Geoff Schwartz Is Smarter Than You - Games in Empty Stadiums, Regular Season Schedules & Rooney Rule Proposals

Episode Date: May 18, 2020

After a two-week hiatus, Geoff & Gabe are back to break down why the NFL regular season schedule is more than it seems, how crowd-less games might impact the league and the what effect proposed Rooney Rule changes could have moving forward. NFL Regular Season Schedule: (0:45) Burrow, rookies learn playbooks remotely: (10:20) Empty stadiums: (18:00) Rooney Rule expansion: (25:38) 'Move the Line' betting segment: (35:30) NFL Network's Tom Pelissero reported Monday (after our taping) immediate rule changes to the Rooney Rule requiring clubs interview at least two external minority candidates for head coaching openings and at least one minority candidate for any coordinator job. Brady, Manning: (1:20) Cam Newton: (12:17) Dak Prescott: (23:51) LeBron James: (32:33) Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

it's monday may 18th and this is jeff schwartz is smarter than you i am jeff schwartz alongside as usual gabe gooden we have a great show for you guys back after two-week hiatus and we got an nfl schedule we were gone something to look forward to whether or not people will be there in person we'll have to find out. Web training is the new normal for the NFL rookies, and the league is finally exploring new options for minority coaching candidates. That's all next. Gabe, how you been, buddy? I don't want to get too excited because, you know, a lot can change, but we're making progress. Hopefully you're healthy. I know you're healthy. Hopefully the people listening are healthy and behaving. Yeah, but so to the league league the schedule is supposed to start on time

um they sent out the schedule they built a 16 week regular season they gave us the playoffs but if you paid close attention or you listen to some of the smart people i try to follow on twitter you figured out that you know they're preparing for everything here so there's some contingencies it was made to. We know that all week two opponents share bye weeks. That way they can slide that week two matchup to later in the season if they need to and just remove the bye week. We know that weeks three and four have no divisional games, meaning those games could basically just vanish altogether. They don't need to play them because they wouldn't determine the postseason. We know that the Pro Bowl can just go away. It's that

week between the championship round and the Super Bowl. We never really the Pro Bowl can just go away. It's that week between the championship round and the Super Bowl. We never really needed in the first place. So by the way, one more thing to think about. Week five, currently, the Thursday night game is Tom Brady and the Bucs in Chicago. Be a wild game. I think what I'm throwing at you here is, Jeff, the season's going to happen, but it's going to start one month late. And they know it. And that's what we need to get ready for. I mean, it's set up in that way, obviously, right?

It's set up in a way to make it to where they can easily chop off the first half, excuse me, first month of the season. But I'll tell you this, Gabe, is that I would actually be surprised if they didn't chop off a little bit in the back end of the season. If we see projections for the fall, even South Carolina, University of South Carolina said today on Monday that they plan to end in-person classes around Thanksgiving and transition to remote learning because projections for coronavirus go back up in early December when flu season hits. So I think the NFL would be more likely to cut off the back end of the schedule, which is tougher to do, obviously, because you didn't schedule out these non-division opponents

and you don't have a week 15 bye week. But they are setting themselves up for a runway if they do have to cancel early games. The reason why it would be canceled, in my opinion, is not because you can't play the games per se, but because guys are not ready yet. They haven't been in training camp. They haven't prepared yet. You know, if you can't get guys back into facilities by August 1st, it'd be hard to play on time.

And every state is doing it differently, right? We have Arizona, Florida kind of open right now. I mean, I'm in North Carolina. We go phase two on Friday. Restaurants, bars, retail open back up again at a limited capacity. But California is in the other direction, right? California is not up again in a limited capacity. But California is in the other direction, right? California is not really doing very much right now.

You're in California, you know. So every state's a little different right now. So the NFL is allowing themselves a little bit of runway here if they do have to kind of chop off a little bit of the schedule. But what I find more fascinating than the schedule, Gabe, is what happens if California's out? Like the Rams, they leave town, I would would assume the Chargers leave town I assume the 49ers leave town one goes Salt Lake City one goes to Vegas and shares with the Raiders and one goes to Arizona I mean I like

what happens if California's like we're not playing games for the first month of season yeah well I mean we've already seen some governors like the the one in Florida basically sort of say, hey, everyone, you're welcome to play your professional sports games here. Like, OK, man, you know, have those conversations in private and figure out the politics of that before you just tweet about it. But but no, I don't. Obviously, I don't know what happens to teams that play in states that aren't allowed to be open with or without fans. And we're going to get to the part about maybe we're playing, but without fans. And what does that mean on the field for the players? We're going to get to that shortly. But let me go back to one other thing that you sort of alluded to. Coaches are not in agreement on how this should go. And I think Mike Tomlin raised a very interesting point

I'd like to hear your view on, which is how can any team be allowed to open and sort of function as normal if not all teams can do the same? Depending on where your facility is might change very much. Even if you're up to league standard, you might not be up to local authority standard. And is it unfair for some teams to be able to work out together while other teams have to wait? What are your thoughts on that? Well, and that's very valid.

And that's what we're seeing now. The NFL tomorrow, on Tuesday the 19th, is quote-unquote opening back up their facilities. And they're not allowing coaches in because not every state is allowing people back into facilities like the NFL. So they're not allowing coaches in. They're not even really allowing strength coaches in. They're only allowing players in for rehab.

They're allowing the rehab staff in. There's a limited capacity of players that can show up to the facility. And we're seeing this in the NBA. We're seeing this in Los Angeles. The Lakers and Clippers are going back to work this week. Now, is that a precursor for the Rams possibly going back to work soon? The Chargers going back to work soon? Maybe. But I agree that the NFL cannot allow coaches to go in the facilities now if other teams can't be uniform. I think like 22 or 23 or 32 teams are allowed to kind of have people back in the building. But like the Panthers, for example, here in Charlotte, they're allowed to.

They're not going to have anyone in the building. They're still going to be closed. You know, players have to get back to the cities they're in. Players have to find a way to, you know, to find lodging if they're young kids, don't really have a place right now. You know, what do rookies do? There's a lot of things up in the air right now for that. So I agree with Tomlin that you really can't just say,

hey, only teams that are open now, you can go back to work, but other people can't. The issue becomes, like I mentioned, Gabe, is that what happens when training camp shows up? What happens August 1st when, hey, guys, we have training camp and two or three states are still closed? I think the NFL is going to tell the Rams, the Chargers, and the Niners, go find another home.

I mean, I could easily see a team up in Salt Lake City where Utah has barely even been closed whatsoever. They have a nice stadium up there, Rice-Eccles. One team, like I said, in Vegas. Maybe a team goes to Colorado. Maybe a team goes to Arizona. I think we could see a situation where that plays out, where every state is quote-unquote open,

but California, even Governor Cuomo today in New York was like, I want sports back. I expect sports to be back without fans. So everyone is signaling that there is an idea of trying to get people back on the field, except California. California, minus the Lakers and Clippers, which should be positive, is saying, hey, look, we're trying to find a way to make this happen.

I'm a native Californian. You're in California. I wish they would be more open, but they have their own set of data and they're sticking by it right now. Yeah. Well, living here at the moment, I'm actually kind of pleased that they're being extra cautious because it's my life that is in everyone's hands. So, you know, we don't need to get into the politics of all that. I'll just say, like, I'm fine going slow because I can afford to be that way. I understand people getting frustrated. The questions I have, though, relate really to this idea of readiness and what the real life impact on football teams will be if you can't start on time. And as that offseason, which is pretty scripted. and what the real-life impact on football teams will be if you can't start on time.

And as that offseason, which is pretty scripted, I mean, those who know the NFL well understand that it's like day by day from really now until the beginning of the season. And when you start trying to condense that, we've talked a bit about this in the past, what does that do for people's physical and mental readiness? And we'll touch on it with rookies, but how can we get guys healthy in football respect by September, whatever kickoff day was? Like, how is that possible? Well, we had a lockout in 2011. I was part of that lockout. Now, gyms and facilities were still open, right? Life was going on, except we didn't have a CBA, a collective bargaining agreement. So we were able to work out facilities. And yeah, we came into camp that year

and we started a little slower than usual, but we picked things up afterwards and we were fine. The problem now is that gyms aren't open, right? And there are guys that are getting their workouts in, but they're not the same as they'd be working out at the facility. They're not the same as working out, you know, at a gym with a trainer.

And we're seeing right now in the KVO, the Korean Baseball League, that there's a high rate of injuries, lower body injuries, hamstrings, calves, because those are injuries you get when you're not training properly. When you're asked to go full speed, when you haven't done it enough,

those injuries that you get, I would suspect we're gonna see a rate of soft tissue injuries much higher this year. And even ACL, because a strong quad can help prevent, if possible, expect we're going to see a rate of soft tissue injuries much higher this year you know and even acl because a strong quad can help prevent if possible an acl injury guys might not be as strong right now as they have in the past you might see more core injuries core muscle injuries in the stomach region which is what i had a surgery for at some point because guys maybe aren't in as shape as they as they don't so i think it's a legit concern that's why i think i speak a lot

on the college side and then sec might be back in a couple weeks but you know college football starts earlier than the nfl at least the regular season right starts like labor day weekend or even a week zero before that and they got to be back like july 15th in my opinion to get going i say the nfl has got to be back by by August 1st because they can theoretically chop off preseason games if guys aren't ready yet. But also, they're pros, right? Guys are working out right now. A funny way to do it. On the college side, kids are at home with their parents, right? I mean, they're trying to work out, do what they can, but realistically, they're not doing as much as they should. So I would say by August 1st, Gabe, they got to be back. Otherwise, I'd be

really concerned about starting the season on time. And maybe it's, you know, you chop off a preseason game and you say, look, we're going to work on getting back. Also, I mentioned this one last thing. The new CBA allows for an acclimation period, a five-day acclimation period of ramping up to camp. That could be very helpful now where you're not in contact for the first five weeks, but even, I mean, first five days. Even then, I mean, if a guy's hamstring is not ready,

five days of ramping up is not going to get it ready when you put on pads. Yeah. Well, we're going to come back to what it will be like when they get into the stadiums and how healthy they are and what the play looks like and the fact that those of us who like to sit in the stands might not be allowed to. I want to come back to that because I think you've given us

a better segue to talk about those rookies and readiness come back to that because I think you've given us a better segue to talk about those rookies and readiness and the acclimation period that you've been describing. So I will put to you that this will be the hardest season ever to be an NFL rookie, and that's probably because you said it to me a couple weeks ago on this show. But let's go further with that. Where we stand currently, no rookie minicamps,

OTAs are on hold or not going to happen um guys are learning playbooks essentially by themselves or over zooms with coaches it's very complicated from what i i'm hearing rookies to be so guys who were just drafted and are waiting to sort of get to the facility are kind of like working out in their backyards or making stupid workout videos with their friends throwing crap at them on Instagram just to troll you. It's not great. It's already hard to be a rookie. Now we're talking about a shorter preseason window

and less time in the facility with the coaches to get up to speed. So forget the injury risk that's dangerous. You already touched on it. I just want to talk about being able to play at the right level. I would argue that Joe Burrow specifically should be very careful not to let his career get David card this year. This is already not a great team that he's playing for. It's hard to imagine he can be ready.

I know he read the playbook, you know, even before he was drafted. Stop. I would say no rush at all for Joe Burrow or pick a few more star players like Tua. Chill, guys. Come back week whatever. Get yourself right. Don't be in a rush to be there week one if the season starts. Well, let's start with Joe Burrow since you mentioned him.

You mentioned the reading the playbook thing. I think I sent you guys the tweet when I saw it and it was like rolled my eyes, right? Like a rolling eye emoji. Like, come on. Like, really? Really? And even his coach, Zach Taylor, I think told Peter King told Peter King like yeah it's great he's reading it but until you see it happen in front of you via walkthrough via practice via preseason game or regular game

it's not the same as just reading a playbook right if you read a playbook like I have a notebook right here I actually have plays written on my notebook if you don't know the scheme about how you're doing certain things on this. I literally have plays written down. It's useless, right? Like if you don't understand the coaching point of why you're doing it, which typically you get that from the coach actually being in the room with you and teaching you, not via Zoom or, you know, or especially teaching you in a walkthrough. It doesn't matter if you can memorize what you're doing, right? You have to do it when people are in front of you and moving around.

And that's really tough. But I will say, Gabe, I'm on the line thinking that you are. It's going to be tough for rookies. But in 2011, I mentioned Lockout again, Cam Newton came in on the Panthers, the team I was on, and had a great rookie season with the same situation. The difference obviously becomes that he could work out at Auburn during this entire time where Joe Burrow probably is not getting a workout in right now at LSU. So there's slight differences in that where Cam was probably throwing with pro wide receivers.

He could go meet Steve Smith somewhere and throw with him for a week. They can't even do that right now. At least they can't do it in public, right, where anyone could see it. So there's that concern as well. But I think for me, as a seventh round draft pick, the biggest issue, in my opinion, is the lower round draft picks that will not have an opportunity to make a team this year because there's not the reps available for those guys to make the team. There's even less reps now in the new CBI. I mentioned the five day acclimation period. There's less padded practice.

That was more off days. So a typical camp practice early in training camp, let's say there's a 15-play period. It's like five reps for the ones, five for the twos, and five for the threes. And then it might go like six, and then five, and then four. Eventually the three reps as the camp goes on get shorter. A 20-play period, five for the ones, five for the twos, three for the threes, and then what, seven for the ones,

right? So there's not a lot of reps for the threes. But now you have a period where you come into training camp, and the ones have taken no reps in the offseason, and you have a game in 15 days. From the start of training camp to your first preseason, it's 15 days. Most of the reps are going to go to veteran players early in camp because they have to get ready to play the preseason games and also the regular season. If you have a new coach, a new staff, those reps are going to veteran guys to get them ready to play.

They have not been on the football field in six months. They need those reps to play. Younger guys that are fighting to make the team, they're not going to get practice reps anymore. They won't get those five reps anymore. Those reps are going to the ones now, or the twos to get those guys ready to play. So there's even less opportunity now for guys to make the squad.

And look, I've told you this before, no surprise. It's a 53-man roster. 47 of those spots are taken before training camp arrives, okay? Now the last six are up for grabs. And those six, a lot of times, are those reps the threes get, and then you get promoted to the twos, and then you start doing special teams. You play well in the preseason game.

And so I think that's where it's going to hurt a lot of guys. We're going to see a lot of guys. We saw in the draft this year, Gabe, a record low number of FCS players drafted, like we called, like we talked about. And I think we're going to see not a record number. It's hard to measure. But a lot of players not make teams this year's undrafted for Asia

or lower round draft picks that would have made it. The top guys, one, two, three round, even though Joe Burrow might not be ready, right? He's not going to get cut. And even the third round, he might not be ready. It's not going to be cut. But seventh round draft pick, not ready. They might go sign a veteran. I think we're going to see a rash of veteran signings here as camp continues, because

we're going to see teams like, you know what? We can't trust a seventh round draft pick. Well, let's go sign a veteran on a cheap deal. Yeah. It's interesting to hear you say that. So then to bring it back to the big name guys that dorks like me try to obsess over, because I think those fifth, sixth, seventh round picks, everything you've told us in weeks past has come true. I predict everything you've just said will be right. and we'll all see that in a few weeks. Let me go back to the big name guys for a second. When I was growing up watching football, same as you, it was like obvious that your first rookie quarterback was not going to start games. Like, why would you ever do that?

You can't throw him in the fire. And then a few examples happen. I mentioned Dave Carr half jokingly at the top. That doesn't go very well. And then at some point in the last several years, I don't know if it's just by luck or by somehow they're getting ready. We're starting to see rookies start, start week one, have great rookie seasons, be pro bowlers by their second year. Like, do you think it's going to go back the other way again? And do you think we're going to make Joe Burrow sit longer than he would have if he drafted two years ago? No, I think there's so much pressure to play now because we see a lot of winning happen when the quarterbacks are cheap and cheap the first five years of their career. We're seeing a lot of guys, a lot of teams just go for it, right? Pat Mahomes, you can argue Carson Wentz and the Eagles,

Russell Wilson on a rookie contract. We're seeing teams really get to the dance with guys on young deals. I think that the coaches want to rush in the new quarterback. They want to play that guy right away. Oftentimes, they're the guy they drafted, right? There's pressure publicly, pressure from the owner. And so we see now waiting, Pat Mahomes waiting for a year is nearly impossible now.

I mean, Joe Burrow, they cut Andy Dalton. I mean, who's going to play? Joe Burrow, it's Joe Burrow's job. Tua at least has Fitz there for a little bit and Herbert has Tyrod Taylor. But I think out of all those quarterbacks, Burrow's playing week one, whether he's ready or not. Well, good luck to him because it just seems like

it's going to be an absolutely impossible task. And from what I can tell, Zach Taylor's offense isn't like some simple thing. I mean, he's supposedly some offensive genius, so I can't imagine he's got a real simple playbook. But what do I know? It's a Sean McVay playbook. There you go. Okay. All right. Let's just quickly, this is a mini topic here thrown in.

So based on these conversations, we're imagining it's going to be hard to get ready, but players will. And then even if they don't start until week five, let's say, of what should be week five, they will eventually play. But even if that happens, probably most of us aren't at the games. So we're assuming right now that all stadiums will either be empty or almost completely empty. Go read up on which stadiums might be. However, obviously, every city is handling this differently. But what I want to talk to you about is the quote unquote home field advantage. This is something that we fans tell ourselves is relevant and that we have some sort of impact on the game.

I think it's a little bit hocus pocus but experts at draft kings who obviously manage you know things like the line say that a three-point home favorite could become a one and a half point home favorite when you eliminate the noise and the chaos of being the home team they think this is real i guess i'll ask you is home field advantage going to be something that goes away if there are no fans in the stands and does that favor teams that are really great on offense? Because I guess defense is helped by a loud crowd more than offense. I got more on this, but go ahead. Defense definitely feeds off the emotion of the game more than the offense.

The offense is more even keeled. Last year, we saw actually unprecedented level of home field advantage not matter at all. Did not matter last year. Big, big, big favorites were winning on the road. And so, look, we're going to get sports back without fans, in my opinion, 100%. I don't think we're going to see fans the entire... And as we're doing this right now, Gabe,

California, Governor Newsom announced the sports might be back in June. As we're doing this right now in California. Just announced it right now. Breaking news. Just announced it right now. Breaking news. Just announced it. So everything I said about California earlier, I'm sorry, California, but who knows if this is going to come case.

But look, no fans, right? No fans. No one's having fans. So I'll tell you what. I watched the KBO, the Korean Baseball League. I watched the German Soccer League. I don't know what the name of it is. Bundesliga.

Bundesliga. I watched NASCAR and I watched the golf. The golf was boring for me, but I watched all four events, okay? Golf didn't get less boring just because of the weather. But I watched four, right? Four, I guess. I'm doing four. If you're watching on the camera, I'm doing four. Very weird

on the camera. Four events. I did not really notice fans weren't there. I mean, soccer stadiums were huge, right? It's easy to see they weren't there. But also having for sports to be back. As a fan, I don't think we will care very much to not watch football with fans. Now, players, on the other hand, it's going to be very, very odd. So on the pro side, I do not think it will matter as much.

If you look at the NFL, New Orleans, Kansas City, Seattle have three great home field events, right? It's loud there. It's also hard to play. Most places, though, aren't really that loud. They're not that crazy. Yes, you feed off the emotion of the crowd if you're at home or away, and that's definitely part of the game, right?

You know, when a good play happens, the crowd's fired up, you feel it in your blood. When a bad play happens and you're on the, you know, and you, excuse me, when you're on the road team and you have a good play and the crowd's really quiet, you feel great, right? But in the NFL, we are pros and we're there to do our job. And we're used to doing our job in a lot of teams that really, they're full, but not very loud. What's really going to affect people is on the college side, which is we're not really

a college podcast, but on the college side, dude, it's going to be a huge, huge problem. You're a college football fan. You know this. College kids are 18, 22 years old. They are up and down emotionally. And a lot of that is crowd noise. We see so many upsets at home, obviously, right? Because the crowd is so into it. You know, they're hyping up all week and the emotions of the game. And, you know, you have a huge play and the crowd builds up and the other side they're 18 to 22 years old the crowd's loud you know you can't hear yourself think and then you just start making errors and then you lose the game on the pro side though we're pros we should be used to playing in the noise a lot of places aren't very loud

where the noise affects everyone in my opinion is this is why it might hurt some teams it might not depends on on how well you can deal with this or how well you have to deal with this in the past. Is a place like Seattle, it's going to hurt a place like Seattle or New Orleans or Kansas City. I'll tell you why. Seattle, the noise, for my money, that's a lot of stadium.

I know the Chiefs have the record. Congratulations. Chiefs fans hate that I talk about this, but Seattle's louder. Seattle, like it builds a game. It builds all game. It's like about this, but Seattle's louder. Seattle, like, it builds a game. It builds all game. It's like just every drive just gets louder. Every play, louder and louder and louder.

And then just like there's like a crescendo of noise. And the entire time you can't help yourself think. And so you can't make the judgments on the field as quickly as possible. You can't yourself think. You can't catch a breath. You can't just you can't yourself think. You can't catch a breath. You can't just take a quiet moment yourself and just like take a deep breath and like relax because it's just noise is rattling

in your ear the whole time. And Seattle just continues, it just builds and builds and builds and builds. And then when they, when they make plays, I call an avalanche. Like the noise just hits you like a ton of bricks and you just go to shit most of the time in Seattle. Now, last year, Seattle lost a bunch of home games. So maybe last year was a bad example for that. But I'm telling you, when I played there, when Legion of Boom, you know, New Orleans

has been that way forever. Kansas City, obviously, who lost three home games last year as well. So maybe home field is not as important, like I said, but traditionally speaking, in a couple of places places the crowd can really be involved okay well i'm glad to know that that's not just a lie that we tell ourselves as fans and the places you id are actually as as tough to play as you mentioned i want to throw one last thing at you and we're going to kind of shift gears to a little bit more of a serious topic but last thing here my own hot take this is not normally i'm sort of summing up what the internet thinks and trying to fire it at you to interpret it. This is just my theory. I would be fading the teams that rely on precision, a really complicated playbook, really precise, timed out passing games.

I would be fading those teams and betting hard on any team that's built around athleticism and playmakers. Now, I know sometimes it isn't one or the other, but that means to me, watch out Chiefs offense. I don't think so this year. Not if you don't have the reps that you need. And bet those Ravens. That's just the Lamar show. I don't care what, I mean, if everyone else is a little slower,

he's going to look that much faster. So I know this bothers you because your Chiefs are in trouble and the Ravens are going to look even better. But this crap offseason, this is truly how I feel. This crap offseason is going to favor the teams that aren't as complicated

on offense. It's just about running and making plays. Yes? Yeah. But the thing with the... Sort of, because I think this offense

is going to favor teams that have the return 22 out of 20 starters, which the Chiefs do. All right. Well, there you go. 20 out of 22 starters. I think it's going to favor teams that are the return 22 out of 20 starters, which the Chiefs do. All right. Well, there you go. 20 out of 22 starters. I think it's going to favor teams that are veteran.

I know the Chiefs have a timing offense, but they've been doing it for many years now. They've had Pat Mahomes' third season starting now. Okay, that's fair. I think that – but I agree with your point, the general point, that the Ravens' offense is – they're running the football, right? They're coming at you. They're going downhill.

There's no, like, being cute and figuring things out. And maybe the offense changes a little bit after the playoffs. But no, I agree with that general point. I think veteran teams are really going to have a huge advantage. the experts are saying is going to be worth a point or two, the lack of a home field advantage. And think about what Jeff just said about veterans on the starting offense. And if you think anything I said matters, think about timing and precision because if these guys don't have a chance to get ready, it could be several weeks before they get all that back. All right, Jeff, let's just shift gears a little bit.

We're going to go to an area we don't normally go on this show, but I think it's the biggest topic in football right now. And it's worth us talking about. I know you have some thoughts. The NFL has four minority coaches right now, despite 70% of its players being black. Just let that sink in for a second. There were five head coaching jobs filled since the end of last season. Three went to white guys who were coordinators or college coaches. One went to Mike McCarthy, a former NFL coach, and the other went to Ron Rivera, also former NFL coach. Ron Rivera, the only man of color in that

group. So in an attempt to address the obvious problem the NFL has with the lack of coaches and GMs of color in the league, the NFL's Workplace Diversity Committee proposed a plan that unfortunately was almost immediately criticized by everyone from all angles. Some of those criticisms are fair and we'll get to them, but according to the reported proposal, which gets voted on tomorrow, teams that hire a non-white head coach could move up six spots in the third round of the NFL draft after the coach kept the job for a year. If they hired a non-white GM, same situation, but it's 10 spots in the third round a year later. Needless to say, Twitter, who doesn't like any new idea, really didn't like this one, but it actually

got criticism from every end of the conversation. There were people who thought, not my words, this was insulting or condescending to African-American candidates. This was an insufficient attempt to fix the ineffective Rooney rule. Others thought this was more of the NFL trying to live by PC culture or that this was quote unquote bribery to make teams care about diversity. None of those are my words or exactly how I feel. So Jeff, I'll just start with you. How did you feel when you read this story? So, Jeff, I'll just start with you. How did you feel when you read this story? Well, look, first and foremost, I'm glad that they are looking at the problem. Because definitely, to your point, it's a huge issue.

It's a huge problem in the NFL. And there obviously is some sort of racial bias, whether it's from the very top, whether it's just 100 years of the NFL, whatever it is, it's there, right? But I think if we dig deeper, there are some things in this that I do sort of like, okay? The draft pick stuff is insulting. I agree. Is a team going to choose a different head coach because they move up six spots in the draft?

Absolutely not, okay? But it's addressing some of the problems with why there are not enough candidates for these jobs. The problem with that is that we do not have a lot of minority coaches that coach on the offensive side of the ball, right? We do not. And incentivizing teams to hire coaches that coach that side of the ball, because we see a lot of NFL coaches are coming from the offensive side of the ball, is a huge improvement in my opinion. It's addressing part of the problem. A lot of it too is nepotism, right Gabe? Is that the head coaches have their sons who eventually become coaches, who typically become offensive coaches, and then they get the jobs eventually, right? We see it

throughout the NFL history. So addressing that there is an issue at the lower positions, quarterback coach, wide receiver coach, of not having minorities in that position is very helpful. But I think the number one thing in this proposal that I like the best, and I think the topic, the draft pick thing is convoluted and a little bit insulting. I'm with people that disagree with that part of it. It's right here. I'm going to read it right here. here. I'm going to read it right here. Among other diversity-related items being proposed Tuesday, according to a source, removing a rule that allows teams to block assistant coaches from interviewing for other teams' coordinator positions, requiring multiple interviews

of minority candidates for a coaching position, explaining the ruling rule to include coordinator positions. The thing I like there, removing the rule that allows teams to block assistant coaches from interviewing for other teams' coordinator positions. So right now, Gabe, if you're a quarterback coach of the Rams, and a team wants to interview you, the Chargers want to interview you to be the offensive coordinator, the Rams head coach, they can say, nope, not happening. You can't do it. We're blocking you. The only time a coach cannot block another coach on their staff is for the head coaching job. Well, most people aren't interviewing a quarterback coach

to be the head coach, right? But now you can at least interview to be the office coordinator or go out to a contract situation or be the head coach. So I think there's certain things in the proposal that are very helpful to fixing the issue of not enough minority coaches in the NFL. But I still think it has to go deeper. It has to go deeper. You need more coaches on the offensive side of the ball that are groomed to be head coaches. And we have a couple now, Byron Lefkowitz

and Eric Biennemi. But incentivizing teams to move up six spots in the draft, 12 spots in the draft, I mean, do you really think Gabe, a team, is not going to hire a person of color because they want to move up six spots? That's insulting. That part of it I did not agree with. When you think about this proposal, which will be voted on tomorrow, what do you think about what they're trying to do? Well, I think it's so hard for me to ever give the league or its various entities credit for doing the right thing in this space because I don't see a lot of evidence that they have. But this does feel like an attempt to give a different group of people a voice to raise an issue that will be voted on by all the owners. Now, this will take 24 owners voting yes for this to go into place. And according to most things I've read, that isn't going to happen because most people think, like you just said, this notion of compensating picks and third round picks, it's a little bit convoluted.

I'm not going to go so far as to say it's insulting or not. I think people have earned the right to say that. I'm not one of those people. But I do think that it's nice to see a people are willing to get into the guts of that conversation is encouraging. But I'm with you. This plan with picks seems unlikely. If your number one choice for your coach or your GM is available to you, you're not improving six picks in the third round to go to the second choice.

Like, that's insane. I'm not willing to tell people they should feel insulted by that. That's not for me, but that isn't rational. That's not going to be how an owner thinks. And something that I, that I text you guys that I think I had not mentioned yet, that I think is important to consider here is that we're at an era now where we have an all-time high in, in the high-level African-American quarterbacks in the NFL, right?

I mean, it's never been better. Look at Lamar, Pat Mahomes, Deshaun Watson, Russell Wilson, Dak Prescott, right? There's more than ever. I'm sure I left guys out. I'm sorry if I did. And that these quarterbacks are going to spawn a new generation of quarterbacks as well. And we're going to see, I think, more quarterback coaches that are minorities from these guys just playing the quarterback position.

And I think, I'm telling you, that's the number one problem, is we need to have, it's not really a problem, but I think it's the best solution, is that we need to have more running back coaches and quarterback coaches that are people of color, minorities, to then allow them to be interviewed for the jobs. We're going to keep hiring offensive guys. It's not a very, it's not a very, it sounds like a simple solution. But if we're going to keep hiring offensive guys, we need to have people in the positions to get hired, right, for those jobs.

And so now you get to interview quarterback coaches. right for those jobs and so now you get to interview quarterback coaches but i think that this new generation of lamar jackson of all the guys i just mentioned pat mahomes dac to sean watson i think that'll lead to to more coaches of color in those positions i hope so because if you look right now what you got you got eric bnme and byron lefkowitz right off the top of my head are the two guys right now that are that-Americans that are OCs, right? But after them, like, again, there's no pipeline of guys underneath them that are ready for these jobs. So we need to improve that pipeline however possible as part of this proposal. And I think that there needs to be a segmented way to do this and not just vote for the entire thing all at once.

Because the entire thing all at once, if it gets voted down, some of the stuff that's really good in here is going to be lost. There are some good spots in here where there are some improvements. And I hope that this doesn't all get voted down. Yeah. Well, you know, another thing that people need to think about, the black head coaches that I have seen in the league in my lifetime, overwhelmingly, I can't say exclusively, but overwhelmingly were players in the league and pretty good players in the league. There's quite a few white head coaches, including some of the most successful of all time, who never played in the league.

Right. Their biggest connection might be that their dad was involved in a team. So if you say to yourself, guys who are who are questioning about qualifications and sort of putting rules in place on who qualifies and who doesn't and what certain experience matters versus others, consider the fact that apparently in most cases with black head coaches, you needed to have played in the league. But with white head coaches, you needed to have played in the league, but with white head coaches, maybe that's not relevant. You know, with black head coaches, you need to have more years waiting than white coaches who, wow, look at this boy genius. And

I'm not going to name names, but we see a lot of white boy geniuses hired in this league. It's time for people to just, you know, step step back don't immediately assume the worst and just say hey is this fair all right let's move the line um jeff these are all sort of silly uh because what the hell are we supposed to talk about right now we'll go quickly through them i want to know nascar races jeff watches without baseball being played until July? Over, under, one and a half. Well, I watched yesterday. My girl, I was watching on a different TV, and she saw, and she goes, hey, Daddy, are those

race cars? I said, yeah. And she goes, I want to watch race cars. And so we watched race cars for a little bit. I actually, believe it or not, I made a bet on the race yesterday, I was told uh buddy todd firman we all know todd firman been doing this for years he said hey schwartz bet kevin harvick and guess who won kevin harvick won plus 600 right into the bank so i'm now folding on nascar so

all the way it's in charlotte this weekend um i think i think i'm not even sure i'm allowed to realize but i think my wife's clinic is like doing some of the testing at the racetrack this week to see if people are healthy or not. They're doing temperature checks and whatnot of other racers, the race cars this weekend. And yeah, man, so I'll watch this week. This weekend's race is long, though. It's a 600.

It's 400 laps, 600 miles. That's a lot of laps. I've been to this one before it is i i'm not a nascar person i went for half the race i got to sit in tony stewart's pit box like i was literally on the track watching the the pit changes um but 200 laps in i was like it's like i'm out peace deuces i'm not i'm not i'm not staying that long yeah you're not i'm sorry i, I've worked at a couple companies where NASCAR was a priority and I learned a little bit about it at the time.

Maybe it's because I'm from Northeast. It doesn't do it for me. So I'll just find some more stuff on Netflix and wait another few weeks for baseball to start. I think you're going to get zero. Baseball and starting, buddy. I'll just let you know that. You're going to get zero. Baseball and starting, buddy. Just let you know that. Well, OK. So, you know, we saw a lot of a lot of qualifications on how it will work for the players to agree to play starting in July. As part of why I was very skeptical about the NFL starting by week one. I mean, you know, I know you tweeted about this. Look, man, every guy on that field touches the ball.

The ball is just covered in crap. I mean, to go watch major league, they put everything on that ball, bodily fluids included. Yeah. So it's hard for sports. We should spend a whole segment next week,

maybe on the labor of the, what's happening in baseball side. There's a big, I mean, imagine if, if you had a kind of a set salary and your company was like, you know what, we're going to reduce your salary, but we're going to base it on revenues, which we've never done before.

And then when things are good, though, we're not going to pay you anymore. We're going to make sure that you take a loss like we take a loss. And baseball players are like, well, I'm not sure about that. So it's more complicated. I don't think baseball is coming back. I don't think it is. I think we're going to have basketball back. Hockey might be tough because they say the weather is too hot for the ice to, like, properly freeze in the arenas or something.

I don't – yeah. I don't – Yeah, there's something about how, like, you can't play – it's why hockey is not playing this summer is because the arenas are just inherently too hot for ice to form properly. Even if the AC is on. Oh, yeah. Well, okay. I mean, they can't. It would take a massive amount of energy to keep the place cool and to cool the ice.

Correct. Yeah, well, sure. I buy that because that's why they don't play in the summer. I thought you were saying like in the winter that was the case. Oh, no, no, no. No, no. Yeah, yeah. They can't play a delayed season.

Listen, again, sorry NASCAR fans and sorry hockey fans. I'm fine without hockey. You know, they locked out a few years ago. I don't think I noticed. It's fine. Baseball, I'm going to miss. I like the Cup. I'm a big fan of the Stanley Cup, though.

It's fun to watch. Okay, but would you trade one week of the NFL season for the Stanley Cup? Of course not. Would you trade a preseason week for the Stanley Cup? No. Yeah, okay. How about the NFL season for the Stanley Cup? Of course not. Would you trade a preseason week for the Stanley Cup? No. Yeah, okay. But I love the NFL. Yeah.

All right, a couple more quickies here. Jeff, I want to know, over under minutes you spent in your chair, in your chair, watching your wife and her friend dance to EDM music at your own homemade EDM festival. It was a long weekend.

It was three nights, Friday, Saturday, Sunday. Or the kids at home. You have a babysitter. How's this working? The kids go to bed at like seven 38.

Okay. So they go to bed and then the, then the music starts. Yeah. YouTube. Yeah. Okay. And Friday night,

Friday night, they went to like uh we go friday night too i don't know like midnight maybe saturday was the same saturday was 11 30 only midnight i thought you were gonna describe something much no midnight no we're friends they're trying to stay up till for cascade at one o'clock um and then we went sunday too so but then we also so this is this is streaming on you have your tv out and there's like a simulated concert going on no no it was a lot it was a live concert from their houses everyone's house like like like the djs are streaming from their house original set like it was original

music from their own houses hosted by somebody and then we also watched in the morning too if we missed if my wife missed a set at night when she was sleeping we watched in the morning oh the re-air so wait a second i need you to paint i need you to paint the picture here a little bit because i know that our buddies at uh pmt are especially keen on hearing about you and your EDM. Are they listening to this podcast at the very end? I would not think so. But somebody who's listening to this right now might tweet something at them.

So I just want to get the facts right. You're sitting in your, I'll call it a mansion, your mansion outside of Charlotte. Instead of Charlotte, yeah. Yep, okay. With YouTube playing on a giant TV screen? So it actually was playing on two because the speakers on my porch TV don't play Apple TV. So I had to play it inside and then open the sliding door and so project it outside.

So this is like – I just feel like – Okay. So that sound is being projected out into your yard. Like, I just feel like it's my house. Okay. So that sound is being projected out into your yard. Now, you have neighbors. I know it's got a big property, but they're neighbors somewhere nearby. Yeah. Okay.

You can keep it playing. That's fine. It probably helps. No, my neighbors, direct neighbors came over. Like, my wife saw them at EDC two years ago, not knowing they'd be there. Your neighbors in Charlotte were unbeknownst to you were at EDC a year ago. Your wife bumped into them two years ago.

Yeah. And so now she knew that last this weekend, invite them over for the concert. They came, I was dead asleep and they came over and hung out for like an hour. How could you sleep with that going on in your backyard? I just put the CPAP mask on and went to sleep. Just nothing.

Are they dancing on grass? No, in the back patio. Just the patio. They're just dancing on the pool deck outside while you're asleep with a mask on your face and this is going on for three nights straight? Yes. And the kids slept through it.

Yes. They participated. We did a, one night we did like a early, we like replayed EDC like seven o'clock and the kids just dance for an hour. And just because some people may not have heard this last time you are participating in this or sleeping through this completely sober, no drugs.

Yes. Completely sober, no drugs. Just sitting there drugs just sitting there sitting there enjoying the music uh sober uh had a protein shake one night just hanging out in the backyard in my little lounge chair uh listening to cascade and duke dumont and there was a dj like who's the name and this new guy i learned his name was like nathan but it was like not actually said like nathan and it was uh he was good uh they had don diablo and uh it was uh it was some good stuff yeah you can't have a virtual cd cdm concert without don diablo oh it's like it's like nathaniel it's like not like nathan it's like nathaniel that's his name they uh maybe that's

his name but like yeah my wife likes him now. And then all weekend, we were outside playing with the kids in the front yard. Sonos speaker playing Midnight Hour by Skrillex. It was a long weekend of EDC. And I think the answer will have to be under. I was going to ask you, how many minutes per weekend do you spend watching dumb videos on Twitter? Over under 59 and a half minutes. But I feel like you don't have time with all this. I mean, if you just follow Rex Chapman, you get them all. I will say, though, are you a TikTok user? No, you keep telling me that I need to be on TikTok. I'm not a TikTok user.

No, you just like, you go on TikTok and you just like open it up. I'm going to open my app up right now and you just look at it and you're like – I'm going to turn this down. Like it's just the same videos over and over again and you're just like enthralled by it. Like you just don't stop watching. No, that's what you do. I don't – the best of TikTok makes its way to Twitter. I don't even have to look for it. No.

No. Like it's just like – so yeah, I don't even have to look for it. No. It's just like... So yeah, I spend a lot of time on TikTok doing it, but yes. More and more on TikTok. I'll just go to the bathroom and get away from my kids and just go on TikTok for 15-20 minutes. Yeah.

I've been called out for that recently. I don't get away with the old bathroom trick. I feel like Paul Rudd blew that for us in This Is 40. He sort of explained that move to too many people. And now moms and wives all know that's more effective. What, just go high in the bathroom? Yeah, pretending you're pooping and when you're really just trying to. Well, I'm actually going.

But yeah, and the pretend part happens sometimes. But for a couple minutes. You're not in there for 20 minutes doing work oh no no no no no no it's like it's like a ratio of like 98 percent doing nothing and two percent doing actual work and maybe less sometimes depends on right so when he he blew that for all of us when he did that scene in his movie please doing word with friends from the toilet pretending he was pooping he got out. Now all the wives know about this trick. No, what nobody's wife listens to this minute of this podcast.

So it's totally safe to say this now. I want to know how, how the PMT guys figured out I'd like EDM music. Cause like I didn't tweet it out either. So someone had to listen to the podcast, alert them to it. I know they're not listening. I look, maybe they are. Maybe they're listening. I will say a guilty pleasure of mine, Gabe, is I've tweeted about this.

I watch Big Cat play video games on Twitch way too much. I've noticed you posting that. Dude, it is intriguing to watch him figure out how to play. He runs the same four plays over and over again, and they seem to work. But I just find it fascinating. I don't know why. I'm jealous I can't just play video games. I will say this. My only exposure to it is you tweeting about it. But if I gathered correctly, he named his college football coach, and

I think he named him Gus Duggerton or something. I thought that's the perfect like Big 12 coach name. The comedy here is strong, but I am not one to go watch him play video games. No. Well, it's also like tonight it's like at 9 Eastern, so my kids will be in bed sleeping. I'll just like pop it on my phone for like 15 minutes. Also, the also part that I also appreciate is that he's doing it while his kid is sleeping so he can't make noise.

So he's sitting there trying to talk to us, like playing. He's like, I appreciate the baby about to wake up. I can relate to that part of it. The whole not making noise.

Well, listen, if you get tired of watching Big Cat play video games, I'm going to give you, obviously you're caught up on The Last Dance. Everyone is. One recommendation for you since we going to give you, obviously you're caught up on The Last Dance. Everyone is. One recommendation for you, since we like to talk Netflix,

watch this miniseries about Waco. I watched it already. Oh, well, all right then. I am not all the way finished, and I don't remember how it ended, so don't spoil the true story. Well, I don't know how. There's always conflicting reports on the actual, like, how it ended, and if you go read about it afterwards on the actual like how it ended.

And if you go read about it afterwards, I just I would read about afterwards. Well, I'm going to because I don't think that this version of the story is the same version we were told at the time, because this version seems to be the most sort of I wouldn't say sympathetic, but from the viewpoint of those on the inside, as opposed to, as opposed to those, the FBI and others on the outside, which of course did not give any rationale for what they were being other than crazy. So, you know, interesting story. I've watched it though, but yes, thank you. I'm going to have that. Glad to be back. We're going to hopefully do these a little bit more next, next couple of weeks and months. We have some big plans for direction of this podcast. We're glad you stuck with us. Please wait, review, subscribe. I appreciate all of that.

Share it on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, wherever you like to do that. And have a great week, everyone. We'll be back next week. I'm not the boss of these things, Gabe. Yeah, I'll come back. We're back next week. All right, everyone.

Have a great day. Have a great week. Stay safe. Talk to you guys later.