Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast - GGACP Classic: Dick Cavett

Episode Date: June 6, 2024

GGACP celebrates ten (10!) years since its debut on June 1, 2014 by revisiting the very first episode of the podcast, featuring a memorable interview with comedian, author and talk show legend Dick Cavett. In this episode, Dick shares personal stories about Jack Benny, Johnny Carson, Katharine Hepburn, John Lennon and Groucho Marx (among others) and talks about the time a guest dropped dead on his set (yes, it happened). Also, Dick recalls writing for Jack Paar and Jerry Lewis and favors Gilbert and Frank with uncanny impressions of obscure character actors. PLUS: "Rashomon: The Sitcom"! The genius of Sid Caesar! The tragedy of Erin Fleming! Tarzan moves in! Dick plays The Bitter End! And Frank Nelson gets mistaken for Gale Gordon!  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

TV comics, movie stars, hit singles and some toys Trivia and dirty jokes, an evening with the boys Once is never good enough for something so fantastic So here's another Gilbert and Franks. Here's another Gilbert and Franks. Colossal classic. Now, there might be some people out there who don't know who Dick Cavett is. So let me tell you, when I was growing up, he was on TV all the time. And there was the Carson Show and Merv Griffin and people like that. And they were always fun.

But you knew Dick Cavett would have people different than what the other guys got. He would have like Groucho Marx, Katharine Hepburn, John Lennon. He had like the greatest authors. He'd have like Richard Burton on. And it was like an amazing thing. And so recently, Dick Cavett came over to my apartment and we recorded an interview where he talks about Groucho Marx and Johnny Carson. And he does impressions of these little-known character actors. So, if you think you know who Dick Cavett was before this interview, well, take it from me. You don't know Dick.

You're listening to the Amazing Col colossal podcast with Gilbert Gottfried. I'm Gilbert Gottfried, and I'm here with my co-host, Frank Santopadre. See, I still can't say it. You'll get it out eventually. Santopadre. Well done. You're kidding, of course. One time in the middle of a show, I i said i'm here with my co-host and

dear friend frank and i had to lean over and go what's your last name yeah yeah well there's you meet so many santa padres over the years who the hell can keep them straight i i well you can be forgiven so so anyway oh could could I make one problem clear My earphones are so fucking loud That I'm busy That's better That's better

Thank you sir Can you say loud on this show Okay Okay. Can you say loud on this show? Okay. Well, we're here. We're still here. Some of us are. Since the Shirley Temple.

Well, we were discussing how Shirley Temple, and when Shirley Temple died, that she was supposedly discovered by Harpo. But she was a child, the story goes. The Harpo discovered Shirley. Yes, you saw her walk. No discovered by Harpo when she was a child. The story goes... The Harpo discovered Shirley... Yes, you saw her walk... No, Alfred Harpo. On the...

No relation. Of the Jersey Harpos. Yes, that's what he said. The story goes that Harpo saw her on the set of Horse Feathers. He saw her parents walking past with her and wanted to adopt her. Just thought she was the most beautiful child.

This could be. My friend Robert Bader, who's got an essential book coming out eventually about the brothers, would know that for sure. See, I'm too young. All of us here to have seen Shirley Temple in her day. All of us here to have seen Shirley Temple in her day. And then as an adult, I don't think her movies played Grand Island, Nebraska, perhaps. But then later I saw The Pedophile's Dream, Shirley Temple.

In just about everything. Can you say that on the Godfrey show? Yeah. Of course, well, I usually shy away from that type of stuff, but still. You're known for shying away. I should introduce our guest. That would be a good idea.

I'm dying to know. When I remember years ago, there was like Johnny Carson and Merv Griffin. And it's like, what's the matter? Chewing your crackers. Oh, it's fine. That's fine. That's the least problem with this show. I respect that here.

There was Johnny Carson and Merv Griffin, both enjoyable. But then there was another show that would get these people on that you'd never see with Carson or Merv Griffin. And there would be like these actors that had never appeared. And that was our guest, Dick Cavett. That was the Dick Cavett show. I'm told this all the time. You know, I never set out to get people nobody ever got. And yet it happened.

I've never been entirely sure why. I do know that I got a lot of big people before having Miss Catherine Hepburn on. But after that, it became, in a way, the show to do for people like that. Now, you had Catherine Hepburn, Betty Davis, Groucho Marx, John and Yoko, who would never be on a talk show. Yeah, that was their first time to come on after the breakup uh they wanted to come on something they wanted to meet me i went over to the saint regis and there they were on the bed nothing's salacious here they were just they were working john had a lot of work laid out on the bed and they had just finished shooting a bit with fred astaire by a handheld 16 millimeter if that's technically possible uh for a movie john made which i was then put in as i was there standing

among a line of men and whisper one whispered to me and I told something to that one and so on. I never saw this film, but I was in it. And then I remember the first time John made me laugh and he was so accessible. Did you ever meet him? No. He was so easy. He felt like, as you did in the same way with Groucho Marx, the minute you met him, he was your friend and you talked easily and there was no awkwardness and not many people have that and anyway john had that and and then i said well what why me and he said well um you've got the only halfway intelligent talk show and i said why would you want to be on a halfway and like you he laughed and we were sort of hit it off from that point on yeah but um the other day a radio guy said you've got a box set of dvds out this is certainly no way

resembles a plug uh you've got several out but the one called hollywood grace he said who's on that and i thought well you should tell me you should tell me. And I had a copy of it there. And I figured, let's see, we've got Katharine Hepburn, Betty Davis, Fred Astaire, Groucho Marx, Kirk Douglas, Frank Capra, and Mel Brooks, Lucille Ball, Robert Mitchum, Marlon Brando, Alfred Hitchcock, and Orson Welles. And I looked at it, I thought, we gave away way too much here.

That's a lot. One box, the whole show is there. Sadly, in its way, Rosengarden's great witty musical play-ons and offs, because the music rights are so complicated, had to be excised largely. But like when I had the great Jan Morris on, the British soldier who became James Morris,

who became Jan Morris after being James Morris and father of four and Queen's Royal Fusiliers or whatever. She was very hesitant to come on about her book, Conundundrum about her sex change and i winced as she came out because i had been warned she might haul at leave and rosengarden played there'll be some changes made that's clever she didn't catch it, and she was there for 90 enthralling minutes.

Now, can you tell us, this is a story I heard, about your report cards in school. I found a bunch of my old report cards, if this is what you are not only referring but alluding to. And every one of them, since in those days a school teacher was an old, pardon me, an unmarried lady, Miss Gabus and Miss Fuchs and Miss Wilson and Miss Cross and Miss Graham,

every one of them in my grade school years had written as if they had conspired oh and Dick has to learn to be more considerate of others and the other comment that was at least three out of five that I dredged up

Dick must learn to control his talking. You know how evil it is to talk. The old bag. I remember like back then when TV used to have like old movies and everything 24 hours.

The Late Show. Oh yes. Billion dollar hours. The Late Show. Oh, yes. Sure. Yes. Million dollar movie. Yeah. Dee-dee-dee-dee-dee-dee-dee-dee-dee. The musical clock. Dee-dee-dee-dee-dee-dee-dee.

Yes. That's right. And, you know, so I fell in love with all the Marx Brothers movies. And then I remember I would watch Groucho pop up on your show. Yeah. would watch Groucho pop up on your show where he'd wear like a little, you know, cap. It was a golf cap. A golf cap. With a bird on it.

Yes, and a turtleneck. And a couple of balls. Yes, a couple of balls with clown faces on them. And he would get into these long talks with you where it would be like, when we were doing motion pictures, and these were pictures where there was motion going on. And they were talking pictures

because these were pictures where people would talk. That's uncanny. Should have known it was Gomo. You have one of the best ears in show business, by the way, as you know. The first time I ever saw you, I don't know if it was your clawed reins that knocked me out, or somebody else. But I know, and I won't lord it over you,

as far as I know, you have never mastered my specialty. Oh. Richard Liu. Oh, okay. Want to hear Richard Liu? Yes, yes. Richard Liu, for those who don't know,

was a Chinese actor who specialized in evil Japanese generals. He was all the nasty Japs in movies. Oh, yes. Irony, of course. Well, it's all right to say that. The New York Times, Japs bomb Pearl Harbor. Truly.

But it sounds funny now. It's a documentary that I saw. See, I get in trouble with the Japanese so I admit some issues there I am of the Japanese I've been queer for Japan since I was

about five years old I got all the books out of the Grand Island Public Library and now my Japanese spoken

is good enough this is frightfully thing to brag about that I can fool Japanese on the phone now so you're richard liu richard yeah as you were launched into saying and i interrupted you chinese actor who ironically played all the evil japanese who were murdering and raping his people at that time in the world well World War II movies. Because the Chinese

were sort of getting revenge on the Japanese in movies by playing evil Japanese. Bad as they could. Just like Jewish actors who escaped from Europe were playing Nazis. That's right. Everybody from Walter

Slazak to Helmut Dantien. Who else played Nazis? Slezak, by the way, you remember him, of course. He was always in a Wehrmacht, not Wehrmacht, but Schutzstaffel, a German colonel, a German. I had him on an early show, and I had just come back from Germany, and I had just come back from Germany and I had just come back from Austria. And I said, you know, when I was over there and you cross the border and you get the wrong money. And sometimes I didn't know if I was in Germany or if I was in Austria or what. And what's the difference between being in Austria and being a German anyway? And he said, oh, don't you know? And I said, no. What's the difference between Germans and Austrians?

The difference is that the Germans were Nazis. Takes a beat. I think for the dummies, he filled it in and said, and the Austrians are. But the interesting thing about that is it's true. There was another actor, Oscar something. Oscar Werner? Oscar Homolka.

Oscar Carl Weiss. Oscar Homolka. No, no. He was in a Twilight Zone episode, Welcome to Death's Head, where he played a Nazi officer revisiting a camp. Are you sure his name was Oster? I have to look this one up. I think so. It couldn't have been my very favorite actor of all time.

Which one? Akeem Tamaroff? Yeah. Oh, God, don't let me blank on his full name. His last name is von Seifertitz. No, that one I wouldn't remember. Google it, seriously. Yeah.

It's not Rudolph von, and it's a faun, von Seifertitz. Can you look up the Twilight Zone episode? Sure, we'll get Dara right on that. And then look up von Seifertitz. Our crack staff is working on it as we speak. He was a German Jew, and he specialized in Nazi office. What did you do? You're Richard Lewin.

Not Oscar Homolka. No, no, no. I saw him on Broadway in Rashomon. Oh, my God. So there was Homolka as a Japanese who made wigs, and I can still hear why did it matter that they cut off their hair?

They were dead anyway. And I saw Oscar Homolka in 79th and Park. Now, for people out there, Rashomon, that became a, that was first a play, I think, and then a Japanese movie, and it became a that was first a play i think and then a japanese movie yeah and it became a very

popular sitcom rosham on the sitcom yeah it no not the format oh the format right became very popular on sitcoms where they'd have a sitcom where a character would go oh that was the worst evening of my life. And then each one would tell. You'd see someone else's view of that evening. Yeah. It was a famous all-in-the-family episode. All-in-the-family, the odd couple.

I'm told by our staff, by the way. Homage to Kurosawa. Oscar Beregi? Yes, Oscar Beregi. There you go. Is that the guy? Yeah. I believe you.

He's still working on Richard Lou. People are going to be calling you up if we don't come up with the first name of Von Cytus. The switchboard is lighting up. Say again. Oh, wait. We got and so I'm playing the bitter end

and I'm, there's a rumor that my career will soar and that I will move to the Village Gate if I get a second show, a phenomenon nobody warned me about. The same audience stayed at the bitter end again. and whoever, and Cosby, and unknowns like Joan Rivers, and one somebody called Rodney Dangerfeld, who was introduced as one there, had to have a second show. And terrified, I went on to the exact same audience, and I managed to fill out 15 minutes

by all but doing Richard Liu, telling them how much I loved him, telling them what movies he was in, Purple Heart, first yank into Tokyo, Purple Heart was the best. And I don't look like him, so you'll have to close your eyes. Anyway, so finally I managed to kill almost a whole show worth and if you wouldn't mind playing this little playlet with me all you have to say go but is

from the Purple Heart where they tortured some B-29 prisoners from the Doolittle raids captured all you have to say is you'll never get any of my men to talk. Colonel Mitsubishi.

And I'll go into Richard Lou. If I can get it, if I don't get it, we'll take it out. Okay. You'll never get any of my men to talk. Captain Mitsubishi. Colonel.

Oh, you'll never get any of my men to talk, Colonel Musubi. I must remind you, Captain, that a chain is no stronger than its weakest rank. Wow. Got the whole audience first. Unfortunately, there are 200 people here. I got him on the show. I had him on my show.

They put him on as a surprise way early, out in California. It's one of the shows the morons erased. Yes. For the Let's Make a Deal episodes. For Let's Make a Deal. You're a homework bugger. I had a surprise guest every day,

El Capitan Theater, out before the curtain in one, the beautiful curtain closed. And here's today's Hollywood guest. Curtain's open slightly in the band. Hollywood guest. Curtains open slightly in the band. Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom I left out something. He sat down and he had seen me do him on the Johnny Carson Tonight Show. And he said, Mr. Cabot, we have reason to believe that you came from an aircraft carrier of the Hornet variety.

And I died. That's great. Changed postcards and things. I remember he said that in a movie. Yeah, I remember. Because I always remember. Akraf Karyo. Van Akraf Karyo.

Yeah, and... Oh, God, he made a lot of films. What's the one on a mountaintop in Hong Kong with Bill Holden and everybody oh that's one of his later films but burma rose the purple heart is the one to see it's a very fine film uh dana andrews um sam levine a whole company of flyers who as in fact happened but they do little raids over Tokyo, they went going knowing they didn't have enough fuel

to get back, and many couple crashed, and others landed in occupied China. Oh, and you like dialects, and you have the ear, but it's required. In the Purple Heart, the plane crashes, they survive, and Dana Andrews and some of the other crew members are picked up by a corrupt Chinese overlord,

presumably an ally, right? And his son, played by Key Luke. The actor playing the Chinese overlord had an exaggerated accent, and Key Luke couldn't do one for shit. And you got the following. I was just going to ask you to do a little Key Luke. Yeah, Key Luke was the number one son.

You know him from Number One Son. In the Charlie Chan. Google it, folks. Old white actors playing Charlie Chan, and Key Luke was his son. You know him from Number One Son? In the Charlie Chan. Google it, folks. Old white actors playing Charlie Chan, and Keeluk was his son. Yeah, they never let an Asian play Charlie Chan. No. So you heard, hello, gentlemen.

My name is Zhen Chu Ling, governor of Kunwan province. And this is my son, Moy. Hello, gentlemen.

Watch for it. You'll just... Dick, let me ask you about something we just alluded to. Some of the great late-night Cavett episodes that were foolishly taped over by ABC. No late-night ones. Oh, it wasn't the late-night Cavett episodes that were foolishly taped over by ABC.

No late-night ones. Oh, wasn't the late-night ones? It was the daytime Dick Cavett show, which, in fact, I have to be reminded was called the morning show at first. And then they did me the twin honor of changing it to the Dick Cavett show and also using the tapes to tape Let's Make a Deal on illegally, like something Richard Nixon would do. Were there some great ones that were lost?

Yes, I can't think about it. I don't know if you want it revealed, the interior of your apartment, of the Gottfried apartment, but behind me is a stunning canvas of Groucho Marx, and really good. So there was a show. Sorry to bring the room down. There was a show with Groucho and his dear friend, Harry Ruby, the great Harry Ruby. Oh, this songwriter.

We were talking about that. Who did a medley of words and the songs he wrote. And he was the funniest, most lovable man. He's on an episode of You Bet Your Life, Harry Ruby, if you want to see him. He was played by Red Skelton in the movie. They looked a little like him, but nothing like him. And they erased that.

I had people that would make a movie buff's mouth water on those early shows. Gail Sondergaard um did i have percy hilton possibly the the trivia expert people um well some of those garson shows the new york carson shows were taped over as well oh a ton of them. And Jack Parr's prime late night. His prime was not as good as his late night. Jack's neuroses and strangenesses and weirdnesses and danger and all his electric

neurosis were in the late night show and you couldn't take your eyes off him. The great Kenneth Tynan said when Jack's on the screen if there are two people even if it's Cary Grant or the ghost of Houdini, you can't take your eyes off Jack

for fear you might miss a live nervous breakdown. It was so true. I think to Ernie Koufax, they called his wife, Edie Adams, and they said, it was just some guy who worked at the network, and he said,

look, you better rush over here right away. They're going to burn all of his shows. Oh, I have heard this and hoped it was not true. Yeah. Did they get there? I think she got and saved what she could. Well have one like that'll kill selected people a friend of mine went up to nbc to meet a friend for lunch one day and he said my friend was so depressed i said why and he said i just erased george s kaufman's first appearance on the tonight show with jack buck oh geez grouch. Groucho's God, George S. Coffman.

Oh, God. I remember that appearance almost word for word, and I must have been still in Nebraska when it aired. Where were we going? Nowhere. I want to hear some more Richard Liu, I think. I thought I slurred off something. I remember one time at some event,

I started doing the Groucho imitation to you where I started following you around going, I miss Grace Harvey Rubin. And at first you were laughing and then you were- You gave me chills. Yes. Because everybody else does Groucho. Yes, I need

a full man. They don't get it. See, I can't do the young Groucho anymore. It's that soft voice old Groucho. Just velvet soft voice. Margaret Zuma worked with us in some of

those movies. She was always, she never understood what I was talking about. You're making me cry, George. Because she would say, Julie, what does that joke mean? And she never understood. And then they joked me. and she never understood one of the jokes. I remember sitting there when he said that.

I also noticed another thing sitting next to Groucho. He was surprised by things he said. I mean by that, he heard them as we did. He didn't think I'm going to say this.

You said something and he said things and then he'd give a little laugh like hey that wasn't bad oh wow you know yes yes and you've had it yourself you've you've said something and thought geez that was good i didn't even have to think of it oh yes yes very true and in groucho even as he got uh one day, do you dare me to tell you a Groucho story you may never have heard? Absolutely. Love it. Absolutely.

One day, he and Tony Randall were in their tuxedos backstage, I think at the music hall, for some big special. And they were asked to step aside back there in the hall while they brought some scenery through or something. Would you two gentlemen just go into that room? And they went into a room, and the room was a dressing room. And suddenly from the other end, it filled with chorus girls who stripped mother naked and got into some jungle costume as Groucho and Randall stood there in their tuxedo.

You see Groucho holding his cigar and saying to Randall, you know, you don't get this in the pants business. I think what any other comedian might've said, it wouldn't have been that. Is it true that when you introduced him at some of his comeback shows, that you

actually walked out on stage and said, I can't believe that I know Groucho Marx? People get sick of my saying that kind of thing, and I was a starstruck boy from Omaha. Jesus, I must be drunk. Lincoln. I'll tell you why I thought Omaha, because I would go over there sometimes

to see things that didn't play Lincoln, like Spike Jonze. So you don't remember where you were born? It's the state, right? I've never known for sure. This is strange, but almost like, how can you explain this, boys and girls? Okay.

Here's a man who grew up in Lincoln, Nebraska, Grand Island, Lincoln, Nebraska. And before he went east to school, in Lincoln, Nebraska, he had met Dane Clark, Basil Rathbone, Charles Lawton, Agnes Moorhead, Charles Boyer, Cedric, I was corrected on that by Stephen Fry, Cedric Hardwick, Henry Fonda, and somebody else. Oh, you know

something? I remembered a Cedric Hardwick story. Shoot. Sir Cedric Hardwick. Sir Cedric Hardwick. To you, buddy. He was Sir Cedric Hardwick. Sir Cedric Hardwick. He was Sir Cedric Hardwick. He was in Ghost of Frankenstein. That's right. Was my favorite.

I had heard he had trouble with impotence. Sir Cedric Hardwick. I think it came quite easily to him. And I think it came quite easily to him. We ought to be on the radio. He had a problem with him. And he used to introduce himself as Sir Seldom Hard Dick. My God, you have collector's items like that

i met him once in the doorway of the algonquin uh and uh it was freezing cold and i thought i gotta say something to him he's we're coming in opposite directions and holding the door for each other. And I said, this weather's not too good for the voice, I guess. I was always, I could connect with him. Should I do his answer for you? Oh, please. Not too good. I think I confused Cedric Hardwick with Cyril Richard.

They would both hate you. Fair enough. One was a foot and a half taller than the other and gay as a fruitcake. Cedric Hardwick's son was Watson on the Jeremy Brett Sherlock Holmes. He wasn't the first Watson. I think he was the second Watson. Well, the Jeremy Brett one. Oh.

Yeah, yeah. See, I was just. Edward Hardwick. Yeah. We will return to Gilbert Gottfried's amazing colossal podcast after this. Colossal podcast after this. I think there was a story that Ralph Bellamy would tell that they were doing one of the Frankenstein movies and the director gave them this direction like,

Frankenstein is chasing you and the wolf man is coming through the window and Dracula is coming out and we want you to react like you're fed up. Fed up. Yeah. And that used to be their greeting to each other. From then on, Ralph Bellamy would see Cedric Hardwick and they'd both go, so you're fed up yet?

I love little bits like that. Why don't you do a book of this fabulous collection of jewels that you have stored in your head like a toad? Yeah. Why am I wasting time talking to you when I should be doing this book? If I were you, I'd turn on some sort of recording device. That's an idea. We didn't think about that. I remember when I was following you around with the groucho thing,

you then eventually. I had to swat you away. Yes, and you eventually ran into an elevator, and I wasn't able to stop the elevator in time, so I called your room. And the hotel. You don't really want to tell this, do you? Yes.

Go ahead. Okay. No, and then I just. Oh, tell us about. You used to write for Jerry Lewis. Yes. Go ahead. Okay. No. And then I just, oh, tell us about, you used to write for Jerry Lewis. Yes. You know how Jerry would come on and go, I wrote that. That was yours?

Yeah, that was mine. It's the only one he ever used. And that Hindenburg of a show that he did, which was one of the most expensive catastrophes. One that was like three hours long? It was two hours long live. Totally unscripted, allegedly. Yeah, what's he going to do for two hours was the motto they flooded the country with for about a year.

And I liked Jerry very much then and now. But it was a load that he should not have taken on, and it was not possible, and he would get depressed. And when his dad came around, and I don't know. Did you leave The Tonight Show, Dick, to go to that show? You might have, too, because I made 360 on The Tonight Show. Jerry did it for two weeks, liked me, wanted me on his big new show, and I wanted to be faithful to Johnny

because we're both from Nebraska. And for other reasons, I liked him so much. But yeah, I went to my manager's office and I heard the late Charles Jaffe talking to the Jerry Lewis ABC show saying, my client doesn't work for $800 a week. And I said, get him back. It's true. I work for 360.

Come on. And he got $1,200 a week. Imagine a boy who had been a copy boy at the time a few years earlier at $60 a week getting $1,200 a week with Jerry. But there was a lot of good stuff in those shows. And to my amazement, they have just come out on a box set of all those shows. Kennedy was shot near the end of the abbreviated run. And after that, I think about three more shows sort of dribbled out and then he quit.

But I had a good time writing for him. I didn't hate Hollywood the way you're supposed to. I would now, I'm sure. But I liked having an apartment in Bel Air. I liked seeing Johnny Weissmuller as my neighbor. And I liked going to paramount and sitting on the old western set and then the new york set and then that's where they take that standing paramount lot yeah and i heard well johnny weissmuller to anyone listening who doesn't was tarzan yeah and i heard toward the end, he had gotten like Alzheimer's

and would be in a home doing the Tarzan yell. That's sad. It's true. It was sad when I knew him. I lived in one of those, one of the million rectangular apartment, two-story

high buildings with a pool in the middle that you have out there. And one day, here came Tarzan. A little pudgy, with his hair a little long. Actually, I didn't see him first. I heard him. I was just going to swim, and I heard, you're going to hit it?

And you know he had a high voice. And here he was, carrying a very heavy suitcase a smaller suitcase and a six foot by four foot portrait of himself no i'll tell a lie a photograph full-length tarzan and he said i'm moving in here because my apartment, my house is being painted. An excuse in Hollywood when the IRS had gotten you and you moved into an apartment and told people your house was being painted. The sad part is he was on the second floor and he was winded having climbed one set of stairs, and I helped Tarzan take the stairs. Wow.

And if you'd told me when I'm Grand Island at the Grand Theater where I was first molested, I would, watching Tarzan and Mia's mother on the screen, I would carry a suitcase someday I wouldn't have been able to conceive of it. Now, I heard Jerry Lewis basically is the nutty professor. It's like one minute he's a nice, funny guy, and the next minute he could turn, like, totally evil on you. He never turned evil on me.

Really? This is not to deny all the people who say that, but I didn't see it. And, oh, my God, look at, listen. I'm getting a call on my phone. I mean, don't cut this. Richard Lou's airs. Yeah, I'm not doing anything but a live show with...

Yes? This is the Gottfried show. I'm sorry about the laughter. They're going to jump here. The car is there. I was just going to ask him to do his bird quook. I'm sorry, repeat what time it arrives. Okay, tell him I'll need 15 minutes beyond that.

Okay, thank you. He's having too much fun. Deposit your dime again. Remember when you deposited? Oh, yes. Whose great joke was it? i don't remember but i always remember when i would be on a pay phone and i'd hang up it would ring back and say you owe like 25 and nobody would pay that it was idiotic yeah was it in mike nichols and was it nichols may's great phone thing or some other

comic i think it might been some other comic and maybe shelly burman who got to that point in his bit and he said boy said you must deposit 15 cents and he said well i can't but i'll take your name and address. I hope that's true. Yeah, that used to be on those pay phones. They would call you back, and you'd have to pay, but then they realized that was so stupid. No one would ever pay. What would you do?

Would you just say, okay, here it comes? Yes, yes. I would always hang up and walk off with the phone ringing back. Or say, oh, good. Frank Nelson. A little Frank Nelson. Oh, tell us the Jack Benny story. All right, but would it be more appropriate to tell a quick Frank Nelson story? Oh, okay. Frank Nelson was...

We'll set up who Frank Nelson was. This will strike you as improbable. I promise. Okay, so... I don't know whose voice to do it in, so I'll do it in mine instead of Jack Ward. Let's say I'm sitting with Streisand in the Kennedy Center in Washington.

Of course, that Kennedy Center, not the one in Broken Bow, Nebraska. And the theater has emptied. It's an NBC special, but it's lunch. Everybody's gone, so an overhead shot shows the two of us occupying only two seats. And a gopher comes over. shows the two of us occupying only two seats, and a gopher comes over. To those unskilled in showbiz jargon,

a young kid who runs errands on a show. Kid in jeans, loafers, T-shirt, comes over, very polite, said, Mr. Dyson, do you want some coffee? And she said, yes, sugar and cream. Do you like coffee, Mr. Cavett? Now, I think it's the fact that he phrased it that way. But anyway, do you like coffee, Mr. Cabot?

Oh, do I? And then he looked sort of startled, of course. And I said, I've got to explain quickly. There was a thing called the Jack Benny Show long before your time. And there was this very funny character actor on it whose name was Frank Nelson. And he said, I know he's my father. Oh, my God. Cue the theremin music of the Twilight Zone. I almost passed out.

And now skeptics have said, well, how do you know he was? Sure. Well, he was. He talked about his dad. He said the one thing his dad hated the most, and don't be offended by this, from something we said earlier, was being mistaken for Gail Gordon on the Lucy show. Yes.

Because they both did the same thing. Wavy duck hair, little mustache. In always like that. And a little fruity in there. Oh, yes. I found an old Life magazine recently, and there's Frank Nelson on it, and all it says is, yes. He had the whole country.

Frank Nelson was on the cover of Life magazine. Full cover of Life magazine back in the heyday of the Benny show. Gee, it's fun to watch those old Benny shows now. Yes. When you were on the Joy Behar show, Dick, you were a guest when we first met, and you told this wonderful Benny story about meeting the fans, the out-of-towners in the elevator.

Oh, yes. Dick here to favor us. Oh, yes. Don't care to favor us? The special on HBO called Mel Brooks and Dick Cavett Together Again. I think I got the biggest laugh with that of anything I did that night. It's a sweet story.

Jack Benny, and a harmless story. Jack Benny being maybe the, certainly one of the cleanest comics I've ever worked in radio and va harmless story. Jack Benny being maybe the, certainly one of the cleanest comics I've ever worked in radio and vaudeville and on. And lovely, and I don't know anybody in show business who disliked Jack Benny, and you can't say that about very many of our beloved colleagues.

Everybody liked him. I hung out because I was in hog heaven once I got the par job I stayed at the tapings I hung out with Bob Hope and Benny and all the comics Burl, whoever it was

I was around them, they were my people I had made it, I had gotten to their world and I was in the dressing room talking to Mr. Benny one day and he ordered a glass of scotch, drank two inches of it and walked out on stage.

This is a separate story, but to me that was astounding. The most relaxed man. Anyway, that night, after the show, got in the elevator, so did some tourists who weren't supposed

to get in that elevator. And in the seven floors, and this will test your age, in the seven floors down to the main floor, one person said, are you really cheap? Another one said, do you really play the violin? Are you old enough to know these references? Oh, yes. Do you not really pay Rochester?

Another one said. And he's rochester another one said and he's such a nice man and he'd smile and you know nod uh is it really a guy living under your house in a you know you know like a vault type thing again did you any drive a maxwell i mean or is that just a joke and he endured all this nicely i just so impressed got to the main floor everybody rushed off to tell their friends i said mr benny does that get kind of old i mean over the years and all that and he said he put his hand on my shoulder he said you know kid sometimes you you just want to tell them to go fuck themselves. That's gold.

I loved it. That's great. The voice that came out of my radio. Oh, God, I would trade a lot for that experience. Well, how do we get off on a laugh? Two bald guys put their heads together and made an ass of themselves. Well, do you... What if we fired some names at you, and you just gave us a little short response?

Okay. Will you keep track of my time? Absolutely. I'm ruining your lives. Our staff, our crack staff is keeping track. Alfred Hitchcock. During a commercial break, sort of not looking at me directly, Great Kelly The most promiscuous woman I've ever known

That's one Hitchcock story That'll do He was just great He was such fun He did the bit Marshall Brickman was working for me And I think he was the one who had the idea Of having our two profiles

at the beginning of the show in shadow. Hitchcock's and mine. Marshall Brickman went on to co-write Annie Hall. That's right. Famously. And Jersey Boys, too. That's right. What about Salvador Dali? Oh, wait a minute. I get you. Okay, but one quick thing with Hitchcock.

Oh, sure. He said, I know the man to my right does him better than I do, but shall we reveal the secret of doing Hitchcock that you, I think Larry Storch told this one, all you have to do to do Hitchcock is to raise your voice slightly and pretend you've got a bit of meat stuck in your rear right top molar, which gives you... I wanted to do a movie once in which it's an assembly line

and there's a frame of an automobile. And then they add the fenders and it moves along and they add the doors and that moves along and they add the windows and then they add the top and then they add the trunk and that moves along and they add the windows and then they add the top and then they add the trunk and then it is a completed automobile

and you open the door and a dead body falls out that was a fantasy of a movie he wanted to do he also announced that he had never ever right up to that day looked through a camera ever, right up to that day, looked through a camera. I'm not sure exactly what that means, except he was famous for, like, cartoon strips working out the entire movie in every shot on paper, drawing the figures and the dialogue. And they said making it was just sort of dreary after that.

Now, what about Groucho's girlfriend or secretary toward the end that's a terribly long story best told by my friend steve stoller in a book called raised eyebrows a young woman vivaciously pretty at the first uh attached to Groucho, and there are two schools of thought, and they are she saved his life, brought him back to life. He was a lonely old man taking walks, trying to talk to strangers because he had no... He'd walked past a neighbor's house hoping to be invited into dinner. And Aaron Fleming, her real name was Aaron Fleming, came into his life and got him to do concerts, got him to Carnegie Hall,

and was also an abusive psychotic. That's in a nutshell. Yeah, that's the nicest thing I could say. I got along with Aaron fine. Some will remember a trial on CNN about the money. And there was a scene, she got in a fight with a guard about her purse. She wasn't going to give it up. She said, that man killed Groucho Marx, pointing at the judge.

And she was losing her mind by then. And it was a very sad and long story, and she later shot herself. I'm surprised no one's made a movie either based on that, not a Groucho Aaron movie, but something. Raised Eyebrows. Oh, and before we forget, someone died. I was talking with Frank about it. Someone died on your show.

Yeah, I think I'm the only, if there's a Guinness Book of Records, the entry for having a guest die is probably occupied only by me during a taping. J.I. Rodale. Who would the gods have die on a show but a health expert? That's a long story, and I can refer you to my book. It's in here. Yeah, talk show book.

Oh, you've got a, that's like a galley copy. Yeah, it's a galley copy. Rare collector's item. And it was totally, totally. And Pete Hamill was on there with you, was he not? Pete Hamill was sitting there and got the column of his year at least the next day

as the men perished in front of the audience how did it happen? heart attack he was very funny for half an hour in his segment I made a mental note to have him back and he sat down on the couch and Hamill came out and suddenly I heard and Hamill forgetting or not

realizing he was in close-up at the moment as it happened said this looks bad and I looked over and there was mr. Rodale in The Death Rattle. Years later, Catherine Hepburn wanted to hear everything about that. When I first met her, her dad was a doctor, and she always gave medicine to people she worked with. And I said, why do you suppose I found myself at the edge of the stage saying, is there a doctor in the audience? And she said, well, you know that. The doctor in the house would get a laugh.

And she was right, and it would have. And the audience didn't think it was real because there's makeup and band and entertainment. You don't die in that situation. That was horrible. And all of us forgot that all of us forgot until a week later when we watched the ghastly tape that

he had said among other things, I plan to live to be 100. You tell your creative writing student, take that out. And I never felt better in my life. The worst thing you can ever hear from anybody, including yourself. What about Olivier?

What's your memory? He was just fine. He's a nice guy. Hell of a tap dancer. I have borrowed a Melbuk answer about, did you know Hitler? Do you want to know if it may never have been revealed? Olivier was great, of course. It's never been revealed.

But I know, if Mel may not, why he came up with the phrase springtime for Hitler. When we were improvising the notorious Ballantyne beer commercials years ago he was the 2500 year old brewmaster and I was the young interviewer sir have you you know uh they couldn't get Carl and uh they got me I was totally unknown it was great fun most fun I ever had Mel we improvised for three four hours at a time. And there was a play that the great Edward Everett Horton started doing when he was about 30

called Springtime for Henry. And he was still doing it when he was 60 and 70. Wow, that's where it came from, huh? Springtime for Henry. And I just know how Mel's mind would be. He would take part of the thing and put it together or something else. And I'd say, what are you going to call the thing?

And he'd say, let's call it Springtime for Hitler. I know that's where it came from. I don't know if Mel knows that. But I hope so. But I'll tell him. Here's a cliche. You've never tasted this beer, have you, sir? I can say anything I wanted to.

I don't think you've ever tasted Valentine beer. Taste some now. Well, all right, Fluffy. Let's see. I shall pour some into my swizzle or mouth. Mmm. Mmm. Oh, do you like it, sir?

My tongue just threw a party for my mouth. Are those available anywhere, Dick? Can anybody find those on the internet? I have a couple of DVDs of them I don't know People wrote in Loved those commercials, so

It'd be great to see And said, what can we do to keep them on? The beer is like piss And we can't drink it But I bought two six-packs, hoping it will help keep your commercials on. They wrote to the editor. I'd love to see them.

Oh, another one we wanted to ask you about because he just died recently, and that's Sid Caesar. Yeah. I say yeah because one of the reasons I'm late going home now is I owe the Times a piece on Sid. I got to call him Sid after a while.

And I think I'll tip the title. I think I'm going to call it It Was Like Looking at a God when I first saw him. I sat in church in Nebraska all through high school, bored my ass off to sit in church, and all I could ever think of on Sunday was show of shows the night before and things that Sid and Imogene and Coco, not Coco, you idiot, did.

And one day I thought, now there's a man sitting down there about his size. Could Sid Caesar physically be sitting in the same room or place that I am? No. He's a god off somewhere in New York, I believe they call it. And eventually I met him, and eventually I had him on shows. And my last contact with him

was Mel Brooks, of course, called and said, would you write a little thing about Sid? We're going to have a birthday party for him this last year. And Carl and everybody, we'll go to his house and we'll read these things. And I wrote something. And I heard that they read it to him.

And all the things that people had written. It couldn't be there. And it was sad. And he was just a shell of himself was left. And the next day he had forgotten the party. The gods disliked him intensely. He suffered so. There was never anybody like him in any way.

The most lavishly gifted comedian probably of my time. Now people would say, was he funnier than Johnny Winters? That's a dumb question. How do you compare great, great, great comedians? Is yellow a better color than green? He certainly had a shitload of physical and mental and verbal gifts that was unprecedented. A little awkward in conversation.

I just watched two shows he was on with other guests of mine for writing this. And then years later, I was on CNBC, and I did two half hours with Sid in Hawaii. I don't know, Atlantic City. He must have been in a great period of his life, maybe off the booze. Maybe analysis was finally working for him. And he was the best talker you can imagine. For three hours, you almost want to say you couldn't shut him up. He was so damn interesting.

He talked about everything. I said, could you do a show of shows now? He said, no, there are no skilled stagehands now who've done live television enough stuff like that it was just technical interesting uh and he was so happy with himself that these two half hours went so well and at the end of the second one he went what a great interview not on on camera. I mean, it was over by that time. But I was so happy that I somehow had made him happy or comfortable or something in a way that he obviously had never been before.

And I treasure those two half hours. What a man. I guess I have to get out of here now. Oh, did you know I was going to do a play off-Broadway? Oh, tell us anything you have to talk. Yeah, it's, you know, a great thing, event, that got very ugly, happened on my PBS show when the great writer Mary McCarthy was on

and talked about the great writer Lillian Hellman in a way that caused Lillian Hellman in a way that caused Lillian Hellman to sue her. The case went on for years. To most intelligent people, Lillian ruined her reputation by pursuing this suit, this great advocate of free speech over the years, and her hatred of McCarthy and the viciousness of the lawsuit. And a play was written by Nora Ephron about it.

And a gentleman by the last name of Maury wrote a splendid new play on the same subject. And I read it with them one night. And somebody said, why don't you do the play with us? So I guess I will. It's at the Abingdon Theater. It'll be at the Abingdon Theater from mid-February to mid-March. About four or five weeks.

And who do you play? Why do I get all the rotten parts? I was myself in four or five movies and myself on The Odd Couple and myself on the... I don't know what all. Oh!

Forrest Gump. That's right. And Apollo 13. And Apollo 13. Am I in that too? Yes, you're in it. In the clip's right. And Apollo 13. And Apollo 13. Am I in that too? Yes, you're in it. In the clip. Yeah, and a Frankenheimer movie. Can't they get anyone else to do me?

Well, Beetlejuice, at least I was allegedly somewhere else. That's right. That's right. Yeah. But this will be at the Abingdon Theater, and you can Google it, and it's called Hellman versus McCarthy, and boy did it get dirty. Two women loathing each other.

Part of it is the fraud that Lillian Hellman was toward the end. Martha Gellhorn, who'd been one of the women married to Ernest Hemingway, did a exhaustive piece about, remember Julia, the novel and the movie where Jane Fonda played Lillian Hellman? And the woman that story really happened to came forth saying it was not Lillian Hellman, it was me. Oh, it's just full of interesting, fascinating stuff. Your sort of thing.

The serious side of you that we see so often. Will Richard Lou be mentioned at any point? I'll probably work Richard Lou in. Jesus, I gotta get out of here, you guys. Can I come back sometime? Please do.

Absolutely. In fact, you have no say in the matter. You have to come back. Okay. Hi, I'm... How's later tonight? Oh, yeah. You'll sleep over.

I'm Gilbert Gottfried with my co-host, Frank Santopradre. Frank knows for a time. And we've been speaking to... He'll get it eventually. Say your name. Santopadre. Santopadre. By about the seventh show,

I figured he was going to nail it down. Yeah, one day, but there won't be a seventh show, I assure you. Is that Pantopadre spelled the usual way? Yes. Yes. Yes. And we've been speaking to Dick Cavett.

And this is the amazing, colossal podcast. Thank you, Dick. It's been a treat. And, Dick, you have to come back anytime you can. Can I get a copy of this to my lawyer before it goes out? Thanks, Dick. It's a treat.