George Kamel - Agree to Disagree | The Minority Mindset & Humphrey Yang

Episode Date: February 19, 2024

 💵 Sign up for EveryDollar today - Create a free Budget!  Today, I’m bringing together two of the biggest names in the weird little world of personal finance YouTubers—Minority Mindset’s Jaspreet Singh and the one and only Humphrey Yang. We play a game called “Agree to Disagree,” and things get real.   Next Steps  📗 Order George Kamel’s new book, Breaking Free From Broke.   Offers From Today's Sponsors DeleteMe: This episode is sponsored by DeleteMe. 🔒 Remove your personal information from the web at JoinDeleteMe.com/George and use code GEORGE for 20% off. 🙌   🎙️ The Ramsey Show 🍸 Smart Money Happy Hour 💡 The Rachel Cruze Show 💸 The Ramsey Show Highlights 🧠 The Dr. John Delony Show 💼 The Ken Coleman Show 📈 EntreLeadership   Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

What's up, guys, George Camel here, and today I am bringing together two of the biggest names in the weird little world of personal finance YouTubers. Three, if you count me. Which no one ever seems to do. I think I need a hug. That's right, I'm hanging out in person with Jaspreet Singh, host of the Minority Mindset YouTube channel, which has over 1.7 million subscribers. Not only that. We have paired him with the one, the only, Humphrey Yang, a viral TikTok influencer and YouTuber with over a million subscribers. Now, the three of us, we mostly agree on things related to money, but there are things we disagree on.

So I thought it would be fun to try a new segment on this channel called Agree to Disagree. And I thought correctly, it was fun. You don't want to miss it. But before we get started, help me catch up with these two titans of the trade and get our numbers up. So hit those like, subscribe, and share buttons so I, too, can one day become a titan. We're hanging out with Justpreet Singh and Humphrey Yang, two of the great financial YouTubers of our time. welcome. Thank you for having us. You guys are meeting for the first time today. Is that correct? We are. This is true. I feel like a magician being like, you've never met this person before. This is fun, especially because we come from very diverse backgrounds with different financial

philosophies. But what's cool is that we all have heritage from the East origin. Is that a good way to say it? That's a appropriate way to say it. We're all first generation Americans. Yeah. Is that how that works? Where are your parents from? How are you from? China and Taiwan. Okay. Yep. Just breathe. Northwest India, state called Punjab.

Nice. And then my family. Of course, Egypt and Syria. Obviously. So we're representing most of Asia today because Syria is in Asia. Can you guys confirm? I will confirm that. Well, I thought because we have mostly the same financial philosophy, but a little bit different,

I thought we'd play a game called... I agree to disagree. Here's how it works. We have paddles, and I'm going to say a financial statement. And if you agree, give it a thumbs up. If you disagree, give it a thumbs down. And then we're going to explain our answers,

our caveats, our objections. You may go like, yes, but, and that's okay. But you have to land somewhere. We've got to draw a line in the sand at some point. Are you guys agreeing to play this game? I agree. Oh, yes. You must agree, contractually.

Okay. Here we go, guys. Yes, it did sign away all my grades. A yes, but answer to start with. This guy, this is not going well already. A good credit score equals good money management. All right, we got two disagrees, one agree. Do we fight him now? How does this work?

Yeah, let's fight him. Okay, what's your thoughts on this? Good credit score equals good money management. Why do you disagree? Oh, I disagree because credit is a measure of looking at how you pay off debt, generally. And I like what the Ramsey philosophy is on that when it comes to credit. Credit score is kind of just a made-up number. It doesn't really mean anything.

I know people that really brag their 800 credit scores with lots of debt and no wealth to show for it, a good credit score doesn't necessarily mean anything about wealth. I wholeheartedly agree. Humphrey, you disagree. I don't disagree with that statement, which is that a good credit score has nothing to do with wealth. I definitely agree with that. However, I think if you have a good credit score, it means you're typically good at paying off your debts at least on time. So I think it does take some financial discipline to do that, and many people can't do that, and that's why they have a bad credit score.

So back to your original statement, I think having a good credit score means that you probably have somewhat of a decent money management system, although if you're still in debt, you know, that's another question. Okay, speaking from a man who is debt-free. That's true.

So, yeah, I see this as the credit score is about debt management, not necessarily money management. Because, like you said, you could be technically broke while paying your debts off perfectly on time, all of that. Here we go. The best way to build wealth

is to invest in a, 401k. Why are you disagreeing with me on this one? I thought we could have a win. I thought we could have a family win today. Don't have a go against a family, Jerry. I don't think it's the best way to build wealth, only because I feel like the 401K is a type of forced savings account.

And I think that if you really want to build wealth, you have to build above and beyond the 401K. And I do think that a 401K offers you a lot of tax advantages. It offers you a match. If you can get that match, it's free money. However, in order to build true wealth that's going to last you, perhaps your lifetime, or the next generation, you kind of have to go above and beyond that. So I think just investing in a 401k isn't enough. I think you got to do a little bit more.

Hot take. All right. Just free? I would agree. I think for anybody who aspires to become wealthy, 401K is one of the worst ways that you can go. Because when you put your money into a 401k, you lose control. Your money is tied up with Wall Street for a number of years. They're going to take a percentage of your money, no matter what.

yeah, you might get some tax benefits, but you can get way better tax benefits. I'm telling you as an attorney, who's not your attorney, by not investing your money to $1.1. If you want tax benefits, go and put your money into rental real estate, and now you can get a lot of tax benefits,

and now you control your money, you can access your money, and you have way more ability to invest your money into other types of assets as well. Juicy. All right, I'll give you my take. I think for the average American

who can't afford rental real estate, I would only tell them to buy investment property with cash. that's a hot take on its own. But with the 401K, we did our millionaire study, over 10,000 of them, and we found that 80% said the 401K was the vehicle that helped them get there. And so to your point where you were saying, hey, I think it's going to be really hard to build wealth, with 401K, you know, the limit for a year, no one's maxing out their 401K.

We tell people to invest 15% of their income into tax advantage retirement accounts as a baseline. And we found that if they do that, they're going to build wealth. they may not build $10 million in a 401k, but can they build $2 million, $3 million in that nest egg over their working career? I think so. And so I think for the average person, it's a great tool that is underutilized

and people aren't investing enough. So I think if we have the savings rate up, you can absolutely build a solid nest egg there to help you out in retirement. It's smart to pay off your house as soon as possible. We have our first win, guys. Let's go. Let's go.

This is controversial, this is a controversial, take in the financial world. A lot of people, when I tell them this on social media, they will harangue me in the comments going, if you have a low interest rate mortgage, you're stupid to pay it off early. Why are they wrong? Yeah, so I think that psychologically, it's a huge win. And I think when you don't have any debt, it frees you up to maybe try something more risky in your own life. Perhaps you have more options, more flexibility. I think if you can just pay it off in full, whenever you can, it's going to be, it's going to free you up so much mentally. And I think I value that piece of of mind over anything.

Good take. I like to look at the home that you live in as a liability. It is not an asset. And the reason why is because, so I'm a licensed realtor and I don't practice now, but when I used to, the big sales pitch as a realtor is you're buying your biggest investment of your life. It is the biggest purchase you're ever going to make.

So now when it's the best and biggest investment you're ever going to make, what are you going to do? You're going to buy a little bit bigger. I want more. And so now what happens? You keep buying into this big money pit. And now every time something goes wrong, you've got to pay out of your pocket to fix it. Every time something bad happens, you've got to pay out of pocket to fix it.

And you think that you're building wealth, but in reality it's just money going into this black hole until hopefully you can sell it for a profit. And I was starting investing in real estate after the 2008 crash. And so I saw firsthand that real estate prices go up and down. And when you understand that, it's going to help you realize that, oh, maybe this invisible number, this invisible equity could go away someday. And when you keep living off of that invisible equity but pulling cash out and spending it, which is what a lot of people like to do, you're playing a very risky game.

Good takes. Yeah, and I like the idea of when you pay off your mortgage, you have freed up that payment to now invest. And you reduced your largest fixed expense. And so you're right, I don't see it as a cash flowing asset because it's your primary home. You're not making money off this thing. It's going to cost you money.

But reducing that payment is going to help you build well faster. And we recommend investing, while paying off the home. And so that's a big caveat. People think I'm not investing and instead I'm putting all that money towards the home. I'm still investing for the future, but I want to get rid of that mortgage.

And it feels good. The best interest rate I found is 0% on that mortgage, and that's what you get with a paid off home. Hey, we'll get back to the conversation in just a second. But real quick, let me tell you guys about delete me. Delete me removes your personal info from hundreds of data broker websites. In fact, they found and removed data about me from over 500 sites. and they sent me an easy-to-read report outlining what they did.

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Is that a caveat or does it matter if you can afford it or not? Hey, I said what I said. Well, I said what I said too. I know this is big for you. It's one of your taglines. Afford the guam. Apparently it is. Yeah, get the guac, baby. Get the guac.

But you got to afford the guac. See, there's the thing, right? One does not simply obtain the guac. One must afford the gull. It costs money to get the land, to grow the avocados. It takes time to see the trees grow. It takes money and time to get the avocados off of the tree, to then make it into guac. Now, if you want that guac, good.

Go ahead. earn it, but you gotta afford the gawk before you go on and buy the guac. Don't go into credit card debt to buy guac. Even if it was at Chipotle, come on, people. What a beautiful journey of the avocado you just walk this through. That was beautiful. We can do a whole episode on guac. I'm sorry, dude.

Talks about your guac in San Francisco. Yeah, yeah, what's true guac in San Fran? The avoculars are pretty good in California. So I don't know. They're good. You know where they're grown? You got a local guy? No, but, you know, I get my guack.

The produce is good in California. Yeah, produce is good. You guys have a nice out of farmers markets out there, man. A farmer's market. How's the avocado in Detroit? We get out of some California. Okay, smart. Good move.

Good move. Probably same here in Nashville. Agree or disagree, no lying. Everyone should be making a monthly budget. Agree or disagree. These are my budget bros right here. Let's go, man. Let's go.

Budget bros. Did we just become best friends? Yep. Okay, this word has gotten a bad rap. A lot of financial creators out there have kind of dog the budget to be like, countercultural, like budgets are stupid, buy what you want,

use my spending method. I think a budget is just, it's just an intentional spending. Yeah, exactly. It's just on spending willy-nilly. It's going, do I have the money? Is this a priority?

Can I cover all my bills and things that matter to me before I go spend? Yeah, I like knowing where every dollar is going to go and then having a little roll for each dollar and then knowing that if I have some left over,

I can spend it on whatever I want. I love that. That's why we call our budgeting app every dollar. Wow, see? Boom. Big brain thoughts. How about you?

I can't... Donald Day, I can add more to what you guys said. Wow. We've left disparate, speechless. Spouses should have separate checking accounts for his and her spending. Agree or disagree. Oh. Now, to clarify, do you have a spouse?

I don't have a spouse. Okay. I think that matters in this discussion. I think that's a good point. But state your case. here. You're saying, hey, Humphrey gets his spending account, she gets her spending account, then we have one joint for bills. Is that how you see it? Sure. Yeah. Why is that? I feel like if I were to marry a person with similar values, that I wouldn't even have to worry

about what goes on in her spending. Obviously, I don't have a spouse, so I don't know, but... But ladies, eligible bachelor. And also, in my head, I was just thinking, man, one day I'm just going to make so much money. It doesn't matter how much my wife spends. All I heard was, if you marry Humphrey, unlimited spending is yours. So my DMs are open. The DMs are open. How you doing? What do you think about this?

I think, yeah, do whatever's right for you as a couple. But for me, because I can only speak from myself, my wife and I have one bank account. It's really just a matter of understanding. My wife knows she can kind of buy whatever she wants, but doesn't. Just out of respect, like, you know, even if it's a $3,000 handbag is not a big purchase for us, fortunately.

We're very fortunate for that. But she doesn't go out and just do that on impulse. So I think it's more of an understanding on a relationship more than just a financial side. Because if you're marrying this person, you guys are sharing everything. I think you should be on the same page financially as well. I like that. Yeah, the way I see it, to your point, Humphrey, people think if there's only one checking account, it's going to cause some friction restriction on spending.

But my wife and I have one bank account, and then we have a budget. And together, there's a line item for, Whitney's spending, Georgia's spending. And so we talk about that ahead of time and go, here's how much you get to spend without my judgment, as long as there's nothing morally wrong with it. And luckily, we have very similar values. And she's not impulsive in doing crazy things.

But I think it frees you to go, no, no, no, Humphrey has $300. He gets to spend on whatever he wants this month and enjoy that. So I found that there creates transparency and trust in the relationship when you have one account. All right. This next one is ripe. because you guys are in this room.

Having immigrant parents is a financial advantage. Agree or disagree. All right. Let's hear the stories. Well, I think when you have immigrant parents, what that means generally is you get to see the real value of hard work. You get to really appreciate the value of a dollar. Although I didn't grow up with the financial education of investing,

I learned the value of hustle, the value of working hard, the value of kind of doing whatever it takes and not complaining about it and being able to appreciate what you have, the opportunities you have here, because when you come from an immigrant family, why did your parents come to this country? They came because it's a better opportunity here than there is there. And so when you grow up in a country where your parents came with nothing, you really have nothing to lose and everything to gain.

I like that take. How about you, Humphrey? Yeah, I agree a lot with Jess Breed here. I think it instills all these values in you that perhaps the average American family might not, if you're not first show. generation. You know, they came here for an opportunity and I don't want to like let that be squandered away with my choices. And so I think I got a lot of good financial habits from my parents as well. And so yeah, I definitely agree. Let's go. I love it. Yeah, I think there's a natural sense. There's a

common sense frugality with immigrants. Because they came with less and there's more opportunity here. And there's almost this gratefulness and lack of entitlement that I find with immigrants. They're not scared of work. They never think something's going to be handed to them. And I think that creates more wealth have handled correctly. Now, of course, there's immigrant stories where they are deeply in consumer debt, trying to live a lifestyle, impress people, whatever. But for the most part, I found immigrants have this innate sense of,

I'm not going to out-earn my stupidity. I'm going to live on less than I make. Buying a home is better than renting a home. Can we do this? Yeah, I'm pretty much late there. Big caveats. I think by the time you die, yes. Right now, no matter what, no.

Agreed. I'm on board with you. Is that fair? Yeah, I'll go with you. Same. Buying a home when you're broke is a terrible idea. 100%. Like when you're drowning in debt payments, you've got nothing down,

and you're just buying because of the pressure, terrible. But is a home a solid asset? And like we said, paying off that mortgage, getting rid of your fixed expense versus rent continuing to go up, I think it's wise to a. eventually be a homeowner. But depending on your situation, your city, the cost of living, doesn't make sense for everyone just to go by. Yeah. It's smart to have an investing pro in your corner as you build wealth. Investments only, or? I said what I said. It's smart to have an

investing pro in your corner as you build wealth. Does pro mean they're paid? It's just a professional. We didn't talk about how they're paid. Well, they could also be the pro themselves, right? You could be standing in your corner as your own pro. I am not qualified for that. Sure. If you're Humphrey and Disprete, easy for you guys to say, as financial prodigies. If you're paying a financial advisor, I would go to this for investment advice. You don't think professional should be paid for their services, is what you're saying. Not financial advisors for investing advice, no. Okay.

I think it's wise over time as you build wealth, especially, serious wealth. Things get more complicated. You want to be strategic when it comes to tax planning and charitable giving. and even just having that person to walk you through, give you perspective, help you understand things. They're knee-deep in this stuff every day versus the average person who's not in the financial space. I will add on that that's okay

because of how you said it changes over time. I do agree. I think as your wealth accumulates, you're going to want to lean on more professionals when appropriate. And you guys, do you work with any pros or are you the pros? So you're like, I don't, it's not necessary for me.

You used to be a financial advisor. I am the pro. So again, he's working with the pro. I don't have a financial. advisor. I work with. I manage my own money. This guy is he does it all. Lawyer, real estate agent. What have you pursued? I don't work as an attorney. I got that degree for my parents, immigrant parents. So I got that for them. So if you didn't go to law school, would your parents find you, would they be disappointed in you, even with your success today? Well, the reason I went to law school

is because I disappointed them. I didn't become a doctor. Oh, so doctor's number one. Lawyers like you're kind of a failure. Lawyer was a failure. Oh my gosh. You have to become a doctor or be a failure. And when they found out that I wasn't going to be a doctor, they were like, you have to at least become an attorney to keep some pride in the family. Was there resentment there?

Because if I, law school is no joke. Like, to go through all of that to appease family, it would hurt my soul a little bit, if I'm going to be honest. For me? I don't know. I wanted to make my parents happy. It was a respect thing. It was a respect thing.

Okay. I think we kind of, they knew that I didn't want to, but I think in their eyes, it was, at least you'll have. have some protection or like some fall back on this terrible suck bar career of being a lawyer so at least you'll have something to fall back on wow all right agree or disagree i would spend over 500 on an item just because of nostalgia this might be something you've done but would you spend over 500 bucks on an item because of nostalgia all right is there an item in mind like what would

you be willing for me it'd be like a concert or something like that where you know i want to relive some sort of experience or I might have to change my answer now. Yeah, I mean, I can't think of anything. But if something I really wanted and I can afford it and it's not breaking my budget, sure, why not? If you have that ability in your budget to buy something, whether it's stupid or not, as long as you can afford the stupid purchase,

that's fine. If you could like that money on fire and not miss it too much. Yeah, exactly. Like I spent the biggest, the most expensive concert I went to was over the summer and it was to see Blink 182. And it was like over 300 bucks and included all you can eat food and drink it was solid but that like hurt my stomach

to spend that much but that was nostalgia for me if you could afford it right that's the big thing right if you didn't have $300 to spend and you put on your credit card then it's a red thumbs down I like that okay you guys change my mind I revert to green it is better to invest in real estate than the stock market agree or disagree this is a tricky one I'll give I can only speak for myself

right I can't speak for myself too For myself. Oh. This is tough. I'll go. So for you, just, real estate has been better than stock market.

It's for me. I understand it more. I like the thing that I can see, feel, and touch. I understand it. I built an amazing team in real estate.

So there are people that have become incredibly wealthy in the stock market without ever touching real estate. There are people that have become incredibly wealthy

in the real estate market without ever touching stocks. I don't care which one you pick. I do both, but I personally prefer real estate over stocks. That's strong. I like what you said there.

And it's, We always say invest in what you understand. If you don't like real estate, you don't understand it. Don't just go buying property because you heard it was a good hack to wealth. How about you? I personally don't own any real estate yet. I'd like to get into the real estate game by buying my own home or perhaps an investment property down the line.

But for now, I just have stocks. And, you know, to be honest, both are assets that appreciate over time, hopefully, with real estate. And as long as you have some sort of assets that have some leverage, I think that's more important than not investing at all, right? Yeah. Well, I've seen people who, they have rental property

and their cash flow is so minimal or it's in the negative. I took this call yesterday in the Ramsey show. They are losing money. They're paying money to own this real estate property. And I'm like,

if you sold that and just put it in an index fund, you would make more money than your rental makes. And so I think in some scenarios it's just like, you've got to think through this the smart way. And so I like paid for real estate.

That's going to cash flow a heck of a lot better than highly leveraged mortgage real estate that's barely cash flowing. So that's my take. I don't think one is truly better than another. You know, it was a little bit of a trick.

Taking out student loans as a good investment in one's future, agree or disagree. You didn't have student loans. No. Did you have student loans? I did not. Wow. Am I the only one? Good for me.

But is it, though? People have gotten crazy thinking it's good debt. That's the term I hear. There's ROI on a degree, therefore take out unlimited student loans to make it happen. You'll make more over your career. Yeah. But I think it holds people back financially into adulthood and stunts their growth and wealth. Well, I'll tell you from my perspective, because I started when I was in college, that was when I started my first business.

It was a party promotion business. I didn't party. I didn't drink. But I saw how much money people were blowing on partying and drinking. There's an opportunity. Absolutely. And the crazy thing is it's, you have, well, from my perspective, what I saw was a lot of kids, deep in student loans who are spending money like crazy. You know, you go and get the exotic apartment.

You don't have cheap apartments. Like when we were in college, a lot of them are now bougies, very nice, very luxury apartments that are very expensive. 19, 20, 21-year-old, you're buying bottle service with money you don't have looking like you're Rick Ross when you're not making any money. And you don't even look like Rick Ross. He looks great now.

Have you seen it? He's lost a lot of weight. So the thing is, I think pseudalones can be okay. I'm not opposed to them, but there has to be a path to monetization, right? Which means if I want to be a doctor, because I want to be a doctor and you need certain loans to get there, fine. But just like anything else, then shop around.

Don't go to the most expensive school just because it's got a name. There's ways for you to mitigate the amount of loans you get, that way you can get the best ROI. Think it like a financial decision. Think of it like a business. All right. Agree or disagree. I own a tuxedo. I'm trying to think if I own one.

You know good and well if you own a tuxedo. I do own one, yes. Wow. No, I would have not, I would have thought Justbred is the Tuxman. I thought this guy's been to a black tie formal event. Look at him. Here's my thought, okay? Every time it costs to rents a tuxedo, it's about $250 for me, right?

See what I'm just going to buy one. So I bought a tuxedo. It was $800, and I've already been to two weddings with that for a black tie one. So, you know, if I go to one more wedding in my life, I break even. Invite him to a wedding so we can R.O.I. guys. What are you doing? Help a brother out. How about you? No tucks.

As far as I don't know. A lot of suits, but no tux. A lot of suits. If you guys need a suit, come by to Detroit. We got some amazing suit stores out there. You got a suit guy? I got a suit guy. And I'm paying very, this one right here, maybe $185.5, three piece. No way. Yeah. I got to see your suit guy.

Agree or disagree? Yep. Everyone should have cryptocurrency in their investment portfolio. Everyone? Wow. So it turns out you don't think crypto is so great, Humphrey. Well, I have some in mind, but I don't think everyone should have some. Why is that?

Because everyone's at different ages in their life. Let's say you're 60 years old. Do you need cryptocurrency with your retirement coming up soon? Probably not. But I think if you want to add a little bit of speculation into your portfolio, I think 2 to 5% in your portfolio. A little speculation spice. Speculation spice.

You never know. But even you're calling a speculation. It is. I've gotten dogs for calling it that. So here's the thing. It is quite speculative, but it's also been the best returning asset since 2010 whenever it was created, right, in terms of percentage. So it's like, might as well have a little bit in there just in case. All right.

I call it schmuck insurance. So I don't feel like an idiot if it goes up to like $100,000 for Bitcoin. It's kind of the foam over like, dang it, I should have got in when it was hot, man. Yeah, but I'm okay if you don't have it at all, too. I mean, you can live a great life without it. You're not going to hurt Humphrey's feelings. You're not going to hurt my feelings. All right.

What's your take on this? Don't make your investment portfolio a speculative portfolio, right? Make a speculative investment, the speculative piece of your portfolio, make it a small piece of your portfolio, and have some fun with those things, whether it's crypto, whether it's something else, maybe, whatever it might be. So, final, what's right for you? I like that. Yeah, I'm not mad at crypto.

I just think people need to first be investing into those index funds and mutual funds and retirement plans before they go throwing money into these speculative things. It's like buying a boat. It's a toy. Agree or disagree? I prefer spending money on experiences over things. Oh, yeah. We're not thing people.

I think everyone has a phase of you like stuff, but you realize once you have the stuff after three months, you revert back to normal and everything's the same again. So really, experiences are what brings me fulfillment, and I'd rather have a good experience over, than something to remember, some nostalgia, if you will, over a piece of clothing or an article of jewelry. I agree.

I've been very fortunate that after my wife and I got married, we were able to travel and see many different parts of the world and live in different parts of the world, which was so cool. And you get to see different cultures and different people, even within the United States. Like Nashville is very different than San Fran. It's very different than Detroit.

Well, just like that, the United States is very different than Europe. And the way that European countries operate is very different. So just seeing that was a very cool experience. Yeah. I think as you get older, you start to shift towards experience. Last one, we're ending on a juicy note. credit cards cause you to spend more than you would with a debit card. Agree or disagree?

Say for the average person. You are above average, I assume. No, I would say just for the average person who doesn't keep a budget, let's say. They might feel tempted to spend more on a credit card because they have that limit available to them. Fair point. And you disagreed? I mean, I agree with what you're saying, but I think now if you can control your spending, your credit card is just a medium of experience.

exchange. So if once you can get that mindset of I know what I'm spending and I'm not going to overspend and my credit card is just a tool to make that transaction, it's not going to change how you spend your money. If it is, you got to stop using a credit card. Yeah. Well, you know, we know the stats on how many people actually are able to pay off their card every month. And there's new studies that I found interesting. I put this in my book in the credit cards chapter. MIT did a study with fMRI technology and they scanned the brain at the point of swiping that card. And they found that it not only releases the brakes, but it also hits the accelerator on spending, which was fascinating to me.

And so that was a really interesting way to look at it. When it hurts less, it costs more. When there's less friction, when it's not your money, like your brain knows, I'll pay it, but it's not my money right now leaving my bank. I think the more friction and pain we can bring back and discomfort when it comes to spending, the better off will be. And that's why I like the debit card, even over the credit card. I do think cash is the most pain.

Right. cash is no matter where you're spending. But even with a debit card, you know that's my money being spent now versus someone else's money I have to pay back later. So that's my take. Well, guys, it's been such a pleasure having you on. Humphrey, where can people find you if they want to learn more and follow you? Humphrey Yang on YouTube and Humphrey Talks on Instagram and TikTok. Love it. Thank you. And just free. Minority Mindset on YouTube and socials. And you can also check out Briefsmedia, briefs.com, where we have free newsletters and a bunch of cool financial news and education content. Well, you guys are doing amazing work, helping people build wealth, avoid traps out there, and you both have amazing channels.

So there's room for all of us in the space, and it's an honor to know you guys. Thank you for being here. Thanks, Travis. Listen, that's as much fun as you can have legally. I had a great time, and I hope you guys enjoyed this video as much as we enjoyed making it. Huge thanks to Jaspreet and Humphrey for playing along and hanging out with me today. And if you liked this video, check out this one where I started a really awkward fight between Graham, Stefan, and Jack Selby. It's worth a click.

Thanks for watching. We'll see you next time.