Girls Gone Canon Cast - ASOIAF Episode 195 — AGOT Arya III

Episode Date: July 28, 2023

Arya listens to the shadows on the wall, whispering that Ned Stark has the bastard, he has the book, and soon the truth of it—but not us, with no book nor truth.  Check us out on Bluesky! https://bsky.app/profile/girlsgonecanon.bsky.social --- Eliana's twitter: https://twitter.com/arhythmetric Eliana's reddit account: https://www.reddit.com/user/glass_table_girl Eliana's blog: https://themanyfacedblog.wordpress.com/ Chloe's twitter: https://twitter.com/liesandarbor Chloe's blog: www.liesandarborgold.com Intro by Anton Langhage

Hello and welcome to Girls Gone Canon Reads A Song Of Ice And Fire Episode 195 195, Arya in a Game of Thrones 3. I am one of your hosts, Chloe. And I am another one of your hosts, Eliana. And Arya, ready for another iconic chapter. This is an iconic one. Actually, yeah, it is. It's so iconic that it was made into a TV show. No, I'm just kidding.

The TV show is what adapted this. Yeah, it's the other way around. You know, my God. Sorry to forget the lore here at Girls Gone Canon. This is a killer chapter. Not quite yet. There are a lot. There are actual killer chapters.

There are a lot of things in this chapter that when you read them, some of it are seeds that didn't grow quite the way George wanted to to or some of it are laying seeds that he didn't know where he wanted to grow it. But there's so much laid in this chapter for the rest of the story that I think is really cool. Really great, really solid chapter. I'm excited to chat about it with you. But before we can jump into that, we of course have some stuff to talk about up top. Yeah, so as you all know, we have a Patreon and last month's Patreon episode was about another iconic chapter, The Forsaken. And this month, July, we are going to talk about road trips and slash or travelogues but road trip yeah i'm excited

about that because we're gonna really dive into road trips not just taking a road trip but also like as a concept as a storytelling device talk about some of our favorite tv movies and of course talk about it in the asanga vice and fire world a little bit we have quite a few travelogues that are characters in this series i would say whether it's aria bit. We have quite a few travelogues that are characters in this series, I would say. Whether it's Arya herself, she goes on quite a journey that we are just starting to embark on. Or Quentin, right, who we've

covered, or Samwell in a couple of ways. And actually, here's one. Was thinking about this one tonight, Eliana, so let me know what you think on this. Duncan Egg. Duncan Egg. Duncan Egg is an ultimate travelogue. That's a road trip and a half.

Every single book for Duncan Egg so far has had a little road trip where they have to go somewhere, and you kind of see them go to the tourney, each tourney, really. I have to think about that. We can discuss. I'm not sure if I agree, but that's what the episode is for.

And if you want to see, hear, whatever. All I can, right now I have, first of all, not only am I annoyed with you, but second of all, I have July, July stuck in my head by the Decembrists right now because you said July. So not only am I fighting you, I'm fighting my

brain. I'm like singing it in my head right now while I look at you. But yeah, we'll argue about all that in our Patreon episode. And patrons in the stranger tier and above get those episodes. That's the $5 tier and up. You'll get a new bonus episode each month. Sometimes it's a Song of Ice and Fire theme. Sometimes it's maybe a little more loosely themed

like this one sometimes it's on a different piece of media altogether or one of george's novellas or novelettes so you can look forward to that over at patreon.com slash girls gone canon that's c-a-n-o-n not like the thing you shoot babies out of but canon lore, history I thought that was a trebuchet it can be both you can do it with either is what I'm trying to tell you I don't know, that's what I learned in the Jamie chapters

so another thing that you can find on our Patreon at patreon.com is access to our discord where once a month we have a brunch slash happy hour, brappy hour. And we've got the dates. You've got the dates set for August and September. Look at us. Yeah, this is a big step for us. We're early.

Yeah, there's character growth to be had on this podcast so august brunch for those patrons in the thunder tier and above that are over at the discord that's a ten dollar and up tier that's gonna be on sunday august 27th from 3 p.m probably till about 5 p.m eastern time et eliana time and then of course september, September. Here we are. Drumroll, please. Saturday, September 23rd, we'll be joining up at 3 p.m. ET once more to chit-chat with everyone, hang out, find out what everyone's watching and up to and playing. Lots of great Zelda talk. Eliana found her Switch. Everyone rejoice.

Rejoice. Rejoice. Zelda talk. Eliana found her Switch. Everyone rejoice. Rejoice. Lots of good Zelda talk at this last week's brunch that we just had. Yeah, we kind of took it over briefly. Sorry, everyone.

It was good. I played it a little this week, and there are some elements of Zelda I love, and then some that I fucking hate. So I appreciated your chatter on it, because i was priming myself to be ready to play i'm just glad it was not the inflation was not in my head zelda inflation no it's so crazy zelda inflation is so real video game inflation in general is wild yeah like what

am i getting for this nothing fucking give me nothing satisfaction dopamine whatever yolo i mean and i don't want to go on a tangent so i will just say final fantasy 7 remake it's gonna be a so it's so beautiful right the first part is gorgeous but it's gonna be like five to six parts and it's gonna be like 60 each time they release fucking one so you have to pay 60 bucks five times to play the whole fucking game wait what i didn't know they were doing that i just meant within the zelda game like my the clothes cost more but like i didn't know they were doing that with final fantasy 7 yeah yeah welcome to the future welcome to uh fucking video games man dang that sucks grind

harder pay more money up front so you get better tokens, though. You know, I mean, you could always pay for better, Eliana. I'm sure. Well, back to this main story. Let's talk about some thoughts that we said we were going to cover about the Aria chapters. Last week, we were just busy, but a lot of people were so glad. Everyone's really excited about the aria chapters yeah thank you for your emails i know eliana was thrilled i was thrilled too but eliana i saw it

in the little cockles of her heart she was pumped dude she loves a good email and every time one rolled in it's like i felt her happiness too so yeah thanks for sending us emails we're not going to get to all of them today keep sending them in though i mean we have so many chapters ahead and we love hearing your insights and you can send those in at girls gone canon at gmail.com send us an email you can comment on the episode over at podbean uh you can tweet at us or skeet which is the preferred term for blue sky at girls gone cannon on Twitter or blue sky. Yeah. Did you say Twitter? Did you mean X X.com?

We're at X. X marks the fucking spot. X. For the historians that listen to our podcast, these are the times we're in right now. X on Twitter. Yeah. So first email

up is from our good friend Lo, you might know Lo from way back when when we covered a character named Brienne Lo came on for that Lo emailed us about Arya and gender, specifically on some of the conversation we had

on shadows and water being kind of fluidity for Arya as something that she exists within and some of the conversation we had on shadows and water being kind of fluidity for Arya as something that she exists within and some of the stuff that Eliana spoke about right with water at the end of last week's episode but Lowe cites trans theorist Susan Stryker and classic feminist psychoanalyst Julia Kristeva as well as Estrida Neimanis who makes the case for human bodies to be seen as bodies of water, and argues this helps us question assumptions that Western philosophies often make about humans and the world we live in. Lowe quoted some of this work by Astrida and said, In the first place, bodies of water trouble the idea of bodies and discreate coherent individual subjects. As bodies of water trouble the idea of bodies and discreate coherent individual subjects.

As bodies of water, we leak and seeth. Our borders are always vulnerable to rupture and renegation. As we know, our human bodies are in constant process of intake, transformation, and exchange. Watery bodies are neither autonomous nor autopoietic. They require another body that in turn requires another body to bathe them into being. There's a lot in this quote, and I think it really speaks to what's going on with Arya and the malleability of

not only her identity, but also her gender. But I do want to call out this fun line in here of other lives that they will become as they relinquish their own human bodies in just lake bodies lake bodies are replenished by rain bodies rain bodies inhale ocean bodies ocean bodies slake fish bodies and fish bodies feed whale bodies um i just wanted to talk about fish

bodies and whale bodies i love it though because it implies that chain right the food chain the food chain from underground yeah this is such great stuff thank you so much low it was great because low opened the email and was like they're like i'm here to say stuff about gender and aria and we're kind of joking about it and it was a very pleasant email to receive though yeah so i hope i hope low expands on this in an essay. I think it could happen for us. Oh, yeah. I think that'd be really cool, especially, yeah, I think there's a lot of fluidity in

the water dancing stuff. Lo has also sent us some other thoughts as well. Not just this email about Arya and receiving the assignment, right? Like whether or not Arya wants to do the assignment of femininity. And I think that's something that will obviously get explored more and more in this story, especially as we near the end of Agot and go into

Akok. Oh yeah. There's a lot of shit happening at the end of Agot too. It does start here, I guess. But whatever. Yeah, that makes sense. That makes sense. And our friend Warren sent us another email. Yes. Of course. The Warren. The famous. Arya Hullock. Infamous sense and our friend warren sent us another email yes of course the warren the famous are you infamous rather oh my god the aria holic warren said and actually he sent a couple of

things in this email and i'm just pulling out one of the things i really love the most which was he said uh last chapter ned was a great father he He was understanding, he was listening, he gave wisdom, and he did the work, right? He put in the work of being a girl dad last chapter. That's my words, not Warren's. But this chapter, he was very dismissive of Arya, and he found that really interesting.

And we'll talk about this later. There's definitely something here going on in these next few chapters for Arya and Sansa in general. So we'll talk about this. We'll come back to this. Thanks, Warren. Yeah, that's actually a really great observation that I don't think I noticed until Warren called it out. So thank you very much. And also, fun fact, I did find a place called Aryaholic. Did not go. I think it was a salon or something in the Philippines.ines so i sent the photo in slack once we also got another email from theresa who said specifically appreciated the ned thirst yes we did discuss

quite a bit ned's thighs last episode and points out that especially since john is supposed to be pretty ned must be too and like even if ned isn't like i know his body's good um also the thighs yeah the calves yeah i know he's ripped right he fought a war um and is still hey in the words of theresa theresa said chloe talked about it but not for enough yeah is basically what she implied theresa did say like basically say that and um yeah i mean like he's still training because like he could be pulled into war at any time like in the next few chapters except he dies before it happens um anyway there's that one artwork of ned where they make him look a little like jake gyllenhaal you know

i think it's in the they have it on the wiki do you i'll send it to you yes you know the one i know what you're speaking of i'm thinking of it thank you he does look like him right even though jake gyllenhaal is ruined for me after that taylor swift song but um anyways theresa also is sad about these being aria's last like quote safe and happy chapters and mentioned that she thought that Arya had lost her appetite about the ribs because Jane had told her that Micah's dad thought that he was a pig initially when

Micah's body was handed over to him and I do think that's true. I agree, Teresa and I did think about that during the chapter but I was more sad that the ribs were not eaten because those are my priorities. And I would even stake a further claim and say

medium rare please I would stake a further claim and say that's just heresy. We don't know how true it is that that happened. That's just talk. You mean that it looked like a pig being handed over to him? And that he was given that way to him.

That's all just gossip. I think that's true, but I think it, like, as Teresa said, this might be what Arya was thinking about. Oh, no, I think that's true, but I'm just saying that is gossip. No one knows the truth of what happened. Yeah, that is true, except for two people, one of whom may or may not be dead. It sounds like gossip to me. So thank you, Teresa, for the email. I did think it was suspicious, though, that we do get it as hearsay.

Anyway, last one is Poor Chloe specifically. Poor Chloe? Poor Chloe. No, this is not Poor Chloe. This is in support, in defense of Chloe. Do you think I could get away with that? Poor Chloe? Ooh, April 1st, look out for me. Poor Chloe. Poor Cloent support, in defense of Chloe. Do you think I could get away with that? Poor Chloe? Ooh, April 1st, look out for me.

Poor Chloe. Poor Cloenton. I don't know. God. Move over. She's coming for you. So we got a, as you all know, very exciting, rare, but not that rare, but rare enough, moment, Podbean comment. It know very exciting rare but not that rare but rare enough moment pod bean comment

it was very exciting but it's remember this is again in support of chloe our friend hall like one that you walk down um says please don't stop doing voices the characters aren't real they won't be offended so chloe you just have to keep doing voices thanks to hall christmas has been saved christmas has been saved thank you thank you thank you all for your comment no i appreciate it and and it's all in good fun folks it's all in good fun but i'm not gonna stop doing those voices like i do need you all to know we are on what of our song of ice and fire public episodes we are on episode 195 i don't think it's gonna stop i just think at this time if you're still listening out there it's an acquired taste so you better acquire it i think i'm not only is it not going to stop

i think we have to double down. Alright, we'll see about that. Before we start anteing up, doubling down, whatever verb Eliana's going to throw out there today, let's hop into our lightning round because you've been waiting long enough and it's time to jump into Aria 3. But before we do that, let's pop it off with Bran 4. Tyrion Lannister is received at Winterfell. Eddard 5. Ned's investigation into Jon Arryn's death gets deeper. Jon 4. Jon defends Samwell Tarly. Eddard 6. Ned deals with issues surrounding his tourney. He heads to a brothel for a release? Just kidding. There's no release from his depression.

Chloe wrote this. I just delivered it. Catalin V. Catalin takes Tyrion captive for his many, many crimes at the end of the crossroads. He's been a very busy man. Sansa II. The tourney is magical until it isn't edward 7 the tourney is magical until it isn't september day in one the tourney is magical until it isn't when she passes out the hangover she's just passed out she's like oh god i shouldn't have had red wine the sugar for real though the sugar does get you i know that's why i can't do it anymore it sucks well let's talk

about aria 3 in a game of thrones aria overhears this conversation that perhaps she shouldn't have perhaps mayhaps mayhaps aria chases a one-eared black tomcat down the alley telling herself quiet as a shadow light as a feather she's covered in scabs and scratches having been at it day and night it being chasing cats she'd run to sirio with her hands bleeding but he merely would tell her be quicker that her enemies would give her more scratches. I love that. He keeps putting mirish fire on her wound to heal it and sends her back out to keep doing it. And it reminds me a little bit of On the Road when we hear that she had covered herself in mud after getting bit up.

Right. And she had brought those flowers from the bog to Ned. Purple and green flowers. Wonder what it means from a bog can't tell you but the truth is out there but yeah so she already liked to get rid of the itches and the bites she had put mud on so it reminds me of that and we don't really hear much about mirrish fire i don't know if it was something that like because it's so exotic george just doesn't remember to bring it up or doesn't bring it up that often or expected to use it more but it doesn't come back often it's an ointment it comes up in Sam 3 a storm of swords

with some other herbs that could be used as poisons which I think is some Liza foreshadowing right as well as maybe later Joffrey poisoning foreshadowing but there's also Mirrish fire wine so the Mirrish love their fucking fire, which it might not be related, but perhaps it uses similar spices to brew or something. Who knows? Who knows? I think of it as like, you know, you have some of that healing similar qualities in some of those

herbs that also probably provide a very strong flavor. Yeah, I couldn't tell if it was like, Mirrish Fire is just a really strong alcohol for killing things, but then I'm like, I like the idea of it being like a neosporin-esque thing though yeah and like containing a certain type of spices that you could see used like a sachet used across if different things too yeah and i mean you know in our real world like lavender yeah in our real world there's like a lot of drinks that i don't know sound a little similar to maybe a medicine.

So like tonic water or penicillin, the tiki drink, right? And that is also a medicine. Penicillin. Yeah. Shots, shots. Shots, shots, shots. Yeah. Okay, I had a question for you. How do you feel about this chapter going in a different direction

than the original source material of the TV show, right? In the TV show, they make the repetitive thing. In Arya's storyline is like, not today, right? What do we say to the god of death? Not today. Whereas in Arya's, in the books, there's like all these different little mantras. And then fear cuts deeper and swords is actually the one that I think is that she repeats and draws strength from what are your thoughts yeah that is some pretty

bullshit erasure from the book no i'm just kidding um i get it simpler i do find that interesting though it is simple and it worked right it uh yeah people love it it worked very well and let's be real miltos and and Maisie did such good work on the show that of course it fucking worked. Of course, when she looks at him with those eyes next chapter slash in the episode, it happens. You know, she's about to cave and just die with him because she's just scared. And he looks at her and he's like, now what do we say? And she says it back. And he's like, good, go. And the way they look at one another is just it's some supreme acting it's one of those you know the show used to be so good in season one i don't know what happened after season two episode nine but yeah until series anyways i'm not gonna i'm not going

there but yeah it uh it's emotional it's very sad and beautiful i think both have their place i think that tv's role is to simplify something more complex and still deliver an emotion in a lot of ways when it comes to adaptations, right? Some shows can hit that, and I do think that it's on par. I'd say it's on par. However, I love her mantras. They're very internal. It's not something she says all the time out loud. So that makes it harder. I think you're right about it being simpler but therefore like very impactful because i don't think they're fun right like all these different mantras that she learns and those tenants and stuff but they don't hit the same but i do now

wonder if like the fear cuts deeper than swords like is that like george's like oh this is my fear is a mind killer moment or something and like yeah you know come if it'll come back like what is a mantra that's a great point that is it yeah but other than that like it yeah even even so fear cuts deeper than swords cute but you're right maybe not as like not today was very yeah it was so successful. Something you could quote immediately from, you know. And everyone knows it. From the longer phrase. Yeah.

I mean, hell, I had to remember it's not book material for a minute. I'm like, oh, that's right. It's not because it does fit well. They did good on that. They did. And as you said, like brilliant performances from that source material. That sells it for me. That really does sell it.

Yeah. Good emotions. So this is one of my favorite bits. The red keep was full of cats. Lazy old cats dozing in the sun. Cold-eyed mousers twitching their tails.

Quick little kittens with claws like needles. Wait a second. Wait a second. Quick kittens with claws like needles. Ladies, cats, all combed and trusting. Ragged shadows prowling the midden heaps. I'm moving to the Red Keep, everyone. That's what I want you to know that I've decided as of today I'm moving to the Red Keep where all of the cats lay and play. I love it there. Go cats.

I love that they call out mousers too, specifically. Some of my favorite mousers, my partner's family has a mouser, a Manx cat. No tail, actually. They don't have tails. Very cute. I thought that this was a fun description of how cats are in every part of society, I i guess of the red keep and you can find them anywhere from like you know out on the streets or in the shadows or in places of nobility and that's just like aria who can be anywhere yeah and she learns to blend like that too exactly it'll be interesting when she has to blend being part of nobility again.

A cat of any coat. Oh. Claws? Cats? I don't know. Just interesting. Interesting. Who are you?

The proud lord said. I mean, that is what Myrcella and Tom would say soon. That is true. They're like, who are you? Hoomst?

Hoomst? So one by one, Arya brought proudly back to syria each cat except for this one the one-eared black devil of a tomcat he's the real king of the castle one of the gold cloaks said he's older than sin and twice as mean the gold cloak had told her a story that the king had been feasting lord tywin and the black bastard hopped up and snatched a roast quail out of Tywin's fingers. See, that's how you do it. You got to eat the roast quail. The gold cloak warned her to stay away from him, but still she persisted. Yet she persisted.

That is what I had in my head. I know. I know. I know. Tale as old as time. Most sane fans, including me, in my opinion, believe that Balerion the Black dread the cat. Not the dragon. Not the dragon. The cat.

That's who this is. This is Rhaenys' cat. Yes. Right? That's what most do. And I do believe that. I think there's no fucking reason for him to point it out otherwise. Let's be fucking real.

Same. out otherwise let's be fucking real same uh but we later hear that he clawed joffrey's hand and that he constantly haunts tommy at night until he gets the kittens from marjorie and like the kittens kind of scare belerian away i think that's incredible i think it's going to add to something i'm going to say later maybe too but not to take it sad and serious but you know how like maybe at this time warging and skin changing and dragon dreams weren't necessarily developed and weren't necessarily something in the first book that we had like a guide to. But we're starting to get more and more maybe gardened information about dragon dreams and dreamers and dragon riders and the bond that you share with your dragon. you share with your dragon. I personally feel that the bond you share with your dragon, or if you have dragon dreams, means that you are susceptible to a bond like that probably too,

and possibly makes you able to skin change into your dragon or become one with your dragon, etc, etc. You know, in ways not unlike how the Starks become able to kind of become one with their wolf. Now, with that said, do you think when Rhaenys died, she skin changed into her kitten? Because I know that's silly. And by a Game of Thrones standards, the answer is no. But by the recently gardened, like George's adding lore, he's expanding his Targaryen world, he gets time built into this. I don't think it's that far-fetched. And it's really sad. No wonder that cat is so mean to everyone. She dies at four. She's stunted inside this motherfucking cat.

She's just the cat now. I could see it being a thing. So at first I definitely made a facial expression because I thought you said the bong you share with your dragon. And I was like, interesting. Interesting. Then I realized the dragon torches it. You don't need aong you share with your dragon. And I was like, interesting, interesting. Then I realized- Well, yeah, the dragon torches it.

You don't need a lighter if you have a dragon. Yeah, exactly. You've seen those episodes of Pokemon, okay? Absolutely. So at first I thought that's what you said. I was like, what an interesting way for Chloe to phrase that. I realized later on you said bond, which makes a lot more sense. And also initially I was like, I don't know about this i was like is she joking like the ned working into a pigeon but then as you said

with some of the information we're getting in these stories and also with like house of the dragon stuff and what it's taking from the lore that george is gardening and writing and how we see you know aria does skin change into cats and second life stuff i don't i don't think it's crazy i think it's i don't think it's that far fetched yeah like it used to be a joke and now i yeah now i'm speaking leave me in my league alone um no like now i actually think like maybe especially with what we learn like that you know she jumps up i mean valyrian jumps on the table and takes the fucking quail out of his mouth like yeah she's got fancy taste she was a royal yeah i think it's definitely possible also um i think there'll be

something fun about that then like the connection with aria there's some fun language here too when they're talking about belerion the black dread slash cat and of course being named after a dragon and you know so they call this tomcat the real king of this castle and then you know the story about tywin and specifically they call him a black bastard this this cat. And I was like, very interesting, this language about kings of this specific castle and black bastards reminds me of someone that, you know, Arya probably knows very well, who might just be a contender for king of this castle. Who's a black bastard. Also, my final thing I'd like to add is that it does remind me of succession in season three

no two season two when tom walks by logan sitting there eating chicken and he picks the chicken up off his plate and eats it and stares straight in his eyes and like says thank you and walks away asserting his dominance over logan roy belirian the black dread could also be tom wamsgans is what i'm trying to tell you wow the hbo cinematic universe tomcat wamsgans exact thank you thank you i don't think it's like a true theory not the tom wamsgans i know that's not a true theory i was like you know but i don't think like the rainies thing like we'll never learn whether it is or not so it doesn't matter but that makes me love it that much more. I don't know that, we may or we may not, but what if Arya tries to skin change the cat and is like, oh, someone else is in here, right? Because you can sense that.

What if the battle at King's Landing comes down to Arya skin changing Valyrian, the Black Dread Cat? black dread cat. I do think like Aria is probably going to skin change some of these cats around here. Right. And I haven't thought that until this very moment, but now I do strongly feel it. It's just a way to look. You don't have to use your eyes.

Jumped all in just now. Now that suddenly makes me not want to believe anymore. So thanks. No, I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. Popcat and Wombs kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. Popcat Wombs again.

I'm just kidding. Here I am. I'm a scorpion. Not a Scorpio. There's a difference. A big difference. Holy shit. One's meaner than the other.

You can decide which. So. Arya runs around the castle. Up, down, left, right, B-A-B-A. I mean, around, over and over and over and finally she has him high walls press close a massive stone ahead and she slides around light as a feather and hugs the cat to her chest his claws rake her chest and she kisses his head he yowls and spits at her and someone shouts what's he doing to that cat? Has no one ever kissed a cat before?

Also. I do it all the time. Aria just grabbing, finally catching this cat, then kissing it. Very big Usagi kissing Luna. The first time she ever finds her vibes. Except Aria evades getting her face scratched.

And thus she doesn't get those anime big blush marks on her face in the in the process true true and this bellerian does not have a crescent moon shaped bald spot definitely not definitely not still royalty though and yeah true i i also want to say especially with all the things we've been pointing out already that remind us of it she kisses the cat in the head which reminds you of the kindly man again oh i like that yeah um this is a good time to remind everyone sailor moon is coming back august our sailor moon episode yes but then we're doing every other month probably yeah we got some time

we got a little time on our hands thanks to the release of that sail Moon. Yeah, turns out we thought we knew the date and we fucking didn't. Alright. So, startled, Arya turns back towards the voice. At the end of the alley is Myrcella, pretty as a doll, with Prince Tommen next to her, plump, wearing the prancing stag and pearls

on his doublet. They're accompanied by a septa and two large Lannister guards. Sorry, I got a quick fashion hour here. Very brief. Fashion minute. Okay, Tommen's drip. I love this idea of the prancing stag in pearls, or embroidered as pearls. That's it.

Very proud, very beautiful. Very fancy. Yeah. And Tommen and Myrcella don't recognize Arya. they call her a dirty ragged boy um they're like who's this dirty ragged boy which like to be fair this is you know nobility this is what they know this is what's put into him from birth so aria drops to one knee and lowers her head and tries to hide because she's like if they find out who i am sanza and ned would be ashamed it's really interesting that she thinks of her family in that moment and what they would

think but um the fact that they don't really see that it's aria right and aria's story is later on she's being taught to really look really see things um speaks to speaks to uh how glamours work right people see what they expect to see and what tommy and marcella saw was dirt they saw the signifiers of what they didn't assume people that they knew would wear and um let those expectations fill in uh the identity of this person it's such a great line from here to yoren when she meets yoren right and then that yoren when he sees her at the beheading and takes her and tries to protect her like it's such a great line through that of him being able to say boy boy like listen boy and really impose it to try to help her and yeah with with that the glamour and everything like this is just a great step to her losing her identity already and it also brings

back that memory later on when she's going towards the twins with Sandor and she thinks you know will my mom even want me anymore she's always been worried and it starts here in king's landing for sure at home it started really obviously with the treatment of john as a bastard and how that affected her too but then here in king's landing it's been made worse by sansa and her dad and her not being able to fit into those perfect little holes those you know like when you got the cube the star the circle and she just doesn't fit into them sorry you know kids toys yeah i just remembered you remember that video of the woman and then she's like yeah yeah you put the you put the rectangle rectangle and they all it's very

calming though and they just all go into the one same hole and she's like that's not the right hole and she's like so disturbed anyway yes memes yeah great point though good points good points yeah um but but absolutely she's she's struggling here i wonder yeah i wonder how it'll go later on interesting so when asked what she's doing aria panics because she's unable to speak she's like if i talk they are gonna know my voice and as the guard and scepter reach for her she runs quick as a snake swift as a deer she bowls into prince tommen saying oof she hops over him and off she fucks chloe wrote these leaping up to climb into a window all right i'm sorry she pulls herself up like aria has insane upper body strength but also like you know she's got less weight to pull up because

she's a child but still insane upper body strength um wiggling in and surprising a washer woman swift as a deer quiet as a shadow she runs deeper hearing only her heartbeat in a drip of water. Huh. There's that water again. She has this moment where she remembers these dreams she's had, and she thinks her father told her the Red Keep was smaller than Winterfell. But in her dreams, it's an immense stone maze. It's shifting. It's changing. Sometimes she dreams and hears her father's voice, but it's always a long way off, growing fainter as she ran toward it, leaving her alone in the dark.

Arya is getting some classic grade A Stark 101 crypt dreams. Oh my god. And I don't know that I noticed this. It slipped in very subtly. There's a couple things in this chapter that are real, real softly put in there that I'm like, that's kind of of a huge thing like later when part of the tunnel crumbles like i'm like george that's a huge thing that you just wrote in two sentences so let's come back to that but same thing here like this is like a huge crypt dream and i feel like sansa and aria don't necessarily

usually get crypt dream uh pages you know like john bran theon even gets them but everybody i mean i think there's a big symbolism behind them right of like them being that crumbling pressure being put on them from winterfell in some ways too um but also the pressure of ned's legacy ned catalin's legacy right that's a lot to stomach and take on but man, man. And the ghosts of Winterfell, I guess, are another part of it. This is, uh, I really didn't notice this stream until this read-through, I think. I don't think I would have noticed it if you had called it out as well. Yes, that's absolutely, definitely feels like that's what that is. And it is really interesting.

Because I guess, yeah, it's not proximity based you know what's down there because theon gets them too also especially because like what aria said to look like liana and you know back then george was playing around with the more like shinji rei thing for john and aria before could their dreams have been connected yes yeah i don't know um but i think he's veered he's veered away from that so the shippers want to know eliana as an aria john shipper yourself no there are no aria i don't think there are any aria john shippers are there i'm so glad that you're standing for the aria john no i'm not when i say there are no aria john shippers including am including myself as

because he's targaryen so it's like arian but it's arian she hates me jaria why are you doing this arian but like with the darya there's arian and there's arian 69 the only arianne I care about. We love Jaria. Oh my god. I don't think it exists. I think we're the only Jaria podcast.

We're the only Jaria podcast. We're not a Jaria podcast. Eliana, if this is what you want, then I want to support you. And I want everyone to know that you loving Jon and Aria so much is what I want to happen for you. Like, I really support you. And I think everyone should. Don't try to hide it. You should be proud.

You should be proud of Jarya. You know what? Maybe I should just pretend that's what I'm about. Because 93 George was about it. I'm an OG. He's probably going to go back to it at this point. Dude, he better fucking... I don't think he will. I think he's pretty committed to not.

That's why he's taking so long. He had to rewrite everything so Jaria's canon again. Anyways, she realizes as she continues to try to hide that it's dark. It's getting darker. And she hugs her knees to herself and she thinks, okay, hide that it's dark, it's getting darker, and

she hugs her knees to herself and she thinks, okay, I'll count to 10,000. By then it'll be safe to come out. By the time she reaches 87, the room lightens a bit and she can kind of see shapes around her. Jagged shadows of long teeth. She pretends Syrio is there, whispering in her ear and saying be calm as still water strong as a bear fierce as a wolverine the monsters are still there when she opens her eyes though and she makes herself look at it and i know that's a ring

so i'm wondering if we'll see these skills of her like seeing the dark a little better come back for her during the long night maybe we'll even get a call back with some of the language to this exact scene of her counting to you know to 10 000 or lord knows what and then you know, to 10,000 or Lord knows what. And then, you know, the monster is being there, but the fear gone and she goes to face the others. Or maybe it's something else, right? Like she does this and turns out, you know, the monsters turn out to be people, right? Like we find out throughout the story that turns out the knights are the monsters. And by knights, I mean the letter K. The knights are the monsters. And the fear lingers. Maybe she starts worrying more about her loved ones as opposed to her own safety and thinking about the political aspect if her story ever starts to encompass that more.

No, I love that because Sandor. Yes, who's not a knight. That's, yeah, that's in everything you just said. And that kind of like the monsters could be humans too, which is scarier than anything else in the real world. Yeah, scarier than the others, which are, they're kind of human, but not. They're pretty scary though. Yeah. I mean, they were.

They feel things, I guess. They laugh. This isn't the conversation to have right now. Yeah. Sorry, everyone. I don't need to talk about others and their rights. Let's for an other time. Chloe's done with the podcast, we're not even halfway through. I just want to block number one Jarya fan. Oh my god, that's not me!

That's your username, right? It's not. All the same, something in the cavern feels very wrong and she whirls around and feels the bones of the dragon nipping at her and she runs towards the biggest skull of them all i love that bellerian is so present throughout this entire chapter i think that's awesome um the dragons are surrounding her and i wonder what means. We don't get to see her often interacting with like Targaryens or with dragons yet. She's very far away from that plot. So I wonder what her first real life dragon interaction will be probably at Winterfell, I'm guessing. But

interested. It could be even like at Braavos or Pentos or Volantis, right? Like her story could intersect again with Illyrio's very, very much so. I would love for Arya to see Dany before Dany gets to Westeros. I do think it's possible. Like, she gets to the boat she takes as part of Dany's fleet or something. Mm-hmm. Interesting, a boat. A boat. Well, a boat that. A boat about this passage about this passage so

this line this language stood out to me of like a dagger made of darkness in regards to I guess these teeth but it also makes me think of like a sword like dark sister or well I do I guess we see something that's kind of like a

dagger made of darkness literally in book two when uh friendly gets stabby stabby rip rip she thinks also here that the skulls cannot hurt her uh but then i think we'll find out later on in these books that i don't know maybe skulls can hurt like ned's skull is used to try and inflict some psychic damage on sansa but she's like i do not see it and in a literal way uh dead people's skulls can probably maybe come to life unsure unsure of the mechanics of whites later in the story but that seems hurtful she'll definitely have to come back and face some of the whites whether she knows them or not too you know she'll face dead undead and just like carsey i mean she's already at this point in publishing she's already faced some of the dead right uh you think of the brotherhood oh true there for meeting them and learning of their secrets. And then, of course, the possibility of her meeting her mom again.

Yeah. From the undead and dead. I think Arya is going to have her. Arya is like the character easiest transported into the Grishaverse. You know, like I could just throw her in the Grishaverse and she would be able to like make her way and be a badass in it with like all the dead and undead and face changing and shit. I've been thinking about it lately you gotta read those last couple books because they're wild there's some shit that i'm like aria aria could be in those she's got some cool magic going on there well partially because not not because of

the trope and so forth but she is like a character that you can kind of throw into a lot of things right yeah that's true she's got the assassin she's got the magic, the face changing. Yeah, she's got all these dead and undead surrounding her already and so much sadness and darkness from the beginning of the story set is kind of saddling itself around her. So true. I don't know. launching herself toward a door with an iron ring set in the wood she opens it far enough to slip in and then she's in complete darkness following stone to her left and trying to remember her new water dancer skills she keeps walking and when the wall ends she hears a distant sound of voices and a flickering light on the wall she stands at the top of a well 20 feet across this is a huge ass well plunging into the earth with huge stones set into the walls circling down like the steps of hell that old man would tell him about far below two men stand with a single torch small as a candle speaking in which you can only hear disjointed bits of this was like my audio a few weeks ago

found one bastard the rest will come soon. A day, two days, a fortnight. And when he learns the truth, what will he do? The gods alone know. The fools tried to kill his son, and what's worse, they made a mummer's farce of it. He's not a man to put that aside, I warn you. The wolf and lion will soon be at each other's throats. Whether we will it or no.

Too soon. Too soon. What good is war now? We are not ready. Delay. As well bid me stop time. Do you take me for a wizard? No less. See, we are only going to do

even more voices. I was hoping it was kind of like somewhat Italian influenced. I don't know how you felt. We don't have to talk about it, but. You have been learning Italian recently. I'm on day 210 for Duolingo and I'm kicking ass. Oh shit, 210. I really am.

That's a lot of things. Yeah, I might make it a fucking year, dude. I'm like in it to win it. I'm proud of you. Sometimes when I'm walking places, like I do some of the speaking exercises, because I'm like, yeah, I can say that shit, so I'm pretty good at I get the accents, you know.

I'm in there. That's good. I'm proud of you. Yeah. I don't know why I gave that to him, but I'm like, you know, I could be Italian depending on where my mom really was adopted through. We don't know. Yeah. Let's disclose all of this to our people. Yeah. Yeah. through we don't know yeah let's disclose all these defensive people yeah i want you all to know where i take my thoughts and my voice inspiration from so

it could be my culture it might not be so i love that various delirium are described as shadows emerging from the bowels of the earth because I think that they are kind of bringing all these people back from the grave, back from the bowels of the earth. And by that I mean the Blackfyres whom we thought we had all defeated long ago and Aegon

who may or may not have been part of the story at this point but George was cagey about whether or not Aegon survived. So I don't know what role he was originally going to play but anyways agan the sixth the actual sixth um anyways and and they are shadows right like it really plays into varies's riddle of power again about the shadows on the wall uh they're not so quiet they're not quite as a shadow as aria might remind herself to be but their shadows are also described as being as tall as giants and it comes again to that idea tying it to tyrian's story right when it comes to all these

different players melisandre and shadows right um you have this also irony i think of varies asking if alirio takes him for a wizard, given Varys' distaste of magic and wizardry because of what happened to him. And I'll come back to that in a bit. I love that. And I have something to talk about with Aegon in just a bit, because I feel like he's a shadow himself on this chapter, right? Knowing what we know.

Knowing what we know. Obviously, like you mentioned, there's a lot of gardening being done in general, but I think that they really stand out in this chapter, those children of Rhaegar's. Yeah. The shadows are almost on Arya, and a moment later, the man with the torch climbs into her sight and so does his companion. She creeps away, listening more. The torchbearer, a stout man, man scarred in a leather half cape gliding softly

even in boots who could it be asks what to do and the other man the one with the very italian accent and a yellow forked beard says if one hand dies why not another you have danced this dance before his rings glimmer on his fingers one of my my favorite lines. Honestly, I love this line in Agot. I didn't know that. The colors are very telling. Again, is it gardening or is it foreshadowing? We don't know. Rubies, sapphires, yellow tiger eyes, red gold, pale silver.

All of our favorite colors. And I know we kind of talked about this a lot back in Ned. It's been a very long time. but back when we chatted about ned we talked a little bit about this chapter and some of our uh some of our theories and schemes going on here in the background and that came up right with the black fires versus the targaryens with the colored rings absolutely like i mean we have discussed in depth what we think this is about i think before already and i like how illyrio and his shadows are playing with people's expectations right kind of similar to lord manderley and what people think that they see based on their bodies which is kind of what aria's

story is very much about because i love this language that ties it to uh dancing as warfare especially as it goes together with aa and Sansa's storylines. But you see Arya being very observant. She notices that Illyrio stands on the balls of his feet like a water dancer does. And she knows this already because she's exposed to what water dancing is like and is learning it. So again, playing with what people think that they see.

And as you said, right right we talked about this with ned and some of those john connington references absolutely and there's something interesting too again coming back to these moments that are really understated maybe from what i remember about this chapter and i swear i've read this chapter so many fucking times so take that grain of salt but a piece of the ceiling comes down as aria's listening red and rock like it falls down crashing and it almost makes her cry out and it stands kind of at the entry to the well solid and unbroken and again it's one of those like blink and you miss it paragraphs that this piece of the red keep has tumbled down and broken apart. It's very metaphorical in a way, I think, when it comes to King's Landing and what's happening there as it kind of is breaking apart as Robert's reign is falling apart.

It's the Lannisters machinations and Ned showing up and it's kind of like a sinking ship. But it feels evocative too of something that could come back to or something george was playing with right when we think of king's landing falling apart brick by motherfucking brick right and yeah i do think maybe it's less talked about people kind of forget like if only there was a family that was going to king's landing who swore to one another that they would tear it apart and tear everything the lannister stood for apart if only that was happening in the winds of winter eliana do you think that might happen i don't know it wasn't in the show so like i'm not really sure the The bad one. Okay, you should have known from that.

That's an adaptive choice. George was really creating magic off of what those boys did. No, I'm just kidding. I think, like, King's Landing is kind of it falling because of the secrets of the realm being fucking puppeted by people like Illyrio, people like Varys, and all these secrets from Cersei and Robert. I think that is a little bit of the foreshadowing happening here in quote-unquote the cave, which it does feel like that allegorical cave, right? It does feel a little bit like Arya is having her first allegorical experience of the cave before Bran, even. But even with Aegon maybe being gardened later and the decision to bring Aegon on later being it. Rhaenys and Aegon are the center of this chapter. The very first thing you see is Tommen

and Myrcella, innocent, still noble and a little bratty and shitty, but Tommen and Myrcella, who are the fucking blood debt that are gonna be paid for Aegon and Rhaenys, let's be real. Those two kids are dead as shit. They're gonna die like fuck. Those two kids are lucky they're still alive by the time Tiwau rolls real. Those two kids are dead as shit. They're gonna die like fuck. Those two kids are lucky

they're still alive by the time Tiwau rolls around. Like, those two kids are dead. Dude. Dead as fuck. They're dying for these sins they didn't commit that their families committed. And we're gonna probably get a second sack of kings landing. Right? I think about so

much that moment when Varys and Pycelle and the Gates and Tywin strolling on in and just fucking butchering people. That's gonna happen to the Lannisters who have grown so comfortable in this keep.

Yeah, and you talk about Tommen and Myrcella being kind of punished for, I mean, they're punished for, as you said, the sins that they didn't do and the sins being kind of punished for I mean they're punished for like as you said the sins that they didn't do and the sins that kind of made them right like their parents incest and in the

tying it to the red keep falling down I've always kind of gotten this like follow the house of usher vibes yes I would say usher atrius yeah not that usher atrius yeah not not that usher um edgar allen well you got it bad um yeah yeah yeah as baby let it burn they do have confessions in this storyline well these are cersei's confessions yeah jamie's got hi he's got a lot of things

to confess to probably um anyways so yeah follow the house of usher vibes as well with the king standing coming down and i will say in defense of tom and marcella yeah they're kind of bratty but i've met like kids who are not rich who are that bratty too yeah so it's really they're just kids kids they're just kids so they're doing the best they can in the face of everything in the face of death literally so aria listens in as they discuss stannis and liza fleeing king's landing and that the knight of flowers is writing high garden to bring his sister to court to marry robert and how little finger and ned are out of their reach ned specifically is their problem we have this line here that's a little misleading of he has the bastard he has the book and soon enough he'll have the truth foreshadowing

every reader reading a game of thrones george right now you have the book soon you'll have the truth the bastard lays right there but not that one um you know the irony that i think a lot of things and this is this is kind of you know i guess subjective to think on but like a lot of the times when i see things happen in plot to ned or ned learn information i always think that one of the first few thoughts is going to be correlated from john right like protecting john keeping his identity safe i think it's safe to say he knows his identity my god like him riding in the rain to the brothel and thinking somehow he didn't think rhaegar would go to a place like this is like okay we got it liana had a baby with Rhaegar. I get that now.

Not everyone gets that apparently. But everyone reading this book is like, oh my god, oh my god, when they read it long enough. Like Jon Arryn read it eight times and he's like, I have to start my reread podcast on the lineages of Westeros. Jon Arryn would have a podcast. Oh, it would probably

be such... It'd be fine fine I have thoughts anyways it's probably okay it's not my cup of tea maybe for others but but John Aaron is so consumed when he reads the book and the idea of

Robert and what Robert's bastards should look like and what Cersei's children look like he doesn't get to the next point which is interesting so you're saying Robert and what Robert's bastards should look like and what Cersei's children look like. He doesn't get to the next point, which is interesting. So you're saying that if you have a very light haired parent and a very dark haired parent with a very specific look, so specific that it doesn't always trump all, some looks have persevered in some familial relationships like Bran, Rickon, Rob, Sansa, but Arya and Jon have one look, and Jon

has a very specific look. And you're saying once more that dark hair trumps light hair sometimes? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. That's a great point, that it's tying back to doing a lot of lifting for a lot of things. The seed is strong. Absolutely. Absolutely. And

yeah, as you said, you know, there's like an irony here, right? Like he has the book, but I'm the bastard, but we don't have the book. Yeah. Dude, I dreamt that I met George last night and I had to refrain. I had to be very polite and not ask about the book. It was so hard. That was my dream. I was like, I'm not going to fuck this up. I'm not going to be an asshole and not ask about the book it was so hard that was my dream i was like i'm not gonna fuck this up i'm not gonna be an asshole but i'm on my podcast so i

will be yeah an ass waffle yeah george isn't editing this you are yeah god damn it so they chat about how ned's wife has abducted tyion, thanks to Littlefinger being a problem, and that it will cause strife between the Lannisters, Tullys, and Starks, and Illyrio, the Italian guy with the mustache, aka me, asks Varys to delay, and he's like, work your magic longer, and then Varys is like, fine, I can do that, but I'll need more gold, and I'll need more birds in exchange. He says 50 birds to be exact. Illyrio says the ones you need are hard to find. They're young to know their letters and lose their tongues. Dot,

dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot,

dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot,

dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot,

dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot,

dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot,

dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot,

dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot,

dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot,

dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot,

dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot,

dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot,

dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, dot, hear a monologue from Varys about the game being bigger than two players though like it's it's quite a long paragraph but it's a fantastic mini summary of all the pieces at the start of the story at the start of like a game of thrones that are all like that powder keg for Aswath and all the balls that George starts juggling and I don't know maybe one day he'll he'll finish and he'll finish catch those balls who knows well that's the thing this is like a huge reveal for the reader but not for Arya, right, for the reader it's almost like, this is like he's giving us a fucking bone, he's giving a dog a bone like we're sitting here like, wait a second

so there is something afoot, there is something going on and it is like a very it's a validating feeling reading this chapter because it's like, it's not enough to give away the whole plot but by the end you know it's Illyrio and Varys. You're like wait a second that's Illyrio and Varys and you

know that Ned's not listening to Arya about something and you're like something's gonna happen and something's not right and then every chapter after this continues that feeling so it's such a great tone setter and it's such a great like slight info dump not enough to like make you too powerful but enough to make you

feel confident before you get the fucking rug pulled out from under you right yeah yes yeah it just like keeps ramping up and it not only that it hints at like because some of these don't come to fruition this book right like you think that they do with like one hand dying being dead but then a lot of it turns out is is has different subtext and doesn't even get like untangled till book five and i like that you've called out the little birds here because it's interesting now on look back it's right there like that tells you obviously it's very short so it doesn't give you all the details but that tells you who var it's very short, so it doesn't give you all the details, but that tells you who Varys' little birds are right there. They are young, semi-educated children, but not rich enough that they matter enough. Right? Not rich enough to stop them from being mutilated and basically kidnapped and sold into service. Not too educated that they're rich people's kids. service, not too educated that they're rich people's kids. It's horrific to remember that they are heading up this trafficking scheme, like that's Varys's demands. And it's really

interesting that we actually learn about it in Arya's plot, considering it revolves so much, her arc revolves so much around some of the lower class, sex work, manual hard labor, and trafficking, right? Like, I'll be at the Heron Hall or even come feast and dance. It makes me hope that Arya will get to come back and do something to be able to help other children being sold into this service whether it's this service or other service or others that are living in a way that they don't wish to right that have no control over their body however they use it and someone's being trafficked in her name right like literally Like literally Jane Poole, who was, who's like in that middle ground of like, rich enough, but not rich enough, right? She didn't have the same privileges that she bullies Arya because she envies her for.

Yes, exactly. That's 100% it. I think that's such an important point to like, Jane is a stupid preteen teen girl that is so jealous of everything aria has yes absolutely it doesn't make like bullying aria right but it it gives context to like what what she wanted um and then how unfortunately the story gives it to her in the worst way george's favorite thing yeah Yeah, true. Monkey paw. And also, you know, regarding that idea of slavery and servitude and children being slaves, it makes me think again of what we were saying about Melisandre during that Melisandre chapter of how she sees other people as pawns in this bigger game i guess between relore and the great other because not because like she thinks she's above other people

but because she sees herself as a pawn in the whole scheme of things as well right and i think that maybe varies maybe illyria i don't really know we don't have enough of like illyria's history to say this about him but like definitely for various probably like he maybe sees himself as able to use these people because he was used in that way he's just repeating the cycles of what was done to him right like he may say that he hates wizards because of what was done to him he hates magic because of the mutilation he endured but he's become that same wizard that sorcerer he. He keeps saying it over and over again. Illyrio keeps saying it, right? He's the one now cutting off children's parts to work his sorcery. His sorcery might not be literal magic, but it is seen by some people as such, right?

He's destroying children, trafficking them for knowledge, same as that wizard who threw his genitals into the fire. Yeah, he's hurting others the way he was hurt and not unlike melisandre right in that seeking of that higher purpose with what she's endured and that she's not exactly hesitant to throw children under that bus it's just normalized for them right they don't think anything of it they're like this is the way the fucking world is, duh. You have that old wave of people and then you have the new wave of people which I hope Arya gets to help front of these children that are like,

that's not the way the world should work. And we can change it incrementally, maybe. That's the best we can do. Once their voices fade, Arya follows the smoking light of the torch, keeping on straight, and finds herself at the top of deep, steep, narrow stairs that go on for what seems like miles. Eventually, she's knee-deep in foul-smelling water.

She wishes she was Syrio so she could dance upon the water, and she pretends Nymeria is paddling alongside with her. When she emerges, it's night, and she stinks very horribly, so she drops her soiled clothing in the riverbank, and she tries to clean herself in the water. I love that she's taking a bath in the trident, a baptism of her own here. A Tully indeed, too, right? They return to the water.

Ooh, yes, definitely. Finding a different person upon it? Well, kind of. Kind of. Well well bit by bit miles from the castle she looks up and sees a red cape high up on a hill her clothes are almost dry when she gets back to the gatehouse and the gold cloaks keeping guards sneer at her telling her uh we don't have any kitchen scraps for you boy and offers a clot in the ear and she tells them that um excuse me do you know who i am my father is the hand of the king and ear, and she tells them that, um, excuse me, do you know who I am? My father is the Hand of the King. And they laugh, and she's like, I don't think that my father,

the inventor of Winterfell, Toaster Strudel. Yeah, Toaster Strudel. Appreciate this. One of them swings his fist at her casually, but she springs back, untouched, tells them that she's Arya Stark of Winterfell, and go fetch Jory, or V Veyon from the Tower of the Hand

thrusting her hands on her hips and asks them if they need a clout in the ear to hear her. Dang. Yeah, get em. Okay, Little Miss Nobility. Okay, okay, Little Miss Class Conscience. She's like, but also I'm of Winterfell, so. I love that, though.

Chloe has her hands on her hips as well just like Aria there's a little Aria in me after all no I'm like that I used to hang out at my dad's work like when I was younger I remember and he he managed a tire store and he had like 10 to 15 employees that were all like young guys right so I would go in there real macho myself and just boss everyone around all the time when I was there I I'd make them, you know, like spin me in the chair or give me parts of their lunch or entertain me. I was very bossy and that's kind of how this reads, so I really appreciate it. I love you, Arya. Yeah. Aww.

Very brat. Very brat central. I get that. Brats. That's a fellow brat. Different kinds of dolls. Yes. Yeah, different kind of brat not that not that kind yeah harwin and fat tom march her into her father who sends them off with thanks sternly telling her i didn't have my guard looking for you young lady and septimordane was beside herself maybe with a hangover uh with fear praying for her return in the sept currently which i'm like okay

well that's not gonna do much septimorty he tells her she's never to go beyond the castle gates without his leave and she's like i didn't i was in the dungeons and men were talking about killing you and that you have a book and a bastard and that if one hand can die why not a second which i'm like that should put some alarm bells in your head uh and she points at the book and she's like is that the book and she's like john's the bastard i bet which i'm like oh my god med right now must be shaking in his seat shitting his pants he's like oh fuck fuck fuck yeah uh which the irony being yeah John is the bastard everyone should be talking about, but no one knows it. And Arya's like, John's the bastard. Yes, and. And Ned's like, no, no, not John.

Who's John? I don't know. Not you. Who's John? It's like Ted Danson, Michael in the Good Place when he's like, Jason? Jason figured it out? I have to rewatch that show one day. I haven't rewatched it yet so much

we should i miss it i re-watched it once it's good it holds up yeah uh well you know also in regards to like all right we were talking about aria stark dying but not you were entirely but kind of just the identity yeah last last chapter, kind of like how death is being spoken about here, right? They're like, one hand can die, and I'm like, oh ho ho, but John Cunnington isn't really dead. Kind of like in Reputation Name, they said he's dead, but he's really not. And that was, I guess, their plan for Ned, but turns out Ned's actually dead. Rip. Okay, well what do you think your whole end game here is eliana can you be fucking polite i don't know i had no end game other than any point hurt people yeah great points they're just

mean points yeah that's all i was gonna say yeah yeah uh but yeah that's a great point about john khan because he is like unsaid and a garden but be like yeah, like, ha ha ha ha. Ha ha ha ha. Yeah. John Kahn, the long Kahn. I think he started being gardened, what, book three, probably. Yeah, but you know, and maybe this comes from not having a new book, but like, maybe George is just that good.

I think he would have dropped hints earlier. I think he had the idea of him, but he was like, coming up with that name is for, like, that's a future George problem. And unfortunately, a lot of things are apparently he thought future George problems. Well, I also think by 2015, he kind of had a more clear picture of what he wanted to expand when it came to like the world of Ice and Fire and some of the story, especially in the rebellion that he had started crafting out more and like actually putting into place um and the dunkin egg stories too kind of have a little bit of those echoes so i think like as he started this outer world building he started understanding what he wanted to tell in that story more and more and so i don't know i think it definitely could have been swimming in Yeah. So, Aria tells Ned, one of these men was fat with rings and a forked yellow beard, and the other was in chain mail and a steel cap.

And she recaps the conversation that they can't keep juggling. The wolf and the lion will eat each other. It's a mummer's farce. Unfortunately, not all of it really makes sense to her. But she tries her best, remembering them saying the princess was with child and one of them was a wizard. But not like old Nan's stories, she declares. And she's like, I was chasing cats. And then I was there.

And Ned's like, between the cats, the wizard, the monsters, you had quite an adventure, little lady. And he's like, it seems you saw mummers who are in town for my tourney. Dozens of them. And maybe the king asked for a private show. Well, he's going to get a private show, that's for sure. Ned chastises her for following people and spying on them and climbing in windows. And he criticizes the scars and scratches on her arm and says he wants a word with Syrio Ferell, a stern word. and says he wants a word with Syrio-Farrell, a stern word,

but they're interrupted by Desmond, who announces that a black brother is here to speak with them, Yoren. I like that classic trope that the adults are not listening to the kids when important information is coming by, especially as Warren pointed out in comparison to the last chapter, where Ned was very patient and understanding and kind of played the dad card. He doesn't always play it but here he's very much playing the lord and there's a great irony in this chapter versus sansa's next

chapter where ned listens to sansa on a lark on accident he's like from the mouth of babes when sansa's like yelling about how joffrey's nothing like Robert. He refuses to see it because he's so blind, probably from his own situation with Jon. Right? He's so blinded by Jon the bastard. Yeah, there's a lot on his mind. But then he listens to Sansa about Joffrey and the king and bastards versus Arya here yelling

about a bastard in a book. Yeah, and death. And I guess he is trying to play the dead card, but like as us pointed out he's not really giving it weight he's he's trying to give meaning because sometimes i think adults children sometimes look to adults to explain the world right give it shape meaning um i do like that aria insists that what she's telling dad she's like no it's not like old Nan stories because the language of it does sound like a fairy tale right and wizards mummers wolves and lions animals talking animals

going to war I don't know but it's not it's not one of those fairy tales or stories it's not like the songs as we're told throughout A Song of Ice and Fire right like this is now the story of their lives it's real life for them not not real life these characters are fake they will not be offended by the voices and and it is like the story it's like aria and the other children are learning right even if it's dressed still in the language and symbolism of it which is why ned is so confused um but yeah ned he's like same as not listening to the children he's not listening to symbols, and he just doesn't like doing that in general. As we see at the beginning of this very book, where he's like, I don't know, what could it mean when Catelyn's like, I think that's an omen?

When there's a stag horn through the direwolf's neck? I don't know, what do you fucking think it means, Ned? I mean, to be fair, signs of importance are what his sister and her lover followed so fair true true true maybe i would want to believe in the simple things too after all that man do you think after seeing your whole family die because of that that about rhaegar i feel like that was like rhaegar's dark secret i think he knew to an extent he was a doomsday maybe i don't know i think yeah i think like he under yeah he's a fetal doomsday prepper. I don't know. I think, yeah, I think, like, he under, yeah, he's a fetal doomsday prepper. That, like, Liana, I think he knew that she thought she was doing it for a greater purpose. But, I mean, what girl doesn't think that when she offers her womb up to a guy's cock, to be fair?

But we all think it's for a greater purpose, but it's not. It's for, like, a guy's cock. It's not. I've been watching a lot of Sex and the City, and it's all just for cock? Yeah. There's no higher purpose oh my god chloe quickly surpassed me in uh sex in the city this is our first watch through for both of us very exciting very exciting i'm ready i'm ready for the movies i'm ready for and just like that and just like that and just like that, and just like that, Arya. And just like that, Euron enters going to Ned and to Arya saying to Eddard, oh, this must be

your son, he has your look. But casually also another R plus L equals J clue coming off of what we just discussed there with the bastard in the book. Like, they are heavy-handed in this chapter and I don't know that I necessarily noticed it until this read. Especially because some of those first brand chapters are so and john chapters are

so chock full of these and that uh these moments and hints towards r plus l equals j but even aria has them in these chapters pretty strongly after last chapter in this chapter yeah i mean that black bastard real king of this castle hell Hell, even next chapter, I would argue we don't know. What if there is something of that? I'm sure Lyanna had to run for her life at some point. Yeah. There's what? Was that Lady Gwyn's theory?

Someone's theory. The best essay ever. Lady Gwyn's essay about the end of the crossroads. Yep. And I believe that like i actually unfortunately it's just been so long that i take that as canon so until there's a book to disprove my head canon yeah yeah c-a-n-o-n so aria exasperated is like i'm a girl do you also know my brothers and there's this like cute cute little exchange oh my god i love this exchange so

much it's literally so cute she's like do you know my brothers rob and brandt they're at winterfell and john's on the wall john snow he's in the night swatch too you must know him he has a dye or what if a white one with red eyes is john a ranger yet i'm aria aria stark and then she's like when you ride back to the wall could you bring john a letter if i wrote one oh my baby girl it's very sweet no it's very sweet it's um she misses them i wish they were there too just for her but i'm glad they're not because they'd probably further get slaughtered so yeah well ned is like ahem my daughter forgets that she's a lady with courtesies and then asks if benjamin sent him urine says he was sent by old

mormon to find more men for the wall, hoping to seek the king's help when he holds court, hoping to take some of the folks in the dungeons north to the wall and give them new jobs. But Yoren says Ben Stark is definitely why they're talking. There's a line of, His blood ran black, made him my brother as much as yours. It's for his sake I'm come. I thought that

was interesting that benjin has that much influence and people respect him that much and we learned that when it comes to corinne too to corinne halfhand and that benjin really made his own home and family there um but yoren says he had left the others behind which i'm like what does it mean the other the others ned others um ned is like what do you mean the others and i'm like what do you mean the others um you're it's so funny go on you're good sorry you're it says that sellswords and free riders at the inn had ridden with them but some made for king's landing someone for casterly rock because tywin would have gotten word by now. And Ned's like, which words are you talking about?

But Joran eyes Arya and says, it's better left in private. So Ned sends Arya to bed and is worried that something's happened to Jon or to Uncle Benjen. But Joran says, it isn't them who concerns him. And Arya is taken off by Desmond, wishes that it was Fat Tom instead so she could eavesdrop some more. But Desmond isn't that easily tricked. So I'm like, it really is. Fat Tom did understand that she was in that room. He's just a big softie doing nice things for Arya.

And she doesn't get that. That's so cute. She's like, I wish Desmond was stupider like Fat Tom. It's like, no, sweetie. Fat Tom's just a sweetie. Yeah. Yeah, and they're all going to die. But yeah true true before that we have a conversation about what happens if possibly they might die how many guards does my father have she asked him as they descended to her bedchamber

here at king's london 50 you wouldn't let anyone kill him, would you? No fear on that count, little lady. Lord Eddard's guarded night and day. He'll come to no harm. The Lannisters have more than fifty men. So they do, but every northerner's worth ten of these southern swords, so you can sleep easy. What if a wizard was sent to kill him? What if a wizard was sent to kill him? Well, as to that, Desmond replied, drawing his longsword, wizards die the same as other men once you cut their heads off. Ooh, that kind of comes back to Echo in Storm, right? Or in Trial, right, actually. Is that Clash? Storm? Clash? When she asks the question of could you bring a man's back? You know, just this head.

But also, what if Arya cut Euron's head off? I don't think she will, but what if she did? What if she did? That'd be really interesting. Why not? Who cares? Why not? Let her. Yeah. I don't know. I see him, like seem like i don't know being burned up from the inside somehow i like that too no i like that and i like i like the uh quentin poor quentin the poorest of quentin's his concept is that uh bran will fry him internally while danny fries him

externally yeah yeah he was thinking i don't know if i think both but I like it I like it like Aang and Ozai but also with fire yeah I think it's funny that you were talking about you know cutting Euron's head off right him as a wizard because I'm like oh Euron what he's doing instead is he has got a bunch of wizards and he's cutting off

their other body parts not their heads because the head is like the stem of the magic maybe i i don't know why i thought about shrimps and then you suck out the juices of the head but um that's i'm i think i'm hungry i think that's where the sausage is made is really the the long and short of it is that like your brain is where the mat i mean it is right like because your heart can't think your brain is the only thing that can think magic requires intentional thought so you need your head but you can live without your arms or your legs yeah live without

a lot of your organs and my understanding is also with the whites right like george seems to imply especially in later interviews that blood's not pumping so like do you even really need the heart aspect well and that's where you have the idea of rob and john right skin changing or warging into their wolves or other animals or john surviving through his wolf right like you don't your consciousness can live elsewhere yeah and like a tree or something and bide yeah you could bide your

yeah Bran yeah you could bide your fucking time if you had to yep hmm a lot of stuff happens I feel like we just got somewhere in here yeah

yeah you got me there Eliana thank you yeah I like doing voices I'm really bad at accents I just want to throw that out there are you feeling insecure at my bad accent? I was really impressed and I was like I'm sorry I can't like I can't be a good scene partner here it's okay Sally Reed I've got you I can only do like four accents and

they're not that good so I'm not very good at them but I could do louise belcher i can do a scottish i can do john snow and i can do whatever the old man voices i do are or the older like the booming you know i don't know whatever those are that's about it that's about it yeah i don't know that i can do the voices but i enjoy attempting and that's all that matters because it's my podcast. The journey. Yeah, the journey. In your podcast.

And if you want to keep up with those, you can find us on social media at Twitter slash X. Unsure. Unsure. We're still Girls Gone Canon though. C-A-N-O-N. But somewhere you can definitely find us also now is on Blue Sky. Ho, ho, ho. Also Girls Gone Canon though, C-A-N-O-N, but somewhere you can definitely find us also now is on Blue Sky.

Ho ho ho. Also Girls Gone Canon. And you can also send us some emails at girlsgonecanon at gmail.com. Yeah, yeah. And I've had a great time with you, you all tonight. You know, all you Jarya lovers, you Jarya shippers at home, thanks for listening. Just putting it in everything so you can't get rid know all you jaria lovers you jaria shippers at home thanks for listening just putting it in everything so you can't get rid of all of it but thanks for listening and uh yeah we're gonna roll out and let you find out where to find us

and more about our patreon with this word from our sponsors our our patrons. Thanks again to our friends for chatting about where to find us. You can catch Girls Gone Canon on any of the following streamers. On Podbean, iTunes, Google Play, Stitcher, Acast, Spotify, Overcast, Apple Podcast,

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important channel of all. Respectful thirsting, because there's a channel for that. Come by, join the community. It's a lot of fun and you won't regret it. and you won't regret it. As always, I've been one of your hosts, Chloe. And I have been another one of your hosts, Eliana. See you next week. Are you ready?

Are you ready? Aye, aye, Captain. Oh, I can hear you. I'm quiet as a shadow. The shadows were not very quiet. No, not at all. Not at all. Kind of stabby, too. True, true. Alright.

Bye! Bye!