Geoff Schwartz Is Smarter Than You - Herbert Wins the Twitter Bowl, and Purdy Beats Pretty

Episode Date: December 13, 2022

Geoff and Gabe are back to break down the biggest headlines from the past week of football, starting with Justin Herbert's triumph over Tua Tagovailoa in the first ever one-on-one NFL game. Then Gabe explains how Tom Brady lost to Brock Purdy twice on Sunday, and Geoff copes with the Chiefs' lackluster second half against the Broncos.On Moving the Line, Geoff predicts what accolades Caleb Williams will earn next season, discusses Jalen Hurts' MVP odds, and issues an official apology to Dan Campbell (Acho, take notes).Be sure to leave a comment and a rating on the show's feed to let us know what you think, and tweet @geoffschwartz if you enjoyed the episode.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

it's tuesday december 13th i'm jeff schwartz alongside gabe goodwin this is jeff schwartz a smart you powered by the varsity podcast network we have the tua versus herbert bowl that happens on that football we'll talk about all of that we have so much to get to tom brady gave us a gloat about tom brady's career you have some college football some chiefs all of that all today over under eagles lions i, there's so much to talk about, Gabe, after week 14 of the NFL season. How are you doing? You're back home. You look refreshed.

I saw you last week. Your teams were up and down this week. You had a Heisman winner from your favorite college. Man, you got a lot going on in your life. Yeah, here's a question I have for you. I'm going to give away one of the over-unders for later because I think it's just fun. It'll screw with your brain. I'll have you thrown off the whole episode now.

Okay. All right. You have a few choices here. A year from now, Caleb Williams is a two-time Heisman winner, a national champion, the number one pick, all of the above or none of the above? He's the number one pick. Okay.

I think winning a Heisman is very hard back-to-back to do. There's naturally going to be regression in that USC team from the turnovers we talked about. I just don't think they're going to have quite the season they're going to have. So I would say that he's not the back-to-back Heisman, even though he will be the first pick in the draft. And there's going to be massive taking efforts from multiple NFL teams to get themselves Caleb Williams, who is absolutely fantastic.

To me, it wasn't even a question of the Heisman. He was easily the Heisman in my eyes, and I'm glad he won. He was humble. Dude, we talked to him in Pac-12 Media Day all the way back in July, and the vibe you get from him, I think he's a very humble kid. He gets it. He understands the job, right? He understands being a USC quarterback.

He understands what that means. And how about Lincoln Riley? Lincoln Riley's coached six seasons, has had three Heisman winners and one finalist. He's had four quarterbacks. They ended up either winning the Heisman or were a finalist in his six years. Yeah, he was the right choice for this.

I loved his joke, too, about how the guys are playing the playoff and he wasn't. He just gets it. He's a self-aware, very good football player. He will be the number one pick of the draft next season. But I hope this question doesn't distract us from why England lost to France, which is very important as we are a soccer podcast now, Gabe. We were texting back and forth about this.

How was the family handling this man? Well, you know, this is where it's very helpful for the kids to be Brit ish. You know, like we leaned on the ish part this weekend that they had the, uh, the, the kits that their grandparents sent them. Uh, they were all decked out with the three lions trying to root for England, but as soon as England lost, they go back to being american so that's that's what's nice about that i just love having someone that sort of follows soccer that could text during games because i have no idea what's happening i get that i get the sport of course but like it was unlike you when you text me during usc games i was sober well you're doing it wrong you're not supposed to watch soccer sober come on jeff oh you're not like is that the only way to watch it?

It's just like, I will say, okay. I obviously, we kid about soccer on this show. I've been watching the World Cup. It's been a lot of fun. Yeah. Like, I will, as someone, again, who is, I don't have the bandwidth to watch soccer for the next four years. But the games have been good, man.

Like, the end of these games, the last 30 minutes, last 15 minutes, dude, second half of the games, fantastic. A lot of action, a lot of energy. It is kind of weird to me how, like, you cannot score for 70 minutes and all of a sudden score quickly and then just score quickly again. It just, it always kind of, that's the only thing about soccer, I just don't understand.

Why don't you do that the first 45 minutes? It takes, you have to have exactly the right set of things lined up. These guys are so good that it takes perfection on the offensive side and one minor screw-up on the defensive side. All those things have to happen at the exact right time for them to score. It's just too precise. I prefer a less skilled game where you just kick it at the goal and get a rebound and score.

You know, I feel the same way about hockey. Just smack it at the goal and somebody will get it in. Doesn't work that way at soccer. That's what I feel, too. Right. Just smack the ball in and let's see more goals. But we did see last night, Gabe, a lot of goals from Justin Herbert of Los Angeles Chargers. Yes.

Nice segue. So, listen, this was like the Twitter bowl. This game, this Sunday night game between two and Herbert was basically, you know, Rocky versus Drago of the people we follow on Twitter. This was going to settle one of the longest, and in my opinion, stupidest debates that all of our buddies are involved in, you included.

And, you know, resounding victory for Justin Herbert and the Herbert stands and a real a real dump of a game for Tua. So that's very bad news for your boy, Emmanuel Acho. He's he's wearing it, as we know. He has been all over the Tua train, but a big win for Herbert. And maybe finally the end of this silly conversation about which of them is better it's pretty obvious to me in the NFL Herbert is a better player right yes he's absolutely a better football player and this is why discussing any position in this league

maybe outside of like wide receiver and corner where you like you act you absolutely see it it's easy to see who's good and who's not. Other positions require nuance, right? And when you look at the quarterback position, and you look at Herbert and his size, his strength, his ability to make throws other quarterbacks can't make, to read a defense, to rip the ball. That throw, that nine-yard throw to Keenan Allen late in that game, like, there are elite throws he makes throughout the game.

But it's also worth noting that last night was, I believe, like the second time all season he had Keenan Allen and Mike Williams on the field for more than any sort of 10 plays. I mean, I think it was 40 combined plays all season long those two played on the field at the same time. He has an offensive line that is not good, right? They're good if they're healthy, but they're not healthy right now, right? He has a coach in Joe Lombardi on the offensive side of the ball who is atrocious,

right? Like the coaching is bad. The play sequencing, a good play for the charge is like a five-yard throw. Like what are we doing? You have this guy with this monster arm, let it loose. On the other side, we have Tua, and it doesn't mean Tua's bad, okay? It doesn't mean he's bad, but in the offense he's in, it's a quarterback-friendly offense. Brock Purdy, we're going to get to him in a second. He played in this offense this weekend. It's a quarterback-friendly. Jared Goff went to the Super Bowl in this offense.

It's a quarterback-friendly offense. Tua has Tyreek Hill and Jalen Waddell. Tua has an upgrade offensive line. We came in this season saying we don't know about Tua, right? We don't know if he's the guy. Upgrade coach, upgrade wide receiver, upgrade offensive line. We came in the season saying, we don't know about Tua, right? We don't know if he's the guy. Upgrade coach, upgrade wide receiver, upgrade offensive line, much better. Next year, now this win maybe prevents

Brandon Staley from moving on, but they need a new offensive coordinator. A new offensive coordinator, healthy wide receivers, better offensive line. Herbert's going to shoot right up to the moon as he should be. And I think that we realized that last night when they played next to each other,

the difference is just the talent, right? And Tua has like one fastball. And if it's not working, and the Chargers defense did a fabulous job of shutting that down, he doesn't have a secondary pitch. Herbert has eight pitches. Eight pitches, and we see it the entire game. And yeah, wins and losses are important. The goal is to win and lose, right?

Will he win, obviously. And Herbert has not done as much winning as Tua. And sometimes that is on him. But most of the time it's not. And I think it's fair to acknowledge that quarterback wins are great. It's good to win again. But not everything is because of the quarterback. In this case, I think we saw last night.

And even if Tua was better, let's say, in the game, it was very clear, Gabe, who the better player was. And it's Justin Herbert. I'm glad. Herbert was 39 of 51 for like 367. And Tua, before garbage time, was 6 of 23 for 112 yards. And one of those was a 60-yard touchdown to Tyreek Hill. So I like Herbert.

I mean, I was one of the biggest Herbert stands coming out of the draft. So I'm happy I'm correct about that. And I think, again, new offensive coordinator, he'll get even better. But I think the story out of this game too, Gabe, is that defenses have figured out Tua. And we'll see what Mike McDaniel and Tua can do next. Okay. Well, I want to just say for a second here that i like guys like tua i like guys who buck conventional wisdom and prove all you big

brain people out there with all your cool stats and all your you know your beliefs about what a quarterback is supposed to be i like when the guys who aren't that win so i'm rooting for him and i think he's better than a lot of people will ever give him credit. But what is the argument that someone like Acho, and I'm not trying to pile on Acho. He certainly had plenty of people bagging on him on Twitter today. What is the argument they're trying to make? Like he's obviously good enough to be an NFL quarterback, but what he's making the argument you're making that like that winning is, is like, he's making that argument, which you sent a text the other day about like to us, Tim Tebow. And who do you include in the text message?

You're like Tebow and Vince Young, Vince Young. And he's all the winners wrapped into one. Yeah. Caleb Williams, I think, was probably on your list. It's like he's all wrapped into one. And I think I said Alex Smith, but all right. It's like he's all wrapped into one. I think I said Alex Smith, but all right. Okay.

I don't know who you're talking about. It's like four guys with, you know, not the – I guess Caleb wouldn't be in that conversation. He's very talented. And, yes, there is a quality to playing within a system, and there is a quality to not losing games, which a lot of quarterbacks – again, I hate to go back to Brock Purdy because we're talking about it in a second. Brock Purdy was good yesterday. Wasn't great. The best thing

he did was not turn the ball over, right? And not give the other team opportunity to have the ball. And Tua doesn't do that, right? Tua does not turn the ball over. He doesn't make a lot of mistakes in the offense. He does exactly what is prescribed to him in the offense. There's nothing wrong with that. But we talk about the talent of a player, you can't overlook that there are limitations that Tua has. It doesn't make him a bad quarterback. It doesn't make him a great quarterback. He's just a good quarterback, and that's fine.

But I think we saw yesterday that just physically, the quarterbacks aren't in the same stratosphere. And I think for Ocho, his argument has been, well, two is a winner and Herbert's not. And here's why. And of course, look, the completion percentage, like the numbers were better for two of this season and they might end up better this season, but you have to take into consideration again, the offenses they play in. Are you telling me that if Herbert played in the Mike McDaniels offense, he'd be the

MVP? He'd be the MVP of National Football League. And it's okay to, again, just because we say one guy is elite in Herbert, to me, doesn't downgrade to us in the way he's played this season. I think that's the way we often mess this up, right? As we say, because one guy's good, the other guy stinks. No, no, no. Two is good.

Herbert's better. And that's fine. It's okay to be that way. It's okay to talk about sports that way where two is good. Herbert's better. And we can enjoy both these guys. We don't have to shit on one guy to praise another guy. Okay.

I buy all of that. Let me throw this at you, though. Part of what I was always told in the myth of Tom Brady. And yeah, I am bringing him in here, but I think it's relevant was, you know, look,

he's, he can do what Belichick needs. He's good for the culture. He understands the playbook. He's coach's best friend. He wasn't, if people rewrote history, he was not a stats guy for his first three rings.

He was, he was stay out of the way. Let the defense win the game. You know, make a few plays when we need you kind of quarterback. He was stay out of the way. Let the defense win the game. You know, make a few plays when we need you kind of quarterback. He became a stat guy much later. Isn't there something to be said when your team is the star

of this team is still the coach. Everyone's falling in love with Mike McDaniel. I think he's incredible. I'd love to talk about him more. It's a coach led team, a coach led overhaul of culture on that franchise.

If the coach likes the quarterback and the quarterback fits with what he's trying to do, isn't that it's hard to quantify, but isn't that the skill? Isn't that the thing we're identifying? Absolutely. But a couple of things here, Tom Brady does not get credit for the,

the arm that he has and still has. He isn't a exceptional thrower of the football two was not okay again and i i hate to say this in like a way that something watch when i watched you a throw last night i'm like okay like the like let's go like the ball needs to get there quicker like like there's no like zip on the ball right there's no like and maybe his ankles hurt, which is, I think, maybe some of the issues the last couple of weeks. But Tom Brady zips the ball in there.

I think that also, too, like, your point about, okay, you run the offense. Absolutely correct. But the throws that set guys apart are the third down throws, the red zone throws, and when you're under pressure, right? And Herbert nails all of those. And Tua sometimes does not. And Tom Brady has nailed those in his career. When the pressure's at the highest, Tom Brady has played well.

Obviously, he's 45 now. We'll talk about him in a second. And that's, I think, what sets apart, I've said this for years now, just kind of the good to elite. Go back to the Jim Agropolo Niners Super Bowl, right? He missed two throws in the fourth quarter that win him the game. Those are the difference. Two throws a game, maybe one throw a game.

Those are the difference. And right now, Tua has made those. He has in the last couple of weeks. But we know Herbert can make those throws. We've seen him do it. He has the talent to do it. He did it last couple of weeks. But we know Herbert can make those throws. We've seen him do it. He has the talent to do it. He did it last night. Okay.

Do you think either of these teams playing their best ball are good enough to make any real noise in the playoffs? Well, Miami has to figure out this defense that the team's running against them. People much smarter than me have talked about this. Nate Tice being one of them. He broke it down pretty well today. Their teams are, in the last two weeks, the Niners and the Chargers just weren't press man coverage,

which is something that no one did the first 11 weeks of the season. No one ran man coverage. Because they're worried about Tyreek Hill's speed and Jalen Waddle's speed. But when they're pressing these guys, it messes up the timing into his mind. And then he has to make throws he doesn't want to make. He was tearing his own up. When you play man coverage,

you got a little different type of throw, right? It's a little different area you're throwing it to. Almost less anticipation, right? Because if you know the zone, okay, they're going to be right here. The runner's going to come right through here. I can throw it into that zone. Man coverage is not quite like that, right? Because if you know the zone, okay, they're going to be right here. The runner's going to come right through here. I can throw it into that zone. Man coverage is not quite like that, right?

And Tua doesn't run the ball. He ran the ball more yesterday, but he doesn't really make you pay when you play two-man. And I never would have thought man coverage would work against the Dolphins like this, but that's what teams are doing, and they've got to find some man beaters. They've got to find ways to get Tyreek Hill and Waddle into space against man coverage

and allow Tua to get the ball out quicker and get in more of a rhythm. So I think either of these teams playing their best games is not going to win the AFC. However, the Chargers play their best game against the Chiefs. So if they go to arrowhead in the playoffs, I don't know what's going to happen. They could beat Kansas City. They play their best game each season against Kansas City.

Yeah. All right. Do you think the Dolphins would rather have McDaniel and Tua or Tom Brady and Sean Payton? Oh, Tom Brady and Sean Payton. I stunned you into silence with that Hank special there. Yeah. I think Tom Brady. I was thinking about this year.

I was thinking in my head like this year or next year. I think they'd rather have Tom Brady than Sean Payton. Okay. Well, let's use that as a segue to Tom Brady. I've coined this the Brock over Brady, Purdy over Purdy. The Niners got the dove against the Bucs. I would say, even though I know they still technically lead the division with a losing record, I would say this is the end of the Bucs season,

perhaps the end of Tom Brady's career. Let's cross our fingers, Jeff. I think you are more likely to see Tom Brady as your colleague soon than watch him in a Super Bowl ever again. Agree? Yeah. They're not making a Super Bowl this year. God, they got their butts whooped.

And even when they had a good play, they had a hole in the left tackle. They scored a touchdown holding. I loved year. God, they got their butts whooped. And even when they had a good play, they had a hole in the left tackle, right? They scored a touchdown hole there. Yeah, I loved that. God, that felt nice. I mean, they're minus 30 in point differential. Same as the Panthers right now, who are now one game behind them

in control of their destiny because they've already beaten the Bucs and they play again this season. You know, I go back to the coaching on this team. It's just not good. It's not good. It starts with that. Todd Bowles, and I had high expectations for Todd Bowles this year, wasn't good. Byron Lefkowitz, who I think did not get enough credit when Bruce Arians was there, maybe rightfully so now, not good in offense. Tom Brady doesn't look comfortable. He looks miserable out there, which I'm sure breaks everyone's heart.

The offensive line is very beat up. And defensively, that's supposed to be what they do. And Brock Purdy tore him to shreds yesterday. So it was a poor game for the Bucs. And look, they're probably winning the division. And they've got to host the Cowboys most likely. Even this weekend, they have the Bengals coming to town. The Bengals are going to kick their ass.

Like, the Bengals are playing good football. The Bucs are just not good. They're just, they can't score points. They have the least amount of, second least amount of points in the NFC conference right now. They're at 224 points. The Rams are at 218. And the Rams are playing third stringers all over the field. They just can't score.

They're just not a good football team right now. And there's a sense that Tom Brady is going to go for the Niners next season. I wouldn't sign Tom Brady right now. Would you like for next season? Would you sign him? Well, I would never sign him to any team that I had. I look,

I don't think Tom Brady's bad, but they're not playing good football right now. Well, I, you're not going to get me to argue pro Tom brady takes i i i see that they're not playing great football uh i i'm happy to see him go two thoughts here one maybe the nfl should look into if no one in the division has a winning record you don't automatically get a division winner let's just put another wild card team in That would be worth looking at because this is getting stupid. I feel like many of the last few seasons have included a completely incompetent

division putting a team in the playoffs that shouldn't be there. So let's look at that. Two, I think the dream that the supposed dream Tom Brady has of going to San Francisco got screwed up by two people this week, Brock Purdy and Baker Mayfield, who we're barely talking about. But I think that's his competition right now, not to mention Trey Lance. Like, I think this is it. I don't think there's anywhere for Tom to go. Well, the Brock Purdy thing, look, let's wait a couple more weeks before we make him the Niner Star for next season,

even though obviously the Niners have tried for years to get rid of Jimmy Garoppolo. And maybe this is the actual time they can finally do it, right? Is Brock Purdy. And he was good yesterday. Not great. But he completed the first pass outside the numbers that went for an explosive gain all season for the Niners. So he had that element to it that they ran the ball well. The offensive line played well.

Remember, Shanahan is such a quarterback-friendly offense. Like, it's just a lot of fun to watch this offense. And, you know, he mentioned this week that going from Jimmy G to Brock Purdy wasn't as big of a difference from Trey Lance to Jimmy G, and that was looked as a shot against Jimmy G. I think it's more just scheme-wise. They run the same offense with Brock Purdy. And, again, those special moments I talked about,

third down, behind in a game. You know, the Niners were big the entire game. And you still kind of see that from Brock Purdy at some point this season. But he played well. And the Niners are playing good football. Their defense is absolutely incredible. And I think right now, they're the only team in the NFC

that I think can give the Eagles a really tough go of it in the playoffs. Okay. And is there something about that matchup that you think gives them the advantage or just that they have looked very good on balance? Well, they can play defense and they can run the football. But it's not an Eagles-specific point. You're just saying the Niners look very good. Yeah.

No, it's not an Eagles-specific point. You're just saying the Niners look very good. Yeah. No, it's not an Eagles-specific thing. Is it the Cowboys? I don't think it's the Cowboys that's the team that can compete against them. So, to me, it's the Niners because, again, their ability to kind of make you very uncomfortable on offense. And it speeds up the process, typically. It makes your quarterback kind of jump in the pocket. And then when you get behind in a game,

it just kind of magnifies everything and amplifies everything. It's just tough to, I think, to get things going against the Niners. It really is. Did you see the kid from the Niners who picked off Brady, Dre Greenlaw, went up to Tom and asked him to sign the ball that he had picked off yeah and Tom actually did it and that's surprising to most of us but here's the funny part Greenlaw apparently said you're the greatest ever I've been watching you since I was two years old man that's not the greatest diss by a player ever since I was two. When you were talking about Tom Brady's early career,

early in the show, I was thinking to myself about like thinking of throws he made during that time. And I realized I was in high school. Yeah. Like, I don't remember Tom Brady, like a throw from really until the 07 Superbowl.

Like that's kind of the first time I remember really paying attention to Tom Brady, just as as a fan. Oh, they're playing the Giants at Super Bowl? I'm going to watch it. Of course, I watched football. I was a big sports fan. I was a Niners fan as a kid. I wasn't watching a ton of Patriots football. So yeah, he's been doing it for that

long. And he just looks obviously frustrated. He looks tired. And it looks like he's not having any fun and maybe the fun next year comes back and playing for the niners but at this point why like why why would you want to do that i have no idea what motivates this guy anymore it's hard to tell um maybe he'll make a career shift and go play on the live tour or something. What does this all mean for Baker?

Because, you know, obviously that unbelievable game out of Baker was last Thursday. I think most of the shows have already given all their takes. That's why we're not spending as much time. But Baker obviously has to have his eye on a starting job somewhere. If he finishes the season strong for the Rams, it doesn't seem like he stays in L.A. So what's the best case scenario for him in all of this? How does it impact Tom's option? Are we sure he's not

going to stay in LA? Is Matt Stafford going to play next year? At his age with his injuries? You're saying he's walking away from $100 million? I don't know what his salary is. I believe he has four years and $100 plus million left. Three of four years. Hank will help Hank Hank will double check check me but I looked it up I because I thought oh maybe Matt Stafford just sort of fades into the distance

and Baker takes over I don't think so I think he I think he's got a lot of money on the table so next year he's no not I don't think so next year he's only – oh, it's really in 2024 when he makes all the money. Oh, wow. Yeah. Geez. Yeah, they structured it so that he could come in and win for them. It worked. It was brilliant.

The front office gets a lot of credit. But now they got him, and I don't see why – if he's healthy next year, I don't see why he'd go anywhere. That's a good point. So his yearly cash is um 27 million it was 61 million this year 27 million next year 31 and 32 they really can't get out till 2020 oh boy oh boy all right well never mind on that um by the way mayfield has to play well by the the way, for the next four weeks for this to matter, right?

And we'll find out as we go. But the Mayfield story, look, I think that anyone who likes sports roots for comeback stories like Baker's story. He played well the last five minutes. He deserves all the love he gets. But this goes back to coaching, man. Sean McVay has got the most out of Jared Goff, out of Matt Stafford, out of Baker Mayfield of 48 hours, out of anyone who plays that offense. He gets the most out of them.

And Baker Mayfield has played for many different coaches and many different offenses. The two he's succeeded in the most are McVay offenses, right? I mean, excuse me, are Shannon offenses, right? Kevin Stefanski and now very shortly was Sean McVay. If I were Baker Mayfield, I would only our Shannon offenses, right? Kevin Stefanski, and now very shortly with Sean McVay. If I were Baker Mayfield, I would only play those offenses if I were him. I would either as a backup or a starter the rest of my career, only those offenses.

If he plays well for these four games, Gabe, I don't know who signs him. Like, look around the NFL. Teams are pretty set at quarterback unless you're going to draft a quarterback. And I don't know which team him. Like, look around the NFL. Teams are pretty set at quarterback unless you're going to draft the quarterback. And I don't know which team would want Baker Mayfield when it's kind of, he's been typecast, right, into playing this offense and being good. Otherwise, he's been poor. And I don't think that teams are going to jump at him

like they did this past offseason. All right, can I throw a, I hear you loud and clear on the coaching and what it can do for a quarterback to be in that offense. I'm sure that's right on balance, but doesn't it sort of seem like Baker? I'll just say Lincoln Riley quarterbacks and guys like Baker do best when there's no time for a playbook. Like the plays that Baker made on that drive were not, they weren't because of some brilliant scheme. Everyone knew what he was trying to do. He just threw a perfect ball two or three different times.

And he didn't know a playbook. Like he had three plays to pick from and he executed every one of them. It's just the guy can play. I'm with you there um my pushback on that would be they only scored 17 points like because he was running plays the whole game but they just let him do baker stuff you'll lose a few games that way yeah but you have to have some structure in the offense you can't just do bigger stuff you know i've seen i've seen this idea by the way that well the rams just have run two minute all game because he worked well in two minute or tampa bay by the way it's great in two minute just run two minute all game guys you can't do that for a couple reasons you just mentioned one of them game he has like three plays it's really more like eight

plays in two minutes you get figured out after a while you can't keep running the same eight plays over and over again with two protections for the most part. Secondly, it's tiring. You don't dress enough players to have them run all that. You dress five wide receivers, six wide receivers. In college, you dress 12 wide receivers. You dress eight offensive linemen, nine, ten in college.

You have running backs. You have four running backs. In the NFL, you don't have enough guys to run that offense for 60 minutes. Plus, Chip Kelly's last year in Philly, when they were running the uptempo offense, the Eagles defense played two, two extra games worth of reps, because your offense goes three and out,

then your defense is back on the field right away. And it's only, you can't do that full time. You need structure in an offense. I did find it funny that did you see during the game they put that play call on the screen the long word oh yes yes yes yes i think mcveigh was just trolling everybody that that's like not just everybody but the reason why structure is important is because when you have an offense that's multiple by multiple I

mean multiple formations multiple personnel groups you want to be able to to move guys around different positions and easily do that and that's the reason for the verbiage right because if you if you lay out every individual job you know deuce right f this y that z this h this then if players switch different positions like one one time the wide receiver is an f next play he's the z he just listens on the z this play okay z go got it done if you don't have structure game then you're not going to be able to do that you're going to be in one formation all game and you're going to have the same personnel grouping all game so there's the importance of have the same personnel grouping all game. So there's the importance of those long calls.

Again, I think McVay was mostly trolling everybody because the first one had Z doing three different things, which is not what this reality. But nonetheless, that's why you do it. As you say, so if you move guys around, you have guys that are injured come in the game. Okay, I'm the F on this play. All I listen to is what the F does.

That, I think, is the reason why structure is important um when you talk about you know offensive offensive all right but then doesn't that also mean maybe what helped baker is that he had a bunch of scrubs out there with him who are like i don't yeah fine i'll be the z and i'll do that thing that you just said I'm no I'm Ben Scronreich like I'll just do whatever the hell you tell me to do as opposed to some of the guys he's played with who might have said yeah man I'm pretty good at this I'm not

going to do exactly what you just said I'm going to do me and maybe Baker is the personality maybe he needs to just be a leader and be surrounded by a bunch of nobodies. Not going to win any games doing that. I don't know. Ben Skromroniak looked pretty damn good.

Jefferson made a couple plays for him. Yeah. Those guys aren't any good. Two-two at will. Yeah. The Raiders also might just absolutely stink. So that's also a possibility. Well, the Raiders do stink, and their coach is absolutely stink so that's also well the raiders do stink and their coach is ridiculous and i that's for another day why that guy still has a job well

how about this next year tom brady josh mcdaniel's las vegas i mean god that'd be like watching you know like these bands that yeah you'd be like watching, you know, like these bands that. Yeah. You guys are back together. Like, God, I thought many of you guys were dead. Yeah. How many stars go to Vegas for their last, like their last hurrah, their last performances, their residency. We're watching Britney do it. She's in Vegas right now. Didn't she?

My wife shows me her Instagram sometimes. Oh, boy. Careful. It's. She is. Yeah. in vegas right now didn't she um my wife shows me her instagram sometimes oh boy careful it's it is she is yeah um she's got control of that instagram now look what we've been missing out on it is quite it's quite unique what's happening there um we try to get some some taylor swift concert uh tickets for vegas and it is expensive oh boy i don't make enough money for that um but uh yeah like you know he's gonna have a uh a residency in vegas for for a year or two okay uh let's talk about the team that uh i've been giving you a pass i've been trying to easy into this because i think this is gonna hurt what what the hell happened with the chiefs i swear to god

i turned the game off i was like this is the dumbest game i could possibly with the Chiefs? I swear to God, I turned the game off. I was like, this is the dumbest game I could possibly watch. The Chiefs are up 27-0 against the Broncos, who are terrible. I didn't look at the game. And then I had to read notes in a rundown to realize, no, no, no, no. They blew the game. They made this thing close. Pat threw three picks. I mean, he made it a one-score game against a backup for Denver.

I mean, how the hell do you let that happen? The whole first half was just the Twitter plays from Pat. How do you let that become a game? That's got to scare you. This is the Chiefs. I said this on the podcast with Matt the other day. This is the exact game I thought they would play. They always do this.

It's a problem. This is why they're having trouble being the Bengals and Bills right now. It's because when you play like this against those teams, you lose. When you play against us like the Broncos, you're going to win. Because the Broncos aren't very good. The first half was fantastic. Well, excuse me, the first 26 minutes. They're up 27-0.

Pat looks great. Defense had a pick six. Defense was playing well. Sacking Russell Wilson. They're up 27-0. Pat looks great. Defense had a pick six. Defense was playing well. Sacking Russell Wilson. They allowed 14 points in the last five minutes of the first half. Then allowed a touchdown after the half. It's now 27-21. And then kind of had to return it back

on. Pat wasn't good in the second half of this game. But this is what the Chiefs do. And this is why I'm a little concerned about them in the playoffs. Not offensively as much as defensively, Gabe. They're 25th right now in defensive efficiency. They're not good. Now, some of that is young.

They're playing four rookies. But they don't tackle well. They don't watch the passer terribly well. The one year Mahomes had an average defense. They finished 14th in DVOA efficiency. In 2019, they won the Super Bowl. They don't need a great defense, Gabe. They just need an average defense, and they are far from average.

They allowed the best offensive game for Russell Wilson in the season, for the Broncos of the season, And their defense worries me a lot. Like, I think that's the reason why they might not make it back to Superbowl this year. Well, they've got four regular season games to, to get some reps in and tune this team up.

They're at, they're going to win all at the Texans. Okay. Well, so there you go at the Texans, they host the Seahawks, which is looking like an easier win than it would have a few weeks ago. Then they're home against the Broncos.

That's a rest. And then they're in Vegas for the Raiders, who at that point should have hung it up. And I assume we'll have an interim coach. So you think they go 4-0? Do you think they can work on anything or improve anything in that time? Or are we just going to go to the postseason with a below average defense? Okay, so people get upset at the defense corner of Spagnu and i get it and i think there are there's some blame there but a lot of times guys are in position to tackle and just don't i don't know what defense coach

could do about that in week 14 like you're in position go make a play make a tackle you know the youth obviously you can get a little bit more reps under your belt but you're not playing good teams either so like well against the Texans, Raiders, and Broncos doesn't give me confidence. You should. I hope you play well against them. Seattle's offensively a little bit better. Obviously, if the running backs come back, they're in a better shape than they are now.

To me, Gabe, great. Awesome that you play well in those games, if you do, but then you're going to play the Bengals and Bills in the playoffs. And are you good enough to stop any of those offenses? Yeah. The Bills don't look great.

I'm just, I'm here to say. No, the Bengals, I'm going to say the Bengals should be the favorite in the AFC right now. They're playing the best. Yeah. They're playing the best football right now in the AFC. Well, I'm going to use that as a little segue. We'll take a break. We'll come back.

I have a very controversial question to ask you about the quarterback of the Bengals. Yeah, we'll do that on the other side. over under 20 chance joe quiet is better than joe cool i haven't heard a single story or peep from joe burrow all season long and they look very scary what do you mean like you think he's better just being like you said that you said that text yesterday stop wearing the stupid designer glasses and the little flip in the hair and all this you know cool i'm mr cool and the stupid cigars all the dumb shit that he was doing last year which i think got a lot of people to kind of game up for him he's just a good quarterback now who i don't hear from that's my theory i did not understand your text yesterday but now i do you said that to me i was like i don't know, I don't know what he's talking about because it was like signing a football.

Who's Joe? No idea. I am generally with you on the concept of I would prefer you let your play do the talking. And I didn't think about this until now. You're right.

But I think Joe would be good either way, whether he was out there or not. But yeah, I think it's always good either way whether he was like out there or not but yeah i think it's always good if you can kind of be a quiet assassin more than allowed you know allowed nobody basically yeah i mean because he hadn't i mean not that he necessarily was begging for all that attention but god it seemed like last year was just less this year yeah it's just like okay he's good he he's getting treated like justin herbert is where people are like he's really really good i just i don't know what else we're supposed to say about that you know like he's in that category yeah and i think you know

for him he doesn't have i'll call him heisman moments right like pat mahomes had that heisman moment yesterday right he's running down the right sideline, or not the right sideline, but running toward the right sideline and flicks that pass to McKinnon for a long touchdown. Jalen Hurts certainly has those moments during games. Joe Burrow's just good. He doesn't really have like, yeah,

the throw to beat the Chiefs at the end was fabulous. But there's not like that sports center top 10 throw each week. And again, Bengals fans, Joe Burrow is a top three

quarterback in the NFL. There's nothing against Joe Burrow. Okay. I'm just saying that I think this is why there's a little more kind of quietness when it comes to

how we perceive Joe Burrow versus like a Palma Holmes or Josh Allen. Yeah. Well, one guy you just left out of your top three is probably the MVP favorite. I mean, he is the MVP favorite according to Vegas right now.

So what are the odds? Jalen hurts, wins the MVP over Pat and the bunch over under 33 and a half percent. If Eagles went out, I would say over, I think there's a good chance he wins the MVP. And really it's not because Mahomes doesn't play well or anything.

To me, it's just when you go 16-1 and you play the way you have as the quarterback of that 16-1 team, it's going to be really hard for Mahomes to win that award. It's almost getting to the point where you get a little bit of the LeBron where LeBron's the best player in the NBA

for so many years. He doesn't win the award. Mahomes is the best player in football. That doesn't mean he doesn't win the MVP award every year. And I think if Hurts goes 16-1, he's very deserving of that award. And it doesn't take away anything from Pat Mahomes, but Eagles are playing good football right now. And if they win out and they still have the Cowboys up in the schedule, I believe that's a tough matchup.

Cowboys, Saints, Giants. I mean, there's a good chance they went out. And if they do, then I think Hurts will win the award. All right, let me ask you this, because I was going back and forth with a few people over the weekend on this. And I don't know much about Nick Sirianni. I've paid closer attention to Mike McDaniel. I'm going to put them both in the category of guys who seem like regular dudes seem to be enjoying their jobs

talk to the media and and it seems like they're players the way we would talk to our friends um surely they know the game yeah but but they have like normal human being emotions instead of what was very popular for the last 20 years, which is to be like Bill Belichick, right? Yeah. Is the success of Sirianni and McDaniel, so much as its success so far, going to take over? Are we going to see more human beings be good coaches? Yes, because younger coaches act like McDaniels and Sirianni.

Do you think there are a lot of, like, right now, guys who are still one job away from the big job who are going to get that chance? Oh, yeah. I mean, DeMarco Ryan to the Niners is going to get a job. He can't be older than 40, right? Okay. I don't think he is, right? So do you think that – I guess that's the smarter question then.

Do you think that this next offseason or the next few offseasons of hires are going to skip? D'Amico Ryan. I'm sorry. D'Amico Ryan. He can't be older than, how old is he? He's 38. He just retired in 2015. Yeah.

Do you think we're going to just skip that tier of like the, oh yeah, that guy. He's been a coordinator for 100 years. And just get past that and get right to the young guys. Yes. I hope so. D'Amico Ryan is going to be a coach this season. Somewhere will be the third straight year. I think a Niners assistant became a head coach somewhere.

And we've seen Robert Saul is a good coach. And Mike McDaniel is a good coach. And we have this whole Kyle Shanahan tree. coach and yeah mike mcdaniel's good coach and we have this whole kyle shanahan tree um so uh yeah domico ryan's i would imagine is the same sort of style of coach now i also think it's i don't think i think i think offensive coaches tend to be a little bit more personable as far as when we see like kind of the way you're talking about that's just their nature on offense versus kind of defense is more of that kind of tough-minded like it's hard to explain, but there's just like this, you know, the weatheredness of a defensive coach versus an offensive coach is kind of

just more free a little bit. It's kind of different in coaching styles, but I think we're going to see younger coaches take over and continue to, and they're having success too, which is important. And we're seeing, by the way, college football too. And we're seeing young coaches everywhere um and even dion who's not young i talk like a young coach actually a young coach right like i think that's that's the style of of coach that connects the most with players now yeah um all right how many games do the cowboys win

in january if they sign odell beck Jr.? Over, under, one and a half. It doesn't matter at all. First of all, he very clearly is not ready to play football yet. I mean, the Cowboys, I don't know why they leaked it out there, but he's not healthy. You heard him on the, what's that show they do on Monday Night Football? Whatever that show. The Shop.

I watched some of The Shop, yeah. You did? I didn't think you were going to be an audience for The Shop. How was it? I wanted to see what it was like. It did. I didn't think you were going to be an audience for the shop. How was it? I wanted to see what it was like. It was cool. It was good. It looks great.

I mean, they get cool people on there. It's a lot looser and less about football than the Manning cast. But, you know, if you don't care much about the teams playing and you like some of the guests they bring in, it's a good show. Who was on this week besides Odell? Was there a good, like, there was a guest you're looking well cam jordan was like their main talker he's good yeah yeah he was very good uh obviously maverick carter was there's a comedian whose name i'm forgetting who was good uh a rapper anyone who pays attention to hip-hop who listens

to the show is going to mock me for not knowing who it was but i think it was yg i think it was yg uh it's yg the guy he has his career sort of linked to nipsey hussle right i think it was YG. I think it was YG. It's YG. The guy, he has his career sort of linked to Nipsey Hussle. Right. I think it's, I don't think it was YG. And maybe one other, one other player came through. I don't know.

It was just like a different vibe and it was fun. Speaking about Odell, as we're talking right now, the Cowboys have signed a wide receiver. Oh yeah. T.Y. Hilton. So the old culture.

So this takes, this takes odell out of it odell will not be a cowboy i mean i don't know if that means anything but all right fair enough um let me slide down the rundown to this question um who would you rather play in january the lions or the vikings obviously we saw them play each other this weekend which one scares you more in the postseason if uh if they both get in that's a great question oh thank you good job hank nope no no nope nope i know it pains you to know hank did not write that question that is me doing my job oh what that's an upset for today yeah did not see that coming oh yeah um oh boy i would say the lot i would say the lions scare me more as a team but i think the cousins jefferson

feeling is a little bit better than golf and that And I know Cousins has not played well in these moments in his career. But if you need a touchdown to end a game in the playoffs, you need that big throw to be made, I trust Cousins more than Goff. And sometimes that's what comes down to in the playoffs. All right. Let's say you need a big catch to be made oh jefferson you're going to jefferson or panay sewell but i still dude the lions are so i i ragged on dan campbell

we all did like a month ago they were one and six they were bad or one and five they started bad and they've been much better obviously so i'm sorry dan campbell i I doubted you. You've been great. It's third and seven. The Lions are up eight with two minutes left. They take their right tackle, Panay Sewell, and put him in the slot as a wide receiver. They motion him from the left back to the right, snap the ball.

Remember, third and seven up eight with two minutes left. Snap the ball, run a bootleg, and throw the ball to the right tackle for a first down to win the game. Third and seven, the Lions threw the ball to a right tackle. It's like a big FU to the vikings right like it's i love the best this is like clearly penesu can do both he can catch and he can block clearly this penesu jamar chase debate is over it is ended now penesu clearly the best option for that draft pick yeah i mean i guess acho is the only person person who might say otherwise i'm i keep waiting because we're recording this now ocho's on i'm kind of waiting for like the

is he gonna go like all in with some some random thing about two of today or is he gonna just admit he was wrong and move it along no there's no chance it's b uh i wonder i wonder like i was joking with him the other i've known ocho for quite a while now we did broadcast boot camp together so we thought we uh we went through this together. I was asking him, like, do the Dolphins, like, give you an NIL deal? Like, are you getting paid by the Dolphins? Like, he was at the game, obviously. He went to Dolphins practice.

They were in Los Angeles, so they stayed on the West Coast after playing the Niners. Did you see, by the way, the Chargers denied him a sideline pass? No, I didn't see that. That's what he said, yeah. It's like a real thing. Like, people are like, and what's crazy is we're doing exactly what Alcho wants, obviously, which is making a big fuss about what he said. But he started, like, he started this entire social media, you know,

the, again, 2% of the country tweets, right? Like this small fraction of the country arguing about football and Tua versus Herbert because, you know, there's like, I don't want to argue about what Elon's doing right now. I'd rather argue about what Tua and Herbert are just taking our time up arguing about Tua and Herbert because of of acho it seems pretty harmless to me and you know what it's just harmless fun you know what like i i don't really know acho very well i have worked with him a tiny bit i've met him once or twice obviously a nice guy obviously a very

smart guy um i don't have any idea if the level to which he believes all of what he's saying but i know that the people around him the people who he could look to to see how it's done in that building his colleagues uh they believe the things that people think are crazy and that is why they stick with those things and that is why he will stick with this if he believes it he just tweeted out that he's going to issue an apology today well i i would not advise that i think he's gonna i think he's gonna pull a wwe move he'll do the nick right he'll he'll say he's apologizing and then throw the apology out and say screw you guys i think go chiefs i think he's gonna do an apology for for all of you who ever thought that i might change my opinion about this i'm sorry

the nick wright apology which is so which is fantastic by the way see about about shows on fox obviously i work for fox but um this the shannon and skip thing from today oh my god it is great television like i didn't even see it oh oh skip basically told shannon sharp his career was worse than tom brady and he stinks and it was like and people are taking it way too seriously on the internet like guys it's a tv show it's entertainment and shannon got rightfully you know like they went back and forth dude it was great television and people are making way too much of it of course because why would you know it just it's their job is to be entertaining and they're entertaining um yeah basically their friend tom brady skip was like you suck tom's

better than you who do you talk and shannon was like i made the Hall of Fame. But his crowd's great. Good TV. Very entertaining. So the best part was Shannon took his glasses off to argue. And Skip said, put your glasses back on. Skip treats every Monday morning like NFL players treat their Sunday. He's deadly serious about this debate, man. He believes that that is his competition. And's deadly serious about this debate, man. He believes, he believes that that is his competition and he prepares for it to win. Yeah.

He did. It's 6am on the West coast. These dudes are in a full out screaming match on television. I, and normally I'm not a fan of like the screaming back and forth television. I think this is pretty good. I think it's a good, there's no debate. Those two are terrific at what they do steven

is also very good at what he does like some people are just that's the way they communicate those guys are good at it so let me throw this question at you this would not make it onto one of those shows but we're talking about you know sticking to things you say and believe silly if Killian Mbappe played for the Chiefs. Yeah. Over under 75 catches in a season. How big is he? Looks big enough. I mean, we can Google it.

I don't know. He's a pretty big dude. Obviously, he's very fast. I mean, we know that. His footwork is incredible. He would get off the line. Yeah. Yeah.

I would say he would have a lot of catches. He's a good athlete. It was fun watching that game the other day. He's listed at 5'10". Oh, really? But he looks a lot bigger than that. Unless everyone out there is tiny. Wait, Hank has 5'10", 161?

That's it? Yeah, he looks thicker than that. Maybe not. Maybe we're all wrong. I don't know. I don't know. I mean, that would make him bigger than Marvin Harrison, I think. Yeah, but you're going to get hit.

Like, you're going to get hit in the NFL. And I will say, it's been nice to see less flopping as the games have gone deeper in the World Cup. Like, far less just outright, like laying on the ground with you're totally fine. I, I, this will sound very, uh,

xenophobic. I don't know. American, I guess we flop less. We're not as good. We're not as good. We, we absolutely do flop.

We flop less. And I'm proud of that. We also shoot less too, which you could argue. We win less. We flop less, and I'm proud of that. We also shoot less, too, which you could argue. We win less. We're not as good. But we do not flop as much as the other teams do. I agree with you. I didn't want to tweet that because, you know, soccer people,

they're very protective of their sport. Who do you got? So we got Morocco and who we got? Morocco, France, Argentina, Croatia. I didn't know Croatia was good at soccer. They have like the size of Connecticut. Who's taking it home? Well, it certainly seems like it's going to be France, Argentina.

And I would think France would be a slight favorite in that game, but there'll be plenty of intrigue. I don't even have an answer. I have no idea. I mean, Morocco keeps beating countries that they have beef with, right? So the Spanish certainly look down on Moroccans. I would assume Portuguese are the same way. And I'm guessing the French who look down on everyone look down on Moroccans.

So this will be will be a lot of like a lot of energy in this one for the Moroccans. I think it's proof that a 12-team playoff is going to be great for college football because Morocco has no business being there. But they are, and they've just beat two of the world's best, and they're going to scare the crap out of people in the next matchup too. So that's just fun. The bosses of Fox are rooting for France-Argentina, right? Of course, yes.

Yeah, okay. Messi, what's his name again? Kylian Mbappe. Mbappe, yeah. Mbappe-Messi would be a great way to finish out, right? It's NFL Sunday morning, too. It's Sunday at 10 a.m. is the championship. Oh, wait, there's a loser game too on Saturday.

That stinks to play in a loser game. A third-place game? Loser game sucks. Yeah, loser game stinks. I mean, it probably matters. Like, if Morocco wins the loser game, I bet it's the biggest thing that ever happened in Moroccan soccer. Yeah, that'd be third.

Yeah, fantastic. So, all right, everybody. That's enough soccer soccer enough football for everyone Matt and I had a bad week we need to come back it was bad week we're going to bounce back guys so stay tuned for the rest of the week we'll get our wage it'll be a day late I believe

we'll be in Los Angeles recording in person with Matt it'll be a lot of fun hope you guys enjoy please rate review subscribe Powered by the Varsity Podcast Network talk to you guys in a couple of days. Take care.