Going West: True Crime - Katy Benoit // 232

Episode Date: September 3, 2022

In 2011, a 22-year-old graduate student in Idaho was baking cookies with friends when she stepped out for a cigarette and was murdered on her porch. Police would soon uncover that an obsessed professor who referred to himself as a “psychopathic killer” had been behind it all. This is the story of Katy Benoit. BONUS EPISODES patreon.com/goingwestpodcast CASE SOURCES 1. Spokesman: https://www.spokesman.com/stories/2021/aug/22/we-dont-shy-away-from-it-university-of-idaho-hon 2. NBC: https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna44264056 3. LA Times: https://www.latimes.com/archives/blogs/nation-now/story/2011-10-27/idaho-professor-who-killed-student-secret-records-revealed 4. Caring Hearts: https://www.caringheartsandhandsofhope.org/pdf/Katy-Benoit-Life-Skills-Dedication.pdfor/ 5. 911 Call: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MEUQQ5c6peg 6. Ernesto's Obituary: http://www.tributes.com/condolences/view_memories/92218602?p=10&start_index=1# 7. D News: https://dnews.com/local/family-friends-at-boise-service-say-katy-benoit-pursued-her-life-with-passion/article_353caaa3-a236-54e4-83dd-50abdfc39fb3.html 8. NPR: https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=141740113 9. Katy's Obituary: https://lmtribune.com/obituaries/kathryn-katy-m-benoit-22-moscow/article_78b24e7c-a5b5-5339-a08e-052524d90b9c.html 10. The Times-News: https://www.newspapers.com/image/legacy/523599834/?terms=katy%20benoit&match=1 11. Idaho Press: https://www.idahopress.com/community/community_columns/we-need-that-house---it-s-critical/article_00a906dd-6fdf-57b1-8e1f-8781a11d0cc1.html Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What is going on to crime fans? I'm your host Tee. And I'm your host Daphne. And you're listening to Going West. Thank you. Thank you everybody for tuning in to get another episode of Going West. Hope you're all having a fabulous week. Today's case was recommended by the victims, very own sorority sister named Courtney. So thank you so much Courtney for sharing her story with us and we're so sorry for your loss. I hadn't heard about this story before at all and it doesn't seem like there's much coverage on it, but it's a really, really crazy story. Yeah, I mean, we lived in it's a really, really crazy story.

Yeah, I mean, we lived in Idaho for a very short period of time we lived in Boise, so naturally we did look up other cases in Idaho, but we never came across this case. So again, thank you so much Courtney. Yes, and it's not an old case. This happened like a little over 10 years ago, so let's get into the details here today. All right, guys, this is episode 232 of Going West, so let's get into it. 1 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 個 In August of 2011, a 22-year-old graduate student in Idaho was baking cookies with friends when she stepped

out for a cigarette and was killed on her porch. Police would soon uncover that an obsessed professor who allegedly had multiple personalities and referred to himself as a psychopathic killer was the one behind it all. This is the story of Katie Benoy. I want to preface this episode by saying that the French way to pronounce Katie's last name is Benoit, but the three news clippings that we did see on her case, they pronounced it Benoit. So I don't know if Katie's family pronounced it Benoit or Benoit, but we're just going to say Benoit because that's what these newscasters said.

So maybe they have information that we don't. I just wanted to preface that in case anyone's like, why you saying it like that? Yeah, definitely. So anyway, Catherine Benoit, who went by Katie, was born on April 24, 1989, to Janet and Gary Benoit, and had a brother named Andy. The Benoit lived in Boise, the beautiful capital city of Idaho, surrounded by lush forests, mountains, buttes, and divided by the Boise River. According to her parents, her love of music began in preschool, and by age five, she was

taking piano and fiddle lessons. And when she was just nine years old, she competed in placed 5th in a national fiddle contest, so she was very good at playing the fiddle. Then at age 11, she set her sights on a different instrument, the cello, which is an instrument that she would play for the rest of her life. In addition to her musical endeavors, Katie competed in soccer and on her school ski team and also participated in Girl Scouts as well as 4-H for those who don't know what 4-H is.

It's like a positive youth development and mentoring organization. Yeah, and I know I said this last time we talked about 4-H, but I think it has something to do with like animals and agriculture. I just read it's like very positivity focus. I didn't know what a 4-H was, but we have talked about it. You're right. That's just what I remember from my school. Right, I see. So ultimately, despite Katie's love for various sports,

her biggest passion was music. She played with the Boycey High Chamber Orchestra, even touring Europe with them, the summer before her junior year of high school. She performed with her family members as a beautiful senior recital upon her graduation. So she played music like her entire school career. And she was honored with bronze, silver, and gold Congressional awards, which recognizes achievement in public service among young Americans. So while we didn't find it mentioned anywhere else, her obituary writes that she was survived by a son who's being raised by two loving parents.

So it seems that, you know, at some point she had given birth to a child and then possibly gave him up for adoption. And Katie's parents addressed the baby and his adoptive parents very fondly. Katie attended Boise High School, as we just mentioned, and graduated in 2007. And then she spent a semester at local Boise State University, the Broncos, before transferring to the University of Idaho and Moscow in Moscow, Idaho. I just thought it was so weird. Every time I see that, I just want to say Moscow. But it's Moscow, I guess.

It is. So, and Moscow is a five and a half hour drive north of Boise. That sits right on the Washington border, whereas Boise is parallel with the state of Oregon. So she's still not too far from home, but not in her hometown No more. Right, but still in her home state. So although she still loved music, Katie became fascinated with the study and practice of psychology and decided to devote her career to the pursuit of personal growth

and herself and also for others. Now according to our obituary, she quote, had an amazing gift for connecting with people. Katie was innately kind, smart, and fun. She had a passion for learning about others and bringing out the best in herself and those close to her. She always relished her spiritual journey, but she reportedly had a lighter side as well. Friends and family remember her being prone to bursts of dancing anytime and anywhere, in her fondness for Thai food

and Mexican food, the spicier, the better. She also loved to travel and even studied abroad in Spain. A childhood friend who played cello with Katie, Abby Lute, said that she had a penchant for making friends. She said, quote, she wasn't afraid to cross lines and to connect with people. Katie was also a proud member of the Alpha Gamma Delta Sorority and was fond of Greek life. One of Katie's first cello teachers, Bill Wharton, said quote, Katie was like a bright light. Whenever she came into the room, she sparkled. Katie was like a bright light. Whenever she came into the room, she sparkled. Now, after graduating with a bachelor's degree in psychology and a minor in music in December of 2010, she started her graduate school journey also at the University of Idaho in Moscow. So she was

staying at the same school for graduate school, which I'm sure was very convenient. Yeah, and a lot of people do that as well. Yeah, I mean, she knew it. Why not just keep going there, right? So in August of 2011, she was elated to be stepping into her new role as a teachers assistant for undergraduate classes in social psychology and developmental psychology.

So she was gonna be an assistant professor. But sadly, an angry ex-boyfriend had other plans for her. In the fall of 2010, so a year before she's starting graduate school, as she wrapped up the last semester of her senior year, Katie took a class instructed by a 31-year-old assistant professor named Ernesto Bustamonte. Now apparently there is a prominent Peruvian scientist, whose name is Alsto or also Ernesto Bustamonte. So we just wanna put it out there,

there's no relation between the two in case you're thinking of the other guy. Yeah, and reading that, I had heard of that name before, but I was like, who the hell is that? Different man. Different guy altogether. Now let's talk about this Ernesto Bustamonte. So Ernesto Alfredo Bustamonte was born on Old Dominion University in Norfolk, Virginia,

graduating summa cum laude, meaning that he was in the 95th percentile or above. After acquiring his Bachelor of Science degree in Psychology, he temporarily moved out of the US and back to Venezuela for a position as a research assistant with the Center for Psychological Research at the University of the Andes in Columbia. And then after spending a few years there, he moved back to the United States to pursue his doctorate. At the age of 27, he obtained a PhD, again from the Old Dominion University, before being

hired as an assistant professor at the University of Idaho in Moscow. Now in October of 2002, back home in Venezuela, he married a woman that he met in college named Xiaomi Leon, but the two were later divorced. So yeah, that marriage didn't last too long at all. And while his family, friends, and colleagues all spoke highly of him, he had a dark side that not many people knew about. A dark side that Katie was about to see. Now, one student called him a dedicated instructor, but also classified him as intense

and odd. During his time at the University of Idaho, at least three female students lodged complaints about him due to his flirtatious behavior and favoritism. Meanwhile, other students filed complaints about his erratic behavior. So this is not a good sign. I mean if there's multiple young women filing complaints about him, you know, coming off, you know, sexually towards them. He's 31 years old, so he's not too far away from them, but at the same time, it's like you are the teacher here.

Yeah, yeah. There's a boundary here that you're not supposed to cross. There has to be some sort of boundary there in this scenario. Right, and so, but then also with other students saying, it's not even that he's acting, you know, sexually towards them, but erratically, which is a bad sign as well, and not something you want to see in a teacher. Yeah, and I'm definitely curious, like, what led them to say that he was acting erratically,

like, what is their description of that, you know what I mean? Totally. Well, what we do know is that when he was hired in 2007 Ernesto himself admitted that he struggled with bipolar disorder, but that he was taking medication and had it under control, so it was a kind of a non-issue. But at the end of Katie's fall semester in 2010, so still about a year before she's going to start graduate school, Ernesto and Katie entered an intimate relationship. Few details have been made public about how the two started this relationship, but friends remember it being tumultuous. According to her roommates,

Ketie had called things off romantically with Ernesto in March of 2011, so after a handful of months of dating. But things turned especially sour just a couple months later in June of 2011. And Katie was starting to feel threatened by him. Her roommates told her that they were scared of him as well. So it wasn't even a secret that this guy was bad news. And you know, Katie and her friends were all just really creeped out by him. Yeah, they were in a grance that he was a weird guy. Right, which is why Katie, you know, did what she did and she cut ties with him in March. But on June 10, 2011, Katie met with the University of Idaho to officially lodge a complaint

against Ernesto Bustamonte on top of all the other complaints that already existed from other students. The faculty discussed precautions that they could take to keep her safe and instructed that she report him to the Moscow Police Department. Two days later, she filed a formal sexual harassment complaint with the university,

and she claimed that Ernesto had threatened her with a gun on three separate occasions. In January of 2011, around the time of her spring break in 2011 and then as recently as May. On June 13, she emailed the university to notify them that she had filed a police report, so just three days after the university had advised her to, and that she would like them to hold off on lodging their official complaint against him, although she didn't indicate why. After two weeks of not hearing back from Katie, the University of Idaho reached out again following up, and she apologized for losing touch, citing that she had been out of town.

So on July 6, 2011, Ernesto was officially ordered by the University of Idaho to stop all communication with Katie. And obviously, it worked for a university, but it's pretty disturbing that multiple students had filed complaints about this guy for sexual and behavioral reasons yet he remained employed at the university i was just about to say that like fire this fucking guy well right and at this point the university is just like ordering urnesto to stay away from katey but he's allowed to remain employed as an assistant professor where he can

wrap harass other students yeah i mean obviously going back to all those other complaints against him like the university should have done more in that moment they should have fired him on the spot when those came in yeah i agree it's kind especially with kate that should have been the the cherry on top of the cake like okay

this has been happening and this guy hasn't been working for us that long so we should address this i do appreciate that they were at least taking precautions and saying, report this to the police, we're gonna do what we can to keep you safe, but they're definitely hesitating, just getting rid of him. But I mean, it's also not,

it also goes beyond the sexual harassment and things like that. I mean, he's threatening her with a gun. Yeah, like that's like, this is a dangerous person. Yes. So two days after the university ordered Ernesto to cut communication with Katie on July 8, 2011, Ernesto filed a counter complaint with the school,

claiming that Katie was making baseless allegations that would hurt his career. So everyone who filed a complaint is lying? Yeah, no. No, dude. Yeah, I think you're the one with the problem here. So the university then followed up with the Moscow Police Department themselves, asking that they complete a threat assessment on Ernesto to try to figure out how much danger he actually

posed to Katie and also other students. Or if this was just like a case that would simply fizzle out on its own. But again, there's other complaints. So why is there this like dramatic assessment that has to be done? I understand it's only fair to make sure that Katie is telling the truth, of course, which we know she was. So I get that an investigation should take place and I'm glad that they were doing that, but let's get that ball rolling. Yeah, definitely. So Moscow PD appealed to Katie directly, requesting that she stays somewhere

other than her apartment, but Katie again stopped responding. This may sound unreasonable now, but at the time of course, she didn't know the true threat of the situation that she was in. So the school informed the police department that Katie no longer wanted them involved,

and was probably scared at the potential magnitude of this issue once they launched their own investigation. During a review of his performance, determining whether or not he should be allowed to continue to teach at the University of Idaho, Ernesto admitted to having sexual relationships with Katie and other female students during his past four years as a professor there. But he furiously denied threatening Katie with weapons, accusing her of defamation of character.

While the university reviewed his case, they made sure to keep tabs on Katie, and she alerted them that she was planning on staying in Moscow for the whole summer, meaning she was going to stay in the area, she wasn't going to leave for the summer, and then of course she was going to continue staying there for graduate school. So she was not leaving at all. And affidavit with pertinent details was kept from the public because it was considered a personnel issue and therefore confidential. But when it was finally released on October 26, 2011, two months after Katie's death, it was revealed that Ernesto resigned via email on July 20, and that his employment officially

concluded on Friday, August 19, 2011, just three days before Katie's murder. On Monday, August 22, 2011, so just over a month after Ernesto resigned with the university, due to the action being taken from Katie's allegations, the university met with Katie to inform her that Ernesto's last even employment was the previous Friday, which again was August 19th. She returned home and had a long heart to heart with her parents, talking excitedly about her life and future. They told each other that they loved each other, and then hung up. Thrilled to put the whole ordeal behind her now that Ernesto had resigned, Katie and

her roommates decided to celebrate by baking cookies together. While they were in the oven, Katie stepped out on the back porch to smoke a cigarette. Then, at 8.40pm, shots rang out at their home at 112 South Lily Street and Moscow. Katie's roommates, Megan Walker-Smith and Emma Gregory rushed to the back porch to check on Katie and found her face down and bleeding profusely from her torso. Panicked and unsure what was really going on, they fled the house and called 911. In a disturbing 911 recording, you can hear one of Katie's roommates say shakily that she thinks that their roommate was shot. Quote, we were in the

house cooking and we heard shots and our roommate is outside covered in blood. According to the girls' accounts, there were, quote, lots of bullets. When asked by the dispatcher why they thought someone would shoot their roommate, the caller said, quote, she kind of had some things going on involving someone, to which the dispatcher responded, can you tell me who that someone was? Her roommate answered, Ernesto Bustamonte. That's the only person I know of. When the operator asked if he had been in the area, Katie's roommate said he just got asked to leave the university.

Because of her, the dispatcher asked? Yeah, they responded. Megan and Emma were also able to identify the car that Ernesto was driving, which was a dented 1990s Ford Mustang in a teal color. A neighbor of theirs named Lauren Hetzler told police that he heard what sounded like shots, and then saw a man fleeing the home dressed in a dark trench coat and a hat. 22-year-old Katie Benoit died on her porch after being shot 11 times in the stomach with a 45-calibre pistol. Thus, police began to hunt for their only

person of interest, 31-year-old Ernesto Bustamonte. The following day, which was Tuesday, August 23, 2011, the Moscow Police Department located Ernesto's car in the parking lot of a Moscow hotel. So his Ford Mustang was parked at the best Western plus university in, which was directly across the street from the University of Idaho. So he could not have been any closer to this situation.

I mean, she didn't live at the university, but you get what I mean. Just he didn't leave the area at all. So when police arrived at room 213, where he had been since an hour after he shot and killed Katie, they found Ernesto dead of a gunshot wound to the head. Along with his body, police recovered six guns and four different prescription medications, all prescribed to Ernesto himself to treat epilepsy, anxiety, depression, and bipolar disorder. A friend of Ernesto's named Raudi Hope was interviewed by police and revealed some more disturbing information about him.

While not diagnosed, Raudi said that Ernesto referred to himself as having multiple personality disorder, or disassociative identity disorder, which is a mental condition in which people can have more than one dominant personality. In addition to controlling their behaviors, people with this condition can have gaps in memory when one personality over rules another. Now, it's generally thought of as a trauma response in order to allow a person to, you know, like avoid memories of a traumatic or painful experience. But Ernesto called one of his alternate personalities his psychopathic killer and another he simply referred to as the beast.

So this is all coming from the front. Like he was open about believing he had this disorder and had names for some of them. Yeah, I mean, that's really crazy to, you know, I hate to use the word crazy, but to say that you had a personality that's a psychopathic killer. Yeah, that's, I mean, it's scary.

Very scary. So, and actually, five years after this happened, is when M. Knight Chomelon made the movie Split, which is about a man with this disorder who oddly enough, had a personality also referred to as the Beast, which is very interesting, though, apparently that movie is based on a different true story. But I also read that disassociative identity disorder

is sometimes misdiagnosed as schizophrenia, but Ernesto had not been diagnosed with either. Not that that means he didn't have either of them. So, it's just a terrifying and thought provoking sentiment from his friend Rowdy, like to have this information to say, oh yeah, he believed he had this and he had, you know, these personalities that he named. Tragically, because her murderer was now dead, Katie's family and friends never saw true justice for the loss of such a promising life. They would never truly know why he did it.

It was even reported in the aftermath that Ernesto had been actively pursuing another young female student at the time of Katie's murder. From his obituary and the kind words from his friends and family, you would never know how swiftly and carelessly he had taken the life of such an adored person. A statement made at a press conference about the murder, the University of Idaho president M. Dwayne Nellis, said quote, The University responded immediately and decisively to protect Katie and to remove

Bustamante from our community. We communicated and coordinated with Katie and the Moscow Police Department and counseled Katie repeatedly to seek protection and use violence protection resources available to her. We still, however, suffered an unthinkable tragedy. Since Katie's death, every person associated with the university has grappled with this tragedy. We are not over it.

We'll never be over it. And I am at least glad that they did take some of these steps but with the information that Ernesto was you know quite unhinged I don't know why they expected this obsession and just aggression towards Katie to just go away with him off campus I mean obviously the police were also involved and hindsight is 2020 but he clearly didn't think he did anything wrong as you know he called her claims baseless I think that's why he said baseless yeah and said that these apparent lies could ruin his career. So to think that he couldn't retaliate for her ruining his career it wasn't Katie's fault

but he thought it was because he wasn't taking responsibility for what he did wrong. Yeah yeah and there's two elements to this story that are so important. One is, you know, this rejection. He's being rejected by Katie, and that gives him no excuse to do what he did at all. I'm just stating that this, this is probably in his mind what he's thinking. Oh, absolutely. The rejection, but also the fact of like his career, like thinking about the fact that he's now lost a person that he cared for or what have you, I guess. But also lost his job. Right. So, and obviously he's not willing to take that responsibility because in his mind,

he didn't do anything wrong. Right. But just knowing that three days after he officially left the university, he took Katie's life and then his own life is really scary because this could have been foreseen, just knowing how he was, but how do you avoid that kind of thing? It's very, very hard, especially knowing that Katie was staying in the area that summer. It's very hard to avoid that. Yeah, maybe if she had left, but is she supposed to uproot her life for an unknown situation it's really really tough yeah so Ernesto's family issued a statement saying that their thoughts and prayers are with Katie's family and friends which the Benoit's responded to by saying quote we are deeply

grateful for all of the thoughts and prayers that Katie and her family have received we appreciate the condolences from the Bustamonte family and offer our condolences to the Bustamonte family as well. This is a difficult time for everyone. Her parents also said, quote, Katie was a beautiful, intelligent, and musically talented woman, and we are so saddened by her tragic death. Those are really nice responses from them. But despite the devastating loss of Katie Shortlife, she was able to affect so much positive change for those around her and made a lasting effect on campus.

Katie's death prompted the University of Idaho to re-examine how they navigated students, trapped, and abusive relationships, as well as making sure that there were always mental health and domestic violence resources available to any and all students who needed them, which is amazing. Yeah, I'm glad that they at least kind of saw that they maybe needed to make a bit of a change. And this is just the worst thing about life, I mean not the worst thing about life, but

you know what I mean? Like this is just a really shitty thing in general. Is that bad things have to happen sometimes for positive change to be made because it puts things into perspective. Yeah. So, also the campus enacted counseling and courses for how to pinpoint signs of abuse in friends and peers so that they may be able to spot the signals of domestic violence in others as well as manipulation that may lead to intimate partner violence in their own relationships.

The school dedicated September to Katie as well, dubbing it the Katie Benoit Campus Safety Awareness Month. So we are currently in that month. Yes, we are. There was also a safety fund established in her name to assist those who were unable to leave abusive relationships because of financial constraints. Katie has made an impact on those who knew her and even those who didn't.

Her brother said quote, They may not have known Katie, but she changed the UI campus for good. It's interesting because a lot of people who are here when it happened aren't anymore, and a lot of students here never met her, but are still affected by this and still want to show support. The teachers and faculty presiding at the time committed to remembering Katie and not allowing her death to be in vain. The vice president of the university said quote, Katie has not been forgotten. She's celebrated. We honor her passing and we are doing everything we can to learn from that experience and move forward and support our students everywhere we can.

At Katie's funeral, hundreds came out to show support for a beautiful life cut short. Old friends from childhood, new friends from school, classmates, teachers and faculty, mentors, and past cello teachers all came out to celebrate Katie and lift up her family. Her sorority sisters were all in attendance and, in a show of solidarity, many fraternity brothers from campus fraternities came as well. Her cello sat on display next to a picture of her, leaning down to smell a flower. Her brother Andy delivered a touching tribute to his beloved sister, cracking jokes as she would have done.

He said that Katie would have counseled her friends and family to move on, saying quote, guys, quit whining about things never being the same. Things were never going to be the same anyway. The universe is always changing. Do you really think one event can derail all of this? I don't feel like Katie's in my overall connection has changed that much. That connection is grander than anything on Earth. He remarked what a testament it was to her as a person that so many different people from so many different phases of her life showed up to honor his sister. During the newly minted Katie Benoit Campus Safety Awareness Month, the University of Idaho provides training, resources, and events for personal well-being and safety, such as

I got your back for suicide prevention and awareness, and the Green Dot Safety Program, which empowers bystanders to feel like they have the abilities to step in if they're witnessing an act of violence. On the 10-year anniversary of Katie's death, a memorial was held to honor her life and the lasting contribution she made to her school and her community. A marble bench was revealed and dedicated to her as well. It reads, in memory of Katie's journey, her care of others,

her willingness to speak up, and her courage to make a difference. At the Caring Heart High School in Kenya, two annual awards were initiated in Katie's honor, a full ride scholarship to reward academic achievement, and the Katie Benoit's Community Service Award for a student who has shown outstanding support to those around her. Can you born Dr. Vincent Kutuku, who is a motivational speaker, author, and business owner who now lives in Idaho,

founded the school for girls to give back to his community. According to the Idaho Press, where Vincent is a regular columnist, Katie's story had a lasting effect on him, and he wanted to pay tribute to her. He said, Katie's successes in all she did and how she cared for others was inspiring. Her story inspires the vulnerable girls at Karing Hearts High School to believe in themselves and turn their dreams into reality. In 2019, the Benoit family paid the school a visit and Janet, her mother, exclaimed, Katie would love this.

The school's webpage dedicated to her story and detailing the awards to be given to her name ends with, Katie continues to shape the world. [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ Thank you so much, everybody, for listening to this episode of Going West. Yes, thank you guys so much for listening to this episode, and on Tuesday, we'll have an all-new case for you guys to dive into. And just another thank you to Courtney for sharing this case with us. We love to hear everybody's thoughts about this case and every other case we cover, so

make sure you go and follow us on social media. Our Instagram is at Going West Podcast, Twitter at Going West Pod, and we're also on Facebook. What a senseless and just tragic story. I mean, it seemed like everybody just loved Katie and she had so much going for her, like, just the amount of awards that she had and the amount of love from her community is just incredible and it's just so sad that she's not with us anymore. I know, I agree. And just the fact that there were these complaints against him again and that she was actively trying to fix her own situation, and was simply just hanging

out with friends, and there he is, just probably, I mean, we didn't even talk about this, but he must have been like staking outside or staking out outside of her house. Yeah, maybe just prowling around the property waiting. Especially because she was on the back porch, so I wish we talked about this in the episode. It totally didn't even think about it, but he must have been stalking outside, watching them from the windows or something. Yeah, I mean, it seems like he picked an opportunity

when he knew that she was gonna be alone and ended her life. And wearing a dark black trench coat and a hat, so creepy. Make sure that you share this episode, guys. That really helps out our show. Also, if you'd like to leave a sort of view, if you can do so, we read them pretty often. So we love when you guys send us some nice reviews. So please do so.

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