Girls Gotta Eat - How to Have the Sex Life You Want feat. Psychotherapist Vanessa Marin

Episode Date: November 21, 2022

We could not love this episode more, and are so happy for you to hear our conversation with sex therapist Vanessa Marin about communication in your sex life. She explains how to bring up a sexual slump or frustrations in your relationship with the exact language to use and type of conversations to have, how to tell your partner to stop doing something you don't like and start doing what you do like, techniques for spanking and choking and how to get your partner to do these things the way you want it (and vice versa), the best way to 69, and more. Before Vanessa joins us, we're chatting about Ashley's unexpected erotic encounter and Rayna's secret dream job, and discussing those feelings of "all my friends are married" that can creep in especially during the holidays. Enjoy! Follow Vanessa on Instagram @VanessaAndXander, preorder her book Sex Talks HERE, and check out her website for more. Follow us @girlsgottaeatpodcast, Ashley @ashhess, and Rayna @rayna.greenberg. Visit our website for tour dates, merchandise, and more. Shop Vibes Only. Thank you to our partners this week: Babbel: Go to babbel.com/gge for up to 60% off your subscription. Living Proof: Go to livingproof.com/gge and use code GGELP to get 10% off your first purchase. Tushy: Save 30% when you go to hellotushy.com/gge with promo code BROWNFRIDAY. Osea: Get 10% off your first order with promo code GGE at oseamalibu.com. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Choking, a lot of people underestimate, like, how gently you can do it with spanking. A lot of people think that you should go soft. No, we know. Also, we, people, I can't tell you many times I've been softly spanked and it really gives me the ick. Welcome back to another episode of Girls Gotta Eat. Welcome back. We literally just did this 10 minutes. We were below the line and we had to get above the line.

I was in the middle of a story and I was like, you hate this. We just recorded for 20 minutes, and I was like, we have to stop. It's not hitting. It's not right. We were below the line. I feel like I try to help and you're like, no. I'm like, we can do it tomorrow. No.

I'm like, we can do Thursday. No. Like, I guess we're doing it now. Again, we talked about this last week. I think about it all the time. Do you guys think about the line? The line and below the line all the time. Yeah, I think about all the time.

We're hovering right at the line. Well, happy Thanksgiving week, guys. This is my favorite holiday because I don't have Christmas. And we hope that you guys all have. safe travels and we'll give you guys lots of fun stuff to listen to while you're home with your family if you don't want to talk to those people. Yes. If you are with your family and you are just hiding out in your childhood bedroom and you hate everyone or you're sexting with your high school ex or whatever, please just do a confessional and tag me. That would be so funny that

somebody's like in their bedroom and they're like, I just fucks my ex from high school and they just tag you and people are like, my mom is driving me fucking crazy. And then Raina. Yeah, so if you You want to complain, tag Ashley. You can tag me too. Or if you're masturbating in your childhood bedroom, just let me know. Just tag Ashley only. No, give no context. If you're like, who's this girl?

You tag us in your vibrator pick. And then this is my favorite holiday of the year because you guys all tag me in your Thanksgiving plate picks. So the beige or the better, all of your beige carb picks, please tag me in everything. I will repost all of them. This is the day of the year that I will lose followers. We're saying. I love it.

Actually, no. Okay, you know what? Listen, I'm not saying you should like rip off Jared, and I want to give credit to Jared Fried, the board lord, because for his judging of charcutory boards going. But should you do plates? Because I do feel like it's this thing that like kind of is similar, but then there's these crazy outliers.

And there's really polarizing stuff. Like, what's polarizing to do you like the can of jelly? No. With the ridge indentation. No, it's garbage. You guys don't understand. And I went to culinary school. I worked in restaurants.

We'll get to the ads. I worked in restaurants my entire life. I worked for Danny Meyer. I worked in some really high-end restaurants. My mom is a phenomenal cook. I'm a phenomenal cook. I love canned process foods for Thanksgiving so much. Get out of here with your like artisan, organic, like oyster stuffing, fresh cranberry sauce.

People that make like a roast chicken. Get out of here. I want stovetop stuffing. The mashed potatoes can be fresh. I just like fresh food. Call me crazy. You can fresh. food at the other 364. But my taste don't change. So I don't like a gelatin that's been sitting

in a warehouse for months. I got to be honest, I usually don't even eat it. I just like the way it feels on the place. Cindy Hustletons, cranberries are second to none. They're just on the stove top. They're so good. Yeah, I just, little cinnamon stick, little orange rind. We don't do anything crazy, like gourmet, fancy. It's still standard stuff, but it's fresh. Food. I don't want to. Do you refresh it the other 364? I don't care. Okay, we are going to talk about some sales stuff, but I would like to get this out of the way

if you were watching this and you're like, where is Azul? Let's acknowledge that he's not here. People are just going to, they're going to tune out. No, so he'll be here in the second half. He comes in half time. Oh, we didn't even bother. Well, I bothered. Oh, you didn't bother.

I'm wearing the same thing. Oh, that's why you're changing. That's why you changed. Listen, the jig is up. Sometimes we do the guest interviews before the intro because we like to keep the intros relevant and timely. You didn't even say, are you changing to me? You're loving your life.

I'm not going to tell an adult what to do. I forgot. I was like, she's just doing what she wants. I don't care what you do. So now you guys know that I am wearing the same outfit a few days in a row and Ashley changes. We have been trying to keep it consistent, but I knew there would be a point where it was like we give up. Five weeks in. Here's a little BTS for you guys.

Sometimes we do do the whole episode of one, but sometimes we have like stacked guest interviews, the guests come in and then, you know, as timely as we can. We like to do the intros, so they're fresh. I just thought you were committed to the red sweatshirt and that's what you wanted to do. I wasn't going to challenge it. What did I wear in Vanessa's? Bella, do you remember? It wasn't a turtleneck.

We're down with turtlenecks. Oh, it was that checked sweater. You guys are getting two sweaters for me today. If you're watching the YouTube, let me know which sweater you like more. Could have so easily put that on. I'm wearing a leggy. I really was, I was just like, she's just living. You know what I have in the bathroom is my holiday show, my live holiday show outfit.

I should put the other one on. Why do you have those here? Bella picked them up from the Taylor for me. Oh, okay. I was wondering why they were here. Okay. So Azul's not here. I ended my tour and I was going to be gone for like five days.

So I just had him go with them because I only had a week between that and Christmas. Oh my gosh. Between that and Thanksgiving. But I was going to go home for Thanksgiving. So this is that week in between that I'm missing him. He's not here. I hate that he's not up here on the couch with us. We have a replacement though.

Yeah. George, we have a backup dog. So if you guys are watching. you are going to meet George. Bella's also here. This is Bella's dog, George. This is, he wish he was a Zol's boyfriend. Oh my God, he sat down.

Oh, my God. I love you. He doesn't, does he like to be, like, on the couch? Yeah, he likes to be in your about. Or does sit here. Bellet, can you bring the lint roller over with all of his old's fur on it? Maybe George will sit here. So I miss him so much in my heart.

Like, I feel like a part of me is missing. I hate being apart from him. I actually really, I was walking over here with, like, kind of cold. and nasty today and I was really looking forward to seeing him and then I remember he wasn't here. Oh, it's okay. Oh my God, George, are you coming back? So this, yeah, this is a holiday week. I'll be with my family. You'll be with your family. Yeah. But I just came back from, I wrapped at my tour. I was in Nashville, so much fun and Atlanta. And going to tell you something that I did masturbated manually in the hotel in Atlanta. Ashley, I was masturbating the other day and I was

thinking about you because of this because I was like, on the couch. And I was like, ooh, I'm turned on. I started masturbating. I was wondering, like, okay, if you guys aren't new here, Ashley doesn't masturbate manually. I do now. Which is great, because we own a sex toy company. So you should be using sex toys.

But if you're, like, watching TV and you get turned on, do you physically get up and grab a vibrator? Or do you not, like, spontaneously masturbate in your living room? Such a personal question. On our podcast, we have a sex toy company. Something about it feels different. Do you know, like, I don't want to answer that? You get up and get a vibrator from the other room.

I have never, keep one in the living room. Listen, what I've never done is been watching something. I get up, get a vibrator, bring it back to the couch, and I'm masturbate on the couch. That's something I don't do. No shade. You don't masturbate on your couch? You spend zero time masturbating on the couch. I don't masturbate on the couch.

You do? Constantly. I only watch TV on my couch. You're just jerking off on the couch. Watching what? Whatever is there? I don't know. Sometimes I'm really turned on by something.

Like sometimes somebody will like bend over and like I just, I'm turned on by it or I don't like throw on porn hub or anything like on my television, which I would put porn on my television. I'm more of a computer porn person, so I'll do that in my bedroom. But I don't know. Sometimes I'm turned on by the concept of something and you just got to go. So again, once again, this is not a plug for vibes only, but it is inadvertently. I was working on this story concept. Masturbating on the couch?

I was in the hotel. Oh, you were, okay. Yeah, I was like conceptualizing it in my head and it's extra nerd. And it's extra naughty. I was a nerdy. It's extra dirty and naughty. I find it there. And I got so turned on.

Yeah. So sometimes I'm doing something on the couch and I'm turning on. I just got to crank it out. So crank it out. So just have to say in the vibes only at this week. We have a new story, special for Raina. Camping. It's hot.

Is that the one you masturbated to? No, no, no, no. Sometimes I've had a hard time listening to the stories because I'm like, Ashley masturbated to all of this. So we have a camping story. It's really sexy. Where do they have sex? Well, I don't want to give it away, but it's like they have never hooked up before.

It's like they're friends that have always had a crush on each other. And she's a reluctant camper. She didn't want to go, but he's like, thank you so much for coming. I'm really, I'm really glad you're here. And then they take it to the tent. But I have to say. He said, can we take it to the tent? What's his name?

He's nameless. Okay. Some have names. Some have don't. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love it. I was masturbating to Conrad, to a Conrad fantasy. So everybody loves Conrad.

But then I got home last night and I did use the Ashley and it had been a minute since I've used the Ashley. Because I've been testing other stuff and using the new toy that we have coming out. And, I mean, it really just rocked my world. I hadn't used her in a while. So it was incredible. So we, you know, we love all of our toys and we have some new stuff we want to tell you guys about for the holidays. Yeah. And we, so we will just get all this out of the way really quickly.

We are having Black Friday sale at Vives Only and a Girls Gotta Eat. So Girls Gotta Eat Podcast.com and we are changing our URL, Girls Gotta Eat. Eat.com. So either one of those will go to the same place at the moment. That's a big announcement. Yeah, it is a big announcement. Girls Gotta eat.com straight up. Yeah, so we own it.

We did it. We did it. We did it. And Girls Gotta Eat Podcast. Shop. We paid for it. We wanted to get it. It was important.

Don't give us any money. me, buy a vibrator. But yeah, Girls Gotta Eat Podcast. Shop has everything. We've really cute stuff. We have sweatshirts and mugs and stickers and all kinds of fun,

gifty stuff. So we will have Black Friday sales on that. And then Vives Only, we have Black Friday sales. We have so much fun stuff coming out for the holidays. Do you want to talk about the pouch? Yeah.

So if you're watching, I'll just hold it up. So we have this custom vibes only. Oh my God, I love this moment. I'm like a QVC moment. This custom vibes only travel pouch. Of course, it will hold your vibrators.

But what we have is, the get wet set. So these are all of our products. You get the vanilla frosting blow gel, the juicy berry massage oil and our elite lube, all in this custom travel pouch. The pouch is free and the package itself is cheaper than if you were to buy all three separate. So you're getting a discount on all three. You get the free pouch, really gifty, or for yourself, of course. And then you can also get all three vibrators for a limited time. You can get the Ashley, the Raina, and the Gigi for $2.99. which is the savings of $46, I believe it's $3.45. Yeah.

And then you get the pouch as well. Yeah. So if you want to get gifts for people, this pouch is really gifty and so fun, you get all the stuff or if you're going to spice up your own life in the bedroom. And if you just want to buy vibrators for all your friends, for the holidays, get all three at once. Or get them all three for yourself, you know, no judgment. But Vibs only dot on.

Like, stocking stuff, some of them like do whatever. Yeah. It's a great gift. And that's all going to be a fives only.com. So we'll have Black Friday sale. you can get on our newsletter just by going to the website, enter your email, and then we'll obviously email you about this as well.

And if you're new here, and you were like, what were they talking about with the camping thing? We have an app that is erotic audio experiences. You can get that for iPhone and for Android, and it connects to your toys. They're all Bluetooth enabled, and there's also a remote control in there that is free. And then there's premium features like the stories,

and there's video content, not porn. It's educational, sex video content in there. And again, but you can see all that at vibes only.com and within the app store where if you get your apps. Yeah. Last thing that we'll get out of the way and then we'll keep it moving.

We're going to put this on our website too, but order by dates. You can go to our website to Vibes Only to check the dates to arrive by Christmas. It'll be in the FAQ. And then also for Girls Got Eat, we'll throw that in there as well

on the Girls Got Eat site if you want that merch. So thank you guys for always supporting us and everything we do. We just are so excited to put this stuff in front of you. We worked on stuff for the holidays really, really hard for Vives Only. We have really cute merch.

We are going to put these mugs on sale if you're watching. It says, caffeineate and masturbate, and we have a great crew knack and all kinds of really fun stuff for you guys. So check it out on our site. And there's new toys coming. Yeah. So just stay tuned.

We'll alert you guys about all this stuff. And again, sign up for the newsletter, of course. And get those tickets to Girls Got Eat shows. They make a great gift. Girls Gotteeat.com. Click on live shows. We have so many shows coming up in 2023. And again, tickets just makes such a fun gift, especially last minute.

Yeah. You know, you haven't got someone a gift. Get them tickets to the Girls Got to Eat show. Yes. So thank you guys again for your stuff. poor and we're excited for the holidays. Yeah. Okay, so I had a erotic moment earlier. The window washer is washing the buildings today and I heard him banging around and then he comes down in his like little rope swing, whatever they go, whatever keeps them. Carabiner. I made that up you guys. I have no idea.

He's like hanging outside the window and like he's at the window and my shades were up. And I wasn't going to go over there and put him down in his face. So he's just looking in and he like gave me a look. This, he was like being sexy and I, I swear to God, we had windows while I'm like doing stuff. Like I was like filling up my water picture and I was like kind of tidying up. And I'm like, he's watching this whole thing while he's like giving me this like smirky smile. I, this would be my dream job to be to like repel down a building like rock climb up and down a building and look in people's apartments i i love taking what okay when you first started that sentence i was like what rock anything like athletic no and then i get it now you want to spy on people i want to be a peeping tom you know what the only

right what a dream and it's like it you're like you're thinking like should i shut the blinds and nobody does it because every person is the same thought you do. They're like, it's so rude to shut it. So people just go about their day in front of these people. Let's talk about if I did. If I walked over there, I would have been face to face with him. If I wouldn't, because what I have is I have a big window and my whole door to my patio is glass. Like, it's a giant window. It's a huge, it's like a wall. Not that my apartment's that big. It's not. But like that whole wall is window. So I would have walked over there. I would have been like face to face with him and just shut the blinds in his face while he's like going

like this, like, ugh. I'm kidding, but he did give me like a sexy smirk. Yeah, he got, he caribined down. Right, that's not a word. Ballet, can you Google what carabine means? Carabiner is the hook on the golf towel. Look up carabine. Yeah, but it's a, when you like, it's a thing.

No. It's carabined. Listen, guys, I never said that I was athletic or natures. I feel like he just know. You could be right also. I don't, I mean, whatever. I think that, like, how many gross people must you see it? And then he gets to like repel down and you're just like a nice looking young lady just in her apartment.

You probably run those booty shorts. No, I was wearing the sweater number one. I'm like sitting here like beating myself up that I didn't change my sweater. You want me to tell. I feel like I don't want to manage you. I feel like that's not our vibe. Raina, I told you you do need to manage me better. You don't like it.

I will appreciate it later. No, you do. This is like that pepper when you let just let me eat that pepper. Ashley, I put on some hand lotion, sat down next year and you were like, did you just put on perfume? And you looked at me like the flesh was going to melt off your face. You didn't like it. So I'm going to be like, change your shirt. Smelling like a bath and bodyworks. Jerkins.

I'm not trying to have ashy legs for you guys on the YouTube. But like, Raina, like we said we were going to be changing outfits. And you said eventually you were going to stop doing that. But why don't you just say, what do you think was going to happen if you would have said something? I don't know. I just thought you're living your life. Bella, maybe you should. Bella should have managed this. Anyway, okay, so dream job, secret dream job.

Rana, this is funny. Like, if you get asked, if you didn't do this, what would you do? And I'm like, I would be a DJ or a private investigator. DJPI, what is DJPI? So, you would be a window washer so you can spy on people. You know what? The way that guy looked into my soul, it was a lot. That's why you take that job.

Okay, there's a million jobs you could take where you might not die. What if you were? There's only one reason to take that job. I see people, the building across from me, so my building is 18 stories, and the one across from me is more, so it must be like 25 stories, and people, like, repel down that.

You have a death wish. If you want to pick that as your job, you just like peeping on people's apartments. You could get any other job that pays that. Some people, it's a job. They're in it for the game. I don't think it's that scary. You're attached.

There's other jobs where you're not hanging off of a building. Pretty dope job. Yeah, but that's got a thrill to it. That's what I'm saying. You have to want to do. You have to have a death wish. No. Okay.

So I wanted to tell you this story, which I want to tell you guys this story. Of course, I talked to Ashley about it. But this thing happened to me this weekend, it was an unfamiliar feeling. And since we're all going over the holidays, and I feel like a lot of times it comes up, like, who are you dating? Are you single? Are you seeing anybody? And I think people just really sort of dread going home for the holidays because of that.

So you shouldn't. And we have great episodes about it. So check our website. And you guys can look at older episodes where we've done. talked about that because it's such a common concern. But I had this thing happen this weekend and I'm just, I'm not used to the feeling. So I had some friends in town that I grew up with. And I grew up with this like big group of guy friends and everybody's married. Some of them live here. I've dated one of them. And like the main one that I'm the closest with was in town with his wife. So I had

asked him when he was doing on Friday night and he said that another one of our guy friends and his wife were going out to dinner. And I thought it was like a little weird that they didn't include me, but I just thought whatever they just want to be the four of them. And then the next day, I came to find out that there was like eight of them at this dinner and it was four guys that I grew up with and all their wives and I was like excluded from it and like kind of lied to through a mission and it really hurt my feelings. And the reason that I was left out of this is that I used to date one of the guys. Not seriously and years ago. This is never like a boyfriend of mine. But tumultuous, he was like a pretty big liar and just acted like a jerk in general. And he was, I guess, had come with his wife. I didn't even know he got married. And he had basically said I kind of prefer that ran it at a lot. doesn't come. And he just said, I don't think my wife would love it. So I don't know if that is anything to do with her asking that or not, but it's fine. It just, it really hurt my feelings. And I felt like I was left out and lied to and all these people like hung out without me. And I started to feel really sorry for myself because I felt like I wouldn't have been left out

of this if I had like a partner. And I can't imagine somebody's wife being like, she can't come. Like, I'm this single girl that used to date her husband. And I think that if I had somebody, they would have included me. And it just, I went home and I felt like so, sad that night. I was really feeling sorry for myself and I just felt like I am so single and all these people I grew up with like got married and started families and I just didn't. And now I'm being like excluded from something because of it. And so it just really made me feel sad and I was like really in my feelings about it. And it's not something I experienced a lot. I don't think about it very often because you and I have made it a goal in life to have all these different kinds of friends.

We're always out with girlfriends and like nobody really makes you feel bad about this. But I don't want to be like sometimes in a small town. But Pittsburgh is not like a big town. it's a Midwest town. I think that that's what people do. They get married. They start families. You know, this isn't like a big city where people are like single friends.

So I just was feeling sorry for myself. And I wasn't really talking. Even Ashley, the next morning was like, girl, you good. And I was like, I was actually just typing all my feelings up to send them to you. Sometimes I do that one. I'm going to send you like a really long thing.

I'll put it in my note section. Oh, yeah. And I sent it to you and I like talked through it with you. And it's not that I feel like the feelings were, I did as I typed it. I was like, this is silly that I'm beating myself up about this. that I feel like so sad and in my feelings about this. And you had some good feedback for me.

But I just want to like, I think people are like, you girls are these like single icons. I don't always like it. It's not my dream. But nobody's ever really made me feel bad about it before. So I just was feeling sorry for myself and feeling sad. So I just want to acknowledge that like, you know, that can happen sometimes.

And I really encourage you to like put that on paper and write it down. And it helped me to at least think like about all these other good things I have in my life. And you said to me, you can speak on it a little bit more. I don't try. Should I pull my text? I just need to reiterate. I felt like I did pretty good in the moment. You did.

I was really sad, and I think a lot of people's knee-jerk reaction is to sort of retreat and feel bad for themselves. And it's mine too sometimes, but talking it out and typing it out really helps. So you had some insight. It did help me to sort of feel a lot better and just be like, okay, stop feeling like this. I have a lot to say about it. I mean, I think that some things just aren't as personal as they do feel. You know, I was like, how many times, you know, have we gotten together with our

girlfriends and everybody knows it's a girl's dinner. You can't bring your partner. Like there's no rule, but it's like it would be weird. You know, like this is kind of like, I'm not saying that we're all single, but, you know, we're just kind of like, that's the vibe tonight is like the girl's dinner or whatever it is. And sometimes it's a couple's dinner and couples are going to couple. You know, sometimes they want to just do their thing. And it probably isn't ideal for that guy to have somebody that he dated or slept with, you know,

to be at dinner with his wife. And I don't even know if it would have been different if you had a partner. You just don't know. And I just sometimes you get so, not you. anybody can get so in their head, like, this was premeditated and they sat around and talked about how they didn't want me there. Sometimes it's not that deep. Sometimes it's like, these people made a plan and you weren't included for maybe this reason and we're all adults enough to realize that these things kind of happen, but they can still sit with you. And obviously I validated that. And I don't

think that it's silly at all. But I think that you told me that you didn't have like the best ending with him. Yeah, it also felt like shitty that I was like, oh, this person gets picked over me. And this is like a liar who you don't think is the best person. So I was just like, you shouldn't feel alone because of this guy. You should feel thankful you weren't with that guy. That was one of my takes. And I just said that I think we all, why am I reading back my own text? Ashley's like, I killed it. No, no, no, no. I just, in the moment, I like felt what you were, I knew what you were dealing with. And I was just like, I think we all have low moments and you and I have less than most, which is something to be thankful for. Married people have low moments all the fucking time. And I think

of what that guy's wife must go through day to day. Listen, I don't know what their relationship is like, but I don't either. I think it's good to put things in a perspective. And I have lows for sure. I had a low an hour ago, but it's a adult. You'd think that I would have more lows about not being a relationship, but I truly don't, because I really do love my life. I feel like it's a dream. And I just remind myself of what I do have and what I am so happy to have and that I don't envy any couples that I know, really, you know?

Like, I like my life. And the things that get me down are not feeling like alone or single. And I feel so proud of that because if I wanted that, I could. probably have it. You know, I'm living the life that I've chosen for myself. Yeah. But validating at the same time that we all have these moments. And especially like if something happens with somebody that you're into that doesn't go the way you want. I mean, even if it's something silly, like on a dating app or something, like we sometimes can't admit that it does get to us. How many times do you sit there? I mean, maybe not you, but everybody, like the plural you

and you're just like, why am I letting this bother me? Yeah. And it's okay. You know, it's okay. I think that if you have a moment like this, one of the things it's nice to write down is like all the things I have in my life that are good that I'm proud of. And I like to think about everybody else's marriage around me and all the problems and the struggles that they go through and that I don't have to go through. And I think marriage is a beautiful thing and having kids is beautiful. And everything is hard. There's tradeoffs for everything in life, you know, but that girl is married to a pathological liar and there's a tradeoff to that, you know, I'm sure she's wonderful and doesn't deserve it, just like me. But I think there's tradeoffs to everything. So if you're feeling

like, especially, you know, during the holidays, people are like, are you dating anybody? And you're like, I hate that I have to answer no. Just think of all the things you have going on. And if you have to like pre-lock in those talking points in your brain, have those ready to go. Yeah. People are just asking you because they have nothing else to talk about. But it helps me to really write things down because I was sitting at home just like ruminating, marinating in this. I was so sad. And I ended up going out to dinner with one of the guys on Saturday night. And he was just like, you know, he basically echoed what we were talking about that there's like tradeoffs to everything. Marriage isn't easy either. And I just, I felt really sad. And he also echoed,

like this was kind of just a boys dinner. Yeah. And like that's just kind of how it was too. Yeah. Like I'm used to always being treated like one of the boys and I have a big group of guy friends that I had growing up. But it could have just been that too. Totally.

I mean, that's the thing. Sometimes we like spiral. And also, listen, there is something to be said for every once in a while really needing to sit and feel sorry for yourself and letting it all pile on top of each other. And like, I'm single. And they're excluding me. And we all do it. It's like I don't do it a lot.

I'm not that type of person. I'm not like a person that sits around and feel sorry for myself and plays a victim and all this stuff. But we all get in those moments and sometimes you just need a friend to pull you out of it and put things into perspective. And I think that like you said, it's just remembering that everybody's got their own shit, you know, and reminding yourself that you're a bad bitch or whatever you need to do and think about the things that you've going on in your own life. And we talked about this circling back to the holidays. We've had this on multiple episodes. But people get worried about that dreaded question of like, are you dating or what's going on with you from family members? And sometimes family members are going to, to pressure you and they're going to breathe down your neck and they're being assholes about it. But a lot of times we've said, like Raina just said, it's just small talk. It's just something to bring up and you can just pivot the conversation and say, no, but what I am doing is this thing in my work or I picked up this new hobby. Like, you lead the conversation. Like, don't be scared. And if someone just won't let up, they're like a dog with a bone and just walk away or be like,

I'm going to, I need to take a shit. Sorry. The canned cranberry just really just really just hit me. No, but set your own boundaries. of course, we say that all the time with your friends, family, whoever it may be. But those conversations can be easily just pivoted. You can redirect. Yeah. So I'm glad we talked about it. I think it's very timely.

And yeah, that's all. Just want to share a little antidote with you guys. Yeah. When this was happening, I was in Atlanta and I really had a great time. I love Atlanta. I love how it's grown and changed even since I've moved away. There's just all this like new really dope stuff. So I had a great show there.

I had a great show in Nashville. But I've said this to you before. Like, it's so weird for me to go back there because I lived another adult life. there. Like I felt like I'm revisiting old Ashley in like a weird way. And I don't know if this hits so different because of who I am, but also because I never moved as a kid or anything. I stayed, I lived in my same house my whole life even. Like I don't have different lives. And then you go on, you have like the traditional stages of life where you go off to college and you do this and do that. And those feel normal. It feels normal to go back and visit like my

college. But when I go back and visit Atlanta, I'm like, I was here for 10 years, had a career, you know, dated, had a serious relationship, had a group of friends. I'm still close to most of my friends as like a different person. It's just weird to me. I don't know. I always say it to, I'm like, it feels so weird. It feels like I'm like visiting my old life or something. I think it's so interesting. I can't really relate to it because I moved here when I was 21, 22. I knew I was 22. And I've only had my adult life here. So my whole friend group is here. My whole life is New York. And it's so weird to think like if I had had that somewhere else also. But I mean, you can do it. People ask us all the time. Should I move? I mean, people moved to New York

and we encourage you guys to do it and you can start over. And I like that message too that you can make a whole new friend group and a whole new job and all that and you can look back fondly and still really feel happy about it. I still have friends with all those people

and my career there was building blocks for my career today. So it was not like a look down on that at all. I loved it there. But I really like, I think there's some people like we talk about Jenny Jones who move all the time.

You know, she's lived in, I don't even know, six different cities since you've even known her. So for me, like I lived there for 10 plus less years, like, a whole life.

Put roots down there, like had a whole ass life. Yeah, whole ass life. And then have a whole ass new life. So it's just to go back. It did feel, you know,

like home in a sense. So I was like walking around where I used to walk Dewey. Like I just, I walked my whole old walk. I stuck into my apartment complex. I went through the gate and I was like, oh my God,

I sent you a picture. I was like, I used to live here. Like it was just crazy. It was like, I was just always there with, with Dewey too. Like I was like,

I just, you know, yeah, it's a different time. Yeah, it's nice. I feel like I don't know. It's hard for me to like validate it because it's so outside of my experience. But it is really nice to just go back and remember and feel like I've come so far.

And who was that girl back then? Who was she? She was a different face. Different life. She did have a different face. A different dog. A different job. You didn't even know me.

Someone like wrote in a comment like, where's Dewey? I was like someone that started from the podcast from a while back or maybe start at the beginning like wrote in a comment recently. Like where's Dewey? I was like, he's Dewey's dead. I'm kidding. I would never write that. That would fuck somebody up because I have like a dark sense of humor.

But anyway, Dewey is my dead dog. You're curious. We miss him every day. RIP to the king. You shed your whole old life. But if you're listening, you're like, where is he? He's no longer with this. Is he in your apartment?

His ashes are. He's in your apartment. You're right. He's on the shelf. He's always with us. All right. Okay. Well, we are going to get into it.

We didn't even talk about our guest today. We were so excited about her. have the best episode. I am so excited. If you're watching on YouTube, get ready to see my second sweater. And I am going to tell me. I like that sweater so much more than this one too. I'm like upset. I can't believe I've even been able to record through this. You've been saying like for a while, like eventually I'm going to stop caring and I'm going to like not put on the same outfit days later. And I just thought today was the day. Last week I didn't do it, but I kept the jeans on, but I did a t-shirt and a sweatshirt, which could be like I got hot. Yeah. This is a whole,

different vibe. I'm letting you fly. Raina, I told you what you've got. I have to manage. Okay, one thing, you guys are probably wondering, we said we were going to recap Love is Blind when it ended. We're going to do it separately because we can really deep dive on it and put it on YouTube. So at this point, it will already be up there when this episode comes out. So head over to our YouTube and you can watch the full Love is Blind recap. Yeah. All right, guys, well, enjoy the guest and the rest of the episode with Ashley in a different sweater. Oh my God.

Okay, guys, we are really excited to welcome our guest today. She is a licensed psychotherapist with 20 years of experience in the sex therapy field. You don't look old enough to have 20 years experience. We'll get back to it. She's featured in hundreds of articles in places like Harper's Bazaar, Allure, Oprah Magazine, and the New York Times. Her weekly podcast, Pillow Talks, covers all things, sex and intimacy. And you can pick up her book in early 2023, sex talks, the five conversations that will transform your love life. Please welcome to the show, Vanessa Morin.

Thank you, guys. so much for having me. I'm so excited to be here. We're so excited to have you. We just found out that you have two pugs, a black and a tan, and it takes me back. It's, Raina's, the only type of dog she likes is a pair of pugs that are different colors. That's really, and they cuddle and it's so adorable. Well, when you guys come out to the West Coast, you can come meet them. We absolutely will. They're definitely the most interesting thing about me. Stop. And we also learned that your husband had two last names and you have obviously a last name like everybody. And You picked between the three and you both changed the last names.

I love everything about you guys. Oh, thank you. Yeah, I didn't want to just have to default change my name because I'm the woman. And so he had that hyphenated name. We said, okay, we have three options. Let's pick. And I thought Marin was the prettiest. Yeah.

And you let us know that it's a lot harder for a man to change his last name in general. So anybody that's listening, make your man do that. If you want to make his life harder. Yeah. We fully supported. Yeah. Well, we found you because. Actually, we were looking for people to do some sex and into these videos for the app,

and we had a couple listeners who suggested you and your husband who do a podcast together. So I would just love to hear a little bit more about you, introduce yourself to the listeners who are what you do. Yeah. Yeah, so my name is Vanessa. I'm a sex therapist. I have a business together with my husband Zander, and we really focus on helping couples keep the spark alive in long-term relationships. So we've got, yeah, all sorts of stuff.

We're on Instagram. We have the podcast. We're writing the book. We are just really passionate about this topic. Like you guys know, like, what do you want to talk about? I'm like, here's a list of 100 things that I would be so stoked to talk about. So I just love doing this work and I'm really glad to be here. I'm curious, we want to hear the story about you and your husband too and you share this in the book.

And I think it's probably a lot of people's story too that people will be able to relate to. But I'm also just curious about you working together and living together, being together, like live work and play together. It's a lot. I mean, you guys know. it's a lot. We don't want to sleep the other night. We have like a friendship and working together with the business and you know it's like

a lot of stuff. But yeah, I mean, it is a lot but you know we love spending time together. I think that's really what makes it work and we have really good communication as well so that's made it work. But we kind of fell into this. He was working for Google. He had like a long career in tech and HR

and we ended up moving. We were in San Francisco at the time we moved to Berlin and he just wanted to take some time off and kind of figure out what his next move was. And I just asked him to help me put together an Excel spreadsheet for tracking some things. And that was sort of how he fell into helping out with the business. So he was doing all the behind the scene stuff for a couple of years. And I kept bugging him saying, you know, we're a real couple and we go through real struggles of our own. Like, I think we should talk about this together. Because it's one thing for me

as a professional to be like talking to people. I think sometimes it's easy for people to say like, well, yeah, you're a sex therapist. You have all this training. Of course that's easy for you. But I just thought there's something really valuable about being able to share as a real couple. So it took me a few years to convince them to like come in front of the camera and do the podcast with me. But now we get really great feedback from people saying like, I appreciate your vulnerability. And it just normalizes all these things that all couples go through. It makes me feel like I'm not alone. And it just opens up the conversation between partners easier to when they see like another couple talking about it. Absolutely. I love that. So you guys were in a place where

you were dating, you were not married yet, right? And your sex life just like took a steep dive off a cliff and you went to therapy about it. Yes. Okay. Yes. You know, I tell the story in the book and I'm like, there's nothing very unusual about this story. I feel like everyone in a relationship has some version of like things were hot and heavy and then life kind of catches up to you. And so we just got into this phase of we were both working really late. We had a lot of responsibilities. We weren't making time for each other. And we were having very little sex. And when we did have sex, it was very boring. It was kind of predictable. It wasn't very pleasurable. It just felt kind of icky and disconnected. And we had never had to talk

about sex before because things were so great at the beginning. So they were like hot and heavy at the beginning. Yeah. And I think it gave that impression of like, oh, it's so good, we don't even have to talk about it. And I think that a lot of us are going for in relationships. Like we think that if I don't have to say anything, this is a good sign. And so we got into that tough point in our relationship and realized we had no skills or like techniques to draw upon because we'd never talked about it before. So all those initial conversations that we had just immediately went into fights. Like you never initiate. Well, you don't seem to care about me having an orgasm. You know, because we just didn't have any communication foundation to fall back on.

I'm so intrigued by it. I mean, not intrigued because it's just so normal. I just feel like people are listening like, same. That's me. Yeah, right? So what did you do? I'm I was like, you know, this is a deal breaker for me. Like, we are not resolving this. So he very begrudgingly went to therapy. I mean, he was not into it. And I start off the books talking about that first session of just even sitting in that therapist's office realizing, I don't even know what to say.

Like, I don't know how to describe this. I don't even fully know what I want. I just want not this. So it was really hard to just like figure out where to go from there. We have done some really great episodes with Ian Turner. Emily Morris and everybody, every time we poll people, what do you want to hear from a sex therapist? They say, I've either a mismatched libido with my partner or we used to have this hot and heavy sex life and we just don't anymore and I don't know how to approach it. I think the advice so much

not from those people are you, but the advice in general is like, well, just talk about it. And it's like, but I don't know how to talk about it. It's scheduling sex weird. Is it weird if I'm just like, let's throw on a porn. We've never watched a porn before. A lot of these things aren't actionable. They're just like, just talk about it. Yeah, I mean, the idea of like we need to talk about it. Everybody knows that already. There's nothing new about that. But what really bothered me and what drove me to write the book, we actually wrote it together, was that there's so few pieces of advice about, like, well, what do I say? How do I say it?

When do I say it? And so I really love getting very nitty, gritty and practical with people. I think, like, that's the most important thing. Because if you give that generic advice, it just makes people feel even shittier. They're like, oh, all I'm supposed to do is, like, just talk about it. Right. Or like, just relax and stop thinking about it. So I really wanted to give people much more actionable, like specific things to do.

So that's why the book is really full of specific conversations to have and conversation prompts and examples of how to say things. So what would you say, if you don't mind, like sharing a little bit more? Was there one underlying issue? Was it just that like life got in the way and then you didn't have the tools to figure out? Or like what helped? Like is there a way to just give the short answer here? I mean, I know we know it's all in the book.

But yeah, I mean, there really was. wasn't anything in particular that was going on. Azole, come on. My sneakers smell really good. Yeah, hi. Azole. Yeah, there wasn't anything specific that was coming up. It really was just a classic case of like life got busy.

We weren't prioritizing it. We didn't know what to do. And so I think that really is the case for the majority of people. It's like there's not one thing that goes horribly wrong. It's just kind of like a cascade of tiny little things that start to snowball and really become a big problem. How many years into the relationship did you go to therapy for this? We went for a couple of months. But how long have you been together? Oh, we had been together for about two years at that point. Because I think some people are like, yeah, I think some people are like, well,

is this weird that I even think about this after two years? But I'm sure a lot of people hit that mark I have after two years. Like, I just don't fucking use not that fun anymore. Yeah. I think we've all experienced that. And it's this sense of grief almost. Like what happened to us? It was so great at the beginning. The chemistry seemed good. I do want to say like some people don't have that hot and heavy stage and that's normal and that's okay too. But I think for so many of us who do, it's, yeah, the sense of loss. It's a confusion. Like what happened? And it used to feel so effortless and now it feels like it takes so much work. And I think that's another thing that scares us too. Like in the book, I call it the fucking fairy tale that this is what we see of sex in TV, movies,

porn, like sex always seems completely effortless. It just happens. It's spontaneous. Nobody's ever talking about it. And so we all crave that feeling of effortlessness. And when it starts to get trickier in our relationships, it starts to feel really scary. It's like, well, this isn't what it's supposed to be. And this can't be like this maybe isn't my person. So I think a lot of us end up ending relationships at that time too. I mean, I definitely thought about it at the time. Yeah. Is it in a place now where obviously relationships are work forever. But did you feel like it was just a lot of work during those few months and now it is a little

bit easier? Or do you feel like it's a constant we need to communicate, see where we're at, check in? Or has it gotten back to a place where it does feel a little more natural, less work has to be put into it? Yeah, I'm laughing because it's making me remember this meme that I saw last week. It was, I'm not even sure who it was, but it was like a couple of lesbians. And they're like, heterosexual people are always talking about like relationships. There's so much work.

I'm just like totally mocking us. So yeah, I mean, I do think they're like, you signed up for this, Richard. Like the difference that we came across is like, how do we find ways of working on it that like can feel fun? So it doesn't need to feel like this big, heavy. Like, okay, let's go work on our relationship again. But like what are simple things that we can do like every day that take very little effort, very little time? but it keeps that thread going between us so that it doesn't feel like it's always as heavy. Well, and it's sex. So it should be, like, the reward is great. You know, it's not that, like,

you sit down and work out your finances. Like, you're working out your sex life. The reward is right. Yeah. Yeah. So let me ask you. So, you know, for couples that are, I would say, like, quote unquote, just ordinary. Like, there isn't, a parent hasn't died. There is an extreme panic over, like, money or job security. If it's just day. And it's just, day to day, like, I'm just a little tired of this or a little bored of this. Like, where do you start the conversation? Because I want to say that like, I understand that certain real traumas in your life and stress make you, of course, I want to have sex and that's a different conversation. Yeah, absolutely. Okay, so let me start off by telling you guys what typically happens. So people

don't have these experiences talking about sex in relationships. We wait until things get really bad. And it gets to the point where we've got all this anger, resentment, frustration, confusion, fear boiling over. And we end up doing exactly what Zander and I doing is like the first conversation is a massive fight, right? And of course, that only reinforces like, ooh, sex is a bad thing to talk about

because if we have to talk about it, it's bad, we're going to get in a fight, things are not going well. So instead, my recommendation, which is the first conversation in the book, is to start with just the acknowledgement that you guys are having sex. Like, it is wild how few couples have been together

years, even decades, and never really had an honest conversation about their sex life. Like, we just do not talk about it. So for so many couples, it's literally just got to start with having that topic be a more comfortable, like, part of your conversation. So that's some of the feedback that we've gotten about our Instagram account because we show up in stories together every day. And people say, like, you know, it actually really helped us just to start talking about sex in a more general sense rather than starting to talk about our sex life specifically.

So having those conversations where you're not trying to solve anything, you're not making any requests, you're not giving any complaints, you're literally just talking about sex and getting comfortable with it as a topic of conversations. That's the best starting point. Like, what is talking about sex? I can't. I can't. Yeah, yeah. I can't relate. Yeah. Like, what are we talking about? I know for you guys are not going to relate with this conversation. You're like, I've had this for a living. I've had these problems in my life, of course. Okay. So my favorite starting point is literally just with confidence. So I lay out in that first chapter to bring up just randomly out of the blue like one of your favorite sexual memories with your partner. So like give them a compliment. Say like, you know what just randomly popped into my head the other day or you know what I had a dream about last night. That time that we did, da, da, da, da, da, you know. And so you're recalling a memory. You're reminding each other like, hey, we have had really great sex. Remember we do it and we can be good at it. Okay. That's a positive memory. You know, it's going to create like a positive experience. experience. And then, so keep that going for like every day, every other day for like a week or two

weeks where you're just giving your partner a compliment. Like you look so good today. It doesn't have to even be explicitly sexual. You look really good today. I was thinking of that time that you did this to me. I love the way you kiss me, the way you hold me. So you're just like laying that. And again, it's not any sort of like, don't do that or I need you to do this. It's like just putting the conversation on the table. And hopefully they're receptive. Yeah. I mean, They might say like, you know, like, wait, why are you bringing that up? And that's fine. Like, the point is not that you're, like, trying to catch them off guard and they don't realize

what they're talking about. But you can just say something like, it just popped into my head and it was a fun memory and I figured I'd share it with you. Well, and we always say things like that. You can fib a little. You can say, and you can say, like, I walked by that movie theater today where I blew you and the fact that you could just, sure. It means that reminds you, you know, so-and-so called and it reminded me of the time

at their wedding when we. You know, had that hot sex or this hotel or vacation or anything like that. You just want to create this positive association. When we start talking about sex, it's a good thing. I feel good. I'm getting compliments. I'm remembering good memories that we shared. Okay.

Okay. And then if they're not picking up what you're putting down, if you're like, this is a little more broken than I thought it was, what's the next step? Or what's the next step in general, if it's going well. Yeah. Yeah. When do you start having sex?

Yeah. I mean, it's really going to be dependent on where each couple is. Like, are they even in a place where they're like, there's something going on that I don't want to be doing? Or, you know, I think in general, it can be a lot better to start with making like positive requests rather than immediately going into the like complaints. And we can get into like the nuance of like some complaints are more urgent than others and we can get into those first. But I think going into like making any sort of positive requests of like, you know, I really love when we go so slow. Like this is one of the biggest complaints I hear from women.

is like we just jump right into the intercourse and there's like very little in it for me. So making a request in a positive way of like, I love when we go so slow. Can we do that next time? Something like that. You told me something on the phone that I want to validate. You said that like some women are like, I don't like that we just jump into it. You said that you hold people and that what 90% of women said their favorite part of sex is not the penetrative part of it. It's like everything else. Yeah, 91% of women.

We said like is intercourse like your favorite activity that you guys do to? together of women who have sex with men, and 91% of them said, no, there's something else that I prefer. And it's just, I mean, it's so important to recognize, like, our bodies are not really wired to feel a lot of sensation or to have orgasms from penetration alone, but it's something that most women don't know. And so they feel like something is horribly wrong, horribly broken with them, and they're having sex. It feels like there's nothing in it for me. I'm not enjoying it. It's just kind of, I'm laying there, staring at the ceiling while my partner is jackhammering away. I'm like, what's wrong with me that I don't love this?

It's very funny because I'm thinking of some men learning this stat and being like, what? I have a lot of heartbroken head up there. Like, I'm thinking of if you pulled 100 men and they'd be like, what do you think the best part of the sexual experience is for you and your partner? He'd be like, when I'm fucking her. When my dicks inside of her. And women are like, no, honey. No, sweetie. No Richard. Sorry, Charles. It is so true, though. I mean, even what we do with our erotic app, we have these erotic audio stories. And if there are 10 minutes, two minutes of the story is that, you know, so much of it is like the buildup and the foreplay and all those types of things.

Yeah, absolutely. And so that's not to say that intercourse can't be pleasurable or feel very intimate and, you know, enjoyable. But I think it's so important for us to recognize it's just, not how women's bodies are really wired to work. And the foreplay, I actually hate the word foreplay because I think it implies like these are the things we do beforehand. Like intercourse is the main thing and we just do like the quick little foreplay beforehand. But I know everybody uses that word. Well, do you have another word?

I don't. I keep trying to think of none. I'm like, other people use core play and I'm like, okay, that's all right. But yeah. That sounds a little like hardcore. It sounds like a workout to me. I went to the core play class.

I'm like, I'm so sore today. Solid core class. If anybody has a better name for it, let me know. Can I ask you a question? I want to know your answer. So when you masturbate, is it to thoughts of penetrative sex or is it thoughts of like other stuff besides? Like, Ashley, tell you, masturbate.

I mean, sometimes it's like the full circle experience. But the way that I would start conjuring up a memory is not with being penetrated right away. It's like the pushing me up against a wall or something like that or something that like got me in the mood. Me too. So I'm like, that's how I feel. Like so much my masturbation is like my head. The thoughts going through my head are not like

dick and vagina. It's swimming away. 30 years you want to masturbate to dick and vagina. I don't even want to put anything in my vagina. Even in my fantasies, you're just on my clit. My porn was all clit. I only incorporated a penis into the porn I watched during the pandemic.

because I just missed it so much. And here's one of like the terrible things that happens in heterosexual sex, too, is like when we start having issues, a lot of guys think like, okay, you know, we're not having sex that often. Maybe she's turning me down a lot. So when you do get a yes, a lot of guys are like, well, let me get right to it before she changes her mind kind of thing. And so a lot of couples end up like just shortening that time of the buildup.

And it just goes straight to the intercourse, which just creates even more of this negative cycle of like, I'm not enjoying the sex that we're having, so why would I crave it? So we're going to have less of it. You know, it's just a really awful cycle. Well, and if there's weird stuff going on in your relationship where there's tension or resentment, it makes you want to be so intimate even less. It almost forces you to have that mechanical quick intercourse as opposed to like touching and feeling and all the romanticism when you're kind of resentful of your partner as it stands in the first place. For sure. It's really easy to be like, oh, just do your thing. Yeah. I'll just get it over with type of thing. Do you hear that a lot from couples that like it becomes a little robotic

after a certain amount of time? Like I remember thinking of my longest term, X, it was like the same menu all the time. I would like wake up, I'd blow him, I'd get on top, he'd get on top, and we both be done. I'd have to do it again for seven days. I was thrilled. Yeah, you can like script it out to the moment. Like he's going to touch my breast and this way for like 10 seconds and then you know exactly what's coming. So of course like sex drive is one of the biggest complaints that people have. They're always like, I have no sex drive. What do I do? And the first The first question I ask people is, well, tell me about the quality of the sex that you're having.

Is it something that's worth craving? And I think so few of us make that connection between our enjoyment of it and our desire for it. But for 95% of people, it's like, you describe to me what your sex life looks like, okay, makes perfect sense why you have zero desire for it. Why would you? Right. Yeah.

So, I mean, again, we don't have like all day with you and people can read your book and they can also seek therapy themselves. But the book is about these conversations that you have about sex. Can we just discuss like another one that you really love? Yeah. So the second one is what do we need to feel connected? And I think this is another really important piece that gets left out of this conversation. Like we talk about sex and we go immediately to thinking about the physical act of it. And I think a lot of people don't realize that like emotional intimacy and physical intimacy are so deeply intertwined. And so most couples, these, these days, like you're leading lives that are so busy and full. Like most couples will say,

we just feel like ships passing in the night, like, or roommates more than lovers. And so it's so important to recognize, like, if you're feeling so disconnected from somebody all day long, it's like, I don't even know who you are anymore. You're just kind of like, you're in my space. Why are you going to feel the desire to be wildly intimate with them later that night? So that conversation is all about like uncovering practical ways that you can still feel connected to your partner. So it feels like you're not starting from ice cold and trying to get yourself to boiling, but there's like a simmer going between the two of you. And can that be things that aren't sexual at all?

Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. I think that a lot of couples are just missing any sort of emotional intimacy. Like little non-sexual touches, compliments, like, you know, spending quality time together. A lot of love languages type stuff can come up here. So that's a great one. Compliments are such like, I feel like I see so many couples that don't do that with each other.

And the couples that I like the most, it's our friends, husbands that are like, my wife looks so hot. Look at the way she dresses. She's a fucking fox. I feel like I don't see that in so many couples. And when I do, it's like so nice and refreshing. I'm like, I don't care. You just have to just tell me I'm funny. I mean, it's nice to like get a compliment personally, but I think there's also something special about the way your partner talks about you in front.

of other people. Oh my gosh, totally. I mean, we can all, I'm sure, think of examples of couples where it's like, they're just ragging on each other the whole time or like, you know, complaining or ignoring each other. And then when you see somebody exactly like what you were saying, like, my wife is so fucking hot. You're like, oh, that's so cute. Yeah. We love to hear what people say about us behind our backs. Like, nice stuff. Like, I feel like that's a turn on. Yeah. Huge turn on. Should we move on to how to tell someone what you don't like what they're doing in the about a redirect.

And we want to discuss actual, actionable language and things that you can do when you're like, stop doing that? Yeah. Why would you do that? Okay, so let me set a little groundwork here. So I like to divide these into three categories. So at one end of the spectrum, we have what I actually call like sexual perfectionism territory. And I'll get back to that in a sec.

The other end of the spectrum is like actual boundary or safety issues. And then we've got this like delightful gray area in the middle where I think we'll spend most of our time. But so the sexual perfectionism thing is I've actually found that a lot of people, because of the fucking fairy tale, we have this idea that every moment of sex should just be passionate and intense and feel so good. But the reality is like it's totally normal for your pleasure

and your connection to kind of rise and fall throughout an interaction. Like let's say for example, if Xander is going down on me And there's a moment where it's just like, it's not feeling as good. I'm not going to jump in right in that moment and be like, stop doing that. Go back to this. Go do that instead. Like, that's going to feel intimidating for me because then I'm going to feel like I'm having to correct him every two minutes. It's going to feel shitty for him because he feels like he's getting like jumped on.

So instead, I think those can be good territory to just kind of like wait it out for a minute. So not put this pressure that every single moment has to be wildly pleasurable. Because like you don't want that pressure for yourself either. I have to do such a good job to my partner that the connection never wanes for a second, right? So it's like just wait it out in those kinds of situations. And just nine times out of ten, it's going to get better in that moment, you know, in the next couple of moments. So that's one category. And the one time out of ten, it'll go into the gray area.

The other end of the spectrum is if something's happening that's like a boundary or safety issue. So let's say it's something that you don't feel comfortable doing. It's causing you pain in the moment. Have you guys done a sexual pain episode? No. Oh my God. I have a good guest for you. Okay.

30% of women were in pain the last time they had sex. Isn't that wild? In different ways? Are we talking about just that they have like vaginal pain or something that their partner was doing was causing them pain or both or either? Yeah, usually something their partner was doing. It's typically with penetration. Can that 30%?

Can that change? I feel like when I was a little young, I used to be in pain a lot during sex. It's not excruciating, but I don't feel like that anymore. Yeah, it can change, but there are a lot of sexual pain conditions. This is another thing that does not get talked about. We should definitely do an episode on this. And then also, of course, sometimes just high level, it's just you need lube. Yes.

I mean, that's one of the quick solution fixes for it. It's not everybody's problem. But I mean, I've been in pain where I'm like, oh, I just need more loop. And that's why we sell a great loop. It was probably because I didn't like the sex I was having, honestly. It probably didn't part of it. Yeah, yeah. There are a lot of potential causes for it.

but I think as women, we're kind of taught to just let it happen and just continue. A lot of us think that pain just is a part of sex. That just is what it is. So I just like to be super clear of like, no, you should never be in pain. And you're going to destroy your sex drive if you're having sex with you in pain too. So if you're in pain, if somebody is crossing a boundary, doing something you don't want to do, that's a moment where it's just like you just have to speak up in that moment and say something like, I need to change something up.

that's not on the menu for me tonight. Like, that's not something that I feel interested in doing tonight, something like that, but be really clear and directive. And it doesn't have to be a slap in the face, like, fuck you for doing that kind of thing. But just like, yeah, that's not really something that I'm open to doing tonight or I'd like to switch things up right now. So, you need to take a break.

We cannot do this. Yeah. So that's that. And then we've got the gray zone, which is, you know, a lot of different stuff can come up in that category. So in general, the advice that I have, when your partner is doing something that you're not loving, is you're always going to get better results

when you're making your request if you frame it positively than if you make a negative complaint. And that's true inside the bedroom and just generally in life. So try to figure out what is a way that you can give some positive feedback to your partner instead of making a complaint? If you're at the early stages of a relationship or you're just starting to have more communication about sex,

give your partner a ton of compliments is where we like get back to the compliments thing like a lot of times if you're giving your partner enough good feedback you might not get to a point where there even is something like super negative that they're doing because you've given them feedback of like I love when you go slow like that I like it when you touch me I prefer you going down on me versus fingering me so that kind of stuff but in the moment we want to think about what's a way that I can kind of positively redirect somebody And I will say people get a little bit resistant to this because we have that fucking fairy tale in our head thinking like our partner's just supposed to know what to do, just supposed to magically figure it out.

And sometimes we feel like I don't even know what I want or what to ask for. But I do think it's really important for us to recognize that responsibility is on us to figure it out. We can't expect our partners to be mind readers. And we wouldn't want to be expected of that in reverse either. So really trying to think about, Okay, how is the way that I can frame this?

So it might be something like, oh, that softer pressure that you were using a minute ago. Like, that felt so good will you go back to doing that? Something like that. So you're giving them a compliment, but you're giving them a little bit of a direction with it as well. Okay. So something, and we do want to give like better techniques for doing some of these things. Something that I've struggled with with a couple guys is they want to stick a finger in my ass during sex and I hate it. Like I really, it takes me out of the moment.

I don't like it. But if that's going to like really turn them on, I want to find them. I want to find ways that maybe I could find it more pleasurable, you know? Because like if that's really where you want to be, for the finger in my butthole, every time you're coming, fine, I can figure out how to enjoy this more. But like all I've ever conjured is like stop doing that. I hate that. Don't do that anymore. Yeah.

I mean, that sounds like it's a pretty strong feeling for you. I don't like that. I don't want that to happen. So I can appreciate that you're wanting to be like a generous partner. You're like, okay, if this is something you're really into, let me see if I can find ways to enjoy it. So there could be a compromise. Like maybe there's something like your partner's just touching your butthole instead of going into it. So that could be something. But if it's, if you're keep coming up against this like, don't do that. I hate it. I don't like it. I would

say don't force yourself to push your boundaries. Sounds like you have a pretty clear. Well, I mean, what you like don't. That's, I guess obviously that's a turn on for them. But like it's probably more of what they think you want. Like what guys like really just love to stick a finger in the, But, like, they probably just think that's what you want or they think it's hot in some way. But they can definitely do without it. It's not like they're getting off by their finger. There's not that much sensation in your finger. Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

There's not a bit. Oh, it feels so good up there. I'm just like, I feel like you can, if they're also, I mean, I, I slept with a guy that was, like, such a butt guy that I was like, do even know that I have tits. Like, do you know that I have anything else going on in my body besides my butt. Like, all he wanted to do was, like, be back there, everything to do with it. So I feel like if it's that, they could, like, spank you. They can be kind of in the crack a little bit. They can do more stuff with your butt than stick a finger in the hole.

I like the rimming idea, actually, because they can still feel like they're like butthole adjacent or like around it, but I'm not having. Also, I have no problem telling somebody, don't fucking put your fingers there. Like, I'll draw a boundary anytime I need to, but I was trying to compromise. And I feel like a little butthole play, I could get behind a little more. Okay, so if there's something like your partner's doing in the moment and you just cannot figure out a way to like, how do I redirect or like change this into something, You can do the like, hey, look over there technique that I like to come.

What? Just tell your partner, hold up, let me focus on you for a second. So you're changing things up. It's just like giving you the opportunity for a total reset. But listen, I just feel like men are like some of their dumb brains would be like, okay, so every time I put a finger in her butt, I get a blowjog? Like, they're going to think that they're being rewarded. There's not classical conditioning going on here.

You just do it sparingly. Can you have a bigger conversation if they keep going to the butt? It's a little bit of last ditch effort. But it can be like a great, if you're just really stuck in that moment, like let me just focus on you for a moment because that feels really sexy. Who wouldn't want you to focus on them for a second? And it just gives you the opportunity to like reset the moment. Yes.

And you might be able to figure out some positive feedback or some coaching to give to your partner while you're doing it. So you might say something like, let's say you're going down on your partner. He's a guy. And you can like lick the tip of. his head and see like, hey, do you like the way I'm licking you? I want you to do this to me next. So you're actually like teaching him a little technique in the moment. Or it could be more broad. Like, do you like when I go nice and slow like this? I want you to do that to me next. Okay. So it could be super specific or it can be general. But it's a very sexy way of giving

your partner a little bit of information. I think we, I'm just trying to think of what we see the most questions, complaints, emails, messages about. I mean, a lot of it is oral sex and either that they aren't going down there or they're doing it totally wrong. They can't find the clit. I mean, I think that that can be like, I love what you're doing. It just needs to be what higher up. Like, I don't know.

I feel like, I've never really experienced where a guy really has no idea what is going on down there. Oh, yeah. It's not pleasant. Yeah. I mean, so one great resource that we have is we have these four play guides where, where we have super specific and detailed illustrated techniques. And so we love recommending couples get those together

because it really levels the playing field. You feel like you're both kind of like learning new techniques together and you can try things out together. It makes it feel fun to learn new techniques rather than like, oh my God, now I've got to teach you what to do. But another technique that you can do, I call it the eye exam technique. Like, you know when you go get an eye exam and they're like, okay, what's better like this one or this one kind of thing?

So compare two techniques against each other. So it gives you a little bit of information to go off of. Because if you ask somebody, tell me what you like. That just feels like a really big question. It's hard to answer. Like I can't give a super step by step, like do exactly this and then exactly that. Like it's just, it's too big of a question. But if Xander's going down on me and he's like, okay, what do you like better if I lick like this or I look like that?

I use this pressure with my tongue or I use this pressure with my tongue. Then it's like I have options to choose from. And he's not feeling like I'm criticizing him because I'm picking the one that's better, right? And it's like this fun kind of we're exploring together, trying different things. So you can switch off like, I'll do it to you and then you do it to me. But if you compare different techniques, and again, it can be specific stroke, it can be pressure, it can be speed, it can be like two completely different activities. Like, do you like it better when I finger you or go down on you?

But it's just a more fun way to explore and give that feedback. to each other. Okay. I love that. I'm assuming also I'm thinking of other things. I bet there's a lot of like guys putting their finger inside of you because they think that's what they're supposed to do. So I like that a lot. But you mean during what's maybe it's down on you? Especially younger, I feel like we have talked about this like the term fingering. Some people don't know exactly. I mean, it can mean putting your fingers inside. But some women don't like that. And they're like, you're supposed to be like playing with my clit or like the outside as opposed to like just jamming your fingers inside of me. So I feel like that can be a little difficult to redirect. Yeah. So that can be

a fun one of like, oh, do you like it better when I put my fingers inside of you on your clip or I do both at the same time? So that could be something to explore. But yeah, I think a lot of men, I mean, and again, they're conditioned by TV, movies, porn to believe that the penetration is like the be-all end-all. So the funny comparison that I like to make is like it's really important for us to think about it from a nerve-ending standpoint of like what parts of our body. bodies are actually wired to feel a lot of pleasure. And the interesting thing, too, is that our genitals, we all start off basically as one gender in the womb and our genitals don't differentiate until like eight to 11 weeks. So different parts of our genitals actually match up with different

parts of like male genitals. So the vagina, the equivalent of the vagina in a woman is actually called the prostatic utricle in a man, which is like, where, no man is out there expecting, like, where are my prostatic utrical orgasms? Like, how do I get that? So that all sounds a little complicated. So I like to boil it down and just say like intercourse for a woman is basically like stroking a man's balls. So like, sure, that might be fun. It could be pleasurable. If you have balls that are really sensitive, great. Explore that. Play with those balls. But would we expect the vast majority of men to be wildly orgasmic from a little ball stroking? No. So why are we setting this expectation for women that we should be wildly orgasmic from a part of our body that just does not have

very many nerve endings? Uh-huh. Uh-huh. That's interesting to think about. So guys get that a little bit more. I'm like, let's imagine an alternate universe where intercourse is like a guy rubbing his balls on a woman's clitoris. You know, like, I'm like, I'm getting the stimulation of the most sensitive part of my body and you're getting stimulation of a very insensitive part of your body. Like, why is that not working for you? Yeah, I would get off instantly. You could rub anything on my clip. Even your boss.

Run the ball. And I also like just taking someone's hand gently, but I think it can be hot. I mean, I don't know. Maybe I think that to do that in like a sexy way, just like moving someone a little bit from like where they were previously. Sometimes I think you can do it without words. But if it's, you know, you're going to feel the moment out. Yeah, I like a request.

I love stick your fingers inside of me. I like when somebody goes down on me and is like sucking on my clit and figuring me. I like the whole shebang. But what if somebody is like my man just doesn't go down on me at all? Yeah, that's where it's going to be time to like make a direct request of them. And so I always like to start again with framing it in a positive way. Like you know it sounds so hot to me. Or again, we can do a little bit of fibbing.

Like I have this incredibly sexy dream last night about you going down on me. I can't get it out of my mind. Like I would love for you to do that. You can even turn it into this fun thing about like, you know, why don't we have a little oral only night tonight? Like, I'll go down on you, you go down on me. So you make it feel playful rather than coming in hot with the like, you motherfucker, you never go down on me.

I'm so pissed. You don't care. You know, like make it feel more fun. And I'm sure there's also a world, especially if we're talking to younger people, that they just are intimidated because they don't think they know what they're doing. And they've heard women say like, he's so bad at this and he can't find the clit. And so they've gotten in their head and they were never really. taught. I don't know how you really learn.

I don't know how guys learn. I don't know if it's like actually like American pie. Yeah, another story that I tell in the book is at this same time I was noticing that like Xander just really wasn't paying very much attention to my pleasure. It was very intercourse focused. He wasn't really like he'd touch me or go down on me

for like 30 seconds and then we'd move on and I kept getting the sense of like God, this was actually a bit earlier in the relationship and I'm like, God, this guy seems so amazing in so many other ways. But like he kind of seems like an asshole in the bedroom and I don't understand what's going on. And so I finally got up the nerve to talk to him about it. And it turned out his last girlfriend before me had said, like, she had a lot of orgasm

issues. And she's like, actually, it really puts women on the spot if you like finger them and go down on them for a long time. So like it's the more polite thing to do to just move ahead. And so he was thinking he was being this nice guy of like, oh, I've got the cheat code to women and I know what women want, he thought he was being so kind and sensitive. And I was over here thinking like, God, this guy is such an asshole. So again, this is like why I'm so passionate about communication. Like I could have very easily broken up with him. Like, this guy has a selfish asshole in the bedroom. I'm over it. But instead, by just opening up that conversation, I realized, like, there was this awful miscommunication. I don't know why this woman said that to him in the first place. But like,

it was very easy for us to reset from there and realize like, oh, you want me to go down on you? Oh, my God, I'm totally happy to do that. Well, we say that all the time that people are just a product of the partners they've had before you. And what pleasured, if we're talking about a man, what his girlfriend, girlfriends before you liked. I mean, Raina doesn't like guys going down on her for some insane reason. So if a guy dated her for a long period of time, especially very seriously, especially if, you know, it was his first serious relationship, but you just didn't like it.

He absolutely would think the next partner just didn't like it. So I'm glad that you brought that up because we have discussed that before and how they're just going off the last one. And sometimes I think what we like to hammer home to especially any men listening is like every woman's body's different. Just because you blew some woman's mind doesn't mean what you're doing is going to blow the mind of the next one. And I think it's important for women to recognize too. Like it's very sexy to tell your partner what you want. Yes. You know, like we are all desperate for more feedback.

and in the bedroom. We all want to know, am I doing a good job? Do you like this? What could I do to be the best that you've ever had? And so we get so scared on the other end of that of like, oh, I don't want to give feedback. I don't want to tell them anything. But like, it's so valuable to hear that.

And a lot of people are just desperate to hear like, I would love for you to do this to me. You would turn me on so much if you did this. Yes, it turns me on to turn another person on. I mean, that's what I really enjoy. And I think kind feedback is great. I don't mind at all. And I think how I would want it, if I was like giving a blowjob to somebody and they stopped me at any point, I don't think I'd love that.

Or if, you know, right after sex, they were like, I didn't really enjoy that experience. Like, it would really hurt or upset me. And I feel like there's just kinder ways to bring it up. But I am happy for the feedback because then I'm like, how great is this? I get to like be even better at this for you. Yeah, absolutely. Another great word that you can use to when you're making requests is like, just use the word curious. I'm curious about trying this.

I'm curious to see what this would be like. Because sometimes when we give feedback, like, it can set up this dynamic of like, I'm the teacher and you're the student and there's this power imbalance of like, now I'm coming in here and like teaching you what to do or telling you what to do. But if you use the word curious, it just kind of, it levels that playing field again. And it makes it feel like your partner's not being judged. It's like, oh, well, they're just curious to see. And it gives you a little bit more space too of like, well, I don't have to guarantee that I'm going to like something in order to ask for it.

I just have to like be curious enough to know what it's going to be like. Okay. So we wanted to talk about a little bit of technique and we'd have on our list, banking, choking. I sent her down to you in 69. I sent her an email with this yesterday and I was like, this is our work emails. Yeah. Well, so I, it's funny because I've been doing a lot of just research in my stand-up of asking guys if they're choking. And I have this whole thing that like Gen Z is just not choking like millennials do. And older guys do. And I don't know if they're scared or they're

timid or they're not sure what to do. Yeah. Well, which consent. We can't, you know, we, of course, consent, but I just, I think it's intimidating too, you know, and I think, of course not all women want a hand on their neck, but I've been kind of interested in this topic of guys that are like, I would never do that. And it's like, you should try to get into it. Bad Sander. No, it was so funny. I got your email and we were having breakfast this morning. I was like, let's run through the topics that they want me to talk about. So we're like loudly talking about spanking. He got all excited like, oh, don't forget to tell him to do, da, da, da.

Just like yelling about spanking and choking in the middle of this restaurant. Oh my gosh, great. And spanking. I mean, I love it. I've always loved it and I'll tell someone to do it. And I usually get what I want. But I also see a world in which a guy, for example, has never done that. He's like, you want me to hit you?

Yeah. Like, Zander got really nervous about the choking. And he's like, you know, I've only ever seen it in porn where it's like, it's really aggressive and it feels like violating and creepy and gross. And like, I'm nervous. I don't want to hurt you. It just like doesn't sound right. So let's start with choking.

Which also, we do choking tutorials at our shows, too. So we're-Rame and I are out on these streets, really. We're choking pros. We know all the different kinds. If you've used two hands, you have gone too much. If you're choking from the top, I always tell guys of like, don't go top two hands. Then you're just strangling.

And that's, maybe someone want it? I don't. I was surprised we've had to tell people, don't come from behind with both hands. Oh, gosh. No, no, no. We did this. At the show, we were in Phoenix.

and we brought these guys up and Rayna was like, the waiters at the venue? Yeah, there was not enough guys, so we brought the staff up and this one guy, Rayna was like, why don't you show us how you would choke Ashley? And he was like, okay. And he came from behind with both. And we have this image of me like this.

And the way he thought he knew exactly what he was doing. Oh, no. Step right up to the plate. He ran there. But then like Andrew Collin, for example, a friend of ours, I did his podcast like years ago. And he was like, can you just show me like how you do it? And at first he did too much pressure.

The fingertips, I was like you've got to do like a cuff. Yes, exactly. Don't want to take your trache. Nothing on the front of the throat. It's only the sides of this. And you can do this to yourself. Like the sides of your throat are pretty tough.

But even the slightest bit of pressure on the front of your throat and you're like starting to choke. Yeah. I'm like it's my wind by blacking out. Okay. So anyway. If you're a guy who's nervous about it and you've never done it before, like a really great way to ease your way into it is just like start to caress your hand up the neck.

Yes. And you don't even have to squeeze. it's just like putting a little bit of pressure there. And that movement, you can move from the breasts up to the neck. Like, that's super sexy. And you can see if your partner is, like, responding to that. So that's a great way to start. But then, yeah, if you do want to squeeze, you want to do it really lightly.

Like, I think people underestimate how gentle you can go and still make an impact. But, again, the pressure is only on the sides. It's never on the front of the throat. I just love everything in my neck area. Like kissing, like hands, all the things. So I think you can even do that making out. Like I love, so we always say like if a guy's got his hand on your neck when you're making out, you're like, it's a lot.

It's going to be good. The back of the neck too. Very underrated, but the nape of your hair. Oh my God. So I think that this is, these are the things we want people to know. And I know, you know, mostly of our audience is women, but them even relating to their partner. And of course, like slipping them this episode is just, it's not as intimidating as you think.

And it's can, you don't have to go zero to 60. Yeah. If you've never choked somebody before. It can start, yeah, soft touch at the neck. I mean, this is another sneaky way that the sexual perfectionism comes creeping into our sex life is that we all feel like we have to go zero to 60 immediately. And it's like there's something really great about taking small steps and easing your way in. And there's a lot to explore too.

Like a little gentle caress up your throat can be way more pleasurable than like a tight squeeze. So it's like don't downplay them as like, oh, they're little baby steps. It's like, no, they're really. sexy, fun, exciting things that you can do. And it's not easy for everybody. I've had like experiences where somebody's choking me and their arm is laying against my neck a little bit. And it really, it feels, I mean, nobody's trying to be violent with you, of course, but it feels a little violent or it hurts. And I don't know how to stop them because the point is to like be a little bit scary and dangerous.

Well, that's what happened to me in Greece. I was like, I'm in a chokehold. Yeah. I'm just going to let him finish. I think. I'll tap out. I'll tap out if I need to. When he comes, are you faint? A little safe word might be good to use two if you're going to do some like intense choking.

For sure. Okay, so I like these choking tips. Let's go to spanking. Okay, so spanking is kind of the opposite. We're choking. A lot of people underestimate, like, how gently you can do it with spanking. A lot of people think that you should go soft. No, we know.

Also, we, I can't tell you many times I've been softly spanked and it really gives me the ick. Like they're going to spank you really hard and you just get a tap. It is so ick. When Raina's turnoffs include too light of a spank. That's what gives you the ick. I completely resonate. There's nothing worse. There's nothing worse when you think they're winding up for like a real hit and they just graze

your butt cheek. Like they caress it. We do this in our live shows. But I get it. I get that they're scared to hit you. I know. Well, some guys are. Other guys go way too hard.

We do this in our live shows sometimes and like I'll be bad. over the chair and they will knock the chair over with me in it. Raina falls into me. I'm like, you should get his number. Yeah. I actually like catches me. I've walked 10 feet from this bank. I don't know.

I think that your butt can handle a lot. And I mean, I've been at points where I'm like, I'm about to come and it does hurt. And I'm like, I'm sure my ass is like bright red. But I'm, I'll tell you to stop if I don't want it anymore. But I have kind of like gritted my teeth and taken it because I'm like close. And it's like that pleasure and pain. I mean, I just think not everybody can handle that much, but I actually is a high-paid tolerance. Our asses are equipped to handle it.

But then sometimes I'm like, can you just get the other cheek? Like, I feel so unbalanced. Yeah, switch it up a little bit. And like that's the one with the dent in it. Like, just do the other. Their left cheek focused. Okay. Also, you have to spend me like you mean it.

Dirty talk too. I feel like I can tell if you don't mean it. You know, like when somebody calls me a slut and they don't mean it, I can tell. We get very fixated on technique with sex, but the energy behind that technique is just as important. Okay, we have totally derailed you. How do you get guys to spank you? Or anyone to spank you. I want to talk about the energy of spanker.

So if you're in a relationship, I recommend that you have a little spanking session outside of the bedroom so you can get a sense of the level of pressure that you guys each like because it's too much in the bedroom. It's like in the moment where it's either too soft and it gives you the ick or it's too hard and you're like tears coming down your face. So do it outside the bedroom. I love that. And have your partner like start kind of soft and work their way up

and then tell them the level of pressure that you like. So it's like getting a sense. This is also a really great trick to use for hand jobs because a lot of women underestimate how much pressure you can use on a penis. So you can like grab it and like squeeze and have him, like you slowly squeeze tighter and have him tell you like that's the level of pressure that I like. Wait, I love that.

Yeah. That's a fun exercise. It's so valuable. You will be, I promise you. We're doing handjob squeezing tonight after we watch. You'll be shocked by how hard you can go. A lot of women are doing like the sad spank equivalent of a hand job. Just like barely, barely.

They're like grazing it. Yeah. So, okay. So other things with spanking is like the location is important too. Like if you're too close into the crack, like you can hit the tailbone or you can hit the hip as well. So when you're in the moment, One thing to do is like use your hand to kind of like caress the butt. So we're not spanking yet.

We're just caressing it. And like use that to kind of find in the mediest area. That's where we want spanking to happen. So you use your hand to kind of like find it. And then once you found it like then go in from the spank. Got it. Yeah. I'm not that I'm the one that's banking, but totally.

I'm thinking of when guys have done that. Like yes, they're finding where they're about to just wind up. If you don't know your target, like it's very easy to go off. That's so funny. You do have to like find you. You're targeting first. The fleshy part of the fun.

And it doesn't, when they do it in the wrong part, it doesn't even make a good sound. You're like, oh. That felt flat. They just smack your side? You're like, there's no pleasure zones there. You're just punching me on the side of my body. You got to find this fun. Okay.

Okay. I want to talk about energy for a second, though. What if you're like, I just know his energy doesn't say I want to spank you? Yeah, that's a tricky one. Like, so you might have to have this conversation. with them, like, asking him, like, or just giving him that positive feedback of, I love it when you spank me. I think it's so hot. It turns me on so much. A lot of guys, like, get worried about hurting you or, like, I don't want to do that if it feels, like, degrading to you. So you

might just need to lead with that. I love being degrading. Yeah. So you literally say that to your partner. Like, that turns me on when you do that, when you get into that kind of energy. But I think even just talking about, like, what is the kind of energy that you most like to experience during sex? So it's different for everybody. It can be different. different in every moment or like in every interaction, but like what is that vibe that you're going for? I mean, this is another thing couples very rarely talk about. But I love picking, like, pick your five favorite words that you most frequently, you know, want to experience during sex. So is it like curiosity, is it exploration? Is it romance? You know, they can be totally varied. But I think

one of the most important ones is enthusiasm. Like somebody can have the best technique in the world, but if you can tell they're just not into it. Maybe they're not even present in the moment. They're just going through the motions. Like, that's some of the worst sex ever. Yes, I dated somebody like that. Perfect dick, great body, good-looking guy. I was just like, are my bothering you?

Yeah. Right. And I feel like you hear that with blowjobs where guys just say, I just want you to be enjoying it. That's the number one technique for a blowjob. If you are enthusiastic about it, you can have really shitty technique. But if you're really into it, he's going to be into it. Okay, can we just go back to spanking really quick?

I'm ready to do our spanking whole episode. You know what I think is funny that when guys varying technique, it's a quick and they pop back out or they kind of hold their hand there. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, it's either like they slap and they hold it or they go, and it is funny when they just like, they leave their hand there when they're done. But it's also kind of like, I think, tell me if it kind of compares, you wouldn't really understand.

But like when you do, when you get bikini waxed and the second they rip a thing off, they put their hand there to like kind of like, curve the pain. Yeah, that is the technique is it kind of helps dole the pressure. So if you're doing a really intense spank,

that actually is a good way to dull it. But if you want to feel the pain of it, then take the hand away and you'll feel it more. Like, it's funny when you're having sex with someone and you're like,

oh, that's their technique. Uh-huh. It's more the quick, pop, pop. Maybe we just end with 69ing. I'm going to be honest, guys. I'm just not a 69 fan personally. You're not really either. I just kind of like,

we wondered if you had any. No, no, I can, I just always have to be honest. about that. I'm like, I like the giving or the receiving at one time or the other. Okay, but a great technique for 69ing is try going on your sides instead of top to bottom. So a lot of people don't like 69ing because they're like somebody's face is always in somebody's ass. And it's just like, it's hard to, if you're the one on top, it's like, it's kind of hard, you're like hovering, but you need to use your hands to brace you up, but you also want to

use your hands to like do a blowjob or a hand job or you know, whatever it is. So it can be a little bit tricky, but if you flip over onto your sides, you can still have that configuration of like heads are in genitals, but it's a more comfortable position to be in for some people. You've got like an arm that's a little bit more free to help you work. Okay. I love that. Great. That's a great tip. I like just side sex anyway, aside from 69ing. Yeah. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. So just kind of take that into your 6090. Yeah. And also with 69ing, you can do just your hands. So I think a lot of people feel like you have to do sexual sex, but like, you could do just your hands, because hands are a lot easier to do as well.

And some people just prefer that. So it's fine. It counts if it's just hands. I'm excited for the next person I date to do this handjob night. Yeah. Where I'm just like, harder, harder? How much more? It's just like so funny to me. I think hand jobs are one of the most underrated sex acts. People write them off. No, we agree. We love them. I love the stroke a dick. They're fun to do. And a lot of people are like, oh, he can do it better than, you know, than I can't.

No. No. It's very fun to have it to you. He doesn't have to do it. It's nice. And then he teaches you how to do it. Yeah. It's very fun.

Oh my gosh. Vanessa, this was so wonderful. I love you. I love this conversation so much. Do you feel like anything was left out? You're dying to say? I mean, I could sit here and talk.

Okay. I know. We'll have to have you back. We'll do it in L.A. We'll have to catch up in L.A. I'm so excited that you guys are coming out. We are too. We are too.

Yeah, we'll do. I love all. Your episodes are great. So people are looking for a podcast to listen to about you have a 69 episode, you have a squirting episode. I would get granular. We have a child-free episode too.

I know that that was something that you guys did. That's our most popular one. Wow, really? Yeah, I decided we're going to be child-free. Yeah. I know I loved you. Love to see it. I really want to listen to that

because we came at that from obviously two single women. And so I'm definitely going to cue that up and listen to you guys, discuss it as a couple. You were so great. And this is wonderful. I'm sure everybody's going to want to find you everywhere they can,

your website, your Instagram, everything. So tell them, and then tell them when the book comes out and everything else they can find. Yeah. So I would love to connect with your audience on Instagram. We're at Vanessa and Xander. Shoot us a DM. Let us know you found out about me on Girls Got to Eat. We have a ton of information on Instagram, too.

Like we do stories, like I was saying, every day. So it's a great way to just, like, get the conversation going. Sometimes we even do stories where we say things that, like, okay, you watch the story and just crank the volume up. So your partner's, like, in the background and they hear it. They're like, wait, what are you talking about? So that's a great way to get it started too. I love that. That's great.

I mean, we always say use our podcast as a gateway to a discussion that you want to have. And I like that to just like crank up the volume on something. We literally do it. We put up a question box. It's like, what's something that you want us to say out loud so you can play it when your partner's in the room? I love that. Your partner comes around the corner. He's like, what was that about choking you order?

It's a great, like, great way to teach your partner something without having to stay. Play it in the apartment. That is so funny. So come say hi on Instagram, and we have a ton of information on our highlights about all of our different guides and courses. The Foreplay Guys. We have like Next Level Intercourse, all kinds of fun stuff. And then we're also online at VM Therapy.com. It's my initials.

The book, Sex Talks comes out February. We're so excited about it. And, yeah, our podcast Pillow Talks on all major podcast platforms. Oh, my gosh. I love a February release. We do. We love February. It's my drop.

It's my birthday. I love February. What's your birthday? The 13th. Love it. And also I just want to say this episode is pretty heteronormative people with penises. Yes. But you really do make an effort to be pretty inclusive with your business.

I've noticed. Yeah, absolutely. The inclusivity is really important to us. Obviously, Zander and I are male, female couple. So we try to like call that out. But we think everybody's deserving of hot sex and deep love. So we make a really big effort to make everything inclusive. Good.

Well, we loved having you. Thank you for being here with us. We really appreciate it. And Ashley's just going to take us out. Yes. Well, since this was a sex episode, we'll go ahead and plug Vibes Only. Only. You guys can shop all of our products at vibes only.com. You can download the app for iPhone and Android. It's called Vibes Only, of course, and of course pair them together. And Girls Gottoeat.com. You can get our tour dates, get tickets for our snack city tour in 2023. Girls Got to Eat Podcast on Instagram. I am Ash Hess on everything. Raina is reina. greenberg. We are Girls Got to Eat Podcast.

podcast on TikTok, Girls underscore Gotta Eat on Twitter, and of course, subscribe to the YouTube and watch on YouTube. And we'll see you next week. Have a good week, guys. Bye.