Garza Podcast - 254 - Billy Strings: Bluegrass Riffs, Death Metal, Knocked Loose & Mom’s Passing

Episode Date: October 12, 2026

Garza sits down in-person with Billy Strings. Grammy Award-winning guitarist, singer, songwriter & bluegrass musician. New album “So Much For Goodbyes” out now! https://billystrings.comGet ad free episodes, Garza’s guitar tone here: https://patreon.com/garzapodcast00:00 - Jammin’02:09 - Discovering Suicide Silence07:28 - First Guitar 10:56 - Getting Into Bluegrass 13:53 - What Do People Call Billy? 15:29 - 1st Gig as Billy Strings 17:53 - Cryptopsy 22:33 - Curating Early Metal & Hardcore Shows 29:05 - Early Metalcore Bands 34:32 - Riffs: Bluegrass vs Metal 44:03 - Bluegrass Rhythm 47:40 - Quitting Day Job for Music 50:57 - Writing Dust in a Baggie 54:25 - Riff: Billy’s First Song Ever 1:01:30 - Escaping Addiction 1:06:38 - T Bone Burnett, Bob Dylan & Willie Nelson 1:10:28 - Sam Bush, Bluegrass Standard & Traditions 1:18:23 - Riff: Writing Home, Away From The Mire & Voice Memos 1:25:24 - Writing Still I Crash & Mom Passing Away 1:29:07 - Not Knowing Father, Addiction & Lost Family Tapes 1:39:02 - 1935 D-18 Martin 1:43:28 - Garza Plays Billy’s Martin 1:46:12 - Riff: Dethklok, Metalocalypse & Riff Cheat Code 1:49:17 - Riff: Billy Freestyle on Garza’s Fender 7-String 1:58:14 - Riff: Bury Your Dead - Magnolia 2:00:48 - Theo Von 2:03:15 - Frizzy Hair Problems 2:04:53 - Metal Background 2:07:36 - Favorite Metal Bands & Knocked Loose 2:17:32 - Top 5 Albums

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free of charge. BetMGEMGEMP operates pursuant to an operating agreement with Eye Gaming Ontario. That's crazy. octave things yeah that's that's a that's my secret weapon I put it like a 25% octave in there

yeah so unless you really fucking listen for it yeah that's wow a shit would you mind just grabbing this

fuck yeah dude just throw them in the case yeah that's good would you mind if I burn a little Paulo Santo I don't care please you got lighter anywhere oh we got

we got Yeah. Yeah, perfect. We got some heat, dude. Sick. Are you comfortable? Are you cool with where you're sitting? Yeah.

Is it the mic? I can move this. Okay, cool. Play or whatever. All right, sick. But, you know, yeah, whatever you think, man, I think. It could be a fart, a fart mic. Nice.

Point it down this way. Boom. Got you your coffee, too. Thanks, man. You got fresh. Fresh coffee, dude. Fuck yeah. Strong, too.

I reckon. Cheers, brother. Thank you. Billy, cheers, man. It's great. It's great to meet you in person. Hell yeah. Although, like I was saying,

I might have met you years ago. Really? I mean, like, in the early 2000s or mid, 2000s I was playing in metal bands you know and I remember being at my guitar player's house where we rehearsed when we were all like gathered around the computer watching the videos of this new

band that we had just found called suicide silence oh wow and it was I didn't know we're going here okay yeah straight up dude like it was blowing our fucking minds you know and I just remember like vocalist had these huge gauges and he was like this skinny little dude and the music was so sick and there was this one song that had this crazy breakdown and uh and then there was all the family guy snippets you know what the dude you're podcasting me right now oh my gosh yeah because i remember with you know tom hanks that's an aw funny guy tom hanks everything he says is a stitch this is this is too much dude and so we loved that shit and I mean that must have been like

before the first record even came out it was just like some live recordings on YouTube I'm saying probably 2006 maybe 2008 wow um like and I went back

are you out of uh 2004 holy shit so I was fucking 12 bro are you out of near at this point um or did you already move yeah I was like maybe still living out there at my mom's, but I was getting into heavy music a lot at this time.

You know, this is like when I was in middle school, and I wanted to play music with folks that were like my age. And some of my buddies, good friend of mine, Kyle, he was the guitar player in this band. At the time, they were called Fall of Victoria. and the vocalist, his name's Tyler, he actually is the vocalist in this band called Hollow Front now, and they actually are just getting ready to put out another record.

Yeah, Hollow Front. He's the guy on the left right there, so he was sick. He was like the original vocalist in the band that I was in called Two Once Darken Skies. Okay. And that was, you know, back in the day. and yeah we just we were into it man i started going to these shows um just like i said i just wanted to hang with people that were my age and play music because playing bluegrass in my whole life yeah because you're always you're always used to playing with older people right yeah and then and then

when you turn 10 uh your your dad terry got you a red squire right right with the pig amp, right? Yeah, a little pig nose and the squire. And then I started learning like some Hendricks stuff. I learned, Hey Joe. You were watching Hendricks at Woodstock on the VHS. Yeah, boom, boom, boom, right? Absolutely, yeah, man.

My dad, you know, had all these really cool tapes. And my parents were just really into music, you know. I wanted to ask you, like, what is your, it's a two-part question. I mean, what is your earliest memories, as being like a human because you got your first guitar at four but you already had like a toy guitar prior to that so i'm like you've been playing guitar practically like your whole life yeah since like diapers i mean i remember that little toy guitar it was like what was it it was like a white plastic guitar and it had like these neon like buttons on the fretboard and shit and i never had batteries yeah but right on the middle of the

guitar there was like a speaker and it had these plastic horizontal ridges like the same direction as a guitar string yeah my dad gave me a pick and i would just like chukchchchchchch i would like scratch on that and like make percussive sounds pre four yeah yeah this is when we lived in the trailer park over in portland michigan and um yeah it was it was that was my start man it was on one of those things you know my son has one now okay so so you that's actually if you're a parent it's actually a great like way to find out if like if you're serious and not get in like the toy version and see

what they do with it yeah and you're just strumming that thing for like years I assume like yeah like I said my dad gave me a pick because I assume that when those buttons on the fretboard were pushed they sang songs or whatever but I never had batteries in it I just played it like a regular guitar but it was more like a drum

you know yeah and I just like I would scratch on that thing and my dad I remember you know later in life you when he was telling me about this he said man your right hand was going and he said look at his right hand you know to my mom and stuff and and so he he thought i was going to be a player and you know yeah by the time i was four he had got me a real guitar at an antique store um and i remember when i like we were at this antique store the lady who owned that store just recently passed away actually um wow but it was like

like out by stage road where I grew up in I own you and it was just like an antique store you know but I turned this corner and I saw this guitar it was like a smaller size like good for me you know but the light was shining down on it and I just threw a fit you know I threw myself on the floor and oh yeah that's that's how you get it yeah yeah and my dad you know they didn't have any money you know and and they was like man you know come on stop you know I was like I need it you know so he took his you know he kind of talked to the lady and said what do you take for this guitar and I think it was like, you know, 40 bucks or whatever. My dad's like, I got 30 and the woman was like, he can have it, you know.

Oh, wow. And so he took his last 30 bucks that he had to his name and, you know, bought me that guitar and took me home, taught me G, C, and D and gave me a capo and, you know, I was on my way. Yeah, sure. Like, he would literally like sit, like sit you down. Like, all right, listen to Doc Watson, Bill, Bill Moreau, less or flat. Like just you really got like the most now listening to it like the most technical hard hard to play stuff at a very early age and he like sat sat you down right like you need to listen to this. Yeah, I mean the first stuff that I was learning was tunes like Beaumont Ragg Salt Creek and Long Journey Home and and you know of course Blue Moon of Kentucky and a lot of Stanley brothers stuff, How Mountain Gals can love.

And my dad had this friend, his name was Brad Lasko, and he's no longer with us. But he played the five-string banjo, and so they would get together and pick. And, man, they sounded amazing together. And they sang really well together, and they had great harmonies, and they could both, you know, pick their asses off. But that's just the way it was, like, growing up around where I was from, it was like, people would get together, have a few beers, like the instruments would come out, and it would just go on into the night, you know? and I was just a little kid, like, sitting on the cooler, kind of watching all this shit, like, damn, this is badass, you know.

And this music just seeped into my ears, the harmonies. And I noticed, you know, from a young age that, okay, well, my dad would sing here and Brad would sing up here. And sometimes they both go up together, but sometimes my dad goes up on his own and Brad stays where he's at. Sometimes Brad goes up. And the way that this bluegrass harmony works together, you know.

And it later on, I would, you know, learn more about what was actually going on, but I just heard the sound, this lonesome kind of blues sound that exists in bluegrass where, especially if you're singing tenor, you kind of like bend up to the note. You don't really land on the fifth, but you kind of swim, you swim underneath the surface and just kiss it, yeah. So it's like, yeah, that's where the blue note exists that's where the lonesome sound is is bending up to that note so i just heard that all that stuff just soaked into my ears you know and and i was just lucky to grow up around it you know and it's it's just great music yeah and he uh you will watch his old like vhs tapes tapes of like all that those players

right and then uh and then you put what you put a peanut butter and jelly sandwich in there right yeah it did why at one point i don't know because it looked like it would fit perfect you know the VHS, you know, has had this perfect little rectangle hole, and I just took my fucking peanut butter and jelly sandwich, and I put it in there. And my dad was trying. Yeah, he was. I mean, he also thought it was funny, but he tried to put in a tape, you know,

and he's like, what the fuck, you know, what's going on with this thing? And he looked in there, and then he took the whole top off it, and there was my peanut butter and jelly, but, yeah. That's crazy. Fuck it. What do, if you don't want me asking, what do people, what do your friends call you? Or what do people typically call you?

Billy? Yeah, I've always had a lot of names, man, even just growing up. Like my family and shit and like my close friends call me Boomer. Your mom, your mom called you Boomer, man. My mom called me Boomer. Yeah, and all my close friends that I grew up with, you know, like from Ionia and shit. Yeah. They all know me as Boomer.

So like if I'm somewhere playing a gig or something and I hear somebody in the crowd go, boomer, I'm like, damn, who's that? You know, because it's like, oh, gee. Yeah, they like, no. And then, yeah, Billy, you know, William, Willie. And then, you know, like I said, when I was sitting there on that cooler trying to learn how to play, my Aunt Mandy looked at me one time and said, look at little Billy Strings.

And so that's kind of where that name came from. She wasn't really my aunt. She was just like my mom's. Mom's like best friend, right? Yeah, exactly. and she was this really cool lady that really took care of us kids when we were little. It was you and your brother, right? Right.

Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, whatever other kids were like running around at the time. But Mondi was always a very kind of sweet maternal figure. If everybody was partying and all the adults were being big, like big loud drunks and stuff, you know, she would make sure us kids, she would read us a book or something and snuggle with us and make sure we were comfortable and shit. Wow. And so later on, when she was on her deathbed, dying of cancer.

You at this point, you already moved to Transfer City, right? Traverse City, yep. Yeah, and I was starting to play like open mic nights and shit up there just for fun. At the hayloft, right? The hayloft, yeah. And there was a place called the Loading Dock that's not there anymore. But I would just go into these places. I was too young to even get inside.

I think I was probably still 18 or some shit. but I would sneak in and put my name up on the, you know, either that or they would let me play because, you know, that's kind of how it's always been. I've always hung out with older people and shit too, but my guitar, my guitar like gets me into these places, you know. And so I'd go play sneaking drinks and shit, you know what I mean? They're like, you can come play in here, but don't be drinking, you know what I mean?

I'm like, I won't, you know? And then that got you your first gig at the right brain company. That's correct, yeah, man. I got a, you know, message on Facebook or some shit, an email or something. Because at the time, I was, like, a totally solo musician. And I printed out these business cards that said, Billy Strings. And I took a picture, and I put it on there, and I put my phone number on it and shit. Maybe it was a text message.

But somebody reached out and said, hey, you know, I work at Right Brain Brewing Company, and we're putting out this beer and we want you to play the opening party so that was really my first gig as Billy Strings you saw on the flyer boom there it is yeah yeah totally it's a big moment man yeah and I mean

at that time I was really into like pokey Lafarge and stuff and I just felt like for one thing growing up like everybody always would mess my last name up it's William Apostle A P-O-S-T-O-L people all I always spell it T-L-E, like the Bible. Yeah. And so I just, I thought, man,

maybe I should make this something more easy to remember and easy to spell for people, too, because if I, you know, and then, like I said, at the same time, Monde was dying. And when she died, that's when I started putting Billy Strings on the, on the chalkboard to sign up for the open mic night. Because I was thinking of Monde, you know what I mean? Mm-hmm. And that's, it just stuck, man.

I was branded then and there. It just started everything. Yeah. You know what's crazy is like before I went, I went into your world, people kept commenting your name to me. And I didn't understand why this has been going on for the past year. It's like you got to get Billy strings on. You got to get Billy strings.

I'm like, why? And then I did a little bit of digging all the way. He, like, he, he, he, he listens to the metal, so it's just odd. I don't know, just, like, call a God or something, but, all right, I mean, hopefully one day, like, happens. Yeah. And there, around the time I was trying to get, get a hold of you, I guess, like, the, like, the connection happened. Totally. Yeah, well, like I said, I've been, I've seen your stuff for a while now, and, you know, I enjoy talking about stuff that I like, you know.

Yeah. I, I go on things and talk about my shit all the time, you know, but it's funer. to me to come talk to like some metalhead or something because i can talk about you know metal or something that i don't always talk about you know yeah what was i mean and and the timing too how did you uh you did a song with a cryptopsy right yeah that that was fucking sick dude yeah that was sick as fuck man so one of my all-time favorite bands in the world i mean ever those first couple records none so vile and blasphemy made flesh Fuck, dude

It doesn't get any better I mean that is my favorite death metal Yeah straight up Was that at a festival? Yeah, well they just came and played at my At my party and I own you that I had But before that I had played a We were at this gig man

We were playing in like Fucking Iowa or some shit I don't know Texas Yeah I don't remember where we were but I figured out that Cryptopsy was playing in the same town as me and you know they live in Canada I've never I've never had the chance to go see them and um so I was bummed out bro I was like fuck I'm walking on stage right now for my gig and I know that right across town

flow is getting ready to oh yeah you know and I'm just like oh gee god damn it man this this sucks So I told one of my team members, I was like, go to their gig, buy a bunch of merch and bring them a cake that says open cake surgery. Just knock on their bus and fucking bring it to them. So she went out, she got this cake that said open cake surgery and love BS, you know. And went and bought a bunch of their merch and she delivered them this cake. And they were like, what the fuck? Like, who is this guy? You know, and so they had sent me a message being like, man, thanks for the cake.

Like, that's so sick, you know, like, and then I, that's how we kind of became friends. Like, I just creepily sent them a cake. Dude, I don't know what I would do is someone made me a cake. Like, what the, this? Keep this person, like, away from me. Yeah, for sure. Dude, I wanted to creep them out. I was like, fuck it.

You might have. Oh, no. Great. What did they say? Well, they were like, thanks for the cake, you know. And then I think they probably looked at my shit and was like, dude, this kid shreds, you know, this bluegrass stuff. And then so I became friends with their vocalist and some of the other guys, you know, in the band. But yeah, mostly I talked to Matt, I think, like just on Instagram and shit.

Yeah. And he told me about this thing that they were doing, what was that, 20 or 30 or something? 30 years of blasphemy made flesh an anniversary. So they were going to do like the whole record as like this big nine minute fucking montage. Yeah. Like just go from one song and the other like a medley.

Yeah. And he was like man well you play the open face surgery guitar solo on here? And so that's what they did. It was called blasphemy made fresh and I recorded the solo on that and that was like

I was so fucking honored. You know? I'm like Oh my God, I'm collaborating with Cryptopsy right now. Like, this is fucking incredible, you know. And so that was sick. And then, yeah, most recently, man, I had this party in my hometown of Ionia. And I wanted to have some metal bands. Like, we had a bunch of bluegrass bands, but I wanted to have, like, this metal tent. So I kind of curated this lineup of, like, a lot of the bands that I used to run around with and stuff.

Flesh and blood robot was a big one They're from my hometown They were from You know A little bit before like my band came around And shit We looked up to them They were like a little bit older

And they were killing it in the area They had a record called the sounds that Revolvers make Shit is fucking sick I never heard of them Well you're school only me Yeah flesh and blood robot So the vocalist Chris Fox

He's actually in Cue next Tuesday right now That grinds Yeah. Oh shit. Yeah. And I remember, you know, like we used to, you know, we played shows at this, this VFW hall all the time. And this lady Deb, like, owned the place, but she let us kids, like, curate it. Like, me and all my friends got together. Like, we painted the place. We built the stage. We, you know, sourced a PA. We did everything. I mean, I would work the door. I would take five bucks ahead, you know, and we would get back. And we would get back. bands from like Detroit or Lansing, you know, we used to get For the Fallen Dreams, fight it out. There was a band called No Life at the time. They're now called Heart Sick. And all these bands, you know, back then it was like, and the sky went red. There was this band, you know, a bunch of like regional bands. Who else would come through? This band called My Friend Rudra. I mean, I think maybe even Black Dalia came through at one

but it was like our shit like we were throwing these shows we were the ones like bringing these bands we'd be like five bucks ahead fight it out would come from flint put on their hardcore show and then we would have you know we would open the show for free and uh and then flesh and blood would play and then for the fallen dreams and then fight it out or some shit you know and then fight it out would get like 400 bucks you know and we would like you know five 10 bucks ahead i would always pocket a little bit for some weed or something Of course you did. Yeah, but I mean, it was like we were throwing our own DIY shows,

and that's how I got to meet a bunch of these guys. And I mean, this is when For the Fallen Dreams had, like, Andrew as the vocalist. I remember he worked at Hot Topic and shit. This is, like, before Changes, before any of that shit, like, changes was, like, late for the Fallen Dreams for me. And, yeah, I remember C&C next Tuesday back when they had that guy bare on vocals. He did all, like, inward vocals. Yeah.

It was crazy. But, yeah, later on. Fox got that gig and yeah Flesh and Blood Robot man they were they were from my hometown and they were like my heroes like I looked up to those cats

and so at this party that I threw we got all these old bands that used to play at the VFW to come play. Flesh and Blood played, see you next Tuesday played for the fallen dreams played

um heart sick played and so this is like a total throwback to our VFW shows it was called the center is what we named the place or whatever but then we also got Bain and Cryptopsy came to play so it was a pretty diverse you know there was some grindcore there was some hardcore there was some death metal um it was a pretty like diverse show but it was also like a total throwback to to the shit we all used to be into you know Yeah. How did it mesh?

It was great. Really? Oh my God, it was incredible. Like, I saw all these kids that, like, come to my shows all the time, like, wearing tie-dye and flip-flops, like, crowd surfing and moshing and shit. So it worked. It worked. It worked amazingly. Wow.

And I've been trying to get... Pyramids game. Yeah. Yeah, that was it, bro. Pinball and metal tent. Yeah. Bang is legendary, dude. Yeah, they killed it, dude.

Every band killed it. shows. I, yeah, me too. I mean, I remember seeing them at the inside-out gallery up in Traverse City, and that was the first time I ever went to a show where there was just a steady line of people stage diving, like, the whole time. Like, holy shit, this is incredible. There was, like, more people on stage that weren't in the band than are, you know? But, but, but yeah, man, I, uh, I kind of just developed a taste for it. Like, at first, I didn't understand it. I mean, I came from listening to Bill Monroe and the Stanley brothers and shit. Yeah.

And the first band that really turned me on was no life. And who is now heart sick. Okay. And because Alfonso would sing. And then they would also scream. And so, I mean, but when I first heard it, I'm like, you know, screaming and shit and all this heavy music coming from bluegrass, It's like, man, this isn't music, you know?

Like, what the hell is this shit? And then No Life, I kind of dip my toe, and I'm like, well, this is kind of cool. They got some hooks, you know, they had a song called Vains and Vines, and they had one called balloons, that both of those songs really kind of hooked me. And so then I went from there, and then I really got into flesh and blood robot, which was they're kind of like grind core in a way, but they had breakdowns. And it wasn't like straight up grind. like one-minute songs with crazy titles.

It was like, you know, they were kind of a little bit of everything. But they had cool harmonies with the guitars and shit and really cool riffs. I can't say enough about Flesh and Blood Robot, man. They were like... You're like pushing it hard. Well, they were like my key into this shit. You know, I fell in love with that band. And, you know, from there, it just went...

I mean, I totally fell in love. with it. Now my acoustic guitar collected dust and all I played was heavy shit. My grandma hated it. You know, she was like a hardcore Christian, like Baptist and she was like, this is the devil's music. You know, I fucking, next thing you know, my hair was dyed black. I had big ass gauges. I was wearing girl pants, you know. I was a scene kid. And how far are you from Granite Rapids? Half hour. Half hour. Okay, so you're, oh, okay, it makes sense.

Yeah, this was my band, bro. So that's me in the green shirt. That's you? Yeah. What the hell? Back in the day. That was at like a team center thing that we played at. And that's Kyle on the guitar and the Abercrombie shit.

And then in the Dillinger shirt, that's Tate. And then back there with the bass, that's Jacob. And then our drummer, his name was Jamie Byrne. But our band was called Two Once Dund. dark in skies. And, yeah, I can show you a little bit of it. Oh, please, yeah.

This was in the basement of a church, bro. Yeah. Yeah. Outta boy. So that's me in the gray sweatshirt. Right here. Dude, the lyrics, the lyrics that he's saying right here is who the fuck is

Helen Keller. That's all he's saying. Oh yeah. Got it. That's the breakdown. Who the fuck is Helen Keller? That's all you need, man. Man, when was this? I don't even know what year this was. I was probably like 13 or some shit. Wow.

Is that a... Is that an Ibanez? Yeah, it's an RG-570, bro. Ooh, look at an RG, dude. I love Argees. Yeah. Yeah, that guitar was sick. It was like, I think we called it Barney. It was like purple, but kind of blue. They called it Barney? Yeah.

Wow. It was dope. Do you still have it? I do. Oh, dude, it was great. I actually, I don't have that one. I have, like, I bought the same guitar later on. That guitar got pawned off.

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So I got one. That's what I played the solo on the Blasphemy Made Fresh. Yeah. was on that RG, yeah. Wow. Yeah, dude. So, like I was saying, at that time, you know, around this time, we would go to skeletons and see shows.

We would go see, I remember going to check out beneath the massacre. Like, holy shit, dude, it was fucking awesome. And seeing suicide silence back in the day, I remember, I mean, it was just incredible. And that was at that time, like, in between songs, it was always some family guy shit. And, you know, I was like, that was the first time I saw a band, using like little clips like that like in between songs that that was the purpose to get like ingrain in people's memories and then years later they stole oh yeah they have like the family guy clips yeah but then yeah like after the show man we were out back at skeletons and i remember uh

you know some of us were like smoking down or whatever and one of the guys i think maybe lopez or something was like someone's talking to samson and they're like who's talking to samson like i feel like you guys were having that like that was a saying on your tour like let's talk to samson like meaning like let's go blaze like all my it might have been he he was the smoker and in a bunch they had all these weird words and crazy words i didn't even know because i didn't smoke until i was 21 so the first two years they were like what the hell is going on and now and then now even now i still like connect things so oh yeah you're fucking high as shit yeah but yeah it was cool man we got to meet you guys

Everybody was really nice to, like, me and my friends. Everybody was like, All Shell Parish was on that show. I can't remember who else. So you saw, like, the All-Shill, that was 2006, right? Yeah, you were there. That was our first tour ever. Yeah, bro. You were there.

Oh, my goodness. Yeah. It was at Skeletones. Scalotones, man, wow. Yeah. Yeah, we were gone for two months. It was a fucking blur. You know how it is just going for it.

All right, this is it. I'm fucking leaving the house. Yeah, and we got it. in a van or something yeah a white a white fan like an econeline van or some shit yeah my i remember that was the first time i saw all show pairs too we came for suicide silence like i said me and my boys dude we fucking we huddled around the computer when we first found this shit was like dude listen to this breakdown and and and mitch's vocals were so insane you know like when he did like lows it was just like so incredible and like just the range that he had was like the highs were so high

and the lows were so brutal and it was just like the crazy like opposite light dynamic just added like this dimension to it yeah and just coming from this like scrawny little dude with huge gauges like whoa freak dude yeah just even too to say he's a fucking freak yeah man just had a special voice man absolutely wow yeah i was hyped man oh shit there is skeleton tones oh shit you actually have that july 2006 yeah damn bro then you guys went to harpo's and the interstate section. Have you been to Harpo's? Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean that, yeah, I grew up around there, so. What other, um, because I was, because I was, I was watching you play riffs. I'm like, man, like his like the tremble was like kind of better than mine. Like, I mean, like, what's like the, what's like the connection with what

with bluegrass and like metal riffs? What's that like, is there? like anything similar? Well, man, you know, playing bluegrass is like, especially flat picking guitar, mandolin playing stuff like that where you're using a pick. Yeah. It's pretty right hand dominant, you know? I mean, the left hand is doing what it has to do, but it's really based on what's going

on with your right hand. And there is a lot of like alternate picking and just kind of up and down, I guess, what you'd call tremolo picking. you know. And, um... I call it speed picking. Yeah. But I mean, like, you know, like, even this stuff...

Like... Oh, yeah! So... Kind of like Dick... Kind of like Dick Dale or something. I mean, I'm... I'm going up and down a lot, you know? And so...

And it's, like, the tremolo thing, that is a really... Um... common technique for mandolin players. Is it? Yeah, I mean, mandolin players a lot, especially because you have the double strings, you can just like, and I do that on guitar sometimes, you know.

And it's kind of cool because playing like metal kind of gave me some of that better tremolo technique, and now when I play mandolin, I can kind of use that. But I also think playing bluegrass helped me play metal. And then now, Now that I have a career in bluegrass, I think one of the things that kind of like set me apart in the world that I exist in was that I had played in metal bands.

I mean, I started playing bluegrass and I learned how to play by playing that. And then I got into metal and I played some of that. And at a certain point, I just realized that bluegrass is where my heart is. It's what reminds me of my childhood. it brings me back to hanging out with my dad when I was a little kid. It's a beautiful, like, spiritual thing for me. And I love all sorts of music, but I kind of came to this point in my life where I was like,

what am I doing playing all this heavy shit? Like, I should play bluegrass, you know? That's like what I really love. That's what makes me cry and laugh. And it's unlike anything else, you know. I mean, I can hear a certain Stanley Brothers song, and I'm zapped back to when I was four. years old before I knew anything dirty about the earth.

Wow. It's deja vu, you know, and it's a bonding thing that I shared with my dad. So many years of jamming together. Yeah. Yeah, and like I said, like when I was just a kid and everything was good, and before, you know, any of the bullshit, you know, there was food in the cupboards and we played music and everything was fine. It seemed like the sun was shining on us.

but you know later on when I started writing my own music and stuff I tried to like incorporate that sound okay the heavier stuff not on purpose but just when I started writing stuff you know like there's this

like I wrote that song turmoil and tinfoil and I didn't mean for it to be like this kind of heavier thing it just I was writing these lyrics and through the turmoil in the tinfoil, you know, and I was like, well, that sounds like kind of like some dark shit, so I started writing this riff. And I realized that I was kind of using some of my more heavy metal influences, even though

I was playing bluegrass and writing for a bluegrass band, I was still allowing myself to kind of, you know, use some of these more diagonal and crunchy sounding things. Whoa. And on top of that, I never really. performed as a bluegrass musician. I think a couple of times, I got a talent show or something here and there, but I learned how to perform in a metal band,

and we would throw our guitars all over, and we wouldn't even be in tune, we'd be head banging so hard and spitting on people and kicking people and running into the crowd and whatever, crawling up and down the walls. So when I kind of started playing bluegrass, like, again,

professionally, and I would find myself on stage with a band, I couldn't help but still move like that. Like, I would headbang and shit. We'd be playing some fast bluegrass song, but I'm like, I'm wanting to fucking headbang. And I just couldn't help it because that's how I knew how to perform. So it just is like this kind of conundrum of like, I play bluegrass, but I love heavy metal.

And I learned how to play by playing bluegrass, but I learned how to perform in a metal band. And so, you know, yeah, I, I play bluegrass but also sometimes when I'm writing songs my metal influence comes out

like even more recently I have a brand new song on the record that starts with this riff that's like Oh that's fuck And it's like that comes from like heavy metal shit You know what I mean that's not bluegrass It's all diagonal and crooked

sounding and shit you know I don't even I don't even know you're fucking doing man that's crazy yeah that one's called lucid daydream and and man was funny too is like just everything i've learned throughout my life you know even just playing these like diminished chords you know like any of that uh them half augmented diminished chord demented shit yeah yeah i don't know what it's called but you know that that uh Robert Johnson chord?

Yeah. Soul to fucking soul, dude. Diminished, I guess, is the sound I'm looking for. And that came off your new record dropped in August, correct? Yeah, some of this, this, I call that the polywag riff, you know?

And I don't know why I call it that. I just needed something to call it so I could tell the guys, okay, we do the polywog riff. The polywag riff. And then we do this thing. Which is totally not bluegrass. you know i mean that's more like

i would use that yeah you know um i'm probably i'm a steal dude i'm i guess like the whole point of talking about that shit is just to point out like that these like heavy metal influences are still making their way into my shit

whether it's how i perform on stage or when i'm writing music you know i may be writing songs to play with my bluegrass band but I'm still thinking sometimes in these heavy riffs. Maybe that's been part of my... Maybe that's what, that's what, like, separated you. Yeah. Added things that don't go together, but when it's done properly and went bright.

Well, I've always just wanted to, like, be myself, you know? Always, yeah. And try to not get in my own way when I'm composing music to try to just follow whatever that, inspiration is and sometimes it's darker stuff and I feel like when I'm writing darker lyrics and stuff it just calls for darker chords and sounds yeah and I have that kind of metal background that I can pull from and it's not a pre-contrived notion it's just how it happens you know I don't always write stuff like that I mean some of the stuff is more inspired by the classic bluegrass I grew up on

or you know um but i've never tried to like pigeonhole myself as like one style of you know i play with a bluegrass band but we play all sorts of different stuff yeah you know you do you know what's insane is i was listening to your records and i didn't even realize what i was listening to until you said it i was like oh yeah uh it was like some and interview yeah we we don't have a drummer dude i let's do a full record didn't even realize there's there's no drums yeah i was like what the fuck that's that's kind of the cool thing about bluegrass it's like you are living my dream it's no no drummer dude oh yeah love you ernie but it's like uh it's like a v8 engine or something you know there's all these different moving parts and the bass is doing one thing the mandolin is

chopping. The bass is like the kick drum. I was wondering, how did you keep time then? Yeah, I mean, the bass is going, you know, a lot of time and then in between that, the mandolin's going so there's like this kind of groove that's happening, you know, and I'm going

you know, so that's actually the main thing that separates you from an actual band is because a band can be sloppy I mean, we're a pretty example, but the drummer is so on point. So if that one member that says on, the whole band sounds great.

But you guys, every member has to be on. Every member has to be on. Yeah, it's all working together, you know, to make the groove. I mean, and really the bass and the mandolin is like the kick drum and the snare. Interesting.

And then you have like the banjo doing like kind of like a roll thing. That's kind of like more like what the high hand. hat would do you know so we are the drum set you know and and and sometimes like more in our like kind of jammy stuff you know there's different grooves we get into there's sometimes there's like so you know we can do different grooves and stuff but it's it's all working together it's like it's like somebody going to doom do do don't you know it's it's do do do do do do do you know it's Do do do do do do do do do oh it's like a tom roll dude yeah holy shit i just can't do those those dots wow

yeah you know what i mean so do you how we are the drums you know and that's you know we don't play with like uh um what do anything in our ears or anything it's all just we vibe with each other you know i mean there's no like click is what i'm saying yeah you have nothing to hide like you that there's something to hide anything. Like, literally, you could come in here and play like a song. Yeah. You know, not many bands could do that. Yeah, I mean, that's the cool thing about bluegrass is you can do it on your back porch, you know, or whatever.

And you could, I could do it here or wherever. I mean, I used to busk a lot on the streets, you know, and sit on the park bench downtown and play banjo. And people would pass by and throw a $20 bill in or whatever. Throw a $20 there. Hell, yeah. Yeah, it's just acoustic music, you know. I really want to know, like, the, like, those formative years, like, because you used to work at a hotel, correct?

Yeah. And then you had a good friend tell you, kind of open up your mind, hey, like, you don't have to do this. Totally. Dom, right? Yeah, Don Julian. Yes, and. So I was in a duo project with him,

and when it started, I was working at the hotel all the time, you know, I was a terrible employee. Of course. I would, it was, it was not good. I mean, I would fucking, like, just go smoke weed. I would show up to work drunk. Yeah.

Late. My boss was constantly being like, you need to go shave your scruff or whatever. I'm like, what the fuck? Like, I'm all hungover and shit. Yeah. Dude, I used to just, like, go into a hotel room and find some, like, bottle of booze,

and I would just, like, put the do not disturb on and just go in there and drink up. Oh, my goodness. and watch TV and shit. I remember, like, driving to work one morning. It was, like, seven in the morning with, like, a beer sloshing in one hand and, like, a joint in the other, like, pulling up to a red light. Because I'm, if I didn't keep drinking, I was going to be so hung over. And I'm, like, at the red light, like, chugging this beer.

And I look over, and this lady is looking at me so disgusted, you know? Man. I'm like, fuck. But I was a really bad employee at that place, and my boss was really cool. Somehow she didn't fire me. I put in my two weeks notice, you know. I tried to do good, but I just, I was not a good employee. Either way, man, I worked there, and I would be, like, at work until, like, 6 o'clock at night.

By 8 o'clock, I would be on stage, play till midnight or 1. You serious? Oh, yeah, and then I'd go party, be up till 4, sleep for 2 hours, wake up, hungover, go back to work. I was burning it at both ends big time. And, you know, when I was in that duo project with Don, he was the one that was kind of like, man, you know, you don't always have to work at this hotel, you know. I'm like, well, what do you mean? You know, I still didn't believe that music was a viable option as a career. And he's like, well, dude, I've been doing it since the 80s, man.

Like, you could teach a lesson on Wednesday. Thursday, we could play down at the coffee house. You could play solo at the library for tips in the basement on Friday, and Saturday we'll play out at Shorts Brewing Company for tips or whatever. And we started doing that, you know. And I had these two piles of money. One was my check from work, bi-weekly check. And then the other was just this pile of cash that I got from playing all these places for tips.

And I noticed... Eventually the other side caught up their job, huh? They were the same. It was like, damn, I made $1.000. 800 bucks at work, but I also made 800 bucks playing gigs. And I used to only live off this 800 bucks, and I was fine. So instead of having 1,600 bucks and working at the hotel, well, I just still live off 800 bucks, but then I don't have to do a day job.

So then I eventually, yeah, I put in my two weeks notice, and that was like when I was like 18 or 19 or something, and I kind of hit the road on tour and I haven't stopped, you know? Wow. Yeah. Yeah, what was writing your EP like, like, uh, like, like, slow train? I, I, I heard a rumor, I could be wrong, but I, I heard a rumor that, uh, Dustin and Baggie was the second song you wrote. Yeah, it was. Are you fucking serious?

And I wrote that when I was at work at the hotel. I didn't even have my guitar on me. I had an, I always carried a little note pad in my front pocket. Like, you know, when you check into the hotel, they got the little note pad in the pen. Yeah. Um, I carried, I would. I always grab one of those from the hotel room and I would be like writing down lyrics and shit when I'm trying to work. And I wrote this song because my friend Brad Lasko had went back to prison for meth again. And that's the five-string banjo player I was telling you about that my dad's best friend.

When I was growing up, man, it was us three. My dad, Brad, and myself, we played a lot of music together. When I learned all that Stanley Brothers stuff and the music seeped into my ears like I mentioned earlier, It was Brad's banjo that I heard. He was the first banjo player that I ever heard in person. Dear friend of my families, you know. And he struggled. A lot of people struggled in the area that I grew up in.

That shit was an epidemic. Many families were, you know, ravaged by methamphetamine. And then later on, oxycottin and shit. But so he went to prison for a while. and then when he got out I was like dude we got a jam you know like me and you and my dad like with the old days

we got together one time and we played music and a month or two later he was getting hauled right back off to prison he got pulled over like at McDonald's or something he had less than a quarter of a gram in the bottom of a baggie

and then he was going away for a long time again like dude we only got to play one time and you're already going back to prison, like, fuck. So that's what I wrote that song about, you know, 20 long years for some dust in the baggie because it was just basically nothing, like less than a quarter of a gram, like I said. But he was on parole.

So, and I don't think he went for 20 years, but he went for another, at least five or something. So then I worked at that hotel. He used to call me from prison. Like I said, I was a bad employee, bro. I would go into the bathroom and that this is a call from, you know, you know, the correctional facility.

you press one to accept and I would, yo, Brad, and I would go in the bathroom and talk to Brad. And I'm like, man, I'm writing this song about you, dog. And, you know, and so I wrote that tune, Dustin a Baggie, you know, that was like my first tune that I ever wrote. Or a second one. That is insane. Yeah, because you try to write when you were 15, 16, right? Yeah, the first song I ever actually wrote by myself with lyrics and stuff, because I had written a lot of, all that stuff I played in the metal bands we composed all that music but we would write the music

and Tyler would write the vocals he would just like listen to what we were doing and jot shit down and talk about you know Helen Keller or whatever yeah very important yeah or Alex Trebek or whatever we had all these songs it was just you know something about cherry Kool-late I don't remember just

dumb shit hilarious yeah yeah but I just you know, wrote that tune about Brad and, um, but anyway, the first song I wrote when I was like 16,

I was actually coming down from smoking crack. And like, I didn't have anymore. So I was like on this come down. And I just picked up my guitar and I started writing this song. And I, that's the first whole song I wrote. I did record it back in the day, but I never released it and shit. I don't know if I could even remember it. But it was about this guy whose wife had left him or whatever,

and then he goes down to the bar, and then the bartender tries to console him a little bit, and then he wanders off, and nobody's seen him for quite a while until some fisherman hooked onto his boot in the river, and he was, like, dead and gone, you know. I used to call it Willie's boot. Man, I don't know if I could remember how it goes. I mean, I haven't fucking play this shit since I was like...

I probably won't be able to remember. It was something like, like Willie was a drunken man at the age of 21. He found himself a drinking beer until his mind was spun. He sat there on the street where all of his possessions lay. Because the girl who stole his heart had thrown him out. day with no friends to depend on his money is nearly spent the people laugh and cause a scene as he counts every cent bartender please just one more drinking could you make it free you see the sunshine of my heart has just walked out on

me well it's last call for whiskey and one more call for beer if you ain't buying shit from me then get right out of here I can't remember. You know, the bartender fucking... How do you remember that? It's been years, man. That was the first song I ever wrote, though. How do you remember that, dude?

I wish I could remember the rest of it. The bartender tries to tell him, you know, just give it time. Everything's going to be all right. And then he, like, wanders off. Like I said, some fisherman, like, hooks onto his boot. Everybody thought he just, like, went away, but I guess he, like, drowned in the river or something. I can't remember the whole song. man I wish I could.

Yeah, I can't remember it, man. I was expecting to play like, maybe like a riff for like five seconds. Oh yeah, I tried, but I was like, wow. Dude, I wish I could remember how it ended, you know. So is that, is that recorded? I mean, I recorded it when I made turmoil and tinfoil, but I never put it on the record. No, it's never been released or anything. It's the first song I ever wrote, but I never recorded it or whatever.

I don't know. And then you took it three-year break. Yeah. I can only imagine what you did for those two, three years. A lot of drugs and partying. A lot of fun. Yeah, crazy shit. Man, there used to be this thing called Slit Your Throat Fest that we would put on too at my friends.

My friend Dan had this trailer out on Charles Road in the middle. of the fucking nowhere. And he used to have parties called Slit Your Throat Fest. And we would have bands come and play. Dude, like, you might be able to look on YouTube. Look at, type in, like, from a second story window, Ionia, Michigan, or something. Because I'm pretty sure there was a video of them playing in Dan's trailer. Yeah, that.

What the fuck is this? So this was in Dan's trailer, bro. out on a dirt road this was our shit that's Dan right there that's his house this was in a trailer in the middle of the country dude

just in his kitchen that's the shit we're into bro nice I remember there was this well who else played there I mean a bunch of bands played there fight it out I remember there there was this great time where

we were supposed to play and my drummer was passed out like he had taken some pills and then he was like drinking whiskey and then when it came time for us to play he was on the couch and his boxers like laying in his own puke and we're like dude get up like we got to play our set and he was just like he literally sat behind the drums it was like chich and chung too fucked up dude it was just like that and and he i don't know how he powered i think he was like crying like we were like you're playing and he was like i can't Like, dude, we don't give a fuck.

You're playing. But fight it out, played. And I remember Dan White was, like, so drunk. And there was always these beefs with, like, these area codes, right? 616, 517. These area code crews and, like, you know, like, courage crew and all these, like, fucking dudes that would come mosh. And, like, you know, there was, like, the scene kids who would, like, two-step. And then there was-

There was-cruz back there, too? Then? Wow. Yeah. And I remember, like, Dan White, whose house this is. He would, like, grab the mic from the bands and be like, fuck, 517, you know? Like, this is fucking 616, you know, and all this shit. And he would be getting his, like, underwear drunk, like, just on his own property.

It was so free. I've never seen someone more free. Wow. It was so awesome, you know. But, yeah, like, there was a, there's another video of that band, the number 12 looks like you or something. Is that what they were called? Yeah, you got it.

Yeah. They played there, too. They were like a duo Or all that party You have a pretty decent memory Yeah Dude it was Hard to forget

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Because I drove home when I should have been driving. driving home in my early 20s. I'm like, I don't know how, why? And I'm fine. I don't know, man. I've always just had like, I kind of think of it as like, I have this like experiential kind of,

you know, I grew up around tweakers and shit. They were sleeping on my couch. I saw them being hauled off to jail. I saw them picking their face and listening to the scanner and missing teeth and sunken in cheeks. And, you know, whenever I did drugs and shit, I would like do it a little bit.

And then I would be like, okay, like, that was a weekend, but you got to be done now. Otherwise, you're going to end up like these fuckers. You know, and so I just, I would have a good weekend, but then I would cut myself off for, you know, you're not doing this shit again for at least six months, bro, or whatever. And I don't know how. I mean, I think I was just exposed to, like I said, I was witnessing all this shit. I was watching these people ruin their lives. And I saw it, you know. stealing your

your mom's 70s 70s chabelle drinking booze booze cruising right yeah and and and you're fine well yeah I mean I got in some trouble and you know I had a lot

they filed truancy on me because I dropped out of school and I had a lot of MIPs you know minor in possession and I got a DUI and shit and I wow you know but luckily I skid through all that

somehow without ever developing a real serious addiction besides to weed you know and i was an alcoholic i wouldn't drink all the time but i'm like a binger you know like if it's happening good and it's tasting good i don't know when to stop i we need more let's finish the bottle you know take it till the morning until the sun's up you know i just don't know when to quit so so yeah i had to quit drinking uh i quit drinking 10 years ago and um more recently kind of haven't been smoking as much weed or I haven't been smoking any weed for like a year but um that's different it's like California sober well no I mean I haven't smoked since last December but I still miss it and I still what like alcohol is not good for me right I don't know

it will fucking destroy you dude yeah yeah I don't know if I'll ever drink again but I probably will smoke weed again yeah like at some point yeah I've been drinking us six months so I'm recently off the booze and I haven't smoked but I'm thinking about going back to smoking because I miss the thoughts I miss like that really like

introspective kind of like reset but I kind of wanted to get like the alcohol out of my system first before I bring in something else but it is on my mind well I'm just like taking a break you know what do you miss about weed

barking up a big fat green bowl and just the flavor the smell the way it makes me feel the way i pick up my guitar after everything but um yeah i'm a father now and so i just don't want to be like high as a dad i don't want my son to grow up with like thinking that's cool yeah like i did you know um i just i've had my entire life since I was like, you know, 10 years old or whatever. I've been getting high, so I've never really experienced life just sober. And so this last year has been the only time, like, this is like the hardest drug that I do right now. It's coffee.

It's the best. It's kind of great, you know, like I've never been sober. So. And you're 33. Yeah. Are you going to be 34 October 3rd, right? Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Coming up. Fuck. That's sick, dude. I'm turning 41. I'm ready, dude. Hell yeah. So,

yeah, man, I just... Okay, so what is this that that we keep burning? Oh, Palo Santo. What is this? It's just like some wood that fucking smells good. Cleenses the vibes, man.

Okay. So it's only like, is any, like, meaning to it? This is a good... Well, I... I think it's just a cleansing kind of smell. I don't know. I started burning it when I made this last record with T-Bone Burnett.

He was always burning it in the studio. And now I'm, like, addicted to burning it. Oh, yeah. So I'm like, whenever I'm trying to, like, chill out and, like, get in the zone or the mood or whatever, I kind of will light some up. Did T-Bone tell you any stories about Bob Dylan playing for Bob? Not too many. I mean, maybe a little bit about being on that tour. Because he was playing with Bob Dylan in the 70s, correct?

Yeah. Wow. Yeah, he was on that Rolling Thunder tour. I'll just be asking so many questions, dude. That's why I started this thing. I could just ask questions, it's fine. I mean, he's how I met Bob. I think T-bone is the one that told me that Bob was a fan of mine.

Are you fucking serious? Yeah, and I was like, What do you do with that? Wow. And so he said, you know, if you really want to get a hold of him, like, or I think it was, my manager told me that one of Bob's people had said, you know, if you really want to get a hold of Bob, write him a letter. Wow.

So I wrote him this letter. And then when we were on tour with Bob Dylan and Willie Nelson, I don't know, it must have been a little while ago now, a year or two, a couple years ago. We were at the Hollywood Bowl And he was coming off stage And I was standing there I didn't even know he was coming off stage And here he comes in this big-ass North Face parka

And shit And somebody came up to me right at that time And was like, Billy, great set earlier And he stopped in his tracks And he was like, Billy And he came up to me and shook my hand And he was like, thanks for the letter, you know.

And then like a couple nights later, he asked me to come play with them and shit. So I went, I went and played all along the watchtower with him. Oh my goodness, dude. That was my favorite song that they were playing on that tour. What the hell? Because they were,

they had this really cool arrangement of it. It was totally sick. And so, man, we watched them every, every night. And it was so cool that that's the song that he asked me to play on. So yeah, that... Dude, what was that like to play that song with them, man? It was amazing. That's insane.

Yeah. Man, you got the stamp, dude. Yeah, I just got a lot of respect for the dude, you know? Of course. I wonder what he thinks about the, uh, the Jimmy Hendon's cover. Oh, man. I'm sure he digs it. That's the other...

I mean, we were on that tour and... I don't take this shit for granted, you know? It's like every night we finished our set, and I went to the green room and, like, put my guitar away and shit and, you know, got a seltzer or something, and I went right back to the stage and fucking sat there and watched Bob Dylan intently. And then the same thing for Willie Nelson.

You know, these guys are our heroes and our legends, and they are living icons woven into the tapestry of American music, you know. of American culture, of America. And so that was the whole point of really going on that tour, was to be able to go and open the show for those cats and then be able to sit there with my band and soak that up every night. I mean, it was just amazing.

And, yeah, it was, I'll never forget it. Dude, you've met, I mean, you've met some of your heroes and you talk about Sam Bush and you mentioned that he gave you a lesson without any words. What did he teach you? Well, that was at a... Because you were jamming with him, correct?

Yeah, we were all on stage. You know, the thing about bluegrass is it's a traditional music, right? Mm-hmm. So a lot of players know the same songs. I can get together with five dudes at a music festival all from five different bands and we can play hey let's play nine pound hammer and we all know it you know it's not why is that that's because it's a tradition it's not like

you know all these tunes that are played by different artists and stuff you know i mean it's almost looked at as like a lot of people play salt creek but it's how does this guy play salt creek you know oh, he plays the melody like this, or he does this certain thing, or they, you know, different versions of the same tune. It's no different than jazz, you know, people playing these traditional tunes that there's a canon, you know, there's a big list of traditional songs that everybody plays.

It's not like, I guess, like, in rock and roll or something where people write their own tunes and that's all they do. It's like, no, bluegrass bands have been playing nine-pound hammer and Long Journey Home and Salt Creek and Beaumont Rag and shit since the beginning of bluegrass, you know? And so it's a tradition. You carry on those tunes. Some of the songs were written in the 1800s and we're still playing them today. And I may play Shady Grove a little bit different than some people down south do or something. And that's also a part of it. You know, you go down south, people talk a little different. They may play this song a little different. There's a different

dialect. You can hear the different accent, you know. Yeah. But yeah, it's like there's all these tunes that are just part of this canon, you know. And so that's the part of it is, okay, like some, I write a lot of my own tunes too, but I also play old bluegrass songs that have been being played by bluegrass bands for years because that's part of the tradition. Yeah, what separates you and like the bluegrass, that the whole bluegrass genre is that. Where it's like everyone that's there has basically studied and played all the foundational artists. Where it's from, I mean, front to back song where metal, it's very common where it's like, yeah, we'll know like a couple riffs of the song. And it's very common for like having a conversation with someone.

Yeah, you know, I never like jammed someone else's song before. Right. Yes. It's not common at all where we could all. get in a room like hey let's just play this one song it's kind of like a lot of the songs that you know that exist in this world they're so old nobody knows who wrote them they're just songs that have been passed down from family to family for for generations and they come from this kind of melting pot of you know these people that live in the appalachian mountains and these people brought their fiddle

tunes over from the british isles when they moved here and and things like that and and and this this music this traditional American music kind of just molded together and eventually Bill Monroe took all of that together and put it in this high-powered kind of vehicle yeah and put some kind of horse power behind it but I mean there's tunes like let's see you know you know you know that's just old fiddle tune Soldier's Joy It's an old Civil War tune You know

And so it's To me it's important To keep playing these tunes So that they continue to exist And it's my duty here On earth to teach them to the next generation Wow So that

You know these kids that are coming up Learn these tunes That's why I don't just play my own shit You know I'm a bluegrasser You know And that's part of playing bluegrass is carrying on the tradition

and I'm going to teach it to my son and if he has kids someday he'll show his kids and years from now people will still be playing Soldier's Joy that's how that happens I think it's important you know

yeah I've heard you talk about how important it is to if you're going to play bluegrass you have to know like a tradition you have to it's like mandatory and that and that kind of allows you to, which is what you did, branch out.

Totally. Yeah. It makes sense. Yeah, you got to cut your teeth on the roots, you know. Yeah. And, I mean, that is, in bluegrass, you know, Bill Monroe, the Stanley brothers, flattened Scruggs, and, you know, a lot of big ones for me, Jimmy Martin, Mack Wiseman, Larry Sparks, the Osborne brothers. and then even like later on you know as the branches of this tree continue to grow and bud and stretch out into the bluegrass album band and country gentleman and then on into newgrass revival and then up into yonder mountain string band and the string dusters and green sky bluegrass and then on into us kids and now there's folks coming up that are new mountain grass unit you know uh shadow grass there's all these kind of

of younger homies that are now i'm beginning to be like i was the new cat and now i'm like beginning to be like one of the older guys that wow just like that um yeah i know just like that dude crazy because i remember these guys mountain grass unit they were um dude they were in my front row when they were like 14 years old and shit and i was like holy shit look at these kids man they're into this shit that's so cool and then here they are i you know starting their own band and kicking ass, you know, they just put out a new record and it's number three on the Billboard Bluegrass chart. Are you serious? Yeah. And so I'm like, damn, I'm the old guy now. Wow, just like that, dude. Yeah. How old are they? They're in their like 20s. But,

you know, yeah, Luke Black, man, the guitar player, he was like, dude, your record turmoil and tinfoil was like our shit in high school. Yeah. Fuck. You're like, it. It happens quick, dude. Damn it. Like, am I really old already? That's what happens, man. What the fuck, dude? That's what happens, man. What, uh, with, you mentioned you, you've been sober for 10 years. So I'm kind of, uh, adding the timeline.

Because in 2019, you did your record home. And, um, I was curious where, where you were at mentally, like, and how, and how did you start writing those songs? Like, do you remember, like, the first song, the first couple riffs and did it feel different? Because that record kind of, like, propelled you guys, it seemed. Yeah. it was also a really kind of weird thing

because we put that record out and then we were all stuck at home you know after like right after that which was like it's just shit's always been weird like that man I don't know I mean away from the mire that it's always been about like my own personal shit that I'm

going through or whatever and I try to I just write songs about it and it ends up being very therapeutic for me you know like I'm writing about the shit that I've gone through in my own struggles or my family struggles or whatever and I just try to write it in some artistic way I mean away from the mire was literally I wrote that after I got into a fight with my brother about his own drinking and he came to a gig of mine and embarrassed me and got into a fight with security and all this shit and he was really drinking too

much back then and so I was like you know I wrote that song you know I was like pissed at him and that's what it was about but it's about whatever you think it is you know i think it's about a lot of different things to different people but because i wrote it about shit that was close to me that actually meant something and i was getting some shit off my chest i think people can hear it from their perspective and it means something to them too because it's like it's really up to the listener to decide what it's about but when i wrote the song it was about you know this or or whatever and and yeah home man i wrote that like i feel like i was trying to write like a radio head song even though i never listened to radio head or something okay you know i mean like i would like hear it from afar like

my bandmates would listen to it or something or i'm like i just never got into it you know yeah and i they still kind of rag on me about that like dude you don't know fucking radio head and i'm like dude i just never listen to it i don't know sure you know and and and and and yeah stuff like that will influence me in a way like like say I'll hear something, but not really listen to it, but then next thing I know I'll be writing a song and it's like, I feel like I'm trying to write a song like that shit Royal was listening to in the van or something, you know? And it's like a mix between like some radiohead shit and something like Kashmir or something, you know. I just, it just pulls, you know, pulls from different places.

It's all inspiration. It comes in my ears. I hear some shit that I like or that I just soak up somehow and it gets. It's regurgitated and it comes out in my own sort of way. Everything that I've ever written has been inspired by something that I've heard, you know. Are you writing lyrics first? Are you writing full songs first? Does there's like a riff come out when you're just on your couch? So like away from the mire, like is that like a riff first?

You have like a... Man, some of them happen at the same time. You know, I might sit there and play. my guitar and I'll start riffing on something and then I'll think, okay, well, what does this music make me think? And then I'll write that down. Oh. And then I, you know, as I'm writing the lyrics,

I'm already... You're already. Like, if I go back into all my voice memos and shit from way back, dude, you still have that been saying. Oh, yeah. I mean, let's see. When did I write that shit? 2017. Dude, you got to save all those voice memos, dude.

see that what you're saying so you're writing both I never heard that before like you're it's both are coming to you at the same time yeah you know that's that's that's a lot

yeah I think so it's kind of like you might have like a little lick that might inspire a emotion what this is made this is July 5th 2018 dude

a lot of the lyrics like have changed Of course. Wow. That was just like sitting at home coming up with this shit. Like I said, I'm like pouring it out. I'm feeling for my brother and shit. Like we got, I wasn't even like talking to him. Like he pissed me off because he got too drunk at my gig and got into a fight with security.

And I'm like, bro, I'm working here. Like this is my livelihood. And you're coming here like starting fights like getting too drunk. And I, and I. It's tough. I didn't know what to say, you know. So I just wrote down this shit. And, you know, and he's, he's.

He's doing a lot better these days, bro. He's killing it. But at that time, yeah, I was like, what the fuck, bro? Like, don't come to my gig and start fights, you know? Like, you know. Yeah, that could easily be a headline. Yeah. And, you know, it was kind of about how it's always been me and him against the world.

And, you know, growing up in Michigan, like when I said spring lied to us again this year, it kind of means, like, I know we were dealt like a shitty hand, bro, but. like eventually the thaw does come even though in Michigan you think it's going to be spring and then it snows a bunch again and then you have a little bit of warm weather oh spring's really coming no fucking blizzard it's like spring lied like every time but it's almost like i was talking to him like the world lied like you know it's me and you against the world bro like we got to have each other's back you know and i don't know like i said it's just some kind of poetic way of trying to talk to my brother without actually calling them on the phone, you know.

And that's how I make my music. You know, turmoil and tinfoil was about missing my mother, even though she's standing right in front of me. Oh, wow. That's about seeing this huddled gray form of my former mother that I miss so much, even though she's standing right there. But she, you know, her skin is gray and her soul is gone, and the smile is gone, the laughter is gone.

I miss her, but she's, her body's right there, but she's not, you know. Do you think that's probably one of your more emotional songs, and one of your hardest songs probably play like a, like still, still I crash. You think that's probably, one? Yeah, that one, I mean, definitely. My mom just died a year ago. Sorry, man.

Yeah. And so that, I wrote that song days after she died, you know. And I, again, I just, I sat down and, and let's see, I probably have the, the original recording of that. So awesome that you save your voice notes, dude. Well, they're just still all in here. I can't believe they're in here since, like, since, like, 2017. You gotta back up your phone, dude. Yeah.

If you lost that shit, that would be fucking terrible. Yeah, you're right, man. I should do that. Let's see. Well, this is... No rush, man. I want... I want to hear it.

That was when I was on tour with... Bob Dylan and shit. So this is just in my office, like, the original voice memo of this song, you know? And I was just literally talking to her. Like, I just make these little voice memos, you know? And I, you know, send that to T-Bone who was going to produce.

the record and he said man we just do it just like that just you and the guitar we can't do anything else with that shit like it's got to stay intimate you know and i just play it i've played it a couple times on stage but you know it's intense but that's what i do is like take all this bullshit and make art from it to try to you know like make lemonade you know from these lemons or whatever I think a lot of my favorite artists have similarly colorful upbringings. Hendricks didn't really know his mom. You know, James Brown was fucking dancing for the military men trying to get him to his aunt's whorehouse and shit. You know, a lot of...

Do you think... Oh, shit. Yeah, I was doing research this morning. kind of struck home with with me. Do you think not knowing your father, do you think that kind of subconsciously inspires all your music? Yeah. Because he died from complications of heroin when you're still in diapers.

Yeah, yeah, I was two. So I never knew him, you know. I don't remember him or anything. My brother was like five. He still remembers him. And that has caused like certain things in our own. kind of upbringing. Yeah, yeah.

You know, my dad, Terry, who raised me. Terry Barber. My stepdad, you know, but he's my dad. He's your dad, yeah. I mean, I've always, he's the only dad I've ever known, you know. He sounds like a great dad, man. He is. Yeah.

And he's all I got left, you know. And he's always been there and he's still there. I see him quite often, you know, when I'm back home. yeah we were just recording the other day making some music at my house but uh but yeah man as I got older too I started thinking about my real dad and shit

and it's like when I was a kid I used to think oh well you know fuck him he didn't love me you know he obviously loved heroin more like kind of shit real spiteful you know yeah but now that I grow up and I you know I lost my mom to addiction as well both my parents died from drugs and um i realized that addiction is an illness and i realize

it's not like that it's not like oh he obviously loved heroin more than me no bro like he was going through some shit you know what i mean like he had a you know people that are addicted to that shit it's not like they want to do that it's not like they want to fucking hurt their children you know they can't help it you know it you know it's truly is an illness, you know. And so, so yeah, later on,

bro, I started thinking about it more. And then after my mom died, crazy shit happened. Like, I went to my mom's house after she died and I started going through a bunch of her old shit. She had like,

suitcases full of old pictures and letters and shit. Just crazy shit. Like all this memories just crammed into a box. And I found this letter from my dad when he was in jail. back in the 90s, you know, and saying, come on, Deb, like, can you just write me back? Like, I want to hear how my boys are doing. Like, I miss my boys.

You know, I love them and shit. And I'm reading this as a 32-year-old man, the first time I ever heard my dad say, I love you. You know what I mean? Wow. It fucked me up, dude. It was crazy. And then even more recently, my cousin Patrice,

She came across all these old tapes that my grandma Betty had recorded on her phone in the 90s and shit like she had her own phone tapped crazy shit I don't even know why but my dad's on there talking on the phone and shit it's the first time I ever heard his voice

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my grandma on my mom's side calling my grandma betty telling her about what happened how it went down and shit and then they're talking about little me and you know and my brother and uh they're like you know i don't know how aaron's going to take it but little boomer he's probably too young for it to affect him too much you know but it's just it's crazy to hear all all that, you know. And the crazy thing about that is, too, a lot of people think that was more like a murder than an overdose. People back then were giving each other hot shots, you know.

We're hot shots. Like giving someone a dirty hit, you know, on purpose. On purpose. Yeah. Or giving them the rehash of the, you know, the dirty shit or intentionally putting way too much in there, you know. But a lot of people think that my. dad was maybe fooling around with this dude's old lady and he gave him a hot shot on purpose

to get back at him or something so it's kind of the word on the street around the north side is that my dad was more like murdered than OD you know but it's it's crazy that your family recorded that that is bizarre yeah it's some wild shit that is So bizarre. Those are a bunch of tapes, bro. Like my... Tapes. Yeah, and my cousin

Patrice had all this shit. And she started sending this shit to my brother and I and I started listening to it. And it's just stuff is crazy, bro. Tape label, Billy's...

Do you keep it with your riffs? That's my mom talking. Because she's talking to my grandma about she heard from her cousin Jakey who was in jail with this cat who said Steve Rogers was bragging about giving my dad a hot shot. So that's my mom calling my grandma Betty telling her what she's hearing on the north side, you know. And dude, it's just crazy as fuck all the shit that was happening back then. Wow, it's crazy that's coming up now.

It is, dude. And I can't go too far. I was in a rabbit hole for like days. this shit. Like I was not even like present with my wife or anything. I was just like stuck on these recordings listening to every second of it. Wow. And it's like I'm finding out more and more shit as I go along about my dad and how he died and shit. And then of course I'm hearing this recording of my mom talking and she's dead and hearing her voice. It's crazy and shit and just also like I always thought my family was crazy on my mom's side.

Like my grandpa was a bootlegging, moonshining, fucking race park driving, crazy fucking outlaw hillbillies. But they're just as crazy on the Apostle side, you know, in and out of jail. And man, my poor grandma had to deal with all that shit.

They're wild on both sides, bro. And I think maybe it was probably just way like crazy back then, the late 80s, early 90s, like, I don't know. Hopeless fucking alcoholics and shit, you know. It's so weird hearing that in your 30s.

It is. That's so weird. It's crazy, bro. Yeah. Yeah, I was wondering if that, like, if you think that subconsciously, like, it's in the music. Well, my dad, my biological father was also a pretty talented cat. Really? Like, in many different ways.

And he was a musician as well, but he was, he could just do anything. You know, he worked all these different jobs. And he was like this kind of Robin Hood type character that would go into a store, put on three pairs of pants, six t-shirts and three hoodies. And then fucking steal that shit. And then go out and, like, hook up his homeless buddies with, like, fresh, like, hyper-color shirts and shit. And I've just heard so many stories about this dude, like the crazy shit that he used to do. Wow. Like he would pour beer on his face and then light a fucking bottle rocket and like don't even let it go and the fire would just burn his face and shit.

Like he could like walk up and downstairs on his hands. He used to work for this cable company. Like there's this crazy story about my dad. When I was a little kid, my grandma at her house always had free cable. And that was from when my dad hooked it up back when he was alive because he worked for like a cable company at first. and he climbed this telephone pole one time, probably drunk. And he was like, I'm going to hook up cable, you know. And on Fairfield Street, everybody came out of their house looking down this block

because their TV shut off or whatever. And he's up on that fucking pole with no shirt on and short jean shorts and shit being like, you have HBO? And they're like, no. He's like, you will in a minute. Just go back inside, you know? And so he hooked up free cable for everybody on the whole block. And it was still that way.

When I was a little kid, like in, you know, 95, 96 and shit, 98, I remember watching TV at my grandmas, and that, she never paid for it. My dad hooked that shit up back when he was alive. Wow. Just crazy, fucking unbelievable kind of shit, honestly. You know a lot about your family history. It's cool. Yeah. Well, I mean, they're mythical figures to me, you know.

And so all I have is these stories. so I cling to them, you know. Listen and read. Yeah. And you're 30, it's fucked up. Yeah. I'm curious because I don't, I've always wanted a Martin. What kind of guitar is this, man?

Yeah, this is a 1935, D-18. Wait, is it really a 35? Yeah. Are you fucking serious? Yeah. Yeah, it's from 1935, man. It's a D-18, which is like a mahogany. guitar.

There's actually a video of, I played this guitar back maybe 2017 or some shit. It was at Carter Vintage guitars and I was playing this like Yeah, that video right there is this guitar. So, I did this kind of video for Carter on this axe, man,

and this is one of the best guitars I ever played at the time. and Brian Sutton bought this guitar right after this video. So I always told him, man, if you ever sell that guitar, let me know. You know, and he finally came around selling it, so I got it from him, you know, maybe about a year ago or something. They just have so much... What is it, hey, what is it about it? I mean, do you feel like the history of what? No, I mean, it's literally the sound, the volume, the tone, there's so much, so much ass. Like, I mean, it's got a big bottom.

But it's also got like treble, all-rounded sound. When you're playing in a bluegrass band and you, you know, you got a loud fiddle and a mandolin and a banjo you're trying to play over, you need a loud guitar. So these old ones have been beat into submission for years. So all this, the wood, it vibrates a lot. I feel like it's dried out. The hide glue is, you know, you can't replicate this vintage thing. There are some people that are coming really close with like pre-war guitars and stuff. Like they're coming pretty close to making new ones that sound old,

but there's nothing that touches like old Martin guitars. and really specifically from like 35 to like 39 kind of era you know what's it what is it about that pacific era man i think it's the woods that they used um really quality like Brazilian rosewood mahogany i think it's the bracing patterns that they that they did the scalped braces i think it's these have a wide neck you know one and three quarters not i feel like just like just that big neck, like, kind of sends all the vibration back down here. I don't know. They're just magic.

I mean, you got to strum a chord on this thing. So it's just life to it. Yeah. It just kicks ass, man. It's badass. Can I, can I do a board, man? Fuck yeah. Wow.

Oh, dude. Holy shit, dude. I never played a 30s. tar before. So that's a piece of a tortoiseshell. A tortoiseshell pick? Okay. Okay.

Vibration in your lap? Not much. Yeah. I'm the same fuck as going for it. I'm playing a 30s fucking Martin, dude. Thank you, man. Have you ever played a seven? Not really.

No? No, I mean... All right, so, so we're both in untrarted territories, perfect. You know, I'm not something funny is that... So, like, I was telling you that there's a lot of riffs that I still use and shit that I learn, like, playing metal. And there's one specifically that I use all the fucking time. And I'm, like, giving away a damn cheat code right now.

Okay. But, so, you know... So, uh, metal eclipse, man, Thunder Horse, Death Clock. Oh, fuck. You know, but there's this lick in there. And I use that shit all the time. Really? Like on bluegrass gigs.

Dude, I'm always like... Oh, I see it. Wow. That's dope. That's fucking sick. That's how I learned that shit. Let's see. That's crazy.

I actually just got this Charvel guitar recently that I really dig, man. Oh, really? Yeah, one of the, like, Sandemus ones or whatever. I'm trying to think of... It's weird having the seven. I never really fucked with it too much, you know. It sounds sick. Yeah, man.

This shit's fun. That's dope. Is that Nile? Oh, my God. I was like, that's Nile, dude? Fucking ripping, dude. It's heavy, dude. I just, I, I, I, I,

what do you think? It's sick. Hell yeah, dude. Yeah, I dig the sound. I just want to play, like, hardcore on it. All for it. That's dope. Um, I just realized, like, whenever I played with Cryptopsy,

so they tuned to, like, B standard. Mm. And, but, I used like a seven-string set, but I just lost the little E. Oh, yeah, yeah. On a six-string guitar. So, you know, thicker gauge, but tune it down so you can keep the tension. It's really fun.

Really, you know, one of my Charvel guitars was just, like, laced up like that now. Yeah, was that the guitar that you used? Yeah, right? The cryptopsies hit in. Nice. Yeah. That's what I did back in a day. I just took out the high E.

I can't remember how that shit goes. Man, I wish I could remember some of the shit that I used to... It's weird on the 7 string, though. I can't even fucking think. All I can do is go. That's all you need to do, that's... that I do. When in doubt, chug. When in doubt, chug, dude.

When in doubt. When in doubt. I knew that shit goes. crazy riffs and shit. No, that was one of your riffs? Yeah. Oh shit. Nice.

That's dope, man. Yeah, that extra string just fucks with my head. It is different. It's rocking, dude. Dude, this thing fucking vibrates. It's crazy. You feel it. I'm trying to think of some shit that would be played on the seventh string.

I mean, you're just doing it. It's chugging, dude. Fuck it. When in doubt, Chuck, that's what I do. Dude, how are that on? I'm kind of nervous. I'm holding this thing. Fucking 35.

Fucking Martin, dude. Wow. So how long ago was 1935? 89 years? 91 years. Damn. Yeah. That's an old bitch.

Speaking of hell and killer. I'm nervous. I'm nervous. I like the noise gait Oh yes The azool is the best one Okay so You get to know what you want

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That's sick. Just trying to think. I almost played First Blood. I couldn't remember. Was that a cover your tracks? Yeah, that was Magnolia, right? Yeah, yeah. I always love that, like, big one-string shit like that.

My favorite. Top string riffs, dude. Yeah. Low tune fucking drop A. That's sick, dude. Barry Your Dad was fucking awesome. It's a great record, dude. This thing is making me nervous, dude.

That thing was making me nervous. Everybody's going to be like, oh, he doesn't know how to play that shit. We were both in uncharted territory. I'm like, I never play acoustic. Yeah. And it's like, you know what? I never play electric. Damn.

Like, it's like, what better place than in front of the world? Yeah, exactly. I don't give a shit, dude. Especially the internet. I'll fuck it, dude. Just out of curiosity, Billy, what was, uh, I mean, maybe my biggest inspiration or, I mean, one of them is, uh, Dio Vaughn. What does he, what does he like in person?

The same way he is on his podcast or, and ever. He's just, that's him, dude. Wow. He's just a fun. funny, funny guy and a real sweetheart, too. That's Brad. I mean it truthfully. Like, he's, when I was in the hospital with my dad, he was, like, calling and checking on me.

When my mom died, he was, like, calling me, checking on me. When I broke my leg, he was, like, offering to come walk my dog and shit. He was like, bro, if you need anything, let me know. Like, if you want me to make you guys a meal, come bring it out to your house. Whoa, I know. Like that. Dude, he's a fucking sweetheart, man. truly...

That's special. He's got a big heart and he's a good, good friend. But yeah, he's funniest, funny as shit, dude. Like, I took him

on my fishing boat one time and this is just an example of how everything is like, he's not even, it's not up front, he's just funny inherently. Like, we come around this corner

in this cove and there's like a blue heron standing there. And he's like, dude, look at that stork. He's like, Like, dude, it's a fucking heron, you know. Wow.

Just everything he says is hilarious. He's an all funny guy. Everything he says is a stitch. Man, you just brought a full circle, dude. Yeah, dude. I was just curious because I'm just a fan. Like, wow. He's a great dude.

Like I said, he's, and he's fucking hilarious. It's just a great interviewer, I guess, not like a, there's a conversationalist, I guess, you'd say? Maybe. Yeah, he's just, he's a great, he's just a great hang. Yeah. It's like, it's like songwriting. It's this, is this who you are? Is this who he is?

Totally. It's wild, dude. Yeah, I mean, he wakes up in the morning and that's, that's Theo, man. Yeah. It's not like an act, you know, he's just, he's just an interesting guy with an interesting brain and a big heart. That's rad, man. Good dude and a fucking cool haircut, you know. haircut I think only he could pull off

I don't know any I don't know any other human on his fucking rock dude You don't know anything about haircuts So yeah I have a big problem with my I got a fizz issue I'm trying to figure it out So do I we should We got a collab on fucking frizz

I know dude no Some frizz care No matter what I put in my fucking hair Dude it is goes out of control That sucks dude I don't know what it is It's because like I feel like these little hairs get broken or some shit

Oh yeah that And then there's like short ones that are just sticking out. That's a problem too. Probably like a few months ago, my wife was like, what the fuck are you doing when I was brushing my hair? Because I was just like going, she's like, dude, you need to brush it from the bottom. I know that. You got your stuff from the bottom. Yeah. Well, I didn't know that. And I was like breaking all these hairs, you know. You're welcome, dude. I didn't have like a fancy ass hair brushing shit. Do you do the like the half boar's hair, half nylon bristle shit? Oh, yeah.

Okay. Exact one. Yeah. That's the best. Yeah. untangleby out you got to start from the bottom yeah yeah i didn't know that i was going to say something but i can't give out secrets either about um i just noticed playing with a certain death metal band that those guys some of them anyways will like wet their hair backstage so it's easier to fucking oh yeah i didn't know that trick dude yeah yeah holy shit dude we we we we used to cheat during like it was like a it was a year trend where we would uh me and our bass player it was like

2009 we put baby oil in our hair and that's how we got that that secret we were just down four for four locoes and vodka and put baby oil on our hair and we was fucking big a fucking crazy dude fucking ditty curls hey oh uh billy is there anything that i missed about you that that you want out there i think we we touched on on a new record no man i mean great great great title about that shit, I'm here to talk about heavy metal. You know, I just think it's great because, I mean, that's kind of the reason I wanted to come on here is to, like, talk a little bit about more of, like, my metal influence and stuff. And I think, you know, a lot of people don't really, aren't really aware that I have that as a background.

But, yeah, I'm sure. Dude, look at that on Broken Wings shirt, dude. If an Unbroken Wings shirt, you're not fucking Wings shirt. You're not fucking around, dude. No. No. No, I'm not. I pierced my own fucking snake bites in school, dude.

You piss yourself? Hell yeah. Dude, this fucking ear got ripped in a mosh pit, dude. Oh, your ears fucked up. Yeah. See? Check that out, bro. That was me.

Fucking scene kid. With the cake that I waited 15 years to give to Cryptopsy. Oh, yeah. You never thought about getting the surgery? No, fuck it. I like this shit. Yeah, that's old school shit, bro. I had the skunk stripe going on.

That's that shirt that I'm wearing is like a, well, it's like a fleece, but that band was called And the Sky Went Red. You ever heard of them? No. Dude, that's deep cut. Deep cut shit. There's me and Tate. He's got the red cord.

I got the old school for the Fallen Dream shirt on. and I still have that PRS. That's like my best guitar that I... Really? My best electric. That's... I've had that thing since I was a little-ass kid. Have you put it on any records?

I never really recorded with an electric guitar, I don't think, besides the cryptopsy thing. Damn, you never recorded electric, huh? I mean, we made like an EP, like a long time ago, back to One Starken Skies and shit. But yeah, like I said, Tyler Tate, man, he's got a band called Hollow Front. right now and they're getting ready to do look how tough we were pretty tough dude little i was

i don't even think i hit puberty if if i did i was like just starting it's like i'm gonna steal my mom's car in about two years i was really trying to trying to fucking hit puberty right there wow look at jacob's face dude that shirt jacob's wearing is an o g see you next tuesday shirt with the ufo that's crazy and yeah I got the old for the phone dream shit what are some of your like what are some of like

your favorite metal bands if you were to do like like a handful of them I mean probably like a lot of stuff I've touched on today I mean there's a lot of different areas you know I love hardcore I love death metal

I love metal core I love I mean I just recently like a couple you know maybe like a year or two ago because I've been out of the loop I've been in this bluegrass world for a lot and I still listen to cryptopsy all the time and I still listen to my shit that I will pull up you know I've been listening to Nunso Vile since I was a kid and will always listen into that record yeah

but I was not aware of knocked loose until like a year or two ago oh wow and I was just at a gig and my sound guy and my guitar tech and shit. They're like, we're going out to this gig tonight. You want to come? This band called Knocked Loose. I was like, well, what is it?

Yeah. You know? And they showed me a little bit on the phone. And I was like, well, I was like, yeah, I'll come, you know. So I went on to this show. The first band we saw was show me the body. I'm like, damn, this is fucking sick, dude. Banjo, dude.

Yeah, like playing the banjo. I'm like, this is fucking badass, right? I'm like, okay, this show is pretty sick. And then Knocked Loose came on. And you got to understand when I was playing gigs, it was like I showed you in the basement of a church. Yeah. You know, even skeletons like, you know, you guys, 50 people, 80 people, small little mosh pit, you know, in a VFW hall, and wherever we could throw our own show at a fucking dance trailer. You know, I had never seen 2,000 people fucking doing the wall of death for not.

knocked loose. This blew my mind because I didn't know they were like a hardcore band. Yeah. I mean, they have a lot of like different sounds. They're kind of can get pretty brutal. It's heavy. Even deathy and stuff too and like death, you know, core. But, but I mean, at the base of it all, it's like, I'm like, dude, this is a fucking hardcore band. And there's 2,000 people out here. And holy shit. Look at the size of the marsh pit. And my mind was blown, dude. And I was. It's like, and they're so fucking tight.

Yeah. You know? And so I became a big fan of knocked loose. That's sick. And I fucking love those guys. I mean, holy shit. They're so good. Yeah, they've been killing it, dude.

Their music is so fucking good. And Brian's vocals are so sick, dude. And I just, I don't know. I mean, I love those guys. But, yeah, I mean, before that, it was just like I said, all the same shit that I've been listening to for every, ever and it's pretty broad i mean from between the buried in me to glass casket is a big one for me

house casket hell yeah um you know in between the sheets like that shit back in the day was was was really sick but i love that record called desperate man's diary fuck dude that record is amazing it's got like a lot of classic like melodic death metal kind of influence you know like really sick guitar solos like yeah harmonies and shit um i love desperate man's diary a bunch that's one that's been on the on my playlist forever um more on like the hardcore side fucking first blood shattered realm shadow realm wow yeah um you know thick as blood that shit dude's so fucking good um Bain has always been on there.

And then more on the death side, like, dying fetus, fucking, you know, cannibal corpse. Fucking cryptopsy is the big one, though, for me. You just lashed on to that band and those records. Dude, they're so good. Not so violets as top, dude. It's like one of the best stuff on records ever.

Yeah. But what else? I mean, I listen to like some psychoptic. I listened to some, you know, the red cord, Black Dahlia Murder. There are some Michigan dudes, you know. Fight It Out was a band back in the day. I can't even find their recordings anymore, but they were a sweet, hardcore band back in the day.

Barrier Dead. I listen to that a lot. You know, and the cool thing is, is like, A lot of the guys in my band, like, they don't know nothing about this shit. Yeah, that's rad. And I'm, like, schooling them on it. And I'm also, like, punishing them with it. I'll be, like, backstage before the gig, like, listening to fucking first blood. And they're just like, what the fuck is this shit, bro?

And I'm like, they drew first blood, you know? Like, what the fuck, dude? Wow. And I get so hyped. Like, I listen to that before the show to just get hyped as fuck before I go on stage. Wow. And, um, I mean, let's see. What have I been listening to more recently?

Yeah, what have you been jamming, dude? Let me just, um, I've been listening to For the Fallen Dreams a bunch, changes. Um, it seems like, what's the best way to find? Maybe if I just look on, like, what's on repeat or something. Here we go. It's pretty broad shit. I mean, I've got, like, the Greenbrier boys, Hendricks, Dolly Parton, Dye Spitz. You heard them from Austin?

No. Dude, they're fucking sick. David Grisman, but then, you know, skeletons of society, slayer, flirting with disaster, Molly Hatchet, fuck. Muscles, Diana Ross. come all you tender hearted Carter Stanley but of course open face surgery is on there probably because I had to relearn that solo recently you know

yeah I mean the shit that pops up Desperate Man's Diary that for the Fallen Dreams record oh dude you know what I've been listening to actually a lot that I don't think it's on the only place that I've found it is YouTube and it's for the fallen dreams

self-titled uh EP I guess which I remember when that shit came out yeah that that one right there the red and green dude this shit is so fucking good

you should play a little bit of this shit let's do it jam it I don't know who he is. Oh, weird. And what can't be stopped. No killing what can't be killed. Dude, I remember when this came out so sick. Shit gets me hyped, bro.

It's so good. That's tight. That's sick, dude. That's rad. Dude, there's some fucking insane breakdowns on that shit. See, we're hyped to play a fucking bluebird. I'll show right now, man. We are fucking hype, dude.

I am, dude. That's what I do. I'll be backstage and I'll listen to that shit. And then I'll go play how Mountain Girls can love. Yeah. It's cool, man, because I'm sure like a, probably most of the people that listen to you aren't aware, right? Probably not.

I mean, that's the cool thing about my crowd, too, is, like, I see, like, there's, like, hippies. There's, like, some old rockers. There's, like, I do have some metalhead fans. You know, I do, like, look out and see people. fucking yeah that's dope long hair fucking slayer shirt rocking out to like banjo music and shit so it's pretty tight you know and we have you know been lucky to like have a pretty diverse crowd in that way and we've like done some festivals and shit like we opened from metallica at

lalapalooza one time nice and it was like it's like sick we get to like win these guys over and we started our set and everybody's kind of just like What is this shit? And then by the end of it, it's like, all right. Okay, okay. Yeah. I get it. Nice.

Yeah, man. Well, we, Ronnie and third here, we end every podcast the same with the same question. What are three albums that have inspired you? No rules. Any music, any era? The David Grisman, Quintet, The Essential Doc Watson. So is that like a great like a greatest hits? Kind of yeah.

Okay. You know what? I see those like essential CDs. I'm like who who listens or buys these I guess. Okay. All right. Me. All right, cool.

I want not touch you all anymore. That was a big one. I mean, that's the main one for me, the essential Doc Watson. But yeah, DGQ and I would say Johnny Winter self-titled. Johnny Winter. Yeah. And I could just keep going. I mean, Edgar Winter's white trash.

And then of course, like I mentioned, none so vile. Wow. Alaska. Alaska was the first CD that I ever bought for myself. And the crazy shit is that me and my brother, we went into the mall and we stole this big-ass bean bag from this store called Love Sack.

Yeah. Fucking huge beanbag. And we just walked out of the mall with it, sliding it on the marble floor. And my cousin wanted it for her house. So we stole it, and she gave us each $200 for stealing the bitch. And I went straight to F.Y.E.

And I bought Alaska. Oh, wow. Sick. So that was a big one for me. But, but yeah, man, I mean, all that shit that came out dude like job for a cowboy was fucking sick back then

I remember when that what was that really brutal shit that waking the cadaver that came out that blew my fucking mind in Muir I remember like It dies today had some sick ass breakdowns

um yeah I miss it dude it was a special time those MySpace days bro yeah it was only a social media that was dedicated to music yeah it'll never happen again it was a it was a arrow it was a quick arrow too it was a special time for sure like just i feel lucky to have been

exposed to heavy music at that time you know and to gotten bit by that bug and yeah you know i really do thank uh heart sick and flesh and blood robot for the fallen dreams those guys that were like the first bands that I latched on to, you know. But then, like I said, that that led me to dying fetus and vital remains and fucking all that crazy, you know, deicide and, you know. So like I said, at first I didn't even like it. And then there was a band that sang too. And I was like, okay, well, at least they sing a little bit.

Yeah. And then now my favorite shit is just like fucking dying fetus. I know. Wow. It's just like, I went right down. Dude, it's cool to hear that that all inspired you. It's rad. Yeah.

Fuck, yeah, it is. It's sick, dude. And I love it all, man. I love, you know, kind of like that lineup that we had at my, at my festival. I mean, there was like some hardcore, some death metal, some grind. I like it all of it, man. I like it all. Are you planning to do the festival?

like annually? Or is it like a one-time thing? I don't know. I think we still got to think about it. But the grounds are right next to this river that floods like a motherfucker. Oh, yeah. So I don't want to push my luck.

You know, I feel like lucky that we got away with it one time. Days after the festival, it was a fucking sloshy mud pit. Really? Everybody that was loading the gear out was actually a, you know. But yeah, dude, it was a good time.

Like, everybody had a good-ass time. I'm dude and I didn't know how the metal tent was gonna go but it fucking killed. Damn. All right. Shit was awesome, dude. There was like 30,000 people there. It was fucking sick. Dude, that's fucking badass.

Well, if you do it again, I might know a band. Dude, that'd be sick. I might know a band. I might go there flying as fucking start chugging your fucking dick off, dude. Yeah, that'd be amazing, dude. We love you guys, man. Oh, yeah, man. Honor, ability.

Yeah. All right. Well, new record. is out now, came out August. You have some tour dates? Always. Always. Yeah, you do.

You always have tour dates, right? Yeah, I'm always on the road. Constantly playing gigs and, uh, yeah, where are we going? Yeah, we're playing in L.A. Shit, if you want to come out to the gig, bro, let me know. Oh, damn, thank you, man. Because we're playing at the forum on Saturday. Friday, we're playing at the Orphium Theater.

We've been doing, like, these, like, arena gigs and then, like, having, like, underplay. I saw that I'm like what I was like what are they doing okay it's that's that's fucking a rat like in Denver we did two nights at the ball arena and then we played at the paramount theater which is like a thousand people so we played for like 20,000 at ball for two nights wow the next night we played like a little intimate thing how's that been going it's sick it's sick I mean it's yeah it's a kind of a mind fuck I mean the sound is like so different in these different places oh yeah like I've actually gotten used to arenas

where I'm starting to feel pretty comfortable there I used to be a I used to kind of not like it but now it's like damn now when I get to the theater I'm like dude the speakers are like right there they're right there do you have

man I did the thought of a acoustic guitar in a fucking arena playing playing one so vulnerable I can't fuck fuck it I ain't scared

that's fucking badass all right well check him out now Billy thank you for your time man dude thank you Appreciate it, man. I'm honored, man. Thank you. Fuck, me too.

Hell yeah. Thank you. All right, one. That's it. Later. My rec league goalie says he plays for the love of the game. You gave up six goals last week, Steve. Maybe play to win, huh? Like with Bet365, I get paid the second my team goes out big with early payout and can cash out at any time before the game ends. Steve, Bet365, the home of winning early.

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