Geoff Schwartz Is Smarter Than You - The NFL Combine Bubble, Chiefs Rumors, and the Steelers Hire Brian Flores

Episode Date: February 22, 2022

Geoff and Gabe are back after surviving the first week of the offseason. Luckily there were plenty of headlines to keep them occupied, and Geoff cuts through the noise to tell you what’s up with prospects “boycotting” the NFL combine, which stories about the Chiefs circulating on Twitter you can trust, and what to think of Brian Flores taking a job he’s supremely overqualified for. Plus, on Moving the Line, Geoff reveals which NFL players are really going to retire, and who’s just being dramatic (again), and Gabe asks why CFB can’t get playoff expansion right.Be sure to like and follow the podcast, and leave a comment or tweet @geoffschwartz with how you’re planning on spending the offseason.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

It's Tuesday, February 22nd. I'm Jeff Schwartz alongside Gabe Gowen. This is Jeff Schwartz of Smart. You're powered by the Varsity Podcast Network. And we did it, Gabe. We went one full week without the NFL. But there's always NFL topics to discuss. We have some NFL combine news to discuss.

There's some issues with the bubbling, with players skipping as well. Brian Forrest took a job. Some Eric Biennemi news. And some other ons and ends with the NFL Gabe how was your first weekend without football since August it was actually quite nice but I had no excuses to avoid my family um so I was in full dad mode I did not even get to see any of the NBA all-star festivities which I'm sure some of our fans were were watching NBA All-Star festivities, which I'm sure some of our fans were watching. But a sports list bubble was okay for me for like two days. Yeah, I did not watch the NBA All-Star game because it didn't

start till like 9pm Eastern, which is just way too late for you. And I was like, yeah, I'm gonna watch you with my wife. I will tell you one whole something that happened this weekend. So my son is had baseball tryouts on Saturday, took absolutely way too long, and they're completely pointless, but he's 7 1⁄2. Like, this is completely pointless. But he did his tryouts from machine pitch. It went well. So my wife is kind of getting in the flow of, like, baseball being back,

and she's not, like, an athlete. She didn't play sports as a kid. So yesterday we were playing catch with my son, and my son ran off to play with some friends, and she goes to me hey can we play catch i was like what do you mean yeah cool she goes i've never used a glove before she had never in her entire life played catch with a baseball or softball what and we played catch yesterday for 20 minutes and it was the best i would i am glad there's no football because otherwise i never

would have played catch with my wife. I mean, hearing you say you played catch with your wife this weekend, I'm thinking that you mean something else, but you are literally talking about throwing a baseball. In the front yard with no football on yesterday, about 3 p.m., my wife and I, she put on my son's glove and we played catch. I fixed her, she held the ball with all five fingers.

She now holds the ball with three. So, yeah, that's a very rudimentary changeup. But nonetheless, so, yeah, a weekend without football. Watched some college basketball. I played some catch with my wife and my kids. And here we are talking about football again, as it always happens. There's always football news. Where would you like to begin?

I think I'd like to begin with the most confusing story that may be a non-story, you know, by the middle of the week. So over the weekend, news broke that 150 or so NFL prospects are, they're organizing, I guess, what we'll call a boycott, though I think the reporting has already shifted. It's not a boycott anymore, but they're upset with the bubble rules that are going to happen at the NFL Combine. And as a result, a lot of guys are saying as of now, they're not going to come. Agents are pissed off. It just doesn't feel right. Jeff, I know that the Combine is kind of just a made-for-TV event.

It's just a fake reality show that smart people like you have never really believed in, I think. But also, this seems like a total overreaction, and I don't quite understand what people are pissed about. Sort this out for me. All right, yes. So the NFL Combine is approaching. March 2nd, I believe, is the first day of the Combine. And let's do a background on the Combine first. What the Combine was originally intended for, which it still is now, is medical checks, right? So it's one centralized location where all the top draft prospects go in Indianapolis. And we spend an entire day doing medical so there's multiple

rooms with all the team doctors from each team and you go into each room they already have your medical information and they poke and prod you and move your body where i remember i was in one of the rooms and a doctor was checking my knee stability he's like do you do you sprain your mcl once i was like yeah four years ago as a freshman in my second week of training camp, they can feel these things in your body. They mark everything down. They send you off for MRIs, x-rays, other imaging, you know, EKGs. They do it all, right? It's a huge medical workup. Secondly, there's the mental part of it. Now, they've eliminated the Wonderlic, but they're using other mental processing tests to use kind of more on probably a better process than is the Wonderlic test. And then you interview.

You interview with the teams. You interview individually and in small settings with team personnel if you're good enough. And that is the major bulk of what the combine is. The workouts is what we focus on, what we see on television now to televise product. That's the end of the week. You go there, you work out the last day and you leave. And it is interesting the way the combine workouts go

because for a game, you would have proper sleep proper rest proper recovery you eat well you show up and play the combine is not like that at all the combine is wake up early drug test up late at night poor food and it almost feels like at times the combine design to get you to work out in a stressful environment rather than than an easy kind of your normal environment to see what you're made of right it felt that way when i was there it feels that way watching it now that is set up in a manner to actually make it less advantageous for you to work out because then because then the last day you work out you work out in this giant empty dome it It's four degrees outside, not particularly warm in the dome.

You run 40s, you do your testing, you do your position drills, and it's just like a long, sterile, boring, drawn-out day. And that's why pro day, typically, a lot of players do better, right? You're at home, you're comfortable, you warm up properly, eat properly, whatnot. What set people off this year, Gabe,

was the combine, or the NFL, I should say, decided to make the combine a bubble, okay? They're not allowing the players to prepare even in the way they used to, whether that's warm up in the lobby before the combine, whether that's do some throwing drills in the lobby, whether that's meet with your medical personnel. You're allowed one approved medical person,

whether that's your trainer or a PT or someone else, to help you while you're there. But it has to be a designated room. The food, outside food can be brought to the lobby. But otherwise, you have to eat what they have for you. And the access for agents and marketing people is not quite there. But the reason why this is so surprising is the NFL decided during the playoffs, COVIDovats over we're not testing for kovat anymore right right we're ignoring kovat and we're seeing around the country i know you're still in in la county it's different for you but like everywhere else we're dropping mass mandates i'm in i'm in charlotte north carolina our mass mandate is over

friday it's done and we're probably not going backwards our school mass mandate probably done march 7th it's so this is like it's all kind of coming to an end, it feels like. And then the NFL's like, oh, never mind, bubble. And it just seems like it had gone backwards. And I think there's already a movement for top players to not do the combine, at least the physical part of the combine. Again, they still have to go for medical. They're all going to go, Gabe. It's a matter of whether or not they part of the combine. Again, they still have to go for medical. They're all going to go, Gabe.

It's a matter of whether or not they actually do the drills. The agents are trying to use some leverage to get the NFL to go back to the way it used to be, which is more people there, more hands-on people. You get to bring your own food and whatnot and kind of have more of an open environment. And you're right about the changing of the words. The NFL went from, the agents went from,

we're going to boycott to like, well, I mean, we're not telling the boycott, but like, if they don't show up, then we'll advise them not to do that. It says here, Adam Schefter tweet out, agents are not threatening a boycott, but rather considering advising the players in mass to hold off on workouts till pro day. All right.

It's a boycott, right? Either way you want to put it. I don't know what the right thing is here. I just will say the bubble, Gabe, seems very odd considering where we are right now as a country and where the NFL decided to be for the entire postseason. I think you just have to combine as usual. Let everyone be themselves. I don't know why I was this past week down in Dallas to film Big Boys Club, right? So I'm at this facility for three days. Yeah, they're just working out like normal. COVID's not a thing, right? Why all

of a sudden now are we going backwards into bubbling? I don't know. I get why people are upset about the change, especially being announced 13 days before the combine. Yeah, well, I, I can't argue with anything you've just said, I guess. My question is, is it just that agents of, you know, star players have not liked the combine format for a while. And we're looking for an excuse to, you know, gain some leverage and fight for a while and we're looking for an excuse to you know gain some leverage and fight for a few things they care about and this was the excuse they got and that this probably just blows over the combine is only valuable to a certain class of player anyway and you've walked us through that in the past like we're not learning anything new about the top three quarterbacks of the combine

i definitely think it's agents who are who are trying to exert some power, right, and that don't like the combine in general. Mike McCarthy, who I'm close with, he was a priority of sports. He's still a priority of sports. He was one of my agents when I played. He represents Aiden Hutchinson, one of the top defensive players in the country. They represent Icky as well, one of the top offensive tackles in the country. And he tweeted out, as an agent, I struggle with the combine.

Players get optimal nutrition and rest for games. The combine, almost the opposite. Improper rest and diet, and they get tested in a cold, sterile environment. It's part of why guys test better at pro days, and somehow the NFL has now made it worse. So this is telling you right now, right? He's not been a fan of the combine. It's true.

I did much better in my pro day than my combine i ran you know two hundredths faster i you know i jumped higher i was in you know again less stressful but i do think the point of the combine is to be very stressed and again i want to make this point because you mentioned i had made it before but for new listeners um is the physical part of the combine it's's testing, right? We always talk about the 40. There's a 10 and 20 involved. There's some agility drills and your position drills. What it is for scouts, if there's 100 points, emphasis, to get drafted,

it's like two of the 100. But what it does is, let's say, we're evaluating you, Gabe, right? And on film, you look fast, you play quick, you move all over the field. And in their mind, they're like, there's a certain number Gabe's going to run at the combine, certain way he's going to look.

And you go out there and you do not make those numbers. You are worse than those numbers. You look less athletic. They're going to go back and wonder, why is he faster on the field than he is at the combine? Is there a reason for that? What is that reason? That's actually better, right?

If you play fast, that's good. Vice versa is the guy that plays slow but runs really fast. It's like are they not confident in their abilities? Is their offense holding them back? What's the reason for that? And that's what the physical part of the combine is for. And again, now because pro days are back in mass, right? They're not, you know, a couple years ago because of COVID, they weren't.

That you can evaluate these players in the pro day now just the same. But again, those numbers are not going to be the same as the combine. And so I wonder if teams, if someone skips the combine, teams hold that against them. Yeah, well, we'll never quite know how teams will react. Let me ask you another story that's sort of i wouldn't even say related but fits into the same category of players are upset about a thing that i don't think the average fan fully understands we may be by some talking points from one side or the other but i would like you to tell me why all of a sudden so many nfl players

are freaking out about turf versus grass. We know Odell got hurt on turf in the Super Bowl. A lot of people tweeted about it then, but this conversation has continued. Some people we like and trust are pro-grass. About half the stadiums right now are turf. Why is this such a big problem for players? Well, I'm extremely pro-grass. I've talked about this.

I think all outdoor fields should have grass. I don't care where you play. If you can have grass in Green Bay, in Pittsburgh, in D.C., you can have grass anywhere. It seems like the NFLPA made a concerted effort to tell their players this is messaging, right? Because, look, does Odell get hurt in the Super Bowl on grass? Probably not.

I don't know. Maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe he doesn't. Well, not on that play that way, but maybe he gets hurt by getting his foot stuck in the turf, or the grass, excuse me. The thing about it is that there are a lot of injuries on turf. We've seen now that we have domes in Arizona and Vegas that can grow grass outside and move it inside for the game.

Again, we have stadiums that have grass, that have multiple teams play on the grass in a week. It's not great grass. Pittsburgh's not great grass. It's grass nonetheless. And it does feel like an absurd effort by players this week to make that a point of emphasis. I don't know if that's something the PA has talked about

or whether that's just something that they decided to do on their own. But there definitely is a push this week from NFL players. Dude, my year in Kansas City, we played 17 games. We had a playoff game. I played 15 games on grass. It's awesome. You play your eight at home, your three on the road, which was in that point San Diego, Denver, and Oakland.

And we played at Philly that year. We played, what was the other NFC East team? We played Washington that year. So we played both NFC East teams that have grass at home. Went to Jacksonville. It was, the only team was, we played Buffalo, in Buffalo and in Indianapolis for the playoff game. Otherwise it was all grass.

That was awesome. That was so much, I mean, that just, you think about turf too, and this doesn't happen for games per se, but like the places that are cold and you're inside for practice for last eight weeks of the year and that dude that turf it it gets on your knees your ankles not falling down just like you feel that weight of that hard impacted turf on your bones and on your

joints and ligaments it's not fun to have to play on turf for weeks at a time okay well i i would have guessed as a fan who's played recreationally on both surfaces i would have guessed that players would prefer a really good turf i'm not talking about the crappy turf of the 80s you know in philadelphia i'm talking about like the state of the art stuff no dude we prefer grass i think i mean i i'm hearing it loud and clear now maybe some guys on defense like pass rushers want to play on turf they're typically faster on turf yeah let's go guys but majority of players they want to play on grass yeah fair enough uh another offseason storyline that we thought would linger and and maybe now some people wish this is the end of the story i actually kind of think it's the beginning of the story so brian

flores um took a job as a steelers defensive assistant and linebackers coach. So that's a step down, obviously, from a head coach. It's also a step down from a big coordinator job. But it is a job. And it was only a couple weeks ago we were wondering if this guy, because of the stand he took, was ever going to have a job again. So credit to Mike Tomlin. I guess credit to the owner, Arruni II. But it still makes me feel a little icky that, you know,

the only tenured black coach in the league and a ownership group who has this rule named after them, that they're the people who hired him and gave him a chance and no one else would. That feels weird to me. You? Well, I guess we don't know if anyone else was going to give him a job as a position coach. Obviously. I think he was senior. I think he got the title of senior assistant, right, and linebacker's coach.

He really, in this situation, he's almost like an analyst because this is their third linebacker coach. I feel like he's just there to, obviously, kind of what Nick Saban has always done, right, hires former coaches to be analysts for a year, and then they go off and be a head coach again somewhere else. Brian Flores should certainly be a defensive coordinator somewhere. He's very qualified for that. And he's qualified to be head coach.

We've talked about this before. He should be all those jobs. But the Steelers end up hiring him to be the senior assistant. The Steelers did the NFL a big favor here, Gabe, right? Because hiring Brian Flores takes this lawsuit, in my opinion, out of the spotlight a little bit, right? He's in a position where he won't be interviewed by the media. Like, this is not a coordinator position, not a head coach position.

He's not going to talk to the media about this. Maybe the Sears let him do it on his own, but he's not going to be in the media. He's coaching again. Hard to claim that the NFL, and again, we've talked about this, the NFL has a hiring problem. So when I say this, just thinking about this from like a lawsuit perspective, right? Hard to claim in court I'm being discriminated against when you have a job, right? Sure. That's a hard argument to make in a courtroom.

Not, again, saying this knowing that he's qualified enough to be a defense coordinator or head coach, but he has a job in the NFL. So you can't say, hey, everyone's discriminating against me. You have a job. Again, the more I think about his lawsuit, the more I think it's going to be hard to prove specific allegations in the lawsuit. Obviously, as a whole, though, right, we've talked about this subject more. It was covered all Super Bowl week, all radio row. We saw the instances of minority hirings,

whether it was at the executive level or coaching level, increase exponentially after the Brian Flores news came out, the lawsuit came out. So all those things are good progress for the NFL. They have a long way to go. But in the end, the Steelers, I think, did the NFL a solid here, Gabe. I mean, it certainly seems that way.

And who knows how much intent there was behind that. Who knows if Mike Tomlin feels that he has enough power to help keep this guy's career alive so that he then returns to head coaching one day do you think that will happen is this if you were going to write a script for Brian Flores to get a head coaching job again is this a step he would need to take that's a good question Gabe um I think a lot depends on the lawsuit outcome right like the NFL pays a billion not billion dollars but you know millions of dollars depends on the lawsuit outcome, right? Like if the NFL pays him a billion, not a billion dollars, but millions of dollars to settle the lawsuit,

maybe he's head coach again, right? While the lawsuit's still active, probably not, right? I think that feels very unlikely. But afterwards, he's still very young too. I mean, there's a possibility 15 years from now he's head coach, right? I mean, like there's a lot of possibilities there. But I think while the lawsuit's still active and pending, no chance of being head coach.

Okay. Let's leave it there. And then I want to bring up something a little closer to home for you. And certainly something that's been in your mentions for the last several days. I read a long story written about the Chiefs and Coach Biennemi and Pat Mahomes and all the drama going on with them

around the AFC Championship game. Then there's a whole other side angle of talking about Pat and his family and his wife and his brother and the whole thing. There's a lot of basically like anonymous drama and oddly sourced reporting going on around the Chiefs, which boils down to it seems like players didn't really love playing for Coach Biennium lately, and it's hard to unpack what the truth is. So do you have any insight or any reaction to all these big bombshells that are taking over chief's

kingdom well look the the stuff with with pat mahomes wife and his brother is gross right like that shouldn't be we shouldn't be speculating about that and and people have have debunked that theory um a lot they just he just, that's not true. The story was he asked his wife, or future wife, I should say, and his brother to not come to games next year. That never made sense to me. There was a little bit of Pat Mahomes and his wife, or fiance, I should say, were at a basketball game, and they had an interaction,

and people were mocking them for that. I just think that's just gross, right? It's what social media has become at times. I just don't like it, that part of now the article about eric bnme was was interesting um it has been retracted i believe or not retracted but not posted anymore the authors of the article said hey we're receiving too much hate and and racist comments in our in our mentions and our comments we're taking it down we stand by reporting we're taking it down the article was long game it was a lot of things that I think are true wrapped around a lot of things that are not true. And

it's hard to piece together what is true and what is not true. It's very clear the Chiefs and Eric Bien-Ami are, I think, destined to break up, right? The Chiefs have made it clear that he is no longer employed, but his contract is up. And they've made this clear a couple of times now. We have seen Andy Reid go out of his way trying to get Eric Bien-Ami a job, right? He's been very outspoken about it. Eric Bien-Ami's interviewed a lot of times. He doesn't have a job. I think it's beyond, you know, a race issue with Eric Bien-Ami, right?

Just like everyone has said, oh, he's not hired yet. It must be the NFL's hiring problems. He's had 15 interviews, Gabe. Like at some point, it's not about that. And I don't know what it is. We've heard bad interview. I don't even know what that means. I don't know what bad interview means, right?

They have these nine-hour interviews. What does a bad interview mean? I don't know. He seems like he should be prepared for interviews. Maybe he's not. I can't speak to that. I haven't been in those. I haven't been told that. But obviously there's a reason why can't speak to that. I haven't been in those. I haven't been told that.

But obviously there's a reason why he's not being hired. I don't know what it is. If you have a better answer, at Jeff Schwartz, tweet me, leave a comment. Do you have a better answer, Gabe? I don't know. Well, I don't have a better answer. If I'm going to take this reporting,

which I guess has been taken down, but if I'm going to take it at face value, it sounds like the narrative of the story was that Coach Bien-Ami and Pat specifically were not seeing eye to eye about the offense. Oh, we'll get guy is getting a lot of credit for a great offense, but in fact, he and the quarterback are not on the same page, don't get along, and a lot of the players are frustrated with this guy. I can see why you wouldn't want to hire that guy. So if there's truth to this reporting, I do see why he hasn't been hired.

Let's get to that part of this article. So they try to frame Eric Biennemi in a way that it was his fault that the Chiefs' offense struggled this year, and it was his fault that the Chiefs' offense struggled this year, and it was his fault that the Chiefs struggled in the second half of the AFC Championship game. I think that's putting a lot of blame on Bien-Ami that's undue. In the end, this is Andy Reid's offense. There are parts of the game that Eric Bien-Ami might call,

but in the end, it's Andy Reid's offense. I've talked about this many times. It's always his offense. It will always be his offense. No matter who's calling the plays, the offense is Andy Reid's offense. I think Eric Bien-Ami calls some plays, I think, but I've said it all along, and I feel very strong of this,

that Andy Reid calls the plays. And it was mentioned in an article that Eric Bien-Ami has in his contract that he's the play caller. Maybe they may just get him a head coaching job, but it's Andy Reid's offense. The blame should fall for failures on Andy Reid, not Eric Biannimi, in my opinion.

Now, Eric Biannimi is part of the offensive staff, so you want to put some blame on him, be my guest. I mean, he's part of the staff. Are you going to put it on him and Coach Reid and Mike Kafka, who's now the Giants OC, and Pat Mahomes? They all go around, but in the end, it's Andy Reid's offense.

100% Andy Reid's offense. And to frame Eric Biannmi in that light of like, it's his fault why the Chiefs struggled, I think that's wrong. I do think there's some validity to Mike Kafka having a bigger role in the offense than reported most of the season. I think he had a bigger role. He's not there anymore and was more influential at times than Eric Bien-Ami was.

That's the whispers I've gotten in that from this story and from talking to people throughout the league about this. Do I think Eric Biennium and Pat Mahomes don't like each other? I don't think so. I think they like each other. They've been together a long time now. Eventually, sometimes relationships

just sort of fizzle out, Gabe. Especially if Mike Kafka ends up doing more than what Eric Biennium is doing or there's doing more than what Eric Bien-Ami is doing or there's some disagreement in what Eric Bien-Ami is doing versus what Kafka or Andy Reid is doing. I can see where there's... But I don't think it's as bad as that article made out to see. I do, however, I've been told this by multiple people now.

Maybe this is from the same source. But at halftime of the AFC Championship game, there was an altercation between those two, Bien-Ami and Pat Mahomes. Was it a yelling match? Shoving match? I don't know. But I feel very comfortable in saying that happened.

So this is the thing. In this article, right, there's things in the article that happened. Altercation at halftime. You know, Mike Kafka doing some stuff on the offense. Then just a bunch of stuff like Eric Bien-Ami's fault for everything. It's like, nah, it'sb's fault for everything it's like nah yeah it's not his fault for everything right like this so there's certain things like that were true in the article that were untrue that were stretched a little bit that probably so that's why the article was taken

down i think because it just was like there was some truth some not so i think i think that the chiefs have made it clear via reports that they're willing to move on from veric bnb that should tell you what you need to know, right? Because they've had him four years with Pat Mahomes, four great years, four NFC Championship games, a Super Bowl, two Super Bowl appearances. If they're willing to move on from him, that does validate some of the concerns, in my opinion, of the article.

But again, you cannot lay the blame for what happened with the offense this year on Eric Biennemi, in my opinion. It's Andy Reid's offense. Fair enough. So then as the guy who knows how football works best, let me not get into the soap opera of this or the journalism school portion of this. Let me just ask a couple of points that the story raised, which is there's a claim in this story that Pat was literally having trouble hearing the play call because there was too much traffic in his headset right so he had all three of those guys and they were contradicting one another and yelling and cursing and disagreeing with one another in pat's ear which is why we see him at times sort of

covering his ears and trying to get a play call and that sort of the insinuation was that that botched final sequence before halftime when the fight occurred was the result of a lot of crosstalk on the line to Pat. Does that seem plausible to you? Forget who's to blame. Does that seem possible? I think only one coach can talk to the quarterback at a time. So maybe there was, you know, maybe he heard, maybe the mic was open. He heard them talking, yelling at each other, like right next to each other.

But he probably didn't hear it through the headset because Andy Reid, there's only one person who talks to the quarterback, and that's Eric Bien-Ami. And again, that was sourced by players that were there, supposedly, right? But look, and they tried to, again, I don't have a confirmation for this either way, so I don't know, but part of the article said,

hey, Eric Bien-Ami told Pat Mahomes he had one timeout left when he did not. Right. I don't know. It wasn't there. I don't know but part of the article said hey eric benamy told pat mahomes he had one time out left when he did not right i i don't know wasn't there i don't know well a lot of the storytelling in this piece are very detailed descriptions of conversations with only a few people in the room yes none of them look great for coach biennemi. None of them seem like stuff Coach Reid would want out. Usually the only other person in the room in the anecdotes shared is Pat Mahomes. Yeah. So a reasonable conclusion is that it's made up or it's coming from Pat's camp. That's what I'm guessing.

You don't have to agree. That's a fair evaluation of this. I mean, that's how it reads. So maybe it's all nonsense which is why they backtracked it and maybe coach and and pat get along great but it's starting to make me see that these stories that when we find out about stuff tell me this is true jeff by the time we fans dopes like me hear about stuff going on behind the scenes in the nfl every single person in the n NFL already knows about it.

I, yeah, it does. And look, people say, I just, I hate this when people say, well, the players said on Twitter it's not true. Okay, I mean, what are they supposed to say? Yeah. Like, come on. So, dude, here's the thing. We'll find out because if Eric Bien-Ami does not get the job,

keep his job, I should say, in Kansas City, I think more will come out, and we'll find out why that is. But right now, I don't know if anybody knows who he wants to hire, if Eric Bien-Ami. There's a lot of things that are kind of working right now behind the scenes, I would imagine. But, yeah, I would be – I think EB's probably back, but I think that there is some thought that they want to be done with it. Okay.

Well, we'll see if Matt Nagy, your boy goes back uh to take over his old job again uh clearly being a head coach did not work out great but maybe being an assistant could work yeah um all right let's take a quick break we'll come back we'll move the line we got a few other stories to cover from around the league and around the sports world in general so we'll do that next all right jeff we're back it's time to move the line a little over under game uh so the green bay packers have hired tom clements as a quarterback's coach he is an aaron rogers favorite he was there with him in his best years. So now that he's back, does this mean that Aaron Rodgers is a 99% chance he still complains and still whines and still makes us wonder until September if he's playing for the team? Or is it a 1% chance that maybe he'll just be happy, settle down, show up on time and

have a great year? I think, again, that he will be back like that's that's what i've said for two years now he's just gonna make us wonder the whole time yeah i think he's i think he's i think he's back yeah all right but do you think that is it he gonna keep up this charade of i don't know maybe i'm not happy i'd like this i'd like that and be cryptic in the media and and be evasive and not show up to team events or is this just they gave him what he wanted now he'll just play ball good question he you know he did break up with his uh with his girlfriend he did i wonder if that plays a role in how he handles the off

season okay no yeah well he's broken up with a lot of girlfriends in the past few seasons i'm just curious if that changes the way. I don't know. No? I have no idea. I don't know how much he ever listened to his girlfriend's opinions on anything anyway, so I'm not sure. It seems like Aaron Rodgers kind of moves at Aaron Rodgers speed.

I don't think that too many people have much sway in his life, even the women he loves. I think he'll be back. I think he'll be back. All right, fair enough. Who is more likely to be retired next year? Aaron Donald or Tom Brady? Think about that. Oh, geez.

Aaron Donald or Tom Brady. I would say Tom Brady still. I think that Aaron Donald's going to play 100%. I think Tom Brady's 50-50. Okay. So what's the chances that they're both back? Well, Tom's only coming back to the Niners. So the Niners have to decide that they don't want Trey Lance to play this year.

They have to trade for Tom Brady. Yeah. They'd have to trade for Tom Brady. That's a good point. Okay. I believe so, right? Because he's under contract still. Yeah, technically I think that's right. Unless the Bucs just outright cut him.

Now, wouldn't Trey Lance be interesting trade bait, though? Because here's a guy who a lot of teams probably wished they could have had, who didn't look like crap the couple times he played. He's still got, what, two, three years left on a really good deal. A lot of teams could use a franchise quarterback, and he's better than most of the quarterbacks we think are available this year is he better i i don't know but i mean he's younger and maybe better than a few of them why not i i i would i don't think he's i don't think there's a lot of trade value for him okay that has traded so much they traded so much to move up for him i can't imagine they're

going right to tom brady after this year if treyland doesn't work this season maybe they go to tom brady then but i can't imagine they go to tom brady right now it doesn't they put all this money in trey lance okay i you're making more sense than any crazy theory i would throw at you i think we're going to spend a few weeks this offseason hearing people talk us into trade rumors for both quarterbacks in San Francisco. Okay, so the XFL and the NFL have announced a new partnership. The XFL is going to test out some new rule changes specifically focused on player safety. Over under 25% chance kickoffs are the first thing they try to fix. Kickoffs are the first thing they try to fix. A hundred percent.

The XFL had that unique kickoff style. And so my guy, Sam Schwartstein, was part of the XFL crew that led the change for all these rules. And he's not there anymore, but basically he was talking to the NFL about some of the rules that they've implemented and changes they've made. So now they're doing this more officially um but you know he's taking some of the things that were part of of um of what the xfl did when he was there and making obviously they're going to talk about them now um look it it makes sense i think for the nfl to have some sort of connection to one of these spring leagues and if this is the connection here which is like hey we're going to try some things out then i'm all for this um why not try it? They're not going to try it.

Minor league baseball, for example. They're trying out robot umpires and pitch counts and moving the mound back. The NFL doesn't have a minor league to try that with. College football is not changing things for the NFL. This is a good opportunity for the NFL to have somewhere to try some of these things out. I like it. Okay.

I can't disagree with that. And we do need a little bit of experimenting with some of the rules. I'd love to figure out ways for these reviews to be faster. Just streamline that whole process. Keep the game moving. Maybe the XFL can help with that. Be great. A little bit of rumor mill out of Houston. So people reporting that basically every player you've ever heard of on the Texans, namely Deshaun Watson, could get a deal done soon. So I guess, are you buying the idea that Deshaun Watson is going to get traded before all that legal stuff gets resolved?

No, no, he's not going to trade until the legal stuff clears up. I think there's some thought the legal stuff might clear up before the start of the season or before the draft. But I do think that Laramie Tunsell, I think everyone's up for being traded. But I think Deshaun Watson, like the civil suit ends like tomorrow, then 24 hours later, he's traded.

Like I think it's that quickly. But I don't think anyone could trade for him at the moment with 22 outstanding civil laws. Now, if they decide to not, to not file criminal charges, maybe the NFL says, all right, go ahead. Right.

But until then, Gabe, I think they're going to tread lightly. Yeah. It's such a strange scenario that he's, he's, well, he put himself in and then he has been put in.

I mean, he has to take responsibility for the starting of all of this, but man, what a weird limbo he's been in now for a year. All right. Speaking of limbo, college football announced that they'll be staying at a four team playoff till at least 2026 after they took a vote and a few conferences said, no way, we're sticking with four teams.

It surprised me, but probably because I'm not as informed as you are. So talk about that. But also I want to know, over under four and a half teams in the playoff by 2027, when the hell are we going to expand? All right. Lots of things to cover here. I'll try to keep it as,

there's 11, there's 10 conferences plus Notre Dame, right? So 11 votes. It was eight to three, supposedly eight, four, three against. And the ACC has been firm and not wanting to expand. So there's that alliance between the ACC, the Big Ten, and the Pac-12. Those three voted no.

Presumably, the ACC, because they don't want to expand, the Big Ten wants automatic qualifiers, which does not include, I don't think, which means if your conference wins, you're automatically in. At least one. And the Pac-12, I think, wanted automatic qualifiers. Now, the Pac-12 and their commissioner, George Klyovkov, have been very, very vocal about wanting to expand no matter what.

So I was surprised to see him vote no on this. He's been very vocal about it. So I think they want automatic qualifiers, which was not part of the 12-team deal. So that means that if someone's outside the top 12, but they win the conference, they're in, which makes sense, right? There should be some reward for winning the conference.

I think one thing that's not discussed enough is the TV rights about this. So right now, ESPN owns the rights to the Clutch Bowl playoff. And they have, I think, every bowl game but two, right? The Sun Bowl and Fox has one bowl game,

maybe the Holiday Bowl. And they own the playoff. That's ESPN. The playoff expands. Guess who owns the playoff still? ESPN. And Ioff expands. Guess who owns the playoff still? ESPN. And I think that the alliance conferences, the Pac-12, the Big Ten, and the ACC want the casual playoff to be sold like the NFL playoff over four networks.

And that's more money. It's more money for everyone else. And there's new TV deals soon for the Big Ten and the Pac-12 conference. I wonder if some of the negotiations around their individual TV deals is about having the right to have playoff games on their networks. And so I think that's under-talked about when it comes to why this is not approved was they just get four more years of playoffs on ESPN and these other networks who are partnered with Fox and NBC

CBS want those networks to also be part of playoff coverage okay so I think what you're telling me is the thing that most fans at this point want which which would please more fan bases and more regions of the country would be an expanded playoff. More football games of consequence, more teams participating, maybe more parody. The right team gets hot at the right moment. We aren't stuck with Alabama-Georgia every year. All of that seems good for the fan.

And you're saying you don't think it will happen because of the multi-millions of dollars in broadcast rights deals that are too confusing to even talk about on this show, but actually determine everything. I think it's part of it. Also, I think the the the alliance wants, they want to have some power in this restructure. And they don't want the SEC to have all the power. And this is another way to kind of say, Hey, man, you're not deciding what we do. We're part of the competition as well. Yeah, it just, my first instinct, and I think I texted or tweeted this with you, my first instinct was, man, if I was the Pac-12, the ACC,

not really the Big Ten, I think they're probably doing okay in the current setup, but those other two conferences, like, and the Big 12, like, yes to expansion, because it takes a whole lot going right for you to get in. Yeah, so I was surprised the pack 12 was again been very vocal for this voted against it surprised yeah it's weird and i think that not that utah was great all year but by the end of the year they looked pretty damn good

and i don't think i would have wanted to play utah if i was a one seed and they were the eight and they might not have even been the eight certainly nobody would have wanted notre dame to show up on their doorstep as a five seed you know i don't think anyone would have wanted both those teams lost their bowl games well but they wouldn't they wouldn't have you told us that they would keep trying if there was a championship yes correct yes you know i don't think anyone would have wanted to see a big 12 champ sort of even if they had to limp in get there i'm with you we've been better for football yeah so all right well well i guess we'll have to wait another few years to see expansion then

last thing uh we'll have to wait a few years for this too but i think this will definitely happen lebron has basically promised us that he's not retiring until he can play in the league with his son brani uh so that will take a little time. And who knows if Bronny is actually an NBA caliber player. He seems like a pretty good baller, but NBA worthy? We don't know. Hank put this question in. I like it. I'm going to ask it.

10% chance the Warriors draft Bronny just to piss off LeBron. Well, the Warriors don't care about LeBron. It'd be like the Cavs doing it to piss off, or like the Heat or something, right? Like Pat Riley. Do we know if LeBron A is an NBA player? B, does he want to play with his dad? Like, is this something he wants to do? But this is the leverage play, right?

Like whoever wants LeBron, you just pick him up as undrafted free agent or draft him at the very end of the second round. And he then ends up being, LeBron ends up coming to your team. But I mean, look, I appreciate the power move by LeBron here. Like, he's saying, like, yeah, I'm that good. I get to determine how my career ends.

And it will end with me playing with my son for a year. Yeah, and by the way, those of us old enough to remember, when Ken Griffey Jr. and his dad played together, it was awesome. Yeah, they backed back home runs, right? Yeah, it was the coolest. And this would be equally cool, except LeBron just doesn't age. So there's no reason to believe LeBron couldn't still be one of the best players in the league as he bumps up against 40. He's ridiculous, dude.

It's unbelievable. He's unreal. So, you know, his kid might not be a surefire first rounder out of the gate, but would you bet against LeBron's genes? I wouldn't. Maybe the kid grows a couple more inches. I'd take a flyer on him. Yeah, so would I. Yeah, undrafted free agent, sure.

All right, I guess we won't know for a little while. Do we think that LeBron ends his career in Los Angeles? No, I do not. It doesn't seem like it, as of yet. I think he'll go somewhere with his kid. Yeah. Do we think that the Lakers make the postseason this year? And if they do, are they dangerous?

Yes, probably. And there's that whole playing situation, right? Yeah, they'd have to win the extra game or two. Probably win two extra games. You have to win two of them, right? Yeah. No, no. The first winner, get the winner of seven.

If you just win, if you get the 7-8 and you win it, you're in. You don't have to do anything else. Yeah. If you lose, I think you round robin. I don't know. There's a whole. I think the seven, eight play, the winner's in eight that has to beat the winner of nine, ten to be in. Correct. And so they could end up somewhere in that stack, which means they got. I think they will, but I know

they're not. No, they're not winning a title. They're not going to win a title. They can't shoot. And Russell Westbrook can't score enough points in a major game. And Anthony Davis, who knows? He's hurt right now and will probably always be hurt. All right, I'll end on this. Michael Jordan, probably joking, but maybe not, teases Magic Johnson at the NBA 75 event.

Put on your sneakers. Let's play one-on-one. And they're all laughing about it whatever but i actually wondered in their prime who wins a game of one-on-one almost everyone would say jordan in their prime who wins a game of one-on-one lebron or jordan probably lebron you think so right he's bigger dude he's huge i i think eileen lebron but i imagine someone a few years older than either of us it was the first time by the way that seemed that it seemed like Jordan and LeBron really had a friendly relationship in public yesterday.

Jordan was 100% serious. He would have played Magic Johnson right there, right now. Yeah. No doubt about it. Yeah, I don't think Magic is in the kind of shape Michael's in, though. He wasn't trying to play that game. He didn't care about that. He doesn't need that.

All right, Jeff. Well, so let's do a little housekeeping here. So we're going to keep the show going throughout the off season. We're going to pick up extra episodes as we get closer to the draft. You've got so much content on the draft and then we'll probably pop in

for some extra stuff around the tournament and some things you can bet on. I want to make sure people are getting to hear Jeff's voice a lot, but it won't automatically be two or three a week, every week, all off season. We're going to slow it down a little bit. Correct.

Yes. Some of us are taking a little vacation, a little alone time, a little me time, and it's a little slower right now. So perfect schedule. Again, we'll have some stuff on March Madness. We'll have some stuff on NBA playoffs. We'll have some NFL draft stuff as well, as you mentioned, heading toward the NFL draft,

which will be here before we know it. Then guess what? Back to the grind. Can't beat it. The NFL's almost nearly year-round. We're powered by the Varsity Podcast Network. Have a great week, everyone. Please, if you listen this long, you enjoy the podcast, please leave me a rating, a review. Let me

know what you thought about the episode, at Jeff Schwartz on Twitter. Talk to you guys next week. Have a great one, everybody.