Girls Gone Canon Cast - House of the Dragon S1E3: Second of His Name

Episode Date: September 6, 2022

EDITORS NOTE: Vaemond Velaryon is a nephew in text and not a cousin, my god we're very sorry these trees are sprawling  SPOILERS: ASOIAF, F&B, KOT7K, TWOIAF, ETC Join us at our Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/girlsgonecanon Follow us on Twitter: @GirlsGoneCanon Sound Effects from Pixabay "Night Vigil" & "Big Drumming" by Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com) Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/

Hello and welcome to Girls Gone Canon Watches House of the Dragon, Season 1, Episode 3, Second of His Name. I'm one of your hosts, Chloe. And I am another one of your hosts, Eliana. You know, last week, if you were listening to us last week, you may have heard where I gaslit Eliana into making her do the intro. I was wrong. I don't declare this publicly often. So keep that in mind. I was wrong. I did indeed introduce that first episode that I also edited and uploaded, by the way. So I don't know why I didn't remember this. So now, in all fairness, I have introduced today's episode for you, Eliana.

I'm very willing to doubt my reality. So I do not have confidence in my perception of events. So I was like, of course, Chloe must be right. I auto Hightower gaslit you really hard. I'm like, Alison, darling, you introduced this episode. Welcome back to our third episode of House of the Dragon. If you listen to Girls Gone Canon, we are a spoilers podcast, so we will talk about the books. Any of them.

All of them. Any of them? All of them. Yes. They are all fair game. If George put them out, we read them. Yeah. Except for some of the Wins chapters, right, which we will get to eventually. At some point, we will... I think Chloe's read all of them. I've read all of them. And I haven't because at first I was holding off but also now it's fun now we get my first

impressions for some of them not all of them that's true as we go but we're not gonna really be talking about wins much right because we're talking about the past yeah we're really deep into fire and blood i'm on a reread i'm on like my eighth reread, 800. I actually think I'm starting to the front again just to see if I can catch up to the show and then do it as we go. For fun? Is this just like, this is like Mario Kart where you're just trying to laugh? I'm level grinding right now. I'm level grinding in A-Swap. We are putting out these episodes weekly for House of the Dragon. So every Tuesday morning, you should have an episode in your feed by then, unless something's gone a little wrong or slower because, you know, we record these up Mondays, Monday nights. You'll also have another episode if you're subscribed to us weekly on Fridays for public, which is Bran Stark. We just started up Brandon Stark in A Song of Ice and Fire. In our main podcast, we go POV character by POV character through their chapters as a whole,

and we just started Bran. I'm very excited for Bran 2 this week. Yes, I mean, Bran 2, big things happen, right? That chapter. But also, I mean, big things are happening now in House of the Dragon. This isn't the only discussion we've had this week about House of the Dragon. I will say, last week, right, for episode two, we had Kim Renfro on, so if you haven't listened to that please check it out but also last night as of recording this we joined our good friend joe magician to discuss this episode of house of the dragon we gave immediate reactions to the episode um and they were very immediate yeah i mean you'll you'll likely hear maybe a refined version

today on some of these. Hopefully. Hopefully. Yeah. You just got to take that little bit of Kristen Cole and refine it. You know, just refine it. Oh, my God. Every week, we're also having House of the Dragon discussions on Fridays from 2 to 4 ET, hosted by our friend Maddie. So if you're in the Patreon tier, thunder and above at patreon.com slash girlsgonecanon, you have access to a House of the Dragon discussion hosted by Maddie at Friday. Friday at patreon.com slash girls gone canon you have access to a house of the dragon

discussion hosted by maddie at friday friday at two and i can't wait to hear we kind of speculate about the next week together you know everyone kind of jumps on and talks about the episode talks about next week and i can't wait to hear what they come up with this week and i mean you don't have to stay for the whole time right like when Like when I can, I'll try to jump in. And then next thing you know, I have a meeting and I'm like, sorry, everyone. But we also did a Patreon episode for August that came out. We're still finalizing this month's Patreon episode. But last month we did part one of Mothers of the Dragon or Milfs of the Dragon, depending on which version you hear from which maesters allow you access.

If it's Mushroom or... Yeah, Mushroom or... Yeah. Mushroom or Munkin or Eustace. Absolutely. It could be any version. I look forward to part two. It might be this month. We just don't know yet.

But patrons in the Stranger tier and above have access to bonus episodes every month. $5 and up gets you bonus episodes. And we've covered the dance in full. Extensively. Too extensively. but yet here we are covering it all over again well it's very different right than the time that we did it last because last time we were only going off of what was in fire and blood and this is of course its own canon but i think what's really fun about it is again like as you and i were discussing while

watching this episode you get to see the personalities behind the characters that are stripped away by the maesters, and the really human conflict. I mean, I think George starts inching into that, right, with Fire and Blood. He tries to create elements of that, but he's also just, he's also very interested in the way that history gets things wrong, so it pulls back from that a little too and i like some of some of these changes we've watched them start to leverage like the ages for alice and ramira and streamlining that those are good changes i mean i think that makes more sense

cohesively for their characters and to make the heartache kind of more effective so i love that we're seeing this downfall and like tragic heartache and it's really this episode started to lay it on yeah immediately it started to lay it on that things have changed in the last three years absolutely and it's fun because we're getting it not just during you know a time of political change within westeros but But as you said, they've changed the ages of the characters, and it's happening during the time of both Rhaenyra and Alicent's adolescence. I mean, there's a reason why there are so many coming-of-age stories, right, that happen along those times, or stories in general, because we as people think of adolescence as a time of change.

Yeah. In many ways, it's doing what we didn't really get from Game of Thrones for some of these characters, right? Like, you know, we have Sansa losing her wolf. And it was still sad in the show, but it wasn't as effective as the story and what that means in the story. Like, what that does to Sansa's character. And you don't get the POVs brought to life. character and you don't get the povs brought to life and so they have kind of a challenge that i think they're succeeding at with this show where they are bringing povs to life because they never had povs on these people you don't have allison's emotions yes you can see her carefully playing this episode around you know courtesy as her own armor and also having to play against her

husband having to play against her father her father yeah she's she's got a lot of conflict going on within her heart as well all the characters do except for otto i think the only conflict he should have in his heart is i don't know a blocked artery oh my god let's kill otto hightower but sorry sorry we'll get there in a second. They're just doing, I think, a really great job of fleshing these characters out, giving us moments that are only hinted at in the books, right? Like the stepstones, which is how we open up the episode. We have a stepstone sandwich, a crab sandwich. Ooh, soft-shell crab sandwich.

Yum. Yeah. I love a soft-shell crab. I do. I do. Ooh, or a crab cake sandwich. sandwich oh i also love a crab cake stop making me hungry i know i know i know every time i see the crabs on screen i'm like delicious delicious bingo card or drinking game how long does it take us to get to food and somehow there

there is food there's a lot of food this episode too there is we'll talk about it in a bit we open up with the valerian banners burning and Caraxes is burning everything. Very well done. Something I'm noticing how they leverage in the show, they're leveraging how to use the dragons and make them not look silly. Total CGI, you know, monster. No She-Hulk going on here. But they look, I'm just saying, you know, darkness is your friend when you have to do

some crazy CGI and they look good. They make Caraxes look very menacing. Yeah. Very menacing. Honestly, the only CGI that brought me out in the episode, it didn't bring me out that much, but I did notice it was surprisingly the deer. Yeah. The brown one. The brown one.

The white one looked alright. Yeah. I mean, like, because that one you are supposed to supposed to i guess feel a little more otherworldly slash but i think maybe it was because the elk was surrounded by real dogs and you're like that's a real animal that one's not like demons like knowing the difference between a demon and between an animal and horses there were also horses yeah so it too so all those other real animals made that stand out but honestly honestly, we'll get there. But that's all I'll say about the CGI for that animal. Oh my god, the guy crying out for Damon. Oh my god.

That gets stomped on. Oh man, the royalty of this world is great. I love that everyone was like, and they say the show has no comedy. Oh my god, everyone in the audience. You were laughing within moments. It was perfect. I mean, I think it was a great way of showing that levity and then also our friends have pointed out as well such as low it's a great

way of conveying the quote from i hate i hate quoting jorah mormont i was actually like googling this just now and like had a typo and it said jorah mormon is a simp was one of the suggested searches but he's he's also like not i hate him anyway sorry sorry so as you know the famous quote the common people pray for rain healthy children in a summer that never ends it is no matter to them if the high lords play their game of thrones so long as they are left in peace they never are never, that's a, you were talking about how some of these guys to see some of these very small head motions during the war from Krahas, like, they had to really have great eyes. And I'm like, so they just go outside and yell for their best Mirrish men to show up and with their good eyesight for this? How'd you choose this draft of men? I actually was.

I was like, how do they see the little hand motion? But I've just been having a lot of issues. I need a new prescription. This is the truth of the matter. I mean, if you look at me in my glasses, you're like, do your glasses need to be cleaned? And I'm like, no, those are scratches. But also my eyes have gotten worse because I spent the past few years only staring at screens. Yeah. I'm sure I'll be legally blind at some point in my life for real.

I thought your eyes were good. They are, but they'll go downhill fast. That's part of my autoimmune shit though too. Okay. Like literally they will, I could just go blind if I don't, you know, I could just go blind. I'm just saying Chloe has no, does not need any visual aids at the moment. At the moment, not yet.

I've never seen her in glasses or anything. Not yet. Yeah. need any visual aids at the moment at the moment not yet her in glasses or not yet yeah i will say watching it with two people that don't have 100 vision i do get you know i get asked those kind of questions those detailed questions what were they doing what is this but i have adhd so it's unfair that you guys expect me to do that for you so maybe you should work on those eyes eat some eat some carrots eliana i'm sick of you I guess it's too late for that, actually. They use the caves as a retreat. If they build on this, we might end up seeing Dorne come into

the fold a little more, maybe in a minor way while playing with the Triarchy War stuff going on. I don't know. I think they might actually expand this plot as we go. We didn't see Recalio Brindoon yet. He shows up in 109 in fire and blood so if they choose to adapt agan the third's reign out farther with lease in it yeah we might end up seeing recalio rindoon uh a year after the war of the stepstones during i guess during he rises up right as kind of a commander doing the fresh invasion against Daemon for the next year. So I don't know, with time jumps, we might miss Recallio Rindoon. We may or may not get him because, as you said, right, he ends up partnering with the Dornish,

which would, I think, occur during the dance and does have effects or does affect it. That was reminded to us by our friend Eric Palacios, you know, whether or not Recallio will show up. Because, I don't know, I just thought, and obviously this pairs with the end of the episode, I thought that the way that they do Krahaz, like, it was really interesting, and I think, so someone, um, Whomstrina, Whomst, Whomstrina, if you look at the way that this, uh this username is spelled on Twitter, said that they wanted an entire prequel about Krahaz, which I totally get because, I don't know, there's a lot of stuff that could be fleshed out there that would be fun with the triarchy. Fleshed out. Oh, oh.

And Volantis, right? That war conquering the sub-stones. I mean, people love pirates, right? Greyscale. I mean, they effectively created a plot yeah out of a non plot just for i mean you needed a war because there's no war in this time so you needed a war i mean it metaphorically george did the same thing yeah but they had to do it to screen to create some screen time and effectively what it did like 15 minutes of this episode was devoted to it probably

yeah i mean and it was fun right and they did a good job of using it somehow to also do character building. So I think it'd be cool if they brought Recalio in and the Dornish part, because we are still wondering, how will Dorn factor into the story? If they want to keep going with this, they've talked about it as possibly an anthology,

if it's successful. And if they want to keep going with that success, I could see it working yeah right like i could see them really expanding on that and they could even not introduce recalio and just have him talked about in the background for now and come back up in season two i don't know i understand not wanting to cast him yet if daemon's coming back to the kingdom next episode maybe they have it wrapped up then well they have that wrapped up right and then things fall apart with the triarchy apart which is which would be fun world building because that is something that

just do we have time for him to go to the stepstones again not on camera i don't think no but we have time for the stepstones to affect the story as as they do right with um the background the two sons that's true i think it could be done very well in the background and we wouldn't need to have i just don't think we're where's the time for Daemon to go battle again at the Stepstones? Yeah. The Aegon Emissaries. Yeah, I think we'll probably see that happen when the babies are born. Yeah, that's why I think it would be interesting and important to bring all those, but...

Ricalio Rendun would look amazing. It would be so fun to see Ricalio. They're six and a half feet tall, stoop posture and gait, one shoulder higher than the other, often dyed their hair purple with orange streaks, bathes themselves in lavender and rose water, and sometimes dresses. Feminine presenting.

Interesting. Yeah. That's, it's going to be a fun character. I mean, there'd be a lot to discuss for sure. I hope they go all out. I hope we get Ricalio Rindoon and they just go all out there could be like a really interesting thing to discuss there in regards to him and apparently he hates slavery you know and so his character kraha is right with his gray scale which was a show which was show only as far as we know and

you know larry's clubfoot in rush room if they bring him in. Back to court. To the baby. To the conqueror babe. Oh my god, I can't believe he said that with his whole chest, as I said. Egan to the conqueror babe. I'm like, you sound like an idiot. You sound like a dumbass saying that. He's a baby.

What's he gonna conquer? Uh, I don't know. Food? Nap time? Pooping? Yeah. Sitting up, as we've discussed holding himself up yeah everyone's fawning over him he's done nothing yet i mean he was born with a dick isn't that so amazing congratulations child only some can do that i hear yeah only some only some people do that we are not among among them. Otto and Hobart Hightower discuss Agen's ascension and Otto's role in it. So we get a really great relationship building where quite obviously Hobart Hightower is like,

you're going to settle this right, right? Because dudes rock. And like the realm needs to be reminded. Dudes rock. And Otto's like, you're right. I should be doing that for us. Yeah. Yeah, it's kind of great to see Otto bullied a little, right?

Because obviously he takes it out on Alicent. But at the same time, I'm like, this was also, this is all on you, Otto. Tylan Lannister shows up. This is so exciting. We have Lannister's back. And not only is it Tylan, we get Jason, who we'll talk about in a bit here when he shows up, who is also just Tylan. And we also get their, it seems like their mother, Kira Lannister. Yeah.

Or something like that. Yeah, I think Kira Lannister was the name they gave her, which was fun to see at court, as we'll talk on. But he shows up and he's like, Viserys, get your shit together about the Stepstones. Viserys gives one of my favorite new lines. Not today, Tylan. Oh my god, I'm going to say that all the time.. Not now, Thailand. And while they're loading up their plates, Viserys and Lionel are

ignoring Thailand, loading up their plates, he comes back to push further. And he's like, things are really bad in the Stepstones. Like, I know that you don't care, but they're really bad. And he's like, fuck my brother. And he's like, bad, very bad. Oh my gosh. Yeah. And it's just typical Viserys, right? He is like, oh, I can wait three more days. And I'm like, I don't know. Like, can it, right? Because we see at the end of the episode, they're like, with the rate that this war

is going, we will last maybe another fortnight. Every single one of those days matters. A fortnight, I'm assuming you all know, is like, it's two weeks, 14 days. Three days out of that is a significant percent. Three days is, that's soon. Yeah, three days out of 14, right? Like, and he's like, oh, let's just delay. We got to go on the hunt.

And this doesn't have to be dealt with now. I'm like, no, literally the hunt does not have to be dealt with. Yes, yeah. The hunt is literally you just further pushing your problems back so you don't have to deal with them. That is the thing that you could probably deprioritize. And it's not unlike the tourney when he didn't even have an area. And he's like, what if we threw this preemptive tourney?

He doesn't seem to understand that, like, yes, you did not start this war. And this is something that, you know, we will get to in a bit with Lady Redwine. But though you might not have started this war, Viserys, your realm is still affected. And it was affected even before you started the war, which is what Corlys was trying to bring up. And this is your job. Your job isn't just to make babies. Your job is to manage the affairs of the realm,

even the ones that you didn't start. That's how it works. That's what being a king is. Yeah, you can't just ignore that. I mean, that's part of it. He inherited this job. His inheritance was this job. And you're seeing so many different parts,

especially in this episode, that reflect once more on like, you did nothing for this. He didn't do anything, right? He was just born. They complained in the first episode that the realm has been going downhill since the death of Queen Alysanne.

But that's the thing. Alysanne and Jaehaerys were, they were very proactive rulers. They were like, this might not be my problem, but I will make it my problem and I will work to make it better. They mitigated risks constantly. Alysanne looked out on the defense for different things that she could sew together, right? Especially marriage alliances and different bits of land that she realizes, we have no use for this. We should be gifting it to people. And Jaehaerys was obviously busy. His better ideas came from Alysanne and Barth, right? That was his left and right. That was what kept him moving while he faced the rest of it. And he listened to them. Yes. When they brought something to him, he's like, you're right. We should deal with that.

Whereas you have Viserys as the complete opposite in this episode. Later, he yells at Rhaenyra. And when he yells at her, he's like, don't you understand? I have like a whole pile of paperwork on my desk and you ignore me and won't let me talk to you. And I'm like, maybe if you treated her as an equal in this, then she would be not only more respectful and more proactive to learning. It's just frustrating. I'm also like, if you have a pile of paperwork on your desk for series, why are you on vacation? Why are you going on a hunt?

Why did you take your PTO right now? Not that people shouldn't take their PTO, but also he's a landlord, you know? No, sorry, I'm joking. But am I? I don't know. Well, there is a certain aspect of that. Like, so the hunts, I mean, the people expect to be distracted from the horrors of the realm per usual. But it is said in the books that right now at this time, he was just feasting and doing royal hunts and doing all these things to keep lords happy and distracted.

Instead of actually doing what needed to be done as far as the succession, right? Like reinforcing the succession. He kind of just moves on with this happy new life. And we see some of those effects, right? Like Rhaenyra, first of all, she is not here hanging out at this birthday bash for Aegon. She's like, I don't give a fuck about this chubby baby or what happens to him. And she's hiding under a weirwood, right? Her favorite spot, reading, and she has taken captive a singer,

a la Sansa in Winterfell. She has taken hostage a singer, and she is making him sing over and over. She's missing out on the two-headed pig, which I still don't know why it has two heads, but it did look delicious. The song that she's listening to ties back to something in the first episode.

Yeah, well, I could glimpse. I'm kind of bummed because the captions are there when it's just him singing, but when she and Alicent begin to interact under the weirwood, the captions go away and you can't really easily pick out all the lyrics. But what I could pick out, right, was under the dragon's eye, under the dragon's eye is kind of the end of the song we hear. And then she fled with her ships and her people, her heart broken for those. And I couldn't really catch more than that.

But those are the lyrics I could catch. I believe it's probably about Nymeria, which it seems that she might have been rereading her Nymeria book. Yeah. Same as the first episode, which is related, I would say, you know, Numeria, our witch queen. And it comes back to, again, we were talking about Dorne just now and how they were able to resist. They were able to resist the dragons. So very interesting. There's a couple of reasons for why Rhaenyra might want to study Dorne.

But here, I mean, we get the first interaction between, that's just Rhaenyra and Alicent this episode. And for obvious reasons, it is very tense. Yeah, it's even announced as the princess, the queen. The singer like stands up and he's like, oh, oh shit, I gotta stop playing. And she gets a little annoyed. And then she realizes, oh, my stepmommy's arrived. I think she knew that she was there the whole time.

And she makes it clear. And it was their spot. That was their hangout spot. And now it's just her and, I don't know, this guy that she's forcing to sing. And again, it becomes a place of tension in which you see like, who holds more power? And that's becoming, that's the question in this episode.

Yeah. And I will say, Allison knows how to wield her power now a little bit. She's starting to come into it, right? Because she insisted and called, made sure to remind the singer that she's the queen and that Rhaenyra is the princess. Yeah, and Rhaenyra does not press, though,

that she is heir to the throne, which I think should hold some more sway, in my opinion. But I'm also not a legal expert. I am no lion, no strong. And I am not the learned hands. I am all Yes, I am not the learned hands podcast. I'm just the person going dun dun for them. So yeah, it's it's very interesting and i saw someone point out in the comments and not in the comments someone point out on twitter i am so sorry again that i have forgotten who this was i thought i liked it but i couldn't find it allison says it doesn't need to be this way rain nira but like the thing is you're you're undermining her at every second right if you're wielding and throwing your power around

as queen so that she can't even play the goddamn song she wants to play how are you going to mend that rift between the two of you i will rebut i will i will but that is pretty much the only power she has is to tell off singers right now which is probably what really frustrates alison and what makes her further kind of take that repression that she's already had to deal with and why she kind of puts that outward in the future i would say and she does come to ask raniera to go on the hunt with them raniera is like fuck that hunt i don't want to go on any hunted stupid and alison is like same girl like you can tell that she's like uh she's pregnant yeah she's pregnant as hell she doesn't want to go when we get in the carriage in a minute it's awkward as hell yeah like obviously she's lying because she has to because that's her job now too yeah however she comes with love and i see this

throughout the episode a few times that she does come almost open-handed trying to because the things that are going to fall on Rhaenyra from Viserys are already going to happen. Alicent is trying to do it smoothly with so not to hurt anyone's feelings where Rhaenyra gets that and she's like yeah but fuck that because you still don't you're not on my side you're on his side. And it's hard because Alicent is being pulled between many sides, right? We will eventually see her, obviously, probably pick a side. You know, we see the seeds of that this episode with Mother Wooden, right? When it comes to her own son. And obviously, someone wants the best for their children.

As you said, she, I think, does come with love. She's coming with love for Rhaenyra. That was her best friend. And I think she does acknowledge and see within herself. She doesn't say it aloud, but it would be for the best for both Viserys and Rhaenyra to be aligned, to make up, and be well with one another. Just like we said about Alysanne and about these other queens, they didn't have a lot of power.

So what they could have control over, they tried to take as much control over they could, right? So this is the little place that she sees that maybe she could do something to make it better for everyone involved. But there's only so much that these two can commiserate on, the prison that is their gender in this society. You can only go so low until you have to fight your way back up. Yeah, and that is absolutely what comes up in her discussion with Otto. in this society. Like you can only go so low until you have to fight your way back up. Yeah.

And, and that is absolutely what comes up in her discussion with Otto. That is, it's another question off of the series that Rainey's brings up when she has her talk with Rainera, right? Of this is what the world is when it comes to womanhood and power. The carriage is also another side of that too,

right? The awkward, the awkward riding. Yeah. Immediately Rain is also another side of that too, right? The awkward, the awkward riding. Yeah, immediately Rhaenyra's like, should you even be riding in this carriage to this hunt, traveling this pregnant? And Alicent kind of lies and smiles about it and just like says her pretty words about it because like, it's true. Should you be? You are huge. Like she looks like, you know, eight, nine months preggo, like she's gonna pop helena out any moment should she really be going to this hunt and she's doing it because she's expected and she talks about how birth usually goes and they start to smile and say oh you'll be with child soon enough and veneer's like don't i have to get married to be with child first isn't that

the order of operations on this one so are you saying you're marrying me interesting and it all clicks later she's like disgusting disgusting disgusting it's it's nice though to see reynira raise the question even though she does say it kind of like sternly she's like be here once again you get a consistency with her character she's the only one who cares about the pregnant woman and her health right as? In terms of the woman's comfort itself, the way that she did for Emma. She's like, someone has to worry about you. And she's same as how Allison was, to some extent, looking out for Rayneira's, like, interests. This is Rayneira showing in looking out for Allison's interests.

Yeah, that's very true. As it goes throughout the episode, right? And thankfully, it comes to a head later. You know, as you said, Viserys being like, you're going to marry and it's, it's a strange position for Rhaenyra to be in. Because as we said, adolescence is a time of change. But Rhaenyra is caught in that, like in Britney Spears' words, I'm not a girl, not yet a woman. has already been pushed into the role of womanhood and motherhood earlier on and reynira by comparison therefore looks does she look behind does she look stunted in her uh coming of age and adulthood when it isn't really right like it's it's again characters being forced into these roles because of their gender granted we see some characters male characters forced into leadership early on in aswaf there were a couple really strong lines in the carriage yeah which by the way did anyone appreciate the cup holders in the carriage oh that was the coolest shit in the world they had

cup holders for their wine goblets built in watch it again in that scene they're like yeah they're bolted to the wall that was amazing they really knew how to party back then, you know, in this historical time. This historical real time. This is going to sound so dumb. You know what cup holders I always loved from a movie? In the Santa Claus, the little hot chocolate maker. Well, this is my number two then. Yeah.

No, no, this one's better, right? This is like their, I don't know, booze cruise shit. yeah yeah no no this one's better right this is like their i don't know booze cruise shit and there's there's this one line that i love from reynira of no one's here for me right she's there it means no one's coming to the hunt on account of me but also no no one is here for her on a personal level no one's she has no one she's alone her on a personal level. No one's- She has no one. She's alone. Yeah, Alicent reiterates it, right?

Because Alicent says, oh, Aegon came quickly and without a fuss when they talk about marriage and babies. And you see the serving women all look at one another like, okay, sure, without a fuss. That kid has never fussed. In fact, later, Aegon has a crying fit when she goes to talk to Otto.

So you see it's false. Like, obviously he fusses, fact later aegon has a crying fit when she goes to talk to otto so you see it's false like obviously he fusses he's a baby but she has serving women to help her uh she has the serving women that are there for her for the babe and she has viserys and she has her father but she's taken i mean unfortunately she kind of has viserys now and that was reneara's only person yeah now reneara has kristin cole well she did have well alice and reneara once upon a time had has Viserys now and that was Rhaenyra's only person. Now Rhaenyra has Criston Cole. Well she did have, well, Alyson and Rhaenyra once upon a time had each other. Yeah, now they don't. Everyone's, it's all just been

again, Otto Hightower hope the conflict is a blocked artery. There's this line boars scream like children when they're being slaughtered and it stares straight at Agen too, who isn't going to die of being slaughtered as a child, so don't worry. However, he sure is going to have some children that do. So that was a total blood and cheese foreshadow. There was a lot of foreshadowing in this chapter, in my opinion.

Or this chapter, this episode. It is like a chapter, though. It is. It's several chapters. God, boars scream like children when they're being slaughtered. Very, very interesting. Yes. Let's talk about a couple of other not so boring moments.

Yes, some very strong moments, I would say. The royal hunt. The royal hunt. The royal hunt. Larry's clubfoot and Harwin strong. That's all I care about is that we get Larry's and Harwin. I don't care about anything else. Well, I guess I'm sad for Rhaenyra because she like stays in the carriage while everybody cheers Aegon to the Conqueror Bane.

I fucking hate that. So dumb. So stupid. I hate people. So dumb. It's... You and Matt were so excited to discuss How Strong last night. I was so excited.

I love How Strong, and I just think that they get a strong introduction. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. We will be insufferable. We will be insufferable throughout, I mean, the rest of the show in this season. We're already insufferable. Yeah, true. But the show in this season we're already insufferable true but with the strong puns i mean we can't help it we didn't do it george did it's not our fault yeah i mean it's there to make the joke constantly yeah as we go inside the pavilion tent we got a

lot of little i mean this is very political so much political stuff dropping i love by the way renera's bun this week looks like her celtic not valerian steel necklace like it has the same like inner roping so that was very cool a cool concept larry's strong he decides to join all the gossiping ladies so as mentioned we have some gossiping women that are around alicent all the ladies at court which is awesome because that is that's one of my biggest complaints for sansa going to king's landing yeah she doesn't have a court with her like you don't send your daughter to go be a queen and not give her a court of ladies you're already isolating her talk about dad issues but allison has ladies dispatched all around her again no one's there

for raniera but she has all this court surrounding her where Rhaenyra only has like men looking at her as the hunt prize. Yeah. I mean, the ladies in court, I guess she could. But they're all they're hunting her, too. Yeah. Lady Redwyne puts her on the spot with. So what the fuck is going on with this war? And it is a little damning that Rhaenyra does not have a good answer for it, especially if she's meant to be heir.

Right. Yeah. I know that we're meant to see this as an own against Lady Redwyne, which totally it is, right? I mean, also that pug was, as many pointed out, the star of the show. Oh my god, amazing, amazing. For her to say, I don't really have an opinion

or a say on what goes on in the war, and I haven't spoken to my uncle in the past few years. It shows weakness in the house in general and that she's not up to date. But at the same time, she's also in a bind, right? Like what can she say that does not, that could not be interpreted as treason against her father's wishes? It was a very interesting position to be put into. And that right there is like

a whole other political warfare happening, right? That she has to navigate both of these worlds of both the men that just want her for her body. Yeah. And also for her name and claim. Yeah. And then these women that also want that same thing in a totally different way,

how they digest her, right? They want everything else she has to offer. And part of it is she doesn't want to play those games of courtesy. We see that she isn't, you know, she doesn't like that. Last episode with choosing Kristen Cole, before getting to him, Otto's like, now you're supposed to say thank you to these guys. And she's like, why? They didn't do anything for me. Yeah the political she gets that from her dad right hating politics apparently right but whereas i guess i mean viserys doesn't he doesn't do the thing right either because i was gonna be like maybe it's a little like stannis being like i

don't want to do all this pop but like it's not because viserys does it in a very different way rainier is way is a little maybe more similar to stannis but well the ladies as you said right they want what she has not just like in the way of what she can offer them but is there an extent in which they want what she has which is as well that freedom right she's the heir she could own the throne she could have power she hasn't married yet yeah they they don't but these women offer a different kind of power which as you said Larry Strong is trying to get into. Yeah, because he has to navigate that, right?

As having his disability with his club foot. I can't get over that they literally showed it. Like, it's such a big proponent of his character. And it's something Game of Thrones would never have done. Like, look at Tyrion, right? Look at Tyrion's nose. They didn't even want to go the full way with cutting Dinklage's nose off. And he's a main character.

That is a lot. I get that. They'd have to do it every single episode for all those seasons. They'd only have to cut Dinklage's nose off. And he's a main character. That is a lot. I get that. They'd have to do it every single episode for all those seasons. They'd only have to cut Dinklage's nose off once. Oh, that's true. They should come into the pit. What unions?

It's Labor Day. What unions? It's Labor Day in the US, folks. But I mean, I get it. It's a lot. It's every single makeup, et cetera. So they did the best they could with that prosthetic for the scar, which is good.

But it is such a big part of his character. And he uses it, his disability to like navigate these circles, right? The men don't look at him as being masculine enough because he has a deformed foot. So he can't go out to the yard and pop beers with the bros and train, right? That's not who he is. He has to learn other ways and that's also what makes him most dangerous because even though we see in these scenes jason lannister throwing himself at reneera and being kind of a cock about it and totally

going about it the wrong way like you don't that's not how you approach reneera on it but like even though we see that larry's has to learn and does learn that the most powerful place to be was right there with Kira Redwine. Or no, sorry, Kira Lannister and Lady Redwine, Joslyn Redwine. That's the place to listen. Yes, absolutely. And that's so interesting that you're saying that Larry's does inhabit this in-between space or ostracized space as well when it comes to gender for both of those. But so does rainera she's not for many obvious reasons masculine enough to be at the men's table etc but also

because of her position doesn't also like join the ladies at court but also her father does try to kind of make some of that space by being like, oh, you should come with us on the hunt. But the real place she should be isn't at the hunt, which though there is, of course, there are studies and there is evidence that things like, you know, going on golfing trips with the men when it comes to business and stuff, right? That is where a lot of the deals are made. That is where a lot of those connections professionally are made. She's got to be at the table. She's got to be at the table.

She's got to be at the small council table. And as we saw in episode two, she's not. Yeah. And they're taking her seriously. It's been two years, dude. So one of the biggest call outs in this. Oh, my God. We were so hyped.

You and I were sitting on this couch so excited when When they called out Lady Joanna, the Black Swan, right? Joanna Swan, a noblewoman from House Swan during the reign of Kings Jaehaerys I, Viserys I, Aegon II, Aegon III. She becomes an influential courtesan in Lees. I was so excited they referenced her and referenced that this is good. Like, this is what gives me hope that we might get some of the Lys stuff. Oh, yeah, interesting. Yeah, yeah. Because this, they have to go to Pentos this season already.

We're definitely gonna get further Lys stuff if they do a good job with this show, I think. Yeah, at Lys. At Lys. We got this, and yeah, it does kind of make you wonder, will we get the Aeg and third stuff towards the end i i have no idea what scope of the show they're trying to do so very very interesting

if we keep watching sunday nights at 9 p.m we'll find out i think how for how long though you have to keep watching for years this apparently might come next season might come out 2024 but oh my god no seriously but uh so one last shout out to the pug and now let's go outside the tent so jason lannister is the fucking gall i just want to say also amazing job amazing job the actor is doing yes absolutely i mean you know l know, Lindsay Lohan. Did it first. Did it first. Did it the best. But I'm happy. This is the actor of Ser Hugh of the Vale.

He dies early on in Game of Thrones. No, but I don't know what you're laughing. It is. It is. Yeah, the hands tourney. I'm happy. I'm happy for him. Like, I'm impressed.

They did a good job because even though I knew it's the same guy they did look different like yeah they look different they had different personalities yeah it it was only minor confusing like at most at most if there was any confusion it was very small confusion i figured it out and i knew it was coming just because you know obviously we're into production stuff and we care about the show and the the books but it was very interesting that they chose him to do both Thailand I mean I really appreciate Thailand's character I actually am just finishing up like I said Fire and Blood again and so they just he just came back as the hooded hand basically um like a superhero or a vigilante I should say aman vigilante the hooded hand

i'm excited that they're keeping them in because again there is just these side characters that i really didn't think had a place not didn't have a place but i you know i'm just i've been hurt well tylen plays a pretty significant role throughout the dance jason not so much yeah his wife plays a significant role in the hour of the wolf right yeah that's true so it is interesting that they brought them in I don't know it's fun I know our friend Mike is having like a fantastic he's having like a super bowl I guess is what I assume super bowls are like but Mike is so excited with all the minor characters that are getting, like, that are joined. Yeah, Jason Lannister, wonderful execution of terrible guy. Well, there's something that's really obviously being drawn in the sand here, too,

is we're seeing some of these rejections happening for Rhaenyra with men. Or we're seeing, like, her make her choices. And it's laying the seeds for these further battles to ensue. Because Jason becomes a staunch green supporter, right? He supports his armies down in the Riverlands. He's a big person in the Riverlands taking people out with Aemond. So you already could see those seeds set up here that he,

Rhaenyra doesn't like him and didn't appreciate the way he came after her, which I don't appreciate the way he came after her at all either. Something that really struck me was when he told her, he's like, well, I'd build a dragon pit, of course, for you. And she's like, oh, shit, you're hitting on me. Sorry, I didn't know it was this kind. Like she changes tone. She's like, oh, that's what this is about, which we've all been there. But he says that he'd give her a dragon pit for her dragon or dragons, you know, thinking that they'd have children and she would give them dragon eggs and the Lannisters could become that kind of powerful family. And he's really just seeking

to keep her and collect her in his dragon pit, right? Like a trophy case, all men do. And it reminds me of, I can't do High Valyrian, it's not for me. I hope you all can think about it at home in your head. But when Dany says a dragon is not a slave going back to that first episode when we see reneara get off syrax and the dragon keepers you know tame the dragon back into the cave it's very much symbolic of her entire journey in this show and how like she's just trying to be kept at every corner people are just trying to put her in that trophy case at every corner yeah absolutely and i think they're a little astounded that she has a say right jason goes about it all the wrong way no couth man

really though like it could have if if you were a different dude maybe it could have gone well maybe maybe he could have gotten that marriage plan he wanted but he's not that dude and this obviously upsets rain era who then brings it to her dad yeah brings it up to her dad as you said picks a huge fight which is i would do yeah i was like i expect nothing less from 17 year old girl yeah like you sent your fucking weird friend to hit on me dad that's really the context of the convo and he's like well and he didn't to be fair he didn't send jason to do that because jason we see approaches him later about it and it's like he never asked miscommunication like that is bad that's a bummer because this fight yes she's mad it's not specifically his fault right this moment however she's bringing it up in a great way like dude because you aren't saying anything these people think this is okay to

treat me like this and they see me as just like a way to get to you as an extension of you yeah they see me they don't see me as their future queen they see me as you said before right as their future hunted yeah they're the prize and that's not the case at all. And it does not help that Viserys scolds his daughter in front of the entire court, right? And as was discussed in episode two, does not help, like how he has not been training his court and all of the lords to take Rhaenyra seriously as a leader. Yeah, I mean, it starts with him. He can say things all day long quietly under the guise of no one listening. Funny how it's those things that he doesn't let people hear. But he can say those things all the time. But it's his actions that speak so much louder than those words that he's barely saying. Yep. And we see the difference in people's actions right um these targaryens actions and what makes one a leader and what doesn't when uh throughout this episode

yeah like he's i don't know and everyone sees it everyone sees it and looks and they're like what the fuck it's kind of fucked up that otto is the one that is like you guys you can't make a scene like this in front of everyone and he interrupts and changes the subject and he's like ah the true king should go catch the true white heart in the king's wood, my king. And it's going to be you because you're my king. Ha ha ha. Yeah. It's a he's singing on the inside.

I am sure when all that happens, especially because, yeah, I mean, they all think that the heart is a sign for Aegon II, and it's interesting that in the earlier party, they all point out how he has Viserys's eyes, nose, face, trying to almost be like, oh, he's almost just as good as a real, like a pure Valyrian, right? That's interesting because they are tugging apart the purity of the Targaryen line, you know. Yeah, and whereas Rhaenyra obviously has more Targaryen blood. She sure does. It's a wreath.

It is a wreath. I'm not saying that, you know, being inbred is a good thing. But anyways, regarding how Otto distracts Viserys, our friends over at Direwolf City, I remember Grey after the first episode, pointed out how during that small council meeting auto distracts damon bringing up i mean serious issues and was like let's talk about the tourney and he does the same here right he keeps distracting from real things

by bringing up all the fun stuff that the series wants wants to talk about instead, like with the hunt and hunting the heart. I mean, I would even go as far to imply, like he is the one that's probably also pushing that Viserys needs to feast and hunt all the time. I bet he's saying, oh, the lords need the distraction, blah, blah, blah. He's probably the reason for that. He definitely starts to really,

this episode especially, I love that he's like talking to Al to Allison at one point and he's like, yeah, so now our new narrative is this, even though, yes, my dear, just a couple days ago, we were talking about how I am the reason that Rhaenyra is the heir. Do, do, do, do, do, undo, undo, control Z. Yeah. Like you can't just undo that.

We already saved the game. Yeah, absolutely. We hit a checkpoint. You can't just undo that we already saved the game yeah absolutely we hit a checkpoint you can't undo what you did and he's trying to do that and it's so annoying we'll see more about it and you know reynira storms off as any teenager would again all of this is relatable content kristen cole follows because no one understands her except for us and they do this for most of the episode, partially because it's his job. And he's like, wait, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. He actually does a fantastic job of like jumping on the horse very quickly and chasing after her.

I was impressed. Yeah, he was fast. And so you and I were kind of discussing this offline that we're implying that for three years, he's been her sworn shield now. So they should have a decently close relationship. That's what they said in the after episode i didn't feel that unfortunately i felt more like this was their relationship really blossoming yes i i did feel that way like this is one of their first conversations which for me it would be fine if it were because it makes sense that reynira has been so isolated for two years and is obviously frustrated by that

but I didn't get very close friends over the past two to three years from this obviously it would still be formal but I don't know yeah I didn't get that and that's okay whatever it's not really a big grape that I have with it I can live obviously I can fill in the blanks because I've been

doing it already before the show you know that's the book's nature and I was fine it. I can live. I can, obviously, I can fill in the blanks because I've been doing it already before the show. You know, that's the book's nature. Yeah. And I was fine with what I was presented, right? Like, already. Without, it was the behind the scenes telling me that that threw me off.

So I'm fine with it as is on screen. But they do have a short amount of time to make that work for me. Sure. Like, next episode is, it seems, it. Rhaenyra is the princess of Dragonstone and she says a very interesting line she says that she feels toothless i thought that this was a very fun

thing for her to say because as many of you may or may not know toothless is the name of a famous dragon in how to tame your dragon interesting i i i'm glad that i saved this line for you and that's what you brought me i thought you knew that's why we were saving the line. I didn't know what you... I thought you were bringing something like big. Well, I had something else. That is big. Well, I guess.

It is kind of like how to train your dragon. Toothless is pretty important. Well, I will say that it reminds me of Arya in A Clash of Kings Arya 10. You are Arya of Winterfell daughter of the north you told me you could be strong you have wolf blood in you the wolf blood aria remembered now i'll be as strong as rob i said i would she took a deep breath and lifted the broomstick in both hands and brought it down across her knee it broke with a loud crack and she threw the pieces aside

i am a dire wolf and done with wooden teeth feeling toothless right like being obviously we know that means that she feels like she has no fucking offense she has no you know she feels like she has no power she's no power it's all been ripped out um and i just was reminded of the dire wolf wooden teeth line from aria she's done feeling toothless herself yeah it's funny when you brought up aria right before you talked about that line in the wooden teeth, I actually thought you were going to bring up her throwing away lion's tooth slash paw. Lion's tooth.

Okay. Interesting. Her Arya going off with Micah, the butcher's boy. Yeah. Right. Instead of- Not our friend. Yeah.

Not our friend, Micah. But going off with Micah, the butcher's boy on the trident when they're all, you know, carousing and they're doing the hunt stuff. It does remind me of that a bit of when she trots off on her horse and Kristen follows her. Yeah. Yeah. And practicing all of that. And we're actually working up through the Game of Thrones plot because then we're going to get to Aemond and the strong boys. And that fight is literally just Arya, Joffrey, Micah, Sansa,

and the wolf dying because of it. Like it's kind of the same. Yeah. There's a lot of the same drama. They're all pulled out in the middle of the night to deal with it, it looks like. So I feel like that's going to be interesting. I don't remember if you had this later on,

but you were saying something really, really interesting while we were watching about seeing more of Arya, Arya's character in Rhaenyra. Yeah, because the interviews that kind of came up before the launch of the show, I think both Emma and Millie, the actors that play Rhaenyra, they both said they read Arya lines for Rhaenyra. And I never pictured Rhaenyra's Arya. I mean, again, we don't have POVs on these characters. So we've had to fill in a little of the imagination, but I never understood considering Arya was within her, but you can see like that, that blatant want to run away from

tradition and not wanting to have to do it that way and being kind of stuck in your gender prison, which both characters very much are. And with the boar, we'll talk about the boar in a bit here, but the boar actually, in my opinion reminds me of aria now kristen has this line where he tells raniera that he owes her for his station and for everything he's kind of become as a king's guard because he didn't have this opportunity before i love that i think that is like an interesting way to leverage this because he's saying right now thank you but later he probably won't feel very grateful because it almost feels like a trap like it really does remind me as we've likened

kristen to jamie lannister in the books already because of the kingmaker and being able to crown another um and him killing another you know jamie killing a king and kristen crowning a king there's a little bit of uh Cersei Jamie vibes, right? That Rhaenyra has single-handedly condemned Kristen Cole to the Kingsguard, whether he knows it or not. He can do some great things, some terrible things from that role, but he will be stuck in that role till he dies. Yeah.

And it's, he's playing it kind of, this is why I was like, I'm not sure I got that sense of closeness, right? It feels like he's like playing his cards close to his chest, which makes sense, right? That's what you kind of have to do with these royals. We see Alicent having to do it with Viserys, but he does feel, seem trapped. And he's telling Rhaenyra, people would envy your position. And I mean, that's true, right? Many women would envy your position and I mean that's true right many women would

but as she points out not everyone has been in my position which is I mean there's truth to that as well right it's a precarious position to find yourself in yeah and then being able to choose choose your path he can't anymore

and this is his path now yeah for better or for worse this is his job now he's a supreme court justice and and so uh we were discussing this also on matt's stream last night his his armor has this like banded design to it all the king's guard do but it reminds me of the dresses that allison wore in both episode one and two that bandaged sort of look of them being sort of strapped and bound in their position this path for them but also yeah I can't it does he does he hate it or not but also he will he didn't have to he didn't have to put in a job application for it, right? Like, why was he there then? I think that also does show, like, his ambitions.

Because he does say, like, he tells her, I never had a formal betrothal because I wasn't high enough nobility for that to fucking matter. No one cared about me. Just like how she's feeling right now. Like, no one cares about her. You know, that's probably why they're so drawn to one another. Because he knows that life, but he wants more. drawn to one another because he knows that life but he wants more he also is vying to get just a taste a lick of that ambition that's just radiating around her right now as she is the air until someone changes that or a taste of freedom right to tie back to what miseria told damon she's hoping

for liberation to feel free for her it's free from fear for kristin what is it free to do what and you were talking about how there are similarities between his and reynura's position right now i wonder if he and allison then would they bond over we have to watch our words all the time around these people that we are with all the time that's true how do you play giving counsel? I mean, that is a big part of Allison. Yeah. How do you deliver those words? Yeah. Interesting. I want more Kristen Cole because I do want to care about that because I don't feel like I care anything about him.

I want to see that built up because I want to understand. I think the betrayal needs to have weight. And it will probably, but I'm still... I'm not there yet with him. And also because that is, I think, one of the biggest mysteries, right? How did it all really play out when it comes to everything that fell out between the two of them? And so I don't know. I don't know.

The next two episodes are going to be really pivotal for that. That's going to be... They really have to bring it home. And I'm glad they started in episode three. I think that means episode four. The next two episodes are going to be really pivotal for that. That's going to be, they really have to bring it home. And I'm glad they started in episode three. I think that means episode four, maybe we'll get a chance to see that expanded, but I don't know, in the weeks, the next week trailer, you know, we see Damon comes back and I think that will be a big driver for her and

Kristen. Like that's the wedge that comes between them. It seems. Comes between them. Yeah. Or not comes not comes well it will because he's a oh but it's a drinks guard so who knows he's got a edge forever oh my god okay so the men are in the forest and they're chasing the heart they're seeking the beast otto has this line he says i've never been one for signs importance your, but he said the thing. The whole entire episode's theme for Viserys, hysterically, underneath the guise of this hunt is he is one for signs and portents,

which is, if you don't remember, it's Dany's, the dreamer's accounts in Dragon Dreams, basically, brought over from Valyria. He has a whole entire signs and portents scene in front of the fire with Alicent after this. So it's really interesting that Otto's playing on that and being and being like you know i don't really get into that prophecy stuff that you kind of slam around viserys however if we get this heart you know this white heart

very important that it's beautiful and white like the blood of valeria yeah for plot reasons to come but if if we get this it's a sign that you're the truest king ever it's it's pretty funny because i on one hand i'm like oh yeah it's kind of i guess an easter egg that's for us thank you ryan condell appreciate you thank you and as you're talking about regarding the white heart it's something that comes up in the first book. Joffrey is hunting for one, does not find one, which goes to show us, you know, as well as that he's not the true king. But also it's something that, you know, as they point out in the behind the scenes episode,

is a symbol that goes back even to Arthurian legend of being a sign of legitimacy in a way. Yeah, that's perfect because Sansa is very like, I had a dream Joffrey would get the White Heart. You know, it's very rare and magical and he's much worthier than his drunken father. And it doesn't go well for them

either because they do find the White Heart in A Game of Thrones, but wolves found it first. Oh. A little different than what actually goes down in this episode but i mean the symbolism is very obvious before we get to kill that heart viserys is just getting bombed he's getting drunk as hell because everything sucks first of all he's in bodily pain since he's you know lost some of his fingers the infection is spreading and yet he's touching

all of the food at the buffet with his bare hands oh my god it's his buffet aliana i know but he's just like it is some great gross body some tongs my god yeah what are we barbarians some chopsticks or something i don't know christ it's um it's gruesome those fingers are gruesome think about the rest of us the series we want to eat that food too. He's consuming so much wine. Like you're just seeing him drink and drink and drink. And it's obvious that he can no longer stand to exist without doing that. Like that's how he's existing, right?

Consumption. Insane. Jason Lannister shows up and gives him a special spear he had commissioned just that day for killing the white heart also he's like i want to marry your daughter but i have nothing to offer you by the way um but at the same time jason is assuming this is a discount proposition because he's like well everyone knows you're you're making egg in your air right like that's what this whole entire you know weekend of celebration is about since you had this son and it's his name day and you're doing a celebration for him wow where's renear's name day celebration like 15 years ago

or even like the last three years though anyways yeah jesus um well that's a that's a good question where has it been especially if she's coming of age where's her coming out sir and where's her quinceanera wedding that's supposed to be her coming out you're supposed to come out as wed so they don't have yeah i guess they don't have cotillions right right i could tell you it would have been smart they should have done something like that or yeah i mean obviously now she's going to be traveling around to you know do the bachelor ceremony in several places but it is interesting that like agan's getting these huge festivities thrown in his name after doing nothing just being a baby just being born he was born with a penis and again only some

people are able to do that as you said earlier statistically only some people can do that and agan was one of them congrats agan but that's the thing is like they literally made a huge weekend of festivities for him of course this is what people are thinking and viserys yells at jason lannister so and it's like a quiet yell he's like how dare you say these things you know reneera is the heir and no i'm not gonna yell this part louder for everyone to hear yeah he tells him he pretty much is like you know i need you now to take this and tell all of your lords that you know. And I'm like, why don't you just make an announcement? Yeah.

Oh, now you have discretion? You have the royal voice. Exactly. Exactly. Use your fucking king's lord's voice. Yeah. And he uses a quiet voice later on, you know, where he's like, tells Otto. He's like, I just, I want Rhaenyra to be happy.

And Otto Hightower kind of nods, and I'm like, that man does not understand the concept of wanting his daughter to be happy. I know it. I know it. He's like, I want Rhaenyra to be happy. And Otto's like, good thought process. Maybe we marry her to Aegon II. Yeah, right? What?

Even Viserys laughs. He straight up laughs. Yeah, he's like, you fucking idiot. Like, you serious right Yeah, right? What? Even Viserys laughs. He like straight up laughs. Yeah, he's like, you fucking idiot. Like, you serious right now, Otto? That's hysterical. She would murder us. Yeah, but at the same time, Otto's maybe like, I don't understand. It's a smaller age gap between you and Alicent. He doesn't say it aloud, but let's be real.

It's a thought, but, and this is something we also discussed last night with our friend Matt, but it does imperil the royal line for her to wed agan the second yeah when it comes to if if their goal is even at all right retaining i don't know blood and power within house targaryen she'd have to wait a while before she could even begin bearing heirs if that is the goal if she wed agan the second because there's this disgusting sweet spot that women can get fertile younger doesn't mean their bodies can bear children better or easier but you know fertility comes at a certain age and goes at a certain age statistically yeah you know they like to push you to breed faster.

I mean, even when she gets to that point, right, which would be about, like, in her 20s, Agen still wouldn't be old enough. Yeah. And also, I mean, it's two minds. Like, the age gap really sucks there. Okay, I told you yesterday. In CK2, the other thing is, like,

you don't want to just you don't want to just marry off all of your people in your line to make alliances because that means that when every fucking petty lord you've married into your line calls for a favor you have to go help them right and so you want to save that for when a when you need the alliance like you want to marry off when you need the alliance like okay we're doing this b it needs to be either beneficial then if not like if not marrying off for an alliance in war it needs to be beneficial so we're gonna see lena and damon right get betrothed and that becomes very beneficial especially after this war where he went to war with her father in the stepstones and helped protect his you know

economic gain so to speak like the valerians were losing money so he helped protect his, you know, economic gain, so to speak. Like the Valyrians were losing money. So he helped protect their legacy and he's getting rewarded for it. And it's a good alliance and it gives him a good alliance for later. And the biggest dragon. That too. It doesn't hurt. It doesn't hurt.

Yeah. So Viserys gets sloshed and there's this moment where the sound fades out right is drowned out behind him and you hear echoes of laughter and screeches happening at court where everyone's feasting and you just see him drinking alone and it's not unlike the scene in the brothel with damon where everyone is you know festivities behind him and everything's blurring out and he's just drinking before the speech yeah i think they're doing a good job this season of showing how all these people are very isolated even when they're amongst a crowd and that is to and the nature of power to some extent it is the nature

of the roles that their society has given them and it's something that I think was very important to the themes of A Song of Ice and Fire. Not that they dug into that in the original show. But it is in there in the books, right? Loneliness and isolation. And I, though, when you were saying, like, you were drawing that parallel with Damon in the brothel, I was like like why doesn't he go all the way with the parallel why does he not give a loud speech about his heirs about heirs in general and unfortunately he does give a speech about that in private in front of in front of the fire anyway we'll get to that eventually right now lionel strong tells the series that kristin went after rainera and that

you know we're working on it. We plan to find her. There's this line from Viserys and he says, if I had forbade her from marrying Jason Lannister, she would have done it out of spite. Well, don't write that idea off too fast Viserys, because guess who? She's going to run off and marry eventually.

Your brother. That was so loud. There's so many like loud foreshadowing moments in this episode they're fun they're having fun with this yeah yeah i think so lionel asks viserys he's like do you want my opinion and he's like fine but then he's like what are you gonna say that your sexy meatcake son is the strongest fighter in the seven kingdoms i should marry my daughter and he's like no i don't want to be the next person you yell at today he's like i'm not that stupid i've watched he's the smartest person there he's like watched every other person get yelled at by viserys and he says including renyra including renyra looks over its side yeah he's like i don't feel safe

here um he's way smarter though he says no renyra should marry elaine oralyrian. Remember at one time I told you to marry Laena and you didn't, but thankfully there's another one in that family that could get married in. She should marry Laenor. It's a perfect match. Honestly. Yeah. I mean, this was fantastic advice.

Thank you again. 10 out of 10, Lionel strong. Yeah. He, he does not put forth Harwin like that here, but you know, I mean, it's's great though because in that same way he's using the what he just learned from the series right like the series straight up just said my daughter will not do something if i tell her to do it i have to do

the opposite and lyle goes true so i'm not going to tell you to tell her to marry my son and it does the opposite effect she still fucks Harwin yeah exactly she does it on her own he wins I mean he does win in a way except then he loses yeah I was like except for that part where they die but absolutely right because he's like no she can't marry him and I do love how lionel couches it of saying like this would help mend any slights real or imagined right because it's smart because viserys thinks that they're imagined slights he doesn't think that like what he did to house valerian was meant as a slight at all because he's a fucking idiot yeah we know it was to them they took that as a slight i mean it was a real slight right like alice it's only two years older and he's like no i'm married for love it didn't mean anything it's

like he didn't even marry for love he married for attention which i guess is just you know that works but i loved the real or imagine line because it's straight up the cersei line right about cersei never forgets a slight real or imagined oh interesting it's the up the cersei line right about cersei never forgets a slight real or imagined oh interesting it's the same language they're doing such a good job of pulling out a swath and putting it in the script just randomly they're like we got we got a chance to do it right we can actually adapt book system them pulling out all the material that was unadapted wow look how much yeah look how much we could do what's the next thing thing? What's the next Easter egg we're going to get? That's what I want to know.

It's going to get more and more each time, I think. I mean, every episode has had more. No, I'm joking. Every episode has had more Easter eggs in it. So I'm excited about that. We flash over to Rhaenyra and Criston in the boar scene. First off, right off the bat, bat there's a line she straight up asks Kristen Cole and says do you think the realm will ever accept me as their queen again conversations

that they've probably been having for three years right right Kristen says they'll have no choice but to which is such deliberate wording because so many people are going to be forced to bend the knee to Rhaenyra. Yes. Whether they like it or not. Like in the most extreme use of the word forced. Yes. Like by dragonfire. Absolutely.

And I just thought that was an interesting thing to say. That's not something you say to someone who's your good friend, you know, whom you admire. On one hand, we could interpret it as lionel strong sorts of honesty but on the other i don't know there's something about the way that it's delivered that feels very uh cagey you know like it feels like a non-answer yeah because she wasn't looking maybe she did want to hear it from someone you know of them just say yes because i guess you know sometimes we all do but at the same time it was a non-answer it didn't explain i think they will because and here's my essay it was well there's no

choice they have to which isn't really yeah and it's also not true because she knows that there is another choice right like that's what the question really was was do you think they're gonna choose aegon over me is this really gonna happen yeah and i mean he's tired at this point right they've been out like for a while and he's petty because he's the one that does it yeah yeah absolutely absolutely so i'm i'm fascinated how this evolves into that because he doesn't, that's not something that someone who wants you to rule says, or who cares about you. I mean,

it may be depending the way it was delivered did not feel that way. And I mean, it's double edged because we know what's going to happen. Yeah. Without knowing it would do its most weight and work. You know, if you hadn't known what's to come with that betrayal, if you didn't know,

Kristen Cole places the fucking crown on Agen Two's head. Yeah. Because, like, I don't know. For me, like, this scene feels like someone who's annoyed that he's- He feels like he's babysitting her, right? Because of her temper tantrum, which- Her bad manners. Yeah.

I mean, he does ask, like, 80 times, like, Princess, can we please fucking go back? Yeah. Well, exactly. Exactly. And she's like i don't know and finally she asks that question which is i think all she wanted to hear from anyone she wanted honesty from someone and then after that they're able to go back after now first she has

her life imperiled and then she sees the white heart but like look at her at the beginning of the episode with the singer and how she treated the singer. No, start over. Go back to the beginning. Do it again. Don't listen to her. Sit here and sing my song to me. And then look at how she also is doing that with Kristen's time.

Yeah. You know, in a way that the people that serve her too, she is to an extent exploiting that service and making them stay with her for her emotional needs which is fine because i do that to you all the time but like yeah for my emotional needs but i guess it's i mean she's right no one else is in her position and again that's the isolation of loneliness the only other person that she could really do that with is her father or with damon as we see right with the with their dialogues with one another and it kind of reminds me of the little princess in a way the character from the great novel that like right she is used to like her servants are all that she has in her life because she was such a you know independent street child and she

was a little um willful as a child and then she like ends up losing it all right and she has to kind of go into poverty and fight her way out of it and so there are some aspects of it like nothing not one-on-one none of this is one-one but there's just even something about it of like those are all all my servants are my only friends because i've been isolated all i have are these people yeah and i think like that's why i don't know the way she's treating kristin and the singer samwell samwell isn't great which is interesting right like allison does call him by name right but she doesn't feel like there's anyone she can be close to in a real way she doesn't have anyone to anymore she has to grasp at the connections that she can try to grasp and and hold on it's

sad it's really sad well you see it reflected at the end right when she tries to hold on to damon even though he's flying away from her at full fucking speed at the end and like she's like maybe if i hold you to me harder you will not leave and in a way you see viserys do a little bit of that because it's all that she knows is from him in that way to love we're seeing that happen the insecure attachment style as the as people have been discussing in terms of different like relationship attachment styles that's a point. I'm not a psychologist. But yeah, and then so... If you were a psychologist, what would you say about her going Arya Stark on this boar?

Yes, when that scene happened, I know apparently I guess some people were seeing it as a sign in for madness. I don't see it as that. I saw it as someone at their breaking point of frustration. And when it happened, I think you heard me yelling, is there gold there gold in the village yeah i was on the other end of the couch going how much how much how much uh it was amazing i'm so excited to see the books adapted finally yeah this is this is wild there's there was so much anger and rage and like everything pent up within her yeah and she's tenderizing it so they can eat it better and faster.

Absolutely. Which, I mean, so that is a part where, I don't know, I'm a little torn. Because on one hand, yes, they're tenderizing it. In the behind the scenes, they joke that she brings everyone pulled pork later. But I do love a whole chunk of roast pork. Slice it off. Yeah, but I guess it's boar, so it's harder, right? So you could, but you could, that would make a fantastic ragu. Actually, now that I think about it, you like,

you shred it, and then you like braise it for a long time. Sorry, everyone. This is also, remember, this is also a cooking podcast. This is a food podcast as well. Food podcast, first story, second. Food podcast, comedy podcast, finally.

We maybe talk about A Song of Ice and Fire and surrounding stories, but we were talking about this again on Matt's channel. And I want to point out when I was contrasting this with Viserys' and how those scenes are portrayed and why we accept one and not the other, like Rhaenyra killing the boar, you and Matt pointed out it was in self-defense. But I just thought it was impressive on the part of the direction that we were able to have scenes that have maybe like similar ideas and moments but the emotion is so different yeah there's very different emotion in the way that it was mostly self-defense but also at the same time it was dead like it was

kristin got it by the second yeah she didn't need to keep going but again it was therapy at that moment for her she was getting out a lot of the silence which that's even something really interesting to look at is look at you know the the no dialogue happening in the stepstones during the battle for damon nor krahas that we'll talk about and like for her she didn't need words in that moment because everything was within her just like those battles something very interesting about the wordless battling all these characters had to do in their moment uh and before we get to viserys's metaphor with the heart because it's a big one it's a whopper can't wait we have to talk about viserys telling alicent about the vision about the prophecy in a way he straight up i mean this

was the wrong drunken speech viserys this is not the drunken a way he straight up i mean this was the wrong drunken speech for series this is not the drunken speech about heirs that we wanted and he gives her everything i mean this is i feel really bad because it puts her in such a sorry my god it puts her in such an imposition first of all like the more she knows the worse it is for her because it's what her father demands of her right like the information that she knows she is her father's pipeline to the true king at this point and who he really is in personality so for him to tell her everything and to tell her that he felt like maybe he made an incorrect decision in naming Rhaenyra Erythra at first and that now he knows that like you know that was wrong of me to think that way but he says to her you know he's like but what if and then he tells her his entire vision of placing agon's crown was placed upon his

son's head and the dragon's roaring and what is alicent gonna think about that when push comes to shove and her protection which is viserys dies yeah and all she has is her father in one ear and her children's lives in the other she's gonna see this as her making sure this prophecy happens right i mean she's also thinking that she needs to carry out this prophecy now she probably will feel some sort of a debt to it they're aiming towards two different prophecies right allison's aiming towards this one that viserys saw and then rainier is aiming towards an older one that's been passed down. That's the legacy. That's what's been passed down in her family that we see in the trailer

for the next episode. The sword. The knife. The cat's paw. The knife in which the prophecy is. What Alicent doesn't seem to know about the dragon dreams, because she has not read Signs of Importance, probably. It's banned in

the reach uh i mean maybe it's probably here in this library but i don't know they're both bookish these two girls but she it's a warning the the dragon dream that this series has is not like something you should be aiming towards it's a warning do not let this pass same as like don't stay for the doom of valeria don't fucking let winter come that's what this is a this dragon dream is a warning do not put the crown on the boy but they take it the complete opposite way because i mean of course i mean that's it that's the whole he did he did such a good job. He was born with a penis. Stop! You have to crown him. So we're back to Viserys, right? He kills the heart.

And I want to come back to what you were saying about the differences and how the heart and the boar are killed. And the heart is tied up, held down by several men with dogs everywhere, horses everywhere. They have it caught up it's there's no fighting back for this heart it the imagery is not unlike emma being held down to be cut open i mean sorry bring it back up it's been a couple episodes but it's not unlike that with the women holding her down uh and once more his warhammer set his kingdom none of this was earned right so him the whole idea of the king catching the prize for the hunt is that like it's supposed to show ah he's a true hunter he's a true warrior in the woods he went out there with his spear and he caught it but these men have caught it and tied it up and said now here you go viserys come stab it and cut it open and like theon and like rob he isn't able to kill it

on the first go even while it's right there in front of him right so that's a sign that's important uh and the other thing that said they find it's a brown heart it's not a white heart and they say ah it's still the same thing which is kind of funny because they call it burly and strong and it's brown instead of white. Not unlike delivers that line. Yeah. Is a strong. So it's not unlike the strong boys. And that's like, I mean, that right there is the metaphor for his reign and what's about to come from his line.

Absolutely. for his reign and what's about to come from his line absolutely it makes me think that we're going to see him deal a lot more personally with the bastardization stuff and like that he knows that they're bastards and this man only takes things personally he literally does he does not consider anything from a larger societal perspective until someone's like but what if you thought about it like this like everything's personal to him and i love i love the comparison that you're making about the heart and emma erin and her death because as you said right they're here they're like all right here it is here's the hunt perform masculinity now go be a man go to your job as a man and in service of this ritual of patriarchy and that is what killed emma erin right the ritual of patriarchy on which she was

sacrificed yeah it was like an altar it was and that's what this they're all gathered around to watch it right it's all just a performance and you know speaking of of that like he feels it he feels it completely and also it's not a white heart which is they point out in the behind the scenes like he's relieved to an extent because that's the moment that he decides to never disclose to alice enough like that reassured me that i made the right choice in picking my daughter um because there wasn't a white heart for my son's thing so he's not the chosen one but anyway the way that it's presented also makes me think like is it like auto putting alice in in front of the series but also how he couldn't kill a fucking still deer, whereas Daemon's out here.

He's the one being hunted. And then, I don't know, doing all the fighting. Not that being a good fighter makes you a good king. That is not what I am saying. And this isn't even, yeah. Yeah. But he's willing to be out there and do it himself yes and to be amongst the people and to do a real fight not a fake one in service of pomp

this is like something that is good for the economy of westeros and i will say viserys looks away and closes his eyes when he goes to stab the heart. Oh. Don't look away. Father will know. Oh my god. Yeah. When can a man be brave? Interesting. But also, like Arya, you know where the heart is, right? Yeah. And maybe if Viserys cannot

look the heart in the eye, he shouldn't be killing him. He should not. Fucker. That was horrid. Yeah. That was, uh, that line earlier about the boar, you know, screeching like child being slaughtered. Fuck, the heart screeching. That was devastating. Yeah, they did that on purpose. No real animals were killed in the filming, as far as I know, of House of the Dragon.

And there were real animals around. This is an episode about dogs. Oh my god. As you pointed out for me. You pointed it out for me. Yeah. It's a doggo episode. There's so many dogs in this episode.

There are. It was made for you. There were some peacocks. Yeah, there were also, yeah, that's right. Two peacocks. It's also a Borb episode. And birbs, yeah. And we talked about vultures.

Vultures. We need hawking. I want them to give me a hawking scene very interesting i would love to see like laner and raniera go hawking didn't rhea royce like to go hawking who knows what's happened to her i think we're gonna see her still i really do i i think we kind of have to right that's why i'm like how much show do we have here to get through shit raniera when she sees the white heart right it's all sorts of full of symbolism and metaphors

there's something to be said like you said it's almost like an altar right so it's almost like an altar like Otto putting Alicent out as a sacrifice for his king to gain power right you gain power from a sacrifice from a blood sacrifice so to speak and Rhaenyra letting the white heart go because she's the white

heart right like all these men came vying for her hand, hunting her like meat for her prize, her name, her place, her claim. The White Heart being the chosen one, the chosen heir, and that same idea that like, that's the heir that Viserys chose. You know, if that had come to him today, he would have been like, Aegon, you're the heir. Maybe it is true. All for you. But because he doesn't, and Rhaenyra sees it, and she lets the white heart go and walk away. Not unlike Arya Stark with the white horse in season eight's Masterpiece of the Bells. It's my podcast. You guys can't be mad at me. Why? It's true, though. I mean, it's the same symbolism. Like, it's that purity in a sense of,

letting it walk away, letting something still be whole, instead of tearing it apart for tearing it apart's sake. And it's interesting that it's from Arya's view there, and this is for Rhaenyra. I mean, after we saw Rhaenyra have a little bit of that Arya-esque stabby stabby going on. Oh, that's so true, right? Yeah. And I think that's important, because again, like, I don't see her stabbing the boar as indicative of her madness I also don't think Rhaenyra goes mad um I don't really think that madness is a fair term anyways like I really don't I think that like you said it's somebody that's been pushed to their breaking point and we see a lot of these Targaryens pushed in one way or another to their breaking point because it turns out managing the lives of what millions of people or whatever who knows how many people there are but that's why that's why you were forced to retire by a certain age if you're an air traffic controller it's stressful it's super stressful and oh that also has to do with things in the air if you think about it i was thinking about dragons

yeah yeah i mean who has gone into a presidency in the u.s and come out looking younger no one no one yeah they like it's it's a time chamber itself there's time skips within that pregnant not presidency that presidency oh my god yeah absolutely regarding her finding the white heart you know i'm torn on this because she does the right thing that is the right thing not killing the heart and again that shows that it's not about that madness these are different circumstances also i'm putting it out there i don't think targaryen madness is a real thing i think it has to do with as you said power and isolation and like being in charge of many people's lives and some people go crazy with power and we see that outside of the targaryens

i don't i just think it's so interesting it's it's just like a propaganda excuse to cover up things that really happened they just happen to have a lot of power and also I guess magic so like that's gonna do a number on anyone if she had slain the heart and came back with it that would have been a very powerful message

to the lords of Westeros of who is the heir the right heir it's me bitch but she chooses not to which again is the right call but also it's tough because both reassurances of her

claim are seeing the heart letting it go and then Viserys reassuring her later on and both of those are private no one knows that they happened and therefore it's something that gets lost to on a all the lords of westeros and b the later historians yeah it is like a ripple effect when she comes back to the yard the best moment the best moment the whole episode the most characterization any character has had in one episode is harwin strong and larry's really yeah uh both of their faces during this moment are so indicative of who they are as characters that

she comes back bloodied up and harwin is in the middle of ripping out entrails of an animal not unlike tywin right when he's skinning the deer interesting kind of reminds me of yeah interesting uh he's ripping up an animal and he's just watching her and that look in his eyes he's like wow i would go crazy i would fuck for you right now in front of everyone i would just let's go queen he's like i would give you that lord's kiss yeah he's gonna do something yeah wow he's he's gonna get that girl pregnant is what he's gonna do holy shit which apparently is what she needs according to the realm according to the realm but also i mean i think he knows how to give an orgasm so like he knows where to put it he knows

he knows where to put it and i don't know that was a fun scene as you said and then larry's just sort of staring observing and then larry's doesn't have like any shits to give he's like all right so she a little crazy cool what else can i figure out from this court today yeah she's looking around and harvard's like yeah she crazy the look that he gave her oh those eyes oh man that's gonna be great i can't wait to watch this courting go down oh my gosh and then i mean many people have pointed out like that's book dario right yeah it's totally book dario it's fun. And we also cut to Jason, Jason Lannister as well. And then I'm happy for Sir Hugh's actor. I'm happy for him because he does this like really small,

like little twitch of like disgust. It's very well done. Happy, proud of you. Go get paid. He's going to, I mean, if this show keeps going on, he's going to have a job the rest of the show. Oh my God. He's going to have two jobs. I hope he's getting paid for two jobs i have no idea how did

lindsey lowen get i don't know sir you were the veils actor better be getting paid two salaries yeah or even like i don't know thinking about ollie so you brought up she hulk earlier tatiana mislany and orphan black oh my god give that girl a million dollars per character. For real though. Yeah. We have a scene between Otto and Allison where Otto basically comes to her. She hands off the baby so they can have this chat. And he's like, you need to make your son your heir. And he totally is like gaslighting the whole conversation.

He straight up doesn't say anything. He just says, yes, it's so funny now that you have this son, which will now be Aaron. She's like, that's not true. There was a big ceremony that we were you were there with me, dad. We both went to the ceremony after you pretty much made Rhaenyra the heir by saying David couldn't be. And he's like, no, no, no, no, no. You see, we were all just waiting for a boy to be born. And now we can all go back to the normalcy you know what you've done allison what you've birthed is

great and it's gonna fix everything that's been wrong with this place and i'm like it won't it won't it really won't i mean he's committing major treason against viserys like all the time right all the time absolute hypocr. All the time. Absolute hypocrite. Like, he loves pointing the finger at other people. His middle finger, as some he have liked calling Otto recently. Middle finger. He loves pointing the finger at other people, especially Daemon, and being like, that's treason, that's treason, that's treason. I'm like, sir, you are committing treason.

When you are saying this is literal treason and, and like how no one sees through him is absolutely insane yeah how he can't keep getting away with this you know how he can't keep but he does and i mean that actually says a lot about the relationship between raniera and alicent that immediately when she does retake king's landing like alicent doesn't get the chopping block she's just like you can just be in jail forever she's like your dad though we're killing that bitch fuck that guy i fucking hate him yeah i do hate him and they got this shit right he does he does get fired though right for suggesting that they give up i mean because it was treason that is treason and he has big axel florent vibes yes it's who he really has like i've been thinking a lot of people compare him to like tywin or littlefinger or other characters but he's very axel florent in

just his ambitions like the axel florent goes as far we were just re-watching this in season four of game of thrones we're on a very slow re-watch and it's just when we're bored for an episode you know but not in the show they do not adapt what axel did and why he's being burnt he's being burnt because he's a non-believer in the show which is stupid because janice doesn't care about that he's like yeah whatever i just care that you don't eat other people and you do my bidding um those are my two real rules but in the books he's burnt because you know he was plotting to marry shireen off to tommin yeah that is treason and to undo her claim which is what he's doing in this episode with

aiken and renero that's treason yes absolutely absolutely and you know again to allison's credit you i think that um emily carey emily carey does a good job of showing that conflict within Alicent, right? When her father proposes, you know, your son as the king, of course she smiles. Again, our parents want the best for their children, which is what we see of Viserys, right? That's what Viserys wants for his daughter. Why would Alicent not? And I don't know, it's fun because also viserys doesn't seem that affectionate of a in the second he's most worried about rainiera which is probably bad care about

all your kids but anyway um well but he's more worried out of guilt which is the problem like because he knows he fucked up again there's as usual there's a lot going on there there's a lot weighing on that entire relationship and again to allison's credit she points out ring nero would be a good queen yeah right like i mean you can't say that aegon the second would be a good king he's literally baby no one knows anything about him or like his views or anything right he doesn't have any he doesn't he doesn't and ot being like, the realm will tear itself apart if Rhaenyra steps over Aegon. And I'm like, you mean if Aegon steps over Rhaenyra? To her credit, Alicent says the same thing.

She's like, I won't have him be sad that he stole his sister's birthright, dad. Yeah. Yeah. And the seeds are being planted though for that to become the seeds are being planted and it's it's all a trap right because as you said right how what other power can she try and grasp in this world if not through her children when this series dies as high as she comes until she gets that next step and so she she's trapped what power she's trying to reclaim power for reyniera in a way right she's asserting reyniera's claim which would be game changing

system changing in many ways and auto's like no no no no don't do that none of you need rights including you daughter allison none of the women need rights. And he says that is the way that it was made by gods and men. That is the laws of gods and men. And I'm like, interesting, the laws of gods, whatever. I don't think the gods fucking care. And he says, and men. So Alison is being forced into choosing, same as Rainey's,

a system that continues to subjugate yeah women in order for that self preservation of power and again to her credit like she doesn't actually go do her dad's bidding yes she goes to viserys after this and they have a conversation and she doesn't do what her dad implied she needs to do instead she gives him good advice on what to do for the stepstones which is get over yourself and save your brother's ass. As well as then discusses Rhaenyra with him and who she'll marry. And she's like, you know, like she actually says to him, you get kind of this recant that she says, I told you that wouldn't go well with Jason. You didn't listen to me.

So like, you know, she was defending Rhaenyra in some aspects. Now she agrees with him and believes he's correct. She needs to get married. She gets it. But again, she wants that news to be delivered softer to Rhaenyra. And she's like, you know that she needs to be kind of treated differently about this. She's not like me, who was cowed by my father and groomed to be this way. Like, she's very independent.

You need to treat her so and give her some say and make her believe that she has a say yeah and but also here's how to manipulate your daughter honey yeah i mean she does care she does care about her friend and that's part of what she's trying to she has a genuine connection or did have a genuine connection with rainera that was shattered and she's got like this weird one with viscerys and it's it's changing and yeah like you said she has to say i don't know i know rainier is type it's me but but we ruined all that by us getting married anyway it's true she're like her type was me we transition out of this scene to our last i guess politics scene before we finish with the stepstones so we transition to raniera and viserys chatting in the small council room and she's actually sitting in the

hand of the king's seat which i'm sitting sitting here like, she should be. She should have been this whole time. Right? I mean, Balin, her grandfather, Viserys's father was made hand, right? Replacing Sir Rhyam when he died, because again, timelines fucked in the books. So when Rhyam dies in the books, Balin is made hand. However, he dies a year later, he gets a stitch in his side, and he dies of a burst belly after five days and his father jaharis lights his pyre very sad but like his heir that was his heir and he put him on the council i mean balin was still pretty young there's no place for her gender to rise to right on the council if he doesn't put her on the council yeah cupbearer you can't go be a squire or knight next you need your next thing to be a political role he should have put her on the council yeah cupbearer you can't go be a squire or knight next you need your next thing to be a political role he should have put her there to show a his faith in

her b show that he thinks that she provides a strength to the council and that her voice is worth listening to yeah and see that if he were to drop dead tomorrow he had faith in her following him and like needed to put that on display for his people. And he does not do that. She should have been sitting in that hand seat for the last two years. Yeah. Or even if not the hand, there are a bunch of other positions. You can make a fucking position.

Emily, you're rich. Make a new chair. Yeah. Literally. Make a bigger table. And that is the metaphor we talk about all the time when it comes to power. Make a bigger table. Yeah.

I will say he does waver finally, like on all this. He tells her, I want you to find someone you think is a worthwhile match. Yeah. And be careful what you wish for. Yeah. I mean, he does it. She does find someone who is a worthwhile match in a couple of different ways. Right.

And I love that that might hint that she chooses the laner match or he lets her choose it. Yeah. Quote unquote choose because it's already been chosen for her. But I hope that that shows like he's putting it in front of her and not telling her to do it and letting her see this is the smartest match. And I think it's great because when we get to the next scenes, we see laner is a good match, right? Except for, again, that one thing. I think that they both know. Yeah. So I think they both choose it.

But also, I don't know, I love that this scene between them ends in many ways similarly, visually, to the end of last episode. But with amending, hopefully amending of their relationship. Which, I don't know, they're back and forth all the time. It ain't that just the way that families go. And I mean, the defense that he will bring to her when it comes to the bastards, right? Like, yeah, that's gonna that will speak volumes. Yeah, that's true. Absolutely. Absolutely. However, I can see how insulting it is to everybody else that she has bastard sons, and it feels obvious they're bastards. And who cares? Obviously, you and i don't

care i mean i'm a bastard you still like me i can see where the insult rises that allison had trueborn sons and now not only is reneara the heir but her not trueborn sons whatever that means well i think that's a threat right yeah the threat is if the line passes matrilineally, it doesn't matter if they're trueborn or not. You know where the baby came out of. But wait, are you saying that it turned out it never mattered? Wait, if that doesn't matter anymore, then none of this matters. Oh my god, wait, none of this matters? I mean, I would say that, but I mean, I don't know.

I'm just an untalented person who was not born with a penis, so. Stop. I didn't have that kind of talent, Chloe. Like Egan 2's talents. I did not have. Yeah, and I love that he reassures her on the memory of Emma and that love, right? Which is, it's beautiful. It means nothing.

And when he's dead, I mean, nothing means anything anymore. He's like, I promise no one will supplant you. And I'm like, can you promise that louder? Yeah. Can you make everyone else promise that too, right now? Feels like you need to say it to other people loudly. Oh my God. Personal promises don't mean, he only understands pomp and performance on one level. Yeah.

He admits to her that he did waver on her air status, which. Well, yeah, everyone fucking knew. Unfortunately, everyone saw you waver on her air status which well yeah everyone fucking knew unfortunately everyone saw you waver you got caught everyone saw you waver undo it show everyone where you're not wavering and standing firm now yeah speaking of stepping and standing the stepstones yeah let's close up today with our action right we'll hit the end of the action on Damon's suicide bait mission, which proved really fertile. It was a great mission. It was wordless, like we mentioned, like Krahas's entire role, which I thought was very evenly measured. And between the no dialogue for Damon in this scene and, I mean, Damon beating Sir Adam, the guy that brings the message from Viserys, beating him senseless.

Poor guy. I was like, what Adam is that? I know. I was like, that's not our Sir Adam. Not loyal. He was loyal, though. Unfortunately. Poor guy.

And just Daemon going on his own and choosing to be the one to kill Drahas and being the bait and being able to put himself out there i'm just saying he has a good leader like as a leader you should never ask someone to do something you would never do yourself right and so he did he went out there on his own and just did it to prove that he would do it and i mean viserys's letter sending help enrages him because he just wants to prove i could have done it on my own this whole time that's not what this was about. That's interesting that you said as a leader, you shouldn't send people out to do something you're not willing to do.

Yep. Like tie down a heart. I was going to say like when Rhaenyra sends Rhaenys on her own to deal with Vhagar and Sunfyre. Yep. Which doesn't go well. That goes badly. Poorly. Death. Anyway,'t go well. That goes badly. Poorly. Death. Anyway, so, but back to this battle first.

Yeah, it was a strong scene. It was a fun way to end the episode. I loved the little, what, did they just tear off the little crab claws when they would get them? And then they made the figurines of the crab feeders troops using those on their on their strategy chess board i love that i loved um i love the the strategizing you can see the tension with vaim and beginning yeah with uh now his brother cousin in the books which i was telling you earlier yes i was reminded that not only was he a cousin but he was a cousin from an elder

sibling so technically he has a better claim than corliss and that's actually was he a cousin, but he was a cousin from an elder sibling. So technically, he has a better claim than Corlys. And that's actually what he brings later to court when he's like, well, I should be the fucking Lord Adriftmark. Like, and he also was like, you and your, you know, daughter with her bastards out here. I don't want this passing out of my line either. So I do think the cousins were a little stronger of a connection because of that succession. But I'm interested to see. It's easy to wipe that away and just be like, well because of that succession, but I'm interested to see. It's easy to wipe that away and just be like, well, I don't want this line to fall to bastards, you should give me the next brother hit.

Yeah. Less effective, but it works. Yeah, I mean, they've done a couple of simplifying things, right? Like, for example, making it between Viserys and Rhaenys, right? As opposed to Viserys and Laenor at the start with the Great Council. But yeah, I mean, I like that they brought in Vaemond. I thought there were some fun scenes between him, his nephew, and his brother. Laenor was the MVP.

I don't know if I believe that three-year age up did all this for him, but... Well, yeah, I agree. I mean, I guess he's been working... How long has he been out here on the battlefield? Because he's been working out every day, apparently. i guess he's okay he's been working if he how long has he been out here on the battlefield because he's been working out every day apparently yeah he's getting buff he um he had a good one-liner like when he called vehement the master of complaints oh got him got him and him on sea smoke sea smoke looked amazing just so fantastical and his woos he

at one point yeah he's like dracarys woohoo yeah i mean he we see a lot of proof in this episode that if we're talking about good matches on paper laner is one right he's he's the one who conceives of this plan right it wasn't damon damon's getting blamed a lot for it and i think i think it a good plan. I think it was a good plan. Lainer, great job. Yeah, he masterfully did that plan. And he said, this is what we're going to do. We're going to use bait, bleed them out.

Yeah. Be gay, do war crimes. Yeah. I mean, everyone's like, oh, it's bad. It's a war crime. And I'm like, what happened to be gay, do crimes? All right. Yeah.

I thought Lainer had a good plan. And it's interesting to see. This is what we mean when we talk about give your heir meaningful work. Lehner is the one who is A, fighting next to his father, B, at this council as a leader, C, doing strategies, and D, being given the ability, not the ability ability given the weight that they will carry out this strategy they honor this strategy from laner which again works yeah which is funny because the plan that laner is using and using the dragon for i mean it's not unlike what raniera suggested

and was shut down in the small council they They shut her down when she said, you have dragon riders, father. We could just... And he cuts her off and they all say no. It's pretty much what saves the day. Yeah. Yeah. And I mean, we also see that Laenor is willing to do it as well, right? Being on dragon back and doing this against all of the archers, which as we're shown at the beginning of the episode, it is a dangerous position to be in.

And he does it fantastically yeah and and leads everyone and this is fantastic for morale except for except for damon's morale surprisingly i think damon is um gonna be a lot happier that it seems greyscale is not a blood-borne disease yes there's that also i was complaining about this i was like what is he doing what is with the targaryen men just holding dirty shit like literal shit and also grayscale but turns out it looks like he's gripping him maybe by the sleeve yeah thankfully and only the outside of the sleeve where it did not touch but i mean it's targaryen exceptionalism yeah you know they don't get sick eliana i'm just kidding just may gel that one time who died oh my god and viscerys and viscerys listen but otherwise targaryen exceptionalism aren't they exceptional folks and and that time that daenerys does get diarrhea so there is there is illness and that

daenerys dies of the uh the winter the other Daenerys. Yeah, and the Great Spring sickness. Yeah. But besides all those times, besides all of that, Targaryen exceptionalism, Eliana. They just don't get sick. Absolutely. And they're also fireproof. I'm just kidding. Oh my gosh. But what about that other element? What about water, Chloe?

I loved the decision to omit seeing him killed Drahar or Prahas Drahar. Yeah. him killed drahar or pragas drahar yeah i loved seeing him off screen killed because it made when damon wordlessly comes back and drags him through the water uh there was that moment blood went in the water and i think that it's obvious in this episode especially blood is being spilled in the water already like the war is becoming a possibility a civil war becoming a possibility bigger and bigger that's a great spilling blood in the water which is kind of what he'll do when he marries his niece later but i mean absolutely the seeds of it are being planted they're being planted in front of that fire with a

visceri spilling everything to allison right that's why he throws his wine later, right? Because he just spilled it all. No, I'm joking. But that is also what happened. There was too much wine wasting in this episode for my tastes. And in front of the fire, I don't know, it feels very Danis and Melisandre, but also role reverse.

I was like, Viserys is Melisandre. Anyways. In front of the flames that will engulf the entire country one day. But for now, as you said, fantastic performance by Damon. Also fantastic performance by Daniel Scott Smith. No relation. I swear to fucking God. There is no relation.

And I don't know. I like at the end, right? Damon comes out. He looks tired. And yet somehow this did not bring him happiness. He looks a lot like, I won. Now fucking what? Now what? Yeah. I'm interested

to see if he stays there for the next year dealing with Recalio off camera and if the next time jump is like a year time jump or something. Good question. We had a lot. The Weeks Ahead, or the Week Ahead trailer. I don't know why i keep calling it weeks ahead the trailer for next week the trailer for next week has a couple of moments that if you

watch it slowed down it looks like they go to storm's end for uh possibly consulting about maybe marrying boros you and i were speculating offline about you see boramans there and she's sitting with boram and kristin Cole being entertained at Storm's End. So I imagine it's going to be like a tour to get her married, basically. Yeah, this is her shitty cotillion. Yeah, it sucks. It's not missed on me that it reminds

me of the Martells going through the kingdom in the main story with Elia and Oberyn having gone through. Oh, yeah, very true. I mean, you know, it's glad that, I'm glad that she's going around and gets to do this and that she did call out her dad on like,

you know, if it was about tradition and duty, you would have married Lena. And so now Boros, we were speculating like, maybe this is why he's such an asshole when the dance is starting because he feels he took that real personally when Rhaenyra turned him down which I mean she doesn't she's not always the nicest with it so maybe she really did insult him but he probably deserved it I mean look at Jason right Lannister

he deserved it yeah he deserved it but Boros is obviously a prick when we meet him in the books uh and yeah I think this is, it's planting Jason's rejection, his rejection, all these people that become big players for the greens and give them support in the war. Like you see why. Yeah. It sucks.

I don't agree with the why, but you do see why. Yeah. No, same, same. The why is shitty. And I mean,

it plays into how people have discussed. We'll see how it goes with these rejections. When men are rejected, their fear is embarrassment. But women are afraid when they reject men that they'll be assaulted. Yeah, the reactions are very different. I mean, even in this fantasy world, it's not unlike that. Yeah. I mean, because you got rejected once like a

decade or two ago you're like putting an army against someone yeah they're like let's go to war but i mean i guess i understand if it's about how they think the whole power structure will collapse if they'll be able to schmooze in the way that they have with the series and i mean they're also just fighting against that traditional change like yeah the idea of succession changing that would ruin their lives everywhere is kind of how they see it and that becomes such a central theme and that yeah and that'll come up with again as we discussed last week house rosby absolutely i love uh you pointed this out last night to me when we finished the episode that the credits song the song in the credits has kind

of the lannister late motifs in it like uh some of the little hints of the lannister themes and i love i saw some thread on reddit a few weeks ago where people were like there's but how there can't be a house lannister theme because the red wedding doesn't have or not the red wedding the reigns of castamere don't happen canonically and i'm like yes but that song had to be born from somewhere yeah amazing also like time is a circle also i mean they weren't playing it in universe you know like the people do not hear the theme song playing behind them as they come up it's for us the audience to make these connections of who is on screen and what it all means yeah that's true it's for us it is for us like i mean the music is supposed to add emotionally to the entire tone of the show yeah that's the goal it's to make you i mean it is

immersive it's to feel immersive like you're in a different world with swooping sounds that take you to different places what we need is more brain nearest theme which is an absolute banger they played it when she walked into the um hunt with the boar yeah and that was good do it every time she returns from i guess disobeying because that's when she's getting to assert her agency in a way in a way i don't know it's a great song we needed more and i look forward to next week like i can kind of mention last week to us that she couldn't quite 100 recall what was in this episode but that episode four she said it keeps getting better from there so i'm looking forward to next week and some of the drama it looks like we have a shot of raniera and possibly

beggars boys clothes going to a brothel with Daemon? Is it a brothel? Is it not? Because she's also like, this is a serious accusation. You know? And she's fighting against something. Some sort of gossip and rumors. And Otto, he's like, oh, I'm so

sorry to deliver this. I'm like, shut the fuck up, Otto. Keep it to yourself. I think we're going to get some of that Kristen Cole drama, some Harwin Strong introduction. Yeah, it's the Bachelorette. And some Damon. Yeah, yeah. I'm excited.

They all get the rose in different ways. Oh. Well, thank you so much for listening today. We will be back next week. Keep an eye out in your feed. And we can't wait to come on back. Goodbye! Thank you, and thank you, and if you want to know some of our thoughts

and see whenever all of our different episodes come out, be sure to follow us on social media. You can find us at twitter.com slash girlsgonecanon, that's C-A-N-O-N, or maybe you have thoughts. People, oh, oh, we got an email about a new catchphrase! Yes, we did. Oh my gosh, oh my an email about a new catchphrase. Yes, we did.

Oh, my gosh. I just remembered our friend Laney emailed us last night with a new catchphrase to possibly be using. Yes. Oh, so. They said that a companion to get a job, Littlefinger, should be, does she have a job, Viserys? Because Laney said, you're not giving her responsibilities that would indicate she has a job job Viserys because Lainey said you're not giving her responsibilities that would indicate she has a job Viserys great great catchphrase I really love yes and you can send your catchphrases into us too at girlsgonecanon at gmail.com yes I'm so

sorry hopefully everyone hears this at the end of the episode because this was a fantastic suggestion thank you Lain thank you laney and make sure you're subscribed to us on a platform where you listen to your podcast whether that's spotify google play itunes stitcher a cast you name it we're on all of them hopefully and of course you can definitely always find us on patreon patreon.com slash girls gone canon where we have bonus episodes for patrons in the stranger tier and above five dollar and above tier this month is still pending but last month we did kick off our mothers of the dragon series yes we get to talk at length about one of our favorites reina so tune in for some good theorizing, too, because I'm sure some of that theorizing will come to this forefront of this show soon.

Soon enough. And we also host weekly events for House of the Dragon discussions. Our friend Maddie is hosting the actual discussion. She's doing such a great job. Fridays at 2 p.m. ET. You can join in at the Discord if you are in the Thunder tier, $10 tier and above. That's patreon.com slash girls gone canon again and we are having our brunch this month

I want to say September 18th Sunday the 18th we said 2 to 4 so patrons keep your eyes peeled for that information in your inbox as always I have been one of your hosts Chloe and I have been another one of your hosts Aliana till next week

I can't believe we have to wait a week. Every single week, I'm just furious that I have to wait. Bye. Goodbye. Bye.