Garza Podcast - 170 - SICKSENSE: Nu Metal, Being Married, Introverts & Focusing On Your Business

Episode Date: March 28, 2025

Garza sits down in-person with Vicky Psarakis - “Killer V” & Robby J. Fonts - “Rob The Ripper”.  From Arizona nu metal band SICKSENSE. New Album “Cross Me Twice” Out Now! https://linktr.ee/sickXsenseSPONSORS: Garza Podcast Coffee - https://conceptcafes.com/product/garzapodcastcoffee/43CHAPTERS:00:00 - Being Married in the Same Band09:09 - The “Whys” of Being In a Band10:02 - New Trend of Vocal Gymnastics2:14 - Where Did Vicky & Robby Meet19:12 - Focusing Only on Business22:00 - Upbringings & Metal Helped Robby Be Himself

Well, Sixthense, thank you for your time. Thank you for being here. Thanks for having us. We appreciate this. Yeah, this is so cool. Yeah, I'm honored. So you guys came from Phoenix? Yes.

From Phoenix, yep. Nice. We're all from different places, everyone in the band. I've seen that. That's our bases. The base now. So you wouldn't say from, what do you say a bass? Based out of Phoenix, yeah.

Because the band initially started in Montreal, Canada, with different members as well. Vicki and I were there from the beginning, but now we're a, based out of Phoenix and our guitarist Phil he lives in Athens, Greece, and our bassist Rich, he actually lives in Texas. Texas, like the Dallas area. Wow. Yeah. All over the world.

Yep. Yeah. We're international. Canadian, Greek. Yeah. Worldwide, six cents. Yeah. Come on.

What's something I can't, I cannot wrap my head around this with your band is so you're both married. Yes. Okay. I'm like, how are they, and you're both, singers. How are they making this work? How are you married a married couple singers in the same band? That's a tough question. That is tough because like any relationship is tough to begin with and then you throw in, okay, there's a band. Exactly. So we are seeing a lot of bands that have band members that are

married or in long-term relationships. But I guess not very often that they're both vocalists, right? Exactly. Yeah. And I think vocalists get a bad rep as, you know, being maybe egotistical or narcissistic or, et cetera. But I think in our case, I guess it works because we're not that. We're like both pretty introverted. We do this for the right reasons. We just want to create good music. And like stuff that comes from the heart. It's not about being on stage and like, look at me. I'm awesome, dude and all that. It's just about writing good music. And I think we both have that goal. So when we do bud heads, it's for the right reasons. It's about, hey, I think that idea is better. No, that idea sucks. You know, this is better. So as long as we keep in mind that like we're both working towards the same positive thing,

then it's just the arguments are sporadic. It never lasts. Yeah, it really comes down to like a respect factor as a vocalist. So it's like, I guess, yeah, it would be a little difficult to working with a different vocalist who I'm just like, I think I may be better than you in some regard that may sound egotistical, but... You can't say that. You can't. But vocalists do that.

Every vocalist has a big ego, but I think with us, I'm just like, okay, working with Vicky, she does a lot of stuff. Like, she kicks my ass in, like, different things that, like, I can't do. So it's like, I like working with people that, like, push me or, like, have these skills that I don't have. I respect that a lot in different vocalists. Whereas, like, if I'm working, like, if I'd work with a vocalist who can do similar stuff, that I can do. It's like, well, why not me just do it myself? So I think working with Vicky and being

able to write like that, I'm able to write different things that like I can't do myself, but she can pull it off and she pulls it off amazingly. And I think we can work really in sync together, whereas somebody else might come in and be like, fuck you, Rob, I don't want to take your advice or what you have to say. So it's a really good dynamic between the two of us. That's an interesting dynamic. It's very like, wow. And I mean, we learn. The more we do it, the more we learn and the more we push each other and you know it's it's great and I think it's it's a comfortability like which I any band has over the years the more you tour the more you get to know each other the more comfortable you are around each other but we skipped that already like we're already there so um it's it's

good I don't know it's good okay next next question so were you you got married first and then six cents came up because I was kind of I was trying to find dates because it seems you guys were already writing songs like 2017-ish correct yeah that's when the band started like late 2017 but yeah we've always been working on stuff too together vicky would get features and stuff or we'd help each other out with our other projects we'd uh you know give each other feedback and stuff so we've always been writing behind the scenes but with six sense it's more like immersive like we're both yeah and it wasn't our intention either it just kind of happened like he auditioned for a band that wasn't at the time six cents it was something else

else and he doesn't sing. So they were like, I think we should have a second vocalist that can sing because with our previous vocalist that was doing everything, they'd go out on tour and he'd blow out his voice and then he couldn't sing. So they were like, I think it'd be smart to just split up the duties. And at the time, you know, I was finding myself with a lot of extra time. I was in The Agonist. We were doing stuff, but everyone else in that band had daydust.

jobs and I didn't want to do that I just want to do music full time so I'm like wow I know that yeah so I'm like sure I'll join another band why not you know um so it just yeah just kind of happened and then we started working on stuff together and I think the more we do it the better it gets yeah uh more power to you guys it's awesome it's very it's very uh to me being an outsider that is very impressive thanks because it's like what do you do when you're like you're married or Even if your boyfriend, girlfriend, and then you fight, say, hey, we got to work on a song right now. How do you handle that?

A lot of the arguments probably happen over, like, band stuff. But it's like not necessarily between us. It's like outside factors, like industry factors, most of the business stuff. We butt heads on a lot of stuff. We're in agreement with a lot of stuff, but it's just problems arise. And then it's like, well, you take care of it.

No, you take care of it. I got to take care of it. And then like, it's just that frustration. Yeah, like I've been there. Yeah, I've really been there before where it's like I'm like so fed up. Like I don't want to deal with this. Like I want to work on the music stuff, but I want to deal with this business stuff. Yeah.

But somebody has to take care of it. But it is to add to that, I think it is great that we have that open honesty. Because one thing that's frustrating about me is being in a band. And there's always at least one person in the band that that isn't open about their feelings. I mean, I guess, I don't know. That's my experience. Maybe other bands are sitting there yelling at each other, right? Or two.

Or two or more. It's just like, yeah, man, everything's fine. And then they're just harboring all these feelings and all this resentment that just grows over the years. Sure. And I don't like that. I'd rather just hear the painful truth and yell at each other and then work on it and then grow a stronger relationship. Yeah. Or if you've got things going on in life too, it's like, hey, everyone's human and everybody has their personal goals and their professional goals that they want to do.

And it's all good. But I think like if you're in a band dynamic, everyone needs to kind of be on the same page. Because if like people are pulling each other in different directions, it's not going to work out. So you just have to respect every individual in the band and be like, okay, if this is what you want in life, like I got to let you go and you got to pursue that. But this is the direction we're heading in because this is what will help the band grow. How did the other band members react to that? You guys being a couple. So far so good.

I will say that if we've had like a band talk and us, we start going at each other, they just kind of step back a little bit. Just listen. Don't take sides. Like, I'm not going to chime in. But we've never. And that's the thing that I think gets misinterpreted, that it's like I could have that same conversation with someone else.

And it wouldn't be perceived as severe. but it's because it's a married couple, your brain is automatically like, oh, they're arguing. And we're not necessarily arguing. Maybe it's just that there's no filter, right? We're just talking, so they just kind of step back and don't say much. And then when we stop talking, then they add to it. But I can't think of anything that's been so crazy that, you know, I don't know.

We're pretty chill. Yeah. I guess. I don't know. We get through things. It's fine. Yeah. You've got to push along.

Yeah. Well, you got years under your belt, so it's cool. That's something to be very proud of. Yeah. You know? Yeah. Well, I guess in a way, I'm sorry, I'm getting pictures in my brain in real time. Like, if you can't, correct me if I'm wrong, you can't do like the cliche I quit band thing because it's your wife.

Right? Yeah, that's part of it. That makes it tougher to do. There's days definitely where you feel that, but it's also like you just got a kid. Keep pushing through it because there's like the lifers and then there's the people who, yeah, they're fed up and like, I understand it takes a big mental toll on you or you can't like all these things. Yeah. I think back to basics is important when you're feeling this as an artist because I've definitely felt it a few times. Back to basics.

Like, why am I doing this? You know? Yeah. I'm just kind of remember. Why? I'm getting emotional saying this now, but. That's cool. Just kind of remembering as a teenager like,

why did I decide to do this? Yeah. I don't know why I'm tearing up. That's cool. Chris, it's the vibe. It's this thing here. No, it's cool. Yeah, it's cool that you guys even know that

because a lot of us don't know our whys. And sometimes we got to, it's like what is, and they actually say as far as like just your psychology, like you kind of know your why with any goal. Yes, yes. Because when shit goes wrong and it will go wrong, like there's a 100% chance it is. you got to go back and go back at that why.

Yeah. And I think the industry has a way of like making you think you want things that you don't want. Sure. So like as a vocalist, for example, we're seeing this like new trend of vocal gymnastics happening in metal, especially with Death Corps. Yeah, I'm sorry. It's insane. It's fine and it's cool. And as a vocalist, when I first started, part of that curiosity was like, I want to see what I can do.

with my voice. But it was like, it was for me. It was for like pushing myself to see how far I can go. Yeah. Not because I'm in direct competition with everyone else out there and I want to be like thought of as the best. Sure. But the way the industry is with, with, especially now social media and online and people arguing like you can't go on any video and see one person say so and so and so is the best vocalist in metal. You'll get another hundred comments underneath about No, you're wrong. Listen to this person. Listen to that person.

It's impossible. Yeah, and then you have like the top 10 and the voting system and all that. And that really messes with your head. And you're like, I got to be the best. But it's like when I started, I didn't care about being the best. I just wanted to sing and I just wanted to write music. Who cares if I'm the best, you know? So I think that's one example, at least from my experience where it's like,

remember why you're doing it. Don't let the industry make you chase something that you didn't even care to chase to to begin with you know it's true yeah we're right we just yeah we're just like reading things and seeing things and then we like we forget who we are and what and why and why we even started doing this yeah why why do i quit my job again oh yeah oh yeah just want to just want a freaking jam tunes yeah i just want to get married and jammed tunes you know yeah and get and fights in front of my band yeah it's It's fun. It's cool dynamic. It's different. It's cool. You guys should be very proud. It's awesome. It's awesome. Thank you. Yeah, I'm 39. I still do it still deal with that. Yeah. It's just your brain is for kids. It pisses me off. It's why it's how it's how we're wired.

Yeah. You know? Absolutely. Okay. So you guys met in a wish this was a, it's a shame. It's not around anymore. Yeah. There's a festival called heavy Montreal. Yeah. Yeah. And that's where you guys met. Yes, cool. That was your time 15, correct? Yeah. Yeah. So the story behind that was the agonist.

Her previous band was playing there. And I had joined Stuck Mojo at that time. And my bandmates... Crazy time for you. Rich and Frank were playing with Fossey. So Fossey was playing heavy Montreal in that year. So they invited me to hang out with my ex-bandmates in Astellamerte. And then one of my bandmates knew Vicky.

So we met backstage. So he was like my buddy Kevin who's now in a disembodied tyrant. He's the drummer of that band now. Small circles. Kevin Alexander. So it's a small world. Yeah. He was like, hey, Vicki, get over here.

He's an Italian guy from Montreal. And yeah, we've been inseparable ever since. Yeah. There were a lot of beers involved for sure. What did you think when you saw her? Like, oh, man, she's fucking hot. I got to talk to her. Honestly.

What am I? What am I going to say? Oh, I might embarrass her, but like the funny thing was like, it was amazing catering back there. Yeah. And Vicky just like went in with a bunch of Tupperware. And she just like showed up with like all this Tupperware. And I just like, I laughed at this girl. I'm like, what's not that?

I'm like, wow, what a woman. Like she just decides like, yeah, I'm going to take all this food and desserts home with me. And I'm like, yeah, she knows what's up. And that just made me so laugh that like she was just like so like honest about that. Like, yeah, whatever. This is what I do. And it's like, it's. It's the being.

woman in a band. You know what everyone wants before they know what they want. So people are making fun of me about my Tupperware and grabbing the cookies and cheesecake and all that. By the end of the night, it was all gone. Because everyone was like, are those the cookies from the catering? Give me one. You know? You knew what they all wanted. That's cool. I knew. And I knew that the catering was going to be done by the time I was off stage. And I was like, I want to have a good meal after I finished my set. So yeah, I'm just, just tour smart, I guess. And honestly, like, my thinking wasn't like, oh, I'm going to pursue her romantically. Honestly, my first impression, like, I thought that was funny.

Like, I like that as, like, a person, just like as a respecting. But I just really respected her. I was like, oh, yeah, she's a great vocalist. She's a great lyricist, too. I'm like, yeah, just respecting. I'm like, and maybe we can work together in the future or something. You never know. It's a small circle.

Like, I just thought of it like that, like a platonic thing. And then we just, you know, we really hit it off. And we just started hang out that week. And yeah, here we are. It just worked. And yeah, that's it. It worked. Yes.

It's like when you know, you know, it's like, hey, you know, like, and I was really young at that time. I think I met Vicky when I was like 21, like in 2015. And it's just like, you know, I didn't really sleep around in my life at all. It was just like, yeah, okay, this is it. This is it. You know, you know, it's like, hey, when you strike gold, you strike gold. It's like, I don't need that. So I just, for me, I just cut that off in my life immediately.

And I was like, yeah, I'm set. Yeah. Well, what is the other side think? Oh, wait, this dude's fucking hot. I don't know why. How do I talk to him? I, like I said, there were beers involved. He's just put in food.

Yeah, yeah. We weren't even playing that day. Heavy Montreal was very generous that year with the backstage pass situation. Nice. It was a three-day... Three days? Three days that year. Oh, wow.

Yeah. We were playing on the Saturday, and this was the Sunday. So I'm typically very responsible. on show days. I don't eat, at least before the show, I don't drink, I don't smoke, I don't, I don't go crazy because I want to, I want to feel like when I'm on stage,

if something goes wrong, I want to have myself to blame for that. And not like a substance or something. Like, you know what I mean? Like I used to when I first started, like I'll have a few beers, it'll be good. But then I realized I can't do beer because when I'm doing vocal,

I start feeling like the, what's it called? Like going up, you know, and like I start burping, and I'm like, this is just uncomfortable. So I want to feel like I'm in total control. And then after the show, depending on how I'm feeling and what I'm doing the next day, like I'll have a couple drinks or something and go to bed. But that was a festival. So the Saturday happened. It ended.

It was great, partied. But then we had all of Sunday to just go back. And we still had access to the artist world area that had free. beers and food and all that. So I was like, all right, I worked really hard. We had a great show on Saturday. We had people moshing around the trees. That was great, circle pits around trees.

So it was just a really good feeling. And Sunday I was like, all right, today I'm going to party, I guess. And we were just filling up beers and drinking beers. And then when we were hanging out all at the table, I don't know, I just had this, like, instinctual thing that I felt like Robbie was really different from everyone else there. I don't know how to explain it Like everyone else was like Super extroverted

And like very like Stereotypical like macho man Sort of vibes like And I don't do well with with like the puppy dog energy That a lot of people have Sure It just kind of pushes me into a corner and like you know And he was like very quiet

And his I could tell by his body language To what I was saying and then what other people were saying. I don't know. I just had a good feeling about him. So that and I guess a few beers helped us starting to talk. We were hanging out during a Lamb of God and Slipknot. That was cool.

Yeah. Well, we'll thank them for a lifelong connection. Yeah. Yeah, it's great. It's awesome. So you instinctually knew. Something was different. bottom. Yeah, just aura of vibes, I guess. I don't know. I've ever, I've always been like that.

I can't tell you that I've always been right. I have thought people were a certain way and then they turned out to be a different way, you know. But I'm usually right on like the energy and the vibes I pick up on people. And I could just tell that like the thing he mentioned around about like sleeping around. Like he didn't strike me as a guy that would just like hit on chicks and like, you know, want to get laid and all that. Which in our industry, I don't know. much of that is happening today because, you know, you could have terrible consequences. But 10, 20, 30 years ago, people did it a lot. They didn't care.

You know? So it was kind of refreshing to get that vibe from someone. Yeah. It's awesome. Yeah. Well, that's a, maybe that's a, maybe that gives guys hope. Like, just, I mean, it sounds dumb, but it just be, just be yourself and maybe let let yourself do with the talking.

Does that make sense? Yeah, that does. Of course. That does. I think it's a good opportunity to bring, like, my perspective on it. Because, like, I think we live in a culture where, like, sex is, like, a big thing for a lot of dudes especially. Yeah. And for me, I always felt like a weirdo.

I was like, I'm like, I even question myself. Like, shit, am I gay or something? Like, what's wrong with me? But, like, it just came down to it. Like, really, I'm just like, I don't. like the idea of sleeping around and like i don't even think it's like cool to me it's like yeah other people do it like that's for you but like speaking for myself i'm like that's cool i'm more focused on like my business and like creating and like the art stuff or like i'm really

really into like business stuff like that's why like i love being like super involved with everything like even like making from like even like driving the band here to california making sure everyone's safe i'm like really like protective of that and like keeping people in my circle safe and just the business as a whole in a good place and like even at the shows like I set up all the merch and stuff and like I make sure everything's good and just are you good you good everyone's taking care of and that's the priority for me just like hey what can I do for society and it just happens to be this role as an entertainer or whatever else I do for work and just like I focus on that instead of like breaking up families or something like if there's an affair

happening like I'm not interested in that that doesn't give me validation or joy for myself. But that's me. So that might be a refreshing take for anyone else who feels that way. Because I never heard people in the public sphere talking about that as dudes. Because it's not cool. You know, it's like I could almost associate it to like people that were into like comic books and like superhero stuff and like, you know, the 80s and 90s and they were like made fun of. And like, look now.

It's like it's all the all the craze like all the Marvel movies and DC and all that. and now it's cool to like superhero stuff. Yeah. So I just think like that's the way the world works in trends and they come and go and then they come back again. So I think the thing you're talking about, it's like it's not cool for a dude to come out and say like, yeah, I don't care about that. I want to be responsible. Yeah. So there are probably people that feel that way and just, yeah, not openly talk about it.

I don't know. No, it's cool. I know a lot of people don't don't like this but I think I think people attract not what they want but who who they are you know what was your upbringing like just now now I'm just curious what is what was your upbringing like to for for you to be that way oh well I don't want to talk I don't know I'm afraid this is in a good sorry I don't want to insult my parents at all sure because like you know it's a respect they have a great relationship with both of them now I always had a pretty good relationship with my mom for the most part of my life. But it was a, not to bring up their dirty laundry, but it was a very, like, really rough child I had. Like, they were just like, my parents didn't have a good life together. They were just always, like, fighting every day. It was a constant battle. So that made me really reserved as a kid. Like, I would kind of act out at home. And then, like, when I'd go out in public, I would just shut down. Yeah. It made, like, relationship.

like and getting friendships really difficult for me because they were just screaming they were really like drinking a lot together or you know and just like throwing stuff at each other it was it wasn't really like they would hit each other there wasn't any of that but it was like violent screaming like yelling like every day like it was like pretty rough they brought out the worst in each other basically the worst in each other and then they finally divorced like when I I just ended a primary school in Canada and then they got divorced and then they got divorced and And that really put like another downer in my life. Because like at that point, I started trying to like make jokes and being a class clown like later when I was in elementary school. But then when they got divorced, it like really shut me down. And I was just like I had this like huge void. Like during my teenage years, I was like miserable. I didn't like I didn't want to talk to anybody. I didn't care.

Like I was just like focusing on like getting good grades and I was amazing at like sports and stuff. but like I never wanted to join the sports teams but I could like out play anybody who was on the actual high school teams and I'm just like the coaches or like my teachers would be like why don't you play on the volleyball team playing the basketball team or soccer team

and I'm like I just didn't care for anything and like finally it was when I got into yeah this is a great segue metal like really saved my life and it's a damn I'm getting emotional because it's the honest truth it's honestly your band

did that suicide silence for me it was like I I started playing guitar hero and I heard Slipknot before I forget and that was when YouTube was coming out and it just opened a rabbit hole for me it was like checked out Slipknot

then it was like suicide silence Whitechapel Black Dalia murder and that just like sent me down like I was like this is it for me and like I just like found this huge catharsis like when I was in high school

just like screaming along to like your songs all those songs from white chile you're trying to make me cry yeah just like screaming along to white chapel suicide silence black valley murder and that's what did it like i just love those the lows and the highs and like i focused on that and i'm like this is my thing like this is probably what i was put on this earth to do and then i got into rapping much later but it was really like the metal deathcore vocal style that like i was like i have something now in life that's worth living for and is that when you started practicing

and vocals in your room far as a day. Yep. Yeah. I was just in, uh, fortunately, um, my mom's parents, uh, bought my parents a home. So I had a, uh, a basement to just like practice and like, I drive my mom crazy. And she was just like, what are you like, she didn't get it. Like it's like, what's going on? But, but her and, uh, you know, my, my stepfather, they're like super cool about it.

They were like at a great stepfather too. Like they have a really solid relationship. That's cool. him and my mother. So that that was like a healing thing for my mom. So I'm happy she found that. I gave him a hard time too. So I'm sorry for that tat. So when when they first started dating. But then, you know, we have a great relationship too now. And we we didn't early on like in my teenage years. But yeah, that was it. I would just practice every day like you're doing. I would scream for hours. Like I just. No microphone just no microphone. Just yeah. I've seen the videos.

They're great. He's got short hair. It's all curly. He's wearing his glasses. He's like, 15 years old, just screaming, just in the room. Wow. That's awesome. Usually with someone with your upbringing will actually be against any kind of marriage. Usually with that kind of upbringing. So it's fascinating. I just, you know, I say like we got role models in life.

And I like to say there's anti-role models too. So it's like I got to see a lot of the negative stuff. and what went wrong there in those relationships. And just, you know, when you have a perspective on your parents when you're a child and then you realize, hey, when you grow older, like you're looking back and you like, oh, you know what? Maybe that parent did things in the wrong way or like, oh, they were trying to like, you know, like bribe you with like taking you out on outings or giving you gifts and stuff. And not that that's a bad thing, but it's like realizing like as you're older like, oh, well, maybe you should have stepped up in these other ways, but hindsight's 2020. So I just think like I don't I want to just be a better person and not be that and like just do what I can and like what I'm in control of. So like I agree. Like I think I think a lot of people, you know, you could either let life beat you down or you can grow from it and get stronger from it and just move on and like realize, hey, this is the steps to take to just make my life better. Yeah. I see I see why why you like him a lot. Yeah. He's a pretty great guy. Yeah. See that's the thing about anyone that's. introverted or introvert if you get them talking they have they have the most they have the most to say

yes yes it's cool but and it's and that wall is hard to break though that that wall is pretty hard to break yeah yeah but it's and that's a misconception that um introverted people don't like conversations like they don't like to talk and it's not true it's not true about so we love to talk just about things that matter like we don't like small talk and nonsense and conversations that see It's cool. Boring, but if you just find the right topic, then it's like we won't shut up, you know. Yeah. It's like, you know, talk about slept not and have an instance.

You got to talk for, you know, a few hours. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. No, it's so true. Yeah. You know, but we also, yeah.

If you find a certain subject, you're just going to. Yeah. Let's go. Yeah. And I think it's especially important, like now more than ever to have these conversations. because like not to make this conversation like the podcast about this but just with social media and everyone just being glued to to a phone and screen and all that which there are extremely positive aspects like what's happening here right now people are going to be able to listen to it

and watch it which is which is great but there's the negative aspect of it just people constantly scrolling and attention spans decreasing and I feel like I I was in love with the concept of the internet when it first became a thing and just having access to like music because I was in a small town at the time. When I found metal, especially like how am I going to listen to music? I had no way of doing it. So I used the internet. And I love that. And I loved what Facebook first was or Myspace before that.

It was great. But I don't love what it's become. and I think now more than ever, it's important to just like put your phone down and meet people and have genuine interesting conversations because humans are meant to be social beings. Even if you are introverted, we're meant to socialize, you know? True. Yeah. And that is the conflicting feeling in our bodies. Like we're introverts, but we need to go out there and talk to people.

So it's like, it's just conflicting, you know, and I really feel for people that haven't gotten to exercise at that muscle. It took me years to get out of it. Yeah. Because you basically build your own shell and you're in your own shell because you're introvert. Yeah. Which who you are, but also you need human connections at the same time. It's just like conflicting. Oh, it sucks.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I will say for me, what's helped is being a vocalist. If I weren't a vocalist, yeah. If I were guitar player, drummer or whatever, I'd probably just sit in a corner and I'd talk to anyone. but just kind of forces you. You're like, I'm stage now.

Everyone's looking at me on stage. What do I do? Yeah. And one thing I picked up on was when I would go to shows myself and look at bands performing, I feel like, again, instinct, I would gravitate more towards the bands that felt genuine or the front people

that felt like, I don't know what they're going to say or like they're not working with a script. They were just like in the moment, vibing, picking up on the crowd and talking to the crowd. And it just felt like it came from a genuine place versus, let's say, the bands that came out and they were super choreographed and, like, say the same thing every night and this and that, which I understand it's a show. And maybe some people need that structure to put on a great show.

But I connected more with those that were just improvising it. Like, I don't know what I'm going to do. And I think that inspired me to come out of my shell and just, be like, I can't do the rehearsed choreograph thing because it just feels fake and phony for myself, who I am as a person, but I can just let loose and do my own thing. And it's interesting how some nights it's maybe not going to go as well, but then some other nights it'll be great, you know, because the crowd's inspiring and I get inspired by that and I can let loose. So, yeah, it's definitely helped. Yeah, it's cool sometimes. Yeah, a band will help you or won't. You'll make a huge,

both ways. Yeah, absolutely. Well, I gotta be responsible. You guys have a new record coming out. Yes, that is true. February 14th, correct? Yes. First record.

Yeah, first official whole album. The first album. We even have pictures of it here. Yes. All the color of the vinyl, sick. Yeah, it's awesome. That's our guitarist Phil. He did the graphic design for it.

Nice. If you're just listening, it's like a purple splatter. Yeah. What you got me with the purple. It's nice. Yes, this is great. It's funny because purple's my color too. Like my room, my studio slash stream room, it's all purple.

It's like that cover. That's cool. And before this record, you have two EPs. EPs. Yeah. Nice. Crossed me twice. Congrats.

Okay, I was going to ask you, who did the artwork for your... Like that? Yeah, who did this artwork? That was Alexandra Morales. That was our ex-gatars brand's ex-wife. Yeah. She's a painter. She's an incredible fine artist, yeah.

So we asked her to do the artwork painting. That's actually like, I haven't seen that one in person, but I saw the previous one in person. It's actually like a super large painting. It's like, yeah. It's a crazy full on piece. It's the size of like a wall. Yeah, that's been digitized afterwards. Was that a, what, was that plan where one of eight piece called Kings a day, the next one

called full tomorrow is that planned or is uh it was supposed to be a full album like so all the songs on those we recorded it as an album but then the pandemic happens so we're just like let's um you know let's extend this like how can we just like push this that's smart so we just split it up so the yeah the initial artwork was just the king's today one and then i was like i'm sorry alex can you uh give us another one do another one with a different color scheme so i actually with all this all the six sense artwork i actually doodle it I'm a terrible drawer, but I got ideas. So I actually doodled both art pieces and she brought it to life.

And then the same thing with our future artwork. Same thing with Cross Me Twice. Yeah, with Cross Me Twice. I did the same thing. I do concept drawings and then I'm like, here, you know what you're actually doing with this. So make it a real thing. It was great because we just had no ideas for the album cover. And he sat up, stayed up until like seven in the morning.

I worked on them for like eight hours, just like sketching, listening to the music. And just like trying to get inspired by each song. all like what can I come up with and yeah like based on the lyrics I was looking at the lyrics and just like doing little doodles and I think it's 20 drawings that you have and that one became the cover but then some of them have become merch designs either merch designs or like art inside the booklet okay you know yeah nice yeah and I really like the art for this because it's like it kind of encapsulates like the themes of our album cross me twice and kind of like it's like the inspiration comes from my upbringing too where it's like hey I went through this this where it's like yeah i've seen i've seen like beer bottles get thrown at the wall so it's like just that image of the the vase getting like smashed by something it's like something beautiful and it's getting destroyed by something so ugly that's the concept behind it what what i enjoy about that is how we had i don't think this was in your original drawing was it the the knife on the handle i think of the bat i don't think it was i think it was yeah it was because yeah it was the idea was

like I wanted something like you're kind of hurting yourself while you're holding it. And that's the idea that if when you, when you harm something or someone else, it's like you are harming yourself too at the same time. So we wanted to depict that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I want to get high to think about that for a while. That's it. Yeah. That's cool. Congrats. First, first album. Yes. Thank you. Yeah. When I got hit up by Alex about your, your band, I got, I got, I, I heard Masquerade. Parade.

Yeah. Masquerade parade. Yeah, there we go. The videos right there. That's quick. Like the intro is like, email back yes. Really?

Okay. It kind of show that sometimes, you know, I'm just as guilty. It's funny. Sometimes I feel like I am a hypocrite sometimes where it's like, why don't people listen to my record? Why don't listen to full song?

But I'll listen to a band for 10, 20 seconds. and then no. It's like, man, why do I? Fuck. Gotcha. But I did that, I did that with your band. And then I heard, I heard the, the intro's, this is sick. You ever seen the, it's called, is it Batman or Robin?

There's a song from Balenko. It was like a kind of like a, that kind of. I know what you're talking about. I was like, it kind of took me back there. Oh, okay. I was like, oh, I haven't heard a band do this ever. Well, thank you. Finally someone did it.

Well, thank you. So for many years, I would use my voice as a way to create, like, textures and sounds in the music in the background. And I think part of that was because my first love in music was a piano, actually. Like my first memory of wanting to be a musician was just driving by the music store. and just begging my dad to go inside, and he's like, we're not buying anything because that's who my dad was. He would always tell me, like, a million knows

before finally saying yes, which I'm super grateful for. And, yes, I just walked in, and as soon as I saw, like, the keyboard section, the pianos and all that, I don't know why. Like, something pulled me there. And we walked out with, like, a Yamaha, like, the cheapest, you know,

dope. Five-octive keyboard you could find. And I just never, had like any like lessons or any like just just self-taught and I would love um I love the idea of like creating like soundtrack like I love soundtracks and I love gaming music and all that and just like how many different things you can do with keyboards and so I would I would do that by myself um at home but I never had the chance to do that on a song like an official release until recently But all that being said, because I didn't have a chance to do that with keyboards, I would do it with my voice as much as I could.

So it's like we have the main vocals, but then it's like I'm going to make some choirs or some eerie pads or whatever using my voice. So that's what to segue into that, that's what I did with Masquerade Parade. Like that intro, it's like, I don't know, 20-something tracks of me just doing creepy sort of sounds and layering it together. And I think you know it sounds like me when you know my voice, but I could see people being like, oh, I didn't realize that was you, you know. Yeah. So I'm happy you like that intro. That's cool. Hey, yeah, Jake, can you can't create the intro for like 10 seconds?

Yeah, I was, okay, I'm in. I'm in. Yeah, with the beat too and everything. I'm in the band. That's sick. That's cool. Thank you. Was this the, I don't know, was this the first single or no?

Third single. Third, okay. Yeah. Because you lose three, three, right? So far. So far. Yeah. Because in Spotify, it won't put the order.

I was like, which one is first? Yeah. First, crap. By the time this is out, there will be another one out. So we'll have four at that point. Okay. Yeah. Cool.

Yeah. What's the label? Eryg. Nice. Yeah. Went full on freaking death metal to label. Okay. That's cool.

It's, yeah. Nice. It's cool. Okay, so you guys were living in Montreal for a minute. Actually, we were in Chicago. Chicago. We were in Montreal like a year. Yeah.

We were. We moved to Chicago. Our first year together was in Montreal and then we moved to Chicago in 2016, end of 2016. What made you move out of there to Phoenix? Everything. Oh, yeah. A lot. Well, Chicago, so Chicago was just the obvious choice because I grew up there and my dad was there.

and family and all that. So it's like, okay, if we go to states, let's go somewhere where we know people and we have some support, you know. But it increasingly became more and more difficult to live there with, you know, the crime and and financially too. Everything just got so much more expensive,

taxes and all that and the cost of living in general. So we were just for a few years, just saving up money and trying to get out of the there and we weren't exactly sure where we wanted to go. We were like, we're going to do Phoenix, or are we new Arizona? We need Florida. Tennessee was there. It's an option. And then on the last tour that I did with the Agonist, Robbie was actually with us on that tour, helping out with merge and driving and all that. And we had a day off in Phoenix and we just were like, yeah, this is the place. It was, I don't know. It was like 104.

but it felt great. Oh, wow. Cool. It felt great. It didn't feel like Florida, humid, sticky, you know, like I can't do humidity. Yeah. But specifically, too, I remember the show that I played that night. It was one of the few places I've been where it was like a death metal tour for the most part, death slash black metal tour.

But the crowd, they were wearing shirts from like anything. As you're like power metal, the grunge, old school rock and roll, like every t-shirt you can imagine. And I was like, I like this, you know? Yeah, yeah. Because like one thing, one issue that like a lot of metal heads have is just being super like narrow-minded and focused on the genre that they love. So they're like, I'm going to go to the death metal show. I have to wear a death metal shirt, you know. I can't have anyone think that I don't, I listen to something else, you know.

And I just feel like Phoenix, the vibe there is just like, we don't care. We'll go to all the shows. They're just excited to go out and have fun. And maybe it's the sun and the vitamin D that you get in your body. It just like makes you a more positive person. I don't know. Oh, wow. True.

Yeah, true. Yeah. So we just fell in love with it. And now we're there. So you guys are already, you guys. So do you have a like discussion for like a few years? It sounds like, hey, we should probably move out. Let's start sweeping up.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Initially, we were just going to like move next. store to Indiana. Yeah, we were considering Munster Indiana. It's really nice. They have a nice brewery there called Three Floyds that we love. I love the beers from there.

That's all you need. Yeah, it was a really cool spot, yeah. The Midwest is really nice. We even looked for homes there too. But we just kept getting out bid. Like we'd like put in an offer and then somebody else would come in like a developer would come in and put like 30,000 more and it's like okay this is already a fixer up or

somebody else is putting it 30,000 more. We weren't meant to live in Indiana. But yeah, it was just like, okay. I love you in the weird way. Yeah. Yeah. So to add to that, that's why, like, if bad things happen to you or things aren't going your way, it's because perhaps better opportunities will come up. And that's the case sometimes.

Yeah, people, we're not good at having foresight. No. You know, but you just want to see, oh, it's not going my way. What's the problem? But, yeah, open the door at some point. Yeah, it's the same thing with our relationship. I'm thinking, like, man, if I just settled down with some other woman before Vicky, it's like, I wouldn't be here.

right now. This, my life, would have taken a whole different trajectory. So it's like sometimes your biggest losses end up, you know, happening for a reason. It's crazy. It's so bizarre, man. It's cool. Yeah, I heard, Vicki, I heard you talk about when, um, when you put out that EP with the agonus, you, you weren't aware that was going to be your last thing. No. Recording. No, I didn't. What, would, uh, would, uh, anything have changed if you, I had known. Yeah. I don't think so.

I think I would have been more sad as I was creating it, like as I was writing the lyrics and the vocals and all that. It's really interesting because it turned out to be a themed EP. Like I didn't, that wasn't my intention, but then I was like three songs in and I'm like, I'm noticing a pattern here with the lyrics. So let me just continue it. And it is actually, it's, it's about a journey through death, that, that EP. And then the final song, you come back.

to the world and the world is like not what you remembered it to be so I for me it was like a segue EP to another bigger album hopefully in that direction and it just didn't end up being that but at the same time it's kind of poetic I guess how it's sure about death and then the band doesn't exist anymore yeah interesting uh yeah it's kind of crazy how that works yeah absolutely wow I was wondering I was born because we always at hindsight I was like I'm wondering I wonder I wonder if she would have changed anything. You know, I'm always like, a brother son, I'm like, I wish I would have did this differently.

I'm an idiot. Could have made that better? Could have? Oh, yeah. So I struggled with that in general in the beginning as a songwriter and as a vocalist. Like sometimes I'll go back and listen to things I did. And I'm like, oh, man, that could have been done better or different or whatever. But one thing I, I guess, one philosophy or mentality that my mentality shifted in recent years

that to tell myself that that was the best possible thing I could have done at that moment in time. It's not like I had the knowledge of five years after than that I could have done it. I couldn't physically do it at that time. So I did my best and moved on, you know. Yeah. I think that helps. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And Rob, you mentioned when you joined your band, Stuck Mojo, you mentioned.

You mentioned that you learned a lot from Rich and any sneak as far as like a songwriter. Yeah, definitely. What was your takeaway? That was a really cool process. It was just like I just learned a bunch of like technical things like how to record vocal takes like layering stuff. Just seeing how they songwrite. And one cool takeaway I got from Rich for songwriting was like he's like you need to layer the music in a way where there's like kind of like different tempo changes with. different instruments. Like, I'm not really technical, so...

I think tempo changes. But it was just like, basically, like, if something's going like, duh, da, da, da, da, have something else like a shaker going like, just like make it's like a bunch of layers. You're talking about arrangement. Yeah, arrangements, yeah. So, like, he, he does that with, like, like, his guitars and, like, the instrumentals. And I was like, wow, what a cool process. And it was just like, I mean, I think perhaps like I went into it, like, I'm grateful for my my guitarist and my band that I was in Asta, Dave Evangelista, I always, like, love to give him props because he taught me a lot about, you know, recording vocals and, like, being on time. He's an

incredible guitarist. It's a shame he doesn't, like, do music anymore, really. But so I went into it, like, with a lot of knowledge. And then just, like, recording with Andy and Rich, it was, like, I didn't really get too much feedback. It was like, I was good, I guess. Like, I just had a week to do it. And it was like, they were like, yeah, you did great. You did great. were super pro and I just wish I had a bit more time but like Andy was there in Georgia with us and we just had a week and it was like the end of the record and then Rich went to finish it off elsewhere yeah it was a good process yeah I will say Robbie's a bit of a robot um in that he will you tell him do three takes and they'll be like identical really I don't know yeah I don't know I'm really good with

that that was like a compliment I got from Andy too where it was like he's like all right do the take and then do another one and it's It's like, great, it sounds pretty much the same. So to add to context to that, if someone's listening, they don't, they don't, like, why would you need three identical takes? For example, it's like a lot of way, a lot of producers, mixing engineers like to work is that it's not just a single main vocal. They like to use dub vocals underneath to like make it sound fatter.

Not saying that everyone does that, but that is the concept. So as close as possible as it is to your main vocal, it's not going to be as noticeable. So that's why that was a. really positive thing at that time for him is just like it's great you know it just fits like a glove timing wise expression wise you know yeah and then to add to that another cool trick i saw indi doing was like while i was recording like parts of vocal sections he would edit it immediately like you'd take a little break and he would just start choosing the takes like what he liked he'd start comping things immediately and i was like oh that's smart because it's like it's fresh in your head he's like he knows exactly what he wants

how he wants it to sound and he was just mixing it right then and there and i was like it's Great, it was awesome. Six. So you put your ticket. So you probably take that and you apply it now. Absolutely. Yeah. So there's just little things like that. Yeah. I mean, we could probably talk about it for hours. But at the end of the day too, I really think it's just like basics too. Like there's just like things where it's just like this is just the rules or this is how you should go about it and just continue to apply it like that. And I love working with Vicky when we're doing like our vocal production stuff like she edits all our vocals and stuff and like we'll choose takes together. So like if she she gets my feedback, she'll be. Or whatever. what are we doing like what do you want and i'll be this take and i'll tell her why it's not just like uh it got some bullshit reason it's like well i like it when like certain words they kind of sound like the word you're saying if you understand what i'm what i mean where it's like if you're like saying like well i'm mad at you or whatever like well make be more aggressive like give me don't be like well i'm mad at you like don't choose that vocal take choose like one that like

emotes that yeah yeah yeah yeah so we are we are we We are self, well, in the past, like now we have been working with our producer that mixed Cross Me Twice, Joey Doherty. It's a co-relationship, but like up until that point, we were just doing everything on our own. And Cross Me Twice was fully recorded at home aside from the drums. We did rent a drum studio for that. But guitars, bass, vocals at home, sound design and all that, did that at home. So it's, it's, um, it's very fulfilling, but it drives you crazy at the same time when you do everything on your own.

So, yeah, yeah. Like the thing that you just mentioned that like Andy Sneep was just comping and choosing, like making the perfect vocal take on the spot. I could never do that, you know, because I'm, I'm the vocalist. So I'm recording myself. And I just make a mental note, do I feel like I have everything that I want? and then I step away and I go for a walk or make dinner or whatever and then come back and listen and then try and choose the perfect vocal take you know I can't just do it in the spot because just my head is I guess so clouded in that moment but I do love that control because in the past when I would go rent a studio and someone else would record me I haven't been happy with the results you know I haven't like oh yeah yeah it's usually like yeah we're good and I'm like I don't think we're good i want to do more takes you know what i mean and then it's like it's happened where they just

like slap auto tune on there and i'm like i hate this just let me do more takes you know yeah then then you got play shows with it and then you're not not proud of it it's like a snowball just yeah yeah it's it's the the teach a man to fish you know uh philosophy with with vocal production or recording in general where it's like when i first started out i was financially not too well. I was working like day jobs and I just quit all that because I wanted to make music my full-time thing. But because of that, I was quite poor and I would just stay at home and all my other friends that I knew that were doing music, they would run out of studio, it'd be like, yeah, it's only 10 bucks a day, or I'm sorry, a day, an hour just to record. So it's like,

it's not that expensive, but I'm like, well, I could just, I have a computer. I could just buy this cheap focus right, you know, it was $150. the cheapest microphone I could get and download a DA, which happened to be QBase, and just learn how to do it. And then I'd never have to pay for a studio again. So, teach a man to fish. So I just think it's very freeing. And I think it helps you become the best vocalist musician you can be because you're there alone

with your thoughts and your time for hours. And, you know, you're not like, oh, shit, I booked the studio only for four hours. I got to get it done. And then, especially as an introvert, you freeze up and, you know. And you start overthinking everything. Yes. Yes. So it sucks.

Yeah. I heard you guys, I heard you guys need to hear music and then you write lyrics after. Do you guys not write lyrics at all, like prior? Or do you jot stuff down and kind of store it? Yes. That. Yeah. Ideas.

For our next record, we're doing it in reverse. We're doing the lyrics first. Not the lyrics, though. Concepts. Okay. We're coming up with concepts and we're like, this song's going to be about this. Yeah. And then when we have like a riff or an idea starting to develop musically, we're like, oh, it could fit with this concept that we wrote down. Sometimes the concept is like a song title or just the idea in general. But yeah. Yeah. I just, I don't know why. I always had this knack with like if you gave me like an instrumental, I can just like, it kind of like the music speaks to me. and I'm able to be like, okay, the theme should be like about this.

And like, I'll build vocal patterns and lyrics based off of that. So it's like, I really feel like, yeah, if you gave me a song today, I could write your song today. I could like probably do an album a week if I had the time for it. Life's in the way and things get busy. That's part of being, I think, a professional musician too, is being able to do it. Like, it's better to be, what's that saying? It's better to be prepared and not called to do something than to be called and not be prepared. So I think it's important, like what Robbie just said, like, yeah, I could write me a song.

I'll write a song today. You know, I think a lot of professional musicians can do that. But then when you're talking about your band and your own art and your heart and your soul, you don't have to. You know, you could take your time. You can, I like to say that I want to. to experience more things in life between albums because a lot of the stuff we write about is our life, our experiences. And it's like I need to go through some stuff to be able to write another album. Yeah, touring the world and get a get more experiences. Yeah. Have more fights.

You know, Rob brought us a song, I hate you. You're like, what's about? I don't know. Is this, is this a metaphor for something. Yeah, she felt that way with this one song that we wrote on our second EP, Fools Tomorrow, and I was like, it's not even about you, don't worry about it. It's true. It was about a past relationship I had. Wow. And I was telling her about it. It was just like,

yeah, I was just like. Because the timing, because we had some stupid argument. I don't even remember what it was. And then he shows me the layers, like, pull apart the pieces, put them back together, throw it all away. I'm like, are you trying to tell me something? I think it's like, emo about this. And I was just like, no. It was just, honestly, it was just like a

reflecting thing where I was like yeah I was a dumb ass I was a piece of shit and I wrote it as like yeah you know what sometimes it's like hey own up to when you're the problem and that's what that sounds about sometimes you are the problem yeah and some people are like you know like oh no it's never me it's always like somebody else and I'm just like no I was I was not in a good place at that point in my life it was a bad person and now I'm fixing that and like I'm I've moved on from who I was then that's awesome And sometimes, yeah, dude, I had a, my, my first ever girlfriend, like, you know, 12, you know, and we're dating for a year. And probably I thought about her like a year ago, tears around that kind of time for it. I was like, oh, memory started coming back with bad things I did. Yeah. I was like, oh, because she, because she dumped me for, like, some senior. Because we, we got freshmen and a lot of girlfriends did that when they, everybody

in high school in my, in my, uh, you dumped the freshman and you go to go to the senior. But I was like, wait a minute. like I just started evaluating what I did I was like damn I was kind of a shitty boyfriend I kind of I kind of I sucked yeah yeah man said then I kind of read it's funny I mean this is like years ago over 20 years ago yeah I'm I re-evaluated I'm oh wait that was my fault yeah that relationship is my fault I remember like back then I was like you mean you break up and I have a Donna Bauer who years years and then popped up yeah I was like wow that that was my fault. It's important to do that, I think. But don't live in the past.

No, no. No, no. Always thrown. Yeah. I think it's important. And I think another thing that's important is to realize is that I don't like to think of like people as as good people and bad people necessarily. Like sometimes there are exceptions, of course. But I think sometimes I think like, hey, maybe I met someone at some point in life and I was having a bad day and I was a total dick to them. Sure. And they think I'm like the worst person on the place. Yeah. Maybe it's happened. But, um, but I like to think about that when I meet other people, too. It's just like benefit of the doubt. Maybe they're not having a good day or whatever. Never know. Um, or maybe they did like what you're talking about now. It's just like they were at a

point in their lives and they, they were just acting terribly towards people around them and they got out of that. So it's, things aren't black and white, I guess, what I'm trying to say. Yeah. Well, it's great that, uh, that song was not about. you. No, I was just like, hey, wait a second. Yeah, because I'm always meeting new bands and new, new conversation, new something. And then, though sometimes someone tells you a story and starts sparking stuff. This is, this has helped me, like, just kind of reevaluate my life. Someone will say something or listen to a song and his memory would just, yeah, I was like, wow, I haven't thought about that person or that thing my whole life and it pops in there. So I'm kind of

Forza. I guess I'll put it out there. It was, you know, I'm 12. So, but remember there's a school dance. And she was, I mean, she was a very, she played the flute in a band. She was very, she was a very attractive blonde chick. She was fucking sick. And remember she was dancing at school dance and I got really jealous because you're 12.

And then I remember I grabbed her by the shoulder. kind of like kind of put like enough to like you should never do that to a woman grabbed her like kind of pull I pulled her I remember like she I haven't thought about her face the way she reacted until like you know like last yeah recently I was like wow that moment happened and I just blocked it out of my mind to where it and now every guy I went wow that's yeah yeah she should have done me yeah she should have that's it yeah and that was then that was you realizing that what you did in that moment like that's not who I am no no it was just a feeling an impulse it was just like overpowering and it led you to do that and that's why I think it's important

to think about these things too it is it sucks but yeah you got to just yeah anything pops up especially when you're introvert you have a lot of time I think yeah and look up your concept thought I got to process it yeah you know you don't want to take out your fucking childhood trauma on somebody else yeah absolutely yeah absolutely you guys are I mean more more so you're married. So, yeah, I've dated my chick for five years. So, you know, just always try not to like, always try not to put, you know, ban drama or past trauma on like on that person.

Yeah. Yeah. What am I feeling? Okay, just try to, okay. Yeah. Process it and channel it in an adult way. Yeah. And that's what we do.

And I think that's what growing up is. Mm-hmm. That's what growing up is. Yeah. And that's why it doesn't really have an age. You know, like when we were young, we would look at our parents and think like, yeah, they're grownups. They got their shit together. Oh, no.

They're humans. Yes. They are humans. Grownups don't know what they're doing in life. No, but they figure it out. But my point is like there's no exact age for maturity, right? Like you'll meet someone that's 25 and maybe they own their own house and they have their shit together and they, you know, figuring out. And then you meet someone's in their 50s and they don't know what they're doing in life.

So that feeling of growing up and maturity and responsibility and all that doesn't really have a number. Yeah. Yeah. Speaking of responsibilities, have you guys thought about family or what's – Yeah. We have. Yeah. Cool.

It's been an ongoing conversation, obviously. It's tough to balance with both of us being in a band, you know. In the same band. In the same band, especially. But we do have, you know, family and all that and a support system. So if we decided to do that, we wouldn't be like entirely on our own, you know. Because the last thing you want to do is have a child and then have strangers raise your child, you know. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Cool. Yeah. How close are these conversations? I don't know. Yeah. I don't know.

We'll see. It's always like a, there's always been something with music all the time. That's like, well, we got this coming up. That's coming up. Dude, that is the hardest part. about doing what you want to do with their life because then you have like the music part and you're trying to like how am I going to

integrate these things and make it work. It freaks me out all the time. Yeah. Because it's like there's other people involved. There's like your bandmates. There's like a team behind it. There's the label.

There's other people involved. Touring crew. So it's like you can't. It's like you want to have everything in life but sometimes you can't or then like when it's like oh now you think you're ready it might be too late unfortunately. Yeah.

That's the thing. I have like this internal clock going off. I'm like, you have time, but you don't have time at the same time. Yeah. It's like, fuck. Because if there is this clock going, you know. Absolutely. 39, you know, fuck.

But you have your band members. Yeah. Yeah. And they're on lives. You might make sure you have the, you have the responsibility of making decisions that infect them. Yes. Yeah. You know? And that's, uh.

I think it's important when you are in a band to have. I guess stability and security outside of the band as well. Because like we see especially, I mean it happened with me, but a lot of bands during or after the pandemic, they're just like, we're done, you know. And imagine any individual that maybe was a part of these bands and had nothing else outside of the band. It must be a crushing feeling, you know.

And another thing I have seen as a negative, I guess, feeling being within a band is, is blaming your own band and its trajectory for your own personal life. Oh, wow. Yeah. So like I've seen people say like, hey, the reason I don't, I'm not getting a raise or a higher position in my day job

is because I have the band, you know. So like, for example, people that have worked, let's say, at a company for X amount of years, that company would let them leave for a month and then you can come back and you have your job. Yeah, yeah. But you're not gonna get a promotion. and I'm not going to give you more responsibility

because you're leaving for a month. So then you start blaming the band where it's like, well, I'm not making more money every year because I sacrifice the band or whatever. And I get it, but it's a selfish thing and it brings down your band members and the whole vibe in general. So I think...

Yeah, it's tough. Yeah. It's tough. That's why for me, I was like, I just want to do this full time if my one band isn't touring and making me my full salary from that one band, then I need to figure out other ways, you know, to monetize.

Fuck it, let's just make merch. That's what we started doing. I literally started screen printing because of that. I'm like, how do you save money? I'm always like looking of ways like, how do we save money, how do we make more money? We were always running our own merch online store. So that was something we set up. We made the website, my brother and I.

That's cool. And yeah, and then I was just like, you know what, for this album cycle, let me print out the merch because I had a bunch of ideas that I wanted to do. I'm like, let's bring this to life. And like we got Phil and the band, our guitarist who does our videos and he's doing the graphic design stuff. So it's like he's able to, I'm able to collaborate with him. We made our designs. And yeah, everything, a lot of the stuff that's going to be at the shows today and tomorrow, it's like, yeah, we, I printed them.

I just started screen printing. And it's like, it's a great fun endeavor. So new hobby. I'm always like learning new things and trying to get better. It's also because you know what that shit costs. And you're going to apply that in the future. Yes. Everything that you're doing hands on, you know, like, costs.

And I think that's pretty important. And then it's also the quality control of things. Like it's like, I'm happy with it. Like this is how I want it. I could feel it like, oh, is the ink deposit going good here? Or the colors accurate? Are the colors working? Like, is this the color it's supposed to be?

I'm able to do that because sometimes. you might go with the very talented screen printer and all the colors were off but it's really it's really tough as i found out i'm like oh this is tough let's try to simplify things like the more simple a design is the easier it is to print and it's also great as a young band that like you know you're gonna put out a new t-shirt design it's not going to like sell like crazy because you're a small band you're growing right it's great when you do it yourself because you're like i can literally just print 30 shirts at time if i choose to you know whereas like when you have someone else you're ordering merch to get like lower prices they have like I don't know a hundred minimum or whatever so you're

like okay I want to get a good price per shirt but I got to order in bulk and then you're just stuck with this leftover merch that won't sell um when you are a smaller band so um we started doing that for ourselves and like it's you know he does the actual screen printing but it's a team effort and like yeah vicky actually mixes the colors for me like the things yeah She's like, I got a good eye with that. So she makes the inks on that hoodie design. Yeah. You're both so in it.

It's crazy. I feel like bands have to be now today because it's like there's so much you need to do on your own. And it's just so costly to get started. And we're fortunate that, you know, we worked in other areas and saved up money to like reinvest and be able to do this. That's cool. Yeah. Because it's like we're really in control of a lot. There's some things in the industry you're not in control of like perception.

and like how people find out about you or hear about you. But it's like, hey, like, what am I in control of? It's like our music, our art. And it's like, okay, now we can do the videos ourselves too. Having Phil in the band, he's like, we come up with the storyline concepts too. We sit down together. And it's, yeah, we're really hands on about it. But like, I'm passionate about it.

I love the business stuff. And it's like, to me, it's like punk rock. I think a lot of people don't think about it like that. But like being like punk is like, to me, having your own community, your own people. so it's like, okay, like for me, it's like six cents and like my people, if like I can't do it I need somebody else in the band to do it and if we have to outsource somebody, let's work with them

like Alex, you know, booking agent is amazing. Just like have somebody who can do what you can't do and just work together and make money, like have your own community and like whatever the rules are and the laws are like to me it's like, okay, yeah, I'm not saying don't follow the laws or anything. Be a good citizen and whatnot and do that, but it's like there's let's book shit up.

Exactly. Like there's no. limits there's like no rules like as long as you're not hurting anybody or like infringing on somebody else's life like do your thing you know i'll apply like what my beliefs are to myself and that's how i view things and it's like yeah you know just work it yeah yeah it sounds like you guys really just want to make the band work it's cool yeah who doesn't right yeah yeah i i just obviously everyone that is in a band and is doing this like a little more seriously you know not just just jamming, like playing shows and all that.

They want the band to work. But I think it goes back to the why that we spoke about in the beginning. And I think that's where we're a little different, not to say that there are other bands out there like this, absolutely. But why are you doing this? And again, it goes back to the songwriting and being able to connect. And I think of like when I discovered music and it saved me from my own thoughts and my own, the stuff I was going through that power. Like, hey, I can write a song and it can save someone else from the other side of the world.

You know, and I think that's the one thing that I hold on to where it's like, okay, maybe we're never going to be like an arena band or whatever because you can't control that. You don't know how big the band's going to get. But just the fact that you're making a difference in X amount of. people's lives is important, I think, and it keeps you going. Whereas, I'm sure we all know this, that there's a lot of bands that maybe they're not in it for that many reasons. Like, maybe it's just about, yeah, man, I just want to rock my guitar, go on stage and, like, have fun, you know, and that's cool too, but I think if it's just that, the fire dies sooner,

you know, because then you hit 40 or whatever, and you're like, I don't feel like a rock, star anymore. I'm just dad, you know, and you just rather stay at home. But I think the fire of writing music and making a change in people's lives, I think, I think that is harder to put out. I don't know. I think the change thing, too, is cool because it's like, there's like a, there could be a ripple effect with it. Like, you know, like, I was influenced by you guys. And it's like, okay, now you, you, like, inspired a younger band to do their own thing. That's different, you know. It's like full circle where you guys are always talking about, like, you were inspired by new metal and it's like well here I am I was inspired by you guys death death core and now it's like oh now

I'm doing like this new metal hybrid thing and then I also think about like life's crazy it's like maybe there's somebody who's a kid right now that might get into six cents one day and be like you know that was my that was my inspiration and then they do something that's even better than us and like i'd hope for that because it's like with any culture like the metal culture you want it to grow and get better and like improve so that's what it's it's all about for me it's like I want to put my money where mouth is and like, like, not just talk it, like, let me walk it. Like, okay, this is how you do things and like, hopefully it inspires somebody else. Like, this is the way to do things properly and this is the etiquette and just like improve and get better. And like, yeah, to add to that,

it's like, yeah, everyone's always talking about, what's the greatest band of all time? And I always like to say, like, who's to say the greatest band even exists now? They're probably not even born right now. There's probably a bunch of kids like in 30, 50 years from now that are going to be the greatest band of all time. You don't even know it. Yeah. Music is still evolving now. We, we, we, just don't know. Yeah. You watch it in like 10 years from now or like, or even sooner or maybe longer,

there's me always like these married couple bands. You know, you know, you know, you know, that would be sick. That would be wild. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, all, all these babies on tour and now and now, and now they're the drummer. Yeah. As long as they have ear protection headphones, then it's all fine.

Have you seen those, uh, they make, they make for dogs? I have. I just saw those like a couple days ago. I think Jay probably showed me. I don't know.

I saw like these little dog headphones. Yeah, yeah. I was like, whoa. That's awesome. Oh, that's cool. Well, because dogs have crazy hearing, right? So I can imagine you bring them into a venue. That's not going to be pleasant, you know?

Jake Clay. Yeah, there you go. Oh, my goodness. So cute. That's awesome. Hey, Jay, I pulled the one with the glasses. Oh, the bottom? Yeah.

Yeah, that's nice. That, they're listening to a six. I wonder if they make headphones for cats. I don't think a cat would like it. No, cats would just say it off. Scratch everything there in the venue. Yeah, cats. Oh, they make human cat.

Okay. Yeah. Oh, my goodness. Of course they do. Everyone thinks they're a fucking cat. That's cool. Or cat wearing headphones. I don't know.

How would you word that? Yeah, okay. Yeah. Is that real? Oh. Is it? I don't. on the sign it's not doing its job that way it's not doing it's just a prop

oh my goodness yeah well maybe it could be a invention that uh i saw a cat video of uh it was it was walking on the snow in his own and put him like as like a jacket a hood and they're like a little like snow boots that's awesome do you guys you guys have any pets the dog or we do we have two dogs Two dogs. Nice. Two dogs. We got our first one, Oreo.

He's a Pomeranian. I got him from Georgia from our buddies, Rick and Lisa. Nice. They breed Pomeranians and Pomskis. And yeah, they were like just like,

yeah, you want, you want one? And I was like, Vickie, it's like fell in love. And I was like, all right.

So it was actually when I did the festival, we did two festival dates with Stucamojo. I played Bloodstock and Brule of Salt and then came back home from Europe. And yeah, that was one, like we were moving,

I was moving to Chicago. So I was still living in Montreal at that time. but I finished these shows, went from Georgia to Chicago. We stayed there a month. Then I went back to, like, wrap things up in Montreal, and then we ended up moving to Chicago, and I went through the immigration process, like, after we got married. Oh, yeah, I didn't think about that.

Yeah, I just became American last year, actually. Oh, congratulations. Yeah, thank you. I didn't put two to do together. Oh, wow. Yeah. How was that process? It sucked?

It sucked. It was tedious. I didn't do it without a lawyer. I did it myself. So like I did all the paperwork, yeah. Well. Time consuming. I like to think the, I went to college.

I got a, I guess it's the equivalent to an associate's degree here in the States in social sciences. So I think just the tedious process of going through college and like this workload of doing papers and stuff you don't want to do. Yeah. Made me like this office worker robot. And I'm kind of like very analytical with stuff like that anyway. So it just made me like, okay, it's just another, whatever. It's like another college project. So let me just like get through this essay and like it I'm I'm really good with that stuff now because of that

So like I like to knock college a lot, but really it was like I guess the work ethic behind like accomplishing stuff I had to do in school Yeah got instilled in my a work mentality and so I I did it was tedious but it's kind of nothing either like I don't want it to like sound like it was easy because it's not but for me it was like Getting through the lingo you know of yeah you have to understand the legal jargon and just like doing it and like I think you know what was the craziest thing for me it was actually like on this last run because like there's like steps to the immigration process and on the very last thing like as i was applying to do my civics test to become american i had to note down every single country i went to uh you had done two tours and i did two tours and i we went to like every country in europe and i had to note it down but thankfully google exists and it noted down google maps like noted down every single place i was at like and i

I had to note, like, every time I went back up to Canada, because my family's there, I visit frequently, and all the tours and every place we went to, every country. And, like, that last European run we did with the Agonist, I was doing merch for them, too. And I had to put that in my application. It was, that was tedious. That was like, oh, no, but I did it. So, all good. I think that's what, I think that's what love is. It's like, why, why am I doing this? Yeah. That's cool. That's cool. Yeah. Right on. Anything. that uh we uh we talked about the eps to your record uh anything that i might i might have missed that uh that that you want people to know that are fans to the podcast or fans of your of your band oh yeah i really

want to share this story with you i i actually met you and the rest of your band at warped tour when i was a kid back in 2010 oh wow really i met you guys yeah with mitch mark and you you got and you Chris and you guys honestly you made my day you guys were the coolest people I ever met and that really appreciate that that that imprinted on me I'm like I want to be that cool too so like I'm super nice to everyone who comes up to me too I'm like that like made my day yeah you did the meet and greet thing I did the meeting group thing yeah I got I got you guys signed my poster and everything yeah yeah back in 2010 and like you guys were awesome and you were actually suicide silence was my first mosh pit I went into the wall of death

that day and like you guys blew me away I was like dude this is the greatest band on the planet I love you man that's fucking crazy so it's like all full circle and it's just like you never know man it's like here we are today like talking you never know

it's funny I'm always like if I hear a story they're going to say so I met you back I'm always waiting for like something this is a perfect example at Warbatore we're drinking our 4-Loco and putting vodka in the poor local cans you just yeah we're fucking maniacs too but it's cool man I think it's yeah that's really

I think it's cool thank God it was a good experience yeah no I think it's cool to like as an artist when you meet younger kids you know I I feel like I don't know for you but I feel like I talk to younger kids differently than say someone that's my age or older yeah like because you said you were young like how old were you must have been like 16 or 17 yeah I mean you weren't like a child but you looked a lot more youthful than you look now obviously looking back then that's for sure I just I feel like when when I meet someone at a show that's like still in school I don't know I get like a little oh you came here tonight

you know like because maybe because I was a teenager and I just feel like there's so many things you can do as a teenager major, like, to have fun. And it's like, you chose to come to my show. And now you're, like, inspired and you want to be a musician, too. I just feel like, I don't know, proud in a way. So I have, like, the interactions that I've had with fans, I probably remember all the ones where it was, like, a younger kid or something.

Like, it's hard to forget, you know. I don't know. What do you mean a lot of, a lot more people today? Yes, hopefully. It'll be fun. I don't know. It's wild. It's wild that we're doing this.

Sold out today. Sold out tomorrow. Yeah. Play Anaheim today. Yeah. Sold out. Sold out tomorrow. San Diego.

Officially sold out. Nice. Yeah. That's fucking cool. Santa Barbara as well? We're not doing that show. No. We're not on that one.

No. It's a separate. Yeah. It's like in February. That one. The fuck, Alex. Come on. I'm not.

I'm not kidding. But we do have, we do have our own headline show. on February 14th as well. So the day the album's coming out, we're in Phoenix, well, Glendale, right next to it. We're doing our own show, playing the whole album, plus some old songs,

and yeah, it'll be a fun time. Cool. And if you're listening and watching, we'll put the link in the description. And if you're in a Phoenix area around there, February 14th, Valentine's Day. Valentine's Day. Nice. Yeah.

Wow. That day for me is so, discard because we put our record on Valentine's Day and then that's when the panty hit. Oh, yeah. It was like such a, but, but you're, but you're gonna make this day better. Okay. Yes. Sixth Sense is gonna bring Valentine's Day back. Yeah. Because suicide sounds almost ruined it. So you're you're the ban to do it. Six cents is the ban and do it. Hopefully. Right. Got to be responsible. Six cents, uh, cross me twice. artwork by

by Rob and Phil and Phil collaboration collab yeah and me yeah

that's great I could inspired the I'm gonna hope it I couldn't help it I couldn't help it anything else

that uh work we'll find you guys find us all socials all we're everywhere you know

six cents one word um what else what else I feel like you got Twitch but you haven't been

streaming well I got really sick during the holidays. Oh, no. I'll probably get back to it on Monday. Okay.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I stream on Twitch, but, uh, it goes back to that introvert thing. You know, if I'm not feeling good, I just don't do it. But yeah. Yeah. But, uh, yeah, I was really sick during the holidays and, uh, I guess it's good that I have experience in playing shows because up until like, like, the start of this week,

I just hadn't sung. I hadn't done anything. And I was like, I don't know, I'm going to do these two shows, but, um, it's been sounding good the last few days so I'm excited but yeah getting sick sucks that sucks yeah getting sick at rob he got sick too but he didn't get as sick yeah well I think uh I think you guys as a married are setting a great example that it is possible because you're such an in close base and you're married and you're writing lyrics together what's that's I can't wrap my head around it so it's cool that you know so on so on's out there doing it uh setting a uh example it's dope yeah thank you

thank you i appreciate that yeah that's dope yeah doing our best did i miss anything i don't think so i think we got it all we got everything just thank you for having us yeah yeah it's fine i'm honored i know i know it kind of kind of crazy with the timing and stuff and the drive but i'm honored made it work thank you six cents appreciate you thank you honored all right everyone that's it later