Girls Gotta Eat - The Only Way to DTR (and Other Dating Advice) with Nick Viall

Episode Date: August 7, 2023

We are so excited to welcome author/podcaster/Bachelor alum Nick Viall into the GGE studio for some real-talk dating advice. We discuss fuckboys vs. players, how to approach (and not approach) the DTR conversation, the step-by-step process for turning a situationship into a relationship, compatibility vs. chemistry (and what's more important), why love at first sight isn't real, and more. We also have Nick translate common things guys say ranging from "I can't give you what you want" to "I want to lay low tonight." Before he joins us, we break down the Barbie movie, Ashley's passion for shopping malls, and Rayna's date with you-know-who. Enjoy! Follow Nick on Instagram @nickviall, check out his podcast The Viall Files, and get his book Don't Text Your Ex Happy Birthday. Follow us @girlsgottaeatpodcast, Ashley @ashhess, and Rayna @rayna.greenberg. Visit our website for tour dates, merchandise, and more. Shop Vibes Only. Thank you to our partners this week: HelloFresh: Get 50% off plus free shipping at hellofresh.com/50gge and use code 50GGE. Buffy: Get $20 off your order at buffy.co with promo code GGE. AG1: Get a free 1-year supply of immune-supporting Vitamin D + 5 free travel packs with your first purchase at drinkAG1.com/gge. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Remind yourself that you're single. If you're in a situation, what you're not in is a relationship. You are single. Yes. That's very important. Clip it. Welcome back to another episode of Girls' Gotta Eat. Welcome back.

Somebody said that one week I said, hey, guys. No, that's a lie. I got a message. I got a DM. Somebody was like, you wrote, hey, guys. And I was like, that's literally a lie. You think I wouldn't pick that up? That's an insult to me.

You need to apologize to me. You think I wouldn't notice. What if you did? I'll die. If you did that in, I think you would. I didn't notice. I would question everything. I don't think that's possible.

Hey, guys. No, no, no, no, no, no. Hey guys. No, we would have caught it. What if I hit you with a hey girls one week? I'd be like, am I having a stroke? I'll never do that to any of you. Am I malfunctioning?

You're malfunctioning like Barbie. Barbie, we're the best part of your weird Barbie. I love that part of the Barbie movie so much. Weird Barbie is like. She had that fucked up hair cut. We all did that to our Barbie. Okay. But did we do.

I did. Or is it a personality type? Like I would love to know if there are some listeners that didn't cut their Barbie's hair, fuck with their faces with markers, do crazy stuff. Like, are there two types of girls? Or were we all ruining our Barbies? I would do it with like one Barbie, like the stupid, like the waitress Barbie or whatever. Like the one I didn't care about. Well, we're going to talk about our Barbie journeys and I'm going to reveal what I did to Matt's Barbie on the podcast. You know the story. You know the story right now and it's fucked up. And you guys are going to look at me differently. I used to make Arlen wore dresses. I was ahead of my time.

I was like, even boys can wear dresses. Obviously, I put Matt in dresses too, but this is bad. It's so funny to think about, like, your brother's just so much bigger than you. It's not funny to look at my brother and be like, you could bully him because he's the same size as me. Well, I bullied Matt until, you know, the story. We were home alone one time and he raised that fire poker to me. And my whole childhood, my mom would say, just wait, he's going to get bigger than you.

And you can't picture that when you're little. You're like, yeah, right. I'm older. Like, I'm four years older. What do you mean he's going to get bigger than me? That's a sentence I heard the most in my life from age four to 10. That's the most I just didn't happen. Greenbergs are short kings only.

Except for Uncle John. Somehow he broke six feet. But everyone else is hot. He is kind of hot. Raina, you can't say. Shout out to Andrews. sessions every week. She is a dedicated listener.

Okay. We were really exciting episode today. We have Nick Vile today. and if you think we're pronouncing his name wrong, there is no correct pronunciation. I thought it's Viol. But I'm saying like, people are probably hearing it and like, that's not right.

He doesn't even know what's right. And we'll talk about it with him. But like I always said Viol and then people say vial. And it is closer to vial. He said he doesn't know or care. Well, I always said Viol, but I listen to his podcast and it's the vial files. Like it's supposed to rhyme. He doesn't know or care.

And he says that. He's so hot. I don't care. We have a call him whatever he wants. Like I'll go John. Oh, my God. Who are your hall passes? Nick Vile, your uncle, and that guy that looks like a big baby.

You guys. He said that, Jenny. I don't want to deal with her joke. So Dave Batista is the love of my life, my perfect man. And he is like a, if you guys know, he's a wrestler, but he was in, not knives out, but what's the other one? Glass Onion. Okay. He is a massive, bald, bearded guy with tattoos.

But Jenny, our friend Jenny, was like, he looks like a giant baby. Did that change your opinion at all? Yeah, can you see it? I can't. And then today he posted a photo of himself with hair from like back in the day, long, thick, clush his hair and I was really icked by it. I didn't like it. Ew. Ew.

Ew. So, yeah. So we saw Barbie last night. And, you know, I already posted this on my Instagram, but I had thrown Barbie a little shade. I did a poll a week or so before it came out. I was like, do you guys, A, feel like this has been going on for fucking ever? And it's been so much in your face and like the marketing.

And it's just been shoved down our throats. And like the movie could never possibly live up to. the hype. And I think it was like 60 or 70% agreed with me. And I wasn't trying to be like controversial or pick me about it. I just was like getting annoyed. But someone said last night, one of our friends, we went with the said last night, she was like, well, first of all, it's because it's coming from Mattel and they have all the money in the world. Like it's different. It's like a branded movie. Absolutely. And the demo could be literally anybody, you know, so a lot of movie marketing campaigns are only catering to like a certain demo.

And Barbie could be, I said it's everybody except like Andrew Tate dudes. Well, also you said, I think you said that we live in L.A., so it's like everywhere. I know. And I kind of forgot literally is everywhere. The movies in Venice, Malibu, Barbie. Like it's so, Barbie was very Los Angeles, California in the first place. So I think we were seeing it way more. So many installations are obviously going to be in New York and L.A. and whatnot.

So I'm sure maybe people in other cities in the Midwest were like, it's just normal marketing. And we're just like, it's everywhere. Anything that's marketed that hard is dog shit. It's never good. Even the Mattel machine, it's never good. I know. When we were joking that I was like, they haven't even been that discerning with their collabs.

It's like progressive insurance. You know, it's just like every brand was branded with Barbie. And so it felt like so overkill. But I should have done more research. Like I should have known Greta Gerwig. And I should have known that it was going to be this more like feminist East Array as president.

Yeah. So, you know, I take back what I said. I still think it was crazy amount of marketing, a trillion dollar budget or something. just a give or take. But we loved it. We had the cutest date night, first of all. It was me and you and our two girlfriends at the mall.

Ugh, that mall at Century City. It was, there's stores there. I didn't know anthropology just had a home goods store. I didn't know free people had an a leisure store. But they don't have in that mall is a map. We go. Raina's trying to find her car at the end of the night. But on my way into the mall, Ashley was like, are you good?

It took me 20 minutes to get from the parking lot to the theater. And I was like, I'm going to leave. I'm going to leave. No one would help me. I had to go into a yogurt shop and ask for help. You sound like pretty woman. And I have all this money and no one will help me. I want me to shop and no one will help me.

I was having a complete meltdown. You guys had gone in. I was like, enjoy your day. It's hot. And I really was having a meltdown trying to find it. I found this. So I don't know why this is so funny. I went to walk away.

I was laughing so on the other night, it was just me right and Kate and I, I think we were doing a little bit better navigating the mall. But we knew that we parked on the parking level. We parked in the orange area and you parked in the red. So we're in front of this giant like digital directory. And it says like search by store name and Rayna just, right? It just starts to type in red. And I see her type in an R. I'm like, oh my God. And Kate goes, is she typing in red. It says like search mall by store name. And right is like red.

Parking. Red. I'm in the, it was so funny. And some coffee shop called like red straw pops up. Like you did. It was so funny to me. In the moment I guess I didn't realize it was so funny. I mean, in my event, where is my car?

That mall is four stories high. It is a full LA City blog. It's the biggest mall I've ever seen in my life. And I didn't know how to find red. And it said orange and some blue downstairs. You guys did make sure that I got to the car safe because you know I trip in parking lots. We did make sure you got there safe.

malls were my entire personality growing up. Like, all I wanted to do was be at the mall. All I did was play mall madness. Like, I remember the Christmas morning that I got Mall madness. Like, all I cared about, my mom once a year would take me up to King of Prussia Mall. Because, like, Dover Mall was my local mall. And then Christiana was the fancy mall. And then if we went to King of Prussia, who, it was on.

Like, all I wanted to do my whole childhood was go to the Mall of America. And then when we went, I was just like, this is like the best day of my life. But I remember even going to Miami to visit our family in Miami. And there was, it was called the Falls. That was an indoor. outdoor mall. And I was like, who gets to live like this? Like, I was like, who gets to have this mall? Like, you know, you grow up in the north and like things that are like that, like even high school movies, like high schools that are indoor, outdoor, like malls. You're like, this is so far

from my life. The quad in high schools. Stuff like that. Yes. Like I couldn't, it was so foreign to me. And like when I was little, I couldn't even comprehend even living in California, nevertheless, even visiting. And so to be in that mall and I'm like, I live here. This is like my local mall. The child in me is just like, I made it. I get to. to go to this mall. That mall is incredible. And I have to tell you how jealous I am that that's like your childhood experience. I didn't know. I wasn't a mall kid. And I've been thinking for a long time about why. Because you brought this up on the podcast and we were talking about listening. Oh, right. We have talked about this. Yeah. I was not a mall kid and I'm sad that

I was robbed with that. But my parents got divorced and I was four and the only time I got to spend with my dad was Saturdays and Sundays. So you pick us up and do activities with us. And so I never had a mall culture. Yeah. I mean, that totally makes sense. I guess, A, I wanted to always be at the mall shopping and things like that. And once I could drive, all I ever want to do was drive and shop and things like that. But you'll like this story. One summer, I worked the whole summer. This was the summer after senior year in high school. So going into college and I worked at this golf club. It was the worst employee that I've ever had. I've like joked about this. I drove across the green. I was like the historically worst person. Who were you telling this story to?

Oh, Larry David. I was so jealous. You're doing so good telling the story. And I was like, she's making laughs so much. I was telling Larry David the story about how I worked at this golf club and was so terrible when I was like 18. He was laughing so hard. I was like, this is the best moment of my life. I was so, I'm never more jealous. And I made all this money. I don't know. Maybe I made $800. Right.

Like the whole summer, a thousand bucks maybe. And this was what, oh, one. And I went up to King of Prussia and spent every dollar. That I relate to. And I came home with all these shopping bags. I had a coach bag. And my parents were like, what the fuck? And I was like, I went shopping.

They were like, did you? I was like, I spent all my money I made this summer. They were like, you were supposed to save your money. And I was like, well, you didn't take. Tell me that. Okay, that's bullshit. And all of us have had that fight with our parents, and every single time I had that fight with my mom

and I was just like, what am I supposed to do with it? Wet seal has so many T-shirts that say, like, come dumpster on it that you had to go buy. First of all, $800, I wasn't a wet seal. I was at guess. I was at coach. You knew you were fancy if you bought the coach bags. I bought like a $250 coach bag.

I was like, am I Paris Hilton? No one told us to save our money. And also, by the way, Rayna, I don't know if that's true. sure people had parents that were like save your money but like for some reason like I liked having my own money because I always worked but like I just blew it all like I didn't know that I was supposed to save it. I also thought that like $800 to $1,000 wasn't that much. I think I was like in the grand scheme of things. Oh I thought that was. I was like I could buy this mall. I was like it could go no bank account what's that going to do or I could buy t-shirts and that's going to be amazing.

I mean I feel like you would blow it all in t-shirts like that's what you still do today. a running joke in my family since I was 14. Raina spends all over money on T-shirts. And I'm buying coach bags. Investment pieces. I remember that bag like it was yesterday. My mom used to say to me, I think it's more important to buy one nice thing instead of 20 average things and I would be like, you're stupid.

And I was such a slut for Ardenby and BB. Bebe was my favorite. Like one time I bought a $100 pair of pants, I was like, I'm the richest woman alive. Pants that are $100. They had those like Rhinestone Bebebe Shirts that said BB across your chest I felt like the richest person alive

So fancy my baby shirt Are you Swarvowski? My juicy pants The BB T-shirt So I did while we're doing nostalgia Which we have been doing a lot lately I did want to hear about your Barbie Journey like growing up

Like I don't even have to know this Were you so into Barbies like Are you just normal? I think I'm right up the middle I don't think I got like Midge or Skipper or like I didn't at the accoutrement Barbies, but I had like, probably like Dr. Barbie, a Malibu Barbie. Yeah, totally hair. Totally hair Barbie.

She came with a little gel. Yes. If you weren't cutting your hair, you're not our people. If you didn't cut totally hair of Barbie's hair, I loved to cut hair. You were supposed to cut it, right? I think that was the point of it. It was down to her feet and you were supposed to give her little haircuts. I think I just had like run-of-the-mill Barbie. Yeah. And then we had a plethora of Ninja Turtles, just hundreds of Ninja Turtles. But did you? You play with them too? Did you like voice toys?

I loved Ninja Turtles. I hated anything boy. I loved it. We had so many Ninja Turtles. G.I. Joe's. Get out of the most of in the house. Berenstein Bear Books.

Ninja Turtles. And Barbie. Also, why did we have so many Ninja Turtles? There's only so much range you can get with the turtles. Were Ninja Turtles trying to be like Barbie? Was there like a doctor Ninja Turtle? No, there was. Stop.

Rain and an astronaut Ninja Turtle. President Turtle. President Michelangelo Ninja Turtles Like why did I have so We had like a Ninja Turtle's like layer They were in the sewer They lived in the sewer

Yeah April So wasn't she in charge of them Or was that somebody's girlfriend April was like Splinter's girlfriend No she was just in charge of the Splinter Ninja Turtles Anyways I don't know why we had so many Ninja Turtles

My brother was super into the Ninja Turtles But I was obsessed with Barbie Like totally obsessed And I also think like The thing that spoke to me so much in the movie was that before Barbie, it was just baby dolls for little girls to play with. So you were like, all the only thing I can play is to be a mom, you know? And I'm sure, again, I don't know how totally accurate that was, but I'm sure that's the case. That was the first time it was like an adult

woman you were like playing with. And I grew up like not really liking cartoons. Like I wanted to watch like Stay by the Bell and full house and like real people as soon as I could. Like I just wanted to like be grown up, I guess. But I had the townhouse. The Barbie townhouse. It had a little elevator. So I thought it was a condo. I looked it up earlier with Tessa. It was a three-story townhouse. But it still wasn't a dream house. So we had a downsized Barbie dream house. It's a townhouse. It's one you get divorced from Ken where you have to move into. But like I was never a rich kid so like I didn't have Barbie power wheels or I didn't have the dream house. But I had a townhouse. That's middle upper class. You got the town house. So funny. That's where you move with your mom after your dad lose you.

But Corey reminded me the other day. She was like, because we were friends since we were four. She was like, remember I would come over and like we would use a little elevator. But I was just like so obsessed with them being adults. And then after that, I had a memory unlocked that I had since 93 every year for, I don't even know, 15, 20 years, the holiday Barbie Christmas ornament. So they made it and they would sell at like Hallmark stores. And I had like 20 of them. I don't know what they're worth these days.

Like even when I was an adult, I had like a whole ass Barbie Christmas tree with just the ornaments on. I'm like, my mom has gotten a Christmas ornament every year since we were born. and me and my brother, it's like a holiday tradition. Then she started getting me the Barbies, and I was like so into it. So this has kind of come back to me how much I was so obsessed with it. And I...

Did you meet friends that had the car? The real car. That's what I'm saying, the power wheels, right? Yeah. No, that's rich kid shit. That's a really rich kid shit. Like, I remember one girl, her dad owned car dealerships.

She had that shit. And they had like a Jeep for boys. Oh, that's great. They had a Barbie Jeep. Wasn't this power wheels and Barbie? Like, whatever. Yeah, there was a real ass car you could drive around. Those were the richest kids in town.

I was like, I have the townhouse. No one wanted to come over to your house. But, you know, the movie, I loved it. I loved the beginning. I love the end. I laughed out loud at the very, very end. And I loved everything in between. I was, like, talking with Tess about on the way over.

Like, I want to see it again. And I want to read more think pieces on it. I mean, we just saw it last night. And, you know, obviously, it's a lot about feminism. And, you know, but there's a whole thing. Was Barbie a feminist icon in the first place? And was she harmful to body image and things like that? And then the whole patriarchy thing.

I mean, there were points in the movie that, like, made me angry and, like, sick a little. Like, when they do take over and make it Kendom, like, I got this weird feeling of, like, when Donald Trump won the presidency, you know, like, where I'm like, I was sitting in that movie and being like, why couldn't Hillary win? You know, like, I know it's not like, we don't live in, like, Kendom, but there was things that were weirdly triggering to me, like, when Ken came to the real world and there's that montage of all men, and they treat that woman assistant like shit. And then it's like all the presidents.

and everything was in the horses and I just was like I turned to Kate I go, I hate this. Like that part of it I don't know what I expected I didn't expect it to be laugh out loud funny I laughed out loud in that theater so many times

I cried like really cried had to like overt my eyes towards the end I didn't think it was going to have all this deep symbolism about like the patriarchy and what it is to be a woman and America Ferrara is so good and she's an incredible speech and I'm not going to ruin for you guys

but just about how hard it is to walk the line of a woman and to be respected and liked and powerful but approachable and it's just... And thin, but not too thin, and, you know, all the things. I just didn't expect the Barbie movie to be so deep and meaningful

because I just thought like this has to appeal to kids also so I didn't think there'd be so much like symbolism and like deep, I don't know, thoughts on the world. Yeah, I mean, I want to read more or watch more, Tessa was like schooling me this morning. She was like saying that's such the most brilliant stuff. What she sang? Repeat it.

The one thing she said, so I was like, I saw this notion, this is like a hot take, but that it was reversed. You know, like Barbie land is actually like the patriarchy where the men are in charge. And Tessa was like, well, no, because the Ken's weren't oppressed. They weren't actually oppressed. The Barbies just didn't care about that.

Right. And that was one interesting thing. And then the other thing she said was that the issue that I didn't like, I thought Ken got too much air time at the end. I thought the whole scene with her in the yellow dress talking to him and all that stuff, it could have been shorter for me. It was starting to drag on for me. I was like, too much air time.

This should have ended after they won back the community. The John Travolta Greece dance number. I didn't need it. But then if you guys know what we're talking about, out there's two alternate worlds and the Barbies are in charge of Barbie world. If you haven't seen it, you're probably skipping ahead, like a spoiler, you know, whatever. But I'm sure so many people have probably seen it by now. But she made such a good point that like that whole thing where Barbie is trying to make Ken feel good about himself,

he never once apologizes for like taking over her house and trying to ruin their community. And it's like, again, women having to like console men and help them like find themselves. It like angered me again. It's true. And then he just, she like kind of played. him and then he comes on to her again. And it's like, why do we have to live in this world? Do we have to like placate men?

America of Ferraris says this too. She says something like, we have to let men down gently because if you lean into your slut and if you say no, you're a bitch. And she like lets him down gently and he still tries to hook up with her. And how unfair is it? I know.

So I wanted to read you this. I'm just going to read the list, but there was an every girl article, which I have a little bit of a beef with every girl from this one thing they posted on Instagram one time and I unfollowed them. But whatever, they still have good content. I'm not going to get into it.

But anyway, I did like this article. It says Barbie was surprisingly deep. Six lessons will remember for life written by Emma Ginsburg. One, it was surprisingly deep. Girls can do anything and it's okay if you find that absolutely exhausting. Two, different generations of feminists can find common ground. Three, extremes of masculinity and femininity are damaging to everyone. Four, it is not women's burden to fix men who do not yet know themselves.

Five, womanhood is a constant balance of contradictions and recognizing that is impanagan. And six, we need more female directors in Hollywood. Is that a good list? It's a good ass list. Yes, it really sounds good. We'll share that, you guys. Do you have anything else to say about Barbie? I love the movie.

I highly recommend it. I totally agree with you. I want to go see it again so I can pick up the undertones. And I even liked how they treated Ruth, I forget her name, but she was the creator of Barbie. And they like made jokes about her Ginsburg, right? That's actually like I was on the tip of my tongue. I was like, it wasn't her, right? Well, and then the-

She was like, she embezzled from the company. And she's like, it's a different movie. That was the funniest line. And, oh, you know what made me laugh the hardest? I was trying to remember if I knew the moment. The moment I laughed the hardest was when they first showed that cellulate. It was up there. We all laughed so hard when they showed the leg and people like,

and it was just like a little piece of cellulite. I had lost my God. I got to grab my own cellulate. And then the line at the end, mom stands still so they can look back and see how far their daughters have come. Is that accurate, Tessa? Something like that. You guys know it. Okay.

I want to decide. I do want to say one more thing to you. Think about the hardest you ever cried in a movie. The hardest I ever cried in a movie. Yeah. Yeah, this is so easy. What? I have a childhood one and an adult one.

Okay, tell me. Childhood was Forrest Gump. What happened? When Jenny died, the second, they say, like, you died on a Wednesday or whatever, the day of the week. I lost my fucking mind. And then a star is born. You know, I had to walk home. People were asking me on the street if I was okay.

I sat in the bathroom stall to try to have my face go down because I sobbed. You got mad. I saw that alone. You were like, why did you go alone? I was like, no one can see me like this. It was like Dewey died. It was unbelievable. I went alone purposely because I knew I was going to lose my goddamn mind.

What's yours? Okay, I have one that's going to surprise you. I was trying to remember. Also, weirdly million-dollar baby. Did you see that? I saw that theater in college and Hillary Swank and Clint Eastwood, and for some reason I was like really into that movie and when she gets, you know, injured.

She's a spinal cord injury or whatever. And I just was weirdly sobbing. Okay. Those are my three. Okay, listen, I had to overt my eyes a little bit during Barbie. Last night, towards the end, when they do that montage of like, feelings and like memories. Yes. The second hardest I cried was the notebook. I was going

through a breakup. Like guttural sobbing in public. It was humiliating. And the hardest I've ever cried to movie, this is like a deep cry. I feel like a lot of people haven't seen this. She's in the giver. I just thought you pulling this up. I did not see the giver, but I read the giver. Have you read the giver? Have you read the giver? Yeah, in high school. So it's really weird. I thought you couldn't read to him a couple weeks ago. No, I can read aloud. You read aloud. You read it out loud. I'm sorry. You've read the You read a book in high school? Do I not know you at all?

I didn't know you ever read. So this is a crazy thing. I read a couple books in high school. The only books that I did not do close notes for, they all start with a G. The Giver, the great Gatsby, and great expectations. Okay.

Those are the only books I ever read. Rain and G. That's why. Rain and G. The Giver is about an alternate universe, right? Where basically people, they don't experience feelings and they don't have memories of the past.

And so the giver is a person, and he, once in a while, like, chooses a person to teach them how to feel. And at the end of the movie, this kid is like burst out into the snow, I think, and he's never felt snow before. And there's this giant rush of like feelings and death and birth and heartbreak and love and marriage and having children. And like, I like lost my mind in the theater. It was sort of like last night. That's the hardest I ever cried in a movie. It's really beautiful to think about all the things we get to experience in life, even the bad stuff.

So we like get to feel. So I love that. What a good correlation between the two. Yeah, all about like feeling. I want to ask this maybe on like an Instagram something. Like what's the hardest people have ever cried in a movie? I really like that question. Oh, thank you. Yeah. Okay, I did want to say before we get into Raina's date that this week in a month, we're starting the tour. So it's August 7th, September 9th.

We start the tour in London. I can't wait. And then we're in Texas in September 2, Dallas Business Card Guy. And there is the transition. So there it is. You did it. We're doing a really amazing podcast or guesting on someone's podcast in Austin, which is truly like my lifelong dream.

Yes. Come catch us in Austin when Raina is on a high from who we're recording with there. Biggest high ever. It's not Joe Rogan. That's a great guy. Just to clarify. Not him. The other really famous comedy person lives there.

And then just so many amazing tour dates. So that's it, girls got to eat.com. Dallas Business Car Guy is in town. So you made me laugh so hard earlier because you said I wish that my boyfriend had a nickname. It's just... You're like, I'm so sick I'm calling my boyfriend. Well, it's just... I'm not going to say his name, whatever, like, yet.

And so, you know, he's like a private person in the world. And I will never reveal somebody I'm dating ever again. Right. I mean, you kind of like, you set the tone with the last one. But I don't have a nickname for him. I hate to be out of your, like, my boyfriend every time. And it's like too late now. Like, you have Dallas business card guy forever.

I know. I know. Well, he created his own nickname. I mean, we could give some nicknames. Did he? What do you mean he created? Just like you created the car?

I mean, I have a nickname. I don't, do I have a nickname for him? I mean, I could come up with one pretty easily. Beautiful man. He is very beautiful. Those eyes. Sparkle eyes. Do you want sparkle eyes?

Yes. That's it. It's imagining you tell you about your first fight and you're going to be like, and then sparkle eyes. had the nerds. Sparkle eyes. It's so good. He's great eyes. Yeah, okay. I can't wait to you have a serious conversation with me about sparkle eyes. That's sparkle eyes. Well, I would say his name to you if you meet on this podcast. He's on this podcast. You know, we're probably never going to fight. We have guys. We're never going to have a fight. Who was the guy? So Kane and I were

having our first fight. We're on the beach in the Hamptons. It was hazy. It was like 40 degrees up for some reason. And Wolverine, what's his name? Not Wolverine. Sabretooth. Leaves Shriver. Leav Shriver. Yeah, he was on the beach. I'm just thinking about, like, describing this fight that Cain and I had on the beach and Leav Shriver is there and the dog's there. And I'm referring to him as Sparkle Eyes. Sparkleyes is so funny. Like, I'm not going to be able to not laugh every time I say it, which is exactly what you want. Yeah. Because I feel like that about Dallas Business Card guy. It's funny every time. And I was emailing with him about something. It was cute. Something Dallas related. And, and. And he wrote back and referenced the business card. It's just, oh, love him. You guys have been really sending some cute emails back and forth. He's nice. He said that he was on a date with somebody and she guessed that he was Dallas business card guy.

And I was like, I don't need to hear about you going on dates with people. You just put that back at the box. Right. And he was like, I never heard from her again. And I was like, that's right. She did the right thing. That is so funny. When she realized it, she was like, I can never see you again.

I don't want to be on the girl's got to kill list. She did the right thing. So yeah, he's in town, and we haven't really spent like a long period of time taking like that in a while. So we went to Elefonte. It was fun. Our friend Alana. My new your friend. More than his friend. Yeah.

She set us up with a table there and the staff was really nice. And he got there early. I got there late, which I loved. He was waiting at the bar, got me a drink, whatever. We needed a nice dinner. They comped all the drinks, which I didn't like. I wanted to be like, put those drinks back on the check. I mean, yep.

Same. I had Alana make me a res. When I went out with Sparkleized I'm changing his contact to my phone right now Well yeah When Sparkleys A lot of made us a res

In New York And when I asked Alana Make me a res I'm never asking for a comp I just want to reservation A good table Reservation in New York It's like hard to get you know

And so she was like We'll probably send something out And I was like don't I don't want a comp I don't want a bunch of special treatment And like I'm trying to show off Then I'm also obligated to take photos And promote

I don't want to do that Yeah Elfonte was I couldn't get in and the tables are hard to come by and so I just wanted a table. Yeah. And that was like our first dinner date. I was like, he can pay, you know? And it's so funny because I dated a guy, stuffed animal guy that only took me to comps, which was, ugh. I have Jeremy constantly.

My friend Jeremy, who is a food blogger, like, do you take girls to this stuff? He does, though, right? Yeah. I mean, it's also like for me and Sparkle Eyes, that was like a first dinner date ever. So down the road, yeah, let's get some comps. If someone wants to give me a comp, great. Like if you're dating someone, if you're dating Jeremy, that's fun. You go out, he's got to take a couple pictures.

You know, you're watching your man in action. The food's free. People are giving you nice special treatment. But like a first date, it's just like, I don't need it. I don't want it on either end. Also, you and I aren't food bloggers. Jeremy's a food blogger. So it's not so crazy for to take a photo.

But yeah, I'm not trying to sit here. Like, I would have died taking photos of that stuff. Can you imagine? Okay. So, yeah, that was fun. And we went to the proper to go to the roof and my car stalled out in the driveway because I couldn't figure out to work the e-break. That was humiliating.

There was like four staff members trying to help me. It was so embarrassing. They sent me away. Was he there? He was sitting in the car with me. He couldn't figure it out. He did not get out of the car and try to figure it out. Matt Hustleton, Sparkleus.

Sparkle-lis. I'm actually not going to tell him about this until he listens. I'm so excited. I think he'll be happy with the name I picked for him. Yeah, no. So it's a small turnabout and I just picked my car up from the ballet at the other place. And so they must have turned my e-break on. And, I mean, I just got this car like a month ago.

So I don't know how it works. And the e-break is like under the dashboard. It's not obvious where it is. And so there was like four ballets running around trying to figure out why I couldn't move my car. He did not get out of the car and try to help. He didn't not try to help. He was like looking around. Obviously he's in a brand-new car.

He's never seen either. Yeah. And usually the e-break isn't under the dash all the way to the left. I mean, it's way down there. Yeah. So then we went to Wollies and had some drinks. It was fun. I had a good time.

Yeah. You want to see him again. I do. He's very nice to talk to. There's a lot to talk about. I enjoy his company. He's great. That's great. Yeah. I mean, we keep having this conversation of like, that's kind of how you should feel with a relationship that in my experience does end up being like healthy and good. It's not this like obsession for moment one, which can often just kind of be a person that's like suspiciously charming or something. And it's like that with everybody. Not all the time, but that can be the case or your butterflies can be anxiety. Like we always say like if you like talking to somebody, you want to see them again enough after the first date, then you should and see what happens. Yes.

We've just been talking about this because I feel a calmness about it. I don't feel like, this is no shame to him. I don't feel like, I'm so obsessed with this. I got to see him every second of every day. But like the people that I have felt like that about after a first or second date, and this is not across the board, but people that are tremendously charming over the top

for a second date. They tend to be like that with everybody. And so it's like not really that special. And I don't know when I've like really bonded with somebody over that. It hasn't worked out long term with them. Yeah. And there's some of it that's, again, not always that is game. You know, like there's some of that like gazing deep in your eyes and doing little things on dates that it's supposed to make you feel like you're the only woman in the room, yada yada, whatever. Like it is running game. Not always, but sometimes, you know. And that stuff

kind of takes a little bit of time. Like, that's how I feel now in my relationship. We, like, stare at each other's sparkle eyes. Like, I feel like the only woman in the room. Like, all that stuff is come with time, but it's like, we have so many friends that are in like long-term, incredible, enviable, healthy relationships that would tell you it was like a slower burn, you know? So, yeah. I wouldn't refer to him as like a slower burn. I really, I do enjoy him a lot. But you and I are friends with a lot of male comedians and they're exceptionally charming on a

first date and they're wildly chatty and lots to say. And then like you dig into it and they're like that with everybody. It's not special. Like, it's not special to you. And there's a reason why they like need to be liked so much and they've crafted that personality. That's not every person. But like, I don't know. I don't need to feel these like extreme, like I'm going to move to Dallas tomorrow, butterflies on a, not a first date, but you know, reentering, whatever you call it. I think you're exactly how it should be, you know,

in my past experience to have something that has like some longevity, but we'll see. But we'll see. But like the foundation, it feels there for something if that's what happens, if you guys both want that, you know, just like a sense of calm, you enjoy talking to him, you're attracted to him. Yeah. He likes what you do. He said, pull the car over right now because we're going to make out. And that is what I'm attracted to. Say less. Dallas business car guy.

He's not bothered by this. I was talking about it. You know, like, that's high on the list. Yeah. And he's not getting off to it too much either. He's just like, yeah, that's what she does. I'm down. Get her go.

You know? Look at her go. Yeah. Aw. That's cute. All the makings are there. We'll see. Ashley picked my last boyfriend too, you guys.

I don't mean that as a dig, Ashley. I know, but. It's triggering for you. It is. I hate being wrong. It's more triggering for you that is for me. Why do you have to say that? Now I'm worried.

Well, we're not in COVID times anymore, so our brains aren't all fucked up anymore. And my last boyfriend was the kindest person. The sex was amazing. He was a great emotional support system. And again, it was COVID times. Okay, guys. very excited to welcome our guest today. He is a former star of The Bachelor, his own season, all kinds of seasons, really. He is the host of the Vile Files and the author of Don't Text

Your Ex, Happy Birthday. Please welcome to the show, Nick Fial. Ladies, so good to be with you. Back again. Back again. It took too long. It's vile. Vial. Vial. Is that right? No, I can't seem to get it right. Is whatever? I don't really get it right. Okay. Thanks for saying that. As someone of the last name that also Like my friends even It sucks. Like, So you'll take whatever.

You're not offended. I'm not offended. Okay. I find it easier to say the whole thing at once. Yeah. Like it's one or it's vial. It's vial, but like I don't like enunciate

because I just mumble in general. And so like in being from the Midwest you have like a harder accent, you know? So it does sound like vile. Okay. But because, you know, as I like a young man,

I didn't think anything of it. And then I started dating and everyone's like, do you realize your last name sucks? And I was like, really? And I'm like, yeah. They're like, yeah. I'm like, oh.

Yeah. I go vial. And it became very self-conscious and I tried to enunciate a little bit better, you know, and just like a whole nightmare. I have a left. It could have been a lot easier if they just said Nick Vale. Yeah. Change it.

Do it. Just change the pronunciation. The veil files. Can we do that here? That's our big T. We've changed Nick's name. Honestly, thanks. You're welcome.

Welcome to the show, Nick Vale. I appreciate it. So we just went on your show. We had the best time. Likewise. It was hours long. Did your audience love it? Yeah. People really loved it.

I watched the clip, just like the hype reel of the episode. I was like, Ashley, this is the most fun I have ever watched. I just can't wait to listen. And then I was like, I was on it. That was our episode. So I just have one question. When you guys do these like literal therapy sessions, we talk to this caller for an hour. Do you get updates?

Do they let you know? We do. We do get updates. We have our update specials. Oh, right. For the longest time, we never did updates. We would just do the calls. People want to know.

And then people are like, we want to know. And I was like, really? And I'm like, yeah. And then so we tried one, crushed. And then I was like, I guess we should do this a little more often. Uh-huh. Then we do it once a month. And then, you know, stream is plug.

Vial Files Plus is available. And so we do one for free every month. And it has three updates. And then we drop two more every month. Okay. Behind Vial Files Plus. It's free to sign up. Okay.

Great. So we don't have to give it away. But do we have an update on the witch, not which from our episode? Oh, that? Yeah. I don't know. Okay, it'll happen. Yeah.

Hopefully. You know, I try to, I don't know why I do it. Maybe it was pure laziness at first, but like I try to go in blind. And I want to hear the people's stories. I can read it firsthand, but I kind of have my team hold our call on as accountable if they forget stuff. But I want to hear the story as if I'm listening to it, like meeting someone on the sidewalk or in an elevator because I want to like really pay attention. And I don't want to come up with answers before they say it. So I really just let my team decide.

who's on the show and kind of vet them out. And then I kind of sit in and kind of go in pretty fresh. Okay. Well, we loved it. Yeah. And it's a great episode. People should listen to it from June of 2023. Yeah.

Yeah. Right before Fourth of July, I think it was. Last week of June. Yeah, no, it's very rewarding. I mean, I've had some, not only people like, follow up with their stories, but people have sent in some very gracious letters about the impact our show has had on their lives,

which is very flattering. Totally. Well, okay, I'm glad that you said that because I want to tell you and I want to hear your thoughts. So I started to become like really into your show during Scandibald. And I loved listening to your takes. And I loved listening to your insights on Raquel and Ariana specifically. And I never thought of you as like a dating advice person.

I never thought like, let me listen to Nick Files' podcast for dating advice. I didn't know that you wrote this book. And I kept saying to Ashley, like his advice really, like blows me away. Like really hot takes and really empathetic takes on women specifically and what it's like to be in the dating world as a woman. And I read your book after we did your podcast and I love all the actionable steps. So I'm just curious like, how did you?

get here. Like, how did you become anointed to doing this type of dating advice? Because it's really insightful stuff. Well, I guess to start, I just, like, made a lot of my own mistakes. Yeah, publicly. No, but yeah, honestly, before that, like, I was well on my way.

I grew up in a kind of very traditional family. Like I talked of my book, kind of just really admired my parents' relationship and had to kind of, like, when I started dating, really wanted to find love. And I was a romantic, kind of young. man, so to speak. But I also was competitive and stubborn, and as many of us can be. And so that

combination kind of led to, you know, when you're in love and young, you know, everything they teach you about love, right, is that it's great and you have to fight for it, you know? So I was like, okay, well, I guess I'll just keep fighting for this, you know. And it was hard for me to let go of things and hard for me to move on and I had a hard time getting over, you know, X's and I would ruminate and get in my head. I also have and certainly had. I've always had a big ego. I've learned how to control it a little bit more as I've gotten older. And so I would kind of lie to myself. And so a lot of what I learned was self-preservation so I could get out of my own way and just be a happier person. And I've always had a bit of snark in my personality. And I've always,

I'm not a good liar, just in general. And I'm also just like, I have a hard time not saying what I'm thinking at the risk of someone being like, well, that's kind of rude. I'm like, really? Is it? Well, sorry. I'm honest. You know, it's just like. And I've had to learn a little bit of tact in that. Delivery, right. You have. I don't know that version of you. Maybe like the TV audiences do, but I think that you have like a lot of empathy for women, I feel. Well, yeah, and then I think just the empathy comes from, I'm honored and flattered that, you know, most of my audience is women, and for a woman like yourself to say that. I have certainly through my show learned a lot about women. I also grow, I have six sisters. Oh my God. You know, so I've always been comfortable

around women and I've always had women friends. I always enjoyed hanging out with women, but certainly My show has taught me a lot about the plight of women in the dating world. But at the same time, I will say, especially nowadays, I hate conversations around gender because I feel like there's this kind of gender role. When it comes to heterosexual relationships and men in dating, it's like, all, you know, from one side is like all women suck or all men suck. It just as a man, I can just say, you know, while men aren't necessarily good at talking about it and opening about it, like a lot of the struggles at people,

have in relationships are, I would say, 80, 90 percent similar. You know, that 10 percent can seem different. And there's a lot of things that women go through that men can't relate to and vice versa. But feeling misled, feeling manipulated, feeling lied to, you know, letting your ego make decisions for yourself and seeking validation, all the things that kind of get us in trouble or dating are mistakes that men make as well. Universal. And so I just was open about my experience and it seemed to resonate with both men and women, but I think women being a little bit more insightful and a little bit more willing to learn about these things,

I think naturally allowed me to have the audience that I have. Wow, well, thanks for sharing. Yeah. You're true. Thanks for asking. Well, we asked our audience what kind of dating questions they had for you, and we read the book, and we compiled some stuff that we thought would just be really interesting

thought starters and topics for you. I just love them all. We had a hard time. I really like this. The way that if you guys are listening, you want to pick the book up, it's structured so well. Like, I guess you should read it in order, like of any book, but you really... You don't have to that. That's what I'm saying.

Okay, good. I'm glad you said that because you could really just pick kind of what applies to you. And it's like an enjoyable read. I would say, read the intro. Everyone start with chapter one, then skip to chapter 10. Okay. If you want to. And then go back to two because chance you're going to start dating.

But 10 is about how to get over them. Right. And so if you're just going through a breakup, it's good to like learn about what the book is in chapter one, then skip to check the check. You tend to figure out how to stop ruminating over this person who's not worth your time. And then when you get back into dating, go back to chapter two because your chances are you're going to incorporate and then, you know, run into some fuckboys and players and things like that. Right.

And find yourself in situationships and you're going to have to figure out to navigate that. Well, I just opened the book up and I just was like, you know, like when you're on a map, you're like this thing. And I did situationships first. But since you picked on players versus fuck boys, do you want to start there? Because we would love your insights in terms of like what is the difference between a player, just the guy's just like living his best life. He's just out there running through girls and fuck boys who definitely have more of like a manipulative

street. Well, say I would say it's more the opposite. Yeah, maybe it's I'm aging myself. But like back in the day when I was you know, there's a movie like how to be player and shit like that. That's Badocee. That's where that player was that movie. Player was the original term for what is now I think fuck boy. Right. But I love the book because it's like a player

has all the fuck boy traits plus plus they're just pieces of shit. And the reason I say that is because we Now, because of hookup culture, I refer to men and women as fuckboys. It's more of a term. Totally. It's a way of being. And I always say that one person's fuck boy is another person's future partner.

Because in hookup culture, we're all fuck boys. All it takes to be a fuck boy is the willingness to date and usually have sex with someone who likes you a little bit more than you like them. And if that's a situation you find yourself in, you're the fuck boy. Yes, and you're aware of it and might try to deny it. And you might try to deny it. What do you mean? I don't, that's crazy.

This is casual on both ends. And I also say a well-intentioned fuck boy is still a fuck boy. Every fuck boy wants to and probably will get married someday. Sure. You know, the player is the one who's like, I don't want a girlfriend. I don't want a boy. You players are usually men. I don't find a lot of women players who are out there just like wanting to fuck as many people

as possible. The love of the game. Yeah. The game and they're actively trying to manipulate. They'll do the love bombing. They will lead you on. You know, they'll date multiple people at the same time. There's a goal involved.

The fuck boy is as someone who's like, you know, I'm just like, I'm not really ready for a relationship, but let's hang out and like, I really like you. And like, they act like your boyfriend, they act like your girlfriend. They're just not ready to commit yet, you know? They're just not sure. And they have all the excuses in the book as to why they can't date you. And they believe every word they're saying, you know. So there's fuck boys.

Everyone's a fuck boy nowadays. If you participate in hookup culture, your chances are you've been someone's fuck boy. Okay. So you have a few ways to recognize them in the book. Can we go through them? Sure. Do you want to reference your own book? Or do you got this?

I haven't read it in a while. Do you need the page? If I wrote a book, I'd be like, hand me the book. I don't remember the five things. Or they're five. Probably. People bring up the podcast. Like, you said this thing.

I'm like, I did. Yeah, right? I say things. I see things. Yeah, top four traits of fuck boys. Inconsistent. They don't make plans in advance. You know, they always make excuses

as to why they don't want a relationship with you. And they usually tell you the truth. We say that if someone tells you who they are. Listen. I'm not looking for a relationship right now. Fuck boy. That's it. But, like, I appreciate the honesty.

And most people will tell you this, date one. I'm not looking for one. And what everybody here. What everybody hears is except for with me. Right. And most people hear I don't want a relationship and they think you'll learn. I'm the best. And I don't think it's a good way to go through life.

But all of us have fallen prey to this. Yeah. It's our egos telling us this is your opportunity to be special. Right. 100%. Yeah. You're like, really? We'll see.

I can't reiterate enough. You're not special. I'm not special. Rayna is not special. There's exceptions to every rule, but you're not special. Well, I say this in the book, right? Because my book was often referred to as like this modern day, like he's just not that into you.

And in that book, he's just not that end to you. They referenced that you're not the exception. You're the rule. I don't love that because we all love to be the exception. You both started this very now successful show because you were like, you know what, does everyone have a podcast? Yes, but fuck it. We can do it better.

And I don't even think our egos are bad things. They're like superpowers. But if you don't control your superpowers, superpower, you're going to kill everybody kind of thing. And if you don't control your ego, it's going to hurt you. So, like, our egos and our willingness and desire to be the exception rule, I think is great. You just have to be honest with yourself about it. What you don't want to do is try to be the exceptional rule and then pretend you're not trying to be the exception to rule. Right. Like when you started a podcast, you weren't like, you know what, we're the first ones to

come up with this idea and this is a home run no matter what. You're like, no, let's sit down and figure out how can we do this a little bit different and a little bit better than everyone else. How can we separate ourselves from the noise? What do we have to do to actually rise above? If you're going to try to be the exception rule, at least be honest that you're taking a risk, that you're doing something crazy, that you're like there's a good chance that it won't work. At least that way you have like an out and exit strategy, so to speak. You know? Yeah.

I'm sure at some point when you started this show, like maybe failure wasn't an option, but I'm sure at some point you might have been like, you know, hey, like, no one's listening, you know, kind of thing. And then maybe at some point you would have stopped if that were the case. Well, what I only mean by that, because if you get yourself in a dating situation, obviously you guys are crushing it, but if that were to happen, if you pretend you're not going to be the exception to rule and you're just like, no, this is like normal. Everyone does this and you date the person who is just like, I'm not ready for relationship. And then next thing you know, you've been in a four-year situation. You know? Well, Ashley and I always say in business,

we're good at pivoting. So I think business is different than relationships. I think business, you actually can sit down and say, what are people doing wrong and what can I do to address that? Ashley, and I did sit down day one and say, here's how we can make this a business and be different. And I think in business, you can pivot and we're going at pivoting, like where we say, okay, I don't see this going on forever. Let's start a sex toy company. Like, not the podcast, but, you know, the world changes. I think pivoting in the dating world when you're dating a fuckboys, you've got to like cut. Well, at pivoting, you have to pivot to someone else.

Right. You got to cut ties to pip to somebody else. I mean, I love business to relationship correlations. this one to me, they're farther apart. Like, it feels so different. Like, I've always known, like, I am going to do something big and, you know, better than people have been doing it. I'm going to be successful. And then, you know, you're motivated by someone telling you,

well, you can't do that. And that's not how it's done. And it almost, like, motivates you. But I'm completely opposite in relationships. Relationships are tough because it's... It's a person. You only have so much control. You can only do 100% of your half.

Yeah. And in business, it's kind of like... There are real steps you can take. There's things you can do. You can always adjust. Right. Yes. We would pivot in business by starting

something else and adding to our brand in a relationship. You just got to pivot to another person. Correct. But it's funny because a lot of people really get off on someone like shutting a door in their face saying no, rejecting them and in relationships. Like the second I'm rejected, I'm out. Like I'm not motivated to make you love me. You're so lucky.

You're so lucky. Well, that's my quote. I don't like someone that doesn't like me. I'm not attracted to like someone who's not into me. Can you teach that to people? I've been trying. I feel like I've really been preaching this gospel and like the person I'm dating now, It's been so secure since moment one.

And it's like, that's how I knew it was for real. Yeah, because that's how it should be, right? Yeah. Like someone not liking you should be a flaw in them. Yeah, what's wrong with you? But with age, I think you get better at it and you just become more comfortable. Like the things I used to wait around for a man to do, like call me, show up, make a plan, be consistent, be committed. Like, I would just never wait around for that.

Like, I used to just sit at home with my makeup on on the couch until 10 p.m. Being like, maybe he'll call me. Maybe he'll tell me I come to him. Now there's not a chance in hell that I wouldn't make a separate plan go out and if they're around they could come meet me but I would never wait around for somebody

to commit to me or to commit to a plan ever and that just gets better as you're older it turns me on that you like me if you don't like me what am I doing here I'm just feeling insecure by the minute I don't know it's just kind of like it's always been like I don't like you unless you like me that's kind of how relationships work

right. It's a gift. Thank you so much no it really is I feel lucky to feel like that it comes with age too Yeah. I mean, in high school, I just remember going to be like, I don't really like you. I mean, like, well, I love you. In high school, high school hit different.

That's how you game the system, though. That is how you fuck boy, a fuck boy. Your only line of defense is to do nothing. Just don't agree to anything they want to do. Don't pick up the phone. Don't agree to play. I act as though you don't care. Yeah.

You can't just try harder. Well, I would first, unless you want to get in yourself a game, right. It's a balance of vulnerability and then kind of standing your ground. Mm-hmm. Because nowadays, everyone's like, I don't want to tell them I like them. Like, whoa, that's fucking weird. It's like, you can get negative of them.

Right. No, there's power in being confident in your feelings. So, you know, for all the people out there who are finding themselves in situationships or liking a guy and it's like, I don't want to need to date you. And they act like your boyfriend, as I'm sure you say and things like that. No, it's like, you know, everyone's just like, so what are we? Never ask someone, what are we, you know? Let's talk about why.

Because you immediately have just given away your. power, you know, like, why are you asking a question? You already know the answer. Do you think if you have to ask, you already know the answer? The answer is you want to date them. Right. You know, you think you should be in a relationship, you know, so that's what you should say. You shouldn't ask the question. What are we? Why are you asking them? Right. You know, you shouldn't even ask them. You'd be like, I think we should date. Here's why. Yeah. Give them a couple bullet points. You know, they'll probably say no, because that's their default. They won't even consider it. It's just like, wait, I'm, I know. And then you just calmly say,

oh, okay, well, thanks. Calmness is the key. Yeah. To your, like, not acting like you care. You're going to be fine without it. I just want to let you know that I think we're great. Well, calmness and confidence, right? I was giving advice to a friend the other night with the same kind of situation.

She wants to be exclusive with this guy, lock it down, whatever. She feels like he's in the fence. I'm like, I feel like you just got to be like, hey, this is what I'm looking for. If you're not, we can call it. And, like, put it with an eye statement. This is what I'm looking for. I like you. If this isn't a fit for you, then we can go.

are separate ways. No problem. No heart feelings. And then the most important part after that is to never negotiate on the boundary you just tried to set. Right. You got one shot out of it. You don't want to be their friend. You're not interested in hanging out. Some of them is not better than none of them. Right. Right. You have to be ready to walk away. We've said up before. It's the only way. Yeah. It's the only way to do that. Okay. So with this was on our list and I feel like we're getting a little bit of ahead of ourselves, but people always ask, can I turn a situation into a relationship and if so, how? And I know that we're kind of discussing that now,

but we want to hear what you have to say about that question. So first, if you haven't defined the relationship, you do that. And you do that by telling them what you want, not asking them what they want, explain them why you think you should date, and then be willing to walk away. At some point, they're going to call you.

Now, it's important between now and then that you have the perception of being single. You might be down on your dump, so you might be telling yourself, I'm not ready to get out there, and that's fine. You don't have to, like, run out, there, but just remind yourself that you're single. If you're in a situation ship, what you're not

in is a relationship. You are single. Yes. That's very important. Clip it. Don't take yourself off the market. Right. Right. Pust is like, huh. You look very interested. Don't put yourself on hold. Yeah. Right. You know? Which we've all done. Create urgency for yourself. Love it. You know? Demand. At some point, your situationship is going to call you. Now, don't lie. You know. But go out on dates. It doesn't matter. You don't even have to like them. You know, just get out there, meet people.

And when it comes to dating, yes, dating sucks. It's hard. You know, if you bat 300 in baseball, you're a Hall of Famer. And then dating, if you like one out of ten, honestly, kind of a hall of famer. There's a lot of bad people out there. So like stop saying there's, like, we know. And it's not because people suck. It's that you're not supposed to love everyone.

Right. You know? If you loved everyone. then what would be the point of trying to find someone to spend the rest of your life with? You're only looking for one is also like the biggest reminder. It's your biggest thing, yeah. You will only have one relationship in your entire life that doesn't fail. Hopefully.

Unless they die. Right, right. And you try and find love again. Okay, right. So you get back on the apps and you plan a date. At some point, your situationship is going to call when you have a date. Now, the default usually in that situation is to lie to your situation because for whatever reason we want them to think, people in situationships think that if I just show them

how good of a partner I can be, if I show them how loyal I am and how dedicated I am to them, they will come around. I will prove to them how amazing of a girlfriend or a boyfriend I can be. That doesn't ever work. But also, you've been doing it, right? So it's time to pivot. Yeah. You've showed them. So they're going to call you and they're going to say, what are you doing? And you're going to say, I'm getting ready for a date. Yes. my favorite part of the book. I feel so hype. I recently did a show I cannot talk about yet. But part of the show, they talked about the concept of dripping information.

Okay. Which is answer the question asked and don't give them anything more than they've asked. Make them ask another question if they want more information. So you drip them information. So what are you doing? I'm going on a date. You don't say anything else. And they'll ask who?

First name only. Okay. Mark. Time mark. Whatever, right? Usually they'll tax, by the way. They're probably not calling. They're probably texting this.

And again, feel free to take your time to respond. Totally. You know, things like that. But never give them more information than they ask for. Eventually, they'll probably call in a bit of a panic, especially when you're just kind of like, yeah, I'm going on a date. And you say it very matter-of-factly. You treat them like a girlfriend or just a pal,

they're just some person who just asked a question. and you're just being totally honest, and you're acting as if this is a normal thing. And it is normal because you're single. You're single. Can I ask, like, if they say, who is this? Somebody I'm out on a nap. Like, do you think it's bad to make it sound like a casual first date?

I would let him spiral. Me too. Don't say anything. So when they ask more and more questions, you just say, I'm sorry, I'm getting ready for the date. Can we talk about this tomorrow? Yeah. Yeah.

After I get plowed by Mark. Yeah. And that's another thing. Don't oversell it either. Right. It's very nonchalant. It's when you're, I don't know, know, someone that you're just, I don't have time to talk.

What do you want? Like a friend, yeah. Yeah, you're just like, what do you want? I'm smart. What are you doing? We're going out. Where? Yeah.

And then when they ask very specifics, you're just like, hey, I'm sorry, I'm running late. Can we talk tomorrow? You're just nonchal. And then you don't respond to them the rest of the night. Very important. It doesn't matter if they call you or text you, you're on a date. Also, keep in mind, never fucking cancel for your situation. Go on that date.

I don't care how unexcited you are. I do not care. You go on that fucking day. Or if you don't go on the day, you just, you do not cancel for them. That's the worst thing you can do. I lie. It's to like, is to like drop everything you have planned for the person who only hangs out with you at their convenience. And by the way, I want to slip in here.

If by any chance they give you any sort of sludge shaming, shaming in any way, they're terrible and forget about them completely. I think sometimes women have like, well, he's going to think I'm, going out with indeed and other people. It's like if he comes at you negatively for that, you've dodged a bullet. So anyway. Yes. This is written step by step. Yeah, I know.

I love the steps. Is everybody listening? I just want to make sure. I love this so much. And I just want to be like, guys. I like this breadcrumming. I don't want to have to do this, by the way. And I have never done it.

But people ask. So here is the only method that you have. It's the only way to do it. This is very key. If this doesn't work, nothing was going to. Yes. Totally. This is your answer.

This is it. And I have done this. And if somebody does not care at the end of this, they really do not care. But to your point, Ashley, if they make you feel bad for going on a date because you're single, like you simply remind them. Because remember, you've already tried to define the relationship earlier. You've confidently and without passion, you've already said, hey, I think we should date. And here's why. And you opted not to.

So if they make you feel bad for being single, you just confusion is always the best. When in doubt, act confused. I'm just a little confused. Right. Thought you wanted to be single. But that's true. You don't get mad. Do not respond to their jabs or they're putting you down.

Don't let them work you up. That's not doing it on purpose, but people, we all manipulate when we're not getting our way, you know, or we, you know. It's a red flag. Yeah. Yes, we all, I guess, a lot of people do that. But that's run to me. but okay.

It also kind of gives me the ick. I've had this happen before where I've liked somebody. It's hard to manufacture this, by the way. It is hard to be like, I like this person and I'm just going to pretend that I kind of don't see what happens. It's hard to manufacture it. But when it's happened to me,

I liked this one guy, I was a manager of restaurant, he was a bartender. We were sleeping together. He did not want to commit to me. I met somebody else that I liked. I went on dates with him, and then this guy found out about it

and like spiral city, just like, want to talk me all the time, text me, joke around, come around, all of a sudden want to take me out on dates, showed up in my apartment one day. all of a sudden just wanted me because somebody else did. It almost was this amazing thing that happened for me because I'm like, now I'm just turned off by you. Well, that's for you to decide.

And then maybe you realize at that point, you know, it wasn't the real feelings that you had, you know. But at least now you've changed the power dynamic. Now you're in control and you're making decisions. Also something to be aware of, too, is sometimes we get excited when the people we want to like us get mad and get jealous. So, one, don't let them respond to you, but don't get cut off guard if they don't care. Okay. You know, if they're like, oh, really, oh, tell me more. That should be fun, you know, because a lot of people do that.

Yes, I know. A lot of people act like they don't care because they know they said that they've turned you down. But, you know, they're only asking because they care. Just remember that. If they're asking questions, they care. It doesn't matter whether they pretend to care or don't care. But either way, you're too busy getting ready for your date. You do not have time to really indulge.

You just say you're going on a date. You offer a first name that's the only. only information that you're allowed to give them. And then you're just sorry, running late, have to go for my date. Can we talk tomorrow? Right. And then do not respond to text. Do not answer calls for the rest of the night.

Do not call them after the date. Don't answer their calls after the date. Let them pine over how great this date might be going. Did you spend the night? Did you wake up the next morning? You're busy having fun on your date. Yes. Do not reach out to the next day.

You are allowed to then take. their call the next day if you want. And again, confusion. And don't oversell it. You know, it's none of their business how that date went. Yes. Right. And I don't care if it went bad or good. It's just none of their business. I've heard that tone, by the way, but like, so how was it? So how to go? The smiling tone, it doesn't feel defensive. It feels almost like antagonistic. Like they're going to really let you know how little they care, but they're still asking. And you calmly to say, again, hey, listen, I'm not trying. to be rude, but like, I just don't think that question is appropriate. We're not friends.

We're certainly not boyfriend and girlfriend, so I don't know why are asking me about my dates. Totally. And that's it. Again, if that doesn't make them eventually come around and panic and realize what the fuck am I doing, I'm wasting a good thing, nothing was going to get them to come around. Yep. Period. I guess the fear would be they just are only motivated by you going out with somebody else. It's the competitiveness, the ego, the wanting to win. And I don't know if there is a way to ever know that. You have to decide, you know. Yeah, you have to decide. Yeah. But make them really show you, you know, like, you know, when they come around and ask questions, well, what changed, you know? And why should we do this? But they shouldn't just, and that's the thing, don't let them

back by putting just a little bit more effort than they did. No, they need to go all the way. They need to give you everything that you wanted with them when you try to define the relationship, the full commitment, everything, everything that when you write out of the list of things I want in a committed relationship and you have every right to want whatever it is that you want, they should be willing to give it to you. And if they are not,

you do not negotiate on your terms of what it means to be in a relationship. And the more confident you are and the more sure of yourself, the more likely you are to get it. When we're just like, you know, what are we? It's just like, I don't know, I'm just like, I mean, you know, I like you, but it's totally okay if I was like, who wants to get with that? I agree.

You want to get with the person who's like, I'm valuable. You want to be with the person who, I think, as a woman, initiates a conversation first. Any relationship I've been in that's worked out, including the one I'm in, including any time of, it was someone that really wanted to be with me. And the conversation kind of just happened organically, but I knew that I didn't have to wonder.

I do think nowadays with hookup culture, if you like someone, regardless of your gender, just put it out there. You just, you know, would it be better if a guy did that? I guess, sure. Yeah, whatever. But, you know, nowadays, you know, I think gender roles are getting more cloudy and confusing. And, like, you know, you have guys being like, well, I don't know if I want to be pushing.

So, listen, if you know you like someone, I'm not saying you have to, like, be the lead and everything, but just let them know how you feel and they go from there. The only time I've seen this work is when you set a hard boundary and you do not change your mind. And like one of my best friends did this with a guy recently. She was dating this guy. I was kind of a situation ship for like four or five months. And she was like, I want to be with somebody once to get married. I have kids.

If you are not ready for those kind of commitments, let's just call it. She fully walked away. She did not speak to this guy for like six weeks. Good for her. And he fully turned it around and was like, you're right. I do want to be with you. I care about you. He is like the world's best boyfriend.

They just took a great trip to Napa. He came here. I was hanging out with him. He's so wonderful, so kind. But the only time I've seen it work is, when you just set the hard boundary and you're ready to just bounce. And the thing is, too, the thing I'd argue against, like, it's not just people, like, rising to the challenge. Unfortunately, with hookup culture and dating apps, everyone who's out there dating, when they decide to commit to you, it's like, is this person better than everyone in the world?

Right. You know, and if I make you my girlfriend, like, because, you know, 10, 15 years ago, it was like, yeah, I mean, like, yeah, I mean, like, like, I haven't met someone cuter or nicer than you because, like, I've only met 30 people over my life. You know, but now it's not that crazy for anyone to, like, be like, I could meet a waiter from Paris, you know, because like, we have access to everyone on the internet, you know? Every dating app, you have, there's 80 dating apps out there. It's just the paralysis of choice, and it's the fear that as soon as we commit, something

better is going to come around. So people need to, like, wake up and realize, like, what the fuck am I doing? I have a good thing here. And it's just that fear of letting something better come along and not being available to it. That's causing both men and women to, like, again, just be like, well, you know, I'm not really sure if I'm ready for a relationship. But it's just they're afraid to press play on the movie

because, you know, they're just obsessed with watching previews constantly. Do you believe in like, so like there's right person and there's right time? Do you think that like people just, they have a right time? And we've talked about like they just throw the cab like. on and whoever gets into the cab, like that's the person? Or do you think that like people, even if it isn't the right time, can find the right person? I think more of the latter. I think, you know, right person, wrong time is this an excuse we make when someone we really like doesn't like us back? I think there are so many people in this world we can be compatible with.

I don't believe in one and only. Totally. And I think right person wrong time is more on the destiny aspect of relationships. And so what I'm saying is like when you say, right person wrong time, you're basically saying, I met someone I'm really, I have good chemistry with, I have a lot of compatibility with, but there's also a handful of things that I don't like about them. Maybe some of them, like, fall into the, you have some non-negotiables I'm interested in. It's just like you, you happen to met someone who's pretty good for you, but they're not great. And you're looking for great because you're only looking for one. Yeah, I mean, we've had someone in the show who I can't remember who said the quote. If it's right person wrong

time, it's the wrong person. Yeah. But if people have a hard time understanding that, because they're like, I have so much fun with them. Yeah. Like, oh, the sucks is good. Like, they can list a handful of like, they're like, well, if it's the wrong person, then why do we have so much chemistry and blah, blah, blah, and things like that. Chemistry is overrated.

Let's get into it. And let's get into love at first sight is bullshit. Yeah. Listen, chemistry is sexy. It's hot. It's fun. It's exciting. Something to talk about with your friends.

But it's compatibility that really solidifies a relationship. It's just not as sexy compatibility. It's kind of boring. Chemistry is easy to fake. You know, a lot of things create chemistry. Your environment can create chemistry. You know, having things in common, you know, lived experiences, something to relate to create chemistry. Some people are just naturally charismatic. Yeah. Right. And so everyone has chemistry with them. Right. You know, it's hard to trust chemistry. It's easier to trust compatibility. What do you have in common? What are your mutual interest? You know, when I was younger, you know, I'd love to think that love was, you know, so good. I love her enough,

Will Miggott work, you know? And it's like, the more I love her and the more I hate her, the more special it is, you know? It's just like, because I love her so much, you know? I was like, ah. But like, and then, you know, like I dated a vegetarian one. It's a fucking nightmare, you know?

Like, I just love to eat meat. And I guess it's just like, yeah, just enjoying the same shit is nice. Relationships are hard enough. Like, don't make it any harder. Right. You know? Great point.

And it's nice to be able, on most days of the way, week to not have to like debate what you're eating for dinner or debate what you're doing tonight or to constantly have to compromise about everything you're doing because you're always going to have to compromise. You know, it's already going to be hard. So you better have a lot of shit in common. Most of your decisions about what you're doing on a day to day to basis should be pretty easy because eventually there's going to be plenty of moments even when you have a lot in common and you have a lot of shared interest that you guys are going to be like, well, who's compromising here? I'm laughing because I was listening to this part of one of your episodes the other day

and you and your fiance were talking about shoes in the house. And it was just a very funny conversation how you guys, like, navigated, like, that she didn't want somebody to shoes in the house. She made you tell them. Oh, yeah. My brother. And then she was like, why should you fucking throw me out of the bus like that? But it was just fun to, like, watch the dance of you too.

And it's nothing about chemistry. You just, you seem very compatible on how you, like, deal with this dumb shit. Yeah, we like a lot of the same things. We enjoy the same content. We like a lot of the same foods. And I say that. It sounds silly, but like, I've dated people where we do. didn't like the same foods. We didn't like watching the same shows. And like every day was this

like, to be honest, I don't have fun with you. And it's like this is so different than the difference is what creates some of the magnetism. You know, like it's not opposite to track. That's not what I'm saying. But that's not exactly what we're talking about. We're just kind of talking about you like to do some of the same shit. You know, because we also think people should have different interests. You have a little bit of a different life. You're not together all the time doing all the same stuff. That's boring. And that creates a lot of sameness. And, you know, know, can lead to, like, just a lack of a spark in general. But I like what you're saying, that, like, you just like to do the same stuff.

Like, how's life going to be if you just don't like some of the same shit? Well, my last boyfriend, I broke up when we were screaming at each other. He was like, you wouldn't like the same movies as me. And I was like, all you want to do is see comic book movies. I can't go to another Marvel movie I've seen four this summer. And at first, you can do it. But after a while, you're like, I can't, I just can't fucking do it. I can't, yeah.

And listen, there's so many different things about Nellie and I. We're very different people. And the difference is, it's great to have that. She's so charismatic. She's way more of an extrovert than I am, and she helps me get out of my fucking shell sometimes. And there's ways as I motivate her, and so our opposites do attract. But yes, you have to like some of the same shit.

You have to enjoy being around each other. If every day is a compromise, it's just like, fuck. That's so true. Like, I mean, I wouldn't go down that row with somebody because I'd be like, we don't get each other. You want a flying economy, and I'm going to try to do that. That's not even it. But if you just want to even put travel in the mix,

like if you really just don't want to do the same stuff, like we've always said, like, we aren't going to go down a road with a guy who wants to camp every weekend and is so outdoorsy. And like, that's his life because it's a real type of person. Like,

let's take a Denver guy who wants to hike every mountain and camp every weekend. Like, you could just have great sex with him and be like he's so hot. I would never go down that road. That's the opposite life of my life. Like it's fun for like a...

You can pretend that fun for twice. You can write once. for the story, but then never again. Like, I just couldn't do it. I asked on every first date, what is your dream vacation? Are you going to make me sleep in the wilderness? How do you like to travel? Like, yeah, do you see yourself, like, staying in a tent in the woods?

Do you want to bike on the weekends? I'm not your girl. Yeah. And Nali and I, we both love a big city and we love beaches. So either we're going to go to New York or Paris and just like appreciate the culture of that city and go out to cool restaurants or we're going to fucking kick it on a beach. And it's so easy for us to make travel plans because there's, so many options. We don't like the fucking camp. We're not going to museums.

It's the best point. Like, it's really true. But, like, I'm making fun of myself because, like, now he's, like, the first woman I've dated where, like, I made that a priority. And it's, like, game changing. Because, like, back in the day in my 20s, I was such a fucking love martyr, you know? I was just like, oh, my God, but you realize how much I love her because I'm literally really going to be miserable, you know? it's like I'm at a museum I'm obsessed with that term

by the way I just came up with it well I just I feel like someone's like that's me like someone's really realizing in the moment we've all been there

you know and that's the thing I think you know romcoms let's if you talk about romcoms for a second go off terrible

what a terrible fucking playbook like stop Noah and Allie were toxic miserable people who just ran over anyone to, like, get what they wanted. Yeah.

Think about it. Totally. Noah was insane. He got a date with Allie by threatening to kill himself. Yes. And then he just built that house for. Built a house for and then tried to kill people for buying said house. Like, he wrote her a letter every day for a year.

Imagine texting someone without a response for a year. Right. Oh, my God. This is fucking insane. That's the fucking thing with the sex in the city of the movie with Biggs dumb emails too. Oh my God. And Noah was a fuck boy. He was.

Ask Martha. But they had chemistry. Martha. Yeah. And we're all Martha trying to be an Allie. You know? Uh-huh. And yeah,

Ali cheated on her fiancee to get with Noah. Right. These are terrible people. Yeah. And that's our holy grail of rom-com. And I love the notebook. Don't get wrong. It's a great fucking movie.

I love it. with the notebook or sex in the city Big Carrey and Big is that the premise of all those shows is it does not matter how toxic it is. It doesn't matter how bad it is. It doesn't matter how many people you have to make cry. At the end of the day, it all works out. And if it

all works out, it was worth it. It was worth it. And that's just not fucking true. I mean, look what Jim did to Karen. He left her in New York City to drive back and tell Pam. I'd like to go out to dinner with you, you doughty a little bitch. And people were just like psychotic. It's crazy. What he

did to her is so wild. Are you familiar with like this? Yeah, yeah. I never heard of it. You're not as in the culture as I am. But yeah, Pam blew her a whole marriage up for Jim and then he bounced and went somewhere else, wouldn't talk to her for like a year, found some other girl and then left her in New York for Pam. Left her. Yeah. But we always say like healthy relationships wouldn't be fun to watch. No. Like I, as long as you can watch these things as almost like a what not to do.

Yeah, but like don't reference them and be like, weren't out for no and alley. And I'm just looking for a love like big and Harry, it's like, no. Worst relationship. Samantha and Smith, that's all I want. Carrie broke up with Big the first time because they were about to go on vacation, I think it was, and he, like, wasn't ready to commit with her,

and he just, like, broke up with her. Yeah. She broke up with him. And it was just like, why don't you just get the known guy a little? It was, Carrie so terrible. So we just interviewed Candace Bushnell before you. Like the creator, the real Carrie Bradshaw. She wrote the whole thing, yeah.

And interestingly enough, she told us some tea, because we talked about Big and Carrie, and she said, after Big got married to Natasha, that was supposed to be the end. But viewers wanted it so bad. And they wanted to give the people what they wanted. And that's why he came back, which exactly proves the point. Yeah, this is what we look. There's toxic fucking monsters who love to torture ourselves emotionally.

And we think it, like, there's a payoff, you know? Yeah. It's just like the more pain I feel, maybe it's just like our religious backgrounds, you know? It's just like suffering is good, you know? I was great as Catholic. Well, obviously you said six sisters. You were told that I have also four brothers. This is crazy.

You have ten siblings? I do. I wouldn't make you name them like that. What's the movie? The town. Goodwill hunting. Goodwill hunting. Oh, my God.

Wow. Can we talk about that later? Yeah, let's just stay after we record. That's wild. Where are you in the midst? I'm the second oldest. Are you close with? I mean, we're close family.

Do you remember them? Like, do you remember them? Do you have all their numbers? I know other birthdays. I know their names. I don't know their ages. Because that changes. That's fair.

It changes every year. So who knows? Changes suffering. No, it does. Totally. I get it. No, I get it. That's true.

I mean, I have a brother and three stepbrothers and every time I tell you their ages, I have to do the math. Not my brother. You're just like, hey, what, how old am I? Right. Yeah. I want to go back to your love at first sight question. Yeah. We just love, that's a chapter title in the book.

There's no such thing as love is love for sight. Yeah. What are your insights? Yeah. Well, there's lust at first sight and chemistry at first sight. And there's coincidences. Yeah. Well, listen.

And love means different things of different people. But if you ask me, people ask me all the time, like, what did you learn being in The Bachelor? I used to be like nothing, you know? Like, I did a show. It's like, I was all, like, annoyed by the question. Next question. That's how Candace seemed about. When I went up, I'm like, is this 30-year-old?

As if, like, going on the Bachelor, like, transformed me. Right. It affected me. It affected me, for sure. And I think I was a bit resistant to it. But when I was a little more open to the question, the answer I came to was feeling in love and being in love can be two different things. and feelings change. Feelings are temporary.

And so depending on what love means to you, but for me, love means, in addition to a lot of things, having an established emotional connection, knowing someone, knowing someone's weaknesses, what do they like, what annoys you about them and loving them regardless, you know, just truly knowing them,

having a foundation of trust where you're not wondering how they feel about you. You know, if you're wondering how someone feels about you, you don't love them and feeling like you know someone forever, you don't. You know, it takes so long,

to get to know someone. And it takes so long to learn people's bad habits. It takes us 30 years to get to know ourselves, you know? And so, yeah, I think you can have chemistry really fast. I think it can feel like you know someone. And again, I recognize that love means different things of different people. But for me, you know, not wondering how someone feels about you and feeling secure, you know, that when you are fighting with someone and you're not getting along, you feel disconnected, that you still don't question their love. That's love. You know, everything else are just a bunch of like intense feelings

that you're processing in the moment. You know, and then that's probably chemistry and maybe there's some compatibility or maybe just simply excitement because you haven't met someone you even remotely liked for two years. You know, and there's that. It's excitement.

I think there's worlds in which you meet somebody, you see them for the first time, you have an intense feeling. And then you actually do end up in real love and then you get to say it, but it was just a coincidence. Yeah, it's hindsight. It's luck.

Yeah, it's luck. Yeah, it's luck. And it can happen. Of course it. Anyone who's like, I knew from day one has a benefit of hindsight. Right. Sorry. That's what you're right.

That's what it is. I've been in several since day one. I will say everybody that I've been really deeply in love with in my life, I will say on the first date, I knew this is somebody I could love. This is somebody who makes sense for me to be in love with. I've never been on a date with somebody and thought, I'm really not into this. And like, lo and behold, six months later, we were in love. That's because we're not, that's a thing.

And that's like I said earlier, like dating is supposed to be hard. You know, we all want love to be special and yet we want to like everyone, you know? Right. Which one do you want? You know, you have to dig through dirt to find gold. Yeah. You know, type of stuff. So last thing we're going to do, Raina, I want to cue it up.

We'll do like a rapid fire fun thing with you. You've a glossary of terms in the book and Ashley picked her favorites. They're mostly from the book. So the ones that I wrote down are from the book and a few submissions. Okay. So let's start with, what? doesn't mean when they say, I like you, but. Oh, what did I write? Well, it's like they don't, you know?

There shouldn't be a butt? Yeah, there's no but. Okay. Yeah, I like you, but. It's whatever comes after the butt is the truth. Right. There we go. That's the truth. Anything that follows the butt is actually how they feel. Okay. Okay. I don't want to do this to you. I don't want to do this with you. Nailed it. Wait, I'm loving quizzingick on his book. Okay. They want to quote unquote, Lay low. They want to lay low. Oh, they want you to come over and have sex. Oh, they don't want to go out.

I thought I meant like they don't want to like be seen with you in public. No, it has more to do with I want to put out the least amount of effort to have sex. Okay. Got it. Okay. Good call. It's one show. So it's a Netflix and chill kind of thing.

Okay. Lay low. Chill. Like, no guy's actually embarrassed. If he wants to sleep with you, he's not embarrassed of you. I know there's a sex and city episode like that. takes to the one restaurant. They have the Chinese restaurant, yeah.

What do they mean they say? I can't give you what you want. They just don't want to. They can. These are all the same. They just don't want to. It's so funny. They can.

But they just don't want to. It's like, no, I literally could. I just don't feel like it. It's funny if you were to give the interpretation back to them. Like if some guy was like, I can't give you what you want. And you were like, oh, you could. You just don't want to. And he would be like mindful.

Well, that's the thing, too. I genuinely believe that despite all the differences that men and women have when it comes to dating, there are more similarities than differences. And so when you're confused, and I'm speaking to the ladies out there, just ask yourself, how would I handle this situation

if I really liked someone? And that nine times out of ten, how he would act if he liked someone to. Totally. Men will lose their goddamn minds when they like a girl. They will turn into absolute mush balls. They will talk to their friends.

They will stare at their phones. They will, like, ask a bunch of questions. they'll lose their shit. They're no different when they really like someone. When we like someone and we are asking and we want validation of the person we like, we crumble. And men are no different.

And it's not some sort of game or super Jedi trick that they're playing. They just don't care. And back to the whole situation ship, maybe you just have to show them why they should. And the only way to show them why you should is to let them know that you could have anyone you want and you're going to, so they better like figure it out pretty quick. otherwise you will no longer be available.

The way you tie that up. Yeah, the way we called it back. What a king. Well, this has been incredible. I had so much fun of you ladies. Yeah. We're so funny, Nick.

Yeah, we can't recommend the book enough, the podcast. I'm such a fan. I'm taking it down a notch. I came in so hot to your podcast. I was so late. I was like, I'm such a fan. Ashley was like, stop. I was actually hot.

I'm getting hot now. It is a good. It's podcasting is what it is. Yeah, we'll fix the situation. What was the term I came up with this? Love martyr. Love martyr. Episode title. Okay. Well, Nick, plug all your stuff. Well, if you like what you heard, the VAL Fours, we are on three days a week.

I sound kind of busy. But if you like this relationship stuff, every Monday we have our Ask Nick episodes where people call in, share their stories, a lot of dating situations of stories, a lot of family dynamic stuff. And we just offer advice and people share their stories. It's very relatable. If you like reality TV, we recap a lot of reality TV shows like Vanderpump and Housewives and Bachelor. We cover those usually on Tuesdays. And then on Thursdays, we have our going deeper episodes that you ladies are on where we interview interesting people like yourselves, actors, actresses, musicians. There's a little bit of an asonic element on texting office hours in those calls. And you can check it out wherever you listen to podcasts. You can watch it on YouTube. Don't text your X.

Happy birthday is available wherever you buy books. There's an audiobook. TikTok, Instagram. We're out there. And then also what I love in the book is there is some asnick really quick, short answer. It's like, it's cute to read. It's like set up like text messages. It's really fun.

It's really meant to be a very, I mean, I'm dyslexic. I can't read. So like, you know, I, uh, it's supposed to be easy to read and you can page through it and something you can like reference back. It's, it's really meant as like, you know, a guide. And as I say in the book, it's not a manual. Like dating is fluid in a sense. There's no like specific golden rule. There are exceptions to every rule. And again, if you're trying to be exception, just recognize it, you know, and have an out. Okay. And then you read the audio book? I do. Awesome. And I read. And I read. And I. recommend listening at 1.2 speed only because I am dyslexic and that was just a real painful operation for me. So like if you play it at 1.2, it kind of smooths out my voice.

Smooth it out. I think or maybe 1.1. But otherwise, I mean, there were like sentences I had to read seven times. And I had to be like, I'm so sorry. I'm having trouble with and. It's the conjunctions that are getting me. All right, guys, we'll check out the audio book sped up version, speed it up. And you know where to find us. Girls Gotta Eat.com. for tickets to our fall tour and merchandise and all the things. Girls Gotta Eat Podcast on Instagram and TikTok. I'm Ash Hess. Raina is rena.org. And of course, our other company Vibesonly, Vivesonly.com and Vives only on Instagram.

And we'll see you next week. How are we, guys. Bye. Bye.