Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast - GGACP Classic: John Amos Returns

Episode Date: February 8, 2024

GGACP celebrates the 50th anniversary (!) of the groundbreaking Norman Lear sitcom "Good Times" (premiered February 8, 1974) by revisiting this charming mini-episode interview with star John Amos. Also in this episode: Jack Cassidy! "704 Hauser"! Tom Hanks sings a TV jingle! Gilbert writes a Superboy comic! And John remembers Mary Tyler Moore!   Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

TV comics, movie stars, hit singles and some toys Trivia and dirty jokes, an evening with the boys Once is never good enough for something so fantastic So here's another Gilbert and Franks, here's another Gilbert and Franks, here's another Gilbert and Franks. Colossal classic. Gilbert and Franks, colossal obsessions. Hi, this is Gilbert Gottfried, and I'm here with my co-host, Frank Santopadre, and this is Gilbert and Frank's Amazing Colossal Obsessions. And we have a return guest to the show.

We do. Since we've already read his introduction, I'll give you a short one. He starred in Good Times, Roots, and... Coming to America. Coming to America with Eddie Murphy. And a million other things. 704 Housing.

Colossal Obsessions. Now, oh, and let's start off with you have a book. You want to say who it is? Yeah. Oh, wait. Although, I bet they know from those three credits. It was all moving along so smoothly. I thought, huh, I'm not fucking this one up.

So I forget to introduce the guest, which is a minor problem. Ladies and gentlemen, John Amos. Good, but how are you? Hi. How are you? Good to see you again, buddy. He needs no introduction, really. Welcome back, John.

It doesn't hurt anything. Thank you. Appreciate it. Yeah. You have a short memory in this business, you know. John who? It's like, it feels like we just had you on yesterday. It was. It was about a year ago, I think. Maybe, maybe. Just about a year ago. Maybe 10 months. Something like that. Somewhere in there. Now. Yes, sir. Now, look, all of us have regrets in our lives, and I want to try to correct one now. Please.

Okay. I'll start off. When you were, like, let go from good times. Fired. What do you mean, let go? I was trying to make it. Trying to make it nice, right? You were fired.

They kicked your ass out the door. That's right. Norman Lear said, take a hike. Yeah, yeah. They threw you the fuck out of good times. Yeah, what about it? Okay. So they wrote an episode to be the first one without you where your character off screen has a heart attack and dies.

You know, Gilbert, there's a little bit of a mystery about that to me. I heard, of course, having been killed or kicked off the show, I don't know how I died. But the rumor was that I died in an automobile accident while I was looking for a job. Now you're telling me... Oh, wait, that's even better. Yeah?

Yeah. For who? For me. You were fired. So what's your view? Well, anyway, the character either died in an automobile accident or like you say. I thought a heart attack, but he died in an automobile accident? That was the word.

Looking for a job. Oh, that's very good. Looking for a job. I think that was it. Yeah. Oh. Okay. Because I was dead, so I can't confirm it.

Yes. Yes. Norman says nothing but lovely things about you now, by the way. Now. Well, I got nothing, but, you know, the guy changed the face of television. Let's face it. He did. And didn't he also, like, later on hire you for things?

Yeah, we made our peace, and later on he came back to me with another idea he had for a show called 704 Hauser Street, which was the address for Archie Bunker. And I and my family, which consisted of my TV wife and I had a son on the show who was, to put a twist on things, was an ultra-conservative black man. Okay? I mean, he was real conservative okay so we move into uh archie bunker's old house and we spun off from there didn't last long but it was a hell of a good premise ahead of its time that was ahead of its time now we got to get to the most important part of the interview please when they did that show where your character dies in a car crash right

after they kicked your ass off the show right uh florida your wife florida's walking around yes and she wants to be strong for the family so she's pretending like it's a day like any other day during the, you know, she's showing no emotion. All right. And then there's the famous ending where she's washing a big salad bowl and she either drops it by accident or flings it to the ground. And what does she scream out, John? Damn, damn, damn. His life's complete. Yeah.

That's it. Yes. Is that not it? Yeah. Yes, that's exactly it. But if I can direct you now, can you make it more gravelly and more black? Okay. Take two.

Okay. Damn, damn, damn. Oh, yes. Does that get it? Yes. Thank you, Mr. Director. Thank damn, damn. Oh, yes! Does that get it? Yes! Thank you, Mr. Director. Thank you, John. I'm directed by Gilbert Gottfried.

I can retire now. When I left... It's the bottom. After the last... Oh, no, I didn't mean it that way. After the last interview I did with you, I was on my way home and I said, oh, fuck, I didn't ask him to go.

Damn, damn, damn. Well, you got it now, buddy. Yes. It's been bothering him since you were here. I'm sorry, man. I'm sorry about that. Oh, I feel so much better now. Good, good. Very few times can you correct something.

That problem you had in a bed. This and a little ex-lax will have you on top of your game. problem you had in a past. Listen, a little ex-lax will have you on top of your game. Now, John, I was remiss, too, because I don't think I shared with you the fans' response to your episode, and people kind of went crazy, especially when

you sang the McDonald's jingle. They loved it. It was one of our most popular shows out of 160. You know, that McDonald's jingle, it resonates, even after all those years. I think I told you last time I was here, I went to see Tom Hanks in a Broadway play he was doing. Oh, yeah.

And I walked into his dressing room very humbly to get his autograph. I'm a Tom Hanks fan. I walked through the door, and he broke into the McDonald's song, so we finished up singing it together. He went on to tell me that Good Times was one of his favorite shows, and that my character was like a surrogate dad for him. He'd come home from school and watch the show, and he'd get scared when I'd take my belt off, you know, to whip JJ on one of the kids. He's quite a character. And he just broke into the song with you.

He just broke right into the song. I had to remember the lyrics. We sang it. It was good. With Anson Williams. He's in it too. Exactly. Anson Williams was in it. I don't know if Anson is still around. Are we Anson still with us? Yeah. He's hanging around.

That's the worst thing you want to hear when you're an actor. What's that? You don't know if he's still with us. Yeah. True. Yeah, that's... That happens a lot. But we... I'll get

it to you and Paul, because what we do is when we put an episode up, people tweet and people put stuff up on Facebook. Most definitely. And there was a long list of raves. I'm glad to hear thataves for the John Amos episode. I'm glad to hear that.

I should say something for Anson Williams, if he's out there listening. He did say he decided to move on to doing directing and writing. That's right. And he's very honest about it. I was once talking to Anson Williams, and he said, well, I looked at myself, and I said, I'm a passable actor and a – no, he goes, I'm a passable singer and a shit actor, so I got to do something else.

He directed a lot. Yeah. He had a big TV directing career. No, he's had a very successful career. Yeah. Good for him. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. The other thing I wanted to ask you about.

Yes, sir. That we didn't talk about last time, and I'm going to send you and I'm going to send Paul those raves. But this came to our attention. Jimmy's dating Ann Coulter. You know anything about this? Jimmy who? Jimmy Walker. Yes.

Dating Ann Coulter? Yeah. I'd read it in the paper, but it was one of those rape rags. So, I mean, the National- Norman Lear. Norman confirms it that they came to a party. They were at a party that he- Is Ann Coulter got brain damage?

I mean, what's going on? What is she doing with her career now that she's dating Jimmy Walker? No offense, Jimmy, but that's a hell of a combo when you think about it. Yeah. Don't you think? There's something weird going on there. Something very strange going on. I thought he was joking when he said that.

No, I saw a picture of them in the National Enquirer, and evidently it's true. Hard to believe. Is Jimmy conservative? I don't know about that. Conservative compared to what? Oh, no. I just couldn't understand that pairing. Yeah, that's two opposite ends of the spectrum, huh?

Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you saw it and didn't believe it? No, I didn't believe it. I just saw this is somebody's idea of a joke you know like telling me donald trump is hanging out with one of martin luther king's children i don't believe it didn't add up the other thing that norman told us about 704 houses street does this ring a bell about you shaving your head and creating a continuity problem yes yes yes thank you Norman, for not letting that nugget die.

What had happened, I went to the barbershop before we started shooting the show, and I got a haircut, and my story, my cover story was I fell asleep in the chair. The truth of it was, I just had one of my radical moments

and I told the guy, cut it all off. Or not all of it, but most of it. I came in the studio and Norman was apoplectic. I think if he'd had a gun he would have shot me. I said, what the hell are you doing? God bless it. You're going to get a wig and you're going to pay for it.

And I did. And I got a wig and I paid for it. He said, now, and don't ever do that again. I said, I'm going to get a wig and you're going to pay for it. And I did. And I got a wig and I paid for it. He said, now, and don't ever do that again. I said, okay, Norman, all right. I mean, you know, I walked in, he looked at me, I thought he was going to have a stroke. I said, what's the matter? It's in your head. Look at your head.

I said, I can't look at my head, but what do you see? I see a man that screwed up the whole sequence. So we rectified it. I got the haircut, and that was the end of that story. But we had some – the thing I loved about Norman was the exchange of passion. When he got pissed off at me for something I was doing or not doing, he'd let me know about it. And the same with him, except that I wasn't the most diplomatic guy in those days.

I always was threatening to hurt somebody. I see. I'm glad you're not that way anymore. I never did. I'm too old for that physical confrontation stuff. But after all those confrontations and the differences we had, we still love each other. At least I think he does. And I had to acknowledge his contribution to television.

Oh, yeah. We'll never see his like again. No, I don't think so. Because the medium has changed so much. The man was, the first time I ever saw anything he'd done, I was being managed at that time by the famous Amos, Wally Amos. Oh, Wally Amos. Famous Amos Cookies. So Wally called me and he said, hey, come on up to my office. I want to show you a tape of a show. And I did. And it was the pilot episode of All in the Family. And the only person that was still in, Sally Struthers wasn't in that pilot at the time. Oh, that's right. Different

pilot. I think Rob Reiner was there. Well, the first pilot didn't have Rob Reiner or Sally Struthers. Yeah, that's right. Neither of them were there. Right. But when the dialogue ensued, I fell on the floor laughing. But I said, there's no way they're going to let this get on the air, Norman. I mean, you know, I mean, Wally, because Norman wasn't there. And ultimately, of course, it did get on the air. And that was a change in my career when Norman called me and said he'd like me to come in and audition for the role. And when I read for the role, Esther Rolle was already cast as a wife. And when I got finished, she looked at Norman and said, he'll do just fine.

So I said, well, thank you. And I got the job. We will return to Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal podcast after this. And now back to the show. What had he seen you in that he decided that you should be? He had seen me in a play, a wonderful play that, ironically enough, was directed, I think it was directed by Carl Reiner. Oh, no, no, I take it back. It was a play called Norman Is That You.

Oh, sure. It was running at the Ebony Showcase Theater, a black theater in Los Angeles. But it was to fall down laughing. It was one of the funniest pieces I've ever been involved with. So the word got back to him. And he said, I heard you got a real funny thing going on stage there with that play. I'd like you to read for good times. And I did, and the rest is history, as they say.

They wound up making a movie out of Norman, is that you? Yes. It was Red Fox. Oh, that's right. That's right. Yes, that former podcast guest George Schlatter directed. Yeah. And I remember you saying the last time about your temper.

Yeah, that was my younger, tempestuous days. And you said something like, a couple of years of unemployment cured you of that. Yeah. There's nothing like the unemployment and the bills being due to make you get in line, so to speak. Well, you'd come from a violent sport in your own defense. I mean, you were a football player. Allegedly. Yeah.

It was never confirmed. After you get cut from the 13th team, you start looking for other things to do, you know? I'll tell you also something that happened since you were last here is we lost Mary. Oh. Mary Tyler Moore passed since the last time we we lost Mary. Oh. Mary Tyler Moore passed. Yes. Since the last time we had you on the show.

That was a shock. And it was, that hurt a little bit because that, she was, well, she was America's sweetheart. But what that show meant to me was, it was an incredible opportunity to just have a recurring role and to work with those people. I watch the reruns now and i still crack up when i see ted knight i mean the man was man he was magic if good but i don't know if you ever worked with somebody

that makes you crack up all the time it was hard to be around him and keep a straight face this guy had some he just had that comedic genius you know for that particular character. And I miss him. And it was a wonderful chemistry with Ted Knight, Mary, and, of course, Gavin McLeod as Murray. Oh, yeah. You know, but Lou Grant was like the anchor for the show. I'm hopeful that Lou and I are going to work together again soon. There's been some talk about a project. It won't be a series.

Oh, you and Ed are going to do something together, huh? Yeah, I said Lou. I meant Ed. Yeah, Ed Asner. He's been on this show with us. Yeah, and Ed was telling us on the show, like he had fights with Ted Knight and everything, but also, same thing, he said he just couldn't believe how funny he was in that character. It was tailor-made.

Nobody could ever do that character as well as he did, I don't think. Ed told us that that he and gavin would go sit and watch ted's performance right from a distance just as just to see and he loved it i mean ted loved it he got i think i shared with you the last time this guy was so into his character he got a letter a hate a hateful letter hate mail and said, you are the most obnoxious, the most conceited, arrogant. Why they put up with you in that newsroom, to her it was all real, you know. Why they put

up with you in that newsroom is beyond me. I would have fired you the first day. You're nothing. You're nothing. I hate you, Ted Knight. And he just came in, guys, guys, you won't believe this. This is beautiful. It was damn, it was better than the nomination. That's great.

Because people were buying it. They bought into it 100%. And you watch the shows now. Even in the reruns, it still holds up. It's a brilliant show. It really was. The chemistry was perfect. Well, the writing.

It all went back to the writing. Alan Burns and Jim Brooks. Of course, Jim went on to tremendous success. Won an Oscar. Won an Oscar. But the combination of the writing and the on-screen talent, it spoils you. You know, when I had the offer to do Good Times,

I was still involved with the Mary Tyler Moore show, and I wasn't sure that I wanted to leave that to do anything. But then they told me, well, there'll be an appreciable increase in salary. I said, I'm out. Well, you're one of the few actors that worked for arguably the two most prestigious television production companies of the decade, MTM and Tandem. Exactly. I was very fortunate. The timing could not have been better. It could not have been better.

And I said to our listeners last time, look up those episodes that you were in, Ted, the one where you co-host the show together, where Mary comes up with the idea of the two of you. It's just wonderful. And also the one where you make the triumphant return, and he's seething with jealousy. Ooh. Yeah. He could do jealousy better than anybody I've ever seen. Oh, you're so good in that episode.

When I told him how much money I was making with the New York job, it was unbelievable. Yeah. I really missed the guy. He was a real talent. He was that. Yeah. So tell us.

And Ted Knight, do you remember what, which episode of Twilight Zone he was on? I remember him in Psycho. Oh, I don't remember him in Psycho. He's in Psycho for about five minutes in the end. Really? Yeah.

Now you're going to make me watch Psycho. I'm not going to tell you who he plays. Just watch the last 20 minutes and you'll spot him. He's in the Twilight Zone episode starring another actor we both admire, Jack Warden. Oh, Jack Warden. Oh, Jack Warden. Oh, I know. Jack Warden is on another planet where they keep him prisoner.

I saw that one. I remember I saw that episode. And he's- Was that Twilight Zone or Outer Limits? Twilight Zone. Twilight Zone, okay. And they have a guy who's, I forget that actor's name, who's like the general who's in charge of everything. And one of the

soldiers behind the general was Ted Knight. That's cool. That's cool. Of course, I remember him narrating kid shows when I was, he used to do the superhero shows. Oh, wow. He used to do the Super Friends and DC Comics, Justice League cartoons.

He was big on that, narrating Aquaman. Ted was? Yeah, he narrated Aquaman cartoons. You know where he got that character from? There was a TV personality back in the days, early 60s, through the 60s, named George Putnam. George Putnam. And he put the C in conservative. Really? He was really over the top. This is George Putnam. And he put the C in conservative. Really?

He was really over the top. This is George Putnam. And then he'd go on. Whatever he had to say was the most important thing in the world. And when Ted was building his character, he said, that's the guy. So he fashioned it after George Putnam. I'd heard that Jack Cassidy's character on the Richard Benjamin show, he and she helped inspire the Ted Baxter character. Possibly.

Which I have to get to the bottom of. I had the pleasure of working with Jack Cassidy on Broadway. We did a short-lived play at the Royale Theater, and that was an education for me as to the realities of business. We opened in a play called Tough to Get Help directed by Carl Reiner opening night at the Royal Theater full house, I think it's 1400 seats couldn't get a seat to get in we got a standing ovation four curtain calls

and they canceled the show the same night like a fool, I come back to the theater the next night I was playing a much older character. I had a body pad and had to get grayed up and all that stuff. So I said to the old guy they call Pops, always sits on a milk crate reading the racing forms.

And he don't want to be bothered with nothing. So I said, you mind letting me in my dressing room? He said, for what? I said, I want to get dressed. I got a show. He said, kid, you ain't got to do a show tonight. I said, you mind letting me in my dressing room? He said, for what? I said, I want to get dressed. I got a show. He said, kid, you ain't got to do a show tonight. I said, why is that? He said, don't you read the papers?

Don't you know anything about reviews? I said, no. My first time on Broadway, what happened? He said, well, you're in for a little surprise. I'm saying, wow, we did so good. They're giving us the night off. Wow. Come to find wow, we did so good. They're giving us the night off. Wow. Come to find out, we got canceled.

I mean, they blew the – the critics came in. At that time, Clive Barnes. Oh, yeah. He was the deciding factor of your career on Broadway. And staying ovation at the Royal Theater, everybody in the theater was standing up except Clive Barnes and his crew. And he's sitting there with his arms folded across his chest like, I can't believe I'm watching this.

And sure enough, we got canceled. The power of the critics. At that time. At that time. Despite what the audience was feeling. Wow. I mean, one woman laughed so hard she wet herself. They had to help her up the aisle.

Wow. It was unbelievable, the laughs. I'd never heard laughs like that in a live theater before in my life. You and Jack Cassidy. Who else was in it? The late Lillian Heyman. She played my wife. Jack Cassidy, of course.

And Jack quit. He quit the show five days before we were scheduled to open, and they brought in another actor, Dick O'Neill. Oh, I know that actor. You know Dick O'Neill, Gilbert. I'll show him your picture. I'll show you his picture. He learned.

I've never seen such a tremendous job of retaining dialogue in my life. He retained all the script that Cassidy had been studying for a month or longer even, rehearsals and everything, he committed to the memory. No bug in his ear to feed him or anything. Unbelievable. Never dropped one line. It changed the timing and the dynamics of the piece, of course.

There's an appreciable difference between he and Jack Cassidy. But we did it and still got canceled. Showbiz. Showbiz. Tell us, sir, about your new project. Which is what's going on with you. It's a children's book. It's called A World Without Color.

And I got a wonderful couple of guys working with me on it. Actually, I'm working with them, and I'm honored to be working with Dennis Warburton is one of the writers, and I'm writing it along with him. And Lenny Kenyon is the artist. It's a children's book with animation, sort of. Hopefully, it'll turn into an animated series or there'll be an afterlife for it, but we think it's going to do very well in the schools, particularly with

the lack of diversity from the administration, the present administration coming down. I think the country needs something that brings kids together and particularly something that covers, you know, any type of insensitivity in regards to other people.

And it's a good book. I think it's a good story. Little kid comes across, discovers the fact that the whole world is gray. So the book has no color when it starts out. But as he meets different people and they establish a bond together, the world starts to brighten. You know, the sun comes up, the leaves are green, and he starts to see different colors. So the object lesson is obviously aimed at kids, that the better we treat each other, the brighter the world seems. And that's the message that we're going to be putting out there with this book, A World Without

Color. Yeah, your man Paul was nice enough to send us a PDF copy. Oh, you got it. We read it, and yeah, it's very touching, and it's a fun idea. Thank you. It's a fun idea because it's also a visual idea. Exactly. What made you want to write a children's book? Well, for myself, my own, if you look at my high school yearbook, and I can confirm this, I'll send you a picture of my graduation picture. You know how they put your picture in your high school yearbook?

Yeah, sure. Indicating what you want to do, Gilbert Gottfried. I want to become one of the funniest people in the world and talk bad about people. That would be... And get paid for it. And get paid for it. That would be in your yearbook.

So mine said two things that were in my dreams. John hopes to play pro football one day for the New York Giants. Ha! And the other was New York School for Cartoonists and Illustrators because that's what I wanted to do. I wanted to be a cartoonist.

I thought that was the best job in the world. And I ultimately did go on to become a cartoonist where I would come up with the concepts as well as some of the punchlines. And I had a wonderful artist by the name of Dennis McLean who would do the visuals. Incredible artist. So you might say that it's all come full circle for me. And then I'm back to what I wanted to do in the beginning as a child,

to be a cartoonist and illustrator. That's fun. That's funny. When I was a kid, I wanted to be a cartoonist for a while. And now look at you. You are a cartoonist. a while. Really? And now look at you. You are a cartoonist. He's played a few. You've voiced a few cartoons.

Oh, yeah. You should show John your illustrations sometime. Oh, yeah. Not a lot of people know about him. I'd love to see it, man. We cartoonists got to stick together. Oh, that's right. And he also wrote a comic book. I'll be damned. What was the comic book? I wrote, and I wish I you know, like the schmuck I am, I should have, like, collected, like, a thousand copies of it.

Yeah. I wrote a copy of Superman. So DC Comics let him write an issue of Superman. You wrote a Superman story? Yeah. And they published it? Yeah. Good, but you got to, I got to make a copy of it.

Xerox, I got to see that. We'll get you one, John. Please, please. I'm going to hold you to that, man. Okay. I definitely will. I'll make sure we get you one. Got to be a collector's item.

So it's called A World Without Color. A World Without Color. And when do we have, do we have any kind of a due date? Yeah, we can anticipate the book being released September 19th. September 19th. Wonderful. Not too far down the road. Great.

And the hope is to turn it into an animated series? I think the book will be successful and then anything that follows will be contingent upon the success of the book. Well, it's a very sweet idea and a very original idea. Thank you. And I have to tell you, last time you were here, you were wobbling in with your foot in a brace. Because I'd had Achilles tendon surgery. And then shortly after that, both Frank and I

were wandering around with these large boots. Shortly after you left, we both broke. I broke my foot, and he broke his ankle. I broke my ankle just getting up out of a chair. It was like you stepped. Oh, you're a real athlete. You just couldn't. I was going to go out of the chair.

It was a low chair. I couldn't believe that. You broke your ankle stepping off a curb. Achilles tendon. He tore his Achilles tendon. Yeah. I broke mine running for a bus, which is embarrassing. I broke mine standing up.

So there you go, John. And now look at the three of us. Yeah, the three of us. Cast free. Cast free. We'll be dead in another hour. Probably. John, thanks for coming back.

We'll get the word out about the book. Before you go, if you can, and remember, gravelly and black, can you... Don't do it Swedish. Florida's line after she smashes the ball When you've got killed

In a car crash In good times Something to the effect of Damn, damn, damn Oh it's so good It's like Esther is back with us Thank you Gilbert John you're good. It's like Esther is back with us. Thank you, Gilbert. John, you're the best sport in the world.

We will get the word out about the book. Good deal. What's the name of the book again? It is A World Without Color. Okay. And you're going to send John your damn Superman comic. Oh, I definitely will. Okay.

This has been Gilbert and Frank's amazing colossal obsessions. And we've had a return guest today, John Amos, who is best known for this line. Damn, damn, damn. Thank you, John Amos. John, God bless you. Thank you, gentlemen. We'll see you again, pal. We'll see you again, pal. We'll see you again.

Colossal Obsessions.