Geoff Schwartz Is Smarter Than You - Roger Goodell Says "Black Lives Matter" & Introduces New COVID-19 Policy

Episode Date: June 8, 2020

After a week that saw NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell make profound statements, Drew Brees directly engage with the president, and several NCAA players contract COVID-19, Geoff & Gabe are back to get you caught up. Later, we'll review ESPN's mock draft, outlining the order of the game's best players. Roger Goodell: (1:00) Drew Brees: (15:11) NCAA Prepares its Return: (24:29) NFL Memo: (30:59) ESPN Mock Draft: (37:17) Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

it's monday june 8th roger goodell finally says black lives matter drew breeze called out the president and both the nfl and ncaa take new steps towards returning to the field i'm jeff schwartz alongside gabe goodwin this is jeff schwartz is smarting you hopefully you had a great weekend i know there's a lot of unrest happening in the country right now but hopefully you're able to enjoy your time with family and friends. And join us today to talk about football and what's happening within our little world. Gabe, how are you doing, buddy? Yeah, man, I'm hanging in. It's definitely been an exhausting week and a half for all of us.

And I'm consuming more news than ever before and eager to talk to you about, I wouldn't even say football, but issues related to football. Well, we do have some football time. I know we spent last week obviously focusing on a lot of the social issues happening in our country. We'll do a little bit of that today. We do have some football news and some fun over-unders. We'll have a lot of fun in over-unders. So if you make it to the back half of the podcast, I promise you we're going to talk strictly football. So, Gabe, lead us off.

Sure. So by now everyone knows that Commissioner Roger Goodell reversed course late last week and put out a powerful statement in support of NFL players and the Black Lives Matter movement. This came after some star players, including Patrick Mahomes, put out another powerful video demanding to be heard. A lot of people saw that, including, we think, Goodell. So here's a quick bite from Roger Goodell, his statement to fans. We, the National Football League, condemn racism and the systematic oppression of Black people. We, the National Football League, admit we were wrong for not listening to NFL players earlier

and encourage all to speak out and peacefully protest. We, the National Football League, speak out and peacefully protest. We, the National Football League, believe Black Lives Matter. All right, look, Jeff, people can feel how they want about Goodell and this statement, but many people I respect on these issues, particularly Black media members who have thoughtful things to say about these issues, they were pretty pleased by Goodell's comments and proud of how far, frankly, this movement has come, in part because of players pushing so hard. The NFL owners seem to be shifting. The commissioner seems to be changing his language. Remains to be seen what people act upon.

But, Jeff, this felt to me like a very big deal for him to admit that they had been wrong. I'm still in awe that they admitted this, honestly. And when has the NFL ever admitted they've been wrong ever on anything, right? I mean, you know, simple things like, oh, we screwed up the pass interference replay review, but never an issue like this, where in 2016, 2017, and 2018, they were just vehemently against any sort of protest. They didn't like it. Now, it corresponded with ratings going down and business issues. And obviously, owners were concerned about that. But to see Goodell come out and be so forceful with this was pretty surprising. And I'm glad he did it. Look, the players put out a video a little bit before he came out and made it about 25 hours before.

You go read about it. It's really interesting. Someone who's working in NFL media just decided to go behind the back of the superiors to get this video made. He thought the NFL wasn't doing enough to address some of the issues in our country, and he got the video made. He then ran up to two superiors. They put the video out. Goodell saw it, and then Goodell had a Zoom call with a bunch of leaders and decided he needed to say something.

This is the first step. The first step in admitting the NFL was wrong for blackballing Colin Kaepernick and not paying attention to the players' protests in the first place. Now, Colin Kaepernick was not mentioned. He was not mentioned at all. And there's, I think, a couple reasons for that. One is that the liability game, I think, is too much. I don't know what the final settlement was in the first collusion case. I don't know if there's

going to be another collusion case eventually. We don't know this, but I think there's a very legal reason why he did not mention Colin Kaepernick's name. Secondly, in this discussion that we had privately via text chain, you know, everyone's saying, well, look, it's great you put out this statement, but now are you going to sign Colin Kaepernick. And it feels to me like just signing him to sign him kind of defeats the purpose of this whole exercise, right? Like if you're going to sign him, it should have been a couple of years ago when he was still in his prime, he could still play. It's been four seasons now.

I don't know how much you're going to get from Colin Kaepernick. But at this point, it feels like it would almost be an insult to just sign him to sign him. Yeah. And I think, listen, I mean, my opinion only, but the act of signing Colin Kaepernick or the physical demonstration of kneeling are now just figurative, right? Like whether those things do or do not happen, this is now a movement. This is now something people are speaking about in a number of different ways. this is now a movement. This is now something people are speaking about in a number of different ways. So I don't think people should limit their thinking to whether those things happen or not.

I think this is about a much bigger conversation. I'll throw it back to you this way. We saw members of the Denver Broncos actually at protests, peacefully protesting in Denver. And, you know, maybe that type of thing has happened in the past but it certainly wasn't documented and shared as widely as it was just after the commissioner made his statement so i'm curious do you think that by goodell coming out so forcefully he's given a few guys the chance to speak their mind in ways that maybe they hadn't in the past yes 100 i think so too but i think players are understanding you talked about this last one there's a good point the younger generation of players now feel more emboldened right they grew up on social media they grew up voicing their opinions about all sorts of subjects video games food video i assume

i always mention video games video games and food and whatever else they want to talk about and now they're talking about things that are near and dear to their heart, which are social justice issues. And players feel emboldened to do that. And now the NFL commissioner has said, look, we will accept you doing this. I will protest with you, which is what I'm interested to see what that looks like. But that, look, we are now going to accept it and we're not going to sweep it under the rug. Look, they allowed the players to do this beforehand. But I think it emboldens more players to speak up

and feel that they can actually do that. I was very impressed. A lot of players, we talked about this, are they putting their, not their money per se, but are they putting their actions behind their words? A lot of players have really done that. A lot of players have gone out of their way to go and be visible at these marches,

to go and be visible with their donations, with their commitment to the community. And I know there's something floating around. I think the Players Coalition is going to have a letter to Congress coming up fairly soon. So they're putting their actions behind their words, and it's been pretty impressive to see. And I also think, Gabe, look, the president came out

and pumped up Drew Brees on Twitter for his original comments about disrespecting the flag and why he doesn't kneel. And I do think that part of the answer from the NFL was, hey, look, we're not going to take it this time. We're not just going to give in to what the president says like we did last time. We're not going to appease him. And there is a money part of this. There's 100% of money part. The NFL does almost nothing without deciding what about the money. And I think that you're seeing now, the money's going to be on the side of the protest. The money's going to be on the side of looking for social changes.

The money's going to be on the side of finding a way to end police brutality. That's where the money's going. I think that's where the NFL has decided they should be going to. I've always thought, Gabe, that Goodell was more or less kind of on the side of the players on this, but that he was a little hamstring from the ownership, right? Goodell is a funnel for the owners. Goodell does what the owners tell him to do. And I don't even know if he told owners he was making this video.

I mean, I have no idea. That has not been reported. So I've always felt he's been sympathetic to players a little bit. And I do feel that he does feel it to players a little bit. And I do feel that he does feel it was wrong to what happened to Colin Kaepernick. He can never admit that obviously because of the liability issues. So this, it may take for Goodell to do this, but to allow the NFL, the NFL's channel to do this and tweak this out, I was still surprised, but I'm glad, I'm glad they did it. And, you know, get into specifically the kneeling part of this,

because it's going to be a hot topic from now until the end of the season. We're still months away from the season. Players, Adrian Peterson said he's going to kneel. I'm sure he will. Players may or may not kneel. We'll find out. The NFL can still find ways to not let this hurt business, okay? Because last time it did hurt business, right?

Ratings did drop. But guess what, folks? NFL players are still kneeling now. The idea that NFL players aren't kneeling is not true. People are pandering on social media. Kenny Stills is still kneeling. Eric Reid was still kneeling. He's not in the NFL right now, but the players are still kneeling.

TV networks decided, maybe in accordance with the NFL, maybe not. We're not going to show it anymore. We're not going to show it anymore. Because remember, guys, the anthem is only played, really, week one, September 10th this year, Chiefs-Texans, it'll be shown on TV. And then maybe not again to the playoffs. It doesn't get shown on TV.

Gabe, I got a good story. I had, I won't say who it is. I don't think they listen to the podcast. I don't know if they do. But someone was talking to me about the NFL protest a couple of years ago. He goes, you know, I just, I really love the anthem and I love watching the game for the anthem and the anthem is ruined when guys protest. And I say,

I said, hey man, they don't show the anthem. What are you talking about? And he just gave me like this stunned look on his face. Like, oh, you know what I mean? Like, don't even pay attention. Like, are we really tuning in the game to watch the anthem? Really? Is that what we're doing now? So look, players have been kneeling. There's many ways around this if the NFL does not want this to hurt business. One, just tell the networks, don't show it. Just don't show it, okay? Or just make a light mention of it. Whatever you want to do. Two is the NFL could just not have players come out for the anthem. Before 2009, we did not come out for the anthem. College football, they don't come out for the anthem most of the time. They're inside. They play the anthem and players run out

and you play football. Those are two ways around it. The NFL can also mandate player stand, which is probably not going to happen. They tried to do that already. It didn't work.

But it's just interesting because the NBA, Gabe, the NBA mandates their players stand for the anthem. And you get, there's almost no backlash for that.

And the NFL gets killed because they let their players kneel. I don't get it. Well, again, I mean, listen, it took on a huge significance when Colin Kaepernick and Eric Reid started doing this four years ago at the suggestion of Nate Boyer, by the way, who'd served. This was meant to be the respectful way to voice an opinion subtly. It turned into meaning something else. So whether or not players choose to kneel this season, I don't know if it's the most important debate for people to be having because now everyone is having the real conversation. And we'll get to Drew Brees in a moment, but we're no longer pretending that this is about respect for a flag or respect for a country or patriotism or respect for the

troops. We're no longer pretending it has anything to do with any of that. The conversation is now squarely focused where Colin Kaepernick wanted it in the first place. That's what the commissioner's statement proved. Yes, we know what this is about now and we want to listen to our players. We did a bad job, but now we understand. So I don't know that it matters if player X or player Y kneels or doesn't, white or black. I think the question is, is the league allowing guys to move forward with their feelings and to make some change happen? It's basically to allow the kneeling, to allow players to do this. And so that's why I focus specifically. But you're right. Look, if you, and you're right about Drew Brees.

We'll get to him in a second. If you are of the opinion that the players are kneeling to disrespect the flag, your opinion is wrong. It's wrong. It's not correct. It's not factual. There's no fact behind it. It's your personal opinion, which you're allowed to have, by the way.

No one's saying you can't have the opinion, but it's a wrong opinion. It's okay to be wrong. It's wrong. And so you're right. The argument is no longer, is it respecting the flag or not? And you're right. Goodell's statement firmly puts the NFL in the camp of players. We understand what you're doing, why you're doing it, and let's look to helping out. The help part of it, I don't know what that is. I don't know what form that's going to be. Obviously, the NFL has given money to Players Coalition before, which is not really affiliated with Colin Kaepernick, but they've done some good work on their own as well. So I don't know what exactly, Gabe, the outcome, the actions will be besides, hey, look, we understand why you're doing this. We're on your side. We'll have

you back. Here's what the NBA, and I talked about that. The NBA has always had the players back when it comes to these things. They've always been forward thinking and it hasn't necessarily helped their business. But I think the NFL realizes that, look, this is where we're going in our country right now. And it's better to just be on the right side. And look, Gabe, like I mentioned five minutes ago, the NFL can definitely win this moment and then also win another moment by just, look, hey, we're not having players out for the anthem this year like it kind of solves two problems right like you don't have the kneeling you don't have people asking about it you know players may or may not be upset but

some players might feel that okay the pressure's off of me the pressure's off right i don't have to decide whether i'm gonna kneel because we'll get to breeze in just a second there are players that feel that way they feel that for personally, kneeling is not very respectful. And that's fine. It's okay to have that opinion. And so I think that might solve a couple of things. Like, hey, look, we're just not going to have you guys out. So no one has to make a decision.

No one has to need it that doesn't want to need just because they feel like they have to. No, you know, you can stand. It just, it takes away all the pressure from everyone. And is it the right thing to do? Maybe not because it doesn't kind of avoid what might happen but it might be gave the practical solution to all of this yeah well it'll be interesting if people do come out and do kneel then not kneeling will suddenly become a statement now that the handful of guys who are left standing

there then they'll be suddenly making a statement the question is will all the same people say that they didn't have a right to do that i i, who knows? It's very confusing. I want to ask you this one last thing before we get to Bruce, who we keep mentioning, uh, the cynical guy in me does have to wonder, do we think that the owners who are 97% older white billionaires, um, finally understand the issues or are at least open-minded to the issues and therefore moved in the right direction or uh do we think that maybe again my theory only i have no evidences maybe they're not looking to have a prolonged heated argument with players just before asking players to embark on a totally unprecedented and maybe risky season during COVID. Is it possible that maybe they thought,

we don't need this headache right now. Let them do whatever they want. Oh, it's definitely possible. I wouldn't put it, I wouldn't have passed. Now, I don't think Goodell did this with much owner's approval. I mean, it could find out that he did it, but I definitely think it's possible to say, hey, look, let's win the moment now, right?

Let's win the moment now. Let's win the moment. Let's be on the side of the NFL players. Let's show them the support. And I think if you read some of the articles, like when Pat Mahomes was in the video, it's like, look, Super Bowl MVP, the best player in the NFL.

He's in this, like, we have to respond. And then the president attacks the NFL as well. They had felt that. So I think that it's in the moment, it's a win. The question becomes, how do they handle that moving forward? Is there real change? What happens now? But I think it's the win the question becomes how do they handle that moving forward is there real change what happens now but i think it's the first right step acknowledging that you have a mistake then move on from there all right well so you just alluded to pat and people for the longest

time have been saying as soon as some star players step up you know guys where you can't make a side argument well he doesn't deserve to be in the league anyway which was always what we heard about kaepernick pat mahomes is the best player in the league. One of the only other guys on his level is Drew Brees. So I think we all know by now, Drew Brees, to put it lightly, really screwed up with words a few days ago. I mean, he stepped in it bad and people were really hurt by the things that Drew shared in an interview on Yahoo. But many believe he bounced back quickly. All right. Not only did he apologize

for his words, he expressed shame for his previous ignorance and committed himself to more listening and learning. He didn't say that he changed his mind or anything like that. He just acknowledged that he did not understand the issues and spoke poorly and wanted to apologize to everyone involved for it. So then President Trump tried to use Drew as a political weapon with his greatest hits tour about the quote-unquote respecting the flag, and Brees wasn't having it. So Brees took a pretty bold stand. He doubled down on his new stance with a post directed at President Trump saying, quote, I realize this is not an issue about the American flag.

It never has been. We can no longer use the flag to turn people away or distract them from the real issues that face our black communities. We did this back in 2017. And regretfully, I brought it back with my comments this week. So that was Drew after this realization. So he's publicly taking a huge leap forward and challenging the president on this issue. After a big mistake, you know, one we're not going to all forget, he just cleared the way for other star white players to get smarter and then speak up like he has. Agree? I think so.

And obviously we saw his wife put out a heartfelt statement as well. And I really do think that they mean it. I think that as apologies go, I think Drew Brees and his wife and everyone involved, they really do mean it. And I want to make something very clear, Gabe, very clear, because it's something that's pissed me off all weekend i've told you about it i've tweeted about it let's be very clear on what happened okay drew breeze is not apologizing for the way he personally feels about the anthem and what it means to him he is not doing that he's apologizing because he

didn't listen to his teammates he did not listen to what they've been telling him, to how they feel, and how, why, really how and why they decide to take a knee in the protest. That's what he's apologizing for. It's apologizing for not listening to his teammates. He's not apologizing because he feels a certain type of way about the anthem. He's not. When they play their first game this year, I think it's Tampa Bay. Your boy, Tom Brady.

Week one. Drew Brees is going to stand up there and probably put his hand over his heart, think about his two grandfathers. That's not going to change. But now he understands the guy next to him might take a knee and he gets why he does it. That's what's changed. And so many people, and this is so typical social media, right? Just completely ignore the entire context of what's happening and say,

Drew Brees gave in. He gave in. No, he didn't give in. He decided to listen to his freaking teammates for once. Like that to me, it's so simple to decide what actually happened here. And we have decided to just ignore what happened and pander to either side, really just to one side of the situation. He did not apologize for him personally feeling that way about the flag. What he apologized for was not listening to what other people say. His wife said this very well. To say, I don't agree with disrespecting the flag,

I now understand was also saying, I don't understand what the problem really is. I don't understand what you're fighting for. I'm not willing to hear you because of our preconceived notion of what the flag means to us. That's the problem. That's all they apologized for. It's so simple. And of course, we are what the flag means to us. That's the problem. That's all, it's all they apologize for. It's so simple. And of course we are missing the entire part of this. That's all it is.

Drew Brees now understands, hey, look, the guy next to me, I love my brother. And there's no doubt that Drew Brees has done great work for the city of New Orleans. I do not think he's a racist. I never thought he was. He just did not listen to what other people have said about what the protest means to them.

He now gets it. As his people on called him I do think the apology is heartfelt I don't know what I don't I know Thursday the apologies just came out as I recorded my my podcast I wasn't quite sure if it was sincere or not and then hearing his teammates talk about it they had an emotional zoom 100 minute zoom call by the way Shaq was on the Zoom call, which was odd. But yeah, so they had, Peter King wrote about this morning, they have a scheduled speaker like once a month. It just happened to be the day Shaq was scheduled to speak. And so he was on the Zoom call as well.

So look, I think Drew has done the appropriate amount of apologizing. I think his teammates mean he's understanding, sincere now. I don't think it's going to take a lot for him to mend the bridge. Because again, look, he has done great work in the city of New Orleans. There's no doubt. Do you think he's racist? Have you, did you think this? No, I don't even think it matters if I think that.

I mean. No, but people immediately were like, oh, he's a racist. He's not. No, I mean, I don't know if I get to be the arbiter of that, but I think probably the most even fair assessment of the situation was that Drew Brees may or may not be a racist. I personally don't think he is. But what he wasn't proving to be was what now is an important term, an anti-racist. He was not doing anything to further this cause that so many other players are fighting for. And that leads me to a point here where Shannon Sharp, who's as smart on football and these issues as anyone on earth.

So please go check out the things Shannon has to say. He's just wrapping up his own show right now. I'm going to read a little quote from Shannon who spoke with Drew over the weekend. And our producer Zuri helped find this. I want to make sure I get this in because I think it's important. This clarifies the difference between being not being racist, which is a thing that a lot of star white people, white players have leaned on, and then being anti-racist, doing something extra to support your teammates. So this is from Shannon, quote, I said, Drew, for one second, we didn't want you to be Drew Brees. We wanted you to be one of us. What hurt the most is that it came from you. No white quarterback in the history of the NFL has had black support like you. And so Shannon, who laid that out for Drew directly, was saying, like, you have the opportunity to do more. That's why this bummed us all out so much. out so much. And that's why I come to the conclusion that his apology probably was sincere. But more importantly, 24 hours later, he took on the damn president. Like, I don't know what's in

Drew Brees' heart, but if you want action, the dude is acting. He's immediately saying, don't use me for your point. In fact, President Trump, think the opposite of what you've been saying. I'm Drew Brees. I stand by that. Now, that tells me that he's doing what Shannon Sharp was asking for. I think that's, I think Shannon, he has been great with this as well. He, it's, Shannon sums this up, I think, pretty well. Again, it goes back to my point about Drew was not apologizing for his own beliefs. He was apologizing for not listening and not being supportive of his teammates. And we talked about this even last week. Like, it was a Yahoo Finance interview.

Like, it was a home run question. It was, hey, Drew, what's your responsibility as a leader? And yes, the kneeling was mentioned at the top of the question, but it just was a freaking home run. Hey, man, look, I support my teammates when they kneel, but, you know, or do it the other way. was mentioned at the top of the question but it just was a it was a freaking home run hey man look i support my teammates when they kneel but you know or or do the other way you know when i when i when i hear the anthem for me i think about my grandparents who fought in in world war ii and how much it means to them and i stand and i put my hand over but but i understand my teammate wants to kneel i understand why he's doing it and i get and i support him like that that's all you have to say. But of course, he didn't do that. He writes it and Shannon Sharpe's point, I think,

is accurate. Look, he immediately went back to disrespecting the flag thing. And I'm actually surprised he went to President Trump. That might go a longer way than any other apology that he had. That's going to be the lasting impact of all of this is going to be that Drew Brees, who he has some kind of relationship with Trump. I mean, they've been pictured together. I don't know if he'd put on the Make America Great Again hat or start campaigning for the president, but he's certainly familiar with him. And the president has complimented him, which implies they have some kind of connection. And if he's saying, Mr. President, you're wrong. I was wrong. We need to stop pretending that we think this is about disrespecting the flag. We need to acknowledge what my black teammates have taught me.

I think that's a huge step forward. Now, some people may never give Drew another chance. That's their choice. I was bummed out by what he said. I analyzed it a lot. You, me, and Zuri talked about it a lot. And now I feel like he's taken some serious action to help. I hope he continues.

I think just being able to listen to your teammates and hearing what they go through is the first way to do it, which he has. He's just being able to listen to your, I think just listening to your teammates and hearing what they go through is the first way to do what she has. He's done it. He got bombarded. People talk to him. And now obviously what action do you think he's already donated a ton of money.

He's helped a lot of low-income communities. It's not like he hasn't done those things before, but now you're just listening and he understands and that's it. So that whole part about disrespecting the flag is over. I just want to make that very clear that he didn't apologize for his own beliefs. He apologized for just not listening and not having compassion and not having empathy. People have been using the word ally lately. And I think he has shown that he intends to be an ally and to use his resources.

And Drew Brees is a pretty powerful ally if he wants to be one. He's got a lot of money and a lot of people listening to him. So let's see if he continues to help. I'm going to move to a story that I mean, I can't believe is sort of getting lost in all of the tough news that we're reading about. This is falling down the headline stack in a lot of cases, which it would be the number one story in sports normally in times of COVID. So listen, people may not know this. College football programs right now are reporting positive COVID-19 cases all across the country. And we're not talking about random schools. We know that Alabama, Auburn, Oklahoma State, Iowa State, and Marshall have all had reported positive tests.

Who knows how many other positive tests have not been reported positive tests who knows how many other positive tests have not been reported or tests have not been taken yet it seems like all the players who were tested positive had been asymptomatic and now they're mostly going into isolation and dealing with it that way but guys are supposed to be coming back to campuses college football is about to sort of start ramping up as we get this news. Remember, Notre Dame has already adjusted their academic calendar because they want to be ready for what they expect a second wave of COVID to be in the late fall around Thanksgiving. So places like that are already thinking about what might be coming. Before that's even happened, we have guys testing positive. So, Jeff, I hate to be doom and gloom, especially coming off some difficult topics,

but this is a very, very bad sign for anyone who wants to see football in September, be it college or NFL. I'm worried about the season starting on time, and I'm worried about the season getting interrupted if we already have players testing positive. I don't think people are going to care. I've been kind of on this for a while now, and not my opinion has not changed, especially since we've seen now a couple of states have been open for a while. And yes, they're testing a lot, but their numbers keep going up.

And I just don't think people are going to care as much. I know people have tried to equate, you know, people don't care anymore because there's protests happening. I don't think that's the case. I think people that have gone to protest, at least the videos I've seen, have worn masks. And we know that transmission outside is not as common as it is inside. So I'm not really, don't think people stop caring about the virus. But I do think, generally speaking, Gabe, there's just not as much to care. I don't think people are going to care as much. Look, today is June 8th, recording on June 8th, okay? March 8th, three months ago, just three months ago, we were playing basketball.

We were in spring training. Everything was normal. Things change so fast. And I think they continue to change. As we're talking right now, the World Health Organization put out a report saying, look, asymptomatic carriers might not spread the virus at all, which means that the five players in Alabama that they say are asymptomatic won't spread it to anyone else. And that obviously will be a game changer for all this. That's, you know, we don't know if that's totally accurate.

Who knows? But it's exciting if it is. It's exciting news to, you know, moving forward for sports. I don't think people care, Gabe. I really wish I had a better answer for you. But I think people will just isolate the players and continue on. I don't think it's going to be a concern unless an entire position group gets wiped out for some odd reason.

But if it turns out the asymptomatic carriers of COVID-19 can't spread it, then that's a game changer, obviously. Again, that changes the discussion thoroughly. But I just don't think people care anymore. Well, OK. I mean, that's sort of a nihilistic view on things. So let me just – I'm not trying to convince you to convince other people to care. I know you care. You're to convince other people to care. I know you care. You're saying other people don't care.

I mean, look, I just think that when we get to football, people are just like, whatevs. Like, all right, a couple guys, I want my football. A couple guys tested positive, whatever. But we would agree that however much people care, once a team learns of a positive case that player can't play they can't be around their teammates if they're carrying this virus so whether or not people think this matters or is a big story or is overblown or whatever if guys start getting it because they're getting it from their teammates and they're also around their coaches and the other people on the whole campus this is going to make some schools say hold on this ain't worth it any longer so i'm just worried the money's too great man i think i think that's the problem yeah but

i mean there's already a loud chorus and i i tend to agree with most of the people who believe this that are arguing that these players have to be treated better. These college football players who don't get paid to do this can't be put in some of these situations where their health is at risk before they're even earning any money. And now we're going to just say like, ah, you know, we got Mississippi state this weekend, get out there with the guys you have. Yes. If you, cause I think if you ask the kids, would they play or not, they'd all say they'd play. I know that,

but think of how many things from our childhood that our parents had to prevent us from doing because it was idiotic. We shouldn't have been doing it. And it's not, again,

it's not about the kids. The coach of these teams are all old men. The concern is not the kids. The concern is a couple of things. The concern is obviously the coaches that are of age that coronavirus attacks you know more more ferocious ferociously it's the parents right it's in the community if you get if you get people sick because we look we know that the healthy

healthy players 18 22 are probably not going to get very sick from the coronavirus but also the one thing we don't know we're finding finding more out, is that if you have coronavirus, are there long-term health symptoms? We don't know that yet, right? We don't know that. And that's the concern that, small scale, that I have is like, look, if the player tests positive, yes, they might be asymptomatic. They might not spread to anyone else. But is there a long-term health effect symptom of having coronavirus? But Gabe, I know that my view is very simple, but I literally think that like we wait to September, people are going to be so excited for football. They're not going to care if players are testing positive.

So I'm not, I listen, I can't compel morals onto people. People are going to care when star player X of said team can't play. And he's a, he's a game day scratch because he tested positive. They might not care about the situation they put him in or what this says about our society, but they are going to care that the game isn't being played the way they thought it would be played, right? Like if you're betting on a game, if you're playing fantasy football,

like I can't even believe I'm talking this way because it makes these people sound like they're not humans, but that people will care about that. They'll care because their favorite guy's not playing, but they'd rather have that than no sports. Here's the issue, Gabe. What do you do? Do you just say there's no sports until there's a vaccine? What's the solution, though? Well, I'm not proposing that that's the solution, but I think we have to be honest with ourselves that we aren't going to like some of the solutions.

We're going to veer into a whole other show here if we keep going. So I want to bring it back to the NFL for a second because they they're at least on some level trying to acknowledge this reality. So they've implemented they put out some memos. They've implemented some new policies, behind the scenes stuff in order to try to get ahead of this. Right. So they're going to have the locker rooms be socially distanced. They're going to encourage virtual meetings even after teams get back together. They're still going to say if you can meet away from each other, you should. They're going to change the way that guys work out.

So just smaller groups of guys working out in bunches. But it doesn't change the fact that they still don't know how our players going to travel together? What are stadiums going to be set up like? Like none of the big issues facing the NFL have been addressed, but a first step memo has gone out to talk about safety, testing, and treatment. What were your thoughts on all that for the NFL? We talked college. Yeah. So let's take specifically to some of the things that happen for the players, right? Which is basically the social distancing, they call it physical distancing, in the locker room and in the areas of work.

So locker six feet apart, weight room 15 guys or less, meeting rooms have to have chairs six feet apart, no more than 20 players in a meeting at a given time. So it has to be done virtually otherwise. There's going to be tier systems for personnel tier one tier two tier three there's gonna be obviously cleaning of lockers all this other stuff done but just specifically to the idea of like the lockers being six feet apart the idea of the meters the nfl does not have facilities that can handle this nfl lockers are not big they're. They have 65 lockers in them.

Like, the logistics of making this work is going to be really fascinating to see because I would say, okay, move meeting rooms to cafeteria and indoor. Not everyone has a full indoor field. Some only have 50-yard fields. Some have no indoor field. It's going to be,

I don't know how they logistically pull this off. I mean, also, isn't this a bit of a red herring? Like Jeff, what, what seems more problematic to you that your fellow teammate might be sitting a few feet too close to you, or that when you go out on the field, you're going to spend an hour smashing into another sweaty guy, huffing and puffing in your face. Like what? I'm sorry. Like getting the distancing right in the facility is not really the issue. Well, I'll say this.

People have made the argument and though it is very valid, but I want to give you one example of where, where the distancing in the locker room could be helpful. First of all, look, as much as you can, you want to practice the physical distancing, right? Even though on the practice field, we know it's not very possible. But I locker next to Steve Weatherford for the Giants,

a punter, okay? I'd never see him all practice. I'm not close to him. I'm not near him at all. But what if he's symptomatic and I'm in the locker next to him and he gives it to me because we're sitting right next to each other

and we're bullshitting like usual. And then I pass it to the offensive lineman. They pass it to the defensive lineman. Like it could be easily prevented by just me not being close to him in the locker room. Now, I think players have to wear masks in the locker room as well. There's a lot of things here. Also this game. I think it's very easy to put in a lot of protocols early on like this and then take them away as data changes.

So if you say, okay, look, we're going to set everything up now to be six feet apart. We're going to have to wear a mask. We're going to limit meeting rooms. We're going to limit all this stuff. Then as data comes out, the changes, we can then say, okay, we're putting lockers back. We're changing things as we go. I think it's easier to do it this way than just have no restriction and just try to put them all back right away. I guess. I mean, I'm not Dr. Fauci. So, you know, I can't comment any further. We're going to have to accept, man, that it's going to be a shit show this year for football.

Like, the guys are going to test positive. They're going to be sick. It's just going to be a shit show. You already see colleges. You mentioned it. The colleges are adjusting their campus schedule now to not have football or not have school past thanksgiving break um mark emirate the ncaa president said hey look we probably won't get a full season in like it's it's just gonna they're trying to do

anything they can to just get some sort of football played and this is what we're gonna have to to risk doing this now we've seen it look we've seen the other leagues around the world that are not as physically close as the NFL, right, that are really on top of each other. But KBO, Bundesliga, they've gone by with some positive tests, but they've made it work so far. So it does give me hope that football can make it work as well. Okay. I think the NFL, these are millionaires making grownups making their own decisions. I think this conversation is going to make its way to mainstream news and not be a sports conversation. When you ask amateur athletes to put their health at risk to play a game where they don't see any upside right now, this is just going to further the conversation about why these kids aren't getting paid. Listen to what I said at the beginning of this. Alabama, Auburn, Oklahoma State,

those are three teams that are probably going to be top 10 teams this year, already have positive cases. They haven't even been smashing into each other yet. So I don't know, man. I think it's going to lead to some much, much bigger philosophical conversations. We've been in some pretty heady space here. We've been we've been talking about some big, serious stuff. I would like, if you don't mind, to take a big, deep breath. I'm going to have a gulp of water here and we're going to move the line. Normally it's

our over under betting game where we pick random topics and I make you take a side. But instead of doing that, I want to go kind of through every single pick in a mock draft that ESPN put together, where they repicked from this year's draft with all eligible current NFL players, right? So not drafting college players, drafting current NFL players to real NFL teams in the order that they drafted this year. The list is insanity. It's totally hypothetical offseason nonsense, but I want to get your take on that next. So take a big, deep breath, have a glass of water.

We'll put a little edit in here and we'll pick it up on the other side. All right, welcome back in everyone. Gabe properly got his water and now he's ready to continue on. So we have the over under segment. We're going to make it a little different. ESPN did a draft of really the top four rounds from this year's draft. We're just going to go over the first round here. They just drafted players for their teams based off of where the draft slot was last year,

including trades. Anyone was available. No salary cap. Just build your team. Go ahead and do it. And of course, in typical fashion, Gabe, a lot of people got it wrong. But no surprise. That's why I'm here to correct you.

I'm here to make you a smarter football fan. So, Gabe, I don't know how you want to proceed doing this, but let's go at it. I'm going to go pick by pick. And where there's no debate needed, we'll save some time. And then a few are going to lead to some real exhausting analysis. I do also want to clarify, Jeff, you laid it out well, but one important point, the people who drafted for these teams were instructed. This is as though you're trying to win a Super Bowl within the next few years. You're not in like a total rebuild mode. You're trying to win in the near term with the picks that

you made, which makes some of these choices even more puzzling if you ask me, but whatever. All right. so first up number one pick was Cincinnati if they could pick anyone in the league right now obviously without money or anything being consideration they took Patrick Mahomes I don't know why anyone on earth would argue that that's easy right okay number two is Washington they also don't have a franchise quarterback currently so they took Russell Wilson I suppose we could debate it. I don't think you will. Russell Wilson feels like a safe number two. Yes. All right. Here's where it gets interesting. Detroit, who is now at the tail end of a Matthew Stafford era, has the opportunity to

draft Lamar Jackson. And so they do. What do you think about Lamar Jackson going to Detroit? And so they do. What do you think about Lamar Jackson going to Detroit? I mean, is Detroit going to buy in to the same level that Baltimore did? I guess so. I mean, I would have gone with the next guy that was picked, Deshaun Watson at three, Carson Wentz. Oh, what? I mean, Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers.

Like, I just, I don't really, I mean, look, I'm going as many times. So Detroit's going to basically draft Lamar and do the exact same thing the Ravens did, right? They're going to build their team exactly the exact same way the Ravens did? Or are they going to do like the regular offense? Like, what are they going to do? That's part of this as well. I think they're going to have to then spend the next couple of years trying to rebuild what has mostly worked for the Ravens this year.

I'm going to go. I'm going to, because they picked the rest of the, okay. So here's the thing. So I know Michael Rothstein, the Lions reporter. So he drafted Lamar Jackson and then he took Derwin James, Tredavious White, and DJ Moore. How is that building a team that is remotely going to help Lamar Jackson out? I guess they're just thinking if you can get your hands on Lamar Jackson, you should, and you'll figure it out after that.

Number four, Deshaun Watson. Makes sense. Duh. Texans. Okay, but hold on. Does it? Because they have a quarterback. This is assuming that the Rosters are just like completely clear

but then none of this matters period like they're just this is just saying who would you build your team around then fine all right fine i mean sure then they would take to sean watson who would be an upgrade over the guy that they have but if in this imaginary world they didn't have it says here what about the other 20 starters for each team the rest of the roster is made up of average level nfl talent yep fine so i mean i could argue that i have an average nfl quarterback in daniel jones i don't need to pick him right now i'll go get someone else but deshaun watson's exceptional so let's go with him five was miami um yeah aaron donald i mean, look, I would just take quarterbacks until they run out. But Aaron Donald, I mean, it's not the worst choice possible.

I'd just take quarterbacks until they run out. Yeah, Aaron Donald is probably the best defensive player given his age and his ability. But he's coming way too early in this, so Miami's reaching. Then the Chargers go with Ronnie Stanley, offensive tackle. What are we thinking here? He had a great year last year for the Ravens, but I just, again, I would take quarterback.

Quarterback, quarterback, quarterback at six. Stanley's not even the best left tackle, in my opinion. You take Teron Smith or David Bakayari, but, I mean, this is a bold, bold selection here. You're taking, you're taking Ronnie Stanley as the sixth best player in the NFL. That seems to be what they're suggesting here uh okay then joey bosa fine that's a similar logic to aaron donald you get a young guy who's a stud who can do it all for a lot of years but that's a guy who chases

quarterbacks not a quarterback so we're gonna say maybe not the wisest pick then it starts to get very weird okay take a take the last week of his life out of the equation. Drew Brees at like 40 or 41 now goes to Arizona at eight. That seems off to me. Okay. So the question becomes, who are you taking ahead of Drew Brees here? Well, I mean, I guess I'd like to look for someone with more upside left. We thought he might retire. Soon wentz no don't keep trying to trigger me with that press card no who you take it dak prescott i mean i guess i'd slide further down the list and take my chances with joe burrow or tua or i mean i don't even want to say this because it might end the podcast too quickly but i'd take christian mccaffrey i you

know like i'm not gonna go for drew breeze now with what maybe he plays one more year and i'm not taking him ahead of aaron rogers if i have the two of them as old man so so the answer is so so your answer is you would take aaron rogers at eight that's your answer then if i have to follow your rules i'm going aaron rogers dak prescott's nine to jacksonville Whatever. It's high, but whatever. Again, before Aaron Rodgers. Makes no sense. Nick Bosa, 10 to the Browns.

Then we get to Carson Wentz, 11 with the Jets. Now, here's our first just like, what are we doing right now? 11, I mean, 13, Joe Burrow to the Colts. He hasn't put one snap in the NFL yet. Wait a minute. You like Carson Wentz as the 11th guy? He should be higher, but yes. You want him in the top 10?

Oh, yeah. You guys, not a hate on Carson Wentz is ridiculous. Can somebody explain? Can someone explain Carson Wentz to me? He is a total enigma to me. Why is he good? Well, he was going to win the MVP. They won the Super Bowl.

He just hurt himself. Oh, he was. you mean the year he got hurt right and then describe some of the other years he's had where he didn't get hurt he didn't get hurt last year till the playoff game oh till the game the game when he was needed okay yeah when he was when he was when he was when he was helmet to helmet the back of the head how's that his fault i'm not saying it's his fault i'm not listen i'm not shaming him for getting hurt i'm just saying like some of these guys play every day for their whole careers and prove that they're great and everyone keeps talking about the promise of carson well this is this is this is a draft off promise this is a it's a it's a fantasy draft off promise is what you're doing joe burrow he doesn't play down the nfl yet i get a little bit of like data though i've seen these guys now so i now know

carson wentz i'm good thanks i'm gonna put some money in him i'm putting some money in him to win the mvp this year by the way the um uh 14 we'll get through this game. 14 is Tom Brady to Tampa. What a surprise. 15 is where the shit goes wild. 15, Denver takes Drew Locke. This is unacceptable. It's unacceptable. Why do we hate Drew Locke so much?

You just told me quarterbacks all of a sudden. Yeah, because look, Tyler Murray is better than Drew Locke. Matt Stafford is better than Drew Locke. There's many players that are better than Drew Locke. Drew Locke has played five games in the NFL, and he was okay in some of them. Come on, man. It's ridiculous.

Well, okay. If Denver should have taken a quarterback and it wasn't Drew Locke, then I don't know why they didn't go for Baker Mayfield, who lasted until 21. Or Kyler Murray. I would take Kyler Murray. Matt Ryan went to Atlanta. It's funny how some of these mashups. We mentioned Kyler Murray, 17 to take Kyler Murray. Matt Ryan went to Atlanta.

It's funny how some of these mash up. We mentioned Kyler Murray, 17 to Dallas. I really like that pick. Pittsburgh, Teddy Bridgewater, Chicago, Jimmy Garoppolo. The Rams, of course, choose a running back because why not? Christian McCaffrey, which again, silly. Philly takes Baker Mayfield. And then just kind of gets like Michael Thomas.

And then, Oh, Oh man. How does this make you feel? Sam Donald to the Patriots. Yeah, I know. I got trolled by a friend.

I tweeted about how the jets in a hypothetical draft where it would be impossible to screw up because every good player is available to you. They still somehow did this. And then he of course trolls me with some Patriots bullshit. To which I responded, yeah, actually, he probably wins six rings if he played in New England starting now. That's the reality of being a Jets fan is knowing, yeah, that Sam Darnold has rings if he goes to New England. Not even a debate. Okay, then we had, now, 24, New Orleans takes Khalil Mack. Like, Vaughn Miller's better than Khalil Mack.

I just don't know why that distinction's still not. I'm guessing that's an age thing. I guess so. You get more years at Khalil. Ryan Tannehill, 25 is utterly ridiculous. Matt Stafford's better than him. I don't understand why. Houston takes DeAndre Hopkins.

Houston takes DeAndre Hopkins. That's just a troll move by whoever made that pick that's just funny um I can see in this that perhaps since the guys who made the picks cover these teams that there's maybe a little bit of like you know butt kissing like this was forwarded to the agent of the key player like why San Francisco taking George Kittle at 31? If not, because the guy who covers San Francisco wanted to mention that. What's the point of that? Who would take a tight end?

Who are you taking then? I don't know. I get the entire league to choose from. I'm not sure. I'm taking. I mean, you probably take Stefan Gilmore ahead of him, but George Kittle is pretty valuable,

but yeah, you, you, you're so you take, no, I would take, I would take Stefan Gilmore. I would take probably cousins.

I mean, there's, I would take a quarterback. I've never asked this question. So I'm scared of the answer here. As much as you spend your time, uh, shaming,

defaming, slandering running backs and how useless they are and overvalued they are. And you just, you hate running backs, despite living in a mansion in part because of running backs. How do you, how do you feel about tight ends? Why are tight ends critical, but running backs? They're a nightmare matchup. Teams don't know how to match them. They're, the tight ends now are, you can put them against corners. Corners can't handle them because they're too, tight ends run four fives now, four

fours. They're too fast and too big. And Kittle can do both. He can block too, which makes him even more impressive. Technically speaking, by the way, I do not live in a mansion. I actually have to look this up because my son asked me, Daddy, do we live in a mansion? And I have to look it up and said, no, we do not. But thank you but thank you anyways yes as you see the helmets behind me

that's uh jonathan stewart dan joe williams jamal charles agent peterson's 2 000 yard season right there on the wall so yeah they've helped me out a lot thank you running backs i appreciate it salute yeah i mean if anyone should salute running backs jeff it's it's for sure you um well i mean espn was having some fun and thank god because we needed a little bit of fun this week so i i like to you know nitpick it we all do but that was a cool idea i hope they do more stuff like that i would say encourage that and if it gets people to talk smart about football every now and then that's not a bad thing do you have an mvp pick for this year, Jeff? You can't pick Mahomes. Anyone but him.

Okay. Guys, we like to gamble, me and you, okay? Everyone always says that you have to bet a long shot because they have value. That's horse shit, okay? Stop betting on Josh fucking Allen, okay? Just like last year, everyone bet on Mr. Biskey. I looked up your stats. Mr. Biskey was better, far better in 2018 than Allen was in 2019.

It wasn't even actually close, okay? And people, Josh Allen right now is, according to whoever tweeted out, the number one bet right now to win the MVP. That doesn't present you any value just because he's a long shot, okay? He's not going to win the MVP this year. So I would put money on obviously, if I'm betting it, Pat Mahomes would be who I would take.

I think that this makes the most sense. And he's like plus 350. But Carson Wentz is who I'd put money on for quote unquote long shot odds. I'll tell you what, if between the choice of Carson Wentz and Josh Allen, I'll go Josh Allen all day. They're going to go 12 and four.

He's going to, he's going to run for 800 yards. He'll count for 35 touchdowns. He's still got a rocket arm. They're going to be on more, you know, we'll, we'll watch them more this year.

And he'll be like one of those, like, really? That was the MVP. All right, I guess, but it won't excite anyone, but we should bet a dinner on who's a better quarterback this year.

I didn't know. MVP, not better quarterback. No, but you are so into anti-Sam Darnold, by the way, who's going to take your team back to glory. I just don't like big, strong guys who don't actually hold on to the ball and stay healthy. I'm just not into that. Sorry.

He does not stay healthy. I'll give you that. But look, he got monolingual. It's a kissing disease, man. He was out in Brooklyn. He was out in Weehawken. He was out in Hoboken just doing his thing. It happens.

It happens to the best of us. Sorry, buddy. We're married. We don't have to worry about it. You picked some really weird towns. Sam Darnold's not hanging out in Weehawken. I don't know. He's going out there for a duel with alexander hamilton what the hell is a weehawken reference doing in this show we're next to hoboken this is close enough no i think it was i think it was i got it i think it was in hoboken though i think sam darnold can afford meatpacking

or someplace in manhattan a lot of players go out and make out with the girls a lot of players don't live in weehawken that's why that's why i said i just like that Manhattan. I know a lot of players go out and make out with the girls. A lot of players don't live in Weehawker. That's why, that's why I said, I just liked that. I liked that city. A lot of players live right there. So that's why.

All right. You made me smarter about that. There we go. All right, guys. Hope you enjoyed our show. We had some fun today. It was good.

We talked some serious, talk some, some, some not so serious. Please rate, review, subscribe. And I'll be back later this week.

I'm hoping to get a good interview. We, we have some, some viewers in here. Get some moving, shaking things. to get a good interview. We have some, some beers in here, get some moving, shaking things. We had a good interview last week with Duke. Gabe,

have a good week. Talk to everyone next week. Have a great one.