Geoff Schwartz Is Smarter Than You - Combine Fallout, a Loaded O Line Class, and a Moose at the Iditarod

Episode Date: March 6, 2024

Geoff is back alongside Gabe to break down everything they learned from the combine, Geoff gives his impressions of the many offensive lineman expected to go in the first round, and a check in on Russell Wilson's value. Plus, who's the John Dowd of NCAA 25? And what's going down at the Iditarod?Be sure to follow the podcast to be notified whenever a new episode is released, and leave a rating, comment, or tweet @GeoffSchwartz to share what you think! See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

it's tuesday march 5th i'm jeff schwartz this morning we're live on twitter on youtube and i'm back with gabe goodwin to talk all things football we've been out for a couple weeks recovering from the super bowl gabe the combine has has come and gone it's now officially draft season lost to get into but first buddy how buddy, how you been? Are you coaching your son's baseball teams? Again? It's baseball season already. My son and daughter. You know, I got the whole middle of the order, Jeff. Yeah, they're on the same team.

Oh, yeah, man. Yeah. And my pitching arm is nice and loose. First game is this weekend got rained out here in SoCal opening weekend. You know, it's not it's not as hot and dry as people think it is. How are things in your world baseball season begun over there? What's wild is every practice has been rained out. So it's the only day that we have practice of the week the only day it rains. So I'm excited to be back. You know, it feels like spring out here. It's nice. It's in the 70s. And when we think about spring, at least for me, I think about some NFL draft and what's happening in the NFL Combine

after this week, some NFL free agency news. We will cover it all. We also have a fun story out of Alaska. Anytime that you can talk about the Iditarod and moose and harvesting of moose, mooses, meese, moose, a moose on a racetrack, we will talk about that i think the i think the plural of moose is mooses i don't think that one gets a weird treatment yeah it's not like goose and geese yeah i think it's just mooses and and uh and that story is insane and it somehow makes

more sense than uh the true detective setup in alaska so it's not even the craziest story we can get into that at the end of the show lots of questions about that no spoiler alert but than the true detective set up in Alaska. So it's not even the craziest story in Alaska. We can get into that at the end of the show. Lots of questions about that. No spoiler alert, but the tongue makes no sense. Couldn't spoil it if I tried, Jeff. Could not spoil it if I tried. Look, okay, one second.

Sorry, we're getting into this now. I watch this season every week with my wife. I kept telling her like, okay, it's going to pay off at the end. It's going to pay off at the end. It's going to pay off at the end. And nothing got paid off at the end. So thanks. Thanks for six episodes of nothing. I think Jeff, the point of this show, for anyone who's watching live, where anyone has a chance to listen later, is to get

smarter about football and and you know, find out where the easy takes that bounce around the internet and maybe on some TV shows that we watch you know where those could get sharpened up a little bit by a guy like yourself no time in the year is this easier to do than when everyone starts watching the combine and has absolutely no idea what they're looking at and just make stuff up this is when a bunch of NFL people suddenly go, oh crap, I have to have smart takes about college players I've seen twice. And I'm going to do that by thinking about things I've never thought about, which is how big a person's hands are and how fast they do a three cone drill. It's all make-believe. So I'm going to start with the

guy who should go number one, the guy I've rooted for for a couple years, the guy who I see very few flaws in, Caleb Williams, who basically said, I don't need to show you people-ish. I'm good. You know it. You don't need to measure me. You don't need to evaluate me much. I'll just sit here and wait to be number one.

Was that the right move? Is that what Caleb should be doing? All right, so Caleb Williams went to the combine, and he did his weigh-in. I believe he weighed in. I'll just sit here and wait to be number one. Was that the right move? Is that what Caleb should be doing? All right, so Caleb went to the combine, and he did his weigh-in. I believe he weighed in. He's a decent size, normal size as he should be. And that's all he did as far as sort of the testing, right, and included medical testing on this. He interviewed with the teams.

The point of the combine game, we've talked about this for years now, is the medical testing, right? It's one centralized location where all the teams are at, the players are at and there's a day of medical testing there are multiple rooms with five or six doctors um from from each team or one from each team um and you get evaluated in these rooms uh they feel your body they move your body around uh they look at your medical history from college and they determine whether you need to get MRIs, x-rays, and figure out if there's a medical issue, how do we evaluate that? They also do blood work, EKGs. They've evolved some of the heart testing over the years at the combine. But that's the point of the combine, the ultimate point of the medical testing.

So Caleb Williams refused the medical testing. We know this. He talked about it. And the reason he gave was essentially of like, hey, wherever I go visit, we'll do the medical testing there. Now, the way the visits go, Gabe, is they fly you in. It's more of an interview. You talk with the coaches. You meet with the staff. There's not often a physical part of this, right? Not physical workout, but a physical where you're getting evaluated by the team medically on these visits. So for the Bears, let's say, to set up a visit for Caleb Williams,

they then have to get the doctor aligned, the MRI. They've got to get all these things aligned for Caleb Williams to get the medical checked out at the facility. The thing that I don't understand about this game is the why, right? Like it feels like he's being difficult to be difficult. There's no reason not to do the physical at the combine. It's why you're there, okay? The reason that people say is, well, he don't want other teams to know what's wrong or not wrong with him. What does that matter? What does it matter if the Packers know that you have

a weaker ankle on the left side than the right side? They're going to use that? They're going to, like, target your left ankle when they play you? I mean, I don't know the point. He's the first person in the history of the Combine to refuse any of the medicals, to not do any. Like, Gabe, it's so easy just to do it, and there's no downside. There's zero downside unless you're hiding something.

If you're hiding something and you're trying to rehab something and you need an extra two or three weeks fair okay fine you're trying to hide something maybe it's a hamstring he pulled in in workouts or he's got a bum knee or something trying to figure things out before he gets to the combine um before he gets to sort of the but Gabe this is refusing to do it to just refuse to do it there's no actual reason now it doesn't change Gabe whether he'd be drafted one overall, I think he's the best player, the best quarterback, he should go one overall. But it's just odd. There's no actual reason for him to do this. Okay, that I can't really come up with a good reason other than in this point in one's career, you're looking for every piece of

leverage that you can find, right? And so perhaps his camp believes that giving away a certain amount of information or conceding certain things makes it easier for someone to build a case against him. And it's not that he's hiding some huge medical issue. It's just like, you don't need the information. You've seen me play. You have questions, ask ask you know like could that be it i that doesn't seem overly strategic but maybe that's all it is maybe but i mean my first thought is he's hiding something like what's he hiding why is he not deciding to go through this process like everyone else is doing and it's not going to change his medicals and look maybe

he's trying to be so difficult the Bears don't want to draft him. Maybe that's his reasoning for doing all this. But again, the reviews were he was great in his interviews. So he's not being difficult outside of that. It's just people were saying, well, this is going to change the NFL combine. He's doing this for the future. I'm like, all right. I mean, I don't know. Everyone else is going to to change the NFL combine. He's doing this for the future. I'm like, all right. I mean, I don't know.

Everyone else is going to do their medicals there. What do you – I guess the question again is like why not? Now, the other team is more hassled to set up these physicals for you when you go visit, which again feels unnecessary to have to do that. You could have just done it all in Indianapolis. But also too – They show their cards though. If somebody is not willing to do that work to try to figure that. He could have just done it all in Indianapolis. But also, too, I'll say this. They show their cards, though. If somebody's not willing to do that work to try to figure out what he's doing,

then he knows they're not serious about taking him, and maybe his goal is to be taken number one but moved on draft day like we've seen so many great quarterbacks do. It's only happened a couple times. But, like, what if – I have to do two. What? What? What, Manning and...

Elway, right? Elway, yeah. Elway had the leverage of the USFL, though, at least. All right. So, okay. Let's say there's a situation where... Okay, this is hypotheticals. The Chiefs, like Mahomes, they wanted Mahomes, right?

They trade up all the way up to 10 to get him. What if there's a team, an unknown team, Gabe, that doesn't want their tensions to be known, that they want Caleb Williams? And it's a good team. I don't know. A Kansas City type team. And they say, and they're like, you know what?

We didn't get your physicals, man. We just can't draft you. I don't know. It's possible. It's possible, right? They don't want to bring him in for a top 30 visit because they don't want people to know they like him. The team can interview Caleb Williams at the combine. There's no reason to not know the background before that. They don't need to bring him in for a visit.

And now what if they want to trade for him and have no medicals on him whatsoever? They're not going to do it. Peter Schrager brought this up on Good Morning Football. It's a good point about just like the Bears. The Bears cannot trade Justin Fields or move on until they find out about Caleb Williams' medical history. They can't. And so that's delaying the process of Fields being traded. Now, I think Fields' market is not really there.

There's not like a robust market for Justin Fields where like they're losing out on not trading for him, or to be trading him. But it kind of holds the process for a lot of teams if they want Caleb Williams. So basically, now does now Washington, Chicago, the Patriots, someone else have to do individual physicals with Caleb Williams. It just seems unnecessarily difficult.

We could have just done it at the combine, when it's all set up for you to do the combine. Last point on the procedure here, and then we can talk about the player and some other guys who might go first round. If what you just said is true, if the Bears can't figure out a market for Justin Fields until they understand that Caleb Williams is healthy. Isn't Caleb Williams essentially forcing the Bears to imagine trading the pick? And isn't it possible that where he wants to go is a team that stinks but could get good soon, his hometown, the Commanders, D.C.? Isn't this maybe some agent has figured out a chess game here? He has his family family's his Yeah, those his dad, I think is manager. Um, I guess, but Washington still gonna want the

physical to game. I'm sure gonna have been on a visit and do physical, they'll pay to bring a doctor in and do a physical. That's not Yeah, I get a physical a couple times a year. Big deal. Twice a year. That's I lied. I don't even get one. a year i mean that's i i lied i don't even get one more i lie i lie about half the stuff i say in a physical i might as well lie about how old i have them that was great twice a year wow you're really thorough game your insurance must love you um you okay you wouldn't get this jeff because you

you're to your audience is famously not a drinker but for those of us who like to have a beer here and there uh or more than a beer here and there the do you drink alcohol and i'm always like yeah sometimes and they're like how many a week and then that answer is never true you never there's that parks and rec clip of ron swanson giving that answer and he's like they're like how many drinks he goes what one he's like one bottle a day or so whatever it was it's just it's so good um all right let's talk about kayla williams as the player really quickly this is a fun discussion to have about him jane daniel's direct way so as people i i am right about a lot of things i'm wrong about a lot of things but i've been right about this more than anything else maybe this year gabe. I said from the beginning of USC's season that their offense was not

functioning at a level that we saw previously. Now, their defense is what it is. We talked about that all year. But as the season got on, I kept telling you guys, privately as very tight measures on this show, sometimes we talk more about the defense more than the offense. But I was like, guys, the offense doesn't look right. It doesn't look like an offense that Lincoln Riley has had before.

And now people are starting to watch Caleb Williams, and they're like, yeah, it looks kind of bad. Caleb Williams' film is not great from this past season in totality. Now, his arm talent is incredible, best in the draft by far. His playmaking ability, best in the draft. But sort of the rhythm of the offense is non-existent. There is not a lot of catch the ball, throw the ball.

There's not a lot of in-rhythm plays in the offense. Not a lot of guys just open at the snap. The offensive line was bad. He held the ball forever. Now, that wasn't his fault all the time. The idea of taking a big play instead of a small play because the defense is allowing 42 points a game, you know, got to get points, got to get points, got to get points.

These all contributed to really sort of – it's not – the film is not this season what you would see from a number one draft pick. Last year it was. But I will say, though, again, you have to look at all these reasons why. And the arm talent, man, when he lets it go, there's no one like him right now in the in this draft like he is he makes electric plays with his arm and that's why he's going number one if you say to yourself i think the bears are saying this whoever else the commanders will get

him in a stable offense that has some rhythm to it where he can catch the ball throw the ball some easy throws some easy play action passes will help with nfl look, if he's in the Bears with a decent offensive line, their offensive line's okay, getting better, young offensive line. DJ Moore, and let's say Roma Dunze, I mean, that's a huge upgrade from what he had at USC last season. USC has how many wide receivers drafted this year, Gabe? Probably two. Taj Washington and Rice, maybe, maybe at the most.

They don't use a tight end in that offense. Offensive lineman, maybe the right tackle gets drafted, maybe the left tackle. I don't know, like late round picks. Running back, I mean, like the talent on offense was not like Riley had in the past. So it led to all these things not being great on film. I'm going to make it very clear. Caleb Williams, I think, is a great player. It's just the film wasn't good this year because of all those reasons.

There were moments that was good. The turnovers were not, you know, again, him pressing a little bit too much it's fair to ask okay if you get in situation in the nfl are you gonna take the easy throw you're gonna try to make the bigger play but again i think you can excuse a lot of these issues and that's why these interviews happen at the combine hey hey explain your process right now explain why you're doing this. And all accounts to you, by the way, Gabe, great kid. Handled LA. It's a tough market to be in. Handled it excellent. Yeah, okay, he wrote FU Utah on his fingernails.

I mean, look, do NFL teams like that? No. He's also 20 years old. They'll get over it, you know. But I think he handled LA great. He was a good ambassador for the USC program. In the time, by the way, with NIL, right, being such a big part for the USC program. It's in a time, by the way, with NIL, right? Names like this being such a big part of the game now.

And so he's the number one pick to me. I take him number one. I have no problem taking him one. There's some talk about Jane Daniels going one. The odds have come way down. I just don't see it really. But again, Williams is fantastic. He just has to get a better office.

Tell me if this feels accurate to you. And I don't need to add on to everything you said I watched him play more than any other player that I've watched in this draft. Yeah. And the the lack of rhythm and the inability to just make the easy type plays that we're used to seeing the Chiefs offense do for instance, the Pats ability to go, you're giving me four-yard slants and easy screen plays and quick outs. I'll take them. Caleb did not do that consistently throughout the year.

And when he would do it, you'd go, this is so easy. We're going to clobber these guys. And then he'd revert back to something else. Here's my question on ceiling and floor. The comps are always silly, but here goes. Floor feels like, and this is a nice floor, Kyler Murray. Ceiling gets described as Patrick Mahomes. That's difficult. Ceiling probably a little bit more like Josh Allen physically. Where do you think about that? Well, I mean, physically he looks more like Mahomes, but you just can't compare to one of the homes like that's unfair to kill that's great aaron rogers

would be an amazing ceiling i i think there i think there's a very little chance he's a bust if that's if that's what you're asking me like i think he's he he can do enough with his legs with his arm to not be a bust is he a hall of famerer? I don't know, man. That feels hard to – But I don't think he's – I don't think he's a bust. And you're right. Where you go, we've learned over the years, is a big reason why you succeed or don't succeed. Chicago, unfortunately, for years and years and years,

has just not been good at quarterback. Their best quarterback in their history of their franchise – I'll be serious – is probably Jay Cutler. Yeah, baby. One of the best quarterbacks in the history of the bears franchise um is you know mcmahon is not was not as good as cutler yeah they won a championship with him but he's not he's not color like that's the best they've had so you know there's a little bit of like overcoming that in chicago as well for

but i drafted one i think there are look i think his management his management, we'll call it that. I am one who have said this before. I said this about Lamar Jackson's mom helping him. It turned out maybe he wasn't helping him as much as someone else. But like, I'm not a big fan of family members sort of being part of your decision-making circle. You can certainly talk to them about decisions. But I advise, I'm a fan of an agent, a marketing person, like someone who is not your family member to be the one advising you. That's going to turn teams

off, but not enough to where they don't say, hey, I'm not taking Caleb Williams. But I would say that that's a part that teams are like, ah, I don't know if I like that part of what he's doing right now. But in the end, can you play or not play he can play he can definitely play i'm not convinced the other quarterbacks all of them at least can play let me confess a few things to you drake may sorry wasn't really somebody i was paying close attention to all season i've i've seen the stats i've heard his name mentioned for over a year now whatever fine uh jayden daniels like you know i got a little taste of him out here then he goes to lsu like and then the whole second half of the season we're obsessed with talking about him because the stats he puts up i don't know jj mccarthy obviously has this incredible resume

as a quarterback all i've seen him do is meditate like i don't know it just feels like we have to convince ourselves that all of these guys have top 10 potential but why do we have to do that like none of those guys except pennix to me look like they really have it yeah i have questions about pennix too um me and daniels i think are going to be fine if they get in the right place game are they going to be the best quarterbacks i think you you typically have one quarterback in the first round per class that is the the home run um you know you look at last year bryce young stroud richardson stroud obviously i think is the best one there. Richardson didn't play very much, but maybe he can be good. In 2021, the five first-round picks in the first round,

Lawrence, Wilson, Lance, Fields, Mack Jones. Trevor Lawrence didn't play well last year, but he's won, right? He's the guy. The year before, Burrow to a Herbert. That feels like Matt Havre, too, right, with Herbert and Burrow. Kyler Murray, Daniel Jones, the year before that. Kyler Murray. You typically don't get

a year where you have five first round picks four five three and like two guys are good normally it's one 20 2018 is different josh allen and lamar it's a great year um but you so it's unlikely that all three are going to be good game right two at the most at the most. McCarthy, I don't know, man. I don't know. His film doesn't show top 10 pick, but I think he's going to the top 10. You're just judging it off of some of the throws he makes, I guess. I mean, he was the one who looked the worst throwing the ball to combine with just no one rushing him.

I don't know. It feels like a big projection. I have a hard time getting there with him as like a top 10 pick. I'm the dumb guy on this show. I see like Chase Daniel. Like, cool. Great college career. Obviously a bright guy.

Seems like a very coachable guy, has some talent. You'd feel fine having him in a quarterback room, and if he had to play, okay, I guess. But how are you turning that guy into Tom Brady, let's say? I just don't see it. I don't either. But the interesting part about some of the draft talk right now is, like, Kirk Cousins going to the Falcons is I think a real thing that might happen.

They're out of J.J. McCarthy, so now is it like Sean Payton? Are they going to J.J. McCarthy? Is that a guy that the Vikings go McCarthy? He's going early, Gabe. I just don't know where, and I don't see it. I really don't. All right,'t well so before we get back to other rookie names from the combine let's just quickly mention the biggest news of the week or at least it should be the biggest news of the week I'm not sure I care Russell Wilson at what point in the

draft are we like well they didn't get the guy they want like I guess they should sign Russell Wilson on a discount like he's still got something in the tank are we going to be thinking of russell wilson as game stop all off season is what i'm saying like it is it just going to be a game of do we buy high or low and ride the you know ride it or not um i saw i saw a video today someone put a video saying, Russ can still cook, and it was all highlights from Seattle. It's like, well, he's not in Seattle anymore. He played Denver, two years at Denver. Yeah, it's really interesting, Gabe. I think as a minimum salary, something in the –

maybe obviously we'll get minimum, but somewhere like the $3 million to $10 million range for him, I'd imagine some teams feel like, okay, we missed on someone. Let's go. Like if the Steelers missed on someone in the draft and don't figure out maybe Russell Wilson's their guy or the Vikings for a year. I just – at this point of his career,

what are you getting from signing him for a season or two? The answer to me is not enough to make it happen. him for a season or two the answer to me is is not enough to make it happen um so i it's not a great there's not someone will sign him gay but there's not a lot of great options for him right now and what's so interesting he did that interview with um um brandon marshall on and i watched most of it like russell came off as like a real person don't no we're not getting we're not doing that we're not doing that topic and um he seemed like a real person like I wish he showed more of that side of himself not the robot that he is at times in front of the media

we're not going there I don't know what topic you think I want to bring up I just don't want to talk about I know I don't even I really don't know where you're going with that. I'm already bored of talking about Russell Wilson. Okay, let's move on. My favorite joke, Hank shared it with us, is the meme, the illusion of free choice and it's the Steelers choosing between Russell Wilson and Kenny Pickett and going 9-8

and limping into the postseason either way and losing in the first round. That's what's going to happen, but fine. Let's all talk about it all offseason. Also, can i make just one rant real quick guys football fans we watch football because we like to see guys like run fast and hit each other and do incredible things and root for our team we don't watch football to be like novice accountants enough talking about dead cap space enough talking about like the salary cap you're not cpas you don't have excel spreadsheets just pick fantasy players make a few bets root for

your team and shut the f up i am so sick of people pretending that they're salary cap experts it's not interesting and you don't understand it just shut up rant. Rant over. I mean, fair enough. It's something I don't really pay attention to. I mean, it's also – the cap is real though. Ask the New Orleans Saints about it. I don't like to note the cap is not real, people. I'm with you. Like the dead cap and the cap is not real, people.

It's a lot. It's exhausting. It's too much. Okay. Let's get back to the combine. You mentioned him earlier. Schrager was there. He's one of the best in the biz at sort of unearthing things. And, uh, you know, his takes are always based on facts and things that he reported. Uh, but this is a spicy

one. Um, a GM told me this morning, this is the best offensive line group he's ever seen at the combine. That's what Peter Schrager was reporting a day or two ago. He also tweeted about how there's a dozen guys, a dozen who might have first round grades, and your specialty is talking offensive line and you must be just as wowed by this group

as Peter was. So, we don't need to do every single guy, but can you tell me why it is that the market for offensive linemen in the first round is so hot and which of these guys really stand out to you? All right. So I'll just list very quickly on the guys that I think might go in the first round.

We have Alt, Fashanu, Fuwaga, Mims, Fatanu, Latham, JPJ, Guyton, Barn, and Sua Mata from BYU. Sua Matia, sorry. Those are mostly guys that I've seen in the mock drafts for the first round so far. You know, Frazier is a center that's probably not going the first round. Not many guards, I would say, in the first round, mostly taggers. Now, some of these guys might play guard when they get to the NFL. You know, Fatanu might. He's a real candidate might play guard when they get to the NFL. You know,

Fata might, um, he's a real candidate for that. Fouaga might end up doing that. I do think it's a little bit rich to say just, this is the best online class of all time. And there's been years, 2008,

my year, there were eight offensive, uh, tackles dropped in the first round. I mean, there's been years with 2000, 2021, I think had Slater and Darish.

I mean, like a lot of good guys as well. So it's not just this year that we're seeing offensive line, but it's a year where the offensive line wide receiver, I mean, this is your year to get those guys. We're going to see maybe record numbers of those guys going in the first round. So it's a very good class. It's a deep class.

There are guys in day two that will be really game changers. But some of these guys I don't think have first-round grades. Remember, Gabe, it's worth pointing out, most teams have like 20 players with first-round grades. You might be drafting the first round without a first-round grade. So, for example, I don't think Guyton, I've watched some of him, has a first-round grade. I don't think Barton has a first-round grade.

But they might go in the first round because that's the best player on the board at the moment. The other guy that may be a first-round pick is Jordan Morgan from Arizona, probably tackled probably guard in the NFL. He's a maybe first-round pick. But to me, if you're sort of ranking the NFL. He's a maybe first-round pick. But to me, if you're sort of ranking them at, it's a little bit like Alt, Fashanu, to me, Fuaga,

and then Faltanu from Washington would be one through four for me. I've seen mock drafts, by the way, with Latham being the first guy, with Mims being the first guy. It's a super deep offensive line draft. Okay. We each play our roles here. I saw bunch of tweets about um mims walking around uh surrounded by normal size humans and he was enormous um yeah and all of us go like whoa like are we just falling for it or is there something special about this guy physically oh he's a freak buddy

he is a large human the thing about mims is it's crazy he's only he's only played 800 snaps in college football and that's like the lowest in a long time for a guy being drafted in the first round uh you gotta go back a lot of years i mean even got like kyle long started six games in college but he played in jc for a couple years. He had some experience. 800 snaps, that's all. The film is there. If you can find it, injured a lot last year, so two years ago, watched the Ohio State game, Georgia tackle Mims.

He's a freak. It's so funny how the draft narratives, just one draft narrative story. He's like 6'7", 5'8", I think. 6'7", 5'8", is what he was listed at. And then Joe Alt, the left tackle of Notre Dame, was like 6'8 1⁄2". And that's what his official number was.

So one inch difference, right? I mean, about. And the thing was like, is Joe Alt too tall? Is 6'8 1⁄2 too tall? Yeah, Mims like 6'7", 5'8". It's like, no, perfect size. Perfect size. It's like, no, just watch the film, guys.

Just watch the film. Joe Alt's not too tall to play offensive line. I do think some of the hype on some of these guys has gotten a little aggressive. I mean, Fulaga, I think that's really good. I think he definitely deserves to be a top 10 pick-ish. But the hype train on him is like out of control. I mean, you know, Faltano, same thing in my opinion. Guys are good.

But, like, after the combine, they had good workouts. Mims didn't really work out because I think he hurt his hamstring early in that. Fashanu as well. Both guys I think didn't do much of the wave drill and the offensive line position drills. But, yeah, it's a good – look, I'm telling you. I think if you look at right now – we'll do a draft show later with some props I would imagine uh as close to the

draft but i mean you're looking at maybe like just 10 defensive guys in the first round i mean you look at the wide receivers probably six four quarterbacks 10 offensive linemen you're now at 20 plus brock bowers that's not 21 um you know not not not a big defensive draft in the first round I should say all right same type of question I asked about quarterbacks floating around out there uh will be questions about Tyron Smith doesn't look like he'll be back in Dallas yeah obviously you know great player physical guy as well my question is not where will he go but rather wherever he goes how easy is it to move a guy from left tackle to another line position because you can get yourself a guy like tyron smith like how when do you start making that

having that conversation and how do you figure that out in training camp? Do you have a specific player you're thinking about? Like as a Chargers fan, you want Slater to move to right tackle? I don't know if that would be worth it. He seems like he's off to a great start at left tackle. But let's say the Chiefs, a team that's a great team but doesn't have anyone with his reputation at that position. Who gets it?

Well, Smith will stay at left tackle and Taylor will stay right tackle because Donovan Smith, the left tackle, had a one-year deal. He's out of there. The Chiefs are not signing Teron Smith. He's too injured for them. They don't sign injured players to those type of deals. So I've actually thought about this. If you're ring hunting yeah if you're

Smith that's the best way to go put do you go play right tackle for the Niners like do you do you like do you go do that for a couple years and remember he was a right tackle USC Matt Khalil was so good that Matt Khalil played left tackle and Smith played right tackle and and Toronto Smith's going to end up being a hall of famer in the end. And Khalil was very good early in his career as well. So I've got to say, I've got to give a shout-out to Colin Coward. He said something yesterday I thought was really interesting, and I've thought about this. The Cowboys might have had one of the best offensive lines in league history

to never, like, win playoff games. He mentioned this yesterday. He said, like, look through the history of the NFL at the best offensive lines. They win Super Bowls, the Hogs, the Great Wall of Dallas. The ones that haven't were the Chiefs in the early 2000s with Roof and Shields and Brian Waters and that rush. And the Cowboys who end up,

they're going to have two Hall of Famers, Zach Martin and Smith. And then Travis Frederick for so many years at center was the all pro, was the best guy. He obviously had to retire a little bit early. But even now, like they're not a – Tyler Smith, the left guard, all pro, pro bowler. Biatch at center is not bad.

Steele is good at right tackle. Did not even like win any playoff games. They've won a couple obviously. I'm exaggerating a little bit. That was a pretty good point by Colin. Who knew he was an offensive line guy? Offensive line guy. Yeah.

Long coward. In March, everyone has to become an offensive line guy? Offensive line guy. Yeah, you know. Long coward. In March, everyone has to become an offensive line guy. By September, thankfully, we don't have to talk about you guys. We can talk about wide receivers, which is what I think we should do now. I mean, do you want to talk about the NBA or do you want to talk about offensive linemen? I vote offensive linemen. Well, you're in company of one there. Let's talk about the wide receivers, all right?

Xavier Worthy broke the combine record with a 42140. All right. Great. He's very fast. And then he ran even faster than we thought. First of all, I don't know why human beings keep getting faster. I feel like at some point this is just fast enough,

but that's for another podcast. Obviously the debate is like, sort of like the, is alignment too tall? Can a wide receiver be too fast? And I, it's hard to say that given when, you know,

you look at a guy like Ty Hill, but most of the time, the really, really fast guys don't pan out. And the guys who do a better job of running routes and staying healthy do. Well, I think the question goes back to the film, right? Gabe is like, do we see the fast on film?

Because a lot of guys that bust, they're fast on film, but don't actually make many plays. You know, like there's not a lot of NFL skill set in how fast they are. I think Worthy has the NFL skill set, and he is fast. So also, too, where does he go? If he goes to Kansas City, probably going to be good. Goes to another team? I don't know.

Might not be. I think part of that is John Ross famously, right, left the 4-2, whatever it was, and went to the Bengals. It just wasn't a good situation for him. So I think that it's a good point you made, but you're not about to watch a film, right? Like, is he NFL fast? Does he make good cuts as a wide receiver?

Does he run good routes? Things like that. I think Worthy has that in him. It's just a matter of where he goes. As a Chiefs fan, I'll tell you what. I kind of want a big guy. Like, I want a bigger wide receiver than Worthy. Worthy, I think is like 170 pounds.

That's too little for me. the chiefs need someone bigger uh 6-1-1-72 yeah i i i don't i don't think the chiefs would draft him okay that's about what davante smith is right and about his size yeah but the chiefs need aj brown they don't need they don't need a Devante Smith. I need an AJ. Everybody needs AJ Brown. Well, that's my point. Like if you're choosing between two types of draft,

give me the AJ Brown player, not, not the Smith, but they have Rishi Rice. He's sort of the Smith player. They need a AJ Brown. All right. Does that make sense?

Yeah, I think so. We did the research, by the way, recent hall of famers, wide receiver position. Very, very few under 4'4". T.O. over 4'4". Isaac Bruce over.

Calvin Johnson, obviously, Megatron, just a hair under 4'4". He had everything, though. I don't think speed was the point with Calvin Johnson. Andre Johnson over. Devin Hester, even, over.in hester even over reggie wayne over tory holt a hair under but the speed like you said it was more tape like he ran the right routes he had a great quarterback uh can i give you um my favorite tweet from this weekend about the 40 times uh chuck bass ff tweeted this out uh quote jay rice ran a 471 end quote and then he said yeah

he was playing air when defenders were smoking crack cocaine before games those good good anecdotes yeah yeah he did not look here's something about about play speed right i think i've mentioned this before on many things i've done maybe here maybe not there's a great clip of great clip of the Rams drafting when they drafted Pukunukuwa last year. Now, he was a fifth round pick, a fourth round pick, and they like, look, his testing times weren't great, guys, but if you watch the film, he's open. He runs by everyone. So the play speed and the actual 40 time sometimes don't correlate. There's two more examples. One is Keon Coleman, Florida State's wide receiver, big kid. He ran a slower 40, like 4.61,

but they have the GPS units on the guys during the combine, and he was running the gauntlet drill, right? That drill where you catch a ball, you spin, you catch a ball, you run down the line, catch a ball, swim each side. He was the fastest wide receiver in that drill. So what do you take, Gabe? The GPS time when you're doing an actual football thing or the 40 time? Last one.

Last example of this. Patrick Mahomes was overlaid the entire combine. He made a joke about them not doing it. Of course, the NFL did it the entire time. Gabe, who would you take in a race in a game? Patrick Mahomes or anyone else chasing him? It's just Patrick Mahomes. No one catches Patrick Mahomes on the football field.

So does it matter that he ran whatever time he ran? No. How fast do you play on Sundays? So the 40, again, is a fun tool to have. It's a small data point in an entire combine profile. But all the teams have to have the GPS units units and times from these kids at college they all wear them during the games and so again the 40 time to me feels a little bit less important when you have all this other data yeah i got a follow-up question i can't even believe i've never asked

you and i don't think i've really ever heard anyone talk about before what is there some measurement or some way that people evaluate literal stamina in that? Like if you run a 4-4-40, if you can get out and get going at full speed on the first snap of the game, how close to full speed are you by the last snap of the game? And is there some way that you... The GPS units measure that. Well, I know, but historically historically that's like brand new stuff i'm talking about like no did jerry rice just hold the four seven the entire game no matter what my

guess is yes oh yeah yeah i mean just very famous workout routine yes right so are is there a way to spot a guy and i'm going to use marvin harrison j an example, where it's like, all right, he's a tenth of a second slower than some of these other dudes, but obviously he can just physically keep going and make incredible athletic plays the whole game long because of just how he's built and what he knows how to do and the kind of routes he runs, the contact he can avoid. Isn't that, I mean, how do we spot that?

Watching film and watching him run just as fast as he did at the beginning in the end it always comes out to film gabe very simple film boy that's it you guys really are gatekeepers with that i don't get to watch all the 22s i mean some of us get just watch highlights and post videos some of us watch all 22 you do what you can some of you guys get very upset with each other for posting your takes on what the film shows um i don't know no i i i don't get mad about other people's opinions on that i think i think when you when you compare someone to a third round draft pick who's gonna be drafted to overall that that's where i think the comparison argument sort of comes off to me but i don't get that mad about film text. I love film because, Gabe, we can watch the same

thing, come away with different opinions, which I think is fun about the draft process. Yeah, and watching shows like True Detective, for instance. Two people can watch it and have a very different opinion on what the hell happened. I saw someone wrote an article

and I think it was Rolling Stone about how great the ending was. I was like, maybe watch a different show. Yeah, I think they're just a little bit more hip than you and I. We don't need to take a break, Jeff. Let's keep rolling. We've got a couple other little items to get to. College football, the EA is coming out with a college football game, big deal.

For some reason, the story all week is that Arch Manning doesn't even play or hasn't even played is not participating in the game for business reasons like i i don't know he said he said he wants to focus on football um whatever man i i uh it just reminds me of john dowd do you get the john dowd reference no so mvp the best video game of the best sports game of all time mp05 baseball game obviously yeah barry bonds did not participate he was john dowd in the game for years he would not participate so he went he went with john dowd my favorite game even up to like i don't know five years ago my brother would each year would go through and redo the rosters and send me this the the memory card of the roster

current mlb roster so i could play i have a ps2 somewhere with the game still probably plug it in and play uh mvp has time for that i'm surprised that he knows this is before this is before i think he got married like when he before before marriage we didn't we didn't time to do that i see him he's busy i didn't know if there was something he could no squeeze into the schedule. Okay. All right. So there's nothing more on that. That's just Arch Manning wants to focus on football,

whatever the hell that means. It's such an unimportant story. Like, who cares? Well, Hank cares. I want to be nice to Hank. He did a good job laying out a rundown. We haven't asked him to do that for a few weeks. He came back strong.

He put some Texas stuff in there. Let's give him a little love. I talked about Texas at all tonight. It was the only time. There it was. Well, Xavier Worthy. It's not even quarterback one. No, he's not.

It's bizarre he hasn't switched schools. All right. Jason Kelsey. You loved him before most people loved him. Now the whole world loves him. He's saying goodbye, we think, for good. I take him at his word. This is it.

I think the hour-long press conference yesterday where he thanked everyone and was very emotional would announce his retirement that's official. No? I got a couple of press conferences that like to argue with you about that. But yes, I agree. I think Kelsey is already like 250 pounds pounds and he can just walk in whatever job he wants next year so i think he's going to be set for life i don't think far was walking into the set of amazon prime on thursday night football that wasn't quite the job he was looking for no uh i like that you said 250 and you didn't say this but the implication was he's already lost a lot of weight i think he has he looks like he's i think he was like 275 he played like he played really light and i think he

looks like he lost some more weight do you you're you're a media mogul do you what do you predict jason kelsey is doing media next year so the same he'll have his podcast like what's he what's doing for media what do you think well i have no inside knowledge even though i guess our world's sort of kind of start to touch yeah but no one has mentioned fox at all they've said only and other all of our networks i i have friends at all these places i haven't heard a thing and but my guess is he's smart enough to try the independent thing for a year see what his price goes up to he and travis obviously have a very successful show together he can obviously green light and and make other things happen should he say he wants to do them i don't necessarily believe he needs to

take what would be a very large paycheck for not a lot of work to be relevant a lot of guys do it so they can stay relevant so they can get something they want in the future i think jason has relevance so i think he can pick and choose it's a good it's a good i think amazon like thursday night football is where they're gonna wear me all the players already on there right with whitworth and and uh ryan fitzpatrick, I don't know how many of them are still going. And that feels like a good spot for him, especially if they're looking for another guy in the booth. I'm curious how many people these networks are trying to pay for his podcast, though.

Like Amazon will be like, you come work here, how much you want for your podcast? His podcast is really – I was walking the dog deer there. My neighbor, I had no idea that she even cared about sports, was listening to New Heights podcast. She's like, yeah, I love the podcast. I was like, do you even like watch sports? She's like, no, not really. I just saw the podcast and like it.

It's like, fantastic. We need to get her on my podcast. So look, one last thing on Kelsey. Kelsey is like the dream and hope for a lot of NFL players, right? A lot of us are not drafted in the first round. He was a later round draft pick, sixth round draft pick. And all he did, Gabe, was grind and work his ass off earlier in his career. He made his six All-Pros in his last seven seasons.

He was not like good, quotation marks marks like elite until 2017 right like he worked his ass off with different coaches different coordinator he had only two offensive line coaches Howard Mudd and Jeff Stoutland which like two hall of fame guys I mean it's the best you can ever have for two two offensive line coaches and all he did Gabe was bust his ass right was work his ass off to get to where he is. And I love that story. I was a later round pick too. And I wasn't as good as Kelsey, obviously. But just I like his work ethic, the way he went about his career.

Obviously, I like the other stuff about him. I think he's a great person, which is obviously very awesome. Root for. I love what he said about meeting his wife. I felt the same way about meeting him. I think we all felt the same way about meeting our wives. I just thought it was great just to hear him talk about his family, what they meant to him,

his Eagles family, what football meant to him. But more than anything else, I think for a lot of us, that's the path we dream for, right? We dream for his path. You get in the NFL, you get it any way you can,

and you work your ass off to get to a point where you're... He's a Hall of Famer now. I think we use first ballot way too much as an idea. He's not a first ballot Hall of Famer. He's a Hall of famer now i think we use first ballot way too much it's an idea he's not a first ballot hall of famer he's a hall of famer doesn't make it any less impressive like first ballot is like julius peppers right like the all the fourth all-time in sacks he's not gonna be a first ballot hall of famer he will be a hall of famer which is a heck of a thing again you don't for the first six seven years of his career no pro balls no all pros

and then boom 2017 takes off and um man he's a hell of a player i'll miss watching him play well well said and all i would add is i like anyone who whose career is kind of a middle finger to the so-called experts because here we just talked about the combine and how oh obviously this guy has it and this other guy doesn't. And, you know, I readily admit I don't know what the hell I'm talking about. I don't claim to be an expert. But there are plenty of people out there who do this for a living who are dead wrong about people like Jason Kelsey. And I like that people like Jason Kelsey become what they do and buck the conventional wisdom.

So for that, I would thank him. He's an inspiration on that front as well. I'm trying to. I'm trying with the offensive line stuff. We're making it in there. Look, we have a kicking specialist on CBS. We've been over this many times. We need an offensive line guy.

Centralized offensive line guy. Just come to me during a game, and I'll tell you it wasn't the offensive line's fault. It was the quarterback's fault. That's what everyone wants to hear. Why is it the fault of the quarterback? No, look, what Whitworth is doing, what Kelsey's doing, what Schlereth has done, what Ross Tucker's doing, it's fantastic that we're getting more offensive linemen.

I probably missed someone. I'm sorry if I did. But just like with Baldy, yeah, Baldy put offensive line. It's great, man. It's awesome, and the way we talk about the game is different, and I think Kelsey would be great in any role he has on any of these games. No question. He will tush-push a few more big guys like you into those booths,

and that's a good thing as well. Let's talk about the most important story of the week. You know, you really were the reporter on this for me um so i don't want to steal your thunder but i think you have an important update out of the iditarod that you'd like to share with us okay so this is a tweet um about the iditarod for those who don't know is a dog sled race in alaska it's like i remember we know we know what the iditarod no no you don't it's like 30 days in the wilderness it It's ridiculous. I could never do it. But basically in the first 24 hours, a

musher punched an aggressive moose in the face. The next musher had to shoot it, which means you have to stop the field dressage. And then the third musher's team ran into the carcass. So there is a rule in the Iditarod that in an event, an edible game animal,

moose, caribou, buffalo is killed in the defense of life or property, the musher must gut the animal and report the incident to a race official in the next checkpoint. Following teams must help gut the animal when possible. So if you run up on someone gutting a moose, you have to then gut the moose as well, which seems like a fair thing to do. And then no teams may pass until the animal has been gutted. And any other animal killed in the fence of life or property

must be reported to the right of the official but not need to be gutted. So I just love sports. They're just the best. You don't get this in any other walk of life. Everyone tweeting about love is blind. You don't get this in love is blind, okay? You get this in the n the night did a rod okay i am a big fan of anything that i can watch that reminds me

how much more manly you can be than i am that's one yes that's absolutely more mainly than us yes by like every element of this is something I cannot do. So first a man punched a moose in the face. So that's over one next shot. It like knew how to shoot a moose. You can shoot a moose if it was attacking your family. I could shoot at it. Like I'm not sure I know how to carry a weapon and shoot a moose,

but all right, I'd go 0 for 2. Maybe you're 1 for 2. I could shoot fine, yeah. Got it? No. No chance I know how to dress a moose. No idea how to do that. And then just riding around on dogs.

I don't know how to do that either. That's 0 for 4. Oh, and survive in freezing cold temperatures in Alaska. I don't think that the people that participate in Indira live on Venice Beach. Oh, and survive in freezing cold temperatures in Alaska. I don't think that the people that participate in Ditteron live in Venice Beach. So I think that there's just a different way of life. I do like watching those shows about people that live in Alaska. It's just not how I grew up.

It's not how you grew up. It's not how we live now. I don't live off the land. I don't know what I'm doing. Couldn't even keep chickens alive when I had them. But yeah, so the Iditarod, off to a bang, everyone. Off to a bang. If you were curious.

I should have bet on that Iditarod. That would have been fun. The next time we put a show together and talk football, let's make sure we get an update on how the Iditarod concluded. It lasts a while, right? They're out there for a long time. 20 days, I think. As long as it depends on how long, how long is the, I mean, it depends how long you do do it. It's, it's a thousand miles. The closest thing I've ever done to an Iditarod in my life is play the game Oregon Trail in middle school.

Yeah, but you can just... So it takes between 8 and 15 days. I think it'd take you and I about three months. The fastest one took 7 days, 14 hours, 8 minutes. Okay. All right, listen, I want to call it here before i feel even less of a man um i enjoyed uh getting smarter on the combine with you i enjoy getting back with you a little closer to draft to talk about uh all the news that's changed but none of it's going to change

let's just come up with new takes about it how about that yeah we have we have enough for agency though so we'll have something to do coming up in a couple of weeks. And March Madness, maybe we'll hit some March Madness wagers in our next show. I'm all in on the women's tournament. Don't care about the men. I actually thought about this on the women's side. I was looking at the women's odds. So a lot of times one player can sort of get you pretty far.

You've been on the Juju Watkins. Like USC to get to a final four, I don't think they're beating South Carolina. South Carolina's just too deep. But like USC feels like a team, all like a Caleb Clark. You just have like one player that just takes you to the promised land. USC, if you're looking for women's final four futures,

not a bad wager. Great wager. And mark this because Jeff never says anything nice about USC, and he just did, so you know he means it. I don't. And the Pac-12 was good in women's basketball this year, so that's a way to end it with a bang, everyone. Alright, guys, we'll talk to you

in two weeks? One week? We'll let you guys know. Talk to you guys then. Take care, everybody. care everybody