Girls Gone Canon Cast - House of the Dragon S3E7: The Dragon in Winter

Episode Date: August 5, 2026

SPOILERS: ASOIAF, F&B, KOT7K, TWOIAF, ETC There are a few differences between Anthony Harvey's 1968 THE LION IN WINTER and Nina Lopez-Corrado's THE DRAGON IN WINTER. Most of those differences are dragons, but maybe also a few other differences, too.  We're back piecing together how we feel (which is excited, because Dreamfyre, YAY!!!! and AWFUL, because leave Sheepstealer alone .....) and you're invited to listen.... seeya there ;)    @ patreon.com/girlsgonecanon NEW INTRO: thank you kevin macleod and pixabay "The Descent" Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com) Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/ Dragon Studio + PhatPhrogStudio on Pixabay  

Hello. Welcome back to Girls Gone Cannon Watch's House of the Dragon. Season 3, Episode 7, The Dragon in Winter. I'm one of your hosts, Chloe. And I am another one of your hosts, Eliana. A lot happens this week, I feel. This is a whirlwind. This is like, what the frick just happened here? Like Louise Veltre voice, what is going on? Before we go into all that, here's our spoiler policy. If you go here, you go here. First of all. Second of all, if you don't go here, welcome. We spoil everything. If it has been on TV in the A-Swaff universe, in a book, in the A-Swaff universe, in a novella, in and out side of the A-Swaff universe, I would say. If it's written by

George R. Martin, we've covered it in some sort of capacity. Fire, blood, Ace Waf, the World of Ice and Fire. We'll refer to all that stuff. We'll refer to the shows, all of them. So everything, everything, you will be spoiled if you come here. And you'll probably be spoiled for other things too, right? Like, we talk about everything all the time. Yeah. Rapidly. Very rapidly. I think the only thing you can expect us to not spoil that much, I guess, is the Mad King play, because we have not really consumed it. So we just can't really talk about it. We have gotten asks, are the girls going to be covering it? And, like, maybe.

Maybe. I just like... Someday. Not now. I haven't seen it. Yeah. I don't want to, yeah. Like, if we see it, yes, but we don't have plans to go.

Till it comes here. Yeah, till it comes across the ocean, because... Budgets. Yeah. That's it. There's some sort of joke about, like, Deneres are queen across the sea and, like, making her come to Westeros for us. Like there's something in here.

Make the play come for us to the United Nations of Westeros, all seven nations. Yeah. The play will come to us. And when the play comes to us, we will accept it lovingly and we will talk about it. And then we will cover it. Yeah. Yeah. We just like haven't, we haven't seen it.

So we've seen like what people have said. I know quite a bit about it. I just don't feel qualified to discuss it yet. You know? So, and like, it's not in the back. not downloaded in the back of my head for me to just like pull and like reference at any time as the rest of all the things that you said that we will spoil. We are on the penultimate episode. If you don't know who we are and why you're here listening to us. We don't know either.

We have in a Song of Ice and Fire podcast. We've been recording this podcast for many years, for like eight plus years. We are reading a song of Ice and Fire, POV character by POV character at a time and we are on our final POV character. That's right. We finish out our A-Swaff POV reread for all published quote-unquote chapters. George, your move. We finish that after this POV, which is Tyrion Lannister. We are done with a Game of Thrones. We're going to start a Clash of Kings sometime after the end of Hot D season three. So stay tuned for info on that. But that's not all we do. We cover other stories like The Hunger Games, which we're covering in full part by part, act by act, bit by bit. We're finishing that up as well on Patreon for patrons in the

Stranger tier and above with the last act being what we have left to cover of Mocking Jay. I just want to like call out here briefly when you talked about how long we've been doing this. Happy 30th anniversary to a Game of Thrones, which released August 1st, 1996. It's a Leo. Thank you. Oh my god, it is. And then, of course, actually, like Chloe should be introducing this to you, but the other month, the other month. The other month. We did a deep dive or a deep climb or high climb, because dragons on the dragon Dreamfire.

And Dreamfire's riders. So, you know, we're finally getting fed this episode, not fed to the dragons. Like, we are the ones who are being given the food. But, you know, if you want to go check that out, might pair well with this one. And also, yeah, something else that we do is we have our Patreon brunch slash happy hour every month. And we are TBD on the date for this month. Yeah, on account of one of our hosts was born this month, so she throws a big wrench in the month every time. That and also I just kind of like, I got distracted with everything like going on in life and also House of the Dragon.

And next thing you know, it's August. And I'm just like, where does the time go? I'm getting existential. Also, I did not push you like I'm supposed to on the 15th because I do have the calendar thing on the calendar, the reminder that by the 15th of the month before, I'm supposed to remind Eliana to tell her we need to choose a brunch date. It's not just you. And I didn't do that. So I take accountability and this is my apology. Hold on.

Let me open my note, my Apple note. Just kidding. I don't have an Apple note. I was like, interesting. I, Chloe, this is a Samsung note, will be better and take more accountability. And I'm sorry for not reminding Eliana about brunch. Thank you. It's okay.

I forgive you. I don't care if everyone else does, but I do. Oh! But... Hopefully I don't get girls gone canceled. There's a lot of questions, right? About accountability and forgiveness throughout this past season. That was a segue.

That was not the racey. Not pulling out the responsible, accountable, consulted, informed. I've never heard this great work. Okay. Oh, no, no, we gotta stop. I can't be out here doxing myself racying. Yeah, you gotta look it up. Our ACI.

It's all about accountability. We need to be holding people accountable in the racy format in HotD is what I think. This is only gonna hit for like some of our corporate fan base. That's crazy. I've never heard this. But here's the thing that I have heard our friend Fernando's Spotify comment, who didn't really actually update the reviews were named that much on Spotify. But good luck. And Fernando also feels that last week was our funniest breakdown to date. And there have been many. And I love that.

I love that, like, growth. We're getting better as we age, even funnier. This was one of yours. I loved that one. Gwayne having Westrose Grindrinder and then also your Pokemon bug catcher Helena. and then a throwback to the Paella Targaryen. Honestly, Fernando must be like a maybe a hot show listener. I don't know. Fernando, where are you at? What's your GGC update? What's your status update?

I'd love to know. Yeah, but also, like, I think we talked about Paella Targaryen more in, like, some of our other fine blood coverage. So I understand if, like, you know, you haven't gotten to those. I feel that. In the GGC you? I think we talked about it more like when we were probably covering Jehary's stuff, which I don't remember when we did. I actually don't know that we, did we do a dedicated Jerry's episode or did we just refer to it?

We do like a question of succession. Yes. We covered the question of succession, so I think we covered a lot of. We, when Fire and Blood first came out, 2018 back in the day. Jesus. Wait. No, no. Just talk about something.

Fire and Blood came out the year that Girls Gone Cannon came out. Is that really? Lord Blood Raven, is this true? Like, I don't think of those things happening in the same year. Like, I feel like I thought that our podcast was going on longer by the time fire and the like came out. We were already so enmeshed. We were so young. Oh, that. We were like, sorry, we were like invincible. Like, I don't think that we understood that.

I wasn't. I threw up. Yeah, you did pro up. But that's because of all the fucking White Walker Jim. Beam, Johnny Beam, whatever the fuck it was. Whatever White Walker ass, booze. See, I don't know which one it was. That's how you know I'm not getting money from the... It wasn't good. I'll tell you that. It was not good.

Oh, it was Johnny Walker, White Walker, is what it was. It was terrible. And you made all of us straight. Yeah, I did. But it was cool because the bottle changed when you chilled it. Yeah. I think maybe like fire and blood, maybe that's why this is so close to our hearts, that was like such a special year, like, of life, of being alive on this planet, this hell planet.

2017, 2018, yeah. I went through a lot of changes in life, but like, I guess it's worked out in some ways. The other parts of the world that have changed have not, like external to that. Yeah, man, the world around us, I'd say juries out, but is it? That was a fun time, though. That was a fun night. You know what else is a fun night, Eliana? A night in Heron Hall.

Is that what you were going to say, Eliana? I don't actually know. Because it sounds like that was what you were going to say. I was going to say something probably along those lines, but I actually had no idea what I was going to say was going to be, it was going to be winging it. Kind of like our dream fire episode. One night in Heron Hall makes a young man humble. I was thinking the same thing. I love that song.

It's probably very like inappropriate. appropriate. It's so, but I don't care. I love that one and Rock Me Amadeus. Oh, I love, right. And you can't like those songs anymore because of woke. No, I'm just kidding. I'm sorry. Let's talk about Heron Hall. You know who had not woken up, amen in the beginning of the Heron Hall scenes? First of all, roses where roses are due, comedic brilliance, the entire everything. If you took out everything except the Heron Hall bits and just watch the Heron Hall POVs, this episode, if you GGC'd this episode, comedic fucking brilliance, add a laugh track, add some applause. I might have to do this now. I might cut it up because I literally last night,

the only things I had typed in our outline was, I love it, LMAO, I love it so much, LMAO, I love it, LMAO. Like, I was dying. It was the perfect, like, sitcom. You know what reminded me of strangely enough, like Wanda Vision? Interesting. There are like greater works that Wanda Vision is also copying off of, but it reminded me a little bit of Wanda Vision in like things are not right here, but they're being presented as right. You have, you know, Aiman, like his mom telling him all the things he wants to hear and kissing him all the ways he wants to be kissed. And then some.

And like obviously that's not right. There's like the horror aspect. So I very much actually love the horror aspect of Harenhaw this time through still. It was a new way for them to play with that. It was almost very much like a horror film that like, I don't know, like a evil mother in a horror film. Like that Jessica Chastain other mommy film that's coming out. Have you seen the previews for that? It looks terrible.

I will not be seeing it, but like... I haven't. It seems too scary for me, probably. Yeah, it is too scary for you. Very crazy, though. And then like the awkward meeting your mom dinner immediately after, like, oh, you're just in time for supper. and also the fact that like Allison's just going to have to try better next time when she poisons the next son, you know, like she really biffed that one. But yeah, someone was talking about that being the setup.

I'm like, oh, yeah, that's true. I think there was a great setup with Larry's leaving Egan and Allison, like, biffing Amund's poisoning that's going to lead both of them to doing it together, maybe, and even tying some little knots of their plot off, right? because they don't have very much closure necessarily to their characters having history. So I don't know, I could see them together coming to the, you know, that she needs to kill him. Like, we're going to have to kill him, Larry's meme. Something about that. Yeah. I think I saw someone phrased it kind of like more comedically.

She just keeps trying to poison her kids and stuff being like, Helena, take this. Amen, take this. And, but it, I see it. I see the vision. I'm not against it, especially because, I don't know, I guess it would be interesting if she comes around to, like, kind of comforting Agin, too, just because, like, she didn't, right? In the past, we've seen Agan crying and struggling, and Allison doing nothing to comfort him. I see also, like, as you said, it was... Ooh, avenging her lover.

Which lover? Rainira. Oh, yeah. I guess. And then also, like, as you said, I don't know, I haven't watched this movie since, like, in decades. I was like, is it like Meet the Parents, the movie? I was thinking that it was very much, like, sitcom-y. With Ariana? Movie-y. Yeah. Yes. Meet the Fockers. Yeah. Yeah. I, there was definitely some sitcom set up there. And of course, it was like a really great balance because you start the episode where you can, He, like, loves his mommy more than anything, and then trusts his mommy more than Alice.

And he straight up says that to her, kind of, at the beginning. He's like, what are you talking about? I trust my mother more than you, which. And then Allison, Alice is like, okay, sure. And Allison then proves Alice right, like immediately. So now Amon is probably not going to take that personally and will not burn everything, right? Like, this is a pretty good reason to want to burn down the countryside around you that Mommy doesn't love you. In fact, so much so that Mommy wanted to kill you.

Yeah. It's... It is interesting. I guess... Bro men, Roy. It's fascinating. I mean, I understand why he'd be like, I trust my mom more than you. He's like, I just met you.

Like, I don't know. Two weeks ago. and they're trying to be in a relationship. What is this? Love Island. It's fun. Their interactions as well. I don't know if I truly understand. I feel like they're trying to set up a like

mother doesn't like girlfriend trope, which is like a fun thing to play with. But I'm also like... Yes. She's not jealous of her. I think it's more of just like... And I think Amon thinks that and like he grasps Allison's hand. And I'm like, do you think you're about to like sister wife,

but not sister, mother wife, I guess, with a sister wife, like your new girlfriend and your mom? I guess like Magor and Vesnia, right? Yeah. Like, it's very Magor, Vesnia. She's the Tiana. But Allison was like, bruno. No. And Vesnia would have been like, I guess.

She's like, please just release me. which actually that was a big deal right that like he was like yes I'm not keeping you prisoner because that was what she was waiting for him to be like no you are a prisoner now which is the smart thing to do quite frankly well it's all shit that's ever happened to her it makes sense like her like trauma responses to be like I'm about to be imprisoned again like hernal is probably the furthest that she's been from Kingslanding and Lord knows how long if you think about it because like she did go on she went camping but not that far out.

She went to Dragonstone, she went to Heron Hall. Those are like somewhat similar distance, but one has water and one doesn't. I consider Dragonstone still part of the Crownlands, so I'm like, it's in the same state. So it's not like going, she didn't cross state lines and she did for Heron Hall. You are getting in a boat. Like I'm sorry, but if you're getting in a boat, do you go on a journey? I guess. I guess, in my heart, it's a little bit like the ferry.

I know it's obviously further, but it's a little bit like, you know, Staten Island and a... Like more 20 to 30 minute ride, you think? I mean, it's probably longer than that, to be honest, but, like, I feel... It feels that way. You know? Because I can drive to a state in 30 minutes, you know? Yeah. Or, like, you could probably do that commute.

It's probably much more perilous, but... Well, maybe we should question Eliano's geography moving forward. No, I'm just kidding. I'm not good at geography, so, like, you probably should. but like in real life. But I can read a map. I'm better than, I can navigate if I must. Yeah, you can.

But the catch is we will not use words like left and right. We will say this way and that way and we must pay attention to my hands. Over there. Because I don't. We must. No. I can't. I will tell you the wrong thing.

I am one of the people. There are dozens of us. Actually, maybe even hundreds. There are at least two of you. At least two because they are my best friends. the two people that do this. We don't know our right from our left. So, well, you know who else is fucked about getting home?

Allison. Allison. Dude, no more Adrian Redford. We're going to talk later, but interesting, he's dead now, right? He lives till Dragonstone in the book, and Fire and Blood, the book. So that's interesting, but she, I'm, like, concerned, like, perilous journey home. How will Reneira answer this, right? She's coming back without a Queen's Guard.

Queens Guard is in short supply these days. Oh, yeah. I feel she had, there were, like, other people who left on this. There were at least, like, four other people in the ending scene of the previous episode, right? Who, like, all escorted her out? Where are they? Or, like, three other people. Like, I feel like I remember there being, like, a corner, like her in the middle of multiple people,

as they were riding out, you know? Sir Adrian remained steadfast and resolute. He led us to a secret gate and I had enough coin with me for horses. We tried to remain off the roads, but the forests have become impassable in places. There are wild men in the woods now. I would not have arrived here if it wasn't for him. So no. I just feel like she was lying.

Well, yeah. I mean, she loves to lie. She does. That's a bisexual thing. That's a culturally bisexual thing. We get it. Oh, my God. We absolutely understand it.

But yeah, like, to me, it seemed that they, like, got rid of those men or whatever. Oh, they only one so far. Yeah. I mean, I guess. Yeah, I don't think the men came with them. So that's moreover that I'm like, how is she going to go, you know, like, over the river through the woods? Here comes grandma. Yeah.

Wrong lyrics, but. In her, like, little blue riding hood. Yeah, literally. And she'll huff and she'll puff and she'll cry. Yeah. Maybe. Maybe. I don't know.

Much to think about there. I feel like something that was. kind of fun about this episode is it is like it very much primes you to question you know to pull a line from mocking jay real or not real but you have like this very dream sequence you know with the way that you're waking up with helena right and that brings you into the next scene with amand and you're primed to be like wait no is this like actually real or is this actually happening maybe this isn't alicent and turns out it's not i love the way you're speaking of of that because that is part of that episode, right?

Like, the dreamer quality of it is important. And it's great. Look, people that don't like Harrodhalt, I don't understand you because I'm getting everything I've ever wanted. Again, this is like the, people are like, that was so fucked up. That was so gross. I can't believe it. And like, my household was like more, more.

It was kind of fucked up. I'm like, what's wrong with us? Oh my God. But it's awesome. It's everything we've ever asked for. Like, it's doing its job. We set up the framework for what Harren Hall could do in season two. right and what it could do to a motherfucker

Alice even jokingly saying like I know what you Targary and guys really want your mommy's that's what you really fucking want that's why you're here and why you're hounding her but there was that great bit where Amon is mid-stroke in his mother and the audio effects

layers both Allison and Alice's voice and she's like in this moment I will give you a son which also is the whole point right like that's it that's what the mother son incest is because the mothers are the daughters and the sisters and the cousins in not just the Targaryen world, but in the total world that are being used as flesh, as passage, as coin, as like a currency that are being traded back and forth and paying the price in so many ways

for power. Yeah. Yeah. Not just their power. I agree. Or like just, you know, you can see that Allison, And to an extent, like, she's also kind of become even an object to Amand in some ways, right? Like, just something that can give him.

And, like, you know, the point of a parent, not the point, but, like, they're supposed to give you love and reassurance and everything. But, like, he's trying to still use her in that way. He's been set up, too, as you said. But another thing that, like, this whole dreamlike quality, I guess, it warns us throughout the episode. that not everything is as it seems, not even just like in terms of literal the dreams, but how people are approaching it. Like, Allison, actually, even she, when she actually does show up, that Allison is also fake. She, as you said, she's just lying to her son for everything.

And what I think is interesting, though, about Alice is it feels like she has like one move, you know, like how the guy with like one pickup line. And she's just been looking for the person who's going to respond to, I love fucking my mom or something because like she pulled the exact same move on Damon and when Damon like came to for a he was like whoa no I'm not into this and he like recoils from it he's like this is not the thing that I'm into but Amon like goes all in he's like this is absolutely the thing that I'm into so like this is just like her one the one thing like she's like I'm fine I'm looking specifically for the man who's very into this I don't know I don't know if I agree with that

only because I feel like she's sensing out what they're made of, and like, Damon even says in this episode later how distraught when their mother died he was. So, like, she knew something's there. It's just not sexual for Damon. Yeah. She just got the wrong one, the wrong thing. Yeah. Yeah. Which, ironically, Amon is leaning more and more into being Damon 2.0 as he's at Heron Hall. I think a little. I think he's actually, like, as you can see, like, he's becoming, like, maybe the younger, but Damon himself, he's becoming a different, a very different person. He's got a very different, I think, trajectory that we're starting to see. And I'm curious where that goes.

And I do think there were a couple lines that Allison, especially like fake Allison said that I thought were like really interesting that stood out to me. First of all, you've been so clever. It just makes me laugh because you're so clever to see it and the way that's delivered. I'm like, ah, oh yes, he has read the songs of chapters. And then also, Amen saying that he himself has been forsaken. And, like, I don't, it's not necessarily a reference, but you're talking about all this, like, youron stuff going on here. I'm like, ah, the forsaken.

But maybe it means something. And, you know, how these different lines that she says kind of land have different effects of, like, my best and truest son versus her saying eventually later, she's like, you're all I have left. And I'm like, dang, one is like, I cared for you the most. The other is like, you're leftovers kid. You're the last. That's it. Yeah.

And she said in the dream or whatever, like, you were the last, but like, also she started with you're the best. Now she's just like, it's just you. I got to settle for you. And like, it doesn't feel good to be settled for, no matter the context. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And you can see what she does remember, her actual favorite child,

because Allison remembered and learned from her daughter's plant knowledge. Yes, the poison. I was like, oh, she was paying attention to one child. And then there's this line that Alice, as Allison says, of like, I will give you a son. And I thought that stood out to me because it reminded me of Melisandra and how she, you know, seduces Stannis. Right. And also even speaks to the way that, like, Mizarria, because I think you can see Mizarria, having like kind of like similarities with the way that Alice is acting towards Amin,

Mizaria doing that to Rainira, right? Like placating her, feeding her what she wants to hear, which is also what we see Melisandra do with all of these different kind of leaders. That's the playbook. Yeah, we're going to talk about Misaria in just a moment, honestly. But like, this feeds really well into it because she, honestly, by validating and placating Reneer, like what you're saying, I very, and especially the religious part. right, like, oh, you must do this because if you don't do this, like, everything that you do

is forgiven, she basically tells Reneira, based upon the prophecy. Like, you are within your right to do whatever if it means to enact this prophecy to save the world. And that's a very fucking dangerous thing to say to someone. Agreed. It's a dangerous thing for anyone to believe that everything is justified so long as, because it's for this, like, end goal or this means, right? Greater good.

Yeah, greater good. The greater good. Well, yeah, exactly. Like, some people have definitely thought that, and that didn't turn out well, did it? So there are some really big, famous people. Glossing over that into Queens Landing with Mizaria, where we're going to talk about Ray Saria and Sylvie. I definitely felt also, like, with Mizaria, saying that to Ranira, I didn't feel that

she believes it, obviously. Like, she herself doesn't believe that Ranira. Reneira is necessarily justified, but moreover that it was to placate Reneira by saying that, and that it's in order to advance her personal agenda, because we do get kind of this breakdown of her and Sylvie, right, where Sylvie calls her out and is like, those people are shitheads, and like, you've forgotten about the little people. You were one of us. My roommate asked, what do you think is going to happen in Mizaria and the show, since we're

remixing so many things and deaths are changing and not everything is going to be book death. And honestly, I kind of think she might go down in the riots from the small folk. Like they might kill her, like class traitor shit. Like I don't know if the lords are going to kill her or if she'll be here when Aiken comes. I wonder if it's going to be the small folk that kill her, almost like Rago draws too in a way. Like she gets a couple of the book deaths. It also, it's a little similar to like, so, yeah. Sarala of Mir, which kind of makes sense, too, with the way that Misaria's stuff is going. And I don't know,

there is, like, absolutely the othering that goes with it. And I kind of, I don't know if they're intentionally channeling that narrative or not with Misaria. But I do think about it, I do think about it as an Asian American person of, like, you know, when it comes to not just like class, like people who side with some like very like white supremacist ideas and being like, dude, like they're never going to, they're never going to see you as one of them, you know, like you look different from what they think human looks like. But I also understand that in the world. Even when they invited the small council, you know, Torrin and Sabatha. Yeah. They sat there openly mocking her.

They did. And like also, I mean, there is the xenophobic. phobia aspect. Like racism, and I'm not trying to like be like, racism doesn't it. It exists in the way, but our modern concept of racism, like, is something that comes about later that doesn't exist in the same way that this kind of xenophobia. Like, I think they are absolutely, there's a xenophobia probably there. And we even see it like against like the Valerians and like colorism, etc. But I don't know that it's like the same thing. one-to-one. If you wanted to all hear me, really like try and parse and think that aloud in front of all of you. But yeah. No, thanks for sharing that. That was my whole thought process. I'm not great at thinking aloud. No, I really thought it was, I thought it was semi-cohesive. Thanks. Thanks. Thanks. Thank you. Thanks for sharing that because, you know, I don't think about that shit, because I'm not an Asian-American. So I don't always think that way.

But having you helps me recontextualize those thoughts. But yeah, absolutely. Poor Mizarria, I did feel, you know, really excited that A, yeah, I am miseriaable. I feel very sad for her. I do. I think that she is in a very impossible position and she thought it was going to be an opportunistic position and that maybe she could do something that could keep her ahead and do something for the people. but like it's the same thing just on a micro scale right like the tradeoffs like what you sacrifice

in order for what to get what you achieve like is it worth it in the end is a big question being asked look at rinira and what she's doing on that macro level and then what what sylvie and misaria and these characters are trying to accomplish underneath i really enjoy that we're seeing that and it's connecting us to that story it's something that i think being started and set up in season one that I'm really glad they're following up on, especially with like the three, the moon or the kings, right? Three kings. Three moons. They're coming. That also is what this scene said to me. I'm like, yeah, I bet Sylvana. I bet. I do, I will say like, Sylvena is a character that I don't love the way that she's written. Like, interesting. I think it's too, she's too innocent. I don't know

how to describe it. Like, she's too, too, I think, pure in some ways in terms of, like, obviously she has the moral high ground in these things and the way that she is presented when she was petitioning Rainier, be like, and I speak for the people, you know, very like, ah, kind of like saccharine. I don't know. I think it's kind of how I feel about her. Interesting. Yeah, I get that too. I think it's kind of a somewhat diversion, too, Like, it is weird to have her be, like, of the people, because obviously of a subset of the people, I think there are a lot more people that are minding their own fucking business also in Kings Landing than that. Yeah.

You know what I mean? Like, yeah. But you know what? I get that it's TV for small folk. Yeah, she's a shorthand for, like, standing in for the interests of everyone else. I get that. But I just, you know, I don't love it. You don't have to love it.

Yeah. It works. It gets the point across. Gets the job done. Yeah. Yeah. I do, so more Mizarria things in regards to her interactions with Raniyra, I did really love this observation from my focus group consultation really, like, involved one person this week. But I thought this was really good. So as Mizaria, like, she's getting physically closer to Raniara, but in those same moments, she's also dissoning.

distancing herself emotionally. I was like, that is such a great juxtaposition of what's going on in that scene. Please clap. Clap, clap, clap, clap, clap, clap, clap, clap, clap, clap, clap, clap, clap, clap. That is really good, actually. You should tell them good job. I'm really happy that they came to that conclusion. And you could tell that Mizaria is already fighting for power.

Mm-hmm. Right? And for her own position, fighting with her tongue, some would say. But also, loki, like, as we've been known to say, coercion, right? Like, this is not... Yeah. Of course, she can't turn away from it, and of course she started it, but this is the only way she has left to the queen's heart through her clit.

Desperate times, desperate measures. It, like, reinforces to an extent, you know, what Sylvina was telling her of, like, this is how they're going to see you, and she... she returns to that role, but it also, I think, kind of asks the question of, like, to an extent, isn't everyone kind of doing that sort of, like, work around a ruler, regardless? You're all doing different kinds of that sort of, like, not always sexual, yeah, but, like, that labor around them to, like, please them all the time, right? Like, and cater to them in those different ways, their pleasure.

And, like, now. so she's doing that and it's also Alicent to Amen earlier in the episode Darren to Ormond Yeah and I mean like even Allison to Visseries right Like I think it's not the exact same location

But it looks similar of like Or maybe it is a same No it's a different look at But they're doing it in front of this fire And I recall again I've been hearkening to these scenes a lot Alicent and Viseries sitting in front of the fire discussing

What should I do about like the kingdom and the ruling and stuff, right? And this is also in the context of the overarching subject of like, how would Viseries approach this? What would Vissaries have done? It's not even like about that. But Alicent, you know, also kind of massaging Viseries's like fears about himself, etc., doing that sort of labor and then and then guiding him towards an outcome. Yeah. Oh, this is what managing up is. Yes, no. I was like, I don't know how to take this joke even further, but agreed, maybe. HR complaint. Yeah, I know, I know, right? I'm putting in several HR complaints right now. Sleep, your way to the top is all I was like, good thinking.

But for Mizaria, it's like, fuck your way and stay at the middle because your only competition is Damon. Just lick your way to the center, like a tothy roll back. Hopefully. Hopefully. Hopefully. by the third, like you'll have beat out Damings, they'll have killed himself from being crazy. You have to chomp. You have to chomp at the third one. Don't chomp it. Do not chomp. Ow, do not chomp. We've got some good Larry's moments

here, and we'll talk about them later on. But I do think that, as I look at them, I feel like Lerries and Mazzaria are kind of these two different dimensions of Vary's character, right? Like, Vary's person who initially kind of claims I'm doing things in the interest of the small folk and also rose high, right?

And then Larry's being person who squirrels away nobles, especially royalty, allegedly, for whatever they're doing. So you can see those archetypes of those characters and how George always kind of, he does very much play around the archetypes of characters and reuses them and then remixes them. Considering Moon of the Three Kings, it's so interesting you would make that reference. Speaking of squirreling away nobles or royals, it's going to happen. Probably the beginning of season four when Rainer's flood, right? Like, Reneura defeated and then she leaves, and then the bastards have taken over the

red keep in full this time. But not Reneer's bastards. Let's go to the small council in Queens Landing, where we're all trying to find out who has been slandering torrent. manderly. We can't figure. Who has been doing this thing? Who's doing this? Yo, speaking of like, Rago Drozaz hours, for real. Yeah. Raygo Draz was in this episode, and I think you're right that this is a great time for me to tell you all how there are 10 ways we could still get the Lysini Spring. Yeah.

In House of the Dragon, starting with. Yeah. We could still. We could still. We really could. This is basically, this is basically Lysini Spring in some ways. So I go, thank you, Ryan. Oh, no. Thanks, Obama. Thanks, Blood Raven. Oh, my God. Thanks, Blood Raven. Cheerily.

Thanks, Blood Raven. Wait, you're right. It's supposed to be a different tone. I've been doing it all wrong. You're just, you're kind of earnest, you know? It's sweet. It's sweet. I don't know if any of that is true.

Is this true Lord Blood Raven? So, something else that I thought was fun about this scene is like, Taurin is clearly destroyed. by this graffiti that's going around of him. And it's fascinating that Rainier's like, what do you want me to do and has like absolutely no empathy for this and cannot like seem to equate how like, to use a line from Ulf later this episode that he also took from us,

that we took from Denaries, it is the same, right? Of like the graffiti when Rainier towards the beginning of the season started like her gold cloak crusade and was like, go find the people spraying graffiti about me. and set them on the small folk and now all the gold cloaks are dead. But like, it is the same. T.B.H.

Yeah. And she did set them against him by telling all the small folk that were there asking for her to listen to their petitions. She'd be like, I don't know. You'd have to speak to Torin Manderly about that. Which, like, I've heard people at work do this before in meetings and it never goes well where they don't have an actual answer. to be held accountable. They're like, no, you have to go talk to this other person by. That never goes well. Yeah. It's, you know, it's her tenants. Like, these are things she stands for, and she hired Torin. Yeah. It's very Circe. It's very, except Tom James was too smart to fall for it,

but it's very Selena Meyer being like, do you want to be the economy czar, Tom James? And he's like, Tom James. Yep. Yep. Absolutely. He literally is the economy's art. Um, okay, the biggest thing that happened in this council that I feel like needs to be shouted from the fucking rooftops is Reneera ordered Sabbatha to return to the twins and lead the men that she has left there to Herenthal. Now, do you know why this is important for Sabatha, Eliana?

Because of Yuri. Yes. That's what I was, but I'm just like, when is that going to happen? I feel like I'm here for this portrayal of Sabatha, but I feel like she's portrayed differently in fire and blood. I'm not against it. I'm just like, I'm still, I'm trying, I'm waiting and the vision is going to come together because I do think, come together. Because I do think that Ryan Condal has been giving us this. So, in the books, or in the book, the one.

one book, her husband is killed in the battle by the Lakeshore. So we already had Lakeshore and there was no mention of that, to my knowledge. So she seizes Harren Hall after it's abandoned by Kristen Cole and Amon, and Amon returns unexpectedly. She hides in the bathroom to get, like, away from the dragon flame. And then she escaped and returned to the twins, quote, unquote, according to whichever maister said so. And then she rejoins for the second battle of Tumbledon with Adam Valerian.

and participates in the Battle of the Kings Road and shares a tent with Alice and Blackwood. So we're not even there yet. Like, that's early season four. So they could still be absolutely queer, all of them, first of all. Like, it's like we got her early in some aspects. I do think so. Like, I think, like, that is the case. I just, I'm struggling to see the sabbatha that we have now in battle.

I could definitely see her hiding in the bathroom. Oh, yeah. And, like, I could see her. hiding in the bathroom with her BFF, Rigo Droz, and they just be, I think, like, I think that's the one thing that I'm a little sad about. I'm like, what happened to my podcast between these two people? Her and Toren, yeah. Don't, don't get it twisted. I want them to. Oh, yeah, not Rigo Droz. I like that you're calling him that, though. I mean, I think that's great. He is that. Like, it is that storyline now that you, like, brought it up and, yeah.

Black Alley, Sam Tarley, and Sabbath Afray are going to be in a tent doing things to each other. I do think it could happen. I can't wait to watch it. I think it could happen. After the veil? I think it could happen. Wow. Don't even get me excited. We're not even there yet. Okay, closing out. Kings Landing. I don't know why I put this here, actually. I have to say, we see the dragon pit at the end of the episode, you know, when they return to it after Dragon Mania that we'll talk about. But good, it's good that we see the dragon pit again and them coming to it. We haven't seen it in quite a while. And I just wish I understood why they're showing us the dragon pit.

What could be happening there someday? Is there something I need to worry about in the dragon pit? Someday, somewhere they'll tear down the dragon pit. Okay. All right, Eliana, girl, were you thinking of me last night? I was. Were you so happy for me? Were you like, what?

Well, no, I wasn't actually happy for you because these were not like happy moments for a lot of this. So I was thinking of you, but I was like, these are sad. What are your thoughts, actually? Because I'm curious, like, I have thoughts about Helena, obviously. This is like the only thing I actually cared. I mean, I cared about stuff this episode, but like this is where my mind was all last night. When I rewatched it today, I was like, oh, yeah, that did happen. Like, I was a little deep into the dream fire and the Helena of it all.

So what did you think of the Holianisms? I am glad that we started getting more insight to it. I think they've intentionally, and that makes sense, kind of been keeping us behind us. She clearly has way more dreams than any of us thought. I do think this series was a little bit of a dreamer, but maybe not a lot. Maybe like, you know, every now and then, like a stray dream hits anyone if you think about it, right? Like a falling star, who knows? I don't know.

I think they like made me worried for her. Like none of these seem really, like they felt like possibilities to me. Like obviously some of it we know comes to pass, but it felt like, you know, these are the different shapes that the future can take and it's not certain, you know? Yeah, the vibe I got, especially from her visions,

like was that you can't outrun fate, right? That each vision shows her kind of like doing something and then the long night came, right? And we can go into that a little more. But, like, her with the kids in the yard, and then the sky changes and the moon changes, her having Mailer and the Kingsguard takes her baby, knowing that, like, there's this one little vision

where she has a happy life, again, Wanda Vision-esque, right? Happy life with her kids and the chickens, and then the sky turns and the long night is here. And the long night representing more over her fate, that there is no winning. Yeah. Like, it was almost like her exploring every possibility and seeing that there is no possibility. The possibility is death for her in almost every circumstance, whether slowly or quickly.

And I thought that was really interesting, like that the winter, the dragon in winter, the lion and winter kind of reference for movie heads everywhere. But the dragon in winter, like, that was her here and realizing that, like, her fate ends with winter. the long night. Her fate ends like not just with the long night, with the doom, right? I felt very much of like, is this what Dainey's saw? Did she just see the doom in absolutely everything? Did

every vision she have end in this darkness and this horridness? Kind of terrible. Probably. No wonder if she's like so afraid of many things. And okay, this is going to sound crazy. Like when I saw like the way that it was filmed and the scene of the two kids and it feeling like very unreal,

what I thought of was inception. Oh. And the ending of inception, it reminded me of that. Yeah. In terms of the visuals, not Wanda Vision. So very interesting, you know. Okay.

But not dissimilar. Yeah, it's like, it's evoking a similar thing. Very much evoking like that similar emotion and that loss and like that surrealness and not the same. Nothing is real. Uh, interesting. Okay, I really, I don't know, I mean, I want to take it a step further and say, you know, we open the whole entire thing with her kind of with that gray mare and reaching and then that door opening. And like, again, her fate, right? Like, what does it mean? Is that the fate? The opening of the door, the light, going to the light. I don't know. But she says to Renira when Renira wakes her up, she says, when I was a girl, I wanted to fly. to fly.

A young girl. Oh my God. No, that was the wrong thing I wanted you to focus on. I see why you focused it on that now. But, you know, like, when I was a girl, I wanted to fly. Like, you know, like, fly or die, Eliana, like three-eyed raven, like, crow? Whatever the fuck. It's TV, so is it the crow or the raven now?

Who knows? No, you're right. I actually don't know. I also thought of that line from Yeron, right? you're on, right? Perhaps we can fly all of us. How will we ever know unless we leap from some tall tower? Yes. Love that. I mean, I really love that you connected it to all that because it speaks to so many different themes that are going on in the Song of Ice and Fire and in this one, like to what you're saying regarding like being a seer and then very much the be careful what

you wish for. What is the price that you're paying for that? And to an extent like Helena didn't really talk about this much with anyone, so it's not like she went chasing after this, but to what you're saying about it being like, the fly or die scene, especially like with Bran. I mean, if anyone's kind of imprisonedish a little like right now by visions, it's Bran. He's like underground, kind of tied up literally by some tree roots. Literally, dead in the ground. No, well, he's He's alive, he's alive. But it also, like, I mean, Lord Blood Raven, though. Like, you and I talked extensively during some of, like, our brand coverage, too, about how Blood Raven, there is a question there of, like, do you choose this power?

Do you choose your family, right? What does fly or die mean when it's not, like, when it's about just power, regardless of whether it's visions or dragons? And you get that same question with Raina in this same episode. and like with everyone else, I guess. Yeah. Family and what it means. Like she said to, you know, the Damon and to Jane even, like about coming back, right?

Raina about like how she didn't realize what it was she'd be giving up. Yeah. Actually, it reminds me as something Sonsa said in season seven, no, was it season seven episode four, with Spoils of War? Yeah, season seven episode, no, it was season six, episode 10. I'm sorry, season six, episode 10, the winds of winter of Game of Thrones. You literally cannot expect you to remember anything that happens from like season,

probably three onward. Well, let me just tell you, as somebody who recently watched season six, episode 10, the wins of winter, and season seven, episode four, the spoils of war, because when I do a podcast, I do it right. I do my homework. the streets were saying... I just refused to re-watch. Yeah.

No, I respect that because the streets were saying this was a very season 7 episode. And I'm like, hmm, I see what they mean, but not quite, not quite that bad. In terms of pacing, in terms of pacing,

the past few episodes, yeah, I will give that. Anyways, what Sonsa said in season 6, episode 10, under the Weirwood tree, two Littlefinger that when she was a little girl, she didn't think about what she had, only about what she wanted, and now that's all she

thinks about is what she had. And I think that trade-off and that sacrifice. The sacrifice of being a dragon rider, and that she gives us, Helena gives us this reasoning, right? And later we connect to Vesaris and Balearion, right?

And Damon talking about how Vesaris rejected Balearion. He rejected being this dragon rider. And here you have that realization come to by Rainira and Helena that like, Helena wanted to ride her dragon, but it was too much. It was too intense. The connection was too much. And being able to handle that was too much.

Very interesting, especially when you get the later comments from Damon about Viseris sinking into sadness when their mother died too. So interesting, like grief trajectory for Helena. and I don't know, it makes me accept the reasoning behind her not flying dream fire. Doesn't make me accept the reasoning about them not showing me dream fire until last night. However, the reasoning for Helena. Yeah, it does make sense. And like, I mean, even when I was a young girl, God damn it, when I was a girl, I wanted to fly aspect.

And it does even speak to like some of those themes we talked about. with Reina other Reina the one that was referenced as having been at Heron Hall not the one that we all just like yeated her dragon a few moments ago just to remind everyone which rena we speak of it's confusing it's so hard but you can see like when she was a girl she loved to fly right like and there was so much that she wanted and same as with Helena like so much grief surrounding it same as with I guess Pissaries, so much grief and everything. What was the price? Yeah, how do you remain focused on your end goal when your whole journey is fucked and delayed? And there's something to it for Reneira, right, who has somewhat ridden Syrax in a handful of

moments in the last couple seasons, but also in the books, arguably doesn't ride Syrac at the end, which now we have a reason for, which we'll talk about later. but like I think also had a little bit of foreshadowing for Ranira as well in that aspect because I don't know if she'll ever ride Sunfire again. Agreed. And I will say like so you talked about the gray mare and like how this episode opened and I'm going to be real with you all. Like I completely like misread that because I was like, do I just like thought no horse colors? And I was like, is this like a silver? Is this like Denaries? And then other people brought up this other thing that I will let you go into. more Chloe because that's definitely more likely what it's kind of speaking to, but I was like, oh yes, the silver.

And like, Helena longing to get on a horse and like leave because she really wants freedom because it makes sense to want freedom in this moment. Yeah, it did make me think a little bit of like the dying girl on the gray horse, the gray mare, like Jane, right? But also made me think of like the bloody flux, the pale mare. Yeah. And I don't know if we're going to get disease, but like, you know what? Fuck it.

Are we going to get the bloody flux? I don't know. I think it could be interesting if we did. Like, we never really, we didn't see it much in Game of Thrones. And I feel like the idea of a huge epidemic is something that, like, George very much explored. And, like, let's be real. all right in this day and age we all have lived through

a pandemic if you're listening like we we as a generation went through that I realized I said that I realized I said that all wrong I didn't mean it like that I didn't mean it and I was like

oh my God I got to be like specify here let me try this again like let's be real like we as a generation we like have experienced a pandemic so we know what that feels like And also, like, we, in this day and age of this coming out, which Ryan Condal could not have planned for, are going through a diarrhea lettuce problem. So it's like, it is the same. It could be the same.

It could be. It literally could be. The moon was, in Helena's vision, the moon stood out to me. And I have to come back to something I said in previous weeks to you, which was, remember when I was talking about. about the design in the veil. Yes, you were. And I was like, oh, I didn't pay attention to all that. And yes, I remember you talking about it, though.

So right directly above where the throne is against the wall, there is a crescent moon, it looks like. And in Helena's dream, as the eclipse happened, that's when the snow began, et cetera, you know, as the moon got eclipsed. So I don't know, it really stood out to me and made me wonder, like, Like, obviously nothing's canon anymore and nothing's fucking sacred, but it did make me think about, you know, like the moon, that being the signal, like the eclipse of the moon and like, okay, so the veil has the moon against the wall, like, is there some deeper lore?

You know, like how in Game of Thrones you had all the spirals that the first men, white walker, whatever symbols of the spirals, the children of the forest made all the crazy spiral shapes for some reason, and that was symbolic of the White Walkers coming. This was in Game of Thrones, for those of you that remember the spiral shapes in like season seven and eight in the caves and the White Walkers left it out with bones and whatever. So I'm like, is it the moon? Is the moon becoming eclipsed? Like, is that, I guess, blood moon?

The long night? Like, is there something going on here? Yeah, the long night and like also touches on like the whole birth of the dragon. and the, moon is not egg, coesi. Oh, but maybe moon is a little big of, a little bit of an egg. Oh, like an egg on. There's something. Or egg on.

Pretty people have, like, discussed this. I'm like, sure people have discussed this. Yeah. And like, I don't know. Day of Black Sun. Is this like a Midnight Sun, Twilight thing? No, I'm joking. I don't know anything that happens there.

I'm going to be real with all of you. Or the new one. There's a new one. Have you heard of that? Wait, what? She's coming out with a new one where they're gender-bed. Wait, what? Same story, but they're gender-bent.

It's like Blythe and what's the other name? I don't know the other name, Eith-ethel. Ethel and Blythe or some shit. I don't know what they named them. But yes. It's the exact same story? Yeah, pretty much. I'm just waiting for her to do the Yuri one.

Then I'll come back. I feel like Blythe and, like, Ethel could be. Like, those names, that could be a, Yuri one, like if you want it to be, like if you tried. Yeah, right? Like those are, Blithe is like a gender neutral name. I know. I don't know what she's up to, but she wants her bag or she's got to keep fulfilling for her editors and for her contract. So good for you stuff. Keep them out. Pump them out. Fascinating. Let me know when you do the Yuri one. Yeah. I mean, yeah. I got to see Dreamfire. I'm like kicking my legs right now, grinning ear to ear. I was

in shock. I was also shocked when that happened, but I, like, it delivered. It delivered. In terms of the colors. It was crazy because that was all a lot. Yeah, I was really surprised about the purple. I was pleased. But I like it. I was pleased

with Dreamfire's appearance. Not to be shallow about, like, my dragons. You know, what's on the inside counts, I guess, but. I saw people, like, say they didn't necessarily like her horn. and I haven't seen it made. The argument that I'm going to make is it's a crown.

She has a crown of horns. She literally has a crown. She's the queen, the mother of all dragons, and has the crown of horns. Yes, love. I liked it. I thought, because, like, I think this is not like a criticism or anything, but the colors of many of the dragons have kind of kept with the conventions from Game of Thrones, and they're more muted.

but they really turned up the saturation for Dreamfire, and I'm here for it. I loved that. Also, I learned that I can put the saturation up and the brightness up on my TV. So I did that last night for the episode, and that was crazy. So I don't know, maybe I experienced it five points better than you guys did, but can say it looked great. See, so you know what? But I've seen some great, also some lightened photos, because it still was really dark, honestly, in my opinion, which is okay.

And love Helena's riding leathers. They're styled after Renira's from season one when she goes and kills the boar with Kristen. It's very similar, the cutout and the design, except Helena's wearing green underneath the letters. So she's wearing that, like, teal green that her mother wears a lot more of, and you saw the younger boys in. So I thought that was interesting. And they did change, it seems. Well, okay, so who knows if that was actually Dreamfire that blew fire at Amand in season one when he was in the dragon pit. It was always kind of rumored or theorized that was Dreamfire being like, get the fuck away from me.

Yo, for real, go. Get the fuck away from her. But I really was actually pleased with the design. I think the scales were really beautiful and shining. The purple touches were nice and do set her apart from the other dragons, which all do look kind of like gray. blue some of them. I really rather like the design. And I also thought the saddle was really pretty. It almost looks like like petals or maybe like wings even. So kind of like bug wings or petals. I don't know. So I thought that was nice. I'd like to see a better look at the saddle because a lot of the other dragon saddles have come out in better detail in full HD. So I was actually, I will say,

very disappointed to get meta, there was really a lack of information and background like stuff on Dreamfire and the behind the scenes in both the cabana that the dragons created, as well as the after, little after interview, which is always a little more vanilla anyways. But then I realized why they were not detailed on Dreamfire. And that's because, Helena dies. Probably next episode, if not in the beginning of next season. But I'm going to say probably next episode. Yeah. And I do think that's part of like when they'll do the Dreamfire stuff as well as like, I feel like if they want to go into more depth on Dreamfires design, etc. It'll be next episode. That or during the Dragon Pit.

So, thank you. Yes, I realize those two things as well. So I can't complain. It was overall great. Also, she seems to be at the dragon pit, right? So again, to me, it read like yet another opportunity or yet another maybe example of an outcome, right? And like, if she had been at the dragon pit, at first it made me think of like Egan's coronation, right? And made me think of like when Mayleys was like bursting through. But then it made me realize, like, oh, is this the storming of the dragon pit? And is it her? the storming of the dragon pit to come and her being there, but she's not there because she... I wasn't sure if it was also like a...

It could go this way, right? Like, she could... This is a future that she could choose in the way that, like, you know, if she dies next episode, presumably, I guess, it's before the kid is born because... Mm-hmm. It hasn't been long enough for the entire period, like, so that that's one future that could come to pass, that this one is as well, in which... I agree.

Because she's wearing the same leather, as you pointed out, as Rainierra, like, the idea of her seizing being the queen. She has every right to do so as well in many ways. I like that interpretation, too. So, like, these were kind of how I saw it especially, like, in the context of Rainierra being like, did Amon ask you to ride with him? This is what it would have looked like. And then it also made me think of, though, when they were all situated at the dragon pit, all the people entering that she was about to, you know, Dracarus, and then she Dracarus, which also we got a whole lane of Dracarus. Thank you.

Thank you, everyone. I deserve that. It reminded me, though, speaking of Dracarus, of the DeNaris Dracarus chapter, when DeNaris has the dragon dream where she dreamed she's Rhaegar riding to the Trident, but she was mounted on a dragon, not on a horse. When she saw the usurper's rebel host across the river, they were armed. armored all in ice, but she bathed them in dragon fire and they melted away like dew and turned the trident into a torrent. So it made me think of that.

Yeah, I love that. Honestly, if I was Ryan Condal, which I'm not clearly, we would have had way more of this. We would have way more Helena dreams. We would have moments where Helena is like snapped out of fucking reality and we get like a quick tunnel into it. Like when they did brand visions, right? That's what this reminds me of. the brand visions that we randomly would get here and there.

Randomly. And I did like those. And I liked when they came back that one time, but only for like a little bit. I like visions. Yeah. I do. I wish they would do more of it. Like, I'm pro vision.

I think it's a great storytelling device. It's a great way to use some foreshadowing without forcing dialogue in some aspects, which, no offense, but pretty much all shows these days suck at dialogue. Like, it's tragic. a degradation in society. I have actually liked most of the dialogue of House of the Dragon. Every now and then some stuff jars me. Like the usage of the word scapegoat or like when Gwain talked about fawning.

I think those like took me out. I was like an actual, a psychological term. Like, I don't know. That took me out. But yeah, I do like a lot of the dialogue in this. And I'm kind of wondering is, Is your love of visions, like, rooted in, like, your love of the show heroes? My God, because to save the cheerleader means we would save the world. I'm just saying, does it go that deep, like, for you? Who knows?

I think it's more based on, like, my culture and that I have visions, so... I see. No, that's true. You do. You do. She has a vision. Yeah. I'm... I do. Unfortunately, like, I also am psyched. That's so blood-raven. It's a future I can see. That's so blood-raven. Shea used to have that as like her handle right on Twitter. Never forgot. Never forgot.

Shoutouts. Well, I ate good. Thanks for the Helena. You know, until next week, I'm going to be a blubbering mess. It'll be so sad for me. That's my baby girl. But whatever happens, happens. Oh, I really like that. What Renira said to Helena, actually, but Helena Renira stuff was really, really good. It was interesting.

Yeah. It was sandbox that, like, we've never really gotten and always wanted to know what would happen. So I was very excited to have it. And I liked that line that you may refuse me as your sister, but as your queen, I may compel you. Do you think that's how having dreams works, the dragon dreams? No, I don't. It's, I mean, we're told this, right? In a song of Vice and Fire, I can't choose what the five.

show me all the time, like I can ask. Yeah. And guess what? Do you think if you keep pushing somebody because they have these dreams that they can't control, what do you think will happen? Yeah, I think every single time I've seen a story or historically, like, have seen someone just you keep pushing them,

it absolutely turns out the way that the person pushing them wants it to go. Every single time. No, but, yeah. And also, like, I don't know, I did like that, change and I think an echo that you'll see throughout this entire episode because I do think that they are good at like themes and themes per episode is like do you not feel your dragon has changed you you have seven I love to that or like I was like six yeah I guess it is six because I was like no I got that number wrong she's like you have six and you don't think it's

changed you and I'm like that's real yeah damn she could have had seven but seven eight nine aka everyone ate sheep's healer. No, for real. Damn, I can't even. I don't want to get upset. Tumbledin. Tumbledin. Dude, I really liked this parallel

with the Kristen Gwain stuff where Kristen's talking about Gwain to Darren and he says he gave himself to the dust and then later Egan says then I'll die but not as a fugitive unknown covered in dust not with an arrow in my back or trapped like a fox in the hole

loved that connection. Yeah, I really loved that as well as like, I also like this like thematic through line between the brothers, right? Darren being like, what kind of king would just sort of would abandon his people and like not be there would not, you know, would just leave them to the dust like that? And arguably, Egan kind of did that with the one person who was willing to follow him. He was like, no, Thailand, like, he didn't run. He was like, you bold.

And we'll get there. But, like, he, he did something proactive. And I also, like, like, like this line. I have no, like, bigger thoughts about it yet. But from Darren of saying, I have no fear of insignificance. Which, as we can see, like, it's something that he, I guess, kind of shares with Helena. He longs. I lied.

I have thoughts about this. Darren has no fear of insignificance because he actually longs for it in a way that is different from the way that his siblings. grew up, right? His siblings have grown up with this, like, it's not a prophecy, but we're going to call it one to be dramatic. Like, this prophecy of you must be important, you must mean something you are a Targaryen. Everyone showers you all the time with attention here, and you must live up to that. You were around the king, your father. And Darren, on the other hand, has gotten very much attention, too much attention heaped upon him by Ormond and the people

of the high towers. And now all he actually longs for is, is. insignificance because that is where safety lies. Every single moment brings me closer to being sadder for Daron. Oh my God. This poor little guy, he, I was actually very moved by him being like, I don't want the crown. I want nothing to do with that. Like, I never have.

Oh, dang. In your words. Yeah. In Chloe's words. Oh, my God. Wayne Gretzky, Michael Scott. Yeah. I was very moved by his character in this, you know, skipping kind of towards the Corliss stuff.

However Mad Reneira made him, Corliss isn't playing this game with Ormond, and Ormond very much revealed, like, Darren doesn't quite get what the game is, but he also is like, something's up, and something's up with this guy because he's never this fucking happy. And it was a very interesting little dance they played at that. A lot chance. Question mark dinner. I see. Oh, the food. Did you see the food? Yeah.

Like the raw chicken? I was like, I don't know what's going on here. I thought I was like, is this like, is this like a version of duck breast? I wasn't sure what was happening. But that's a good point. What is up if it is raw chicken? I was like, wow. He's about to get that parasite.

I know, right? We're beyond diarrhea lettuce now. We're at salmonella. Salmonella chicken. Yeah, I like how also in this line you've referenced many things. You talked about the dance, a dance, papad dragons, as well as the game. It's the Game of Thrones, y'all. And I think there's a good mirror, though, between whatever's up with Corleys and what's

going on with Thailand, who do, like, they make it a lot further than y'all would think, but not you guys, because I assume you all know what happens in this story, because you're here and there are spoilers. And so, like, there's a mirror there in that Corley's, as you said, right, he's not up for it. He's going to stay loyal, especially because, like, and it makes sense to me. It could go with one way of, like, he wants revenge, but his wife died for this, right? His wife died for this cause. Like, he has to, I think, bear some loyalty for it. His family's in service to her. Like, he can't just back out his son's lives. Of them, too.

Yeah. His grandchildren. His grandchildren. His legacy. Yeah. And like, I think he's going to, I'm going to, I don't mean this for to be a pun, but I'm going to say it. He's going to go down with this ship, you know? And he will put his hands up and surrender.

He's not, like, not for this. And like, I think honor is all he has left. So he has to do that. And, like, Thailand even, you know, showing that same sort of loyalty to Egan, interestingly, which we'll dive into in a bit. But I was like, it's interesting. Yeah. Absa, absolutely.

I didn't think about that. But, you know, they are two people that very much suffer. They suffer. I mean, clearly, Corliss loses a finger. Thailand is going to lose some parts as well. He's going to lose a lot of various parts. Oh, yeah. the corliss thing also felt very

theon-y Oh, very fian. I do like that. Very fion. I do like that. Very fion. Al-Anon. Reminded me a bit of Davos as well. They're of the sea. Oh, yeah. He's also of the sea. So true. Yeah, very Davos fingers. Hashtag shout out. Hashtag shout out. Yeah. But also also like in the way that he's, you know, the sea-faring character that cheats on his wife.

hashtag shout out hashtag shout out very davos i also really liked the way this was shown on rewatch because you know you end the dinner with ormond with the butcher chop in his hand and then later the finger and like to me at first i was kind of like there's no way it's really his finger right are they sending davos's like davos's head style like are they sending someone else's finger with his ring but then like i'm like no he doesn't definitely did it because he smiles about the blade and then literally the next scene is Darren being like he was really fucking happy. That's interesting. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, I didn't doubt it was his finger because I was like, because for me, I thought we were taking the same beats with like again. No, absolutely. Makes sense. Yeah. Makes sense. Now I just wasn't there yet. But then after I rewatch, I was like, oh, yeah, duh.

It's right there. and then you can see in the trailer for next week. His hand is like wrapped up with blood on the wrap. So yeah, absolutely taking the RIC kind of side of things. Let's talk about someone else who's going through a little bit of a character change and not, you know, speaking of like Rik and Theon, this is not the same. That was a bad segue, but let's go with it. Yeah, so Alan's probably going to do something rash about his father, it seems, question mark.

Alan's going to go to Tumbledon? I, yeah, I guess so this is going to be like, I was going to say it's very rob-sark of him, but it's not. But, yeah, I think so. And I'm curious, like, how, I'm curious about what's going on with the Valerian family storyline. I am. It's, like, I know that people probably hate this part the most.

But I love, like, a dramatic soap opera romance, you know? And, like, this is not part of the romance. obviously, like the part about father. Oh, and we're getting it. But it is a little, because that's what makes Bela make out with him, you know? He's just like my granddaddy, but half not. He's just like my granddaddy. My, oh my God.

It is weird when you put it like that, because that's his dad. Miam. Hmm. And that is basically the male figure she has had in her life, considering her father has been No, she had her fiance, who isn't going to raise her, I guess. Oh, little baby meow, meow, okay. He's dead. Dead in the ground.

No, in the ground. Oh, wait. No, he wouldn't be. I mean, parts of him might be. Anyways, charred, you know? Chard. You know, like dust. Wow, talk about turn to dust.

Wait, I do think there's something intentional there. All right, let's go. I did think about his dark materials. Oh, I didn't mean that. I meant like, because you literally like, when you're burned as a dragon rider, right? And you're ash. That's literally what it is. Yeah, for real.

Yeah, exactly. That's what it means when he keeps saying, like, to become dust. Like, that's something that I really liked about that was, you know, Kristen kept saying till we become dust, till we become ash, but also till we become little particles floating around, right? Just like dust from his dark materials. Like, that's all we are. All Kristen wants is for his little ashes to mix with Allison's little ashes. And all Gwain wants is to mix his ash with Kristen's ash.

Wait. I guess. I think he also was just like, no, fuck this guy. I think, like, Gwain has higher standards maybe for his men. I don't know. He was literally distraught telling his fucking nephew about how he was in love. Were you not listening? I guess.

I think he, I saw it as sort of a bit of exasperation, but anyways, I just was like, him. I think that's just what I think. I'm like, when someone's like, I was into Christen call him? Yeah, that's fair, that's fair. And that's why I'm like, Gwynn, come on. We've all dated idiots. I mean, there were like two redeeming features. But Gwain did stand up.

That's why he left and why he's alive. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Because men's lives have me. meaning, not their deaths. Especially Gwen's. Speaking of men's lives that have meaning, and men's rights,

Ulf! Yo! Ulf! It was a little disjointed, but I really liked the exchange. It felt like we were missing a scene. I wonder if something got cut, you know, for time's sake. Of how he fucking got there? Yeah, well, me and my roommate were talking. Yeah, exactly, because like, Dennis Reynolds, I mean, Ormond is like, he like says it's like their second meeting, right? So Emmett was really upset.

My roommate was like, well, I want to see the fucking first meeting, the seduction. I don't want to see the agreement. Like it is kind of a cop out not getting the seduction first. But I do really love the exchange they had where they were like, Ormond was like, the laugh at you know more when they see you as you are, which I feel like has major hot deconotations, right? Like Reniro saying to Allison, now they see you as you are. That felt very reminiscent of that line.

And instead, Ulf says, no, they will burn, smiley face. Very fun. What a frame to close the fucking episode on. And having this read off of the sunfire scene with Tom, where Tom, with Tom, with Agen, played by Tom Glencarnie, where same character. Same character. Egan is just like walking around, stomping, being like, no one can fucking stop me, like, I am God. And then, Ulf, great, you're right, no one can stop me,

I am God. That is what I've been wanting to hear. Like, ha ha ha ha ha ha, uh-oh. He just wanted to be told, and that's what Ormond is doing, right? He's telling him, you are worthy. And- gassing him up. That's what Ray Niro wanted to hear that she was worthy. Everyone just wants to fucking here that they were worthy, right? And like, I think that, as you said, like, great continuation of those themes of like, this isn't, this is perfectly encapsulated of what it means for, like, the dragon to have changed you and like what you expect of yourself, what you expect to do to other people. And I think the way that, like, Tom Bennett, because there are a lot of

Tom's acts this, was so well done. Like, his smile is different. than this sort of like jovial smile that we've been seeing from Ulf. It is someone who is, it's a little more sinister. It's someone who's like, ha ha, I'm going to show them. And also another thing that I saw here is it makes me think of Tywin Lanister. Like this is the thing that drove Tywin Lanister. He hated. He hated that they laughed at his house and that his family.

So it's, you're getting that like that sort of element of the characterization. through Ulf and clearly a very different person from Tywin. Interesting the way you just put that. I love that because also it made me think of Taiwan in the way of how Ormond is employing Ulf and how Tywin would employ kind of like mad dogs and then write them off and Ulf feels very much like he and Ulf kind of feel like the Gregor Klugane kind of characters right like the people that Tywin was sending out to do the dirty work. So that kind of rang up out when you said that. Yeah, exactly, exactly, exactly. Yes, that's what they are in this story. Yeah. I'm curious to see how it'll go with Hugh,

but yeah, what the fuck did he meet Ulf before? And we didn't get to see it. Yeah, there's a couple of other... Silly. I feel like there's another beat in there too with not being laughed at. That ties into asswaf, but we'll come to it when we come to it. Let's talk about... Hell yeah. Let's talk about people on the side of the greens who did fail as we talk about who they fail to, which are the winter wolves and the toleys. Great little clip, just to see catch up.

You know, Kristen Cole's head on a spike. I'm happy. It took me a second. If it wasn't for the arrow, I don't know if I would have recognized him. People do look different when they're dead. life death lesson. Anyways, what this made me think of is the Asha fragment where they come across like some of the other like I guess Northmen. I'm going to spoil this. Like this is the point of our spoilers all podcast. Once upon a time, George foolishly, it actually was not foolishly. We're

just crazy as people on the internet. He very innocently shared an image of himself working on WordStar with, I don't know, the Colbert report. And then, and I say we, like, very literally, because I very much spent a large chunk of time trying to decode the Asha fragment. We don't know that it's an Asha chapter, but we know it's an Asha chapter. And the text that was on Georgia's screen, and you see, I believe it's a crow food umber. I should probably have reviewed this, but, like, his head is upon the spikes that they see. So I was like

I We don't know But You know We know We do know And it's like But we do know

Yeah It's um Yeah it's crow food um Yeah it's on the Yeah it's on the shaft of like I guess Some of There's some phrase who are there And they're brandishing it

And I mean like this is common We see throughout the entire story in the books Heads on Spike whatever, they do it. They do it with Ned. So it's probably not that, but that's what it made me think of. I loved it, though. It was a fun little beat. And they're all marching forward. You know, we did get a line to, just for timing purposes, that it took them a fortnight to march. It will take them a fortnight to march towards Tumpleton, right? Or took them a fortnight. So like, it's been a fortnight. Time's moving. Yeah, it is good because like pacing is always the question. So very curious. Not much

else for them, but next episode will be a big one, I imagine, as they get to Tumbledon, and we have a big all-out fight with everybody there, our Avengers portals scene. Yeah, that's true. Okay. Next time on the summer I turned pretty. Okay, but we were right. Yeah, I don't see why this is, like, surprising to anyone. Like, not the part about us being right, like, that it was the summer I turned pretty.

I love, but we were. Like, you were right that it's summer I turned pretty. I was right that it was going to turn into a triangle. just not in the order of the triangle, but this is much more angsty. I was surprised. Also, she's gonna feel really guilty now when Adam dies. As somebody that's been there, done that, boyfriends died, like, real guilty. I did, yeah, we were wrong in the order.

I did think it go a little different. And also, like, I stand by, I told my focus group, just one of them, my joke about uncles, and he told me I was very funny, and that it was a very good joke. And he told me, you are worthy of being very funny. funny. No, I'm joking. I was like laugh. I don't know, laugh for me. Laugh for me. But yeah, I, I don't know. Like, I know no one wants it, but I do. I think they should spend more time on this. It also makes sense as to like, I think it's fun. And also they should spend more time on, sorry, it makes sense. I was like thinking, why didn't, why wasn't Baila

part of the whole, like, we're looking into the Damon Sheeps, and it was like, oh, Doug, because that's her dad, and, like, she's going to be biased. So it makes sense that she brought Adam, that Rainier brought Adam with her. But it's cute that he really wanted to be, yeah, like, I think it's interesting also, like, the difference in that Allen doesn't really give a fuck that much to an extent about being legitimized, because he's like, I live with that disrespect my whole ass life. But Adam is now very motivated for it so that he can be. Oh, it's a little little fingery, but like, what if I liked Littlefinger, you know?

I definitely, okay, I could see that. I could see that. I did. I don't think it actually is, but. Yeah, I didn't take it that way, but I see what you mean. I didn't either. It was just an off-the-cuff, like, spitball in this moment of he wants to be, he wants to be legitimized so that he can be on equal enough footing to be like, Baila, let's go on a date. I also really respect that he's very savvy, right? But he like, you have Alan who's like not very ambitious when it comes to that.

And it's like, I don't really care. Like, you know, your name would be great, but, you know, it isn't everything. Like there are different things in this world that can make me happy. And Adam is like, oh, I was going to find a highborn lady. So I get legitimate. Like, I will be legitimized. I am not going out, not legitimized. I found that fascinating.

It really, they actually have had a really good dimension. understanding their characters or like giving them some character which I really respect so now I would like that for Bela she's starting to get some but I would like it to not just be about them yeah I think I guess it's interesting too when we talk about how a dragon changes you because what you said made me think is part of the reason that Adam now feels that he wants that last name the same reason that like you know both Ulf and Hugh felt very much robust when they're like what do you mean we're not Targaryens and it was a little I guess embarrassing for Adam

to like suffer that disrespect again, like in front of everyone of not getting the last name, not being recognized as a Valerian, and especially now that he has a very much trapping of power whereas Alan's like,

Daddy loves me and maybe that's all I care about. Yeah, maybe that is all he cares about is his family now. And also like, look at what Bala wants, right? Maybe maybe Bela wants

some sanity. Maybe she wants a little bit of that care. I mean, she's had a wild dating relationship with one dragon rider already who flew off the handle and went to his death. That's one way to put it. You know, I mean, it reminds me of Girls don't want mud, Barriston said. Maybe sometimes girls do

want mud. Yeah. I don't know, but Adam he wasn't like, he was like and then we'll fly away and I'll like protect you and whatever I'm like I'm just a soft I'm just soft for Adam, sorry y'all

never mind, ignore me I'm just biased Oh my gosh Well yeah, he's gonna die too So I mean So am I Yep, so am I Yeah

Let's talk about more death as we enter the veil the veil of death the valley of death more like the little death if you know what I mean when it comes to jessamine redford yes

I was like oh my god I used to us I knew I hoped that they were going to do it because like in my head I was like there's no way they could do all this other gay shit and not bring in the ultimate gay shit mother and also

literally the day before I told my roommate I'd be happy if we had seen her with her actual pets, not these dogs. And sure as fuck, there's her and her pet. Did feel, though, like, I was kind of surprised, Adrian Redford dies. And I don't know what their actual relation is,

but like when you're in a TV show like this and you have two randos that happen to be from the same house, usually they're connected. So that was interesting that we saw Adrian Redford's death. And then, like, we also see potential. I don't know if she was actually named Jessamine, but, like, should be Jessamine. Should be. She might be.

So, I don't know. Maybe relation later, like, maybe that'll come up somehow. Maybe Jane will say it in passing. Probably not, but. It's very possible that, like, that is Jessamine Redford. Like, I don't see why not. I think it has to be. Why they wouldn't just give that to us?

Yeah, I don't know. Like, you'd think that they'd be related. but sometimes I guess they're like whatever, because we haven't really touched that much on how Alice and Larry's are actually probably related. So whatever. Yeah. If you think about it. Yeah.

I was very pleased that this happened. Am I, like, settling for crumbs? I don't know. Because I also was like, we could end the series here. Like, we could end it there. Like, for some reason, that's all I really asked for. That and as you were talking about with Sabitha as well. Yes, yes.

Let's get that nice and happy too. Yes. Yeah, then I'm good. Then I'm good. That's fine. No, instead, we're going to go to this messy-ass scene. I don't feel like there's any other way to describe this other than messy ass. And I don't necessarily hate it.

I don't necessarily dislike it. I think it was a messy scene, and there are pieces of it I do like. However, we did get to see some dragons dancing. I was on the edge of my seat. I was going, what? What? And then I will say, I take tear up. I was upset.

I was actually physically upset. It was upsetting. In fact, it might be the first time since, Game of Thrones that I was like in shock for a moment thinking they were going to kill Syracs. I was like, what? I was a little worried about all that too and how that was going to go down. It is good that they were able to make me feel danger. You know, I think so too, actually.

Like, I actually was like, okay, stop your little fucking game. That was fucked up. Yeah. You have Thrones? Yeah, I felt very fucked up. I was like very mad for like a brief moment. I was like, no, they're not going to kill Cirox. X and I was also justifying to myself already, like, how I would deal with that if they did kill Syrax.

It was kind of a crazy psychological experiment. What they did to me is what I'm telling you. I was like, what? Why did my brain think that? It does give, in my opinion, a very good reason for Syrax to not do shit for the rest of the dance, which, like, honestly, in fire and blood, you do wonder why does Syrax not get repriments? as doing anything. Well, I guess now we have kind of a reason, huh? Because, ooh, sheepseeler got her ass. I was like, whack her again, sheepsealer, whack her again,

she deserves it. How could they do that to my friend sheepstealer? No, it was... I was crying. It was so, it was really, it was really sad. It was, um... They were mean. It was pretty devastating. And then also, like, even, even Raina having to, like, first makes the choice to abandon sheepsealer because she's like, I got to run away. Right? And then doing it twice. Yeah, well. Then the Sansa.

Yeah, and then like we're taking her here. Yeah, you have to come with us. Yeah, it was very Ned and Lady. And I just, I, if you all want me to, I guess, draw that line very explicitly, you know, the father having to put down, I guess, the bonded paired animal of his daughter. So I think. I thought that was really interesting. And then also, I wasn't sure

is Sheep Steeler dead, or is Sheep Steeler pooted away like the Aria and Nymeria? What do you think? I very much felt it was the Aria Numeria and like alternate ending Ned Lady that Damon, you know, couldn't do it, which I thought was very interesting. I actually felt

there was some Amin Vagar, like, the night when he lost his eye and how the kids attacked him. That's literally how I felt about sheepstealer. I'm not kidding. No, I think that's interesting. Especially because it's in reaction to write, like, Rana being like, that's supposed to be my dragon. Yeah, which happened, like, where they were like, you stole Vagar. Full circle. You stole Sheepstealer, you stole Vagar.

It doesn't work like that, yeah. I don't know how I overall, like, it. It's a fine scene. It was a little messy, like I said, but like, I see the outline. Like, we were discussing. I see the outline of what they're going for, but whatever they're doing on the inside, no fucking clue of that outline. Like, I don't know what's going down with the shading and the details. They're doing some weird shit, but I'm interested. I don't hate it. I don't love it. I think, right, like if Raina, the line, like, essentially kind of comes from her, right? Yeah. Like, later on, it...

Like Bela said, you will start anew. You will start a new, but also like we're talking about if it's like Net and Lady and then Sonsa becoming Queen in the North. Whoa. There. That's what I thought. That's what I thought. Like, is that what we're playing with? And you're so clever to see it.

Yeah. So I don't know. I'm just kind of curious about that. A different parallel. This is kind of, I guess, the opposite of a parallel. You, we were talking about Alicent and Amon, of course, at the beginning of this episode. And then you have this scene between Damon and Raina. And you can really see the contrast between these kinds of parents and how they care about their children in that.

Alicent won't deceive Rainira, right? But she's willing to do whatever it takes. She's willing to deceive her own children. child. She will betray her own child multiple times. Like, I mean, I'm sorry, but like trying to poison and kill your own son. That's a fucking betrayal, right? Whereas Damon, despite not really being there as well emotionally for Raina, cares about her so much as her father that he will, arguably does deceive Rainira on behalf of Raina. He tries to do everything he can to protect her. He's like, I never summoned them. I never told them. And he puts himself.

at risk. Self-fulfilling prophecy. Yeah. He puts himself at risk to protect his daughter. It is the opposite of what Allison is doing. And like, honestly, that's the very least he could do as a parent. Well, that, and I think he sees that. And again, it's kind of that atonement journey from last season in some aspects. And Damon is who Damon is at the end of the day. Like, he's not going to change who he is necessarily at his nature. He's very, um, in his ways. However, he feels this immense guilt, right? And I'm glad they're actually approaching that.

I'm glad that he, like he said to her earlier on, remember, I really liked hearing him say, like, did you know, like, I didn't have a dragon either? Yeah. Like, didn't you know, I didn't either. Which is funny because we had that scene where Bela and Reneira talk about it last season, about how he tried to take Maly's after his mother died.

and that he was rejected. So he had the same trajectory, really, that Raina had, right? Being rejected from dragons. And the mother's dragon. It was kind of painted it on purpose. Yeah. Yep. Exactly.

So there is something there to your point with that mother, especially with Damon, his mother, Amon, his mother, Haran Hall. There is something going on there in that parenting. And that's, I think, something that really came through very sadly. And MADARC, they did a great job acting it. That she really wasn't mad. she really wasn't freaking mad at um rena she was disappointed that damon was willing to lie to her over something like that and didn't believe that she would listen or like be amenable to it which to be

fair to be fair i don't know would she have been i don't know but that's what i took from it is all that she was more hurt and betrayed that someone that she thought loved her and trusted her implicitly did this. Hopefully, like, you know, my focus group never listens to this, but, like, I think I would have made the same decision as Damon. I would have made the exact same decision that he did. Like, you, you know, that's what I'm saying. Like, he put his child first and, like, that's, he's not the best parent, but, Honestly, he's kind of better than a lot of... Funny time to start, but...

Well, he's not... He's not the worst one, to be honest. Like, he's really not the worst one that we've seen in this series. He's actually, like, maybe even top, like, 50% of parents, and that shows how low the bar is. Not a great husband. No, but I think it was important to show, especially when you have them that same contrast,

like Ormond and Darren and Gwain and Darren, too. to look at the other siblings. Like, that makes sense. Yeah. I do feel terribly, like, sad for Raina. Sheepstealer's not dead, so that's going to come back in some way, shape, or form, and drive Reneera insane. Divorce art continues for them. Like, man, the papers will be served soon because she's going to find out sheepstealer's not dead.

Probably next season, and that's going to be fun. Yeah. Probably what sends him to Harren Hall. go fine and kill sheepstealer and Vagar. Okay. See you never. He's like, well, if I die killing Vagar, I don't got a, I don't got to kill sheep stealer. But you can kind of see in this scene, though, at least, like how Karexies would be able to put up a fight against Vagar.

They're two completely different styles of fighting. Like, sheep, sheep stealer is bigger than Krakis, right? And you can see that-Total DPS tank. Yeah. And like, Vigar is also. like a tank, right? Like, whereas Caraxis is absolutely like, we had never really seen Caraxe's fight in that way,

like a Dex build, like very precise in the way that Caraxies was able to take down sheepstealer by going for those like specific areas and targeting like those pressure points because of the length, because of his noodleness. Because the noodle neck, yeah. Yeah, it's very much. Also that like...

Dark sister, perfect pairing. As a person who's like... chancla. He was like beaten the shit out of a sheepstealer with the chancla. Yeah. I was like, oh, what is, don't hit him with the, don't hit him, leave him alone. When he got him out of the sky the first time, not when they were attacking him. Oh, so sad.

So sad. I love though. Like, Karexies, yeah, you can definitely see his movements being different. I like getting to see the different fighting styles going on with the dragons. Yeah. And also. I just remember sheepstealer also fighting to be like, no, Raina. Come back. Yeah. Well, you know, that's something I was going to comment on.

I don't always comment on the discourses. They're usually pretty beneath me, you know, because the only discourse that matters is this discourse between you and I. Low-key feel. There are no men like us, only us. And, you know, most importantly, though, the thing that I've been seeing a lot of people have been like, I hate Raina, or like, why would you choose to, well, that's what you get. Like, why would you choose that dragon, blah, blah. and it's really confusing to me for the people that still don't seem to understand that I don't think you choose a dragon. No.

I think you're lucky that the, like, the dragon chose her. The dragon chose her. It's the dragon and the, like, this magic, like, if you have not understood in House of the Dragon, that they are not controlling the magic. They are not controlling the dragons. The dragons are an illusion of their power, which they are losing beneath them bit by bit. and then when they take those symbols into battle, the magic is just fucking obliterated and wasted between it. Just like watching it ooze out and pour out like the blood from the dragons.

Like that's it. Like that was their power. And now it's gone. I'm going to say something like absolutely crazy here. Do it. Okay. Love is not always sweet and pure and kind. Okay.

Love is a poison sometimes. as Ceres has said, right? And... So you all say. And unfortunately, sometimes you don't choose who you love. Like, that's the thing. Like, she didn't choose this sheepstealer, dragon. They're pairing, their bond, it's love.

And love changes you. Same as how, like, also power can change you. All of these things change you. But it's harder when it's dragons. But, like, they had a bond. Like, it's not, she didn't choose this one. It's like, I don't know. Like, I just, I feel like that was obvious.

I thought that was obvious about how dragons worked, especially after the dragon pit scene. I don't know. Absolutely. But maybe not. But especially a why, a dragon that, like, even in book, Sheep Steeler was, like, born during Jehires' reign from an egg, and then no one ever bonded with Sheep Steeler.

So Sheep Steeler grew more and more and more, isolated and less amenable to man mounting him. So like what gives you the thought that any human being, even a Valerian, has some sort of power over sheepstealer? And the fact that Raina has a bond with sheepstealer, that is incredible when you think about it then. That's even more incredible. Like you can't just walk away from that kind of bond. That's what I don't understand. Like you, that's a part of you. You're a part of it. You can't just walk away from. it. How could you just throw rocks at it? How could they be so mean? I've promised myself I wasn't going to cry today in this episode, but honestly, it hurt me to watch that because that was her.

That's Raina. Like, that's her. She's inside that dragon too. Like, part of her soul is bonded inside of Sheepstealer and they were just like hitting him and attacking him, which is like her entire everything she's ever been upset about her entire life, right? Like, that they hate her and that they don't want her and that they want nothing to do with her. And then they did that to her dragon. And it's still, there's still a thing together. I'm going to say like something. And I think all of you already know this.

I love you sheepstealer. I think you all already kind of know this. But like I'm going to say it just to inflict maximum damage. It'd be like very controversial in my podcast. But like even if, even if part of Raina is not inside of sheepstealer. All right. I want you all to imagine. You don't have to actually imagine this because this is actually like very

fucked up thing I'm going to say. Someone takes like your dog or your cat and is just like kicking the shit out of them. Like would that not like be like incredibly painful? That would that would that would that would that would just destroy you. Like that's what they did. That's what they did. Even if she were, even if a part of her were not inside sheep stealer. No, sorry. Let's let's put that backwards. That's what they did to sheep stealer. They hurt rain. That's sheep stealers animal is rain. Yeah, sorry, my bad. Raina is sheepstealer's pet.

Actually, you have it backwards. Did I say that? Yeah. Oh, no. But also, like, to your point earlier, if Rayna were inside. Yeah. If Raina is the future, right? She's the hope.

She carries on some of the line. She absorbs that fucking, like, pain of this entire war in a lot of ways. she carries through she was the one that birthed the last dragon in book like even if she is this hope and representative of the future similar to Sansa like you had mentioned I mean

that they kick they kicked me at they kicked me at they kicked the hope for the future which is like the point of the show that they're like the only thing that the house of Gucci I mean the house of dragons did was like bring itself down right and that's what they did

they shot themselves their future Raina. They just shot her. Yeah. It was fucked up. So that's how I feel about the scene, actually. I'm glad we just did that. I was so sad.

It really did hurt my feelings. So you can see how I'm going to be next season. I know, right? Yeah, I did tell, like, because, you know, my focus group, very upset about this scene. He was like, I'm going to rage quit the show. and he was so upset about it and he was like but and he was like how could they do that he's like

it was so terrible it was heartbreaking and he's like I can't I was like you understand like what the outcome is for the rest of like the series right like he's but he was so upset he's like I how could they do that to the dragon how could they kill? I was like do you understand like what's

gonna happen like I feel like this isn't a spoiler because in Game of Thrones, you know, De Neres brings back the dragons. Why are there no dragons? Like, you understand the implications of the series, right? One of my ex-co-workers texted me today and was like, so wait, who rides Dreamfire later, like, after this generation? And I was like, whoop? I don't know how to answer that.

So I'm just going to be like, okay, I don't want to spoil this one for you because you're going to find out. Yeah. You'll find out soon. And that's all I said. I was like, guess what? No one, because they all die. That's really what I wanted to say.

I wanted to be like, no one. They literally all die. I was like, I think he knows. Like, I think like my partner knows, but I'm just like. But if you're not like. Thinking about it. If you haven't, if you're not thinking about it, you're not reading fire and blood. You're not thinking about like the past constantly.

You're just like, yeah, they had dragons and later we have it. You don't think about it often. I do find that fascinating. Like, it's something really fascinating. George has done. Like, it's not logical. And that's a sign of that the show actually is good, right? It's roping you into the drama so much that you're distracted from the fact that, like, they're all going to die. But yes, logically, they all die. Like, historically, they die. Yeah. So we're going to just do this like a million more times.

That's terrible. I really do hope we get some great, I think we have to get some really good closure for Raina, especially with that great, bittersweet scene between her and her sister, like where her sister, like we said, says, you'll start. a new. Because also, no, she won't. Like, her heart's broken. She can't just start a new. Well, guess what? Sheep Steelers still out there. So maybe she will get nettles and it. Yeah, they even did make a reference. Yeah, I was like, all right. Um, I don't know how I feel about it. They made a reference. They're like, um, amongst the nettles and the insert another thing here. I was like, okay.

That's fine. Whatever. It is what it is. Yeah. That is what it is. It is. Um, well, All right, somewhere in the Crownland, Sunfire wakes up. Hi. I mean, I like this. I like the scene. It's all fun. It's great.

I love it against Helena because Helena dreams and sees dream fire and then sunfire awakens and it's all, you know, the moon, the sun, the sun. So I like that. I don't even think about that. So true. And there's a lot of like the sun kind of happening in those scenes. Yeah. Even from the start of it.

And like, I will say, you know, before we get into the sunfire of it all and the Agen of it all, let's talk about some of the characters surrounding of I, here's another good observation for my focus group of when Lary's is like, I am piecing out Agin, he's kind of like doing so because now Agen's no longer following him, right? Like, Larry's is only bought in and is only here quote-unquote supporting Agin when Agen does whatever Larry's wants to do, right? But now that he doesn't want to. And I do think that this line that Larry's delivers was an interesting mirror to Rainira saying that she could compel Helena's queen. Larry says to Agen and to Thailand, like, if my king commanded me to stay, he'd have to stay. right? But I also think, like, I don't know, like, Larry's kind of as a point. Like, what's the

fucking point of him, like, being there to, like, go die in this, like, last stand? He can't fight. Like, that's just, what's the point in that other than, I guess, the whole loyalty aspect, which we see Thailand doing, right? Thailand, I think, it's seen as cowardice in that he last episode or the other episode where he would not say directly to Agin, that he thought that he was a terrible man, but I don't know if that's what it is, so much as like Thailand is in some ways kind of an idealist. Like, if he were truly like the bestest person, he would have, like, followed Rainierra probably initially and not Egan.

But I think he's an idealist that he doesn't want to say that Egan is a terrible person because he wants to try and acknowledge, I guess, maybe that complexity. That's why he stays here in his ideal. He's supposed to keep this value of loyalty. He's supposed to support it. He's supposed to like do all these things. And that's why he tries to live up to that in these moments. So it's not that he's a coward.

It's just that he doesn't want to write it off because he believes that someone could be better or something can be better. I don't know. No. I also see for Larry's especially like is a preservationist, right? Yeah. He preserves. He knows when to flee or when to flee. fight. He very much understands that if he stays, he's wasted for the future.

Agreed. Whereas Thailand has something to prove in some aspects, you know, kind of a failure on the gullet in some ways. I mean, for me, I'm like, good for you, but that's not how anyone else would see it. So in some ways, he sees this as a way to live up to it. Also, Egan's never fucking liked him. He's always had to try to like live doubly up for Egan. You know, he's going to probably lose body parts for having done that. I like that they open it up for him being taken or him being lost in this time. So we'll see how he gets back to King's Landing potentially from here. I'm very curious about that for Thailand.

Yeah. Agreed. And also, like, I think there were some, there were just, like, some fun, like, details, too in the way that they led up to this. Like, for example, when they're talking about Larry's, and Larry's is, like, reminds him he's like, I'm a cripple. like I have nothing to do here. And like, Egan understands that now very intimately.

He's like, yeah, okay, sure. And like he, when he dismounts from his horse, he does so because being on that horse all day in that way is very painful for him in his condition. And you see that in the way that it's acted in that when he dismounts, he makes a grunt of pain, right? And then he actually like stays on the ground like for a bit as they walk forward because and you can see what that takes from him. So I thought those were like some good details.

Yeah, I absolutely loved to, I mean, sorry, not to skip ahead, but Sunfire coming up, looking as fucking crazy as Egan looks now and deformed, disfigured and burnt and fucked up, and Egan just like cackling into the fucking night with Sunfire looming over his head. That was fun. That was a blast. That was a money shot right there. That was amazing. It was. Literally a blast. I think about him laughing. Did you see that tweet from at Aganism? No. I don't know what that is.

That was like two crazy bitches telling each other exactly. Oh my God. That was amazing. I can't wait to see more sunfire and Agon from this for sure. I agree. And also like, I like the detail of when. Agin says Dracari is and obviously reclaims essentially his kingship, his power in that moment. Thailand, it's meant to be

him ducking down under the fire, but I see it as him he's kneeling. He is bending his knee to his king as he does that. And then also I think it kind of bears out what we've been talking about. I was like, that look on Tom Glencarnie's face does not say

like, man who's changed for the better and has learned his lesson. it says, I'm now a man of action and the actions might not be good. And that's okay. We're okay with terrible actions now because also it was a certain freedom, right? Because now he's king in his own right in his own way. It's a perfect encapsulation of the dragons have changed you because like for two seconds there, you know you seem being like behold and he's being very heroic in this moment. etc. And like, did the dragon change him? Did he change the dragon summoning him by

finally he embraced his, that moment of like, it's me and like, you know, and switches immediately. He's like, oh, I got a dragon. He goes, Jacari's like, that's a big, like very obvious, this person is a changed by having a dragon. Yeah, that is how it's changed you. That's for sure, Egan. well you know what it was a little messy but not terrible for a penultimate episode I'm still open-minded my heart's open my soul's open and I'm ready for next week's finale yeah I can't tell like is my taste bad I don't know but I I'm like enjoying it but it was I liked the highs of this episode I think some of the highs like and like those beats were well done but previous episode and the pacing's, it's rough. It's a little rough for me, I will say. You know, there's, um,

what's that line that Allison had to Helena where she's like, finally I am as I am or whatever fucking free, basically when she's like, oh, I'm a free bitch now. That's how I feel. You know, I'm just having fun. I'm just here to have a good time and a bad time and to cry about sheepstealer. You know, I was here for sheepstealer and Dreamfire this week and, uh, that didn't disappoint. I mean, it did disappoint because I'm very upset. But you know what I mean. Yeah. I guess I should have brought this up earlier, but I didn't think too.

But yeah, I do feel like, I don't know. This is not a thing I should have ended the episode brought up. I do feel like Allison's storyline feels messy to me. It is, but, you know, there's not really much else for her to do, but be locked up. And I do like that they moved her away from Helena just for Helena to get some characterization. Yeah, that's true. So I'll take that.

Yeah. You're being so talented and positive about it. You know, I'll just take a trade-off. The one thing I will say is it's not nearly as consistent as the Game of Thrones subplots where you have a couple subplots you're following an episode. There's way too many, not consistent. The pacing's a little off.

But you know what? At least if I don't like something, there's like, three other scenes I will like. And that's okay. I'll take the good and the bad. I'll take the good and the bad. I agree with that. And then also, as we've said, like, I mean,

I do think there are themes. And like, I'll take it for that. Yeah. You know, it's a, it's a marathon, not a sprint. So we'll end this part of the marathon next week. We'll tell you more about our future plans. And thank you so much for listening. Make sure you're following us on a platform that you like to listen to your

podcasts on, whether that's Spotify or Apple, or maybe it's Podbean or Patreon, where you can also find us, Patreon.com slash Girls Gone Cannon, C-A-N-O-N, where we have more perks for patrons. Indeed. As always, I've been one of your hosts, Chloe. And I've been another one of your hosts, Eliana. I'm not like Helena. I haven't looked into the, yeah, I haven't looked into the future when you said our future plans. It's like, holy shit, we have to like do something else.

We have to think about a different thing. I haven't thought about this whole transition yet. Well, get ready. Wow. All right. Goodbye. Bye.