Girls Gotta Eat - Understanding (and Fulfilling) Our Sexual Fantasies feat. Dr. Justin Lehmiller

Episode Date: November 15, 2021

Oh yesss, we have an erotic and educational episode for y'all! We're so excited to chat with sex educator and author Dr. Justin Lehmiller about fantasies, fetishes, f*cking your friends, and more. We're discussing the psychology behind fantasies and kinks (yes, including foot fetishes), threesomes and tips for successful/enjoyable ones, cuckolding questions, and even how your political affiliation can play out in the bedroom. Justin is also sharing the truth (and data) behind friends with benefits, and we dive into casual sex and why it's more difficult for women to indulge in. Before he joins us, we're recapping our wild Cancun trip, Rayna's post-breakup turnaround, and Ashley's missed connection. Enjoy! Follow Justin on Instagram at @JustinJLehmiller and check out the Sex and Psychology blog and podcast. Follow us @GirlsGottaEatPodcast, Ashley @AshHess, and Rayna @Rayna.Greenberg. Visit our website for tour dates, merchandise, and more. Thank you to our partners this week: Babbel: Go to babbel.com and use code GGE to get 3 additional months when you purchase a 3-month subscription. Hello Tushy: Get 10% off + free shipping at hellotushy.com/gge. Daily Harvest: Get up to $40 off your first box at dailyharvest.com/gge. Nutrafol: Get $15 off your first month's subscription + free shipping at nutrafol.com/gge. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

And he went over and he started looking at them and smelling them. And it was like this fresh leather. And he just spontaneously ejaculated. And like he's been into shoes ever since. Ever since. Yeah. Welcome back to another episode of Girls Got to Eat. Welcome back.

We're back from spring break. And it's getting dark. I listen. People are like, oh yeah, hot take. It's dark at four. I'll never stop talking about it. It is so ridiculous. I've lived in the Northeast.

whole life never deviated on the restop time, how cold it is and how dark it is. 4.30. I got, I slept in obviously the other day. I woke up at like 11. I was like, I feel like it's about to get dark. Like, I feel like it's getting dark after lunch. Like, you finish eating lunch and the sun's like,

hmm, so I'm about to set. Yeah, it's 315 and we're like hurry off this intro. So the Sunday I hate this so much. Well, actually, you know what? No. The only reason I like it, I do like cold and like, I like fall and winter. I like, I like, that you feel like it's later than it is and you can get more done. So I like that,

like, you think it's eight, but it's like four. And I like that. Like, there's more hours in the day, it feels like to me. Like to work at night. Well, it just feels like, the worst thing is when you think it's earlier than it is. You know what I mean? When you're like, we have so many more hours to do cool stuff. And then you're like, no, it's time to go to bed. Like, I like that you could be like, is it eight o'clock? And then someone's like, it's five o'clock. And you're like, I think I just your vibe because I like to work in the morning and I need more daytime hours and the minute the sunsets, my work is over. And you're like, I'm just getting started.

But you were editing something at 11.30 last night. And I was like, I'm going to go to bed now. You are fully working, like computer out editing 1130. But even in life, like, if you're out having a good time with your friends and you're like, God, it's got to be so late. And then someone's like, it's only noon. You're like, woo. Like, I just am a big fan of thinking that it's later than it is.

Okay. I'm the opposite. I am more rainist friend. I want to go to sleep when the sun goes down. Today we have new merch for you. We have new live shows. We've announced new times for live shows. So all new merch drop today.

We have new stuff for the holidays. We have gorgeous green sweatshers with white sweatsuit. We have mauve and maroon. I just like, I love it. Dog bandanas. If you're a more Azul's friend. And we have new Live Your Truth stuff. We have a great Live Your Truth.

Green sweatshout. We have great black sweatshirt. All of it is really wonderful. We're so proud of it. Holiday ordering deadlines. We're going to ask you to please order by December 3rd. So get in there, order as soon as you can. And if you didn't, if you missed those deadlines, of course, you can still order or you can

gift cards. We have that on the accessories tab on the website at girls' gotty podcast. Dot shop. It's so beautiful. We love all the merch. Get it for your friends. We are so happy with it. I'm sitting here in it.

It's just so cute. So check it out, guys. Yes. And like Raina mentioned, we added late shows in D.C. in Portland. I don't know what the fuck happened with you all in D. but you sold out this huge theater in one day. Like 12 hours. You guys really stormed.

Yeah. Stormed theater. Yeah. It took down Ticketmaster. So Late Show in D.C. and in Portland. And then there are still tickets available in San Francisco, L.A., San Diego, and Dallas. There's probably a few left.

Seattle also. Yeah. Seattle. Sorry. Seattle. Well, the map on Ticketmaster is. Completely. Well, the map on Ticketmaster are very misleading.

So there are tickets there. Yes. Sorry. Yes. You got to click the upper balcony and then it's going to be a GA upper balcony. So I don't know what's going on up there. She's up or deck. It sounds like it's like a party up there.

I don't, what is going on there? No rules set the upper deck. They're like just who's to say? Just grab a ticket. We don't know where you'll be. Who's to say? So we're really excited to be in all your cities. We can't wait.

And that's all available. Girls GottiPoddypodcast.com. We cannot wait for these shows. I am so excited. So speaking of shows, we're going to talk about Cancun. Some girl DM'd and said, please share every detail of this trip. so we can feel like we were there. Because if you were watching along on Instagram,

it looked incredible, and it was. You were like, what the fuck is happening? I mean, we did not know what the fuck was happening. When we got there, we were like, what is going on? I had to get my bearings. I'm like, where's the coffee? Where are we supposed to go?

Like, you go to, you end up like a big resort and it was beautiful, but you're kind of like, what's going on? It was huge. I've actually never been in a resort that big. I walked like for like 15 minutes down the hallway after I left you. Yeah, we had to get our room.

Raina was like, I'm not ocean fresh. She had a switcher room. Yeah, it was a whole thing. But we were at Just for Last Comedy Festival, which we've done in Canada that you guys came to in the past in Toronto, Montreal, Vancouver. But this is the first JFL escapes that we were a part of. We were the guinea pigs for this whole festival. We were. And it was incredible. I mean, again, we did not know what to expect.

And we just had such a good time. We met so many of you guys. You guys are always so hilarious. He told us the craziest stories when we met you. We hung out with other comedian friends like Mateo Lane. a lot who we love so much, can't recommend him enough. Nikki Glazer, Andrew Collin was there. We got to be reunited with him for a minute. Nikki let me open our show, which was really special to me.

I mean, Nikki's a friend, but I'm also a fan. So this is like really fun to do that. And then when we saw the setup for the show that we would be doing at the pool, just this stage set up by the pool, we were like, fuck it. We got to do full spring break stage. Like I've finally, I lived my dream. It was just, it was incredible. Yeah, it was MTV Spring Break. Like we saw buttholes and boobies and we had twerk competitions. We're pouring Don Julio into people's mouths. It was one of the best day of my life.

It really was one of the best days of my life too. And the night before we did the jam. We did the goddamn comedy jam. And it just really was, that was the best night of my life. Yes. So there's this thing. It's called the goddamn comedy jam. Like Raina said, they travel.

They do shows all over. Josh Adam Myers, who does it is here in New York. But the band is in L.A., I think. I don't know. You talk to the band more than I did. What's deal with the band? Yeah, I did. We'll talk about it later.

You're such a creep. And they perform and they basically let comedians be rock stars and perform a song with a full band. Like you sing the song, you learn the song, and you have a full band. They'll help you out. You know, like if you, they know the. But it's instrumental. It's not karaoke. No, not at all.

Like it's, they did this in it. So in Atlanta, which is a really cool thing, which the first time I'd seen it, it was called Meddlesome Monday. And it was at a bar underneath dark horse called Ten High. I'm sure that's still around. Or it's not. I could be wrong. And it started like more heavy metal rock. And you would go do karaoke.

with a full band. It's so fun. You get to feel like a rock star. So I'd have a little experience with it, but we ended up singing crazy in love. And it's a fucking hard song to learn. Like not, I'm not, like, Beyonce's part is hard. The lyrics are kind of whack. Like they don't, it's, it was so difficult for us to learn. So ran and I were trying to learn the verses and everything. And then one of us thought we were going to do the JZ rap and we were like, we just can't do it. No, one of us. I volunteered to do it. Oh yeah. You can be the Beyonce. I will wrap the JZ part. And I, I, I was like, okay, Good luck. And it's just, it's difficult. It's like, rapping's hard in general. Like, if it doesn't exactly go with the beat, it's so hard. Like, even in karaoke, I used to try to do

raps and I just had to give it up. I just said to stop. I thought there was going to be karaoke in the back. As soon as I learned there would be no guide, I had to abandon it. They were like, what do you mean? I'd be able to play the music a little bit. I'd be able to like hear Jayze singing. So he thought they were going to play that that's, like, but who would sing it? We would sing it along with Jayzie. I thought I'd have a guide. Yeah. So it's like with the full band. So we're at this rehearsal thing. And, and. Josh, who's like in charge and who I know he needs a friend, he was like, I'm going to text Jay and see if he'll do the Jay Z part. I was like, Jay, Jay Farrow, who was on S&L, he's a headliner

of this festival, and who used to impersonate JZ on S&L. I was like, no way. There's no way he's going to sing that with us. He was like, I'm going to shoot him a text. And sure enough, we were like waiting to go on stage and he just came up. He was like, I'm going to be singing with you girls. I was like, I can't even believe this. I can't believe it's like the second best thing to JZ in my eyes. I mean, it was like listening to JZ. There was no difference. Yes. Perfect voice.

It was unbelievable. He does the voice. You can't tell the difference. So Ray and I got to perform crazy and love that he came up and sang with us. I have a huge crush on him. Can't stress it enough. Jay, if you're listening, I'm here.

Who doesn't? I didn't know how hot he was. I didn't either. I saw him like walking across the quad at the buffet. And I was like, what? Like most people, I always feel like most famous people or anybody really that you see on TV, they're always smaller in person. Whether they're thinner or they're shorter or

just a smaller frame. Like when you meet a person that you've seen on TV and they're actually like bigger and more muscular and hotter, you're like, what? I feel like it never happens with men. I feel like every man you see a TV. Like women sometimes men are all small. Women, I think across the board, it's just a small, it's smaller because women are typically thinner.

Thinner. Like, yes. And men are shorter. Lighter shorter. Like rarely are they bigger than you thought. And I was just like, oh my gosh. He's, he's so wonderful. So that's my new.

Crush, watch out Mike Johnson. That's a competition, Mike. Well, it really was so special. And I was just excited to be a part of something that had never happened before. And we were kind of the guinea pigs for it. And we just had so much fun. So if you guys came, thank you. Hopefully we'll do this again next year.

And it'll be an even bigger, wilder party. And I mean, it was just so, so special. Like, I am a party girl at heart. I did spring break every year in college. I have the most insane party stories from Dewey every summer. Like I still party and I still get wild. I love to dance and that crazy. But way less than I obviously used to.

Like I'm not like getting drunk and acting a fool. Like I spent all of my 20s and early 30s. But I got to like live my dream. Like people were sending a message to there. Like you look happier than I've ever seen you. Like you look happier on that stage pouring tequila in people's mouths at the pool. Judging the co-ed wet t-shirt contest. We had a guy picked me up while Ashley sang the Lion King song.

It really was just the best. It was just unreal. I can't even believe. leave it. I feel like the present of the festival was just like, you girls are just incredible. We were like, thanks, Bruce. Thanks, Dad. So it was fun. I feel like so many people were seeing that and they were like,

if this happens again, I'm there, I'm sold. I love that we performed in bathing suits. I was like so comfortable. I love to be like taking shots with the fans. It just was great. So if you guys came, it was really special. And I felt like, so this trip like unlocked something in me. I just like, I've talked to you

about this a little bit. I mean, a lot to tell Ashley everything offline. But I feel like since my breakup, it's been really weird. Like, I haven't been attracted to anybody. And I've talked to you about this. And I find it so interesting because, like, we have quite a few friends that have gone through breakups recently. And I've seen them just dive immediately into dating. And they want to like fuck their ex right away. They want to sleep with a fuck buddy. They want to go on dates. And like, I have had the exact opposite response to my breakup. I just haven't felt like it at all. Like I've said to you, like, if I saw somebody who was like the perfect man, I just like can't imagine being interested in it. I just felt like I need

to take a little break. Yeah, not like you're like heartbroken and think you're never going to find that again because that happens too. My experience after my bad breakup was like I feel like I threw away really good guys because I just wasn't ready and they didn't compare. And so you get, you see the people do that where they're just like too heartbroken. They can't imagine someone else touching them. But like, that's not your, that wasn't your experience. It was more just like you just kind of shut it off. It was something just in the middle of that. It's so weird. I've never experienced this. I wasn't so like, no offense. I like wasn't so heartbroken. I like, yeah. was fine and I don't feel like I'll never find love again.

But I also feel like I didn't feel like I need to fill this part of me that like needs confidence and needs reassurance. And so I have to go out and date and I have to be sure I can find it again. Like I just was like wellming somewhere in the middle and I like wasn't finding anybody attractive or anything. And I feel like this is the first trip where like I actually like, I mean, I met somebody with like a man bun and a beard. I mean, that'll unlock stuff in you.

And I finally was just like attracted to people for the first time in a while. So it was a nice feeling to feel like. little bit like I'm back and I can flirt with guys because like I couldn't imagine doing that for the last month. I've just been so turned off to it in general. And I wanted to like tell you this analogy that my friend Chelsea had told me. And a different friend had said to me, she just broke up and she's like, how long do you think it takes to get over somebody? And you and I talked about that and how everybody's sort of experience is different. And Chelsea said, you know, it's it's not, I'm going to try to say it as eloquently as she said it to me. But she said that, you know,

feelings of breakups and getting better. It's not like a linear thing. It's not like, you know, today you're going to feel shitty and three months you're going to feel good. She was like, I don't like to think of it as waves either. And she compared it to a spiral. And she said that, you know, because there is an end to a spiral, and you're sort of like looping around this

and you have these like very, very depressive lows. And you're just like, I'm never going to find anybody. I'm so upset. And then you have these manic highs where you're just like, I'm so glad I don't have to be in this anymore. And I feel free and I'm so good. And you sort of loop around the spiral, those periods become less and less,

and they become shorter periods of time where the depression is so terrible, but the manic highs aren't so manic anymore, and you will come to an end of this eventually. And unfortunately, nobody knows how big their spiral is. Everybody starts with a different size spiral. But I liked it being compared to that, and it gives, I would hope, other people comfort

that are like, what am I going to stop feeling like this? And it's like, eventually you will. You will probably feel sad every day and then happy, but like the moments where you feel sad will get smaller and smaller as you like etched towards the middle of the spiral. I love that analogy. That's great.

I like to visualize stuff in that way. Also, if you don't talk to the person, it makes it a whole lot easier because then you get thrown off completely now you're back up at the top. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like I think those things, we've done a million breakup episodes at this point,

not a million, just a few. But like those things throw your, it all out of whack. Because you should actually be like decreasing in that way. It should be like getting less and less and less. and less manic, like you said, and like all over the place. Like as you wean off of a drug, I think of it, you know?

And the first like couple weeks of my breakup, I was like, I feel great. And I was like, oh, we're talking every day. Yeah. So like we weren't really, and we broke up and it was like, I still knew what he was up to every minute. Yeah. Huge mistake. No, for in general. It is.

I agree. It's not, you're not broken up if you're talking every day. And, you know, I just think that like if you feel like I need to unfollow somebody's social media, is that petty. It's not petty. Unfollow it. If it's for your mental health, unfollow it. and walk away from it. If you have to block their friends and family too, do that too.

Like, whatever you need to do. But I don't think anybody has a clear path to feeling better. I think that, like, mine was different because I probably felt better quicker. But, like, my path back to, like, feeling like I want to sleep with people has probably been longer than your average person. Everybody's path is just different, but, like, don't beat yourself up. It's taking you too long or you're at a different part in the recovery that somebody else thinks you should be in.

And I just love that analogy. I was excited to share it with you. I don't think this is excessively long at all. I mean, you guys broke up, like, a month ago. I'm not for me. But like to sleep with somebody. Like I don't think, I think people like go through breakups and really don't feel comfortable even. They don't want to sleep with somebody for a really long time.

I think it's hard for some people to get back in the sack, you know, after only having sex. If they were monogamous with just one person for like a really long time, I think that can be a really tough hurdle to jump over. Like you're like, I can't even imagine another dick. Not for everybody. Some people are like, new dick tomorrow. Hit me. But if you got really fucked up and really heartbroken, like that was a little bit of my experience.

Like there was moments, months after I feel like I'd broken up with my ex where I was like, I can't imagine sleeping with somebody. Maybe a make out here and there, but like that level of intimacy, like it just took a minute. Yeah.

To get past it. Yeah, that's what it is. It's intimacy and I feel like, you know, I had a nice level intimacy and I had a good sex life with this past person.

And I'm not rushing to feel better about myself. I feel fine about myself. But like I found myself in Cancun like late at night, Florida with this guy with a man bun and a beard and I was like, I'm back. I turned to Raina. I just love when I see things she doesn't and vice versa, like with guys specifically. You know, Raina always like sees potential before anyone else.

But I like look at him. I'm like, yeah, Rainey, he looks just like George and Tom. Let's just say those are like two guys. I was like, yeah, he's a hybrid between these two fucking people, neither of which are my type. Raina, I cannot. I can't see us ever even like fighting over a guy. Like every time she finds a guy attractive, I'm like, girl, how? And I feel like she's like the same with me. Like it's, we'll come together sometimes and agree and like very

traditionally attractive looking people obviously. Yes. We're not blind. Yes. But yeah, I had a situation in Cancun and it actually comes up to day in this episode. We just finished this interview, which we are so excited about you guys. I love this episode so much. But I was talking about this opportunity I had to hook up with somebody in Cancun. And I was beating myself up a little bit for not taking it, I guess, because it just would have been a good story. You know what I mean? Like, yes, the guy was hot. Really hot.

And yes, he very much basically hit me. It was very, it wasn't aggressive, but the tone, the, like. It wasn't an underlying tone of what's fuck. Yes, but it wasn't, it wasn't let's fuck. It was like a cute way. It was, you know, late at night. But I just was like, I got this DM and I cannot tell you, Raina, it was to the minute of I had just done my skincare.

Like, I'm talking like, I just took everything off. Like, I might have even entertained if I hadn't have already put this giant t-shirt on my love line, which is being right t-shirt. Like, I was no longer in that mood at all. It was, it was late at night. It was like almost one in the morning. Again, it's like a party trip.

So that's not that crazy. But like, I just wish this guy would have messaged me like eight because it, I probably would have a better story for you guys right now. Like, I just felt like, I don't know where he's been. You were asleep. I was like, I don't know if he's messaged Raina. What if I wake up and he had messaged Rain an hour earlier and I'm the second choice? Like, I just, I got in my head about it.

We talk about today, actually. I don't know this person. It was like a hot guy I met for a second at the, in Cancun. Like, I really just kind of feel like I could have got it done if I had had a little more time. But it was a little too late. Also, by the way, this was the third night of the trip. I don't go out and party and drink three nights in a row usually. And it's not like we were like snort and crack.

But like it was a lot of activities all day, every day, a ton of drinking. I started to feel like depressed by the end of the last night. I think you're right on that too where it's such a different vibe on the last night versus the first night or even the middle night. Like I wasn't out. I never got like drunk drunk. Like I drank a lot. I felt like really sluggish by the end of the trip. But if that had been the night before, you still have that like excitement of we have another day. Like you're not trying to fuck somebody at one in the morning. You got to get to the airport the next day. No. There's something about it that's not even fun anymore. Like you're like the trip's over.

Trips over. I went home a little bit early that night. I was just like I asked a security guard to walk me back to the hotel. I was just like, nothing cool. Yeah, I do love a security guard. This guy was cute. but I was down with the experience. But I kind of turned him down, obviously. I responded a little while later. And then the way he responded back to me just felt like really nice. Like he just, he, it wasn't like annoyed.

It was like, yeah, I get it. It's late. Like it was just kind of. Yeah. Then I was kind of like, yeah, give it. And then I message him and be like, hey, we're coming where you live. I just don't think you would have been fun.

I just like badly tonight. I'm drinking all day long. You're drinking all day long. I'm tired. I just. Yeah. Even an hour before I would have an update for you. What?

So speaking of like the Formula One stuff and I didn't know what that was and I didn't know anything about like it being in Austin and then I found out how I could have found out. Yeah was in Austin that week. Oh, that race he went to. I could have figured out what this was because my brother was at that race. Really? Yes. He was in Austin for the Formula One race for a bachelor party with a bunch of friends.

And like, had I just, like, reached out to a family member sooner. I could have known this and not bombed in that guy's text messages. Oh, my God. Also, you guys went crazy over our discussion about Formula One. Are you kidding me? Like, all these years, we've been doing dating content, which should put a race car podcast. Yeah.

We got invited to a Formula One race in Montreal. The amount of people that have directed me to the Netflix series about Formula One racing I do want to watch that, yeah. I mean, I guess I have to now. Yeah. And I just have an update about Hinge's voice prompts that we talked about last week. you guys have been sending some to me. A lot of them are going viral on TikTok. But you guys have sent me some. I feel like we could do a whole episode in this. They're unreal.

Like one girl sent me one. This guy, I'm not kidding you. Listen to me when I say this. Real life, he was taking a shit on his voice prompt. He was farting, explosive out of his ass and going like, ah, that felt so good. You could hear the pooping. That was the point. Oh my God. Another one was the one viral. I know. So disgusting. I was like, are you kidding me? I responded back to this girl. A guy doing a Mrs. Doubt fire impression has gone viral. It's really funny. That would get me immediately.

Like, hello. Anybody being funny would get me immediately and I don't even care what your voice sounds like. But some of them are just like, they're saying like one word. It's so weird. What's the word? I don't know. Like a long word?

Like what's your favorite thing in life? And they're just like Formula One racing. And it's just like, okay, I guess I heard your voice, but you sound like such a dud. Uh-huh. So I just feel like it's taking the world by storm. I think it's gone so terribly wrong in some cases. And like no one is sending me anything that's like, this is hot. It's all funny.

And it's or like really gross. No one is using it for the right reasons. Like I'm here for the right reasons. No one's using it for the right reasons. Like for something disgusting or like a tear. I just, what you should be using it for us to tell a hilarious joke. Well, it's 30 seconds. Yeah, Tommy's joking 30 seconds.

I mean, or yeah, if you have an impression. I just think it's tricky, but I mean, I think it's a very fun. funny feature and I wonder if other apps are going to like adopt this and thank you guys for sending me these funny ones. You really don't have to stop. Don't send me the ones that have already gone viral. I've seen them. Don't send me in the jungle. I posted that myself. Are you recording your own voice one? I'm not, no, because I'm not, I don't care. You don't want to. Like we talked about it's difficult. I don't know what I would even say. You know what's funny about you is that like somebody finds out who you are and there's literally hundreds of voice samples of you in the world. So take one

second to find out what you sound like. What if I get on there and like, hi guys. I do it with Raina. It's just the intro of our podcast. Okay. Okay, guys, we are so excited to welcome our naughty guests today. Oh my gosh. He is a research fellow at the Kinsey Institute and author of the book. Tell me what you want, the science of sexual desire and how it can help you improve your sex life.

He's an award-winning educator. He's been honored three times with the certificate of teaching excellence from Harvard University where he taught for several years. He is also a prolific researcher and scholar. He's published more than 50 academic works to date, and he hosts the Sex and Psychology Podcast. Please welcome to the show, Justin Lay Miller. Thanks for having me. I'm so glad to have you. Raina just wanted to say the word naughty because she knows it makes me uncomfortable.

I don't like it. It's not my favorite. I got to say naughty and lay. In the beginning, yeah. We're so excited to have you here. Yeah, I'm excited to be here. And basically, it's hard to make me uncomfortable around seven. because I've kind of seen and heard it all at this point.

So you didn't hurt it all. I love that. And don't know. Or one time later. Buy me a drink first. Okay. We have a fridge full of drinks. I'll get him a drink.

There's alcohol. There's whatever you could want in there. There's cheese. It's in the fridge. Apparently. So you have been researching sex and like the psychology of sex and desire for quite some time. So I started in 2008.

You know, it's funny. I went to graduate school to study the psychology of romantic relationships. and along the way discovered, like, we're studying relationships, but nobody's talking about sex, which is kind of this fucked up thing because sex is a pretty big part of most people's relationships. And so I really started to get into the science of sex because I think it's just this topic that almost nobody talks about in the academic world. And we really need to understand sex scientifically. We want to help people have better sex and fix their sexual problems.

Yeah. I mean, thank God for people that. have that way of thinking. It's like the knowledge people crave the most. It is, but it's something where it's really hard to get funding if you want to do sex research. So it's kind of hard to choose that as your path because there are just so many roadblocks and obstacles. And then people don't take you seriously when you study sex. You know, I even encountered this, for example, when I was teaching at Harvard, where other faculty members kind of looked down on my course, considered it a fluff course because it was about sex and thought that students should be taking their course. And

instead. So I actually had people who were resentful of the fact that I had high enrollment for my courses. Yeah. So you're jealous. Yeah. Right. Sorry. This is the best class on this campus. Sorry. And it's going to teach them the most useful, practical real life information. Yeah, I don't want to take algebra. We're going to suck dick in college. I did that always outside of the classroom. I'm trying to do it in the classroom. Oh my gosh. Well, can I just ask you this? This is like not going to be about this today. But have you felt a significant shift since 08 in terms of I'm not so much of normalizing talking about sex, but in terms of even like funding and things like that, do you feel like the scene is better in that world?

In the academic sex world, really not that much has changed. I mean, I think more people are going into it, but I know a lot of sex researchers who have fled to Canada because it's a lot easier to do sex research and get funding for it. And, you know, they can apply for government-funded studies of orgasms and pleasure and things that are worth understanding, but you can't. study that here and get, say, federal funding for it. Like, the only thing you can get funding for here is if you want to study STDs and teen pregnancy prevention and, you know, any of the, what we consider usually to be negative outcomes of sex. It's really discouraging. Stuff that we do, we run into

roadblocks every once in a while. I sometimes forget that it's taboo. And then we'll like get hit with something. And they're like, well, yeah, because it's sex related. We're like, what? You know what I mean? I've got to be careful with this and this and this. We're like, really? Still? So I just, that's really like discouraging to hear. And it's especially discouraging that even just like our closest neighbor is like so much better than we are. It's not surprising. I think so many things are backwards about America. But so many people I think have grown up just thinking like the stuff that they want is like weird or like fucked up or backwards.

And the stuff that you study is not just like how to improve your sex life. It's polyamory. It's why do you watch this kind of porn? It's like why do you these sexual fantasies? The stuff that you're doing is like even kinkier. But like I think that we need to be like telling, not children, but like, you know, college kids. Are you? This is normal if you want to like suck a toe or you want to like do butt play.

And I think that like things like podcasts have like really gone a long way to show people that like things like polyamory and being sexually fluid is a very normal thing. But yeah, I think it must be really tough to get funding to like tell a roomful of 18 year olds that polyamory is normal, quote unquote normal. There's also no way you can have say one sex education course at a younger age that covers everything you think you need to know. So I take the perspective that we really need lifelong sex. Ed. And so podcasts, books, films, like, there's all kinds of ways that we can keep learning about

sex because most people stay sexually active into older age. I know a lot of people don't like to talk about it, but hey, sex doesn't have to end at a certain point. And when you get older, you're still going to want to have sex. So let's talk about how to make that sex better. Yeah. And for women, like men, they're like, take this pill. I'm in my sexual prime. I'm just getting naughtier and nottier. I feel great. I will never forget. We were in seven. seventh grade health and we had the most awkward teacher. I don't think he was supposed to, I think he was like a gym teacher that they were like, hey, can you teach health? And I just will never forget when this kid from the back of the classroom was just like, hey, I heard this in the bus this morning. What's 69? And I just will never forget the moment of him. I think he just died in front of us. You know what I mean? His soul left his body. Yeah. I don't think we got a clear answer. I mean, kids finding out what 69 is just so funny because you will never stop laughing. about it. It will be a 10-year journey of being like, you put what in where while your thing is in my face? What?

So you research sexual fantasies and the porn that people watch specifically, and we can divide that to two. But you research sexual fantasy and why we're attracted to what we're attracted to. And one thing we're laughing about us feet. So like, what makes somebody attracted to feet? Like, talk to us about like the research behind sexual fantasies. That's a big question and a small question. Yes. So let him go. Like, can we just answer the feet first? I just got to know. Because now I'm like weirded out about posting my feet on Instagram because people will be like, whoa, girl, don't be given the feet away for free. I'm like, are guys jerking off? I do have beautiful feet. Yes, they are.

I did a podcast last night of these guys. And the one was like, I come to feed. You could charge for that. Yeah, I'm looking into it. Justin, just can you explain this and then we'll move on to bigger and better questions? But what is the feet thing? Let me just step back one second to say the bigger question of why are we turned on by what we're turned on by. And the answer is complex.

And two people can develop the same sexual interest for totally different reasons. So when you pick like a specific fantasy, like threesomes or foot fetishes or whatever, there's not just one thing you can say like everybody is into this for this reason because it's complicated. But in the case of feet specifically, there are some different schools of thought. So there are some people who believe that it's due to like a crosswiring issue in the brain because supposedly the genital pleasure centers in the. foot sensory center, you know, they're close to one another in the brain. And so maybe there's a cross wiring that happens. They just get fucked up in the brain. Your wires get crossed. Yep. You're like, wait, is that a vagina or a foot? I don't know. So people like want to fuck feet because of that? Maybe. That's one school of thought. I don't know if I'm convinced by that.

So I think most fetishes, whether they're for feet or something else, they're learned, right? These are learned associations. And there have actually been scientific studies where they have conditioned boot fetishes into men who like sign up to take part in the study. They used classical Pavlovian conditioning. Like basically, those are straight guys. They brought them into a lab. They hooked them up to a device that measures their erections. And then they show them an image of nude women.

They get turned on. The penis gets hard. And then they show them an image of boots. They're not showing any arousal to the boots. But if you repeated the pair, like the nude female with the boots, then eventually they start to show arousal to the boots. alone, right? So it's learned through this process. We develop these associations. And when you think about feet in particular, like, we kind of sexualize them as a society and culture. If you look

at like women's footwear and the way that they're displayed and we associate that with sex and sex appeal. And so you've got that broader cultural piece. And then, you know, I think it's just sort of learned for a lot of people. Footwear is very sexy. And like the thing that goes in, like a beautiful pedicure like is so sexy. I think women's bodies are like, so sexy. I have a question, like, to go along with women's be being sexy, do women have foot fantasies about men? Oh, Raina. Is this like a traditional... No kink shaming, but geez, no. Right, it doesn't feel like it goes both ways. Like, I feel like women's footwear is beautiful. I think toenail, like, manicures are beautiful. Okay, hear me out. Oh, I just think women are so much more into hands.

And I don't know that men care so much about a woman's hands. I think he doesn't want a woman and then has like bigger, stronger hands than him. But I and so many of my girlfriends are so into man's hands. I mean, it's the first thing I notice. I'm also just like a larger woman where like I want a bigger guy. But like just the way they look, you know, I will be a small lady hand. I'm like, I don't want it. Like I think hands are so important.

So I'm wondering if it's like women are more in hands, men are more to feet. I don't know. What are you fine? Okay. So women can be into feet. Like that is a thing. Of course. Yeah.

Anybody of any gender orientation can have a fetish. for anything. But men on average are much more likely to have foot fetishes and men are more likely to have almost all fetishes in general compared to women. Some researchers think that that's because men tend to have this more fixed sexuality, whereas women's is more flexible and fluid. And so men are more likely to just sort of develop this very intense attraction to something often at a young age. And then that sort of becomes like the key thing that they're always turned on by. And I think it's really fascinating when you have people who have fetishes where you ask them to describe like where do you think this fetish came from. They can often point to this like very early experience in life. I always think

of this one guy who talked about how he was home alone and his uncle had or dad, I can't remember, had just gotten a new pair of penny loafers and he went over and he started looking at them and smelling them and it was like this fresh leather and he just spontaneously ejaculated. And like he's been into shoes ever since. Ever since. Yeah. I used to sleep with this guy. We casually dated it and we had pizza like the first couple times we had sex.

Pizza just happened to be around. One night we got this full, the pizza place around the corner gave us a full pie. We had sex. We ate the pizza. And then the next time pizza was in the room. I don't know. It just turned to this thing.

So he was joking that every time you walked by a pizza place, he got hard. And it was a joke, but I just, I love talking about this of like just the association. can be something totally non-sexual. Yes, and I think the past very much shapes the present when it comes to our sex lives.

Like so much of it are these early things we learned. I also see this in my fantasy research where I asked people, what did you do during your very first sexual experience? And whatever took place during that first experience, people are more likely to fantasize about that now. Like there's this sort of imprinting process that kind of happens. The first penetrative sexual experience or just other things in general?

Could be anything. Okay, just sexual in general. So that's a Malibu rum for me. Coors light. Peach snobs. Every time I drink Coors light, I just think about getting fingered in a basement in high school. It is like interesting to me. Like some people have like very violent fantasies.

And I'm, I don't under, I don't understand where they come from. And it's interesting that you talk about like that they imprint a much younger. Because there's things that I masturbate to that other people would never. I always joke I like stepmom porn, but I do. Like I like it. And, you know, I think that there's violent porn. It's not for me. I don't, you know, I would never watch it, but clearly it comes from like childhood. Well, it can. Now, I don't want to like go down the Freudian rabbit hole and say everything is about like what happened when you were a child because sex is complex.

Yes. And, you know, part of it is differences in personality. Some people are what we call sensation seekers where they just need something more intense and potent to really get them off. And so they tend to be drawn toward more rough and violent and other sorts of activities or risky things. that's part of it. There's also, you know, your attachment style and sort of how much security and nurturance do you need to feel. And that can also shape what turns you on too. So there can be all kinds of reasons why we're drawn to what we're drawn to. That's probably also I feel like that's a personality type of people in general, like thrill seekers in life. Like people that need to do like hellas skiing or, you know, people that just want to like see the world. Other people that want to stay home, just how you're wired. And like, I understand that more that like you're, you need something pretty hardcore to even get aroused.

Like some people need something hardcore to have adrenaline. Yeah. So like what about people that do have like dom or sub fantasies? And I think like people joke that like, you know, I'm dominant all day long. So I want to be a sub in the bedroom and things like that. And like what is your research in that? People that really like to be dominated in the bedroom.

Are they somebody that are less dominant in life? Like how does actual real life day to day translate? Like a CEO of a Fortune 500 company that likes a girl to like pee on them. Like how does that translate? So it's a mixed bag when we're talking about this. So some people who are dominant in everyday life are very dominant in the bedroom too. So for some people, there's total consistency. For other people, it's a switch where what they do in daily life is different from what they want sexually.

And it's a way that they seek balance. And so an example I can give you is I'm friends with a lot of dominatrixes in my line of work. I know a lot of people who work in a lot of different areas of sex. And I remember the story that this woman told me who worked at a dungeon in New York City and she would have all of these high power CEOs coming in, stockbrokers, other people. And they would want to be punished by her because they had been taking advantage of the middle class that day. Like with the financial transactions they were making. And they wanted to seek balance.

They wanted her to beat the shit out of them because it was a way that they could. could psychologically deal with the real world harm that they were causing in their job. Wow. That's really interesting. It's twisted. It is. And I see it. Like I need to be punished.

I know I'm doing bad things. Yeah. And I see it in the opposite to two. I dated somebody who I would say is just not a super alpha person day to day in life. He's just like a nice guy. I wouldn't call him meek, but he's just super not alpha. But in the bedroom was very much like choke me, wanting to like, you know, spit in my mouth, call me a whore, which I love.

I mean, I felt safe in that. Like I think we should do anything. I felt safe in that environment. I didn't feel like any harm was going to come to me. I feel like it was consensual. But he wanted to like be like, you're my little fucked doll. You're my little whore. Tell me that you're my little whore.

Things like that. And I see it exactly translate as feeling like you want some dominance in life. Well, maybe he felt the opposite. He felt taken advantage of all day. So it's the reverse of that. Yeah. And it could be the one context where he feels safe or comfortable being dominant. maybe because you were a trusted partner, like someone that he felt safe with, to explore that

different side of himself. But yeah, people are all over the map in terms of like how their everyday life and their sex life match up. Anything else that you see is like a wide difference between like people's day-day life and how they are in the bedroom and like any thoughts or musings on that? I mean, there are a lot of people who are just, you know, they're thrill seekers in life and that translates to the bedroom. But this is something that can also change over time, right? So some people are not always thrill seekers, but later in life, they might become a thrill seeker. Maybe they hit their midlife crisis. Maybe some trauma happened or something and they need to feel alive. And so they go out and start doing these new thrilling, risky things. So I think it's really fascinating to think about fantasies and sort of the life course that they have because they seem to evolve and change over time to meet our needs.

And so it's actually the case that younger people are kinkier than older people in terms of interest in BDSM, but older people, more interested in threesomes and group stuff. And so there's some interesting variation there. Well, we were going to talk about threesome. So it's a perfect transition. What do you want to ask, right? I actually wanted to ask you before we moved in to threesomes, if you feel like your fantasies have really changed as you've like got,

because mine have, I feel like I've very much evolved as I've gotten older. And I guess maybe been exposed different things, but I like, I masturbate to completely different things than I used to. And so I was wondering if you felt like the same. I don't know. You know, I guess it's hard to like remember. I feel like when I was younger,

probably the one I was having the most sex, like when I was just in college, early 20s. I can't recall like fantasies. I think the fantasy is like, be my boyfriend. You know what I mean? Your favorite was your born category. Fantasy is like, hopefully this football player will want to date me. You know what I mean?

And like, oh, you know what I mean? I feel like I had a little more romantic fantasy, like a joke in a side. you know, the things, the images of my head were probably more romantically based. I mean, you know, I'm curious because I used to love lesbian porn and now, like, I don't even watch it. I won't watch it. I don't care about it at all. And like, I like a penis in my porn. I'm actually more wanton to just masturbate to my own, like, past. And you talk about sexual, like being sexually fluid. And I think that that sort of goes to that is that, you know,

you can change throughout your life. I found that sex life on Netflix. Did you watch it? No, I actually don't watch a lot of sex. sex shows because it feels like work for me. I get it. The one exception was sex education on Netflix, which I love. I was wondering if you were into that show because we were talking about education and sex. I'm obsessed with one of my favorites. It made me realize that everything that happened in that I wanted it.

It opens with, I mean, it wasn't the greatest acting in the world, but I've never been so turned on by a show. And it opens with him. He's just going down on her in public. Like I think my fantasies are probably the risk of being caught. Like when they fucked out, it was totally unrealistic. but when the subway went by, I was like, I am so horny for this. Like the thrill of getting caught.

Gone Girl, when Ben Affleck and they thought at the back of the strand at the bookstore, I'm like so turned on by it. I love a lot. Like a library fantasy. Yeah, library fantasy. Like they did it in friends. Like, because no one ever like went to go look at Ross's book. And so he like, fuck this girl is.

Whatever. It's not important. But I like the thought of that. So like nerdy librarian comes and finds you. But that's weird because my mom was a librarian. Like that's probably coming. for my child. Anywhere somebody can pull my panties aside

and fuck me is where I'm at. Hey, you know, you're not alone and having public sex being one of your favorite fantasies. It's super popular. I actually just published a blog post today on the 10 most common places people fantasize about having sex. Oh my God.

What do you think that number one would be? Is it a bathroom? Like, is it a restaurant bathroom? I'll let me, I'm going to guess. Yours is the restaurant bathroom? He gave me a face, so I don't think I'm right. But I'll keep my answer. is at church.

So I was really interested in the results. Like the number one place people fantasize about having sex is actually in their own fucking bed, which I'm like, what? What? Like how, but I understand it now. Is that just technically because you're thinking of it? Like, it's not your fantasy. You were like, I said fantasy. And I think for a lot of people, like in your own bed feels comforting and safe,

secure, and intimate. But there are lots of places. Most people fantasize about multiple locations. And so public settings, like bathrooms, you know, are very high up there on the list. Airplanes, motor vehicles, like all of these things are places people, a majority people fantasized about having sex. The rarest place people fantasized about it was in outer space. More people fantasize about sex in church. How do you even do it with the gravity? Like, I don't even know. Where does the come go? You got to come inside. We need studies of sex and space. Like, we don't understand

it. Like, how does it work? Hasn't Elon Musk done it? Probably. Probably not. He probably wanted like a zero gravity chamber and jerked off. You know, there's actually talk of when they do a mission to Mars. They want to have all-female teams of astronauts because they are afraid that men and women will have sex and a pregnancy might happen. And they don't know what that would turn into. And so they're like, well, yeah, we'll just send all women. They won't have sex. And it's like, Jesus.

Like. They will. I guess a kid of a baby. Procreating sex. Well, why not send all gay men then? Like, you know, you could. Yes. Or that.

It's funny. Well, then all they would do is have sex. Could we do? Yeah. True. They never get any work done. They feel like we got to jerk off everybody on this spaceship first. Okay, so that was really common, you said, like, was anything else?

I want to get back to threesomes, but like, was anything else like super common fantasy than anything like surprise you or like his feet at the top of the list? Is butthole stuff at the top of the list? Threesms are at the top of the list. All right. And like, let's talk about it, like male, male, female. Like, are you, because we had a guest on. He said MMF is like on the rise.

where it was a little more taboo years ago, I guess. And so different people have different preferred gender compositions of their threesomes. I think it's fascinating to look at the dynamics of people's threesome's fantasies. You know, there's this tendency to think when somebody says, oh, my fantasy is a threesome. We all like sort of picture like the same thing. We assume everybody's on the same page with us, but no, it's a totally different dynamic. Like, do you want to be the center of attention?

Do you want to go in with your partner and bring a third in? What do you want the gender composition of the other people to be? What are the specific acts that are going to take place? Like, threesome's are kind of all over the map. And so if you tell your partner you want a threesome, you should be pretty fucking clear about what it is that you actually want. That's like saying I want to go to dinner. Okay, where?

Yeah. Like, what kind of cuisine? And if both of you want to be the center of attention, like that can't really happen unless you take turns. So you have to negotiate. Like, how would a threesome work? And so I find threesomes are the single most common thing people fantasize about, but they're actually the fantasy that's least likely to turn out well

when people actually do it. And I think it's because people are, just on totally different pages about what they want. And then oftentimes it's just they stumble into the situation without discussing it. And that's just a recipe for disaster. Like, if you're going to have a threesome, it's best to have advanced communication with all parties to make sure everybody's getting what they want. That is so true.

I had a threesome and I just like, I really wanted it. I thought it would be great. And the actuality of what I got was like not fun. You hear that a lot. Like she felt like first of all, I don't know that I even really wanted to sleep with her. I wanted to sleep with her boyfriend. And I kept, I wasn't trying to. like go down on this girl. I've gone down on girls. I don't want to go down on her. I just wanted

to fuck her boyfriend. And I think that she didn't really want to watch her boyfriend fuck another person. And she didn't really like that. And then they started fucking and I just felt like a little left out. And I was like, I'm not sure to be here anymore. I just like got up and left. And I just thought no part of it was like fun for me. And you're right. Had I, I, I'd be like, whatever, we're drunk. It was two o'clock in the morning. We got him from a bar and we've fucked each other. But if we'd had had any like pre-discussion, I think it probably would have been much more enjoyable. And she probably would have said like, I don't particularly want to watch my boyfriend, fuck you. And I probably would have been like, okay, well, then let's not have this threesome, you know?

Because I'm not here to just like let your boyfriend watch me at your box. Yeah. That's a great call. Yeah. Well, then what are we doing here? I don't want to be here. Yeah. Like, what are the specific sex acts that you want to take place?

You know, and part of it too is, yeah, the idea of a threesome might sound great. But we're actually terrible as human beings at predicting our future emotional states. And so a lot of people don't anticipate the jealousy that might arise if, say, their partner gets more attention than they do or yeah it's just we're bad at predicting the future. I can't even imagine a situation in which I'm not getting all of the attention. Like I just feel like I'm too, I do have a jealous streak. I'm a little too competitive. Like I would be like, I don't want to, this is not what I want. You know what I mean? I would just need to be all about me. It would be like my birthday, you know? Yes, I do. I was talking to

this guy last night. We were talking about Threesome fantasies and him and his girlfriend. He said something else that I never thought of. And he was like, it would be hard for me to watch my, he was like, I do fantasize about it. I would love to do couple trading. He was like, I'd like to have a, like, an orgy with another couple. Because if I watched my girlfriend, fuck a guy and she moaned just a little harder than she does with me, he was like, I don't think I can handle it. But if I was, if I was also having sex, another person in the same room, he was like, I feel like I would really enjoy that. And I think that's interesting. Well, you know what's so interesting is related to threesome is this whole idea of cuck holding, where there's somebody who is watching,

their partner have sex with another person. And oftentimes they're really getting off on the fact that this other person can bring their partner more pleasure than they can. So there's, there's kind of this humiliation component sometimes that goes along with it. And that's the arousing part for a lot of people. And these fantasies are really common among heterosexual men. I actually find that a majority of heterosexual men I've surveyed fantasize about watching their wife, girlfriend, have sex with another man, often a guy who is more well endowed than him. And so that's sort of part of the appeal. And it's like, she's having a good time.

He's not involved in it, but he's still getting what he wants by watching and seeing her pleasure. Where does that come from? I'm just going to ask. Like the humiliation kink. Like, why do you, is it like, is that person an insecure person at their core and they're just doubling down? So why are people into humiliation specifically?

Why does a, you know, heterosexual man want to watch a more well-endowed guy, fuck his girlfriend better than he could? So for many of them, it's actually tied to a broader interest than BDSM. So I find that people who are into cuckholding tend to have more BDSM fantasies and also more multi-partner sex fantasies. So cuckholding is kind of a way of combining those fantasies altogether for some people. But again, there can be different reasons people are into it. I actually got an email from someone recently who described their favorite fantasies being cuckolding.

And they said, could this be related to the fact that when I had my first orgasm, it was listening to my parents have sex in another room. Probably it's tied in. So it's sort of like the observation of other people having sex, like it could be part of it. For some people it might also just be like, they're just total voyeurs and they just always want to watch. And cuck holding is like personalized, customizable born with, you know, you can pick and choose who you're watching and you can get up close and whatnot.

Yeah. I like it from the, I like the idea of like hooking up with a girl and my partner would watch me and tell me what to do. Like, I think that that's really sexy. Yeah, that's sexy. And they're, like, involved in it. I like the idea that you're, like, jerking off and watching me. I don't, I like it that it would be same sex for me, like, me and another girl.

I have a question, though, how does those kind of fantasies play out than in the, I don't know if you know the answers, but in the real world. So you have now watched your girlfriend have sex than another person who is more well-endowed than you made her moan louder. Now you have to, like, go out into the world and, like, be in a relationship. Like, are there dynamics where, like, the girl can't ever come back from this, that you're just like, you just want to watch me get fucked by another dude? Like, is there a, is there a world where you can, or pegging or something? We had somebody say like, you know, I wouldn't let my girlfriend

peg me because then we'd like go to brunch and I don't want her to know that she fucking pegged me or sitting at brunch. Like, is that hard to come back from certain fantasies in the real world? For some people it is. But in the research I've done on sexual fantasies and I've also done some work specifically on cuck holding and I asked people whether they've acted on it, what the experience was like, how did it change the relationship for cuckholding? Overwhelmingly, people report positive effects, that it brought them closer to their partner and improved the relationship, the fantasy exceeded their expectations. That's not to say that everyone has a positive experience and maybe the people who had bad experiences broke up and they're not reflected in my

data. But there are a lot of people for whom this does work out really well. I think where it doesn't work out is where somebody gets jealous and they open the relationship in some way and then they want to go back to closing it, and that can be hard to do for a lot of people. And it's actually really interesting in the case of cuckolding threesomes, open relationships. We see a lot of heterosexual men who are pushing for it. Like, they want to open their relationship. And then when they finally do, and this is especially true in the swinging community, the men sometimes want to go back and close.

The women want to keep going, right? Because they're getting all this great attention and living out their sexual dreams. And there's maybe not as many opportunities for the men in something. cases. Do you find that the men that really want to watch their partner have sex with somebody that's better, more well-end-doubt, whatever you want to use, is do they have a deep insecurity that they can't please their partner? Sometimes. Okay. Yeah. But there are also the flip side of this. And some people use a different term. They call it hot wifing, you know, in that heterosexual world. But basically, it's not about insecurity. It's about they get validation

from knowing that somebody else finds their partner attractive. It boosts their self-esteem and makes them feel good because she's going to sleep with you, but she's going to go home with me. Right? And so it's his confidence thing. I'm turned on by it. I totally get that.

That's hot wife. That's such a like, you picture the guy that says that. You know, my smoking hot wife, it's like a youth pastor. You know, that's like such a thing. There's just like a meme about it. I love that we just,

I just love that we're discussing this because we have never talked about it before. I know. the psychological reasons behind cuck holding. And that does, that totally makes. I mean, we all like that. We all want our partner to be desirable to other people. Like, nobody wants somebody that nobody wants.

Yeah. I mean, people do get off on that sort of other people being jealous of their partner. Okay, I have a question for you. So if you want to, if you really are into this like cuck holding kind of fantasy, whether it is that you want to fuck someone in front of your partner or you want to watch your partner fuck someone in front of you, do you advise on like how to bring this up? Because, like, I feel like, especially as a female, bringing it up to your male, at a time of heterosexual relationships, like, that could really, like,

a masculine guy and, like, you can't come back from it. So, like, I can come back from anything. But that could be hard to come back from. And I get emails from guys all the time who are like, can you tell me how I can tell my wife that I want her to go sleep with other people? Right. Like, all right. So you need to step back here before you introduce this idea.

And I think there's a bigger question about, do you have, good sexual communication in your relationship. Have you ever shared fantasies at all? Right? You don't just want to jump right in, like out of the blue, be like, let's strike out golden. Like, it's not going to work. So you got to build up like the trust, communication, intimacy, and then like start sharing some of your more vanilla fantasies first. So you're kind of like gradually through self-disclosure, building up the trust and intimacy. And then you can kind of introduce the idea later on. It's best, I think, to introduce fantasies when you're both already in a state of sexual arousal because when you're already aroused, your disgust response goes down.

And so you're less likely to have an extreme negative reaction to something. So you've got to pick the right time and place to bring this up. And you can also let technology be your friend when it comes to sharing fantasies. There are some great apps out there that, you know, you can take a survey and you can link your accounts and then it only shows you the things where you're a match. And so if your partner really isn't in a cuck holding or they're not into something else, you don't even have to bring it up because maybe you know they're just not going to be into it. I love that. I mean, we talk about that all the time of, like, ways to get around the face-to-face. I mean, you know, couples should be able to communicate face-to-face. Ideally.

The texting, you know, even like, I had this dream, like, you blame it on your subconscious, you know, and just kind of to ease your way into those harder conversations. And you're right. We've talked about this with also with the Dominatrix on our show about how, like, you don't start like the top level of the dirty and stuff. Like, you know, I had asked my boyfriend at the time, like, we were going to interview that Dominatrix. And I was like, do you want me to, like, tie you up? pre-ended that and he was like no and then we talked to her about like just blindfolding and so I went home and did that it was like so sexy yes as I often like to say it's baby steps the whips and janes right totally you say that was such like a like a sweet smile on your face

what's yeah I'm just wondering what's the what is the baby step to the to the cucking I mean so so the public plays or like maybe go to a bar and floor with somebody else in front of your man exactly so there are lots of ways you can kind of ease into it so you can go out to a bar and watch your partner flirt with somebody. And if you get an extreme jealous reaction to that, like, you probably don't want to proceed down that route any further. But if you're like, oh, this is kind of arousing, then you can sort of progressively take it to the next step. Do you want that? It hasn't come up. No. I have some friends that like it. I have a friend. No one flirts with your boyfriend. I want to be with somebody. The person that I dated before this

last boyfriend was very large and everybody would look at him when he would walk into a room. He had like full tattoo sleeves. Like I remember like the waitress was like, I fucking am and I was just like, I kind of liked it. It turned me on that like people were like turned on by the person that I was with because exactly like you said, I was like, I get to go home and fuck this.

I don't know that I like it in practice. I don't know that I want to sit back and watch a girl flirt with my boyfriend. I think it would make me want to claw eyes out. I mean, I think it is like so many women's fantasy though to know that all these other women want your man and you get to go home with him. Like it just, he's got to play it right.

because I feel like I do want it. I feel like I want to watch it. I feel like I want to sit there and like have a drink and like watch all these girls try to get up on my man. But I feel like there's a line of like, why did he look at her like that? And I'm like, is he telling her that joke? Like I feel like I'm like, what are they talking about? I know.

I feel like there's this line. Because I just, I think it's really, it is sexy like you said. Like the waitress is I fucking him and that's and he just has like what just wants to be with you. I think a lot of people probably are super into that. Yeah. Can I tell you my favorite cuckolding fantasy that I've heard? Yeah.

Okay, so I did this study on gay men's cuck-holding fantasies. It was a collaboration with Dan Savage and Dr. David Lay a couple of years ago, and we published our results in an academic journal. And we asked gay men to describe, like, they're cuckolding scenarios that they fantasized about. And so this one guy was talking about how his ideal cuckolding scenario is his partner brings this guy home, and he has to wait on them, hand-in-foot,

like serve them food and drinks and all the stuff. And then they retire to the bedroom. And he sits in the next room and drinks beer and eats cream-filled donuts while he's listening to his partner have sex with someone else. And also while they call him names from the other side of the wall. Oh, like really humiliating stuff. So I'm like, that's very specific. But I like the donut, the cream-filled donut touch. Yeah, I like the cream-filled.

You have to stay on brand. He's eating donuts and drinking beer. He has a cop fantasy. That's what he has a fantasy. Yeah. Are there any other, and we are going to be on it's about it. other subsides fantasies, but is there any other, like, really prominent fantasy that people are like, well, I mean, I think that like, pegging is something that people are like, is my boyfriend

gay? It's like, no. But is there, I mean, we can talk about pegging or any other, like, really prominent fantasies that you feel like people want to explain. Yeah. I mean, when I looked at more than 4,000 people's sexual fantasies, I found there were really seven broad themes that emerged. So the multi-partner sex was the biggest one.

Then there's the kink, BDSM, rough sex kind of stuff. And, you know, pegging sometimes goes in that BDSM. category because it's sometimes about dominant submission. Another big category is just doing something that's new and different and thrilling and exciting, like having sex in public, you know, or where there's that risk of being caught. Then there's like just doing all the taboo stuff, like anything you're not supposed to do. So that could be, it could be, could be having sex in a church, could be, you know, anything that's... He was like, church. Oh, I thought stepmom porn. Well, yeah. And the incest fantasies or the focessed fantasies.

Those are pretty big. Then there's the non-monogamy fantasies like swinging and cuck-holding. Then there are the gender bending and homo eroticism fantasies where it's like you're just sort of exploring the boundaries of your sexual orientation and your gender identity. And then lastly, there's like the passion and romance stuff. Like what you were talking about a little earlier that, you know, it's like, I just want to feel loved and intimate. So it's like these are all popular fantasies that most people have had at one point or another. It's interesting that you say love and romance. I used to like sometimes when I had this boyfriend that cheated on me a lot.

We were together for about a year, my first boyfriend in New York. And like something I would masturbate to like not all the time, but like I thought it was really weird. We would like go out to dinner and he just like would hold my hand and we'd like make out of the table. And I like I would masturbate to like how romantic that was. And I think that there is a part of me that was like I don't trust this person. I feel like they're treating me really poorly. And those were the moments where I felt like I was being treated really well. So I masturbated to that.

You know, since you mentioned that he cheated on you, this is something I've heard from a lot of people with cuckholding fantasies is that their interest in it did not arise until their partner had cheated on them and they found out. And so they somehow eroticized this trauma that they had endured. And then it became appealing for them to know that their partner was sleeping with other people. Well, that feels normal to me. Because now you're in control of the cheating. I was just going to say, is it the control thing? Because you're like, if you're going to do it, can I watch? I don't know.

But eroticize the trauma. That's interesting. It happens. Huh. Okay. And can we just talk about pegging for like one second? Oh, yeah. So like why would, I mean, I feel like I have a good handle on it, but can you explain? Why would a heterosexual man want his heterosexual female partner to peg him?

So there can be a couple of reasons and it can be different for different people. Part of it is, you know, the prostate play. Like, anal penetration can be very sexually pleasurable. Just purely the sensation. Yeah. So some guys get, they really get off. on prostate stimulation and they often have more intense, more powerful orgasms than they otherwise do. And some people have orgasms just from prostate stimulation alone, like no penile stimulation

whatsoever. So the act of it itself can be really pleasing to some people, but it can also be about sort of flipping the script and the dynamic in the bedroom, like switching sexual roles or just sort of, for some people, it's just doing something taboo. Like you're not supposed to put things up her butt, whatever. You know, a lot of straight guys think that. And so it's, to sort of that transgression that is appealing to them. Okay. I actually wrote an article on pegging for Playboy a couple of years ago. It was like the peak of pegging or something.

Just how it's like, you see it everywhere these days. Totally. I wonder is there a connection between people that this whole like doing things you're not supposed to and people that maybe grew up with a lot of rules and rigidity and just like it's more, it's rebellious? Yeah. I mean, so it's also got me thinking about the difference. in people's fantasies based on their

political beliefs. So I see differences between Republicans and Democrats. Break it down, hit us. Okay. Oh my God, I'm so excited. Okay. So, I wrote an article about this for Politico a while ago. And I love that it made it

into Stephen Colbert's monologue. What? I'm out at the bar like some Saturday night. My mom calls me. She's like, they're talking about your sex research on the Colbert show. Oh, my God. Okay. I'm on the edge of my seat. All right. So the thing that I find that Democrats fantasize about more than Republicans is BDSM. I'm so obsessed with this conversation. That's the title, what Democrats fantasize about. Oh, man. Okay.

So the Democrats are more into power play. And my thought process on that is that, you know, on the political left, you're told to believe in the idea of an equal playing field. You know, everybody's equal. You're not supposed to, you know, put people in positions where somebody has power over. them and you know we talk a lot about the importance of equality and so forth and so I think that playing with power in the bedroom becomes this taboo thing right so you're told not to do that and then that's transferring over into your bedroom where you're eroticizing it in a way now on the right um I don't want to know what they're into pee on them they have more taboo fantasies they have more fantasies about cuck holding more fantasies about swinging uh going to strip clubs like I don't know, there's just all kinds of things that they're told they're not supposed to do, and then they fantasize more about them. So I think since you mentioned, you know,

people who have more restrictions placed on them, people on the political right have way more restrictions placed on their sexuality because they're told you should only have a heterosexual monogamous marriage and put penises and vaginas and save it till you're married and do it for the purpose of having babies, right? So when you grow up with that sort of very restrictive lens, almost everything is taboo. And so I find it's great. attraction to all kinds of things amongst Republicans. That makes total sense to me. I mean, it's like people in Europe, they get to drink at an earlier age.

They produce less alcoholics than Americans, you know? Oh, yeah. It's so much more taboo here. That makes a lot of sense. What is socialists into? What do liberals like? Democrats are liberals? Libertarian.

Libertarian. What is the Green Party? I have those data. I haven't analyzed it, but I could look. Next time. I'll tell you what the green party's into. I'm independent. Okay, so a lot of your research, if we can like just take a laugh,

has focused on Friends of Benefits. You said that you wanted to talk about it today. And I like it from a more clinical position of like, can it exist? Can we truly have casual sex and enjoy it? Can both, can any gender have casual sex and enjoy it? Yeah, earlier I was setting up the cameras and you said, I've been studying friends with benefits for years.

And I was like, what? Yeah. I'm so intrigued. It's funny to like be a thing to study. I love it. He's like, I've been talking all my friends for years. That's my research.

So what got me into it and actually friends with benefits, that was my very first sex study that I ever did. And the reason I did it was because I was teaching these college level human sexuality courses. And I would get all these questions from students about how do you make friends with benefits work? And I'm not somebody who likes to. give sex advice without having data to back it up. Like, I want to know, like, what does the research actually say? And there was no research on friends with benefits. So my first- You're such a pioneer. The pioneer of friends with benefits. So my first study was just sort of,

what do people want out of these situations in the first place? And I find that there's a pretty big gender difference where men are more likely to hope that it just stays the same over time. Like, it's this open-ended opportunity for casual sex, whereas women are more likely to hope that it changes form and that they either go back to being just friends at some point or they become romantic partners. So you've got this disconnect, this mismatch. And so later I did a one year longitudinal study of friends with benefits to see how does this work out. What did people want at the beginning and how did that match up with what they actually got? And I found that, you know, after a year, most friends with benefits weren't still together as FWBBs.

We're still benefiting from the, yeah, friendship. So, you know, it was split into, you know, roughly quarters or so where, you know, some were still friends with benefits. Some went back to being just friends. Some became romantic partners. And then some were frenemies or whatever you want to call it, like no relationship whatsoever. But the people who wanted it to become romantic were the least likely to get what they wanted out of that situation and for things to go poorly. And so I think it just really points to the importance of you kind of have matching expectations going in and a heck of a lot of communication because we found that communication at the beginning about your balance. boundaries and what this is is the biggest predictor of how things turn out in the end. And the other

big predictor is having a good friendship to start. So you actually have to have the friends in order for the benefits to really work out. So do you see it as like a lot of people ask us over the years, you know, can I turn my fuck buddy into a real, a real relationship? My friend with benefit. And do you? Those feel different to a fuck buddy. I think friends of benefits is different than a fuck buddy. A fuck buddy is like we're not friends. Yeah, that's true. Okay. So all right. So we'll stick with friends and benefits for now since you've been spending for years. He was a pioneer. Do you think in one person's mind, like the dynamic shifts of like, I don't respect this person

anymore. I can see them naked. I can penetrate them. I don't look at them as like a respectable, quote unquote, partner anymore. So like they're going to stay in the friend bucket and that's it. I mean, it could be. Which is fucking stupid, by the way. It is stupid.

But, you know, different people have very. different experiences with these types of relationships. And you know, you ask, like, can you turn it into a romantic relationship? I mean, you could potentially, according to my data, that's a pretty rare thing. So I'd say if you really want a romantic relationship, fucking look for love. Like, don't like try to turn something that is a casual sexual relationship into a romance unless that's what both people actually want. You know, it's like sticking a square peg in a round hole.

Like, don't do that unless it's a sex toy. But, you know, it's like... Yeah, then it works. Yeah. I mean, I do really think just generally speaking, especially just as a woman, I think women do this because they have a crush on their friend. You know, not always,

but I think a lot of it is maybe you're lying to yourself a little bit, but you really want to date your friend. You know, so I guess it's a... I guess there's a matter of like, I just want to get laid, but then that is more of a fuck buddy situation because I hold my friends, I regard my friends so highly.

I don't want to fuck a friendship up. So one of my close guy friends, I mean, if I was thinking I'd want to fuck them, I'd want to date them. They're my friend and I want to fuck them. Like, I'm in love with that person, probably. So tell them how you feel and hopefully they'll respond in a kind manner if they don't feel the same. And then I think you leave it at that.

Because I think it gets really muddy if you're like, maybe I can trick him into my brother's better of it. You know what I mean? Deception is always the foundation for a successful relationship. I think there's probably just a lot. On both sides, I'm just generally speaking more from women, maybe a little bit of lying to yourself that this could work out and hoping they'll fall in love with you.

And I think a lot of people lead each other on in these situations trying to get what it is that they ultimately want. And that's just where they go wrong. Yeah. Because I'm thinking of somebody that I used to date and I could so easily have casual sex with him and I think it'd be fine. But I would just call that a fuck buddy.

I wouldn't. I don't think about it. have a real friendship with him. You know what I mean? Yeah. Because I think fuck buddies probably works out better. You know, you hear Shambouty say all the time. She married a fuck buddy.

Like, I just think that, to me, that feels like there isn't this relationship there. There isn't a friendship. Those two seem separate to me. Well, I mean, scientifically, there's like five different kinds of casual sex. Right. You can find in the literature. So you've got the friends with benefits. You've got the fuck buddies.

You've got the booty calls. You've got the one night stands. And then there's something else that's escaping. But you've got... Well, I'm just talking about the casual sex. The flavors of casual sex. What are the Republicans like? It's escaping me.

Is it paid? Is it like prostitutes and sex workers? I'm blanking on what the other term is. But basically, yes, people do define these things differently. And they all vary in terms of like, how much emotional connection do you have this other person? And what do you really want out of this? And how frequently do people do people... people interact. Is it monogamous or non-monogamous? I love that. And the other level is even

just like booty call. Like I used to have a booty call in Atlanta. It was just this like law student that Emory and I would, you know, hit him up at 2 a.m. And he would just come over. He's the first guy that ever ate my ass. And it was just such a great setup. And then in the morning, I'd be like, I had a guy friend that I did have a crush on. He called me one morning. He was like, hey, do you want to go on a hike? And I was like, you got to go. You have to leave. He was like, fumbling and getting into shoes. I was like, I'm about to go on a hike. somebody I really like. You kind of get out.

He was like moving slow. That is so funny. My guy kind of called me. I was like crouched down. I was like, what time do you want to go? Like, I was like, get your loafers and get the fuck out. That's so funny. You just like, don't respect him on them.

You don't have to. Like I think he wanted to go eat because we'd eaten before like the last time. We had eaten before. I think for me like it's very hard. And maybe not everybody's like this, but when somebody is in a bucket. it's hard for me to take them out, put another bucket. It's why I'm probably never going to be friends with an ex because we were only romantic partners.

We were not friends before. I don't know you in that dynamic. And it's hard for me, like when I'm friends with somebody, like if I have sex with you, like it's hard for me to shift back to that dynamic. Like it's just, it's hard for me to start in one dynamic and go to another one. And I'm assuming it's probably hard for people

in that friends of benefits thing to be like, who we're friends, but now we're fuck buddies and now we're going to be in a romantic relationship. And like you said, a lot of times it probably is that you are sort of in up with the person. Because if I want to sleep with my friend, I'm probably sort of in love with you. A good friend of mine.

What else is there? We're good friends. We have, like that's a relationship. Like, I can't jump buckets. I guess is what I'm saying easily. It's hard for me to like jump buckets. And I understand, like, a lot of people do kind of approach relationships like that, but there's lots of people where casual sex is

this continuum. It's a scale of casualness that starts with the one night stand. And then you can become booty calls or fuck buddies or friends with benefits or romantic partners at the other end. You can slide back and forth on this. Some people just have an easier time sliding. Jumping buckets. I mean, I think it's probably that both people are on the exact same page. Like, everything just falls apart when the other person picks up on the different intentions, expectations. And I think it depends too on sort of the connection that people see between sex and love

because not everybody sees that the same way. Some people have a much easier time disentangling those things. And for other people, they're like very intimately intertwined. And so, knowing what we call your sociosexual orientation, I think is really important for how you approach sex and figuring out maybe whether casual sex is right for you, whether an open relationship is right for you. It's all about knowing yourself. And like experimenting, figuring it out over time. No one has it all figured out. I think you should date a lot and try different things. That is the only way you're going to know what works for you. Yeah. Do you guys hear us don't marry. Some of you met in college, I'm here 23. be a Democrat I'm kidding

and then don't change that we did an episode a couple years ago called you do fuck your friends and I talked about how a best friend of mine currently like him and I started sleeping out sleeping together and I felt like I was really in love with him and he did not feel the same he really really wanted to be

close friends he loves me very much as a friend and he was just like I'm not looking to date I don't want to be in a relationship with you or anybody else whatever and I appreciate the honesty but it took me like probably a full year to come back from that, to be able to, like, listen to him, talk about other girls, to be, like, able to even hear, like, I'm going on a date, like, that was very, very difficult. So, you know, I would just ask anybody, like, that is thinking, should I fuck my friend? Like,

are you ready to lose this relationship, like, this friendship? Or are you ready to put in the maybe year of work it'll take to get it back? Because not everybody has my experience, but it was really, really hard. And, like, we're fine now, but it's been six years. Yeah. Yeah. I have a good friend that we had sex when we first met. Like, we started as like we should fuck. And then now we're close friends like because we weren't, but we weren't friends before. So you see relationships like that and then you get to joke

about it forever. You're like, remember my fuck? That was so weird. Yeah, I love joking about fucking him now. Yeah, you do. This is where things can be really different across gender and sexual orientation. So for example, if you look at gay men, like they tend to have pretty positive experiences with friends with benefits. And, you know, there's not necessarily that

expectation of anything more beyond that. So if you take same gender people, they're more likely to be on the same page about their expectations. And so it tends to work out a little bit better. But when it's between men and women, it's a different story. I actually like just like to touch on this in the male gay community. Why is it so just open? And what are the reasons? Why is casual sex? Yeah. And like it seems like there's less jealousy. Maybe less ego. I mean, is that accurate? I mean, it just seems like everybody knows this is a big generalization. But, you know, it appears in a lot of

communities, everybody kind of knows everybody's fucking each other, a lot of openness, things like that. Can we discuss this? Sure. So men on average across orientations are more interested in casual sex than women. Now, I think there's an interesting question to be raised about why are women less interested in casual sex? And if you look at some of the research that I've done and some of the research that Dr. Terry Conley has done, where we look at, you know, what are women's attitudes toward threesomes and casual sex? Well, women are thinking differently about these things. They're more likely to think about potential risks to their safety, potential health effects, like unintended pregnancy, risk of sexual violence. If it's somebody that you don't know,

like, what's going to happen? So, you know, men and women are just thinking very differently about casual sex. And so if you give women, like, the optimal circumstances, like, you can have casual sex with the celebrity of your choice and, like, whatever. So if it's their optimal circumstances, women are just as interested in men. Right. If it's who they want to be with, and they think their pleasure is going to be taken seriously and they feel safe. So that's just where the gender difference sort of comes from. So for gay men and straight men,

they're just as interested in casual sex. It's just easier for gay men to find other partners because within that community, like most people are kind of on the same page about it. So it's just sort of the pool in which they're dating where it makes it easier. It just seems a lot more accepted and people care less that this person slept with your friend,

you know, where women, might be a little bit more like, I don't want to, you know, that guy fuck my best friend. I don't want to, you know what I mean? And it just seems like in the gay community. It's like, we don't care. Yeah, I mean, and there is less concern and the way casual sex is viewed is very differently in the gay community.

But it's interesting, like I see in the gay community, it's very easy to find sex, to have a lot of sex. Very difficult to find relationships long term, like committed relationship to somebody. And so it's just funny when different people look at different community. are like, oh, that openness to casual sex sounds great, but that goes along with, it's harder to find a romantic relationship. And most gay men that I talk to say they want a romantic relationship.

They just can't find it. What about lesbians? Is it the opposite? Is it all relationships? It's not casual sex. You know, the casual sex does happen with lesbians. I found out from a student presentation a while ago, there are lesbian bathhouses that exist.

That kind of like blew my mind because we tend to only think about bathhouse. for gay men. And I'm like, so that led me down this rabbit hole of casual sex among lesbians. And, you know, yes, it does exist. It does happen. And if you compare men and women of different orientations, like lesbian women, much more into casual sex than heterosexual women. Okay. I think it's because it's with another woman, right? Take the safety and the pregnancy, like all that stuff out of it. I mean, that's just, I love that you talked about that because there's too much going on in our head. Like,

even like when we were in Mexico and I was like kind of the opportunity to fuck this guy, I was like, I don't know. What if he slept with other people today? You know what I mean? I don't know him. Like, I wasn't really scared, but there's too much to worry about sometimes. Like, it doesn't feel as freeing. And like you said, you're right.

Like, how do I even know if this is going to be good? So had it been like, this somebody came down from the heavens, it was like, Ashley, you're the only person he's going to sleep with today. It's going to be great. You're going to have an orgasm. I would have been like, come over. But you get to when you're heading, there's too many roadblocks. and you're like, fuck it.

There's angels talking to you and you're a retirement of Cancun. You know what I mean? Like I just, I think that's an important thing to bring up. Like it's not that we don't want it, but it's like there's too many other factors, like potential fear, risk.

And then are they even going to care about my pleasure? It's going to be good. Casual sex is not that realistic for me anymore. I think I used to be more, I would gravitate towards it more because I also knew less about my own body and what I enjoy and what's going to make me get off, what's going to make me feel like,

quote unquote, safe and comfortable. And so casual sex is not so natural to me because when I think about the best sexual experiences in my life, there was somebody that I feel comfortable with, which is usually somebody that I care about, not somebody a long-term boyfriend, but somebody I care about a little bit that I feel comfortable naked in front of. I can relax. And I'm going to probably have feelings for that person a little bit. And to me to just totally disconnect from you emotionally, it's hard for me to connect with you sexually.

And I had that with somebody I was sleeping with during COVID. It was my neighbor and you would come down and we'd have sex. And it just wasn't good because I didn't feel like I was emotionally connecting. to him in any way, so I didn't enjoy the sex. So casual sex is probably not super realistic for me at this point in my life. I'll do it. Well, and if you look at the research on women in casual sex, women are much more likely to have an orgasm, the more hookups they have with a given casual partner. If it's a one-time thing, the vast majority of women are not coming, right? And that feeds into like, is this going to be good? Is it going to be worth it? Is it worth

all of the potential risks to my reputation, to my health, all of these other things for something that might not be pleasurable. You just like nailed my exact way of thinking. Is this a risk to my reputation of my health for something that I might not be good? 100%. Do I need another person who's seen me naked to hear me come, to watch me? And this is where we need like Yelp for casual sex. Like verified ratings from people like, is this a good partner? Is this going to be worth it? But you're a good partner. It's not next to my good partner, you know?

Just because somebody, like, fucked you really well, doesn't that mean I'm going to enjoy fucking that. Well, I mean, I still think I could, I still think I'd like a review or two. Like, I still think at least a woman could be like, he's, he did this, he's good at this, he spanks good. Like, you know what I mean? Like, I think, yes, Rada, I agree with you, but some details from another woman would be helpful because I think women can be like, girl, no.

He's selfish. Does not know what he's doing. He's not passionate. He was rubbing my taint. He thought it was my clip. You know, like stuff like that. Like we're, I think we could get a picture. Yeah.

A review is not going to guarantee a great experience. But it'll at least give you useful information so you can like weed out. 100%. Yeah. Let's get this going. There was way back in the day there was that app. Lulu ranking guys dating. Maybe that people would have sexual details in there.

But that was like hot for a minute. Did you ever get on that? No. I love this idea. If there's a database. It was crazy. And my guy friends were asking me, like, can you find me on Lulu? I think it's called Lulu.

Can you find me on there and tell me what people were saying? Yeah, but like also, it got a little defamatory. Like, people can just lie. Like, what if you broke up with somebody? It can be like revengeful. Yeah. That's, I feel like I would, if somebody does be really bad to me, I would write on that website about them. He's got a tiny dig and you can't find the glid.

Right. All right, guys, we'll look out for our app or yell for sex launching soon. And Justin, this was so great. We loved, like, unpacking all these fantasies. and I'm sure people want to find your writing and your website, everything you've done, your podcast to tell people where they can find everything you do. The political article is specifically in the Colbert piece.

So I run the Sex and Psychology blog and podcast. You can find it at Sexand Psychology.com. You can also find links to my books and all my social media accounts. I'm on Twitter at Justin Laymiller and Instagram at Justin J. Laymiller. And if you want to watch a fun clip about the Republicans and Democrat sexual fantasies, if you search for Colbert Republican sexual fantasies or something, you'll find it on YouTube. It is well worth a watch.

Oh, we'll post it. Yeah, I can't like to watch this. Well, thank you so much. This has been really great. We appreciate all your time. Yes. Thank you so much. And guys, you know where to find us.

Girls Gotta Eat Podcast.com for tickets, merchandise, sign up for the newsletter. Girls Got Eat Podcast on Instagram. I am Ash Hess on Instagram and TikTok. Grain is Raina.com. GirlS. underscore got eat on Twitter and YouTube.com slash girls got to eat. And we'll see next week. How we go week, guys. Bye.