Going West: True Crime - The Mineral Murders // 95

Episode Date: November 18, 2020

*In 1985, two couples were murdered while out on different trips in a Mineral, Washington forest. Between a suspicious note found and a very specific M.O, police feared they had a serial killer on their hands- and that these murders could also be linked to another couple’s killings months prior. These are The Mineral Murders, also known as the Tube Sock Killings.* *BONUS EPISODES* www.patreon.com/goingwestpodcast *SPONSORS* *MAGIC SPOON CEREAL* https://magicspoon.com (use code GOINGWEST for free shipping!) *SWANSON VITAMINS* https://swanson.com (use code GOWEST for 20% off & free shipping on orders $50+) *CASE SOURCES* https://www.seattlepi.com/news/article/Suspected-or-convicted-serial-killers-in-1107863.php https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/skull-discovery-revives-washington-murder-mystery/ https://ididitforjodie.com/2012/03/29/wither-the-tube-sock-killer-a-tale-of-murder-and-mystery-in-the-pacific-northwest/ https://sites.psu.edu/gillianpassionblog/2020/10/09/washington-tube-sock-killings/ https://unsolvedmysteries.fandom.com/wiki/Stephen_Harkins_and_Ruth_Cooper https://unsolved.com/gallery/diana-robertson/ https://www.reddit.com/r/UnresolvedMysteries/comments/bhraei/the_tube_sock_murderswashington_state_unsolved/ https://truecrimearticles.com/2018/01/23/the-unsolved-case-of-the-1985-tube-sock-killings/ https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/137597165/_ https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/137475894/kimberly-dianne-lavine Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands Privacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What is going on TrueCran fans? I'm your host Tee and I'm your other host, Daphne, and you're listening to Going West. Thank you so much everybody as always for joining us today. We're on episode 95 so we're almost to episode 100 which is crazy. Yeah I can't believe we're that close. So we're trying to think of something kind of special to do or something kind of different. For me I would be really down to redo our first episode on Brandon Swanson. That's just me. I love that case and I'd love to

redo it. I don't know if you guys would be interested in that to kind of have a new look on it or what you guys want to see for that episode. Yeah, let us know what you guys want us to do for that hundredth episode. And by the way, if you're all caught up on going west, we do have bonus episodes on our Patreon. The link is in the description below or you can just head on over to patreon.com slash going west podcast. We just released a bonus episode on the murder of Bobby Kent. I don't know how many of you guys have seen the movie bully that came out in 2001, but it's based on this case, so definitely check that episode out. Yeah, it's a murder that takes place in Florida in the 1990s.

So if you want to hear that episode and a bunch more bonus episodes, go check out our Patreon. Also, we're gonna be releasing another bonus episode for you guys later this month. All right, guys, this is episode 95 of Going West, so let's get into it. In 1985, two couples were murdered while out on different trips in a mineral Washington forest. Between a suspicious note found in a very specific MO,

police feared that they had a serial killer on their hands, and that these murders could also be linked to another couple's killings months prior. These are the mineral murders, also known as the tube-Sock Killings. Today's story takes place in Mineral Washington, which is an insanely small, unincorporated town of just over 200 people. And because of this, it's home to a ton of gorgeous hiking trails and amazing nature spots, including mineral lake.

It's also pretty close to Mount Rainier National Park, so it really has this remote feel to it, and it's a great destination for your outdoor needs in general, just really beautiful place. There are some other towns in the general vicinity, of course, but the closest big city is over an hour north, and that's Tacoma, Washington, home to over 200,000 people. Then, Seattle is about an hour and 40 minutes north of Mineral. So the first part of this story takes place

on August 10th, 1985. And we always like to include information about the victim's personal lives, since these are their stories and their tragedies. But unfortunately, for this first murder, we couldn't find too much background into this case, but here's what we know. Heath, take our way.

On Saturday, August 10, 1985, 27-year-old Stephen Harkins and his 42-year-old girlfriend, Ruth Cooper, left their home in eastern Tacoma to take a drive south with their dog for a little weekend getaway. They had just been to a wedding reception the evening prior, but had previously planned to go on a little camping trip to Toulac, which is north of Mineral. Steven and Ruth were super outdoorsy as many Pacific Northwesterners are, so they loved getting out and camping every chance they got. And Steven's brother even described him as Grizzly Adams with a smile, because he had

a huge beard and long hair. And for those of you who don't know who Grizzly Adams is, he was a famous mountain man and bear trainer in California, and he had his own show. So that was very much who Stephen was, and he knew his way outdoors. Two days later, on Monday, August 12, 1985, neither Ruth nor Stephen showed up at their jobs. They both worked at a vocational school, also known as a trade school, in Tacoma where they lived, and that's actually how they met and started dating. They were supposed to return by Sunday evening. So come Monday morning when they didn't show up to work, some red flags were obviously raised. It wasn't like either of them to just not call in or not show up,

so calls to family were made to alert them of their absence at work, which also alarmed the families. People knew they had gone camping, so at this point, they feared for the worst, and that day, they reported both Ruth and Stephen missing. Since they were adults, there's not much the police wanted to do just yet. You know, maybe they had decided to camp in extra couple days without telling anyone or something along those lines. But on top of that, the area they were going camping was very vast.

So finding them would be a tough task anyway. Yeah, I mean, growing up in the Pacific Northwest, you kind of realize early on that there was a lot of vast forest. I mean, there's a lot of trees and there are parts of Oregon and Washington where you can get lost in the forest because it's just a gigantic area. Yeah, if you look at mineral on a map, it's just green, like all around that whole area because like I said, it's unincorporated, so it's just very much the forest. So, I mean, every time we go camping,

we tell people exactly where we're going, but there's a lot of people who just like to camp in random spots, not necessarily at campgrounds. So, it's harder to kind of pinpoint your exact destination to tell people where you're going in those cases. Police didn't even have to look for the couple though, because on Wednesday, August 14, 1985, so four days after they left to go camping, Steven's body was found. That warm summer day, a hiker was passing through a remote campsite while on a trail when they came across Steven in his sleeping bag. And a lot of people camp like this in the summers where they won't sleep in a tent, but

they just sleep out under the stars in their sleeping bag. And Stephen was definitely known to do this. But the hikers noticed something as soon as they saw him. They saw blood. He had been shot in the forehead with a 22 caliber gun, and it being 1985, the hiker had to leave and call the police right away, and when Pierce County law enforcement arrived, they soon found what they assumed to be Stephen's dog dead as well. Whoever had killed Stephen had also shot and killed the dog. God, what a piece of shit.

I just don't really see the point of that. I mean killing people is also pointless like why the fuck would you do that but why kill a dog just let it go. I know that's just hurts my heart. However, Ruth was nowhere to be found. For some reason there wasn't a massive search done for her in this area, but they did search in the general vicinity and didn't know where she could have been. So then of course, they wondered if she had committed this crime herself. So the reason that there were some suspicions that Ruth could have been behind it was because it seemed Stephen had been sleeping when the attack occurred.

But everyone that knew her was extremely confident that she would never commit such a crime, although no one could explain where she was. Like was she out there in the wilderness somewhere they didn't look, did the killer take her hostage, and if so, who committed this crime? But considering this happened while they were camping, police began to believe it was done by someone who had come upon them, someone who was a stranger to them, and with this thought, police started to believe that Ruth had likely been murdered too, and that the murders were committed by the same person who had murdered a couple five months earlier in Kent, Washington. The murders of Edward Smith and Kimberly Diane Levine. And by the way, I don't know if it's Levine or Levine, but it's capital L A, capital V

I N E. So I assume it's Levine, but I'm not sure, just so you guys know. Kimberly Levine was born on January 2, 1958, and Peter Burrow knew Hampshire to parents Ruth and Bob Levine. Kim grew up as a wonderful, kind, and very independent young lady. She didn't need anyone to hold her hand through life. She was also very smart, and while she was in high school, her dad accepted a job as a high school principal in Massachusetts, so the family had to move. But Kim never once complained about this, even though it was during her senior year of

high school, which would be really, really hard to do to relocate being in high school, or especially your senior year. She did very well at her new school as well, and she graduated at the top of her class. She was even a member of the National Honor Society. But instead of going to college straight away, she decided to enlist in the U.S. Air Force and move to the Philippines to work on aircrafts. Upon returning from the Philippines, she served a few years in North Carolina and then even went to Guam for a short period of time. But after all of this, she settled back into Massachusetts life and shows accounting as her career path. And with that, she headed off to Dartmouth College.

Edward Smith, who went by Eddie, was born on August 11th, 1958, in Fall River, Massachusetts. So he and Kim were only about eight months apart. As a kid, he was always very interested in music, and he could play the trumpet, French horn, and he even taught himself piano. So of course, when he got to high school, he was a part of the marching band and saying

tenor in the chorus. He was also in drama and appeared in multiple school performances, so he was very interested in the arts. But like Kim, Eddie was very smart, and after attending a local community college and receiving a 4.0, he headed to Dartmouth for a degree in accounting as well. And it was at Dartmouth in Massachusetts where Eddie and Kim met and fell in love. So when they graduated in 1984, they moved to Kent, Washington together and both got jobs working as accountants.

Kim got a government accounting job at an agency in Seattle, which is very close to Kent, while Eddie got a job in Kent at a CPA firm. And for those of you who don't know the area, Kent is just outside of Tacoma, where Ruth and Stephen lived, and it's actually between Tacoma and Seattle. Both were doing very well at their jobs, but Eddie was already being considered partner material, which would be huge for him. But he had a lot of plans. He still loved music for one, and his co-workers thought he was very talented.

And actually one day while he was at work, the power went out, but there happened to be an old piano in the office, so Eddie went over to it and began to play, and then all of his co-workers joined in to sing, and they all laughed and enjoyed the moments until the power came back on. Eddie was just that guy. He was so fun to be around and he had a great sense of humor. He also planned to go to law school so overall this couple has big goals and they're doing really well for themselves. Shortly after moving to Kent the two 26 year olds got engaged and were planning their wedding for the upcoming summer, so in 1985, back home in Massachusetts.

But sadly, they never made it to the summer. On Saturday, March 9, 1985, they set off for a weekend trip to Grant County, Washington, so about a three-hour drive east to see some sights and explore nature. It appears they did make it to their general destination, but something unknown happened that resulted in their deaths. Because the following day, Eddie's body was found in a gravel pit in Grant County near the Wannupum Dam. It was clearly a murder because his hands were tied behind his back

and his throat was slashed. But Kim was nowhere in the area, just like Ruth hadn't been. It's so unfortunate to hear stories like this where there's a successful young couple and they're murdered. And it's like, to me, it feels like just a sign of the times. Like, the 1980s was very much like that. Like, nowadays, I feel like things don't happen like that as often.

Like, couples don't really disappear in the woods or get murdered out in the woods for just taking like a day trip or a nice drive. But for some reason, in the 1980s, this happened a lot more. It did seem to be like the peak of murder. Right, right. You think about all the serial killings

that have happened throughout history, and the 1980s seem to be like the real, like, well, the 70s and the 80s seem to be that time where people went missing, and it's just, it's so unfortunate to hear about this couple in particular. I know and that's why I like going into their back stories to kind of get to know who they were since they did tragically die because especially with this case when I was, well not

especially with this case, but particularly with this case when I was researching it and I had kind of read about their murder, but then once I dove into who they were as people, it made me so much more sad knowing who they are and where they came from and that they had such bright futures ahead of them. And then it was cut short by some asshole. Like it's so sad. Yeah, and it's just like senseless murders, you know? Like this couple was just enjoying their day out and then just was murdered.

Like it's crazy to think about it because I try to see it from the perspective of like, what if that was a family member of mine or what if that was a friend of mine? Yeah, it's horrible. So Eddie didn't have any kind of idea on him, so when he was found, it wasn't initially clear who he was. But the following day, which was Monday, March 11th, 1985, both Eddie and Kim's employers called

the local Sheriff's Department to report them missing. Again, it wasn't like either of them to miss work and they didn't answer any calls the employers made to them. So even though they were now reported missing, the connection still wasn't made between Eddie and the body that was found. That is, until two weeks later, when their car was found, about 10 miles from where Eddie was murdered. So then it was confirmed that the body was indeed Eddie Smith's. But still, Kim was nowhere to be found. Luckily,

they were able to collect a single fingerprint from Eddie's car, and it didn't belong to either Eddie or Kim. And this is in the mid 80s when they were able to do this and they found this fingerprint and they're like, this could help us someday. So that's really key in this case for sure. Very, very important to collect all the evidence, no matter how little evidence there actually is. So the similarities in the two cases we've discussed so far is that

there were both couples who went on weekend trips in Washington State and both of the men were found murdered, although killed in different ways, on a Sunday. And both women were not near the scene. Both couples misswork the following day, which was Monday in both cases, which was strange for all of them. Just like Ruth, authorities felt confident that Kim Levine was either kidnapped or murdered. But in August 1985, so five months after Eddie's murder, and around the very same time that Stephen Harkins was murdered while camping, Kim Levine's skeletal remains were found two miles away from her fiancee Eddies.

I didn't read another article that said her remains were found 30 miles away, so we can't confirm if it was two or 30, but regardless, she was not near Eddies' body. And to make this even more strange, about two months later, on October 26, 1985, Ruth Cooper's remains were found, 1.5 miles or 2.5 kilometers away from where her boyfriend Stevens' body had been found, and in some deep brush, so her body was kind of hidden. But dental records were able to confirm the remains belong to her. Like Stephen, Ruth had been shot, but she was shot in the abdomen. At first, only her head was found, and then two days later, about 50 feet away, the rest of her body and her purse were found.

Weirdly enough, a tube sock had been tied around her neck, but the medical examiner didn't believe that the tube sock took any part in her death, but since the remains were only skeletal, it couldn't be concluded how she died. Although she had been decapitated, it's believed that this was done by animals in the area and not by the killer. And as for why her body was so far away from Stephen's body, it's unclear. Police thought Stephen and Ruth's murders were likely related to Eddie and Kim's because

they were in relatively close proximity just months apart. But they still, of course, looked into other leads. During their investigation, they discovered that before Steven's murder, he had been in a quarrel with the man after damaging his Harley-Davidson motorcycle. And in fact, as we mentioned before, the day before Steven and Ruth went camping, they went to a wedding. And the man with the damaged Harley Davidson showed up at the wedding reception looking for Steven, and he was pissed. But at that point, Steven and Ruth had already left. So when police discovered this, it was a huge red flag, of course.

This man was considered a possible suspect in the beginning of the investigation, but they did question him and just didn't feel like he was their guy. They couldn't link him to the crime scene at all. So this really did seem like a good lead, but after talking to him, they're just like, I just don't think is him. Yeah, I mean, it's a little suspicious to show up to a wedding looking for somebody who damaged your Harley Davidson. I mean we know from watching multiple films and TV shows that you don't want to fuck with somebody's motorcycle because they'll probably kill you. That's our baby. Yeah exactly. So this to me sounds really suspicious and I'm wondering why they didn't feel like he was a suspect,

but if that's what they determine, then I guess it is what it is. It's interesting because these cases aren't very well known. There's not that much information on the internet about them, so I didn't find anything specifically about why they didn't think that he was their guy, but he probably had an alibi or something like that. But it did seem like a good go for a second there, but it just wasn't him. About a month and a half after discovering Ruth Cooper's remains, and four months after she and Stephen Harkins were murdered, yet another tragedy would strike in this area. On December 12, 1985, a 36-year-old man named Mike Reemer, his 21-year-old girlfriend

Diana Robertson and their two-year-old daughter, Crystal, left her to come home to check on some animal traps and choose a Christmas tree out in the forest that they wanted to chop down for the upcoming holiday that was just two weeks away, which was Christmas. Mike Reemer was a very skilled outdoorsman and he also was an animal trapper, and an animal trapper is somebody who traps animals in order to sell their fur pelts. But he worked in Seattle as a rougher for Seattle's Queen City sheet metal and roofing incorporated. So Mike trapped animals as kind of a side hustle and he had set some

traps prior and needed to check and see if he had caught anything. So they made it a family trip and headed out to the Nisqually River in Lewis County next to Mineral Washington. That afternoon, hours after they left for their day trip, two-year-old Crystal was walking around alone inside of a K-Mart in Spanaway, Washington, which is about an hour's drive away from where they had been in the forest, and it's very close to Tacoma where they lived. When someone found her and asked her where her parents were, she didn't say anything. You know, being too, she didn't have any idea where they had been earlier that day, or what happened to her parents.

So she was sent to a local hospital to make sure she was okay, and then she was placed in temporary foster care. When they asked her where her parents were, she gave her response this time. She said, Mommy is in the trees. But of course, they had no idea what that could mean, because that's a creepy-ass thing to say. That's all she said. And of course, being too, she really couldn't give any more information than that.

So at this point, Crystal was considered missing. So they put her on the local news and in the papers in hopes of someone recognizing her and identifying her. And luckily, her mom, Diana's mother, Luis Conrad, was watching the TV broadcast and called in immediately. From that day on, Crystal was cared for by her grandma. And this is so strange to find a child in a cameart, because typically, like, when you find a child lost in a store,

it's like one of those immediate things, Find a child in a cameart because typically like when you find a child lost in a store, it's like one of those immediate things like you're able to usually find the parents like right then in the store. They're usually in the store or you know on certain occasions the parent had actually accidentally left the store or something like that, but they're able to reconnect the child with their family. But in this case it's like I couldn't even imagine searching around the store, not being able to find the parents, they're like, well, I mean, what do we do here?

We just are gonna have to send her to the hospital because we don't know what else to do. Yeah, so I mean, at that point, the parents are nowhere in the store. No one in Kmart knows where her parents are, or even knows how she got there. So they have to call the police, and then they don't know if something happened to her so they wanted to go get checked at the hospital. Like it's just a very strange situation. Yeah, very not typical. So even though Crystal had been picked up by her grandmother Louise, there still was the question of where her parents were. Once they were able to put clues together and figure out the general area that the family had been that day, they had a massive search out from Mike in Diana.

And Mike's best friend Steve was there to help search because he knew the different places that Mike set traps and the areas that he frequented. After hours of searching on land and in a helicopter, they found absolutely nothing. And this search was a bit hard to do though because of all the snow, so even the bloodhounds couldn't be of much help. A whole two months went by and they still had no idea what happened to this couple. Did they leave on their own free will and drop Crystal off somewhere? That they knew that she'd be found or did someone hurt them? It was just too strange. On February 18, 1986, a man walking his dog in a mineral Washington forest stumbled upon the body of a woman partially covered in snow, and he called police right away.

And he had been driving and just took his dog outside to use the bathroom, so this location was right on Washington State Route 7, so right next to the road. The body found was that of Diana Robertson's. She was laying face up next to Mike's 1982 Plymouth pickup truck with a tube sock tied around her neck. Again with the tube sock? I know.

She had been stabbed 17 times. Just like with the tube sock found around Ruth Cooper's neck, it didn't seem that this aided in Diane's cause of death. It was just like the killer's ammo, like a mark by the killer. There was still no sign of Mike though, but police became suspicious when they searched through his truck. So first and foremost, there was a few small blood stains found on the front seat. Since a couple months had passed, the characteristics and the blood that were needed to determine blood type were gone, so they couldn't figure out whose blood this was. But they did know for sure that it was human blood. Also in the truck was an envelope sitting on the dashboard that read,

I love you Diana. Interesting. Very interesting to me. And it was right there on the dashboard. So this isn't like a little I love you note that's taped to the the console or whatever It's like sitting on the dashboard. Right. So this potentially is Mike's Note to Diana. This became a very weird detail quickly. It was written on one of those big Manila envelopes in blacker and police couldn't tell when it was written. So they started to worry that Mike had killed Diana and wrote that as a good bite to her. Because Louise, who remember is Diana's mom, stated that it was definitely Mike's handwriting

because she recognized it from various holiday cards and other things since he and Diana had been together for four years. The FBI had a handwriting analysis done on the letter, though, and it was inconclusive. They couldn't tell for sure if it was Mike's handwriting. And a big reason why they even suspected Mike of such a crime is because, according to Diana's sister, quote, he beat her up. He took everything out on her. He blamed her for things that he did.

If he was seeing somebody else, he would turn it around like Diana was seeing somebody else and justify it in his own mind. So this guy's a cheater for one and he's abusive. I mean, I definitely understand the suspicion against Mike, especially since he was known to be violent towards Diana, which is not okay. But first of all, his car was still at the scene next to Diana's body. So how would Crystal, their daughter, have ended up in our north? Very true. And how would Mike have gotten away from the scene without his car? Because you would imagine, too, if this was true, and Mike hitchhiked or something with the daughter,

like somebody would have, somebody would have come forward. Yeah. And I feel like if Mike wanted to kill her, he could have just left Crystal at home and done so in the woods and then just left in his car. And also the whole tube-sought connection to me points to a different person doing this. And that letter could have been written at any time, but again, I do think it strange that it was just sitting on the dashboard as if it had just been written, because it's like, it's like a huge envelope. This isn't like your keepsake that you just keep on top of your dashboard. If Heath wrote me a nice note like that which he has before, it's very sweet. I would put it away somewhere, it's not just going to be sitting on the top of my dashboard.

That's the kind of thing that falls off when you drive, because it's so big. But unfortunately, we'll never really know what happened with that. Also the blood, I do think that's weird, because that would probably mean that either Mike or Diana had tried to get into the car, but obviously they didn't go anywhere. This is odd. Yeah, the whole situation's very odd to me. I think that Mike, I think the fact that they couldn't conclusively determine

that it was Mike's handwriting says a lot to me because even though I know Louise says that she believes that it is his handwriting, if the FBI is doing handwriting analysis, I mean, I think that they would probably know whether or not it was Mike's and the fact that it's inconclusive, I mean it does mean that it could very well be his handwriting, but it also could mean that it's probably not. Yeah, I definitely agree. The whole letter situation is really odd. It could very well not be connected to this case, but just the fact that it was just sitting there and she's dead is really, really strange. But for the next 25 years, the location of Mike Reemer was unknown. He never returned to work or used his bank account or contacted his daughter, Crystal.

For years, family and locals wondered what could have happened to him and if he committed this crime after all, which I will say Louise, whose Diana's mom, did believe that he did it. They also wondered if he committed the murders of Stephen and Ruth, considering he knew the area and he set animal traps there often. But on March 26, 2011, hikers in Mineral came across a partial human skull and reported it to authorities. And after testing was done, it was determined that it belonged to Mike Reemer, and it was found less than one mile away from where Diana's body was found 25 years earlier.

So I don't know what it is about this area where I mean both Ruth and Mike were found not far from their partners. So I don't know if this area is really hard to search or if they just didn't do a thorough search but if they had only found his body earlier they would know how he died and it would really help put the pieces together a little bit more on this case. Yeah, definitely. I mean, it is definitely hard to find human remains in the forest because there's so much obstructing going on.

Of course. I mean, there's, you know, trees, bushes, sticks, you name it, whatever. So I could imagine how hard it would be to find a body. It also, I wonder, I wasn't able to find the coordinates of where his remains were found, so I don't know if he was found on a hill or on a mountain or on a ledge or something where they wouldn't have gone because it was too treacherous, you know? So especially because it was quite cold, it was winter time when this all went down, when they were murdered, when Diana's body was found, So I guess it does make sense that his body was probably

covered in snow when her body was found. Exactly. Yeah, that's what I'm saying is, you know, one, it's the forest, two, there's snow everywhere, easy to cover a body. So since so much time had passed, they were unable to determine how he died. But they know he wasn't shot in the head,

just because they had his skull they could tell, that was one thing they could rule out. So to them that kind of meant that he didn't kill himself, and that kind of made them feel like he was probably innocent. Yeah, that's definitely a good thought. It's very possible that he was stabbed to death by the same person who killed his girlfriend Diana, but some still wonder if he was the killer and if he somehow killed himself in those woods. In 1989, four years after Kim Levine and Eddie Smith were murdered, that fingerprint that

was taken from their car got a match. It belonged to a truck driver named Billy Ray Ballard Jr. And it matched after he had committed a different crime in the state of Wyoming and sent to Wyoming state penitentiary. And he actually ended up pleading guilty to both Kim and Eddie's murders. Unfortunately, we couldn't find any kind of explanation as to why he killed them, but we can only guess that this crime was a crime of opportunity.

And we say this because in Wyoming, Billy Ray Ballard Jr. had been convicted of abducting, raping, and torturing two women. So this guy was obviously a ruthless piece of shit, and we can't even imagine the things he probably did to Kim. So it was likely just a wrong place, wrong time situation. And Billy Ray Ballard Jr. denied committing the other tube sock murders when he was actually questioned for them, but I don't know. I mean he was probably in that area for work since he was a truck driver by that area. I mean Grant County where Kim and Eddie were killed.

So with all the travel he did, he was almost able to get away with murder, and I'm assuming he probably did get away with some murders considering how much of a sadistic asshole this guy was, but I don't think he committed the murders in Mineral Washington. Not just because there was no tube sock in the Kim and Eddie case, but because the two tube sock murder cases

were done in the same area. And he clearly isn't the guy who sticks around. I mean, I read that he's from Montana, and we know he committed crimes in at least two other states. So I don't really see him committing a crime in mineral and then four months later committing another crime in mineral, you know? I think that it is somewhat possible that this guy murdered the other couples.

And the reason why I say that is because just because there wasn't a tube sock found in Kim and Eddie's case doesn't mean. I mean, we already know he's capable of murder. And there is one MO there. And it's the couple thing. It's the fact that he had killed a couple. And then two other couples were also murdered in relatively the same area. But what I mean, they were like three hours apart though. Yeah, but I mean this guy travels a lot, right? Well, yeah, I mean, I don't know if his his route was ever through mineral because that's a super remote area

But I mean, it's not like he only killed couples because he did torture and rape those two women, so I mean it's definitely possible But there's no there's no like clear cut link to the cases They just thought that the two cases were connected, but once Diana and Mike were murdered They kind of threw the the other case the Kim and Eddie case out of this whole loop I just got to say real quick the name Billy Ray Ballard Jr. That just fucking sounds like a serial killer name, doesn't it? Oh, it so does. It just sounds like a dude who's just a slimy fucking grody piece of shit who just murders

people like that's ugh. You know what's interesting to me about the whole, uh, the Diana and Mike murders though is because whoever committed those murders let Crystal go. And that kind of says a lot about them. And yeah, it's so hard because she was only two, so of course she doesn't remember. But it happened to her, so it's so frustrating because if she was maybe a little bit older and was able to remember, then she would be able to explain who this person was, who did it, because she obviously was in a car with them for an hour.

Yeah, we'd have some details at least. I still have my suspicions about Billy Rebellard, just because he's in the area and because of the couple thing, but I'd like to know more information about him, I guess, I would say. Because I can't rule him out, but I can't also say that 100% he did it. Well, I think we can agree then that the Harley Davidson guy was probably innocent. Yeah, I think we both can agree on that. I mean, if they already ruled him out, I mean, please know what they're doing, so I'm sure that they had a reason why they ruled him out. I mean, police know what they're doing. So I'm sure that they had a reason

why they ruled him out. I mean, if this wasn't, if Diana and Mike weren't murdered in the same area with a similar M.O. You know, the whole tube sock thing. So same M.O. Like I would have thought that Harley Davidson guy was probably guilty because I mean, this wasn't a one off murder. But if it was, he would look really suspicious to me. But it's definitely possible, too, that there was a copycat if this wasn't a serial killer. So what if it was Harley-Davidson guy for Stephen and Ruth? But then, like, I don't know, somebody saw it on the news and they did the same thing.

I don't know, it's possible. But since it was such, you know, close proximity and location-wise, it's widely believed that the person or persons who killed Stephen Harkins and Ruth Cooper is, are the same who killed Diana Robertson and Mike Reemer. Yeah, I think we can probably say that. Yeah, I personally think that it's like a vagrant or an outdoorsy guy who lived like relatively close to this area. But if you have any information regarding these murders or know who could be behind them, please call the Lewis County Police

Department at 360-748-9286. Thank you so much everybody for listening to this episode of Going West. Yes, thank you guys so much for listening to this episode and next week we'll have an all new case for you guys to dive into. We of course want to give thanks to everybody who has joined our Patreon this last week. Remember Patreon is where you can get bonus episodes. It's the best and easiest way to help support the show, and it means a lot to us when you guys join that community over there. So thank you so much to Rosland, Clara, Christopher, Kelly, Halle, and Josh.

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