Girls Gotta Eat - How Can I Make Him Commit?

Episode Date: December 17, 2018

Ahhh the age old question -- How can I get this guy to commit to me/be my boyfriend/stop sleeping with other women/marry and impregnate me? We tackle it from all angles -- tough love to techniques to last ditch efforts. We also recap Rayna's Mexico trip/plague, Ashley's new international man, and introduce a hilarious (and inspiring?) new game: PSYCHO or POWER MOVE. Enjoy! Follow us on Instagram @GirlsGottaEatPodcast, Twitter @Girls_GottaEat, and check our website for show dates and merchandise. Thank you to our partners for supporting Girls Gotta Eat: Fabletics: Get two pairs of leggings for only $24 by visiting Fabletics.com/gge. Scentbird: Go to scentbird.com/gge and use code GGE for 50% off your first month. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Do not ever, I feel like we're like, this is a huge tactic. Do not attempt it until you're ready. But you can. You have to be serious. You have to be ready. Like, you guys, don't even try it if you're not ready to be without the person. Don't even fucking try it. Back to another episode of Girls Gotta Eat.

Welcome back. You're especially cute on that one. Look at you drawing it out like an aquapella singer. That's me. Just sitting on the couch, petting my dog, living the dream. I'm all sick. But we miss Paul. People are obsessed with Paul.

I'm obsessed with Paul. Okay, stop. We can't talk about Paul too much because people are like won him on an episode. You guys are always asking for podcast recommendations. So if you have finished listening to ours every single episode. Twice. We do have another recommendation for you. You guys know that I'm like so obsessed with like murder and crime and cults and com.

That's my dating profile. Interest include. Murder and calls and come. Anyways, I wanted to suggest a show to you guys. It's called hostage. We're both fans of it. You want to talk about it a little bit? Yeah.

Well, and first of all, like, we kind of discovered this whole podcast network of murder, crime stuff. They have one called Calds, which Raina's been binging. No shocker there. But Raina's really into Colts. I'm really into hostage. I don't know why. I guess I just want someone to, like, love me enough to kidnap me.

I'm kidding. So that was funny. I know you took a sip of water so I didn't get the laugh I expected. It's fine. Yeah, you guys, this episode, literally the straight of the title of this podcast is called hostage. And it examines all the ins and outs of a hostage situation. So like the FBI, their crisis negotiation unit, world governments, even the hostages parents, they highlight the moments where everything went tragically wrong.

And also the techniques that save these lives of these hostages. So we really like this. Again, like this is a really cool podcast network. It's called PARCAST. But if you guys want to check out hostage, you can check out this three-part episode on the Hearst Kidnapping right now and look for upcoming episodes on the Iranian hostage crisis. Are you excited?

Did you just like you're getting excited? Yeah, I really like crime stuff. I watch a lot of like documentaries on CNN about that. I know. There's a really good Patty Hearst documentary series also on CNN. Yes. Check out hostage. New episodes come out every Thursday.

Visit Apple Podcast. or wherever you listen to a podcast and search for hostage. If you can't spell hostage, H-O-S-T-A-G-E, or you can visit P-R-C-C-A-G-E, to start listening right now. Parcast is P-A-R-C-A-S-T-com.

Hostage, and we're really, we're only planning to plug hostage, but also cults. Join a cult maybe. I feel like cults, too. It's just like, it's so interesting to me how seemingly normal people and up in a cult.

Like, is it going to happen to me? someday. If you're lucky, it's your one dream. All they do is fuck and smoke weed. It's like all they do. Okay, but honestly, let's be real. If we have to do this podcast for a long, for years, which we plan on it, this is a long-term life goal. We're going to need more content, which means you are going to have to join a call just for the stories. Like every time I'm like in a horrible situation, like a terrible date, but you're like, I don't understand why you stayed. I stayed for work. Right. I have to do stuff for work. Yeah. So like, I don't know. Probably like, you're like 20, 21 is going to be your year, like when you join a cult.

Don't you feel like you feel the vibe? A real one or like Scientology? No, a real one. Like the kinds is like sex and drugs and the cool fun stuff. Yeah, the cool, cool, cool. Scientology. It's not a regular cult. It's a cool cult.

I'm going to join the Amy Poller of cults. I'm not a regular cult. I'm a cool cult. Anyways, some updates on us guys. Live shows. You can still get stuff for Vancouver and Chicago. I think you can still get a little VIP for LA. That's it.

We'll get some other stuff coming up. Stay tuned. Check our website for all that stuff. And more shows to be announced soon. We're going to try to run through our updates really quickly to keep them short. Merch, shop it as much as you want. Obviously, deadlines for Christmas are long gone. But we still have cute stuff that you guys are going to want for the new year.

Patreon is up three episodes up. I think they're great. But yeah, the last one, like, We answered some really, oh, the last one we talked about what we were like in our 20s. So if you want to hear it. Spoiler, drunk sluts. Like the drunkenest sluts on earth. So if you want to listen to that, people are always like, wow, you guys seem like you really

have it together. We want to just let you know that we didn't. Head over there, patreon.com slash girls got to eat. Just a couple bucks a month. We do extra episodes there. So yeah, you guys can check that out. I think that's all. I haven't like really like browbeaten you guys into leaving ratings on iTunes lately.

So please do that and tell all your friends. Yeah. Subscribe break, review. Okay, we're done with updates. Yeah. All right. Well, a little update in our lives. I just got back from Mexico City.

Okay. You got very sick. I'm not okay. You're just now coming around. We were like, you were sick for like three days. I was really, Mexico City was great. I had a lot of fun. Yeah, tell him about the trip.

It was fun. I was there with a guy friend of mine. Got a lot of messages about like, is that my new man? No, he's gay. He doesn't swing for my team. Spent a lot of time on Grindr. He spent a lot of time on Grindrinder. an inordinate amount of time on Grindr.

But we stayed at the St. Regis. It was one of the nicest hotels I've ever stayed at. It's incredibly inexpensive. Apparently of that portfolio of hotels, like that five-star portfolio, it's the cheapest one in their entire portfolio, the one of Mexico City. Yeah.

So it was like a very high-end luxury resort. It was $240 a night. Right. And that's like, I mean, go there and ball out. Like when I were still, we're going there, I'm going there in a few weeks from going there over New Year's right after Christmas. and I looked at the price on our Airbnb.

I thought it was a typo. You know, it's like a nice Airbnb with a patio and like two bedrooms, like 80 bucks a night or something. And the nicest neighborhood of Mexico City. Right, yes. And also, like, we wanted to try a bunch of food. And so, like, every restaurant we went to, we ordered, like, four dishes because, like, I'm not being,

like, everything is a couple bucks. Like, it's really, really inexpensive. So I did get the plague the minute I got back. Well, actually, on the way down there, I met a nice guy. Oh, God. Okay, yes, we got to back up. On the plane down there, there was like this guy sleeping in the middle seat next to me. And I was like, I don't know.

You jerked him off in asleep. Just a little bit. Not to completion. You were like, I'm sorry, I'm on ambient. Okay. I'm a lady, okay? I'm sorry. That was so fucked up.

That's like if a guy did that, it would be like we would burn him at the stake. There was no molestation that happened. But like, I feel like we broached a lot of topics. I wouldn't talk about the stranger just because we were at a high altitude or something. Like, also... She goes down on an airplane, I feel like. You, like, weirdly bond with somebody, like, strangers. Right, because you're never going to see them again.

Yeah, well, probably. You would like to. Maybe. I think he just DM'd you. Like, what, I mean... Yeah, to say something is super plutonic, and he's a doctor, he was just checking on how I felt. That's what it was. Okay, keep going to.

I've been sick all week, and he's been like, take pediolite, make sure I'm like, okay. I said to take pediolite. You're like you're the only person who knows about pedolite. You're like, I own pediolite. I'm a doctor. Well, I know you had your medical degree also. Pedialite. Oh, my God.

Yeah, anyways, he was cute. He lives in New York. Maybe he'll call me. Probably he won't. He'll probably just straight me along and orbit me for a few weeks and then I'll get tired of it. I'm upset because he was there with a hot friend and I was not there. Literally.

And the friend was tall too. Like, I met the friend. And you know what a good friend I am. I'm at the hot, tall friend, and I was like, Ashley, you should fuck this guy. Okay. Also, when you told me about this guy, the friend that was with the doctor, you know, the first thing out of your mouth of what you said to me was he was wearing joggers. Because I feel like he was a great dick outline. Like you know me so well.

Like Raina goes, he's wearing joggers. And I was like, oh, black joggers. They were nice. He had like a nice swagger. I love a guy in joggers. Me too. Like a guy in a nice capri. He had like a nice jogger capri.

He had like a nice jogger capri. A little ankle action. Anyways. I got back and like the minute, I think like 10 p.m. But wait, hold on. So you guys, you just kind of stayed in touch. Nothing really happened in Mexico. He was like just doing a different type of trip than you. Yeah. Right. Wanted to be in like five star 15 course meals every day. Right. I decided to eat street food every single day, which apparently was a mistake. Oh, guys. I landed at like 8 p.m. on Monday night. And I, this is Thursday. This is first time I've left the house. I know. The reason why I couldn't leave the house is because I haven't been able to do stuff.

shitting my pants for one second. Oh my God. Let me tell you, you haven't lived until you get out of bed because you think you're going to throw up. You can't make it through the living room. So you have to pick up a Tupperware container to vomit in. And the pressure causes you to shit your pants standing up in your living room. I, well, I have had it.

I've had the Mexico sickness. What is the name? It's Bonnezuma's revenge. Monizuma's Revenge. It's like Traveler's Diary or whatever. It's a parasite. I had this. Kate got married in Tulum a few years ago.

And it was a small, awesome wedding, like 40, 50 people. And half of us got this wedding night. So. A wedding night? After the party? Right. Yeah. Like, everyone was okay at the reception.

It was something obviously that happened to dinner. You know, Touloum is like, it's this hot spot, but it's a little, it's underdeveloped. It is underdeveloped. you know, the electricity and everything. So no big surprise that like something got in the water, like whatever. And like, you know, lettuce is washed in their water, like whatever it is. So I got it like middle of the night, like 3 a.m. And just started like shitting and puking until I was able to make my flight the next day.

It was like really like only like 12 hours. Kate got it on her wedding night. And she was like sitting on the toilet throwing up into a bucket on her wedding night. Oh my God. And her new husband did not get it. So he was just walking around the resort, all boned up, trying to fuck his wife on their wedding night and could not. Like, he comes to breakfast the next morning. We were like, what's going on?

And I mean, can you, God, your wedding night? Oh, my God. I mean, it's such an, if the other day when I was simultaneously chitting and vomiting into a tubular container at the same time, if that was my wedding, this is the lowest day of my life. All I kept thinking, my number one thought was, thank God I live alone. Yes. Like, thank God my husband isn't here with me. And everybody, I remember going at mine, I didn't get it as bad. And we stayed at this place called Casa Vela.

She had this sweet overlooking the ocean. And I go into check on her and we're both like laying there like best friend puking. You know, like we're laying there and this like guy. Everybody wanted to come say hi to her. She's the bride. And this guy came in. He was like, hey, just come in to say hi. And she's like, you need to leave.

Like she said, you need to leave. And I was like, get out of here. She went straight to the bathroom. It was so bad. I never knew this story. This is a crazy story. First day of marriage. Marriage is going well.

No, they're amazing. But we just always laugh because we joke about her husband just being like, would love to fuck my wife. Really would love to do that. And you're the least sex that you've ever been. She was like, please keep him out of here. Well, I did read. I literally couldn't do anything besides sit on a toilet.

I did read the 50%, almost 50% of travelers come back and get sick. Yeah. I mean, here's a deal. Like, it's not going to kill you, but you can avoid it by just going to like a Marriott. You know, like, I've been to Mexico twice and nobody got sick. Like when you're on those resorts, like my other best friend got married at like an all-inclusive the following year, nobody got sick because like they have their own water filtration system. And like when I've stayed at the Cancun Marriott, nobody gets sick.

Same. Like, but when you venture out, which is cool to do, Touloum's incredible. But you're at risk. Last year, last week, you guys. mentioned a date. I was excited to go on. Clearly, that didn't happen because the New York dating scene is so dismal. We rescheduled, which means it'll never happen. But I feel like I'm just going to date only in our cities where we do our tour dates. So if you want to boot up bumble for me in Boston, let me know. I really do the Boston will be great. Do the Katie Storino method. Yes. DC or Chicago.

I'll date in any of those cities. Right. So that's my new method and also Saskatchewan. Is that a That exists? It's in Canada. I didn't know that was a place. I got a message from a guy in Saskatchewan. I've been getting a lot of DM slides. I may not be like killing the dating scene in New York, but I've been getting a lot of DM slides. You're killing dating seats everywhere else in Saskatchewan? Yes, I am kill. I'm a 10 in Saskatchewan. Okay. Some guy DM'd me and said, you're too perfect. Your podcast is definitely one of my favorites, even though I'm a dude from the middle of nowhere in Saskatchewan. I have been listening to your podcast for almost a year now.

Listening for a while, just never chimed up, but I can't hold back anymore. Every time I see your face sneaking through my stories and my feed, I wish I could just come to Vancouver, but that's just a tad bit far for me. Love what you're doing. Keep it up. Be yourself.

Never change. I love you, Ash. Are you going to live there now? Did you Google where a Saskatchewan is? I googled it. There is a town in Saskatchewan. called Moose Jaw. That town fucks.

You guys get married. A small little town called Moose Jaw. Not to be confused with Moose Knuckle. Am I right, honey? Like, I have a boyfriend there. He loves you. He said, I love you. How soon is too soon.

Anyway, guys, after Vancouver, we might be making another pit stop. Sorry, Toronto. We're going to Saskatchewa. Okay, but maybe you're not going to get married this year, and maybe you'll get married at the beginning of next year. In Moose Jaw. You guys are all invited to our live show, to our live show slash my wedding in Moose Jaw in 2019. Guys, we're going to get into our topic today.

Serious, good serious. We're going to get serious. And then we're going to end it with our new game. We are so excited. But we've been getting a lot of this, like, one very specific type of email. And I just have been like done. to address it. We get emails so much from girls being like, I like this guy and I would see him for a long time. And, you know, I've met all of his friends. I've met his family. And it's like we're

dating and we sleep together all the time. But like he won't commit to me. And now I don't know what to do. And like it's the number one like issue I think that we'll get emails about currently. And like, I just want to like address that stuff. And I think that probably we're talking about people in like the three to five month range, but also when somebody won't really make a commitment several years in and how to deal with that. But I think a lot of people are dealing with this quasi in-between phase. Right. And we certainly have too. Yeah. I mean, I was reflecting on all my past relationships and anything that was ever at this point of like, I don't know how this guy feels about me. I want him to commit. I want to be a boyfriend, girlfriend, girlfriend, hasn't

worked out. I don't think it's a good sign, to be honest. And we're going to get into this and we're going to give tips and tactics and maneuvers to attempt to get somebody you want to be with, to get on the same page with you. But I just want to say up top that I think the ultimate goal and what I want every person listening to this to feel is that feeling of being with somebody and liking them and they like you back the same amount and you really like each other and you're committed to each other and no one wants to date anybody else and you're sleeping with each other and you, this guy wants you to be his girlfriend and they want to be in a committed relationship with you. And I've had that and you've had that. That's just what everybody should want. And

when girls immediately kind of do this like, we've been dating for a few months and he won't commit and I want to be with him, I'm kind of like, I'm like, I don't know if it's the right thing. Well, the number one, I mean, obviously the ask in all these emails is how do I get him to commit? like, yeah, we'll talk about this more, but like, the short and sweet answer is, you don't. Right. If somebody is not, if it's not easy, if it's not like going the way that you want to go, the person hasn't like seen all these great things you're doing for them and committed, you're not going to convince somebody to change.

You should never have to, the takeaway at the end of the day, you should never have to convince somebody to be with you, especially not a woman convincing a man to be with her. Right. And the answer is not, the answer is not do more, accept less, try a hard, give him more, fuck him more, give him more dinners that you cook it. That's not the answer. Actually, the answer is the opposite. Exactly.

This is such a realistic thing that every single person, no matter how dynamic and smart, like I look at girls that I think are friends of mine and me and you, people that I think are the most dynamic, beautiful, smart, interesting, fun, except all the things. And I see them as this like beautiful little like microchip. and they meet this one fucking person and this tiny grade of sand destroys the microchip.

Yeah. And I don't understand it. And I look at these situations, like, why are you letting this person do this to you? But in reality, we all let people do this to us. There's nothing to be ashamed of. Like, I think I'm a pretty great person. I've let people just destroy me and stream me along forever.

Yeah. And, you know, if I could change something, you know, hopefully what people take from this podcast is us being like, you know what, I try this thing. didn't work and here's what I might have done differently. And like, I, looking back, like, I just would have done less and tried less hard and made myself less available because, like, once you give it all up, you can't take it back.

You can't take it back. Exactly. And we're going to get to that. And like, I just want to say, I don't want this to seem super negative and super pessimistic. It's because we want you guys to all feel the feeling of what everyone should feel of, like, this person's into me. As much as I'm into them, there's nothing that feels better. Nothing.

Like, it doesn't happen a lot. It's super rare when you're like, God, I'm so into this. guy and oh my god he likes me the same amount back and oh my gosh she wants us to be boyfriend girlfriend and whatever it is and eventually like oh my gosh this person wants to marry me and all these things like everyone should want that and if you aren't getting that I'm not saying to walk away right away and I'm going to get into the situations where it worked where like the guy was noncommittal and they're married now it can happen but there's I think a certain thing that also has to happen that we're going to get into that we're going to kind of take this like along the stages of a

relationship in that type of order but I don't know like we talked to we talked to a lot about this with Lindsay Metzler on the, we met an Acme episode of like, when a guy wants to commit to you, he's going to commit to you. And before that happens, live your life. Right. 100%. Like the answer is not like, I just this one email keeps coming to my number. She's like, I met all of his friends and his family and we do all these things together. We plan trips together. We act like we're boyfriend and girlfriend. You're not his girlfriend. Right. Don't act like you're his girlfriend. Right. And so let's, we want to get to that and get like you just said, like once you've done these things, you can't take them back. But I think I kind of want to stoke. I think I kind of want to

start with first before you're like, I'm going to freak out and ask this guy, what are we? God forbid. But like, please don't do it. But like, ask yourself, like, what you want and if you are rushing this. That's the first thing. Are these feelings valid? Are, yes. And all your feelings are valid. We will validate you what guys all forever. But like, you know, we're not trying to unvalidate you. But let's just be real here. And I want to bring it back on me because I don't want to act like we're insulting anybody. When I was 25, I wanted a boyfriend so. badly, like so bad. Like I just had some like, whatever job at a PR company. I didn't have all this going on. I just wanted a boyfriend. And I think that I would rush things and try to make things

happen non-organically. And I remember dating this guy and we went out on a first date. We really liked each other. We spent the entire day together. And then, you know, we were kind of texting the next day and then we hung out the next day. You know, and like I probably shouldn't have like invited him over. We didn't have sex or anything, but he came over. We hung out. And then I think we went out later that week, I brought him to an event because I wanted to show off how cool I was, whatever. Like, I just did everything wrong. And I swear to God, I think I went on three dates with this guy and thought he was my boyfriend, like wanted him to be my boyfriend. Like, I remember getting like upset that he didn't want to come out with me this one night and like meet my friends,

like a week in. And I know this sounds crazy and especially sounds crazy coming from me now because of what the way I am now. But I remember that feeling of just you want it so bad. And like, that's what makes you come across needy and come. across that you are going to be demanding and then you're asking too much and you're not somebody that a guy is going to want to commit to and I was guilty of it. But it's like, it's not your fault. I understand being like, okay, I don't like people that often and I met this person and they're fun and cool and I like hanging out of them and we vibe and how could they not feel the exact same way? And like, it's normal to be like, this is fun and you should be

allowed to enjoy things and not think so far into it. But like, yes, I mean, meeting the friends and all these things is a little soon. And so when I say like you're, Are these feelings valid? I just mean, like, is it too soon to have these expectations of the person? Exactly. Like, are your expectations in line with, like, the timeline? You know what I mean? Like, I think that I was also, I mean, at that point, I was probably dealing with, like,

I don't know, my second or third DUI. I was a little fragile. And, like, I met this guy that I wanted to spend time with. And my friends were pairing up. And I just, like, don't be, like, 25-year-old Ashley. You know, like, don't be three dates in with a guy and wondering why he's not acting like your boyfriend. And I think that's the first step is, like, take a second,

take a pause and be like, do I need to just relax for a minute? You know what I mean? Yeah. And look, falling in love is so exciting and finding somebody you really like, you know, I'm like you. I don't meet people like all the time that I'm so crazy about. So it's so exciting when you meet somebody and you're like really excited about them and it's rare. And of course, you start thinking like down the road like, could we have this future? And like, that's just like a normal silly girl thing to do. Of course. We've done it. We've all done it. But like you've got to pump the brakes. You've got to like internally just be like, we are not there yet. It has been a few dates. Even if you feel like you've displeased.

discussed everything deep and important under the sun. Like, you don't really know this person. Right. And do not make them your priority. Like, that's a thing. What I just, if I, not that I want to go back and change this. I mean, I did that for a reason. I lived that life. And, you know, my main thing I think in the cases like this is like your best things that you can do are relax, be patient, not forever. We'll get to that. And just live your life. Like, that's where everything goes wrong. And every guy that's ever fallen for me was the guy that I was like a little eh at the beginning and wasn't giving them all my attention and wasn't prioritizing them and wasn't falling head over heels for them. Because at the end of the day, we talked about this in the

Mashmaker episode. It is this hunter-gather bullshit. Like, guys are going to need to chase you a little bit. So we're not ever telling you to play games. We're not ever telling you to like, ignore him and do this and do that. Live your life. Just make, don't wait for him to make plans. Don't wait on them. Don't prioritize someone that's not prioritizing you. Right. Like, I'm so big on like my quality times, my love language. I'm like, why? am I prioritizing quality time with this person who has yet to do the same for me? I agree. And look, in the beginning, it's fine to, like, not get everything from a person.

They shouldn't see you every day in the beginning. They shouldn't be texting you every second. Like, just relax. Yes. And, like, especially if you guys in your 20s, like, you have so much time. Yeah, but I think that, like, when I start to get anxious Nancy is that, like, three to five month period, We're like even the most confident of people in the world are like, okay, what are we doing here?

Are we going to stop sleeping with other people for a little while? Like, what's going on? I have a right to know if you're dating other people, if we're exclusive, if there is a commitment. Like, I think there's nothing wrong with feeling that anxiety, like, you know, edging on like four months, five months. And really just want to know, like, take the temperature and like what else is going on?

And I think that a lot of people just fall into this situation where like you've been doing all these things like you're a couple, but you're not a couple. Right. So don't do them. Like, I think, I feel like we got an email somewhere along the lines that was like, well, he's like, we spend there almost every night together. Why the fuck are you doing that?

Send him home or you go home. You're not, if you're, if you guys are not committed, why are you basically living together? Like, just make other plans. Do other shit. Tell him you need to leave. Ask, tell him he needs to leave. You have an early morning. Like, don't do these things.

And I think we will get to the point in this episode of like, okay, you've done all this stuff. You can't take it back. here's a maneuver that you can do. But like, just to be proactive, just don't give all these things to this person. Don't give all the benefits of a relationship before you're in a relationship.

If you want a relationship. I had a girlfriend that she was like, before I'm committed to somebody, I won't make their bed in the morning and I won't cook for them. She was like, that is something that I reserve. These like little nice, like gestures, like my love language is like,

acts of service. I won't do those things for somebody unless I've been a relationship. And like, even things like, yeah, showing up to their family. families, whatever, holiday parties. Like, just don't do it. Right.

I don't know. And like, if you start to feel like, and every normal, rational, sane person, I totally understand four or five months in, wants to have the talk. And you can't expect people to be a mind reader, not men are not mind. Men are stupid.

Men are not mind readers. Stupid and lazy. I'll get to that a minute. You can't expect your party to be a mind reader. So if you've never expressed that what you're interested in is a long-term partnership or even a short-term partnership, but a committed exclusive one. And you are certainly entitled to say that. And it's important to communicate that because maybe they don't know. I mean, all men know that all women want that. But, you know,

maybe they don't realize that that's what you want. And you should have that talk because they're not supposed to be expected to just figure out what you feel. I just strongly believe that most men, again, we cannot ever speak for all people. Most men need to feel like they have a reason to keep you around. And like, if they don't feel that, why would they try to lock you down? Why would they ask you to be exclusive? Why would they commit to you? If they don't feel like they need to, if you're already acting like you're their girlfriend, you're having sex with them and doing all these things and you're super available to them at all times, why would they ever ask you to be girlfriend boyfriend? Well, think about it in reverse. Let's take like the gender rolls out,

like just I'm me as a person. If somebody is just available to me all the time, I can fuck them whenever I want, they'll pay for stuff whenever I feel like it. And they're just going to like, be my beck and call person. And they ask nothing of me. I'm never going to give them anything. I probably, I'm not a cruel person, so I wouldn't take advantage of a person like that. Yeah.

But like I can see most people falling down that path. Right. They ask nothing of me. So why would I give them anything? Right. Okay, let's get back to it. You were just starting to talk about sex. And I love this because I think that that is,

we both have a lot of feelings about, holding on sex card. Okay. Okay. So if you want to be in a relationship, like you want a boyfriend, you want a boyfriend, you want to commit a relationship. We've said this a million times. We don't need to say it. I mean, we can say it again. Don't have sex until you feel like they really like you and are somewhat committed to you. It's the last card you can hold on to. And you can, you don't have to rush it. We talked about this on the Nikki Glazer episode. Like, don't do it until you feel super ready. But like, have sex with whoever you want. Have sex with somebody right now. tonight, do what you live your truth.

But if you want a boyfriend and you're starting to date somebody, don't have sex to them right away. Like, duh. I, uh, I feel like I want to give like a little timeline of my last relationship that was great until it wasn't. But we waited to have sex. It was more because of him, which is, whatever, it was just cute. So I think he really liked me and whatever. You didn't want to rush into it.

We had, we had sex like, like a month in. Oh, my God, really? Yeah. three weeks to a month in, we'd hung out a ton. Like, I couldn't even, like, we were hanging out all the time. We just didn't have sex. It was kind of nice. We just, like, it was kind of off the table until we really felt like we were in it. And I remember when we did it, we were not, like, boyfriend, girlfriend, but like we were. Like, I felt like, this guy really isn't to me and we're going to have sex. And I think, yeah, the time, a week or two later, we went on this trip and we decided we were

boyfriend girlfriend. And I've talked to this before. It was just a very casual, like, of course, we're committed. We're, like, on a trip together. You know, like, it was like, he was like a weak boyfriend girlfriend. I was like yeah, and that was it. Like it was like, duh. I already felt that. I already knew. And then maybe, I don't know, week or two weeks after that, we like said, I love you. I mean, this is, I just like to give a timeline because it was no problem for me to wait to have sex three weeks to a month of this guy. He will wait. I'll wait. I've never ever, I've tons of guy friends. I have never heard a guy say that he stopped talking to a girl. Yeah. Because she wouldn't sleep with him. Right. Never in history. I've actually heard the

opposite. All the guys we've had on the show have been like, like she just dodged me and dodged me and dodged me and now we're obsessed with each other. I mean, every other guy is like, I don't know, she had sex with me on the first date. Like, I don't know that I need to go back for anything else because they don't know. Look, again, have sex with anybody you want. Somebody doesn't respect you for that, then fuck that person. Right. But like, if somebody sleeps you on a first date, it doesn't call you.

Like, you know why because they got what they wanted out of the experience. They don't look at you as a person. They don't value you as a human. Right. And like, fuck that person. Right. But like if you really want to be in a relationship with somebody, then you, that's your trump card.

You hold it. Yes. And I mean, why not, if you're like, if you really are like, I'm waiting to have sex till this person and I are in a committed relationship, we have a title, whatever you need to feel that way, you can tell them, hey, you know, I'm just not really having casual sex. You know, I kind of want to know that I'm in it with some guy. What guy isn't going to respect that?

Because what, they don't want to know that you've had sex with a ton of people. You know, like, if you're like, I'm not really a casual sex kind of girl, like, they want to hear that. You know what I mean? So I just think that you can say something like that or I just want to take it slow or whatever verbiage you need to use. And you know what?

Sometimes a guy will ask you to be his girlfriend and we'll fuck you and we'll dump you. It happens to the best of us. That's a piece of shit of a guy. It happened to a girl that emailed us. She was day in this guy. He was like, I want you to, I think he got a vibe of like,

this girl isn't going to fuck me until we're boyfriend girlfriend. He did it. He did what need to do to get laid and he was out and fuck that guy. What a loser. it's going to happen and there's nothing really you can do about it. And so if that happens, fuck him, move on, laugh about it with your girlfriends, get tested if you need to. But like,

those situations are, I guess you can say you can kind of get a vibe for a person if they're a shitty person, but like sometimes those situations are unavoidable. And if it's going to happen, it's going to happen. And that was obviously not the person for you. But I don't think this sex and like commitment title, whatever it is necessarily go hand in hand. But like they're kind of can be around the same time. Like that's kind of a bit in my experience. Yeah, but I think the word talking about people that have probably already already had sex. Already had sex. They're down this road.

They're like, I want to be in a relationship. So I just want to give people permission to just say what they want and have the conversation. Yes, we can talk about how to have that conversation. But like, unfortunately, there is a reality here that you can't convince somebody to be with you that doesn't want to be with you. And you're never going to convince somebody that doesn't want to be in a relationship, period, to be with you. And maybe, maybe the truth is they're not scared of the label. they're just scared of the label with you. And that's a horrible

truth to swallow, but maybe it isn't him, maybe it's you, and that's not your person. And again, you're still never going to convince them to be with you because there's no amount, you are who you are. And that person, you're not their person. Right. And that's okay. Yeah.

And I mean, I've had relationships, you've had relationships. I've known of hundreds and hundreds of relationships between all my friends and all the people they've dated throughout the years. And I would say 90% of the successful relationships that I look up to and have ended in marriage and whatever you used to define a successful relationship are that the guy, that this didn't have to happen, that the guy pursued the girl. Usually the girl was a little standoff at the beginning,

wasn't that into him. You know, like, it's very rarely the opposite. It's very rarely like, I can't get him to commit. Oh my gosh. What can I do? And then it works out. You never hear that story. I have one. I'm going to share it. Okay. But when we get to kind of like our ultimatum point of the episode. Ultimatums are different, but I rarely heard the story of like, I just chased after him for five months and he just like basically accepted what I was selling and gave me nothing.

Yeah. I just feel like what is going to make that switch flip? Nothing. Like you're already acting like this guy's girlfriend. Like, what's he going to wake up one day and be like, you know what? It can happen, but it doesn't usually. It can happen. But like I think that girls take this so personally.

And again, like, I know just like some of the greatest people I've ever known, like, fucking successful New York City just like powerhouse women that this happens to. Oh, yeah. It's not personal. I mean, it might be personal. But, like, you're not going to convince somebody to pull into port that doesn't feel like it. You are entitled to have the conversation. You're entitled to say to somebody, we are having sex without a condom. And I just want to know that you're not doing that.

And I just want to, like, settle down and see what this is like for a little bit. And I'm not saying, I'm not asking you to marry me. Right. I'm not asking, like, you're, I think guys, like, think that we're all just out here trying to, like, get their sperm and get pregnant. Like, well, and that too, this was the situation I had when I was a lot younger, like, 19. I was dating this guy and we ended up being boyfriend, girlfriend.

Like, it's fine, you know, but at the kind of at the beginning of a dating at me, he was kind of like, I'm really not looking for anything serious right now, for whatever reasons. And I was like, okay, well, we'll see. But we just were dating. we really liked each other. I knew we really liked me. And there was a point where I don't remember exactly how it happened and how it came up. But I didn't necessarily need him to call me his girlfriend. I didn't need this committed relationship. I just wanted him to call me a little bit more.

Like this was pretty smartphone. We talked to the phone back then, back in my day. And so I just was like, I remember saying to him verbatim, I was like, if you think about me throughout the day, like just maybe pick up the phone every once to a while or send me a text or whatever it is. And he kind of took this like, oh, that's all you want. You know, like, I was like, I like you. I think about you all the time. And I pick up the phone. And I kind of just want to know that's how you feel in return. I just want to make sure we're on the same page here. I'm not asking you to be my boyfriend or girlfriend. But like, that's kind of what I wanted. We ended up being boyfriend girlfriend. But like that's what I felt like I wanted. And so I think sometimes guys,

they do get in this thing like, oh my God. Well, she wants to be married to me. No, we fucking don't. We just want to know that we're on the same page. And I think sometimes it's easy. And I think sometimes it's easy to say like, hey, like, could you do a little bit more of this in a nice way? And, like, you might get it. You might. And so I think that, like, that conversation is so scary for so many people. But if you are just in your head making yourself sick and there's, I mean, I've been there. Like, there's so much anxiety inside of you. Like, you don't know what he's doing and who he's doing it with. Then, you know, if you've really evaluated the situation and said to yourself, I think it really is time for this, this conversation. I do think we're like headed to have the

conversation. I don't know. I think that like, I think it's fine. I don't necessarily agree with Lindsay, never have the conversation. I don't know. I don't know. I hate this. I hate saying this because I want women to take control of their lives, but like I feel like I resonate so much with what she said. Like guys have to think this is their idea. Like guys have to get you. They have to. And if you're the one asking them to commit, it just doesn't work. I strongly believe this. Like, a guy has to feel like he's gotten something and he's like landed you. And when you're the one asking them to commit, I think it's a recipe for disaster.

I just hate this idea that like we just have to like give it up to men that they have to, I'm not saying that you're saying that's just, I hate this idea that like men are in control of when we're in a relationship and when we get married, when we get. I don't think that. I'm not saying you think that. I'm just saying I hate this idea that they're just like in control of all this. And like if you have reached,

I'm not saying you breached this conversation three months end, if you reach your breaking point and it has not naturally happened because it should just naturally. I've never had this conversation with somebody. Let's be clear, guys. That's the goal. that they shouldn't come to this, just so we're clear. Right. Personally, I've never had experience with this.

I've never, I've never been in a situation where somebody has strung me along for like five months and I've had to have that talk. I just haven't. I've just naturally been in the relationship with the person. But like, if this is just making you miserable, then you should be allowed to have a conversation. Okay. Well, first of all, I don't picture it as waiting around for a guy.

I picture it as like, live your life. Do you not prioritize this person? Date other people if you need to until this person decides that they want to commit to you. I don't think of it as like sitting home and waiting around for this person commit. We can obviously agree to disagree. What I think is that if you get to that breaking point of like if this person doesn't commit to me, I'm out, then that's what you have to do. And we have talked about this. We talked about it with Nikki, actually. And we actually had to cut some of it because the episode was very long and like it was just some whatever, for whatever reason.

it was valuable information and there's books on this and there's all these things and it is this like ultimate ultimatum thing and if you've been with this guy for however long significant amount of time where you want the commitment where it's five months it's five years whatever it is and you are not getting what you want and you are like if I don't get it I do not want to be with this person it's one or the other you can tell them this and you can say hey in a super casual way don't need to be all worked up. Wait till you're calm. You can say, hey, this is what I'm looking for.

And if that's not really what you're interested right now, I think this is time for us to go our separate ways. And you can do that. And if you decide to do this, you got to be prepared for it. You have to be ready to walk away. If they're like, I understand, then A, they probably really aren't the person for you. They don't even want to fight to keep you. But B, I've seen it work.

And there's books on it all kinds of stuff that, like, if you, leave and you initiate this breakup and you really leave and you really don't text them and talk to them and you're really like, no, I got to do what's best for me. A lot of times a guy will come back. I was just talking to a girlfriend of mine that I love her relationship with her husband. And I was like, it was not like this in the beginning. It was like he wouldn't commit. He was doing all these things. And he was running around. And I was like, what actually happened? Because I was having trouble remembering. And she was like, I broke up with them. Like she was like, I knew I wouldn't be with him. I knew he liked me, but he wasn't committing.

And so I broke up with them. And sure enough, it was like a week and a half later. And what we talked about this with this book that Nikki was telling us about is that typically when this happens, the number one thing you do is you have to stick to it. The worst thing you could ever do in your entire life is give an ultimatum and not follow through. Forget it. You lose all respect. You can only have this conversation once. Nope. Because you have lost it. So do not ever, I feel like we're like, this is a huge tactic.

Do not attempt it until you're ready. But you can. You can't be serious. You have to be ready. Like, you guys, don't even try it if you're not. If you're not ready to be without the person, don't even fucking try it. Do not think that I'll threaten them to leave and that'll make them want to stay. It probably will not.

The way that this has to work is you have to say, hey, I want to be in this relationship. I want this from you. You're not giving it to me. That's fine. But I need to move on and find what I know that I want and what I'm deserving of. And then you have to leave and you can't talk to them, you can't text them and you can't send them memes and do all these things. And if a few weeks, it's like three weeks to a month or earlier, they could come back

around. If they don't, then you're kind of over it by that point, too. And if they don't, they don't want to fight to keep you anyway. They didn't want to be with you. They didn't want to be with you enough. That's your answer. I don't think that, see, I don't think that you need to have the, what are we conversation. Right. Never have that. I think you want to have this conversation. I think you just want to have like a, you know, here's what I'm looking for. If you're not, that's fine. Like, I'm not mad at you, but like, I can't just keep doing this with you, but you got to walk away. And I mean, people love a chase. Who doesn't like a chase? But like this conversation is an exploding offer.

You never get to have this conversation again. You do it once. So like you better be so fucking ready. Don't you dare email us and tell us. I did the ultimatum thing, but then I texted him. Sorry, email somebody else. We have no sympathy for you. We're telling you how to handle this.

You've got to be ready. And here's the deal. If he doesn't want to be with you enough and he doesn't want to fight for you, then good riddance because you're lucky you found out before you got married. Like you want someone that's going to fight for you. No woman should. ever have to convince a man to be with her after one month, one year, five years. Like, whatever it is, like, the saddest thing is I feel like when people are in committed relationships,

they're quote unquote boyfriend, girlfriend, and the girl still doesn't feel like the guy is fully in. Yeah, that's, that's hard. I've never been in that situation, but I, you know, I have a lot of girlfriends that I think have also. And I think that, like, there's so many harsh, harsh truths to this that, like, if somebody really liked you, they would fight for you. And if somebody really wanted to be with you, then the thought of you being with somebody else would kill them. And the thought of you walking away and the things that you bring to their life, like, you shouldn't have to play games. But the truth is like sometimes you have to. I don't know. Like, it just sucks. But like, I think that like if you accept less than you deserve and you

are allowing somebody to just do whatever they want, that doesn't make them a nice person, but you can't ever expect them to change the way they're acting. Right. Yeah. It's not fair. And I think, you know, for the future, like let's say right now you're single, like, if we're talking to you guys just so you don't get in a situation like this. Like, I hate to even act like this as playing games or being manipulative. I just wanted to be like, live your life. Do not prioritize someone until they're doing the same for you. Check in with yourself. Ask yourself, does this person really seem like they're into me as much as I'm into them? Do not sleep with them until that's the case. And everything should move along as it should. You know what I mean? Like if you're just really just living your best life and not acting like someone's girlfriend when you're not. It should work out. And if it doesn't, that's probably not the person for you. And if you get to a point where you're like, God, I love this person. This is the person. I can't be without them. Like, do this ultimatum thing and see what happens. Right. And I cannot stand this like the words that people say to you. You're so amazing and incredible. And I just need a little more time. And it's not you. It's me.

And I'm just so fucking, I don't want to hear that stuff. And like, honestly, like, all I hear from all these words is like, I'm never going to choose you, but I'll let you continue to choose me as long as you're going to let this go on. Right. And that is not fair. It's not. It sucks. And I don't think you're playing games by giving an ultimatum. You should mean, the ultimatum shouldn't be a game. It's not a game. It's like, here's what I want. If you can't give it to me, bye-bye. And like I said, I was talking to my girlfriend. They have a beautiful marriage. They're a great couple. And she was like, I, she was like, what I see happen a lot, not all the time. is that the couples right before they get engaged or right before they commit long term,

like do have a little bit of a breakup because it makes the guy realize what he could lose. I don't know, guys. I hate to say this. I just think men and women are built differently. And I think most guys have this innate thing of like, they got to have a little bit of a chase and they have to know that they can lose you to want to keep you. Like if you're just always there, you're always available, you're fucking them, you're making their bed, you're making them sandwiches, whatever. Like, what is the reason why it's that whole cow milk for free shit? Right. And that's not fair. That doesn't make it. be a nice person that they would just allow you to do all these things for them.

But the reality is it happens. So we need to accept it. I'll say one more thing. Every once in a one I like to give out like a trick that I can't guarantee is foolproof, but it's something that you could try. If you're like, oh God, I'm doing all the things. Fuck. Oh my God.

We're fucking. We're doing all these things. I'm acting like his girlfriend, but he won't commit to me. But I'm not ready to do the ultimatum walk away thing. One thing that you can do is just to light a fire under his, lazy ass is you could go out to drinks with a guy friend. I'm not saying to lead some guy on like you want to date him. I don't really believe in that. I'm talking a guy friend. I'm talking a plutonic guy friend that the guy you're seeing does not know about Bill. And you go out to drinks with Bill. Maybe he's

a co-worker. Whatever he is, your man doesn't know who Bill is. And if you're in a relationship where you're in this non-committed relationship with some guy that you guys are usually in context, like he knows what you're doing most nights? It's like, what do you up to tonight? What do you up to tonight. Like you guys are in that sort of place. You're going to go to drinks with Bill and he's going to ask what you're doing and you don't answer. You don't answer his text back and you don't answer him back to the next morning and you just be like, oh yeah, I was a drinks with my friend Bill and see what fucking happens. If he doesn't give a fuck, I don't think he like you. Oh, he doesn't like you. You don't like you enough. But that, that will make a man crazy. It will. And here's the thing.

You didn't do anything wrong. You went to drinks with Bill. You were in the moment. You didn't answer. You didn't feel like texting back. You were having drinks with Bill. And then you had a little too much to drink and you went home and you got right into bed. You don't owe him that text and you don't owe him that call because it's not your boyfriend. And the reality is it's this weird cyclical thing where like when you start just going out and living your life, even if it's just despite another person, like maybe you might start liking Bill or maybe you'll meet somebody else at the bar near Bill. And like when you decide to actually just go start living your life, like it will actually become what you are enjoying. Yes, I love that. And like, you know, I just think that that will show the other person you're not waiting around.

but then you will actually realize you're not waiting around. Yeah. Like, go enjoy yourself. Yeah. I remember with my ex, we were like in this hellscape of being broken up and getting back together. And I went to drinks with a guy I used to date and didn't answer his text all night and didn't answer his calls. And he blew me up because we were talking all the time. And we were technically broken up.

We were on a break. I don't whatever. I went to drinks with this guy that I used to date. He had just moved back to Atlanta from Chicago and he flipped the fuck out and he was like well who is it like who is this guy and I'm like this dude I know I never lied

but he was like he's just an old friend I think when you say old friend they know They know he was like So ready to like get me back And I was like mm-hmm I see you I'm not saying play games But go to drinks with your friend

That's all right game You know I mean like don't play games But play the game Like just be a little woke about what's going on, you know? Like, I don't want somebody that's super available to me all the time either. It's not attractive.

Right. And, like, I just think that so many people are so far down this road. And, like, I can't believe how to be emails that are like, we actually are boyfriend and girlfriend. He's not, bitch, he's not your boyfriend. Right. So go live your life and enjoy yourself. And to someone that is with somebody for years, like,

these are, these are sad. Because you, you're with this person. They know you at and out. You've been with them for years. And you still have this. sinking feeling that they have one foot out the door or they're not fully committed to you. I, it breaks my heart and I hate that women and, you know, men let this happen.

It's very carrying big, you know what I mean? Like, carrying big, we're technically together. But like she always felt like she didn't really have him. And if you're in that situation, I think that's when you, you will find a breaking point. You will get to your breaking point. And if you will have to leave this person,

if they don't give what you want. And like, if they don't try to get you back, I mean, they did not want to be with you because they've spent years of their life with you. They don't miss you enough to try to get you back. Sorry. Sorry you wasted years with this person, but it's sad. But the reality is like, you know me. You know me. There's nothing else that you can know about me. I'm not changing. You know me. The only thing you can, the only thing you can do,

I think in that situation is leave and see what happens. I mean, yeah. I mean, I think God, I've never been faced with having to do something like that. I mean, I've certainly been in bad relationships. For sure. Lots of other reasons. But I'm moved to New York. I think that Ashley's It's actually solution everything. You and your boyfriend, you guys are dating in Minneapolis, and you're like, you know what? You won't commit to me? I'm going to go to New York, see Ashley and Raina.

I think the problem is thinking that just because you have a past together means you're going to have a future together. I love this. And I just think that, like, they might know everything about it. You've done all these things together. But, like, if you don't feel like somebody's 100% committed to you, it's because they're not. And I'm not saying that means they're cheating on you.

I'm just saying like, you know what it feels like when somebody's 100% in. You are so right. It does not need to mean they're cheating on you. No. Like, I have a girlfriend and she has been with this guy for years. And I didn't even, I knew that they had some issues. But when she told me one time over drinks that she has never fully felt like he is 100% committed, I felt like my heartbreaking.

Like, oh my God. And this is someone I love. Someone's like family. And I'm like, oh my God. I didn't even know that. Like, you know, like someone won't let you in. and you've been with them for years. It is heartbreaking.

And again, this is also one of the smartest, coolest, hottest girls that I know. Like, I don't know how you could find somebody better than this girl. Like, there's nothing wrong with you for going through this. Everybody goes through this. Yeah. And it sucks. Like, when you love somebody like that.

I know. And, like, again, like, we just want to be super clear that we know that this advice that we're doling out is so much easier said than done. Like, when you were in that, when you're in it with somebody that you really like and you really love or you see a future with and you don't like a lot of people and you like this guy and he makes you laugh and he does these things and he's nice to you. Like the thought of just walking away from that is like kind of like not an option, but we're just telling you that it is the only option.

Right. I don't really know what else is that. I think it's normally like you listen to this podcast, you hear all these stories about like terrible dating stories. Especially Ashley and I. Ashley and I are inundated with 50 terrible dating stories a day. But that doesn't mean that you stay in a situation that you are not happy in. Because every day I would rather be alone shitting my pants in my apartment in peace than with somebody that I fucking don't like that makes me feel bad.

And look, here's the deal. I just want to give some credit to the guys. I do believe so strongly in my heart of hearts that men committing is so much about timing. And I just think they get in their head, all these things and these things that hold them back from really committing to women that, like, they really could be with. and that's when I think that like the thing that changes their mind is like knowing that they could lose you. And that's what I'm talking about. My friend that's married that I consulted with on this.

I think that was the case. I think he knew he loved her. But whatever was in his head, whatever is in his head, he's like living with a bunch of bros. Like whatever he had going on that was not letting him commit to her. Like it took her leaving for him to realize it. Yes. I fully believe that men can be completely in love with you and still not want to compete. Yeah.

I can too. And like, but I just don't think waiting around. and sticking it out is ever the answer. Yes, for sure. But, okay, and just to elaborate a little more, like on a man being in love with you but not committing to you. Right, because that sounds crazy because women would never do it. So do you think that every man, and I mean, obviously we don't,

but do you think that every man that won't commit to you is like this piece of shit? No. And I do, I want to touch on this because I feel like you and I have guy friends and men in our lives that have built super successful businesses and they have all these things going on in their life and they've probably been at that point in their life where they're like, I can't give anything else to somebody else because I'm just so busy

and I'm trying to accomplish these things and the thought of like someone else needing me to prioritize them is not going to happen at this point in my life. And I've seen that happen. You know, I've seen guys that are perfectly good guys but they're like in that work mode and they're hustling. They don't have any time at the end of the day. And like they really do feel like they don't have space

for somebody in their life. And I felt like that some days, you know? Like there's days when I'm like, I work so hard. I mean, you and I are trying to do this thing where I'm like so exhausted at the end of the day. I'm like, I can't imagine if I had someone that was like needy right now or like needing me or like needing something from me. Like I'm out. I'm tapped out. I'm nothing else to give.

I like how you said that also like needing something else from me. And it's like, yeah, all I want is like a little bit of attention. But like that's a lot. And if somebody at the end of the day like asked us, ask me for like more of my attention at the end of a day after like you and me have like a crazy day. like I couldn't give it to them. Yeah. And I like what Jared Fried said, I mean, months ago, but he was like, you know, we don't talk about it a lot, but like men have this idea on their head of like where

they need to be financially and professionally in order to commit. And like, until they fulfill that, like, they're not going to commit to anybody. And you can be the most incredible, amazing smart. I mean, I've seen it happen to my friends. Like, incredible people. And like, if they're just not ready, like, you're never going to convince them. It doesn't make them a terrible person. Right.

It's not there. I don't know. We talked about this before, that women will change everything for a man that they want to be with and men won't really do the same. And to me, the answer here is assessing this guy, like, let's talk to the ladies, like assessing what this guy's life is like. And I think of somebody like my cousin, he lived here, he worked in finance, and now he's married with three kids. They moved back to Miami. But like when he was here, he was hustling every day. And his wife is just this chill person that understood his life and felt like they were committed. You know, I'm sure he was like, yeah, I really like you. I want to be with you. I just don't have the

time, but like I'm going to make time for you when I can, but like, please know that, like, I may not be able to commit to a date nights because I'm working late. And I think the key there is, A, that it's the right match, that it's a woman that's willing to be a little more patient, not be needy and, like, understand that this person that you want to be with has, like, so much else on their plate. And vice versa. Like, let's not, let's be clear here. We're men and women. Like, it can be the opposite as far as the genders go, but we're kind of talking about men here. And I think that the guy has to be honest. Like, the guy is to be like, hey, I'm trying to accomplish this. I'm trying to start this business. I'm working 12, 15 hour days. You know, like, I like

you, and I'm not trying to fuck anybody else, but like, I might not have enough to give you. And I think that's where it all goes wrong. And I think you need to look at this guy. Is this guy really that busy? Is he really trying to accomplish this and make this amount of money and do these things? Or is he just like trying to fuck other chicks and blaming it on being busy at work. He's like, I'm so busy with work, but he's doing coke every night with his friends. You know, Is he really? Because I think there's a genuine thing there of a guy that can't compartmentalize, you know, how busy he is with work and what he needs to give you in a relationship. Well, I think that's fair too. And if somebody said to me, like, I need you to be home every night of the week to cook dinner.

And that's what's important to me is time spent. And I look at like our next couple months and how much we're traveling, then that person couldn't date me. And like, I think as long as you're honest with the other person, what you're willing to give in terms of commitment, then as a woman or whoever, you need to ask yourself, am I willing to readjust what my view of commitment is? So maybe it's not my pre-subscribed notion of what commitment is. Can I accept what this person is selling me? And if you can't, then that's okay. There's nothing wrong with you. You don't have to, like, give up everything that you thought commitment was

because somebody can't give you what you think they should give you. Right. And here's the thing. You know, be open with your partner. If you have this guy that you really like and he's, you want this super successful guy and you love that about him, but he is just trying to start a business or whatever. Make it in finance.

Whatever he's trying to do. Like, it's fine if you guys are in a good place to ask him like, hey, do you see this long term? Like, do you think you'll ever, ever be able to, like, give me this thing? You know, again, this is not a what are we conversation. But if you're in that place where you feel comfortable with this person, I think it's fine. To open the lines of communication. If a guy likes you, I do believe if a guy really wants to be with you, he'll even initiate

that conversation. Like, he'll be the one to be like, I'm really busy with work, but I don't want to lose you. Yeah, I had a guy say to me point black and I hated it at time. But, like, he was like, I'm starting this business and like, that's, I hate it. I hate it. He was like, that's my wife. That's what I'm doing. And that is the priority.

I am nothing else besides starting this business. Nothing else matters. Yeah. And he said it really early on. And again, all you want is somebody who's like honest with you and not like just trying to be nice and not you hurt your feelings. Like I can take it. Yeah.

And again, though, I've also seen guys that have lost, that's the whole one that got away. They've lost women that they really liked and cared about because they were too married to their work too. And again, like we're talking to the women. If you get to a breaking point, leave. do the ultimatum thing we've discussed. I've seen it happen time and time again and work out. Like I know couples that are married where it was that situation where the guy couldn't

commit because he was too busy trying to build his career and do these things. And she walked away and then they got back together and they got married. You know, when things settled down for him. It doesn't always work like that, but it definitely can. I mean, I just would never want to, if the reason they can't be with you is truly because of work and you just say to somebody you need to dial back and they do it and then they're miserable anyways because they're like giving up all these things that mean a lot to them to like appease you. Like I don't want to be with that person either because

that person's going to hate you. Right. And like there's some, again, there's plenty of powerful women out there too. But let me just talk about the men. There's men that are just super busy, super successful trying to accomplish these things in their professional career. And a woman that really needs a lot is just probably not going to be the match for them. Totally. And that's something you need to assess within yourself. Like you want a guy that makes a shit ton of money and runs a company and does these things and works these long hours, you're probably not going to get a bunch of, like, little cute notes around the apartment. Right. You know what I mean? Like, you know, like, you might be have to be a little patient. Right. And like, like, you and me are gone,

I'm gone the entire month of February, basically. Yeah. We have so many shows. I'm going to Miami. Like, if some guy said to me, like I just, like I said before, if I need you to be around to do all these thoughtful things, then like, what am I going to give up my career and what I've worked so hard to build? Because like, sorry. You need to have dinner with me? No, I would never do that for somebody. Yeah. But I would be honest about it. That's a thing. Just like figure out what the situation is. Do you need to dial it back and be a little more patient? Or is this just not a match?

And hopefully that person's like being honest with you on the other side too. Good. I'm glad that you said that. Because not every person that does this is like a horrible piece of shit. Yeah. I think that women want to feel like in relationships and any relationship, did I do every single thing I possibly could have done? I suffer from this.

The everything I possibly could have done. Yeah. You did. You did all the things. Yeah. He knows you. You've done all the things. Yes, exactly.

And we, um, when we were discussing this episode, we know there's kind of a whole other layer of this, like, when to throw in the towel kind of thing. And we're going to do a whole other episode on when you're in the relationship. It's committed, it's fine, but it's toxic. And like, when do you leave? And, you know, Rain and I have talked about this on this podcast of like with our exes,

like, feeling like, did I do enough and like, when's it time to give up and leave a relationship that isn't right? And that's going to be a whole other episode. So in case you're kind of like in that stage of a relationship, it's a coming. Are you ready to do the game? Yeah. We have a new game.

I am so excited about it was brought to our attention by one of our listeners, actually. These are so great. Why are you just, like, creating all of our games for us? She sent us a DM, and I've been, like, waiting to do this, and we finally get to do it. This is from Melmosa. I already like her Instagram name. Hi, I love your podcast. Can't wait to come to Chicago for the show.

Yes, girl. See you there. See you there. I think it'd be really funny if you had a new segment called Power Move or Psycho. There's a fine line between the two and it's a funny game I put with my friends. Here's a couple of examples. Is it a Power Move or Cycle to show up at the bar? You know someone you're interested in is at because you stocked them on SnapMaps.

Is it a Power Mover Psycho to get someone tickets to a concert, two months in advance, after only dating for three weeks? Is it a Power Mover Psycho to try to hang out with your ex's friends? So this inspired us to ask you. Thank you for that. Crazyest shit that you've done. And oh my God. You got like the speed that they came flooding in.

I was trying to plan the episode last night. I was in bed every five seconds. I, like, thought I was done. Like 30 more emails came in. Let's see how many emails we got for this. I got 100 emails about this in one day. Oh my God. A hundred emails in a day.

Y'all are crazy. And these are some funny ass emails. Yes. So I have a couple. I'm going to just do one. We're going to play this again. So I'm going to hold on to them, but I'm going to do one,

but I'm going to end with it because I don't want to show anybody up. We've 100 emails. I mean, we're going to be playing this forever. For years to come. I also sort of thought that Ashley and I didn't even really need submissions for this because we have enough. I mean,

we have enough of our own. Mine are all like a blend. It's like a psycho power move. Like you're always a psycho power move. Ashley, that's psycho, but damn, that's a power move. Busted in my ex.

door. I mean, all of these emails were like, he cheated on me and I did this. He gaslit me for months. Like, they're all power moves. I don't care if they're psycho. Right. You made me do it. Okay.

This one was really funny. Okay. Okay. Psycho or power move. A couple years ago, I went to move my furniture out of the apartment. I had shared with my cheating ex-boyfriend with four of my friends. I had truly gone with the attention of just getting my stuff and getting out. But once I stepped in and felt the rage.

Yes, girl. I was easily convinced by my friends to leave a little mark. Hold on, her guy friends. Yeah. Like, let's clarify. She was a dude friend. And they were like, go girl. I didn't want to fuck up any shit too much,

but wanted to leave little annoyances around the apartment. I love that she was like, one thing is not enough. We must do multiple. Yes. So we. Dot, dot, dot. And then she bullet pointed it out. Yes.

Put milk in his clothes. alone, vodka in his nice bottle of whiskey, olive oil in his shampoo, took all of the labels off the cans of food, emptied the whole puncher on the carpet, and took the vacuum. So who was a whole puncher? Okay. This is a few years ago? A home office. Hid the remotes for the TV.

Took a break and had some bananas and apples for snacks. She had fucking snacks. put the peels and cores either behind the fridge or in the toilet tank. Yes, getting that toilet tank. Last but not least, the guys had to take the door off to get the couch out, but then they put the door back on. They put it back in with Q-tips. What do you mean?

Like they took the hinges out of the door. Instead of putting the screws back in, they put Q-tips back in. So the door would just fall the fuck off. Yes. That's so good. I know I should have taken the high road, but since I've never actually gotten it, apology. I'm thinking about the slow discovery of these annoyances brought me joy. Sincerely, he may have had the home wrecker, but I wrecked the home.

Yes. You know what resonates with me? No apology. I'm sorry. If you would cheat on somebody, you don't even offer an apology. You better get the fuck ready. I will ruin your life. Like, if I give you the opportunity to make it better, no, I'm coming for you. I love this. This is hysterical. This is like all-star status. Like, I can't believe this girl. This is so funny. She just went and had like a day with her friends.

They had snacks. They did every annoying thing you could possibly do to somebody. I love it. And like the best part about this is that one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight things. So all the little things that's happening to him, he's like, like waiting for more. Like he's like, what the fuck's going to happen to me next? Oh my God. Living in constant fear.

Yes, constant forever. Forever. I love the remote hiding. I will say, my friend in college, she had a boyfriend. I mean, it's college, but she would randomly hook up with our quarterback.

Okay. He's in the NFL now. It's fine. You can look him up. He would come over. She would hook up with him. She had this little skinny nerdy boyfriend, but it was like she would sometimes hook up with the quarterback.

It's fine. And her like pink and green Lily Pol is her bedroom. And one night, she left him in the bed, the quarterback, and went to her boyfriend's house we never found her remotes again. He woke up, realized she wasn't there. He was in our apartment and I think he took the remotes.

We never found them. That's what you got to do. The remote is such a power move. It's just, it's so, it's fuck. It fucks the so bad. You know how long I'll look for a remote forever? Tear this couch apart. And like all these things that she did put milk in his cologne.

Yes. He's washing his hair. There's olive oil coming out of it. So good. You're right. She just, like, triggered him so hard. Yeah, like, he's, like, you know what? He fucked with her and, like, he traumatized her.

So it's like, that's what you do. You get him back. Look at this fun day she had with her friends. I know, her guy friends. I love that. She created this memory. Like, don't you, I'm sorry. People are crazy.

I'm sorry. She was with her guy friends that prompted her to do this. Also, I don't care. Men's favorite excuse is they're crazy. What the fuck did you do? Exactly. Every time a man says to me, this girl was crazy, literally, like, I'm just like, you're a piece of shit. What did you do? Every guy that's like all my exes are crazy. Do not date that

fucking guy. Okay. Ready? Psycho or power move? I found out my boyfriend of three years was cheating on me with a teammate of mine. I was a fuming when I found out and I'd been having a girls night, so I also had a few drinks at this point. Naturally, I gathered all of his belongings, things he had left at my house and all the gifts he had given me. I asked the girls to get in the car and drive to this bitch's house. Of course, it was raining. Just my luck. No weather was going to get in the way of doing what I was about to do. So we show up to her house. I knock on her door.

No one will answer the door and she won't answer my phone calls. Looking back, I don't blame her. I do see her looking out of her window. So I just start calling my boyfriend, quote unquote, and telling him to tell his hoe to come down because I have something for her. Eventually she comes down. I hand her a box of all the things I had gathered, take off my promise ring and look her dead in the eyes. I then simply say, have fun. He's your problem now.

Bird. Well, you know what? Fuck that girl. The girl knew that was her boyfriend. You know what I mean? Like, they're on the same team. Right. See, if it's a stranger, I would really-

No, I wouldn't do this. I wouldn't, like, exact any kind of, like, revenge on a total stranger. Like, that girl's not your friend. She doesn't really owe you anything. Like, exact all the revenge on the relationship. Yes. But, like, this is your friend. Yeah, like, you've been burned by both of these people.

Yeah. Burn the house down. This is the least crazy thing. Right. You could have done. Like, I would have gotten you kicked off the team, fired from your job. Right. Like, yeah.

Yeah. I mean, this is, this is tame. I know. Good for you for holding it together. Okay, this one made me laugh so hard. Power mover Psycho. Let me start off by saying, I'm not this crazy anymore, but don't tempt me. You're still kind of crazy. I heard that my boyfriend at the time was out with another girl. Of course, I tried calling and texting, but I got no response. So I took matters into my own hands. I grabbed as many items with his as I could, and I made my way out to the fire pit. My God. I started off burning his cheaper items. just in case he would call me back, but he didn't. I like the strategy. It's really strong.

Yeah. And then we started to get into his Jordan. Yes, and this is some left eye shit. We all know a black man and his Jays. Yes. I tossed a few in because the fire was dying out and started to cook s'mores over the Toasty fires. This bitch.

I love that they all bring snacks. I know. Revenge is exhausting. You've got to bring snacks. After I sent him a video, he decided it was a good time to call me. Come to find out he was hanging out with his bros after football practice. Wasn't even with a girl. This kind of psycho.

Okay, you're right. We haven't even been rating them. Psych or power move. That's the whole game. Well, the other ones were power moves. Okay, hold on. Hold on. Are we sure?

We're not even playing the fucking game. I haven't been. Okay. The homewrecker power move. Huge power move. He's your problem. Now, power move. Power move. This one,

psycho. This is what happened to left eye. I can't. I mean, when she burned her boyfriend's house down. She put all those jays in the tub and set him on fire. Oh, is that what happened? Yeah. Oh, yeah. But I can't remember if he, I can't remember he was cheating on her or not. I'm sure he was. Women don't just wait. Okay. Some women. Maybe there's like unicorns out there.

I like that you could include this one because I wanted an actual psycho one. Listen, I think some women sometimes wake up and are like, a little further along the crazy scale, the hot crazy matrix, than others. This is so funny. Yeah. Okay.

I'm going to read this last one and then I'm going to share my own. This one is holiday related. Perfect timing. My boyfriend broke up with me completely out of the blue the day before Christmas Eve and told me he wasn't going to be joining me in Colorado with my mom. Instead, he was staying with his family in Texas. We decided to not do gifts last year,

so I didn't buy him anything prior to breaking up. However, right after he broke up with me, while still in shock, I went online and overnighted his family, their favorite expensive wine, their dog some treats, and other gifts with notes that said, can't wait to see you. So blessed to be a part of your family. Blah, blah, blah. But it looked like she sent it a week prior. His family loved me and always told him that he better hold on to me since I'd be the breadwinner.

I work at a large bank. He's in the Coast Guard. Everything arrived the day after Christmas when all of his aunts, uncles, cousins, grandparents, etc. were over. they texted me thanking me for the gifts but we never got back together I just wanted to prove to that mofo

that I would be super successful one day and leave a lasting impression with this family of the one that got away I think it worked because they still look at all my Insta stories. This is the boldest power I love this bitch so much because I just love it because she's like I'm a boss and she like threw down some money

money money like she was like uh uh uh I love that like she wasn't even clouded by the breakup she was like oh fuck no she went on like Harry and David or like fucking silver oak. She's like sending like silver oak cab to their house. She said the dogs and fucking organic treats.

You know she did. She spent hundreds of dollars to overnight this shit. Just to make a point. Just so the whole family could look at him and be like, you're a piece of shit. On Christmas, the whole family is like, you fucking loser. You let this.

Who are you going to find? While they're drinking the wine and eating all the snack. The dogs chewing on the treats. Like everything. She's in the house. Like the whole house is all shit that she says. You're a fucking loser. That's what it's whole family.

This is the most boss-ass power move. I love it. I know. I'm glad you liked it. Also it involves snacks. What? All of these involves. This is not planned.

All of these involve snacks. I'm telling you. When you're pulling power moves, you need sustenance. You know the other one we haven't read yet? Also involves snacks. God, I love girls so much. We're the best. You're out here like exacting revenge.

on these assholes, and you're like, I gotta have some sex. I just like this through hysteria, there is comedy. Like, you can still find something funny as fuck to do in the depths of anger. I just love it. It's my favorite thing. Oh my God. This is this girl. I love her so much.

I was laying in a bet. This came through like 3 a.m. I think she had a glass of wine. I was like, I'm going to send him my power move. Okay. I'll share mine really quickly. Okay. So I'm going to, there's a lot.

There's kind of a lot. to there's layers of this story, but I'm going to keep it short because there's just like one main point. So I dated a guy and I've talked about him before. This is the one guy that I feel like really cheated on me. And I found out that he cheated after the fact, social media and that he was with this girl. Okay. So that's kind of the backstory. We'd been broken up for a year or two. I can't really remember. We've been broken up for a year or two. This is something I knew from college. And another guy that I knew from college that was kind of in that same friend group, this is years after I'd graduated, reconnected with me. He had just moved to Atlanta. And he was like, hey,

you know, we started kind of talking a little bit more than friends. And then he asked me to my ex's wedding to the new girl. We'll just call him John, my ex, right? He was like, hey, you know, I know this is a little forward and we've only really been talking for a little bit of time, but like, would you want to go to John's wedding with me? I was like, absolutely fucking yes. The fuck I do. The guy. The guy. I know. I that cheated on me went to his wedding with the girl that he cheated on me with. As it turns out, the guy that I went with was a groomsman. And the way that the wedding was laid out, I sat right across from the bride at dinner. It's so psycho.

I cannot stress to you guys enough. If you get a chance to go to the wedding of the guy that cheated on you with the girl that he's marrying that he cheated on you with, you fucking... With his best friend, you fucking go. Who's saying no, I don't care if his best friend is abominable. I don't care if he's the worst person. I'm going at fucking wedding and sit at table. Yeah, and just to be clear, like when I dated this guy, John,

quote of a John, allegedly John that got married, it was really under cover because he was a, he was like a kid asshole. This is a guy that doesn't have social media. Like, of course you cheated on me, you know, whatever. So this guy that asked me the wedding didn't know that we dated. You know what I mean? It was just this kind of quick little. Oh, yeah.

I forgot that he didn't know. He didn't know. He didn't know. And like I didn't tell him. Like, you know, whatever. I did a lot of things that are a little questionable. This is like, I think I was 25, 26 at the time, but, I mean like 27. And it was last week.

Whatever. Yeah, this was actually just last year. No, but yeah, I don't love the way that I handled everything. Well, actually, I do. Like, I would go to that wedding again in a heartbeat. But like the fact that I sat across the table from the bride. And I looked so good. This is right when I used to be like kind of heavy.

This one right when I started to like lose weight or this like sequin dress. It's been all this money on it. I'm a hair done. And, like, I showed up at that wedding up to dance and all night. You know, it's one of those situations where he's like, what is she going to do? What is this rabid fucking animal who has clearly gives no fucks, showed up in my wedding, is sitting across from me? What else is she going to do?

Sitting across from them at dinner. Still can't believe it was set up like that. Honestly, like, didn't see that coming. I couldn't think if your man who was in the wedding party would be. sitting with the rest of the wedding party. But like we had named cards. You know what I mean? Like across the table.

I'm looking at this bride in the eyes. I fucked your husband. You know how mad he was, though? He was just like, what is this wild animal going to do? What is she going to say? Right, with an open bar. Right. Like what is it?

She takes the mic. We're all going down. Cance him the wedding. I will say this. And then we'll end the show. What was crazy. were the speeches at the rehearsal dinner with the timeline of when they met when we were still dating. Oh, that's nice for you.

You know what I mean? Like, they met, we were definitely still together. Like, I love you kind of shit on Memorial Day. And that's when they met. And that was in the wedding speeches. You know that he was looking at you the entire time. Like, he didn't even, like, acknowledge the bride. He was just like, what is he actually going to do?

God damn it. How could she do this to me? So power move or really psycho? I'm not going to go to the wedding? It's a psycho power move. You know I love a party. You do love to dance. Can't hold you down.

I just show you, I'll black out my date space. Like there's a picture of me from this wedding. We should post it. I'll post on the story where like you can tell like how much I'm just like feeling myself at this wedding. An open bar and a band. I won't,

you can't get me to say no to that. Right. I don't care who's getting married. In Charleston? Yes. My ex who left in the day after our, of our engagement party, I'll go. Yeah, that was a good night.

Nobody's ever going to marry. My date went down on me after the wedding. It was great. What is this episode? Thank you for our new game. Listener. What is her name, Melissa? Melmosa.

Okay. I love it. Dewey's got to go out, guys. We got to end the episode. All right, guys. Thank you for listening. Oh, thank you. Raina is fully reclined.

Took a lot out of me today. Listen to hostage. Get your Fabletics. Leggings, get your scent bird perfume, subscribe, rate review, check our website for live shows and merch and all the things. Leave a positive rating. We love you guys so much. Thank you for listening to another long episode. We hope it was helpful. I don't know. I need lots to say. Pran is going to go take a shit now. Bye. Bye.