Girl on Guy with Aisha Tyler - girl on guy 194: steve mazan

Episode Date: July 22, 2015

join comedian steve mazan and aisha as they wade through loving what you do, pursuing what you love, never giving up, and chasing your dreams against all odds. plus steve shows aisha what relentlessness really means. girl on guy hates to say it, but you only live once. but seriously. you only live once.

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Girl on Guy. Hey, everybody, this is Girl on Guy 10094. Welcome to the show. I hope you're doing great. We are coming up on the sweet and bitter dregs of this season of Girl on Guy. But it's so wonderful to have you here. And I'm thrilled to be talking to you right now. I am recording this the Sunday of Comic-Con. And that's why my voice sounds like the ass end of a cat, dragged over a gravel driveway. But I'm doing my best, and that's all I can do. This is an advertising free episode of Girl and Guy, which is exciting. But if you do have a chance, go fill out the questionnaire. Tell us more about yourselves. I want to know more about you

because you know so much about me. And knowing more about you helps me make Girl and Guy a better show. So go check that out if you are able to do so. All you have to do is just go to podsurvey.com slash girl, P-O-D-S-U-R-V-E-Y-1-W-R-L, take the survey, help out the show. and you'll have a chance to win a $100 gift card. So that's a super fun, great thing. This episode of Growing Guy is with Steve Mazon. Now, I may not know who Steve Mazon is, but he has a very interesting and compelling story. Steve is a comedian, and when he was about 35 years old, he found out that he had cancer

and might only have five years to live. His cancer was inoperable. And so his dream had always been as a comedian to be on the late show with David Letterman. And he made a film about it. He made a documentary called Dying to Do Letterman, and it's all about his journey to try to get on to Letterman. And it's a really lovely story. He's a lovely guy, funny and sweet, and I really think you're going to enjoy this conversation. He says something in the film, and I think he said it in the podcast, but I'll repeat it here.

A quote from Steve is, if you stop chasing your dreams, you're already dead. I think a lot of us have we found out we didn't have a lot of time to live. We might curl up in a ball. We might drink ourselves into a hole. This guy got out and started chasing the things that he cared most deeply. about. And it's a great, great story, and I think you're going to love it. So with no further ado, ladies and gentlemen, this is Girlin Guy 10094, with comedian Steve Mazon, the subject of the film dying to do Letterman coming at you straight out of the Girlin Guy bunker and right into your face.

Steve Mazon, welcome to my show. Thank you. Thank you for having me. This is exciting. I'm excited. Okay, well, because you have such a unique story, kind of culminating in this film that you did, and then, you know, culminating in the rest of your life as well. Yeah. Let's let's, let's, let's start at the beginning. At the very beginning. The very beginning. Where were you born? I was born in Illinois in a log cabin. No, not a log cabin. Chopping down cherry trees? Yes, exactly. A long time ago. You look amazing for being like 250 years old. 250. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah, I grew up on the suburbs. Like the kind of, you know, all the John Hughes movies. Oh, yes. Yes. What's that? There's a famous John Cusack movie, Gross Point. Yes, yes. Yes. Okay.

So, you know, like where they did, ended up doing, like, you know, Breakfast Club and 16 Candles, pretty big, all that kind of thing. So the, not the higher end of that, the nice Gold Coast area of Chicago. But, yeah, like Elgin area, it's a working class, kind of suburban Chicago. So, yeah, grew up there, live there, yeah, until 18. So, like suburban, but not like 16 Candles, big house suburban. Exactly, yeah. There's the, you know, do you remember, so there was always the, the John Hughes movies always had. like a, you know, the railroad track kind of story, you know.

So there was the nice side. Then there was, Molly Reginald was usually from, I guess in Breakfast Club, she was the rich girl. Yeah, but she was usually. Like in the other one, and Pretty and Pink. Pretty in Pink. Yeah, her and Ducky. Closer of that, yeah, the ducky side of the track. So, yeah, the suburban strip balls and that kind of thing.

So, yeah, lower middle class, I would, I would say is probably, yeah, what it ended up being. What did your parents do? So my dad was like a carpenter, a glazer. He did his main thing. He's, like, installed windows and glass and stuff like that. I'm pleased with myself that I knew what glazer was before. I was like, oh, I know what that is.

You know what it's funny? My dad, one of his thinks he passed away a couple years ago, but he was on Wheel of Fortune. Oh, really? He was a big fan and he got to go on. And Pat Sejek, he had to explain to Pat Sejack what a glazer was. What a glazer was? Yeah. You know, he's like, what's a glaze?

You glaze cakes? Yeah, that's going to do what glazing? Yeah, exactly. Donuts. Donuts. So, yeah. That's a special. That's a special.

Exactly. So he did that. My mom worked in a factory. What kind of factory? They made flower pots. Adorable. Then we had a joke all the time. So it was like plastics is what they specialized in.

So plastic flower pots like you would find at that time. It was before we didn't have Walmart in Illinois at that time. So it was like Kmart and that kind of thing. But the other thing, they made seatbacks. This is going to sound crazy like for cars. Okay. Like I don't know if you kind of remember back in the 70s. So you'd have like a cushion seat, but the backside would be.

Like the mold of it. Yes, exactly. I guess they'd probably still have that. some cars. So we used to, like there's an ongoing joke in my family of my mom being really tired, like, you know, after working at the factory and sometimes she was working even like the overnight shift. And so the big, there's an ongoing joke in our family of like, don't bother me today. I did seatbacks last night. That was the very hard job, I guess, at her factory. Right. Oh, seatbacks. Seatbacks, right. Seatbacks. So it's like a lot of pots was cake, but it was the seatbacks that really wore you out.

Yeah. So it's like a ongoing like, you know, buzzword in our family. Seatbacks. So like just working, like working class family. both your parents work. You know, it's funny because it's not like there haven't been families time in memorial, but especially like the last 56 years where both parents have worked. But I do think that maybe back then, like, you know, I don't know, my parents both worked. And like, you know, I just had my own key and I let myself in. And now it's like crazy if like a kid like goes to and from school on their own.

Exactly. I walked, yeah. This is going to say, like I'm not doing the, I walked a mile both ways, that kind of thing. But I did. It was about a mile to my grade school. Yeah. And I remember as early as second or third grade walking. Yeah.

And there was no like... Second grade. Yeah, I don't know. Seven, eight years old. Seven, eight years old, right? And now people are flipping the fuck out about that. There was recently a story where some kids were at a park, right? And they got picked up by the police.

And the mom got arrested. Yes. She's like, I want my kids to be normal. Sure. And they walk six blocks to the park and they play in the park and they walk back. I have a couple of cases like that. And it's so far-fetched to me because I remember like walking to the bus stop with like a bus pass, not even a school bus, like to the bus and getting on the bus.

Like that was just, yeah, like, you know, come on. It is. Yeah, it's so crazy. So, and I go both ways. I mean, there's such a, I think, a level of freedom and probably wonderment that you have by that, getting that, like, walk back and forth. You know, you felt like every day was like stand by me. Right. Right. You're having a little adventure with your friends that are going. Yeah. The friends. Poked some poop with a stick. Exactly. Let's go, look, we found a dirty magazine in the woods. Like, you know, all that kind of stuff. and that's yeah people people are never away from their parents now or another adult figure until they're 25 yeah probably as it's as late as that yeah but where you would trust a kid to walk that far now

right right and and even be uh not just like um hey you know you're gonna walk on your own but just like hey kid go play and walk to the thing and then let me know when you get there and don't be a dick you know that was like pretty much that was the whole thing beyond another thing is my parents used to have this thing where they would be talking or something, you know, with the family, you'd be bugging. I'm like, mom, can I do this? Can I do this? She'd literally say, go play in the highway. Go play in the highway. Go play in that. Like, as a joke, you know what I mean? Like, go play on Barrington Road was the busy street near my house. Go play on Barrington Road. Like, we knew she was joking, but there was some truth to, like,

get out of my face. Like, make your own fun, entertain yourself. I'm not going to be here to help you. I don't work here. Exactly, right. Like, hey, I'll put you to bed at night. I'll feed you three meals. You need help with her homework. Okay. But, I'm not entertaining. Yeah, my gag is not to entertain. Go find what you're doing. Isn't it so funny? That's attitudinally separate from like the thing of people being afraid for their kids is this other thing, which is like it's my job to entertain my child.

Like I've got to fill their day with activities. I'm not sure they're engaged. Whereas when we were kids was like, engage yourself, jackass. Yes, exactly. Yeah. You're exactly right because it is. I can understand the safety angle of it. Like, okay, maybe walking a mile.

Maybe something could have happened terrible. Like the chances are probably pretty low. But right, if you're at home, like there is still the, I guess, the helicopter parenting where they're, you know, they're all never leaving the kid alone and like, let's a new activity, let's new move on to something else. Exactly. Yeah, my mom and dad were both like, yeah, like, would be ridiculous if I ask them. Like, what's our next project? Right, exactly. What are you talking about?

Or like the line. We're like, I'm bored. Boring people are bored, man. Get out of my face. No, got a stick in some poop. Never disappoints. Go walk. Do you have siblings?

Yeah, so I have, I was kind of the, um, um, mistake baby. Yay. I think, yeah. So like both older, they're like seven and eight years older than me. So yeah, my parents,

I think they were in their like 32, 33, like when they had me. So I think, yeah, I think it was kind of a surprise, like they were planning on me. Yeah.

And I think that probably added it to it too. Like it's like, they say that kind of thing. Like, you know, when you have the first baby, you do everything, you take thousands of pictures

and you protect it. Right. And then the second baby, they're like, he'll be fine. Right, right. Exactly.

The bigger one. We've got another. Sorry if that one does. So then add another step down and seven years to that. Right. I think they were kind of at that point like, yeah. Over it. Yeah, over it.

All right. Yeah. You'll find your way. You'll figure it out. How did you interact with your older siblings? Because it is a big gap. Did you, with them a lot or did you feel kind of separate from them in some ways? I felt kind of separate.

In fact, yeah, really the earliest memories I kind of even have are, you know, them being gone all the time. You know what I mean? Like never, never really being home. I don't really remember a lot of. Like, we'd go on vacation, of course, and stuff like that. But I don't remember the first real memories I have were, like, wow, having a bond with my brother and sister are both when they're already out of the house. Like my sister off to college and we'd go visit her at college and she, you know, would buy me a sweatshirt or something. She went to Purdue.

And so she got me a sweatshirt. And I was like, oh, my God, I'm getting a gift. Like, this sounds crazy for my sister. And, like, it felt like, you know, so I must have been 12 at the time. And, you know. Because by the time you were kind of like old enough, probably when you were old enough to play with them, they were probably like, You little dude. Yeah, exactly.

It's just like annoying little person, right? And then when you got even older to maybe like articulate, you know, like stuff, like, let's say you're 7, 8, 9. Yeah. They're teenagers. Right. And they're like, or they're out of the house. And they're just like, oh, you know, teenagers are the worst.

They have no time for anybody. They have, yes, exactly. And they have many more memories. I guess, you know, it's that thing. Like when, I don't know, how old do you think you were? Like, what's your earliest memory? How old do you? My earliest memory has got to be like two or three.

Oh, really? Yeah, but really nascent. I mean, like, very cloudy. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, more feelings than anything. Yeah, yeah. So, yeah, it's that kind of thing. So even by that time, like you said, they're teenagers.

Like, they have a lot of memories of, like, things I don't remember. Like, they always tell me about a game they'd play with me called ghosty goooly. And it was, they would tell me it was hide and seek. Right. But their idea was really just to scare the shit out of me. So they would hide somewhere, and then right when I found them, they would, you know, jump out. Yeah. Scare the crap out of it.

And I'd run to my mom and she'd say, I don't care, you know, go play. Go back. Your feelings mean nothing here. And they would trick me every, that's the ongoing joke because that I was so gullible is that they always say, you know, I'd be like,

I don't want to play ghost too gullible. They'd be like, no, no, no, it's hide and seek. It's, you know, they would change the name all the time. So, and it was really just an excuse for them to scare the shit out of me. But I don't remember that. Because also they're teenagers and teenagers are dicks

and you're like a little dude. You're like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, let's be friends. Yeah. Were you, when you were a little kid, like, what are your first memories of what you wanted to do for living like what you wanted to be when you grew up yeah i think you know i think i had all those things

where you're you know you get uh as a boy you get you know fire trucks and stuff like that so the early stuff where you're like oh that it that'd be a fun job to to do that or something adventurous um but i i think you know i'm a comedian now and i i remember the the real first time i saw and i had stayed up watching like you know um johnny carson at that time you know i'd stay up late my parents would be watching that. And I guess, you know, he had comedians on, of course, but I don't really remember that. And I remember we got cable when I was 11 or 12. And I remember Richard Pryor having a Richard Pryor special on.

And that's when it kind of first hit me that that was an option. I was like, oh, my God. Like, it didn't seem like jokey joke. It really did seem like a guy up there talking about pain and just sharing stories about his family and his life. and just, I guess, the scope of it really made me feel like, oh, that's, that's a career? Yeah. You could do that?

And I think I probably even already knew Richard Pryor from, like, that he was a movie star or things like that, but just that there was this option that you could get up and be a stand-up comedian. So, yeah, when I saw that, like, that was the first time where I said, well, that's what I'd like to do. And, you know, after that, it took me a long time to even try it. Really? Yeah, like, even after I was, you know, obviously I was 11 or 12 at that point, but I didn't, I didn't start comedy until I was 29. Okay.

I just never got, I never had the balls. Really? I was going to say, so you had this in the back of your mind, your whole life. I want to be a comedian. I want to be a comedian.

And was it that you were just too afraid or you didn't know how to start? I think, I think both. I had no idea how to start. And obviously this is, you know, now we're going back to the 80s. Like no one in my,

no one in the Midwest that I knew. The closest person to entertainment that I knew, I had a friend. His dad was a cameraman for the White Sox. Oh, wow. Yeah. And then when Oprah came to town, he worked on the Oprah show as a cameraman.

And so that was the closest I ever came to, like, knowing someone in the entertainment industry. Like, no one, everyone's dad was, you know, like, just in some trade, you know, construction guy or something like that. So to even think, like, I wouldn't even know how to ask, you know, like, how would you get into this. Like, now, of course, now you could look on the Internet and be like, oh. Yeah, and there's a million things, a million resources. Yeah. So you just read a blog to tell you how to start comedy. Right, right.

But, yeah, so I think not knowing was a big part. And then just the fear. And then plus growing up the Midwest, I think everyone's much more, I mean, this is a generalization, but, you know, the safe choice kind of thing. Like, had I announced, I want to be Richard Pryor. I want to be a standard community. I'm sure everyone would have said, and whenever I did announce stuff like this, it would be like, well, that's a good backup option.

Right. But you need to have, you need to be, you know. You need something pragmatic. Yeah. How are you going to pay the bills? Yeah. Exactly. You're not going to pay rent by doing that.

Right. And Richard Breyer's one in a million. So, yeah, do not even think about trying. Yeah, there was, I mean, there was this thing I remember that was like somebody like Kim or like Eddie Murphy were like magical creatures from space. You know, like, you know, sure, it was amazing and you wanted to do it. But like how to do it just felt like, okay, either you're that guy or you're not that guy. Right, exactly. Becoming that guy.

Exactly. There's no, there's no path to it. Right. He was born, Eddie Murphy, able to walk out on a stage and be that hilarious. And be that funny. Yeah. Exactly. So, yeah, it didn't even enter.

So, and then just, yeah, so to being scared, one of admitting it to anyone that that's what I want to do. Really? Admitting it to myself, saying it out loud. And then, you know, again, they say, you know, it's the biggest fear is to speak to strangers. So I think, you know, just even to say, okay, I'm going to pursue something like that. Yeah. It took me a long time to build up the balls to do it. Yeah. Well, what did you do in the interim where you were working on the size of your bowl?

So, yeah. So finished growing up there, and then I was in the Navy for, five. five years? Join the Navy, like, right out of high school? Right out of the, yeah. So I had a, I was supposed to have a job at my mom's factory. Okay. Which would have paid my college tuition.

Yes, I would have had seatbacks. I would have had seatbacks. I would have had bitched. And I was all set up and I was going to go to, I had been accepted to school, was going to go to college. And at the last second, they canceled the summer jobs. They were cutting back at the place. So now all of a sudden I would have had to get student loans to go.

And just growing up in the Midwest, we were like, like I said, a lower middle class family. So money was always an issue. And like just all of a sudden, like just graduating high school and being like, oh my God, now I'm going to have loans already. I mean, it's crazy now because it's such a big issue. Right. Right. Right. But this is back then when, I don't know, I'm sure it was a year of school could have cost you six grand or something. Right. Right. Ridiculous. Yeah. But that seemed like so much to go. So I had a couple of friends that had joined the service. So I joined the Navy so that I'd have, yeah, money for school afterwards. So I did that. And- But then you stayed for a long time. I did. So you had to go, I had to sign up for four years. I did, this was so stupid and smart at the same time. I went and took, you take a test when you go to, you know, down to the recruiter. And, you know, I've never been great a test, but I'm relatively, I don't want to say a smart person, but I can do okay for myself, right? I'll surprise people usually. I never, not like a straight A student, but like, I pick things up quickly. So whatever, I don't know what I did this day. I ace this basically this test.

they gave me, right? Like, I saw the recruiters come back in. When I first came in, they're like, oh, you can do this, you can do this. After I took this test, these people were so nice to me. They're like, come in here, have a seat, like come into our main office. I was separated. Don't forget what you were saying about being separated. This is going to be terrible, everybody who's served or has family members that served. But, you know, there's a wide array of people that come in to the military. And a lot of times if they're like someone who would ace a test, they're coming out of maybe RTC out of college or like some kind of like feeder program, typically like, you know, a prime kind of meat doesn't just wander into the recruitment office.

The guy wandering the recruitment office is like, I'm on parole. And the only way I can get off of it is if I join the military. Or I'm running from a murder. Or, you know what I mean? So like the fact that you just ambled in. And because I bet you also, those recruiters get points when they bring in like a big, the big, big fish. Yeah.

That's exactly right. And you know what? No one will be offended by that in the service. I'm not saying a genius has a brought into a recruitment office. People outside who haven't been in the service, you know, those kind of people will they'll be offended for someone else. They'll be like, hey, wait, that's not cool you're saying that. Anyone in the service knows exactly what you're saying

because they know the array of people. You've got all your teeth. They know that there's, yeah, that you have the genius guy that went to West Point and, you know, the guy, like you said, who would be in jail if they were not there. So that's the array. All amazing people. So you take this test. So I take this test.

They're crazy. They come in. They're like, hey, you have qualified for this nuclear program. Ooh. Yeah. So they're like, it's very tough. It's on par. It's second only to MIT as far as difficulty level and dropout rate and all this kind of stuff.

But you have to sign up for six years instead of four, but you get a $25,000 bonus when you finish the schools. Wow. So, listen, right away, like, I'm 18 and I'm like, oh, and they're so excited. I had never, in my 18 years, seen people excited to see me like this before. No one had ever been that happy. You know what I mean? So I was kind of like, it was my first brush as a rock star. I was like, wow, right.

Yeah. They were really impressed, so I thought, well, I should be impressed with myself, right? So they end up signing me up for this thing. I agree to you at six years, you know? So I end up, so it is one of those things. I go in the Navy, I go to boot camp. I realize in boot camp, I'm like, oh, this isn't for me. Like, I don't know what I got into here.

You're totally out of your league. I've told me out of it. They're talking about, like, you know, MIT and like tests. And then meanwhile, you like vomit and, like, put it in your pocket. Right, right, exactly. So, yeah, between, first of it, between the schooling, when I got to that, it was just crazy, hard, but even just the military life, I was just like, oh my God, this is, I had never had this much discipline. Like I said, my parents were the opposite. Like, go do your own thing. Like, and now all of a sudden,

you know, having your day is completely structured. So I go to the school and, you know, it's eight hours a day of school. And then if you weren't doing well, which I quickly wasn't doing well in the school, you have to do a mandatory study afterwards. So sometimes it was as much as four or five hours a night. So literally I would spend my whole week doing school and then I'd have to on Saturday and Sunday put four hours in at the school as well. So this went on for, so there were like three different schools you'd had to go through. And this went out for like nine months. And I kept thinking, like I would see other people. They would fail out. And then you just go out and you, you'll have to do some extra time over four years, but not the full six years. Right.

Depending on how long you stuck in. Right. And for whatever reason, I would always do just well enough to not get kicked out. Right. And looking back now, I should have, knowing that I would eventually fail out, which I did. So I spent five and a half years rather than six in. I wish I would have just quickly failed out early. But I kept sticking around. Like, I would go to these tests, like it was like out of a movie where they would, I would go

in, they'd be like, you have to meet with three people and you'd go and it was almost like American Idol. You're standing in front of these people and they're asking you all these nuclear physics questions and stuff like that. And I'm writing stuff on a chalkboard they're asking about. And I'm like, ooh, I blew that. I don't even know what I was. just writing. And then they'd come in later and they're like, come into the office and I'd be like,

all right, here it is. They're going to tell me I'm not to, and they'd be like, good news, you did well. And so we're going to, we'll test you again in four weeks and see how that goes. They just kept extending me. And then finally, I think the final school was 20 weeks and like 17th week. I finally failed out. Brutal. Yeah, it was brutal. But it really felt like one of those, like they did the thing. I've heard they do this like at other schools like MIT, where the very first day of the school, they say look around, that person next to you isn't going to be there when this is all over. And it really did feel like everyone was staring at me.

Like we know this guy's not going to think. So, yeah, so that's why it's so many years versus just a normal four. So then when you wash that at 17 out of the 20 weeks in the last clue you need to complete to kind of wait program, how does that change your trajectory? Yeah, so at that point then they know you're relatively smart. Yeah, you made it almost all the way to begin. Yeah. So they give you a lot of options of what you do.

So again, I took a money choice at that point. So I decided one of the things you get extra money for is if you agree or volunteer, you have to volunteer basically to serve aboard a submarine. So there's extra money for being aboard a submarine. And at that point, the Gulf War was just starting. So there was extra money because it would be in a war area. So I volunteered for that. And so then, yeah, I basically spent, so after that the schooling, I spent the first Gulf War.

Almost, yeah, the very first Gulf War. So about, yeah, three and a half, four years living on board a submarine in Norfolk, Virginia. I just had somebody else in the show was talking about living on a summer. submarine. Oh, wow. Maybe he was on, no, he wasn't on a submarine. He was on an air carrier. Aircraft carrier. But what he was saying was it was like super boring. Like, you know, even with the structure of your day, there's just like nothing to do, no movies to watch and just like stuck in your bunk with your thumb up your ass and probably can't even masturbate because you go to the million other guys in the mobile. I'm sure people tried. Oh my God. Yeah.

I mean, it was, yeah. It was just like a lot of no eye contact in the morning. Yes. Yes. I just heard they're actually just now, uh, they'd been talking about it when I got out, uh, having women on board at submarines. But, you know, at least on an aircraft carrier, you would see a woman. Right, right, exactly. It was co-ed. But it was literally 100 guys on her submarine. So that was it.

It was crazy. But, yeah, there was no stopping the masturbation. Like, it was still going. How could you? Yeah, right? So you had a little, you literally had a little bunk like this, the size of like this table. Yeah. For the people listening to your home, maybe your kitchen table.

That's all you had. And that was your whole space, right? No room for you had. Yeah. So, yeah. You would be in there and you just had a curtain that slid across your bug, so you would just have to try and be quiet. Yeah, no sound, not soundproofing.

You're right. But there would be many times where, like, they'd be like, hey, go wake up Johnson. You know, Maison, go, go wake up Johnson. And I'd have to go wake him up. And I'd have to go wake them up. And I'm like, whoa, sorry, you know, finish up. Right, exactly. I don't want to introduce you.

That's just cruel. Right? Don't give me a few minutes to finish up. I'd pull it together. Yeah, I mean, there's also just got to be like this unspoken understanding. We're all on the same, well, sorry, we're all on the same boat here. I really believe that's where that's saying came from. Yeah, exactly.

Like, we're all, yeah. Yeah, we, you kind of, it was so funny because it was such a change for me. I felt like a relatively, like, naive Midwestern boy. Yeah. And then all of a sudden, you know, the people say, oh, he talks like a sailor. Yeah. It really was an eye-opening thing. Like, just, again, it's the worst of whatever's bad about men.

Again, I lived with 100 men, so I saw the language, the depravity. Yeah. Everything just... Unregulated. I remember in high school, like, people would be... We used to make fun of this friend of ours. And again, I'm sure now it's... We were basically bullying this guy.

But he was our buddy. He was our best buddy, right? But we, as someone, one of our friends had went to his house and his mom was like, hey, Brian's upstairs. And so my buddy walked in and Brian was in his room masturbating. So, of course, we all knew about it and we all teased him all the time about it. Oh, you were jerking off. And where's Brian?

Oh, he's in the corner. So it was just, you know, for years, we tortured this guy. Yeah. Of course, we're all masturbating, but none of us would admit it. No, no. And also, well, there's that like, that like tool of deflection where you're like, well, you know, like, that guy's masturbating, right? As you like slowly pull your hand out of your own pants, you know, just like, everybody

look over there. Yeah, that's exactly what it was. But of course, the minute, like, now I'm on a summary. Now, literally there was no shield or denying it. Everyone was like, yeah, after watch, I'm going to go masturbate, then I'm going to take an app or blah, blah, blah, I'll get up later. Right. Or, hey, you hear her so-and-so?

He got his dick caught in a vacuum. Like, it was just like stuff like that. Like, it was a complete other level of acceptance. Right. Of how, like I said, whatever is bad about men, it was, it was that worst side of it. Right. I mean, it's like, you know, there's this thing of like just no cultural or social checks and balances, right? Like, no reason to mask like your worst.

Because everybody thinks terrible things and doesn't say them. Of course. Yeah. Because you're worried about being rejected or unlove. Right, exactly. There is, yeah, I think there is some things, listen, you never want to have anyone keep anything inside or whatever. Right. Right, let yourself out.

But I think there is some good things about being maybe more subtle about things or not, not just being right in your face. And that's why I think, you know, again, I say men, the worst part of men. Like, doesn't, women are such good influences. Like, they at least, they are the checks and balances. They keep us, like, if it was just men, like, it really would be an awful world. Right. Well, I'm not going to disagree with it there. I will say for the record, women have said and done terrible things,

not just on like a global scale. Right, right, right. You know, but I've been in the company of women where we've said some pretty, pretty ranger shit. Sure, sure, exactly. But there is, there's probably a level, there's probably like a level of extremity that just comes out of, like, the presence of testosterone.

Oh, exactly. Which, you know, has an effect on people's brains and interactions that you aren't even aware of. Do you know what I mean? It's just like chemical shit where guys just... Yeah, it is that. animalistic. It's animalistic, almost caveman-esque. When I got out of the Navy, I worked at a place in the Bay Area. It was when the first dot-com boom was going on. And it was a staffing company,

and my two bosses were these amazing women. And I learned so much, they were like mentors to me, but quickly, I mean, very quickly, like, they, like, had to school me, because I was still in this mode of working with 100 men. So if someone said something to be like a coworker, you know, said something to me. I was quickly back in his face like, hey, what the hell are you talking about? That doesn't make you know what I mean. And they would grab me and they'd be like, hey, like, there's a better way to approach that. Like, why not this? And that's what I mean. Like, women

are just very, they consider things more. Right. They have probably, I'm sure that you guys have the same exact thoughts and Well, you know, it's interesting. I just had this conversation with someone about that, about, and like, again, there are exceptions to every rule and I mean, multiple exceptions to every rule. She was saying how like, you know, some people, and maybe guys,

let's just say for the sake of argument will really air on the side of like, hey, you know, so, Steve, you know, the report I really needed by the end of the day. And you'd be like, what the fuck? What the fuck? I mean, I was going to get it to you, right? Like, they'd go there. And then the woman would be like, well, you know, asked him, well, so it would be really great if you could chat. Like, you literally haven't done the report and it's two days later. It would be, I know, I was two days ago, but if you could just buy. You know, he's falling like way outside the spectrum of being effective on both. On both ends. Yes, yes. Yeah. But that's interesting. It's, it's, there's also something, right?

There's kind of like territorialism in that. Yeah. I have a lot of guy friends, and I will say that, like, you know, you were saying, oh, we probably bullied this kid that were just, like, that was the way we showed affection. We were just awful to each other. Just, if we didn't say anything mean to you, we didn't care. Yeah. That's the whole thing.

I mean, I remember literally saying this when we're in the Navy, like, if I'm not giving someone shit, I'm not having fun. Right, right, exactly. That was fun. And again, like I said, obviously, you know, now we look at these things in a different way, and it's like, oh, you can be construed that way, yeah. When you're giving somebody shit, and, again, depends on the, agree, but, you know, for us, it was like competitive shit. Like, who's better?

Right, of course. Right. You're exactly right. Come right back with another comeback. And, you know, so much I slam you and you slam him harder. Exactly. You know, then you kind of won that round. Have you met Lothman? He's a ballbuster. I love that guy. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And you kind of, and then you pride yourself on how much you can take as well. Exactly. Right. Yeah. So you come out, so you do, you do the submarine. Yeah. And then that kind of culminates in you taking the discharge at five and a half. Yeah. So then I get five-and-f years. Then I go back to Illinois, went to school there, went to college. And then once I got out, then I was like, all right, this is the time.

I really got to, I started really thinking about comedy, but I still wasn't admitting it outwardly. And my sister was living in Pleasanton, California out in the Bay Area. And she had just had two kids over the end of the end of the, they were like one and two at the time. And so I wanted to be close to them, so I moved out to the Bay Area. That's nice. Yeah, I wanted to be close. And I had never being the youngest of my family in that separate. We had never had a, you know, a little baby in the family after me.

So it was so exciting. So I wanted to be close. And I moved out there. And within three months of me moving, her husband got a job back in Chicago and they moved back. So then I was like, all right, do I keep chasing them wherever they go? Right, right, right. And I was like, so now I was left alone.

I had this job that I was talking about it, is the dot-com boom going, and staff and company in Hayward, California. And I was like, you know what? I'm left out here now, now or never. I was about to turn 29. I was like, you're going to do this comedy thing or not. And so I started looking, and this is the internet was really starting to go then.

And I remember I found a comedy class in San Francisco. And I was like, okay, I'm going to go take this class and do it. And so, yeah, I really had to, I remember deciding, like, almost my heart's beating faster as I'm looking online about this. It was the first time the possibility seemed real. You know what I mean? And putting something out there rather than just thinking in my head, this is something I want to do. Right. And really fantasizing about something.

And again, it feels as remote as like being like an Olympic downhill ski jumper. You know, and then you're like taking a concrete step towards this thing that you've been like pondering since you were a little kid. Yes, yeah, exactly. So it was amazing. It was this incredible moment. How old were you? So, yeah, 28 at that time. So, you know, so yeah.

So I was like 23, 24 when I got out of the Navy, four years of college. And then, yeah. And working. So 28, yeah. How did it feel when you? So first you took the class. So yeah, so it was actually a one guy with a comedy. coach. Okay. And so I took his class and it was good. I like you, not that you need a coach

or anything, but it was good to just learn the things you would never even think about. Or the things that it would take you forever to figure out on your own. Like I did never take any courses, but I just remember like the things I know about comedy now, the things that I could impart to somebody. And like, not even folklore and shit, just just experiential stuff was stuff that I had to figure out just by failing over and over and over and over again. And having somebody to kind of pick out, also to tell you, look, I'm watching you. And like, I really think, that this is what your strength is. Because a lot of times when you're a baby comic,

you're just trying to emulate people that you love. And that's not your, that's not your shit. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. So that's exactly it. Like, yeah, just even the little things like, how to hold a mic or, you know, I'd never been on a microphone before or operated a thing.

You know, and you see people who are new, sometimes they fumble too long with the mic stand or the, used to whip the cord all the time. Like for the whole set. Yeah. Then people like, you're whipping the mic where I was like, no, I was like a crazy tick. You didn't even know what you're doing it.

No, I had no idea I was doing it. It would have been a good thing, though. That could have been a punchline. Your coach would have been like stop whipping. Stop, no more whipping. So I did that, and then I remember the, I finally, he was a guy, he actually, he would, I started hearing for other people. I started going to open mics.

I hadn't gone up on stage yet. And they're like, oh, you're going to the comedy coach. You don't need that. Like you can learn this. You can learn it on your own. And comics are, like I always hear some people say, oh, comics are bad people. I always find them like there's always a bad. bad person.

But by and large, they're so helpful. Everyone wants to, it's a nice return to do. Yeah, I mean, it's interesting. I feel like the San Francisco community generally is pretty collaborative as well. People tend to be less threatened there that maybe, I don't know, maybe New York or Boston. Right, right.

That's true. Right. Maybe they're just shitty in Boston. Yeah. But yeah, I also felt like you could find peers that would be collaborative with you. I would have writing groups and we'd all be like, everybody's bringing five new jokes on Sunday.

We'd like get a beer and then, you know, everybody pitch your jokes and we'll pitch you tags. And it's, you know, it's just like a way. Yeah, yeah. That's what I mean. And there were definitely people who were like, well, what's his problem? He seems to hate me, and I've never even met this person.

They don't want to talk to me or they don't want to help me or I asked him, I've tried to introduce myself and they turn their back out of it. There's definitely those people, but I think buy and large, and maybe that's it. You remember those people. Right, right. So where was your first set? So the Brainwash Cafe? Did you ever do the brainwash?

That's the one over there in South of Market that's like a laundromat. And there's a room and back? Yeah. Yeah, there's a laundromat cafe. So I showed up. I did one of the worst sets I ever had in there. Silence. So silent that I was tickled by.

It was so funny. It was so funny. It was so fucking quiet. Yeah. I loved it. I'll never forget that set. I was just talking to another kind of stuff with it. Do you think it's really important?

One of your first three sets has to go at least decent, right? Well, my first set, I mean, your first set. Did you do well on your first one? Oh, yeah, your first set. But the thing is they have nothing to compare it to. Right. Doesn't. Yeah.

And I, that's the thing. I mean, I think everybody remembers their first set going. well because they've never gotten a laugh before. So one laugh is plenty. Oh yeah, one laugh in three minutes. You're like, I destroyed. It's just the next thousand sets of- that are painful.

But you need something, yeah, to carry you over. Yeah, something to let you. But if you just get the one laugh, it's so intoxicating. Yeah. Yeah. Did you feel like your first set? Well, of course it went well. It wouldn't say, well, I got there like, it was one of those I had been told,

like, get there at 8 o'clock to sign up. Yeah. I showed up early. I came in. I remember wearing like a suit. Good for you. Like right away, all the comments. Western boy.

All the comics start walking here. They're like, who is this doofus? I signed up. I knew not to sign up first, so I signed up third on the list. I was the first person now. Yeah.

So, signed up third. And I ended up going on, the show started at nine. I ended up going on at five to midnight right before the place closed because they kept bumping me. Right.

Because, you know, other people would show up and I, no one knew who I was. So even though I had signed up third, they kept up, I kept asking the guy like, hey, when am I going up?

He's like, no, no, you're going up soon. just a couple more. So I'm waiting. I had a day job. It was like a Thursday night. So I had to get up the next morning and it's getting later and later.

And I'm like, what's going on? And sure enough, by that time, the place had cleared out. There was like the time where it was hot. Yeah. Everyone's killing and there's a real crowd in there for some reason. Right. And by that time, like, there's one person folding their clothes. There's the host.

There's the guy that just went up. And there's the guy that's serving coffee to people. He's cleaning up. Yeah. So that was all. But you're right. I remember one guy laughing. And that was enough.

And that's really, one laugh. That's all I remember getting, but that was, like you said, I remember, like, walking out, like, like, Judge Nelson at the end of breakfast school, and bumping my fist. Like, I was so, like, I'm a comedian. I did it. And, like, just how exhilarating it was for that, you know, 40-minute ride back to the East Bay. Yeah. And how exciting that this is something you've been fantasizing about your whole life. And then the first experience for you was, was meaningful. Because, you know, I mean, every once in a while, somebody goes up and any, and maybe just the feeling of being on stage doesn't work for them, regardless of the laughs. Yeah.

just too disorienting or you feel more stage fright than you thought you would or you freeze. There's a million bad things that can happen. But yeah, it just takes the one laugh and you're like, I'm a genius. Exactly. I was really, I remember maybe like, it'll probably be a couple months before I get the Tonight Show. But, you know, I'll put the work in. I mean, I really want to polish. I want to, I want to look good. For them. For them. For them. Yes. A fine point. So then you start doing stand-up. So then I, yeah, I started doing stand-up and, you know, it is really a drug. It started getting like addicted to it so I was up. I'd keep track. I remember like at my day job, I had like, you know, one of those big, uh, from, you know, staples to big calendars. The desk calendar. And I would mark all my

sets and everyone I was going to do for the next week. And at the, at the end, like how many, if I could beat how many I had last week and that kind of thing, you know, like my, you're, you're living, I'm sorry to cut you off, but you're living in San Francisco and your family's gone. So you don't really know anybody. No, yeah, I didn't really know anyone. That, yeah, I was kind of left, left to, uh, left by myself. So, you know, that was a great thing. So, yeah, I guess that maybe that's the other reason like that. I do think that comedians, by and large, are so nice. Because, again, they quickly became my friends and family.

Right. Completely. These are all the only people I knew out there. Right. And there's a shorthand that we have with each other. Yeah, yeah. You just very quickly, you start speaking the same language. You're in the, you know, not to compare it to war, but these are people you're in the trenches with.

Yeah, exactly. And you have a shared experience that you don't even have to articulate it. You all know, you're all feeling and going through the same things. Yeah. So you start marking off your sets. Right. Start marking off the sets. Oh, I did 19.

I got 19 sets in the, you have a certain. week, amazing, you know, like that. And I would, you know, so I would go anywhere. And luckily, I was, you know, it's weird. I was very lucky because I had a car because I did have this day job. Yeah. And so I all of a sudden started getting people, a lot of comedians didn't have cars. So they would be like, hey, I'll get you on the show.

Yeah. But you got to drive, you know, or that. Or a lot of guys wouldn't go do shows in Oakland because they couldn't get across the bridge or they didn't want to spend money. But like, I was able to go everywhere. So I started getting a lot. And then a show opened up in Palo Alto called a road. and crown. And it was one of those perfect storms where a lot of guys wouldn't come down from

the city for it or the San Jose guys wouldn't drive up to Palo Alto for it. But I was at that time before I moved into the city was living just across the bay in Hayward. So it was nice and close for me. And so all of a sudden no one was coming down and there was this great place in a college town, you know, by Stanford there. And there was a two hour show every week and only four guys would show up. So all of a sudden I was getting as a new comic, I could do. do 15 or 20 minutes. You know, I didn't even have that time, but I was just up there talking in it. It ended up being so valuable to getting better quick.

Yeah. So, yes. And then all of a sudden I started working the clubs, you know, the punchline and the old cobs in San Francisco and the Wharf. Yeah. The old cobs. Yeah. Oh, my God.

We must have just missed each other. I think so. I think so this was for me. Because if we were there when the old cobs was. This is 99 when I started. Yeah. We did just miss each other because I left. Yeah.

Because I remember people, yeah, there were stories, you know, people talking about it. Terrible stories. No. The opposite. You know, yeah. Like, the great, you know, I will say, just, I don't know, you know, you're so successful. So I don't know if you, you hear this, but like a lot of people, everyone I talked to would always be like, she didn't get her due here in San Francisco. People would say that.

People would say that. Yeah. That's kind. Yeah, because, you know, you're beautiful and funny. And everyone would say, like, how would the comedy people in San Francisco not be like, how great is this? What a great package this is. That's so nice. So that was kind of the book on you.

That's really, you know, no one's ever told me that. Oh, good. And it's lovely to hear. Yeah. And what's interesting is what I will say is I, I, attitudeally, I've always been one of those people who was never like, man, they didn't see how I was. You know, because I feel like it's a waste of your time. Right. But that is usually a comic thing to put a chip on the shoulder, right?

I'm fighting against something. Like, inner monologue. These fuckers just don't see you the genius coming off of me, you know. But I just always felt like, and you knew guys for whom that was always. and then you're like, you know what, you're not an awesome. Right, exactly. That's right. We're not all that love.

Right a new fucking 10 minutes. But I always felt like it was more, it was self-defeating. Like I just needed to get better. And I needed to stop taking it so personally. So I didn't. But what I was telling other baby comics about my experience there and other people's, I was like, you know, no one's ever going to see you as you are now in the town that you started in.

Right. Because they're always going to remember you as an open mic or no matter how funny you get. It's rare that they embrace, like, a native son or daughter and go, wow, you know, he started here and now he's here. They're just like, they just remember he was that little of a micer. And I think that was what, if I was ever, and I never left him like in my wounds, but I felt like, yeah, they just didn't, I had to leave. Like, I had to get out for people to change the way that they saw me. And that was just the way it was.

I never kind of felt bruised about it. But I will tell you a really fun story. Oh, good. Yes, yes. This is so interesting. All of a sense about me. No, that's what I love this. Because like I said, I, that's what I mean.

So another thing, if I didn't say how excited I am, to be honest, because like I said, you were, like, all of a sudden you were on TV and stuff, and people were like, oh, she started, and I'd be going to these open mics, and people would say, have stories about you. And it's fun to be here, and like I said, so whatever story you have. Oh, thank you. And you never know how you're perceived. None of us ever really do.

You're just doing your work. You're not really, typically, if you're a comic, you think everybody hates you. Exactly. You go in with that ass too. Yeah, they're smiling, but they all can not think it's in my fucking guts. But I do remember, and I will tell you off air, but there was this one club owner who would just never put me up. There are two.

Two club owners who would never put me up. And, no, three. Three. None of whom would ever put me up. See, the story's true. This is why they're up. They would never move up. And I never, as far as I can remember, I never complained.

I mean, you just kind of put your time in and you waited around. Sure. You got up and you kind of made your way where you could, and you got into the clubs you could, and you drive to, you know, Chico or Sacramento to get sets wherever you could. You know, Walnut Creek. You know. Yeah, wherever you could get a set. Tommy Tees.

Yeah, Tom Goodell, Tommy Tees. There's a place called Fubars in, like, Richmond Point. That was like just, Martinez, it was just murder. But I do remember them all saying to me later, some version of, well, two of them just said I always knew you were going to, like, blah, blah, blah. And I really had to not do the thing where I was like, go fuck yourself. Right, right, good for you. Didn't think I was going to.

And now you don't get to, like, come back and take credit for, yeah, being so shitty. But I just not that kind of person. But one guy, just one guy, who I've become very close with, I'll tell you who he is up here, said, you know, I was wrong. Like, you literally, I didn't see it. Yeah. And I was wrong. And I'm sorry. And I thought that was so lovely and so atypical for a club owner because they always think they know everything.

And it really touched me. It was really sweet because he never had to say it. And it was like a really lovely moment, you know, and I never, and then I wasn't like, yeah. I was just like, well, like, thank you for saying that that's super sweet. I probably wasn't that funny when I was here. Thank you, right. I think I got a little better. Thank you so much for...

But, you know, because typically club owners just will never admit. They just think they're, you know, everything. And I think just as humans, like, it's so funny you say that, like, what an impact that had. I'm going way off. There's a weird tangent here. Go for it. This is the time. The, I just, this past week that I was on the road, and that documentary on SeaWorld came on. Yeah, the Blackfish.

Blackfish came on. And you know what touch is. It's amazing. And I know I'm way behind. everyone else had seen it. No, no, no, no, lots people. But what really hit me, like, really touched me. I don't know, it was weird, was the people who were part of it,

who were training for you ex-trainer, them admitting they were wrong and how much they didn't understand while they were in it. Right, right. It really, this humanness, like, I was like, wow, it's so powerful when you see someone saying like that, saying, hey, I was just doing my best. Right. You know what I mean?

Like, I didn't know, and I can now, of course, look back and see that this was all, wrong. Yeah, and not qualifying it. Well, look, because it was like this. It was like that. I was wrong. I was wrong. And I'm just willing to say that. And now I'm hoping that I can share this so that things will be better. So yeah, so even you're just saying that, I was like, wow,

I can imagine. People never do that. They don't know. Yeah. And there's always like a little butt or a little like qualification at the end, but just like, I blew it. I was wrong. I want you to know. It was nice. My wife and I were just joking about this because we were saying, she's like, you don't apologize. I'm guilty of that. I'm like, all right, I'm sorry. I'm

sorry, but you know, you really did that. And then five minutes later, I'll apologize. It's my fault for not, for not understanding that you were going to do that. I'm sorry that you feel that way. I didn't know that you were going to react so intensely. There's some shit that I think was not, yeah. I was wrong for not understanding your parents raised someone who didn't like go on act.

I was wrong. For marrying you. For you. That was my choice. So you're living in San Francisco and you're doing stand-up. Yeah. And this is like in the 90, like late 90s, early 2000. Late 90s, early 2000, yeah.

Tell me about, and do you meet your wife there? No, no, no, no. Didn't meet her until, yeah, until L.A. Oh, okay. So when did you come to L.A.? So I moved 2003. Okay. And what were your plans?

Yeah, so I think there was, you know, there was this whole thing in the San Francisco. It's so great that you have the connection to it. Yeah. There was the, I don't know if this rumor or ideas. was there when you were there, but it was like, you don't leave, you don't leave San Francisco until you're featuring at every club. That's what everyone kept saying. Oh, I don't even remember that. People kept saying that. And it just seemed silly. It was like, do people care? Like, does anybody know? Yeah. Does anyone know? So quickly, like, there was this whole backlog of people who you're like,

why doesn't that guy, that guy's fantastic. Right. Why doesn't he go to L.A.? Why doesn't it go to New York? Like, you kept wondering why these people wouldn't go. And there was so no one had moved in like three or four years. So it was a very big backlog. So it was hard to even move up the ranks. that. Right. You know, because everyone, you know, you want to go, you want a feature, but you couldn't. This guy's destroying. Yeah. Yeah. All those weeks were booked. So all of a sudden one guy, my friend Gary Cannon, he moved to L.A. And all of a sudden there was this exodus. It was like, it was like, you realized you could do it. Yeah. So, yeah, me and, you know, our whole little click all of a sudden that we had all moved to L.A. Yeah. And yeah, I think it was just that idea,

like get down here and see, see what's happening, do the same thing. At some, at some point, you do feel like you're just bumping up against the upper region. of what you can be there. I think everybody gets to that point. Yeah, let's see what this next place can do. Yeah. It's so different here comedically. I mean, just there's so many fewer sets that you can get.

Yeah, real sets, especially, right? Yeah, yeah. I remember, like, because I still had this, I got to get, I got to get never less than 10 sets a week. Never. God, I never had 10 sets a week in San Francisco. That is impressive. I was so, like I said, everything worked well well for me.

There were a lot of things, you know, you look back and you're like, God, so lucky, you know, like Obama making that speech where he's talking about, like, well, your business, part of what your business success is is there's roads that we built there. Like, I see some of that in my career. I'm like, well, thank God I had that job when I first did, and I had a car, because that opened up so much for me. Thank God this open Mike Knight and how well to open at just the right time.

And I was able to capitalize on it. So so many little things like that, that happened. And so, yeah, when I moved to LA, I just thought, okay, I got to get out as much as possible, just like I did in the Bay Area. But quickly, it was, the quality of the sets was much. Much worse. So I'd get up 10 times, but then I'm only performing for other comics who are trying to do the same thing. Right, right.

No, and no one's paying attention. No, and everyone's looking at their set list and waiting for you to be finished. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, quickly, I was like, okay, this isn't great for that. So, yeah, I started doing the road a bunch in touring. And, yeah, then I met my wife in 2005.

Here in L.A. Here in L.A. I actually met her. She was dating a friend of mine who was a comic. Rock and roll. I tried to meet her after a show, and I think she knew I wanted to meet her. Yeah. And she kind of bolted for the door.

and another girl came up, like, intervened and started talking to me, so I forgot about her. And then a couple days later, I got a phone call, and my friend Kenny, who knew her, was like, hey, did you, Denise, did you see her the other night? I was like, yeah, she was really good looking. I wanted to meet her. He's like, well, she was asking her, do you want her number? She was asking about you.

And I was like, yeah, please. So I called her. I was all cocky because she asked about me and said, hey, I'm going out of town for some shows, but can we meet before that and go out on a date this week? So we went on a date and hit it off, and everything was great. And so we start falling in love after three months of dating and we go out with another couple and they say, hey, how did you mean? And I tell that story. I just told you.

And when I get to the part where I'm like, yeah, he told me, you know, hey, do you want to call Denise? She was asking about you. My wife interjects. She's like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. I never asked about you. She's like, in fact, they were trying to hook me up with all their friends. Like, I purposely did want it. They really forced you down my throat.

She's like, I liked you the minute we started talking. But I did not ask about you ever. And I was like, oh, my God. That's one of those lucky things. If they hadn't told me, she asked me. You wouldn't have been that confident. I would have never met that. You probably wouldn't even call maybe.

Yeah. Yeah. What she ran for me last time I thought. So, yeah. So it was one of those things. Like I thought that I thought this was this great meeting story. And it was completely the opposite of how well. Oh, I love it.

I was like, pump your breaks. Yeah. I didn't know. I wasn't even into it. You won me over. Exactly. Oh, that's so funny. Yeah.

So, yeah. So, yeah, met her then. And, yeah, moved in. Yeah. I think six or seven months after that. Then, yeah, it was just doing comedy. And then you talked about the movie stuff. Yeah, so let's talk about your diagnosis.

How did you get your diagnosis? So I was coming home actually from a gig at the Braia Improv. What year is this? This is 2005. Okay. So coming home and I, my buddy, Gary and I, had both been on the show and we were driving home and I was like, hey, I'm going to paint him my side. It's really bad.

You might drive in? And until he started driving, then I was like, pull over again. I got to get in the back seat. And then, like, I'm laying down. Then he, you know, he walks me into the house. And my girlfriend at the time was now my wife, she's like, oh, you know, you probably ate something bad, you know, comedy club food or something. You got food poisoning.

I'd never had food poisoning at that point. So I thought that's what it was. So fast forward to like four in the morning. Now I'm like laying on the floor, like screaming in pain. She's like, okay, let's go to the yard. We go to the yard and they're like, your appendix probably birth. That's probably what it is. That's where they're, so I see the doctor.

Yeah. That's being that acute. It seems like that would be something immediate. So I kind of remember the face of the doctor being like, okay, you know, we're going to put you under. We're going to move your appendix, blah, blah, blah. And so when I wake up, next thing, I wake up, and I'm in a room, and it's a different doctor. And he introduced himself and he says, I'm an oncologist. And so now, like, I'm hazy and I'm like an oncologist.

What kind of doctor is that? What's that? Yeah. And then he says, hey, you know, they went in and your appendix end up being fine, but we saw your liver. you've got tumors all over your liver. Oh my gosh. And we need to run tests on this and we don't know. They never, even to this day, they have no idea what the pain I was in.

Really? Yeah, because the appendix was fine. But by the way, thank God. Because if you hadn't had that acute pain and cancer isn't typically painful. No, exactly. Yeah. Exactly. So they still don't know.

Like I've asked them many times like any idea what this could have been. And they're like, no, like it doesn't make sense. Like, I'll have some discomfort now because I still have the tumors are showing my liver. I'll get to where the story goes. but like I'll have some discomfort sometimes because like, you know, it rubs on other organs or stuff. Right. But it's like cramps at worst. You know what I mean?

It's not like this on the ground screaming in pain like I was that night. So it's so weird. But thank God that they did. So they go in and they don't remove the tumors. They just biopsy them? No, they just biopsy because they're like, it's basically all over my liver. Okay. So they can't cut it out.

They can't even cut it out. Because it had it been on half, you know, the liver is like one of those amazing organs. It could regenerate. Right. They can cut it a half and it would have grown back. But it's just too much. too many tumors all over. So the other thing they find is once they do the test that come back like a week later,

so they say, okay, these are malignant, is it didn't start my liver. They know it came from somewhere else. So now I go through like a month of tests. They can't find where it's coming from, where the source was. They eventually find it deep, deep in my intestines. Oh, my gosh. And did they find that? Do they biopsy or do you have to have a scope?

Yeah. Yeah. And they scope your whole, you all. your entire test. And I'd had a couple, like, different scopes of different kinds. So, like, going down the esophagus. Right. You know, every which way you can imagine, they did test. Right. Right.

Because you've got to find where this is coming from. They know, it's almost like the old horror movie. It's coming from inside the house. We don't know where, you know. Right. Right. So there's this panic of it. But they eventually find it there.

And then so, yeah, immediately they're like, okay, we're going to go and you'll, you'll have surgery. And luckily, this is, again, another lucky thing that, uh, I had some insurance, but it was like basically emergency insurance. so it wasn't that good, you know, as a comedian at this point. That was my whole full-time job. But luckily, I was near UCLA when I had the pain. So all of a sudden, I'm seeing, like, UCLA doctors

who were some of the best cancer doctors you can have. And so I had surgery pretty quickly to take out, like, a foot of my intestines. And then the liver part, they're like, the bad news about that is there's no cure or treatment for these tumors. They're a very rare tumor on your liver. The good news is your liver's functioning fine. at some point these tumors will affect your liver, but that's not happening. So now it was like,

some guys wanted to try some experimental things. Other doctors were saying, listen, let's leave well enough alone. We've had things where, like, electrolysis was one of the things. They're like, we've had success shrinking tumors with electrolysis. Well, then another guy came up, you know, it's like a board of doctors, and he talked to actually my wife, and she's like, we're not doing this because we were very considering it.

And then she talked to this guy. He said, we did in one, experiment, the electrolysis actually made the liver fail and the person died. Right. Right away, we're like, forget that. Yeah. If nothing's affecting liver, let's just wait and see what happens. And what they're saying is there's no course for this.

There's no chemo. There's no radiation therapy for this particular kind of cancer. We don't know what to do. It doesn't do it yet. Chemo and radiation do nothing. And so you're like, well, you could live through it and see what happens or we could just like fuck with it and maybe end your life. Right.

Exactly. Yeah. Try something, but we don't know. experiment at that point. So let me ask you a question. Yeah. At this point, are you essentially given like a like a prognosis, you have inoperable liver cancer?

Inoperable liver cancer, exactly. And so of course you ask that, so they say at this meeting, and it's again, it's very casual for them. These are doctors that talk about this all the day. Well, they're dead inside all of them anyway. But, you know, we're hanging on every word. Yeah. So the guy in just offhand in one part says, you know, we've seen people,

you know, the good thing is we've seen people, these tumors, sometimes they grow slow, you know, you could live as long as 10 years with this. Like, and it quickly, like my wife, she was my girlfriend at the time still, which was crazy that she stuck with me through this. Like, again, that you would get, be with someone who is getting basically this scenario and be like, do I stay with? Like, this is crazy. We were only less than six months together at this point. Oh, my God. And you're like, I want to build a life with someone who might not be around.

Yeah, she's in early 30s too. That's obviously a big time for planning families and stuff like that. Am I going to waste this with someone who might? not be around soon. So, but so we, as he said the best case scenario, of course, we're both like, well, if you're telling us the best case, what's, what's the worst case scenario? And so he goes, five years. Worst case, you know, five years, these could excite and that could be it. So of course, that's all of a sudden, that's all we're focused on. The worst, you know, five years, I might only have five years to live if they don't come up with a treatment or cure in the meantime. So that's kind of

where I went from that. So, of course, everything you hear, like, you know, disbelief, anger, depression, like all those stages that you go through. Like, is this true? And, you know, I always say the sad thing and the good thing is the routine of life. Yeah, yeah. It saves you. Because, you know, after I was shocked, my girlfriend shocked, but after two weeks,

every, my family and everyone had gone back to their normal lives. Right, because they had to. Right. And I'm like, yeah. How can everyone do this? Yeah. I'm dying. I have five years to live.

I can't believe, you know, this is. but then a week after that I was like, holy shit, I got to pay rent. Right, right, I got to eat. I have to go back to work. Yeah, at the morning, got to take a shit. So luckily, yeah, exactly. Luckily, that saved me as well.

Yeah, because I think that you, most people, not Americans, most people would think in this particular case and five years is a longer prognosis than like, you know, certainly, of course, yeah. So you've got, it's a weird, it's a weird length of time because it's lengthy enough for you to return to the mundane.

And yet short enough for you to be like, what am I going to do if this is the last amount of time I'm allotted here. Yeah. And I would curl up in a ball and get fucked up. Yeah. So there was a bunch of that. Yeah.

Yeah. There was, yeah, there was, uh, there was times where I'm like, oh, yeah, why, why am I worried about anything? Like, yeah, I just started eating shitty drinking is, you know what I mean? Like, and again, to, you know, some of the, the pain and the disbelief and, you know, you just want to go. Yeah. So again, yeah.

So all these kind of things. So when I kind of came out the other side and was like, okay, who knows? And I'm not a generally a worst case scenario guy. But I was like, all right, if you really only have five years, I think just like anyone, if they give you three months or whatever is, how do you want to spend that time? Yeah. So one of the big things, the reason I got into comedy was I was a huge Letterman fan when Letterman came about and I loved the comedians that he always had on. And that was always my goal when I got into comedy, like to be on Letterman. And, you know, in the meantime, like from when I was a kid and fell in love with it, he became the pinnacle for comedians too.

You know, it was Carson, and then when Carson retired, it became Letterman. Yeah, for sure. And so that became my goal. So to spend whatever time I had left, you know, instead of doing those 10 sets a week, it was, I'm going to make it on Letterman somehow. Right. So I started a project, this is crazy of this because this is 2005, to think we didn't

have Twitter. Facebook was just getting going. I wasn't even on it at that point. YouTube wasn't around. So I just started a website, and it was called Dying to Do Letterman, and people could see my video of my stand-up comedy. And this is like your set? Yeah, it was my set.

This is what I want to do. And there was a website, and there was a little bit. And there was a little button. And if you clicked it, it would send an email to Letterman saying, hey, you should check this guy out. And it was like, hey, I don't want to be on because I have cancer. Don't click this button just for that reason. Watch this set. If you think, if not, fine.

So this was my way to get their attention. Right. Because they're a little East Coast centric on Letterman because they were out there. New York center. Yes. And I wasn't even on their map at this point. You mentioned something earlier about San Francisco. I think that a lot of the, not just comedians,

but it does go this way in comedy. You think, I'm just going to work hard and be funny, and things will come my way. People will discover me. And a lot of that does happen. Like you, all of a sudden, someone takes you to a club. It said, hey, you should look at this guy. So a lot of that does happen,

but there is a whole other angle of where you need to be busting your hump. Constantly. Knocking down doors and going that. And I had never, things had luckily, they had always come to me. And now I realized, wow, I can't, five years might not be enough. wait for that. So it was this whole change of perspective of pulling all the stops at that point. So you've created a campaign essentially to get you onto Letterman. Yeah, to get their attention. You're doing stand-up getting ready, but this website is kind of the focus of this campaign to get Letterman.

And do you start to hear back from them? Not right away. And then eventually I did get a in the mail. Were you approaching them at the same time separately from the emails from the website? I think I had sent an email from what I had, but I had no real bridge to it. Like, I didn't know anyone who knew the exact person, that kind of thing. I didn't have any of that. So this was all just, you know, homemade at that point. And so I got a letter one day, and it had the late show with David Letterman letterhead, you know, on the envelope and everything. And I was like, oh, what is this?

And then I was like, well, why wouldn't I get an email? This seems weird. Yeah, right. Yeah, exactly. I was like, this might be legal. It's assigned. Like this might be like a season to this letter. we are not impressed

so I open it up but sure enough it's from the executive producer Barbara Gaines and it's a letter and I think they didn't know I was a full-time

stand-up comedian at that point I think all they knew was they were getting all these letters emails from people saying put this guy on but it literally in the letter says you will not be on the show

it is impossible blah blah and like that and so like just like obviously a shock of like whoa heartbreak this is yeah

like it's not gonna and again like just completely dismissive. Yeah. And I'm not saying this in a bad way about that. I'm sure they have doing their job, whatever that is. You know, trying to get their attention. So I understand some of it was probably just a form letter.

Right. Right. So. And they have to be kind of definitive about it because they really want to like slam the doors. Of course. Yeah. They don't want to leave anything open. Yeah. Exactly.

So, but to me it was such a shock. And then again, almost like the diagnosis. After a couple weeks, I was like, you know what? Okay. I'm actually going to look at this positive. Now they know they've heard about me. Now I just have to prove to them that I am a comic and then I'm good enough to be on the show. Like now you've got, the hardest part was getting their attention.

Now they know. Now it's just proving that part wrong that they know. And so then luckily, very, I don't know, probably five or six months after this. So I'm still, you know, bugging them, reaching out, putting other sets up and people still sending him stuff. A club owner who may be the same guy that we mentioned really, Tom Sawyer in San Francisco. Eddie Brill had come to town and he, Tom Sawyer, had heard. heard about it. And Tom's Jorge had never been a fan. A supporter. He put me up, you know, and he gave me stage time, but he had never, and this is everyone. So he had, I don't know,

he never gave me a compliment. No, I don't think he gave anybody a compliment. So it was so surprising, but he told Eddie Brill, who was the booker of the show at the time, he's like, you should look at this guy, he's good. Wow. So it was just that little thing that, so now I had the booker's attention. So that was, so by the time he reached out now, maybe, I had given myself originally, it was so crazy. I had said, I'm, I'm going to give myself a year. to get on. Yeah. Even though I had five years,

you know, was the worst case scenario. And so by the end of the year, I finally heard from Eddie Brill and he's like, okay, send me a tape. I'll watch it. And so I send him a tape

and then he gets back to me and he's like, okay, I'd send him a 10 minute. I figure if I have his attention. Right. Rather than send him five minutes, I'm going to send him 10. Also that he knows he's got choices.

Right? Exactly. You know, you think about all these angles. Yeah. So I do that and he's like, there was one joke out of the whole thing. It was a short joke.

It was like a 10-second joke. And he's like, yeah, Dave would love this. He's like, the rest of the stuff wouldn't work for the show. Oh, my God. So again, and now the same thing. So disappointment, sad, like crazy. But now I'm like, all right, well, there's one joke. Now I just need to come up with the other five minutes.

So it basically goes on and on, just this back and forth of me bugging and going back and working, coming up with new material on that. And in the meantime, a couple here in Los Angeles heard about the project. and they were young filmmakers just out of UCLA. They said, we think this would make a great documentary. We'd love to follow you and see where this goes. And they originally signed up just before,

like, when I first started the campaign. So I think they thought it was going to be like a year project. Right. And again, this ends up stretching out like five years of them filming stuff. So, yeah, so they were making a documentary about the whole thing the whole time. That's fine. So you're going back and forth with him for this long period of time, just writing, are you writing jokes and sending him new sets?

and so the whole process and you know like so there's writing coming out with new material right and then you've got to polish it then I got to polish it yeah so that's a good three month period like for a for a joke right even with your 10 sets exactly exactly so yeah just just doing that trying to polish it and then putting them in the right order like how does it how will this work as a set

you've got to get a call back at the end you got to get your big laugh and all that stuff yeah it's nerve wrecking and there's something about developing a set for TV that's different than developing a set for a club it's really got to be super like punch punch punch punch punch punch, punch, super tight. Right. No filler. In some ways, more truncated than the same set in a club where you can kind of relax

and interact with the audience. And it could make you really doubt yourself too. Oh, my God. So much, yeah. Yeah. And again, I'm sending things that people are like, oh, that would be fantastic. That would be great. Oh, what a great set.

That's a good finding. And then I'd send it away and he'd be like, nope, none of this good. Or I like that one part. Oh, Jesus. So little by little. And then there was a period where I would be sending, I send him like probably five DVDs, like of different five-minute sets and heard nothing for him for for a couple years and then and then a couple of years yeah so I was like is this is this dream over is it done then I got a chance

I was supposed to be working in San Francisco with Angayo uh-huh yeah at the last second uh Eddie Brill was coming to town for something so he ended up headlining the sink so I got the chance to work with him so I'm like great oh my god right working with this guy but he didn't really watch me like and I think I think there was some, I, and he's a fantastic guy. He's a super super, he may have even purposefully not watched. I think that's more of what it is. Because then he could claim ignorance. Exactly.

Like, he can't, I'm sure he at some level was like, oh, my God, now, no, this guy's going to expect me to watch him all along. Yeah, and then he's going to be bugging me. Listen, at some level, I'd been. Of course you would have. Bugging the shit out of them from as far away as possible. Now to be in the same club with him for four nights in a row. Right.

I'm sure he was like, oh, this isn't what I was looking forward to. but I thought for sure he'll see five minutes here there then impress him and you know at the end of the week he said no I think you're still still got some stuff to work on and that kind of thing so this what I thought was a great opportunity turned into nothing so I just he just kept sending the stuff and he had originally

given me a list on the very first set I sent him the 10 minutes him saying hey no no voices no character don't do any characters don't do anything you're pretty physical you're not going to be you wouldn't be physical on the show so knock that stuff out you know so it was all these things that I which just naturally didn't.

So I started, don't be yourself. Yeah, I was like, exactly. Don't express yourself fully. So again, I'd always have had people telling me like, hey, you're the Letterman kind of comic. You know what I mean? Like, and I was like so excited because that's my idol, right? Right.

So, and now here is the guy that was in charge saying, what you do isn't really the Letterman style. And I'm like, really? Right. But so all of a sudden one day I had this new joke and it was about hotel key cards and how they never work and what a pain. And it was all together, a five-minute joke.

And I was sending him a second. set of different material and this happened to be right after that material. And so I'm editing it down and I was like, you know what, I'm just going to leave it. I'm not even going to edit it. I'm going to leave this on. I'm going to send him another 10 minutes set. Yeah. I know this is all stuff he hates.

It was a very physical bit. I do my wife in it. I make characters in it. I send it away. And he calls me and he says, hey, I like this key card joke. That's amazing. He's like, I'm going to put you on. And it's going to be this joke.

And I was ecstatic. I mean, as you can imagine, I was with some friends when the call came through. And I saw his name. I mean, he had called me, you know, over the years and said, hey, I got your DVD, you know, go back to work, get back to those. So as it came in, and all my friends knew about this. Yeah. So I show it to my friend, and he sees Eddie Brill on the phone, and he's like, well, answer it. I was showing it to him almost like, hey, look, here we go.

Here comes another rejection call. And so then we were at a rental car place at the time. It was some other comedians. And so they were all in. I walk outside, and he says, I'm going to put you on. And so I turn and I pump my fist. Yeah. And everyone, there were like dogs in the window, you know.

I think they all start jumping up and down, my friends. And it was so exciting. And then I'm not even listening to him because I'm so excited. And then it was a Thursday. And then I realized he's saying Monday. Like, I'm thinking like some, I think I'm hearing him say someday or on a Monday you'll come in or blah, blah, blah. And then I realize he's saying Monday. Like in, you know, three days, four days.

I'm going to be on the show. And so then, you know, everything starts going. I got to get a suit. I got to practice this set more. I got to do everything. I got to change everything. So, yeah, but then I went to the show and it was one of those that was a great, ended up being great because they taped it on a Monday, but it didn't air until Friday.

So I actually had multiple experiences where I had that day that was fantastic. And then I had this whole week of knowing how it went. Right. You know the set killed and you got to tell everybody to watch. Exactly. And then I got to come home. We had a party at my place that night. And all my friends came over and, you know, the filmmakers were there.

It was kind of the end of this odyssey of five years. It was amazing. And, you know, I did this other thing like for the film. We talked to other comedians about what Letterman meant to them. It's so nice because especially him retiring recently. Yeah, yeah. Over the years, I interviewed Ray Romano, Jim Gaffigan, Arch Barker, Kevin Neeland, like all these, you know,

and they're all in the movie, like talking about what Letterman meant to them and how hard it was, you know, for them to get on the show. Like Ray Romano says from when he wanted to be on the show until he was, it was 11 years and I was like, oh, my God. I don't know if I'll 11 years. I never did it. I never did it. I never stand up on that show, but I remember I got my first panel when I was hosting Talk Soup and then I made a joke.

Look, you never know why. You don't get asked back. Of course, right. But I made a joke about, uh, that essentially was kind of like a thinly veiled dick joke. Yeah. And it wasn't planned, actually. It was like, I was just saying something about, like, how exciting was to be there. And I think that the language is like, well, you're so huge. You know what I mean? Like, and I was like, really humble to be there.

And then he made like, he made like, he made like, Oh, well, thank you. And then I rolled my eyes like, all right, buddy, like, drop the brakes. And I didn't get, I didn't get back on that show for like, oh, my God. I mean, it was almost a decade. Oh, really? That long. They just decided that.

Just based on that, like, that's my sense. I don't know why, but my sense is that in that three seconds, I like blew it. You know what I mean? I was just talking to someone about that this is a comedian thing. Our friend, he's a mutual friend. I think you started around time, Cash Lavie? Yeah. Oh, yeah.

Okay, so Cash and I were talking about. Comedians just know there is something we start to be able to be able to to read. Like, I've seen comedians. He was talking about a friend, uh, not having a great set. He's like, but he was having a great set. Just his first joke didn't go somewhere. Right. He said, and I could tell the whole time he was in his head about it. Right. And I was like, yes, I know, I know that moment. I see that. I've had that happen. I've been lucky to do some audience warm up sometime. Yeah. Yeah. And I'll see the host. Something goes one way. And then they're not even paying attention to the rest of the show. And it's just like that. But we're very, we can tell. There's an

extra little thing because you've done it so much and you've worked with, You feel the temperature turned and it can be very subtle. But you feel it. And everyone's like, oh, no, I didn't see. No, no. No, but my spidey sense is fucking tingling right now. My wife is always like, you're overeating this. And I'm like, no, I think I got it.

It can't be overread. Right, exactly. There is no overreed. Yes, exactly. We can go further. So this thing happens for you that you've been working on for your whole adult life. And then I don't know. How did you feel when it was over?

Well, it's funny because people always say, say, you know, we eventually take the movie out and, you know, people always, when we were at film festivals and it was in theaters for a little bit. They're like, what do you do after you've been chasing something that big? Like, you've dedicated your whole life to this. And now that's, that now what do you do? Is there a huge letdown? And I think there would be, but the one thing that helped is right then we knew we had completed the movie. Like, we had joked for five years about this with the filmmakers that there were only two endings to this movie. Either I was going to get on Letterman or I was going to die. Right? Like, we didn't even

consider that Letterman would retire. That wasn't even our thought process. So we joke about that all the time. And that was great. Like we didn't want to, like, that kind of set the tone of the movie. Like, they didn't want to make some hallmark, like, movie about that was sad. It was more, they wanted to do something, you know, you know, kind of more inspiring and get into the dirt like of joking about cancer and that kind of thing. And being less serious about it. So we knew we had the movie then. And so that was the great thing is that we, I could put all that effort that I had been putting into getting on to now, you know, taking the 300 hours of footage we had.

and making a movie out of it. Yeah. And then, you know, once that was finished, kind of touring with it a little bit. And, yeah, it's been a nice run. So now I was just saying to your assistant, like, that's the crazy thing is now, I feel like that letdown might come now

because now we're reaching the end. Like so it was at film vessels, and then it was in theaters, and then it was on, like, video on demand. It was even showing on airplanes for a while. Right. And now it's on Hulu, and you can get it for free because we timed it with the end of Letterman Retire.

Perfect. So you can see it on Hulu. Dined to do letterman. But this will be the last kind of thing. And after this, so now I really do need to find what that big next thing. I think a letdown will be coming where it's like, what do I,

I've always had one big thing to put all my focus on. Right. And now that, yeah, that I think it is going to be a big like, ooh, but again, that's a good lesson. Find what that next big thing is. In fact of drinking. Yeah. Before we do self-infected wounds,

tell me what your relationship is now with your cancer. Okay. Yeah. You can't treat it. Same thing. So no treatment or cure. So that's been the bitter sweetness of it. On the bad side, there's no treatment or cure for it.

But on the good side, I haven't had to go through radiation ongoingly chemotherapy. Like, I'll go to the oncologist's office. I have to go every three months for blood tests and every six months for scans to see how much the tumors have grown on my liver. And luckily, it's so minuscule. They think they've grown very little. But some doctors are like, this might even be an error of measurement. Like, they may be the same size. You may have been that lucky that they haven't grown.

So incredibly lucky. It's incredible. Yeah. So, but I'll see, you know, the people who are going through the ongoing thing, it's, it's, it's nuts. So that's why I'm like, maybe, exactly. That's why I'm like, I've luckily after that first year and the surgeries and all the, the, prodding of trying to find the, you know, where it's coming from, I really felt like a cancer patient that first year. And after that, except when I go to the doctor now for the scans and the blood tests and that,

I've been very lucky to live my life pretty normal. Right. With the quality of life is essentially the same. Same. Yeah. So, yeah, I mean, you know, I probably should pay more attention. It's one of those things, like my wife's very, a California girl, so she's very like, you know, you need to go to a raw diet or more yoga and all this kind of things.

And I've tried everything, you know, over the years. But it's one of those, like, I always weigh the quality of life with the quantity of life. I'm like, you know, I'm going to, it's great to have a beer and get drunk every now. Exactly. Exactly. Right. Fucking chicken nuggets the whole time. And I've had, sadly, I've had friends who got to.

car accidents and died in that meantime, you know, so you never know what it might be. None of us know. Yeah, you might as well make it good while you're here. Yeah. No, none of us know. It's true. And I think what's interesting about that is, I mean, you know, it's platitudinal, but it's true.

None of us do know, everybody should be pursuing a goal like this one, regardless how much time they have. And what's exciting for you is, and I'm sure you will come up with something else that's equally meaningful. Yeah. Yeah, I think so. Yeah. I think once I have that time to, again, sit and talk.

think because even that came out of like a time of, you know, reflection where he sat and thought, all right, well, how am I, what am I going to fill this time with? So, yeah, I think I'll have the same kind of thing. But it's been amazing, this selfish little, I'm going to spend whatever time I have left chasing Letterman, you know, it's kind of selfish thing for myself and my wife and my family to, like, you know, all the things I turned my back on during that time. You know, I probably should have, like, I had to go, we went quickly, even with insurance, went bankrupt from all the medical bills and stuff like that.

you know, a smarter or Lodiverse would have been like stop comedy completely get a real job that has better insurance. Right. You know what I mean? But instead it was like, well, if you're not chasing your dream now,

when would you do it? When would you do it? When the time to be reckless is absolutely now. Of course, so. So, but it's nice to say, the great thing now is like so many people reach out, just like you said,

like they've seen this movie or read the chicken soup for the soul people. Had me write a book version of it. Like, it's been so nice that people have, like, it's come back. Like, they'll send me a picture on Facebook with their, you had a screening and you signed a button that said, I'm dying to write a novel that I wear,

you know, and here's the novel. I wrote it, and it's being published next week. Or I said, I was going to go to Africa someday. Here's me in Africa, you know. So it's amazing, this kind of cool stuff that came out of my self-estream. Like, it's helped other people realize without having to get cancer, like that, you know, if you're not chasing your dreams, you're already dead at some level. Well put. Yeah. Let's do self-inflicted wounds. Yes. So my wife and I was like, hey, I got a couple stories. Which one should I tell? So we thought this was the best one.

I had a, I was working as a bartender in college. And my boss said, hey, he was with some girl. He was dating some girl in the college town. He was in his like 30s, but Dayton, you know, some college girl. And he's like, we just went to David Copperfield. He's like, if you ever get a chance to go see David Copperfield, go see him. And he's like, and women love it. He's like, she's going nuts.

Like we just, she loves me now because I took her. I was like, okay, great. So I, a few weeks later, or it must have been months. It was just in the back of my head. Good idea. Like, all right, if this girl really loved it that much, it would be a good date thing. So I meet this other girl and she's like, well, let's go out on a date sometime. And so I see that David Copperfield is coming locally to Rockford, Illinois.

And so I was like, hey, surprise date. We'll go out, have dinner. And I'm going to take you somewhere fun. And so she's like, great. So I pick her up. She's like, well, where are we going? I'm like, I'm not going to tell you it's a surprise. So we go there, we go, the whole time at dinner, where are we going?

Come on, tell me. And I was like, no, I can't tell you. So now we're walking up. And I'm sure, I'm like, once we're walking up to the theater, she's going to see, you know, the David Copperfield on the marquee. The way we walk up, we kind of come through an alley and we walk under the marquee. So she doesn't see it, right? And she's like, what are all these people?

And now they also do like basketball, like semi-pro basketball at this arena. So she's like, oh, we've seen a basketball game? She's kind of sporty chick. She's like, are we seeing that? I was like, no. She's like, is a hockey game? I love hockey. No, no.

We go inside and still, she doesn't know, right? And there's an escalator. And I remember us walking up the escalator and I see at the top. I see a poster of David Copperfield. Right. Oh, no, she's going to know now. I can't believe it lasted this long. Right, right.

You made it this far. This far. We're in the place and she doesn't know who we're seeing, right? Yeah. But I'm like, at the top of the escalator, she's going to know. It's David Copperfield because here he is. And, you know, the poster with lights all around it. Right.

We get to the top, and I don't know for whatever reason. It said, if they just hadn't changed it, it said at the bottom, coming soon. Oh, hilarious. So it didn't even say now appearing, right? So I'm in my head. I'm at the high, I'm like, hell yeah, she's not even going to know until we sit down. This is amazing. So she looks at the busser, and she's like, oh, David Caffreill coming soon.

I was like, yeah, because he's coming here soon. And she goes, thank I we're not here that night. I hate that fucking guy. And I was like, no. No! No! And I was like, what? And she's like, I hate him. Have you ever seen this stupid stuff on TV where he's making shit?

It's all camera tricks. And she goes like in this huge rant ripping. And I was like, I was like, I don't know how to tell you this, but like we're here. She's like, no, he's coming soon. He's not here now. It's like next week or something. I was like, no, he's, I don't know why it says coming soon. But he's here.

And she's like, no. So like, now I'm arguing with her. Like that he's here and she needs to prep herself. Right. And then I'm like, do you want to go? Oh, wait, neither say it's just to say. We did it for like two weeks. So that was...

Her opinion of you went way down after that. Oh, my God. But yeah, just... So, like, just what an idiot. It's probably better, like, to check some surprises, you know, beforehand. You know, if I was going to take a lesson out of that, would be not to listen to your kind of, like, creepy old bartender box. You know, who's like, the ladies love David Copperfield.

Get her a pinia calada and some hallopeno poppers. Pants. Panties are dropping. Yeah, you can make your penis disappear after the ship. Yeah. Seriously. So you're exactly right. Looking back, like, I really thought, like, he's imparting some wisdom on me.

And you're exactly right. He's like, he was the creepy bartender. He was like the guy with like the Maui gym shirt on. Of course, yes. He had a Porsche and he was like, he was like way too old to be in this college town still even. Way to old to be dating in college student. Of course. But he was my eye.

I was like, oh, my God. He's in his late 30s dating a college girl. He's a grown. He knows what he's doing. That's a great story. I remember how she wasn't even just ambivalent. She was like, I fucking hate it. I was trying to stop her because it was so, because there's people.

Like, it's crowded. Right. And she's like, I hate that fucking guy. And people are like, you hate him. Like, we're all here to see. Why would you come? That's a very good one. Oh, good.

I'm glad it worked. Steve, this was so lovely. This was awesome. Thank you so much. Like I said, it was awesome to be on the show, like I said. Yeah. as a younger person on the San Francisco scene to get to be on the show. It's awesome.

It was a pleasure. Thank you. Yay. All right. That was Steve Mazon. I really loved that conversation. He was so lovely to sit down with and I'm pleased. We were able to talk to him.

I'll put links where you can get the film and watch it and learn more about them. I think it's a really sweet and compelling story and I'm powerful and impactful. I think on anybody in any stage of their life who is wondering about whether they should pursue the things that are most dear to them. You should. You should get out there and do it. No matter what your set of conditions. You have one life, one run, one lash at things. So go for it. No apolloia. Other than I'm sorry, I keep wrecking my voice. I'm a delicate flower. You know that about me. I'm not a delicate flower. Maybe I am a delicate flower, and I think of myself as a big hunking block of wood, and I keep pounding myself into the ground like an idiot when I should be treating myself with more delicacy. But that is neither here nor there. Come follow me and friend me online, Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, MySpace. There's some jackass outside with an air horn. I'm going to go downstairs and choke the life out of them or her, unless it's a kid and then I'm just a dick. You guys are the greatest.

You are my army. You know who you are. You know what you are. Take all of your awesomeness out into the street and explode it all over everybody else. Metaphorically, of course, but go be awesome all over the place. And I'll talk you on the next one. Late. Girl on Guy is a production of Hot Machine, blowing shit up since 2009.