Girls Gone Canon Cast - ASOIAF Episode 16 ADWD Quentyn The Dragontamer/Outro

Episode Date: August 24, 2018

"Men’s lives have meaning, not their deaths." Quentyn plays with fire, and the girls watch him get burnt.   SIGN UP for our Patreon - first charge will be September 1st - ahead of time: patreon.com/girlsgonecanon if you sign up for a $10+ tier by September 1st you will get a BELWAS DESERVED BETTER sticker shipped to you. we will be back SEPTEMBER 7TH with a new POV, Arianne Martell!     intro by Anton Langhage       Eliana's twitter: https://twitter.com/arhythmetric Eliana's reddit account: https://www.reddit.com/user/glass_table_girl Eliana's blog: https://themanyfacedblog.wordpress.com/   Chloe's twitter: https://twitter.com/liesandarbor  

Hello and welcome to Girls Gone Canon episode 16, Quentin, the Dragon Tamer and outro. I'm Chloe one of your hosts. You can find me on the internet as at Liza and Arbor on Twitter and Tumblr and I'm Eliana your other host and you can find me on the internet as Glass Table Girl

on the Maester Monthly Podcast and on the Song of Ice and Fire subreddit. Thank you so much for joining us. We are, as you know, at the end of Quentin's journey. Rip. Rip. Rip.

I know, right? We have a couple of exciting things, though, that are going on this week. Yes, Some bad news but it'll only lead to good news in the long run. Yeah, you guys will totally be

fine. Wait it down on the podcast. Okay, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I can undo. No, it's too late. This is what we've become. Eliana's right. There are a ton of fun things coming. Yes, there's one disappointing thing, but we'll get over it.

You guys will too. The good does not wash out the bad. The bad does not wash out the good. First up, we want to announce the giveaway winner. We've been advertising the past couple weeks about doing a giveaway for Fire and Suds game of thrones themed

bath suds they are newer on twitter check them out at fire and suds but we did pick a winner the winner of this is going to get a denarius drogon egg bath bomb and also cersei's pot of wildfire and drum roll please Aliana that was really good thank you Aliana you're doing great the winner is Miss G M. Garena on Twitter so we will be getting in contact with you asking for an

address for shipping and we are so excited and happy for you that you won this. You deserve some wonderful fizzy bath bomb relaxation a la Game of Thrones style. Woo! It was kind of fun. No, it's very fun. I was explaining

what bath bombs are to my partner the other day, and he was all like, I've never heard of this. And I was like, well, this is heard of this and i was like well this is what it is he was like that's cool so it's very cool and of course we have stickers uh we have many things available now on patreon and so as you all know we've soft launched that uh it hasn't actually started until september but you can pledge your swords to us now if you'd like on patreon um you'll notice that it says your pledges won't start happening after every creation but only once a month um it's just that in order to put

a pause on it we had to set it to that for now but as a reminder everyone who pledges ten dollars or more by september 1st gets a strong bell boss bell boss deserve better sticker. So far, number three is winning based on votes that are on Patreon that reflect the ones in the Twitter poll we just had. Yeah, it's because number three is the best. I think number two is really the best. I mean, it works on a lot of

levels. I'm just saying number two. Eliana really loves sticker number two because it's Strong Belwoss is shitting over a corpse. You can't see the corpse, but it's there in your heart. And Strong Balwas is censored over his butt with Girls Gone Canon. So that's a very meta. And I do appreciate your best pick.

My favorite is definitely Strong Balwas that has the locust in his hand and his other hand as a rock. And then the hearts and the Girls Gone Canon and the it's just very good. So if you haven't checked that out, you should definitely jump onto our Twitter. You can scroll in our media and see those at Girls Gone Canon on Twitter dot com. Little plug there. If you're not following us, you definitely should be. You can watch Eliana and me talk to each other. Or ourselves. I don't know.

We could theoretically just have a conversation of only one of us with ourselves and no one would know. I mean, I think we've done that before. Do you want to tell them the bad news? All right. So the bad news is mom, so the bad news is Mom's leaving for a week. I am going to

DragonCon next weekend in Atlanta. Labor Day weekend, so if you're going to the con, hit us a tweet, let me know. We can say hi, we can wave, we can be nerdy together. I'll be hanging out with a lot of cool people, so excited for that. Hopefully it's one of our

listeners or something, who knows? But because of that, we're not going to have an episode next week. We're going to start our new point of view the week after next. We are, we are, and we are very excited for our next point of view chapter. It's going to be our first

female point of view chapter. It's going to be our first female point of view character. Like, how did we go this long without it? I've just been hating, hating. I know, you know, I can't believe it. We went through Ned, we went through Barristan, we went through Quentin. And I think it's time to get a little mix up on here in these point of views. And this one's a fun one. In our next point of view chapter,

when we come back on September 7th, we are starting with Arianne Martel. So we decided that we would make that jump from one Martel to obviously the other and that way we can get back across the narrow sea a little into the Game of Thrones once more

yeah we've spent a really long time out east and I think it is begging for us to get out west to finally get a little more of the action as much as we love our sad men that we've more of the action as much as we love our sad men that we've spent some time with. As much as we love those sad boys.

We have spent a lot of time with sad boys. Yeah, I think we need some spicy girls and some sad girls. Yeah, and I mean there's just, we're gonna talk about it a little, today we're gonna definitely talk about it more on September 7th as to why we feel that

arianne was a great choice to follow up quentin i mean of course yes they're siblings but arianne's storyline is just so influenced by living in the shadow of quentin which i mean reading quentin's chapters i i'm sure he would be just so surprised to hear that anyone was living in his shadow. Yeah, he felt like he was the shadow. Indeed. And for all of our patrons, if you are spending $1 or more in our tiers, all notes will be up on September 1st from our shows. We have been uploading a couple at a time here and there, but they

will all go live for you on the first. So if you want to see some of our salacious banter with each other or our silly puns or what didn't quite make it to the end game of our podcast, what hit that cutting room floor, make sure to subscribe if you

are in our $1 tier or up. If you want to see our jokes or just us flirting with each other within we do a lot of flirting we do do that how much of that is I encourage it

so with that we are going to stop right into our lightning round of the chapters that we missed we're near the end of Quentin's storyline and the end of A Dance with Dragons. As we said, this last chapter is kind of near the end of the book, so we will go ahead and include other chapters not just in the East. We start with the Griffin reborn. John Connington, who is indeed still queer and still here, takes back his home and small keeps along

Cape Wrath back with the help of the Golden Company. He thinks on Rhaegar and greets Aegon, planning to take over Storm's End, and Aegon wants to lead the attack. We head further north then, with the sacrifice. Asha Greyjoy is a prisoner in Stannis Baratheon's

camp, and the camp is hungrily drowning in the snows. She meets someone she thought was lost to her, and he remembers his name. One of the best moments in the whole book series, okay? You have to remember your name. So good. so good in Victarion 1 Victarion burns seven Lysini bed slaves in a boat

to give tribute to both the drowned and red god Mako reads the Valyrian glyphs on dragon binder to Victarion I'm just like seeing Victarion singing I'm on a boat about a lonely island that is him though that is

absolutely him I'm on a boat and going fast and we should do that we should make this parody oh i'm ready i'm ready next we have the ugly little girl where aria takes on her first face and is given her first target to kill. In Cersei 2, Cersei atones for her sins and finds a new glimmer of vengeance on the horizon. And then in Tyrion 12, Tyrion writes a new deal, written blood, with Brown Ben Plum, joining up with the Second Sons,

and hatches a plan on how to get them to turn sides once more in the king breaker you can tell how jaded i am about baristan because like y'all don't know what happened in the king breaker like we literally just did this chapter with you guys don't don't make me do this baristanon does some shit, and he tries to confront Hizdar, and then he kills Kraz, and he goes to, like, imprison Hizdar, but surprise! All the dragons were just loosed on the city by some chump. I don't know if you've ever heard of him.

His name's Quintin Martell. Also, he dies. I mean, does he? Stop! I thought that was our thing now. God. How could you do that? What a rollercoaster of emotions.

Which of course brings us back to Quentin's chapters of The Dragon Tamer. Hellbent on stealing Daenerys' dragons, Quentin finds himself quite literally in hell. And also Daenerys' dragons. Quentyn finds himself quite literally in hell.

And also Daenerys' bed. Leakin' juices all over. A mood. Quentyn juice. Quench your thirst. We open the dragon tamer to time passing. It's the Hour of the Bat, the Hour of the Eel, so the Hour of the Ghosts, which part of me initially is like, they're just making this up now, right?

Like these names are just being made up. But if you take a minute to go over the hours kind of in a row of what we've learned, we've been seeing them a lot in these recent Essos chapters, but these are also littered throughout others chapters and books. Most of the Hour of the Mentions are in A Dance with Dragons, which, as Eliana referred to a while ago, is interesting with the idea of a time for wolves and the hour of the wolves. A Dance with Dragons, Dragon Tamer, Wayward Bride, Kingbreaker, Ghost in Winterfell, John 2, John 12, and Circe 1, in The Princess and the Queen, and in A Feast for Crows, Circe 7, and Jamie 1. And I found it interesting when you look kind of back on it that there's the Hour of the Bat, which is deep night or early morning there's the hour of the eel which is right

after the hour of the bat there's ghosts which comes after hour of the eel there's the owl a few hours after the bat but before dawn and then there's the hour of the wolf the black is part of night after the owl and of course there's the nightingale which comes after the wolf which i would guess would be morning-ish. You know, this is all like eight hours, I feel like. Well, I guess it's like one, two, three, four. It's five hours. I mean, that's a pretty solid chunk.

It's a solid chunk. There are definitely like other hours, and we'll figure them out at some point. Yeah. Anyone, I know we missed our chance because we didn't think this through before Worldcon, but next time you have a chance to ask George R.R. Martin questions, please ask him, what are all of the other hours? Because now I'm emotionally invested into this. We're going to make a personality quiz about which hour you are. And also this ties into some of the past

Quentin chapters, like this, this idea of the passage of time, like the sperm suitor starts with, it was the hour of the ghosts. Like, okay. Quentin finds himself lying in bed, driven to anguish with thoughts of fire and blood,

unable to sleep. He pours himself a cup of wine in the dark, trying to convince himself it will help him sleep which like i get that same yeah i've definitely done that before which turns out is kind of counterintuitive maybe i mean like the passing out passing out helps but turns out being drunk actually gives you a less good quality of sleep it's something like you don't get quite as good of like REM sleep or something, which can leave you feeling more tired.

And this is just a fun health fact for me. Not that it's ever stopped me from drinking before bed before. So on top of Quentin's self-destructive behavior, he like lowers the flame, touching it to his flesh and he starts like crying out in pain, which jairus is creeping around on him and shows up in his room which that kind of just sounds like he was cheating on him which yeah same boyfriends but shows up in his room because like he hears quentin writhing around noisily in his chambers and jairus is like yo like what the fuck is this your kink like he's, just pouring hot wax on himself and flame on himself?

Like, is this what you're into, Quint? Is this what you're about? I understand the flame with the wax part. It's like, who hasn't, like, used to, like, stick their fingers in, like, the candle and just make little balls of wax? Because you're like, whatever, this is fun. You're like, this is fun now. Like, I don't have toys, I guess. And then, but yeah, I did have a similar thought that Jairus was like, this is fun now. Like, I don't have toys, I guess.

And then, but yeah, I did have a similar thought that Juris was like, what's going on here? I kind of wonder if, like, Dandy's maids were also like, what's she doing? She's sacrificing babies. She does some, like, other weird stuff, too. Killing virgins. Yeah, I mean, probably. Yeah, witch shit. Bathing in their blood you know the use i also just love the progression of quentin's actions in that sentence of like the prince today abed staring at the ceiling dreaming without sleeping remembering imagining twisting

beneath his linen coverlet what What a word, coverlet. His mind feverish with thoughts of fire and blood. And like, I don't know, that progression to twisting, you know, with that imagining and feverish. It sounds like he's kind of ill. But also some of that language feels very passionate. Like, you know, when you're like tossing and turning in bed, thinking about someone that you love or like are into or something,

which like, I guess Quentin's not. He's real nervous. Same death. Fire, passion, you know. It reminds me of that language that we hear in Melisandre 1 that represents John and Danny banging it out. Shadows in the shape of skulls, skulls that turn to mist, bodies locked together in lust, writhing and rolling and clawing through curtains of fire, great winged shadows wheeled against a hard blue sky. Yeah, a hard blue sky.

A hard blue sky. More like a hard blue ice schlong. Oh yeah. Quentin, are you mad? No, just scared. I do not want to burn. Oh my god, is that your baby Quentin, are you mad? No, just scared. I do not want to burn. Oh my god, is that your baby Quentin voice?

I think so. I don't know. Wow, my son. I'll be honest, my son. It makes me think of this chapter of Daenerys I in A Game of Thrones when they're talking to Illyrio and Viserys and Dany are there and there's this line where Viserys says the realm will rise for its rightful king. Tyrell, Redwyne, Derry, Greyjoy, they have no more love for the usurper than I do the dornish men burn to avenge elia and her children which like

meta super meta the dornish men burn to avenge elia and her children they do mostly like in the present day to avenge obran of course but like the obran thing happens because of elia and her children like the dornish haven't forgotten it's all one thing a mildly spicy take kind of like i like the way that jorah line is written sure of like oh you know the small folk don't care they pray for like i don't know good rain or whatever but like jorah's wrong jorah was wrong the dornish do care also this question where jairus like asks quentin if he's mad you know like it's interesting that quentin's being asked that because madness is such a strong theme in danny's storyline she's also always questioning herself if she's mad and how far

is that line between madness and greatness but she like quentin you know they're all just scared little children trying to make their way in the world oh absolutely and with that line from Jorah and the small folk I mean and the Dornish caring we're gonna see that come the Ariane chapter where she goes to Sunspear and I mean the people love her all of the people not just you know the high court in people, not just, you know, the high court in Dorne, not just them. It's all the people are, you know, saying, hello, Princess Arianne. I mean, she is a public figure. And that's super important of what keeps these places afloat. Yeah.

Jairus offers jokingly to get Quent a woman from the Temple of the Graces, and he exclaims that only the Red graces fuck out of the different graces there are. There's just like a ton of exposition on the religious factions here, and how the Westerosi did- how the Westerosi old septas are prunes, and that the religious order in the east is so much

different. When it rains, instead of the workers running indoors, there are actually snuggeries in the pleasure gardens, and they wait there until they're chosen by a man. Those who are chosen must remain until the sun comes up. They're feeling lonely and neglected. We could console them. Which, like, that's not how sex work works.

Like, fuck off, Jairus, you piece of fucking fried bologna. Which is I think one of the top tier insults that we've had so far on this show. I still like glorified houseplant but fucking fried bologna might be good too.

I like the idea of this fucking fried bologna. I don't know if I like the idea of a fried bologna. Anyway. It's good. We gonna like have a more hashtag nuanced take on jairus as this goes though like for example you know like jairus is basically trying to persuade quentin to fuck someone because i mean jairus isn't wrong that like danny isn't the only woman in the world I don't think that like the way

Jairus goes about it is right but like you know like Quentin is on a suicide mission he's like what if you didn't die a virgin yeah but also like damn yeah yeah I don't know

I swear that I will have a nicer more nuanced take on Jairus by the end of this-ish. In fact, there'll be a lot of nuance. He's got layers, we were discussing. Yeah, like an onion. Yeah. Three-dimensional character. All of the dimensions. Yeah, like, it's not just one slice of bologna, you know?

It's a whole... He's like the whole package, but it's fried, all of it. Yeah, it's a whole log of bologna, you know, it's a whole- He's like the whole package, but it's fried, all of it. Yeah, it's a whole log of bologna, you know, that's the 3D. It's not just the 2D. Jairus Drinkwater, you fucking log of bologna. Okay. Quentin did not want to die at all. I want to go back to Ironwood and kiss both of your sisters.

Marry Gwyneth Ironwood. Watch her flower into beauty. Have a child by her. I want to ride in tourneys, hawk, and hunt. Visit with my mother in Norvos. Read some of those books my father sends me. I want Cletus and Will and Master Kedri to be alive again. We have Quentin here thinking on how he doesn't really want to go through with this mission. And he just wants to go home.

He should. Go home, Quentin. Quentin tries to get Jairus off his back, being like, Danny doesn't want me sleeping with sex workers. She's not going to be glad to hear about that. And Jairus is just like, I don't know, dude. She might be. He's not. I mean, J, dude. She might be. He's not- I mean, Jairus isn't exactly right.

But I don't think Quentin's really right either. Like, Quentin's projecting some things onto Dany. Like, I think- I don't know. Does Quentin want- I guess he does. Like, based on what he's just told us he wants. He, like, wants to watch Gwyneth Ironwood flower into beauty and have a child by her.

I guess Quentin wants his bride to come to his bed, a virgin, but it's like, Dany's not really that's not a thing she's really hoping for, I guess. I don't think Dany gives a shit who you sleep with to be quite honest, and

she's been sleeping with that good dick Dario, and obviously he didn't become good dick Dario by being a pure angel just saying right like Quentin wants he doesn't want Daenerys he wants the idea of her and he wants to not disappoint his father

is what Quentin wants he doesn't want Daenerys he wants an innocent romance and he wants love which is something that I know you have a lot of opinions on and we'll get into later is how he is like his father. And it's like Doran. Doran married for love, which we're about to get into here, that it doesn't always work that way. Quentyn thinks he felt like a boy standing before Daenerys pleading for her hand, which of course kill the boy and let the man be born.

Quentin is unable to do that, and not that it did Jon much good. I mean, Quentin kills the boy, obviously. Quentin says Dany already has a paramour anyway, and that he still has a chance because Daenerys doesn't love his dar. anyway, and that he still has a chance because Daenerys doesn't love his dar. Jarrus then chastises him, saying that Quentyn, as you said, Quentyn should know better about love having anything to do with marriage, which leads into some exposition about Doran and Melario's marriage. What does love to do with marriage? A prince should know better. Your father married for love, it said. How much joy has he had of that? Little and less. Dorn Martell and his Nervoshi wife had spent half their marriage apart and the other half arguing. It was the only rash thing his father had ever done, to hear some tell it.

The only time he had followed his heart instead of his head, and he had lived to rue it. The only time he had followed his heart instead of his head, and he had lived to rue it. Not all risks lead to ruin, he insisted. This is my duty. My destiny. You're supposed to be my friend, Jairus. Why must you mock my hopes? I have doubts enough without your throwing oil on the fire of my fear. This will be my grand adventure.

Fucking psychopath. Quentin's a fucking sociopath. Jesus. I don't understand why you won't let me steal a dragon. Why won't you just support me?

It's not a phase, Jairus. Why can't you just support me? It's not a phase, dearest. Why can't you just stand me hardcore? That you are my boy. Yes. You're supposed to be my boy. Yeah. Exactly. That's exactly what's going on here.

What is happening today on this podcast? This passage brings up something else great. So speak Martin from the Citadel on Westeros.org, where a fan asked if Doran and Malario had discussed the reasons for why he wanted to send his children away. Why did she leave? To which George responded, It wasn't a good marriage. They married because of an attraction to something new and exotic. Sometimes attraction happens when you least expect it.

He was a prince of a distant country and she a woman full of life who was very appealing, who came from a very different culture. When she comes to Doran, she finds there are customs that are different from those of Norvos, especially regarding the fostering a way of children to others. This wasn't a political marriage, nor a magical one. It was simply an example of human nature. Sometimes relationships start out on a good foot. You become acquainted, there's a great sexual attraction,

you establish a relationship, you marry, and then in four or five years you realize you don't really have anything in common. That at best you've made a mistake and are in a situation that doesn't have any easy solution in a society such as that of the seven kingdoms where divorce simply isn't common. This is an example that it's not only marriages of convenience that fail, but even the marriages for love can fail. Sometimes the marriages of convenience in the seven kingdoms come out well and those that are for love don't. Sometimes a couple loves another and then at some point they don't. There are marriages that also develop out of nothing more than lust. There's no guarantee things will go well and the consequence of this is that disappointments develop and you end up

estranged, each person going their own way. There's some bitterness from Malario about this because as Prince of Dorne, Dorne has been able to stay with his children, and she has had to leave them. I feel like, I'm not gonna really dig into it, but there's like a lot in here that I'm like, so tell us what you really feel,

George, about your relationships and life. There's so much like I'm like damn George tell us more like this is there's so much and there's so much in here to take apart like in the actual story

too that I'm sure yeah like I mean of course there are a couple lines that I was like oh George what does that mean like attraction happening and how oh some marriages are nothing more than lust some are nothing more than this and then there's even the fact that he has put enough of this thought into Malario's bitterness that gives me like yeah he can't name the unnamed Dornish princess but at least he's characterizing that

Malario had bitterness and why she was bitter and how it kind of happened. I think that's interesting. Yeah, I mean, it just definitely feels like he's pulling from something that- Yeah, real life. Yeah, but- Real pain, bro. But yeah, and it's a fun contrast to Ned and Catelyn. That's also another thing that I was thinking about because of this idea of like

different culture it's not as far away sure the north from Riverrun but like Catelyn had some of that culture shock and she talks about having to adjust and she didn't marry for love she was just like well this is my life now

yeah yeah I think this is a great ssm there's a lot in there and it does a lot to explain it and then of course there's the fact that i trist just isn't mocking you quentin he's trying to save your life which is why his next line immediately in response to that is like, men die on grand adventures. But of course, Quentin still thinks that he's living in a story. And like, I mean, Quentin thinks in response to what Jera says. He was not wrong. That was in the stories too.

The hero sets out with his friends and companions, faces dangers, comes home triumphant. Only some of his opinions don't return at all the hero never dies though i must be the hero and of course like we know what the last hero that's not always what happens like not every hero is concrete and made that way and like hey the last hero lost his friends and his sword broke and then he died. You know, I mean, that's not just because you're the hero doesn't always mean it's like the stories, Quentin. For sure. And like, yeah, of course, like this is such a great meta of like the hero's journey slash the monomyth in many ways. And you can see how Quentin has grown up with those stories like the last hero

same as like the stark children and how this is just prevalent and how many people are patterning their lives off of it so i also think in testament to that like it's interesting that we have these prince stories all going on at the same time in A Dance with Dragons. You have Jon Snow, you have Aegon, you have Quentyn all on these heroes' paths. Poor Quentyn and Nobody Suspects the Butterfly from Aeswaf University did a really great panel on the reader as characters at Ice and Firecon in 2017. I know you were there. Basically on how there's a difference in disillusionments and how there's a difference in sansa and quentin's for example that sansa's story is the metatheatrical center

of the series versus quentin's disillusionment entering farther into his story where sansa's finally begins to lift quentin goes through his arc off the pages and he reaches his true true traumas off page where we are made to suffer sansa's arc as butterfly said sansa has her there are no heroes moment where quentin has his oh i'm not the hero moment which is a total inversion of sansa's arc and is like significantly shorter um yeah it was a really good panel i was trashed i didn't go but i read the notes so it was really good i remember i was doing something i was getting ready i think that was the manimals concert that night so i think i was getting for that on staff. I had a flask.

What am I gonna do with you? Quentin says that people will remember them and insists that Danny lives. He says Danny is lost, but he'll find her. And when I do, she will look at me the way she looks at her sellsword. Once I have proven myself worthy of her. Quentin. I know. Baby boy. boy baby boy it's not how it works baby boy it's fine he doesn't even really want her but he like wants

her to like he just like wants that approval so much he's like she'll look at me the same way someone loves me i know i love you quentin jairus loves him. Yeah, that's true. I ship it. And we've kind of hammered home a lot of the ways that Quentin mistakes himself for the hero of the story. And a lot of people have written about this. But I think there's kind of something else that's going on here. The Tyrion chapters are really good at pointing this out. And even though Tyrion hasn't met Dany yet at this point in the story he gets he just totally gets her character and who she is right in many ways like that Dany has suffered and that she had the kind of childhood she did where she was like penniless and homeless and she has come out on top after a while and like and because of that that makes her

a very proud queen and how can she not be after everything that she's been through quentin's mistake it's more than just thinking that he's the hero of the story it's that he makes a mistake of thinking that danny after everything she's been through is the prize of his story along with the dragons like despite dorn being more progressive regarding sexuality and like the inheritance that women can inherit quentin still very much grows up with these patriarchal these centered stories like the last year you know our protagonist in like the last hero in the prince that was promised the mistake that like you know is called into question uh by amen or like azor ahai and stuff

you know it it still assumes that a man is at the center of these stories and thus quentin fails to fathom that perhaps denarius is very much her own hero in her story she doesn't need quentin like she lives she hasn't died um and it's not because she needs Quentin to find her and show her the way, but it's because she's finding herself as we see in the last, in her last chapter. Right, when she has her Mufasa and the stars moment with Quaithe. And Viserys and Jorah. The best, I mean, it's the best cast you can ask for. Absolutely. She just can't wait to be queen.

She already is queen. I was waiting for the whole song. I was like, did she really write this whole thing already? I was prepared. I was prepared to jam out. Jairus continues to try to tell Quentin that this is a dumb idea, even

if you get a dragon and ride one. Upset at his friend's remarks, Quentin dismisses him, then thinks upon his regrets. I should have kissed one of the Drinkwater twins, or maybe both of them. I should have kissed them whilst I could. I should have gone to Norvos to see my mother and the place that gave her

birth so she would know that I had not forgotten her it's not too late you could go back and do all these things oh my god rain comes down in Meereen and it reminds me of some of those

King's Landing chapters when shitty things were happening in Ned's chapters and it was raining it's also interesting because this rain is finally catching up with us in marine when we read the barrison chapters they were talking about this rain and how they wanted it to break so i thought that was cool that it's another passage of time between POVs. Quentin and his friends eat a very simple breakfast. They make sure not to have

mimosas with their brunch because they're gonna drink afterwards. After they get these dragons. Yeah, which is gonna happen. Yeah. Right? Totally, yeah. I can't wait to see Quentin ride a dragon

and you it's just Bloody Mary alright the big man knew it would rain and he warns that fire and water do not mix but if love and hate can breed so can fire and water totally doesn't have the

same ring so I get it and a song of water and ice totally doesn't work either or water and fire it just doesn't doesn't have the same ring so i get it and a song of water and ice totally doesn't work either or water and fire it just doesn't doesn't work it really doesn't i don't really want to go into this never mind just go ahead i think on historical figures past failures and quentin says that they do not understand they may be be Dornish, but I am Dorn. Years from now, when I am dead, this will be the song they sing of me. But like, what if this doesn't end

the way you think it's gonna end, Quentin? What if you don't die years from now? And I have a song, I have a song lyric for this. It's like, I'm just a notch in your bedpost post but you're just a line in a song that's what quentin is he's just a line in a song it was a good song leave him be be nice to our song still a good song though this line does bug me because it's just like very ignorant thinking

and he's just not he you know, he's just really not thinking. And it kind of reminds me of a quote that we will get in Queenmaker in A Feast for Crows. That is Nymeria's star burning bright and that milky band behind her. Those are 10,000 ships. She burned as bright as any man and so shall I. You will not rob me of my birthright. So the Martells can get a tiny bit self-righteous here and there i know we'll talk about it more in future episodes but that just struck me as a great

little parallel of that line yeah and like him with his destiny the martellus for some reason like there's a sense of entitlement i bet oberon was thinking this to himself when he was like dying well when he was fighting the mountain and especially you know because he almost won he's like i yes my destiny i'm gonna win their pride their pride is what affects them they really do have an issue with that i feel like and it's kind of overlooked yeah they're just very sure of themselves for some reason i mean i would probably be that proud as well, had I lost so much and remained so, you know, hardened. But it's still definitely an issue and causes major blind spots for them. Yeah, for sure.

Next, we have Quentin and his crew getting dressed as the brazen beasts. They are a bull, a lion, and an ape. And Archibald, okay, because of Chloe's fantastic insight in our first Quentin episode, Archibald now reminds me even more of a Baratheon because he takes the bull helm, like Gendry and like Chloe pointed that out. Yeah, just like with Robert's antlers and how Gendry ended up doing the bullhorn instead. But yeah. Plus like they're big and they got hammers and stuff.

Wrathion is hell. Wrathion is hell. So smart. Today's password apparently is dog. Supposedly. Apparently. Quentin has decided that he's going to carry around a whip now because Dany used one on Drogon and he's like this worked for her

it's going to work for me I also want to take a moment to stop and admire some of George's writing because we're not dwelling that much on it in this chapter but like we should because the writing and the prose in this chapter is just so good in the same way that it's very good in The Wind Blown. So, the walls around them were made of bricks of half a hundred colors, but the shadows turned them all to gray until touched by the light of the torch that Jairus carried.

So good. It's a lot like how in King's Landing with the rain in a way, how the red, the pink stone turned to red. That once light leaves and light is draining out of it it turns to dark i just thought that was a nice little little tidbit we got some world building about the pyramids that these gates were once used by slaves delivering things from tradesmen we're gonna get so much more exposition in denarius chapters someday it's crazy to think how expansive this pyramid really is. There are huge sections. The apex, the hall,

the heart, the base, the dragon pit, and then the dungeons. There are actually 33 levels, which they copied off of old geese's pyramids, and it's a sacred number to the geese gods. I didn't know that. That's fun. Yeah, I thought it was fun.

I'm excited to get to those more in detail. They also come across some more brazen beasts who are guarding the door. There's a rat and then a fox. I don't know if it means anything, but I like it. It's fun. They use the password dog. And it works, I guess. There's like a moment of hesitation where they look at each other and they're like, all right. Which kind of makes me wonder, like, do you think that these guys were like fuck it it's not the right password but i

just don't feel like working anymore yeah pretty much i feel like shit and marine is kind of just going downhill so no one gives a fuck right now yeah they have this cool cart full of oxen and dead sheep also pretty maris who says the rest of the Tattered Prince's folk are inside including Kago Corpse Killer which they apparently were thinking they would use to hold a dragon. Amateur hour over here. We get dragon lore where we learn

Rhaegal and Viserion are smaller than Drogon because they are kept in a container like goldfish which we also hear about that happening to the Targaryen dragons in King's Landing. As they enter and really get into the pyramid and all this stuff, Quentyn says that his palms are sweaty and his knees weak, his arms are heavy, and mom's spaghetti. We also think, he also thinks that he's ready for the guards before they get to the dragon pit

but he's he's really not he's not ready for them at all like jairus tells them we've got to be ready for these guards and like he is a fuck boy but as we've seen in the past few chapters somehow jairus is the only one who is holding together all of these plans he's the only one who's thinking like guys we have plans let's try and be prepared and actually do them Ardribald says that they're ready maybe Ardribald's ready but I don't know if Quentin Martell

is because Quentin Martell is channeling a really big mood here there was a cramp in Quentin's belly. He felt a sudden need to move his bowels, but knew he dare not beg off now. And like, I get it.

This has happened to me. Stress shits are a thing. I will attest to the fact that this is a real phenomenon. This feeling that Quentin is feeling is very real. Oh yeah, this is very realistic. George really knows how to cater to his people as they embark quentin then thinks he had seldom felt more like a boy and as we said earlier it's a running theme throughout this entire story of a song of ice and fire with all

of these adolescent characters you have john's kill the boy but you also have danny thinking a mantra throughout her chapters is like that I am just a young girl. But she really finally accepts that in her last chapter. She's like, I am just a young girl. And there's just so much weight on the shoulders of all of these children. The pseudo hero idea supported with Quentin really is in the end, he's just a boy, not a hero. Magical heroes survive what he survived or similar instances where it's pretty improbable they would survive in other circumstances. You know, like being stabbed to death by your comrades of the Night Swatch.

Quentin is not that hero. In the end, he's just a frog, not a prince. Perfectly said. Thanks, babe. They finally get to the door by the dragon pit all the brazen beasts are wearing locust masks oh it's so dumb i think it's kind of fun it's kind of fun but it's like oh it's just like when they were on the stilts with the feather boas i mean that didn't happen but it did in my head his mask was wrought in the shape of a basilisk's head the other three were masked as insects locusts went and realized dog he said i'm so mad i'm so mad like it was right there it was right in front of you know that feeling and mulan when mooshu like is yelling at mulan like right after she sets it off i mean mulan ended up being right

quentin was wrong well he's like he was right there he was right in front of you and you missed but like anyway he was staring him in the face and quentin said dog locusts quentin realized dog you said oh my god that was a pretty dumb moment quentin this is just perfectly written locust like reading that out loud is just like my god the last two men in quentin's party have grown throughout their journeys the brazen beasts suddenly start moving toward Quentin. Quentin is still frozen. He hasn't even unsheathed his blade by the time Archibald has thrown a torch and defended his prince. He's too busy

being shell-shocked by the sergeant dying in front of him. Jiras saves Quentin from a spear to the throat. Quentin, go home! Holy shit! It's like still not too late at this point Right you still have time

Kago and Maris Come to get them While like I guess Arjabold and Jarrus are here Actually responding to things happening Quentin is just over here just like fucking muttering Shit like to himself he's like Dog Quentin said

The day's word was supposed to be dog why wouldn't they let us pass we were told I'm like locusts anyways this just tells us a lot about Quentin though he ends up getting too fixed on this like one thing on how things are supposed to be and because of that he can't react right in the moment

yeah locusts he thought dog he said i'm never gonna get over that quote dude ever i'm gonna text it to you every day it's the most perfectly written line i mean it's one it's it's up there i think i'm gonna i'm throwing that in my top 10 of lines i don't know what else is in there but that's in the top 10 now. Right. Like that's going to be number one, right next to,

uh, you know, like taste of dreams, a taste of innocence. Yeah. Like it's, it's up there. It's up there with the,

from porcelain to ivory. My skin has turned from porcelain to ivory to steel. We have that. Or like promise me she cried in a room that smelled of blood and roses or yeah we have those and we also have locusts quentin realized dog he said fuck and then quentin's like why did these men have to die and quentin's just like unsure and suddenly cannot relate to his father's plans. He whispers to himself, fired blood. Like, that's the reason they came to

Meereen. And also apparently they get to this door and they don't have a key and Archibald, bless him, he's like, I have a key! And he takes his hammer and just starts smashing at the lock. A great moment to talk about how much I love the big man, Archibald, the best character, left.

Just smashed him with his hammer. I love him. They do I love the big man, Archibald, the best character, left. Just smashed him with his hammer. I love him. They do call him the big man. Like, for the first time we see him in this chapter, they call him the big man. Yeah, they call him that last chapter, too. Remember? I was really excited. I know. It's so funny. I love the big man. Like, I'm really glad we haven't had to see him die. I don't think

he will. I don't think he's gonna die. He better not. He's endgame. Archibald is Azor Ahai. You wanna make a tinfoil that Archibald is a Baratheon bastard? Cause like... Oh my god. I mean, it's already better than half the stuff I've read or watched. It's so true.

Robert fucked, dude. He fucked. He really did. He really, truly did. You know who else fucked? Dunk. Dunk fucked. That fucked that's true also dario good dick dario dario definitely fucked anyways the rusted hinges screamed is the language we get of the door opening which never means good things see erin damp hair chapters as As they answer, the language becomes suspenseful and horrific. Quentin thinks, why else would Daenerys have shown

me the dragons? She wants me to prove myself to her. And I'm like, Quentin, you are again? He's so dumb. Dog! He said. Fuck. Locusts, he thought. I'm never gonna get over this, okay?

Ever. Now that I've, like, read that line aloud, I'm like, this is it. I want it tattooed on me. Christ. We're having a panel now at Ice and Fire Con. It's just us saying over and over again,

Locust, he realized. Dog, he said. That's it. Don't, he said. That's it. Yep, I'm in. That's it. Yeah, so he thinks that Dany wants Quentyn to prove himself to her, and this is, again, Quentyn just projecting things onto Daenerys. I'm sorry, Quentyn.

She just... I'm gonna throw this out there. She definitely does not want you stealing her dragons, dude. I mean, Dany just doesn't give a fuck about She just, I'm gonna throw this out there, she definitely does not want you stealing her dragons, dude. She, like, I mean, Danny just doesn't give a fuck about, like, what you're doing and, like, why you're here. She has a bunch of other issues right now that she has to deal with, like, oh,

disease, her people dying, I'm on a dragon and in the middle of nowhere, and like, you're over here, and you're just trying to steal her fucking dog. I think that's fucked up. Like, what are you doing? He's just projecting all of his daddy issues about how daddy doesn't like, think I'm good enough

and wanting to prove yourself to him, onto Danny. Just typical shit. Typical. Dog! Locusts! Christ. Master them, as Daenerys mastered Drogon in the pit.

The girl had been alone, clad in wisps of silk, but fearless. I must not be afraid. She did it, so can I. The main thing was to show no fear. Animals can smell fear. And dragons? What did he know of dragons what does any man know of dragons they've been gone from the world for more than a century what does any man know of dragons danny's like the last dragon it's almost as if this line's like about danny i don't know and he thinks that just because danny did it with jorgon and taming him so so can he so can quint for sure

which it's also shitty because it's like oh that little girl could do it i could do it mentality these chapters have honestly like they've been written from a young man's perspective surrounded by other young men and i don't know they're just really interesting to read from some of the shit I just shake my head and go the fuck excuse me not Quentin as much like I get him but Jairus sometimes will say shit and I'm like

dude look I know you got layers now but the fuck there's so many gifs that you just want to like send it them all the time we have more brick imagery because I like So many gifts that you just want to send at them all the time. Mm-hmm.

We have more brick imagery, because I like these. Wall and floor and ceiling drank the light. Scorched, he realized. Bricks burned black, crumbling into ash. Which I guess tells us that the dragons are here uh first quentin sees regal who has gorgeous bronze eyes also regal is long and green like snack and quentin attempts to call regal's name and instead the word that's used is he croaks it out so quentin feels himself becoming frog again and like he's just using this language of becoming

a frog again and life is not a song he throws Rhaegal some treats of I don't know like giant dead animals the Archibald reminds I know right and they grill them you know like Archibald reminds Quentin that there are in fact not one but one, but two dogs, and so you have to save some of the treats for that other one. Quentin's like, oh yeah, because he forgot. And so he looks around and finds the little cave that Viserion

has made, and Viserion is also long like Snack, so... Quentin says more meat to try and feed them until they're sluggish, because that's what Daenerys did to slow them down. Jairus is making a last-ditch effort to tell his friend, this ain't gonna work.

Loyal bitches, though, like, this is Jairus Drinkwater who led his friends into the Red Mountains to find the lair of the vulture, who jumped into playing a lordly wine merchant to help his friend, like, fended off corsairs to protect his friend with arch, told him to stay close to them to stay out of line of battle. And Jairus Drinkwater is telling you to go home, Quentin. It's what he's been saying this entire chapter. And like Quentin, because he's just so insecure,

he thinks that Jairus is negging him. It's like, no, Jairus is not negging you, he's begging you to just live, like, live your life. Go, don't be like Cletus, you know, he's saying, like, Cletus is never, he's dead. Yeah. Live for the life that he lost, you know, like, make it good for that reason. Yeah, exactly. lost you know like make it good for that reason yeah exactly in a way it kind of gives me similar vibes to rhaegar's obsession with prophecy ending him and something that people like drink don't have that same obsession with power or prophecy and destiny like drink water isn't a high lord

he's better off than most of course probably but he's in a nice wealthy court. He doesn't have to worry about stressors imposed on him to impress his dad, though. He's already doing great, probably, for himself. He doesn't have a ton to live up to outside his station like Quentin does. Drink brings Quentin the perspective of there are more important things. You can go home and kiss a girl and drink wine. You don't need this. You don't need to help your dad with his poorly planned revenge scheme. And Quentin believes he was born for it, like poor Quentin in Butterfly said earlier.

He is going further and deeper into his disillusionment. And then we get Viserion, who's now, interestingly, he's like sniffing at Pretty Maris, and he's able to tell that Pretty Maris is female, which means that the dragons are looking for Daenerys, because they are confused as to why she's, like, sniffing at Pretty Maris, and he's able to tell that Pretty Maris is female, which means that the dragons are looking for Daenerys,

because they are confused as to why she's not here right now with everyone, which, like, same. Same. The dragon knew his name. Quentyn tries to give this dragon commands, like, down. Just go home and get yourself a dog. You'll be better for it quent you can get a dog and hang out with gwyneth ironwood and yeah exactly be so pleased

viserion starts inching towards the guards smelling blood and they freak out for obvious reasons as we see in the pit with daenerys, and shoot a crossbow at the dragons. And, of course, chaos erupts. Another line that I love, because, again, there's so much great prose in this chapter. As he dropped his weapon to try and pry apart Viserion's jaw's flame gouted from the tiger's mouth, the man's eyes burst with soft, popping sounds,

and the brass around them began to run. I'm going to gush again. So the Dragon Tamers are such a good, just such a well-written chapter. The Windblown was also really good. Sprint Suitor and Merchant's Man, they're like, all right. They're not on the same level of language and prose as the Windblown and the Dragon tamer and throughout this chapter george has just really

been using a lot of imagery that appeals to all five of your senses which is absolutely necessary for keeping your audiences engaged when it comes to like that psychology of why storytelling works and what makes it so effective but i just i just love that small visceral detail. It's just so tiny, but the soft popping sounds of the eyes, it makes it so much more horrific. You're not just imagining eyeballs popping.

You're hearing it. There's just such a contrast, I think, to the horror of it and that idea of it's just a soft pop. Anyways, here's me catching feels over exploding eyeballs. No, I mean, A Dance with Dragons and A Feast with Crows are big testaments to George's skill with prose and to his world building and to just him writing, just him doing his thing. You know, it's not all about the tinfoil theories that are posted every day online it's

sometimes it's about george describing food for three pages and it's like you're there and you're eating it yourself and then you're really mad because you're not there and you're not actually eating it yourself but i digress i don't digest but i do digress you could pick yourself up uh a feast of ice and fire. Yes. And be eating some of it yourself. I like to make, made like a couple of times some of the biscuit ones. They're super easy to make. And I'm like, oh, I have these ingredients. This is cheap.

Yeah. Quentin tries to regain control over the situation, which I don't even know if regains the word we should be using here. Maybe get a semblance of control, maybe? Yeah, maybe just gain. Gain it all. Gains. Yeah, gains, bro. Quentin uncoils the whip, and he starts calling the white doggo's name.

So he shouts, down, down. And he tries not to show fear, and then whips Viserion, and then green doggo wriggles like, oh, hell no, you are not whipping. and then whips Viserion and then green doggo Rhaegal is like oh hell no you are not whipping you are not whipping Viserion and Jarrus no not Jarrus sorry Ardribald is now like freaking out and is yelling behind you behind

you behind you and like oh no it turns out I mean we've been calling them doggos this whole time but they are not doggos they are dragons and Quentyn forgot about about regal and then rip when he raised his whip he saw that the lash was burning his hand as well all of him all of him was burning oh he thought then he began to scream that's like the most bone-chilling line too oh it's just like quentin also since it's like his

perspective he's like a step behind every time you know until like the things are happening oh the lash is burning and now my hand like what god my poor son dude indeed the sun sun that line is so sad dog sorry locusts okay okay my dumb sad son is what he is he's a good son he's a good dumb sad dead son dead son dad he's so dead dude we just killed quentin and that that brings us now to our outro let's talk about let's talk about Quentin, you know? Let's talk about his death. Let's talk about his life and Quentin, our poor, sad, dumb, dead something

else son. So dead, dude. He's I'm really excited on the positive side because this will transition really well in doing REN. So high five us. It's really good transitionally how George lines that up too.

And of course, so the Ironwoods have sided with the Blackfires in the past in wars, which makes even if he isn't a Blackfire, which he is, the Aegon and Golden Company crew all the more likely to ally with Doran and Fam. You know?

In a way, which I know Brendan B. Fish might not love this one because he seems to have a different opinion for this parallel. And I'm not saying it's perfect, but I did just like the parallel that Jairus is basically the Kristen Cole in Quentin's plotline, the kingmaker

in this situation, because Kristen Cole pushing Aegon's rule, Jairus and Arianne are the ones that are going to be making Aegon king Jairus bringing Quentin's bones home pushes them to that edge of that decision which it's all but made up by Arianne uh I would say I mean it she likes pretty boys she gone like this one it's just in the cards you know yeah so i think dorn is going to look at this as kind of a breaking of guest right and safe passage quentin's bones charred and returned to dorn will completely burn that bridge no pun intended from danny to martel intended intended in a way i guess i

wouldn't really call it like the dornish Red Wedding but in level of betrayal that will be felt it's kind of similar like if anything with your parallel earlier from the Martells and the Starks and the North Remembers and the South Remembers I mean the Dornish Red Wedding would have been the sack obviously of King's Landing and now every event with every loss of Oberyn just like how you know Bran and Rickon are dead and then the Red Wedding and then Sansa finds out you know this person's dead that person's dead it's just these little betrayals but in level of betrayal this was a pretty big one we the reader know it's not Dany's fault but Jairus' tale is already being spun that it was her fault. We see that

in Barristan's chapters. The saddest part of Dorne is that, in the end, they will not win. Whether or not they glimpse the throne, get vengeance on the Lannisters, they don't win. Their whole plot is one giant O. It's up in flames. All of the justice for Elia was for naught.

It also sucks because you can see that, to some extent, I mean, Jairus and Archibald are, they are still young, and they justice for Elia was for not. just ended like they don't have that capacity for self-reflection and definitely not for the self-awareness that they need right now to realize that part of why they're pinning so much of it on danny and they're not even trying to like take any of the blame off of danny like they're pinning so much of it on danny it's because subconsciously they know in many ways that they are at fault and like barrison points it out he calls them out on it like you can see throughout the entirety of the dragon team where that gers keeps trying to get quentin to quit and go home but he doesn't really say it as much outright he didn't he's going to feel like maybe he didn't try hard enough i don't know if he'll know that

internally or not and i mean archibald didn't try at all like what was fucking archibald doing other he was definitely enabling quentin on these plans and i understand that he's been conditioned to think that's what he's supposed to do but he wasn't trying to be like quentin this is a bad idea like in the way that an advisor would like davos does that for stannis right he tells him this is a bad idea there could even be a few ario hota parallels in there with Doran. Sure. Exactly. Exactly. Because they don't feel that it's their place.

Step in. Yeah. And Jairus tries to. Yeah. But Quentin doesn't listen. As much as he can. And maybe if Cletus had been there, he would have listened. But if Cletus had been there, maybe Quentin wouldn't have felt as much pressure to keep going. and felt as much pressure to keep going.

But there's also, I think, something really poignant in retrospect for Barristan to be the one who's pointing this out to Jarrus and Arjabal that you're trying to pin this on Dany because your prince just died and you don't want to feel like you're to blame for it. Because if there's anyone who can relate to that guilt of being unable to keep your ruler alive, it's Barristan. He's just done that, what, three times? Yeah. Already as a Kingsguard, and he's dealt with that. And so that's why you can say

that's what you're feeling, that's why you're doing that, but it's wrong. Agreed. Agreed. So, with Quentin removed from the picture, unfortunately, rip. It also brings up the idea of inheritance in Dorne, which pits us between Arianne and Trystane left. And as we know, Dorne's plan for Arianne right now is to unite with Aegon and find out if he's real.

And this is kind of Dorne's one last hope because marcella's ear has been chopped off dude like that's some mike tyson shit right yeah tristana marcella are doomed dude they're doomed even if doran's plans the don't pan out with arianne i mean they can't fall back on that they can't retreat to the grass on this one they've already started that war you know and of course a it's so sad because they were just so precious and cute playing savas together but we also know that marcella is doomed based on maggie the frog's prophecy she didn't do anything to deserve this. No, she just existed, dude. She didn't ask to be incest baby-born. Yeah, if she was going to be

unexisted in this way, she was better off not existing at all. Yeah, why couldn't she have been one of the sticky princes, you know? That's true. God damn it. Sometimes in life you're a bastard, sometimes you're a sticky prince. Oh, God.

That brings us to the Sand Snakes. Yeah, so I think Nim, Tyene, and Obara are definitely doomed. I could see Sorella living and maybe two or three of the youngest Sand Snakes, but Sorella may be possibly ruling Dorne. I just, I don't see anyone else surviving and obviously i don't see arianne surviving let's be real i think you have you have a laria with a bunch of her daughters i don't know i don't think laria is going to end up in charge of dorn of course but she has daughters who you know like like Lareza and Luria

and the younger is what I was thinking, but, I mean, Elia's doomed. Elia Sand. You think Elia Sand's doomed? That's sad. She's there with Arianne, though. She is there with Arianne, like, I don't know, doing... Guess what? We'll get there in our Winds of Winter chapters

episode of Arianne 1 and 2 coming in the next month, but as you were. Which I haven't read. Exactly, that's why I'm saying, I'm like, wait till you read. I think you're going to change your tune. You're like, oh yeah, bitch doomed. I saw a quote or two in the LA Sand wiki, just because I was looking that up,

since a plug for Michael Klarfeld, wiki just because i was looking that up since a plug for michael clarfeld who's been doing some great maps of westeros he did the iron islands maps which chloe you're in yes i was a land of harlaw indeed and i guess i'm supposed to be modeling for elia sand so yeah you are i have to go figure out how we're doing that at some point. They're amazing maps. If you haven't checked them out, definitely check them out. Very fun. And a couple of other people are in them, too. Yeah, Asheya from History of Westeros, Aziz, I mean, Elamel.

There's lots of different people that have been on these, so definitely check them out. Coming back to Quentin. So we have this issue now, there's that inheritance issue, and obviously now it passes to Erianne, she gets what she wants, but she wants a lot more, which is going to lead into the fate of Dorne. There's a lot going on here when Quentin talks about how he's not just himself, like Quentin, the Prince of Dorne. He says he is Dorne. And the fate that Quentin gets, I think, telegraphs some of what we can expect for the Dorne storyline. Quentin is in many ways very much a metaphor for Dorne, not just in that political sense but yeah what's gonna happen like fire and blood is what Quentyn says that he came to Meereen for and that's exactly what Quentyn gets

it's what he becomes it's exactly what Dorne's going to get this isn't the way that they thought they were going to get it they were hoping they were going to wield the power of fire and blood but I mean that's not how it goes you can't control fire that's a big part of one of the themes of the story you can't always control these elements and passion and when Quentin Martell says you know like he's chasing after this vengeance

for his father and because of that he's going to burn as you pointed out the Dornish people are burning he dies and it's all wrapped up in this recursive mess because Quentin's death of course is what opens up that door for doran to ally with fagon because of all of these misunderstandings from jairus and argebolt and arianne's of course going to like take advantage of some of that and choose fagon because she's had a taste of what her destiny could have been. Destiny. Being Viserys' queen.

And she's not going back. We're going to obviously go more into this later, but this is going to lead to her making that same mistake as Quentyn. In that Dorne is going to turn their back on one dragon, chase after this

other one, and when they lose sight of that other dragon, mistakes are made and people die. Why would you turn your back on the dragon that has dragons? I know. I know. I'm like, guys, this is so like. We talked about this, Dorn. But both of them make that mistake because remember tyrian tells

tells fagon he's like always keep your dragon close but he's an 18 year old boy yeah the irion's pretty and irion's got ambitions and quentin's a cute boy and like everyone's cute hormones hormones are fucking everything up in westeros i think they're fucking it up for you right now you're like this person's cute you're cute exactly everyone's cute and it's gonna tear everything apart next i want to dig into the relationship in between doran and quentin sort of like in general because the driving force and relationship for quentin's character it isn't necessarily getting denarius and it's not aria and even though you know whom he thinks of like once his entire story and only as his sister which like i mean

he couldn't even call his own mother by his name, but, like, whatever, we're gonna get back to that in a second. The driving force in Quentin's story is his father and wanting to, just not wanting to disappoint him when he comes back home. And we hear, actually, a bit throughout a couple of these chapters, like, how Quentin is very much like Doran. He's a little more bookish. But I do think that's true. You know, we don't have a Doran POV, but I get the sense that Quentin's POV is in many ways a window into Doran's mindset when it comes to this plan for Doran's. Oh my god, I must sound so crazy on the other side here. Doran and Doran all the time.

so crazy on the other side here doran and doran all the time and you can see how doran has been plotting all these years for vengeance for ellia and her children and just as quentin thinks that he can't let his father down and that the deaths of his friends cannot be for naught doran thinks that he can't let down ellian her her children and that their deaths cannot go without having received justice. Now that they've lost Oberyn, Oberyn has died for all of this. They can't let the Red Viper, they can't let him have died for nothing. So now they're all caught up in this huge web of vengeance for their family. this huge web of like vengeance uh for their family and Quentin of course keeps he still sees himself up until the very end as the hero of his story and this causes him to think that things have to go according to plan because I mean like that's the point of a plan right that things

happen based on it and this is very much how Doran seems to think that things will go for him as well. Quentin seems to feel fear, but he falls short of fathoming that idea of failure very clearly. Because, I mean, they've thought it all through, right? So everything's gonna work, right? He's the hero but just as Quentin freezes up when just one detail goes awry like oh no the password isn't Doug Doug he said like what's Doran going to do when things don't go perfectly which is very much what's going to happen when he gets his son's body back and I mean we all know how that ended for Quentin and so like Doran's going to make wrong choices and get psyched out. And I don't know. My point is like, like father, like son, and also take. And there's not really much to say to explain this. But I mean, what if as Quentin is like Doran, Malario is like Arianne? I do like that.

I do like that. I do like that. I think you could be right on that, at least in her storm and angst. It reminds me of Cersei with what of my wrath. But, you know, Malario left and she was incapable of living in this feudal society's rules, living with the political stakes

of sending your kids off. And Malario today would probably be furious if she knew of what Doran was letting happen or instituting to happen. I did mention a bit earlier, but I did want to circle back. Like, I don't know if Quentin not calling his mother or sister by name is exactly like maybe I don't know. I don't know how I'd exactly talk about it that I want to point out. It has been eight years of him living in Ironwood, at least, like give or take. And, well, yeah, he probably visited Sunspear on a few occasions here and there annually. He spent the majority of eight years away from his family and Malario, I mean, had left by then.

So he became this young man wrought with inferiority complexes to his beautiful, wonderful, strong friends and the family he never sees anymore and was teased relentlessly by as a kid, which is interesting because Ariane has some of the similar experiences with how she feels about herself and how she looked. But Quentin being incapable of calling his sister and mom by name title kind of almost fits in with this whole shtick, I would say. Yeah.

I just had a thought right now oh no we've been saying for a while that i guess and i guess it's mostly me that quentin's projecting his insecurity about wanting to live up to like prove himself to his father onto denarius but what if it's that he's you know we discussed before that he was bullied, likely, by Arianne and the Sand Snakes. What if he's more of just wanting to prove himself to them? And he sees that in Dany, not Doran? I could see something like that. I don't know. But I say it's still Doran is the big thing.

I mean, he's the biggest part of it. Yeah, just like maybe on like some subconscious level maybe it could also be like well mom left us so i'm trying to make up for that gap maybe it's mommy issues and daddy issues yeah my diagnosis that with those mommy issues, you know, Malario left because Doran was fostering Quentin away, and it makes me think that there should have been a little more closeness

there, and that he should perhaps think of his mother more fondly. He thinks of her in this chapter and he's like, oh, I want to go there so that Govis and Narvos She knows I didn't forget her. Like Alanis Harlaw. For me, that's just one line where he says, Doran and

his Narvosi wife, like, to me, I assume that's just weird editing. I don't know. I could see that. It just doesn't seem like Malaria was fighting so much as giving in to her lack of rights from mating with a royal, you know? Yes. There's's that and also

we aren't ever gonna find out i mean is the important thing so i like to hope that maybe malari is gonna appear in the story but i don't know maybe she's stepped a little more oh my god you're fired this time thank you you're i quit this time you won't imagine if quentin had just chilled out right like i i just don't understand to some extent what the urgency was of like we have to steal these dragons right now like i know that everything was falling apart in marine but i don't know what if he had just chilled out and like waited for danny to get back and like why did he have to steal a dragon like why did he think that this is what danny wanted like what danny probably would have really wanted there are many things

that danny of course wants like for her city to be saved and like cured the disease etc but like i don't know what if quinn didn't just waited and he like helped barris didn't hold the city or something and like then danny comes back she's like wow that was really great good job fam like I'm super thankful and she's of course like thank you so much for not bleeding all over my bed and fucking it up but instead he just like loses her dogs and dies and makes a huge bloody mess on her bed and like I don't know like women can do that on their own once a month like there's a reason we don't do that there's a reason why you don't let people die

in your bed there is there's probably a few reasons why you don't like accountability susceptibility anyways also that would have been the real hero story if he stayed and saved the city to win the queen and kill the bad guys instead of win the queen to have the throne, like Stannis says so artfully in his arc without the queen bits. The real hero arc would have been more sensible.

No, Quentin, no one's made to go steal a dragon. That's how people die. You know, hindsight is very 2020. There were other ways. And now Barristan is going to die in a pool of blood after saving the city. That is more of a hero's arc, especially if Quentin had seen it from the same perspective as Daenerys. Like, that wanting to ensure that there was a place where people could be free. They had different goals.

could be free. They had different goals. Yeah, like, sure, they're not his people, but like, Bairstyn didn't forge deep ties, but he was like, oh, there are people here that I guess Dany cares about, and I should take care of this and hold it for her.

And, yeah, if Quentyn had chosen that, instead of him being like, oh, look at all these slaves and Ghiscari, they're just like roaches. What if we had decided to save them? I mean, if he had been a proactive good ruler.

But anyway, now he dead. Yeah. And other questions is, how soon is now by the Smiths about Quentin Martell? I think it is ready uh the lyrics are i am the sun and the air of a shyness as criminally vulgar i am the sun and air of nothing in particular but like sun with a u instead of an o you know what i'm saying yeah

but it's also with an o it's both both. In the song, it definitely is with an O, but it works on multiple levels. Yeah, multitudes of point. I just thought that was a great little easter egg, you know? It is. Oh, that should, never mind, they're a copyright issue, they'll be like,

that should be the song we play out with, never mind. No, no, sure can't do that, Fox. Matt, pretend we're doing that dear listeners this has been god this was a heavy episode i'm like heavy-hearted about quentin right now we're leaving we're burying him i guess or are we we're leaving him on the bed to die juicily we're just sleeping in there and he's gonna be that looming presence. He really will be a looming presence, though, in the next few chapters. Yes, absolutely.

We're not really burying, burying him, because we will be talking about him in Arianne chapters. So, I guess that's good. We're letting him, you know, we get to miss him. It's a metaphor. The bed is the Arianne chapters and Quentyn is on it bleeding all over you just had a locust dog moment

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And I have been Eliana. You can find me as GlassTableGirl on the Maester Monthly podcast and on the A Song of Bison Fire subreddit. Bye! See you next week, guys. Rip Quentin. Oh.