George Kamel - Confronting Graham Stephan and Jack Selby on Relationships and Money

Episode Date: November 3, 2023

Today, I’m joined by YouTube’s favorite dynamic duo, Graham Stephan and Jack Selby, in their first-ever interview together outside of their podcast, Iced Coffee Hour. And things are about to get spicy, people—because we’re talking finances, relationships and building wealth with a partner.  Links: This episode is brought to you by BetterHelp. Give online therapy a try at https://www.betterhelp.com/george and get on your way to being your best self. Preorder George Kamel’s new book, Breaking Free From Broke, and get more than $100 in FREE bonus items. EveryDollar budget deal: I love a good deal, and when you sign up using this link, I’ll hook you up with a 14-day free trial and $15 off your first year of the premium version of EveryDollar. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

What's up, guys? Today I'm joined by the unlikely dynamic duo known for their playful banter and legendary impact. No, I'm not talking about Snoop Dog and Martha Stewart, although I wish I was. I'm talking about Graham Steffen and Jack Selby. And if you've been on the internet lately, there's a good chance you've seen these two guys. Graham is a real estate mogul turned YouTuber, hosting one of the most popular finance YouTube channels out there. And of course, his right-hand man, Jack Selby, co-host of the Uber popular Ice Coffee Hour. And let me tell you, the conversation is about to get spicy, because I'm getting these guys to share some hot takes on finances, relationships, and building wealth with a partner. And they didn't always see eye to eye on things.

We've come a long way. Now, it's one thing to debate the right way to buy a Tesla and how to invest for the future, but the real battlefield is the heart of man. And we're going to get to the heart with this dynamic duo. And let me tell you, what you're about to experience is something we've never done on this channel before. An exclusive interview with these two guys for the first time in history. Okay, this is Jordan and Pippen. This is Steve Martin and Martin Short. Shrek and Donkey.

Thelma and Louise. Final answer. The greats, the goats. Here we go. Graham and Jack. Graham, show us how it's done. Would you do with the honors? Absolutely.

So first, you got to hit the like button and subscribe. You're approaching. You know what the next milestone, 150,000 subscribers? Preach it. And you could be a part of it if you hit the button. It's free, right? It's free. I don't charge.

Cool. There you go. Thank you, guys. They're gonna actually listen to you, I feel like. For Jack, it's his birthday today. Please, guys. Do it for Jack. For my birthday.

Subscribe. What a day. It's a huge day. Did you, like, think, you know, you're turning 25 today? Yes. Did you think, as a young boy that you'd like, when I turn 25, I'm going to be on the George Camel YouTube channel on my birthday? It's funny you say that because that's actually all I've ever wanted.

That's your fantasy. Aside from you hitting 150,000 subscribers, of course. That means the world. That's all I've wanted. That's it. I just peaked. I just peaked right now. That was my peak.

You can't get any height. Or more handsome. You're doing great. Well, I'm excited to have you guys here. A lot going on in your lives. I mean, you're betrothed to be married. That's exciting. Are you tired?

There's a lot of wedding planning? Are you nothing to do with it? So far, it's been easy. I have not seen, like, any difficulty with it so far. Must be nice to be a male planning for the wedding. You haven't RSVPed yet. And it's $80 per plate, Darren. I'd say the hardest part for me is some, honestly,

some of the prices. I just don't see... Because you're a frugal guy. Does it hurt you to see like flowers or $3,000? That for me was something I couldn't wrap my mind around because I thought I could just go to Trader Joe's or a grocery store there. So why wouldn't I do that? For $500, I could be all in.

So I think we're probably going to do that. Or just gets married in a Trader Joe's. Oh, the other thing you could do, the edible arrangements. And you get a whole bunch of those. You get like 15 of those things. Put those as the centerpieces. No waste. We're eating it. Do you have a ring bear yet?

Yes, I think we do. I think it's Macy's younger brother. Do you need a backup? Possibly. Flower girl? Yeah, we got a flower girl. Dang it. I'm running out of options here. Usher. Do you have an usher? I can help people to their seats. Maybe that's you.

Is Jack going to be in it? Yeah, Jack's officiating. No way. Yeah, he's going to do it. Are you licensed? Do you have to be licensed? Dude, it is so easy. I've looked it up, done extensive research. All I have to do is, like, pay negligible feel. Put it on the company card. It's like 30 bucks. There's no difference.

Negligible. This is good because the theme today is about relationships and money. You being betrothed and Jack being an eligible bachelor, I thought we could get some spicy takes from each of you on us. So, Graham, I know you had your fiancé on Ice Coffee Hour and talked about pre-ups. What did Jack think of this conversation? Okay, so Graham is very much the type where he likes pre-ups.

I don't think I have such a firm stance on it. Obviously, I would probably prefer a pre-up, but it's not anything where I draw a hard line. A pre-up is super romantic. A pre-nup says, I'm going to marry you, even though I don't trust you at all. I tell Jack, if you don't sign a pre-up, your pre-nup becomes the state. You're basically giving everything you have up to the state. You have a pre-up.

I know, but I do your terms. I do think like if my marriage were to fail, I have culpability in that. Just like if you get in a car crash, it's your fault. See, that's not a reason not to have insurance. You have to get homeowner's insurance. I think it's a little bit different than a car crash. I don't think that a marriage just kind of like veers off into like a... It can.

It absolutely can. Just like a car accident might not be your fault. I like to have... You could hit you. You could hit a car. You could both be at fault. I get it. But also like, think about from the woman's perspective.

This is me. This is because I was back to do a quarter. If the woman joins me for a period of time in my life, we spend years together, she dedicates time, effort, resources, etc. Then you're like, hey, it's fine. Look, it's fine. And here's the thing. I don't put money on the pedestal super high.

Like, I think it's important, but... Because you're like, well, I'll go make more money. It's fine if she takes me to the cleaners, right? That's all the YouTube comments when we talk about marriage. You're like, marriage exists for women to take you to the cleaners. I don't know why they all sound like that in my head, but they do. So here's the thing. In a pre-nup, you could specify what you two as a couple believe is fair

and how you're going to divide things. There's so much nuance that goes into a marriage and in business. Who owns what? Let's just say, as an example, the iced coffee hour. Let's just say that grows from 1 million to 10 million subscribers during your marriage. And you guys split. How do you divide your portion of the business with her? Right.

You specify that in a pre-up. That's why I said. I would prefer a pre-up, but it's not anything that I'm like drawing a super hardline. But it also is a concern if I'm like, hey, you know, you want to do a pre-up? And she's like, no, I don't want to do one. I'm like, okay, well, that's, that's right, stop questioning. You bring it up early, and it brings up so many amazing conversations that I've never thought about it. Macy and I are on the same page when it comes to money. But going through this

has brought up so many nuanced conversations I've never thought about in my life that gets brought out. But it also removes an obstacle that exists for divorce, which I think is extremely important. I think as you get married, as you move in together, as you have kids, as you have pets, all of those things are more boundaries and obstacles that prevent you from divorcing. And I'm a firm believer. It's like, if you choose to live the rest of your life with someone, realistically, you should be able to overcome those obstacles. And you need those obstacles to prevent you from So once you surpass them, then you're like more confident in the relationship and you've been through more. It makes you a more like solid relationship.

A pre-nup, I think, solidifies your relationship even more. It makes it easier to divorce if the person wants to leave because they know the terms. There's no arguing. There's no nothing. And then you know the person is with you or yourself. He's saying he doesn't want it to be the Apple terms and conditions. But it's not going to be that. It's that you have the assurance to know that the person is with you for you.

All the terms are laid out there. If they want to walk away. He has a point. Anti-prin-up. I'm not anti-prending me. I said I prefer a pre-nup, but like I said, it's not anything where it's like My point, everyone has a pre-up. It's do you leave it to the state or do you decide on terms that are right for you and your spouse? And it's got to be fair. So you can't just say, I'm going to keep everything. I feel like if you guys got married, you need a pre-up. Just based on this bickering. Well, no, here's the thing. If we got married, we would be together for the long haul.

So let's just establish that by here. Jack and I have a very strict business agreement. Oh, yeah. There's a contract. Exactly. And so just like you have a contract in business, you would also have a contract for a partner. No, that makes sense. I'm going to give Jack a plus one because he used culpability so smoothly in a sentence that... That's not fair. I use big words, too.

Responsibility. That's fair. Okay. Riddle me this. Can a relationship survive if one person is a spender and the other one is a saver? Because you said you and Macy both frugal. Yeah. What if Macy was an outrageous spender?

Do you think you could still be with her? I don't know. Probably not. It would be different if that changed over time, like initially she was like really frugal and maybe like life happens and maybe, I don't know, opinions change, expectations. Possibly, but I think it would, there'd have to be some ground. There might have to be some compromise, but to what extent. What I'm wondering is you might have to do a budget. Hopefully not, but.

A budget? Why? Wouldn't that solve it, though? If they say, hey, here's the budget. Here's Macy spending. Here's Graham spending. There would be a breaking point. but it would go both ways.

If I were so frugal to the point where it's like, hey, we're not going out. We're not going on trips. We can't do anything. We're going to be inside and save every dollar. That would be a breaking point, I'm sure, for Macy. Just like if she were to say, oh, I want to spend this and this and this and this.

There'd be a breaking point at both extremes. And so can we come to a compromise? I tend to believe that everything I've experienced so far, yes, there would be a compromise. So you notoriously, both of you don't do a budget. But if you were to do one and you were to have Graham's Fund money line item, Macy's fun money line item, what would you say

would be a fair allocation to those line items? It's a few grand a month when you tally everything up and I'm talking like... This is what we're getting into right now. But you would have no qualms with Macy being like,

all right, I'm going to spend four grand this month on whatever I want. I think that's indicative of like a deeply rooted issue if that's what she said. But if you both agree to it, that's all. Yeah, it would depend on what. If she came to me, he was like,

I really want to spend four grand on, I'm just throwing ideas out there. And I probably get some too. I would probably get some too. Your supply. I'm going to spend, no. It would realistically, I know Macy would be like house stuff. She'd say, decor.

Yeah, she wants to paint the front door. To me, it's just like, I don't want to. Paint the front door. You got to get. You start with the front door, and then what's next? Exactly. Back door? Who knows?

And then cabinets and then floors. And then front door again? She wants new landscaping. I know new landscaping. To do it right, it's going to be like 20 grand. 20 grand. Oh, yeah. If you want professional grade landscape.

We're talking like redoing the backyard pool. The lights. No, that's more. That's more money. 20 grand to redo the front. I paid a thousand for my baby little front yard. Yeah, I mean. But, you know, Vegas and your house.

We're doing a desert landscape with like lighting and stuff like that. So I could wrap my mind around that saying like, okay, plant the seed now and maybe in a year, like, throw some cash aside and get it done. Opposing view? Because you're more, you're more frugal. I would say a more spruly than Graham. I would say I'm... Jack's more frugal than me. It depends on what.

Starbucks every day? No, like, I'm cool with getting guacamole on my Chipotle. I'm fine with paying a little bit extra. I'm fine with getting Starbucks every day. But if we're going to go sleep at an Airbnb and one's $100 more than the other and it's like in a night, that doesn't matter to me. Got it. So it depends. Frugal and in different ways.

I think it depends on the level of importance that each person in the relationship have to it, right? So, like, if one person thinks it's extremely important to be frugal, the other person, then it's not going to work out. But if you're kind of like wishy-washy and you can kind of like form to the other person, I think that's great. That's fine. How about this one? Would you date someone who is still financially dependent on their parents? Let's say they're out of college. Maybe they didn't go to college.

Maybe they're working. If I'm bullish on their career and I'm bullish on their ambition and stuff like that, then yes. But I would have to have a true test to like, why are you dependent on your parents? Is it for valid or invalid reasons? And then see kind of where it goes from there. Okay. It's like it is a red flag, but it's not a deal breaker. I would see to what extent.

I don't want to be a deal breaker, a red flag to me. I think it just depends. Some parents really just love taking your other kids. And so why would you deprive your parents of that, you know, joy that they get from being able to provide it? I think it's just dependent on the situation. Well, Dave Ramsey likes to say, an eagle that doesn't leave the nest is called a turkey, you know, so there's a level of like, that's great.

Eventually, you have to become your own person, become an adult. So I understand that. Now, there's people who call in the Ramsey show and they say, hey, I'm trying to pay off all this debt. I'm still living my parents until I can pay it off. You know, there's situations. Yeah, right. But there's also the like, if it's going to take you seven years, just go out, get a job, get some roommates.

You know, you did this. You had a house at, what, you were 21 on the cusp of 22. Yeah. When you got your first home, you had roommates, and you were financially independent, not needing your parents. I do think it is a less attractive trait than a more attractive trait to still be, yes. To be fair, are you still on your parents' phone bill? This is a nuanced answer. That's not a nice. No, no, no, stop. Don't you dare. This is not, this is not.

Wow. Good question. Thanks for bringing in the son. I watched Caleb Hammer. I'm, yeah. Oh, geez, I'm sorry. Okay, so I'm on their phone bill. But I give my dad a kickback every month. So I send them $32.50 because I got grandfathered in on like a very old deal. What's the kickback?

I give them the money. That's how much it costs. But actually, we did get unlimited recently and before we actually had limited data. So I think it's actually increased, but I still send them the $32. So I actually probably closer to $40. Okay, so by kickback, you mean you're paying your phone deal. You're just on your parents' plan. We estimated what my phone bill.

I feel like he was getting some grand reward. Do you think your spouse should know about all assets and accounts? I think it depends, for me, no, because there's so many. It's just like, it would be, like, I struggle with it. You can't keep up. I'm sure there are accounts that I don't even know about. So in my street. What do you mean?

What kind of accounts? I open up every single account you could imagine just to try it out. What kind of accounts? What do you mean? What type of accounts? Like, are we talking bank accounts? Oh, yeah. Credit card accounts?

Oh, yeah. Bank accounts. I've whittled them down, so, like, at one point I had more than 10 bank accounts. Oh, my gosh. But the issue became... You're, like, storing money in multiple high-yield savings and all kinds of things. Right, because I would yield chase. So, like, I'd move from one account to another to another, but keep... To go from 4% to 4.5%.

Yeah, yeah. But then the issue at the end of the year came that I was spending more money on accountants to track it all. Shifting in 1099s from, like, 11 different places than I was making sometimes an interest to keep the account open. Like some of the accounts would send me a 1099 would get like 20 bucks in it It's like it's not worth it

So I've been canceling an account in a hundred bucks I deal with a $20 income It's not worth it So in my case no But I'd say in most cases I think financial transparency is good Maybe it doesn't have to be a hundred percent Of like I open up this

You know bank account with $20 in it But there should be an account You're just like I got a lot going on Yeah Okay How about you Jack? Yeah I would say they should probably know about all the accounts

It's like it doesn't need to be all the small accounts if it's like a negligible amount. But I would say for the most part, yeah. Transparency. It's just being honest in a relationship. That's like the pinnacle, the hallmark of a good relationship, honesty. There you go. Some relationship advice from our bachelor friend. He's single.

Take it. Take it. No, that's good advice. This is his birthday today. On his birthday, nonetheless. Have some class. Is it acceptable to ask someone you're dating for financial help? Oh, oh.

So you're dating a lovely woman. maybe one day, and you're like, hey, I need to borrow a thousand bucks. What am I borrowing it for? Lord knows. The stuff you get into, Robin Hood. How long have I been dating her? I don't know. If she's doing Robin Hood calls, I probably...

You would do that. Yeah, you know what I mean? She's a better chance than I have, honestly, with the Robin Hood calls. That was a bad example. But I probably would... I just find it unattractive. It's like whether or not do I find this thing attractive or unattractive. It's highly unattractive.

has to ask me for money, but I would cross that bridge when it presented itself. How would you feel if your partner earns significantly more than you? Totally fine. Oh, yeah, I wouldn't care. Yeah. I don't understand the guys. You're like, no, I need to be the one who works like.

Is that an alpha? It's alpha behavior? It sounds like it's compensating behavior. It's like, why? Is your masculinity threatened because someone else is doing better? Yeah. That's what it seems like to me.

You know what I mean? It sounds like, yeah. To feel like your masculinity is threatened. I also think it's unattractive when people place all of their value and their financial status. You know what I mean? It's just like, oh, I'm making more money than you. Or if a guy is like embarrassed

because his girlfriend's making more than him, I think that's an unattractive thing. Wouldn't that be a great trait that she is successful and driven and ambitious? I think a lot of guys have the fear where if they do better than all of a sudden they're going to leave. Oh.

And so it's maybe like, why am I going to date? She doesn't need me now. This loser, when I'm making more money and maybe the power dynamic shifts. She's the one calling the shots and the guy doesn't like that. I don't know. To me, it doesn't bother me at all.

Like if she was dating you for your income and all of a sudden, she doesn't need that anymore and your personality is bunk. Right. But I feel like in the relationship flawed to begin. You guys don't have to worry about that. You're an attractive, successful man. We're doing okay here. Let's move on.

Is it acceptable for your partner to spend large sums of money without consulting you? And if so, what is that number? I would say if it's her money, then no. I wouldn't be bothered by it. Define her money. Let's say we're fast forwarding. the marriage is, you know, going great. We're married officially.

Is it our money at that point? For me, it's different. I think it's mine, hers, ours, where she will have the freedom to spend her money however she wants. I never want to be able to question, like, hey, what was this charge? I'm like that even with myself.

Like, going through even, like, the iced coffee hour credit card is like, you know, or Alex had a credit card. I go through that credit card and be like, what was this? I'm talking like stupid $20 charge? I never want to do that with a special. How about you, Jack? Agree? Disagree? Like my money, her money, our money, or would you combine all bank accounts?

I probably would, yeah. Maybe I'm just naive. See, but I probably would. It depends. It's like, if I found the person, I want to spend the rest of my life with, and I'm 100% confident, and I know this is my person, I can't say yes or no because I haven't been there yet, but I like to think, hopefully, fingers crossed, I find that person, and I am so confident that I'm fine with that. That's beautiful. Well, I mean, we have a very simple life, my wife and I. We have one joint checking account. We have a savings connected to it. We have our high-yield savings.

That is it. That's our entire life. We have budget line items for her fun money, my fun money. So we found it works for us, you know, but I understand a lot of people come from different backgrounds, philosophies. But we found that it causes most transparency when there's one account that we all share, and we understand what's in the budget. And that becomes the, you know, tells us how we're going to spend that month.

I have a question, George. If she came to you and she was like, hey, look, there's a great sign-up bonus on the MX Platinum. I really want to do it. Okay, I'm going to spend the money anyways. This is such a hundred and twenty thousand points. Are you okay with this? What would you say? No, we would have a huge fight.

Why? But it's free money. Number one, like, part of the reason I was attracted to Whitney, part of the reason we got married was because we aligned on our financial philosophies, our money values. One of those values is we are a family that doesn't even. use credit cards. We value living a debt-free lifestyle, even if we can pay it off every month. It's not worth the reward to play the games of a broken system. So that's just how we see it. It's not a moral stance of like we're better than anyone. We've found our life is simpler that way and we haven't missed the rewards. We just budget for things, save up for things. So that's how we've

lived our life. But if she came to me and she was like, hey, saw this great offer, should we do it? I would have our heart to heart and be like, what's the heart behind this? What is this offer? Why can't we just budget and save and pay for it? It's not where. worth the risk. We'd have to spend $15,000 to get these free points. It's not, you know, the juice ain't worth the squeeze. So I would try to have a real conversation and not be, just be combative for no reason. But let's say you have a new landscape, you know, expense coming up. It's 15 grand. I wouldn't do it. I just wouldn't. I'd find a new guy. Let's just say there's a $15,000 expense that you have to pay. It is coming up. A health expense. A health expense.

15 grand. Yeah. And there's a credit card out there that says, if you spend 15 grand, we'll give you $5,000 back, and you have the option to cancel the card when you get the $5,000 back. Would you do it? No, I can say that with great confidence that I just wouldn't. Number one, we have an emergency fund that has more than $15,000 in it. And so that would be, yes, it would suck to pay that if it was a true emergency, which landscaping is not an emergency. It's not, it's not landscaping. Sure.

But if it was a true emergency, we would use the emergency fund to cover it. even though you would not be getting an extra $5,000 a bit? I wouldn't lose any sleep over it. Because there's always fine print. There's always risk. And it's just one more thing to manage in my life. And I found that I already have a natural amount of anxiety. And less accounts, less things to worry about, has just led me to a more peaceful life.

And so it would not be worth to squeeze. And I think there's always a catch with the $5,000 you would hopefully get. What purchases are you hesitant or ashamed to share with your spouse? Nothing. She knows everything I spent money on. And it's not much. I mean... Have there ever been things where she's like,

what? You spent money on that? Like, that's... Even if it's laughable. No. I don't think so at all. Okay. How about if there was something, Jack?

You're like, this is probably my most. I wouldn't be embarrassed. It's more of a matter-of-fact thing, but subscriptions that I no longer use that I just forgot to cancel. Oh, yeah. Those will get you. Yeah, it's just maybe an irresponsible, you know?

Thank you for your honesty. I appreciate that. Graham's never admitted irresponsibility on me. on this show or any show. This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. Hey guys, it's George. You knew that. Sometimes this time of year can get a little rough.

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any time for no extra charge. So find your bright spot this season with our friends at BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com slash George today to get 10% off your first month. That's betterhelp.com slash George. All right, let's get back to it. By the way, is this the first time you guys have been interviewed together? This is the first time we've done something together, guesting on the lot. I can't believe I got there first. It's kind of sad because this is so fun.

You should do more of this. We don't do it often. I mean, when are Jack and I together? You're usually doing the interview with. Right. Yes. Well, obviously you guys aren't a couple, but you have been friends for a long time now. And in the spirit of today's episode, I thought we would play a fun,

altered version of the newlywed game. Do you know how that works? No. So I'm going to ask a question. We have paddles that we made just for you guys. Oh, wow. You ready for this? This is cool.

So on these ping pong paddles, it has your name and Jack's name. Wow. Right? This is amazing. And so when I ask a question, you'll raise the person's name that the question most describes. Okay. All right? So if you think, hey, Graham's the frugal one, you're going to hold up Graham's name.

Got it? Cool. And you have to be honest. This is a family-friendly show. We don't lie on this show. It's a family value we hold, honesty. Okay. Who's more likely to burn down the house when they're cooking dinner?

Opposing opinions. We have... Come on, Jack. I think Graham is... Well, he doesn't cook, so I suppose I could flip it. Shots have been fired. First, he says you're going to burn it down, and then he says he doesn't even cook.

Graham can be reckless, but I can be negligent. legit, I would say. Both in a court of law, I'd find you guilty at that point. Okay. Which one has better hair? I like it to Jack. Honestly, I don't like my hair that much, but I probably, I mean, look at the, it's

long, it's flowing. Yeah, you've got kind of that, that Beauty and the Beast Gaston thing you're going for. I could see that. Yeah, I'd give it to Jack. All right, he just tries more? Is that the idea? I don't, no, Jack doesn't try at all. Have we thought about, like, if you just let me style your hair? Like, I took you to my barber, and we're like, hey, let's just jush him up a

bit. Would you let him do it? I might look a little taller if I did ear style. That's why I did it. You think I do this for fun? It's a science. I would say you obviously have the best hair. With a good blow dry and if I let it grow, I could get a good four inches on this thing. Have you tried five or no? I call it full Jimmy Neutron. Yeah, I could get four inches. That would be gorgeous. We'll try it one day. I think his hair is just very basic. You got to buzz something in the side, like a lightning bolt or something. I think I can only do that if I'm a rapper. No. You got to start rapping that. I can do that as a YouTuber and people would take me seriously. I don't even have tattoos, let alone the shaved...

No tats for either of you? No. Ride and clean. All right. Who's the sappy one? It's your weird question. I would say like right in the middle. Right in the middle. Yeah, I'd say so. What? Like sappy, like right in the middle. Right in the middle? That's what I'm doing right. I pin Jack as the sappier one. Like more likely to cry

at a Hallmark movie. Oh, neither. Neither one of us. Well, we don't cry, but he gets sentimental. I would say more than I do. He always goes, right, you remember the good old days. He always says that. So yours is more in the, the community. I feel like you have more emotional, you know, you could get to tears faster as an actor. He's a better actor than I. I'm a horrible. Well, you know, I did.

My first site of Graham was on Netflix watching selling sunset. And I thought, who's that guy? Yeah, neither one of us. Okay. Yeah. Who looks better today? I can't believe he did that. Let the audience decide.

No, honestly, you're both styling today. I like, now, Jack gets a point for the trendy knit polo. Thank you. That's very in right now. Who told him to wear that today? Graham. That was him. Yeah.

Graham, he would win on a sense of style. Styles points. Who would survive longer on our desert island? That is the easiest one that you've asked so far. Why is that? Is he handier? I'm a wimp. He's very sensitive.

Yeah. If it's too hard or too cold. Again, he doesn't like it. If there's anything, like any... If I'm uncomfortable, Jack knows about it. Yeah, everyone knows it. You need AC. On my back, on my leg.

It's just like constant. Dude, my back, man. It's crazy. Yeah, like, you would charter a helicopter somehow and get out of there. He'll be trying to try and. He's poking up a letter and, like, poke himself on the corner of the letter. Oh, Jesus. I'm like, dude, what happened?

And the paper coat would get infected and now be the end of it. And then I complain. Oh, gosh. Who's the bigger party animal? Jack likes to party. All right. Who eats more junk food? Jack likes the junk food.

Who's louder? Jack is the louder one. These are easy ones. Who's more likely to get lost? Oh. I guess you can't get lost now. No GPS. Who's going to find their way home with no GPS.

Oh. We've always had GPS. It's never been an issue. We never tested. I think I have a better sense of direction, but he's more structured. It shows your age, okay? We've never, yeah. You never had to open up the old Rand McNally on the road trip?

I was like 15. You know, I used to go on MapQuest. Printed out MapQuest is a vibe. Yeah, I did that. It's an entire vibe. Yeah. When I first started driving his MapQuest, and I'd like study it before driving,

I'm like, okay, go this way, this way, this way. See, I think you had to, like, use your brain more, and that's why Jack is less intelligent. Yeah. That makes sense. I'm kidding. The guy's a savant. Who's more likely to talk their way out of a speeding ticket?

Oh. That's an easy one. I'm the officer. I'll be able to do it. You know how fast you're going? How fast officer. I'm asking you. I'm not sure.

I'm really sorry. You're being belligerent. License and registration. I was listening to George Campbell on YouTube and I lost track of time. Hold on. Are you Graham Stephan? I recognize that for GT. Yeah, that's me.

You watch the channel. Oh, thank you so much. So it'll be $300. for your ticket, sir. You know, the funny thing about that is that, you know, I spent 20 grand on landscape recently. It's a landscape. And I'm waiting for my new credit card to come in.

Can you just, is there a way that like I get to. I'll let you off with a morning this time. Oh, thank you. I'm safe out there. Love your YouTube show. No. That was pretty good. Who's more likely to use a coupon on a date?

Dang. Guilty. Yeah. Guilty. All right. Last one. Who's more likely to get scammed on an investment? Yeah, that goes without saying.

Without saying, that's your personal brand now. That's fine. That's fine. Scammers, go ahead. Scammers, be scamming. Well, that was a lot of fun, guys. Thank you for playing. I don't know there's any winners or losers here, but I appreciate you.

We could do a tally. We could tell it up. I guess, like, who's more guilty? But some of them are positive, somewhere negative. So it's hard to even tell. But because it's Jack's birthday, I thought, should we sing him happy birthday? Oh, my gosh. No. He's not going to get it elsewhere.

No, I think it would be a good idea, Graham. I think you should lead, actually. Hold on. Let me see if this is in tour. No way. Are you actually? Oh, wow. Wait, are you guys singers?

Graham is? No. He's got a little voice on. Do you have a drum set? Ready? Sure. I think I should grab the guitar too, no? Yeah, can you, uh...

Do you want me to get it? Yeah, I get the guitar for him. Oh, maybe do some, like, some bass notes or something? Oh, there it is. What, okay, are we doing? You go, man. It's missing a string. What string is it?

I swat the bottom. This is going to go... I thought... I'll conduct. You guys do everything. Hey, give me the guitar. I thought, this guy must be like... No.

He has no idea. No, I know. Overconfident? Let's do this one. Just fake it. Yeah, I'll do it. All right. Happy birthday to you.

Happy birthday to you. Happy birthday to you. Birthday, dear Jack, Happy birthday to you. Thank you. Thank you so much. That falsetto right there was just gorgeous. Thank you.

I didn't realize how high that key was until it was too late. But happy birthday, man. Thank you very much. We love to celebrate you. You're worth celebrating. And we hope to have Graham back for his birthday. When's your next one? April.

Come back in April. We'll do it then. And this is for you, Jack. Oh, thank you. keep this? Thanks, man. No, it's great. I love it.

You can have lost to it. I got this at Bargain Hunt for $25. That's about what I'm willing to put into this gift. This has been a lot of fun, guys. Appreciate you hanging out. Where can people find your stuff if they want to learn more and watch more? The iced coffee hour. One of the biggest shows of all time.

Of all time. And you guys co-host that. I've had the pleasure of being on there. You had a conversation with Dave Ramsey that will be up soon. Maybe it's up by the time you watch this video. but subscribe. Make sure you tune into all their stuff. You guys are doing some great stuff.

Always great to have you in town. And be sure to let us know in the comments, your hot take on some of the questions we were asking. We can have a little debate club in the comments. Maybe Graham will jump into my comment section. Maybe. Have you been known to tread those waters? He used to a lot more.

I used to. It's a young man's game, but... Yeah. We're going to keep you young. I'm here for the drama. As always, thanks for watching. We'll see you guys next time.