Girls Gone Canon Cast - ASOIAF Episode 286 — ACOK Tyrion V

Episode Date: October 9, 2026

Things are heating up (kind of) in King's Landing as one of Tyrion's eggs hatches. Eliana's reddit account: https://www.reddit.com/user/glass_table_girl Eliana's blog: https://themanyfacedblog.wordpress.com/ Chloe's twitter: https://twitter.com/liesandarbor Chloe's blog: liesandarborgold.com Intro by Anton Langhage

Hello and welcome to Girls Gone Canon reads of Song of Ice and Fire episode 286, Tyrion 5 and a clash of kings. I'm one of your hosts, Chloe. And I am another one of your hosts, Eliana. We are solidly in October, and I know this because I was like, Chloe, I'm going to tell you this on the episode. I'm not going to tell her beforehand. I've had multiple people send me a screenshot of the tweet that of that person saying they're going to be sexy George R. Martin. for Halloween with like the hat, the suspenders, and I forgot the other thing, the glasses, I think, and it has the two Xs that are meant to be the tapes for the nipple covers, and I've had

multiple people send me this. You know what's so funny is like no one has sent me that. Really? But I've seen it, but no one has sent me that. So like I feel like that's too, that's very much our online profile and persona. I'm glad that our friends have experienced us in this manner. I'm really happy. I don't, but it is very you. Like, that is. Yeah, it was something by some of my other friends. Maybe on your online world, everyone, everyone's already seen it and has assumed that you've already seen it. So they're not sending it to you. And I'm like, the people that I know are not in tune, so they don't know that we've all already seen it. No, it's innocence. It's beautiful, sweet innocence. I love it. I don't have those issues. Thank God. Yeah, for you. Everyone in your circle is like, we've all seen this. Obviously.

Chloe's seen this. She probably made it. Thank God. Keep thinking that. I'm like, I just see a lot of memes. I'm actually not accepting memes right now. My circle is closed. I'm only accepting memes from the already pre-registered memeer list like you. Yes. Thank you. Yes. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. So, Eliana, yes, you have passed that test. You are open to the circle. You can send memes. But my circle is closed right now. Thank you very much. No, I'm just kidding. I really do love not getting that from 20 people, though. I really do love Halloween and the spooky season in our world, in our Ace Woff world,

because I think there's lots going on. And you brought up a great point with this because it is October, bitches, and what are we doing this month? Well, we have plans at GGC, right? Or MGC. Oh, sorry, MGC, I forgot. Reading Energy. Men 5 ever. Men 5.

Stop it. Stop it. Yeah. Men 5Eva, the podcast. That would be a great name for a baby girl. So we're going to do the glass flower for patrons in the stranger tier and above this month. And what is the glass flower? Eliana is asking everyone's asking.

Everyone wants to know what the glass flower is. Well, it's a novelette. by our dear friend. I'm just kidding. He's not our friend, but we do really revere him, George R. Martin, and the guy that the sexy Halloween costume is about. So he wrote a bunch of little ditties, a bunch of little novellas, novellettes, et cetera. If you've been following us, you may have read some of them yourselves outside of us,

but maybe you're listening on Patreon at patreon.com slash girls gone canon, where we've covered many novellas from dream songs by George R. Martins, especially some of the stories in his thousand worlds universe. And that's where the glass flower is from. I don't know if maybe I'm incorrect on this. We'll find out we're going to do some more research in this episode. So you can come here the answer. But this might be his last dream songs or his last thousand worlds iteration.

Oh, interesting. So one of the final stories in those worlds, at least for now, keep reading. But, yeah, I really like the Thousand Worlds short stories, and I think I've come to realize that, A, throughout our journey of it, and B, like, the more that I think about everything in the context of dying of the light. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm. For a moment there, Chloe just saw maybe the dying of the light happen on my face. Maybe I'll leave that. Yeah, the light died. The light fucking died.

The lights just turned off for a second in my brain. Nobody home. That's okay. That happens to me literally 80 times a day. At least. At least. But it's true. Like there's so many good, I mean, even the, there's a lot between the world of Acewaf and the thousand worlds too, right?

Like, there are a lot of thematics that you can see George's playing with. And I like when he kind of, when he likes something about a setting that he's writing. right? Like he's very in 2000 worlds and what those limits are and what those limits aren't, honestly, is really more what the stories are about. It's kind of weird because I know we have a few, we haven't covered. So it's weird to go to the end before covering the middle, but I don't really care. They don't all like, we have time. Yeah, they're not like all chronological anyway. It's fine. Yeah, we have all of the time in the worlds, all thousands of them. Wow. So expect that at the end of October 2020. 26 for those historians at home documenting this. We're going to do a couple of history-making things this month, I think. So that's for patrons, Stranger Tieran Up, $5 and up. More to come.

Lots going on for Patreon this month. But we have another treat from Patreon. You know, every month we put out a bonus episode. Every single month, we do a bonus episode. And in those episodes, what we do is we cover a topic that you guys, have told us you want to hear about, but also sometimes mostly just what we decided to hear about. And we made that affectionately. We know what's best here. We've been doing this for so long. Wow. We've been doing this for a handful or two of years here. And we've done a lot

of stories, a lot of different novellas stories. So because of that, we decided we're releasing something from the Patreon vault later this month. October 30th, we are going to release, And this is especially for those of you that are interested and want to jump into a new George novella or Novelette that maybe you haven't read yet. So if you're interested in dream songs, this might be a perfect entrance for you. We're going to cover remembering melody. But here's the twist. We already did it. It's from the past.

So we're releasing it in the future for you. You're going to time travel with us. And we're releasing that for public October 30th to give you some Halloween spirit vibes. I think you've all heard us talk about remembering melody even recently. I think this is like, this is one of like my favorites of the George short stories that we've covered. Not because of anything like we said. Just like I think that I think it's a fun, it's a fun, interesting kind of spooky story. And I also feel it's like one of the best ones to be like, hey, if you've not like checked out any of Georgia's short stories yet, this is, I think one of the ones that I would.

would say should be a first. It's got a little bit of everything, George. It's got that little bit of monkey paw. It's got the psychic and psyche and psycho horror going on. Like, there's a lot of like psycho-thriller, psychosexual thriller stuff going on. And it's also brief. It's like a perfect hit of George. You know, it's just like a quick, brief in and out. And you're in the mind of George R. Martin, a couple of tragic characters. I love it. I think it's a very, very, fun. Yeah. So we'd love you to jump on the train.

I don't even know what we say in it. Honestly, it's been a while. I don't even know when we did it. I don't even know if it was that long. Man, I'm not even remembering Eliana. Shit. Wow. Well, come find out with us.

We're going to revisit it. What you'll get as a public listener, we will definitely give you an intro kind of talking about it because I know we're going to look back at what we talked about and just give you a brief intro today. to us then because it is a different two people you'll be hearing from. Yeah. Well... Who are they?

Who are they? Someone different than even what you're going to get next week, right? Next week is we're going to continue our journey through Tyrion's. He changes a lot too throughout his life, but we're going to do Tyrion 6 in a clash of kings, slowly making our way towards the Blackwater, which is very exciting. I really am loving. these like Tyrion clash chapters. They're like an interesting little like, I think, episodic serial thing going on.

And then we have, all right, so 1023, we might be off. But you also, there's like a non-zero chance. You could see the return of the hit minisode series. Eliana explains nothing at all. Yeah. I'm jealous, honestly. It's like my favorite thing is hearing Eliana. A filibuster.

An adventure. Like Filipino buster. Whoa. Wait, maybe I should just to title it that. Interesting. The filibuster. It was really, we're cooking. We're cooking today.

We are cooking with wildfire, my friend. Yeah. For real. Almost. We're almost there. We're almost there. But you might hear Eliana talk about exactly that. Yeah.

Maybe. Maybe. Anything could happen. Anything could happen. It's a month of. magic. Ooh, could also even talk about over the garden wall. It is over the garden wall season again. So anything could happen. But yeah, it is happening again. Perhaps. Again, on October 30th, we're releasing remembering melody for the public, but here's something that is not for the public.

Only if you are a member of our Patreon in the Thunder tier above, we have our Discord brunch slash happy hour. It's coming. Yeah, October 25th, which I'm going to be there, like, rain or shine, but I absolutely am going to be on a train also during this exact time in another state, apparently. I'm going to be in Florida, a different state of mind for sure. Yeah, actually. But I'm very excited. It's 1 p.m. to 3 p.m. E.T. Our brappy hour, our brunch slash happy hour. And what's up with brunch slash happy hour? Yeah, I know you are all dying to know.

Honestly, it's a blast. We sit there for a couple hours with our friends. we say it goes two hours and sometimes it does sometimes we're like gotta go we got shit going on you know people got to bail they don't hang out but also sometimes we just like stay and yap all day and it's a blast which happened last time that was really fun yeah that was like i didn't even want to leave i was like man i got to go do shit you guys i'm sorry because also like i have to go like cook dinner or something usually so or eat dinner more importantly i have to eat lunch usually at that yeah someone's got to of time. Yeah. Yeah. Not to be confused with E.T.

It's just fun. It's always fun. So October 25th, 1 to 3 p.m. ET. Should we cover E.T. One day. Oh my God. We can invite poor Quintan. Oh, my God. Actually. Anyway. Actually. All right. That's housekeeping. Let's talk about emails and tweets a note. We got a lot. We did get a handful of emails. We're just going to cover some of the highlights. We got a bunch of great Spotify comments. So we're going to come back to them. A lot of people, we're going to

talk about it next episode with all the Paisal stuff going on. Not this episode, but there's a lot, see, see, I'm cooking again with Wildfire. A lot of great comments about what people think the other links that we don't know about might stand for. I really can't wait to get into that, but I'm holding myself back with these comments today instead. We'll come to it next week. We have first, our friend Rizal gave us a couple comments, actually. Yeah, Lady Raj has reacted to our line last episode of, God forbid, Paisal serves cunt. I mean, like, okay, he's got platinum on.

Like, let him, let him serve, you know? And Lady Raj says, put it on my tombstone. Yeah, let him serve cunt. Next, Lady Raj left us another comment or sent us a message saying, I haven't emailed the chamber that I haven't finished for y'all yet, but I've been meaning to say this from the start, A-Cock, which I believe this spelling is intentional of A-C-O-C-K, knowing the Sunder, says, A-C-Ty-N-F-Ty-N-FOR is my fucking Super Bowl.

I absolutely adore that chapter and find myself going back to it a lot as I continue back through the book these last few weeks to follow along the pod. I feel like it would actually make a decent standalone story. Interesting. It's such a banger chapter, very George B.B. Martin of him. Georgia, big balls, Martin, if you'll remember, you know, for your sexy Halloween costumes, friends. They've left out the balls. I did.

I love that. First of all, I'm so happy to hear that you love that chapter. I think it's like, I think it's very beloved by a lot of people. And honestly, when we get to do some of those chapters, sometimes it's daunting because I know how beloved it is. and that chapter is like such a great the concept of the power and everything going on. I don't know, it's a very strong chapter. So I'm really excited for you to listen to this.

I can't wait to hear what you think about the chapter when you do get to it. But I love Tyrion for, I'm actually enjoying so much Tyrion. Could you imagine that happening to me? Actually, yeah, I could. I think we were always going to have a good time doing these chapters. I don't think it was going to be as bittersweet

considering that, you know, We were young, naive, thought that winds would be out by now, which it is under your chair. Yeah, you just have to like, actually, if you just, for a moment, everyone, if you just go under the chair. If you're pure of heart, the winds of winter is there. I do feel that way about so many things. Whatever something good happens to me, I always tell people, it's because I'm pure of heart. So, I don't know. Well, we got a, thank you, Raj.

for your emails. We got a theory from Katarina, and I can't really do this justice in full. Perhaps Katarina will publish it themselves. That would be awesome. And you should. I think more people should publish their theories. Yeah. Especially like once they've written themselves, because these days on the internet, people like post-chat GPT theories. And it's crazy because back in my day, we used to drink boxes of wine while claiming you're going to write five essays about a Sharadane. Okay. There were essays where, speaking of drinking things, in order to get the juices flowing, I was drinking one dark beer to loosen up. And then also, like, I don't know if it was a coffee or tea. I don't think I was drinking coffee that much at that time. So, and a tea to caffeinate so that, you know, we would have everything happening in my brain at the same time. Because you have to hit that peak of it. And like, if you don't get there, you'll lose it. And if you do get there, you'll get it. But then you have a limited time. You have this much time to get it out of you.

To crank it. Like, it's actually an art. Yeah. You have to crank out. Stop it. You have to crank these words out. No, that's so real because this is like a time of my life where I was like living with an actual roommate, not my roommate right now. Like a real roommate.

And like I would like be up till 4 or 5 a.m. and have my headphones on playing like vibe music sitting in my. Remember that bet I had with all the princess canopy on? and all the glowing lights. I have like purple Asharadain lights going on. Yeah. Like talk about having to have the vibe in order to do it. Like, it used to mean something. And now it's just like, I want to write a theory about X, Y, Z, chat, G, BT, Lord Blood Raven.

Please write it. Like, what is that shit? That's crazy. I log on the Acewaf subreddit sometimes. And I'm like, how dare you stand here like this in the ruins of what was? I remember writing and we will revisit this. We will revisit this essay in theory in Arturian Astormasorts chapters. But I remember writing one of these essays during a fucking work meeting.

Like, my coworkers are around me. And I'm here on my Google talk. Yeah. I'm about a Greek tragedy. Oh, yeah. I was up in that Google Doc at work many a time, many a fucking times, my friend. Well, Katerina, if you so choose, I hope, after I read this, that you were inspired to actually do it some real beautiful justice like your email you sent us.

Put it out there. Write it out. I think the people should hear it. Make a WordPress. You have a gift and I love your knowledge that you shared with us. So thank you for the email. And Katerina said this theory is dedicated to their mom's cat Lily. Katerina's theory makes

one observation I really want to hook but the larger historical argument gets very broad. But the historical backbone is that ancient Mesopotamian rulers periodically would cancel debts and free debt bonded people because unchecked debt could swallow the free population. A slay.

Any bells? Ring any bells? The theory contrasts that Rome had a stronger protection of creditors and then asked, like, what if the Lannister obsession with debt connects their obsession with sex work, right? A Lannister always pays his debts implies debts are ruthlessly collected, but Westeros banned slavery, sex work, other coercive dependencies. that become kind of a substitute for all of that. So it puts Tywin, Tyrion, and even Littlefinger

into the same thematic world of money, sex, ownership, identity, and humiliation. And it's very interesting. So thank you, Katarina. Again, you should write this. Yeah, we're not doing, we're not, like, truly doing it justice, and hopefully that only, like, incentivizes you to actually put it out there and write it.

And I think there were, like, a lot of interesting thoughts that this inspired for me. first of all, first of these thoughts is that my group of friends and I have started going to bar trivia recently and I feel like there's a lot in this email that I'm going to try to internalize because I strongly believe it could come up for me. Like Katerina brings up these, I know, I'm like, this is good to know, swirling this away for trivia. Katerina brought up like these concepts of like Andoraraam and Latifundia that I think like have to could come up for me a trivia.

I feel it in my bones. I feel it in my jellies, to quote, Detective Pikachu. But also... As you should. Yeah. I do think, like, there were some other things that also struck me

as interesting in a thematic way of how it intersects with Tyrion's storyline, right? Because Katerina was talking about how, like, the ancient Mesopotamian creditors would take someone who had, like, an unpayable interest. They've accrued so much interest. There's no way they could.

could ever pay back that debt. And then they would enslave them and their family. And how this, like, plays into Tyrion's storyline. Katerina also points out how, like, the lanester's slogan, not housewords, right? Of a lanester always pays his debts, whatever, are kind of absurd in that, like, the Laidesters are rich enough that, like, they're technically capable of always paying off their debts monetarily. So what do we mean here?

And I actually hadn't given it much thought before. and I think then that means that there's an implication that when we're talking about debts we're talking about slights we're talking about like other things like loyalty is rewarded with loyalty or harm is rewarded with harm

or harm is paid back in harm right so when we're talking about debts we're talking about different more abstract things maybe it doesn't have to be abstract but just not monetarily and we do see that operate throughout the story. However, also ironically, I will say, like, as people have pointed

it out, the lateststers kind of do fail to pay their debts a lot. Like, seriously, he's like, fuck you, Iron Bank. And also, this could still pay off, like, later in books, you know, six and seven that, oh, six, seven. They could or could not be out. Maybe that's why George has never released them. He's like six, seven. Anyways, um, it's because he knows the answer to six, seven is seven, eight nine. Oh, that's true. and the 13th, the ninth book, the 13th book, that's the implication behind all of these. The implication, because of the implication. But these could all pay off later in terms of like, how, how is Tyrion going to pay back the

mountain plants and the second sentence, right? Because, like, he is still indebted to them. And then, again, like, there is an irony in that when we're talking about Mesopotamia, someone becoming so indebted and becoming enslaved. Like, Tyrion's, when we've left him off in a dance with dragon, he is still a slave, right? Or like in that, is he still a slave? Is he not, you know, try to escape?

And he's working on getting himself out of slavery by getting himself into even more debt with the second sons. So it's a thought-provoking email, I think. Very fun. Abs of freaking lute. Especially because I'm like, oh, yeah, the coerciveness of society. Holy shit. Mm-hmm. Like, now you have to indebt your own.

sons into the army because society has said so. Wow. Lots to fucking think about. Damn, Katerina. That's it. That's how I felt about that. Damn, Katerina. Yeah.

Yeah. It's a good thing. It's a good thing. It's going to be good for trivia. Future Aliana's going to love this. I've been studying the periodic table of elements recently. That's like how deep in this where... I've only gone to like two.

at this latest recent one. But anyways. I can't wait to hear more about this throughout the rest of our lives. So let's get to the rest of our lives. Thanks so much for the emails and the comments and the messages on Patreon. Like I said, we will come back to some of the more Picell-themed ones in the future. And we love hearing from you. You can always email us at Girls Gone Cannon at gmail.com as well as,

send us a quick tweet or whatever note over at the artist's formerly known as Twitter, Girls Gun Cannon. And loose guy theoretically. Theoretically. If somebody was checking it theoretically. Theoretically. Theoretically. Theoretically.

Well, here's what we miss between Tyrion 4 and Tyrion 5, starting with Sonsa 2 in a clash of kings. Sonsa is disappointed by the Knights of Kans. King's Landing, aka Dantos Hollard and Sandwork Lagain. Also a side note, I've started doing this lightning round and I literally for like a day had just written. Sonsa is disappointed, and I think that also rings true. It's very true, especially for Clash arc. Sonsa's disappointed.

Sonsa's, put it mildly. Aria 5. Aria's identity is revealed to Gendry, which is not very Halloween of them. The team is captured and Lomi is killed. Oh, what the fuck, Salami? Salami. Oh, that leads us to Tyrion 5, where Tyrion's on fire in King's Landing, the way that he's working, you could say. Okay, not yet, but he is out there, he's politicking, he's avoiding the riots and the shepherd, and of course, he's swindling his sweet, sweet sister.

I want to open up with a quote that I really love from this chapter. The substance flows through my veins and lives in the heart of every pyromancer. We respect its power. Any little mistake can bring catastrophe. That cannot be said too often. I feel like that's so exemplary of like the arc that we're experiencing with Tyrion, who's literally learning from top to bottom about power right now and like understanding the power structure of King's Landing in here.

He comes across these men who worship something even different than what he worships, right? This is their power. This is what they pray to. The fire. Yeah, that is interesting, especially as it, like, flows into the other parts of his story of, like, what does it mean for power to flow through someone's veins, right? When we talk about lineage, things like that, and mistakes. Many mistakes are made throughout by everyone, throughout this entire story. I mean, even so, like lineage, you know, not to bring it up again so early in the day. But, you know, Tyrion's parentage being potentially disputed IDK, IDK, no one knows what the truth is because there's no book, but there's something about it that it's fun to explore with him in clash because book one really explores Ned in a lot of ways in John kind of contrasting their thoughts about one another and explores John kind of with that whole like, you know, but he's your daddy kind of plot. but also like isn't that

kind of that inverse of Tyrion that if Tywin isn't his biological father, Tyrion was the one who was raised with hate by his non-biological father while John was the one raised with love. Yeah, I was actually like thinking you are not wrong to bring up

the theory. The theory. The theory. I'm just saying. There was like a line in this chapter where Tyrion's like and he thanked him every day that like he was born to Lannister and it was like interesting. because what if he's here continuing his father's work? Yeah, I mean, it's...

That dragons work, who brings it? Yeah, it is a question. Okay, well, now that we've opened up with Tyrion Targaryen today. And Kay Bush. Tyrion... Yeah, thank you. That's the men's work, right? That's what that song's called, just like we're men...

Men gone canon. This men's work. Oh, my God. That's all these Tyrion chapters are, is this one's work? Oh my God. Tyrion visits the alchemist's guild beneath Rainies's hill to inspect their wildfire stores. He dresses for the cold in his absurdly oversized shadow skin cloak, while Tumet immediately decides that the underground freezer temperature is not for him.

Same. Hallline shows Tyrion the clay jars deliberately roughened so that soldiers won't just drop them. Wildfire burns until it's consumed, spreads. into cloth, wood, leather, even steel, and it cannot be extinguished with water. Hmm. Seems pretty scary, honestly, but also we'll say that, like, the way that wildfire gets explored in this chapter and also some of the other stuff regarding, like, the power, the Akmas, etc. It's just fun. Just fun thematically and ties together with how this book opens with Melisandra and, you know, fire. It's a great passenger for story, right?

because later we're going to really be glued into, if you're reading this like a normal person, not like us, over eight years reading only one character at a time. But, you know, if you've actually read this before, also like us, you'll know that the actual order,

in the next book, you'll read Jamie really come clean, in the bathhouses of Heron Hall about his involvement with killing, you know, the pyromancer and killing Aries and stopping Aries from lighting everything on fire and you get that reveal about what Aries intended to do

that he had intentions and what those intentions were. So you kind of know, but you don't know, no. So it just delivers it really well across the three plots. And it's so interesting because it doesn't, I mean, we kind of lay off the wildfire after this for a while, which to me says it's like going to come back. You know, like it's not really hammered after book three. like clearly going to come back.

Yeah, very much of Chekhov's wildfire stash. And many people have like theories on how it could come back. I'll let you all read those. I don't feel like rehashing them. And I think you all kind of know. Anyway, I assume if you're like on this journey with us, like, I just assume. But yeah, I really, it stood out to me that the halls of the guild are marble, which is fire resistant. or heat resistant.

It's not necessarily fire resistant, but for the most part it's heat resistant, right? So the more you know. Okay. Question, though, because you brought up the black marble. Are you going to say what I thought? I don't know. Are you thinking?

Are you thinking it's like the oily black stone shit? It doesn't say because it would have just said, right? It would have just said, but also like, wouldn't it make sense because it's going to give to something else that I'm going to theorize about because I'm like, what? What? It feels related, but also I'm like, there's something about it that feels like it goes hand in hand a little, even though they lost a lot of power. It feels a little like House of the Undying, ish. Because that is part of this book, too, you know? That's all. That's all. Yeah. Yeah, there's a lot. Like, I left this reread with more questions, which I did answer someone for myself, like in reading different bits and pieces. But, like, more. thoughts. Like I actually read the first part of this chapter again today and went, huh, wow,

wait a second. And I had all these questions. Like, it really stands out to me that like the main series, it's very crystal clear to me that George sprinkled it in in clash and that bit with Jamie and of the starts of Brandon N. Rickards, deaths. But like, beyond that, there's nothing in the main canon about the history of it, right? Like, if you open up the main five books right now, this is it, this and the next book, like, this is it. So, you know, the World of Ice and Fire has some info, and Fire and Blood has a little bit of info. And then, of course, there are bits and pieces of semi-canonical, right? Which the World of Ice and Fire is also semi-canonical, but glossing over that. And that's like maybe canonical.

all that said it's not mentioned historically until you get to those side books and even like the Game of Thrones lore videos had some really interesting stuff going on if you remember so we'll talk about all that but Tyrion tells us that they light the torches for super important guests in the Guildhall of the alchemists

with wildfire and that it reflects on the black marble and that really stood out to me too absolutely I was like what do you mean it reflects are you sure it's marble um but I just feel like he's not the one to call something, you know, like a blue heron and be like, look at that blue heron in the water and it's actually like an eagle. Like George isn't like that. So I don't know. I just think he's more obvious than we think in a lot of ways. There's some really fun. Yeah, he's, I think we've

all just society been so fucked by like Mcuffins and like, oh, here's this thing and gotcha and here's the big reveal. Like, that's not actually how he is. Think of like the cat spa, right? It's dragged out over three books and people are like, that's anti-climactic. And I'm like, well, maybe it wasn't supposed to be a gotcha. I don't think it was anti-climac. Whatever. Whatever. Yeah. That too. But I just don't think it's a gotcha. You know what I mean? He's not a gotcha. It's not a gotcha. Yeah. The puzzle's already solved. It's not a puzzle box. Yeah. We solved it. He's not a puzzle boxer. Yeah. I just think like we as a people have to get out of that, you know, and it comes from like reading other things and getting other hobbies.

Yeah. Sometimes. It's just been. The real puzzle. The problem. The real puzzle is why is it not under my chair? When is it? Yeah.

When is it? And also how will all of you interpret your sexy George R. Martin costume? There are so many ways it can go. I was going to say send us picks, but don't. I love that this. kind of passage about them with the torches that they put wildfire in for special occasions. A, they're telling you like, oh, yes, only when kings come down here. You know, like, oh, Aries probably is what the last time they did this big performance for the guild hall.

And it really did make me think about, like, just the juxtaposition of, like, their history, because we don't have a lot of their history, but understanding they're ancient, right, that they were supplanted by maisters. So inferring, like, the dragons put them out of style in a lot of ways. It almost seems like, and going back to like the text and going back to the history and lore video, we have this line, once there's had been a powerful guild, but in recent centuries, the maesters of the citadel had supplanted the alchemists almost everywhere. Now only a few of the older order remained, and they no longer even pretended to transmute metals,

but they could make wildfire. Whoa, there's a lot in that sentence. Let's just like pause for a moment. Take that in. That's a lot. That's telling you that like the maesters rise to power. I mean, to me this infers a lot. This is inferring like the maesters rise to power and also old town and the faith

leverage that hold when the Targaryans came to Westros and because they had real fire and not just the guild hall, alchemy, you know, magic. real magic they had like real flesh blood and flesh and fire in their own hands in front of them the maesters rose to power the faith rose to power the alchemists declined and i did rewatch the history and lore video that covers this um i was reminded to do so by stephen adewel's coverage which again i recommend you all go read that coverage he was amazing uh but this covered or this lore video has Magor as the first king to offer service to the

alchemists and then they originally could transmit metals into gold right but he was like no no that's worthless I want wildfire for sieges for torture and then the next king is Agin 4 with his wooden dragons and then of course there's Arian bright flame drinking the wildfire

and Agan the 5th trying to hatch the dragons with wildfire otherwise they had to wait for Aries to show up to really have some work again. So again, inferring like the dragons seem to have caused them to go out of style and their power really greatly reduced in

Robert's reign, which makes sense because you know, the prior Targaryans without dragons really probably needed that power, that fire, where Robert's reign is very much symbolic of an anti-Targarian reign in some ways, except for his wife fucking her brother.

So that that like really was loud to me on reread, just the inference and everything happening there. And that line of no longer even pretended to transmute metals kind of made me think about, you know, the whole conversation of power lives where men believe it. And were they once able to make Valerian steel even or something? I don't know.

Yeah. That's interesting because I feel like, by virtue of the fact that, like, magic exists in this universe. Part of me believes that, I don't know. maybe the alchemists actually were fucking transmuting medals. Hello. Right. And also, you know, the way that you're talking about all this and even made me like

think of how they really just waned after Aries. Robert never came down at all, as we will emphasize how long it's been since someone came down here. It really shows you like how traumatized too everyone was by Aries's reign that they were like, let's just never talk about or think about the wildfire ever again. Yeah, absolutely. Just shut it all away. Well, and there's more to that, right?

Like, we'll come back to them because I think we do get a little bit more of a reminder of, of these wisdoms, as they're called. And they call each other. It's cute. It's cute. And it's interesting. My wisdom, your wisdom. Yeah, but that's the thing. It's like, it's not actually a title.

It's like a poetry device. It's an anconium. It's a formal, like, or writing that offers high warm praise for a person. It's a device. It's not a title. It's an honorific form of a dress. So it's very interesting. And it's fun to explore because in the Byzantine Empire and the Roman Catholic Church, right, wisdom was saved for a supreme divine title. So them calling each other wisdom, it makes me think of like that is the highest theological title for Jesus Christ. So they think themselves so high and mighty like the gods because they can produce this fire. And they're really just

like a fading cabal who lost power after probably exploiting power during the Targ's downfall. And it's interesting that they parallel the maesters in those aspects and like leaching off the power vacuum that the maesters have made. Right? Maybe, quote unquote, maybe it's a maesters. Who knows if the maesters did it? But if the maesters killed all the dragons, they created this power vacuum that the alchemists like kind of retook during Erius's reign and before. And, you know, my roommate reminded me that, like, they're kind of parallel to Carth in some ways of, like, these con artists, these empty shells that have come to deal in this book. And in a way, they're kind of the dragonkeepers, right? Like, we don't have dragonkeepers anymore in Westrose, like what we see in the Westrose shows that are happening on TV.

There are no Valerian dragonkeepers anymore. Like, these are the closest things. These are this era's dragon keepers. They keep the lower and esoteric knowledge. It is kind of interesting because, like, rereading this and stuff. Like, it seems as though even when they could do alchemy, no one really, like, cared about it. I'm like, so they just, like, funded this entire thing. And the only thing that anyone really cared about that they made then was wildfire.

I'm like, what else do you do? That's it, yeah. You were more useful when you could make gold, right? Think about Tyrion. He probably would love that. Well, I just think it's, like, so interesting. I'm like, they really were like a one-trick pony, but it was a trick that everyone fucking loved, I guess. Well, depending on the regime, but some regimes really love that one trick.

And I was like, cool, great. I mean, I guess when you think about like holding your family's power in your hand, right? Like, my great-grandfather, great-great-cousin-grandfather, so to speak, he rode whatever great-animal McGee, the dread. You know, like, this is like so, the McGee. I want to call like the dragons wisdom now. I don't know. I'm not animal McGee. But you know, like, when you have that to live up to, like, even holding a bit of that power in your hand and being like, this is what my forebearers must have felt and must have thought and done.

You can see how enticing and powerful that might be. Like, you can see why anyone would give them some of their time. Yeah. one of the Targaryians did fucking name their dragon Mickey now. And Mickey, yeah. Oh, there's so much in here. But, yeah.

So, I don't know. The alchemists, as you said, they really mostly play a role in this book. And also probably going to come back in some way because the really comforting part of it all is that the guild has thousands of jars. Leftover from Aries's rain. And they're like, yeah, we actually

don't know where they all are. Ha ha ha. We know some. It's so funny. We just discovered some. Some are old enough that the substance is also steeped into the clay. So they're not like very structurally sound. They're quite increasingly unstable. Like any heat flame or even a spark can set them off. Ha ha ha. Yeah, it is a problem. It is a problem. Anything. They were like, oh yeah, 200 forgotten jars were found beneath the great sept only the year before. And also

Ha ha ha ha ha under the sept I mean I'm just saying that Oh I see Again David and Dan probably did read these books You guys They just like forgot them

They just decided they didn't like what they read And they had something different That's true I do think I think it was a little both Considering that The Sam I mean 200 jars

Yeah. I mean, if you can forget 200 jars, something's going on. You can forget, I guess, the Iron Fleet. Yeah. I mean, it's not like they forgot it. Danny forgot it. Don't you get it? I'm just kidding.

I'm literally kidding. David and Danny. But that said like, David and Danny, fuck. I do think all that said, I'm like, oh, there is some setup there that 200 jars were beneath the great sept. I just, yeah, as some people have pointed out. out the circumstances of how it happens might be different. And also, I just think there's got to be consequences for blowing up the sept. You know, there's got to be consequences in the way that, like, I do think to be a little controversial and bring up hot D, I do think there will be

consequences to be like, let's kill the high sept in. The Pope, yeah. Unrelated. Attack God. Unrelated. Apparently someone had Pope Leo signed their Pulp Leo. Pokemon card. Uh-uh. You have to stop. That's great. That's amazing.

Just for a little joy in everyone's life. Things that are kind of whimsical too. Aries had the alchabist's fashion, the wildfire containers to look like fruits, which makes me think of, did you ever have like the little candy powders that were all came in like little fruit plastic shaped things? Oh yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Just straight the sugar.

Chemical sugar shit in the little shapes. Yeah. It's like what if your pixie-six came in like a fruit shape instead? Those were awesome. Yeah. So I can only assume that a bigger version of those is what the wildfire is just chilling in. Second, it does feel to me interesting thematically, this idea of like ripeness and war, etc. With the wildfire and how the language of like the overripe.

blood oranges in Doran's chapters. The idea of so much being overripe and passed their time and at any point everything could explode. But also, you know, the language of knowledge throughout this, the alchemist referring to each other's wisdom and it being like a forbidden fruit of knowledge, if you will, to talk about the Bible because, you know, throwing it back to the Girl's Gone Canon days. Kill God. I love it.

Killing God. Amazing. Wow. Not HDM. Not HDM. I missed them. I... The real them.

Yeah, I was like, I don't know. I don't know. I'm still like mixed every time I hear about. I don't know. Anyways. I love that. I love the, the forbidden fruit.

That was crazy. It was fucking crazy. And then there's this line, too. So many of our masters were murdered during the sack of King's Landing. the few acolytes who remained were unequal to the task. Do you know who was murdering them, by the way? Jamie. Literally, Jamie, Tyrion's brother was murdering that.

He was, he's quite the hot head. This is like a stupid move on Jamie's heart. Not the hot head. Oh my God, I didn't even mean it. I didn't even mean it like that. That's so funny. I'm so, oh. You're witty.

Thank you, wisdom, Chloe. You're too much. I take it back. Oh my God. What have I done? I created a monster. that's like kind of stupid of Jamie and it really like goes together with like

Tyrion saying how both of his twins like his twin siblings are you know very I got that hot temper I'm not trying to like make a joke it's just the terminology that we used to describe this but also like I can understand why Jamie did this yeah because he is kind of like I don't know

these guys are not great yeah he's like these people were a little too excited to blow up Kings Landing Ares might be dead, but I don't know that any of them can be, like, you know, restrained from their appetites of wanting to be like, let's blow it all up. So he's like, he's like traumatized, a teenager and is like, we got to, we got to stop it by any means possible, you know? Yeah, like these people are evil in blowing up the nation. I mean, yeah, kind of. Yeah.

Yeah. So we have a current inventory status, 7,840 jars, including 4,000 from Ares' day. Halline believes they can still meet Circe's promise total of 10K. Tyrion's unsure whether he should be thrilled or horrified, probably both. Yeah, also, there's someone that Halline refers to here called Wisdom Malayard, and I'm like not sure that these are related, but it does make me think. ever so slightly like the different spelling

of the instead of Malliard Mayard reaction which is what makes your browned food taste so delicious I'm pretty sure

we actually talked about this a few years ago like I feel like I have a memory of it somewhere but it refers to what happens when you heat your food and like those proteins brown like let's say you know

you're browning your steak you're browning like you're crisping up like a vegetable Oh, I am. Or something like that. So that's the May art reaction. I'm obsessed.

I was thinking, like, mallard, like a duck. So yours is way better. I was also, like, malleard, like, a malleable, or, like, you know, there's all these other, like, metals. And I have to, like, go relearn them. Yes. You should be studying that because of her trivia. Yeah, exactly. Exactly.

Wisdom Hallline insists the production process is safe. Wildfire is made in isolated stone cells with sand-filled ceilings that are designed to collapse and smother any fires that break out. Tyrion notes this would also smother whichever acolyte caused the problem. So don't fuck out. But Hall-Fine's larger concern. Yeah, like don't fuck up. Yeah.

Easy-p-easy. Yeah, for me. Maybe not for y'all. I wouldn't fuck up. I'm just kidding. I would. I would probably be the first person to just, blu, right there, dead.

His larger concern than his people is actually the common soldier, who may mishandle the wildfire in battle. His advice is to be very careful. And Tyrion actually kind of listens for once. He's like, all right, real. This sounds pretty terrible. He orders thousands of empty clay jars be sent to the city gates for training, and he actually comes up with a whole training.

methodology. Yeah. Tyrion's like, he's making jobs for some people, you know? Even though I guess not all the metal smiths love that job or whatever. I will say we get a reminder of Lord Rosart during the reign of Ares. And we've definitely said this before, but I swear to God he's named for Rosart crayons. Like, I don't think anyone will change my mind. And then just to resurface this memory.

It's so funny because I think it's Rossart. Like, I don't think of Rosart. You just don't think of crayons, I guess, as much as I do. I guess. This also makes me think of to resurface another memory of things we've discussed in past years. The time that Chloe and I made a lot of colorful fire, she brought some to the fire pit some colorful fire powders. And then we did that a lot and changed the color of the fire. And then also, before we changed the color of the fire, because who knows what fucking chemicals were in that, we were making s'mores.

and I drank too much that night with the colorful fire and then I vomited all the marshmallows the next day. Why did you spend so much time vomiting when you lived here? I got cloyed a lot. You did get cloyed a lot. That's so funny. You know what? I saw the person who coined the phrase getting cloyed this weekend.

Oh, really? Yeah, Miguel. It's kind of funny. I still have that, by the way, the powder. Oh, okay. Do you think it's still good or has it grown increasingly unstable? Like, what do we think is the deal with these chemicals? I was going to have Jake and Allie first practice with, you know, like something like a foam cup to hold it in just to practice holding the jar. And then I'm going to have them hold the box

and see what happens. And then if it collapses in and kills them. I mean, yeah. Oh, word. You know, like, if they die, they die. But first they'll live. Oh, my God. By producing. weapons fiery weapons Yeah so the soldiers will practice with green paint

then lamp oil and then actual wildfire But only after they've proven they can handle the jars Without splattering the green paint and lamp oil Or setting themselves on fire So Honestly, it is a good plan Yeah, Tyrion's just protecting them there Because like if you trade with the real thing

You could die Yeah no absolutely He actually like You know I gotta say he does an all right job here does an all right job. He does a pretty good job throughout clash, it seems, except for the part where, you know, he frames himself as a villain.

He makes all the mistakes. He makes a lot of good decisions in terms of what he's executing, but a lot of bad decisions in how he talks to people. Yeah, and like he worries about the wrong things in a lot of motions. But here he's not. Like, this is actually very good. This is a great. I mean, this is what you got.

This is what you fucking. can got, so they respect it. One of his better moves. Holline also wants Joffrey to visit the guild and see the demonstrations their mysteries, and Tyrion's like, absolutely fucking not, first of all. Could you fucking imagine? Like, he was just

shooting rabbits for a week. Now you want him to find out how fun burning people alive probably is. Like, settle down. Yeah, no air is 2.0. Yeah, we just don't have the time at this point, you know? It's bad enough. So, back outside

Tyrion notes, oh, just like the wildfire, King's Landing has become unstable. Recently, there was a food riot, and it reached the Red Keep, and Joffrey responded by killing four people with arrows, and telling the crowd they could eat their dead. He's winning the hearts and minds of Kings Landing, folks, every day. Oh, my God, I get it. It's a metaphor. Everything that's happening this chapter, as we talk about how unstable and deteriorating the state is and that anything could set off, the wildfire.

is about the people in Kings Landing. I get it. No, actually. Actually, yeah, especially, like, I think of, like, the riots in... Yeah. Fire and Blood and House the Dragon as well, and, like, how it's, like, that is... Literally. ...religious stuff here.

Yeah. The religious stuff. Because, like, you're taking away or you're killing or you're, like, you know, that's all they have to cling to. Whether it's right or wrong, that's what the people have to cling to. Because you've taken away all their food. You've taken away all their money. You've taken away all their joy. You've taken their bread and circuses away.

Like, of course. A fucking course. How not? You never want to be left with a crowd that has nothing to lose. Because a crowd that has nothing to lose, people have nothing to lose are willing to just be like, well, fuck it. Let's go. Yep. So fucking lootly.

Joffrey, you know, Joffrey is like, oh, you can eat, as you said, like, just eat your own diet. And I'm like, oh, I see. We're beginning to seed. cannibalism, which is a thing that happens to some of the other kings and their troops throughout the story. Absolutely. Interesting.

Like, Joffrey just straight up said, go ahead and do it. Yeah. Fuck if I care. When that's, like, again, one of the sanctities that's being betrayed. He said, let them eat cake, but by cake, he meant butts. Yeah, let him eat butts, which is fair.

Yeah, let them eat ass. Bron arrives for some reason with two messages. Jocelyn Bywater, Jesselin, urgently wants Tyrion at the gate of the gods, and Circe is also summoning him immediately to her chambers. Tyrion chooses Jocelyn first because he wouldn't ask for him without some sort of reason. Also, making Circe wait would make her angry, and Tyrion prefers her to be angry and stupid rather than composed and cunning. There are two different Sercys.

He does not want the composed and cunning. He wants her to sweat. At the gate of gods. There are at least two, if not eight. That's true. True. Like I'm insane. There are probably 20 Sercise inside me.

Oh, I wish. That sounds amazing. Anyway. At the gate of gods, Tyrion finds Sir Cleos Frey. Newly arrived from River Run under a peace banner with her. from Rob, Cleo's reports that the riverlands are wrecked and the river lords are burning their own crops to starve Lannister forces out. Is it true Lord Blood Raven? No one can say. It could

just be propaganda. Well, Tywin's men in turn are also burning the villages. Everyone's just burning shit. Oh, it's also a metaphor with the wildfire. I see. There's a lot of things going. And then, like, and then Melisandra and the, oh my God, and then the dragons, and then there's so much thematically actually tying together a clash of kings as well. Great job, wisdom, George. So, Taiwan's men are burning villages and killing the small folk. Even the peace envoys are attacked by the unaffiliated armed bands, and Robb's terms are predictably pretty unacceptable to the Lanester regime. They want independence, captives return, hostages, ice the sword, and his sisters, like, please. Trian's like, no chance.

Cleos says, Rob is sitting at River Run while his strength slowly fragments as the River Lords return home because, you know, they have to go defend their lands. But more importantly, the one who actually wants peace is Catlin because she, like, wants her daughters back. Tyrion refuses the proposed exchange of the Stark Girls for Tion and Willem, but plans to offer counterterms. He realizes the peace talks themselves can be useful because they keep Rob hopeful while just sending Cleos back and forth with offers. I mean, who gives a fuck about him, right? And by time, while Stafford raises a fresh Alanister army, a castorly rock, and then Tywin can position himself against the Starks. and it's kind of an interesting, like, very extended family-heavy chapter, right?

You get mentioned again of Lansul, mention of Stafford, and then also meeting with Cleos and the discussions of Tion and Willam, really reminding you about the Lanster family tree. Yeah. Tyrion makes sure that Cleos's escort stays outside King's Landing. They are to be fed, clothed, and treated, but they cannot come inside because no one can know what a shit show it is in here. He does not want Rob hearing about how bad conditions in the Capitol really are. This is like me closing my bedroom door whenever we have guests. No one can see. It is a mess.

Yeah, Tyrion gives Jasselin Bywater the wildfire training plan. The clay pots filled with paint and then lamp oil and anyone who splatters on himself gets replaced. And Bywater approves, but he's like, oh, I hate the stuff, which is interesting. So he's seen it in battle, used or been around it. Writing back, Tyrion thinks Rob has happened. added him exactly what he needs more time. Delay peace negotiations long enough for Stafford and Tywin to strengthen their position. Unfortunately, Renli is still kind of the issue.

He's creeping towards King's Landing and Stannis could appear at any moment on the fucking blackwater, right? Beetlejuice, beetle juice, beetle juice. But wildfire helps, but it's not enough by itself. Yeah, I love that in the next moment as we're, we talk about what's going on outside, the word hubbub is used to describe it. Incredible. Incredible use. Yeah. In Cobbler Square, there is a hubbub. Tyrion passes a street preacher using the comet as proof that the gods are condemning the regime.

He covers like everything, right? Every little piece of gossip that he's heard in the common section on TikTok, he throws it in there. Sircy and Jamie's incest. Joffrey, Tyrion, the twisted little monkey demon is what he calls him. the corrupt high septin Also, even Robert. Robert Barathean catches They're not strays. He like really deserves it.

The pressure warns that the city will be cleansed by fire. Interesting. Foreshadowing. Okay. I was like, let me pause for a moment at this line. Interesting. Me, foreshadowing. Light it up.

Hmm, okay. Tyrion, though, is comforted that most of the crowd still mocks the sky. It's also like rude. Yeah, it was kind of rude about the monkey demon thing, but like fair point about the high septent. Like just putting that out there like, yeah, you're so true bestie. Yeah. Fuck that guy. It's not the best pope we've ever had, you know?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And the next one's not that great either, but I didn't vote for him. Yeah. But then there's the other one after that. He's not a pope, but is a pope and is voted for? Definitely didn't vote for him. You didn't, but a lot of sparrows did. Someone did.

Behold the father. Scorge, we have become swollen, bloated, foul. Brother couples with sister and the bed of kings and the fruit of their incest capers in his palace to the piping of a twisted little monkey demon. High-born ladies fornicate with fools and give birth to monsters. Even the high sceptin has forgotten the gods. He bades in scented waters and grows fat on lark and lamprey, While his people starve.

Pride comes before prayer, maggots rule over castles, and gold is all, but no more. No more. Thank you, thank you. I'd like to thank the Academy, first of all, for this great honor to have been the shepherd.

Wow, wow. I'm just kidding. Not the shepherd, not the shepherd, but actually the shepherd. Obviously, Fire and Blood has a, you know, of this pretty much one-in-one where they're on the streets and they're like incest and dragons

and like we're going to kill all the dragons and these incest lizards that rule over us. A worm. And actually kind of a big deal, right? Like we see in Fire and Blood and the world of ice and fire the repeated nature of like religion being used and leveraged

against the monarchy and looking back at like Magor's reign right and of course the wheat hold the Aeney really had on the throne too after his father left. And the lengths that Agin in general, Agan 1 even went through to keep the faith happy and the outliers and what they struggled with against the faith and how they treated the faith. So pretty big deal having the common folk ready to rise up against the monarchy. Yeah, it is a big deal.

And I don't know. I'm looking forward to seeing this come around again in. I mean, it's all just being set up so well. I'm like looking. George! George! Yeah, I want it. I mean, Egan showing up with the faith backing him and Danny showing up and clearly like, clearly Rallor is going to fall in mind with Danny.

They're going to find some similarities with one another, I think, Rallor and Danny. And, I mean, you do have to wonder, my roommate and I were just discussing a little bit of like the 14 flames, Rolour, like, you know, you have the different tenants of. Christianity, right? What really is different from a Baptist and a Catholic? Well, a Baptist will never be seen wearing jeans on a Sunday, first of all. But, like, what's the difference between a Protestant and a Catholic? But you just have all these, like, subsets of religion that all kind of are believing a similar thing. And I think back to, like, the translation of the prophecy and how in different places you have different versions of that story. You have the hero's journey in the north, you have the prince that was promised, you have Azora Hayut in that, like, you have

all of these different translations. So you start to wonder, what will Danny be when she shows up and who will support her and how is it differing and what will that do with the faith? Well, I think we know. Yeah. I also, I mean, the other difference is also like, Catholicism funded a lot of pretty cool art, sting glass windows. Pretty cool. That's true. And the And the architecture and the architecture and like, you know, the paintings. They were, they were very fun. They just, you know, they're also serving cunt. It was the best, what is it, Metgala.

Anyways. Bummer about everything else, though. Yeah. I will say also, like, a lot of what you see with the Shepherd. I don't know. I didn't think about this in the past. And the speeches that you're seeing here, right, with this street preaching. It's pulling very much the language from the legacy of like those fire and brimstone

cells of preaching famously given in sermons by Jonathan Edwards, especially like sermons such as sinners in the hands of an angry god. So I know that's like a classic, I guess. So I haven't worth revisiting every now and then. They were very fearmongery, but also at the end, I think that one ends with a little bit more of a hopeful tone, but really, really just diving into the American Puritanism. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Very intense. And, like, there's something great about that cross-of-class consciousness, right? Like, you mentioned the cannibalism lead in earlier. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Also, we literally get more of that. We get people in Bowls of Brown. We understand, like, we literally had last chapter the baker who was putting sawdust and his bread, right?

Like, poverty and what it's done to the people. people of Kings Landing, you see them using religion as their shield. They're stepping behind it to strengthen them. They're not rioting in religion, but using it as that shield to step forward. So you kind of like see why it's very stupid to pick a fight with the faith when so many people have nothing and that's what they have, that when they were poor, when they were broken, when they were beaten, they had faith. Yeah, agreed, agreed. And I think I think George has really sharpened the way he writes about this as the books go on. Mm-hmm.

Yeah. Tyrion returns to the Red Keep feeling optimistic. Thinking all, I don't know how you like come away from that. I feel really optimistic about that speech, but anyways. I guess because a lot of people weren't like super into it yet, which shows like the way that attitudes changed in terms of like the desperation, etc. Um, also I wonder if there's like a bit of the Tyrell influence, right? Because like, they're not high towers, but there is like way more of a, you know, reach, reach, uh, faith of the seven like agreement there.

Um, so it's really interesting to see how that attitude shifts by feast. Well, also they're given so many stages too. Yeah. By the end of feast, right? Funerals are a perfect fucking stage to be seen in the set. True. Well, Tyrion returns to the red cape feeling, again, optimistic, thinking all he really needs is time to assemble the pieces, especially once his chain is finished. Naturally, Searcy is waiting in his solar, furious that he ignored her summons. More importantly, she has learned about Marcella's proposed marriage to Tristan Martel. And Trian's like, oh yeah, that thing. Internally, though, he's also like, okay, one of the eggs is hatched. Let's see which spilated, right? Because there's two different, two. different ways that this Marcella plan could go, and Circe refuses to let Marcella be sold

to Dorn the way that she was sold to Robert. We've caught a rat, is what we're saying. We have caught a rat, and it's not Eliana. Yeah, I was also like, but not like me. Different rat. Yeah, Tyrion argues that this is exactly, though, what royal children are born for, and that Marcella may actually be safer in Doren than in King's Landing. No, but yes.

I don't know. It's a gamble, both. It's a gamble. Yeah. His proposed terms were that Marcella marries Tristan when she is 14. She's nine now. He's 11. And until then, she lives at Sunsphere under Doran's protection.

Sir Ari's O'Kart goes with her as a sworn shield, and Doran also receives a council seat. castles and the promised justice for Elia's killers. And a lot is being offered here. I actually, you know, Circe is like, it's too much. And low-key, I actually don't think it's that much. You know, I do think that they are offering a lot. And it's interesting to see the contrast of what they're like, all right, we're going to give all these for an ally because we need Dorn.

We need someone to fucking, like, say that they're still with us, right? versus how they're like we can't give all that to Rob like just two seconds of he's like it's too much but then again Rob did ask for like half the kingdom so I feel that And he's also like an active rebellion Yeah

And doesn't plant you know Like this is different Whatever you offer won't like make much of a difference You know Yeah absolutely And it's ironic too Like you're letting that ally build their power To ruin your the rain

You know like True rain Doren like Ha ha singing the theme song We all need someone Yeah, yeah After you sing it to me last time

I was like I gotta start paying attention to this like Opening song more because why don't I have it in my head I just finished the first season Oh shit Yeah Yeah That is a solid end of the season And season two is actually really good

It's really like you know the middle stuff Like the fourth season probably is where it goes a little off the rails, but it's worth it. Stick it out. It's been off the rails since the start, but yeah. I can't imagine how it goes even more off the rails. So, also, Cersie's not like wrong when she's like, well, they're still going to scheme against us, you idiot. Like, this isn't going to fix it. Like, no, she's absolutely correct.

They will. We have feast and dance. Like, we literally leave the sand snakes. and they're like, I will kill the Lannisters. Yeah, that's true. Not wrong. Really not wrong. The sand snakes who are now going to King's Landing, the same ones. Well, I guess, like, if they had kept Obron alive, maybe they wouldn't feel that way.

Doran, Doran and Obron were really staying in the way. Dorn was like, but what if he, like, didn't kill kids? He's like, kids are great. Let them play. And Obrin's like, I'm going to go. Fuck them kids. Yeah, he's like, I'm going to go get justice. for our sister, which they were both aligned with, you know?

But, yeah. They were all in on the plan. Yeah. Circe does think, to your point, Tyrion's offered too much without her permission. And he snaps back and she slaps him and he's like, very calmly, this will be the last time you ever strike me. Circe mocks his authority and reminds him,

Ned Stark also had a piece of paper that claimed he had power. And Tyrion privately notes, unlike Ned, I have the city watch. Huh. Clansmen. Huh. And bronze sell swords. Huh.

Then immediately he's like, Hmm. Ned probably thought he was secure too. Yes. Correct. Correct. Yeah. Tierian changes his tactics, though,

and he points out the obvious. If King's Landing falls, Marcella's dead. Remly or Stannis would put her head beside Circe's. And then, very unexpectedly, Circe begins to cry. Tyrion is stunned.

He's really not seen her cry since childhood. when he awkwardly tries to comfort her, she recoils and she's like, don't touch me, don't even look at me like this. And honestly, Tyrion is hurt by that. He thinks that hurts even more than the slap.

When I'm upset, I will jokingly, though, be like, don't touch me. Don't look at me all the time. I say it all the time. I'm like,

don't look at me. And then the moment also that like somebody chooses to leave my presence, I'll be like, wait, where are you going? Yeah. Like immediately,

like there's no middle ground. Yeah. I understand this. I'm shameful. This is a very kind of like brief, quick line that we move past in about a paragraph for less and their brief paragraphs as well in this chapter. But I do think it's worth spending a bit of time with and calling out just because I do think it comes to the heart of the emotional crux of like Tyrion's storyline, right? Like, in regards to he was more hurt by the lack of touch versus, ironically, the very forceful touch of a slap, right? That emotional rejection, because all he wants is to be loved.

All he wants is to be loved by his family. Even though he and Circe fight viciously, he still feels like there is an acceptance there. And here suddenly he's realizing, whoa, there isn't. that she can't be, she doesn't want to be vulnerable around, she doesn't even want to be comforted by him. He realizes, wait, maybe this isn't what I thought, like our sibling relationship was like, and it's pretty sad. Yeah, and when you, like,

when you conflate vulnerability and pain and betrayal and, like, hurt for all these similar things, right? Like, when the touch that you receive is pain always, like, what does that do to you? Yeah. Right? When you, when that is your language with your sister, what does that do for you guys? It's, uh, it's very sad. Yeah.

And despite the lack of touch, she does admit to him, you know, there is still some bearing there of, like, she admits how frightened and powerless she feels, like with Jamie captive. And also with Tywin, seemingly useless. as he sits at Heron Hall. And then she voices a thought that we see throughout her storyline, both from other people's perspectives, as well as throughout peace and dance, of how she wishes that she had been born a man,

so she wouldn't have to rely on any of them. And I feel like we dug into this already a lot during Ceres' chapters, but it is one of the first times we get to really see under Ceres mask if you're reading this story chronologically. and you understand how powerless she feels as a queen, even compared to Tyrion.

Tyrion has no fucking title, right? Like, he doesn't even have physical ability, but he is a man, right? This is why intersectionality matters, because there's a lot of things where Tyrion has nothing and a lot of things where Sircy doesn't have anything. But she, despite all that, she's a queen has no power, arguably, like, over her own daughter, right?

Her daughter can still be torn away and sent away from her. And she's like wishing that she were a man, right? So that this, because she also realizes Tyrion's right about the threat that hangs over her daughter. He doesn't even voice the other parts of what she tells Sansa at the Blackwater later on. And why she's like, I'm going to just kill us all. Fuck it. Yeah. And, you know, part of why she cries is she realizes her frustration, her powerlessness when it comes to her daughter.

and also that her daughter is powerless, too, in regards to all these threats hanging over everyone's heads. Yeah, like, what was it all for selling your entire life, right? Like, being sold, like a mare. Marcella's a mirror, too, to that. Like, I don't even know if she's, like, really that sad about, like, she isn't, she isn't sad about Marcella leaving, you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah.

Well, she's got some schemes to hatch, so. I just feel like Circe would have grown up, like, if Marcella grew up there, A, if Marcella Why is that your hair, Marcella? Yeah, why is that your hair, but also being like, I'm way hotter than my daughter, or being like, my daughter's husband actually wants me, and I'd be like, what the fuck? What the fuck? Yeah.

You know? Yeah. Yeah. I would have loved to see that, though. It would have been interesting. What about amazing? I guess it is just Veep. Veep.

Yeah. I'm so glad that you agree. You're so clever to have seen it. You said it first, right? with the why is that your hair? Yeah, Catherine, why is that your hair? I see what you're putting down. There's also that, and then there's like,

there's new girl, Schmidt's mom and new girl. Oh my God, I forgot about her. When he's just like, okay, I'll just make all those changes, mom. Can we quote that one a lot in my household for miscellaneous reasons, obviously? Tyrion explains, well, Taiwan is sitting at Heron Hall's actually good because Tywin and Rob are waiting for the other one to move, but Tyrion sees Tywin as the lion and Rob as the trapped prey. I'm like, I don't know.

Heron Hall blocks the north. The river forces them from combining easily and sits in position to respond north or south. So if run the attacks Kings Landing, Taiwan can march down the king's road, hidden from behind, the city walls are the anvil, and Tywin is the hammer. So it's fun that you mention Doran and Oberyn because they're also kind of like a manifestation. of the anvil and the hammer.

But this reminded me that, you know, a couple years after Clash of Kings got published, George published The Sworn Sword, a Dunk and Egg novella that you might have heard about, which is getting an adaptation on the screen in the following year, where we got to learn about the Battle of the Redgrass Field during the first Blackfire rebellion where Prince Baylor leads as the hammer against the back of Damon Blackfire's army while Megar holds the shield wall against Damon Blackfire as the Anamon Blackfire

as the anvil. So, fun, just fun. Good, clean, fun. Is that, yeah, I guess it is. I don't know. Mm-hmm. Yeah, it's just war. Yeah, you know, making war, as Tyrion says, of what Taiwan's doing.

And I thought that was kind of funny as opposed to, like, making love, I guess. I don't know. Meanwhile, Stafford is raising fresh troops at Castorley Rock, and Circe is like, how do you know all this? And as if Tywin explained the story. strategy to him at all. And Taryn's like, no, I looked at a map. And... Which is fun because she's probing too, right?

She's like, did dad tell you this? Because he doesn't tell me anything. Like, what do you mean? He told you all this? And he's like, no, I just figured it out, stupid. I mean, yeah. He's not... I feel bad. But at the same time, he's like, kind of right. He's like, just look at a map. Open the schools. Seriously, though... And she took that as a...

he loves you more than me. Yeah. Trusts you. Circe is unimpressed with this response, Tyrion. Though, it's like, oh, by the way, also, I intercepted Rob Stark's peace terms. So this is evidence that we're not losing.

And Circe immediately becomes a queen again and, like, asked to see them. Tyrion knows the terms are unacceptable, but their very existence reassures Cersercy, and Tyrion gets what he wanted from the confrontation, though. He's like, all right, cool, cool, cool. We haggled everything. And now Circe is much more likely to consent to the Dornish marriage.

And because she learned specifically about Marcella, Tyrion now knows who leaked his secret as his trap that he set for Paisal, Littlefinger, and Various starts to pay off. And I will say, I did kind of feel that the ending line of this chapter was a callback to the last chapter. It says the knowing who informed him was the plum in his pudding. and he was eating stewed plums with Paisal, which I don't think I would have remembered if Chloe, I hadn't taken as a slight what Chloe said about breakfast that I eat. It was not a slight, but, you know, we all got a little surcey in us.

Real or not, she perceived it as a slight. That's so funny, yeah. That's a fucking great call out. Like, that's your answer if you still didn't remember or didn't flip back if you did forget that it's Paisal. And next chapter will be us dealing with Paisal. Yes. For as many crimes, like shaving his face.

No, okay, that is like so sad, though. Turing's like he looks really sad without his beard. And like as a person who has really long hair that's not on my chin and knows how long that took. And I mean like even coming back to like Circe in dance, like it's pretty sad. Yeah. Yeah. actually it is kind of fucked up and we'll talk more about it, but it is like a total invasion. You know, like it's not right at all of his person.

And it is a cruel, an intentionally cruel punishment in some aspects, especially considering, and again, we'll talk about it because it comes up. But like, you know, a lot of men who keep facial hair, their chins are so white. They're that, they're also like, facial hair is like men's makeup. Yeah, it absolutely is men's makeup. They cover some of their face. I cover some of mine. it all works out. It's their way of doing their eyebrows.

Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. I think it's not nice and I'm sorry for what men have suffered. They've suffered so much. And that's why we're men gone can't. God, Eliana, where can they find us online? Well, you can't find us at Men Gone Cannon on Twitter. You can find us at Girls Gone Cannon, though. What if we think? It's on our list. It's on our list. Anyways, that's true. You can find us there and you can email us to your thoughts. Yeah, at Girls Gone Cannon at gmail.com.

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It's too late. Goodbye. Goodbye.