Garza Podcast - 71 - AUGUST BURNS RED: Grammy Nominations, Flip Flops & Dedicated Fans

Episode Date: March 27, 2023

Garza sits down with JB & Brent from Lancaster, PA metalcore band August Burns Red. Over 20 years being in the game together we talk about how you stay consistent, managing your own band to getting nominated for a Grammy. Their new album Death Below is out now! augustburnsred.com SPONSORS: Click this link to purchase from Sweetwater & help support the podcast: imp.i114863.net/rnrmVB ABR is: Jake Luhrs - Vocals JB Brubaker - Guitar Brent Rambler - Guitar Matt Greiner - Drums Dustin Davidson - Bass TIME CODES: 00:00 - Aches, pains & staying in shape 08:39 - 20 years in the game, re-learning and playing old songs 12:52 - Meeting in High School in Lancaster, PA 16:15 - Recording Thrillseeker with Adam D from Killswitch Engage 29:18 - Managing the band & working together. 32:52 - Jake’s long audition process vs. Dustin’s instant entrance 37:36 - Dustin Shreds, too 38:46 - Being a massive, successful band with complex music 42:57 - August Burns Red & Suicide Silence tour w/ Unearth & Darkest Hour 48:07 - JB’s Flip Flops (Sandals) 49:20 - JB’s Signature Ibanez & Kiesel Guitars 51:19 - Livestream Events (Christmas Burns Red & Suicide Silence Virtual World Tour) 53:48 - Merch Company Woes 57:38 - Double Grammy Nomination 01:00:53 - Dedicated Fans 01:03:00 - Live Show Production & Pyro, touring with The Devil Wears Prada, Bleed From Within, Brand of Sacrifice

It's not the most accessible music, I guess. No, it's not. But the way, I don't know, I can't even put words or put it into a sentence, but the way, like, your songs are structured and it's like, I don't know, like, what, how do you guys do that? I think there really is a structure. It's not Prague, but it's not really structured in any way either. We just write songs.

Whenever I need music gear, I always go to sweetwater.com. If it's mics, headphones, or studio and recording gear, Sweetwater has you covered. Next time you need any music gear, support the podcast by using the link in a description and comment section below. Dude, you've been trying to update your Zoom for like last six months. Dude, every time I log into Zoom, I just never use it. Every time I log into Zoom, it's like, update your Zoom. Well, I bought that new computer.

And now with like the silicon chip or whatever, you like have to update your Zoom. But like, it didn't work at all. There's so many updates on your computer, you know? Just all the time. All the time. It's like, what are you updating? Right. Updating my fucking bank.

You have foe, you fuck. Right. Well, today we have August Burns Red, my close friends, J.B. and Brent. It's great. It's great to see you guys, man. Great to see you too. It's stuck to be here. We have a little bit of history.

Right. You know, and it's really great to see you guys on the road celebrating your band being around for 20 years. I know, it rules. How do your bones feel? The body. It's good. They're good now that we're a couple weeks in. The neck's not hurting anymore.

Right, right. The bangovers aren't what they were after show number one and two. My lower back was sore, like, the first, like, three or four shows. And I'm like, oh, this is new. I haven't had this before. But, yeah, it's all right. It's fine now. But, yeah, you know, as you get older, you get new aches and pains.

And it's just life. That's life, man. You get that just a little, like, surprise, like, pains and eggs. Right. Like, oh, that's a new one. Right. I hate that. I hate that, but it's true.

And you're like, and if it lasts longer than a month, I'll talk to my doctor. You know? Yeah. Like, sure. Yeah, this old age, but, I mean, Brent, you used to be, I mean, I don't want to call you out. You used to be kind of chunky. Yeah. And now it's great to see you, you know, in shape.

Thanks. Yeah. Looking clear. Pandemic help, you know, which I think a lot of people drank a lot more over the pandemic. I just kind of did the opposite, you know. Did you? Yeah, I have two kids at home. So it's just like, chill, hang out with my kids.

And yeah. So you got lucky. It's amazing what, you know, skipping the two or three beers in the evening after you play will do it will do for your health. Who is that, dude? Right, right. Well, dude, you were chunky, man. Right. You do, like, that's a thing.

Like, you know, that was probably van time. So we're, that's like. Yeah, this is like 2006. That's eat at the, you know. I used to be hot back fan. Look at that. No, you are, you are still a fucking handsome man, J.B. Thanks, buddy.

Yeah. Okay, so, so this picture is 2006 in Corona at the showcase theater. You guys are just ripping, dude You guys are ripping right there What's your face doing? Dude, these are pictures That a buddy of ours We hadn't seen in a few years

He came out to see us in Raleigh And he's like, look at these old photos I took of you guys back in 2006 And I pulled the ones where we looked the ugliest And made this post Because I thought it was funny Dude, I don't even understand how you guys Are that close to each other

That was a small stage at the showcase theater I know that but it literally looks like one of those pictures that you take and they like meld together into like a composite thing yeah you guys are so close together because that stage is awkward it's like a it's like a corner right right so you're kind of just like and then I mean that that was my home venue and then when you go outside the estate you're like oh shit that's that's a small last stage right so

pandemic happens and you get shredded yeah well I got to wrap my bike more I write I ride bike a lot I got to do that more and like I said you know with the kind of beers I Like drinking like two or three a night, that's probably like 900 calories that you're just putting in before bed. So you like the heavy stuff. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I have PAs double.

Same. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's my shit. Well, that'll make you fat. So they do. If you have two, you're like, oh, shit. Yeah. And J.B.

Drink more, right? What's that? Did you drink more or less? During the pandemic? Oh, I'd say about the same. Same? Yeah. Like, I didn't change.

I ate a lot more dessert. I got really. I went hard into sugar. It's a problem. I'm a sugar addict. That's like my biggest vice, I'd say. What's your choice? Pie and ice cream.

Pie, that's a terrible combination. No, it's delicious. It's like great, but just like, yeah. For your overall healthy means? Oh, yeah. Like, there's a little, like, market near where I live. Then they make the best pies. And I was just like, all right, pie all the time.

Yeah. During the pandemic. Apple pie, pumpkin pie. Yeah, apple, cherry, pumpkin. There's this pie from our area called shoefly pie that's like a molasses pie that I love. It's like a Pennsylvania Dutch kind of thing. So good with ice cream. Yeah.

Yeah, that one is good. There would be nights where I'd be like, shit, I'm out of pie. And I need some sugar. And I would like, I would like toast an ego waffle and put ice cream on top of it and like put syrup on it. Like, that's how grim it was. times. Man. Yeah.

And you're, well, and you're still ripped. Well, I don't know if I'm ripped, but I... He's got good metabolism. Yeah, I think I have good metabolism. It's catching up. It'll catch up to me, though. It'll catch up. Well, it hasn't.

I mean, I'm, we're older now. I mean, I'm 37. I'm 38. 38, yeah. Brent, same? 38, yep. Holy shit. Yeah, it's wild.

Right. Well, it doesn't it catch up with you when you're, like, late 20s? I don't know. I don't know. I try to exercise, dude. I try to, like, do a little bit of exercise every day. And if I feel like I'm, like, starting to, like, slip a little bit, I'll, you know, I'll curb my dessert taking, you know, I'll slow it up a little bit.

That's a hard thing, Andy. Hey, Jay, type in, when does your metabolism slow down at what age? Oh, I think we're way past that for sure. I think you're right. I want to say late 20s. Because if it's late 20s, I mean, we're, dude, we're fucking 10 years. We're deep. We're deep.

Oh, it drops off significantly. Wait, oh, it doesn't drop off until you reach age of 60. 60? Hell, yes. I got 22 years of pie and ice cream, baby. Let's go. I'm not sure that's how. I'm not sure that's how you're supposed to read that.

Right. That's all good, dude. It's all good. Yeah, I know it's a big change in late 20s. You're like, oh, if you eat a fucking couple slides of pizza and it's like, oh, that's just. I ate a piece of pizza literally as I walked into the venue. this morning. We had a box of pizza hot pizza, like trash garbage pizza, which I love. And I'm like, I'm hungry. And I knew we were coming out here to do the pod. And I didn't know

if I was going to have time to eat. I'm like, just walking through the underbelly of the House of Blues here in Anaheim and just chomping down a piece of cold pizza. That's how I started my day. And then I had a cookie as soon as I got into the venue, chocolate chip cookie. Yeah, I need to take better care of myself. It's tough. That's going out, right? Yeah, I guess so. I guess. I don't think the dad life is what's making me eat shitty, though. It's just, it's just, it's desire. I'd say it's desire and the desire for muscles. It's been the lack of repercussions because I haven't really put on a lot of weight.

You know, I'm trying to find that, trying to find my limit. You've always been in shape. I don't know. Your dad's skinny. Yeah, my dad's thin. Yeah. You got, you got those jeans. I do have good jeans.

I'm sure I had good jeans in that regard. Your whole family is pretty in shape. It's not. it's not fair but I'll take it my wife's the same way she eat whatever the heck she wants and she doesn't keep weight oh my goodness she's lucky yeah doesn't that piss you off

uh no it's actually great for brent I must say it's really good for me my wife's still you know very attractive at the age of almost 40 so I'll take it it's a it's a special thing man when with our ladies and late 30s we're very lucky to live like the lives that we do and we have our our ladies eating ice cream pizza and still shredded.

They're like, what a life. Right, right. What a life. Who, and who knew that after 20 years that you guys would still be around, man? That's a, that's a crazy accomplishment, man. Thanks. Well, same to you in suicide science, man. You guys.

Crazy. You have us by a year, 21. I didn't know you guys started in 2002. Yeah. Yeah. You were really young when you started. I forgot what age. Fuck, 21 years.

That's 20 years. You were 16, maybe? Yeah. I was talking to Matt last night. And we were like going back and I was 18 when the band started. He was 17. I'm like, dang, dude, we were teenagers. That sounds crazy now.

When Jordan was our baseball at the time, he was 16. Yeah. Oh, my goodness. He had been 16. And it was also crazy about your band is that this is both your first and only man. Right. Never been anything else. Yeah.

Do you know what crazy that is? I talked about that in a podcast. You've never met another band. I'm like, no. I'm like, I literally learned how to play guitar when I was like 16 or 17 and then we started the band and that was that. They're like, that is so lucky. I'm like, yeah, pretty much everything in the music industry comes down to luck.

I'm like there's, there's just like, you know, so many talented people out there that are in bands and bands that are good and they don't, you know, find success. It's just a lot of luck finding the right people. Yeah, you know, you got to catch lightning in the bottom in, especially nowadays with like you scroll Instagram and you're like. like, never heard of that guy. He's way better at guitar than me. This guy's way better.

This guy's way better. Like, everyone, you know, like, I can't play any of that. Right. And this guy's, like, some kid in his bedroom playing insane shit. And I'm like, I still can't play the solo from that song that I wrote in 2009. Yeah. But you guys are fucking technical, though. I mean, your brits are like, they're pretty.

Yeah, they're annoying, dude. They're, they're, they're funny. We were learning stuff on this tour. We're trying to play stuff from every single album. Yeah. Oh, that's a great idea. Because, you know, we're trying to celebrate the whole shebang. Of course.

But, so we're learning stuff off of our first record Thrill Seeker. We're playing the first song. It's called Your Little Suburbias and Ruins. And there's parts of that song that I just don't play well. Like, I'm like, I still can't play this well. Like, this is awkward. I don't, I probably played it better, like, honestly, 15 years ago than I do now. Like, it doesn't, it's not in my wheelhouse anymore.

It's not the kind of, I don't write in that stuff. anymore. Like our styles evolve as players, I think. And I just don't feel, I would never write that kind of thing now. And it's hard for me to go back and relearn it. I can get my, I can get through it, you know, but it's not, it's not as clean as it could be. Like we've done those anniversary tours and trying to re-learn some of this stuff. You're just like, wow. It's tough. Earth. It's tough. Like there, yeah. And at the time we're like, ah, this is cool. We'll never have to play that live. Don't worry about it. Right. this down the studio and then you're like 10 years later yeah yeah shoot oh wow right i couldn't

tell i couldn't tell it the fucking future right right oh and then like there is just such like like like with like live music you're like okay i can get this i can get this good enough for live and you're always you know your own worst critic where like you're the worst yeah you're just like hearing it well not you because you don't play with it i was just going to say wait too know in ears man it's even worse you're like you're like oh that's not very good but then you like watch it you do you YouTube video of it late and you're like, oh, that's actually all right. Sounds good. Yeah.

There's a, there's a healthy part there. Like that self-hatred criticism. It just keeps you. It pushes you. It does. Yeah. You know, it's that classic, you know, blessing is a curse. It just keeps you.

I think there's, I think if you don't have that, there's something wrong. You'll get complacent. Right. And then things, yeah, what happens then? You'll, you'll just fall off. Yeah. I think. Totally.

That's one of the biggest. is like regrets we have in our career is you got you get complacent you get comfortable and then you got to re you got to like recover right like claw your way back yeah oh yeah quite quite you're like oh shit but after 20 years dude that's inevitable there's going to be peaks of valleys you know ups and downs yeah for sure yeah do i can only imagine like the peaks and ballets that that your band has had because it seems like i mean so you guys start the band did you guys go to high school together we did brett and i did yeah um we were one year apart but we were buds in school and our drummer Matt was from the same area yeah and just met the

mutual friends with Matt yeah he was homeschooled so he wasn't at our school but we like ran once we started getting into like the music scene and stuff we ran in the same like same circle and our original vocalists went to school we graduated friend yeah and our bass player was homeschooled in the same homeschooled as as Matt so yeah we all grew up in the same town same small town when we start out yeah in on Lancaster yeah yeah so is that is that like a smart town that's like what hour 30 outside of philly yeah about an hour and a half and then yeah it's actually like the city's pretty small but the you know what would be like the metro areas it's still like a half million people it's got a sprawl like the funniest place you know a lot of suburbs around it yeah

yeah the town that we grew up in is only 5 000 people but there's like there's like 20 of those towns like all within a couple minutes of each other so it's like tons of just small town small town small town, so the town. They all kind of circle around Lancaster. But yeah. Well, I'm kind of curious how your band started because, I mean, J.B., I heard that you didn't even like screaming at some point. And then now, Brent got me into screaming, dude. It was we were doing, we were working on like a music, not a music, like a V project. Yeah. And I went to use this song from Poison the Well, I was in December. And he's just like, I hate this. I did. I hate this. Really? And then they started They started listening to.

They started listening to it. All right. You know, we all had like our bridge music. Like, I started listening to like Thursday. And that had a little bit of screaming in it. And then just eventually evolved more and more. And then it really just landed on that opposite of December record as like the record that got me into heavier music. But yeah, I mean, that was it.

That was awesome. And then he got into it from there. Yeah. I got into, tear from the red from Poison in the Well was like a pretty big album for me. And I went back and got into opposite of December. but Finch was my gateway band. I loved Finch. I was into punk.

So was Brent. Like we both came up in punk. And then I got really into Finch and they screamed and I love their screaming parts. It like resonated with me. And then I think from all to ashes, that album, Too Bad You're Beautiful was like really instrumental. And like breaking. That broke some barriers for me because that album was pretty abrasive. Right.

And Poison the Well, Evergreen Terrace. Burned Alive by Time was one of my early. big, like, hardcore kind of albums that broke the mold. And then I, I remember Matt was really into between the Barry to Me and like converging stuff. And so were you. And I hated that for a while too. And then I would now say that between the Barry Me is my all time favorite metal band. Like I just was like, this is too much.

I can't like, all I wanted was I wanted breakdowns, dude. I just wanted breakdowns. He was, I remember there was like a quote. I remember in the basement, you're like, oh, I just never want to sound like this band. And it was between the Barry to Me. Yeah. And then, and then years later, I'm like, I love between the Barry Me, they have no rules. I think that's so cool.

They do whatever they're buying teachers now. Yeah. I'm like, here's my tattoo. Right, right. We tour with them like a bunch of times. Yeah, they're like buds now. Oh my goodness. That's funny how that goes.

Right. It's weird how your taste evolved. Yeah. How long did that tip? Because, I mean, it seems like that timeline is pretty frequently like it's short because you, you, you, you, you're playing guitar at 17, 18, you start the band. You don't like screaming, and then you put it to EP, and then your first record.

It's like a span of like two years, it seems. We did move quick. It was really fast. Very quick. Yeah, we started. So I was 18 when the band actually started. And by the time I was 20, we were recording our first record for solid state. You were only 20 when we did that?

Wow. So you were underage drinking that one night? Yes. Yes, I was. And that's why that record's sick. Yeah. But yeah, Adam D made that record. It wouldn't have been without.

I did not know that you guys went with Adam D on that first record. Yeah. It's sick. And we recorded in this absolutely gorgeous studio called Dark Horse Studios, like outside of Nashville. It was insane. Yeah, it was a really, we had no business being there. No, it was beautiful. It was like a dream for, we were young and naive and didn't know anything.

And that was a cool experience for us. It was nuts. It was like this beautiful, like, lodge that had, like, a separate house for, like, Adam and his, like, produced, his engineer, his engineer wane to stay in. And like, the property was just absolutely amazing. And we got to stay in this, like, gorgeous. It was like a horse farm, wasn't it? Right.

And it was like this all wooden, like, building. It was amazing. But, yeah, it was a really cool experience. And it was funny because then we go and make messengers our next record. We're sleeping on the floor in this small studio on air mattresses. Like in the back of a guy's house from that band, Five Iron Frenzy. Yeah. That Christian ska band, you probably have never heard of.

This guy named Ethan owned it. Yeah, he played... Was it 500 Frederick, or was he in the other one? What was the other one? Supertones. Supertones. I think it was 5 Iron Frenzy, but I could be wrong. It might have been supertons.

It was one of the guitar players from that band built. He owned the house, and then one of the other guys from the band, I think, opened a studio in like a garage, basically. And that's where we did messengers. Yep. Yeah, we slept on the air mattresses on the floor in this garage studio and made messengers. What?

I don't know if any of those guys are him. That's why I don't know if it's the supertones or not. Search for Ethan Luck. Yeah, Ethan Luck. That's a good name. Ethan Luck. Yeah, I just saw. Yeah, there he is.

This one to your left that says, Anadote Radio. Ethan Luck releases Hard Seas. He does all kinds of stuff on that. That's like 500 frenzy. Right. I don't know. I think he's done a lot of stuff.

He's a cool dude. Yeah. Shout out to Ethan if you're listening. Yeah, right. Shout out. So what made you guys go up from like the fancy, overly fancy booji studio to like, hey, we're going to go in a garage sleep. Oh, dude, that was just the label where they put us.

We didn't. Really? We didn't think anything of it at the time. We were just like, cool, you guys have a budget for us? That's amazing. This is so much money. We were just pumped. We were just kids.

We didn't know what we were doing. A lot of the money went. So we had two mad sense. and come do it. And he came all the way from Denmark and stayed at a hotel, like, close to the studio. So, like, that was a lot of the budget, you know, having that happened. And we have been touring and grinding on the road at that point, and we didn't, we weren't opposed to sleeping on the floor.

Like, we were crashing at people's houses. And so sleeping on the floor for five weeks while we made an album, it was fun. We had a great time. I did have a good time. That was a fun record. I mean, there was nothing wrong with the space. it was fine, but just, it was just funny, like, comparatively. Of course, yeah.

It was just like... Okay, but yeah. It was still cool. It was still a good time. And a great timing, too. I mean, two at that time was, uh, only two Manson, yeah, I actually pulled the picture. He was, he was on fire that year. Literally he...

Oh, yeah, he did stuff with... Didn't you guys do a record with him? Literally our records, like, our parallels are pretty insane. He did your record, then he mixed the cleansing. Yeah. Yeah. And they both came out the same year. Yeah.

Yeah, he was killing it. He did a whole bunch of records, like, at that time. I forgot about that. Crazy timing. Yeah, so where's he from again? He's from Denmark. Denmark, correct? Danish music producer, there you go.

Towards the end of the studio, you could really tell that he missed home. Yeah, it got long for him. He missed his wife and kid. Yeah, probably regretted agreeing to, like, come do this record in America for a month. It was a long time. And what state, did you guys track the record? That was Tennessee. Yeah, that was in the Nashville area.

as well. We did our first two records in the Nashville area. And then the next two in the Florida area. And now we've done every single one since locally in Lancaster. Or like at home. We don't want to travel to make our albums anymore. No. Because we travel too much for touring and it's just nice to be home when you're home. It's nice to go home and like just chill versus like going back to a hotel or staying in the studio and being trapped in that studio environment where you're just constantly thinking about the record. I know some bands really like that aspect of it, but we don't write in the studio really.

So there's no purpose in doing that for us. Like we just go there to get the parts down and then we're done. We write vocals in the studio now. That's pretty much it. Yeah. Well, since you went from the first record, I mean, your career again is just fucking, it's very quick. I mean, your first record comes out and then two members go on one tour

and then they're pretty much gone. Right. So they realize, oh, this is the life, it's not. Which when you go on your first run, I mean, people break very quickly. It really weeds you out pretty fast because you're just like, oh, I'm sleeping on floors. This isn't glamorous at all. Like, I literally going to go spend a night.

This kid I never met sleep on his floor and he's going to have five cats that are shedding all over me. And his girlfriend wants to just party all night long. Like, it's just like, you know, it's not very glamorous when you're first starting. And it's really tough. When you have no money and you're like eating crackers and ketchup from the from the local fast food chain that you're stopping that across from the gas station where you're fueling up the van like you do whatever you got to do to make it you just you're grinding and it was awesome and so fun and we loved it it was awesome I have very fond memories of those days sleeping in the van and on overnight drives and stuff like it sucked at the time but it was

really bonding and special and right like I'm really grateful that we have those memories and those opportunities but I couldn't do it again like I couldn't go back to that in course yeah somebody asked me the other day and they're like what would you want to go back and do. And I'm like, the only thing I, like, you remember when you're in a van and touring and stuff like that, that you get to stop a lot and see things. And you'd be like, ooh, what's that in the side of the road? Let's check it out. Like, when you're in a bus, you're just not doing that. You're sleeping the whole way through. You wake up where you're supposed to wake up. Yeah. And and that's that. Like, you know, walk to the same coffee shops. You go to the same restaurants.

Right. It gets almost very routine. Like, oh, we're playing here. I know what I'm going to do that day. Right. Yeah. This is what we do when we're in Boise or whatever. And I was just like, I don't, I'm like, that was a fun time, but would I want to go back and do it again? Like, no. I wouldn't, like, I wouldn't want to be a 30-year-old and doing overnight drives in a van trying to make the next show. Like, I just, I just wouldn't want to do that. Carrying our own guitar cabs in and hauling them off after we played a stuffy, 200-cap bar that was soaking wet, coming off stage, and then loading your gear, piling back in the van, driving overnight, like that kind of stuff.

Like, there's just a level of quality of life and comfort that we are at now that would be really difficult. to go back and repeat. We are accustomed to our cushy lifestyle we've created. Which isn't even that cushy if you think about it. You guys earned it. Right. I mean, you guys fucking grinded. I mean, I've seen guys grind.

Yeah. It's not like it's just, oh, this career just appeared out of nowhere. You know? Right. Yeah, it was a grind. We did the Vanden trailer thing for a while. I know, I mean, we just, we weighed really long to go to a bus. Dude.

Oh, I'm trying not to bring personal shit into this. But I remember, like, you were like my personal exam. I wish we did what they did. Like you guys just grind out for as long as you could. Yeah. It was smart. Because we knew once you go bus, you don't go back. Yeah.

And it's expensive. It was a big, it was amazing, especially you know the bus. We loved it. It was so novel and fun. We just got pushed to the brink where it was like to put on the show that we needed to put on to grow our band. We needed crew guys. And to have more crew guys, we had to go to a bus. Interesting.

So you guys waited until it was. time to like grow. Yeah, we're just like, look, we're just going to keep putting on the same exact show over and over and over again unless we can, unless we can grow and add people to help us. And so just kind of got to that point where we're like, all right, we need crew and we were about to go out on that tour. We were going to do a co-headline tour with the premium horizon for the AP tour. And we're just like, we have to bring a bus. We're like, because we know that they're going to go out there and spend the money to put on a good show. And we need to be able to also do that. So we don't look like we're getting

and crushed every night. So, like, we had that point, we're like, oh, we're going to take a bus, get some texts and things like that, and go from there. And then, you know, at the end of the day, we looked at, like, the budget and we walked home, we're like, yeah, that wasn't so bad. I guess we can keep going here.

And, yeah, that's it. Yeah, that's the tour. Wow, what year was this? 2010, and that artwork was not something we were allowed to say, yeah, or neon, they just made us use it. And I still hate it to this day. It's like a 60-year-old punk guy I know and they wrapped our bus in it

What? Like one of those two The off bus was wrapped in that craft Yeah Yeah two metal core bands With this 60 year old punk guy on it How does that make sense? But plus the AP tour for

Well yeah that was cool It was a really fun tour And we can say we co-headlined With Brue me the Horizon It was just hilarious now With what they've done with their career Props to those guys Would you guys consider yourself

competitive? Because that sounds like a very competitive thing to do. To do what? To like try and like match them. Yeah. I think that it's not it's sure. I guess it's competitive, but it's also just trying to keep pace. You know, like you don't want to go out there, especially when you're on like a co-bilt tour like that and get, you know, shmealed by the other band. Like you don't want to like. You don't want to get schmield. Yeah, you don't want to get smeeled. Is that PA Dutch probably? I don't know. I've never heard that word in my life. My dad says it. Okay. Anyway.

What does Smilin mean? Crushed. Yeah, I don't know that. Crushed. You don't want to go out there and just, like, put on a worse show than the band that you're supposed to be on the same level as. You know, and that's just kind of what our thought process was. And our manager at the time that we had, he's like, yeah, you guys should probably get a bus and do it right. And make sure that you are staying on the same level.

And so we went from there. And then at the end of the day, you know, we just kind of looked at it. We were paying for, like, two hotel rooms a night. and so it wasn't like it does it adds up so it wasn't like that huge of a jump but it was enough but it you know like I said

at the end of the day we looked at the budge and everything came out okay for us so we just like all right we're gonna keep going this way because this was definitely way better than doing the van and trailer there's that cover of course I'll just sit cover oh man how old you guys are there

that was 2010 yeah that was the cover we did because doing the AP tour that was like one of the big perks so you got a cover of what, 26. It's like, if we get a cover,

we'll fucking do do the tour. That's exactly, that was the kind of thing because it, that was a big deal back in the day when media was still big.

And then 2011 was a really big year for us. So like, it definitely helped us in the end, like doing that tour and doing this cover. And like that was when print, like we were saying,

that's when print was still really good. And AP was like the biggest one you could get. And so. In our world, yeah, it was a big deal. So, yeah, like I said, 2011 that ended up being a really good year for us like we went and did warp tour and that year

warped tour 2011 was huge that wasn't because that was really only had one main stage and it was right as a day to remember was just going like like blowing up and so it was literally just like because there's only one main stage and not that many bands on that warp tour it was just mashing every single day like you just played to the biggest possible crowd every single day it was awesome timing dude yeah wow you can't you can't plan that stuff there's a lot of like brent said earlier there's a lot of luck in how things go. Right. With just the music industry and career paths and stuff.

Things have to fall in line. Yeah. There's a lot that could go wrong and a lot that could go right, I guess. Yeah. A lot that's kind of out of your control. You just try to do, you try to make the best decisions you can with the information you got and hope for the best. That's like navigating the music industry kind of on the touring level, I think.

For sure. Yeah. I mean, you guys have a lot experience with that. I mean, I mean, Brand J.B. I mean, you guys manage to ban the first three records. We do now, too. And now, and now too. Yeah.

We've been always very active on that side of the business. Like, very, I really enjoy that aspect of doing a band, like the business side of things. And I'm grateful for the years we had proper management because they were really helpful in getting different things set up for us. But then in 2016, I think, is when Brett and I. started taking over or I guess we took over managing the band then and haven't turned back since and it's been going well

we probably just felt like no one cares about your band more than the guys in your band so like yeah you know it's it's easy when you have a manager for some things to like fall through the cracks and there'd be miscommunication and there's not in this scenario people's come to us directly and then we immediately have that information

and we can make good choices based on that like that's the goal yeah you guys uh sounds like you guys all make like a decision as a band you know we try to do anything big is a vote for sure it's a vote really yeah and if you lose it's kind of like oh sorry but we try to make sure everyone's opinion is heard and there are scenarios where it's just like all right everyone kind of needs to like this but for the most part it's like a democratic thing totally we've all just kind of gotten used to sometimes your opinion isn't the one that gets used or sometimes your idea isn't the one to

get you know yeah so it's uh it's funny like the older you get the more like emotion you take out of it. Right. You know, it's just pure brain going in. Yeah, you learn that the thing that started out as your art is also your art, but also is your livelihood. So you need to make good choices and kind of remove emotions sometimes. Have you found that when it comes to making decisions that it's funny?

Like, when you make a decision based on what your mind wants, the music, it actually does help the music and the art and the riffs get better. Right. That happened with us, you know, taking the motion out. But when you're writing songs, it's like you, you, now you could do this. Right. You know. Yeah.

Well, I think it's certainly helpful to that, like, if everyone's firing on the same page, if you can get the whole band on the same page, be it with your writing or how you're operating the band, things just run so much better when you guys can, when it's a united front versus those situations where it's like three of us one at one way and two of us one at the other. And then it's like, oh, because, you know, the majority is the majority. But then you got almost half the band's not happy with the decision of what's happening, especially when making decisions in the studio. Like that, that, because, I mean, we all get married to our own ideas.

Of course. And if it's been recorded, you know, you get stoked. And then you get outvoted and you're like, oh, my God. Like, this is crushing. I'm crushed now as an artist. Like, this really hurts. Yeah. And then you get over it and you listen to the album a year later,

and you're like, oh, that's fine. Yeah. I remember that other way, but this is fine now. I'm used to it. Yeah. And sometimes it's, oh, wait, is this better? Yeah. Right.

Yeah. That certainly is the case. And at the time, it seems like the fucking end in the world. Like the sky's falling. Yeah. It's ruined the song. Yeah. I'm going to quit.

I hate this song now. Right. I hate it. We're never going to play it live. Yeah. And then it's your, it's fucking huge. Like your staple. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, wait. This is white washer now. Right. Right. How did you guys meet Jake?

Because he came in after the first record came out. He just, I, we were on like our search for a singer. And he, a friend told him that we were looking for a singer. And he hit me up in my space. Oh, my goodness. And I sent him like, yeah. Let's go. And I sent him.

you know and well he sent me then like a demo he had done I'm like oh it's pretty good with his band and like it's pretty good and I was like hey do you want to come up and you know just try out you would just like kind of just mess around with us in our practice space and he was from south carolina and he's like yeah I can drive up I can be there for me he came up pretty quickly and but in the meantime we had already had a friend who was going to do our next like short tour with us but we were still auditioning guys in case like that didn't work out oh side note that tour was with Sinai Beach, who's from this area, right? Do you remember that band?

Of course. And oblige. An oblige. Oh, wow. Remember those guys? Of course. So, you can continue to talk to now. Yeah, yeah.

I thought you might know those guys. Oh, yeah, close friends. That's cool. So, yeah, he came up. He tried out. Well, at first he came up and he's like, can I just eat something for us? We're like, no, let's just get this done. And so he came in the parts of space.

We played like 3750 by Acacia Strain. Oh, my gosh. We played the song Car Bomb. Car Bomb. Just like the intro to the album 3750. It's just a breakdown. We were just like, just like kind of scream over this. Let's hear your voice.

Dund, done, done, done. Exactly. Yeah, and he just screamed. And his voice sounded great. And we're like, all right, like, this is probably going to be the guy. But we unfortunately already committed to doing this tour with this other guy. So we were just like, all right, like, you just be ready. Like, we have another tour in like February, March, whenever it was that you can be on.

And then, but yeah, he just, We just went with him from there. He lived at my parents' house for the first six months. And then, yeah, it was with me at my parents' house. Yeah. And so, yeah, we just kind of went from there. And then he was in the band. And then our bass player, Jordan, he quit shortly after.

He wanted to be home and get married and, you know, have a normal job and all that stuff. So, of course. He did that. And then we found Dustin really quickly. But it was the same exact scenario where we had already told another base player that they could do our, that they could do. art that they could do a tour with us who had tried out before Dustin and so we did that tour Dustin came up and tried out right you can do the next one and then you know he just fit in like like a glove and right you're in and I remember Jake was bummed because Jake's like tryout

process was like four or five months long and we're just like eh and then like we had like a moment we're in the band like this has been going really well and then Dustin was immediately just like in the band yeah yeah he did get in really quick didn't he yeah he did like literally a two-week tour and we're like, all right, this is great, you know, you're just in the band now. We're like, you look cool, you sound cool, you're really good at bass and you have your own gear, you can be in the band. It's like, what about me? Do I look cool and sound cool too? Yeah, yeah.

You did have a hard and tryout process, unfortunately, but it worked out. Well, it's the singer. Right. That's a big deal, dude. That's a big deal. I remember our, like, label was like, I don't know if you guys can come back from this. And we're like, oh, all right, cool, thanks. Right.

But that's a big move because, I mean, you already, you already kind of, like, established your sound. And then after a first record, losing what you kind of established, that's a, that's a tough thing to come back from me. You guys seen them come back from it. I mean, I guess from the outside, like seamlessly. It worked out really well, actually, in the end, because Josh, our original singer, only did one tour. So, and the album had barely been out for, like, a month or two, before. before he quit the band. A lot of people didn't even know that Jake wasn't the singer at the time.

They just assumed it was the dude that was on the album. Because he started touring with us literally like two months half the record came out. So it was just like... I forgot about that. Yeah, so it was a really like seamless transition. And like, I don't think we made like some huge post or anything like that. No, we kept it very quiet. That's right.

We were like, we're not telling anyone that our singer quit. We're just going to keep touring and get a new one and act like everything is the same as it's always been. I mean, stuff, word didn't spread as quickly back then. Social media

wasn't nearly what it is now. It's just MySpace. Right. Right. Yeah. And we weren't a big band. We were just a baby band coming up.

We had barely, people, we were very early on our career. Like, Messengers was like the, the coming out album. You know, we hadn't,

we hadn't have that yet. We just had like our, yeah. It was like an introduction. We were still figuring things out. So, yeah, you guys really found your sound

on, on the next, I mean, Dustin, he's a rapper, dude. Yeah. He rips. I remember, like, seeing him on tour practice on, like, guitar and he would just play, like, Black Dalai murder songs. Yeah, I'm like, dude, you're fucking, Jesus.

Yeah, he's, he's really good at guitar. And, like, now, like, in this set we're playing on this tour, he plays guitar a bunch. And he has been for the last few years now. We would trade instruments at J. J.B.R. I will play bass, and Dustin plays guitar. If it's, like, a song that he was really involved in the guitar writing process, he plays guitar for it. Because Brett and I don't want to learn his parts. I can't put, well, pretty much flat out. I can't, like, he'll, he just has, like, these insane guitar solos, and I'm like, I can't

play that. I can't either. Yeah, yeah, he's really good at guitar. Yeah. He's really good at everything he does musically. Right. He's like the jack of all trades. He can play drums. I mean, he had, like a side project he put out that was like a pop punk thing where he sang, played drums, played guitar, played bass, did everything. Whoa. Yeah. Yeah. So he, that's why he got added to the band immediately. one. We didn't even know that. We didn't even know what his potential was

in the time. Got like to get that one. There's more of that luck and timing. Yeah. Right. No kidding. I mean, what a great addition.

I mean, I was kind of a fascinating about, about August Burns Red as well. It's like, I mean, I could say it because I'm an outsider, but your band's massive. And but it's still like,

but there's like this, you guys are technical, though. Like your ribs are, fucking crazy. It's not the most accessible music, I guess. No, it's not. But the way, I don't know, I can't even put words or put it into an sentence, but the

way, like, your songs are structured and it's like, I don't know, like, what, how, how do you guys do that? I don't think there really is a structure. No. It's just, it's, it's not Prague, but it's not really structured in any way either. We just write songs. I don't know how to say, like, there's seldom. Is there a firm structure?

You know, we'll use a part or a melody multiple times sometimes. And I do think that as we're getting older, I'm more interested in the song feeling like a song and less of a mashup of parts like it would have been back in the day. Like, I feel like we did a lot of thrill seeker. The entire album is just parts smashed together. Like I'm not particularly fond of that album at this point. It was a starting point.

But we didn't know how to write a song. and now I think there's at least we don't have these solid structures but there's kind of themes and stuff that tie everything together but yeah it's not it's not accessible music and it is

again it feels lucky that people have been so welcoming to listen to it and let us experiment and still stick with the band we have very loyal fans which is it's a great gift right it just seems like the like maybe messengers came out at like a really good time for like metal stuff because like at that time like metal core was you know you do a scream verse and then you're going to sing your chorus like that was metal core that's what literally like

everyone was doing and then messengers was just like a balls to the walls just like here's a heavy record that has very few repeating parts and just like go go and I think it was just no singing There's no choruses. I think it was just slightly different enough to, like, catch people's ear, and then it just kind of went from there. And I think we just picked up a lot of fans because at that time, metalcore was really growing. Like, it was really big.

You had, like, Azalee dying and, like, Under oath and just, like, really big metalcore bands. And so I think that that, and, like, Kill Switch. I think that that just, like, helped our band in the long run, because the genre was so big, and then we sounded just slightly different enough to, like, kind of, like, bring people over. Yeah, you still had your own sound,

but you're also a part of this, like, exploding genre. Right. You know. Yeah. One,

I'm sure you remember this, when your band's coming up and you're young, and you're like the, like, cool new band, but you don't have any headlining numbers or anything.

So you're cheap to bring on the road. Oh, yeah. You get every good support tour. Because you're like, yeah, we'll definitely do that tour for $250 and a day.

You know? Like, like, yeah, let's open Presley dine and, And, and every, like, we just did so many big tours around that time because we were cheap. We didn't have headline numbers.

And we just got to play in front of lots of people. It was a great time to grow and just get our name and faces in front of people. I think we literally did what? We did Azalee Dying tour into the Lamb of God tour in Europe back into an Azalee Dying door. Oh, wow. Yeah. And then into Warp Tour. And then into Warp Tour.

And so, like he's saying, just because, like, I think we did this, we were main support to Asley dying. I think we did it for like 750 a night. No less, dude. I remember it was, I think it was 500. Yeah. And I think the first leg of it we did for 250. Yeah. And they said to us, why don't you guys counter? We would have paid you 500.

We're like, I don't know. We just want to do the tour. Right. I had no idea what we're doing. Right. So, well, let's see, like, how many top brahmas do I need? Right. Okay. Okay. $250. Right. Yeah. We were just happy to be on a tour that was a big tour for us at the time.

Yeah, and then you did the, uh, on their tour. Yeah, with you guys. That was sick. That was so fun, dude. And I was such a big fan of On Earth. Like Oncoming Storm was a really important metal album for me. And Darkest Hour was there. Yeah, and I loved Dark.

Undo and Reilly and Deliver Us were like two of my, to this day, they were two of my favorite metal albums. I remember just sitting there watching Chris Norris warm up and just being like, hmm, that's really good. Yeah. He was so sick. He was such a shredder, dude. Wow. Look at you go.

That was a fun tour. It was. I remember I was, I forgot where that first show was New York. The very first show of tour was at the record theater in Talson, Maryland. Maryland, okay. I remember, like, I remember all of, oh, yeah, there it is. Yeah. Because that was our first, like, big run.

And I remember, like, we don't know what's going on, what, like, what we're doing. But I remember, like, everyone's in the venue on the floor, and I saw you guys have, like, your roadcases out. Like, you're missing on, like, cables and, like, and the amps, like, So I started doing it too. Or I had no reason. I'm like, well, Jay B and Brenner doing it, so I'm going to do it too. Yeah. That is hilarious.

I had no idea. Dude, I remember there was just one show in particular on that tour that was awful. It was at, for us, our set was just a nightmare. It was at the Lincoln Theater in Raleigh. Oh, my gosh. What happened that night? I don't remember. A bunch of my stuff broke.

Like, what you get? Yeah, it was brutal. But I remember watching some vans from the floor that night. But yeah, that tour was fun. That tour was a good time. It was. On Earth is a blast, for sure. Yeah, and they're such a staple in the genre.

Yeah. Yeah. They were one of those bands that I feel like they influenced a lot of bands that went on to have like more success than them, unfortunately. Right. I don't know why, but just because who knows this, who knows why one band pops off and another one doesn't like. Sure. Like Parkway Drive to me sounded a lot like on Earth. in the day when they started and look what they've done like the career they've built i mean they've

of course evolved their sound since but um and even like what aBR has done like we were definitely influenced by on earth and i feel let's do i i'm i feel grateful for what that band brought to you know the scene and the songs that were that were influential to us yeah oncoming storm oh my goodness yeah oh my what was their first record uh strength strings of conscious. Yeah. And then they did the NLCP right after that, and that NLCP was so sick. That's what really was like, that NLCP, yeah, was amazing.

I went to see on Earth in 2004 in, I drove like four hours to go see them. And every time I die an Evergreen Terrace in this bar. We all went down there. Yeah. And I got kicked in the balls during on Earth in the pit. Was that the one when we went down there? It was sold out. We drove down there.

Yeah, it was sold out. And then Ash. Who won Samarian Records? Ash and Samaritan. He was the promoter for the show. Oh, sick. And did we didn't know him at that point yet? No, we didn't know him and he walked us in the back.

He was like, he for some reason, I don't know why, but was just like. I think we probably were like, dude, we drove four hours. We can't get in. And he took pity on us and walked us through the back and into the show. I don't know how we got connected with him, though. I don't know how it ended up being that we talked to the promoter. Like I don't I have no clue Maybe we were in with him already Brent

Because we We were in with that band Reflex that he sang for back in the day And we would have played with reflux at that Or maybe the show was in 2003 before that I think it was before that because we didn't know Ash And then it was random that all the sudden Or maybe we talked to him that day About the fact that we were playing

We definitely didn't talk to him that day No Because then we started playing shows with him And I think Yeah I think that we ended up But yeah we ended up linking up with him a lot and playing with reflux and it was it was hilarious because we're just like you're the guy who snuck us in that venue when we tried to go see on earth yeah right thank you yeah right thank you do you really

drive four hours yeah we drove four hours because we're like this is the best build dude we loved we loved eat tid we loved on earth we loved evergreen terrace right and we're like we have to see that show and it was probably in like a 300 cap it was that was really and it if i remember right it had like a black and white like dance floor kind of set up yeah like a check like a check like a Checker, title floor. Holy moly, dude. I remember every time I die coming out and Andy just doing the widest power stance I've ever seen. And they started their song, Romeo Go-Go off of Hot Dam.

I was just like, oh, my God, this is so sick. Yeah. Holy crap. I want to do that. Yeah, it's funny. The memories from back in the day that the things that stick in our brains. It's crazy hell it stays with you, and maybe like subconsciously started doing that. Yeah, oh, dude.

I still think about how wide his power. stands wasn't like how sick that looked. I'm like, I need to get low, like on stage. Like, that looks sick. Yeah. Okay, since we're on a subject, we need to dress them. Okay, J.B., what's up with the sandals, man? Oh, I don't know. It just kind of be, we all used to wear them back in the day. It was like, uh, we went through that like preppy polos and sandals phase as a band. Yeah, I remember wearing foot flops and I stopped wearing them because I was getting shin splints. Oh my goodness. And I was just like, oh, gosh, I can't do this. Then, more like I think that it's these sandals and I actually think it was actually because I got fat

I'm not the sandals I'm getting too chunky dude my right these sandals cannot support this fucking rip I remember talking to our managers we had just got done playing like the grammacy theater in New York and they're like you're not wearing your flip-flops I'm just like oh my god it became a thing yeah yeah you know I'm like no I have shin splins I'm going into shoes and they're like oh yeah that's probably a good idea yeah guys sold out right yeah we're total sellouts bro like yeah this is like two weeks ago. Right. There they are.

Look at that. J.B. Going strong, dude. I got multiple pairs on tour in case one breaks. And if you read through the comments of this, everyone's just like, I don't want to win the guitar.

I want to win your flip-flops. Oh. That's nice. There it is. They're not signature flip-flops. Andrew Hart. Le. What may,

uh, JP, what may you decide to go with the two stripes? That is a funny, well, it's not a funny story. Randomly on Warped tour, I believe it was back in 2011.

our guitar tech Kevin and I just put some electric tape on one of my on my green guitar and it was yellow the first time. Then we switched it to orange for a bit and then we went white and then I left it at white and that was just my thing. And then eventually it just stuck. It stuck and I liked the way it looked. And then Ibanez was kind enough to do a signature model of it and now it's just kind of my thing. So first started off with electrical tape. Yeah, it was just kind of a board on Warped tour. Put some tape on the guitar.

Interesting. Yeah. Is green your favorite color? Yeah. I'd say green's my favorite color. Up there, at least. Yeah. Although I'm not playing the green guitar on the...

Well, I have a green guitar on this tour. I have that one, but I've been playing a white one. And then, Brent, you're playing the more of like the telly shape? Yeah. I play Kiesel, though. Okay. Yeah. How recent is that?

it's been a couple years now a couple years yeah I just really like him the solo 6 it's just the telly style body body that they have nice

and it's just comfortable I like the like I have don't have long fingers and like I Dustin let me play one of his kusels and I was like oh this is immediately more comfortable

than my Ivanes because Ibanez has like the wide fretboard wide flat fretboard oh wow yeah this host me riff more

yeah pretty much I'm ripping you know And your fingers aren't chunky. Right. I'm sorry for a prox shame you had the whole podcast. No, it's fine.

I'm sorry. Dude, I totally get. Gosh, you're getting canceled. Right. The fat shame. The fat shame people are coming for you. Well, that's going to be in the title. August Prince Red, fat shame.

Fat shame. That's going to be the name of our next album. Fat shame. Dude, how was your guys this live stream? Oh, they were great, man. It looks sick. You know, it's cool. It was a lot of work.

It was a lot of work. You guys know how much. much. I mean, you did some crazy. Oh, yeah. Yours was like a world tour or something. It was a terrible idea. But yeah, it was, it was a lot of work. I think we have the same business manager. Are you guys with level? Yeah, of course. And

I won't drop any names, but our business manager, you know, our dude was like really praising what you guys were doing. Like, he thought it was such a cool idea and was like really innovative and was really proud of you guys. Wow. So it was a really cool

idea that suicide science had during the pandemic for live streams. I just wish you did like one right was one show you could have done it that way yeah in retrospect but what you did was was special and that and at that point everyone was just trying to figure out what something to do that was like interesting and different and special and just didn't know what was going to work and it was tough because you don't like who are you going to call right is I mean

hey had you tried this how how would that work you're just like we have you have like no blueprint. We're just trying to try and trying to stuff. Right. Yeah. Yeah. No one,

like no one knew what was going to be good or how it's going to pan out. Like we actually kind of like sat back and watched for a little bit. Yeah. To like see what's going to happen. And then we saw Under Rose went really well and we hit up their manager. And we're like, hey, like, how'd this go for you? Who'd you use like and all this stuff? And we got advice from him.

Oh, wow. And so we ended up linking up with like a bunch of people that way. And we just kind of went from there with it. Sick. Yeah. yours is awesome yeah I mean it's it's the amount of tour for a work it's amount of work for like a whole tour that you put into like one show yeah like it was a lot and then essentially yeah we also run our own web store so it was like double the word we it worked out great for us we ended up

being able to run the live stream through our web store so you had to buy tickets for the live stream through our web store that also had all the merchandise for the live stream so it it It panned out okay for us, but it was a ton of work. It was a lot. But we had nothing else to do. Right. Exactly. Exactly.

I was like, I'm going to sit down my computer and we're going to work on this. Like, yeah, we had nothing else to do. And it just, it was cool. But do I want to do it again? No. Yeah. So should I put more ice cream on my apple pie? Should we do this fucking virtual show?

Oh, I was putting ice cream on the apple pie at night after the show. Of course. Yeah. Right. And like, were you guys like, like, scared? Or, like, worry, because, I mean, you're at the worst timing possible, right? Like, like, your merch company went bankrupt and didn't even fucking tell you guys. Right.

And at the worst time. Because that's, like, our main source of income. And then they didn't even tell you that is going out of business. Wait, did you, you guys were with bad merch as well? No. Oh, okay. You just heard that, I guess. Yeah.

Yeah, I mean. We must have talked about that. I did. Okay. But, yeah, it, so, like, it seemed. That's scary. It seemed like the worst possible timing. But in the end, it was the best thing.

because like we had signed like a deal with them where we got an advance or whatever and then they had the rights to sell our merchandise and to be frank like we had we had had new like account managers constantly and so we weren't selling a ton in web so it was just something that we're just like all right we're never going to recoup this whatever and then randomly like you know all the sudden no more touring and we're like yeah maybe they'll be cool and let us sell some stuff in the web so that can come directly to our pockets and things like that and we just get like an email from the old account manager that's just like hey heads up here they're going under like there's no one there to reply to your emails like they're going bankrupt and we're like oh like it's just an empty warehouse now and they had they had how many pieces of our merch thousands there was thousands of yeah unsold stock and they had a debt collector come after us for the unrecouped advance yeah and we what yeah oh yeah i was freaking out the time i was like we yeah they had the deck like someone bought all their debt and kind of like said us like threatening emails and We had to get on the phone and our lawyer was just like, look like in their contract with your company that you bought that says this is an advance.

It's not a debt. They're like, he's like, I'm sorry that your business didn't do a good enough job recouping this advance. When he was also like, this ban can't do anything. It's during the pandemic. They have no money. They can't pay this debt. Because he knew that it was just a racket. They were just trying to threaten us to scare us into like pain.

And we eventually did work something out where we just bought all of our stock from them. just, yeah, we ended up buying the stock that they had sitting there because they were just going to let it rot in a warehouse. And so we ended up buying like all these pieces of merchandise for what ended up being like pennies on the dollar. Because we're like, look, we'll buy our stock for this. That's all we're going to pay. Yeah, because we'll just buy our old stock. Yeah, they were just like, how do you guys pay us this much money? And our lawyer was like, no.

And they're like, how about this much? No. And their lawyer was like, we'll give you this much for the merch. And they were like, fine. They were just hired to get whatever they could out of it. There was a lot of bands that were getting. I don't say threatened, but we'll say threatened. It was threatened.

At the same time. That's a whole other business. It was going on and being behind the scenes for sure. That was anxiety inducing at the time for sure. And then, you know, it ended up just being. I was just like, well, we have this merch now. We're going to open our web store. And we just learned how to open a Shopify store.

And that was that. Wow, dude. And especially like, and you don't even know, like, if you're even going to be able to go out again and make M. and make your living that you've been building at that point, like, the past 18 years, you know, right, you know, that's, what, that would definitely give me some anxiety. Yeah, it was pretty brutal. Like, to get that call and to get those emails, you're just like, uh, like, I remember when that email came in, I like, we were both just like, oh, shit. Like, is this real? Like, is this real? And then we learn, yeah, this is real. And we're like, oh, God, okay. It's so, it's so strange. I remember, like, bad, like, like.

back in a day is like, why do we need a lawyer? Yeah. And then like this thing has happened. Yeah. Every once in a while, every year is past and like, oh, this is why. Right. You just don't know. Right.

You know, this guy got to be safe, you know. For sure. You know, well, speaking of you guys having a career. I mean, you guys, I built your band to a point where, like, you get nominated for like a Grammy. Right. You know, how was that? Wild. Yeah, that's one of those things you all expect.

Yeah. It was a, I don't know, yeah, it was a surreal moment. We got to go to the Grammys twice. We didn't win both times we were nominated, but it was still cool to be in the conversation. Like that was special. I don't know if we'll ever get that opportunity again. It's definitely one of those things you don't ever count on happening.

And we had like no clue. Like we didn't, like the first time around, we had no idea like how the process worked or the fact that like our label was even kind of shopping us out there to be nominated. Because like you like, you get put in to be nominated. And then everyone has to, vote on you if they want to nominate you. And so we had, we had no idea.

And our product manager at the time, Jenny Reader, she was just like hustling behind the scenes. And we had like no clue. And we just like woke up the one morning the text message that was like, hey, you guys got nominated for Grammy. And we're like, what? Yeah, we were on tour in Lawrence, Kansas,

playing the Granada Theater. I'm sure you guys have been there. Oh my goodness. And Kansas? Yeah. Yeah. And we had like no clue. We were just like, what?

Got a phone call from my wife telling me. Yeah. She's like, you were nominated for a Grammy. I'm like, what? Yeah. Let's have a sleep. Wait, so it was public first? Yeah.

And then it, wow. Yeah. Like, we had no clue. Because they, you know, they release all the categories and who's nominated in each category. That's like, you know, public information when the submission and voting process is over. And then there's another voting process over the. I like screenshot of the text that came in from our. These pictures are insane.

From our manager. And we were just like, and I remember Jake was. like a Grammy, like a real Grammy? Like a real one? Yeah. Some kind of fucking joke or something? Right. It definitely didn't feel real.

It was weird. It was definitely strange. And then like the second time around, we kind of knew how things worked. So like, you know, we got to go in and like vote for ourselves, that kind of thing. And it just wasn't enough. Yeah. Yeah. So, like, that was fun.

But yeah. Dang. That's a beautiful picture, man. Yeah, it was really neat. That, ah. one of those things you don't even think about. Right. No.

Not in this style of music, man. Especially because I can't remember, like, I think, like, maybe Asley Dying had been nominated prior to us. But, like, it wasn't, like, there was, like, a bunch of, like, heavy, super heavy metal bands that aren't on the radio getting nominated for Grammys. Like, that's why it was such a surprise, I think. Because people were, like, who is this band that got nominated for a Grammy? Like, you're not on the radio. you're not like, you know, you have, you know, you're not 4-4. You haven't sold, you know, you haven't sold like half a million albums.

Like they're like, what the heck is this? And then, because I remember like thinking about who we were going up against. And it was all like household names. Like, it was like iced tea and, you know. Oh, body count. Body count. And like all these like other like really big metal bands. And we're just like, oh, okay.

I think Ghost won the first time. And who won the second time? Macedon. Macedon. Yeah. Which is cool. Good for them. Right.

man what a what a career that that's that's still going yeah you know just playing like like the style of music that that you guys been playing it just goes to show like the like your consistency has been insane and like you have this this fan base it just you know has been with you the whole the whole time that's cool you know we're very lucky to have such devoted fans that's definitely like the biggest they have carried us right that's something the biggest thing like we look out of the crowd of these shows but 20 anniversary tour and they're like all in their 30s. Like, it's just like...

Well, not all. Not all. But like a huge, a huge portion of them are like our age. Like, I think our biggest, our biggest Spotify listener numbers are like, you know, I think it's like late 20s to like 40. And so like it...

They grew up with us and stuck with us and, you know, that's why our fans have been dedicated. They just... They came along. They latched someone at the right moment. guess, and we just got lucky that a lot of them did, I guess. Yeah. It seems like if, yeah, if you had a fan that just stuck with you, it seemed they just stuck with you.

I remember, like, I'm talking, like, the first records out, and because, you know, like, you get, like, the tour offer, you know, Augustin's Red and our Earth. And then so I didn't know who you guys were. And then I think it was Ash that might have said it. Or someone whoever was what was booking and was like, no, they hold her weight. You guys had that reputation since day one. You know, it's just whoever the fans that. that, you know, lashed onto your music, just, we're always there. Yeah.

And just kind of just grew and grew. Yeah. You know? It's crazy, like, doing, like, we do, like, a little meet and greet thing before each show. And some of the fans who come through and they're like, yeah, this is my 27th August Burns Red Show. Or, yeah. There's a, there's a dude who came up in our area.

He lives in Dallas now. And he saw us the other day in Dallas. And he's like, that was my 82nd ABR show. Yeah. Like, holy crap, dude. Like, the amount of people that have seen this over 20 times. is insane. Yeah.

It's a big. They're really, really dedicated, awesome supportive fans. Yeah. We couldn't be doing without them for sure. And I mean, you guys are kind of, and I was watching videos of your production on this tour. It looks incredible. Like the lights and you guys. Oh, thank you.

It looks, it looks sick, man. Yeah, we went for it. We're excited about, yeah, this tour's cool. We're trying to make it special because it's, you know, it's a big. Celebration. 20 years is a big deal of us. So we're going to make a special tour. It's an massive deal.

Yeah, our L. L.D. Carlos, he knocked it out of the park on this one. He, like, designed, like, this whole awesome show. And it's just... Yeah, this is... It's pretty rippin. At the masquerade. Oh, my goodness, dude.

It's, like, our first tour that we've brought, like, decking, that we can, like, walk all over and stuff. And then there's, like, lights in between all the decks and stuff. Yeah. That's a lot. That's a lot. That's a lot. Because I don't...

Our backs to it the whole time. Yeah. We actually had them turned down the brightness. Like, it's running at, like, I think, 75 or 80% right now. Really? Like, those strobe bars behind, they get pretty gnarly. Yeah, they can be so brightly. We were in the pre-production space and we're just like, we got to turn this down or else like people are going to go blind in the front row. I do see people squinting sometimes. Yeah. Whoa. Because like the, yeah, the ones that are like the big bars across the back that go across Matt, like if they go white,

that's when it's just like, wow. Look at this. Someone's got the entire show up. Yes, plus their heart. Yeah, he's all a timestamp, too. Wow. That's sick. Good for them. Front and center view? I hope I played all right that night.

Right. Probably not. It's fine. Richard Metal fan. What's up, dude? Probably not, man. Probably not. Dude, I mean, it looks like you guys spend a lot of time on this.

This is a lot. R.D. did for sure. So sick, man. He spent a lot of time programming. Yeah. I could see the weeks. Yeah. Yeah.

We're stoked to it, man. It's a fun show to put on. And chorus and the lineup is perfect. Yeah, it's a fun bill. Like, if you like metal chorus is a good show to go see. Yeah, and we were just like really like proud as a band that other than touring with Parkway Drive and maybe some stuff on Whartotrow, we've never really done much together in the States. And it just seemed kind of weird. We're like, all right, we should probably do this together.

And so it was like a perfect thing. And then being from within was just like, I want a metal band that does well that's never toured America. before. And we're like, okay, to them. They're like, because I like hit up a buddy of mine. I'm like, who knows a lot about like up and coming bands. And I'm like, hey, what do you think? And he's just like, that band leaping with and is crushing. And he's like, here's all their

numbers. I know there's stats like as far as they're like Spotify, reach, like inside America and all that stuff, because they're Scottish. And they've been around for 17 years and they've never toured America. And they're so good. 17 years? Yeah. 17 years. And they're an awesome band. They play so tight. They put on a great show and like they're crushing. People

People are into them. They're about to get, they have some big stuff lined up. They're about to like, after like 17 years, they're about to get like real big. Yeah, I think they're about to have a nice, nice big glow up. Their band is, their band is awesome. They're so good. They deserve it. And they are so sick live.

Like, they just, all the best players, they're really good. And you guys got the first U.S. tour. Yeah. Somehow. Yeah, I don't know. Yeah, look at them killing it in Europe, dude. Yeah. They're sick.

And they have pyro? What the fuck? That's sick. Yeah. I want pyro? Me too, dude. Yeah. We've called around to some venues on like the bigger shows and stuff.

They've been like, can we do pyro in your venue? And they're like, no. It's just so hard to do anywhere indoors. Yeah, really hard. In America. It's just so hard. Even our own like Christmas festival that we do at home that's in like a big enough space to do it, it's still a pain. Like insurance is just like, no, you can't.

Yeah. How do you get insurance for? I don't know. We haven't. We haven't successfully done yet. Like in the room we want to play. they're just like no and it's just it's a lot of like hoops to jump through if you want to do it and like the pyro company that we used to do our live stream they're like we understand that we're like

the last thing in the room like if you've got the money if the room even allows it then we can come in and like do our jobs like they have like these massive tours that they know that they only do like this portion of the tour because the next portion they can't have any pyro and then they got in the next portion like it's and like I said they're a pyro company so they only work with really really big bands because that's who gets to take pyro. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, well, you guys have your Christmas show.

Yeah. You know, and that's been highly successful. It's been great. It's a lot of work, but it's done really well. Especially now that we do it as like a festival thing. It's great. Our like 800 cap venue that was in town closed. The Chameleon Club.

You remember the communion club in Lancaster, Pennsylvania? Yeah, it's gone now. It's gone. So we have to do it. We do it at the convention center, which, you know, opens up the room for a lot more people, which is great. Um, that's crazy. Yeah.

We almost had to turn it into like a festival thing because otherwise like, we wouldn't be able to just go in and like headline the convention center. No, we're not drawn that may be. It's a big, it's a big space. But it's fun. It's a cool like, uh, the Christmas show has become this like almost like a meetup for fans. Like, like people who are from all over the country like get to meet up at the Christmas show and, you know, meet face to face with people that they've been interacting with online and stuff.

It's kind of a... Yeah. It brings people together. Yeah. The hardest part is building the bill. Because it's like, hey, do you want to come to Pennsylvania two weeks before Christmas and play a concert? Or like a week before Christmas sometimes? No, we don't.

Like, yeah, you want to come play a one-off show right before the holidays? That's a big ask for bands. You guys have to pull. Here's Brandon Sacrifice. This fucking slain. Oh, yeah. They crushed it this past year. Yeah.

So this is at a convention center. Beautiful. They do concerts. That's where if like five finger death punch comes and plays Lancaster, you play the convention center. Oh, wow. But it's like right in town. It's like right in downtown.

It's in the square of Lancaster City. Yeah. It's a good location. It's an era, right? Yeah, it's era. Ripping it. From high school to a convention center. Right.

It's great. You guys get it. First band, high school, Grammy, convention center. Piro. Right. A Piro. We haven't achieved a Pira. We only did it for the live stream.

That was it. That's only because no one else was allowed in the room. Yeah, we don't count that. We were able to do that because we could get the actual certifications because there weren't human beings there other than us. Oh, wow. For you guys, I definitely see it happening. I would love to.

We just got, like, I just know it's just really difficult. Like, you have to like plan like certain venues and certain spaces and it's just like. My bad, dude. We got to get pyro for the podcast. I'd like that. Yeah. That would take this over the top. That would take this over the top.

You could just put some candles around. There's one. I see one. I got any more candles. You have, you have pyro. Oh my goodness. Well,

I know you guys could get back to you a sound check. But, dude, I mean, we have a, it was an honor for, for me to have you guys here. I'm very proud to see

where how far you fucking took your band. Yeah. Thank you. Thanks, man. You have a career. Holy moly. We're,

it's good catching up with you, man. We're grateful. We got to do this today. It was fun. It was fun. So you're in a middle of a, what, two-month-long tour? Yeah, we're doing like two legs, a month on, a month off,

and then another month on for the 20-year anniversary thing. It wraps up in mid-May. Yeah. We were just like, with like having the families and stuff now, it's hard to do that long of a tour. So we just broke it up. Like, this is the first thing we've really done that. We usually just go, you know, pound it out and do seven weeks at a time. Yeah.

Like, that's, I see a lot of dates. It looks insane, right? It's a lot of shows. But what you don't see is the month off in the middle. Okay, there you go. Great. Like, after Charlotte, we come back, we go back out, and we start again in Philly a month later. Yeah.

We didn't even get into it, but the three singles you guys put out are sick. Oh, thanks, man. Thank you. Appreciate you listening to them. Reckoning has that really cool, like a bridge. Yeah, that interlude part. Really cool. So the new record is called Deppolo?

Yep, Death Below, March 24th. March 24th. It's coming up. It's coming up. Holy moly. I know, and the lead-up is just so long, you know, nowadays with records because of vinyl production. It just takes forever to put out a record now. It's a mess. It does a mess.

The record's been done since May. Oh, wow. Yeah, we had like a nine-month lead after we finished it. Yeah, you're just sitting and waiting and waiting, waiting. But, yeah, what do you guys do? Well, I look at your dates and there's, you guys aren't, doing anything on the 24th? We're doing a record release party

in our hometown in like a small venue. We're not playing, we're just hanging. We're going to do like a little Q&A and, yeah, it should be fun. Just like chilling with people who are coming out and we're going to like raffle off some cool

ABR memorabilia that we have sitting around. It should be special. So this is going to come out. Do records come out on Friday? Right? They come on Friday. Yeah It'll be a Friday Like a midnight thing

It's like Yeah 25, 26 So this will come out On the 27th So by the 27th He will still have The whole week and a half

Of our shows Hey Jay can pull up the The flyer There you go So You still have Amaha Chicago, Cincinnati

Cleveland, Pittsburgh Yeah, he's one in Pittsburgh That's right Richmond Toronto Oh you guys Going to Canada

Can close it out there? Yeah. We add some shows at the end, too. We have two in Toronto now and two in Montreal now. Dude, badass. Yeah. It'll be fun. Dude, the shows have been so fun.

It's been a great tour. Yeah. And I'm stoked that we have a lot to look for. She's still with it. Yeah. That's right. All right, everyone, check out the new record and check out these dates. Yeah.

Guys, honor, man. Thank you for having us. Thank you. All right, guys. Later. Later.