Girls Gotta Eat - How to Trust the Timing of Your Life with Krista Williams and Lindsey Simcik of Almost 30

Episode Date: June 2, 2025

No matter what stage of life you're in (but especially if you're feeling lost/unbalanced/behind at all), this episode will help guide you. We loved recording with Krista and Lindsey of Almost 30 podcast again and talking about all the changes that have happened in our own lives over the years in friendships, career, romantic relationships, breakups, and more. We discuss Saturn Returns and what age this personal transformation happens, how to trust your own timeline in life even when you feel like you're "behind," knowing when a relationship isn't right and when to leave, communicating with a partner effectively, body image and changes, and being at your "peace weight." We also talk about Krista's dating life post-divorce and Lindsey's motherhood journey. Before they join us, Rayna shares a story about meeting a guy in the wild and the pickup line she used, and Ashley spills some tea on a throuple who came to her recent show. Enjoy! Follow Almost 30 on Instagram @almost30podcast, listen to the Almost 30 podcast, and get their new book Almost 30: A Definitive Guide to a Life You Love for the Next Decade and Beyond. Follow us on Instagram @girlsgottaeatpodcast, Ashley @ashhess, and Rayna @rayna.greenberg. Visit girlsgottaeat.com for more. Thank you to our partners this week: Boulevard: Get 10% off your first year subscription when you book a demo at http://joinblvd.com/gge. Article: Get $50 off your first purchase of $100 or more at http://article.com/gge. Better Help: Get 10% off your first month at https://betterhelp.com/gge. Simply Pop: Go to https://cokeurl.com/simplyPOP to find out where you can try Simply Pop. Rocket Money: Cancel your unwanted subscriptions at https://rocketmoney.com/gge. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

One of the most liberating parts of this time and what I realized going into my 30s was like, I can trust the timing of my life. This podcast is a Dear Media production. Hi guys. Hi guys. Welcome back to another episode of Girls Gotta eat. Your birthday month. Oh my God.

Happy June. Is it? Gemini season? Yes. So we didn't have an episode last week. We missed you guys. I hope you guys had a slutty Memorial Day. Slipping and sliding.

Yeah. I love June. Fuck yeah. The best one. It's the best one. It's so good. So countdown to Raina Belusa starts now. I'm so excited, Ashley.

I spoke with our host for the house last night. And her and I are just like coordinating like the alcohol and the gift bags and everything is just like confirmed. And I made a mood board for everybody's outfits. I got really excited. You made me laugh so hard because I sent you the mood board. And it's festival themed and I was between like Coachella and Burning Man. And at first I was like for someone who hates Burning Man.

So Melanie was like, you should burn a man. Real appropriation. Yeah, and I was like, I can't appropriate Burning Man. I never gone to Burning Man. But then I started looking up Burning Man festival wear versus Coachella. And it's very me. It's like, just crazy over the top. Costume.

Whereas Coachella is very like, I don't know, flowy dress. You know, it's not flowing dress with cowboy boots. It's not for me. I mean, I love it, but I'm more Burning Man. So anyways, I put together mood boards last night, realized I'm more Burning Man. I'm going to do a lot of feathers, a crazy, like, hair piece, hat thing. I mean, it's going to be wild. I'm so excited.

I know. Well, I kind of bought some stuff that was a little different than what I thought you were going for. You said real vanilla. And you sent it to me and it's a mesh body suit. Well, it's like a dress. You'd wear over a bikini. We'll put up on the screen. You guys decide if it's a dress. It's like a cover up. It is a net. Real vanilla. It's like the thing that you get those baby belt cheese in. That's like that's the net. That's what I'm wearing. I'm dressing up as a sack of cheese. With nothing else under it, you nipple. Poking through. But then it like came to me what I'm wearing. I've been wanting, I've been trying to invent more opportunities. And it is something that I, why am I teasing it? It's my birthday.

It's my fringe skirt that I wore on the road last year that was in the running for Beyonce and then I didn't want to wear it. It's like a belt essentially with just a bunch of fringe, but it was expensive. It's real leather. And I'm just going to wear it with a bikini. I'm dying. I'm so excited. Just with a black bikini top.

I'm so excited. But am I going to be wearing like cowboy? boots by the pool? I don't know. So festival wear is always kind of like boots. Like your feet sweat. Yeah. And so I don't know because it's going to be hot. It won't be that hot. It's going to be the evening in early June. Yeah. But I did think of that. Like it is always like boots and stuff. But it's tough to be like the weather warm enough to rock a bikini top and nothing else, but also cool enough to wear a boot with a sock. People do it in the desert at Coachella. It makes me sick. I know. Me too. I can feel it. I feel like people will keep those on for the picks and then that were coming off pretty

quite. I'm going to do two outfits. Obviously, like, it's my wedding. Yeah. I couldn't narrow it down. My fiance is this great outfit. My current fiancee, sorry. I need to get back to calling to my current fiance because it's taking off. A bunch of people sent me a reel of this woman and she says my current husband and they were like, you started this. I was like, I did. I think it's so funny. You just started it by accident. I think it's a nice way to let people know that I could still. A hundred percent. You could be one of many. We could end this right now. It's a good way to play hard to get. This is my fiancé for the next 10 years.

Yeah. At least. We'll see. We'll renegotiate in 10. But he had this outfit and it's this like crocheted. It's a shorts and top set. And the shorts are really see-through. So you like, obviously he'd wear something under or you just see his dick.

But he's not going to have dick out. But I think he's going to wear it with like a brief. It's good. It's very, it's very sexy. I hope guys get into it. And in my mood board, I did include three couples in the mood board, all from Bernie Man, obviously. And Taylor, she was like, do you think I can get Blake to wear this?

I was like, yes, get every man. And honestly, at first I was like, I'm not putting men in this. I don't care about men. I don't care what they wear. I don't care if they come. Yeah, but you want them to be on theme. They can't ruin the photos. For the photos.

Yeah. Get a tie pan for Amazon. Yeah. You know? So anyways, I'll send it out to everybody. You guys stay tuned. It's slowly happening. But all right, well, let's thank our partners and we'll get into it.

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Yeah. All right. So you have a story. You want to tell me? Well, my last tour stop was in Salt Lake City. Not last forever, but like your most recent. My most recent. I ended the tour.

She misses me. In Salt Lake. Honestly, the shows were so good. I could have ended it. No. I knew you love it. We love performing in Salt Lake City at Wise Guys. And I have shows this weekend.

If you guys are listening in Pasadena and then the rest of the tour, I'm just like so excited about all these different places I'm going. You can get all this list of cities and tickets at Ash has. But something really funny happened in Salt Lake. So I was like doing crowdwork to open the show and I talk about like Mormon stuff. You guys can go see a reel. I have on my Instagram. But this was the show the night before of this clip I posted.

And I was crowdworking asking couples there and there was a thruple there. And the setup of the thruple was the man and the woman had been married for eight years. And then they brought in this other woman and she'd been in the throuple for three years. And so I'm talking to them and I'm like, what's your name? And she was like, Kathy. I'm like, that's not your name. Like, what's a fake name? What's about to happen?

Well, no, I think they were just giving fake. I mean, no one's named Kathy. Okay. I'll give my thoughts later. So I'm talking to them and then I said, Kathy, are you monogamous with them or do you date other people outside of the Thruple? I was also like, is Thruple the right word? Is this, am I like saying?

Is it a slur? Yeah. So she was like, no, I'm married. What? And I was like, where's your husband? And she was like, at home with the kids. And I was like, does he know?

And she said no. What? She's saying this out loud. There's 300 people in the room. Holy shit. Also, Salt Lake isn't like New York City. I mean, there's some, it's not a smaller. Yeah.

It wouldn't be crazy for people there to know her. Yeah. So I'm like, is she fucking with me? Is this real? There's hundreds of people in the room. But something, there's, I swear we had a thruple before in Salt Lake. Like, I remember the throuples that come to my shows. Denver, for one.

We had some freaky couple in Salt Lake before. Anyway, so I'm like, this is crazy. The audience is, like, eating it up. So about halfway through my set, I, like, went to talk to her again because she was on my mind. All I'm like, Kathy, what's up? She was gone. Nowhere to be found.

The man says, Kathy's in the bathroom. I'm like, all right. And then, I don't know, maybe 10 minutes later, I look back over there. I just caught a glimpse of him because he was on his phone. And I would call someone out for being on their phone. phone. But I couldn't hear him and it was brief and I just kept it moving. Whatever. I wasn't going to let myself get distracted. I couldn't hear anything. It's super, it's insane to be on a phone during a comedy show. Clearly something's like very wrong if you're on the phone. And it was quick. It was short lived as long as I know. And then he left. And then I look over towards the end of the show and they're all gone. So I'm like, what happened? And then I'm like, guys, the thruple is gone. And then someone's like, well, her husband must have found out. Yes. Absolutely. Her husband found out. And so I'm like, who snitched in here? And I'm like, is her husband in here? Like, it's highly probable that somebody in the room knew that person.

Well, right. I mean, no offense to saw it. Like, you're a small city. Like, that's crazy. Yeah. And I didn't even realize this. Wise guys is the only comedy club in the state. Like, if you like comedy, you're there.

Right. Which not say, I'm just saying it's like a funny thing. It kind of goes to show how much of a smaller community it is. Yes, it's a legitimate city, but you're so right. Like, okay, here's what I would do if I was her. I would just be like, this comedian started talking to me, and I just like made up a fucking story. Right, right. She's a sex podcaster.

I just like made up something funny. Like, that's what I would do. Yeah. And then the next night I was like, you know, asked again, like any throuples in here by chance. You know, and of course these girls like we're like, we are. And it just sounded not real. Yeah, it sounds like a lie. Who knows?

Not to say, but it's like you definitely could just lie to be funny at a show. So she could play it off. But I was like, what the fuck? I believe that they are a real throuple. and the hundred trying to find out that's clearly what happened. What if that's how you found out that your partner was cheating on you? Right. That someone else at a comedy club heard her announce it in front of 300 people.

Or I don't know. Does her husband have her location? And then he's like, oh, Kathy's it wise guys. So is Billy. And he's like, hey, Billy, my wife's there tonight. He's like, so funny you should say that, John. She's here with a couple of she's in a relationship. I wonder if he knows that couple.

And like, I mean, he has to know them, right? And then again, there is plausible deniability. I went to see a comedy show with my friend three years. How do you achieve her three years your spouse doesn't know? Right. Like how much time was she spending with him? She has kids allegedly. I mean, who's to say if any of this is real?

But it made for some fun crowd work. People in Salt Lake are wild. I'm so into Mormon wives right now. Yeah. I didn't watch the first season. I'm obsessed with the second season. I mean, crazy stuff is happening there. It's such a crazy place because it's like 50%.

Mormon? Yes. Okay. It's the most religiously homogenous demographic, like in the country. Wow. So that's why people aren't like stereotyping when they say like, oh, everyone in Utah is Mormon. Like it's actually, but it's interesting because, and you guys can go watch this reel I posted. I ask if anyone's Mormon and nobody is.

A few people were previously, but there's no like Mormons at the comedy show. I mean, maybe. We asked also when we were there the last few times and it was usually just no. Yeah. But the girl that hosted for me was. I was like, this is interesting. Well, my only touch point to Mormonism is Mormon wives. Yeah.

And some of them, I mean, they just sort of like span. They're all Mormon, but they spans how religious they are. They swing and stuff, right? Isn't that the whole thing of Mormon wives? Well, some of them are previously swingers. But like, you do sort of understand. You start to think about like the psychology behind like the ideals around what women are in the home and what women are meant to do. And they get married really young.

I mean, a lot of the girls in the show are like 24 years old. from kids. So they get married super young and the ideas around like sex and it's just different than I don't want to say than a progressive society. Well, so I do this bit and it's fine. I'll give it away because it's on my Instagram now anyway where I talk about the average age that women get married in the US and it's 28.6, whatever. I have the clip posted. It's fine. If you come to a show, don't yell it out like someone did Miami. So, but when I say that age in New York, L.A., Chicago, the women, or like, gasp.

In Salt Lake City, they're like, whew, seems old. That's our first divorce. So my host, her name was Carrie, she was great.

She was 37 and had four kids. Of course. Been married since she was 20. Of course. So I thought she was like this young comic. Like, oh, you're like new.

She is newer to comedy, which I love that. Mama of four started doing comedy two years ago. Fucking love it. But I was like, oh, you're like new on the scene. She has four.

Mother of four. Ma'am. I mean, I'm just, I'm involved. in the culture now. It's like, it doesn't surprise me. Like, I'm getting married 22 years after she did. And I still think I'm like a young hut. I was thinking the other day because I was my nephew, like, somebody saying to me like, your son's so cute and me being like, I am so far

outside of this. Oh, when Steph and I took the boys out to a lunch and we're in Rojobith, it's a very gay, friendly community. Like everyone just thought we were a couple. And we're both these like tall women. We have these two sons. Like when we were out rolling around with those two boys, like I think people were like, oh, what a cute close. They left their husbands. They got together.

They're so progressive. I just thought like when somebody was like your son's so cute, I was just like, old enough to have a son. Totally. Me? Yeah. And I was like, I am old enough to have like a 20 year old son. Well, someone thought I was your mom.

So anyway, okay. What do you want to tell me? I'm really short. I had the funniest experience the other night and I was like dying to tell you about how I have a date with this guy tomorrow. I'm dying to tell you how I met him. I don't know this, you guys. This is an exclusive.

It's so hard. So I went out to dinner with Jackie, who we talked about. Jackie's third host of this podcast. Every day Jackie texting me and she's like, do you want to go for a walk? And I can't tell her I'm busy because she has my location. She'll see me go on the walk. I love that we talk about Jackie because she actually is a true fan of the show.

And her boyfriend. We have friends that don't listen, which is fine. It's fine. But you're not a real one. Her boyfriend will text her. And you can't come to my wedding. I'm kidding. I know.

How do they even know anything about us? Her partner will text. She goes, he listens before I do. I love it. I know. I think it's cute. So she asked me if I wanted like third wheeler dinner on Sunday night. I was like, yeah, sure.

He picked me up. He paid for my dinner. It's great. Yeah, sure. I'll do it. So we go there. The three of us sit at the bar and there's these two like pretty cute guys sitting to my left.

And I'm like, how am I going to talk to this guy? And so they get some food. and I'm like, oh, I'll just ask them. What do you got? Totally. What I prefaces by saying. I worked in restaurants my whole life. Like 15 years in restaurants, went to culinary school, know a lot about food.

Yeah. I lean over. I like touch his arm and I was like, oh, not the touch his arm. Yeah. I like to touch his arm. I was like, oh my God, that looks so good. What is that? It's a charcutory board.

What is that? I got to show you the photo. Like, I sounded so stupid. I sounded like the most helpless person in the world. It's just. Meat on a plate. I was like, oh my God, I can't possibly identify that. That's so funny.

I mean, like, I guess technically you could wonder what meat that was. You know it's bordadella. Yes. But somebody might not. You could, what meat is that? I was cosplaying that I didn't know. This isn't the funny part of the story, but Jackie sent me that photo this morning. I was like, I really did ask a person, what is that?

So this is also while we're here, and it is a good way to open up a conversation. A lot of times a drink is a better move because you really don't know what's in there. I mean, I guess it's a dirty martini. You know what the fuck it is. Yeah. Yeah. I know what beer is that. That sounds really desperate.

Yeah, but like a cocktail. I mean, I went out to Soho's one night alone like recently when I was in New York and these guys come over. I was not trying to talk to anybody. But of course they're like, what do you drink in? Like it works. Yeah, of course. I don't want to talk to them.

But it, you know. People just want to tell you like what they're good ideas for, you know? It's so funny to ask what something is when it's so obvious. You're like, what is that? They're like, it's a piece of corn. Also, I wasn't at the cheesecake actor. The menu was 50 pages long. There was like seven things on this whole menu.

I could have deduced what that facacha bread was next to some meat. But anyway, so we talk a little bit and then at some point Jackie and her boyfriend go to the bathroom together, which whatever. Not an important part of the story, but good for that. So I started talking to him again. He was wearing like a hat from a place I go to sometimes. So we were talking about that. And they come back. We started talking my backs to him.

But I kind of see my peripheral vision. He's like getting ready to leave. And Jackie's boyfriend's like, get his number. And I was like, I don't know how to get his number. I have like the interaction has ended. I don't know how to like get it. Get back in there. He goes, I got you.

And he goes, hey man, what's up? My name is, and he tells him his name. They like shake hands and they start talking for like two seconds. And her boyfriend picks up my phone from in front of me. Hands it to that guy. He goes, can I get your number? Iconic. What a wing man.

It was unbelievable. Why not? Oh, I loved it. Exactly. And it was so clear that he like picked up the phone from in front of me. Yeah. Because like it could look like the three of us were a throuple. Totally.

And we'd love you to join this thruple. Honestly, if that had worked out. Totally. Either way. Either way. But he was like, yeah, I would love that. And so he like took my number. But before I put my number in his phone, I go, are you single?

Like, I just, you know, you never know. And in L.A. He's like, actually, no. He hands the phone back. You know you've got to ask that like, is anybody under the impression that they're getting you? Like, you just never know with somebody. But yes, they seemed like.

like two guys at the bar. We were trying to figure out what the vibe was. I love that two guys on a on a bro date. I really was like, good for them. Yeah. A whole new restaurant on a Sunday night hanging out at the bar. Totally. I mean, clearly you're here to meet me.

You're at the bar. Right, exactly. So you text me right away. Ask me like, is there anywhere you've been wanting to try? Oh my God. And so I picked a place that we're going. Wow. In the wild.

Feel free to use that. I mean, I just loved my friend's boyfriend being a wingman. It's so funny. What guy is not going to laugh at that? I think that's hilarious. I like that too. And even going back to like, what is it? It's so obvious what it is, then it's even more obvious that you're flirting. You know what I mean? And if someone is like, it's obviously meat on a plate, then they don't like you. So then you know, like if they engage, it doesn't even matter what you ask somebody. If they find you attractive enough, they're going to engage. I looked also so shitty on Sunday night, which we always say like the worst you look. I had five day unwashed hair wearing a ball cap. jeans shorts and a baggy white shirt, no makeup on. Yeah.

It's all uphill from here. Oh, right, right, yeah. But in the meantime, I started kind of like flirting with a bartender. And so I'll show you him also. Okay. And I wanted to ask you, so he's the guy behind that plate of food. What? What?

He's cute. That guy? Red face. No chin ginger? Maybe it's a bad angle. You don't like that guy. Rida, I did not. coming. The last guy you said was hot had like a tattooed face.

That's my preference. Raina either wants a guy who looks like he just broke out of prison or weirdly is a ginger. It's just like that's your two ends of the spectrum. I do. I really like. No melanin to be found. I have never seen the silence. He looks like he's on parole.

A light on fire in the sun. Oh, totally. Okay. So, well, he was Australian. Does that make him a little harder? Oh, yeah, makes it better. Yeah. Yeah, you get like five points for that. Totally. Okay. So anything with him? No, I mean, I was going to ask you your opinion about this. It wasn't about him being cute. I was going to ask you that he's hot. No. This was a behavior that I hate the people do and I'm wondering what you think about it. So he starts talking to three of us about something he does something he does for work in the art world and the bartender? Yeah. The bartender? Yeah. Oh, okay. You know like everybody in LA. He has another job. He does something in the art world. And I was like, oh, that sounds like really cool. Can I. Can I. like do you can i see your work and he was like yeah do you have instagram and i was so i handed my phone to like look his account he followed himself he followed himself for my account no a red flag i didn't notice it until later on i'm like that's straight to jail because you know that when you follow somebody their story comes up immediately first and so i was like this motherfucker followed

himself for my account yeah that's always a funny thing then i'm like i'm i'm i want to go back to this restaurant so I can't unfollow him. I will be there and I would like free drinks. So I can't unfa. I don't want to follow this person. I know. It's so funny. Someone approached me after a comedy show with improv and does something that would work for

my wedding. Basically it was like, I want to do your wedding. And I was like, okay, I'll get your info or you on Instagram. And so he pulls up his Instagram account and I just screenshots it. I was like, I'm not going to follow. That's what I always do. I screenshot it. I need to be more selected with my follows.

There's too many people I follow. I can't ever, I can't imagine being so presumptuous that I want to follow myself. Like, I wouldn't follow myself from somebody's phone and people pretty often hand me their phone. Yes, exactly. Like this is, I treat people how I want to be treated. Like, when people look me up on Instagram and I put Ash Hess in their phone, I hand it back to them so they can make the decision on their own what they want to do with it. Like this isn't 2014. We're not throwing out follows like we used to.

I'm not doing it. Also, listen, I have half a million. followers. I'm sure you would love for me to follow you. I'm sure that would be great. But I, I should reserve it. It's my account, my choice. So now you have to unfollow him. I can't unfollow him because I want to go back there and I want to get free drinks. Well, now people are going to look them up to see that face and that lack of a jawline. So you've got to unfollow him for his own benefit. Oh, fuck. Listen, I just think it's crazy. I would never do it. I would never be so presumptuous as to follow myself from somebody else's account. It's crazy. It is. It's a crazy move.

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spirituality, and self-development podcast, almost 30. Since its inception, they have amassed over 100 million download. They've completed a multi-city tour. They host in-person retreats and online workshops. built an unbelievable platform and community that honestly Ash and I are so inspired by all the time. Their debut book, Almost 30, A Definitive Guide to a Life You Love for the next decade and Beyond is out tomorrow. Please welcome back to the show, Krista Williams and Lindsay Simpsick.

Love you guys. The way I want to crawl into my skin when I hear people read a bio is like crazy. Oh, most people enjoy it when I do it. What are you kidding? I want to jump on. I love you reading it. But I'm like, Raina, that was so cringe. I don't know.

It's not even you. I just am like, oh. She's like, you're so mad at that. It's crin. You guys have done so much. It's like, really, you're such OGs. I mean, you guys are OGs. What do you mean?

We all are. Literally, I think it was you guys and us in the beginning. That's like in my brain what it is. Yeah, we had a podcast. We did, you guys. Well, your book, I mean, reading the intro to your book and you guys will talk about it, but I'd harkened me back to the beginning of me and Ashley starting it also and just being like, what's the next move?

What are we going to do? And it was like the Wild West of podcasting back then. I missed that. We used to make up prices and be like, we think you should charge. $2.50. And they'd be like, okay, we're like, okay, we don't have any proof. No proof of concept. We're like, we'll just invoice you, see what happens. Like, and it was the best. Yeah, it was a lot of fun. But I also think about it, like, because I was so desperate to leave my corporate job during that time, it was like, I was determined to make it a business. And we

were determined to make it something just because we were like, we have to have this be a thing. And it was so fun, but unknown at the time. And I'd kind of miss that, like, wild west of podcasting time. Do you guys? Totally. Yeah, but it was also like, you, you know, didn't know what was going to happen. Like, shit would just blow up. You know, like, were you guys started in 2016? Yeah. Yeah. Even earlier than us, like, people ask today and the vice is not the same that I could, I could never give you advice on how to start a podcast today. Don't. Don't. Yeah. Don't. Let your advice. We give. I was like, do TikTok. Yeah. Every 12 seconds, I send actually another person that started in the podcast. I'm like,

it's brave. I admire your bravery. Do you. Do it if it makes you happy. Do it. Do it if it makes you happy, but not if you want to make a huge business out of it. To be honest. It's hard, no. Unless you're a huge celebrity. Exactly. Like back in our day. You didn't have to be.

We were just nobody's. Sorry, we had followings, but you don't know what I mean. Just girls on the floor of a closet that were like, but I think what made you guys so successful as a little bit about ours is just like our authentic connection and chemistry.

Like you guys have such an authentic connection and chemistry that like stood the test of time. That stood the test of time for us that I think really kept us going. And I think a lot of people, also stop. Yeah. And I like talking about this. I was chatting with Rainey the other day about podcast hosts that are actually best friends. Yeah. And this is no shade. Some people don't claim to be. Like we have recorded with plenty of people that are like, we're just colleagues. Yeah. And you guys are really best friends. Yeah. How could you do that as colleagues, dude? You could totally do that as colleagues. But you just wouldn't have, I don't think you would have that

certain chemistry that really is the gina se qua. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Of like a show. We just, our intro to every episode is us talking about like a trip we took together and this dinner we went to together and like you wouldn't have that as much. But since the last time you got, I mean, you guys have just been through a lot of iterations of your own lives together. And like living in LA and I'll let you tell it. But like since then,

I mean, we've had marriages, divorces, babies. Well, one of you have. Chris is just, Chris is still 20.

I don't know what you guys are talking about when I was 21 when we met. So my thing is almost 30. You guys, my thing is lying about my age now when I'm single. Because I don't want anyone to like know the range. So it's just so bad. You lie on your dating apps at how old you are? I'm not on apps.

But if you meet me in person, I'm like, you used to be. 30. But this is, I used to do this. I was intentionally vague. No, I'm vague. Like, the person I'm dating right now thinks I'm a different age than I'm like. No, like, actually. Actually, if he came to my birthday and I had to be like, you guys do not tell this.

I was like, no singing. I was like, no singing the number. I was like, just say, happy birthday. No, no clarity. Nobody sings the number. Well, like, I don't want to be like. Happy 30. What is there as balloons?

Can you see her walking to her birthday party popping the balloon? Oh, what do you mean? No, but like someone walks out with a candle. She's like how many fucking candles are that? I would be like, ha ha, that's a crazy joke you did. I just, it's a weird thing. And I know it's something I need to get over and work on. And I know it's something that's wrong with me that I will work on.

But that's not my journey right now. But when we were, when we met, it was 2021. I was like engaged to be married or married, I think. I thought I knew. Can I just tell you my favorite deflection in the world is I know that's something I have to work on, but it's not my journey right now. It's not my journey right now. It's such a woo-way of saying not my problem right now. It's just not my- No one can push back on that. It's not my journey. Yeah. Well, you're acknowledging it. You're saying you're not wrong. Life is long. You can deal with things later. Everyone will be like, oh, you should accept your age. Where are you? Cool. I will. I will. I accepted my age a week before my 40th. I accepted it. Wow. I was on the Peloton and acceptance came over me. I PR. I PR. I PR. I PR. I PR. I'm that day with Cody and I accepted it. I had a conversation with my friend about it and she was like, you got to get over this. What are you going to do? And I'm like, you're right. What am I going to do? And I just literally I would say that that's, I had a moment of acceptance on like July 1st.

What were you feeling about 40 before that moment? I mean, having a, I've talked about this in the I guess. I really wanted a partner to start that decade in that era. But I just was like women in entertainment and, you know, aging and all the things that, like, are constantly in our head. Just a lot's going on, you know, with being a woman who's aging. I've had to think about, I feel like there's a part of me that feels like I'm too young where, like my gurus are the people I look up to are older. They're like 50 plus. Like Mel Robbins is like a friend and she's just someone.

She sat in that chair. She's the best. Yeah. And I'm like, oh, I'm like, people don't respect me because I'm too young and then I'm too old for some things. You know what I mean? I'm always like too much, not enough. type thing where I'm like with men, I'm too old.

With business and career, I'm too young. It's like, and I've had to watch that where I'm like, where am I making myself just not good enough for any world? You know what I mean in this? I just, maybe it's because I'm getting older, but the people around me that I really relate to are people my own age. I think the standards of beauty are really changing. I think 40 isn't what it used to be.

And I was talking on the intro of our podcast recently about how like I'm almost 40 and a lot of my friends are now reaching this phase of their life where they're having kids and getting married for the first time. And I don't think that was people's experiences. I mean, mine is pretty rare, but it would have been unheard of 20 years ago to be almost 40 and your friends are in that phase. So I think just the idea of age has really changed a little. There's research now that says that more women in their 40s are having children than teen moms. I saw that.

Yeah. I would love to see it. Literally, I'm like this book I'm reading it was a fucking Instagram post. I know. And everyone's getting married later. Everyone, like everything is happening later. I think people are more focused on their careers and just like also doing that work. on themselves.

Yeah. To be able to step into those next iterations of the relationship of whatever they want to do. That is a great segue way into the book. Because you wrote about basically this existential crisis that a lot of us have between like 27 and 30 of like who am I? Where am I going? Do I like the people around me? So can you guys just talk about like the inspiration for that phase of life of being almost

30? Yeah. Krista and I met during this time. So we met at 27. And we were just going through it. you guys can relate. There's just like this breakdown or seemingly what a breakdown might feel like of like, damn, should I be like farther along in my life? Like I haven't found my person yet. Shouldn't I be with my person and like I thought I was going to be married and have kids by now or what's my purpose?

Like just these questions of like who am I really? Where should I be? We both felt this like pain in that and just like we should be farther along. And so in our friendship, we started talking about it. started the podcast, all the things. But in doing the podcast, we also learned that astrologically something was happening. Astrologically and neurologically. So I'll speak to the astrological first. Astrological transit for astrology girlies out there is your Saturn return. So it's this time when Saturn comes back to the place it was when you were born. And basically Saturn, the planet is working on you in a very like tough love type of way. And so you are going to basically be shown aspects of your life that need tending to. That might be misaligned and you really have to look at and get honest about

and through knowing yourself better, you can make better decisions that are more aligned for you. It's tough. It's like it's a time when, yeah, it feels like everything's breaking down, but it's really an opportunity for it all to come together. But it's, you know, hindsight is 2020. And we can say that now. You said that's like between 27 and 30 for most people. Yeah. So every 29 and a half years they say it comes back around. So I would say between, you're going to start feeling your sat in return, probably around 27 through about 30. Yeah. And we're perfect examples like, because when I was, you know, when I was younger, I was like, oh, 26, I'll be with my man. 28 will have kids, you know, and then it's like, oh, we'll have three kids and we'll live in a

house and da, da, da, da, and it's like, I don't have that obviously. And I could not be more happy with where my life is. And when I was in my later 20s, when I met Lindsay, I was struggling so much. Like I was so depressed. I was so anxious. I hated my life. I wanted to find purpose. I wanted to find my reason for being here. And I think so many people in that age and even still today struggle with purpose, struggle

with finding meaning in life. And I think if I would have known the important impact of the Saturn return on my life and also your prefrontal cortex is coming online. So basically your prefrontal cortex is responsible for your emotional regulation, your decision making. When you're younger, you have so much emotion, but you don't really know what to do with it. You're like, I'm just overwhelmed with emotion.

I'm making irrational decisions. like I'm going out and I'm texting and calling him and I don't even know why. So when you're in your later 20s, you actually have that ability to process your emotions and feelings and choose where you're going. And I think when that part is coming online, there's such an opportunity for you to create a life that you love and become the person that you came here to be. Yeah. The 27 thing is so real.

Yeah. What were you guys? What was up with your life then? I mean, that was the, I quit my job in PR to just, I mean, no savings, you know, just to be a freelance writer and go out on my own completely. And at the same exact time moved into my first department that I ever by myself. I didn't have a roommate. So just no job.

I mean, I had a few freelance writing gigs lined up. But, like, I just remember, like, sitting on the floor of that apartment because I didn't have a desk. I was, like, at the coffee table. It was so hot. Like, I had a window unit. I had this dog to take care of. I, like, could barely pay my rent. And that was, like, the year I was like, I'm really doing it.

Like, I went out on my own. I'm on my own completely. But still, like, I want to. find a partner. Of course. What do you mean? My life would be better if I had a partner and you're like, how important was that time to also be single and find yourself? Yes. Right. And it's 28, my fiance left me. My whole fucking life explode. I mean, I was like, I did it. I got engaged by 27. I did the thing. I'm going to be married at 28. We're going to have kids at 30. We're going to do suburb. You had the whole fucking plan. And he walked in the door the night before our engagement party and left me.

and I mean my whole life exploded Saturn returns but like I changed my job I built all these friendships I just I didn't really care about friendships I just didn't have that many really close girlfriends I just didn't I hadn't built it he was my whole life and I hadn't traveled and my career was taken care of but nothing else was and so you're just like oh I've stripped everything away and you look around you at that age and you talk about it in the book that you look around you you think like everyone's got it figured out but I don't and that's a lie and everyone is on a constant journey for to quote unquote figure it out. And but you do think like, well, my friends are engaged and they help good job.

It's like, no, they don't. No, they hate their lives. And we're talking about this like timeline that we think we should be on like the married by this age. Yes. By this age. And I think like, you know, such one of the most liberating parts of this time and what I realized going into my 30s was like I can trust the timing of my life. Like even when it feels like where the fuck is my person? I can trust the timing of when they come in because, I mean, again, hindsight is 20-20,

but what is for you will never miss you? Do you feel that way now that you're with your person? Yeah. I can't imagine it working out any differently. Yeah. Exactly. And that's what's crazy. It's like you could tell that girl that was like working at that desk in that hot room,

like, girl, just wait. It's going to get so good. Like it's going to work out. And even for you, like, if you were telling that 28, you're a girl that just got broken up with like, yo, your life is about to be better than you can ever imagine. You'd be like, are you insane? You know those TikTok. that say like I got coffee with my younger self and they always they gut me because I just think like

I just would tell her like it's going to be okay. Oh I can't do it because I'm to get too emotional. No way. I haven't like done the trend. I could cry right now. You watch them though. Yeah. What would you tell her? Just like it's going to be okay. You're going to make it. You're going to make me financially stable. You don't just stress about this. But also like fear keeps you going a little. Sometimes it's like but what if I don't? Like people would always tell me like you're going to Rob would be like, you're going to make it one day you're going to do this. I'm just like, but what if I don't? Like something that keeps you going.

Like especially people think you are going to make it and you're like now they're counting on me. Yeah. I don't know. That adrenaline. I like intersection though of like being like I'm not sure where I'm going and having it propel you for it and also taking a moment to like pause and be like I enjoy where I am today.

And I think it's hard to do that too. Oh, that's huge. But the partner thing just, maybe that's even what I would tell her is like, You will find your person, maybe later than everyone else that's your age, but it will happen and it'll be the, like, right person, I think. And being full and deep. And for you, I think something that's interesting that you said is like, you know, I think when we're younger, we're sort of socialized to make our person everything.

We're like, this man, we kind of give our whole life. We're like, kind of lose our friends. We kind of let go of friendships. And we just prioritize that relationship so much because that's like the dream is to have the husband that we like worked towards. And then it's like now you've been gifted the opportunity of having really deep meaningful friendships with people and like reclaiming your relationship with women in a way that I don't know if you would have been able to or had.

And it's like what a gift that you were given this renewed sense of female friendships because it's the best. Oh my God. I think about if I could go back 10 years and tell that for all like you're going to be a success, you're going to change women's lives. You're going to build out all these friendships and you're going to make a bunch of money and you're going to have great sex. Like I think about how devastated I was and if you I could just tell her like it's kind of be

it's going to be better than okay. But you got bust your ass. I worked a lot of obsessed. You still got that part. You're like, but you got to work. I know because I'm like I don't be don't get too comfortable. But we're from like the same same generation of like work fucking. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? We're millennials. It's just like millennials. Millennials work hard. Yeah. Grind it out. Yeah. Maybe to a fault. But we didn't, you know, I feel so lucky and we're a little older than. We're a little older you guys, but just at least being able to be so much older than Christa. Krista could be my daughter, honestly. Literally.

Chris is like, talk about yourself. I just snuck it. But just not having to be inundated with it on social media. Because that, this is not a hot take, but like kids today, women and young, young women are seeing people really make it and be on those lavish vacations and have all the money in the world and maybe have the partner too and have everything you quote unquote would want at the early 20s. I know.

And we just didn't have to see that shit. Like, I didn't feel as much like I'm behind because we were not seeing it on social media. Like, yes, marriage and kids is one thing. That's on Facebook. But like the career stuff. I think we all have different kind of lenses that we see the world. So some of us, it was like finding the person. Yeah.

Some of us, you know, it's other things. Mine was like purpose and career. I've always dated. I've always been in relationships since I've been young. So I never really, I just knew I'd find a man. I know I'd be with a man, whatever. So mine was always career and purpose. So I was always with the lens of like I wanted to have a purpose.

I wanted to have a career. I wanted to feel like I was here from meeting. I wanted to have a lot of success. And that's what like drove me insane in my 20s. I was like, how could I fucking find a way to do this? Like how could I find a way to live? And I think for a lot of people in their later 20s, it's like, what is the thing that keeps them up at night?

Or what is the thing that like drives them to like seek for more? So that was for you and Lindsey, same or different? Finding a person. Yeah, I want it so desperately. But then the two women, I'm not saying you guys, but you look at the, other type of woman and you're like, I wish I could just be, you sound like someone who's never out of problem, getting a boyfriend, like, you know, like someone might look at that and be like, I wish I could just be like her and you're thinking, I wish. No, no, no, no. Yeah. Yeah. I think for me,

I think I had a good, great dad. My dad's struggling now with his health, but I'm sorry. I know, it's okay. But so I think I've always had a great dad in relationships with men, so I've always felt like good with men. And honestly, I probably always, I think for a little bit was I was really at self-abandoning. So I could always find a man because I would always be like, what do I have to like get with them. You know what I mean? Like so it was easy for me because I'm like, I will do anything to be with them. Now I'm not like that, but you know.

But you did. I just had this. I was with someone in college and a little bit out of college thought it was my person. I want you to talk about this story because I loved it in the book. Yeah. That's your person who you think you're going to marry telling my Nana like he's my person. Absolutely put money on it. And then there was something inside of me that said different.

And I was like, no. Like he's my person. We can't fuck this up. up like captain the football team like we're going to have a good like timelines right yeah timeline is right I'm like do not like my heart was like hey there's just a few things that like aren't quite aligned like we got to look at this and so when I started to really like get honest with myself yeah there were some things that like just weren't aligned well first of all I think it was timing so our track of maturity like if we were to have met later in life maybe I don't think we would be together but I think maturity wise we

would have gelled a little bit better, but there was some anger on his end. He was drinking a lot. Like, there was just some things about, literally were kids. Literally, we're kids. We're kids. Also, just college dudes. You know, when you date someone in college, they have like punch holes in walls and stuff. We always say people like write in. They're like, he cheated on me. You're like, you're like, you're like, you're not minimizing it. But like, it's just, I don't know. He's going to grow up and be a different person. And so are you. And I, and I felt like I had really big dreams for myself and I felt like I couldn't be big and shine. If that makes sense.

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I really related to you saying like your grandma said, do you like, isn't this the one? And that's so generational for somebody to say to a 21-year-old, don't you feel like this is the one? Literally. Totally. But actually your brain hasn't developed at that time. So you haven't gone through like your full brain development to bring you to a point where you're the person that you came here to be. Like again,

until you reach that prefrontal cortex development of your later 20s, you just are running from programming. So you're running from like your priorities being what your parents say, what society says, what culture says. And you actually like don't really know who you are at that time. And it's quite black and white up until that time. Like you're reacting instead of responding to your life,

instead of like considering nuance. So totally. And that's why your Facebook posts are so cringe. Oh my God. Our Facebook albums. Our Facebook albums are absolutely bipolar. Our status updates? Mine are all private.

I made them down private. My sister and my best friend from mom will send them to me sometimes like, yo. It's like, God, no one can see this. Yeah. What was some of your Facebook album titles? Mine was always like rap lyrics. Yeah. No, like mine was like two bitches, three amigos.

And then it would be like my friends like peeing in a corner and be like, yo ha ha. Yes. Like one album for one night out. Oh yeah. I did not all the time. Yes. But I love your point about the nuance too.

And it's tough also to navigate. And again, this like social media TikTok age where a lot of people are just putting out advice ranging from career to dating to whatever that's very black and white and not nuanced. And it comes with age too. And that's what we try to do, what you guys try to do on your show too. Like everything is not like a sound bite on TikTok. And if he does this or if she does that, you know. Everyone keeps coming to me with the golden retriever black cat.

And I'm like, shut the fuck up. What is that? It's just like, all my, like, I have a friend that literally every lens, she's like, oh, that's black cat, golden retriever. So basically, the theory is that I'm obsessed with you and you can't, you can't, you can say it. Because I'm older than you, you know. But it lacks nuance. So I think it lacks nuance.

So basically it's like, as a woman, you should be a black cat, which is basically elusive, not fully attached, more detached. Okay. More kind of standoffish and cold and have him be golden retriever where he's more obsessed with you, more into you. Okay. Like follows you around. Right.

Yeah. Well, they just say. that those are the best relationship dynamics, quote unquote, best. That that's what works out for people. I think the people are more nuanced than that and deeper. I look at my relationships in my 20s, they were like simpler. I think I just didn't know to even ask anything of somebody. I couldn't name behaviors.

Like you just get older. You have more vocabulary. You have higher standards. That's why men date 21 year olds instead of 41 year olds. You know, I think 21 years are wonderful. They're full of rich advice, but they're different than 40-year-olds. But I think like when you are, I'm curious about your experience with this, but like when you're with your person, it does, it's not like, I'm with my person. Everything's easy. Everything's perfect.

It's like you're being called to like the next level of you in a lot of ways where like they might, they might like invite you into a growth edge that you're like, oh, but I feel safe with you to do it. And it feels right. But it's not like smooth sailing. Does that ring true? Yeah. And I mean, we have been together. We're coming up on two years. it still feels very much like honeymoon phase. But like just recently we had kind of a tough conversation. And, you know, there's part of me that's like, this is going to change us forever.

It's just, it's not real. Like it's not how, and I know better, but to be able to work through it together, I feel like emotion about together, to be able to work through it together on like a Friday evening, kind of like cancel a dinner reservation. Let's just stay in to kind of like talk.

through something, like hug it out and then have like the best weekend ever I felt closer to him than ever. Like I'm like, that's just so special and it's growth and it's not what I'd experienced in previous relationships. That's intimacy. These little, like conflicts don't have to break down the relationship. They strengthen them. And I say conflicts even loosely. Like tough conversations.

Conflict repair is so huge. Yeah. I think, you know, just to your point and then to your point, you know, I was in a relationship for 10 years and we were married and I'm divorced. now for two years. And I remember, you know, we met so young, like, especially for me. No. Were you guys in high school? I was child bride. And I, I just remember my standards and my list. Like, I made a list before I met him. And I was like, it was just, it lacked vocabulary. It lacked nuance. It was like all ego things. It was like he's this tall. He looks like this. He's like, you know, he's like funny and cool. But it wasn't like he has emotional availability. He's like got all these

things. And I think when you get older, you have so much of that. And one thing that we lacked, you know, and this was my responsibility too, was our ability to have conflict repair. Like, we really did not know how to have conflict that brought us closer. And so over the years, it just brought us further and further apart and just made it a lot harder to come back together. I'm so interested in those type of relationships where you meet somebody really young. You're together 10 years. It is really your formative relationship years. And that person forms the lens through which you see relationships. And how long were you married? A year.

And do you talk about the breakdown of the relationship on your podcast? I have before. Basically, you know what I'll say is that I'm not hiding anything, but it's really gray because it's like over such a long period of time. And there's so many different aspects and things that you remember that it's never a thing. Like I remember being younger and being like, oh, so you broke up, who cheated? Like who lied? What's the issue?

And like when you have a relationship that long, there's so many issues that happen to pop up over time. I don't even know what I would say. That's valid. And I don't think that there's always some big thing. It's sometimes hundreds of little things. A hundred. That's what it was.

And it's also with a lot of, I feel like a lot of people have those relationships that they start in their 20s and then they kind of make that transition to their 30s and they're like, am I supposed to be with this person anymore? We have a lot of friends who are like kind of realizing that. And I think it's so much about one, you both are growing and changing period. Like that's supposed to happen. And people get surprised when that happens. They're like, why are you, you're different?

And it's like, that's the point. Yeah, that's the point. And I think people are so uncomfortable when people close to them change. They're making meaning out of it and what it says about them, what it says about the relationship. And really, like, relationship should be a place where you can grow and change and feel safe to do so and supported to do so. But I feel like that ripe time, 20s to 30s, it's like, if you're unable to navigate that, it's hard.

It's hard to make it last in a real way. I feel like I'm so grateful because I obviously wouldn't be the woman I am. And he was such a good place for me to become the person that has the business and does the thing. But I think when I realized that later years of our relationship is I was kind of running the template that I saw growing up in the Midwest, like the template of my parents, which was, and this was just my experience, like the woman was overfunctioning, doing everything in the household, like managing the finances, kind of managing the health of the relationship, like, and I was just completely overfunctioning, doing everything, kind of like the masculine,

almost in the relationship. And that's what I saw growing up. And the man was more emotionally unavailable. The woman was like more, you know, whatever. And there was one time I was like home for the holidays and it was Thanksgiving. And I was witnessing my dad and my mom and their new partners because they're divorced and remarried, but we all hang out. And I was like watching them.

And all the men were just sitting on the couch. watching TV, like totally, like dead, like zombies. And then the women were like cooking, cleaning, communicating, talking, planning everything, da, da, da, da, da, da, da. And just like flying around, like, flitting around everywhere. And I was like, yo, this would have been my life, like, of that type of relationship where there's no real connection. There's no real intimacy.

There's no real partnership. And I was like, I'm so glad I opted out of that, you know, that I'm going from a good relationship that was good in some ways to like a very epic, deep, meaningful relationship that can meet me now. Mm-hmm. I feel like with that example, that scene you just, that is going to resonate with a lot of people, too. What did you guys see as your parents growing up? My parents split when I was really young.

Yeah. And my mom got remarried. And I don't know. My mom just like, she's always in charge of everything. She raised the kids. She did all the plans. I mean, she just did absolutely everything. My stepdad went to work.

He was like a nice person. But I didn't have both parents in the home. So I don't know that I have a touch point the way that you guys might. Like, actually parents were married. It was different. My stepdad was like happy to help if he needed to. But he wasn't going to try to, like, overstep. Like my, you know, my dad was a full-time parent outside the house.

Yeah. My dad, I see similarities between him, my fiancé, a lot. My dad, like, does a lot. You see women just run everything. Like, the man can't function without the woman. And, I mean, my parents are just kind of different. I mean, now they live on this farm. My mom couldn't live there without my dad.

Like, he's, there's some health things going on. But he's just always running around, always busy. Like, he's not the dad, the husband, I guess, that's, like, on the couch with a beer while the woman, like, runs everything. They like really have to be a team with like everything. I mean, cooking, cleaning, you know, the household, all that stuff. So that I witnessed that growing up. But that's maybe a little more rare. A real team.

Yeah, that's nice. I remember that there's this meme that's like, the man that you're supposed to be with isn't the one you have to use gentle parenting techniques with. Yeah. I see so many of my friends doing that where it's like these women that are just, and this is no shade, I love men. Like I deeply love men. I'm so grateful for all of them in my life.

and they serve a very special purpose. But it's like I see so many women that I'm friends with or that I know or that I coach that are like just like having to like completely just parent and adult. Parent and adult. And I refuse to do it. If I feel that I'm doing it, I'm not going to, I'm not doing it. I'm not doing this and I don't do it. And how unfair is it that it turns you, this horrible version of you.

The nagging wife. I have a girlfriend recently said to me she's going through break him and she's like, every day, she was like, I asked him 30 times nicely. And then I escalated. And then I ask them, and all of a sudden I'm this like, bitch. Yes. It's so unfair. You've made me be like this.

Right. Okay, I'm dying to ask you guys a question because we get emails like this sometimes. Yeah. I know. I just have so much to ask about your personal. I'm so excited. Well, we get emails a lot that say like, I don't know if I should leave or stay. I'm with this person that's like a good person.

I trust him. They're a good enough partner. I see what's out there. I don't know that I want that. Like, when do you know? My family likes them. Yeah. I mean, when do you know when to leave a relationship that's just kind of like,

wellming around there? I mean, I'm curious what you guys would say. Yeah, I would need more context, but I think in general, I'd be curious if they've made an effort to bring that into a conscious conversation with each other, rather than like trying to control it and like fix the person or the thing. It's like, can we actually call out what's going on in a way that's like, hey, let's do us against the problem rather than you're doing this wrong. you need to fix this.

It's like, hey, this is what we're experiencing. I would love to hear from you as well. But until you can have that conversation, it's just, what are we doing? Right. Like, have you ever been like, hey, the vibes are off? Yeah. They're probably feeling it too, unless they're totally dead. I think that that's like, we forget that.

I remember saying that to a friend of mine years ago because she like really wanted to cheat on her partner. She was like, I'm really, bro. Before I got married, I was like, I kind of want to be open. I was on a walk with my friends on the beach and they're like, what? I'm like, I want to try open. Seriously. She, I mean, she was just sort of like flirting with other guys.

And I could tell she was like testing the waters because she wasn't that happy. And I was like, I promise you he feels like this. Yeah, totally. Like, I promise you if you're not enjoying the sex and you feel like it's gone stagnant, the whole relationship, she also feels like this. Unless, to your point, it is a totally oblivious person, which you don't want to be with that guy either. Yeah, you don't want to be a guy either. I think there's three things out.

So I'm just that I can share my story and experience with it. from leaving mine. And then also I always think, because people ask me this a lot of when to, like, leave, I think if your values are no longer aligned, I think that's huge. You know, what are your values? Like, I think when you can crystallize your values in life, my values are like truth, freedom, like beauty as an example. Say that through the values. If they don't have the same aligned values, then you guys don't have the same way of functioning in the world. So I think it's really good to look at that. I think a caveat to that is that oftentimes people say values that they're not living.

So oftentimes people will say, like, my values are family, and they'll see their family once a year. You know what I mean? So it's like, you actually have to, like, be in alignment with your values. I think if there's abuse, obviously, abuse, you have to leave their relationship. And I think, third, if you guys don't have a vision

that's aligned for the future, then you're not going to be going in the same direction. And I remember specifically one time I was in the park and I was like desperate. I was trying everything, you know, to keep my relationship intact. And I was like trying all my spiritual shit. And I was like, what is your vision?

vision for the future, you know, like, just like whatever. The vision he said and the vision I had were completely different and we didn't even include each other. Wow. Yeah, bro. Yeah. I remember like I said mine and then he said his and after he said his, I was like, I'm not in this man's vision. Right. Wow. And I remember walking and leaving the park and I was like, yo, like that didn't go his plan. It did not go his plan. But I also realized I wasn't included. You know what I mean? So it's like checking in on the vision. It's good. I think the conversation is really good. But I think it's also a person. thing. Like, I don't want a mediocre life. I want deep meat. I'm, I'm so deep. I'm so, like, intentional. I can't have a relationship that is not deep and intentional and fulfilling. Like,

mediocre doesn't work for me. Mid doesn't work for me. But if you're someone that's, like, satisfied in life and can, like, just enjoy, like, having good conversations and dinners and having a good partner every once in a while, like, that's your, that's fine. But if you want more for your life, you're going to have to, like, choose the harder path, which sometimes means you're alone for a little bit to have the person that's like the epic fit for you. Yes. Yes. I think emotional depth is so important. And like where a lot of women, and I say women just because like I think of my friends and my close circle of friends, like get tripped up is with a really good on paper, nice guy that treats them well, which is also hard to find. So that's where we get these emails of like, and I feel like I can

read between the lines of a lacking of emotional depth. And that's when you start to maybe have an emotional affair or whatever reason start to doubt the relationship. I don't know I brought affair into. But you see that happen. For sure. Find somebody that gets you more. Yeah. I have so much.

Sorry, I keep talking so much. But I have so much to say about this. I feel like there's a difference between emotional depth and emotional maturity. We've all met the dude that's like, you meet them and they're so deep. They're like, yo, the bottom of the ocean is like the same as like the sky and like da-da-da. And they're like, what do you think about aliens? Yeah.

Have you met the deepness in L.A.? Totally. Every guy I go out with this guy. But the LA bros, man, it's like, so they're deep. He's like, do you want space to talk? No. But there's a level of emotional maturity that they lack. And emotional maturity is accountability.

You being able to stand. Consistency. Like, so there's just a difference in that. And I think sometimes we women can get bamboozled by the depth and think it's the same as maturity and it's not. Like, because sometimes a man that's not deep is emotionally mature. Totally. And so that's totally different.

And then I think, too, sometimes we as women approach men and we want them to have the same level of depth and texture as women, and they will not, for the most part. Like, the way that I can be with Lindsay and be like walking around and be like, hey, man, and like, she can feel what I'm feeling and she can ask me the right questions and we can go to every which where in place, a man might not be able to read me like that. A man might not be able to go and ask me the questions that I want him to ask. And I think we just need to be a little bit more understanding of like the texture that men do provide in relationships, which is really beautiful, but no, it's not the same as women.

Yes. And I have thought of this too when I'm having some of these conversations with my fiance because he really gets me. He's really in tune and he's really intentional and he's really emotionally mature, but he's just still not a woman. And I'm just kind of like, I feel like I'm doing some mental gymnastics sometimes like, what is he not saying? He's just not having the thoughts that I'm having. Totally. My whole thing with men, I'm like, what are you thinking about? And they're like, bro, nothing. They're like elevator music. We need to say out loud what we need, what we're thinking. Totally.

Because even to this day with my husband, I told him the other week something that I was like, I was feeling in a moment and he was like, whoa. He's like, this is blowing my mind. He's like, I was not even thinking about that. And it's not even that he was like not in tune with me. But I'm really good at not showing when I like something's going on within me. I can be, I'm really good at that. but I was like, you should know you're my husband.

Like, you should pick up on this shit. And he's like, yo, I did not. He's like, I need you to like even pull me aside in those moments. Like if you are moving through that, like I'm happy to like be with you in that moment. He's like, but I had no idea. And I was like, dude, your brain works totally different than mine. Yeah. And it's fine.

Yeah, he's great. And I actually need a little bit of that. Uh-huh. I need like a little bit of that linear, like, track that your brain moves on a lot of the time. and I need that like not caring about certain things at times from them. So like you can even like take a little taste from your partner. It's like I could actually use a little bit more of that. Because I have always said like he can read my mind.

He can anticipate my needs. He like knows me in and out. But again, there's just then sometimes when it comes down to a conflict scenario, we are just different animals. You guys have just lived such different lives because like Krista, you were for 10 years all through your 20s. And then Lindsay, you met your husband. And at 33?

Yeah, I was single for like seven years. I met him. Well, I met him when I was 25. I was a bottle girl. Yeah. And you told, if you guys want to listen back, she told the whole story.

Yeah, we reunited. I just, I think that so many people are like rushing towards the serious, most important relationship with their life in their 20s. And I'm like, just wait for the, make for yourself to develop a little bit. A hundred percent. Wait for men to develop a little bit.

Like, meeting some in your 30s. How do you see relationship right now? Do you want a relationship? What are you feeling? I've been, oscillating back and forth because I've been having some really nice days alone and I'm like, do I really need this? I don't know. Like, I've been dating a lot. This is the most I've dated in years. I've really like peddled to the metal, just sleep around, date around, do it all. And I'm enjoying it. And I'm in a

phase of my life where I can really enjoy it. Because we always say when it's not enjoyable, don't do it. You're going to go into every date with a negative attitude. I'm having like a lot of fun and I'm loving it. But I don't know. I've been oscillating back and forth recently of like, my life is really good. And like, it's really hard to be in a relationship. You have to prioritize somebody else's feelings and their schedule and their lives and what they want and their whole personality. And I'm like, do I really want their whole personality? I mean, it's still funny because I still resonate with like this single woman. Like I'm like, Tracy Ellis Ross is my icon.

Like that interview Tracy Ellis Ross and Michelle Obama. I'm like, yes, queen. And I'm like, can I even post this anymore? He's like in the room. I'm like, am I appropriating my post-in? Do you see that would be, would be Goldberg quote where she's like, I don't want someone in my house? Yes. I don't want someone in my house.

I'll send it to me. Yo, I'm like, that is the biggest facts. And then I think that, like, the goal is to find somebody that makes you feel that way. Like, it's to feel like I can exist in my life and have my free time and you are a value ad and I'm so amped. Like, I, like, her fiance picked us up from the airport the other day and they, like, hugged and they're so cute to see each other. And I was like, the goal is to feel like when you come back, you don't want to, like, be alone and rot on a Sunday that you're like, amped that person's there. Like, came home early to be with them. Yeah.

Like, that's the feeling I'm chasing. And until I find that, I am fine to be alone. That's how I feel. Where do you feel? I do feel like I'll say, and then I just wanted to say this, I do feel like, you know, because my ex and I met when we were younger, it was like 24 or something. I don't even remember. We were younger.

And, you know, during that time when you meet that young, we were kind of checking each other at every decision point of who we were and in our values and where we were going. And although we didn't end up values aligned, it was like, do we like this? Do we want to do this? And so there was that point where you're kind of so consciously, and unconsciously making decisions together that when I'm older now that I'm, you know, 12, it's like I have to like find someone where it's like we've both had a whole life and we both have a whole developed personality and preferences of experiences that we have to kind of like meet on

where when you're younger, you're kind of clocking those and creating those at the same time. But I think for me, I don't want a relationship right now. I really deeply love, I'm dating someone right now. I don't know if I have a boyfriend or not. But I don't want a relationship. Surrey's out. I was like, if there was a camera over here, you'd see my eyes go. I know.

I feel like half the people listening to this are like, that's my scenario too. No, literally. I'm not dating somebody. I don't know if her in a relationship. I don't know. Last night, Lindsay, I was like, Seth, talking about our conversation. Lindsay goes, so he's your boyfriend. And I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa.

I don't know. We have this funny clip of Ashley going like from years ago talking about her fiancee now. And she was like, I don't know what to call him. And I was like boyfriend. And she was like, oh. Like boy. That's my boyfriend? I have to say husband.

Get out. I can't. It's going to really trip me out when she says husband. Okay. So I want to, and I really want to talk about motherhood as well. But my two main questions for you guys were being single post-divorce and how it's been and how it's changed you in whatever ways. Yeah, I mean, honestly, it's so crazy and cringe because I listened to clips of me talking

when I was like about to be engaged and married. And I thought I knew, honey. I was like, you know, you have to like, da-da-da. And I just like was giving relationship advice and just like, what was the? So we have early episodes that no one should go and listen to. But you were talking and our voices were just so different. But you're like, so here's the thing about Justin. You just have to talk to them.

Yeah, I was like he. You just have to communicate. When I met him, I knew he was my one. And like, you guys have to wait for that. Okay. It's so bad. So post-divorce, I've been divorced for like two, a little over two years now. The first year I didn't date at all.

I was like, I just want to recaligrate. Because when you're in a relationship that long, you are, you know, I'm very spiritual and energetic. So I'm like, you're very cellularly communicating with that person all the time. I wanted to be in my own frequency. I wanted to be like, what do I like? Who am I? How do I move in the world? And so I took the year off and then I started dating like a year or so ago, maybe a little over a year.

And it's been a fucking blast. I literally love it. But I choose for it to be fun. I've had heartbreak. I've had people ghost me. Like, I've had shitty experiences. But I'm like, I just am choosing for it to be fun. I'm choosing for it to be interesting.

I'm choosing to learn about myself. I'm choosing to enjoy the process. And I have enjoyed the process. And honestly, I think I was telling you guys before, it's so humbling, bro. When you're in a relationship for 10 years, you think you fucking know, you're like, she should not be doing that.

You know, you're kind of like, she should wait for the man. And then now I'm like, yo, I got ghosted again last time. You know what I mean? Like, I'm not even know if I'm in a relationship. Literally, I'm like, I might be in a relationship. I might not.

He thinks I'm 24. It's all good. Oh, my God. Like the things that you do when you're like single again. It's just like insane. You could do all the work in the world. You could, like, be in therapy twice a week. You could have done the ayahuasca.

My therapist goes on last week. She goes, she goes, huh? And I go, what? And she's like, you did it again. And I'm like, what? She's like, he's unavailable. And I'm like, fuck. Like, I was like, oh, I thought I had passed this test.

If I weed out all the unavailable guys, there won't be any guys. I were all 100%. I was like, he's a different package of unavailable. Was that year of your life so transformative? Like, being single? Yeah. Like what did that feel? It was just every emotion under the sun, like ups and downs and just.

You know what's funny is I think people talk about this, but women usually process in the relationship. So I was processing the divorce when I was in the relationship. For the last two years of the relationship, probably I was like, it's ending. We're going to transition. So when we actually, he moved out, I was so cool, bro. Okay. It wasn't easy, but I was just like excited to rebuild my life.

And I think it's so beautiful for women. And I think when I was younger growing up with breakups, it was like, got to have the ice cream. Get all my friends. My life sucks. This is miserable. And I was like, yo, my life got exponentially better. I got my deeper friendships.

I felt better in my body. I felt just everything got better for me because I was no longer hiding. I was no longer doubting myself. I was no longer fearful. And so it was actually a really beautiful year, although like there were aspects of it that were of course hard and I didn't expect myself to be single. But it was good. Lindsay, can we talk about being a mom?

Sure, guys. What's the best thing? No, what's the worst thing? Do you want kids? Neither of us, actually 100%. I always say I could see a world in which I meet some. There's one person ever I've offered to have kids with in the last few years. And I heard she said this at a dinner and I wasn't there to check her on it.

And they were like, I was trying to get laid. That was my dirty talking with that guy. Yeah. I was like, no, we could have kids together. It'll be fine. Well, I want to like, I want to hear about you being a mom and you guys talk a lot about like body image. Yeah.

And I do want to like tie that in with it and sex and body image as a mom and all that. But you're just, you're really open about your journey that. I like when people honestly show parts of motherhood. There was a good day. This was a while back, but it stuck with me because like your day kind of got thrown out of whack because your newborn baby and you were supposed to write or something and you just were very open about like this is real life. It's like unpredictable.

Yeah. Like your relationship with time completely changes when you have a kid because I'm a plan. I like to plan. I like to feel like I know what my day is going to look like. I like to know what to expect. and having a child, like your relationship with unpredictability has to be fucking tight. And so, yeah, I've just learned to be very agile. And yeah, I'm just, I'm meeting parts of myself.

I haven't met in a long time, like good parts and parts that I kind of want to like tend to. Like, for example, I mean, in the middle of the night after like the fourth wake up and I've had like two hours of sleep and no I need to be up at a certain time, whatever. I'm like the impatience, the like frustration, that like kind of ragey part comes out. I'm like, yeah, but this is my child. Like, why aren't you a little more patient, you know? I've always known that I wanted to be a mom. And it's like the first time, probably in a long time that I really felt like I'm at home with myself. It's like it's a very interesting feeling.

Like I felt on purpose in my life, but this is just a feeling like I know I'm not going to make a million dollars for being a mom, right? Like, you know, they're not going to get the validation that you get from like pursuing the career and the accolades and the likes and all the things. But it is just like a different type of compensation that I'm just like, this is that shit. This is this is really supposed to be a part of my life. related to my body. I mean... And we don't have to frame it as being a mother, by the way, because you talk about it in the book,

your body being different as you turn 30 and 35 and 40. I mean, we both had our own journeys with our bodies. And I think mine has gone from... I never listened to my body. When I was younger and in my 20s, I mean, my body was sending me messages about the guys I was dating. It was sending me messages about how much alcohol I was consuming about what I was eating and not eating.

And the people I was surrounding myself with, It was always telling me the right and wrong, but I was never listening. And so when I started to listen is when I started to notice like positive changes in my body. It wasn't as stressed. We were homies and I got what it needed. And then when I got pregnant, I had a hard time the first few months. And I think a lot of women experienced this, especially in that first trimester. The changes in the body are really intense.

It's like the first trimester, you're chubby. And so no one knows you're pregnant. and that's kind of a weird feeling because you're just like, you're not going to tell anyone, but you're also experiencing so many changes. You feel like shit. And it's also just a lot of unknown, especially if it's your first.

Like you don't know what's normal, what you're supposed to be feeling. But fast forward, I mean, birth was insane. I will never, ever disrespect my body again. Like it just,

to know that your body knows what to do, not only in birth, but like throughout your life, your body really, really knows. You know? So if you're listening, you will most likely be guided into what you need to do or how you need to treat it.

But yeah, now I mean after like breastfeeding for a year and a half, my boobs are, this is a structured bra, but like boobs are little pancakes. You both look amazing. You know, it's just different. It's different. And like to relate to my husband in a different way, like he's still like, damn. And I'm like, really? But we just, this is part of a relationship.

We're like, we're going to change over time. and I like my work is to embody and appreciate like what my body's done for me so yeah it's like that constant constant journey of of body love it doesn't really stop what was your guys what's your vibe with body had disorderating my entire life yeah I know like our generation bro yeah I mean I started with the diapils and I was like 11 or 12 my dad bought me some when I was 13 oh my god the homie my mom would like chase me around the house she was you'd be like throwing out the no-dose and the dexatrim and all the stuff. Like, I mean, I think it's pretty con.

I also had like really big boobs and I was super developed at a young age. And so I just, I've thought about my body a lot my whole life. And it's interesting a lot of people talk about like, you talk about your book, The Change and Your Bodies, you get to your 30s. I actually thought I've never looked better than when I got to my 30s. Because like you said, I listened to myself a little bit more. I drink less. I work out more.

I mean, I just move more. My skin's better. My hair's better. My body's better since my 30s. insane. I'm not bloated and I know like you're, I can't relate to the like body in your 20s because I was just bloated. You drank so much and then you eat poorly and you just are not treating your body well. So I have always been a confident person, but my weight and the way I looked was always on my mind. I used to be a lot heavier like in my 20s. I don't know. It's weird to talk

about being thin. But I mean, now at 41 like this is the thin. This is better, best I've ever felt and looked. And I'm noticing changes. Like you're noticing changes in your breast and your skin and these things like it's aging it's not easy you just have to accept it and you know do what you can do but it's so much of like the intentional eating and you know I work out to feel good like mentally and not so much I'm not killing myself at the gym like I used to obviously I want to feel like fit and strong but it's more just like the mental health aspect of it all to like go to yoga to get on the peloton whatever it is but yeah I just I finally figured it out I look back and I'm like why was I in my 20s and I couldn't get a handle on my eating.

Yeah. And I'm like, because it was emotional eating. I wasn't happy. Like the happier I got, the better. Yeah. I don't know. It's all connected. It is so connected.

Yeah. I remember, and I know you had something similar that you can speak to, but like that late night after I would have like a night out searching for my husband, you know, found no one. And I would be on the ride home planning what I was going to house. Totally. When I got home to kind of fill that part that didn't get filled. Four pieces of pie. What the fuck?

I'm joking. Yeah, you did. She's like, a lot of pie. She's like, I don't tell anybody that house. It sounds like something I would do.

It was so weird because I was like pie. Is that a bad dream you had? No, it's part of a whole pie. Well, Lindsay, I like that you talk about and I want to hear Chris's journey too, but like I like that you talk about getting a handle on your body

and you didn't mention weight at all. It's just sort of like how you emotionally felt about your body. Yeah. Yeah. I just, I think to get to a place where I can respect what my body is capable of. and I think like motherhood kind of helped me with that. You know, and that's with anything like physical that your body can do. So, you know, motherhood out of it, it's like if I were to fucking

train for a marathon and I could do that, like I would respect my body in a different way. If my body brought me through a really hard season of my life, like I would, you know, it's like having those experiences with your body, I think are are very profound. But I'm curious how you guys feel. I think there's like a piece, because I will say wait. I'll say a piece. I'll say a piece. weight or a piece like homeostasis that we can have in our bodies that we know when we attain it. So I feel like you guys are there now where it's like you feel really good in your bodies, but also it's like a natural place where you feel peaceful, you feel confident, you feel like you're not trying too hard. I think just to that I want to speak to you because I think some people could

hear that and be like, oh yeah, my piece weight is, you know, the lowest weight they've ever thought of in their whole life because that was me. I remember I had a goal weight when I was living in New York City and I was like, I think at the goal weight or before, but I was like, oh, I need more. Like I was like, this is my goal weight. This is the weight that will make me happy on the other side of this is the life that I want and is the life of my dreams. And then I got there and was like, yeah, I think five more would be good. Five less would be good.

The goalpost moved. And now I'm at a place where I have no idea how much I weigh, but I feel so at peace. This is my whole thing with it. It's like it isn't even about the body. It's our relationship to it because you could be a heavier weight and be a You can be a lower weight and be at peace. I do believe that the body has like a natural set point. Homeostasis, yeah. But I think it's, it doesn't matter if it's at that or not. If the body's happy, if our mind and relationship to it is off. And I think so many women of our community and I think

so many women in the world struggle so much with their bodies, like whether they feel insecure about their bodies, they're too curvy, they're too straight, they're too short, they're too fat, they're too thin, whatever. And I think for so many of us, and I think I'll speak for myself, like I was just constantly in a Tetris game of my mind of this is how many macros I've had today. This is how many calories. I need to walk this much to burn the calories off. I need to go to a soul cycle. And then this is how much I weigh.

This is how much I should weigh. And that's a normal loop for a lot of women. Getting up in the morning, this is how many, you know what I mean? Doing that math. Like using so much mental energy to think about changing their bodies. And it almost becomes something that exists outside of the. body itself, you know, where the body isn't even involved in that mental conversation. And when I realized that, you know, I'll never forget it. I was walking across my apartment floor in Venice.

And I was like, yeah, I think I'm going to die with this feeling. Feeling. I think I'm going to live my whole life fighting my body and my weight and playing the game in my head. And it was just like a surrender almost. Where I was like, okay, cool, this is what it is and this is how I'm going to live. And, you know, I think after that point, I found my therapist that I worked on my body with and I really started my true body journey of healing my mother wound, healing the energetic relationship, healing all of these like things that have helped me. And then it was like almost like post-divorce when I really started to look at how I was relating to food because when I was in that relationship, I was stuffing down so many emotions. And I think for a lot of us, we use food to avoid feeling. Yes. We could feel sad. We eat. We could feel happy. We eat. We could, you know, food to soothe, food to cope, food to celebrate, food to all these things. And I was using food in this really, you know, dysfunctional way. And so once I broke that relationship, I was like, yo, I'm actually going to feel what I need to feel. And then I could really be free in my body.

And I think now that I've felt so at home in my body and so at peace, it's the one thing in my life where I'm like, I never thought I would get. And who knows if it's going to be like this forever. But the fact that I've got this is like some of the greatest, like, for me, proof that like the, work works. Thank you for sharing that. And it really, it's a profound statement to think I'm going to die like this. And I think we forget how ingrained this is in our life to like think about our bodies, criticize our bodies. I mean, from the time I was like 12 years old, there was a scale in our bathroom. There was like, you know, the shower, the toilet's scale right there. And I weighed myself every single morning, starting from the time I was like 13. And this went on

for 20 years. I started my day with what is the number on this scale and how is this going to affect the rest of my day? And what a crazy way to start your day. And there was never a number. There was never a number at which I was happy. It was just like yesterday the number was different. I don't like this number. Five pounds left. Like when I threw that scale away and stopped starting my day like that, it changed my whole fucking life. You determine like your worth based on that. You determine your happiness based on that. And just thinking about that prison, you know, and like the fact that your soul has so much to do here to live, to love, to laugh, to do all this stuff. And you're just like, yo, none of that.

is possible now because I'm three pounds more than I want. Right. I know. I mean, psychotic. If you would have told me at 25 that it 40, one, that I would be 20 pounds thinner and not thinking constantly about what I was eating or not eating. I wouldn't believe you. I know. First of all, that's not true because like everybody knows. Like once you hit 30, it's all downhill. All these are like lies. Lies. Crazy stuff. And I mean, then the hormones play into it. I mean, getting off the pill was such a game changer from the way my body looked but just all the things. Yeah, big time.

But then you got to figure out what to do so you like don't get pregnant. I mean, whatever. It's like being a woman is like trash. We talk about that in the book too because it's like for so many women that later 20s and even for us like I got off birth control. I think when I was like 26 and I remember calling my ex and I was like, hey, I'm like off birth control. He's like, he like didn't even know.

He's like, okay, sounds good. I'm like, okay, I'm doing this. And it changed my whole life. Like for so many women, we are replacing what is naturally a hormone in our body with something that is synthetic. So your brain chemistry is based on synthetic things. the way you relate to yourself and others is synthetic. So I think the birth control thing is huge. And I think now women, I think, are looking at it differently where we're not going to

birth control immediately. We're finding other solutions. And it's not like birth control is bad, but for us, it was really powerful to get off of it. Well, we're just not like informed. You know what you mean? So we go on it because I went on it because I wanted to treat my acne and I was like having sex with my high school boyfriend. You know, it's like, oh, okay, cool. And I thought it was like a right of passage. Me too. Same. I was like, I'm a woman now. Did you guys have the alarms on your phone? Yeah. In college? I would forget to take it and then take like three in a day. Oh my God.

And we always like to clarify. Like we also live in a time where when it comes to women's reproductive health, like birth control is so important. And like women being able to like play in their lives. It's just, and I'm on a hormonal IUD. Rain is on a non-hormonal. And I found that it really worked for me. Yeah.

Looking back, I think my journey is what it should be. But like I can't believe I spent that many years on the pill. But I'm also like I met my now fiance a month after I got off it. Like everything played out the way it was supposed to. and I think became my true self. But we don't have a lot of information. Yeah. Are you guys both just raw dog?

Raw dog. Okay. Yeah, 2018. I was on it for 10 years. I went on at 18, got off at like 28, I think. Yeah, raw dog. And you, I mean, you got to be careful. I just laughed the other day because I told my sister.

I was like, I don't think, I was like in my entire life of knowing you, like me and my sister are so close. I was like, have I ever had a scare? And she's like, no. I was like, I think I'm having a scare. She's like, damn. I was like, okay. I'm fine.

Yeah. But I was like, wow, I'm like a right of passage to have a scare. Mm-hmm. You know? I suppose. Yeah, no, I mean, I think I have one scare, but I mean the recklessness with which I was parading around not using protection. Yeah, I know. Yeah, was not good.

But as you do. We all made it. You know, I've been thinking as I almost turned 40, like the things in my, like, what is the last decade brought me? And, you know, am I where I want to be? I mean, when you're almost 30 to your, you know, your books point. Like you do start to take inventory in these decades of like, where am I? Who am I? Have I achieved enough? Am I making enough money? Like who are the people in my life? And it is a really like formative moment where you're like, what do I have to change? So you wrote this book for women like 27 to 30 in this phase of life. What do you feel like is the advice you're the most proud of saying to them? What do you want people to take from this book as they barrel towards 30?

I just want to say too, like, you know, this book is absolutely for that age range, but it's also for anyone navigating change. Like I even found, like, we were reading the audiobook version of this. Oh, fun. I was like, damn, I got to take my own advice on this. Bro, me too. I was like embarrassed a little bit. I was like, fuck, I have not got this down.

Like, there's the burnout chapter on burnout and I was like. On burnout as I read this. I was like, I haven't changed at all. Like that part, I was like, yo. But I think this period is very formative in how you navigate change. and your relationship with change. So I think, you know, one of the things that I took from this period of my life was to trust myself implicitly, you know, and for so long I didn't.

For so long, I outsourced my truth and I outsourced, you know, what I should do with my life. I outsourced all the answers. And when I started practicing trusting myself, I was like, oh, damn, she really does know, you know. And even if she doesn't know the right answer, she knows. she knows the next best like action to take that will lead her into the lesson that she needs. Some of us get into hairy situations and we're like, fuck, we can't trust. I can't trust myself.

Like that was the wrong choice. And it's like, no, like every choice you make is actually on your path, is actually on purpose and leading you into the lesson that you need into the growth moment that is for you. So I would say for me it's just now is the time to start practicing trusting yourself. It's so important for the rest of your life and your relationships, in your career, in your relationship with your body. Like, it's the foundation. And when I say trust yourself to get a little woo-woo, but we talk about it in the book,

it's like that relationship with your soul, the part of you that knows, the part of you that is connected to something greater that, you know, is non-judgmental is always there to collaborate with you. She might not be the loudest one in the room, but she's always there. I think in the book, you know, I felt so lost in life. But when I realized now looking back that me being lost was like me actually getting on the path, that was mine, not anyone else's. And I think for anyone, whether you're in your 20s or 30s, it's like being lost in life

and not knowing the path means it's actually the path you're meant to be on because it's yours. And I think so many of us look at other people's blueprints or other people's Instagrams or social media and we're like, oh, I should do that, I should do that. It's like, no, your path will never look like anyone else's, and that's the point. You don't want it to look like anyone else's. And I just wish that we could really learn that when there isn't a clear path, it's the best one. You know, what is made for us will be unknown.

And I can think the more we can get excited about it, the better. Guys, it's really beautiful. Thank you. You're not behind. You're becoming. Okay. Turn your mess into magic. I just do all of our, like, 50 taglines.

Exactly. And I want to agree with you. that I read a lot of this book. And yes, it is great for any transformative moment in your life where you are like, who the fuck am I? Where am I going? And everybody else seems to have figured this out.

No, they haven't. No, those people will fuck up in fault or two. You just don't see it on Instagram. Just think about me giving relationship advice. They will get divorced too. Yeah, your friends are going to be divorced too. I always say to my friends, so many of my friends are divorced. And I'm like, real G's a divorce.

Well, I love it. And I love that you guys mentioned the audio. book too. Oh my God. That's so fun. Especially for people who like your podcast. Dude, I'm excited if you guys do it. It was the most fun. Yeah. I've had in years. It was my favorite thing. Because also, like, we started on our closet floors. Like no video, no nothing. Oh my God. Didn't have video for years and years and years. Yeah. So it was like, I love that. Like I love just being us in the microphone, like using our voices as our instrument and being in a booth, no video, recording something that was so meaningful to us and bringing life to the words was just like, it was so much fun. Yeah. I love that.

Recording an audiobook would bring us back to our roots. Oh my God. Just like sitting in my old shitty apartment. Should we go back to the East Village? Across from a table I found on Craigslist. Yeah. Hunched over one mic. Did we record in one mic for a little while? Yes. Because I couldn't figure. It was an omnidirectional mic. Oh my gosh. I remember. Did you have the Yetty? We did that too. You had the Yetty. The Snowball Yetty. That's what everybody did back that we had to do this video for years. Do you guys ever think about what if you did? Oh, I wish that we did.

I love to know a video. Oh, the way I would show up looking like shit. Girl, unbelievable. I feel like I only started dressing up one year ago. Yeah, we've been doing video for three years. I know I see at the beginning, like when we first started, I like didn't want to be dressing up and now I look back. I'm like, dress up. But it's so funny because I think sometimes like I have a really good outfit and I'm like, I wouldn't wear it to podcast, but that's the most people that are going to see it.

I know. I know. At least 10,000 people are going to see it on YouTube. Why not? That is so funny. It's a funny thing. But it's like you don't want to try too hard. Exactly. Because if girls try too hard, we get shit. Yes. Right. They like to see us in the sweatband. People that show up in a loop. But also I was so like hesitant to like get dressed for podcasting. And now I wear jeans at a top. Yeah. Yes. A solid color top. I'm not like busting out fashion. I'm wearing a belt. I'm not wearing a belt. No, you look great. I love your belt. But I've actually been stare at your office

and I came out and I came by the whole thing. But like I'm wearing jeans in a top and like I'm not breaking the fashion barriers, but I was really resistant to it. Every time someone shows up in like a look, like, I should dress better. Oh, I know. I know. She came the other day. She was wearing like a skirt and a fur jacket. I was like, girl, what season are we in? Yeah.

What are we doing? Mom wife. Yeah, she showed up in a whole look. Oh, so good. But it looks good when people do like a full look. When you own the look. Yeah, that's real. I can't own the look.

I can't own the look. If I walk in in the outfit, Shan shows up and you're like, this is such a I could walk in and own that. Yeah. She has such a present. I know. She's so beautiful. All right.

Well, you guys, tell everybody where, I mean, the book, of course. Book about tomorrow. Your Instagram handles all the things. Thanks for having us. Tell everybody where they can find everything. Yeah. So the book is almost 30 is the name, just like the podcast. And it's a definitive guide to a life that you love for the next decade and beyond.

So you can have it if you're 20s, your 30s. And it really is like going from lost to a life that you love. And we're really proud of it. It's just like the gift of a lifetime to offer it. You can get it almost 30.com slash book or wherever. you get books, Amazon, Barnes & Noble, et cetera. And then almost 30 is the podcast. We've had the babes on a few times.

You can search The Girls Got to Eat Almost 30 if you want to listen to those episodes. And then Almost 30 podcast on social. And I'm on social at It's Krista. And I'm at Lindsay Simpson. We appreciate you guys. I love you. It's amazing. And it's just been really wonderful to watch the evolution of your lives and meet your

partners. And we love that. You guys are the best. Thank you. Explode professionally. Bye, y'all. Bye. Snackheads.

You guys can find us. at Girls Gotta Eat.com, Girls Gotta Eat Podcast on Instagram and TikTok. I'm Ash Hess. Raina is reina.org. Of course on YouTube, hope you're watching on YouTube. If not, get on YouTube, share this episode with a friend, get their book, and we will see you Thursday. Have a good week, guys. Bye.