Good Job, Brain! - 88: Oh Behave!

Episode Date: November 26, 2013

Chin up, elbows off the table, and stop picking your nose! We explore the world of manners and etiquette this week. Chris quizzes us on the torturous and delightfully wacky rules of table manners. Learn about the Do's and Don'ts of pub trivia, the violent origin of the handshake, and old-timey advice to present thy proper self. Who's got two thumbs and might piss off other cultures? - Colin's public service announcement about common hand gestures that might mean not-so-great things in certain countries. ALSO: Warby Parker EYE-Q quiz, the number 88 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

You're listening to an Airwave Media podcast. Welcome fellow frenzied fact fanatic followers and friends. This is good job, brain, your weekly quiz show and offbeat trivia podcast. Today's show is episode 88. And of course, I'm your humble host, Karen, and we are your happy snappy strappy yappy yappy chaps i'm colin i'm dana and i'm chris i want to note that today's episode is number 88 88 and as a chinese person that's super lucky that's what i hear yes it's an auspicious number eight it means get rich all right all right so this is

wealth fortune right happiness all kind of linked together and i have some cool facts about the number eight the patronas twin towers in Malaysia, famously, the very, very tall buildings, each have 88 floors. I mean, these are not coincidences. Right. No, yeah, yeah. Designed by choice. I didn't know this, but there are plenty of airline companies, any routes to either

to China, from China, or from Chinese places, the flight number is 88 or 888 or something. So Air Canada, Shanghai to Toronto is AC88. United Airlines, a route from Beijing to San Francisco, is. flight UA 888. Okay. And then Beijing to Newark is flight UA 88. I wonder if any of them at all have the number four in them, the unlucky number. Oh, I bet not. I bet not. Yeah. Yeah. Lots of eights, no force. Mm-hmm. There go. I just thought that was pretty cool. All right. Well, without further ado, let's jump into our first general trivia segment. Popquoise hot shot. Get your barnyard buzzers ready. Here we go.

Blue Wedge for geography. The Come As You Are Sign in Aberdeen, Washington welcomes visitors to the hometown of what musician. Colin. That would be Kurt Cobain. Correct. The phrase is the title of a song from the 1991 Nirvana album, Nevermind. Pink Wedge. What did Outcast tell listeners to shake it like in their song, Hey Ya?

Dana. A Polaroid picture. picture, you're actually not supposed to shake Polaroid pictures, just so everybody knows, because it messes up with the chemical process. Okay, great. Next time I think a Polaroid I'll remember not. Hey, no, they're back now. They're making a comeback.

But they're ironic and hits. Well, you're wearing your monocle. Yeah. Oh, my God. Yeah, it's like, oh, I have to take my monocle out so I can take this Polaroid pictures. All right, Yellow Wedge. Who are the only two U.S. presidents to have been

impeached Oh, we keep getting this. Okay, is it, is it Andrew Johnson and William Jefferson Clinton? Correct. That was the trick part of it. The trick is, most people might say Nixon. Yep.

In Nixon. In fact, I think I did last time this came up. Yeah. All right, Purple Wedge. What writing system could be deciphered thanks to the discovery of the Rosetta Stone? Oh. Not the program.

Yeah, which was the language? Was, Dana. Was it Egyptian hieroglyphics? Correct. Hieroglyphics. Scholars use the Greek text on the stone to interpret the hieroglyphics. Orange Wedge. Last question.

What are the three traditional ingredients in plain shortbread? It's not a sports question. Sports and leisure. I'll call it, we'll say, flour, butter, and sugar. And sugar. All right. Probably water, too. No?

No, just those three. very easy to make sure bread you don't know a lot about sports dana clearly we haven't got a sports question a really long time yeah that that's i think these were made by somebody just like me what other things are leisurely you need like 2% sports right just to sprinkle it in the last time i played actual trivial pursuit i mean i just kept getting asked these ridiculously granular sports questions. It was stuff about like, you know, who kicked this field goal and by how many points did this team win in the 1988 Super Bowl and all this stuff. And it was just like, and then it comes back around to the people we're playing against and the sports and leisure questions

are like, there was a question that was just like, what beverage is called the holy water of the South? And it's just like, oh my God. Do you know what the answer is? No. Hold on. Hold on. I have a gas. You're probably right. Of the American South. What beverage? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. What beverage is called the Holy Water of the South? I would guess it comes in a red can. Yes. R.C. Cola?

Coca-Cola. Coca-Cola. Oh, Atlanta. Co-Cola. Roll the die. Yep. Good job, Brains. So many people know that we play as a pub trivia team.

And I'm sure many of you guys, listeners also participate in pub trivia or plan to or maybe have tried pub trivia. Or, you know, if you haven't, maybe you should try it out because it's super fun and rewarding There are kind of manners and kind of code of conduct involved in pub trivia. And I just want to first kind of talk about some of the things that you should or should not do. The do's and don'ts of pub trivia. Well, of course, the big one is if you're at a place where pub trivia is being played, and whether you are or are not playing, you should not shout out the answers when they read the questions.

Yeah. You'd be surprised, or maybe you wouldn't, but how often we have to hear the host, mind people, please do not shout out the answers. You have a lot of people who maybe they don't know that it's going on. They're like, I know this question. The answer is this. I'm so proud of myself. Yeah, well, they don't know what's like a competition. And of course, in the modern times, cell phones, definitely there is a very strict cell phone rule. And, you know, obviously you should not be getting answers from your smartphone. But also relatedly, depends on pub to pub for our pub trivia, even just having your phone out on a table, even if you're not using it, it seems

a little shady. So, you know, when it's quiz time, put in your pocket, put in your bag, and just don't even make people doubt or think that you might be cheating in a way. And ours, I think good sportsmanship is really important. So like if somebody else wins, you congratulate them. You don't want to be the one that everybody's like, those people are jerks. Like, they're so rude. They're the evil ones. Or boo anybody. Yeah, you don't boo people. People get very touchy if you If you are too aggressive. I don't know if this is really under etiquette, but we sometimes have to challenge the quiz master.

And there's always, you know, we have a protocol because you don't want to be too, you got this wrong, where's my point? Because they're immediately going to shut down. So we kind of have our procedures of, oh, you know, I think maybe, or are you sure about? It is etiquette. You know, we've shared on the show,

sometimes we get questions that are just written wrong, or there are multiple answers, or it's unclear, and instead of going up to the quizmaster and be like, hey, buddy, you know, you messed up or like, this is right, overly aggressive or confrontational is never good, even if you're right, even if the question is wrong, if it's super wrong, if it's 100% wrong and you're sure, you can go challenge, but you have to have the expectation that you might not get a point. Yeah, yeah. I mean, their judgment is final, and it's however bad you may feel about it, you have to deal with it. That's all just, you know, part of good manners. Yeah, part of the culture. And so this week for today's episode, we decide to explore the world of etiquette and good manners. There is no one like me

Like me There's no like me See, this is etiquette right in You know what? Or maybe bad manners But you know what? It's all relative Yes

Right It all depends on who you're with And where you are And what country you're in And Dean So let me ask you guys This Maybe in the course of your research

For this show Did you think to look up Where the word etiquette comes from? Yeah Okay It sounds French It sounds French

It is pretty French. Let me, okay, so how about this? There is a word in English and a word in English that is more anglicized, right? That sounds very much like etiquette and they actually both came from the same place. Do you guys maybe want to take a stab it what that word is? Connecticut. No, not Connecticut. That's a Native American word, I believe.

Not ethics. Oh, that's a good guess. No. Coquettish? No, no, it's actually a lot closer. that it's the word ticket as in a little piece of paper so like back in the day in France people would like you know maybe go to court like to see the king and queen or go to formal occasions they would pass out a little sheet of paper to people saying like hey

BT-dubs like here's how you behave around the king here are the manners in which the king wants you to act the little the rules of like you know what to do don't trample on the grass that sort of thing. And they called that an etiquette meeting a little ticket. Wow. Yeah. And that's where etiquette comes from. Wow.

Yeah, crazy, right? That's good. That's fun. So I think it's safe to say that most of our listeners are human. I would go out on a limb and vast majority. I would say, we don't know how many people play this for their dogs while they're out. Yeah. It's true.

That's true. Certainly a plurality of our listeners are human. What about like all the bugs and spiders in the house? Oh. Let's really get down in the... The mites and lice on your body. Are they listening, though? Yeah, they're hearing.

They're not listening. Tusha. Yes. Okay, Colin, we concede. Yes. Point given. Wow. It took me almost 45 seconds

just to get you guys to sign off on human listeners. Yep. It's very one of those questions. So, you know, humans, we're not the only animals that communicate, certainly, but we are believed to be the only animals that use gestures.

for communication. We also use writing too. But for the purposes of this segment, I want to focus on gestures. I've always been personally interested in cross-cultural differences in similar gestures. You know, it's always like, you know, don't do this here, do this here. As you say, as you say, Chris, as you're going to a place you haven't been before, it's wise to know what the customs are there. So originally I thought, well, this isn't going to be good to talk about gestures on an audio program because they are, by definition, visual, in nature. but then I decided to focus it on rude and offensive gestures.

So now this way no one's going to get in trouble because you can't see the potentially rude and offensive gestures I'm making. Great loophole. Great loophole. I have a particular favorite example of someone using what is to him a common gesture in the wrong place. The classic example of what not to do. You probably do.

You probably do. So in 1992, President George H.W. George Bush, Sr., was on an official visit to Australia, and as he and the entourage were making their way through Canberra, there was a group of local farmers who were staging a protest there. I mean, they knew he was coming. They were staging a protest about U.S. farm subsidies, you know, that this is not fair to us Australian farmers. Bush, to sort of show, hey, you know, I'm kind of a cool guy. This doesn't ruffle me. And also just sort of like, hey, guys, chill out.

He thought he's going to throw them the peace sign. You know, hey, peace, guys. Now, if you've lived in Australia or anywhere in the UK or New Zealand, you can probably guess where this is going. Dana, do you probably know what happened here? Yeah, so the palm facing out is peace. Yes. And then the palm facing towards you is a...

Go F yourself. Yeah, it's profane. It's basically the equivalent of like the middle finger. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So that's what we did. It's like, hey, farmers.

Hey, up yours. Don't do that if you're in, uh, commonwealth. Yes, there you go. Commonwealth countries, Australia, New Zealand. That's right. Anywhere in the UK. So as a public service, these are gestures that you should not do when you're traveling to certain places.

So you guys know the thumbs up gesture. Yes. Just, hey, thumbs up. I do it all the time. Great. Everything's going good. Yeah, sometimes the things are going really well. You do the double thumbs up.

Yeah. It's twice as good. Yeah. People in a lot of parts of the Middle East and a lot of parts of Asia, this is kind of considered offensive. This is kind of like almost like an up yours. Not quite as bad, but it's more just like a, Hey, buddy, this is what I think for you.

Yeah, it's not good. And especially if you're not like, hey, you're doing a great job, you might have the opposite effect. So the thumb thing, maybe it was the act one, scene one, or act one scene two of Romeo and Julia, they do with this whole elaborate kind of a taunting about biting thumb at you. Thumbs out, you know, and maybe that might be related. I don't know. There are all kinds of, I mean, as I did some more research, there are all kinds of gestures with the hand and the thumb in particular around your face. We don't necessarily always have those here in America, so they may not mean anything to us. So Middle East, no thumbs up.

In recent years, this has actually really been changing a lot, partly just due to the spread of westernization just through culture. But, you know, these days, especially if you're younger, you're going to know what a thumbs up mean. You're not going to think that, like, hey, this tourist is telling me to where to scrap. Right. But just be careful. Be careful.

Do you guys know the, the come here gesture? So like your index finger out, like kind of curling towards yourself, you know, and you might often associate there's like a seductress and an old. you know, noir-ish movie or something in a lot of countries, especially certain Asian countries like the Philippines, this is really offensive to do the come here gesture with a finger to somebody. Like, if you do this at all, it's something that you would use to gesture animals. So it would be, it would be the equivalent of be like, come here, come here, Chris, come on, Chris. You know, like, slapping your knee, like calling a dog.

And even if you're not calling an animal, you just, you don't do that to somebody. It's just really rude and offensive. The okay sign. Thumb and index finger in a circle, the other three fingers spread out. Okay. Again, we use this all the time here. It's great, everything's going fine. Love it. This one, this one's really bad in a lot of places.

Really? Yeah. In many parts of the Middle East and in some Spanish-speaking countries, this can be considered like a reference to your butthole, basically. You're calling someone a butt hole or just making a really vulgar association. In Japan, it means money. They're talking about, like, money. Just as a general sign for money

Also, this isn't necessarily vulgar or obscene But in a lot of European countries In France or Germany in particular This just means zero You know, like worthless, zero, nothing Yeah It doesn't mean, okay My favorite example of this

Again, I don't know what it is with US politicians So this sign, what we would call the okay sign In Brazil is still in fact considered pretty vulgar And it's again essentially in up yours or an FU Like, you show that to somebody that's not saying everything is all right. On a visit to Brazil in the 1950s, Richard Nixon, he was not president then, but obviously later became president. As he's coming off the plane, throws up a double okay sign. Not just for good measure.

Just not for one. Which, again, would be the equivalent of a U.S. politics. How are you doing, Brazil? I'm Richard Nixon. Happy to see you. Oh, man. Oh, man. And again, yes, left a lasting impression, I'm sure.

And then one final example. So this is one that is sort of considered rude here, but is orders of magnitude more rude in Greece. So the hand out, palm out, you know, like stop or talk to the hand. Yeah. So it's really rude here. It is pretty rude. Like talk to the hand. But in Greece, it's even worse.

This is called the Mutsa gesture. And this is a historically offensive gesture in Greece. Like, it's not just stop talking or I don't want to hear you. It's more like, stop talking, F off. I don't want to hear you're saying. They say that it's a reference going way back to taunting criminals and stockades by rubbing dirt or other very unpleasant substances in the faces of criminals. So it's like saying it's like, I want to rub in your face.

So don't do that, even if you're feeling sassy when you're out in Greece. So save it for Oprah. Yeah. Right, yeah, because the moods I don't want to hear it. Oh, man. So I would say that in summary, my lesson for you is when traveling the world, just never take your hands out of your pockets. Just don't do anything with your hands ever, ever, ever.

That might be rude, too. He'll never win. Well, if I can just make one person's difference. Speaking of moving your hands around, the handshake, the classic handshake, is the way you say hello or the way you meet someone. stand in a handshake. And also kind of the symbol of good sportsmanship. You know, we see this in sports a lot. Tennis, definitely a good handshake or you do like in football, you have a whole row of people shaking hands. And it's so weird that something that is the symbol of good sportsmanship

and manners had a really crazy origin, a dark origin. The first depiction of handshake was probably from the fourth or fifth century in Greece, B.C. Some of you might know this. Some of you might not. I didn't know this. But handshakes, the most commonly cited reason for handshakes was because back in those days, a lot of warring states, a lot of treachery. The handshake was your way to ensure that the other person doesn't have a weapon paid in the sleeve. In another sense, it's also saying, hey, I don't have a weapon. I'm open to shake. And I come in peace. And there are some theories that you're supposed to shake hands really vigorous to maybe, yeah, to prove that you really don't have anything hidden in your armor or under your coat. And so if you shake really heartily, all your daggers will, like, fall to the ground or something.

So, like, weak shakes are not to be trusted because you're like, why are you doing this in such a weird way? You have to prove that you come unarmed. It's weird that everybody was so paranoid that the handshake was your classic example. of, I come with no weapons. Hey, nice to see you. Please don't stop me. It's not paranoia when they really might be. And this is why you always shake hands with the right hand, because that's people's

main weapon hand. And fun fact about handshaking, there is a world record, the longest handshake between two people. It went on, yeah, went on for 33 hours in three minutes and just two people shaking hands. I'm not impressed. I'm not impressed. Yeah. Just seeing, I mean, but you have to stay awake. I don't know if they're awake, though.

No. Like, can you take turns? Can you take turns being awake or in this? Yeah, yeah, he takes turns. So one person is shaking. As long as one person is shaking. Both hands are technically shaking. Yeah.

That's true. Yeah, it is kind of weird to think about it. And I found another custom that also stems from paranoia of being killed. So when we go to restaurants, most of the time your utensils are wrapped in napkin, right? And the origin is because it goes back to the medieval times, people used to put poison on your utensils to kill you. So a way to ensure or, you know, the host proving that it has been untampered is all of the utensils have been wrapped in napkin. And that's a way that would be like they're safe, you know, they weren't exposed to air, no one snuck in and put poison. But then I was like, well, can't you put poison on it?

So there you got lots of good manner things stem from people trying to kill a job. Just trying to get along. Just trying to get along. Yeah, you know, they say actually a lot of table manners evolved as a way of making sure that people who were all eating together did not like kill each other. No, like murder each other while meals were going on because, you know, people used to murder each other a lot more. You know, the only utensil used to be your knife. Right? Like, your dagger. Yeah.

Like, back in the day, like, that was your only utensil. I'm gonna forks or spoons. You just used the knife. And it was the same one you'd kill people with. So sometimes arguments, dinner table argument. I mean, that's why, like, you know, it's taboo to discuss matters of politics in the dinner table. Or, you know, like things that people might get into arguments about because they used to just stab each other. The likelihood that you'll be stabbed by one of your dinner companions is a lot lower now than it may have been in medieval times. However, we have, and most societies have evolved.

Lengthy lists and rituals of table manners. And so, to that end, I have prepared a quiz. All right. Dun, done, done, done. Now, okay, so two things here. This, we are talking about the American style table manners. This does differ in some ways from continental table manners, British table manners. Like, some things are different.

Some customs evolved differently. And also, the big hint here is, if you're not sure of the answer, And if you are ever at a fancy dinner and you're trying to mind your table manners, just do whatever is least convenient for you. Whatever the thing is that is least convenient for you is probably proper table manners. So here is a quiz. So if you sit down in front of you and you see your place setting in front of you, and there are three forks and three knives, which fork do you use? first. I think I remember learning that it's outside in.

It is outside in. So you have three forks and three knives. You probably want to have three knives. But you work from the ones that are furthest away from the plate, in towards the plate. It's probably salad fork, dinner fork, and dessert fork, if anything. You're eating your salad with your salad fork, and you take a few bites and you decide that you want to put your fork down somewhere. Where do you put your fork? But you're not done eating.

No, you're not done eating. You're just putting the fork. work down for a second. Colin. I would guess you rested on the edge of the plate. The part that goes in your mouth, you rest on the edge of the plate. Oh, and the part that doesn't go in your mouth stays off the plate? Yeah, it's on the table.

It's on the table. Wrong. Anybody else want to take a stab of this? It goes behind your ear. Yes. Okay, so here is the rule. Once they come up off the tablecloth, utensils never go back down on the tablecloth.

part of them should touch the tablecloth. You should rest it entirely on the edge of your plate. Okay. We all know that we're supposed to take the napkin and put it into our lap. When should you do this? Let's say you're at a restaurant. Everybody's sitting down at the table. I'm sitting at the table.

I haven't had any food yet. When should I put the napkin on my lap? Karen. When the food is being served? No. Before that. Is it immediately? It is immediately.

it is within like a minute or so of sitting down you don't have to be doing anything now you definitely should not be doing anything that involves bringing any food or drinks anywhere near you without the napkin down so before you can start drinking water you're supposed to have the napkin down yeah i could see not wanting to do the napkin when the waiter comes because you might elbow them or make you know you know no you're not supposed to elbow them either yeah right yeah yeah you just want to be ready you know yeah yeah uh now you don't need to unfold the napkin entirely i find out you don't You don't have to take the napkin and unfold it all the way. The fold is towards you. It is, yes. You can leave it folded in half with the crease towards you. You sit down in a fancy dinner and there's utensils all over the place, right? There's utensils and there's glasses and there's like three glasses in front of you and whatever. Which plate is your bread plate as opposed to your neighbor's bread plate and which are your glasses as opposed to your neighbor's breakfast?

Dana. So your bread plate is on your left side and your glasses are on the right? Correct. If you have trouble remembering this Just hold your hands up in front of you And make the okay Or butthole And one hand will make a B for bread

And the other hand will make a B for drinks Oh, I like that All right If I were to say to you, Colin If the salt and pepper were near you And I say, Colin, please pass the salt What should you do? My mom taught me I should pass them both to you

You are correct. Your mom is correct. Yes, your mom is correct, and so are you. The salt and pepper are married. If someone asks you to pass either the salt or the pepper, you pass them both. Why? So you always know where the salt and pepper are. Yes, they just stay together.

They don't get split up. Yep. Now, Karen is now sitting between Colin and I at this table, and let's say Colin was passing the salt and pepper over to me, and he had to pass them to Karen so she could give them to me. Karen, as the salt and pepper are coming over, thinks to herself, oh, I want some salt on my food, too. Is it okay before it gets to me for you to just sprinkle some salt on and then pass it to me? No. It is not okay. That's right. Doesn't matter why. It doesn't matter why. It's not

okay. You have to, you have to complete the pass to the person who requests it, and then you can request it later. I can see how that might be rude of me if I did that. Right, yeah. But to me, it's like, oh, it's efficient. Yeah. Now, let's say I have the salt and pepper, and my food arrives. I look at the food and I'm like, you know what? I'm looking at this food right now. This food clearly needs some salt and some pepper. I haven't tasted it, but I haven't tasted it yet. I haven't tasted it yet. I haven't tasted it yet. I haven't tasted it yet. I haven't tasted it yet. I haven't tasted it yet. You're not supposed to do that. You're not supposed to do that. No, you are. Insult to the person who made the food. Exactly. So you are supposed to taste your food first, even if it is a pro forma tasting. And then you put salt and pepper on. Hold on. Go on. So in restaurants, sometimes a server will come to you after you just got your food.

You haven't eaten yet. Yeah. And they asked, would you like pepper on it? Right. Then that's okay. That's okay. Because I have a taste of a little bit of blue hole. That's totally okay.

Because that's part of the dish. That is a part of the dish that the restaurant is preparing it this certain way for you. Okay. Let's say they serve me my food. And I look at something on the plate and I think to myself, I do not want to eat that. I don't, I totally don't want to eat that. I'm not going to like that. What is the proper thing to do?

Spread it out around your place. Eat everything else and then hide it under a slice of meagled bread. I'm guessing the answer is not give it to the dog under the table. Definitely, definitely not. I don't make it look like you. Yeah. You think, again, what is the. least convenient thing for you here you're supposed to eat some of it yes doesn't matter how much

you don't yet you don't have to eat all of it okay you don't have to eat all of it but you have to taste everything if it served to you you've got to try a little bit of it and if you really don't like it you choke it down and then if they ask you if you didn't care for it you just say you know I guess I'm just not accustomed to this flavor but I really appreciate the opportunity to try it yeah I told it's okay to say you didn't care for something but you can't say you didn't like it. Like saying, I didn't like it is like so rude, but I didn't care for it. I'm not calibrated right for this. Yeah. Yeah. It's like you're talking down yourself and be like, oh, I'm not like you guys. Pardon my lower palate. If someone toasts you, if they raise their

glass and they say, to Karen, a swell gal. Lots of moxie. Do you, Karen, drink? Oh. Do you drink? No, you can't drink to a toast celebrating. You. you. You do not drink to yourself. The polite thing to do is to nod, say thank you, but do not drink. What if you have something in your mouth that you do not want there? Like if there's a piece of gristle that accidentally got in there, if there's a piece of bone that actually... Eggshell. What do you do? I think I remember reading once. You are, I think, as discreetly as possible, supposed to put it on your fork and then transfer that to the plate? basically, yes. If anything that goes in has to come out the way that it went in.

So if it went in on your fork, it comes out on your fork. If it went in via your hands, it can come out on your hands. If you've got an olive pit, you can take it out with your thumb and forefinger. That's okay. But if it's a piece of bone, what they say is, traditional table manners is you spit it on your fork. And then where do you put it? On your plate. In the hosts drank strangely.

Yeah, it's weird. It's not that convenient for you. You have to get up and walk over there. So this, people, even people who are well-versed in table manners, might not do this because the answer is going to shock you. This answer will shock you. According to the traditional rules of etiquette, if you are served whole asparagus spears with no sauce, how do you eat them? Oh. With no sauce

Like it's not covered in some sort of a sauce or something I think this is one of those weird things That you are allowed to eat with your hands Yeah Asparagus, according to the old traditional rules of etiquette Is a finger food So if you're served like, you know Asparagus that's not slathered in sauce

That's not cut up into little pieces Like whole asparagus spears Hands finger food I'm shocked People would still People would still look at you weird today Because people wouldn't do that yet But it is actually true

If I were in a fancy restaurant I wouldn't take a chance on, yeah. Yeah. And so, finally, we're finally done with this torturous meal. How do I signal to the waiter that I am done? Put both of your silverware on the edge of your plate. Is it like 135 degrees or something like that? You've definitely heard this before.

Whoa. Yeah, you put your fork and knife on your plate, basically both of them pointing towards the lower right hand corner of the plate. If you put your fork and knife sort of like an upside down V, that means I'm not done. Don't take my plate away. So that's how you can leave your utensils on your plate and get up and go somewhere or do something or talk to somebody, but you're still going to eat more food.

That is, man. Torturous. I'm sure I violate almost all of those. Yeah, me too. Oh, yeah, yeah, every single one. All right, we're going to take a little break. In honor of our sponsor, Warby Parker, I made a little quiz. Cool facts about eyes and vision.

You have some IQs? Yes. Some cues about eyes test your IQ. Oh, I didn't think that far. That was good. Oh, man. All right. I had some I-A's.

I have some I don't know. The first question, what specific animal has the largest eyeball? Whoa. Oh, I think it's the giant squid? Correct. Giant slash colossal squid. The recent recorded eyeball length is 11 inches. Wow.

11 inches across. That's like a basketball. So we always say 20-20 vision, 20-20 vision. What does the 20 actually stand for? Oh. Colin. I think that it's, when you say someone has 20-20 vision, it means they can see at 20 feet what the standard person should be able to see at 20 feet with uncorrected vision.

Correct. So if you have 20-40, that means... That means that I don't have as good vision because I can only see at 20 feet what the standard person should be able to see at 40 feet. Correct. Okay. I'm sure a lot of people go to their optometrist, eye doctor, and they have to go through the test where they see random letters on a chart

and to read different lines. What is that chart? We have to add this. Dana. Was it like Snell? Is that the names? Very close. Snelling?

Snell L-L-E-N. S-N-E-L-E-N. S-N-E-L-E-N, that quintessential chart with the random letters. E-F-P-T-O-Z. Oh, I don't know if it's standard. Oh, I think it is. But can't you just memorize it then? Well.

No. I'm not supposed to cheat. They're doing the text, like they're assuming you haven't memorized the whole thing. Like, you're not. Why would you gain by cheating? I don't want to get it right. Crash my car into a tree. Suckers.

Yeah. That's true. I don't know. Two astronauts up in the space shuttle's like, I cheated on the eye exam. Memorize the letters. I'm actually blind. Speaking of blindness, the name of this visually impaired animal comes from a longer, older, Germanic name that literally means dirt tosser.

Damn. Is it like a blind mole? It is a mole. Mole. Mole comes from the term moldy warp. Huh. And moldy warp. That is such a good word.

And it's M-O-U-L-D-Y-W-A-R-P. Moldy warp. That's really. It means dirt, dirt thrower? Dirt thrower. Dirt-tosser. That's great. Yes, moles have bad vision.

And it's mostly due to the fact they have tiny, tiny, tiny, tiny, tiny, tiny eyes. That's basically a thin membrane behind their snout. So these, so these, quote, eyes allow them to sense light, and that's it. Nothing else. Interesting thing about moles, they have a special ability living in low oxygen places, which makes sense because they live underground or they dig underground. And their bodies are able to reuse the oxygen that's in their body so that they can stay alive.

All right, last eyeball question. What is the white of the eye called? The sclera. Yeah! The sclera. S-C-L-E-R-A. And there you go. There's my cues about eyes, my IQs, inspired by Warby Parker.

And check out Warby Parker.com if you're into glasses and monocles. Yeah, especially monocles. Especially monocles. One, two of them. Spread of each eye. No frills, delivers. Get groceries delivered to your door from No Frills with PC Express. Shop online and get $15 in PC optimum points on your first five orders.

Shop now at nofrills.ca. When Johan Rawl received the letter on Christmas Day 1776, he put it away to read later. Maybe he thought it was a season's greeting in one. wanted to save it for the fireside. But what it actually was, was a warning, delivered to the Heshen Colonel, letting him know that General George Washington was crossing the Delaware and would soon attack his forces. The next day, when Rawl lost the Battle of Trenton and died from two colonial Boxing Day

musket balls, the letter was found, unopened in his vest pockets. As someone with 15,000 unread emails in his inbox, I feel like there's a lesson there. Oh well, this is the constant. a history of getting things wrong. I'm Mark Chrysler. Every episode, we look at the bad ideas, mistakes, and accidents that misshaped our world. Find us at constantpodcast.com or wherever you get your podcasts. You're listening to Good Job Brain.

Smooth puzzles Smart trivia Good job Brain Well since I knew we were going to be talking about manners and etiquette this week And I know that we are all fans of anything Even remotely old-timey I thought it would be fun to dig up an old-timey etiquette book

And I would like to read to you guys some choice selections from Martin's Handbook of Etiquette and Guide to True Politeness, published in 1866 by Arthur Martine. This was written primarily for an American audience, but to kind of bring a European sensibility of manners and etiquette to these rough Americans here. And, you know, it's funny reading through this, a lot of this stuff is kind of still good advice today. It's common sense, especially the stuff around conversation in particular. I think is still the most relevant. It's don't go on and on about yourself. You know, don't talk about all the

nice things you have. Don't put other people down. And it kind of makes sense. But where it deviates from today's sensibilities is where it gets funny to me. It's quite frankly, pretty sexist in a lot of ways. At the minimum, it's just very highfalutin. I mean, and you know, you got to keep in mind that this was written for an audience of people who either were or wanted to be. a little bit upper crust or we're part of society. Well, going back to Chris, you know, the origin of etiquette

is more of a nobility and more of an aristocratic code of conduct. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And not necessarily for everybody. You know, and he covers all the common situations of being at dinner, out at a dance, what to do, you know, again, this is your part of society.

You know, you're going to balls and things like that. You might reasonably expect that's part of your weekly routine. He talks about in, conversation. And again, I think this still bears true today. We next come to the loud talker, the man who silences a whole party by his sole power of lungs. All subjects are alike to him. He speaks on every topic with equal fluency and allows no one else to utter a word. And I think we know this kind of person. We all know that guy. Next to the talker, we have the man who gives an account

of his dogs, horses, lands, books, and pictures. Whatever is his must, he thinks, interest others, and listen, they must. I thought you just stopped at dogs, and I was like, what? He's really into his dogs. Just goes to a party and talks about his dogs. You know, that guy. All night. Somebody secretly at that party is like, I do want his dogs. I'm so interested.

A lot of etiquette and manners revolves around dress, how to dress, what to wear, to wear it, what not to wear. So his advice to a gentleman here is, the dress of a gentleman should be such as not to excite any special observation unless it be for neatness and propriety. Don't call attention

to yourself. Don't be that guy. He's like, hey, everybody, look at me. It's called peacocking. Yes, that's right. That's right. He goes on with some very specific advice to men here, Chris. So I think you and I, we need to measure ourselves against this. Go on. There are four kinds of coats, which he must

have a business coat a frock coat a dress coat and a hoodie and an overcoat so I think I fail on every single account there oh no the hoodies are not on that list maybe it's like an overcoat

yeah no what is a frock coat I don't even know what a frock coat I mean I know I know a business coat or an overcoat but I could not tell you that it opens between a dress coat on a frock coat right and again what about a dress hoodie what are the standards for that Oh, I'll close with its final bit of advice, which again, as I say, still stands today.

Never scratch your head, pick your teeth, clean your nails, or, worse than all, pick your nose in company. All these things are disgusting. Scrash head. Never scratch your head. No, never scratch your head. No, because they didn't have head and shoulders back then. Everybody had terrible dandruff and lice, yeah. Oh, that's true.

It might be a hygiene thing. It is a hygiene. If you scratch your head, all kinds of. He knows what's going to come flying out. Who knows what's going to come popping out of there? But then how do you gesture that you're thinking? I don't know. Let me think about it.

There's no light bolt to go on over your head yet. Pop your monocle off. It pops off automatically when you're surprised. That's just my understanding. Yeah. All right. We have one last segment. Dana.

Drumroll, please. So, Colin, I'm really glad you talked about Martin and all the kind of etiquette prescriptions he had, because I'm going to talk about Emily Post, and what she did for etiquette was a response to that. She was born around the time that that book came out. She was from a really wealthy family, kind of the top of society. So she was this well-to-do woman. She knew all the etiquette. She really adhered to it. She had a very messy divorce because her husband was cheating on her with course girl. I mean, it's not very polite to talk about in polite society, but it's very titillating. There was scandal. She got divorced. She became a novelist. In 1922,

she was 50, she published a book about etiquette and it exploded. It became this huge hit because she distilled a lot of those really convoluted rules into really simple and a fun read for people who are middle class or immigrants to get better integrated into society. Yeah, because there was a lot more social mobility in those days, right? I mean, people were starting to be able to like, oh, I can actually like go from middle class to upper middle class to lower upper class. Like, it's possible. You want people to feel comfortable. That was part of her, what etiquette was. It's not a weapon to wield against people. It's more a tool for being able to be around other people to be respected and you respect them. I like that angle. And it totally shines through in her,

in her book, that that was the angle. And so people really accepted it. She ended up, her book is available on Project Gutenberg. And a lot of the things that she writes in there, I think, are still pretty applicable today. There are a few really funny things that she wrote in there that they feel like they're very strict rules, you know, and it feels like a game almost. And I'll tell you, What some of them were. Okay. She has some really strong rules for how men should use hats, like, to signal things. Here you go.

I'll read this too. A gentleman takes off his hat and holds it in his hand when a lady enters an elevator in which he is a passenger, but he puts it on again in the corridor. A public corridor is like the street, but an elevator is suggestive of a room, and a gentleman does not keep his hat on in the presence of ladies in a house. Right. It's got its logic. There is a logic to it.

Like a Professor Leighton puzzle. Oh, I love this one. She had a thing about the bus where if a woman comes on the bus, a gentleman must offer his seat to her. And the woman says, thank you. And then they move on with their lives. If a gentleman offers a seat to a lady, the other gentleman on the bus must lift their hats to the gentleman who gave the same. Yeah. We see you.

We see you. I love the assumption that everybody is always wearing a hat at all times. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I guess a bus is not like a room in a house, but it's more like a corridor. A bus is more like a mobile, it's like a mobile corridor, Dana. She's really into, like, not being pretentious. And so she has these things never to say, don't try to sound more fancy than you actually are.

She was like, never say, tindered him a banquet, say, gave him a dinner. Never, never say, well, accrued me permission. Say, will you let me or may I? Don't say, I trust I'm not trespassing. Say, I hope I'm not in the way. And finally, say, part of you. took of liquid refreshment say had something to drink right it's like don't be weird yeah yeah yeah don't speak with the long words that you think that people want to hear and that

will be they'll let you know that you're fancy no no it doesn't work that way you're making everybody uncomfortable don't do that yeah yeah yeah it's not polite don't say I just pilfered this automobile say I stole this car oh oh I'm like thank you Chris for making me feel included and the thing you're trying to say See? Also, will you give me a ride? Please and thank you. Oh, man.

Actually, in 1950, she was voted the second most powerful woman in America. Wow. That's how big of an impact her books had and really transformed American manners. And it kind of became like the go-to. It's like, well, Emily Post says X, Y, Z. And you're like, oh, okay, well, conversation settled. It's a really fun read on Project Gutenberg. She's like a snappy writer, and it's very conversational.

she does try to make you feel included with it. Yeah, she did a good job. All right, and that is our manners and etiquette show. Thank you guys for joining me and thank you guys listeners for listening in. Hope you learn a lot about hat tipping. What gestures not to do, origin of handshake. You can find us on iTunes, on Stitcher, on SoundCloud, and on our website, goodjobbrain.com. And check out our sponsor, Warby Parker at Warby Parker.com.

And we'll see you guys. week. Bye. in science. Seth and I are the host. Seth is a scientist. I am Molly and I'm a science journalist and we talk to people smarter than us and we have fun along the way. The show is called Big Picture Science and as Seth said, you can hear it wherever you get your podcasts.