Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast - 261. Richard Marx

Episode Date: May 27, 2019

Gilbert and Frank are joined by Grammy-winning singer-songwriter (and amateur comedian) Richard Marx for a conversation about the disappearance of "story songs," the futility of "chasing hit records," the long-lost art of commercial jingle writing and the versatility of film composers John Barry and Dave Grusin. Also, Charlie Chaplin pens a standard, Kenny Rogers pulls a shrewd move, Ben Gazzara pops into Gilbert's head and Tony Bennett and Bob Newhart remember Richard's dad, Dick Marx. PLUS: Earth, Wind & Fire! The genius of Burt Bacharach! Lionel Richie makes a phone call! Lenny Bruce plays Mister Kelly's! And Richard reveals the song he wishes he'd written! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Reminding you that this is Gilbert Gottfried's colossal, amazing, unbelievable, stimulating, should be rated X because it contains things that could be harmful to your genitals podcast. Lucky you! It could be a shitty weather report Hi, this is Gilbert Gottfried, and this is Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast

with my co-host Frank Santopadre and our engineer Frank Furtarosa. Our guest this week is a musician, record producer, Grammy-winning songwriter, andYNC, and podcast Jackman, just to name a few. But wait, there's more. Also the only male artist in the history to have the first seven singles reach the top five on the Billboard singles charts. And the only artist to have written a number one hit in four different decades. in four different decades. He's recently re-released digital versions of his albums, Stories to Tell, A Night Out with Friends, Christmas Spirit, Beautiful Goodbye,

Now and Forever the Ballads, and will be re-releasing, and will be re-releasing and will be releasing his first all-new album in five years later in 2019. This month also marks the 30th anniversary of his album, Repeat Offender, and he's just released Repeat Offender Revisited, a new collection featuring live and acoustic versions of songs from the original album. Frank and I are excited to welcome to the show one of our favorite singer-songwriters and a man who says he had a very good reason for calling himself Richard. The multi-talented Richard Marks. Gentlemen, I'm exhausted. I'm exhausted already. Gilbert, I can only imagine that you are, you just want to just call it a, let's just call it a day right there.

Let's just. I feel that way every one of my interviews. I'm sure you do. We heard your voice. We have proof that you were here. It's like taking the Instagram picture when you get to dinner and go, okay, we can call it a night then, right? It's like taking the Instagram picture when you get to dinner and go, okay, we can call it a night then, right? Now, the important thing to announce here, the most important thing for me, is Richard Marx is a Jew.

That's the headline. Yeah, yes. I wish you had ended the introduction, Gilbert, with, and he's a Jew. Richard Marks is a Jew. You think? Richard, he gets so excited when we have Jewish guests. Really? We've done about 250 of these.

Yeah. Each time. I think, you know, in my reading up on Gilbert, actually, just for little tidbits that I didn't know, one thing that we share is that neither of us were bar mitzvahed. I wasn't bar mitzvahed either. Wow. So we're both bad Jews. Well, I'm Jew-lite. Actually, or as my wife says, you're not really Jewish.

You're Jew-ish. That's funny. Yes. That's funny. really jewish you're jew-ish that's funny yes that's funny can you can you take a second to explain that that last bit about the intro from the intro oh yeah so i you know we'll probably discuss you mentioned that we might be discussing my father my father was a an extraordinarily talented and successful man um named dick marks he was um started out as a jazz pianist in chicago where i'm from and in the early 60s he started his own jingle company and became

over the next 25 years or so the most successful jingle composer and producer in history i mean i could go through you know the hit after hit after hit these little 30 second and 60 second hits that he wrote can i we will can i interrupt you yeah and just hear some of those that your father wrote when a boy wakes up to a smiling face he's been dreaming about raising a land and there's two scoops of raisins in a package of Kellogg's Raisin Bran. My dad wrote that. Nice. Perfect. Even when the lyrics sucked, like beyond suckage, he would like, perfect example. He wrote the music only because the advertising agencies would give him the slogans. He wrote the beautiful melody that went to, Ask any mermaid you happen to see what's the best tuna come on

that's my dad's great work so i mean that's just two of hundreds and hundreds of famous jingles but he was very well known in in my hometown of chicago as he was like he would get stopped on the street he was on tv here and there and so people you know he he cast a big shadow and from the time i was you know young 12 13 years old i made a conscious decision that i would be richard because even at 12 i knew that at least in chicago he would forever be known as big dick and we know what that would make me and no nobody wants no that's not that's not nice for anybody there you go gil so now the listeners won't be wondering what that intro was all about one of the ones i love is le choy makes chinese food yeah swing american he did a nice little piece of music yeah and he you know he was um

you know he was he was very successful at crafting these catchy ditties if you will but he was also a really accomplished composer arranger conductor he worked on i mean i was lucky enough that he did some arrangements for me on some songs that became successful for me but he did work with joe cocker and he did film scores and he was he was the most talented musician i ever met wasn't he a child prodigy richard yeah oh he was he started playing when he was four or five started playing the piano and when he was 11 years old he conducted a full orchestra that's incredible for the first time at 11 that would just annoy the shit out of me. I don't know about you. If I was a musician, if I was a classical player, I would look at some 11-year-old kid and go, I'm out.

I'm out of here. Yeah. Yeah. I read something that you, I think you said that the jazz greats that were coming through town, like Oscar Peterson and Duke Ellington, would make a point to stop and see him play. Yeah. Which is a great honor. would make a point to stop and see him play, which is a great honor.

I missed out on this, but from 1859, I think, to 61, 62, he was not only the house pianist at Mr. Kelly's, the famous jazz club in Chicago, but he also played at places called the London House and the Lea Loa, which was a big club, a jazz club in Chicago. And he, I mean, he had those kind of luminaries that when they would come to Chicago, they would come to see Dick Marks play. And I heard those stories. And then a few years, well, maybe 10 years after my dad passed away, I met Tony Bennett for the first first time and i've met him several times since then but the first time i met him um he said your father was dick marks right and i said yeah he goes oh i saw

your dad i went to see him play at mr kelly's he was one of the greatest pianists i ever heard he was fantastic so you know even cats like tony bennett are like giving my dad props. It was amazing. How about that? And you sang on some of your father's stringles. I did. I sang, uh, starting when I was about five or six years old, my dad realized that he was getting gigs for, you know,

kid oriented products like Peter Pan, peanut butter and, and, you know, Nestle's crunch bars and stuff like that. And I was, you know, walking around crunch bars and stuff like that and i was you know walking around my house even as a little kid i was singing along with beatles songs and monkey songs and shit and and my parents noticed that i was singing in tune i could sing in tune so they brought me down

to the studio one day and tried me out on a jingle for i think it was uh crunchy crunchy crunchy nestle's crunch is so crunchy or something like that and peter pan did you sing on the peter pan one i did if you believe in peanut butter clap your hands right i ended up singing on i ended up singing on a whole bunch of uh kid oriented jingles and it was awesome because i number one i sort of grew up in a recording studio so i i had those chops by the time i left home and pursued a career in the record business, which is a totally different world. But I had studio experience for sure. But it was also because I used to occasionally get to get out of school to go down to the city and do a jingle.

And I loved that. And I think Barry Manilow said in an interview, because he also wrote loads of commercial jingles. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Yeah, and I'm stuck on Band-Aids. That's right. And he said it's impossible for him to write a melody that's not catchy now because of his years writing commercial jingles it's a it's a real specific skill set you know that's why you know historically i mean we i don't know that we really even have jingles anymore i'm just gonna say it's sort of a dying art yeah i mean it's mostly now it's

licensing songs that people already know right songs and adapting them to sell your product but you know in that 20 years or so of the heyday of the jingle business that was a really specialized skill set and you know all nepotism aside my dad was a badass what was the candle ration one because we grew up on these richard oh yeah can ration uh my dog's better than your dog my dog's better than yours come on my dog's better because he eats cattle ration my dog's better than yours there you go that's it it is it is a talent the greatest hits of big dick we're going right through them right now and i remember in an interview john lennon saying he was a fan of commercial jingles. And he said the commercial jingles he would hear were just as good as the Beatles' early work.

I don't know how high he was when he said that. But it's a nice compliment. I think there was some depth. He had just come from some partying. There's an art form to them and you're writing in short form. You're writing 15 seconds or 30 seconds. Yeah. I mean, I think the culture is poorer for it that you don't really hear them anymore. Yeah.

Not as much. And you would think that they'd be more popular than ever because our attention span is absolutely you know that's a good point and now i gotta put you on the spot again can we hear some of the commercial jingles you when i was uh 17 it was a very good year um uh yeah i just went right by you yeah we got it yes no i got it um i try my dad said once you come down to the to the office and and i'll put you and i'll set you up in a room with an electric piano and i'll give you a you know some uh some, uh, some slogans and copy and, and you can try to write something and you can, you know, and he had, I mean, he wrote the lion's share of the

stuff that got recorded, but he had one or two writers that would, you know, help out. And so I, I spent a couple of days in this office and I just was like, I, first of all, I'll never be half as good as my old man. And I just didn't, I wanted all, I'll never be half as good as my old man. And I just didn't, I wanted to make my own, I wanted to do my own thing. And I knew that I just didn't have that gift for, you know, I have the luxury, I've always had the luxury of three minutes, four minutes,

four and a half minutes, five minutes sometimes to say whatever I want to say and do whatever I want to do. My dad had to do it in, you know, 30 seconds. It was unbelievable. Did he also write the Blackhawk, the Chicago Blackhawks fight song? Yep. Here come the Hawks, the mighty Blackhawks. That's great.

That's fantastic. If you go to O'Hare Airport and you park in the parking structure, I think it's level four. That's the music that you hear. It's awesome. That's fantastic. You write in a very touching way about him too, Richard on your website uh you wrote something for for father's day but you you were reminiscing about how he felt guilty that he spent so much time away from home and

so and there was a there was a moment where he heard harry chapin's cats in the cradle yeah wow i i can't believe you know this yeah i don't i think i might have even talked about this maybe once yeah i was about i guess that would have been about 75 when that song became a hit and i so i would have been 11 or 12 and he came home from work and he came into my my bedroom and and was emotional and my dad was a very stoic guy came from that i, he was a really loving, you know, demonstrative dude, but I only saw him cry a few times and he came in and he had tears in his eyes and I thought something horrible had happened. And, and he said, you know, we have to hang out more. We have to play catch more. We have to, you know, you're growing up so fast. And I heard the song in the car and it just broke my heart. And I was his second family. He had three kids from his first marriage and didn't have much of

a relationship with them at all. He made up for that years later too. And I realized that as much as I loved him and admired him, I didn't really know him, you know, because he was always gone. He was always at the office and he was always, even when he was home his head was in you know the the following week's jingles i mean it was a it was a really high pressure a career as well but he was always there for me if i needed him and but he just he was not a dad that showed up at you know baseball games and stuff like that and that song and that day really affected him, and it began the relationship, the friendship that we enjoyed for the next 20 years, as long as I had him. And he became not only this amazing talent that I admired, but he became my best friend. We had an extraordinary friendship.

It's wonderful that he got to see your success success too, and wound up contributing to your records. That was, that's one of the greatest gifts for me is that not only did he see it, but he was part of it. He, you know, he, I had,

I mean, he did several things, but I had a really big hit in the nineties called now and forever. And I went to him and I said, you know, I would love you to write the string arrangement for this. And it's just a string quartet. And he wrote the most beautiful string arrangement that I do to this day.

You know, it's, it's, I feel really lucky that I got to share that stuff with him. That's nice. And he sounded like he was happy you were going into the same business. Oh yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it was, you know, it was a, it was a language that we both spoke, you know, even my mom who I'm, you know, she's 83 and, and still, you know, kicking ass.

And, um, and I have always had a great relationship with my mom as well. I'm an only child. And she would even acknowledge that, you know, your dad and you have this special extra bond. You know, you speak the language of music to each other. So sometimes we'd be in the car, you know, and a song would come on and there would be a chord change or something that would affect like sometimes uh you know and i speak to a lot of people or especially musicians there are these things these moments that happen when you hear other people's work that sometimes really does make the hair stand up in your arm you know and

gives you goosebumps and i live for creating those moments myself, but I also still live for hearing them. I love when somebody writes something that just moves me that way. And there were many, many times when I'd be with my dad at a gig or a concert or in a car listening to music or, you know, even sometimes a piece of a film score, like at a movie theater, and there'd be a moment that would really affect me and he and I would look at each other because it hit him the same exact way. So on top of everything else, we had that bond as well. That's nice that you got to share that.

What were some of your favorite film scores? Oh, well, the first one that really, like really affected me um i'm sure i loved you know music from different films up until this point but um i guess i would i was just about to leave home so i was 17 or 18 and and the film on golden pond came out and the the score uh was by Dave Grusin. And Dave Grusin is an Academy Award winning composer. He scored on Golden Pond. He scored Reds for Warren Beatty. He scored Heaven Can Wait for Warren Beatty. He scored many, many, many amazing films.

Wrote some bitchin' TV themes too. Bitchin' TV themes. Keep your eye on the sparrow. I think it takes a thief too. and it takes a thief and then dave so dave grueson became a hero to me uh because of his film scores and again he's the he was the he's the quintessential example to me of a guy that writes uh instrumental music that absolutely wrecks me emotionally just just in this choice of, of chord changes in the way he plays piano. And so cut to, he was a fan of my dad's,

my dad and Dave knew each other a little bit, but Dave was a fan of my dad's. And, and I met Dave Grusin in a hallway, you know, in the 80s. And we just sort of stayed in touch. And then about seven years ago, I got to sit down at a piano with Dave Grusin and write a song for, I was doing a Christmas album. Wow. Yeah, you know, the Jews that make Christmas albums. All the best Christmas music was written by Jews. I mean, come on. Neil Diamond's made four, I think.

I'm glad it's a tradition that's enduring. Yeah. And so I wrote this piece of music with Dave Grusin. And you can only, you know, I've had many, many examples of, in my life, where I really believe that I pull these people into my life, these people that really have made an impact on me. Somehow, I manifest them into my life you know they cross my path and and in the case of dave grueson i got to write a song with him and and i've gotten to spend time with him so what a treat yeah on golden pond is one of my favorite scores i think my other favorite film score is um another uh amazing composer who we lost a few years ago named james horner um the score to braveheart absolutely

kills me absolutely kills me that's that that whole score is amazing i noticed on your website too you posted a tribute to john barry when he oh yeah out of africa that's a great one that's right up there too yeah john barry was uh you know he did a he did so many of the Bond themes. And he was a magnificent talent. Just before we jump off your dad, and we'll come back to him too, but I want to talk a little bit about Mr. Kelly's and some of the people that went through there, because I found on your social media, there was a picture of you and Bob Newhart, who knew your dad.

Oh, yeah. Who was somebody, obviously, a Chicago-based comic who played Mr. Kelly's. Yeah. So did he play? Because I know he played for Lenny Bruce. Yeah. Well, he not only played for Lenny Bruce, and Lenny didn't, I don't know that Lenny used, maybe you guys know, but I don't think Lenny in general involved other people in his act. Like even musicians or whatever, certainly not house pianists or whatever.

But he took a liking to my dad from playing at Kelly's, and he he started to like he i think it was maybe his second or third time there he said dick you got to get up with me and we're gonna do we're just gonna riff on some stuff and i'll just cue you and you will just you know wing some stuff and one of my dad's favorite stories was i mean he loved lenny he absolutely loved him but he said lenny bruce is the only uh is responsible for the only time i i was ever drunk on stage wow because because my dad was not really a drinker i mean he wasn't like against it but he just he was never his thing um and lenny got him hammered at mr kelly's one night and i said so did you play better he goes i played like shit i played i played like i had boxing gloves on um but yeah um my you know the stories that i've gotten that i got to hear about lenny bruce and bob newhart and

um and he also you know when i i did i just see mr newhart not too long ago and i i had never met him but we were at this uh event and i went over to him and he was so gracious. And, you know, when my opening line to him was Dick Marks was my father, his eyes lit up and he goes, oh, you're Richard. Yes, your dad. Let me sit down. Let me tell you some stories about your dad. I loved your dad. So nice.

Tim Conway was another one that he was that he worked with. And and he played for, you know these amazing jazz singers that came through there as well sure sure and he released albums i mean you can go on youtube and hear his music yeah yeah it's a prolific uh output and who were some of the jazz singers um he played i i don't i mean i know that he played at the same time as Ella and Julie London. I know he worked with Julie London. Well, everybody went through Mr. Kelly's. Yeah, everybody.

Sarah Vaughan. He either played for them or played in front of them or, you know, but interacted with them. Yeah, Sarah Vaughan. I know he worked with Sarah Vaughan as well. Yeah. So big turning point. So you're home now. You've done these, you've done background singing on some jingles.

Right. And you're still, what, writing your own songs as a teenager and singing where you can? Just trying to get laid. No, I mean, that's true. It's really true. I mean, yeah, there came a point when I took it very seriously and I, and I knew that I wanted to be a professional songwriter and musician, but the imp, the initial impetus for writing a song was I was trying to get lucky with

Lynn Harwich. Somebody should do a sociological study of how many people, how many guys went into rock and went into music and songwriting for that reason. Well, it's a very high percentage. Not comedy, right Gil? No, no. music and songwriting for that reason well it's a very high percentage not comedy right kill no no although you guys have you guys have done pretty well yourselves i i had a comedian i

worked with tell me that you know when he he used to have a garage band and he got laid constantly with the garage band and when he went into comedy that all stopped it dried up overnight i just want to talk about the turning point too when you were uh see if i get the the age right 17 when you got your and we're talking about cassette tapes in those days yeah you got your your cassette tape to a friend of a friend of a friend who knew. Yep. Lionel Richie. Right. And this is when, this is the same year that Lionel was leaving the Commodores to do his solo thing.

And I remember, you know, I had only written maybe five songs. And they were pretty professionally recorded. I used my dad's recording studio, but I had to pay for five songs and I, and I, they were pretty professionally recorded. I, I used my dad's recording studio, but I had to pay for it with my own money. Um, my dad was like, I'm not going to, you know, this is a business. Like you've got, you've got money in your savings account. You got to pay the musicians, you got to pay the engineer, you got to pay for the studio like you would anywhere else. And it, it, of course, you know, it made that time very precious and I was very focused and very professional about it. And so I did this demo of these first, you know, handful of songs that I wrote.

And a friend of a friend of a friend of a friend played, you know, played a couple of the songs for Lionel Richie. And I remember hearing from one of the friends saying that, you know, so and so knows Lionel Richie. And for a long time, for many years, when I would tell this story in interviews or, you know, about how I kind of started and how I ended up moving to LA and, and Lionel hired me as a background singer on his first album and was very encouraging to me.

I tell, I used to tell the story in a way that would, and I would always say, I couldn't believe it. One day Lionel Rich would and i would always say i couldn't believe it one day lionel richie called me up i just couldn't believe it and i realized a few years ago that that's not true that i really it goes back to the dave grueson thing there was a part of me that really believed that lionel richie was going to call me and say hey you know how can i help and i love what happened it's what happened because i i think that you know i i try to impart this not just on my kids you know i don't have kids they're grown men

but i try to impart this on them and my friends that you know it's that classic uh you know what you think is what will be you know well you had, but I had, it was beyond that because I really believed that these things were going to happen. I knew that I could see them and systematically they all happened to one degree or another. And Lionel Richie was such a huge catalyst. He's a total gentleman to this day.

When I run into him, you know, I just adore the guy like he's just the sweetest guy and he not only did he encourage me and and hire me as a background singer but he recommended me as a background singer to kenny rogers um and that's how i ended up getting my first songwriting credits was you know i just i i was in the right place at the right time and i seized an opportunity but i none of that would have happened at that time without Lionel being the catalyst. You said to your parents, Lionel Richie wants me to come out to LA where it's all happening. And they basically endorsed you blowing off college and going.

Yeah. I mean, what does that say about them? They, you know, they were like, yeah, you could go to Northwestern and study music for four years or, you know, maybe stumble into something else. But this is what you want to do. And you have an opportunity. Go. You can always, if you shit the bed, you can always go back to school. Great.

Good parents. Yeah. Yeah. Good guidance. And Gilman and I got a kick out of the fact that you were, well, first of all, the chutzpah move. You're a backup singer. And having the balls to say, I'm going to go give a song to Kenny Rogers because I overheard him say he needs a song is, as I said, pretty ballsy. Because that sounds like he could have easily have said, hey, you know, go back to your fucking backup singer. He's the nicest guy in the world.

Or how about get fucking security in here right now and get this guy out. Security, escort this asshole to the parking lot he could have easily said that and would have been justified in doing so but again you know like lionel this is a guy that um was gracious to me you know he he i mean the fact that he even said well you, let's go to the piano and play it for me. He could have easily just said, you know, hey, I'm good. Like I had he had no reason to listen to my song. He was paying me to sing background vocals on existing songs. They were finishing a record.

He you know, the fact that he did that is just it's it's unbelievable to this day. So I played him the song and he suggested like one little change. And then of course, you know, jumped on the song as a co-writer. Yeah, Gilbert and I got a kick out of that. We joke about it to this day. No dummy. He said to me last time I saw him and he's, I always, I check in on him every month or so. Cause he's not, he's had a lot of health issues in the last year um but the last time i saw him a few years ago we did a charity event for the ronald mcdonald the ronald mcdonald foundation

and i asked him to come and sing a few songs with me and my band and he was my special guest and the audience like flipped out and he's such a legend and we did lady and we did the gambler and we did you know and then we did this this this first song that that was my first hit that he co-wrote and i'm i'm doing air quotes oh yeah okay called crazy richard's doing air quotes and even on stage he said at the end of the song you know a huge ovation and he said to the audience he goes you know a lot of people don't know this he said Richard really actually wrote that song

but I get half the royalties hilarious hilarious and you mentioned Ronald McDonald House you have a large group of charities. Yeah, with Cystic Fibrosis.

He's done concerts for Toys for Tots, everything. To your credit, Richard, to your credit. You know what? I've just been approached and asked to do stuff for, and look, here's the thing. From the time I had my first hit in 87 as a singer, you know, you got, Gilbert knows this too. You know, you, if you have, if you're known, you're going to be approached or asked to help out with various things and you have to pick and choose, obviously. But I just felt so grateful to, I met some amazing people. And also it it's like I remind people all the time. I showed up. Generally, I show up and sing a few songs.

It's not heavy lifting. It's the shit that I do anyway. So it's not like I'm doing this huge. I get a little sensitive if I see performers taking a bow for that shit. Like, dude, that's what you do like you're like come on um but i appreciate that but i but the people that i've met uh through doing these charity events and getting involved these charities especially the cystic fibrosis foundation which i'm passionate about maybe above all else um it's been you know i've gotten a tremendous amount out of it just from meeting amazing people.

I have to say, I've worked in television for about 25 years and a lot of talk shows, a lot of award shows. Kenny Rogers and Lionel Richie are two of the nicest people that I've ever encountered. Yeah. Just no celebrity ego. No. Genuine, warm.

No, they're just gracious. None of this surprises me. They're both elegant men no they're just gracious none of this surprises me they're both they're both elegant men and they're gracious and they're just classy you know like they're i was so lucky to work with them at the age that i was to see that um you know and be influenced by that and then a couple years later I just turned into a total asshole. Fuck those guys. Nice guys finish last.

So you sang back up on All Night Long. Yeah. And for a lot of other people, right? In those years. Dolly Parton and who else? George Benson. Do I have these nights? Yeah. George Benson.

Julio Iglesias. Iglesias. Yeah. Oh, that session with Julio Iglesias was amazing. He's really a character. Madonna. I sang on a Madonna record. I sang on probably a Cher record.

I sang on probably 15 or 20 the Chicago 17 album which was a huge hit Olivia Newton-John yeah I sang on I was a professional background singer for three years

while I was trying to get a record deal and got to work on some really big records and work with great artists and yeah it was great

that was an extra great training ground I was going to say even though you were struggling to get your own recording career off the ground, do you still have, do you have fond memories of that?

I mean, those were, absolutely, it was really exciting. It was really exciting and just sort of passing these people in the hall. I remember passing Rod Stewart in the hall. You know,

I've done gigs now with Rod Stewart, but, you know, I was a huge Rod Stewart fan. I remember passing Rod Stewart in the hallway of this recording studio on Beverly Boulevard here in Hollywood and just going, fuck, that's Rod Stewart right there.

He's right, that's the guy. So, you know, rubbing elbows with these people that were, you know, my heroes and people that I was such a fan of. And then in a lot of cases, getting to work with these amazing, and working with Madonna, not working with Madonna, but singing background vocals on a Madonna song that she produced, you know, when I got to the studio,

I thought there's no way she's going to be here. You know, she's not going to show up for a background vocal date, you know. She was producing the whole record. She knew exactly what she wanted. She was a blast to work with she was funny and hot and i fell madly in love with her over that 90 minutes gilbert you ever work with madonna no i could see the two of you doing something together

totally i could totally see him in him in the cone bra? Yeah. Absolutely. We will return to Gilbert Gottfried's amazing, colossal podcast right after this. That's what you say. This episode is brought to you by FX's The Bear on Disney+. In Season 3, Carmi and his crew are aiming for the ultimate restaurant accolade, a Michelin star. With Golden Globe and Emmy wins, the show starring Jeremy Allen White,

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visit connectsontario.ca. It's Frank and Gilbert time. Yes, yes, it's Frank and Gilbert time. It's Frank and Gilbert time It's Frank and Gilbert time It's Frank and Gilbert time Now, what are some of the most important lessons you learned about songwriting? Wow, that's a good question um well i think the the i don't know if it's a lesson but i know that for me i've first of all i've never tried to write a hit song because i think that

that's just setting yourself up for failure um every song that I've written that has had some amount of success, whether it be a huge number one song or, you know, a top 40 single or whatever, every song I've written that has had some modicum of success, I never thought, oh, this is a hit when I wrote it or even recorded it or listened back to it. I just have always written songs that I like. And I songs that I like. And I figure if I like this, it's probably going to be other people that like it too. And obviously there's songs that,

um, nobody's ever heard, or they were album cuts because the record company at the time was like, no, we're going to go with satisfy. We're not going to go with nothing you can do about it. You know, two songs on the same album that if they'd picked nothing you can do about it you know two songs on the same album that

if they picked nothing you can do about it maybe that would have been the number one song you know who knows i i didn't i i was not invested in those kind of decisions and i made that decision when i was first writing songs it was like i'm just going to write music and lyrics that i love and leave the rest of that to everyone else. And it's true to this day. Your process is good. No, I just, to answer Gilbert's question, I think the, the, if, if there's a lesson in that, it's that you, you don't get hung up on that bullshit and you don't let that stuff interfere with your creative process.

You just, the creative process is still as pure as it was the first time I ever wrote a song, which is, I mean, and in a way it's like, I mean, I wrote a song recently. I've been married now this time for three, three and a half years. And I realized that this song that I was working on, this lyric, I was writing a song to totally impress my wife like there was no there's no other reason for and it might be a song that somebody else records or because you know I'm 55 I'm not going to be on the radio anymore but it's a song that could be a hit for somebody else maybe who knows but the point is that the the pureness of it was just like that first song I wrote in high school trying to get a date with Lynn Harwich. This song was like, I want Daisy to hear this and just melt.

And so the process, for the most part, is exactly the same as it's always been. Can I hear the song you wrote for Lynn Harwich? Oh, no. I got to. No, you may not. I fucking have to. I'll tell you what. If you come over to my house

Go to L.A. and I have a couple of tequilas, I might bust out the old demo for Gilbert. I ain't playing that shit on public radio. Now you got a reason to go see Richard Marks at his house. You know, the other story, Richard, about songwriting that's interesting is

you're talking about writing Hazard, setting out to try to write a story song because you were a fan of them. Yep. And how your wife said, I guess your wife at the time said, you said, ah, there's nothing to this. And she heard it and she said, nope.

There's something there. She did. That's a hit. She did. My ex-wife absolutely called that one. And I mean, she has, you know, half of all my old songs anyway. But she did. She called it. She called it. And I was not, I mean, mean I liked the song but I didn't I didn't think

that it had any commercial value whatsoever and she was like you've got to put this on your album and you know the song is

is I mean the music woke me up out of a sound sleep in the middle of the night on a tour and the music was like

maybe this is the only time I've ever dreamed a complete piece of music like it was a completed verse, pre-chorus, chorus, bridge, everything. I could hear the whole thing in my head, no lyrics. And then I, and the music was sort of haunting to me. And so I thought I'm going to, this is my opportunity to write a story song. And I concocted this story, this murder mystery set in Nebraska.

Ultimately, the more I worked on it the bigger piece of shit i actually thought it was starting to sound like and it started to sound like a horrible twin peaks episode or something but i but i loved the uh exercise of writing something so different than i'd written before so you know my ex-wife convinces me to put it on the record on the album it's the second single i think from the album and it's huge and it's hit around the world and to this day i actually have people come up to me to my face and ask me if that's it's a song first of all gilbert in case you don't know it's a song about this little town in Nebraska and a girl named Mary that lives in the town, beautiful girl, ends up dead in this river that runs through the town. And my character is the narrator of the story.

I'm telling the story, but I'm also a character. I'm this weird guy that lives in the town and everybody always thought he was weird. And everybody, of course, thought the guy, I killed this girl, Mary, and I'm professing my innocence. From the time the song became a hit up to literally a week ago, I've had people come up to me to my face and ask me if the song is autobiographical. Ouch. Like, yeah, I fucking

killed this chick in Nebraska years ago and wrote a song about it. Which takes balls. Yeah, right? Hiding in plain sight. One of my favorites of yours, Richard. Thank you. I had heard that story.

Terrific song. I've heard songwriters tell stories of waking up in the middle of the night with a melody. And I always thought it was bullshit. Well, McCartney supposedly with Yesterday woke up with that in his head. But night with a melody. And I always thought it was bullshit. Well, McCartney supposedly with Yesterday woke up with that in his head. But it was scrambled eggs. Scrambled eggs.

But Gilbert, haven't you woken up in the middle of the night with a whole routine in your head? No, not for years. Now you just get up to piss, right? Yes.

Yeah, about 50 times a night. Your act is pretty intact from those old days. In the 80s, you must have at some point, Richard's got a point, you must have at some point awakened with a bit in your head. Did you keep a pad by the bed or do anything like that? No, no, I kept porn by the bed. See, everyone has a different method, Richard. But wait a minute.

So here's my question for you, Gilbert. Would you say that the bulk of your material over your lifetime was mostly inspiration or perspiration? How much of it was you just coming up with shit? Or how much of it was you like masturb up with shit or how much of it was you like yeah masturbation well masturbation is 100 well if you want something done right you got to do it yourself as your funny or die video illustrates mine was i guess inspiration like some would just hit me when i'd be on stage and i'd make a joke about it and then i'd stretch it out right and yeah perspiration that's like i don't know jerry seinfeld's a perspiring comic right you mean he works hard yes yes he worked well i mean i think that some of these guys will

like make like from 1 p.m. to 5.30, I'm going to go in this room, I'm going to write material. And I can't do, I've never been able to do that as a songwriter, and I wonder if that's, it just seems like it would just be uninspired. Oh, yeah, not me. I couldn't sit down. I'd be turning on the TV. Well, your bit, he has a crazy bit

that's been in his act for years, Richard, about the actor Ben Gazzara and a UFO, which I won't go into. Okay. I'm going to have to look that shit up. You can find it. We'll send it to you. Where does something like that come from?

You just worked that out on stage? Yeah, I worked out, and Ben Gazzara's name popped in. I mean, of all the people, seriously? Yes, yes. It could have been George Mahara's. I'm 55, so I know exactly who Ben Gazzara was. But Jesus.

When the joke was relevant. But even then, I'm sure half the audience went, what the, what? And I once did a show. That's how I fell in love with him. I once did stand up in London for one show. And they said, well, we need someone who's more people in London would know. Another celebrity. And I was consciously trying to think.

And I was thinking, thinking no ben gazzara and it's gotta be ben it's only funny to say ben gazzara not not sir cyril richard no it's not funny no ben gazzara is is a is a perfect name for a great bit yeah and that's one of those who i go where the fuck did that come from? You seem like a bit of a student of comedy, Richard, too.

And we just referenced your Funny or Die video, which we will urge our listeners to check out. But, I mean, I read reviews of your shows, of your live acoustic shows,

and I read one where somebody said, you know, you could have had a stand-up career if you wanted one. I don't think so. You do have comic timing.

I think that there are, I mean, you guys will both attest to this. There are a lot of people who have their funny moments, you know, and are generally funny. See the humor in things, are quick-witted. I have a very sarcastic sense of humor, another thing I got from my old man. sense of humor another thing I got from my old man but it doesn't mean that we would necessarily thrive in the world

of comedy the way a master like Gilbert or these guys but I have found myself friendly with some of these guys especially a couple of guys that I I was a big Richard Lewis fan we had Richard here.

And, you know, Richard's, he'll be the first to agree with me. He's fucking crazy as fuck. Yeah. And I love him so much, but he and I became friendly. On my first album, we were at some radio event together

and I was, I just was always a fan of his and he and I became friendly and there are a few guys that I was, I just was always a fan of his and, and he, and I became friendly and I, and I, there are a few guys that I have sort of been around and watched. I'm a student of watching the way I think their minds are working in terms of turning something, a situation into, into a funny story my dad was a really good storyteller funny storyteller and that's kind of what i've tried to do in my in my solo acoustic show i do i'd even do it now a little bit in the band show but most people just want to come they just want to hear the music which is fine but when i do these uh solo acoustic singer songwriter shows first of all i don't know if you guys have ever seen a solo acoustic singer songwriter show but it makes you want to generally blow your fucking head off it's like a like performance art even even the

most talented singer songwriters that i like guys that i really and women i really admire a couple of times i've seen them and they're starting let me tell you this is what i was going through when i wrote this song and only but the muse like i don't fucking care that's like that's just boring shit to me make me laugh like entertain me i you know make me feel like i'm hanging out with you i don't this whole serious singer song everything is just anathema to me so so what i what i've tried to do is much like you just said gilbert like i'll just be shooting the shit with the audience or say something or something will happen in a moment and then it gets a huge laugh and i just cultivate it and it becomes part of the show until you know until i've worn that out for a year and

then it's time for some new stuff but i you know i was saying to my wife the other day she said uh she said the the laughs that you're getting are just more than ever like it's just unbelievable i go yeah and that's during the ballads but um but she said are you aware of it and i said i'm not only aware of it i'm more focused on what happens in between the songs than i am the music now. To me, when I leave the stage from a solo acoustic show after, you know, it's usually a two hour set, I'm, my, uh, my review of that show is going to be based upon how many laughs I got. That doesn't surprise me. It just, it means the world to me when I know that something is really funny and delivering it as if I'm delivering it for the first time and getting a huge laugh is fucking Viagra, man.

It's so exciting for somebody who's not a comedian to get laughs every night in the right spots. I was watching the stories to tell DVD, and you have those stories on there. Yeah. But then I saw some other video where you told the funny story about giving Brian Adams the concoction for his throat. Right. And you tell them very well is what I mean.

I've worked with comics a long time. There's a timing to it. There's a spontaneity to it and a natural ability, a natural storytelling ability that you have. That you may have gotten from your dad or you're just... Yeah, no, my dad had great comic timing. If you were here in the room, when we have this conversation, I always say to the person, ask me what makes my jokes when they go, timing!

Oh, yes, yes. Yeah, no, I appreciate that, Frank. You know, I, but these things actually happened. You know, they're all true stories that, you know, like there's a thing that I have been doing now that happened to me at a Whole Foods. I went into a town and I got in the afternoon and I had just enough time to grab a

bite and there was a whole foods market near the hotel so i went in there and um got a couple things i went up to the cash register and there was a very attractive young lady at the cash register and um she rang me up and it was like you know 1746 okay and i had a credit card and now you know you you don't know whether to swipe the credit card or insert the chip sure so it was so it was insert okay insert the chip I put the card in and the machine goes and I looked at her and I said I just used this card this morning she goes no sir it's definitely not your card we've been we've been having trouble with this machine all all day and then she looked me right in the eyes and said could i get you to

pull it out and slide it back in again oh man so that happened to me kilbert just got very excited and i and that night at the gig i told that story to the audience now i forget where i was let's say it was lowell massachusetts so like yeah you know i was at the local whole foods down here in lowell and i tell the story and it got this huge laugh the next night i'm in uh you know dc and i go yeah i got into town today and i stopped at chipotle and i tell this whole story as if it happened in Chipotle in their town, and it fucking killed again. And I've told it in every single show since then. Because that's the kind of stuff that if I were in the audience, I would want to laugh.

I remember Rodney Dangerfield telling a story. Dangerfield telling a story. He and Henny Youngman went to see this girl singer. Was Ben Gazzara with him? Yeah, he should have been. And this girl singer was doing long intros to every one of her songs. And at one point she said, now I'd like to take you all on a long exotic journey.

And Henny Youngman stood up and yelled, I'm not going and walked out. But conversely, when you see a concert, when you're a kid, and I don't know if you agree with me on this, Richard, you'd go and you'd see a performer and when they just go song to song and not interact with the audience at all or kind of acknowledge the audience, there was a little bit of banter, you feel cheated a little bit. Yeah.

Well, I mean— You feel like they're just doing it by rote and going from city to city. I don't—I mean, when I was a kid, I didn't care. When I saw a band play, I was just so mesmerized. I'm seeing this band. They're actually right in front of me. I used to actually have that thought of like, they're right there. That's them.

And so, but then, yeah, when I started, when I saw enough concerts, you know, you mentioned Harry, the Harry Chapin song that really affected my dad. I think it was a year after that, we went to see him perform. This is maybe a couple couple years before he died and uh and i was it was unlike any other show i'd ever seen before because harry chapin talked all night like he told he sang cats in the cradle and taxi and these great songs but he told and he was funny and charming and and i remember thinking what the fuck am i watching like this is so weird i i've never had a singer talked to the audience like this before and it it was you know these are the things that you know i'm sure just like with gilbert and the people that he watched you know

you collect these things that you think i want to incorporate that into what i do you know to make it unique isn't there more intimacy too in an acoustic show oh yeah that calls for it i saw elo nobody loves jeff lynn more than i do i saw elo at radio city a couple years ago but he just went song to song to song he'd tell you the title and play the song and there's no interaction with the audience whatsoever and there's just you know not to be greedy and that's not his personality but just a couple of moments yeah you just wish he'd tell you something about the song or what's going on in his life draw you in a bit yeah i get bummed out if i see a performer that doesn't interact with the audience it's i do feel cheated now because i just feel like i feel like it's kind of part of the gig you know when you hear or sing your songs uh do you

like get transported back to what you were doing and what you were feeling at the time you wrote them sometimes and sometimes it's like somebody else it's like i'm hearing somebody a complete stranger sometimes i'm i uh i i don't even remember there's a lot of cases where i'll listen to a song that i haven't heard in a long time. Or I'll hear something on the radio and I'll hear, especially lyrically, I'll think, I don't even remember what I was thinking to come up with that line. And so it's a weird, I mean, yeah, in certain cases, I remember where I was at emotionally or what was going on that made me write that particular song. But there's so many of them that I don't, I'm not connected to them in the same way anymore. So, yeah, I think that apartment or that thing.

Yeah, there's a couple of cases of it. But for the most part, it's almost like there's another person. We will return to Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast after this. Spring is here, and you can now get almost anything you need for your sunny days delivered with Uber Eats. What do we mean by almost? Well, you can't get a well-groomed lawn delivered, but you can get a chicken parmesan delivered. A cabana? That's a no. But a banana? That's a yes. A nice tan? Sorry, nope.

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We all have the power to shape the world. We're connected to the world we share. To each other. I am future. I wait in the world of Echo. Discover the extraordinary with Echo, the spectacular new show by Cirque du Soleil. Now playing under the big top at Toronto Lakeshore Boulevard West.

The world is yours to create. Tickets at CirqueDuSoleil.com. Echo, thanks to its presenting partner Sun Life and its official partners Air Canada and MasterCard. Do you have a vivid memory? We've asked a lot of musicians on the show that we've had. Jimmy Webb was here. Holy shit.

Peter Asher was here. Paul Williams. The first time you heard your song on the radio is a question we love to ask. Do you have a vivid memory of it? Absolutely. And the feeling? Absolutely. So it had come out.

The first song I ever put out as a singer was a song called Don't Mean Nothing. And the first three months that it was out, it was not even released to pop radio. This is back when formats were very, very important. And there was not a lot of crossing over. and so i started you know at rock radio so uh here in la we were lucky you know within the first it was a song that because i i was lucky enough to get a few of the eagles to to play on it so joe walsh played the guitar solo on it and timothy b schmidt and randy meisner former e, sang background vocals with me on it. And at this point, this is 1987, there had not been any Eagles records since the long run in 1980. And so people were starved for an Eagles record. And this is the closest fucking thing they were going to get to it, you know? And so I rode that wave.

I mean, I'm proud of the song. It's still one of my favorite songs to play. And I still hear it on the radio and stuff. But I think a big reason that it got attention was because of those cameos that were on it. And so it was a pretty quick hit at rock radio and I was working my ass off promoting it. And so I was not hanging out, listening to the radio. And I finally had a day off. I was home in LA and I was driving to some interview or some meeting or something on Santa Monica Boulevard in West LA. And I was looking, I was dial switching, looking for my fucking song. I wanted to hear it. And I hit KLOS and there it was. And I pulled my car over and I just remember thinking,

holy shit, this is just everything I've been waiting for my whole life. And then I couldn't wait to hear the DJ say my name. And so, you know, it's a pretty long fade at the end of Don't Mean Nothing with all these background vocals and Walsh is playing a solo and i'm just like come on come on like i want to hear him say and that's richard marx and don't mean nothing and the song gets to the end and the dj goes and now a word from velveta motherfucker i couldn't fucking believe it god damn it motherfucker. I couldn't fucking believe it. I was like,

God damn it. So was it the second time that you heard your song? Yeah, I think I heard it. Richard Marks. Yeah, but I don't remember that. All I remember is like that. It's like being, God, really?

You can't fucking back announce me? Gilbert, we've talked about this. We always imagine, and you're friends with Tom Hanks, Richard. We always imagine that it'd be like that moment in that thing you do when the guys hear the song on the radio and they go running through the streets. And it would have been had the DJ back announced me. But the people from Velveeta were probably running through the street. They were very excited.

You said before, I mean, you love the work of other singers. You love the work of other songwriters. I saw you talking about Alan and Marilyn Bergman. But you're working. Can we talk about the person that you're working with most recently? Of course. A giant? Is there a more successful songwriter in history? I so not one that we admire more i mean george gershwin and birth

back right there you go in that company yeah so yeah i would love to talk about him for a minute for a couple of reasons one uh he's the most recent example of what I've referenced a couple times already. About a year and a half ago, my wife, Daisy, and I were walking through an airport, and I forget how we were talking about collaborating, because I write the majority of my songs I wrote by myself, but I have co-written with a lot of different people over the years. And she said, is there anybody left that you really want to write with that you haven't and i said just one burt backrock and she looked at me and she said so make it happen she said and hurry the

fuck up yes he's 90 now he's 91 he's 91 now he'll be nine he'll be. Wow. And I didn't know what his health was or what was, you know. Turns out he's going to outlive all of us. I mean, he's rocking. But at the time, she just sort of hit that. She sort of laid down that gauntlet and she said, you know, make it happen. And I realized that, you know, I've done that in my life. And so I really focused on getting Burt Bacharach into my life. I actually met him and worked with him, not as a songwriter, but he hired me as a background singer in the early 80s before I had a record deal.

So I got to work with him on a session one day. And he was nothing but a gentleman and a total pro, of course. And so I just started emailing different people and, and, you know, what we do, we, you know, you, you reach out to different people. And finally I connected with someone who passed the message to him and he was like, yeah, of course, you know, let's try to write a song. And so we got together about a year ago and, and we wrote, uh, an absolutely gorgeous song called Always. And then we wrote another one recently.

And I have voicemail messages on my phone right now from him saying, Soz, come on. We got to do a third one. Let's write another song. I've gotten to work with him in the studio and just hang out with him. And he tells great stories. And we talk. We're kind of buddies. He's a a gem he's such a fucking cool guy isn't isn't this business and life in general uh strange you you you say you your demo tape was rejected by everybody in town what two or three times

oh more than that at least yeah and those most of there must have been some low moments sure obviously that accompanied that and since and then, there have been a lot of times where I'm like, why isn't this working? Or why didn't this happen? Yeah, of course. And yet you're working with Burt Bacharach. Dude. Which is sort of a modern equivalent of George Gershwin. That's not hyperbole.

It really is. So you must pinch yourself on some level. Well, do that anyway because i i get off on that but i didn't mean to get personal rich you know whatever floats your boat yeah he's i have a long list of those kind of moments you know working with bert is is the most recent but you were, when I was in high school, I was, um, of all the, the people that I admired and was a fan of, I don't think there was anybody I was a bigger fan of than a guy named Maurice White, who was the lead singer of Earth, Wind and Fire. And I was the biggest Earth, Wind and Fire freak, still am. And, you know, years later, I ended up standing in a studio with Maurice White singing on my record. Like Maurice White came to the studio to sing Back on Vocals with me on my record. Though I've had these kind of moments. moments for granted man i am i i i cherish them i've been really really fortunate to have experienced these dreams come true multiple times and i can't wait for whatever the next one is

that's nice do you have moments where you wish you were had taken it more seriously like where you did take something for granted and then years later thought oh oh to where i wish that i had like learned a lesson from it later yeah yeah that's interesting no but i thought where you were going with that gilbert was uh and i don't mean to sit you know like switch gears but more interestingly i was from the time I moved from home, from Chicago to LA to pursue my career, I was so focused and so diligent about my work and my career. And then, you know, yeah, I did struggle for a few years, but, you know, not like some of these other stories you hear where people are toiling away for 10 years, 15 years, whatever. A few years later, I start having a great career and I'm touring and I'm having hits and I'm having all these great experiences. What I didn't do was I didn't have

enough fun. I didn't celebrate my successes until I'm doing them retroactively now. I mark the occasion now of a song that went to number one in 1994. It's in my calendar. And it's only just for me and my wife to have another martini that night and for me to acknowledge and celebrate the fact that that thing that I did reached a pinnacle at that time because I didn't celebrate my successes when they were happening I was always focused on the work

always focused on and I also was maybe a little fearful that if I really celebrated it and enjoyed it that it would all be taken away from me um that was stupid I should have I should have had way more fun I should have had I should have indulged in way more debauch stupid i should have i should have had way more fun i should have had i should have indulged in way more debauchery i should have like yeah it's not too late but uh that you know i i know that's not what you asked me gilbert but it's like it's really um retroactively i think i wish i had been a little bit more reckless as a young man and not so focused but then again maybe i wouldn't have had the successes that i had so who knows you know what it's to me what i've experienced over the years is i've been in so many situations where i'm there depressed and thinking wow anybody else

would be having the time of his life right now oh yeah of course i totally i've been there many many times yeah sometimes the most successful periods of my career i was the most personally miserable i've ever been and and i would and everybody around me thought oh this guy's on the top on top of the world but for whatever reasons you know various reasons i was fucking miserable like it's and usually at the most commercially successful times and maybe for you too but it's like yeah i was you know maybe that's why i get along with comedians because we're all fucking tortured like we're a psycho go you're hanging around lewis too much yeah yeah i i i one time i think i hosted the miss naked greatest potty contest well that sounds like a heart that's our hardship and you're figuring any other guy would have thought well okay i just dropped dead and I'm in heaven now.

Right. And I was miserable there. Really? Yeah. You've always had that problem. Yeah. Yeah. I'm in these things or like MTV spring break I used to do and I go.

Oh, right. Everybody else is having the greatest time ever. But your suffering makes you funny. Yeah. Yeah. I hope so. Or it makes me a pain in the ass to be around. All the funniest people are dark people.

I mean, look at Chaplin. Yeah. And W.C. Fields and Groucho is a dark guy. Oh, yeah. And on and on. Speaking of Chaplin, it's such a coincidence. Just this morning, I had this really random thought.

We had music playing in our house and Smile came on. Oh, yes. Nat King Cole's version of Smile. And a lot of people don't know that Charlie Chaplin wrote Smile. Yes. And Charlie Chaplin wrote Smile at a time when charlie chaplin was charlie motherfucking chaplin

right i think it was for limelight wasn't it it was for limelight yeah so here's he used to bill himself as charlie motherfucking as he should but here's the thing here's the random thought i had because i and i'm excited to share this with you. Please. I'm thinking to myself, I'm putting myself back. I'm like, if I could have lived at that time, picturing all these professional songwriters

hearing this song, Smile, and then being told, you know who wrote that? Charlie Chaplin. and seeing all these professional songwriters fucking pissed off it's like so fucking pissed off like fuck that guy charlie fuck charlie chaplin do fucking movies and make people laugh. Fucking stay out of my way, man. Right? That's very funny.

I think that's how screenwriters felt about Ben Affleck and Matt Damon winning a screenplay Oscar when they were in their 20s. I mean, there's a little bit of that. I'm a fan, but when I saw Bradley Cooper sings, like, fuck you, man. It's not fair. It's not fair. Hanson and all. I'm a big movies. Oh, yeah. By the way, i'm a i'm a good singer too like fuck you man by the way richard speaking of hazard uh why don't people seem to write story songs anymore i mean there are a handful but it's like we're talking about

jingle writing being a dying art the harry chapin's, the Jim Croce's, the, uh, even Kenny's a coward of the County. Yeah. You don't, you just don't see it anymore. No, I don't know. Maybe it's cyclical.

I don't know. That's a good question. I really don't know. I never thought about it. Um, yeah. I mean, I think there's always room for it.

I mean, you wrote a good one. Yeah. I, yeah, yeah i i wrote mine they everybody else can worry about theirs do you think that's a good answer all of a sudden an idea popped into my head how they talk about the mtv generation and now with internet everything has to be quick yeah they don't want to follow a story. That's probably the answer.

Gilbert's got it. I don't think the attention span is there for a song. People will binge Game of Thrones. They'll shit their pants in their living room rather than, you know, they'll sit there in a fucking dirty diaper to binge watch a TV show, but they won't spend four minutes listening to an entire song. Well, here's a similar question, and I'm at the risk of sounding like an old fart. I'm in my 50s, too. Has lyric writing suffered?

I don't see a Leonard Cohen, a Joni Mitchell, a Bernie Taupin, or Hal David, for that matter. No, but there's Halsey and there's... Maybe I'm not looking in the right places. There's Sara Bareilles and there's... Yeah, no, no, no. I'm definitely... I'm not a participant in the pylon of the... I'm not saying you are either,

but I'm not a participant in the pylon of there's no good songwriting anymore. There's no good... There's plenty of it. Maybe it's not in the pylon of there's no good songwriting anymore there's no good you know uh there's plenty of it it's maybe maybe it's not you know in the top 40 a lot but there's always plenty if you go through you know i i just i'm always looking for it i'm not i'm listening to everything and i hear things um that are really inspiring and really badass and And I think that what is happening though, especially in the last few years with female singer-songwriters, is they are writing from their perspective of being a young woman in this time period. Much like you had the Carly Simons or the Carole Kings or the Joni Mitchells. Yeah, their style was totally different it was much more maybe poetic or the this is more this is more talking like conversational

and I and I'm really impressed by it I mean I I find myself trying to um infuse some of that into my own songwriting and just be a little bit more modern with my own songwriting and just sometimes just say stuff rather than I'm always trying to make it poetic and say it in a way that you've never heard it before which you know I like trying to accomplish that but there's also a lot to be said for just

fucking saying it and meaning it and having people react to it so yeah I think there's plenty of it out there I guess I gotta work a little harder to find it are there songs you've written much like how actors see performances they've given and cringe are there songs you've had that either the song itself or just one part of it makes you cringe. Not anything you've ever heard. Yes, there are plenty of songs that if I were to stumble upon the demo tape that no one's ever heard, like the song for Lynn Harwich, for example.

Which I forget how that went. How did that go again? Come over. Come over and bring tequila. No, there's, yeah, of course there's songs that I worked hard on and then they're just shit. You know, they just don't measure up, but no one ever heard them.

Now, that said, there's a ton of my own songs that I love that other people would say they cringe when they hear because they just fucking hate what I do but personally no everything that I've ever released is something

that I absolutely stand behind and that's why you know the concept of singers and songwriters but mostly singers that say they're sick of a song or you know God like I think I heard Ray Davies say or you know god like i i think i heard ray davies say once you know if i have to sing fucking you got me that i you really got me i'm gonna blow

my brains out i don't i love what i i look down my set list every now and i'm just grateful like i love these i still love singing these songs that's great um i feel lucky that way what what are the tell us as you started out by telling us songs that that raise the uh the hairs on your arm what's a song one song that you would be jesus i wish i'd written that oh red rain by peter gabriel wow good choice he didn't hesitate when it comes to mine now that's that's that's the to me that's the benchmark um that i'll never reach and i don't even know what the fuck he's talking about in that song. I mean, I know a little bit.

I kind of get the imagery of it, but I heard that song, I was 22, and it just wrecked me. It was the production. It was the melody. It's his vocal. It's so powerful. And I remember I was young and I was crying.

I didn't know why I was crying. It just absolutely was a visceral reaction to that song. And there are other ones too. I heard this song not too long ago, a few months ago, co-written by a guy that I know. There's a group called Magic. And they're a reggae pop band. And they had a huge hit a few years ago called Rude. Why you gotta be so rude?

Don't you know I'm human too? It's a huge number one song all over the world. And I liked it. I liked that song. It was catchy and fun. And then I met the singer, whose name is Nazri, a Jew from Canada. There you go Gil and really lovely guy young guy really good songwriter great singer and I met him a few years ago we tried to write a song together

it didn't it just didn't gel and then I stumbled upon you know it's like I said I'm always listening and listening to new music and stuff and I heard the a new album by them and this song came on uh called more of you and it was a ballad and i and i i'm even like i'm mr ballad guy but i i get bored with ballads for the most part um and it was but i listened to it mainly because it was so not what they're known for and it was absolutely beautiful and then i really listened to the lyrics and i and i i wept because um he wrote these lyrics that said everything that i would say to my wife i mean i've written songs for daisy and i'm you know i love that i've communicated my feelings for her and you know told my versions of different stories to her in song

but this song said every says everything about how how i feel about her and i was it wrecked me and i called him that i still had his number and i called him and i said man i just heard this song of yours and it fucking killed me so yeah i hear i hear songs every once in a while that's great that it still happens destroy me oh yeah yeah you're not too jaded for that experience. What was the first song? Do you remember that made you cry? Oh, that's a good question. Born Free.

Really? Yeah, because it was in the movie. Sure. The lion died. And I cried. And all I remember is being little. or no the did the lion die no but they had to leave the lion behind i can't remember i can't remember but it's a sad ending elsa the lion elsa the lion right and i think it was i don't think i don't think he died i think band it was you know bambi's mom that died but is that michelle lagrange so the uh born free yeah Michelle LeGrasse? Elsa the... Born Free? Yeah. Who wrote that music? John motherfucking Barry.

John Barry. Forgive me. And so I remember in the theater, I was four years old or five years old. I have this memory of crying at the end of the movie. And that, Born Free! As free as... It's like, wrecked me. Wow.

I looked at my mother like what the fuck are you trying to do to me I need therapy now good questions you were asking Gilbert yeah really good tell us about

the Marx Brothers before we let you get out of here Richard I have three sons the Marx Brothers Brandon is 28 um lucas is 26 jesse's 25 they're all incredibly wonderful young men great human beings and they also

happen to be really talented singer songwriter musicians i have three sons and not one goddamn doctor. Not fucking one. What a disappointment. They all want to be musicians and performers like dad. And I'm like, yeah, okay, 30 years ago, that was a good idea. Now, not so much. I tell them, invent a fucking app. That's good advice. That's good practical advice. i'm such a fan of

of what my sons do musically they're all into different kinds of music and they're they're they're working it you know they're they're they're they're doing their thing and you perform with them sometimes yeah yeah they they come up on stage with me and we perform together sometimes and and actually i'm i'm just i'm just about to finish a a new album that gilbert was nice enough to mention that'll be out this year and what we think is going to be the lead-off track is a song that i wrote with my middle son lucas that he produced and i it's one of my favorite things i've ever done wow that must be an incredible feeling oh man it's the best and it's not just because they're my spawn. It's because they're really, really talented.

Like, I'm a fan of these guys. They're really, really gifted. What a gift to have the three generations. I mean, your mom was singing and your dad was arranging on your records. Now you're working with your sons. Yeah. What a nice thing. Pretty amazing.

Gilbert has a son, Max, who I think is a comedy prodigy. Oh, yes. And I think you're going to have to work him into the act. How old is Max? Soon. Max is nine. thing pretty amazing gilbert has a son max who i think is a comedy prodigy oh yeah and i think you're gonna have to work him into the act how old is that soon max is nine oh wow it's gonna happen and you have a nine-year-old what the fuck dude he does a lot of push-ups holy shit and my my favorite story about him is when he was in preschool we met with his teacher and his teacher said well he he doesn't pay attention and he's always trying to crack jokes and i figured well i gotta definitely beat him now no shit teach him a lesson and and the teacher said where did you learn to be

funny and he said from my daddy and she said oh your daddy's funny and he said he's funny at home not at work oh my. Not totally inaccurate. So Max is out of the will. That's for sure. Yes, exactly. He's done for. Did you want to try to attempt to sing something with this man? Shit, yes.

Uh-huh. Who are you asking, me or Richard? Richard, are you game for this? Sure. If it's horrible, we'll cut it out and shit can it. Oh, no. If it's horrible, you got to leave it in. That's it.

Who's going to think it's going to be good? That's what my wife says. She said that on our honeymoon. What do you want to sing with Richard? You know, he sang with Jimmy Webb, Peter Asher, Tony Orlando, Paul Williams, your friend Josh Groban. What did you sing with Josh Groban? Oh, God. I can't remember.

We had Josh sing some of Gilbert's dirty jokes. Oh. And it was, I'll send you a link. I wish I would. It was quite funny. So he tries, and Tommy James, he did, he did, he did Moany Moany with Tommy James. You had to be there, Richard. I have lyrics. They handed me

lyrics to Tonight's the Night. You want to try the... Oh, I want to try what the fuck's the name of this show? He wants to try one of yours. What the fuck is this piece of shit? I'm here waiting. Oh, this fucking piece of shit you want to try, huh? Yes, yes.

I'm scared for you, Richard. If only I can now say I have a cover version of Right Here Waiting by Gilbert Gottfried. That's worth it right there. Okay. What if you guys, now this is Skype, so it's tricky. So you guys will have to pause. You'll each have to take a section. Yes.

And then our brilliant engineer, Frank, will sew it together. Now, we have it a certain way. Do you want me to do the first part or you to do the second part? I think Richard should start so you remember the tune. Yes. And then you'll sing it up to I'll be right here waiting for you. And then I sing the second part. You're going to take the second verse and chorus?

Why? Do you want me to take the first? No, I'm just sitting here in shock that you're ready to do the second verse and chorus? Why? Do you want me to take the first? No, I'm just, I'm sitting here in shock that you go like you're ready to do this. Yes. Okay. Why don't you let Richard start? Shit, I wish I brought a guitar. Oh.

Let's do it acapella. We'll put some music on. Oh, he's got a guitar. Oh my God. This just keeps getting better. See, so if my part doesn't sound good. I can't play it, but we'll. Yeah.

If my part doesn't sound good, it's't play it, but we'll... Yeah. If my part doesn't sound good, it's because of our lack of instruments here. Right. Yes. Well, no, actually, what you can say now, Gilbert, is if your part doesn't sound good, it's because Richard fucked it up on the guitar.

Yeah. No, I think we can just maybe do it... Look at this. Okay, I'm getting a hard... He's got a guitar. Hang on. You need a pick? That sounds good. I think we can just maybe do it. Look at this. Okay. I'm getting the heart. He's got a guitar. Hang on. That sounds good.

Yeah, close enough. Sounds good enough to fake it. Yeah. They going to plug it in, Richard? That's what she said. No. You going to play it acoustic? Yeah, because it's going to sound like shit if we plug it in.

Okay. Here we go. Okay. Okay. You can start us off, Richard. All right. You ready? Yeah. Yes. You ready, shit if we plug it in okay here we go okay okay you can start us off richard all right you ready yeah yes you ready gilbert yeah here we go oceans apart day after day and i slowly go insane i hear your voice On the line But it doesn't stop the pain If I see you next to never How can we say forever Not yet.

Wherever you go. Don't sing yet. Whatever you do, I will be right here waiting for you. Whatever it takes or how my heart breaks, I will be right here Waiting for you Are you ready, Gilbert? I took for granted

Wait! Wait! One, two, three, go! I took for granted All the times That I thought would last somehow I hear the laughter The times that I thought would last somehow. I hear the laughter.

I taste the tears. But I can't get near you now. Oh, can't you see it, baby? You've got me going crazy. Take it home. Wherever you go, whatever you do, I will be right here waiting for you. Whatever it takes or how my heart breaks, I will be right here waiting for you next Richard.

No, I think we leave it at that. Why ruin a good thing? But here's the really great thing, is that, you know, Gilbert asked me a little while ago, what was the first song that ever made me cry? This is the most recent song that ever made me cry. This is the most recent song that ever made me cry. See, now that's a callback

like a good comic. That is. Holy shit. That was amazing, Gilbert. You fucking tore through that song like a bull in a china shop. Listen, you're in good company richie

we're gonna cut a greatest hits it's you jimmy webb asher tony orlando tommy james who else josh god that was wild love it i'm glad thank you you're a sport let's get some plugs in too are you touring with rick springfield uh i'm doing a couple of shows we've been doing shows sporadically together um oh so not yeah we have a there's not a tour okay my bad he tour he's doing his tour i'm doing my tour and we meet up from time to time because we've been friends for 30 years and um yeah we're playing uh ravinia in chicago uh on june 14th I think no June 15th I'm playing with the Nashville Symphony

on June 14th okay great where's that at the Skirmerhorn in Nashville okay with the Nashville Symphony maybe the

finest symphony in the world I mean I've worked with a lot of them and then June 15th Rick Springfield and I are playing at Ravinia

in Chicago and I don't know the date there's another Rick Springfield and I are playing at Ravinia in Chicago. And I don't know the date. There's another Rick Springfield show at the Rodney Strong Vineyards in California. Yeah, we'll probably do another half a dozen shows together. I love doing that show with Rick because we've been friends for so long. And I always say, you know know two dicks walk onto a stage well if people go to richardmarks.com they can get all the updates on this and and absolutely

and see the dates and then when is the re-release of uh by the way i always i always go on first on those rick springfield show we close the show together doing a couple of songs but i always go on first because if there's going to be two dicks, I want to be the first dick. Sorry, what were you saying? When is the release of Repeat Offender, the anniversary? The revisited, yeah. That came out a couple of days ago.

Okay. And it's Repeat Offender Revisited. That's out there and it's sort of new versions and live versions and acoustic versions of the hits from Repeat Offender. And then, I think it's sort of new versions and live versions and acoustic versions of the hits from repeat offender. And then,

um, and then I think it's going to be September, October, the new album, which is still, I haven't titled the album, but the new album will be out and, you can illegally download that at that point.

Okay. And we want people, our listeners, they, and they will, we want our listeners to go to look at, uh, Richard's very funny,

funny or Die video. That was your premise. Yeah, it was fun. That was fun. And also, if they can find the colonic ad, you're hilarious in that as well. That shit never dies. It's on YouTube forever. We appreciate this.

I totally enjoyed it, gentlemen. Thank you so much. My wife woke me up one night and she said, she was sitting in bed with a phone looking at Twitter, and she said, hey, Richard Marks is fucking hilarious. Really? He'd be great on the podcast. Oh, that's awesome.

Well, give her my best. I will. And here you are. It was great. Thanks so much. And Gilbert, I'll see you at my house for tequila and revealing that song. Oh, okay. I'll be there.

Thank you, Rick. Oh, okay. I'll be there. Thank you, Rick. Thanks, guys. So this has been Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast with my co-host Frank Santopadre and the singer who's going to be singing the Lynn Harwood song any minute now.

Is she going to be okay with the fact that her name came up five times? Oh, yeah. She'll love it. Okay. Fantastic. The Jew singer. The Jew-ish singer. Yes.

The Jew singer whose new album, Fuck the Goyim. That's actually just the first single thank you Richard thanks guys bye bye Time was all we had until the day we said goodbye I remember every moment of those endless summer nights Gilbert Gottfried's amazing, colossal podcast is produced by Dara Gottfried and Frank Santapadre

with audio production by Frank Verderosa. Web and social media is handled by Mike McPadden, Greg Pair, and John Bradley-Seals. Special audio contributions by John Beach. Special thanks to John Fodiatis, John Murray, and Paul Rayburn. You remember all the nights we spent in silence Every single breath you took was mine We can have it all again Say that you'll be with me when the sun Brings your heart to mine And I remember every moment

Of those endless summer nights Oh, I remember And I remember how you loved me Time was all we had until the day we said goodbye I remember every moment Of those endless summer nights Oh, I remember