Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast - "TV Funhouse" Turns 25 (Part Two) w/ Robert Smigel and Dan Pasternack

Episode Date: August 19, 2025

In this conclusion of a two-part episode, Frank and guest co-host Dan Pasternack talk to Emmy-winning writer-actor-director Robert Smigel about his lifelong obsession with Charles Schulz and Peanuts, his preference for "specific" comedy, his working relationship with Lorne Michaels and his unusual friendship with Blackwolf the Dragonmaster. Also, Triumph debates Carl Bernstein, Jesus meets Kathie Lee Gifford, Mr. T auditions for "A Doll's House" and Robert stresses the importance of "embracing oddballs." PLUS: Anne Beatts! Shel Silverstein! The brilliance of Darlene Love! Paul Simon weighs in! Robert turns into Ed Grimley! And Frank and Dan praise the inventiveness of "Leo"! Subscribe now on  Apple ⁠⁠⁠https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/fun-for-all-ages-with-frank-santopadre/id1824012922⁠⁠⁠ Spotify ⁠⁠⁠https://open.spotify.com/show/18EQJNDwlYMUSh2uXD6Mu6?si=97966f6f8c474bc9⁠⁠⁠ Amazon ⁠⁠⁠https://music.amazon.com/podcasts/13b5ed88-d28d-4f0c-a65e-8b32eecd80f6/fun-for-all-ages-with-frank-santopadre⁠⁠⁠ YouTube ⁠⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLgvlbF41NLLPvsrcZ9XIsYKkH_HvUXHSG⁠⁠⁠ iHeart ⁠⁠⁠https://www.iheart.com/podcast/269-fun-for-all-ages-with-fran-283612643/⁠⁠⁠ TuneIn ⁠⁠⁠http://tun.in/pxOWO Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey, kids, it's your old pal, Frank Santepadre, comedy writer, pop culture obsessive, and that guy who had the honor of sitting across from the late Great Gilbert for nearly a decade. That's the guy. We had an incredible time bringing you guys over 600 episodes celebrating classic entertainment, forgotten Hollywood, and the wonderful personalities who made it all happen. After three years away from the mic, I'm thrilled to introduce my own podcast, Fun for All Ages, with Frank Santo Padre. Fun for All Ages builds on the spirit of Amazing Colossal,

but we're not just interviewing celebrities about their story careers. We're diving deep into their own passions, treasures, and obsessions from the 60s, 70s, and 80s, all the way through today. We're talking movies, TV, music, comedy, toys, and collectibles. Basically, if it made us laugh, cry, or geek out, we're going in. So expect funny, freewheeling conversations with icons, experts, superfans, and the creative minds who help shape the entertainment we love. Plus panel episodes, live shows, and surprises galore. If you're a fan

of the Amazing Colossal podcast, you'll feel right at home. And if you knew, well, welcome to the club. I promise you'll enjoy the ride. So join me, Frank Santopadre, this summer for fun for all ages. Find us on all streaming platforms and use the link in the description to subscribe and never miss an episode. Frank here inviting you guys to join the official Fun for All Ages Patreon page. Why? Well, studio time isn't free, podcast hosting costs money, and you're not just supporting your new favorite podcast. You're helping to preserve Western civilization, probably.

We'll start with one single tier for just $5 monthly, so for the cost of a cup of coffee a month, you can keep a struggling host off the streets and in the studio where, let's face it, I belong. Think of it as joining the fan club you always wanted to join as a kid, but instead of a decoder ring, you're getting a logo sticker and a personalized note from me, and on-air thank you by name, and the opportunity to submit a question for our illustrious guest or panel. And you'll also get the warm, fuzzy feeling of knowing you're keeping the laughs and the content coming. And, hey, if you enjoy the content but you don't want to support it, listen, that's fine too. I'll just be over here, creating in the dark, alone with nothing but ambival.

ambition and crippling debt. So join us. Support the show on Patreon, and remember, if laughter is the best medicine, then this podcast is a walk-in clinic with a low $5 copay. So, guys, as you figured out by now, this is part two of our two-part interview

with the great and funny and always candid, Robert Smigel. We're picking things up right around the midpoint in what was a three-hour conversation. We cover a lot here, TV Funhouse shorts, Robert's admiration for Charles Schultz, and Darlene loved his feelings about S&L anniversary shows, and we talk about his writing and co-directing work on the animated hit, Leo, and so much more. So enjoy this part two as Dan Pasternak and I talk to the hilarious Roberts Michael. The ambiguously gay duo, the ambiguously gay duo. They are taking on evil come up may.

They are fighting all crime to save the day. They're extremely close in an ambiguous way. They're ambiguously gay. They're ambiguously gay. The ambiguously gay duo. The ambiguously gay duo. Here's another fun question from Doug Anderson. I was thinking about the triumph in Jack McBrayer segments, I guess he made a series,

and had just heard Alexander Scars Guard mention on Mark Maren's podcast that he's good friends with Jack because of a play they were in. and I thought that was odd that they were pals Maron did too so long story who is Robert's oddest celebrity pal that has even

his family and friends wondering how he's pals with them it's an interesting question maybe it's Hal Pichino it was probably Black Wolf the Dragon Master Does he count as a celebrity

Oliver Shulam exactly I kind of made him a celebrity a semi-celebrity Can you explain to people who Black Wolf the Dragon Master was Richard Washington

who was a guy who lived in East. He passed on? Yes. Oh, I'm sorry. He lived in East Harlem. But discovered in probably the greatest triumph remote ever. The most famous triumph mode ever. And what's beautiful is that we meet on camera. Like I spot him

from a distance and I put the camera on him and then I started talking about there. Look at the nerd of the rings over there because he was dressed like a wizard with a white beard. And eating a filet of fish in. Right. Well, then I start deconstructing, you know, I'm doing, I'm picking, picking it apart. And, yes, you enjoy your fillet of fish. And then off camera he corrects me, it's a McChicken. He talked in this very affected voice. And then we did this bit where I made fun of Star Wars people, but I never forgot him. And then, like a few years later, I had him join. me at

at the uh now it wasn't even a few years later it was like later that year i went back to the uh vmAs and on the red carpet i had black wolf with me i wanted to do something different i had done it the year before so this time i brought black wolf and i don't even remember what we did with him but then a year later i wrote a comedy album called come poop with me with a bunch of original songs and i wrote a song for richard called black wolf the dragon master and it's maybe the best song on the album. I'd love to get a signed copy of that. Yeah, that's, okay.

I'll ask people. I'll ask my people to see if they can arrange that. Richard Washington. And so, anyway, in order to get Richard to do the comedy album, I had to get his number from the Conan people. So I called him directly, and I'm like, okay, I'm doing this. I'm calling this freaky guy. and he's going to have my number forever.

He's going to have my number forever now. No pay phones, no stage. But it ended up being a huge gift because I love the guy. He was, he was, you know, an oddball, for sure. He loved to dress up as this wizard character and go to Washington Square Park and Irving Place and just roam around. He was an incredible gentle soul, and he loved, you know, he used to just love to encourage kids. to use their imagination and and he he would leave me voice messages. So the funniest thing about him was that he had an obsession with pop culture and wizardry.

So he maintained the character of a 4,000-year-old wizard. But he would leave me messages about shit that was happening, you know, with award shows. He would call up, hello, fresh hound. I got to the point where I wouldn't pick up the phone because I wanted him to leave a message. Because those messages were like gold. I love it. I treasured them. I love it.

Hello, fresh hound. Well, well, word has it that Pierre Cosette is finally stepping down as producer of the Grammy Awards. I love it. I fear no one can fill the grand Cosette's shoes. Anyway More later Anon I sounds like

Jonathan Harris From Lost in Space Years later I attended the taping Of one of your Hulu election specials Oh well I used Richard every episode I remember him sitting at the table

With Barney Frank Yeah When I did the Hulu show I never I never I used Richard many times after that but for the Hulu show

I did this show where I was covering the political the presidential election of 2016. I got into it because Trump got into it and I figured okay the bar is low enough now that triumph is appropriately a political commentator

and I thought it would be really funny. I did a lot of remotes. I covered Iowa and New Hampshire and but in between the remotes I had a roundtable There's a political roundtable where triumph was the moderator like John McLaughlin or somebody

Tim Russard and I got real political pundits or people in politics like Barney Frank and Alan Dershowitz did it and Jesus man

fucking Carl Bernstein did an episode and Black Wolf was always on the panel too That's fantastic Sometimes sitting next to one of these people, sometimes fucking forgetting to take a bath that day and reeking because he had this really old costume that he never washed. And I would just, the only thing I ever asked him was just take a bath today.

It's a shoot day, so take a shower. And that was it. But otherwise, he would come in and he would just, and he would, he would offer his opinion. I would just, you know, okay, we got Carl, Bernstein, thank you. What about you, Black Wolf? What do you think? And sometimes they would, you know, triumphs questions would be accompanied by an insult. But Black Wolf would be right there with a bizarre retort. And if I can plug something for Robert. Please, too. I just want to say, so Robert has done this show live a number of times, come poop with me. And you mean, let's make a poop. Let's make a poop. Sorry. Yes. Yeah. And, yeah. So, Robert, so Robert, Robert. has done the show

Let's Make a Poop live a couple of times I think it's Sketchfest and some other places Lawrence O'Donnell on one of those Yeah New York Comedy Festival The first time I did I'd like to go back there actually

I did it with Lawrence and Pete Davidson Right But there's one version that you shot That people can see And it's online Oh there's you can see

All of them Or a few of them But there's one that you end With this beautiful video That's right Of Black Wolf Yeah And it's

It's surprisingly emotional. I mean, it's amazing. It's really... It made me emotional when he was alive. Like, I discovered it in, like, 2015, and I posted it back then, and nobody cared. But it really struck me back then. It's so beautifully articulated, and it's just a plea for people to embrace oddballs. You know, champions of the imagination is how he...

called them and and whoever directed it attached uh the music under it is the song creep but not the not the radio head version it's the chorale version exactly and it and it works so beautifully and it touched me so much um when i saw it and then when he passed away which i was very upset about because i had really he was somebody that i i'm kind of a recluse in a lot of ways and And I don't talk to many people. And so I don't call many people. And Black Wolf would call me all the time. So he became like a person that I ended up speaking to more than a lot of other people.

And, you know, so it hit me really hard when he passed away. And I thought about putting – and he had been my sidekick on the very first, let's make a poop. my announcer. I intended to have him be my permanent announcer but before Michael Winslow. Yeah, Michael Winslow is awesome by the way. He does it in San Francisco and he's hilarious

and but I played this thing and everybody, yeah, I got a lot of comments on it from audience members because it's so unexpected. Yeah, it's totally unexpected and I broke character and just talked as myself, I put

Triumph away and just talked about Richard, because he had just passed away like a year ago at that point. And, yeah, anybody, if you look it up, he does a tribute to this artist called, I'm sure you know who Moondog is. Sure. So Moondog, when I was a little kid, he would play in Midtown Manhattan.

He was this guy who wore a Viking helmet and had a weird beard and a scowl on his face. And a lot of times he wasn't even playing music. He was just scary guy that was just a staple of Midtown Manhattan. Yeah, he was a New York character. Yeah. Yeah. But totally misunderstood by kids like me and probably many other people.

So the whole thing starts with this beautiful explanation of Moondog's life and revealing that Moondog was a very talented musician and they ended up moving to Germany where people were cooler with him. And he fell in love with this woman and continued to make music. This guy who just everybody thought was this oddball on the corner of 53rd and 6th. But of course he's talking about himself, too. No, that's the point. Yeah. That's the point. He's using this guy as an example of, to show people that you've got to look beyond the surface, you know, even though Triumph didn't.

But that's triumph's job. Sure, of course. But, you know, at the same time, I knew how smart Richard was. And I, you know, I was very grateful that I had the opportunity to give him a chance to, you know, a chance to. express himself in different ways even though you know triumph's always making fun of him he got to if you listen to the album come poop with me he's fucking great on his song and he had a sense of humor about himself and he we'll play it actually i'll put it in oh black wolf's dragon master i'll put the song in here right right here are there any phantom menace nerds in the house

some idiots keep saying triumph well i have some news for for you. There is a Phantom Manist nerd in the house. The ultimate nerd. Play him on, fellas. It's unbelievable that he's here, the one and only nerd of the rings himself. Blackwood! The Dragon Master! What's going on, Blackwood? Ah, there you are, you fresh owl. Let's do this! He's got a song? Five, six, seven, eight. Enter my talk. Enter my dark chambers if I would stare.

The wisdom of the multiverse I keep in my lair. I shall regal you with legends of warriors and elves. Then you'll go home and he'll play with himself. Oh, honestly. Keep singing. Because I'm Black Wolf. Yes, the Dragon Master Black Wolf. That most almighty sage, Blackworth.

So many beasts have I slayed. I'm 4,000 years old. And he's never been laid. Oh, now, just a moment, shy. I'm not all that, not, eh? Nexus, please. Oh, I can school you with the ancient craft of the mage. At the Renaissance, fair, tis all the age.

Yes, my sorcery is well known throughout the lark. Yes, he can make his dick grow with just one hand. It's nice. You went out into the field with some comedy writers who do a bit, and you made a friendship. Yeah. So that was a nice surprise. Yeah, it was, you know, and some people looked really down on him, even for years later, like whether it was panelists or we did one segment on that triumph show where the celebrity,

I had warned the celebrity that I was going to have Black Wolf join. And then when he finally did, the celebrity was, like, disgusted by him and wanted him out. And he did this right in front of Richard. and it really upset me. And I ended up taking Richard to dinner with all the writers after the show wrapped just to let him know that nobody, you know, everybody loves him.

And so anyway, yeah, so it makes me really happy when people look at that video because he had a lot, he had a lot going on. Sounds like you did something nice for him. You added a dimension to his life, which is a nice thing. My takeaway, by the way, from this interview is going to be Black Wolf, the wizard calling you and saying Pierre Cosette. I mean... The fact that he knew who Pierre Cosette...

Oh, my God, he knew everything. He knew so much more than I did about... Makes my day. Pop culture minutia. Hey, we'll return to fun for all ages after this brief intervention. Hey, it's Frank again, and as we've done every week, we'd like to read little thank yous and shoutouts to our generous Patreon supporters, and this week is no different. So here we go.

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So we thank you guys from the bottom of our hearts. And now, back to the fun. I got to ask you, before we get on to, I've got to ask you, because Dan brought up Schultz. And I know he's an influence on you that your dad in 1967 is very sweet, brought you a paperback. Here comes Snoopy. Those Fawcett, those old Fawcett paperbacks, man, I had a collection of those things. They influenced so many comedy writers. I'm sure.

You know, and I've, on the old show, and I was telling Dan, we did 600 interviews. More than a few writers, comedy people were interviews influenced by Schultz. Yourself included, obviously. And there's that great TV Funhouse short where Jesus comes back. Oh, that one, yeah. The Christmas one. Right. And I hadn't seen it in years and saw it again.

And I realized, I said, oh, he's a Schultz person. Oh, yeah. I even drew. I replaced my credit with a happy birthday, Charles Schultz, because I did it. It coincided with his 75th birthday. So I drew a picture of Snoopy on his doghouse, but all decked out with Christmas crap like it was in that special. Yeah, that was a big thing. I wanted to be a cartoonist when I was real little.

I was going to ask you about that. Yeah. that's the first thing I could do well was draw like Fred Flintstone when I was like five years old and then Peanuts characters when I was seven and that became my obsession really was drawing cartoons me too I was going to be I wanted to be a cartoonist and even went to SVA for it really

you took it a lot further yeah yeah and then I moved on to like impressions of my friends and making up songs about my friends And just, yeah, I hit a wall with that. It's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, and, and Jesus comes back and, and, and, and walks in on Robert Schuller. Right. And Pat Robertson.

Yeah, oh, that's right. Yeah. Multiple evangelists. He's, he's, he's, he's, he's, he's, Kathy Lee Giffittford's Christmas special, and, and, and he winds up looking through a, a window, a hardware store, or electronic store selling TVs, and, and, and he sees, like, he's, he's, Reverend Dyke selling oil and shit and a bad happy days Christmas episode yeah and finally he lands on Linus's closing speech of a Charlie Brown Christmas and and you thought you were playing it for for poignancy and a laugh poignancy but I thought when they cut to Jesus is with a little smile

and a little tear in his eye I thought people would laugh because just the juxtaposition of Jesus being choked up by any cartoon would be funny. But no, no laughs. It was just everybody was as touched as Jesus. Because it's one of the most special moments in the history of television.

Absolutely. And I'm saying that as a Jewish person, but just everybody can relate to the idea of losing sight of what's important. Well, by the way, again, It's very reminiscent of, you know, what Lenny Bruce had said about, you know, if Jesus came back and, you know, and also another Jew commenting on sort of the state of religion and sort of the purity of the intentions of the scripture. Yeah, and now people talk about it the same way. Like, Jesus would be horrified by evangelicals who support, you know, deporting people and, you know, cutting taxes and, and, and, and, and, and. and health benefits.

I don't think that cartoon's ever going to date. I think it's yours. That one with where he's watching Linus and his eyes well. I mean, Jesus will still be big in 10 years, right? Yeah, it's timeless. It's timeless. We had, Gilbert and I did a tribute to a Charlie Brown Christmas on the old show, and we called, we happened to speak to Craig Schultz.

Oh, yeah. And he got teary-eyed talking about sneaking into his dad's office and watching him work. When he was a kid, I'll send it to you. I got to meet Jeannie Schultz and my boys too. They loved Charlie Brown Christmas and one of them was really obsessed with Peanuts as a kid. So I took them to the Peanuts Museum and I had met Jeannie Schultz at a Comic-Con. So she brought us to Charles Schultz's original office. How nice.

It's really cool. Yeah. That's sweet. What a nice thing. Yeah, it was amazing. You're Peanuts guy too? You must have been. Oh, yeah, of course.

Everybody loved, but I was just obsessed. I was like But also here's the thing is like if you're a slightly weird maybe

inappropriately emotional kid it kind of gave you permission to sort of have those feelings

right? Well as Robert said in an interview it's the first comic strip that made you that made you

realize life isn't perfect and life isn't perfect and life is complicated and what depression was and what longing

was anxiety An anxiety. But pathos, it really is, it's your, it's sort of the, the shallow end of entering the pathos pool. But shallow in the best way, meaning that he had a very light touch. It wasn't exploitive, it wasn't mottling, it wasn't mushy, it just examined it from a funny kind of detached viewpoint almost. But there's such depth in those, in those strips and of those books, especially when he was peaking, especially when he was on his game. I mean, I became one later in life.

Like, I read, I read all his poems to my kids a lot of times at bedtime. I loved his poems. But when I was younger, I didn't, I wasn't that familiar with his stuff. One of my favorite quotes is from Shell Silverstein, though, he said, because I always do these projects that 20 years later, there's like a roundtable on, you know, at the bell house and like, it was before it's time, that kind of stuff. So annoying that he said, he said, you want to be a little bit ahead of your time. You don't want to be too far ahead of your time.

You'll get nowhere. But you just want to be just a little bit ahead of your time and then everybody will catch up to you. Good advice. Yeah, I never, never figured that out. He wrote some fun songs too, boy named Sue and the cover of Rolling Stone and some things like that. And for fan of graphics, you did a, you wrote an introduction to a Peanuts collection. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I enjoyed reading that. Thanks. That was... I thought you nailed it.

Yeah, I can't remember. I said that Charlie Brown was a hopaholic. And, but you know, in retrospect, I've thought about Charlie Brown, and I wonder if he was... I don't know, maybe I'm a little harder on people nowadays, but he's kind of a narcissist. He's so obsessed with what everyone is thinking about him all the time.

Interesting. Like there's something about being that self-conscious that, like, I've just learned because I have bouts with feeling self-conscious. And then I'm like, it's not about you. Nobody gives a fuck about you this much. Just relax, you know. And there is a little bit of, I've just noticed, it just feels like to be self, that self-conscious is also to be a bit self-obsessed. Yeah, a very interesting take, and yet he portrayed Snoopy as the self-involved character. Well, he was in a very playful way, but also in a way that, in a way, he was less of a narcissist because he was just enjoying life and not giving a shit.

And he also, you know, clearly indulged in fantasy in a kind of a totally unapologetic way. Oh, Snoopy. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. All the Red Barron stuff is. Yeah, he didn't give a shit what anybody thought. thought. Charlie Brown, when I called him a hopaholic in that article, in that introduction,

what I meant was I was actually trying to debunk something that has become this really annoying cliche that I hear about Charlie Brown, which is that it's a real Horatio Alger story. No matter how many times Lucy snatches away that football, Charlie Brown's going to keep on trying. And I, in my mind, it was like he's a hopaholic. He just can't let go. of something that is never going to happen. But he loves the dream so much that he, like he, he's never going to kick that football. Somebody should tell him.

And move on to the next thing that he has a hope for. Did you ever get any feedback from any of these famous animators or these people that you were sending up? Like we talked about Luce Shimer and Filmation. You obviously, or even, or even, Sidcroft. Sidcroft talks to a lot of people. Sidcroft's around. He's like 93 or something.

He's like 93 and yeah, he sent a couple of nice... Nice man. We had him on the old show. Oh, yeah? Yeah. But that's it. Jules Bass never got in touch or... No, no, never really got to hear from any of the Jews.

...that we've parodied in terms of animation style that I can remember. Too bad. Yeah. They should have reached out. Yeah. The, the... You know who I did speak to? The daughter of the lady who, uh,

whose dad created Synchrovox, which became Clutch Cargo. Oh, that's interesting. Yeah. She reached out at one point. I think I had talked about it on Howard Stern, and then she emailed me. How did you get, and I, Dan and I were talking about this on the phone, one of the things that's so great about these is the specificity, and we know the importance of specificity in comedy.

Absolutely. But when you're watching ambiguously gay duo, it could be a film. animation cartoon. The way Ted Knight would voice the villains. Yeah. Or those other actors, I can't. There's not any Norman Alden, I think, did a lot of them. The whole point is like you've got to get it as close as possible so that all the jokes play.

Like, there's no humor in bending it at all. All the humor is in capturing it and then having them do something. I love about that. Presidents playing together as a band with the exact Archie's poses. Yeah, they were. That's right. Yeah, the piano, Jimmy Carter on the organ, or no, Jimmy Carter on the tambourine. And, yes, he copied Betty's moves exactly. Is that JJ in those days?

J.J. did the original ones, yes. Robert Marionetti and David Wachtenheim did them for like 12 years. Props to all those guys for executing your vision. When I met those guys, it was like love at first sight. The lights went on, huh? Yeah, because I'm so nerdy about the details. Like you said, it's so important to nail it. Or it doesn't work.

I mean, it doesn't work as, it doesn't really work as, it might work as satire, but it doesn't really pay off as parody. No, not with the cartoons and not with, what the hell, not with Look Well, you know, like Look Well, we didn't want any, don't bend the joke, just make it look exactly like, you know, an episode of Mod Squad or whatever the hell, you know, that's why something like police squad is so much fun yeah totally deadpan make it real deadpan yeah um so you met those guys and it was it was career changing or life

because because it's saturday night live and they there's a million brilliant people at saturday night live but a lot of times the young writers would get a lot of shit for being sticklers about details you know because these guys have been at s and l for like 30 years or whatever at that time at that point it was only like 15 or 20 years but might as well have been 40 you know and they're like what it's not going to make a fucking difference what are you fucking giving us this and but people in animation they're all about details that's good to hear yeah people in animation at least the you know if you get find the right people that was the great thing about you doing those cartoons is you kind of went off on your own and just delivered them finished right

Yes. It was, you know, I had had eight years of being a staff writer at S&L, and that's a lot for anybody in terms of dealing with office politics. I mean, it's a great show. It's still a great show, but it's inherently designed for people to be pitted against each other, and it creates a lot of stress. And some of it's rational and some of it's irrational. But when I got to do the cartoons, I wasn't part of that world at all. I would just show up on Saturday, dress, rehearsal with my cartoon and Lauren Michaels, by the second year, he didn't even want to know what the cartoon was. He's, I like to be surprised. Okay, so can I prompt you for my favorite story about one of the cartoons? Sure. Please tell the story about the one you made for the 25th anniversary special. Oh, God. Oh, which I just watched. It's so good. Right? It's brilliant. You mean where where he sings and all that? Well, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Where Lauren's, we're talking about the same one where Lord's got the device in his pocket. Oh, yeah. Is that shocking people to give him a standing ovation? Yeah, yeah. it's so funny so I

this is like the cartoons were at the height of their popularity so you know they they asked me to do a cartoon for the 25th anniversary show and I was thrilled to be a part of it that way and

but my instinct is always to be irreverent we called it on the phone last night biting the hand that feeds you yeah biting the hand that I that it's really in this case it's it was it's almost anti-reverent like I just and I had

worked on the 15th anniversary one as a staff writer and I to be honest I was not I found it kind of irritatingly self-congratulatory yeah it had the feel of an award show just podiums and introduction and banter and and clip packages and tuxedos and And Chevy, you're too old to fall, you know, and just like adorable. And everything that show is not. Everything the show in my mind shouldn't be. Right. And that's always something that I've pushed against because I grew up with the 70s version.

And I grew up a 70s, 60s kid, you know, where my camp counselors were buttons that said question authority. and I lived on Broadway and I watched hippies march against Vietnam on moratorium day and these were my like role models this is what I aspired to

and you know Nixon being disgraced everything it was all happening and then Saturday Night Live in 1975 and the show was very rebellious back then we're about the same age and it was a breath

of fresh air. There was nothing like it in the history of comedy and television. And not only that, but to grow up in New York and experience that. New York show. Because what's his name? What's his name? Greatest TV personality ever practically. Johnny Carson had deserted New York.

In 72. Yeah. And I was only 12, but I was already like such a TV nerd that I was like, no! Johnny Carson's leaving? And because I had, I was already way into like a New York L.A. rivalry at the time. And New York was... Like most 14-year-olds are.

Oh, yeah. No, this is 12. This is all already 12. I also was obsessed with Nielsen ratings when I was like 12. I was like, where can I find... Why do I only... Why does TV guide only show the top 10? Why can't I see the top 100? That was great.

I was weird. I collected TV guides. Getting excited by reading Cleveland Amory's reviews. Oh, God. I collected TV guides for like 20 years. It's not good. Me too, by the way. Really?

Me too. Wow. Everybody thought I was absolutely bananas. I could, like, literally for almost 30 years. Like, I quit in the early 90s. We'd have made good friends as kids. Yeah. I mean, you know how, like, Steve Martin is, like, waiting for the phone book and the jerk?

New phone books here. That's how I was waiting for the TV guy. So I could, like, sit and circle. I didn't have a subscription. I would just go to the, you know, New Yorker bookshop across the street. Gilbert, too, would circle the things that he wanted to watch. Oh, really? get really depressed because in those days, if you missed it, it was done.

That's true. That's it. One and done. One and done. But what was my point? Oh, Saturday Night Live. So this was like Ford to New York drop dead time in the city. Sure.

And so to kids growing up in New York for the show, for the coolest show on television to be coming out of New York City and to have that montage at the beginning of New York City and to hear the cat phrase be live from New York, it made a, you know. huge difference for me like and then then Woody Allen his renaissance celebrating New York by then you know that was like the icing on the cake but the fun never stops occasionally we pause for a word from our sponsor hey everybody Frank here Remember the British invasion? You know you do. When the U.S. went crazy for the music, the fashions, the spy films, and the sports cars from the UK, and the coolest cats in Hollywood rode stylish, fast British motorbikes, well, the good news is that timeless style never really left. Just found a new home. British Motorcyclegear.com based right here in New Jersey offers motorcyclists

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That's Britishmotorcyclegear.com. And now back to the fun. All right, so get to the cartoon for the 25th anniversary. Yeah, I don't even know why we got to... Well, because you were talking about the kind of spirit that you were trying to bring to the show. Yes, the rebellious spirit of the original writers. The anti-authoritarian...

Michael O'Donnie Hu, Michael O'Donoh, and Al Franken and Tom Davis, and Ann Beetz, you know. I've talked to Zweibel about that, that they used to do those kinds of sketches, like ex-police. Yeah. They used to do subversive, anti-establishment. You know, and I did a lot of that stuff in my years there, but I was not the norm. I was like, oh, he's dark and, you know, but Ann Beetz once said you would have fit in great. Oh, what a compliment. which was like, yes.

What a compliment. That meant so much to me. And then, but anyway, so yes. So here we are, 1999, and now I want to, I'm assuming cynically that the show is going to be just as shitty as the one that I didn't like in 1989, the 15th. It's going to be another pretentious circle jerk. Sorry, that's how I felt about the 15th. So I wrote a sketch. it was all about Lorne Michaels coming out with a tuxedo and acting like, you know, very pompous

and just talking about the history of the show and cutting to a plea standby because he loves to talk about the history of the show. And that was the first, like, real slap in the face that I can't believe I did. You know, this is like... And by the, your voice. the animated Lauren. Yeah, and let me say something else. Like, between the time that I wrote this and the time that it aired, my son was diagnosed

with autism. So my life really changed from after the point that I had written it. Like, I felt so much more vulnerable. Oh, wow. Oh, interesting. And that would affect the way I approached the rest of my career. Like, I never... I didn't know that piece of the timeline.

Robert. Well, I never, for the last 25 years, I've never had the same, fuck everything approach that I did before, especially like four or five years into my son's situation, because it got very difficult, and I've got to realize how much, how many resources he was going to need. And this is not a complaint in any regard. He's the best thing that ever happened to my family and me. and I love him but he but he he needs a lot of support and so I became I you know I became much more worried about like making money and doing what my family needed to do and less about like I'm just going to say and do whatever the fuck I want it's having said that it's amazing that I've been able to do a lot of the things I've done anyway with triumph and whatnot in those years I've gotten

away with more than I thought I could, but I've also written, like, Hotel Transylvania, which I'm very proud of. I think it's really good, but not, not my dream in 1999. Anyway, so I don't know that I would have, my point being, I don't know that I would have ever written what I wrote, like, even five years later. But this, I went, I went all in. So, Lauren, like, I have him. He's hawking murder. He's harking merchandise. That's right.

And he's, and then he's answering a question, Dear Lorne, you're a genius. Thank you. And then he, tell me about who decides how to, you know, who sits where in the show? And then he talks about that. And that turns into a patter song, which I always wanted to write a patter song for Lauren

because his rhythm as he speaks is a little like a patter song. when you impersonate him a certain way. So I wrote a patter song all about him just drinking in the privilege of getting to decide who sits where. And you know how, if you've ever been to an awards show the day before in rehearsal, there's all these cards on every seat telling you which celebrity is going to be in which seat.

So he's dancing around and placing cards here. Let's put Gwyneth in the front. And, you know, I can't even remember the poem. There was one, I know there was a whole section where it's like he tosses a bunch of cards and it spells out Ebersol people. And they're like in the very back row. On the seasons he'd like to forget. Yeah, yeah. And then there was one line about, you know, I can't even remember their names.

Blah, blah, blah. And Gary Kroger can sit in the, fuck. 13 rows behind Eddie Murphy and his cat and then it ends up with Lauren in a in a glitzy kind of Liza Minnelli outfit with a top hat because it's

boom my boom boom boom boom boom boom and then it turns into him holding the note and revealing that John Lovitz is doing the Bugs Bunny character what's opera doc no no no wasn't it that's very overrated by the way what the great one is long haired hair hair long haired hair long haired hair you're right where he fucks with the opera singer who didn't want him

playing the banjo and and then we reveal that it's john lovitt's doing it and um and loren everything that happens to the opera singer happens to Lauren he's like pounding on the ground trying to hold the note and his underpants his pants his pants fall off because he's just bursting all his clothes are people can see it it's online is it on it's i think it's only on my instagram page i think it's on i think i saw it on youtube last night really yeah because maybe they added it but i unless i'm talking about the wrong one unless i'm talking about the life of a catchphrase is on youtube which is the one where he's doing the uh where he's got the electronic device and he's making people i think that's in that that's in that's in that one

he keeps the applause sign on and standing sitting or and he gets adam samler and mike myers to grab them. Yes. Yeah, that's in the anniversary one, but that was on my Instagram page. Okay. I don't know. I think that's the only place you can see it. All right, we'll find out. Triumph, I-C-D-H-Q. We'll find out after we turn the mics off. Yeah, I guess so. But

anyway, you present this to him? I presented to Marcy Klein and Mike Shoemaker, the producers, and one of them says, oh, you can't do the part where he sings and dances. That's just way too much. And the other one says, no, I like the part where he sings and dance. You can't do the part where he hawks merchandise that's degrading and i was like huh you know what let's just write it all

and produce it all and then we'll see because it was like a perfect storm for me like they absolutely were split on both of them so i was like the only solution is to write it all and produce it all and so i did and then when i did they kind of liked it and then And then, oh, and actually, and John Lovitz was so excited about it that he was playing it before the show for like Paul Schaefer and Lorraine Newman because he was in it, so he was so excited. And Paul Schaefer, they're laughing, their asses off. So I was really psyched.

And then this is still about an hour before the show. Lauren wants to see you in his office. Yeah, Robert. Hi. Look, Paul Simon's in the office with him. Nobody else. Tosses out the assistant. It's just, I'm too close to it.

So Paul's going to look at it. We're just going to watch it right now. Now, by the way, I believe Paul Simon is animated in the piece as well, right? There's like a desiccated. Yes. Yes. There's one more section in there. Yeah, so Paul Simon is sitting through this thing.

Totally stone-faced. watching the SSN got guts watching Lauren talk about this stuff

and and then yes there is a section in the middle that I forgot to mention

where it's and now here's a clip from the 45th anniversary show and it's

all Simon C's still crazy first it's Mike Myers and Dana Carvey and they're both fat and

kind of old and they're going swing like really slow motion and stuff and so what's insane

is that on the 40th Mike and Dana did do Wayne's world on the 40th. And then there's a clip of Paul Simon singing still crazy after all these years. And he's practically like his head is like

a skeleton with a fucking black toupee. Right. And Paul Simon's right there, right to my left. So he and Lord are watching this in front of you. They're watching this in front of me. Oh, God. Two of my heroes. Oh, God.

Two of my heroes. So I always say, like, if 14-year-old Robert had known watching Saturday Night Live that 25 years later that he'd be in a room, he'd be in the office with two of his heroes right before the 25th anniversary show, making them uncomfortable. Two of the heroes of the original show. Absolutely. I mean, Paul Simon did, like, I remember one of the first bits that killed on the show that I remember was him playing one-on-one with Connie Hawkins.

The great one. And the Turk, when he comes out as the Thanksgiving turkey. That was a little bit later. Oh, later. But, yeah, but the first thing was the Connie Hawkins thing. I think it was like the second show. But anyway, there they are. And so, yeah, I'm sitting through it, wanting to be dead elsewhere, at least.

And Paul just doesn't move a muscle. Like, I'm not even sure he blinked. And then the cartoon ends. Sure. Boom, bum, boom, bum, bum, boom. Soundly TV, fun house. Deathly silence. Lauren turns.

Paul. Well, uh, I didn't find it very funny. I'm about to really die now. But I did think it was affectionate. That's what he said. And me who had, even though by now, I'm like 39, I had no chill. Lauren always said this about,

Robert, you have no poker face, any emotion. It's so clear on your face. There's never, which I, you know, kind of took as a compliment in a way. But, but, but. Means you're authentic. Yes. Authentic, an authentic pain in the ass.

But anyway, he, when, so when he said that that he thought it was affectionate, instead of just being kind of cool like oh thanks paul you know i was like yes i'm so grateful you said that because that's what i meant for that's what i was going for you know i mean yes it's making fun of him but it's like you know i'm like turning into ed grimly or something no yes no because of course because why wouldn't he want why wouldn't i not want him to be happy it's his 25th anniversary and of course i love him i'm making fun of him and at the same time you see and so and Lauren just kind of had this half smile on his face like get the

fuck out of here okay we get it Robert we get it so it air you aired it so it airs but then yeah it aired and and um I think Alec Baldwin had to do like a little disclaimer yes he had a dis he had he had Alec Baldwin do a disclaimer to soften it and he told me he's I'm going to have Alex say something beforehand, just so everyone knows it's not mean-spirited. And he said, and Alec introduced it like, everyone makes fun of the boss in every office in the country.

Oh, there you go. Saturday Night Live is no exception. Here's our little swing at the big man. Something like that. And it makes him look good that he can... Well, so then after the show, there's one more thing that happened in the middle, which is that...

First of all, so I sit down to watch... the show after this Lorne meeting and the show's great it starts with Bill Murray and Lorraine and Paul Schaefer and Nick is and he's doing Nick the lounge singer and he's I love Bill Murray more than anyone because he never he never he's never too cool to be funny and to go for it all these years later yeah he's he and that's what he did it was like a classic Nick the lounge singer Nick the lounge singer yes and acroids in it and it's like oh my

my god they're doing sketches they're going for it this is so great and then the show just had this great energy and then there was a tribute to chris farley um and then there was a tribute to phil and i watched all my cast member buddies just introducing this moment with phil and like jan and lovitz are just like gripping each other's hands trying to get through it it was so heartbreaking because it was like they lost their dad. It was like this, because he was like the dad of that group. And so I just ran upstairs to where the writers were

who were working on the show. And I started kind of weeping and saying, I don't think my cartoon should be on the show. I don't think so. It just, it's, this is a great show, and I don't feel, we don't need to, to, you know, bring this, cynical shit into it

and then I think Tom Giannis one of the writers in Adam McKay were like no no Robert it's going to be great it's not mean it's going to be great okay it's like it's like as much as I genuinely felt everything I just said

with all my heart I felt that that this is wrong but that's such as the such as the the way of the

narcissistic artist it's like a tiny bit of reinforcement and like oh okay okay I guess so yeah let's do it. When it played so then it played and it played pretty well oh it killed Robert you know what I didn't feel like it was killing

in the room but then I watched it recently and it gets a lot of laughs but what really got a great moment was there's huge applause when Lauren starts singing he starts getting the audience breaks into applause and what I realized was that they weren't applauding the cartoon they were applauding Lauren and I really believe that and at the end of the night Lauren actually sat down with me for a little bit

and talked and I told them that you know and he chuckled again like okay Robert I mean he might have believed it but he wasn't but I remember you telling me that you said to Lorne in earnest no no no that was for you

I did I said that applause was for you that wasn't for the cartoon I did say that to him and I believed it because he never took a he didn't even take a bow on that show so I noticed that at the 50th too well the 50th he showed up at the end yeah but he's strangely not he's he's not out there he doesn't

seem front and centers to soak up the right and the 40th he was just going to do a little video sorry we're just going to do a little phone video okay and the 40th anniversary show he was he was front and center like steve and i just wanted to say before we wrap up and i want to go on to your your acting career you were surprised that you had 75 acting credits have that are like 90 of them Conan or something? No, there's a lot of them that are triumphed, but I just want to throw this out there. Mr. T.

auditioning, demanding an audition for Doll's House. That's my new adventures of Mr. T. That's probably my favorite. So brilliant. S&L. Cartoon. That's so brilliant. It's probably my single favorite. I got no time for jibba jabber. I want to be Torvald, sucker. Yeah. That's a really terrible.

It was Tracy, right? Terrible Tracy Morgan. And yeah, and the premise is truly funny. Mr. T used to have a show where he and his kids would solve mysteries and shit. And so this was just the show where they're, they're just trying to find words for mystery. Really fantastic. I need work.

I need work. I need work. No time for jibba jabba. Yeah. And Tracy's doing a pretty damn good Mr. T. Yeah, he was good. Yeah. Dan turned me on to Between the Temples, by the way.

Excellent little film. It is a good film. Yeah. I was very excited to be a part of that. I love Carol Kane and Jason Schwartzman is so funny in that movie. You're fun as a foul-mouth rabbi. Was I foul-mouth? Just once.

A little bit. You're surprised that you have 75 acting credits. I don't know. That seems like a lot. But, I mean, not if you, it's, I'm sure it's multiplied by all these Conan appearance. And it's probably more than that if you did every clutch cargo I did. Well, these are just, I think, what IMDB has. Yeah, yeah.

My favorites being your new part is Gabriel Razzleton in The Simpsons. That was fun. Okay. Barry, and this is 40. that was fun and yosi and you don't mess with the zohan my favorite by far is doing curb your enthusiasm oh that was fun too that was my favorite thing i've ever done practically i just couldn't believe that i got to be on it and that he let me improvise this whole scene an entire speech i was this manic um i was this mechanic who sponsored a softball team and just I played it like I'm just taking it way too seriously and

my role in shaping this team way too seriously and Larry Charles just at the last minute I didn't even know I was going to do a speech there were two other scenes and he said can you do a little pregame speech and I had like 15 minutes to think about what I might say and I said can I make it really can i can i say can i curse he was like please that's what we say here when you ask us so that's yeah that's one of my favorite things i ever got to do and you know everybody makes larry every story i hear about people who do curb they're just so delighted that they were able to make larry david laugh you know um so i don't feel it special because that was yeah Absolutely the highlight.

Like, I had a whole scene where I argued with him later and got to yell at him. And he laughed so hard, you know. Now, correct me if I'm wrong, but after I think the Seinfeld hosted episode of S&L, he offered me to work there, yes. Did you know that? No, but that's also a great sketch, by the way. Stand up and win? Stand up and win.

Yeah, that's one of my favorites. Really great. Because I had done stand up. He brought out the best in him. Yeah, I had done stand-up parodies like my first year at SNL where Tom Hanks played a Jerry Seinfeld kind of knockoff. And so that was always in my head. But then when Jerry hosted, I have this idea that what if it was a quiz show

and all the answers were very rhetorical, like the way stand-ups are. What's the deal? Well, that's the question. But then the answer is like, I know. Could somebody please explain, you know, who were the ad wizards who came up with this one? Bing, Bing, Bing, Bing. You know. Still good, all these years later.

Yeah. Let's talk. Yeah, Larry invited me to work on the show, but my dad was really sick. And I didn't want to leave New York City, so I'd be much wealthier. Well, you did the right thing, I think. Well, Triumph exists because I, actually, you know what would have happened? I would have done it for a year, and then Conan would have gotten late night, and I would have, there's no job I wouldn't have left. to do to start late night with him that is the ultimate dream job that i i'll never have in job

and those early days and those are when the first time you see those sketches the first year in the year 2000 and the clutch cargo stuff just really great days just i love late night television so much and i love david letterman so much and the opportunity to just try to fill his shoes in any way was the most exciting thing I've ever done easily You guys made television history Some wonderful, wonderful stuff A little bit of history

Yeah, let's talk about Leo And you're working on the second screenplay Yeah But I told you when you were at The View And thank you for signing my ambiguously Gay Duo Lunchbox when you came I think it's as good as any Pixar movie I watched it again last night

It's smart, it's funny The songs are great songs are great it's touching it has insight into into kids real problems yeah i i'm super proud of it i can't like it's it's not as crazy as shit i've written in the past but it's in some ways it's like my favorite thing that i've ever done because you're showing your versatility because well it's in a way it's like more purely about me and my humor than than things like triumph like triumphs the character that I came up with for a bit. And then it ends up being like this alter ego of mine.

But I'm really like writing insult comic jokes is not really my thing. I can do it to a degree. There are guys who do it better than me and they work for me. Ray James and those guys. Well, David Feldman and David Cyrus and Michael Coleman used to do it. Feldman's a genius. Yeah, he's a genius. And, you know, I can do it, but it's not like, you know, I'm like a peanut.

is the heart of my humor. It really is. You're the guy who made Jesus cry. That's right. That's right. Oh, man. But, yeah, so I like humor of discomfort, and I like, I like observing people. I like writing for characters.

So that was really fun because I got to make fun of parents. I got to make fun of teachers and, and privileged kids. And privileged kids, and they're minute problems that were. you know that are so important to them at that age you know i and i wrote it as my kids were growing up like my kids were eight years old when i started that movie and like 12 when it came out and roe and ethen are in it that happened by accident we were writing we were making a scratch track of the vocals the initial vocals and um the producer told me hey if anybody's got like family members that you could use that you think it'd be okay just for attempt

and then it occurred to me like oh my son rowie is in a lot of ways the inspiration for the kid who has all these allergies because he has a million he's diabetic and he has a peanut allergy and he has a gluten you know gluten allergy so he's got a lot of issues and he's got a very sweet voice that worked perfectly for that kid and then my other boy was like to bully Rowie. So Ethan's the bully and Rowie is Eli. Rowy is Eli. He did a great job. They both did. And so we do, we record the scratch and I thought they were both pretty good but then Adam was like, you gotta fucking use those kids.

You're fucking great. What do you do? Buddy, don't worry about it. I was fucking put them in the movie. You know, because his girls were already in the movie. Right. Because they really are really good actresses. They're both great in Leo. But my boy is like, yeah, I I'd given them like one line each in Hotel Transylvania, too, just for fun.

And they're, you know, personal bull kids, and they like to be goofy. Are they going to pursue this now? I mean, I don't think so. No? I don't think so. They're more realistic. They want to play for the Knicks. Oh, I see.

No, they're, they're, you know, thinking about other careers. And I'm not pushing them, although I think, I think they have talent. but, you know, it's a very unforgiving. Of course. It's such an unforgiving profession. I wouldn't recommend it to anyone unless they're possessed and they really want it that badly. Maybe they'll surprise you that way. They may.

If they want to, I'm not going to tell them not to. If they come home one day with a cotton candy beard. And some incidental music from my three sons. It's really a terrific. Congratulations to you and Robert and David because it's really, I watched it twice. Yeah. And I'm going to make my wife watch it. And I'll tell everybody that's listening to this, seek out Leo.

It's very, very smart and very good. Thanks very much. And really, and elaborate in terms of its plotting and its visuals and the visual execution. I mean, the drone alone has like 60 gags. Oh, the drone's really funny. Yeah. You know, Adam and I are very proud of the fact that kids laugh through the movie because there are a lot of animated movies that are amazing. but you go to the theater

and the kids aren't really laughing there aren't that many silly... Yeah, it's like the jokes are for adults. Some of the jokes are for adults or they're just kind of subtle there's just not a lot of I don't feel like I'm seeing that as a priority

in kids movies very often. Like Despicable Me has a lot of hilarious stuff in it. But that's like an anomaly. Like you see a movie like Zootopia or something and it's really interesting and cool but like there's the scene with the slug or the sloth and a couple other moments that are really funny but I just

me and Adam are really interested in making kids laugh but here's the greatest compliment I could pay so you know I brought my daughter to the premiere yeah how old was your daughter so this was what two years ago yes so she would have been she's 17 almost 18 now so she would have been like 15 okay and And she not only loved it, but this is how I know she genuinely loved it. She had a bunch of her friends over at the house, and I'm upstairs, and they're all downstairs. And I kind of surrender the downstairs of the house when all of her friends are over.

Sure. And I hear them watching Leo. Oh, really? Yeah. And she wanted to, like, get all of her friends to watch. She loved it so much. She, like, said, oh, let's watch this. That's cool.

So she watched it. A bunch of 15-year-old girls. Yeah. Did they like it? you never got a report no i mean i heard all the you know the laughing and they would be yeah that's cool and from a comedy standpoint i mean it's got a lot of different kinds of jokes and gags and visual gags yes tons and they keep coming at you and they're brilliantly executed i wrote down you know the the uh as uh as as as as leo is remembering through the years

and you guys are doing that that kind of time lapse oh yes and the posters change yes and there's mark spits in the 70s and then it goes to half in the 80s Schoolers or the kindergartners or whatever the little, little kid? Yes. Oh, my God. Really funny. Yeah. They'll be back in this next movie because people love the kindergartners.

Oh, so fun. And Malcolm's a great villain because she's vulnerable, and she has depth to her. Yes. What they call on screenwriting circles, a rounded character. There you go. I hate when, I really didn't want to do just a villain villain. some of my favorite movies are ones where like Mary Poppins

it's an amazing movie and one of the best character in the movie is the dad when I was four years old and saw it six times in a movie theater I hated the dad he was the boring mean guy but watching it when I you know by the time I was like 14 watching it I realized he's the funniest character in the movie

and he's not a bad guy he just needs to be He needs to be, you know, guided in the right direction, just like Malkin was, and just like, and even in Hotel Transylvania, it was the same kind of thing. There's, like, no bad guy in that movie. It's just Dracula figuring out not to be an overprotective dad. And I just love movies like that. That's why Mary Poppins, too, was very disappointing because they did have an actual villain in the movie and, you know, the bankers or whatever it was. It would just ruin the whole thing for me.

I echo what Dan said, too. The songs are great. How do you sit down? Thank you. You sit down with a composer? No, I sing the songs into a, I can't play instruments, but I've always been able to, like, write certain kinds of, certain level of tune. Christmas time for the Jews?

Yeah, that's, I wrote the music with that. What was Darlene's reaction when you presented that to her? She thought it was really funny, and she's, that's just. We sing it every year, my wife and I, every Christmas we sing. It's just such a dream. Talk about being starstruck. I mean, I just love her. And, you know, Christmas baby police come home

is just one of the greatest recordings ever. And just, I still can't believe she sang my song. What an honor. You know, and then the closing credits, if you watch the closing credits, her name is like in a font that's like 30 times because of any font that. Lord Michael's turned to me and like,

what's that all about? And I was like, I just want people to know it was really her. I didn't want people to miss that. I know you love duck soup and you love... Marks Brothers in general. Yeah, yeah. And Marks Brothers in general. So bless your heart for that.

But I did want to mention that it's Peter Sellers' 100th year to both of you. Mm-hmm. And Johnny Carson's? And Johnny Carson's. And Jonathan Winters. And Jonathan Winters. And Tony Curtis and Jack Lemon. Did Johnny Carson steal being 100 from Jonathan Winters?

You mean the way you? stole and Blabby? That's the joke, yes. We all got that. Maybe there's some people out there listening. That's why I like to explain the joke to my listeners. Paul de Cockers, that's the name of the show. Yeah, yeah. We'll talk another time about your friendship with Jonathan when you come back since you've done such an absolutely wonderful, delightful, inspiring job here today, including bringing out that... I'd like to thank you, Dan Pastor Nass to be my co-hosts. This time that we have Spent together is really the most. Is that what you would do?

You would sing that into a song? That's what Mike Douglas used to sing at the end of every remember. You are right. Friday. God damn. That's the song he would sing. That's how fucked up my brain is. That's a reference. Yeah.

Wow. Yeah. I think Dan brought up the best story of all, which is the Lauren story, the 25th. It was an amazing out-of-body experience, I got to say. Well, I had the great privilege of interviewing Robert for the television academy. Yes, and I want to also thank you for sending me 354 pages of research material. No, I sent him my research that I did for that interview. A nine-hour interview, I might add.

I know. I watched an hour and a half of it. And I said, I think I got it. I turned it on yesterday because I actually was looking for Lou Derman, and that was the only thing they cut. The only thing that they cut was Lou Dermann. He told me. it doesn't matter it's an academy decision it's an academy there's still nine hours there

I mean there's a lot of my mother watched all nine yeah yes because so I so Abby and I sat with your mom at the at the Leo premiere and I told her about the interview and she gave me her email address you please send it to me as soon as it's up so I did and she watched it immediately yes I would say the first person who watched and probably the only person who watched all nine hours Hardly, hardly, but... Who watched nine hours of anybody?

By the way, your mom is wonderful. She's just... How old is mom now? She should interview her. How old is she? See, he actually should video... Maybe you can help me. I want to videotape her and her cousin, who are both still here, and they have an amazing

life. They've heard their parents escaped from Russia, you know, in the 20s because of the revolution and the persecution of Jews, and they, but they escaped to China. And they settled in Shanghai where there was a huge Jewish community. You have to get her story. I mean, look, I interviewed both of my parents before they passed, and I have 10 hours of interviews with my parents. Maybe you should interview them because... No, you should interview them.

Well, we could maybe together, but like you might have a different perspective that might get more out of her. I'm happy to help, Robert, truly. Wow. Let's do it. I might watch nine hours of that. Yeah, that would be worth it. That's interesting. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Not that your story isn't wonderful for nine hours, right? It's no escape from Russia. At 90 minutes, I was not bored. But, like, God damn it, I wanted that Lou Lerman footage, Lou Derman. Lou Derman. Did you have a whole thing about Connie Hines being exposed, them exposing themselves to Connie Hines?

Oh, yeah, that was in there, yeah. That made me why it was waiting. I was waiting for that in the intro here. I was like, wait, he's doing a whole different thing. Oh, I forgot about the Connie Hines. That's okay. Retake. No.

What is talking about stuff that's coming up? What is burying boobie? Oh, Jesus. I filmed that like two years ago. There's another scene, another short film where I played a rabbi. I don't know whatever happened to it. Honestly, it was just a short film.

There was a year where I got rabbi in a short, rabbi in a feature, Jew and what we do in the shadows. That's right. That's right. And your stand-up started with what? Yeah. Well, I know my limitations. It's all coming full.

circle. Yeah. And by the way, Lou Derman wrote, let's give him his props, 34 episodes of all in the family. Oh, that's right. He did end up working.

Bill Davenport. He had a writing part. Oh, he had a partner back in the way. Yeah. And an unsawed, this is what I found online. This is the kind of crazy shit I dig into. An unsold William Bendix pilot.

That probably broke his heart and killed him. Riley's other life. Riley's other life. Yeah, right. He also was the Babe Ruth story. Oh, God, I can do. I'll send you Gilbert and Bob Costas and I talking about the Babe Ruth story. Oh, man.

I would love to hear that. Quite, quite funny. What's happening? So we know about the Leo sequel that you're working on as we speak. In fact, you tore yourself away from a deadline to come here, which I appreciate deeply. What's going on with Night of Too Many Stars? Well, we did one in March. It's not on TV anymore.

We do it at the Beacon Theater live. And in a way, it's a little more fun and relaxed because there's no commercial break, so it just moves. And people are more willing to do their stand-up. So it's, I don't have to, like, write the whole show anymore like I used to with my writing stuff. But, yeah, it's a lot of fun.

We had an amazing lineup last in March, and we're going to do one, I believe, for the Netflix as a joke festival. A first one we've ever done in Los Angeles next year. Oh, so it'll be on Netflix then? No, I don't think so. I think it's just, they do a lot of just live shows in their festival. Next spring.

Yeah, I think that's the plan, yeah. Congratulations for all you've done for that, for that community. Thanks. It's important work. Obviously, it's personal to you. Yeah, well, you know, it just started because when we were, when Dan was diagnosed, all the organizations were all about finding a cure and nothing else. you know, at the time, we didn't really have an objection to the idea of a cure.

We were like, we didn't know what the future held. And, you know, we, there was a lot of literature that was fairly pessimistic at the time. So, but what we noticed was then there were no, there was a big shortage of schools and services and no charities, you know, focused on that. Other than like having to start your own school and raise money for it. So Michelle and I decided. that we were going to do a show that would support people who have autism right now and have needs and, you know, we're not looking, not thinking about a cure at all, just thinking about providing more schools, more services.

Good for you. Yeah, so over the years, I don't know, $32 million, I guess. Congratulations. That's enormous. And just as importantly, by the way, really, I think, people's understanding of autism. I mean, the Jody DiPiazza performance with Katie Perry and then later with Weird Al, I don't think that anything has spoken to what's possible for, you know, for people with autism as much as that for me.

We try to, even more so now, just try to make our short films that are about, cause, just show what's possible. Just show the positives. And, you know, because I used to get people saying, you got to show sob stories. You know, that's what's going to make people reach into their pockets and stuff. And we just never wanted to do that. We just wanted to explain what we're raising money for and what it's going to do and show positive results. Yeah. And so, so yeah, that's Well, where can people learn more about it and contribute if they want to? Nextforautism.org. Next for autism.org is the organization that Night of Too ManyStarsonsons, funds.

And then we create and support programs all over the country, you know, and give out grants. and, you know, my wife does way more of that part of it than I do. I'm the clown who asks my friends to show up. She's amazing. She does so much, not just for next for autism, but just for, like, if you have, if, like, we just get people whose parents, parents who've had their kid diagnosed and just have no idea what to do and somebody I know tells me about them,

and my wife just gets on it. And she just knows so much at this point that. Well, Bravo, you guys are doing something very important and very needed. Don't forget the horse. There are horses out there that still don't have the ability to speak. For those keeping score, we've had Lou Derman. George Burns, Adam Sandler.

Coma. You miss doing Bob Dole, by the way? You just talk all about this nice autism charity, and I'm like, coma. So in addition to... That is the best one-word impression. Just ruining it. Well, you know, Gilbert used to do Humphrey Bogart in one word.

What was that? Stamps. Stamps. You know, I do Dustin Hoffman in one word. Let's hear it, pal. So, you play Sidney Pollock in Tootsie, and you say to me, I'm Michael Dorsey, say, Michael, no one will hire you. Michael, no one will hire you. Why?

That's good. Excellent. My one word, Dustin, I have a two-word, Dustin Hoffman from the movie Contact. Okay. It's airborne. That sounded like Elmer Fun. I know. I'm sorry.

My voice is shot. Like Robin Williams is doing Elmer Funn way. An apocalypse now. Oh, let me thanks. It's airborne. No, I can't do it. My voice is shot. It can't get that way.

It took me a decade to get you on a podcast, Mike, and I'm so glad that it happened, and I'm just sorry, Gilly isn't here. Me too. To experience it. But, you know, we're here in his memory. Yeah. And I'm going to send you some wonderful clips

that you're going to like me and him and Adam and other people. I appreciate it. And, Dan, I appreciate this more than I can tell you. Oh, this has been. So fun. Thanks for having me. You were the perfect person to be a part of this. And at some point, I will watch all nine hours. No, please. If people want to see it, the interview, the extended interview with Robert, well, not the nine hour one, but they can see the 90-minute one. It's up on the website. Yeah, no, they can see all nine hours. If you go to the television academy, I think it's called the interviews.

Or you can go out and get some air. Really. That is radical. Coming from the person who collected TV guide. Let me thank you. Let me thank some people. Thank you to Robert. Thank you to Dan, obviously, to Chance Pryor, who couldn't be here. CityVox and our engineer, our patient and terrific engineer, Don Hoffman,

who's been on the other side of the glass laughing this entire time. Andrew Capone, who is here doing photography duty, Bobby Hutch, Josh Chambers. And thanks to all the listeners are such glowing things about the first episode. episode. More fun next week. Is this the second episode? No, it'll be the third of the fourth. Oh, okay. And fifth. And fifth. Guests of Fun for All Ages stay at the fabulous fortress of privacy, where what are you looking at? Fun for All Ages is produced by Frank Santopadro, Genevieve Sturbans, and Andrew Capone. Post-production supervisor, Bobby Hutch, social media director, Josh Chambers.

Music by M-I-B-E and Pizza Pina, with special thanks to Seth Saltzman, FFAA social media team, Michelle Mantini, Pina, Pino Perserpio, and John Bradley Seals, logo design by John Tesla. Support us on Patreon at Patreon, backslash, Fun for All Ages podcast. I'm your announcer, Josh Chambers. To be a dog is to sit like a log watching people on the run. We don't need your pity because your life is shitty. We have the real fun.

Because I can lick myself, got to go. You guys have fun at the Broadway show. Lick myself, I'm the star. Have a good time at the sushi bar. Lick myself, eat my hap. Have a good time at a poetry slam. Lick myself, suck and squirt. You guys have fun at the Beck concert.

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