard. If it required a lot of ability, forget it. Today we are talking Super Bowl 36. We reserve this game for three people.

One, Tom Brady. Two, Bill Belichick. Three, Ernie Adams. Let's go! Julian, I'm honored to be here. Here we go! It was the first game we won. Nobody on the face of planet Earth, except us, even thought we had a chance.

The New England Patriots, 14-point underdogs. The Rams, you know, they're doing their last huddle. Ricky Pearl comes right over the camera, and a dynasty is born tonight. You know, he just had the wrong team. Ernie knew everything. He's an encyclopedia. A lot of times, you know, when it gets to that critical situation,

having the right information can really make a difference. You get once a week for three hours to do your f***ing job. You can't slide a game or two. It's National Football League. Are you finishing my sentences, Ernie? Yeah. I always said about our teams at the Patriots, the bigger the game, the tougher the situation, the better we play.

100%. He kicks the ball. You're watching it. You finally see it go through the uprights. What's the first thing that comes to your mind? Holy shit. We won! I'm a Patriot!

A Super Bowl serious! Games with Names is a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome to Games with Names, presented by Wynn Las Vegas and Encore Boston Harbor. Today we are talking Super Bowl 36 Patriots vs. Rams, which we reserve for three people in this world. Three. Three. Three that could only do this game. One, Tom Brady.

Tom, easy. First one. Ricky Prowl? No, no, no. Two, Coach Belichick. BB. BB. Three who did this episode with us today

ernie adams let's go wow white whale guest on games with names we got him we got him what's really cool with how ernie was with us on this interview was what I knew Ernie was. It's just no one knows, because no one really talked with Ernie how he really is. He's a fun dude. He knows everything. He's educated on everything.

We talk about the birth of the dynasty. We talk about Tom Brady becoming Tom Brady with Ernie Adams, who's Mr. Scouting Report, Mr. Analytic. We get into analytics because Ernie invented analytics. Ernalytics, as you call it. Ernalytics, I call it. I call it Ernalytics.

Fourth and two against the Colts, Peyton Manning Colts in 2009. We went for it. We lost. But it was the right call for the team and it made sense it made sense you guys will understand that after you listen to this we talked bill belichick and the risky little things that him and old earned dog earned dog what they used to do at high school in high school dynamic duo baby andover we you know, the Kennedys started Andover. That's not true.

That was Dexter. Dexter. We get into both of that. Yeah. We get into both of that. Oh, man. We get into that. And what it's like to be the right-hand man to America's most hated greatest coach of all time Bill Belichick

Bill baby known each other for like since they were in high school and then you go out and win six Super Bowls together incredible who else has done that

first conversation with Bill and Ernie and just this is a special one it's long but it's fucking worth it it's long and if you are a football

fan if you are a Patriot fan if you are a Patriot fan, if you hate the Patriots, literally this is the reason why you hate us. If you know ball or you think you know ball, listen up. This is the episode. We've got, like, Vince Lombardi stories from a secondary source. Let's just get into this one. Let's get into this one.

One hell of an episode. Buckle up, guys. Buckle up guys Buckle up Games with Names is brought to you by Wynn Las Vegas and Encore Boston Harbor Wynn Las Vegas and Encore Boston Harbor Are the ultimate destination for sports lovers Enjoy the sports book

Play golf Eat at a great restaurant And stay in luxury accommodations. Sign up for win rewards and redeem for a resort credit. Let's go. February 3rd, 2002, Louisiana Superdome, New Orleans, Louisiana. Rams and the Patriots are tied 17-17 with 121 left in the game. Who cares what John Madden thinks? Bill Belichick, Ernie Adams, and the young Tom Brady aren't playing for overtime.

This is Super Bowl 36. We shocked the world we did welcome to games with names presented by win las vegas and boston encore harbor welcome to games with names ernie how you doing julian i'm honored to be here and i'm doing great why how are you honored to hear i'm so honored to have you in my house. Well, yeah, because you were, I mean, I lived the Patriots for 20 years, and you were such a huge part of it. I mean, when I think of Julian, I think of the guy who, hey, he's a receiver. We need a defensive back.

Go in and play defensive back. We need a big play. You throw the 50-yard touchdown pass to Danny Amendola. I mean, you need a big play on throw the 50 yard touchdown pass to Danny Amendola you need a big play on special teams you're the punt return guy we had a great group of people and you were one of them

and I'm always honored to be with anyone from one of those teams you're going to make me start crying it's getting too hot you know You're going to make me start crying, Ernie. You know, it's getting too hot. You know, you want a tomato, Ernie? Are those the real heirlooms?

Those are your heirlooms. I can see that, yeah. You see them by shirt, Ernie? I do. That's the Ernie Dog special. Okay, yeah, right there. Now, do you remember when i used to come into you every day and ask you how the tomato was oh it's for sure and you told me that you grew up loving tomatoes because your mom grew them uh you know right that right there in our garden

it was san mateo yeah yeah and and ernie would sit there in the cafeteria by himself you know he'd have his little collared shirt on. He'd have his hat on. And he'd have a fork and knife. And you'd just sit there and you'd slice that tomato. I believe you put a little salt and pepper on there. Maybe a little salt. I'm not a big pepper guy.

Not a big pepper guy? But just a little salt just to kick it off. And I always enjoyed talking with Ernie because Ernie knew everything. We didn't get into his accolades. This guy, he was in the NFL for 40-plus years. He's with the Browns, the Patriots, and started with the Giants.

He got Bill the job with the Giants somewhat. I've heard that story. And when people always ask me, I go, he's an encyclopedia, that's what he is, he just has so many bits of experiences, and he's seen so many players that he's an encyclopedia, and you could always straight up tell us a play, so I'd always nitpick you, right, and you'd always, I'd always ask you for a tip or two, sometimes it'd be about the punter, and you'd always say, oh, his offset's here, you got to watch this,

and you'd give me the rundown of that. You always had information. Well, and there are a lot of times when it gets to that critical situation, a critical game, having the right information can really make a difference. The little bit of edge that a player can have on what another guy might do can really make a difference because when you get in the national football league, all the players are good. So the little edges can sometimes make a difference. Well, we'll get into those edges.

But why did you pick this game? We're doing Super Bowl XXXVI. Why did you pick this game? And is this the greatest game of all time? It's the game I, if you, what's my favorite game? Yeah, this is it. Because first of all, it was the first game we won. Nobody

on the face of planet Earth, except us, even thought we had a chance. Weren't any poor dogs. Right. And I'm not going to say I knew we were going to win. I knew we'd go out and play a good game. But, I mean, you know, John Madden, and I love John Madden, it was like, oh, the Patriots, they have to play the Rams. These poor little Patriots, they have no chance.

And, you know, of course, you get down the situation at the end of the game where, you know, Madden's on TV. They should just take a knee and go to overtime. The way I translate that is he thought we should just gracefully lose the game where Madden's on TV. They should just take a knee and go to overtime. The way I translate that is he thought we should just gracefully lose the game, which wasn't really our idea. But so this, you know, and of course it was the first game Tom played. Tom's first as a quarterback. And, you know, we just played a great game on defense,

did just enough on offense, and won it at the end. Is this the greatest game of all time, though? I'm not sure it's a greater game than beating the Seahawks or beating the AFC Championship game against the Chiefs. So, I mean, I pick this number one because, as I say, or beating AFC championship game against the Chiefs. So, I mean, I pick this number one because, as I say, this was the one nobody else thought we could win. We played a lot of great games.

We were in nine Super Bowls. We could have won all nine. We could have lost all nine. I mean, they were all tight. The biggest margin of victory in any of them was the 10 points against the Rams. And not only were the rest of them, not only were they a touchdown or less, but they went down to the last 30 seconds, which is what you'd kind of hope to get in the Super Bowl. It's supposed to be the two best teams.

Yeah. Now, it doesn't have to get in the Super Bowl. You know, it's supposed to be the two best teams. Yeah. Now, it doesn't have to be our game, but what is the greatest game of all time in your mind? It doesn't have to be one that we played in. It could have been one as a child. It could have been something. Or what was it that comes to your mind when you think of that? If I had to put another, the ones that just, you know,

what really comes to mind, like the ice bowl. Ice bowl. You know, same thing. going down to the last play, we always talk about, you know, the conditions, the frozen, I mean, that's where, the frozen tundra. I mean, that was frozen tundra. Of course, of course, you know, Vince Lombardi had gone to, you know, great expense to have, you to have coils underneath the field

to prevent it from freezing, and the damn thing didn't work. So the field was absolutely frozen solid. You get pictures of the Cowboys defensive linemen before that last fight. They were trying to use their cleats to dig in a little something. It wasn't doing any good. But I still, of course, we all live the game through our own experiences. So, I mean, I come back to, and I'm going to make you a bet. If you asked some other people who were there what their favorite game was,

I'm going to make you a bet that this one would come up. Just the fact that, you know, we knew we were going to play a good game, and nobody else gave us a chance. We reserved this game for three people. Only three people we'd do this game with. One, Tom Brady. Two, Bill Belichick. Three, Ernie Adams.

Well, that's... Because this is the jump start. This is the jumpstart. This is the jumpstart. Well, this is, you know, that whole last two months of the 2001 season that built up to this was really the jumpstart. For instance, we played the regular season game, I'm going to say about the first week of December against the Rams, where they beat us, but we actually played pretty well. Truthfully, I'm not sure we could have won the Super Bowl if

we hadn't played them in the regular season. Got a little taste of them. Got a little taste. We gave us a real, hey, we can do some things. We don't want to do some other things. So as opposed to having to take, you know, a quarter and a half to find that out and be down 14 to nothing. We were right. Been there. Been there. It's tough. It's tough.

And so we went in with a great plan going into the game. I remember, frankly, because that was the year of 9-11, so they had to rejigger the schedule. So we played the AFC championship game on what is normally the bye week. So there was no bye. We beat the Steelers in the AFC championship game. We flew home that night, and the plane was leaving at 10 o'clock the next morning.

So it's, you know, go get some clean clothes, come back, and let's go. Which ultimately gave the template to the NFL that Super Bowls are okay to be played in February. And it looks like they're probably going to try to get that third week here soon because then you get built-in President's Day, Super Bowl becomes a holiday. I think the networks who actually pay the bills have been wanting to get the Super Bowl pushed back in the middle of February for quite a long time. The thing that's absolutely nuts is going to 17 and 18 regular season games.

And I would say anybody who thinks that's a good idea should be required to go into the training room after a few games. Go to week five. That's when the grind of the season. The grind of the season. And it just gets harder and harder and harder. What did I used to tell you about week eight to week 11? Remember I used to come up to you, it's about time, I'm a house and punt. That's it.

It was always in that pocket. Right. And what did Bill tell the whole team? It's Thanksgiving. And what happens on Thanksgiving? Football season starts. Football season starts. Football season starts.

You have to go through September, October, and early November. To learn your team. Yeah, to learn your team and get in position. But the games start getting big. And every win you win, the game gets bigger. That's when it really gets to be fun. But you know you're in a hard grind when you're playing football for keeps in December. 100%.

Now, you talked about the ice bowl, and I've heard that you've been a huge fan of Vince Lombardi. What made Coach Lombardi, because I've heard you talk about this, I've heard Bill reference him, what made Lombardi such a great football coach? The fact that he had that real period of excellence in the early 60s. I mean, the Packers won, they won five championships in seven years. And of course, the first two were when there was no Super Bowl. Of course. And then they, you know, and probably the 60, a lot of people, and I wouldn't disagree, the 62 Packers may have always been

one of the, maybe the greatest team in the history of the league. The what? The greatest team in the history of the league. History of the league? History of the league. I mean, they're certainly one of the ones that come right to mind. And then after the 62 season, they have Paul Horning get suspended for a year for gambling,

which just, you know, he was not only their, it was always their spiritual leader. He's, I started off in the NFL with the Patriots back in the 70s when Chuck Fairbanks was the head coach. And one of my good friends was the late Jim Ringo, who was the captain of these great Packer teams in the early

60s. And every day I would kind of get him to tell me a Packer story. And Paul Horning was the guy. If somebody missed a play during the game, and the deal Lombardi had with the team was if you win, you get two days off. If you lose, you know, you're coming into work. And somebody would miss a play, and they'd walk back in the huddle,

and Horning would be right there. Hey, asshole, do you want to practice tomorrow? That was a real, you know, for all, you know, the Lombardi, the discipline and all that. Jim always told me this is the wildest group of human beings ever put together in one place. So that's in what? You said 62.

You started your career in what? I started in 75 with the Patriots. 75 with the Patriots, and you're here in these stories. When did you realize you wanted to get into coaching or the NFL world? Well, I went to private grade school where football was mandatory. Mandatory. I mean, it was not an a la carte program where you got to choose. Where's this school?

Dexter School in Brookline, Massachusetts. Brookline. Brookline. I used to train there. Right. Well, you are over at the new. They moved the campus, but yes. And, of course, the school was founded by Joe Kennedy,

who wanted a place for his sons to be able to go to school. So one of the early graduates was President Kennedy. So football athlete. to be able to go to school. So one of the early graduates was President Kennedy. So football athlete, we played all sports, but from September to early November, we played football. And I was kind of the athletic director, who was George Stample, a great guy. He coached everything, and I was kind of the pain in the ass. Why don't we do this, do that?

And he finally said, because we were split up. It was all intramural. So we had seventh-grade boys just split up. And he said, okay, you're so smart. You coach your team. And I said, yeah, okay, I'll do that. And I actually said, hey, this is actually fun. So that's where it started.

Is that when you read Coach Boo's dad's book? Well, no. But what I did read multiple times was Vince Lombardi's book, Run to Daylight. And to this day, if somebody asks me, what does a coach do? I said, look, if you really want to know what it's like, that's the book to read. Because he goes through a week, you know, kind of minute by minute, getting ready to play the Detroit Lions, who in the early 60s, it was the Packers were the first team in the league, and the Lions were right behind them.

So, I mean, they had that book in the Brookline Public Library. I must have checked it out and read it 20 times. But, you know, that's, hey, when you're 13 years old, sometimes, you know, you get a bug in your head. 13 times, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Now, Uri, how many books have you read? Oh, God, a lot. And the thing about coaching, you know, you don't, I can't just,

I wasn't always able to sit down and read a book, so I just have a stack of books to read. Now I have multiple stacks of books to read. But you know what? The books are great things. They sit there waiting patiently for you, and when you're ready to go pick them up, they're right there. Jules, how many books have you read?

I've read a good amount. There's different types of learning. That's why I had to write everything down when coach would say, and then I'd have to go over it. I couldn't just read something and comprehend it. But if there's a really good book, you may have to go read it three, four times just to go first time you kind of get the idea, and then if this is something really good

then you can go back and you know and really uh dig into it i mean so if you know photographic memory and all that i'm not really sure i buy that it's just you know but you have to sit down take the time just turn it one page at a time and so is this where the creativity was born and created for the Ernie cards that we used to have to deal with in practice every day? That could be part of it. I mean, there's a lot of all those cards. That's a lot of reading, a lot of film study, because I always try to put myself inside the other team. What are they going to do against us? Maybe it's a play they ran three years ago, and I've been waiting for three years to run this against us in practice. Sometimes it actually plays out that way in the games. Most of the times it doesn't, but I always say keep everybody alert.

Do you ever remember a time where we had one of those crazy Ernie cards where we were all bitching and complaining like, oh, we'll never fucking see this. You've seen it when the offense is over. What the fuck is this? What are we doing, Jesus Christ? Do you remember specifically a time that? For instance, we were playing the Dolphins.

It was probably around 2011 or so because Brian Dayball, who of course he was with us for a number of years, was the offensive coordinator. And I said, what's Brian going to do? And they had the throwback to the quarterback off the shotgun. So we ran that in practice and people were all, what the hell? Well, they ran exactly that play in the game. And the fact that we had seen it meant that we could react to it just in time to make the play

on defense. Because the stuff, it's happening so fast, if you got to think, oh, it just went by me. You got to be able to anticipate. In fact, one of the great lines for coaching football was somebody I have tremendous respect for, Tom Landry, who would say, anticipation beats reaction every time. Think ahead of that. Hey, we know this is the situation. This is what we've got to watch out for.

And that just makes a world of difference than just being out there playing. Oh, my God, the play just went by me. You've seen a lot of guys, they're always half a step late. And that just doesn't work. That's what I try to explain to people. When they ask, what was your guys' day-to-day like? And I'll be like, oh, we'd walk through plays.

We'd walk through the walkthroughs. Then we'd go to a built-in drill for that specific play, take it to a seven-on-seven, then do a team, and we'd have all these reps, and you'd run 30 new plays, but you'd rep them four or five times, and guys would bitch and complain bitch and complain but then when you came when it came to game day like Ernie said it's in your subconscious it's built in your subconscious so you react and you've seen the play it becomes deja vu on this

technique this happens oh I see this guy I saw it in practice I saw it in the walkthrough and it allows you to play fast and that's and that's something that I always tell everyone. What made our teams was our practice and our ability to really take those meetings. I mean, that's hard to get, you know, 30 guys to really buy in and go over plays and plays and plays. But that's what made us us. That's what made us us. That's what made us us. And I think probably our best 90 minutes of football

was Super Bowl 51 against the Falcons. Nobody flinched. Hey, we all knew we could see the score, but we all know we're down 28-3. This is not where we want to be. And what flashed through my mind right there, we are the cat that has used up

eight lives. We do not have another one to give. But you know what? The speed we played with, the way we, those last, you know, end of the third, the whole fourth quarter in the overtime, we were playing, you know, lights out football,

just, you know, that we had trained for. Now, how come we put in fucking five two-point conversions? How come we ran extra hills? Did you guys know this was going to be a 120-play fucking game? You know, because we are sitting, we practiced over at Houston University. Oh, yeah, I remember. And we're sitting in the locker room, and Bill said,

you know what, we really need to be ready with these two-point plays. So that was, you know, he had a sense we need to be ready for them. No guarantee that it's going to happen, but we need to be ready for this. And that was, and, you know, the running the hills. Put it in the bank. Put it in the bank. But, you know, one of the great moments to me was, you know, you go on some team and say, we're going to run hills in December,

you'd have a rebellion. Okay? And we had one game, probably around 2016. Practice was over. Bill didn't say a word. The whole team just went over to the hill. Because you know what we're going to do. That turned you on, Ernie.

Yeah. And I said, hey, you know what? This team totally gets it. Champions. They don't need to be told. They know that, and they know this is going to pay off in a big way because one of the great quotes was after Super Bowl 51, Dan Quinn, the head coach of the Falcons, you remember what he said?

What did he say? We ran out of gas. And you know what?? What did he say? We ran out of gas. And you know what? The New England Patriots did not run out of gas. We never ran out of gas. Meanwhile, at halftime, Jules is saying, got to believe. It's going to be a hell of a story. There it is.

It's going to be a hell of a story. You had to say something, Ernie. Listen, this is so – so Bill and I we we because remember we had a super bowl so that halftime instead of being 12 minutes i mean it's forever because we used to practice it so we would practice in the middle of practice we'd take a 24 minute fucking break and we have to do this little dumb ass warm-up they make us do and but then you get to the game and hey this is what this is this is what it is that was that a real advantage to us, you know, because one thing about being in nine Super Bowls, we knew the drill.

And these other teams that come down, they said, Phil, why do I do a ticket? So whatever the families. Tired, exhausted. Exhausted before the game would even start. But one of the great stories from that halftime, so we had extra time, so Bill and I would go and talk. And we'd go and kind of right down at the end of the tunnel,

we just went right out to the locker room. And so it's halftime in this game, and Lady Gaga's doing a concert. And Bill and I are there trying to talk, and we got Lady Gaga just going like this. You know, we're always having to yell at each other. But, you know, hey, we didn't plan for Lady Gaga, but we kind of got it done and came up with a, you know, when you're down like that, you come up with the best plan you can

and let it go and see what happens. You got to play hurt and you got to plan with Lady Gaga in the goddamn background. That's it. Okay. You got to adjust, adapt, and overcome. And if you don't, you die. That's it. That is it.

Totally. Hey, I'm Gianna Pradenti. And I'm Jemay Jackson Gadsden. We're the hosts of Let's Talk Offline, a new podcast from LinkedIn News and iHeart Podcasts. When you're just starting out in your career, you have a lot of questions. Like, how do I speak up when I'm feeling overwhelmed? Or, can I negotiate a higher salary if this is my first real job? Girl, yes!

Each week, we answer your unfiltered work questions. Think of us as your work besties you can turn to for advice. And if we don't know the answer, we bring in experts who do, like resume specialist Morgan Saner. The only difference between the person who doesn't get the job and the person who gets the job is usually who applies. Yeah, I think a lot about that quote, what is it like you miss 100% of the shots you never take. Yeah. Rejection is scary, but it's better than you rejecting yourself. Together, we'll share what it really takes to thrive in the early years of your career without sacrificing your sanity or sleep. Listen to Let's Talk Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your

podcasts. I'm Keri Champion, and this is Season 4 of Naked Sports, where we live at the intersection of sports and culture. Up first, I explore the making of a rivalry, Kaitlyn Clark versus Angel Reese. I know I'll go down in history. People are talking about women's basketball just because of one single game. Every great player needs a foil.

I ain't really near them boys. I just come here to play basketball every single day, and that's what I focus on. From college to the pros, Clark and Reese have changed the way we consume women's sports. Angel Reese is a joy to watch. She is unapologetically black. I love her.

What exactly ignited this fire? Why has it been so good for the game? And can the fanfare surrounding these two supernovas be sustained? This game is only going to get better because the talent is getting better. This new season will cover all things sports and culture. Listen to Naked Sports on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Black Effect Podcast Network is sponsored by Diet Coke. All right, here we go.

It's Cam Jordan from New Orleans Saints here to tell you it's going down on season two of my podcast, Off the Edge with me, Cam Jordan. Can't stop it. You know what's going to happen. Can't stop it. That's right. Catch new episodes every Wednesday, all season long. That's what you look for in year 14 to do more. No days off. Wednesday all season long. That's what you look for in year 14 to do more. And I'll have my friends who happen to be some of the NFL's biggest stars join me on the pod. We'll give you a player's perspective of the biggest storylines, trends, and did that really just happen moments from around the league. And you know we'll have fun doing it. Oh, and I'll have a special guest each month join me to mix it up a little bit who is it

none other than psych you have to tune in to find out so tap in to off the edge with cam jordan's podcast your ultimate playbook for all things football and not football listen on the iheart radio app apple podcast or wherever you get your podcasts. Back to these Ernie cards, okay? People don't realize, but we'd have like three plays that are four-point plays, which is third down in the red area, which are four-point plays because you don't get them, you get a field goal, you need a touchdown. And one time Ernie brings out this like blitz zero look where these guys jump out, and we look at where he got it from.

He got it from when like the defensive coordinator was a quality control guy at UOP in 1991. And Ernie found this one play on a third down in the red area where he used it against a look that we would give him. How many games have you watched, Ernie? Well, a lot. And, you know, it goes not only watch, but take notes. So I have, like, I can go to my book looking for, you know, those crazy situations, you know, and when I write a play, I always label it, hey, this was against, this was whatever, Cal against Stanford 2003, you know, and when I write a play, I always label it, hey, this was against, this was

whatever, Cal against Stanford 2003, you know, and it was play number 58 in the game. So if I really need to go back and find the video, I've got it right there. I don't pretend that I can just, you know, if I had to just rely on my memory for all of it, it'd take me three weeks, which doesn't do any good when the game is Sunday. Sunday. You know, I mean, when I'm doing those cards on Thursday night, I need the information, you know, like right now. Ernie, you could do a guesstimate. Approximately how many games have you watched?

Oh, God. 40 years worth, which is, you know, which is, years worth which is you know which is there's a you know and of course this is you know like we i would take uh you know a team that i thought was good on offense like from probably 2007 to 2019 the two best offensive teams in the national football league over that time were the Patriots and the Saints. Okay, I mean, they were just, you know, year in, year out. You know, both of us, you know, were some of the best teams in the league. So I would, you know, a nice snowy February day,

I'd, you know, take some Saints games and just go through them, you know, and it's one play, just grind it out one play at a time, you know, try to find stuff, you know, that was... People you just grind it out one play at a time you know try to find stuff you know that people don't realize when he's when he's logging these he's watching the play and after each play he's putting down the formation the personnel group the defensive line look the coverage the potential blitz the situation the score like he's putting all that down every time he's watching each play and you're making i'm not you have a no i'm yeah i mean i'm writing you know oh you're writing i'm right yeah yeah yeah yeah you're right on my uh so a hundred thousand hundred thousand games

that's probably a little much and i would pick and choose you know which i mean some games like in all honesty two bad teams playing i would have a hard time you know, which, I mean, some games, like, in all honesty, two bad teams playing, I would have a hard time, you know, getting myself excited about watching, you know, like right now the, you know, the Carolina Panthers playing the Atlanta Falcons. It's, I mean, unless there was something I really wanted to see, it's kind of hard for me to invest three hours to watch it. But if there's teams who are doing interesting things, I thought, hey, there could be something that we could use at some point.

Because there are a lot of plays I might see. I mean, I could go to Josh McDaniels. Hey, here's a couple plays that I've seen in the league. We should think about putting this in for us. And, you know, we were all doing the same thing. If you want to stay current, stay to the art, you know, you really have to be on top of what's going on. Yeah, and you always were.

I mean, I remember a lot of people talk about that whole, what was it, when we had Who-Man doing the formations against Baltimore. I think Alabama, there was someone who was doing it a couple weeks before. Right. And, you know, and listen. And that was probably a project that you. Well, you know, no, it was a lot. Like, you know, I mean, you know, it's like Bill talked to Nick Saban all the time.

Yeah. I mean, there were, I mean, this goes back, because remember, Bill and I met each other as high school teammates in 1970. Okay. 1970. 1970, right. What's Bill like in 1970? Do you have good feet?

You guys are both linemen. we're both terrible but we love football but there's so many times i've heard in the meeting room me and fucking ernie could do this uh well it depends on what we could we you know we could try hard if it required a lot of ability forget it i mean i mean me and Ernie could get out here. Yeah, no. It would have to be something, you know, require a very low level of skill. But we started, you know,

we started basically a running 50-year football conversation. So that was one thing. You know, if something came up, we need to change something 180 degrees at halftime. We didn't have to have a four-hour meeting. Remember that game we had against the Cowboys in 79? Yeah, this is a similar type situation. Yeah, and it worked then.

So we had plenty of those. You guys could finish each other. Right, football-wise, yeah. And we had seen, you know, he remembered things. I might remember a play kind of, and he'd finish, you know, he'd know, oh, yeah, or it was the same. But that's, you know, it's the kind of give and take and the flow and having, you know, with our staff, you know, like having, you know, we were there with Josh for 20 years.

You build up relationships, you know, together. This worked then. It didn't work now. You know, different players, but a little bit similar. So, I mean, you're just trying to, you know, adjust, work your way through it and try to get it to work. What was the scouting report of Bill as a center in 1970? just trying to adjust, work your way through it, and try to get it to work. What was the scouting report of Bill as a center in 1970?

Well, see, because I played guard, so there's kind of a statute of limitations on this. I don't tell. You know, neither one of us were, you know, 180-pound offensive high school lineman. We had a fantastic quarterback who we won all our games. Now, did you guys do anything after practice to give you that? Because linemen always have like a bond. The O-line just always, you know, when you go in the locker room,

the O-line are always by themselves. The O-line are by themselves. You guys what? Going home, looking at scouting reports, drinking beers? Well, it was actually because this was boarding school. Okay. So there was, you know, and it was an intense academic environment, but we found time, you know, to go over, hey, this play, that play.

Because we both kind of knew, you know, that we probably wanted to end up in football. Being real good friends with somebody for over 40 years, it's a real experience. Do you remember the first time you guys met? I do, absolutely. It's kind of a famous story because Bill's dad, Steve Belichick, who was on the staff, he was the godfather of United States Naval Academy football for about 50 years.

But he had written a book called Football Scouting Methods, which I had actually read. And I was at the school for four years. Bill came for his last year as a senior. And he was one of those old, you know, in high school, we had 80 boys out for football. Everybody's got the name on the piece of tape across the helmet. It's this guy Belichick.

There aren't that many Belichicks in the world. So I said, you know, your dad write a book, and Bill looks at me like, you've got to be kidding me. You know, yes. So that's kind of where that started. We got a little. Oh, football. Well, right.

And, of course, it was, you know, I had the. Leather bound. Hard cover. And, of course, the reason the book I have on my shelf is a treasure to me, it was signed to me by Steve. So that was. John Hancock. Yeah, absolutely. And I think if I remember, it was like,

best wishes and may your interest in football always stay with you. What year did he sign that? Well, what about 1970? Did all those wishes come to fruition? Well, basically, yeah. I mean, yeah. And, of course, this was, you know, one of the great things about, you know,

this game with the Rams is after the game, you see Steve Belichick right there on the sidelines. Getting that Gatorade shower. Got it. The Gatorade shower, yeah. So I heard you used to sneak into Boston College spring practices. This was going on. See, actually, there was a third.

It wasn't just Bill and me. Evan Bonds, who's made a life. He's been the, I think he's just stepping down now, but been like the chair of the music department at the University of North Carolina. He was also totally into football. Just legends. Right.

So this was, so if you read the David Halberstam book, Evan and I, we found time. we went over to watch a spring game at Boston University. We were taking notes, and like, may be you coach? What the fuck? What are you guys doing? How old are you? It would have been like 17, 18 years old.

Who was the coach back then at BC? This was Boston University. This was when Boston University played football. It was a guy named Larry Navio. And actually they had... He used to play right off the pike. Right.

Well, you would drive by their stadium, which was originally Braves Field. When the Boston Braves played baseball there, their stadium, it was just a mile up the road from Fenway Park. Yeah. But the Boston Patriots, their first three years, played at Boston University Field.

I remember the pictures in the hallway. Right. You read it in a book. I saw the picture in the hallway. Right. So you read it in a book. I saw the picture in the hallway. Well, right. Well, but one thing you saw the picture in the hallway from 1963 to 68, the Patriots had training camp at the high school where Bill and I ended up going to school. So there's a picture of the 63 Patriots who ended up winning the, not AFC, in the AFL championship. They went out and got crushed by the Chargers in the AFL championship game. But in the hallway at the Patriots, they have all the Patriot teams that won championships. So this is the 1963 AFL East

champions. But it looks like the wooden stands at a high school that's right they they they took it you know during the team picture you guys sneak in there and no no that was i was only about fifth grade julia you never know you never know right so so a story about those training camps was the coach at andover who was there for about 40 years, his name was Steve Sirota, had actually been a teammate of Vince Lombardi's at Fordham. And Fordham had really good football teams. So I gave the eulogy at Coach Sirota's memorial service where 500 people in the chaplet Phillips Academy. So before the 1969 season, Ray Perkins, who I had worked with, he's our receiver coach at the Patriots,

ended up being the head coach of the Giants, and he hired me. And of course, you know, Steve Sirota was a football fan, and he knew that Ray Perkins had played. You talk about football background. Ray Perkins played at. You talk about football background. Ray Perkins played at the University of Alabama for Bear Bryant, and he caught passes as a receiver. His quarterbacks were Joe Namath and Ken Stabler. Wow. He comes in the National Football League. He plays at the Colts for Don Shula, and he catches passes for John Unitas.

So he didn't believe in associating with people who were anything less than pure hall of fame. So I get hired and I had worked with Ray at the Patriots and Ray hires me and Steve knows his background. Steve calls and he says, hey, Ernie, that's great. You tell Coach Perkins that your high school coach played on the Fordham team that beat Alabama. So this is, and this is, you know, Fordham, you know,

playing in the polo grounds. And their coach was Jim Crowley, who, of course, was one of the four horsemen in Notre Dame. Of course. Of course. And every day, Fridays before a game, Coach Crowley would come through the locker room, the Fordham campus is up in the Bronx.

They play at the Polo Grounds, which is down on the upper east, about 154th Street in Manhattan. And he would give every player two subway tokens, one to get from campus down to the Polo Grounds to play the game and one to get from the Polo Groundso grounds to play the game and one to get from the polo grounds back to campus to, you know, after the game. That was big time football, you know, Depression era 1930s in New York. Well, so the Patriots from 63 to 68 have training camp at Andover. And Steve was not only a great football coach, he was a fabulous track coach. And the more complicated the event, the more he liked coaching.

He specialized in coaching the pole vault and the hammer throw. But as a track coach, he was way ahead of his time as far as lifting weights goes. And so the Patriots are training there, and Mike Holovac's the head coach, and Steve says to Mike Holovac, Mike, send me some of your players down in our weight room. I can help them. And Mike Holovac says, why would I want to do that? So you talk about a way that football's changed. I mean, every football player now 13 years up, you know, they all lift weights. This was back, you know, in the mid-60s, you know, hardly anybody was lifting weights. And one of the reasons that the Chargers beat the Patriots so

badly was they were probably the first pro football team to really get the whole team lifting weights. Now, they had a little problem because they were also using steroids. Like, they had, they, I wasn't there, but I heard they had like the pills, you know, during training camp, like in the little dishes on the table. Yeah, like salt and salt. Yeah, it's like an after dinner mint. But they were one of the first teams to really get into strength training. It was a huge edge for them back in the 1960s.

Jeez. I can only imagine the mischief that you and Coach Belichick got into. Well, you just missed it, the Patriots. One of the great people in pro football, one of my favorites of all time, was Bucko Kilroy. Okay, now Bucko was a great player. He was a nose tackle at the Eagles back in the late 40s or early 50s when the Eagles won, I think, back-to-back championships.

And Bucko was the nose tackle. He was an old Irishman from North Philadelphia. He'd say, everybody calls me Bucko, but my mother calls me Francis because that's my first name. They said, Look Magazine wrote an article about Bucko, but my mother calls me Francis because that's my first name. They said, Look Magazine wrote an article about Bucko, and the title of the article was The Dirtiest Player in Pro Football. How did I miss him? Well, he passed away in 2007.

Okay. Just before you got. He was working with the Pats? Yes. But I'll get to that. So Look writes this article, D dirtiest player in pro football. So why would I love him? You call me a dirty player already?

No, no, no. Bucko says, of course, I sued him and I won. But they were right. So after Bucko got through playing, he really was at the forefront in scouting in the National Football League. So all the, you know, the Cowboys, when they got their scouting thing going and using computers, you know, Buckle was right at the forefront of that. But he was an old wreck. He had been in, he was in pro football for 62 years, and his line was 62 years, just as many as Halas.

But he had seen, you know, the league, but he used to say, oh, the shenanigans we used to pull back. So, you know, there's, you know, everybody's looking for an edge, and, you know, Bucco was, you know, he's the famous story, and Bucco was an old defensive tackle yeah and the he was working for the cowboys and they they sent him they were going to play the rams he said bucko you know bucko was up in a tree while trying to watch practice there's a 300 pound defensive lineman there he is there that's that That is one of the absolute greats. But when I got to the Patriots in 1975,

he was the director of player personnel. And a couple of things he always told me was, just remember about the owners, boys. They own the footballs. So just keep that in mind. You know, okay, you've got players, but it's the owners, they own the footballs. And you know what I say about coaches?

You say, we're all just temporary employees. And remember, they fired Paul Brown. And, of course, Bucko was in you know the national football league of the 50s yeah when you know paul brown was you know the king the king just remember they fired paul brown so so i've more than once i just just remember we're just temporary employees hey i'm gianna prudente and i'm jay Jackson-Gadsden. We're the hosts of Let's Talk Offline, a new podcast from LinkedIn News and iHeart Podcasts. When you're just starting out in your career, you have a lot of questions like, how do I speak up when I'm feeling overwhelmed?

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People are talking about women's basketball just because of one single game. Every great player needs a foil. I ain't really near them. Why is that? Just come here and play basketball every single day, and that's what I focus on. From college to the pros, Clark and Reese have changed the way we consume women's sports. Angel Reese is a joy to watch. She is unapologetically black.

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Listen to Naked Sports on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Black Effect Podcast Network is sponsored by Diet Coke. Alright, here we go. It's Cam Jordan from New Orleans Saints here to tell you it's going down on season two of my podcast, Off the Edge with me, Cam Jordan.

Can't stop it. You know what's going to happen. Can't stop it. That's right. Catch new episodes every Wednesday, all season long. That's what you look for in year 14, to do more. No days off! And I'll have my friends, who happen to be some of the NFL's biggest stars, join me on the pod. We'll give you a player's perspective of the biggest storylines,

trends, and did that really just happen moments from around the league. And you know we'll have fun doing it. Oh, and I'll have a special guest each month join me to mix it up a little bit. Who is it? None other than...

Syke! You'll have to tune in to find out. So tap in to Off the Edge with Cam Jordan's podcast, your ultimate playbook for all things football and not football. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Now, you know what we used to say in the locker room? I'm sure you used to say a lot of things. Those lockers are known, boys. Those are rented. Those are rented. Well, you had, it's, you know, same idea. Now, in 75, you're with the Patriots. In 75, coach is with?

The Colts. Colts, Baltimore Colts. So this was, I kind of knew that I'd really like to get in the NFL, and I came in. I had somebody I had known very well at Northwestern, was friends with Hank Boa, who was the defensive coordinator at the Patriots with Chuck Fairbanks' staff, and made an intro for me to come in and do an interview. And I was just fortunate because Chuck Fairbanks had been the head coach

at the University of Oklahoma, where he was used to having a lot of graduate assistants around. So people, you know, break down film and stuff like that. So the concept wasn't foreign to him. So I came in and had the interview with Hank Bulla, which went great. And I went in to see Coach Fairbanks. And it was even then kind of classic New England Patriots. I was basically there as a tryout.

He says, look, we'll give this a go. If it doesn't work, you're going to be gone. And, of course, the salary was commensurate with that, which was zero. But to me, the chance to, you know, hey, get in, work with fantastic people in the NFL, because Chuck had put together, you know, a great staff. I mean, I really, I should have been paying. If I had been paying them, it would have been worthwhile.

Gaining human capital. Human capital in a big way because, you know, now they have, you know, everybody's got two offensive quality control coaches, two defensive quality. No, no, no. I got to do it for both sides of the ball, which is absolutely invaluable if you want to coach. Instead of being just tunnel vision

you know one little area i got to you know i had my office was over with one of the great defensive staffs in the history of the league hank bulla charlie sumner who was the coordinator the raider teams in the super bowl in the early 80s fritz schirmer who ended up being the defensive coordinator for mike holmgren when they you know when they're super, just to go in every day, learning from people like that and the same type of people on offense was just, you know, an invaluable way to break in the game. So I go in, and this is like early of June in 75, and, you know, Bill and I, we had, you know, we didn't go to college together,

but we certainly still know each other. And I said, Bill, you know, I'm going in to, you know, Bill and I, we didn't go to college together, but we certainly still know each other. And I said, Bill, you know, I'm going in to work for the Patriots. To me, this looks like really good. And Bill said, you know what, that sounds like a great thing to do. So that's where he had some people who were coaching at the Colts who had worked with his dad at the Naval Academy. Bill went over and, you know, basically talked his way into the same kind of deal at the colts so that's the way

you know we both we both started in 1975 now in that interview ernie what what value did you bring what did you say you could bring well what i could do you know what's the value what the value is that i had uh because we all heard oh i'll work hard and I'll be – Right. What's the true – Well, number one, I had done a lot of the stuff at Northwestern. And number two, they had – they didn't know it at the time, but I was actually kind of familiar with their offensive system. Yeah. So they put up the stuff for the playbook, which I already knew,

and said, now give it back to me, which I was able to do right after. Easy. Easy. But that's, you know, again, it's the studying. Yeah. Now, were you in – did you ever help with scouting? Like for drafting players? I did because those 1975 Patriots with Bucko Kilroy that we just had up there,

coaches were totally involved in the draft. So when we had our draft meetings, I mean, it was the coaches and Bucko, and I think we had probably four people in the scouting department who basically all went on to be directors of player personnel in the league. And we went through meticulously, you know, all the players. And we'd go player by player. We would discuss them. And everybody, if you had seen the player, if you knew something, you were expected, you know, to contribute.

And so we put a grade on each player. And then we would line them up, you know, from like, say, one to 250, you know, how we would take them. We'd say nominations, we'd put up 10, we'd vote on, you know, how we, and everybody, you know, we vote who our first seven were. And then we take more nominations. So that's the way we put our board up. And so we're there. This is my first year in the NFL. My first draft I went through. It's a cold night in February in the old, you never had the pleasure of being in the old stadium, which was, why did the Patriots go to Foxborough from Boston? Because it was the place they could build the cheapest stadium possible. The land was cheap.

The stadium was built cheap. The first game they ever played in that stadium was a Sunday night preseason game against the New York Giants. And Schaefer had paid for the naming. I don't know. I have no idea what they paid. It wasn't very much. So it was Schaefer Stadium for Schaefer Beer. for the naming. I don't know. I have no idea what they paid. It wasn't very much. So it was Schaefer Stadium for Schaefer beer.

It's a hot Sunday night, and they have the great idea. We'll sell dime beers. And they had, so they're selling dime beers, a hot summer night, and they had a total brand-new stadium, a total plumbing failure. Okay? So you can just imagine. It was bad. And, in fact, before they played another game in the town of Foxborough,

said you're either going to get the plumbing fixed or we're going to take your license away. We are not going to allow you to have another game in the stadium if you don't get this straightened out. That's why you might have always wondered why the big water tower was there. Yeah. That originated that first Sunday night game they played at that stadium. So this was like built as cheaply as possible, and we're there.

It's a February night, and it was a February night because school vacation week was coming up, and Chuck Fairbanks wanted to take his family and go skiing in Durango. So there was some time pressure. We were going to get this board done right. And we put up about 20 players, and Raleigh Dodge is coaching our outside linebackers, and about half our staff had gone to school together at Michigan State.

Now, on this draft night, were you wearing the red vest? No, no, this is just meetings. Oh, God. We didn't have the red vest, though? Well, see, those sweaters came about from that era because they made the red sweater, but it was New England Patriots. Yeah. And Chuck had one of those.

They made them about 13 colors, and Chuck Fairbanks had one of those sweaters in each color. Okay, so it was those were – You've worn it every draft. Pretty much, and it goes in homage to Chuck and the bucko with Adolph. Chuck and bucko. That's tip of the cap. That's tip of the cap total because –

And you wore it in the dynasty. Absolutely, because so much of what we did at the Patriots had its origin back there because that program came to the Giants with Ray Perkins, Bill Parcells. A lot of that went back to Chequem Baco. But we're sitting there. So it's like a New England, old-time winter, snowy.

We send out for Chinese takeout food for dinner, and we're in there about 9 o'clock in Raleigh-Dotch with a cigar. And that's one thing that's really different about that staff. I was like the only one. Everybody smoked cigarettes, a cigar, a pipe, and it was awful. None of this stuff, you can't smoke inside buildings. This is old. Were you smoking?

No. No, but I was like the one who did. And Raleigh's with a cigar. Hey, Chuck, we got this linebacker here, Rick Bonas from Nebraska, and I'm telling you, he's better than his last 20 guys we've put up there. And Chuck, you could see the smoke blowing out of both ears. He went over that board. We had spent probably all afternoon putting these names up. He just ripped them down on the floor. He says, God damn it. I don't want to be shooting dice in this draft. We will start again at eight o'clock tomorrow morning and get this right.

It was one of those moments, you know, it stays with you. Hey, just get it done right. Oh, yeah. Get it done right. Do you remember the last game played in that stadium? The last? I certainly do. Oh, my God. Well, so now we're getting in. We talked about the end of that 2001 season. We played the Rams. And, of course, the way the schedule worked out, they had given the Patriots the bye week, the last week, what was supposed to be the last week of the regular season. Okay?

But then because they had to reconfigure everything with 9-11, everybody then had to go play what was going to be their second game of the season, which had all been canceled because of 9-11. So we went down and had to play the Carolina Panthers. And then because the Jets blocked a punt out against the Raiders, that put us into the two seed. So we then got another bye week before we played the Raiders in the playoffs. So basically we had played one game in four weeks going into that playoff game with the Raiders, which was huge for us.

We were healthy going into those playoffs. And then mercifully, the one night that winter in New England, we get snow for the game. As you probably saw in the Dynasty film, it started snowing in the afternoon, it snowed in the game, which was a huge advantage to us because they were a better team than we were. But they weren't ready for those snowy conditions. Slow them down. Slow them down.

Slow them down. They're quick. Quick. A lot of receivers. You remember the first every year when it would snow, we would go outside and practice on the turf so everybody could get used to how their shoes were going to get work in the snow. So is that why we used to practice in elements?

Absolutely. For the shoes? For the shoes, absolutely. Because you don't want to be out there, you know, slipping around. Slipping around. Cutting off your wrong leg. So we played. So I think, were you there the game with Tennessee?

Oh, yeah. Okay. So what happened was not only did it, so it's. April, it was October 16th. October 16th. And it started to snow. And what you want to wear on a snowy turf field is- Seven stud. Seven stud grass cleats.

And I'm at the pregame, I can see that the Titans, they're going to try to play the game in their molded souls. I knew they're in trouble. So I went and found John Bankston, who's a grounds guy. I said, John, really slow getting the snow off. Just take your time. I think they had one guy at halftime with a shovel out.

We want as much snow. And you can see their linebackers before the play. They're trying to kick the snow out of their cleats. They have no chance. And I don't know if you ever knew Floyd Reese. Yeah, I know.

Okay, well, Floyd, we had hired him as our assistant GM, and he had been at the Titans when they had, I mean, those were really good teams in the early. Air McNair. Air McNair and Eddie George. I mean, that 2003 team that won the Super Bowl, that division playoff game when it was about zero degrees against Tennessee, that was another great football game.

But now we're playing them a little later and they don't have that team. But for Floyd, it was a big deal. And he was upstairs in the press box with him. And I didn't usually talk like this, but I said, hey, Floyd, they got the wrong stuff on their feet. This is going to be an ass-kicking. He looked at me like, what were you talking about?

And it was a 59 to nothing. And the thing about it was, walking out to our cars after the game it was like zero snow zero because it hit the hit the pavement and it melted but the snow it stayed on the field which is where we wanted it oh now did you scout that out from uh from the ernie box no no this was the this this was like down you know pregame Pre-game. Pre-game. I knew. What's your pre-game ritual? I always wanted to go watch, you know, watch the team we're playing. Quarterback. Really want to watch the kickers and then watch, you know, the kicker.

You know, see what was this. You know, because we played some bad windy days. How's this guy handling it? And then go watch the kicker and go watch the quarterback. Because some guys like playing. He's probably still in the league, so I shouldn't say this – but playing Tyrod Taylor, this guy has no fastball. We can actually play zone against this guy because our defensive players are going to have time to react in a zone.

You go play against a guy like John Elway, forget about playing zone because that ball is coming so fast. You can think you get no chance of reacting to it. None. So, you know, but I wanted to go put eyes on the court, see exactly what we're dealing with. And, you know, sometimes. Walk the field, see the surfaces. Always, you know, see how slippery it is and, you know, what parts of the field.

I mean, we had those games at Gillette Stadium where they played, like, the soccer game the night before. Yeah. And they – Matted it down. No, they went out and painted, you know, painted the stuff. I mean, I'm out there in the middle of the field. I smell paint.

It was, you know, the lines on the field that they tried to, you know, it was crazy. But, you know, you got to know what the conditions are. Now, you go in, you're looking at the wins, you had your little pregame. Who was one of the players you were most impressed with scouting? Whether that we took or we didn't take. One that we took and one that we played against. I'll tell you, the one that was most impressive pregame,

hands down, was Peyton Manning. And I could go out and watch. And so many of these teams, their quarterbacks are out there. They're doing their drops half speed. They're listening to the music. I'm looking at them. Man, you could have no chance. First series of the game, what are you going to do?

Now, Peyton Manning, he came out on that field. And I mean, when his cleats hit that grass he was all business everything full speed the drops are full speed the ball handling's full speed I mean it's no screwing around here I mean this guy's fast gotta start fast hey first first play of the game this guy is going to be ready to go as I mean so many of the others they're going to take that first series of the game to get used to it, and, you know, that just doesn't work. Yeah. So it's, you know, you knew, or like going to play, I'll tell you, going to play Andy Reid's team of the Chiefs,

you just tell the way they're coming out to warm up, you're going to be in a football game. Yeah. I mean, these guys are ready to go, which I think, you know, we were ready to go. Always. Always. But the teams just come out, and you can tell it's kind of half-assed.

What are you guys thinking? You get once a week for three hours to do your fucking job. You can't slide a game or two. This is National Football League. Are you finishing my sentences, Ernie? Yeah, I am. Because, Jules, we were together at that. We know the drill.

I know. Yeah, and not only do we know the drill, a big reason we won is we had everybody knew the drill, and we all bought into it. There's only one way to do it. So we actually have Ty Law on Friday. Okay. Talking the 2003 game against Peyton Manning in the snow.

Okay. Should I got to ask him anything? Well, here's the only thing. Here's what I will tell you. We had three playoff games by the time of the Patriots where we played against offenses that scored 500 points in the regular season. Now, that's a lot. That's like 30-plus points a game.

So that's the Rams here in Super Bowl XXXVI, the Colts in the AFC Championship game in 2003, and the Rams then in Super Bowl 53 in 2018 and we we threw a shutout at these guys for 50 minutes then the dam kind of started to break a little bit why why uh you know what they they kind of we did them we did a really good job adjusting from that regular season game to the Super Bowl against us I think they weren't – I don't think they were expecting the playoffs. They only had a week. So they kind of went in a little bit the same way they did the regular season game,

which we were ready for. Do what they do. Do what they do. And they – listen, they're good. They figured it out. They started hitting the sun. So, you know the the pass up the seam what do we always call that pass up the seam how about ram pass a ram pass yeah how many times

you heard this talk about ram pass everybody yeah that's defense for the scott right 525 f post swing i mean it was like staple well they started to run a ram pass against it and they had a step on us a couple times, and they ran it like five times for five different formations, different personnel groups, and they came back and tied the game up. And then we went back and won it again. But the Colts in 03, I think the final score of the game was 26-3, and the only reason it wasn't a zero was because we dropped an interception in the end zone that we should have had, and they kicked the field goal.

So we held them to three points, and then Super Bowl 53 against the Rams in 2018, we held them to three points. So that was, you know, those to me were three... 500-point teams, three points. 500-point teams. I mean, those to me were three. 500-point teams. 500-point teams. I mean, those were masterpieces. And what I remember, that 0-3 game that you're going to talk to Ty about, after the game they had, you know, on the whatever network was doing it,

one of their guests for the game was Mike Shanahan, coach of the Broncos. And, I mean, his team had been chewed up by the Colts. I mean, they got massacred by the Colts. And Mike Shanahan went on and said, I can't believe I just saw what I saw, which I took as a real, you know, that's like a real compliment from somebody who really knows this is something special right here. But I will say part of that was because I knew in the middle of November

it was going to come down to us playing the Colts. Yeah. That was what it was then. That's what it was. And you know what? It didn't matter if we were playing, you know, the Jets in a regular season game. I made a point of spending an hour a day at least.

One hour a day. Studying the Colts. You know, just in the middle, just to make sure. Now what's the study? Just watching the game? Watching the game. Logging it? Logging it.

And the thing was, they would get, everybody was trying to play him in cover three and cover one, and they killed him running up the seams. Dallas Clark? Oh, my God. It was a slaughter. And so I said, we can't do this. We need to go in and play cover four.

We cannot get chewed up in the seams. And Romeo Cornell, our defensive coordinator, is one of my favorite people, said, when do you want to play cover three? Never. Not against this team. Just don't do it. They will kid you.

Okay. That's kind of what teams would do to us because of Gronk and the seams. So I go, this is maybe two years ago, and I'm watching a Monday night game, and I'm watching the simulcast with Eli and Peyton Manning, and somebody's playing cover four, and Peyton Manning goes, yeah, cover four. I don't really like my in-cuts and my seams against that, and I'm sitting there thinking, yes yes that's why we played it oh i mean it just it made my day oh ernie you know but that's getting off on reading

they got scouting books hey they got 30 years down the road hey listen eli and Peyton, they got us plenty, okay? I mean, they got us plenty. So, I mean, you know, it was, I mean, those were, and, you know, people say we went to nine Super Bowls. No, we went to 10 because that AFC championship game against the Colts in 06, it was, well, first place, the NFC team was going to be the Bears. We had beat the Bears in the regular season for like 40 to 7 or something. And there was no way that Bears team,

there was no way they were going to be able to play against either the Colts or us. Everybody on that field knew this is for the championship. And, you know, they came back and, you know, we got up ahead of them. They came back. Remember it transferred, though? You know, then when Peyton went to Denver, then it became Denver for us. It was us versus Peyton.

And, you know, to this day. Cover four. Cover four. And I was just talking to somebody earlier today. But then you know what they got us on the cover four? That's when they started putting that tight end outside and putting Jamie Lee out there, and then they do that double move yeah yeah listen they this was like you know that this is this is a chess meets chess match except those other chess pieces they can fight back and

they run fast yeah you know so it's con you know i mean it's constant but you know everybody talks about you know of course we had in 2014 that great game against the Ravens. We had to come from behind and beat them. You hit Danny on the touchdown pass. Then the Super Bowl against the Seahawks. But the most truly amazing thing that year was, remember in the divisional playoff game, somehow, I have no idea to this day how this happened,

the Broncos lost to the Colts. Oh, I know. How did... This is like... That just shouldn't have happened. In Denver. I mean, it was like... I remember we went into that week.

We knew perfectly well, hey, we've got the Ravens, and we're going to have to go play the Broncos the next week. And they lost to the Colts. It just... It happens, but it shouldn't have happened. Any given Sunday, Ernie. Yeah, well, that to me was a game that proved it because Denver was so much better than, you know, it's like we ended up beating the Colts 45-6 or something.

The Colts couldn't play with us. They should not have been able to play with Denver. It should have been Patriots-Broncos for another Brady-Mannings-AFC championship game matchup. I know. But listen, they got – so we got the Colts in 03 and 04, and they came back, and the brothers, they got us plenty good. Eli brothers.

All right, one thing before we dive into Super Bowl XXXVI. Something, me being a patriot, I've heard, what is it? You being part of the patriot organization since 75, then jumped around, went to Wall Street, made a bunch of money, which we'll dive into that maybe. What is the patriot way, Ernie? Okay, it's really complicated. It's really complicated. It's really complicated.

Show up for work every day with a smile on your face. Never did that. Check your ego at the door. And you better check your ego at the door. Otherwise, you're going to get your head taken off. That's true. And just go, you know, hey, try to get better every day. And that's what we really had, what made us go with the Patriots. We had a great

group of people. The great Bucko Kilroy said about players in the NFL, you should not deal in personalities, but nobody needs an asshole on their team. We really tried to keep it asshole free. I was an asshole. No, not like a, listen, pro football is not a game for normal, well-adjusted human beings. We've all got some asshole tendencies, but we basically kept it – Vrabel was a huge asshole. Particularly when he would go on the defensive scout team, play a weak safety, delivering running commentary. That was priceless.

But you know what? That's when I knew Mike really had in him to be a good coach. Right there. He was taking scout team defense at weak safety so he could really study the whole thing. But you remember, he would, okay, boys, it's formation in the boundary. Smell some shit here. They're coming back. And it would drive, you know, okay, boys, it's formation in the boundary. Smell some shit here. They're coming back.

And it would drive, you know, the offensive coaches, it would drive them crazy. But Mike, you know, I mean, he had just the right edge. He did. You need a little asshole. You need a little, but what you don't need are the real flamers who can blow your team up. No.

That's which, you know. Yeah, put that out right away, Aaron. Absolutely. Are you the fire extinguisher? You know, people always say about, you know, people drinking the Kool-Aid. Bill and I went down in the sub-basement. We mixed the Kool-Aid.

Oh. So that's where, just so, you know, so getting everything, you know. You mixed it. Mixed it. What flavor? so, you know, so getting everything, you know. You mixed it. Mixed it. A little flavor. Whatever flavor you want, but it's going to have the Patriots ingredients in it. And, you know, we just try to, you know,

they did in the Dynasty film they had, you know, with Gronk on, they had the thing with, you know, doing, you know, at the draft, you know, the family. Yeah. And Bill did call him up because I was in the draft, the family, the dance. Bill did call him up because I was in the draft room right next to Bill. What Bill said to Rob was, enough of the war dance. Put everybody

right up front. This is some things we do, some things we don't do. Any funny Gronk stories? Let me hear your Gronk do. Any funny Gronk stories? Let me hear your Gronk story. My favorite Gronk story was when he said, he told me, you know, I have a lot of fun,

and everybody knows I'm fun-loving, and I do all these endorsements and stuff, and the money I make from those, I just, you know, I have fun with it. He said, my football money, I've never spent a nickel of it. And I said, man, okay, this is a guy who gets it. You know, he can come, fun loving, all that. But you know what? The thing with Rob, when you get to know him, when it gets down to business, he is totally dead ass serious. Dead ass serious. And that's what I, you know.

He's an assassin. He's an assassin. And that, you know, I mean, that's, you know, that in the end, that's what everybody in the building, everybody who was there knew it. And that's why we all loved him. Did you remember hearing about Gronk falling asleep on his visit? Well, what I remember was he had, he had, he had a, he was doing a phone, you know, this pre-draft. You try to get to know players before the draft.

I mean, it's a real – when you've had a guy in training camp for two weeks, you know. Oh, yeah. Trying to get to know him before the draft, you do the best you can, but it's really hard to get somebody to really know somebody who you haven't worked with. Now, what's an Ernie Combine question? We had 15 minutes. It goes pretty fast.

But we always wanted to tell me about what's the thing you're really proud of in football. Tells a lot about a guy. Right. If he goes individual stat, he's an eye guy. the thing you're really proud of in football. Tells a lot about a guy. Right. If he goes individual stat, he's an eye guy. If he goes team. And like the one I remember was, you know, I think I got this right. Joe Burrow, will you remember? State championship game in Ohio.

Came down on a goal line stand, and he was the linebacker. That's what you knew. Okay. This is, hey, right here, this is my kind of guy. He's a killer. Right, right. He's a football player.

It's like Julian Edelman, wide receiver. I need a defensive back. It's the AFC championship game. Julian, go play defensive back. You know, your contract says play football. It doesn't say play wide receiver and don't work hard on Fridays. No, it's be a football player. Yeah.

And sometimes you just got to be a football player. And a forced fumble. Hey, listen, you're on defense. You're supposed to force fumbles. You know, I used to cheat because I would just study conceptually what they would do in my situation. I'd only come in really on third down in a passing situation on second down. And so if they were in like a trips,

A, I'd just hold them for five yards because they're not going to call it, and I knew receivers hated that. And B, just play to your leverage, play to your help, and then make a tackle if you have to. Honestly, defense is so much easier. So much easier. You get to fly around. You get to tackle Vince Young. You get to use your much easier you get you get to fly around you get to you get to tackle

vince young you get to use your hands use your hands you're totally you know it's totally legal and what did you how many times did you hear bill talk to those defensive backs when you're leverage when you're leverage if you actually understand what that means and do it that's half i didn't lose my lever journey if you watch the film. Right, because – I may have got smoked a couple times. Well, listen, it's the National Football League. The other guys are good. You are going to get smoked.

Everybody's going to get beaten now and then, but playing smart, you know, just gives you the best chance, knowing where your help is. You know, it's knowing on cover one you get help in the middle if you play outside levers. Cover five, you know, you's knowing on cover one, you get help in the middle. You play outside leverage cover five. You know, you don't let somebody inside. Didn't you used to, like, I'm thinking that AFC championship game against the chiefs. We're an inside passing team.

They go to cover five and open up the middle of the field for us. Thank you. Every time, every time. I mean, they're trying to have that thief over there. We just bang it right before him. And then that, when that thief came over to me, that's when we hit Gronk on the slam. But if you're playing defensive cover five,

do not ever, ever, ever let the guy inside. You know, but that's just wide open. That's playing smart football. Do you remember the scouting process when you guys were scouting Brady? You know, really, it was, yeah. The number one thing you want to see on a football player is, what does he do in the games?

I mean, it's, you know, that is, it's kind of a bottom line business. And when you get somebody who goes in and plays well in the games, that's what gets your attention. And we had, you know, one person you never knew, a great guy, Dick Rabine was our quarterback coach who unfortunately died during training camp in 2001. Oh, wow.

And we got on a treadmill and, you know, had a heart issue and he died. But, you know, don't try to make it too complicated. If a guy goes in the game against good competition and plays well, that is what we're trying to do. It's not about, you know, the combine stuff, which is important, but, you know, it's really what does the guy do when he gets on the field against good competition. And so you get Brady, hey, have a great bowl game against Alabama.

I mean, you know, and play well when you're in there. There's a lot of things as a player you can't control, but what you can control is what you actually do when you get out on the field. He always used to talk about that. When did you know he was a killer? You know, when I first, Tom's rookie year in 2000, he was like, he was the third-string quarterback,

and he was not going to get in the game. I mean, you know, unless you – look, if you have two guys get injured in the same game, he can get in, but it wasn't going to happen. And after practice, he would go grab our young rookie tight end, Chris Eitzman, and take him over on the side and make Chris run patterns for him. But it wasn't just running patterns. Tom wanted to call the play. It's third and six.

All right, Eitz, this is the play we're going to run. Call it out, you know. Tom wanted to put himself through the situation. Here's the way I'm going to call the play in this situation. It's not just let's just go run around and play catch. You know, we actually think in a game, think in situations. And, you know, I always figured if a player was going to stay out late after practice, somebody should, you know, honor him by going over

and watching. So I'm just standing watching this. You know, this guy, he's really trying to get ready to play, even though he has no chance of playing this week. And of course, Tom's the guy. Yeah. If you wanted to get in the right stance, how do you get in the right stance? You practice it in front of the mirror. You just do, you know, being obsessive compulsive can get you in trouble sometimes, but you can also lead to great results.

And that's the way I kind of look at that. You know, Tom is the ultimate obsessive compulsive among players because he's not – Tom Brady didn't just drop out of the sky a Hall of Fame quarterback. He made himself into a Hall of Fame quarterback. And when people would tell me at the draft, yeah, I work hard as Brady. You're full of shit.

You have no idea what you're talking about. And that's the – 100% correct. I mean, I got there. He already had three Super Bowls, and he was still flying in a coach week 11 to work on his little fundamentals after a practice. Hey, but you know what? That was when he was a – that's what people don't see.

They don't see. They don't understand. And that was kind of like when I was a four. You know, that's what people don't see. They don't see. They don't understand. And that was kind of like when I was talking about being impressed with Peyton Manning warming up before the game. When it's football now, I mean, it's dead-ass serious, 100% every time. There's no – you don't take any plays off in practice. He never did.

Never did. And you know what? He would – if you ran him wrong, first time he'd say, hey, Jules, we really want to do it this way. And then he expects you to get it right that second time. Hey, if you might not quite understand the first time, that's not a problem. Screwing up after he explained it to you, that's a problem.

Make a mistake. He just can't make the same mistake twice. Right. And with him, I was a problem. Make a mistake. You just can't make the same mistake twice. Right. And with him, you know, I was a punching bag for him because the more success that we had, he could never really get on guys as hard as he wanted to because they, you know, they've been watching him since before they were born.

You know what I mean? So it got to a point where it was good to see him do that. We'll be right back after this quick break. Games with Names is brought to you by my friends at Wynn Las Vegas and Encore Boston Harbor. Wynn Las Vegas and Encore Boston Harbor are the ultimate destination for sports and entertainment fans. From the sports book to gaming, restaurants, live music, and more.

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Remember to sign up for win rewards to redeem resort credit in Las Vegas and Boston. Enjoy it all in a luxury resort setting with a five-star accommodation and all the amenities you can dream up. I'll see you in Las Vegas or Boston soon. Let's jump in and go back in time, Ernie. This is a segment we do where we go back in the time

around February 2nd, 2002, and we go over pop culture and we just kind of bounce around and see what you know about that. It's 22 years ago. 22 years ago? Seems like it was yesterday. Like yesterday. Yeah. I was in seventh grade or eighth grade.

I was in eighth grade, Ernie. Number one movie, Black Hawk Down. Did you ever see it, Ernie? Jules, I'm kind of old-fashioned. It's one of my favorite authors. I read the book. I haven't seen the movie. You read the book?

I read the book. And by the way, this guy, Mark Bowden, he wrote one of the great books about football. The two books, if somebody says, tell me, how do I learn about football? The two books I would recommend are Run to Daily by Vince Lombardi and Bring in the Heat by Mark Bowden,

which is about the early 90s Philadelphia Eagles. If you want to know what being on a pro football team is like, that's as close as you're going to get to somebody who gets it. Number one movie, Ern. But I'm glad that it came from an unbelievable book. Jack, you got something? Speaking of great football books, Mr. Adams, are you responsible for Friday Night Lights?

Yes. Yeah! I read that anecdote, and I had to know if it was true or not. That is true. So we've got Friday Night Lights. Now there's a piece of classic Americana, so I will tell you the story. Buzz Bissinger, who wrote the book, was a year behind Bill and me at Phillips Academy in Andover. So when Bill and I actually played together on our

senior team in 1970, the reporter for the school newspaper who covered it was Buzz Bissinger, who went on to write Friday Night Lights. So Friday Night Lights wasn't really his intro to high school football. It was covering Bill and me. So Buzz goes on, and he goes on to be a writer. And his agent in the late 1980s was my dearest friend in the world, Michael Carlyle. And Buzz calls me up. And Buzz says, I'm thinking about going out to western Pennsylvania and writing a book about high school football and the team and the town because I know they're really interlinked.

And I know Buzzy has never been west of Philadelphia in his life. So I'm going to have some fun with him. And I say, Buzzy, if you want to do this, get your ass out to west Texas where they take their football seriously. And you call my friend Bill Reese, who at the time was the football recruiting coordinator at UCLA. Bill will tell you what high school to go to because he knows all of them. So Buzz says, OK. He calls Bill. Bill says, you need to go to Odessa Permian. And that's how

Friday Night Lights came to be written at Odessa Permian High School. And I tell Buzz, I said, Buzz, I changed your life on one phone call because when they write your obituary, it's going to be Buzz Bissinger, comma, author of Friday Night Lights, comma, so on and so forth. So Ernie Adams is going to be Ernie Adams' football encyclopedia creator of Friday Night Lights. No, no, not the creator. I just kind of got the ball rolling. I mean, you know, because Buzz is a fabulous writer. You not only wrote the book about Tony La Russa coaching the car.

You know, that's, I mean, he's a fantastic writer. That right there. You know, we're over here just trying to dick around, Blackhawk down, number one movie. Ernie's got a story about the author who wrote the book. What a genius. speak up when I'm feeling overwhelmed? Or can I negotiate a higher salary if this is my first real job? Girl, yes. Each week we answer your unfiltered work questions. Think of us as your work besties you can turn to for advice. And if we don't know the answer, we bring in experts who do

like resume specialist Morgan Saner. The only difference between the person who doesn't get the job and the person who gets the job is usually who applies. Yeah, I think a lot about that quote. What is it like you miss 100 percent of the shots you never take? Yeah, rejection is scary, but it's better than you rejecting yourself. Together, we'll share what it really takes to thrive in the early years of your career without sacrificing your sanity or sleep. Listen to Let's Talk Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm Keri Champion, and this is season four of Naked Sports, where we live at the intersection of sports and culture. Up first, I explore the making of a rivalry. Kaitlyn Clark versus Angel Reese. I know I'll go down in history. People are talking about

women's basketball just because of one single game. Every great player needs a foil. I ain't really near them. Why is that? I just come here to play basketball every single day, and that's what I focus on. From college to the pros, Clark and Reese have changed the way we consume women's sports. Angel Reese is a joy to watch. She is unapologetically black.

I love her. What exactly ignited this fire? Why has it been so good for the game? And can the fanfare surrounding these two supernovas be sustained? This game is only going to get better because the talent is getting better. This new season will cover all things sports and culture. Listen to Naked Sports on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Black Effect Podcast Network is sponsored by Diet Coke.

All right, here we go. It's Cam Jordan from New Orleans Saints here to tell you it's going down on season two of my podcast, Off the Edge with me, Cam Jordan. Can't stop it. You know what's going to happen. Can't stop it. That's right. Catch new episodes every Wednesday, all season long. That's what you look for in year 14, to do more.

No days off. And I'll have my friends, who happen to be some of the NFL's biggest stars, join me on the pod. We'll give you a player's perspective of the biggest storylines, trends, and did that really just happen moments from around the league. And you know we'll have fun doing it. Ha! Yeah! Oh, and I'll have a special guest each month. Join me to mix it up a little bit. Who is it? None other than...

Psyche! You'll have to tune in to find out. So tap in to Off the Edge with Cam Jordan's podcast, your ultimate playbook for all things football and not football. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Let's go back into sports world this time. National Championship was Miami.

Ooh, I remember that. That's when the Miami Hurricanes, they were still in that totally dominant phase. I mean, they could go. None of those players worked at the Combine because they knew the whole National Football League was going to come to school to watch them. Oh, yeah.

I mean, that's when the U. The U, that's when, yeah. Well, I mean, it started in the 80s, and then they left for a little bit, and then they came back. Yeah. Ken Dorsey? Was it Ken Dorsey? He was, you know, the year probably.

It was Ken Dorsey, and they had a really good running back. Yeah, Portis. Portis, Clinton Portis. I mean, they had a lot of players. Kurt Warner was the MVP. Yep. What was the scouting report on Kurt? You know what, boy?

I mean, went from bagging groceries to NFL MVP. They had the fastest show on turf. And I mean, they were the real deal on offense. Yeah. You were kind of holding on to your butt with both hands. And they had, you know, with Marshall Faulkner, the offensive line and receivers. I mean, 500 points.

I mean, they were totally legit. Yeah. Houston Texans became the National Football League's 32nd franchise. What about those Texans last year? C.J. Stroud, I didn't. You know what? And they played their first preseason game against the Patriots. And you guys picked them.

He had a couple of bad plays. Man, I said, this guy got a long way to go. Well, somewhere he got it going pretty fast. Fast. Fast. I mean, he was able to adjust. And he looked calm the whole year. Yeah, yeah.

And that's a testament to the offensive coordinator and the relationship that they had and developed in such a short time. That's what people don't realize. What do you think's evolved the most to nowadays football, looking at like a C.J. Stroud and how football is being called? What's the biggest jump? It's really become more of a space game. I mean, the National Football League has always been about

the passing game has always been about the passing game has always been much more developed than you get in college. But it's the whole, I mean, everybody's kind of gone in the same direction. I mean, I've, high school football now, they're all spread out. You know, college, it's all spread out. It's, you know, making everybody, you know, play in space. And you have, you know, high school kids. You know, when Bill Walsh was coaching quarterbacks at the 49ers,

I mean, he was doing stuff, you know, quarterback's footwork. You know, he was, you know, light years ahead of his time. I mean, everybody's doing that in high school now. Information. Information. I mean, I thought it was about the 1960 New England, Boston Patriots. You know, we'd never even think about lifting weights. I mean, you know, kids are so much bigger, stronger.

Are you watching football still? Yeah. Who in the league right now are you impressed with what they're doing? Oh, I've been impressed for about the last seven years with the Chiefs. And I thought last, you know, talk about adjusting to the situation. They get into a situation where I think they knew they were struggling to tackle, to protect. You know, the center, Stevenson, Joe Tooney,

who's a hell of a player, guard, struggling a little bit to tackle. So you know what? Do what you got to do. You got Travis Kelsey. Hey, he's chipping. I mean, they're all chipping. They're chipping the defensive ends before they get out because if you don't have pass protection, I don't care who you got Travis Kelsey. Hey, he's chipping. I mean, they're all chipping. They're chipping the defensive ends before they get out because if you don't have pass protection,

I don't care who you got back there. It's going to be a problem. So they adjust. They need to help the tackles. They help the tackles. Yeah. I mean, they have been really impressive because it gets harder.

What people don't realize, which we experienced, it gets harder and harder each year. And to see how these last two years they were able to evolve their team and have the humility. That takes a lot for a guy like Patrick Jones to have the humility to take that check down, to hit where the ball is supposed to go, to hit where the ball is supposed to go, play possession football, play to our good defense.

And then the one time they they mess up that's when you hit the 22 yard in you know that that's right and this is taken into account you know they don't have they don't have Tyree Kiel no I mean so that's why they've real they've done this and I'm not taking anything you know I mean they everybody knows they had a little issue catching the ball last year. And you just keep plugging away. Keep plugging away. I mean, never quit.

Never quit on a play. And that's like we had, if you remember, one day we had some Patriots guests come in. And we had one of my favorite people who that first draft I was in, we took fifth pick in the draft, Mike Haynes. Now Mike had a Hall of Fame career as a defensive back. By the way, if he had stayed at wide receiver, because Frank Cush at Arizona State moving to defensive back, he'd have been a Hall of Fame receiver too because he had phenomenal ball skills, punt return skills.

They needed somebody on defense, they put him over on defense. But the thing, I remember this was Mike came in talking to the defensive backs and he said, hey, never quit on a play. If you're beat by a step, just keep going because the ball might not be perfect and you still might have a chance to make a play. Never quit. Never quit. Never quit. Ernie, can I have you come talk to my 7-year-old daughter right now

when sometimes the ball gets taken from her in soccer? Can't quit on the play. Can't quit on the play. I mean. You can't quit. Kids, no one is that good. You guys aren't that good to quit on a play. Look at the greatest of greats.

They never quit on a play. Listen, you may get beat by a step. It may be a perfect pass. It may be a touchdown. But there's a good chance the pass won't be perfect, and just keep playing. Keep playing. And that's what the 2001 New England Patriots did

against the greatest show on turf, against the defending Super Bowl champions. Jackie, will you please break this game down and set the stage? What a gorgeous segue. What a segue. I love it. All right, let's run through these Rams real quick. As Jules mentioned earlier

this is the greatest show on turf era we uh we all remember they beat the uh the titans one yard short two years prior to this uh the only team in nfl history to score over 500 points in three straight seasons um 14 and two record best record in franchise history eight no on the road some dudes we love naming dudes kurt warner marshall falk isaac bruce tory hulk aeneas williams orlando pace adam archuleta's rookie season grant winstrom he was a tough deal i used to watch adam archuleta do these hamstring things i was like oh my god he's got some strong hamstrings. London Fletcher. London Fletcher. London Fletcher never missed a down. Iron Man. Iron Man.

That's like one of the most impressive. Him and Derrick Brooks, I think, were two linebackers that never missed a play of football. Well, and I want to – okay, so we're talking 2001. I want to give you another stat that's, to me, impressive. Two of the guys on our team, two of our great linebackers, the Patriots, Mike Frabel and Teddy Bruschi, each had, I think, 1,100 plays on defense,

and they each had 200 plays on special teams. Yes. Okay. More you can do, Ernie. More you can do. Hey, you need me on special teams? That's what I'm here for. Now, you probably, with this latest CBA,

that would probably be ruled illegal by the Players Association. Illegal. Forget it. But both Mike and Teddy, they were in there on special teams. I like talking about the Patriot way. They just don't make it like they used to. You know, Ernie, my first day introduced to stabbing on punt team, I was paired up with Teddy Bruschi. Did you get an on punt team. Okay.

I was paired up with Teddy Bruschi. Did you get an education? Yeah. Okay. He basically said if I ever touch him again, he'll cut off my arm. So I had to do the next rep stabbing the air behind him. Hey, got to get those reps in. But Teddy Bruschi, to the day he retired, was doing fucking special teams.

Like, he was doing special teams drills. I love that. That's a real football player. a real football player which which and that was the key if you say one thing that was the key to the new england patriot success is we had real football players the patriot way hey get real football players and let's go do it eat some dirt take a tablespoon of cement get bitched at put a dip in go in meetings, and then play in the last game of the year. Okay. And one thing else about this 2001 team, because that was the last season and the old season, but the new stadium was a construction site.

And we all knew we could hear the bells. We knew when the blaster was coming, because then they had to blast that out of the side of a hill. We knew when the blaster was coming and get that little jolt in the earth and we also knew when the wind picked up it was going to look like one of those those sandstorms on the sahara that wind wall of wind a dirt would be coming right at you you do something you just had to turn around and let it hit you in the back you didn't want You didn't want to catch that right in the face. I picture Ernie riding a camel with, like, a Sahara headband. And you talk about facilities.

We had one of those bubbles, you know, that they pump the air in for the indoor practice. Well, right here in the playoffs, it got enough snow on it. The bubble collapsed. For practice, we had to bus every day up to Boston College to get an indoor practice facility. So that was about 45 minutes up to BC practice, get in the bus and go back.

And for all you listeners out there who say, oh, why are they going to the indoor facilities? Because the game was going to be in an indoor facility, so they were getting the preparation for the game. Well, right. It was just one of those real New England's. Because we used the bubble three times in my career, maybe four, once when the fields were way too frozen,

and then a couple other times where you guys would pump up the heat as hot as you possibly could in December, and then you guys would spray the water. You'd put puddles of water to get humidity up to play against Miami. Actually, it was because we didn't practice here for the Super Bowl because we played – remember, we played the championship. Oh, yeah. But it was like getting ready to go play.

Regular game. Yeah. There was no bye week. But we ended up having to take an hour and a half, go do a bus ride where you could practice football. What made this offense the greatest show on turf so special? They did, you know, Mike Martz was. Did you see him in the documentary?

He was still salty. Still salty. And he was going to try to destroy people throwing the ball. They got great skill people, great protection, and they were one of the, you know, use motion, get out there, use Marshall Falk as, you know, that receiver coming in. He wasn't just, he was as good a receiver as they had coming out of the backfield.

So use all the receivers. Kurt Warren, they did a great job. Open it up, spread it out, get people in motion. These 49ers of now remind me of that kind of offense where they... They may have, but they haven't quite hit the... Well, I mean... Yeah, right. Well, this is the evolution of football.

You know, the Rams were playing a lot. They were playing football in 2001 the way a lot more people are playing now. And, of course, everybody, okay, hey, these guys scored 500 points. Everybody would study them and try to incorporate what they're doing. You know, they used to say, you know, if you just go to take what one coach is doing and copy that, it's stealing. If you look at what a lot of coaches are doing, that's research. Okay?

A lot of people do a lot of research. You know, if a coach has got an idea that works, it's going to show up with, you know, 10 other people doing it next week. What was up with their defense, Ernie? You know, they were the – Lovey Smith was their defensive coordinator, and they were playing a very – like the way they played. He had been at Tampa with Monty Kiffin with the Tampa 2.

Tampa 2. You know, and he really incorporated, you know, the Tampa 2 scheme in there, and they had some guys who could really come off the ball and rush the passer. That Tampa 2 came down to the last drive. We won't get into it now, but that's why he was hitting the checkdowns probably. Jackie, why don't you jump into the New England Patriots

and set the stage for the Pats? Let's do it. Let's do it. We talked about a lot of these guys earlier. This was a team of some real-deal football players, some OG Patriots, Tom Brady, Troy Brown, Lawyer Malloy, Ty Law, David Patton, J.R. Redmond, Joe Andrewsie, Jermaine Wiggins, Kevin Troy Brown, Lawyer Malloy, Ty Law, David Patton, J.R. Redmond, Joe Andrewsie, Jermaine Wiggins, Kevin Falk, Adam Venteri,

Teddy Bruschi, Vrabel, Seymour's rookie season, Matt Light's rookie season, Willie McGinnis, Otis Smith, Ted Johnson, Roman Pfeiffer, Damian Woody, Anthony Pleasant. This was the second year of Bill's tenure in New England. Coming off a year where they finished fifth in the AFC East. So expectations were like a little up in the air, but they had just signed Drew Bledsoe to a huge contract.

10 years, $103 million in the offseason leading into this one. Million dollar quarterback. Crazy, right? Terry Glenn was also on this roster. Suspended a good bit and only ended up playing four games this season. Wasn't on that playoff run. And this was the season Tom was thrust into the starting role, only his second year in the league,

and also got to give some flowers to this coaching staff. Bill, Charlie Weiss, Romeo Cornell, Ernie, Scar, Andre Tippett was in the front office. Dayball was a coaching assistant. Pepper Johnson, Rob Ryan, outside linebackers coach. Scott Pioli, this was a loaded OG Patriots brain trust front office and coaching staff. Ernie, hearing that group of coaches,

which group of coaches through your Patri patriot tenure did you feel that you guys were clicking yeah you know which was your favorite staff to work with i mean the one thing i'm gonna go back to my four years at the patriots with chuck fairbanks that clicked basically every i mean i got to come to work for four years with Chuck and for 20 years with Bill, and basically we were doing things the right way and clicking. I mean, it was fun. Hey, it was fun coming to work.

Yeah, I mean, there's always stuff that comes up that you got to deal with. So, you know, you deal with it. But as far as having really good people there who could work together i mean it was that's that's what made a lot of it that's what made 40 years of it a lot of fun yeah now you come into the building 2001 the week after bledsoe gets his body bashed by mo lewis almost died almost died you got your briefcase you got your newspaper in your briefcase i've seen you do it every time you walk into the building with the briefcase and newspaper what newspaper is that new york times new york times so some people can't function

if they don't read the new york times every day i'm one of those people like i'm here in santa monica and i can you if i'm on the road i I can usually sniff out where the New York Times is. I wasn't able to. This is a rare time. I wasn't able to do it this morning. But I know it was delivered to my porch in Brookline this morning. So it'll be there when I get back. Ern, you could have put that in the requests. I would have had the New York Times delivered with a guy with a hat and a

glass of milk for you. The gray lady. Orange juice, orange juice. Now, what do you remember about this aftermath? What do you remember going into this next chapter of like, you guys were 2-2 at the time. We were 0-2. We were 0-2.

0-2. Yeah, 0-2 is a little different than 2-2. Okay, you lose Drew Bledsoe, and you know what? We're going to play a game. I mean, it's like Bill, everybody thinks, on the Cincinnati. You know what? We got a game next week. We don't have three days to be wallowing around feeling sorry for ourselves.

We got a game next week. We got the Colts. We got the Colts. Let's go. I mean, in a way, it's a cold business that – particularly if you're the player that gets hurt and you come to the rush, hey, you know what? They're going on without me.

I mean, you know, the world is going – it's like – I lived it. Sure, it's like it's going to hit Bill the opening game next season. Patriots are going to play a game without me. I mean mean you talk about the lockers aren't owned their least i mean we're all the owners own the footballs the coaches and the players they're the temporary employees and but you know that's the world let's go now when in the season did you guys feel that you're going to, all right, we're going to stick with Tom?

You know, really, probably when we got into November. I mean, you know, because Tom, I mean, we had to, so we beat the Colts, we beat the Chargers, we go down to Miami and get our ass kicked. Always. And so we have one of those great lines. Then we go out and play the second game with the Colts in Indianapolis. This was really kind of like the breakout game for our offense.

David Patton had the, this is the game, he ran for a touchdown, he caught a touchdown, and he threw a touchdown. He's the other player who completed the double pass for the touchdown. We were two for two on double pass for the touchdown. You were part of one. David Patton was the other. So we're going out playing the Colts, and we're beating them pretty good. And I can't even think who the play-by-play guy was.

We score a touchdown. Who are these guys? Okay, that's where we were started. We were the who are these guys people. But we just kept, you know, hey, we got better. We just kept going. We get the big game for us. You know, we're playing that Rams game we played in early December

that we lost. That was the last game we lost. That's right, week 10. That was – we did not lose another football game. So the Colts, the second Colts game you guys knew when the offense exploded. That's when we started to get it. And we were still feeling our way a little bit. I mean, we were the little engine that could.

Okay, this is not the Patriots of 2007. And I think I'm the first one that really used the evil empire. No, we were the little engine that could. And that's where when John Madden's talking about the Super Bowl matchup, it was like, oh, those poor little patriots. You know, hey, we just, but, you know, we were just out doing the best we could every day. You said evil empire.

You Star Wars guy? No. Who in the evil empire are you then, Ernie? You know, what I remember from the evil empire was Ronald Reagan talking about the Russians. If you ask me where the evil, that's where I think, you know, Evil Empire. To me, that's where it comes from. I mean, for me, movies, I'm more of a Humphrey Bogart guy. Like on those Jeopardy things, history and all, I'm really good.

You start talking movies, I can get out of my depth. Are you killing it on jeopardy every night with the wife i have you know i mean i haven't watched it in years i mean just when i would see it like the history type questions i was usually good when you're talking about movies and actors and not so much getting back into this season so we we we we find out Colts. All right. Tom's our guy. All right. We just signed a hundred million guy.

Bledsoe taking the backseat to the kid. Kid comes out. When did you realize he could win a Super Bowl or could help the team be part of a team that won a Super Bowl? Was it in the playoffs? Was it? Yeah, it was after we beat the Rams in the Super Bowl. Hey, we're just doing the best we can. I mean, going into this game, I knew we had a good week of practice and we'd do the best we could.

Did I know we were going to go out and beat the Rams? No, I knew we would go out and play to the best of our ability. Because we had a, you know, I mean, we practiced down at our practice at Tulane. We had, I thought, really good practices that week. I thought, you know, hey, we're ready to go. Now, do you remember anything part of the preparation process for this team, a hot keyword or a key that we needed to do?

Because everyone talks about, oh, being physical with the greatest show on turf. Was that a point of emphasis, getting the guys that line the scrimmage to knock off the timing of the West Coast offense? Yeah, we tried. Yeah, I mean, that was really the key to our defensive planning was they had a really good team. We didn't think they had the patience to run the ball. So if they were going to play on first and town,

if they call a trap or something, hit seven yards, don't worry about it. They're going to come out throwing. So we played them as a pass-first team every snap. We really didn't worry about them trying to run the ball down our throats. So we played a lot of get the fastest players we could on the field who could play against the pass. We played cover five on first down. It's not a great first.

Terrible. Terrible. You got to run it. You got to run it. But we played them as, you know, we said, hey, they're going to come in and try to beat us throwing. So that's what we're going to do. That's what gives us the best chance.

Now there's a story out there that you and Bill on the plane ride to New Orleans came up with something. You guys had something. What was that? Just what I just said. Right there. Right there. We said, hey, this is the way we need to play defense against

this team to have a chance. If they decide, hey, if they see we're playing pass every down and they want to come out and try to get in the I formation and run against us, we'll have to adjust. But we're going to go in playing this as a pass firstfirst team and we make them do something different did they do that in week 10 were they a pass-first basically they were a pass-first and that's where you guys that they were i mean this is a passing team i mean they they had good players they could run the ball but if we i just if we go into this game worrying about their running game they'll you know they'll run you know they'll throw it for 30 points. Yeah, so the confidence was there.

You guys were real confident. You already had a snapshot of playing them. I didn't say we were confident. We said, this is what gives us the best chance. Okay. You don't say, oh, yeah, we're going to do this, and we're going to win. No, that's, hey, this is the team we're playing.

This is what they do. We've got to take their strength away from them. And really, it went from being that the week before this, we had gone in to play the Steelers, and that was, you know, that was Jerome Bettis. Yeah. That was a totally different game. Game plan team.

Game plan team. I mean. You've got to change it. So we play, we go and play the Steelers. It's cover three. We're going to bring the strong safety. We are going to stop their running game and make them beat us thrown. You know,

we get on the plane Monday morning. We got to go down to New Orleans. It's a totally different set of problems. And that's just having played the Rams once we really knew, okay, this is what the Rams are. You know, this is who this team is. This is the problem we have this week.

This is what we have to do. So that's what the analytics said? No, analytics was billing me sitting down on the plane figuring it out. Do you get fed up with hearing this bullshit analytics talk? Well, you know what? Or are you like, I'm the analytic godfather? You know, for instance, there's a... Ernie Adams.

Analytics, I am analytics. You know, like for instance... Amen. Fourth and two against the Colts, we went for it. That was analytics. Ernie before analytics. You know, but there was... If somebody's got something that makes sense, Fourth and two against the Colts. We went for it. That was analytics. Ernie before analytics. Yeah, but there was, if somebody's got something that makes sense,

you know, like David Romer was an economist at the University of California. I mean, his wife was a critical part of, you know, some presidential administrations. And he wrote the paper on why on fourth and goal from the one you really want to go for it. Well, I read the paper, and you know what? This makes sense. So it's like analytics is one thing, but if it's good analytics, it's going to make sense. For instance, this whole thing that came up, the Super Bowl that was just played,

and I have been waiting for this situation for three years. Somebody, when they changed the rule on overtime, you know, this is totally different. And to be honest with you, they flipped the, you know, the 49ers win the toss. And my text, I sent a bill right then. I said, this is the first time in the National Football League history the right call on winning the coin toss is we want to kick. Now, you know, remember the playoff game, the overtime game in the regular season against Denver. Wind.

We took the wind. You know, this wasn't a question of, you know, we want the wind at our back. We would take the chance on giving the ball to Peyton Manning. We just felt it was outweighed by, you know, we're playing in this. For three hours, we can see what the wind is. We know the important thing is having it at our back. Well, the Super Bowl with Kansas City and San Francisco, it's inside.

There is no wind. But to me, the call is we want to kick. We want to go on defense first. And the big reason it came up when Kansas City got the ball, you know what you need, and you know when you're in four-down territory all the way, because it comes up fourth down, you can go for it. Well, if you know you're going to be going for it on fourth down, that changes the way you can call the game on first, second, and third down. And to me, that's the biggest reason. And it's interesting because I had never – I mean, yes, Kyle Shanahan said, okay, if it comes to a third possession, you know, we kick a field goal,

you kick a field goal, I get the ball the third time. All right, then I can win it with a field goal, you kick a field goal, I get the ball the third time, all right, then I can win it with a field goal. I hadn't really thought of it that way, and that's certainly a valid point, but I think it's overweighed by the fact I'd rather have the ball second so I know what I need. But to me, analytics is if it makes, does it make good sense?

There's got to be a valid reason behind it, not just the computer told me to do, and I don't care what sports you're in. You know, it's like the whole thing, three-point shots in basketball. Okay, well, yeah, it makes, you know, it's points per possession. So if you've got somebody who can, you know,

shoot 40% shooting threes, go ahead and shoot threes. Got it. You know, but it's analytics, but, you know, on the court, it actually makes sense. I like that. It's like, okay. Erna Lennox. Well, like talking about, because it's been, you know,

I think analytics probably would be used more in baseball than in football. But, you know, the book I mentioned that Buzz Bissinger wrote about the Cardinals, and he's talking about their pitching coach, Dave know, the book I mentioned that Buzz Bissinger wrote about the Cardinals, and he's talking about their pitching coach, Dave Duncan, the notes he keeps. Well, that's great analytics right there. You know, that's really, you know, because you can actually give that to a baseball player, and you can apply it and use it. And that's like, but again, it's like, if it's, you know, there's nothing as practical

as a good theory. If the theory works, it's going there's nothing as practical as a good theory. If the theory works, it's going to be practical, do it. So David Romer wrote the book on why you should go for a fourth and one. This makes real sense. So there must have been ten times it came up for us, fourth and goal in the one, but what do you want to do? Call your best play. And we got stopped up at one time.

We got stopped up at Buffalo. Okay, well, it's the National Football League. They're not all going to work. But it's like, you know, this just absolutely killed me. We're playing the Ravens in 2019. We're going into game eight and O, and we get the ball. I had a bad fumble that game. Okay, well, yeah, that's going to happen too. But, you know, we get the ball right towards the end. It's fourth and goal in the one, end of the ball. I had a bad fumble that game. Okay, well, yeah, that's going to happen too.

But, you know, we get the ball right towards the end. It's fourth and goal in the one, end of the half. And, you know, it's like Josh didn't have a play he really felt good with. If you don't have a play you feel good, well, we'll kick the field goal. But, you know, I really, that was like, you know, that killed me. Because, you know, I know I really want to go for it, but I don't want to go for it if, you know, that killed me. Because I know I really want to go for it, but I don't want to go for it if, you know, the offensive coordinator who's one of the best in the business

doesn't have a play he likes. I don't want to go run a play just to run a play. That's what kills him. 2009 regular season game against the Ravens. 2019. 19. Yeah. Well, you know, that was really, from that game on,

we struggled playing good teams the rest of the way. Ran out of gas. We started getting hurt. Started getting hurt. And that was, you know, it's like it's gone from the Patriots the last few years. It's been just. Yeah, that's how it goes.

That's how it goes. I mean, in a competitive league like the National Football League, you're not going to win just because you show up. Hey, we're the Patriots. Look at our scrapbook. That doesn't happen. You actually got to go out and do it. You got to earn it.

Jackie, give us the game, the lead up. So we mentioned the Chuck Rule game earlier. We also had the Steelers game. Drew Bledsoe comes in and saves the day when Brady hurts his ankle. On the other side in the NFC, the Rams turn over the Green Bay Packers eight times in the divisional round game. Then they go out and beat Andy Reid's Eagles to get there. And then the big question leading up to this outside the building, of course,

maybe inside the building too, was are we riding Bledsoe or are we sticking with Brady? That was kind of the lead-up talk okay inside the building it's tom's gonna play if he's healthy listen tom got hurt and drew did being a team guy drew came in he threw the big touchdown pass and we won the game if drew doesn't come in and play well against the steelers you know pitts Pittsburgh's going to the Super Bowl. Yeah. But, you know, we said, hey, and if Tom is so easy, that injury could have been a little more serious. Tom might not have been able to play. You know, we're going to go play with Drew.

But if Tom's healthy to play, he's going to play. Now, were you part of the decision to come out of the team? As far as I know, that was more than anything else. That was the players in the tunnel. That was so cool. And you know what? Okay, so you think about this. You're the guy down there with the microphone doing the introductions,

and you've got 43 football players dressed saying, we're coming out as a team. What are you going to do, try to stop them? You know, just get out of the way. I mean, that's, you know, as far as I mean, I was in the press box. I mean, it changed it. It changed, right. It's never done it.

That's, you know, that was us. Very emblematic. I loved that moment. One of my favorite non-in-the-game moments from maybe any Patriots Super Bowl. Pretty darn cool. Right. And coming up, and then, of course, so we go to the introduction with the team, and then one of my favorite moments was the Rams, you know,

they're doing their last huddle before they're going out for the opening kickoff, and Ricky Pearl comes right over the camera and goes, a dynasty is born tonight. He just had the wrong team, but he had the right spirit in the building. Right spirit. Oh my goodness. Should we run through this game

and some of the big moments and paint the picture a little bit? Yeah. So this is leading up to now, the Superdome had been a bit of a house of horrors for the patriots we lost two superbowls there the green bay one and the chicago one um come out pre-low scoring first first quarter okay i gotta jump in whenever jump in whenever okay so the big uh big key here to this game was the Rams win the toss, they get it to midfield, and they punt,

and we take over the first time on our own five. Backed-up situation. Backed-up situation, where if we have to go three and out, we're going to give it to them at midfield, and that's not going to be good. So we took the ball, and we got first play of the game, 74-shot tosser, hit Troy Brown on a slant, which we wanted to do against Tampa 2.

And we get the ball to the midfield, and we punt it back to them, so they got it on the 5. So, I mean, that was really a key to kind of getting the game going the way we wanted. I mean, this was truly a game where if you get down 14 to nothing, you're in deep trouble. Yeah. So, you know, we... The explosion of their team.

Right. It's the first goal you have when you're in a backed-up situation. Get a first down. One first down. Just so the punter can punt. The punter can punt, and you get some degree of field position. I mean, if you go three and out when you're backed up, you're probably giving up at least a field goal.

Yeah. What other keys to the first half that stick out to you? Well, that was, of course, you know, so we're going kind of back and forth, and then, you know, we stem down into a diamond front. We get some pressure on Warner. He throws one up to Ty, and I think Ty will tell you, probably the easiest interception of his life. I mean, he caught it, which is always number one.

He caught it, and he ran it back for a touchdown. But it was, you know, the pressure that we got on Warner that made the play. The old diamond front, five down? Yep. Vrabel coming off the edge on a Rod Jones missed block. That was awesome. Yep. But we moved the front late.

They didn't quite adjust to it, and that's what happened. Now, going in and playing different looks with the shell of the defense, which they were probably banking on having the post safety. Is that what helped with the pressure that we were able to get throughout the first half? Because you guys were hitting Warner a lot. Yeah. Or is that just one-on-one battles?

Or was there any scheme to that? The first thing is because we wanted to be, we said we wanted to play this as a passing team. So we were very always conscious of stopping the run first. This was, hey, we want to come off rushing the passer. We want our best pass rushers, our best cover guys. We're playing every down like it's third down. And that was a little different for us, and it made a big difference.

Because in that Week 10 matchup, if I'm not mistaken, the Patriots blitzed something like 43 times. They did a good job picking us up. So if you do something 43 times and it doesn't really work well, okay. We probably don't want to do exactly that again. Analytics, baby. That's analytics. And that's where I say having played that team in December

really made a difference. We had, okay, here's a list of the stuff we don't want to do. It didn't really work against them. So let's not go to do this again. Yeah. Patent scores with 31 seconds. And that was another big, you know, that was Antoine Harris forced to fumble, you know,

so we get down to their six-yard line right before halftime. Now this was, I will say, this was some real big-time coaching because we knew studying them down the red area, their defensive backs squatted hard on the goal line. Okay? That was like, you know, so we ran from the six-yard line, we ran a quick out and up. How many out and ups did she do?

Very few. But we said, hey, you know what, this should be the play to run and did a great job. You know, Tom the play to run. And did a great job. Tom threw it just right. And made a beautiful catch. And with no room, they had to stop and replay it to make sure he got his feet in. I remember we brought in Patton. Remember, what year was that, 2011?

We brought him back or 2009, 10? Somewhere in there, yeah. I was there. And we used to run that little out and up when he was there because of that play. Well, this was really the first time we ever did that. You did that front pylon and then get go. You get going and, you know, you've got to get the ball in the air. Quick.

Quick. Timing. Spot throw. So we were, you know, we were ahead 14-3 at halftime. Took advantage of those turnovers in the first half. Yeah, 14-3 at the half. ahead 14-3 at halftime took advantage of those turnovers in the first half yeah 14-3 at the half what's going on at halftime what now what are you guys preparing for are you guys going into this because you're not making adjustments you're basically coming up with a plan on how to either a hold them off b continue to score like what's going on how did

you guys approach half you know really this was kind of a keep it, you know, this game is going the way we want. I mean, our offense in 2001 was smoke mirrors and a lot of Troy Brown. Yeah. I mean, we were not an offense. You know, we got the most out of what we had, but we were not the high-powered offense we were when we got Wes Welker and Randy Moss.

I mean, don't turn the ball over. Run the ball. Play the game at our tempo. Was that a bullshit call on Willie? No, unfortunately. On the 98? Unfortunately not. Or touchdown called back. Because he went in and he held Marshall Falk,

and you can't hold behind the line of scrimmage. And that is why for 20 years after that, every young defensive lineman we had, I went over and had a little conversation with him. Look, when you're playing a screen, you can knock the back down because there's no pass interference behind the line of scrimmage. You can do whatever you want, but you can't hold. And let me tell you about this Super Bowl we were in

where we were about ready to go up 24-3, and we got called for holding. That's why I'm having this conversation with you because it's so natural for those guys. They want to go, there's the back, you know, latch on. No, just knock him on his ass. And that's what Ernie, everyone, what does Ernie do? That's what Ernie did. He would literally, he was your reminder for any kind of situation

of anything that could ever come up in football. And, of course, listen guess, and you listen, this did make the difference between us being ahead 24, three in the Superbowl and us being ahead 17 to 10 in a dog fight. The fact that we held and didn't knock the guy down. That's why I'm telling you this. And Warner scored right after that play. We were on one of the most amazing quarterback sneaks because he goes up the

left guard pulls left the right guard pulls right our tackle stepped out and it's just worth taking it the easiest touchdown ever double sucker play the old the doubles the double sucker quarterback sneak and of course what was interesting was bill was on, at some point this year, was on with Kurt Warner, and Kurt Warner was blown away that Bill remembered the quarterback sneak. Well, who's going to forget a double sucker quarterback sneak? In the Super Bowl. In the Super Bowl, yeah. For a touchdown.

Now, when did you know that the defense was starting to get worn down? Right about there. They started hitting us with some ram passes. Se routes for you seam routes um you know the the super bowl and it's a four-hour game you're geared to play i mean it's hot it's inside it's hot they got you know they're firing off your fireworks and all that hal Halftime show. Any doggas out there. And, you know. You too this game. You too.

You too. Right. Where they, you know, the halftime, they ran all the names of all the people who were killed on 9-11. I mean, you know, it was a big deal. And you talk about being hot. New Orleans is a different setup for the locker room because both teams have to walk the length of the field

to get to the buses. Most teams, you know, they'll have the buses basically parked outside close by to your locker. Now, this one, you have to walk across the field. So walking out after the game, we had beat the Rams. I was behind a couple of their offensive linemen. They're talking. I mean, I can't turn my ears off.

And one of them said, God, I couldn't breathe out there. It was so hot. So it was both teams were second wind there. So they start driving. Ricky Prohl scores a touchdown. There's a buck 30 left. Different generation. Different era of football. Nowadays

that's a light years. At this time, zero timeouts? They had none. Which is really important. Can you explain the situation we're getting into? I don't believe we had any. So it's tied 17-17. And, of course, unbeknownst to me, because we have a TV monitor

where we can look at if we want to challenge a play, but there's no sound. John Madden's on, saying, yeah, they should just go to overtime. And to me, I watched the replay of the TV the next week when I got home. It was like John Madden. What I'm really hearing is, no, the Patriots had their fun. They should just go lose gracefully to the Rams. And, of course, I'm going to fast forward, jump ahead.

We get back. I say to Bill, Bill, if we have to go on defense again, we're going to lose, okay? We need to go get Adam a shot to win it for us in regulation, and the key to this situation is they have no timeouts, so if we get a big sack or a 15-yard penalty, we can take the clock to zero and go to overtime, but we really need to get Adam a shot to win it for us, which of course is what happens. So then we come back to Boston and the whole town is, oh my God, you know, we won the Super Bowl. We get the big parade and there's one guy had, you know, when you're up on the duck boat, you get to see all the fans and the signs. So one guy held up my favorite sign it says i'm glad john madden is not our coach

that that made the whole that made that was that made the parade so oh man we can confirm you made the decision well no i i told i bill sorry bill said what do you want to do? Yeah, I told him. I mean, to me, it was the only right decision to make. I mean, no, no, it's Bill made the decision. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Hey, Bill asked me for my best advice.

Bill made the decision. Yeah, I put the numbers in the calculator. He gave me the answer. Yes, but, you know, again, you're in a game, and, you know, this stuff is moving fast, and, you know, you got to, you know, you are flying by the seat of your pants a little bit. You can go with what you think is best. On that final drive, shout out to J.R. Redman, those checkdowns,

and then the middle of the field just wide open for Troy. For Troy, yep. And that was a big, you know, one big pass to Troy. What are the – there's like three rules in the two-minute drive Troy, yep. And that was a big, you know, one big pass to Troy. There's like three rules in the two-minute drive that you have to do. Am I wrong? Need to get it started. Need to chunk play. Chunk in there somewhere.

I think those are the two. Get it started, chunk play. You need to chunk play. You've got to play smart. You know, I mean, if the clock's running, offensive penalty is going to be an automatic 10-second runoff. I mean, you have got to play two minutes. The number one thing is two-minute situation.

You've got to play your best football. And it's going to be when you're tired. And all the practice reps, you know, the whole thing. And I know there's a big deal on the dynasty, you know, about Bill being so hard on players. Well, it was just so when we got down to absolute crunch time, when there's a championship on the line, we're going to do the right thing. We are not going to flinch.

We're not going to crack. And that's the whole idea, you know, we're going to put our team in when the game's on, when the big game's on the line, we're going to get it done. And I always said about our teams at the Patriots, the bigger the game, the tougher the situation, the better we play. 100%. And that was, you know, and it's Tom jumping on receivers about not running the route exactly right.

We had played in those drives against the Falcons. We actually ran some plays that we hadn't practiced in three years because Josh knew it was the right play. When the veterans were in the game, we would never do that with a rookie. But Josh had no one. I got the veterans in the game, we would never do that with a rookie. But Josh had to know when I got the veterans in the game, I can do some stuff we haven't practiced, but it's what we need to do.

All that hard work and practice, being exactly right, that's why you do it. It'll pay off when it's crunch time. And it's also, my comment in the dynasty, what I meant was, the know, the pain is temporary. The championship is forever.

Yeah. You know, hey, you're going to get hurt. It's like you got a concussion in the Super Bowl against, you know. Did I? Yeah. I don't know what you're talking about, Ernie. Yeah. Well, look, it's not like if it's a practice in August,

you're going to go off the field and see that, you know. But this is, you know, it's fourth like this if it's a practice in august you're going to go off the field and see that you know but this is you know it's fourth quarter of the super bowl you you know um you dream for this you dream for this you know i always tell everyone this about you know this whole this whole dynasty thing if you're in your 30s you've never liked your football coach you've loved him but you never liked your football coach. You've loved him, but you never liked your football coach. Who the fuck likes a guy that's making you run all day? Who ever liked their parents for yelling at them when you did something wrong?

Who likes it? Who liked when your parent came to you with cough medicine? I almost threw up every time. I hated it, but it was the best thing for me. It's what I needed. I needed the cough syrup so I could sleep. And I told you that one of my best friends

was Jim Ringo, our Office of the Lion Christian Patriots, 1978. Every day, I would get him to tell me a Packers story. I've heard some good ones, but one, they come in, and they're playing the Vikings, and they're not playing particularly well. And the team, you come in and it's they're playing the vikings and they're not playing

particularly well and the team you know you come in at halftime and everybody first thing you want to do is you know do you need to get somebody taped get a drink of water go and and lombardi comes in and he's going up against the wall on the top oh oh and somebody said get a doctor, get the trainer. And Fuzzy Thurston, the left guard, all those Packer teams, let the motherfucker die. Yeah. That's what it goes. That's what it goes. And these are all players who would,

they'd name their children after Coach Lombardi. You know, they were the pallbearers at his funeral. But, you know, when you're in the heat of it, and the guys, this is the guy who makes you 80 up-downs, and he's, you know. That's how it goes. Yeah. So take us through that last drive.

Okay, so we decide we're going to try to go get a field goal. I mean, it's indoors. You know, Adam and I got, of course, they conveniently, I can see, they put on, I have the monitor, so they flash it. Adam Vinatieri is like 47 of 47 inside. You know, something. It's like. The kicker jinx.

Kicker. No, what it's saying to me is we're out of our minds if we don't let this guy go get a chance to win it for us. I don't want to go on defense again. So we hit a couple screens to J.R. Charlie calls a great game. We hit the one pass over the middle to Troy. You know, pick up the last six.

You know, we're going to throw it to a little return route to Wiggy. You know, and try to, you know, pick up the last six, you know, we're going to throw it to a little return route to Wiggy, you know, and try to, you know, and then we're going to spike it. You know, and it worked out just, you know, seven seconds left. We got a shot for a field goal, and they're not going to get the ball again. So that was, you know, that's just – when we put the field goal team out there, okay, hey, this is what we wanted. Now he kicks the ball. You're watching it.

You finally see it go through the uprights. What's the first thing that comes to your mind? Holy shit, we won. And Scott Pioli was in our box. He was jumping on top of me. But we actually did this. And it's like Bobby Hamilton said after the game. One of my absolute favorite players on the Patriots, Bobby Hamilton,

blue-collar defensive lineman. We shocked the world, and we did. So I've got to tell you my favorite Bobby Hamilton story because he's one of my favorite Patriots. That first year in 2000, we're going through training camp in the first four games. It's like we haven't got this team awake yet. You know, we're just kind of – they're just – they don't know what Bill Belichick, Pete – you know, they're making the adjustment.

And, you know, it's just – it's not very good. And we lose four games. And we're going down to play Miami, and we're out there at practice, and, you know, it's kind of like get this team going, and the scout team offense is going to come in motion and run the toss crack. So they do it, and Bobby Hamilton goes off

because nobody, he's the defensive end, and nobody says anything about watch the crack. You're a defensive lineman. Your hand's on the ground. You can't see a receiver coming in motion. You've got to communicate. You have to communicate. And Bobby goes off.

And you can ask Ty about this because he, where I talk, God damn it, you've got to say something. And Ty, who are you talking to? You. You've got to tell me it's a crack. And what I love, that was the first sign of life on our football team. That was, okay, these guys, you know, let's get this going. They're starting to digest it.

Starting to digest. But, you know, you have to help your teammate. Yeah. If you see something like that, you know, particularly a lineman who can't see the crack coming you gotta help him and that's and that was the so i will never forget that but he said after the game we shocked the world which we did i mean nobody thought we had you know this was like you know this was going to be the coronation of the rams yeah 14 pointpoint dogs. I text Lonnie Paxton, and I was like, yo, I have Ernie coming on.

You got any Ernie stories? He goes, yeah, ask him about the three-ring binder that was a 10-inch book of scouting reports that he gave to Adam Vinatieri. Did you give Adam? He said you gave Adam a book. You know, I'm not going to say I didn't, but I don't remember it. Yeah, he said that. I mean, to me, my approach was.

About kicking wins, and it was the wins for kickers. It was like a presentation on. Listen, after Adam hit that field goal against Oakland, I would never dream of telling him anything about kicking. I mean, that was, you know. What made him so clutch? Number one thing, he had the best long snapper in history. Lonnie Paxton was a great long snapper.

I mean, that ball was going to be on the money every time. Laces right? Laces right every time. I mean, you know, so that's where it starts. Shout out Lonnie. I mean, the best long snapper that I've ever seen. That's a full team operation. Full.

I mean, look, if the kicker gets the ball with the laces looking right at him and it's crooked the wrong way, forget it. It doesn't matter who the kicker is. I mean, he's totally dependent on the snapper and the holder. And that's why those guys spend all that time working together. So in that critical situation, it's going to be just right. When was Adam brought to the Patriots? You know, he came in the mid-'90s, and he had to go.

He played forever. I have, yeah. I mean, he had to go kick in one of those teams in the world football, the Berlin Dragons or whatever they were. He was one of the Amsterdam Admirals. The Amsterdam Admirals. Okay. Sorry.

But, I mean, you know, it wasn't just – he was a little bit like Tom. He didn't just come in there, hey, I'm a great kicker, let's go. I mean, he had to learn how to do it. He had to practice. He had to develop. I mean, he had to learn how to do it. He had to practice. He had to develop. You know, Troy Brown, I mean, you know, a lot of those guys, you know, we'd come in from practice and I'd say, you know, the other coaches, hey, you know what?

This practice stuff, it actually works. You could see guys and, you know, you would see guys getting better. You know, it's just like going to play uh super bowl 49 against the seahawks you got wendy and and dan conley those two guys came on the practice squad they made themselves into good football players tom brady he you know he made himself into a good quarterback when do you coach now and dan conley made some of the best beer i've ever had have you ever if you ever have dan conley cook for you, it's miraculous. You know what?

And I haven't had a chance to do that, but I know he became a chef, and I can't imagine him not being good. And Wendy, I can totally imagine him being a great coach. You know, this is like some guys, you know, as I always said, some players, you know they're going to be great coaches as long as they can put up with the hours the coaching takes. Some guys just, you know, I mean, it's 100-hour weeks. You know, I mean, you get home, your wife's asleep.

You get up and leave, she's still asleep. You know, and some guys, they might know the football, they just don't want to deal with. And that's why when Wendy's first coaching job was for Buffalo, and we're on the field getting ready to play the Bills, how are you liking this coaching? He says, I love it. Well, if he loves it, you don't mind the hours?

I know you're going to be good. Yeah, he was smart. It had to be pretty cool to experience this with seeing Steve Belichick. You read his book, Full Circle, High School Bro, Bill, you guys over sneaking in, watching games, drinking beers, looking at scouting reports. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, all this stuff normal 18-year-olds doing, scouting reports.

And we split in on the goal line. That's crazy. Yeah, but, you know, I mean, this is, hey, it's real life. And, you know, we got great. The one thing about our Patriots team, we had great people there. Oh, yeah. That was totally. And that was the foundation.

Any wild after party stories earning did you get did you had i know drink a little you drink i i i i know this uh we after we beat this beat the rams i mean i was i mean i was i was exhausted i went to bed i've been told by very reliable sources that Bill absolutely never made it to bed after that. I like that. Jet, what's his aftermath? All right. So we got to remember final score 20 to 17.

The Patriots win it. Adam kicked that bad boy with no time left. First Super Bowl in franchise history. And then the aftermath. Brady keeps the starting role. Drew Bledsoe's dealt in the offseason to Buffalo. In division. This is the start of the Tom Brady legend,

the start of the dynasty. This would end the greatest show on turf era. And it would be the last Super Bowl appearance for the Rams in St. Louis. Yeah, you know, losing the Super Bowl, you know, I said, you know, championships are forever. Well, losing the championships are forever, too. That can be a hard one.

I mean, to lose, you know, losing three Super Bowls and losing that AFC championship game. That was no fun. But when Kansas City won that Super Bowl, I said, well, San Francisco, they can just go back to their off-season program and start lifting weights. I mean, that's what it is. You can go from

on top of the world to being right down at the bottom real fast. People don't realize how hard it is to get to that spot again. Oh, my God. But things have to work your way. You know, it's like when they had the Super Bowl that Kansas City lost to Tampa and Tony Romo.

Well, if they back from home, they can do six, seven. I mean, are you crazy? It is so hard just to do one. Forget a multiple. When i hear people talk about we're gonna win multiple super bowls i'm gonna give me a break yeah it's just it doesn't work that way it really doesn't it doesn't it doesn't because it's hard because once you win you got the america's most wanted target on you at times, you play everyone's best. Yeah, and, you know, it's like I said, well, okay, so St. Louis never got back.

I mean, I will just say from my observation from 3,000 miles away, that blew up the thing in Seattle. I mean, they never recovered from that. It didn't look like, you know, I'm not in their building, so, you know, maybe I shouldn't say that, but it looked to me like that that was devastating for them for them this i mean this had to be probably one of our most important wins in team history oh no no question i mean if if you don't win the first one

you're not going to get to six you gotta win one to get to two yeah you gotta win two to get to three yeah yeah bledsoe never gets injured. What happens with Tom? Ah, that's a good, you know. Analytically, how would you? Analytically? Do the simulation in your head real quick, Ernie. I know you're doing that right now.

Yeah. Hey, things happen, and there's no do-overs. There are no do-overs. I mean, would Lou Gehrig have ever played if it hadn't been for Wally Pipp? We'll never know. We'll never know. Hey, Ernie, who's that guy? What was your favorite team ever?

Oh, boy. This is a little bit like children. It's hard to, I mean, I'm going to say 2001 because nobody else thought we could do it. The ultra team win. The ultra team win. Bobby Hamilton said, we shocked the world. I mean, that was a lot of fun.

And so many things had to line up just right for us. We had to play the Rams in December. It was so great getting those basically bye weeks, back-to-back week to be helpful. We got to play the Raiders in the snow. It all lined up. Everything, you know, everything lined up for us. Jackie, we miss anything about this Super Bowl?

It's a pretty good episode. I will say it's worth mentioning. We talked Steve Belichick was on the sidelines that day. Roger Strawback, also in the building that day. Another great Navy man. And we're a sartorially inclined podcast. We love talking drip. We love the jerseys and the fits.

It's worth noting, blue windbreakers were Bill's best attire in Super Bowls. 2002, blue windbreaker. 2004, against the Panthers, blue windbreaker. Both long sleeve, 17 and 19. Switch to the short sleeve blue Windbreaker. 2004, against the Panthers, Blue Windbreaker. Both long sleeve. 17 and 19 switched to the short sleeve Blue Windbreaker. Won both of those. 4-0 when the Blue Windbreaker was out.

Blue Windbreaker. Ernie, did you get that in the analytics? Well, we did have, yeah, we actually talked about jersey color when we had a choice. I mean, which one are we better in? Ern, I want to play a game real quick. We're almost done here. We're almost done. I'm going to name a player.

Okay. And you're going to tell me the play that comes up to your mind that made that player that player. Okay. Let's start out with Teddy Bruschi. Teddy Bruschi, his tackle and short yardage in the snowball, where he had just a great linebacker play. I mean, he was by himself. The back had all kinds of space and made a phenomenal stop.

Dante Hightower. Oh, Super Bowl XLIX, the tackle on Marshawn Lynch. I mean, look, I know that Butler had the interception that won the game, but if I was showing a young linebacker, here's what you want to do, I'm going to show him Hightower. Because when Marshawn Lynch got that handoff, I'm sure Marshawn Lynch thought, end zone, because there's nothing there.

Oh, that was phenomenal. Randy Moss. You know, their first game of the Patriots, 2007, against the Jets, where he just put it into that extra afterburner, went right by him, and Josh McDaniel said, oh, this is going to be fun. Rob Gronkowski. Going AFC, wildcard AFC championship game,

coming up with that fade down there. I mean, he had – because Rob was the – the reason he's the greatest tight end that ever played is he could catch like a wide receiver and he could block like an offensive tackle. He could knock the edge back in the running game and he was dynamite in the passing game. And he always ran by people.

Yeah. You see him accelerate. Never got caught from behind. Right. Mike Vrabel. Well, I know he had, you pressure to get the Warner here in the Super Bowl, but I'm going to say catching the touchdown pass against the Panthers in the Super Bowl.

Versatility. Versatility. Versatility. Hey, it's only a touchdown pass in the Super Bowl. It's only a touchdown pass in the Super Bowl. Lawrence Taylor. So he plays. They're going in to play the Bears in a playoff game.

And early in the game. What year is this? I'm going to say 85. And early in the game, they run the wide receiver in, and they crack LT, and LT doesn't see it coming. And that really pissed him off. So the rest of the game, he's looking for this guy to come try and do it again.

And when he did, he took his head off. I mean, this Lawrence Taylor, you know, Bill will say, and I'm in total agreement, the best defensive player in the history of the national football league. Because I have no question, he could have played any one of the 11 spots. I mean, he was phenomenal. Revolutionized the game. Tom Brady. You know, again, I'm going to go to that overtime AFC championship game against the Chiefs. You know, we got its third down. If we give the ball up, we're giving it to Holmes,

and he beats us with a field goal. So, I mean, we kind of got to make this play, and, you know, right on the money. You know, Chris Hogan, you, Rob, you know, making those plays. I mean, this is like, you know, that's the ultimate crunch time. I mean, everything's on the line. Julian Edelman. Julian.

I got to say the catch against the Falcons. I mean, you know, you're telling, you're looking at the video, telling the guy, hey, I got the ball right there. I got it. I mean, I think, I mean, I love to say play in defense, because to me that's like Vrabel going on offense, you going on defense. But, again, a huge play in overtime in the Super Bowl.

It's hard to beat that. Bill Belichick. I mean, a game like this against the Rams, I mean, this was – they had a better team realistically. And, you know, I mean, it was – coaches don't win games, but they help players get in position to win games. And I thought Bill did a great job, you know, in this game. Vince Lombardi.

You know, again, I'll go to the ice bowl. Quarterback sneak with Bart Starr. Mister, if you can't score from the one-yard line, you don't deserve to win. And for everyone out there, I'm not going to ask about the pink stripes. Ernie already told me about the pink stripes earlier, you know, before the interview. So we'll keep the pink stripes between, you know, Ernie and I. Julian, it's proprietary football information.

And as you know, if you remember, when you got to the Patriots, you had to sign in blood. You will never disclose things that shouldn't be disclosed. Because as Vince Lombardi always said, what you see here, what you say here, let it stay here when you leave here. That's awesome. Hey, I'm Gianna Pradente. And I'm Jemay Jackson-Gadsden.

We're the hosts of Let's Talk Offline, a new podcast from LinkedIn News and iHeart Podcasts. When you're just starting out in your career, you have a lot of questions. Like, how do I speak up when I'm feeling overwhelmed? Or, can I negotiate a higher salary if this is my first real job? Girl, yes. Each week, we answer your unfiltered work questions. Think of us as your work besties you can turn to for advice. And if we don't know the answer, we bring in

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Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Keri Champion, and this is Season 4 of Naked Sports, where we live at the intersection of sports and culture. Up first, I explore the making of a rivalry, Kaitlyn Clark versus Angel Reese. I know I'll go down in history. People are talking about women's basketball just because of one single game. Every great player needs a foil.

I ain't really near them. Why is that? Just come here and play basketball every single day and that's what I focus on. From college to the pros, Clark and Reese have changed the way we consume women's sports. Angel Reese is a joy to watch. She is unapologetically black. I love her. What exactly ignited this fire?

Why has it been so good for the game? And can the fanfare surrounding these two supernovas be sustained? This game is only going to get better because the talent is getting better. This new season will cover all things sports and culture. Listen to Naked Sports on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Black Effect Podcast Network is sponsored by Diet Coke.

All right, here we go. It's Cam Jordan from New Orleans Saints here to tell you it's going down on season two of my podcast, Off the Edge with me, Cam Jordan. Can't stop it. You know what's going to happen. Can't stop it. That's right. Catch new episodes every Wednesday, all season long. That's what you look for in year 14, to do more. No days off.

And I'll have my friends, who happen to be some of the NFL's biggest stars, join me on the pod. We'll give you a player's perspective of the biggest storylines, trends, and did that really just happen moments from around the league. And you know we'll have fun doing it. Ha! Yeah! Oh, and I'll have a special guest each month join me to mix it up a little bit. Who is it? None other than... Syke!

You'll have to tune in to find out. So tap in to Off the Edge with Cam Jordan's podcast, your ultimate playbook for all things football and not football. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Name the game. We do this segment where we score this game presented by the Wynn Las Vegas and Encore Boston Harbor.

Oh, I didn't know about this game. Oh, you got all excited? So the name of this game, what should we name this game? The Dynasty Starter? The first one's the sweetest? Hey, listen, the Dynasty, I mean, Ricky Pearl told you the Dynasty's being born tonight, so, you know. The Dynasty Starter.

Shout out, Ricky. All right, so stakes, 0 to 10, decimals okay. What are the stakes of this game? Have high integrity. We've done multiple, multiple games on multiple different platforms of sports, championships, World Cups, everything. Stakes, 0-10, decimals okay. What do you got, Ernie?

Oh, this game's a 10. I mean, greatest show on turf, 14 points? Listen, hey, we shocked the world. We shocked the world. This game's a 10. I mean, greatest show on turf, 14 points? Listen, hey, we shocked the world. We shocked the world. What's the star power? Zero to 10 decimal's okay. We were more stars.

This wasn't a game about stars. This was a game about being introduced as a team. Team power of 10. We weren't that into stars. Stars wasn't our thing. I mean, if you came into our building and started behaving like a star, you were going to get crucified, right? You wouldn't even think about it. Can you imagine somebody coming into the New England Patriots,

hey, look at me, I'm special. No way. Have a bite of that humble pie. Yeah. So what is it, a six? Yes. Five? Six.

Six. The game play of the game, zero to ten decimals, okay. Oh, man, yeah. I'm going to give us a ten there. I mean, we played the game the way we played the game we wanted to play and we needed to play. Name the game. The name of the game.

What would you score that, Ernie? Hey, look, not every day do you get to start a dynasty. That's a 10. I mean, that's, you know, that's special. It's special. What did we come out to? Even nine. A nine?

Because, hey, it's a nine because we know we can always do better. Always know you can do better. Where does it rank in the games that we've done? That puts us at a dead tie with Super Bowl 54, 49ers versus Chiefs, and the Immaculate Reception Raiders versus Steelers. All three got nines. The only perfect score is the 2018 AFC Championship game that we talked about quite a bit.

That was one heck of a game, baby. Yeah, I'll tell you what, boy. Going in there, that crowd was all red. It was alcohol-fueled. Like Bill would say this we're the only thing we got that we got to bring our own energy gotta bring your own and we sure did you shut them up with one first down that's what we did ernie we miss anything i think we're i think we got it pretty good i mean you know this whole thing you know with the the the dynasty i mean this is telescope in 20 years into you know a

little i mean there's there's so many you know there are so many great things that i've i've forgotten so many great things you know i'm sure i missed a lot that that that's the ultimate flex right there ernie that's what i used to tell guys on the field I go I've forgotten more football plays than you've ever made because of the success that we all attained together it's like I was just watching the other day a few shots

of our defense from 2004 you just put it on but as I'm watching god damn we were really good I mean I knew we'm watching it, god damn, we were really good. I mean, I knew we were good, but I've seen it. We were really good. You got anything to plug, Ernie?

What do you got going right now? Hey. Now that you're retired. Now that I'm retired, people should plan their days around watching Julian Edelman's podcast. I mean, now that i've seen i mean this is this is this is an operation right here appointment viewer dog you know i i stole the template from this this place in in foxborough that i worked at for a long time i said i want our shit to be tight everything's about fundamentals we need to have situational

podcasting available and on call at all times to execute at a high level under pressure. And if you don't do that, you're not giving yourself a chance. You're not giving yourself a chance. I'm going to call bullshit on that. As soon as he's retired, he's gone full diva. Don't listen to a word.

He makes me run hills out back when I mess up. He's just like, Bill! What the hell? I know. You're down here and you got the mountains going up there. I mean, what are we doing running hills? Go up there and run up those hills. We got them, baby.

We get them. I appreciate you, Ernie. Thank you. Hey, this is great. Thank you. Thank you, Ernie. Man, that was an awesome show knocked my socks off everything in more i mean ernie ernie basically made friday night lights we credit him for the greatest sports

books greatest sports movies greatest sports tv shows tim riggins i mean peterberg coach taylor texas forever the funny part is he didn't say it on the show he wanted to do it in western pa I mean, Peter Berg? Coach Taylor? Texas forever? The funny part is, he didn't say it on the show. He wanted to do it in Western PA. You want to win? Put Boobie in. You got to put Boobie in if you want to win. And also, he didn't say it on the show, but afterwards we were talking, he's consulting with a high school team right now.

It's like he's retired. It's just. You can't take it. Casual. Loves ball. Casual three days ago. Yeah, three days ago. I was watching in 2004.

Ernie. We should have had him rate your Belichick impression. Oh! Oh! All right. Add that to the list. I mean, we had... He did kind of shun my impression a little.

Did he? When? Today? Yeah. Oh, I didn't even notice that. We did finish each other's sentences. How crazy is that? You guys are on Bill and Ernie level.

No, I wouldn't go that far. I wouldn't go, you know. They can communicate. You see those old NFL films footage, and it's like, yeah, yeah, yeah. And they know what they're saying. And then they go out and... I have so many more questions I want to ask them.

We've got a document filled with them. It's literally... We talked for almost three hours today. This thing could have gone on for nine, 10, 12 hours. If the people like the show, we're going to have to get an Ernie part two. Got you. If you could see our computer screens right now. Do the ice bowl. He'll do the ice bowl.

Oh, yeah. No one is alive from the ice bowl, so let's do it. We'll go out there to him. Let's go to Brookline, baby. We're taking him to dinner tonight, Santa Monica. We're going to dinner tonight. My guy goes, yeah, I never been to Santa Monica. I go, you never been to Santa Monica?

Yeah, so I read a book. He read a book about Santa Monica. He found out he was coming here like a day ago. This guy read a book on the terrain and stories of Santa Monica. Scholarly gentleman. I mean, mean this dude i love ernie hope we crack a beer with ernie tonight and then afterwards we we we get some food and our dinner is going to be kind of close cutting it close to you know our heads and tails of the show but he didn't want to spoil his dinner because he's got three hours. Pro move, pro move. But my guy, he took two chips and dips of the French onion,

and he was eyeing that heirloom tomato. You see him? Yeah, you were offering it up. I offered it up for him. I think he didn't want to have bad manners. Self-restraint. He's the only one using fork and knife. I think if you cut into pieces, he would have easily. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

He may have thrown it in because I know him and Coach Belichick have that terrible etiquette. He took that tomato and dipped it right in that ranch. Just like Bill did. Bill dipped it into the Chex Mix. Communal dip. No, but you can't go communal dip with a chip dip with a sloppy tomato. You dipped and you dipped again. Oh, my gosh.

Man, his favorite game ever because it was the biggest team win. Coming out as a team. Ricky Proll in your face, buddy. Man, that was such a fun interview. Rick, I love how much Ernie remembered. Hey, my guy. That one from Ricky Proll. He went at John Madden a little, too.

He did. That's our second. Kyler mentioned it before we got on. Our second guess, it wasn't the biggest Madden for him. Love Madden. Love Madden. We got to get Howie Long on. We got to get Howie in.

Yeah, see what Howie Long. Set the record straight. Because this is some old, you know, we've got to tap in. Now, here at Games with Names, we've got to tap in some, like, crazy cornerstone people of the national football. Damn near the close to the beginning of this shit. The Terry Bradshaws, the Ernie Adams. It's pretty crazy.

We haven't even been doing this thing for, we're still under 50 episodes. And our six degrees of separation from NFL royalty and NFL greatness and the start of this league and the biggest moments of this league, pretty darn impressive. Jeez. Can I just say one negative thing? Just to do it.

Yeah. What is it? Bit of a rookie score. Oh, I knew you were going to say that. Bit of a rookie score. I went with it because it's Ernie, right? He didn't. He gave star power down because we were a 10 team. That's right, baby.

Team first. We, not me. Wait, how close were you to correcting Ernie? I thought it for one second. I saw you lean forward. I thought it for one second, and then I was like, no. Do you think he had someone in the chamber to battle you for the argument? He probably scouted me

a terry bradshaw episode he's like this motherfucker's gonna come in with some bullshit and i'm ready do you think he scouted us the only question is does he have a youtube account he was looking for the camera ernie knew his camera ernie knew his cam all right this is he went to the michael ir Broadcasting, baby. This is at the end of a three-hour interview. Show camera. Let's wrap this one up. That's you. You don't talk to them.

You talk to you. What a fucking episode. Man, that was a fun interview. I want to try to get him again. I just want him to put in a good word for us with Bill. I mean, it's domino effect. Manifest that shit. You know, we're just going to get all these.

You know, we got Ty Law Coming on You get Rodney Harrison You get Rodney there Maybe we get a McCordy Maybe Quit big time on this Maybe you'll text

Tom Brady at some point And that's a great show What another good show And thank you to Ernie Adams New England legend Football legend Football lore football encyclopedia. That was awesome.

Great to get to pick his brain. I feel dumber after it. And that's been another episode of Games with Names presented by Wynn Las Vegas and Encore Boston Harbor. Subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, wherever you listen to podcasts. Comment a game you want us to do. And remember, rate and review. Remember to follow Games with Names on YouTube, Instagram, X, TikTok, and Snapchat. Leave us a message on the hotline at 424-291-2290.

We'll see you guys next week. That's been another episode of Games With Names presented by Wynn Las Vegas and Encore Boston Harbor. Games With Names is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And if we don't know the answer, we bring in people who do, like negotiation expert Maury Tahiripour. If you start thinking about negotiations as just a conversation, then I think it sort of eases us a little bit.

Listen to Let's Talk Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Keri Champion, and this is season four of Naked Sports. Up first, I explore the making of a rivalry. Kaitlyn Clark versus Angel Reese. Every great player needs a foil. I know I'll go down in history. People are talking about women's basketball just because of one single game. Clark and Reese have changed the way we consume women's sports. Listen to the making of a rivalry.

Kaitlyn Clark versus Angel Reese. On the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of iHeart Women's Sports. I'm Keri Champion, and this is season four of Naked Sports. Up first, I explore the making of a rivalry, Kaitlyn Clark versus Angel Reese. People are talking about women's basketball just because of one single game. Clark and Reese have changed the way we consume women's basketball. And on this new season, we'll cover all things sports and culture. Clark and Reese have changed the way we consume women's basketball.

And on this new season, we'll cover all things sports and culture. Listen to Naked Sports on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio apps, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Black Effect Podcast Network is sponsored by Diet Coke. History is filled with unexpected stories, and I'd like to tell you about them. I'm Aaron Manke, and for the past six years, I've been sharing history's most curious tales on my podcast, Cabinet of Curiosities, such as the surprising country that invented the croissant and the wrestling champ who won the White House. And now these amazing stories and many more have been compiled into my new book. Curious to know more? Pre-order Cabinet of Curiosities, available November 12th, wherever books and audiobooks are

sold. Learn more over at grimandmild.com slash curiosities. What happens when a professional football player's career ends and the applause fades and the screaming fans move on? I am going to share my journey of how I went from Christianity to now a Hebrew Israelite. For some former NFL players, a new faith provides answers. You mix homesteading with guns and church. Voila! You got straightway. He tried to save everybody. Listen to Spiraled on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.