Garza Podcast - 54: VARIALS

Episode Date: November 21, 2022

Varials is an American hardcore punk band from Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. We talk about the after-life, quitting college to be in a band & much more! SPONSORS: distrokid.com/vip/garza 30% OFF! emgpickups.com Promo Code: Heavy 15% OFF! Varials is: Mitchell Rogers, James Hohenwarter, Mike Foley, Sean Rauchut & Shane Lyons TIME CODES: 00:00 - Intro 00:53 - Quitting College Is The 1st Step To Being In A Band 16:09 - Orthodox & Boundaries 21:05 - Mitch Singing Full Time 30:05 - Taking Things For Granted 34:06 - Scars For You To Remember 40:19 - In Darkness Writing Process 44:06 - Demons, Ghosts, Spirits & The Wizard 55:26 - Ross Robinson Vinyl & Listening To Music High 58:48 - Hip Hop Influence, Joey Jordison, BMTH & The DOOM Soundtrack 01:04:02 - Fender 7-String 01:08:43 - Turnstile & Future Of Heavy Music 01:12:01 - Lorna Shore & Knocked Loose

Frame by frame, a little rubber duck had to cover certain things. Yeah, the guy's name was ducky too, so it made sense. So someone was moshing at your show and they were naked? Yeah, it was like a bet at the show, like, because we knew it was going to be an insane show. And he was like, I'm a mosh naked tonight. We all thought he was kidding. What are the odds? And then he did it.

And then somebody caught it off video. Use EMG pickups because they help you get the heaviest tone possible. Hit over to EMG pickups.com and use my promo code heavy at checkout and get 15% off. And then once you write the heaviest song of all time, head over to distrokid.com slash VIP slash Garza and save 30% off your membership to get all your songs on all streaming platforms. And now to the heaviest podcast of all time.

This lovely California morning, I'm sitting here with the whole band Burials. Thank you guys for being here. I'm stoked. Thanks for having us, man. Any time. Thank you. I'm getting used to it I'm glad you guys had a day off from

Las Vegas Oh yeah We ain't much needed it Not just because of Vegas Dude and Shane That was your first time in Vegas This is your first time in California Yep it is

Holy shit Yeah feels good I keep forgetting that I'm with my homies He's a very old alumni Yeah I've been in this band the whole time I just took a really long break

Yeah So I guess we'll get straight into that What was the plan on But yeah, let's do a quick intro. All right, I'm Sean. I play drums and varials. I'm Mitch. I sing.

I'm Mike. I play bass. I'm Shane. I play guitar. I'm James, and I also play guitar. Damn, we got the strings. The whole side, holy. Are you ready, dude?

Oh, my goodness. Cool. Well, so yeah. The band formed 2013, correct? Yeah, basically, me and James walked out of our first day of college. And I looked at him in the parking lot, and I was like, yo, fuck this. Let's try a band one more time. And now we're sitting here.

Wow. That's basically what happened. I also quit college, like, a couple weeks after. I think we all quit college. Yep. Yeah. Also, funny, me and James were in college together, like, in the same classes, and, like, we did not know each other. And then, like, a couple months later, we're in a band together, both after quitting college. It's like, hey, we were in the same class together.

Yep, literally. Yeah, it was kind of just like a thing of, like, yeah, let's see. start a band and not let anybody tell us that we can't do it and just find all of our friends that want to do it yeah worked out obviously yeah i mean uh i know Shane you uh you left for a little bit but it was since 2013 it's been like four of you guys minus Mitch yeah it's been the same crew pretty much i mean we added Mitch along the way and then i came back so the whole the whole team stays stays pretty consistent yeah okay So obviously

When you want to do this Like part of the things you happen You got to quit college That was first thing Step one of wanting to be in a van Quit college Oh my goodness I used my paycheck from Giant to buy a fucking

PV Ultra Remember that head? Oh that the orange Yeah had like the different color for the channel I remember And the reverb that would like Make noise in the back So every time we would drive to a show

Like ding ding ding ding ding And be like, yo, I got to get rid of this thing. And the hand kind of sucked as well, so I'm glad I got rid of it. Yeah, well, you got to buy your first PV head, dude. Oh, yeah, I mean, it's a right of passage. I've only won't want PV head, body used from a guitar center. Got to do it. I went from the PV Ultra, and then you had to get a, what was it, 65.5 plus.

I think you got the 5150. I had a 50-150, and then a 6505. James, did I have a block letter or then I have a two? I can't remember. I don't remember what you ever actually had. I was putting this a little nerd amp-ans. Like Legion days. I want to talk to the mic too.

I don't remember what you had. I remember you having the Mesa Head. But that's it. I don't think I knew you before that. I had it at the time, we recorded it one time, a long time ago. Long time ago.

Pre-ax FX, James. When we were young, you know? What are amps? Oh yeah, speaking of amps, we don't have any anymore. The reason Mike's in the band is because when I met him on Facebook, he had an 8 by 10.

And I was like, oh, yeah, you can join my band. You're in. Dude, true, if you had gear, dude, like, fired up. You're like, 2013, you're the kid with the 8 by 10. That's true. The only kid at the local show is that had the giant free gym. I literally stole him from his old band.

Yeah, it's a little more. We were in a local band together, and then, like, Mike started doing Varyals at the same time, and then we weren't in that band together anymore, and then we both ended up back in Varyals when they got me. Damn. Yeah. It's a whole convoluted mess of friendship and local bands.

Which, how is this scene? So you guys are from Philadelphia, correct? Yeah. So is it actually Philly or is it like the outskirts of that? I mean, we started in like the outskirts. Like there was this place called, it was like a Legion Hall. And like it kind of just became like a thing where we would play there every weekend. And it turned into like this huge thing of just like kids wanting to go to like metal horse shows again.

It was really big. badass and after that things just started moving down more into the city like voltage lounge and all that

so but yeah I mean the scene of Philly is dope yeah you guys have a big scene out there you got the uh uh

Chracadurroro rest and peace right oh yeah I think we played there one we played upstairs once yeah right before shut down there is an upstairs yeah yeah I forgot

I don't think we uh I don't even even been that room yeah it was it's the load in one you want to talk about the worst load in a wall of all Oh, dude.

It was like some steps. It was like two flights to get up there. Dude, any of venue and you walk in and you see steps, you're like, this is not my day already. Oh, yeah. This is not my fucking day. I'm fucking hung over. I'm tired. Yeah.

We appreciate the elevators now. It's always a nice. Oh, yeah. Dude, a loader? Should pull to a venue and there's a loader? The guy with gloves? No way. Loading boss.

Well, what's cool about you guys is, you know, obviously, admit you're not in. and then Banya, so I'll make this like kind of period quick. So you guys had this EP come out in 2015, and it was good enough to where, which we're very similar in that. We're like, that got you guys signed. Yeah. Essentially, yeah.

Pretty much, yeah. Essentially, yeah. Yeah, what, like, what happened? We, I remember I was sitting, like, outside of my parents' house, and I was like, huh, I wonder if this is actually going to work or not. And then literally, like, our AR from Fearless, sent us an email. Like hey I'm gonna come watch you guys at New England Metal Fest I want to sign your band and I was like oh shit

We're gonna keep going boys And then we just played that and met him and then you know after that We made pain again and then we made in darkness and now we're on our third record Yeah Scars for you to remember so yeah, how do you hear about you guys? I really don't know Could have been the yeah, yeah, it wasn't that H1 what a lot of okay, so So, that Legion hits. Give them the lore on this.

The Legion Hall thing I was telling you about, there was like this one show there was the last show before it got like shut down for bands. And our friend got naked and moshed and it like blew up. It was on like ridiculousness and stuff. Like it was insane. Really? Like it was huge. And a lot of people found our band through that. But it's like funny now because nobody knows about that.

They just know our band. Yeah. Because I think I remember bringing that up to him before and he was like, what are you talking about? I was like. I just always assumed that that was it too. Like I never even know. Big PR night. Yeah.

It was so funny. I think it resulted in us in fearless being like, oh, we go to Sun who's being, because we had a guy moshed naked to him. I don't think it was like... No, no. It was honestly just funny. It was super fun. That was when the band got like the boost. Yeah. We were like 19 at the time.

Were you saying, Jane? We used the footage of that show for one of the the Savage music video, which I edited and had to do... Frame by frame, a little rubber duck had to cover certain things. Yeah, the guy's name was ducky too. So it made sense.

So someone was moshing at your show and they were naked? Yeah. It was like a bet at the show, because we knew it was going to be an insane show. And he was like, I'm a mosh naked tonight. And I was like, yo, we all thought he was kidding. What are the odds? And then he did it. And then somebody caught it off video and got on the internet and like literally blew up.

Whoa. Like it was insane. Dude, talk about fucking meant to be. Yeah. Did he get arrested or something? No. No. He's fine.

Yeah, he's chilling. He's in the Navy now. Oh. Shout out, Ducky. Yeah. Wherever you're at. Wow. You know, I tell us a lot to people.

Sometimes you just need a little bit of attention. You know, matter how it comes, it's like, oh, it gives you like a little boost. It's cool. Not wrong. Especially now, like viral clips or any kind of meme you might be a part of, it's fucking... We're trying to get the TikTok going, don't worry. Yeah. I feel like that's, like, instrumental in some band's successes nowadays.

Oh, for sure. It's like the dumbest thing in the world, but totally like a TikTok can do so much for your band. It's, like, ridiculous. And you just got to make so many. I'll make the stupidest stuff. And a lot of it doesn't get any views. But like you got to throw shit at the wall until it sticks with that.

So yeah. You guys got to fuck around with the hashtags. Right. Yeah. I hit them usually. I just don't know the best practices yet. It's like you're right. You hit it on a fucking head.

It's dumb. The TikTok thing is dumb to like get big off it. But it's like, I don't know if there's a science to it or like, like someone getting viral up it that there is something to be said about that yeah pretty cool it's a tool yeah you got to use it exactly at the end of the day it is you'd be stupid to not use it in my opinion yeah if you're trying to progress your your band it's a wild wild west out there I mean it's it's definitely working because like uh like when we played in philly like the promoter joe like I was talking to him and he was like yeah man like there's a bunch of new kids now and I'm

like you're not wrong and everywhere we go. It's definitely like over the pandemic, like a bunch of new kids found like metalcore or whatever in their community shows, probably from TikTok. Yeah, I definitely saw it in Philly too specifically because like I feel like whenever we play in Philly, it's like the same like 50 to 100 people that we know that are there every time. Yeah. I didn't see a lot of those people at the show and it was more like a couple hundred people that I was just like, oh wow, like these are all younger, like newer people, I guess. It was dope. We're seeing push mosh. again. Oh yeah, big pushmosh.

We got a wall at death the other night. Yeah. The wall of death. Dude, pushmash walled death was crazy. Oh, my God. Dush moshing during a hardcore show is a big no-no. But these new kids, it's not like they don't care. They're out there just pushmage. Oh, I love it. I don't even care. As long as you're doing something, that's all

that matters. You know what I mean? That's sick. Times are changing. That's what, that is one thing. I know it is like, there is like a more of like open-mindedness to towards music. as she says it sounds moshin yeah because i would push moshin uh you know back in a day you know fucking uh a hardcore show it was just fucking yeah man people they were not having it dude started throwing kicks you at your face and then i learned the hardcore dance solely out of like

survival yeah you know okay i want to see a throw down i want to fucking have fun so i'm just gonna start throwing kicks for no apparent reason one of the funny stories i have when i was do you remember that band legion no they were from columbus They were like a crazy death chord, man. They were sick and like Belai my burial. Did you ever hear that band? No. So they played at like a church near my house when we were like...

A church? Yeah. Wow. Like when we were kids, like it was that, like you would just get your ass beat at every show, which was sick. I mean, I never complained about it. But I remember that show specifically. It was in a church. Legion's playing. They're literally so goddamn heavy.

And the pastor got kicked in the face. Oh. Yeah. Oh, oh, oh. I was like, you! And then somehow the show. kept going I don't know how but I remember seeing the pastor with like his eyebrow like split

open I guess he was just like seeing what was happening it was crazy did he just say okay I'm gonna watch the band from the fucking side of the pit and what's like yeah I don't know oh my yeah I guess you don't know what's going on it was like a classic like 2010 like floor show in a church you know what I mean

oh my god dude that was a thing for a long time like having like heavy shows at churches it was like that thing for such a long time oh yeah apparently still going on i guess we played up to church in philly yeah that's like a legendary venue too in philly there is a church venue huh yeah yeah i forgot about that place yeah i feel like i didn't see shows there for a couple years but now i feel like almost every show now is there again it's

coming back yeah i don't know they still got the carpet they still got the carpet yeah there's like this legendary carpet on the stage there that's literally like the preschool like railroad like uh it's got the streets on it's got the streets on it You know what I'm talking about? Like the generic ass preschool rug. It's just been on that stage for like, like, I saw a show there when I was like 14 or 15 and the carpet was there. Oh, it's filthy.

It's still there. Oh, and it's gross. The green room is the play is the daycare. Yeah, the green room is the daycare. You just get to hang out in the daycare for the green room. It's honestly nice. They have cubbies. Yeah, it was great.

Yeah, sick. What's that venue called? First Unitarian Church. Wow. Yeah. That's a fucking name. Yeah. Yes, sir.

It was dope. Finally got into, like, actually play there. Yeah, that was the first time I've ever played there. Yeah. Yeah. That was sick. It sounds like there's a lot of venues. Like, where you guys are from?

You guys have been just naming off venues, and I never even heard of before. Yeah. Yeah. Well, is Voltage Lounge, like... I think it's not. The last time I... Okay, everybody keeps saying it's dumb,

but the last time I walked by it, shit was rocking. I think they're changing it into something else. All right. Boy, there's Voltage Lounge. There's the fire. Underground Arts. Underground Arts.

Union Transfer. Electric Factory. Franklin Music. Oh, sorry. Yeah. There's more. There's so many. There is a lot of venues in Philly, honestly.

Yeah, I never really thought about that before. There's a shitload. And then you throw in all the basements. Yeah. The venues are infinite. Temple basements. Temple basement shows. And it's basements.

Yeah. You want to hear something really funny? So Blake, he used to play in counterparts. Do you know Blake Hardman? Sounds familiar. He was doing sound for Lorna on Chaos and Carnage, wasn't he? Oh, that Blake? Yeah.

Yeah. So he was in 100th at the time. and Counterparts and Hundreds played a basement show in Philly back in our 2015 era, and we played that. So, like, Blake's doing sound for us now. And he's like, I've seen every version of various. He's like, I saw you guys in the basement. And now I'm out here with you guys.

It's so funny to think about shit like that. Yeah, so crazy. Because, like, at the time, we, like, didn't even know him when we played that show with him. And we were, like, counterparts fans. It's like a last minute show. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I didn't even know he was in that band.

Oh, wait, he was he in 100 at the time. He was in 100, and then he was in counterboards. Yeah. Oh, shit. And now he's my sound guy. Is he? Yeah, yeah, well, yeah, he's doing sound draft. Yeah, on this tour.

Oh, shit, yeah, I just met him. He's a fucking psycho. Oh, yeah, he's awesome. I call him, like, me and him, just, I call him dad, and he'll be like, hey, son. Like, when I first met him, I was like, you're my tour dad. And, like, we don't even call each other's our names. I'm just like, hey, son. It's so funny.

People are always like, what the hell are they talking about? He would be here with us, but he's filling in on guitar for Orthodox on this tour. So he's playing, or he played a show with them yesterday. So he's rocking up later to the venue with them. Dude, that's sick. Yeah, doing double duty. That's a band besides you guys I've been hearing about that you're currently on tour with. Oh, yeah, no, they can pass.

Yeah, their new record is so, so good. Very crushed it. Yeah. And we've toured with them, like, well, I think it's only the second time we've toured with them, We've played a lot of shows with them over the years. Yeah. And, like, they're definitely getting, like, the craziest reaction I've ever seen them get on this tour. Really?

Yeah, they're definitely popping off right now. It's dope to watch. It's really cool seeing it from, like, afar. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, we were just out in September. I see, like, you see, like, the shirts start popping up. Oh, shit.

With us, I got to check them out. Yeah. So tonight, basically, we were saying I have to be there early and see them. Yeah, you should. Yeah. They have men distinguishes fucking awesome. That's also been on the... Yeah.

I've been hearing about... Oh, yeah. They're definitely on the come-up right now as well. They're from Vegas. They're sick as hell. They're a Vegas band? Yeah. I didn't know that.

Yeah, they've been around for a while, but I feel like they just started, like, really, like, hitting, like, the good, like, tour slots and stuff like that. Like, we've... I feel like I met them in, like, 20, like... 15 or 16. Like, they've been grinding for a long time, and finally starting to pay off for them,

and they're really crushing it. Every band, on our tour is really doing extremely well right now. It's awesome to see. You guys got very lucky with your tour package. Yeah, we did. We pushed pretty hard for those bands. And I was stoked that they all took the tour

because it took a lot of effort to like just make that, you know, four band lineup happen. It was also sick because correct me if I'm wrong, this was originally slated for a different time. And we had like a way different package. And then we had to move it. And then it worked out because we got like all the bands that were super good friends within them,

but we wanted on the tour on it. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, we were supposed to do this tour, like, I think we were originally planning it for like 2020, but then COVID happened and then we started planning stuff to come back. Like, oh, we're going to do this tour in the spring. We started like reaching out to bands and then we got the opportunity to do that all it remains tour.

And when that came up, we were like, all right, we're going to take this and push the headliner back again. But I'm glad that it worked out the way it did because we got like the exact lineup that we wanted where we couldn't get that lineup in the spring so whoa yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah huge surprisingly it's rare to get a good tour package yeah and especially like I feel like there's so much uh competition right now for just like getting bands and shit like I was really surprised that they were all available too it was also sick because like everyone put music out like literally right before that tour or like on the tour yeah we didn't even know that our record and

boundaries record were supposed to come out the same day until we had already booked the tour and then like I think their singer Matt or their guitar player Cody or Corey started texting me and was like our records come out the same day on the tour I was like you're joking like yeah it worked out so well your eyes of this new record came out literally last week yeah on the 14th on the 14th fucking scars for you to remember that that's a sick fucking album title's like okay yeah we were just trying to like hit back like hard and and just like fast like just go do the whole fucking thing again you know what I mean yeah and it's funny too because we actually had help like from Matt from boundaries like with some of the songs on the album too so it's sick that like we're on tour with them for like the release of it and shit it's sick oh it's dope yeah yeah right before that record I guess you could say the pandemic in March 2020 Travis your

previous singer and left a few months prior to that huh what what what happened to Travis, you don't mind me asking. So he went the band like January, I think. Like, we were like two weeks before we were about to leave for that tour that we did with Spite. Yeah. And there was like a second where we were actually questioning, like, if we were going to be able to do the tour or not.

Yeah. And then we just kind of like bum rush to figure it out. And then Matt from boundaries, what we were just talking about. Like, he came on the tour and filled in for us. And we were supposed to, like, go. right from that tour to Europe and Australia. Like, we weren't even supposed to come home. It was like one, one, one.

And, like, you know, we kind of, like, salvaged all of it. Like, he was going to do it all with us. And then, of course, COVID hit, and we got sent home at the end of the Spike Tour. So, fuck. Yeah. It was, it was a crazy couple months of just, like, scrambling to get shit back together. But, yeah. Is it, and at that point, like, right before Travis left, you were, like, you were doing,

so you entered a band and you're already doing like back-up vocals yeah did you have any like I was curious this was what I wanted to ask you Mitch was uh

did you have it in your mind like you know I might actually sing Ford's fucking band at all honestly no damn I like I always wanted to be a singer but like I didn't think I had the capability to scream

for that long like I had always just done like more traditional singing on like other music and shit that I worked on outside of Ariel's yeah um and then like I said like we had like Matt from Boundaries filling in for us and then we had like a couple more people after that that we were kind of like vetting like trying to see like what was going to work for the band and shit yeah and like literally uh like September-ish October or 2021 yeah like we were finishing the album and we were about to leave for our first tour after COVID and we were still singerless.

And we were like having this moment of just like, the fuck we're going to do, blah, blah, blah. And I remember I was like sitting in the studio with Mike and James and we were just kind of like, should we try this? Like, so we don't have to bring another totally new person into the mix. Because like I had done the backup vocals before and everything. Like I already had stuff that I recorded on some of the songs that were more fleshed out, like backup parts and stuff. So we just gave a shot and I thought it sounded good recorded but then you know obviously like trying to do it live was a whole different thing but it worked out on that first tour that we did and yeah we just ran with it.

Holy shit. I did not think that I would be in this position though at all. Wow. Yeah. Dude like I don't even know what I would do it in your. It was funny because we kind of pressured Mitch into it because we did like, like we did the record like pretty much. full and then like we had like a couple of people like essentially like try out well originally it was matt and like we were pretty like good with that and then like boundaries started like popping off a lot

and we're just like I feel like he's not going to be able to like manage both so like plus it's like that's his fucking yeah and we didn't want to like take him from that etc yeah the dope thing is like I feel like whenever you try to bring like new people in your band you know what I mean it's kind of like how's this going to work so he does vocals now he just came back and he's one of our best friends so it's like this is sick because we like what we said to like all right we're we're gonna ask Shane to come back and play guitar and if he doesn't want to do it then MacBook's looking real good oh my goodness we ran MacBook on the last story it's sounding great macbook don't miss yeah the macbook does it every night I don't miss either

you got to pay me though it's the only thing it was literally either Shane or bust we were just like it's either somebody that we know fully and and we trust and we know we'll get along with or we're not going to put somebody else in the band. But it worked out. And like, yeah. And like I feel way more confident too because I have like the original Varyos band backing me.

Do you know what I mean? Oh, yeah. Yeah. So it's sick. You're right. You do have like the strongest foundation behind you. People that have been in a band for like 10 years. Yeah, exactly.

And like, you know, he was there when they laid the foundation of everything that made the band like pop off. So it's sick to have him. him back and doing it with us. It's awesome. It's great. I mean, to have like the original fours, it's pretty rare, man. It's great. Yeah. It worked out

strangely well. Shane, I mean, so I had a couple questions for you. Sure. Is that it's so bizarre that, like, you guys get signed, which for any band's like a big deal. It's like, oh, we're fucking signed. We're going to fucking buy houses and you get signed. You're not getting drunk.

I could kind of buy a lunch. That's what it's really good. Yeah. So, but you guys put out, like, your first record, and then you left. Why? I had some personal stuff going on that I was really, I needed to get myself together. Yeah. And it literally took, how long was I gone?

Five years. Yeah, five years or so. Yeah. It probably took the better part of five years to, like, really feel like, like I want to come back and play music. I forget, Shane, were you, did you leave before? before we got signed the Fearless? It was like you guys were in the process. Okay.

So I was like really excited and then and I left. And I just had, I needed to like learn different things about myself and like learn skills. So I actually went like, I stopped being in a band. I started cutting hair. Been working for the last five years and this is my first tour back. It's the first one back.

First one back. Yeah. So it's, yeah, he played a couple, like, he played a couple festivals with us. Yeah, there's like warm ups. Yeah, and then, but this is like his first proper...

Yeah, the first show was the, like, cool 4,000 people. And I was like, dude. Yeah, you missed a couple years of us eating shit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I got to skipball. Just threw it. I got the past, fast. Oh, that was your fucking plenty, you dick.

Yep. I was watching him. He said, I'm going to stay at home and quack up. He said, I'm going to stay at home and just eat a sandwich for five years since I went from to be all right. It's a really big sandwich, boys. Shane left to get the pack of sigs and he just came back. What the fuck? So who hit you up to come back in a band?

Mitch did. Mitch? Yeah, I wasn't going to do it. I feel like, I remember the phone call and I was like, Mitch is calling me. You knew exactly what. And I'm like, this has to do with various. Because it was like the middle of the week and it wasn't like,

oh, yo, we're going out to text mech or something. So I knew there was. I knew there was some business to be handled. So, um, I know, like, I'm on the call. And he's saying what I thought he was going to say. I'm like, okay. I'm like, am I ready to be in a band again? You didn't seem stoked at first.

I was not stoked. But, like, it was like one of those, like, I was torn. Like, oh, you're really fucking asking me to do this? Because, like, all those years, I was like, yeah, I want to play music again. And I was finally like, all right, I'm just going to cut air and chill. and be a 9 to 5 type dude. And I was like, go find another guitar player. Either go find a guitar player, stay four piece.

And then over time, I was like, I'd be stupid to not take that opportunity to play. Yeah, I don't remember if, did I, because I remember the three of us, like, talked about it that day and we were just like, all right, let's just ask them. So, like, you know, it's because we still have time before we're going to start heavy touring again. So let's just, like, you know, vibe them out.

But I can't did I tell you on the phone? I was like, yeah, if you don't do it, we're just not going to get anybody. I didn't, I didn't know that. Oh, okay, I wasn't sure if I told you that. Yeah, that was a pretty interesting phone call because, like, I knew you guys were going on tour. There was no way I was just dropping everything and going on tour. So they did two, I think, two tours without me. Yep.

And I didn't really, like, specifically say, like, yeah, I want to play in the band. I was kind of just, like, showing up and, like, you know, playing the festivals we were doing. And I think I finally made a decision right before we were about to go on the headliner. So did my due diligence. I told my work like, I'm out. Nice. And I decided, yeah. So it's been fun, man.

Was that for you? Was that like a tough decision to make? Oh, it was really tough. Yeah. I mean, it's a whole different lifestyle than what I'm used to. And I got comfortable, like, just hanging at home, chilling, playing video games, but, you know. Like I said, it'd be stupid to, like, turn that down.

You know, like, we're going to get to go to Europe, and it's like, I can't turn down a free trip to Europe. You know what I mean? Even if I'm not, like, going to be making a shit ton of money, you know? So, yeah, it was definitely tough, but I'm here, so. You're here, it's great. Yeah. And we're happy to have them. Yeah, it's been really fun.

Yeah. Grateful. Was that, like, for you guys, was that, like, a casual, conversation like hey let's this hit up Shane pretty much it's like what the hell else are you going to ask yeah literally yeah just calling yo jerk off you're back

no yeah I mean it was I feel like it was pretty chill like I don't even really remember exactly when it got brought up but I feel like from the moment it got brought up we were just like that you know it makes sense it's either going to be like I said him like somebody that we already have known for years like deserves it or we're just

gonna rock as a 4P so Like, they were telling me this idea, and I was like, I don't know, man, that guy's chilling in the barber shop. I don't know who's going to do it. And then, like, I was going through shit over the pandemic, too. I didn't know what I want to do with music anymore. So, me and Shane are texting each other, like, yo, we doing this for a brother. What's good? And now we're both back, like, yes, because I had one of my little homies, Kevin, filling in for me on the last two tours.

Okay. And now we're all back. Yep. Wow. And the band sounds dope. Yeah, first headliner and first tour. after COVID that we finally have the whole squad back. And we're the best version of ourselves right now.

It seems that way. You guys seem from me being an outsider. I just met you guys totally like an hour ago. It seems like really cool. Like you guys seem like a unit and friends. It's fucking cool to see you, man. Yeah. That's like the thing about like what I was saying earlier

about having him do vocals and him back. It's like you don't have to deal with anybody you don't know. Keep the circle tight. Just keep the circle tight. Yeah. So boys are chilling We're up to City boys are up

Yeah city boys are up yeah And uh And Sean you You were talking about how you were kind of thinking like Do I so want to play music and stuff? Yeah It's it's that's a That's a healthy thought process

I think we all we all grow through it Even sometimes multiple times During a whole career we're like I don't want to do this shit anymore dude Fuck I'm fucked Yeah but it's it's normal Yeah the whole like pandemic thing And like how excited we all were to do all this

I just got lost in the sauce straight up when we were home. I was like eh, and then as soon as we got back out here, I was like, what the fuck was I thinking? Yeah, like, too for real, dude. I was like, I am miserable in Philadelphia. I need to go on tour all the time. It's funny

how sometimes you'll take it for right granted. It's so weird. I think about that dude, I was like two winters ago. When I'm home, like I'll hang out with my hometown friends that have nothing to do with music. I went like snowboarding with my friend Kyle and I remember like sitting on the ski lift with him and I looked at him and I was like

yeah man like I feel like I still haven't done shit and he looked at me he's like what the fuck are you talking like you take it for granted it's like you don't even realize like how dope this shit is yeah totally it definitely helps having like a very close friend or something another at home telling you do you know what you're doing

you're traveling every day and you're playing music I feel like that's like a good thing to like kind of think like that and not be satisfied because once you're satisfied and you know your beat but like if you want to keep like chasing it you know Words of wisdom from Sean When you're satisfied, you know your beat

That's crazy Your beat, it's over You're done Wrap it up Yeah Dude, I wish you said it like 30 minutes later Because I was like

Oh we're done Yeah, that's it Dude, it's so fucking real man I mean One of the biggest mistakes I made in my career Like you're dissatisfied You get The moment you're satisfied

You're fucking jaded And to come back from that Dude is hell Yeah So it's cool that, it's cool that you know that, you know? I don't know. Yeah, I mean, this shit's awesome. It's dope.

Like, definitely the coolest thing you can do with your fucking, like, play music. Yeah, for sure. And you guys just put out a record that people are jamming. Yeah. Yeah, people really seem to enjoy the record. I mean, for you and this part, it's cool to see. I mean, I could, I don't imagine, like, like, the pressure. It's like, oh, shit, I'm a fucking front man.

Now, what the fuck is this? Dude, it was funny because I, like, I had, like, people from, like our label, like management, like agent, like everybody that like kept like texting me and like checking in on me when we're like putting stuff out. Especially when we put out this one song where like a lot of our core fans were like, the fuck is this. And they were like literally texting me and be like, are you good? And I'm like, I'm fine. Why? Like what are you talking about?

They were just like, I just wanted to make sure like, you know, it's not getting to you or anything. I'm like, no, I'm chilling. Like I prepared myself for the mountain. of shit and I'm enjoying the mountain of shit. I like that. Yeah, but it's been sick, honestly. Like, it's very, like, it's very relieving that it's just finally out because it took so much time.

And not that there was, like, turmoil, but, like, it was just such a crazy process. It was a long process. Yeah, like, we made, we had to make so many crazy decisions. It was originally supposed to just be an EP too. Yeah. We hit up Fearless and we're like, hey, like, we're going to write, like, a quick EP, like, over this time. that like everything's closed and whatnot.

We literally are about to finish it. And then like one of them calls it's like, yo, you guys got to do an album actually. And we're just like, God, fucking dead. Yeah, we're like, yo, this bitch is like dawn. And they're just like, full length? We're like, oh, all right. Wow.

Yeah. But I mean, once again, a thing that I'm glad in hindsight, maybe I wasn't stoked on it in the moment, but I'm glad that it worked out the way it did. That's like the moral of the story with this whole process. Like hindsight, always 20, 20 like I'm fucking looking back going like damn I was pissed and now I'm like I'm stoked why was I pissed It's great that you see that man like why was I so pissed? Yeah yeah it's like it was just it was a lot

But like I said it's very relieving that it's out and like this seems like like from my perspective It seems like a lot of people were really like questioning whether they were gonna like it Before the whole thing came out like when we were just doing the singles like I saw a lot of people commenting like, I'm not sure how I feel about this or like fuck this this sucks. And then like literally those same people like commenting on the songs now that they're like all out being like oh fuck this actually is dope. Like I like I set my expectation wrong like this is great. So I'm just like all right fuck yeah. Like it feels like we gave people what they wanted which was the goal.

So yeah. That's great. I mean yeah. I mean I'll admit um with you guys I learned that shit I'm a fucking hypocrite. I went up what first two songs did you release was circles one of the first two songs that was the third yeah

we put out a song before we announced out the album and everything called cycle violence yeah and then when we announced the record we put out 50 caliber and circles got it yeah yeah so those were the two that like led up to the album I got it cool because for some reason

I just like went straight to you know I'm all shit is they're playing change reaction so I just went straight to circles so now my introduction to the band I was like you're like the fuck I was like okay cool and my thought process was like okay

that's that's that's that's their sound yeah and then once we once we started communicating more via text I was okay then I dove into like the the EP the first record in the second round I was like oh shit oh my goodness I'm like shit dude I fucking

I always get people shit like don't you listen that one song but you didn't hear the record but I fucking did it I was like God Chris you're fucking I mean see but on the flip side though like that's almost kind of what I kind of wanted to achieve with

putting that song out because I figured we would get a bunch of new ears on the band that wouldn't go looking for the stuff that is crazy fucking heavy they'd hear that song and be like oh this is cool this is more aligned with like something I already listened to or whatever

and then they go to listen to the rest of the album and they're just like, oh. Yeah. In like a good or a bad way. But I feel like in most times, it's worked out good for us so far. Like I've, like I said, I've seen people commenting being like, oh, I heard circles and the rest of this album is fucking heavy as hell. What the fuck? But they're stoked on it.

Yeah. Yeah. Dude to be like, yo, they aren't heavy anymore. And then the first song of body wrapped in plastic. Yeah. Yeah. Told you. Yeah.

Told you, bro. Still out here. Yeah. That's great. It seems people are actually listening to the record, which is, that's what you want. I mean, you're like, you have like this body of work, you know, and you don't want assholes like me, fucking's playing circles. Like, that's it. It's kind of funny, though, what do you think about it.

It is, yeah. You know, what, I think what happened was, obviously, I mean, I think a lot of people do this, where they go on Spotify and they play the whatever first song is. Yeah. And that's a song, Romance. that yeah okay I don't get that fucking song it's like I know I like it a lot but it's like it's such like a like the structure of it is interesting

and it's kind of like a buildup yeah and then it stops and it's like this outer lude also okay I mean that's a great it's a great song but it's just so strange to me that it has so many fucking streams it's definitely like I don't think any of us thought

when we put that album out that that would end up being our most popular song. How did that happen? I don't know. Literally. And the funny thing is, is like, when we put the album out, that was not the number one song. It was, like, over COVID when it, like, bumped back up. Because for a while, our two, like, big songs off the first record were, like, always the

ones that were one and two on Spotify. And then at some point over COVID, romance just, like, crept up into number one. And now, when we play live, that's always. always the song where people are singing the loudest every night. Really? Yeah. Which also in moving forward from that, like, was another reason why I was, well, not why I, why these two actually convinced me to put circles on the album.

But it was a reason why in my head I was like, okay, maybe that song actually will work on the record because we saw romance creep up to become the most popular song. So people clearly like that, like, softer kind of side of Aeal's. but again it's not like like romance it's not really like a song like you said like it's literally just like a couple parts that just like build up and then it's like it's over yeah yeah i like it's like it's definitely an odd song it's easily digestible i think is what it actually is it's just it's short enough to like get the point across not long enough to drag out the one riff that we do in that song yeah i feel like a lot of darkness is what you just said to it like a lot of that

record is like drawn out like kind of like same riff like over and over again kind of thing and that song is short and sweeten to the point so yeah yeah who uh who wrote with that song that was Travis yeah yeah yeah like when we when we did in darkness like that record was fucking bizarre when we did it because like we had probably I don't know I want to say somewhere shy of a full length amount of songs like demos when we got to the studio and then... We went up to 36, I think it was. Well, yeah.

Like, when we got there, we were, like, listening to all of them and, like, us and our producer at the time, Josh, we were all just like, is this it? I don't think this is it. So then we only ended up keeping two songs from that original batch,

and then for, like, two weeks instead of, like, starting to record the record, we just went into, like, go crazy, write a million songs mode. So, like, we had a bunch of different, like, rooms of people pretty much just, like, simultaneously. like writing music and then like like whatever that whatever became of that was like 32 something

songs and then we had to narrow it down from there to what became in darkness so like well we had like Travis like working on songs uh I was working on songs Mike and James were working on songs together like Sean was in with like me and Josh like tracking physical drum parts on demos instead of doing like all MIDI like it was a really cool process And then like, you know, we occasionally would move from room to room and, like, work on stuff together. I wouldn't do it like that again, but it was sick and it was a really fun way to do an album. I remember, like, South of One was probably the last song I tracked. Yeah, I think that was the last one.

And I was so fucking high trying to track it. Oh, my God. And, like, I was getting yelled at it. They were like, sure, get it together. I'm like, uh. Who's got to do it? I remember, like, we were making those songs. Like, me and Traver joking about, like, the 2000.

nine metal four breakdowns. Yeah. And at the end of that song, just like, dig it, dig it, dig it, dig it. And I was like, there it is. There it is. Yeah, it was, it was definitely a fun way to do an album. But like I said, I'm not sure if I would do it like that again.

Yeah. It was a little chaotic. Yeah, it's kind of cool to do something once. Like, not really know what's going on, but, but you're still, you all have like this common goal. Yeah. It is kind of cool. I think we got an interesting product out of it, too.

Because, like, if we had done the record with, what was those original, like, eight or nine demos that we had, it would have been vastly different. I think the only two songs from those original eight that were kept were the first two tracks on the album, Wound and I Suffocate. What did you just go in like and what did, I mean, what, what was different from where, like, before you walked in,

hey, we fucking like these eight, nine songs, just fucking go track them. Then what, like, what happened? Honestly, I don't even really remember. Because, like, I wrote, I remember I wrote wound and I suffocate, like, just chilling at my apartment over the course of that year before we went to the studio

and then there was like two or three songs that Trav had done on his own so like those like four or five songs kind of became like the basis of what we thought we were gonna do and then like me and him had just wrote a couple more individual songs on top of those and then we got there

and I guess it was almost just kind of like a vibe check because like we had it really all like come together in the same room with our producer yet And we're like jamming these. And we were all on the same page of like, okay, wound the ice suffocate. Like those are cool. Those are still like in line with where we're trying to take this. But we need to rethink the rest of it.

And I don't really think we saw ourselves going on a crazy tangent of writing 33 songs. It's just kind of where it went heavily influenced by the volcano vaporizer, courtesy of Josh. Shout out volcano. Shout out Josh. I love you guys. Shout out the wizard. Yeah. And the wizard from Don's basement.

Yeah. Can we talk about the wizard? Yeah, we can get into that real quick. Let's go in. All right, listen. Listen. This thing is kind of fucked up. So, Josh, we would say it is lovely father-in-law's house, Don.

Real quick, real quick. Josh Schroeder is our old producer. Well, not even old. He still worked on stuff on our new album. But he did our first two albums, Pain Again, and in Darkness. Produce, Mix, Master, the whole thing. So anyways, lovely Don.

best person in the world has this wizard statue in his basement and it's like it's literally like seven feet tall it's made like an art class and like something was going on when we were doing in darkness where we would be in that basement and like he would start talking about

like somebody you haven't spoken to in years and though they would text you and it was like that wizard had something going on with it where like we would talk about people and like things would just happen it was fucking also half the time like we'd be talking about someone like not even in like a bad way at all just like talking about someone like random and then like

the next day something horrible what happened to them yeah yeah like it was fucking like hex it started getting weird it started getting weird it started getting really weird and dude dude dude one of the funniest one was uh like i was like listening to stained or something in the basement i was like and literally like trapp picked up his phone and he was like dude he was like the singer of stain just made his first tweet in like five years saying what's up y'all it's been a while right after you put that on dude there's something over that fuck it like it happens still like i'll be in philly with like my friends and like we'll be talking about somebody and then like the person they haven't talked to in five years will randomly

wait Sean maybe bring up the uh the demon thing oh nah dude yes nah that thing hexed me bro oh that thing hexed me it was a little weird now you gotta talk about it i don't know about shit oh that reminds me of dark i showed mitch this but my uh talking about demons my uh my girlfriend's sister texted her and she's like I'm really scared she has like one of the sleeping apps that like records noises if they happen while you're sleeping

anyway she woke up and in the clip she's you know it's her and her boyfriend talking and she's like I had a nightmare did it and then like right after she says that there's like a fucking demonic voice literally embedded in it and I showed Mitch and I was in the hotel and I was like dude that shit's real did I show you that?

I don't know it's all my It's scary movie level, you know? They'll get, like, a audio clip in the movie, and it's like, they're, like, getting the audio and they're, like, making it bigger. Like, what the fuck is that? That's literally what it is. And it was, like, this low-ass voice, bro.

It's pretty fucked up. I was scared. I was, like, having a hard time. Yeah, he came upstairs in the hotel and was just, like... I was in the hotel lobby, like, having a time. Yeah. That's, like, that's, like, someone I know. You know what I mean?

Like, they might have some... some stuff following honey I think you have a demon right yeah I think it's your called a priest

so really actual it's like that it's like no like have you heard it no bro it's it's bad when we get out of here I'll listen to it

yeah it's bad called a priest you believe in ghost Chris yes word I it's funny you actually read my mind

I was gonna ask a question exactly like like I do believe in energy, I believe people pass away. Not like fucking Casper, the friendly ghost running around. Like, for sure. Casper, my God. I believe

in spirits, 100%. I believe in spirits. I believe in energy. I believe when we die, we just leave like a, could be bad, could be good, but that's what I believe. So I was going to ask you guys like, what do you think that was with the wizard? I have no

idea, honestly. I've never, because like I'm on the same page as you guys where it's like, yeah, I believe in some sort of spirit, afterlife, weird fucking shit going on, energy, all that. But I've never experienced something like that wizard. Like we're talking, we're kind of like talking about this like it's like funny, but like in the moment, it was kind of fucking scary. Because like we, when we first got there, like we're staying and this is our producer's father-in-law's basement with just a bunch of mattress pads around.

Like it's very nice, like homey little place. Yeah. And you know, you got this fucking creepy-assizard paper machete. Very out of place. It almost makes you question. Super out of place. Like, it looks like it's something out of a fucking goosebumps book. And, like, we originally were, like, put it.

He had this hand he would stick out. And a little ball in it. Yeah, we would take the ball out of his hand and, like, put your keys or, like, your wallet, like, in his hands. And we'd be leaving and go to the studio. And so we'd be, like, I can't put my wallet. Where are my keys? We'd be like, go consult the wizard. Because we would put him there on.

purpose like oh ha ha the wizard has it and then from there the whole like you know that that was you guys the whole time yeah yeah i'm joking but then from there it progressed to like we would literally be sitting in the basement like here's the best example i can give i was sitting in the basement having a conversation about one of my friends from like 10th grade that moved to florida that i hadn't spoken to in like almost a decade and out of nowhere the following night he sent me a fucking uh like a video message on facebook messenger of like of like of like what's up like life update like how are you like let's reconnect kind of thing and i was just like this is fucking weird and like shit like that just kept happening like every day it was so bizarre i mean that was like number one

And then, uh, one time when I was a kid, I had like a piano in my basement, and literally it was playing itself. It was fucking weird. And like, it,

my dad, like, my dad takes care of his shit, like super, like he takes really care of his stuff. I checked all the strings, nothing broke. Kept going,

dung. And like the cover, like the wooden cover was over the piano. And I swear, nobody was fucking with me either. And then, uh, that was weird.

And then me and Mike lived in this old apartment. And then as soon as I move in, right? The thing's fucking hard. Dude, that was fucked, John. Like as soon as I went out, I was like, text him like,

dude, the wizard's in the fucking apartment, dude. Like, one of us would be home just by ourselves and like, here, door slam. Yeah. Like, text, you're like, yo, Sean, you home? And they're like, no. I'm like, oh, fuck. Literally, like, this one night, I literally heard the door open, close.

Somebody was walking around. I'm like, oh, Mike's back. So I, like, going downstairs, nobody's there. The door's fucking closed. I'm like, okay, maybe the wind, like, banged the door open. I opened because there was, like, two doors, like the first door than the second one. The other door is still fucking closed.

I'm like, Jesus Christ, dude, the fucking wizard. It's in our goddamn apartment. We didn't blame his shit on this for like years. Yeah. It's all the wizard. At this point, I just made him the homie. Like, I'm not even scared of them. No, that's what you do.

That's what you do. Because, like, places can get haunted, but also people can definitely get haunted. And sometimes you just kind of make amends with you. I do. With your guy. Just be like, dude, stop fucking with me. Yeah. Yeah, it's like, it's like they, they say when you have nightmares and you have

like, and you're approached by a demon, whatever form that might be. It could be a spider. It could be a wizard. But I guess like some people that will fix it is like as opposed to waking up You're like oh me you got like a like a nightmare You'll basically grab it and like look at it and like accept it in in in your dream Yeah and then and then and then those nightmares are that whatever demon that's Whatever that might be stops

So it's kind of like you know that's pretty similar what like what like you did You're just like well Wizards my homie Yeah He just follows me around and shit I'm just like all right That's it banging on the walls I'm like keep it down bro I'm trying to sleep I've had, uh, I've had sleep paralysis problems like ever since I was a kid, but like I don't

really have like scary like demon in the corner, fucking spiders everywhere sleep paralysis. Like I literally just like wake up and like I'm all there, but I'm like, like, I'm stuck. We'll be in a hotel sometimes and like Mitch will be sleeping next to me or something and he's just like, eyes open but can't move like, Mike, wake me up, wake me up, shake me. I was literally about to ask about sleep paralysis too. But what I was going to say was like, there has been a few times where I'll have sleep paralysis and it'll feel like I'm having like a full-on conversation with somebody that's not there. And it's either, it could be somebody that's like there in the actual situation physically,

like Mike or the other day. Like I was having sleep paralysis and I thought that I was like physically shaking Eddie, our driver. Like I felt like I was trying to wake him up like just like Eddie, Eddie, Eddie, like, why won't you wake up? And then I fucking just like eventually snapped out and I opened my eyes. I'm just like chilling on my bench and I was like, was I really doing that? I was like, was I just causing a fucking scene in here? And I was like, okay, no, that wasn't real.

So like shit like that will also happen. Or I'll just be like having a full on conversation with like someone that's literally not there like very far away. Or maybe isn't alive. It's fucking weird. But yeah. It's never like scary though. I'm always just like chilling. Yeah.

Well, the other day I woke up in the band of him and screen. No, no, no. Well, I was dreaming. I was like, bro, are you good? I'd be fighting. I'd be fighting demons in my sleep. It's weird because if I'm sleep paralysis,

like I'm chilling, but if I'm asleep and I'm having a dream, sometimes I'm going fucking nuts. Yeah. That's what they call night terrors. Yeah, I guess. Yeah. I'm not, you know, sleeping in the band does not help that.

No. It normally happens to me more when we're in the band. Yeah. Yeah, how is that with your sleep paralysis when you're like, when you're literally on like, a shitty bench. Is it worse?

It definitely happens to me way more when I'm on tour. I feel like I'm at the point now where it actually doesn't really happen to me at home anymore at all. It usually only happens to me like in the van staying at someone's house

or in a hotel. Man, that sucks. But it's weird. Again, it's almost not like a bad thing. Like it doesn't like fucking... Unless I have one of those moments where like I was talking about where I'm like thinking that I'm like shaking Eddie

that's like a one in a hundred stressful one most of the times they're like kind of chill there's the wizard yeah there's the wizard you're just about to say you know bro you got something to say the mic's right here yeah he's talking dude

you're gonna be combing back over the audio and it's like I'm a zoom man let me and chill it sounds like you guys did what every band wants you guys basically have a ghost on your record yeah I guess so yeah that's what we always talk about you're constantly trying to capture some kind of ghost and I have it in the record

so you guys did it yeah congrats isn't there a hidden track on the record there's not really a hidden track no like the one where you like play it backwards and like it plays over the morning oh I see I can't tell if you're being serious or not because there is like a bunch of a hidden like reverse shit on the album but also like are you just trying to make like a demon joke no is it being funny I thought I could yeah sorry I won't for him I had it Huh? Sorry. Wait,

are you serious? Yeah, it's like, there's like nothing like, it's all like joke shit. Like there's like joke stuff like hidden in the background and like if you were to play stuff in reverse and like really listen, you might hear something, but we buried that shit.

So you have to be really high. Yeah, probably. There's a lot of joke shit hidden in that record. Yeah. Yeah. I love them when you're hearing music and like, you're,

you're kind of have to be laying somewhere or sitting down and kind of be like impeached. like when you hear music and like you hear these noises you never heard before yeah he's like oh shit i didn't fucking know that she was even there oh dude when i got my air pods for the first time like i was like just sitting like in my living room like just enjoying music again because i just would put like the fucking noise canceling on yeah and just chill there and listen because it was like it's like like you said it was like i could hear shit in like the background and stuff that i felt like i could never hear before it was dope the best records to hear shit is anything from ross robinson you're

If you hear that shit high, you'll be like, what the fuck is going on back there? Layers on layers. Just little, little layers. And it's so cool to hear those records for so many years. And then you still hear little things. You know, it's so fucking cool. Especially a vinyl, vinyl, too. Yeah, yeah.

You know, I try not to be a vinyl snob, but I can't help it. You, when you play a vinyl and you're high, you're like, oh, it's like, there's like a... There's a layer of something there for sure that's different. It's like... I don't know what it is, but it's, you hear the performance. is more. Yeah, I mean, I've never bounced anything for vinyl. Have you ever bounced anything for vinyl, James? Pretty sure you have to compress

it like a little bit less so it doesn't sound fucked up or something, because I remember I can't remember if it was our new album or in darkness because all the email shit medals together in my brain. But I know that we have like a four vinyl less compressed master of one of our albums.

And I've never like pulled it up on Google Drive and listen to it, but that is a thing. And Yes. Yeah, no, I buy any album that I have like a real, like, crazy fixation on, I'll buy the vinyl of it every time. I'll pay the fucking $45, $50 for it. Oh, yeah, it's worth it. Oh, it is. Trying to be a snob, but it's just, God, it sounds sick.

It does. It does. It's like watching something on laser disc. Yeah. Especially for a record you heard so many times. Like shit for years or I heard, I heard some corn records on DMT. Oh, it's cool. Oh my god.

That's interesting. How was that? It was actually, I was with Mark, and he put Korn's first record. I mean, obviously, it's only in like 10 minutes long. Like, the whole experience is very short, but I put it by my ear, my cell phone, by my ear, and it sounded like a fucking arena. It was a fucking reverb. Yeah, it's a fucking phone speaker, but it sounded like I was in a fucking arena. I'm like, dude, oh, my God.

The heaviest band in the world, though. Holy shit. Dope, man. Yeah, that's fucking, that's awesome. And then did Life is Beachy the second time, and that record made a lot of sense. There's such a primal band. They fucking touched on something, dude.

Something. They do kind of have that, like, primal rage, drum and bass, just like craziness to them that no other band has ever really captured. Yeah. Like, it's just like the most unhinged level of that. It's unhinged.

Yeah, good word. What are some of your guys is, influences you guys have a very you know unique sound some of you guys some things you guys do which i'm a sucker for is drum and bass or like a close high hat chug riff i'm a sucker for those you guys do it a lot so it's i mean i basically just grew up like um like joey jordanson basically in my headphones teaching me how to play drums and then um i got i'm like really gonna hip-hop and shit too so i guess that's kind of where that kind of like when we play those like closed-eye breakdowns and shit like that

comes from that world but it's kind of just a mix of those too but I love doing that shit like the closed I had breakdowns and all that stuff so good my favorite thing I mean I remember Jake from Gideon one time came with me and he's like yo you write like trap beats bro

like when we put out cold her brother he's like that's like a trap beat I'm like I don't know dude I'm just having fun yeah you're not wrong though I always kind of thought that about the older varial stuff like the drums and stuff like you were saying like drum and bass and shit like that. Like, it all kind of flows a little bit differently

than some other metal core stuff does to that hip-hop drum and bass feel almost. Yeah. I mean, I tell people no shame. Like, my favorite band ever is literally bring me the horizon. Really? I love every one of their albums, like, everything they've ever put out. Oh, cool.

But, like, I listen to a shitload of stuff. And as, like, as far as, like, heavy music goes, I feel like I don't really fixate on, like, one, thing ever. Like they're my favorite because they've put that many records out that I've been engaged in consistently since I was like in middle school. Yeah. And like, uh, Def Tones is definitely another huge one for me. Like they definitely fall into that same thing where like all their records have like hit in the moment like for me as well. Um, yeah, I honestly was like kind of like a late bloomer to a lot of like pop and hip hop stuff. Like I was like that fucking like metal core like kid. I was just like I only listen to fucking breakdowns. for a long time. And then, uh, yeah,

I mean, I feel like ever since I started writing music, that was when I became more appreciative of like hip hop and pop and stuff like that. And now that's like mostly what I listen to. It takes something like very specific for me to be like, this is fucking sick with heavy stuff at least now. But yeah. Sick.

Mike? Um, at least heavy wise, like I'm not, and like influence wise, I feel like I don't listen honestly to too much stuff in our realm, at least for like influential-wise. Like most of the stuff I listen to is like indie rock, shoe gaze, stuff like that.

I guess for the new record at least, Mitch kind of got me on, like, influence-wise for writing was honestly like Doom soundtrack. Huge. That kind of stuff. Yeah. Nice. That was that, yeah, video game soundtrack stuff was like video games and like movie scores was like the main thing that I was like listening to when we were writing our new

album. Whoa. And like I feel like also in general we pull a lot from the bands that we tour with, not in like a rip-off like sense, but it's just like a lot of times like we'll see a band play that we tour with and they fucking are so solid live

and like that'll be like what gets me into listening to like their records and shit. Yeah. So definitely a lot of influence from all the bands we've toured with honestly. Yeah. But yeah, shout out Doom soundtrack. Yeah.

Soundtracks are heavy. Especially good ones, dude. Oh, yeah. What's the guy that wrote that? Mick Gordon. Mick Gordon. The fucking OG. Yeah, him playing at like some game awards.

Yeah, they were. He's like dressing his like office clothes and he's like ripping it. Dude, there's like a whole fucking like I think it's like a two to three hour long like conference that he did at GDC. It's like the game developers conference. He talks about like how he like made the Doom soundtrack and everything like that. There's some fucking knowledge in there. the tuning we use uh what's the tune does he use the double drop d tuning in that is that that is like drop yeah i'm pretty sure a lot of that stuff is like different tunings i don't think it's all

really based around like one yeah we have songs on our new record that are um double drop d and like a lot of those songs i think like yeah doom soundtrack those are definitely the doom soundtrack it's just super low tuned like it sounds so low it's very low and like we tune and like we tune the bass up to the same register as the guitar so it kind of gives it like a it's an interesting sound along with it being tuned so low like everyone's occupying

the same space now yeah so it's like a big wall of sound yeah because like if you just have the guitars in that crazy double drop sense I feel like they have a tendency to get very noisy and like you can't really pick like what the note is it just sounds heavy as fuck so we just put the bass like up

like in the normal double drop de-tuning I think the bass would be out of the base would be out of like the human hearing range. It would be absurd if it's another octave down. Yeah. Yeah, it's hilarious. Base and double drop D is fucking easy. It's pretty impossible.

Yeah. I can barely keep my strings in F. No way. No way that would even work. What's your, what's your Fender seven string in? Is that a seven string? Yeah, drop A. Drop A.

Hell yeah. Drop A. Every record, you know. Respect. Does I have a longer scale length? Yeah, it's 26 and a half. Oh, dude. Is that a custom?

Yeah. God damn, that's fine. I'm dying for Fender to release a longer-scale Stratocaster or any one of their guitars. I'm trying to get them on the whole metal train, trying to. They need to just give you a signature model guitar. That's that thing. I'm trying to. I'm trying to.

I'm trying to. Man. There's a lot of... I'll buy one in two seconds. There's a lot of people in our space that are using Fender guitars or more like vintage inspired guitars. You guys, too, I saw you guys recording some songs on the new record. I'm like, oh, is that a fucking Fender?

Yeah. Mike exclusively uses Fender. One of my backups is like an old Fender Telecaster from like the 80s. And it was like specifically geared towards like hair metal players. And it didn't really work and, you know, for what we do. But it's like almost getting there to where it's like it's got two humbuggers, a telecaster. Boom. And it's like almost, it had like a longer scale length.

Yeah. And maybe like a different profile on that, it would be like perfect. Yeah. For the new record, all the, those double drop D songs were on the Fender. bass six. Yeah. Those are sick for those super low tunings. Yeah,

I literally bought the guitar to, like, right for the album because I knew that I wanted to, like, that thing has a really specific sound to it. Yeah. And I knew that that was what we wanted, or what I wanted at the time.

And then sounded kind of weird when we first got it, but then I swapped the bridge out for, like, one of those bare knuckle, like hot rails, and it sounded insane. Oh, wow, that's a great idea. Yeah.

Because it's just like, it's only slotted for the single coil. And we didn't want to carve the fucking thing up. So we're like, let's try this. And we really liked it. Holy shit, that's a great idea. It's funny how, like, the, like, the Fender Six, like, evolved from, like, the cure. And then, like, you start.

You hear where is that now? What you guys are doing with that shit? That's fucking nuts. I always thought that they were sick because I remember, I forget who it was. There was a, there was, like, a family friend of mine that had one. Like, my parents played in cover bands for, like, my entire life. and I saw somebody that my parents played with

that had one of those bass sixes like forever ago and I was like, what the fuck is that thing? And then I always wanted one and I thought it was so funny when they kind of started coming into favor for metal. I was like, well, it does make sense because it's just literally a guitar

that's the size of a fucking bass. So I was stoked. I was like, all right, I'm getting one. I've always wanted one. I'm fucking getting one. It's the sickest, it's my favorite guitar that I own, honestly. They're just hard to play live.

They are hard to play life. I have a custom, like, it's a basic scale. I think it's a 30-inch scale. And it's a bear to play, dude. We have two songs, and, like, for those two songs, we play back-to-back, like, I'm, like, literally, like, full concentration. I'm, like, lifting my arm up here. It's crazy.

I played with mine for the first time. I saw you at the festival. Yeah. Oh, he has the baseball bat, too. I was looking at that. Yeah. Me and James played louder than life. couple weeks ago with that band drugs and that was the first time that I got to use the

basics live and I loved it though honestly like it was kind of hard but I felt like I had like a fucking yours feels better than my gunned in my hand yeah that feels so fucking cool dude yeah god am I fucking Robert Smith right now playing breakdowns dude so it's fucking nuts how that that fender evolved it's not so yeah when I saw videos you guys using Fenner, I'm like, yeah, this is sick. These guys know what the fuck's up. If you set it up right, you tune it right, it's, it could be

it's heavy as fuck. Oh yeah. You just, you gotta put a little bit of work into them, but they, they're sick. I have like a, I have a standard scale, uh, drag and even like, I use that for like drop E and like it sounds sick. Yeah. Yeah. Just gotta set it up.

Yeah, what, uh, what pickups? Uh, dude, they're just the fucking stock ones that game with it. Like, I got the singles. Like, I got the one that has the two humbuckers in it. Yeah. And it has like all those weird like roll off like coil tap switches and the rollers. Yeah. And it's dope.

But like they sound like they could they could be like a little more metal gauged if I wanted to swap them out. But like they still sound sick. Yeah. Shut at the fender man. Yeah. Fucking sick. Just out of curiosity. What do you guys see like what do you guys see like the hardcore scene going?

in like a few years from now or like the like the heavy music genre going that is a great question because it always changes yeah it does not like look at turnstile like that's one of the dopest bands ever and they're not even doing anything related to like really heavy shit but um i don't know it just constantly changes it's like what is it going to be in a year i don't know but yeah i feel like uh i used to always think about this like hard like I would be like where's where's this gonna be in like two years um and like same with like hip hop and pop like I think all the time or I used to think all the time all the same to it like oh like is this going to be the thing that's going to like carry for like the next like five or 10 years like

blah blah and I feel like I'm right in some ways but also wrong in some ways like every time and I feel like now that I'm older I have no gauge on it like there's so many things that have gotten so big in the past couple years that I would have never guessed would have like been huge in a good way and I'm and I'm just like all right like I'm just going to roll with it and see what happens I feel like as a whole maybe like the community is becoming like a little more accepting of just like everybody doing their own thing that's the one thing I feel like I've noticed over COVID like I feel like bands are getting shit on less for being like we're going to change our sound a little bit or we're going to start like, you know, putting a little more

emphasis on like how we dress and shit like that. Like I feel like everybody's just being a little more open-minded now, which is sick. But as far as it going somewhere specific, I don't know. And I kind of like that I don't know. It's like a surprise. I think it gets bigger from here, honestly. Like we were talking about TikTok earlier. Like there's a massive resurgence in like alternative music. Yeah. And like it's a stupid term like elder emo and shit. There is

there's people that are being exposed to that that went their whole childhood years without knowing what it is and now it's like oh what's that and it's like this new like it's this new like scene or like niche for them. There's a lot of people

that are like oh this is cool like I never belonged to something or like I never could identify with hip-hop or pop like where do I stand I think heavy music in general it's like it's very accepting like Mitch was saying like people are they want more

more friends that like this music or friends that like that music that's very accepting I think that's where that's where it'll go it's just more people getting exposed to just stuff that isn't mainstream because it's so accessible now like everything's accessible well yeah because we were

talking about earlier too like when we were when we played the Philly show, like I was kind of surprised at the amount of new faces of people that were there. So, I mean, if we're talking about the, you know, heavy music scene like moving forward and getting bigger,

I definitely feel like it is growing larger right now, for sure. Yeah, that is one thing I can definitely see with my eyes happening right now. TikTok's a huge part of it for fucking Shore. I mean, I feel like Lawrence Shore, honestly, it played a huge

part in like expanding people, into like that extreme style of music recently. Like that was one of the biggest things I've ever, that is the biggest thing I've seen a band do on TikTok. Yeah. Like, and that's one of the most extreme examples of, like, the heavy music scene as well, which I think is awesome because like people are seeing that and reposting it.

And it's not just like, you know, a breakdown with like somebody singing over it. It's literally like the craziest heavy breakdown you've ever heard. People are like, this is dope. yeah so it's also just wild like all that should happen like i've been like good friends with austin for years yeah and like i was just like dude like people don't understand that that band i saw them before i was even in varials in like a small little like legion hall like on shore yep and then it's like if anybody deserves that shit like me and mike were in like an uber with

austin going out to a bar and i looked at him i was like if anybody deserves this bro is you like straight up so anybody he's the ultimate grinder yeah people like are like dog and wrong on him and I'm just like dude fuck you you don't get it like they've been doing this forever and they finally just got like their huge break and it's fucking badass it's badass awesome is a great guy yeah and it's sick too because our old producer recorded those records and it's like i'm super happy for just the all of them because like he deserves to be recognized as the sick producer as well yeah josh yeah nice mike what's up i need i need the bass player perspective on the growing thing Yeah.

No, I agree with what Shane said and everything being more exposed now. And yeah, I see it growing as well. It's hard to say where exactly everything is going to go. But I do think it's growing. Yeah. James. I also agree that it's growing. I mean, you look at, you know, Knocked Loose is huge right now.

Yes. For the hardcore scene, Lorna Shore again is doing their thing. And I feel like they just played fucking Lollapalooza. Yeah. That's crazy. It's like the most mainstream festival besides Coachella probably. And we got to fucking. and the death core boys rock and the boy.

Right, because it's, you know, you get Metallica, which is, you know, classic metal to a lot of people and they don't really kind of get to see what we're all used to, which is the more, I don't want to say, underground scene, but it's not as mainstream. And these bands doing that now is really opening everyone's eyes to that kind of stuff that we're more used to, and, you know, they're just getting a lot bigger off of that,

and I think it's really cool to see. And I'm happy for everybody. It's a win-win for everyone. Yeah. I think we're seeing like the what I'll call the residuals of it right now too because like we're fucking we've never headlined before

and this tour definitely is exceeding our expectation for sure but not like just for us it's like for every van like people every day from our camp and from the other band's camps are being like this is the craziest how we've ever played here is the most merch we've ever sold here

like blah blah like I feel like every I feel like across the board all the bands that are like doing it good and doing it right right now are all like reaping the benefits of it I feel like people are also like recognizing

to the bands that are sick and have been grinding for like the past couple years and yeah overall it feels like everything is just doing way better now than it was right before COVID so true yeah yeah the other thing about like what we all do is like

when the kids come to these shows they realize like we're just standing in the same room as them you know like you go to a concert it's like you're never going to meet that guy yeah you go to like oh show like this you're gonna run into the dude and the band that you like and then that's obviously dope so i feel like once like kids come they see that they're like oh i'm gonna keep going to these things because like it's awesome it's dope yeah i never actually thought about that before because like we're just like chilling we're just chilling yeah i'm outside smoking to sing and some kids like, yo, I'm like, what's up, man?

And then if anybody ever says, like, anything like, oh, like, you're one of my favorite drummers, I, like, don't even know what the fucking say, because I'm like, that's insane. Thank you so much. Yeah. You're like, whoa, I'm missing trap beats. Yeah.

Trapeeds and breakdowns. Trapeeds and breakdowns. Dude, it's so good. You guys are going to Europe next, right? Yeah, we're touring there, November and December with Chelsea Grin, Carnifax, Body Snatcher, and the convalesons. I believe so, yes.

I'm sorry if I said your band name wrong. No, I think that's right. Is that right? No, that's right. Okay. Cool. And this will be Shane's first time. Everybody's first time.

I'm the only one that's already toward Europe, but I went in it once, so I'm like, I'm fucking ready. Dude, that's, that's, I saw a few shows that are actually already sold out. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, because they, we, it's hilarious. This is a tour that we've literally had since, like, 2019. because this was supposed to be like, I think November, December of 2020.

And then when that time frame started pulling up, they were like, all right, we're going to push it a year. And then when that time came up there, like, all right, we're going to push it by three months. And then when that time came from up there, like, all right, we're going to push it to the end of this year. So like, fucking... Yeah, and it better happen this time.

We just got our tickets. Yeah, we bought the tickets. We're fucking going. Non-refundable. Yeah. I was fucking stoked because they sent us an email a couple of weeks. ago and they were like hey we're going to rebrand this tour

and we're going to turn it into album plays for Chelsea Grin and for Carnifex and it was cool because like I felt like we had this tour for like so long it was like the same ad mat same everything we had been like advertising this for so long and they were like let's switch it up a little bit switched it up and it felt like it like immediately

started like performing like sick and like the tour is like starting to sell out it looks awesome I'm stoked to see both the bands like play those albums like I'm fucking excited it's gonna be amazing It's gonna be an amazing tour. You guys seem to not be suffering from what other bands are suffering from. Like us, we're going there later in next week,

and there's a big problem with, like, tours out there doing really bad pre-sell. Like, really, really bad. We're on that list. We tried to cancel, like, last week. Oh, no. But we're just like, fuck it, we're going to go. And then, like, start asking questions to bands are out there right now. They're like, yeah, it's a horrible pre-sell, but to walk up.

people rock up. It's like sold out when you walk up stay up with a horrible pre-sail. I'm okay. So seeing, so hearing that, so if you see any pre-sale numbers, I guess what's happening right now as we speak is like there's just massive walk-ups. I mean, it's kind of the same with like us on tour right now too because like, even on this tour. Yeah.

Like we're kind of, we're kind of experiencing the same thing. Like we've had some shows that have had like really good pre-sale. But then there's been others where it's just like very okay. And we're like, you know, starting the day, like wondering how it's going to go. Yeah. Like even the Vegas show the other day had like 81 pre-sale the day before and then it did over 300 day of. Yeah. Yeah, like people, I don't, I feel like people are hesitant to buy tickets right now because they're worried that shit's going to get canceled and they're going to have to go through the roundabout to getting their money back.

That sucks. So they're just waiting until day of show to just rock up and fucking pay at the door. And I can attest to it because fucking I had, I've gotten like fucked on like multiple tickets that I had purchased for shit that got canceled. So, yeah, I get it. I totally get it. So, yeah, seem that's what's going on. So I think by the time you guys go out there, it's going to be perfect timing. Yeah, I think it's going to be fucking awesome.

We've been waiting literally. Like, we've been trying to tour Europe literally since 2016, I believe, was the first time that we had a confirmed tour that we were supposed to go. So, yeah, it's been a really long time in the making. It's a long time in the making. Knock on wood. We got to close out with what you said. earlier.

What? Oh, fuck, fuck. What I say? When you're satisfied your beat? Yeah, when you're satisfied your fucking beat,

kid. Oh my God. Fuck them all. All right, where can people find you guys? Instagram, fucking Spotify,

Varyals. Yeah. Socials are Varyles P.A. Yeah. And, you know, just Varyals for everything. Yes. Varyl's PA,

social media, Apple music, Spotify, new album, Scars for you to remember. Rocking the boy, chain reaction at night. Yep. Listen to songs other than circle.

Listen to the whole record. Or just circle. Hey, if you only heard circles and you hate us, when you're satisfied, you're beat. All right, everyone, thank you. That's it. Later.