Good News York by Growth Mode Content - GNY EP.102 | Feat. Mark O'Donnell

Episode Date: September 30, 2025

Unlocking the Secrets of Effective Leadership with Mark O'Donnell of Operations Excellence In this episode of Good News York, hosted by Mike, we are joined by Mark O'Donnell, founder of Operations Excellence and host of the podcast 'Operations Excellence'. Mark shares insights into his work helping businesses achieve their goals through coaching, leadership development, and strategic planning. He discusses his background in manufacturing, the importance of people, process, and strategy in any organization, and how he transitioned into consulting after a corporate downsizing. Mark also touches on his passion for mentoring, the challenges of modern workforce dynamics, and the critical role of empathy in leadership. A discussion on the recent controversy at the Ryder Cup and the significance of maintaining professionalism in sports and business rounds out the conversation. 00:00 Welcome to Good News York 00:26 Introducing Mark O'Donnell 00:54 What is Operations Excellence? 05:02 From Downsizing to Consulting 06:31 The Journey to Finding Passion 10:46 The Importance of Mentorship 12:13 The Role of Positive Attitude 20:43 The Value of Relationships 23:41 Diverse Clientele and Industries 29:22 Customizing Client Proposals 29:49 Determining Project Completion 30:49 Ongoing Client Relationships 33:11 Common Industry Problems 36:25 Leadership and Delegation 38:55 Challenges in Leadership 42:47 Upcoming Projects and Workshops 44:47 Ryder Cup Controversy

Instagram teen accounts have automatic protections for what teens see and who can contact them. Plus, time management tools. And Instagram will continue adding built-in safety features to help create age-appropriate experiences. Learn more about teen accounts and Instagram's ongoing work to protect teens online at Instagram.com slash teen accounts. It's a gentle cruising. You start to see the village, almost like a painting. Join me, travel expert Darley,

Newman and Uniworld Boutique River Cruises L' Week Bali to learn about river cruising in France. As we have been setting there for decades, we have been able to create deep connection with the local communities. Local connections make exploring France easy. Tune into the Travels with Darley podcast on IHeart and wherever you listen to podcasts to hear about river cruising and Unirold's 50th anniversary summer specials. All right, good morning and welcome to Good News. York sponsored by Ads on the Go, get ads on the go. Get ads on the go.com. Matt is not with us today.

He is out purchasing different ant farms. He's into ant farms now. It's very strange. But he's a strange man and I love him for it. But I'm not alone. You're not alone. We're here with a very special guest. Dare I say a friend. He is a friend of mine, a friend of growth mode content, a friend of Good News

York. He has a great podcast with us called Operations Excellence. Mr. Mark O'Donnell. Thank you. Thank you, Mike. And I should say not only a podcast called Operation Excellence, that is the name of your company. That is correct. And for those, I mean, look, you and I, we go way back now.

Obviously, I know what you do. Matt knows what you do. But for some of those that are listening or watching that haven't had the pleasure to meet you yet, explain a little bit about yourself and Operation Excellence. So I'm going to take that in reverse. I'll talk about Operations Excellence a little bit and what I do now with Operation Excellence and then I'll maybe still want me to give you a little. Love that.

Quick background on. me. So operations excellence, people ask what I do. I try to stay away from the term business consultant because most people, when they hear that, like reach for their wallet to hang on to it to make sure the one's still there, right? Kind of car salesman or something, right? It's got some negative connotation. What I really do is I work with business owners, business leaders to help them achieve the goals that they desire. And how do we do that? You know, the tagline. I use is turning obstacles into assets, right? There's things that are stopping you from achieving the results that you desire, and whether that's individually or for an organization, right? So how do

I do that? Do that through one-on-one coaching in some cases. I am a certified business coach, and really the whole method that we use there is really reverts back to what's known as the Socratic method, right, which is answering an answer with another question. and continuing to question and peeling the onion, and we call it getting the top spinning, right, to help the client really get to a different level of understanding, and hopefully to help them kind of turn the issue they're looking at more 360, so they can come at it from different angles and come to a better answer, and then help them drive to the results to overcoming that.

We also do leadership development, team building. I do sales development, strategic planning. It really boils down to if somebody is struggling with one of three things. And in many cases, it is one of these three things, which is people processing strategy, right, with an organization. And, you know, it's funny because if you would have asked me when I started my business, who my clients would have been, I would have guessed probably mostly manufacturing. because that was, you know, how I spent most of my adult life, was in manufacturing-type companies. I do have some manufacturing clients, but they are not the majority of my business clients right now. But you think about it, any organization, it still comes down to people processing strategy.

And that's true if it's for-profit or not-for-profit, right? I have some not-for-profit clients now as well, really helping them predominantly with strategy. And it's interesting because they understand the need for a strategic plan. And a lot of them, in some cases, haven't been exposed to really the methodology that helps you not only establish a really solid strategic plan, but helps you implement that plan and really drive to the results that you're trying to get to. That's fantastic. So that's what I do. Yeah. Well, and you do it so well.

You know, even in the way that you speak on your podcast, but also in the way that you speak when we just have regular conversations, you're just so, I don't know what the word I'm looking for, but it's just you're very thought-provoking. You think about the little bit of, you know, the little details. And you really, what strikes me about you the most is you can tell that this is something that you just don't do as a, as a career. now. It's something you're passionate about. Where did you find that passion? Like what, what,

what kind of when you were, because you retired, you said you were working in manufacturing. Well, not exactly. Oh, okay. We'll get to that a minute. We'll get to that a minute. Yeah, talk about that. What, how did you go from, from retiring and then getting into the, the business consulting? So you ask me a couple things, and I'll answer how I got there and what happened. Sure. And, but, but also about the passion. Yeah. And I'll try to address that as well. So I was general manager for a local company, which is owned by a company from out based in the Midwest, a bigger corporation, and was general manager there for four and a half, I guess, almost five years. And they decided in the summer, July of 2021, that they didn't need the general manager position in Syracuse anymore. So I was downsized.

Here's your package. Thanks for the memories. So when I came home, of course, my wife was like, oh, my God, what are we going to? to do and I showed her the package and she said oh well what are you going to do so I'm going to go play golf and figure out what I want to do yeah right says you know they gave me a decent package and frankly at that point and again I won't mention the company it's irrelevant but um I never I always enjoyed what I did as far as the day to day right and the people and um and we were a manufacturing company, amongst other things. We, you know, we had a kind of a project-based business.

And it was a lot of fun. I had a chance to travel the world, went to Vietnam, and spent, you know, off and on for almost five years going back and forth to Vietnam and developing relationships with suppliers there. And that was incredibly gratifying and just a real growth experience for me. So a lot of great experiences. But anyways, so I'm downsized and what do I want to do? So I had always thought, you know, my background, I have an undergraduate degree in industrial engineering from Syracuse University, go orange, and went back to school.

I got promoted in my early 30s, and this is something that I take with me in my business now, and I tell the story of this is what happens at a lot of businesses, right? I mean, I was identified as a high performer in my early 30s and was promoted. promoted literally on a Friday was an engineer and on Monday I'm an engineering manager. Wow. Right. And now they had talked to me about it. Sure.

Offered the job and all that. So what training did I get? Well, they gave me a little training, if you will, on HR policies, right? And how to do reviews and, you know, a handshake and good luck. And the reality is being a worker and being a leader, it's two different skill sets. 100%. Right? And what happened, what I described, you know, basically is what happens even today still in a lot of companies.

High performers get identified. They get promoted into management positions. And they may or may not succeed if they figure it out or if they've developed management leadership skills, right, of their own on their own journey. But a lot of companies just still don't understand. More companies now are, by the way, but some still don't. It's totally different. Just because somebody is good at doing doesn't mean they're going to be good at leading. 100%.

Simply put. So anyways, I had, and by the way, in my 30s, I did go back to school part-time while I was working and got my MBA from a morning college. Another great experience. Go Dolphins. So, you know, two of the local colleges. Yeah. Yeah. Love it.

Finished my degree, by the way. I took what was called the study abroad option at the end of the program. and actually went to Poland for two weeks to finish my degree, where we actually did some coursework with a professor at the University of Warsaw and got to tour around the country. It was fascinating. That was 2003, which was only, what, maybe 10, 15 years after the fall of the Iron Curtain. Yeah.

So that was a really fascinating time. So anyways, I had thought about years back, even as an engineer and then a young manager, the thought had crossed my mind multiple times about consulting, starting my own gig, right? And I had talked to a few people off and on different points in my career, just never pursued it. So anyways, July of 21, here I am. I don't have a job.

I'm in my, what, mid to late 50s, I guess later 50s at that point. What do I want to do? I wasn't ready to retire. And my wife is younger than I, so I'm thinking, well, I probably want to and, you know, need to keep working for a while. Yeah. And so I thought about the consulting thing. And then the engineer in me said, okay, let's do our homework.

So I started picking some people's brains, a few people that had made the transition from corporate to doing their own gig as a consultant. And I heard some great things. And a couple of the really key things I took away was, number one, figure out what you love to do, what really got your juices flowing during your career. Focus on that. And you'll not only be successful, but you'll be happy. Absolutely.

Right? And that's one of the other key thing was that I heard was get connected with a network. And there's a lot of reasons for that, right? So, okay. So I took some time. I really took some time and thought about what in my career was I happiest? What made me happy? What did I love to do?

You know, when I felt really energetic. What was I doing? So I boiled it down to two simple things, right? The engineer in me, and when they train you and teach you to think like an engineer, you don't unlearn that. Right. Even though I haven't practiced as an engineer in probably, I don't know, 25 plus years, I still think that way. And so I love solving problems. I love figuring stuff out, right?

That's an engineer. Check that box. The other thing was I've had multiple opportunities even as a young leader, a young manager, right through my years in executive roles, I've had the opportunity to mentor other people. And that was incredibly, incredibly fulfilling. You know, to see the light bulb go on for somebody else

and to see them take the next step or the next steps in their professional life and not only their career, but to see their life change. It's got to be rewarding. It's so cool. I mean, and you realize, look, like, I didn't do that. But if I was a conduit and assisted in that in some small way, wow. Especially if you help them avoid some of the pitfalls that you went into.

That alone is like, listen, I'm the ghost of Christmas future. Listen to me. And that's a big thing, right? But I, you know, in touring and now in coaching and helping people develop and whether it's a newly minted manager or somebody who's aspiring to be a manager or even somebody who's new to an executive role, you know, anywhere on that, or somebody that's been in an executive role and desires to have some coaching because we can all benefit from it, right? But one of the big things that I really bring to the table, and I did when I was mentoring, is really being a positive voice and a positive reinforcement, you know, because what holds us back the most is us. is our own self-doubt. So much.

Right? And I talk a lot in my coaching about, I call it the formula, right? And now people, you know, if I show a slide or I write it out for them, of course, people who are not technical, their eyes start spinning in different directions. Right. But, you know, once you explain it, and it's very simple, right? How do you get improved results, whether that's personally, professionally, or organizationally, right? Well, you have to have positive behavior change. Right?

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probably say, yeah, that makes total sense. But the secret sauce, I like to call it, that goes with that, that people don't always associate with this, is attitude. Right? So you take that, that positive attitude, right, and that growing positive attitude, couple that with new skills and knowledge that you're honing and continually learning better how to use. Think of somebody who's trained as a carpenter or in some trade, right? They got a set of tools. And at the beginning, they kind of know how to use them because they've gone through the training. But 20 years later, they really know how to use them. Because they're doing it. They're doing it. Exactly. So it's the same thing. But that secret sauce of the attitude, and that is a huge role that I play

because I'm kind of that voice, you know, kind of the Jiminy Cricket in a positive way that says, yeah, you can do this. And then once they start, you know, little steps, right? And you help them walk through achieving some small goals. Now it creates what we call that internal engine. And it's this self-fueling, self-feeding engine that everybody, this is kind of human nature. Once I'm introduced to goal achievement and I get a little taste of achieving some goals, now you want more.

I want more because it feels good. Like I set this goal. and did it. I can do that. Look at that. Wow. And then, you know, it takes it another step and another stuff. So that's that positive attitude, and that is a huge part that I play. Because, you know, anybody, even without my background and my experience, almost anybody could probably introduce many of the skills, skill sets and knowledge that I do, whether it's in an individual program or in group programs. But that attitude, and then, you know, you mentioned it too, you know, they're getting the 35 plus years of my experience. And you're absolutely right. Some of the most important lessons

I've learned were not from successes. They were from complete failures and falling on my face. That's become cliche with social media, but it is so damn true. That's just real life. It is completely real life. But here's the differences, right? Some people are unwilling to share that because they haven't gotten comfortable in their own skin with the fact that they fail. You know, one of the things I talk about in leadership development is, and we used this example of Abraham Lincoln. And most people don't realize Lincoln failed at pretty much everything he touched. His story is amazing.

Everything. And yet he learned from it and moved on. Every time he learned from it and move on. And the point is, if you are going to achieve anything in life, and I'm not just talking, you know, become the CEO and no it translates everywhere multi-million dollar home and a Ferrari and a driveway whatever success and that's the other thing as an individual you get to decide what success looks like for you not what society thinks or your brother thinks or your wife thinks or your or your boss thinks it's what does success look like for you and that really is what's my life's purpose what are my dreams

and aspirations what are my values that those things become the north star when I define my goals Oh, I love that. Right. And so it's just, it is so cool to, you know, I was out, I told you before we started the podcast this morning. I just got back Sunday from Southern California. Yeah. And one of my bigger clients is in Southern California. I had chance to talk quite a bit with him and stuff he's going on.

But, and we were joking about, you know, he's got, I don't know, 4, 450 employees in his company. I met and worked with and know personally. like over a hundred of them. And it's just, you know, even to hear him say, you know, and yeah, does it feed my ego? Yeah, I'm human. But it's very gratifying in a humbling way to hear from his mouth what his people say about me and how I, they feel I've helped them. That's not.

And yeah, is that a great sales marketing tool? Well, yeah, but on a human level, that's what gets me up in the morning. That's amazing. You know, that's why I love what I do, because. you see the light bulb go on. You see somebody's life change. And you see them, you know, I call it the aha moment. I had a coaching call yesterday afternoon with one of the folks from Southern California.

And he's a regional manager, very, very bright young man, very successful. And he's working through some things. And as we're kicking stuff back and forth, he's like, I got to write that down. But, you know, he, by the time in a 40-minute conversation, you know, walked away with some good tidbits for him. And again, what did it really do? You know, was I, was I the answer guy? No, you know, I don't purport to be the answer man. But through that back and forth, he came to two or three nuggets that are going to help him address some things he's dealing with right now from a different perspective. I was just going to say, you're giving

perspective. That's what you're doing. And a sounding board in a lot of ways. You know, it's funny. Yeah, my buddy out in California that runs that company, he says, yeah, you're my professional, you're my business therapist. And I laugh. Very similar. You know, and in some way, and I get it, you know, because there's a value to that. Because having sat on that side of the desk for so long, there's a lot of things that you can't talk about in detail. in the building. You just can't for multiple different reasons,

whether it involves personnel issues or, you know, there is just something that, you know, and it might be timing, you know, because, you know, if you're in the middle of an acquisition or a merger, those things. Yeah, yeah. Right, for obvious reasons. And there's a lot of things that go on.

But anyways, to have somebody who you can talk to about anything, who you know and trust, you know, it's going to stay with them. Those details are going to go to the, grave. Right. There's a huge value in that because sometimes just getting stuff off our chest, it's like a, it's like a release valve in the picture cooker, you know? Yeah, I remember before I went into therapy, I just remember thinking the first time going and saying to myself, you know, I'm going through this, I'm going through that, I feel like this. How is talking about it going

I do anything? I don't need to talk about it. I just need to feel better. Yeah. Well, guess what? After the first session, you know, a few hours later, I'm like, hey, you know, I feel pretty good. You felt better. There's the proof. Right, right. Man, you said so much there. I have so many thoughts going through. I want to circle back real quick to when you said, you know,

you didn't learn anything from, not that you don't learn anything from successes, but you learn more from the failures. And again, I know that's kind of a cliche thing maybe these days, but if you think about it, because you and I always, we love golf and we talk about it, you're talking about it doesn't just translate to being the CEO and this and that. It's in everything.

Like, think back to how many bad golf shots you've had and how many, did you learn anything after you hit a good one? You're like, no, that's great. Look at that. You learn when you're like, why did I just duff it? Oh, you know what? I wasn't addressing the ball correctly. I was in the, you know, my foot was in the wrong position, whatever it is.

So it really does translate. Well, I would say, you know, that's very true. The analogy you use about golf, and one of the reasons I love golf is it is very much like life. But we'll get back to that. Sure. what I wanted to stress is business, like all of life, is about relationships. Oh. Right.

It's about human relationships, right? And so as I learn these things, I'm not just taking them into the workplace to become a better leader. Hopefully, when I go home, I'm a better spouse or or significant other, or parent, or sibling, or son, or friend, right? Because I am better able to connect. I become a better listener. I'm more tuned in to, you know, the emotions and not just what people are feeling that I care about, but why. And, you know, that word empathy, and I'm sorry, empathy is not a made-up word, right? There's a lot of science behind it.

And the truth is, if you don't have empathy, you're going to struggle with really making truly deep human connections. And that's not Mark. That is social science and years of social science behind it. And that's been my personal experience. When I've struggled with connecting with others, it's because I'm not either understanding how they feel and or not understanding why they feel that way. And that doesn't mean I agree with them. It's just I don't understand.

Mm-hmm. Right. You know, I tell my kids all the time that relationships are one of the most important things throughout your life making relationships and that doesn't mean you need to have a hundred friends it just means whenever you're at a party or you're at an event or you're at work when you make connections with people I always say you know take the time to just have a meaningful try to make everybody feel good in some way or just have a meaningful conversation with somebody I would not be sitting here without the network of friends acquaintances and people I've met

along the way, whether that's in the professional, my professional career or my personal life. Somehow, you know, all these times in my life where I thought, I'm not where I should be, right? You probably run into that a lot. I thought I'd be farther ahead than where I am. And I've wasted all this time. Come to find out, wherever I get to in life, I find out that it's, none of that was a wasted time because that connection that I made four years ago helped me here. And again, it doesn't even have to be professionally, just personally. It's so, It's so important. One thing I wanted to ask you was, is there a specific type of client tell, a clientele that you have?

Is it a bunch of different industries that you work in? And the second part of that question is, when do you know, when do they come to you for advice? Is it usually when you're on the ground floor and they're starting their business? Or is it usually when they run into problems they come to you? How does that work? So I'll answer the first question first. I know. I like throw five questions at once.

I'm sorry. You're testing my brain. It's a good time. Add some extra coffee. I know. That's cool. I'm teasing you. No, I don't have one industry, you know, that I'm focused on.

And again, if you would have asked me when I started operations excellence, if that would have been true, I probably would have said, oh, yeah, it'll be manufacturing. Well, I love manufacturing and I know a lot about it. But come to find out, again, people process strategy applies to pretty much. any kind of industry. So, you know, I certainly market and have joint, you know, manufacturing associations, industry associations. I'm a member of the Northeast Dairy Association, which is not just farmers, it's also processors.

Sure. Right? And the whole logistics part of that industry, which I played in a golf tournament this summer for that group. and I met a lot of interesting people, and I learned so much that I didn't know, you know, but that's the inquisitive part of me that I love learning about different businesses, distribution businesses like the HVAC distribution business. I knew very little about HVAC, you know, and certainly, I mean, distribution, yeah,

I've dealt with distribution as part of manufacturing companies before, so I know a little bit about that. So to answer your question, no, I would say it's more of, about the mechanics of how the organization is set up and run and the size. What do what I mean by that? I won't say I'll never do business with a huge corporation, but they're not really my target audience. And the primary reason for that is for somebody like me, right, I'm a one-man show.

I do the sales. I do the marketing. I'm doing the work with the clients, which I love. love, and it's great to be your own boss. It's got its pluses and minuses. It's a gentle cruising. You start to see the village, almost like a painting. Join me, travel expert Darley Newman and Univorl Boutique River Cruises L'ouique Bali to learn about river cruising in France. As we have been sailing there for decades, we have been able to create deep connection with the local communities. Local connections make exploring France easy.

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or to learn more at LiquidDeath.com. Right, but I really learned how to enjoy that. But, you know, with the corporate, the bigger potential clients or clients, there's a lot of decision makers, and it takes a long time to work through that process, which is something I don't have really the time nor the inclination to spend my that way. Yeah. Now again, if if things worked out and I got connected with and could help a bigger organization, sure, right? I'm not going to say no if it's a good fit, right? Absolutely.

But but you know what I find is that the the mid-size to small organization, again, doesn't really matter the industry. What really matters is is the decision maker or are the decision makers involved. And usually it's only one or two people, right, that I'm dealing with either an owner or, you know, a couple of executives, right, that are kind of running the company. Do they understand they have a need and have I been able to connect with them and help them see that I can be a valued partner and bring something to the table to help not provide answers to them, but facilitate them overcoming the obstacles that are there. and turning those obstacles into assets so that they can therefore achieve the goals that they desire.

So is it a good fit? You know, what was the other part of the last part of your question? The last part of the question was just, do you find that your clients are coming to you in the beginning, you know, when the company opens? New companies or existing companies? Yeah, it's been both. A little bit of both. Yeah, I've actually had two recent startups, you know, basically, individuals. individuals that had kind of a side hustle, if you will, and they wanted it to make it their

primary gig. And they had either already established a company, an entity, or were on the verge doing that and had been kind of doing something on the side for months or years and saw the need that, you know what, I need some help strategizing, right? And so helped those folks in both cases with strategic planning, right? We took them through the detail process, really developing, you know, a detailed strategic plan and then actually help them kind of facilitate the review of the plan and a regular cadence to make sure they're implementing it. And then also did some one-on-one coaching with them and they needed help in different areas. One of them, for instance, recognized the need that they were really bad at time management and really needed some

some help with that and uh and we were able to help them that's amazing yeah and and you know also you know like i talk about you know the company in california um they've been in existence for 33 going on 34 years so they're not new you know very successful they've gone from six branches to 52 branches um very very successful company but you know the the conversation with them started off and this was just two friends having a conversation, you know, my buddy had definitely understood, totally has understood for years, the value of promoting from within,

wants to do that and has done that. But from his own experience, had mixed results because, drum roll, please, he wasn't providing them the opportunity to develop those skills. And so he knew he had to do that. And so when I came to him and said,

yeah, this is what I can do for you, and here's how I do it, and here's how it works, And I said, oh, by the way, you know, I bet you because I know him, right, he's got a finance background. So a lot like engineers, he did his homework. And I said, let me tell you what you probably found. You could go online and you're going to get this and here's what it probably cost you. And he goes, yep, that's about right.

I say, well, here's what I can do. And we'll customize a program, but here's a general range of what it's going to cost. And here's what that will likely include. From there, we developed a proposal and did it. And, you know, has since continued to work with them for three and a half years. That's amazing. With what you do, is it hard to, how do you know, I feel funny asking this, but it's a legit question.

How do you know when you're done, right? Like when, how do you know when, hey, I, you know. From a business standpoint, hopefully you're never done. Sure. Right. I mean like from you helping a client. When do you know like, all right, you know what? I've done all I can do here.

Well, so I'll take that from a little different approach to answer that. The way I work is. You know, I don't typically have an open-ended engagement, right? I will give them a proposal. The proposal will say, here's what we together have identified as what you're trying to achieve. Here's what we have identified as the obstacle. Here's the statement of work. Here's what I'm going to deliver.

Here's the deliverables. Right? Here's the results. Here's the cost. It's pretty black and white. I love that. Right. And so that's how I know when we're done is with that body of work.

But what typically happens is let's say I take a group of individuals for people through a leadership development program. What often happens, not always, but what often happens is now those people have gone through the program. Now they say, hey, you know, maybe one, two, or all four of them, I want some ongoing coaching. right so now maybe we set up a couple 30 minute calls a month and we it allows them to continue to have an outside sounding board but it also now they have somebody that's going to check in with them they have accountability for this is now we're talking about their own ongoing development right so there's high value in that and that's something that happens a lot or they become engaged with me and other things come up through conversations and more work i mean it's it tells me that i must

be doing something right to date anyways. Of course. Knock on wood. I have not had a single client that has been one and done. Every single one of them has come back for more work. That is great. Whether it was immediately or, you know, over a short period of time. Which goes back to what you said at the beginning. They got rewarded and now they wanted more.

They were seeing the results. Well, they see the value. You're delivering a value. And, you know, I also understand, hey, at some point in time, you know, maybe they go away for some period of time, but, you know, the relationship is there. You're always on call. You know, well, yeah, you know, and it's funny you say that because one of the things I offer, you know, let's say I'm doing one-on-one coaching, intensive one-on-one.

Like I took one client through an executive leadership development program, one-on-one, right, which was awesome. This individual was at a perfect place in their career and in their life and saw that value and was like a sponge. And it was so much fun working. with that individual. They've gone on, and now they're a regular client with coaching.

A couple more questions, because I know you've got to get out of here, and I could talk to you all day. I love talking to you. I love talking to you, Mark. Mark O'Donnell, of course, operations excellence here on Good News, York. A couple more questions.

Do you find, you know, I feel like in every industry across the board, no matter where you're located, there are always kind of some common problems and with what you do, you work with so many different clients, so many different companies. Do you find you run into a lot of repeat problems throughout different companies? Are there common ones? What are some of those?

Some of the things you hear a lot. You hear a lot culture, right? Yes. Organizational, which comes up a lot in, you know, one of the tools I have is called Dialogue, and I won't bore you with the acronym and what it means, but it's basically an organizational assessment tool. It uses an online survey coupled with one-on-one interviews that I do to add context to it. And it produces a report, which is wonderful because it really shows where the disconnects are.

Right, right. And the disconnect could be, you know, well, the CEO or the president or owner of the company thinks the culture is this. And as you work through all parts of the organization, all the way down to the people that are making the product or shipping the product or whatever, doing the work, they see it something else, and those two things are very disconnected. Well, why is that? So we help identify why those are, where those disconnects are, what we need to do to overcome them, and then we can help companies overcome them. That's awesome. Yeah. So that's one of the things. The other thing with the strangeness of the workforce now, and we've talked about this before, and I've talked about it on my podcast, but, you know, you've got this really generational change

going on in the workforce, meaning baby boomers, which I'm of the tail end of, right, are aging out of the workforce, retiring, et cetera. A lot of that happens starting during the pandemic and it has accelerated since then. So for the first time in decades, the baby boomers are not the majority of the workforce. And so all the generations behind are coming in and that's changed the dynamics. But what I'm getting at is what I hear from clients and potential clients is they're struggling to attract and retain quality talent. Yeah. Right?

Because those generations behind want different things, right? And they're kind of in the driver's seat in some cases. And that's starting to change back. But for a number of years, you know, coming out of the pandemic, and now again it is starting to change a little bit. But we had a dynamic where the worker, the labor force, was in the driver's seat. Yeah. And that's starting to tilt back.

the other way a little bit. But still, the truth is this. If you want quality talent, you've got to have reasons other than just the pay and benefits that people are going to come and want to be part of your organization. Absolutely. And there's a lot to that. So there's that. Secession planning is another thing, you know. You've got generations that were the founders of companies. They're, you know, my age are a little older and they want to transition out. And they may have sons or daughters or both that, you know, they want to come on. And so how do we make that transition? That's amazing. That's fantastic. One thing I learned, you know, you're talking about leadership. It's my last question. One thing I had heard over the years that stuck with me,

there was one thing I heard, which was leadership is not about doing everything. It's knowing when to dole out responsibility. It's not, I have to be in control. I have to, you know, I've got to do at all. It's no, I'm going to, I am going to take care of this aspect, but I'm going to delegate. That's the right word. Yeah. What are some kind of common misconceptions about leadership that you've found along the way? Well, to first talk about delegating, that is a big deal, right? Because if you're coming from a place where you're a high performer, let's just say, as an engineer, you're really good at this piece of engineering and you understand how to do this. And you're good, you're a good analyst, you're good at getting results, you're good at figuring and stuff.

out, now you become the leader. It's really not your job anymore. Your job is to help others do that and do it well and set them up for success to do it. So delegating is something we talk a lot about in leadership development. And one of the keys there is don't delegate task. Delegate responsibility. So let's use an example of let's say I want you to take over the quality control of a certain product. You don't want that. Or service. Right?

I don't say, okay, you need to test that widget. Here's exactly how you test it and measure it. Here's, you know, that's a task. I tell you, you're in charge of the quality coming off of that product production line. Here's what we used to do or we've done so far. If you find a better way, great. But here's the defect rate that's got to be better than X. so I gave you parameters, but you're in charge.

And yeah, you can keep doing it the way we're doing it, or you can do it a different way. That's a responsibility, right? Big difference, because if I'm just delegating task, you're not learning anything, right? So delegation should be part of the... It's a gentle cruising. You start to see the village, almost like a painting.

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Ownership. I trust you. I trust you. And I know you can do this. I'm not just handing you the keys to the car for a night. I'm giving you the title to it. Nice. Right?

What a great answer. So that's a big thing. And, you know, there's lots of misconceptions about, you know, leadership. Ultimately, you know, your role as a leader, you're only successful if your team is successful. So you, your job is to serve your team, set them up for success, to put them in position, you know, to have the best opportunity to succeed. And so, you know, most people think, oh, leadership is that you get the great office and more pay, you know, better bonuses. And that may all be true, right?

But the truth is leadership can be at times, right, somewhat thankless. and kind of lonely place, right, which, again, is a little bit of a pitch for what I do. Like, I can, you know, help, right? Because I understand there's stuff that you, you know, the buck stops with you. You're going to make decisions and guess what? The other thing you've got to understand is

you're almost never going to make everybody happy. Oh, boy. And if you have 10 people in an organization that you're responsible for, somebody, you're going to make a decision or decisions, right? and somebody's going to second guess you, that comes with the territory. But hopefully you've built the kind of relationships where even though people might disagree with the decision, they understand, right, that your motivation is making decisions in the best interest of the organization,

which is the people as a whole, right, that they trust you and that you're doing that. So, yeah, I think people, you know, get in that role sometimes, and they see the external stuff, what they don't see is behind the scenes, and you're going to be faced with making difficult decisions. Yeah. You know? Yeah. Don't ever lose your humanness. That would be the other thing.

You know, I can remember one of the worst feelings I've ever had in a leadership role. I was with a local company. I was the VP of operations, and the company was struggling financially. And we had done some layoffs, but we actually had to lay off 22 managers. just in the local operations. And these were people that I knew. I knew their spouses. I knew their kids.

And I could have not been personally involved in those meetings. I could have let HR handle it. I told the VP of HR I want to be in every meet because those people had earned that. Even if they wanted to go off on me and, you know, tell me to, you know, blank off and whatever. And so I sat through 22 meetings in one day. God bless you, man. And yeah, I will tell you, I will tell you emotionally, I went home pretty well drained. Sure.

But, you know, in hindsight, I'm glad I did it because it was the right thing to do. It's leadership. That is a prime example of leadership. And to circle back again to what you said earlier, you gave yourself a responsibility. You said, you know what, it's my responsibility to face these people face to face. Well, you got to own up. Yeah. You know, those are difficult times and it wasn't personal, right?

were business decisions, but it involved people so it was personal. And you were able to convey the empathy that you felt. Even though the decision wasn't made, you know, to hurt anybody, right, it was going to affect people's lives in a negative way. And so they had a right, had earned that right through their, you know, time with the company and dedication to the company over years to have that face time. You're amazing. You know, sometimes you just got to accept that and bite the bullet, you know. Mark O'Donnell, Operation Excellence is the name of the company. But Operation Excellence is the name of your podcast that you do with us here at growth mode content. Got anything coming up that we should know about on the show or if you want to talk about what's going on?

Well, I will say this. I am, as I told you before, there's some stuff we're working on that I'm not going to talk about because I don't want potential competitors beating us to the punch. But I will say this. I am working on a joint workshop with one of my clients who's actually been. become a close friend as well. And you've met Joanne and Brad from distinctive voices, right? My friends from the performing arts world. Yeah, they were fun. So we're putting together a joint workshop, which Joanne and I are going to do together, and I'm coming at it from the leadership development world that I know and that I'm involved in. And she's coming from the performing arts

world as far as developing your voice, right, and how to really utilize your presence and your voice to command a room. And there's a lot that goes with that. So we're bringing this joint workshop out sometime this fall, hopefully. We had a little setback. They had some stuff going on that we were supposed to kind of finalize some things a few weeks back. But hopefully here, before the fall is over, we'll get that rolled out. And we've got some other exciting stuff we're working on. and when we're ready to roll it out, I'd love to come back and chat with you. You can come here anytime, my friend. What are the plugs?

Give us the website, business name, anything you want to plug for the... OperationsExcellence.com, and that is Operations Excellence without the E in Excellence, because somebody else already had that domain name. Oh. OperationsExcellance.com. Yeah, great website. There's a lot of testimonials on there. It explains what I do, how I do it.

please reach out to me if you'd like some more information and certainly the first consultations and conversations are always free of charge so even if you just want to talk and see if it's a good fit give me a call thanks and this guy's a fun guy to talk to he's my friend he's Mark O'Donnell Mark real quick before we go Rider Cup you and I are big golf fans

what'd you think about the kind of the riffraff with the crowd that seems to be in the media I uh what's your opinion on that I'm embarrassed I am too. I am embarrassed as an American golfer. Yeah. An American golf fan. I don't know how they let that get so out of hand.

That's not what that event is about. And I think I'm proud of the fact that, you know, whether it was Tiger Woods and Tom Watson and others have come out and spoke very strongly and said, you know, look, that's not what this is about, right? It's a competition. and if you want to go and support your team and, you know, that's great. Yeah. But, you know, somebody had a great observation

I happened to see on social media last night. They weren't like, take the match between Scotty and Rory. Right. Cheer for Scott. I didn't hear a lot of people cheering for Scotty. They're cheering against Rory. Yeah.

And I'm sorry, but that it's an embarrassment. You're an embarrassment, right? If you're that angry, of a person, you got issues, you know? Yeah, I'm sorry, there's something wrong with, I don't think, and this is, this, you know, gets more into psychology, right? It's crowd behavior, right? Like, people in a crowd will say and do things they would not do if it was just.

That's right. That's right. And so to me, I'm sorry, but you're a coward. You're a coward, right? If you have this anger or whatever going on and that's how you have to act it out, you're a coward. Absolutely. Right?

All right. Be a man. being adult, right? Don't, it's just, it's totally uncalled for it. I will tell you, not only did the European team win that, and I mean, the Americans made a nice call, I was actually on the flight from the West Coast and was able to watch the last hour or so of the singles matches. Yeah. The U.S. made a run. It was fun. I thought it was good. It would have been. It got a real interesting. It would have been the greatest comeback in the last couple hours. But not only do the European team win the match, but you know what?

And again, I don't necessarily, I won't fault any of the U.S. players. But the European team showed a ton of class. A ton. Now, did they, there was some things said. Yeah, yeah. You know, I don't blame them. I mean, frankly, I think, you know, knowing me, I would have had a hard time not reacting more than it. Yeah.

Right. Right. I mean, I know there was a few times, you know, where some four-letter expletives got thrown back at the crowd from players. but the whole thing. Shamus. Bottom line, and I understand, I've seen, I'm old enough, I've seen a lot of rider cups, and in Europe,

the fans are, you know, boisterous and loud, but they don't do that. No, and, you know, this was my first taste of feeling like, like, you know, get off my lawn, old man yells at Cloud, because I'm usually all for the party atmosphere at those kind of events. If you remember, the waste management open for a long time,

they've rained it back a little bit, but that was a party, but you never saw it cross the line. And this was like, even if the U.S. had come back and won that match, I don't think I would have felt good because I feel like we lost just social. It was just embarrassing. It was stained. It was a, it's a. It overshadowed.

It overshadowed the actual competition. I think it's a real black eye to American golf. And I think, you know, we've got a, we could talk for a whole other episode. I know. You know, there is something wrong with our culture if that. If anybody doesn't think that was an embarrassing. I'd love to have a conversation with it because I'm sorry. That's not acceptable behavior.

That's what's going on in the country right now is there's a lot of it. And social media plays a role, but I just think, I just think. It's okay. You know, it's okay. I'm okay with the party atmosphere. Of course. That's the best. Every major.

It's fun. Personally, I've in person been to every golf major except Augusta. And that's a bucket list item, right? Yeah. I apply for tickets every year. You know, I mean, yeah, there's a lot of jobs. can go on at those events. They sell a lot of beer.

Sure. And the corporate hospitality tents are pouring, you know, top shelf booze. Yeah. You know, so it's flowing. They need to get edibles. Just give everybody edibles. They'll just chill out. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You know, but, you know, you don't see that kind of, you know, behavior. It's just, again, I'm sorry. It's not, it's not right. I didn't like it. I didn't like it. Bottom line, I was, I was embarrassed as a American. I was, too, man. I was too.

And again, I felt like an old man for a second, but I was like, no, this isn't being an old man. This is my morals. Like, there's a line and we can party without being complete a-holes. And that's what we were. And it sucks. But, yeah, I would just leave it at, you know what, cheer for your team, but basically harassing and the things that they were saying. Yeah. I mean, those were not.

It was getting personal. It was very personal attacks. And that's not, you know what? Not appropriate. No. When you see behavior like that or people freaking out in like, you know, in traffic. Yeah. Because of therapy, right?

I've learned that it has nothing to do with Rory McElroy. It has nothing to do with your road rage. There's something more going on behind the scenes and you spilled over. And that's why, you know, we mental health is important. But anyway, Mark O'Donnell, operations excellence. You're my friend. You're a friend of the show. We love you.

You're amazing at what you do. Thank you for coming on. By the way, I love what you do. I love your sports show. Oh, well, I'm giving it a shot. You're a sports geek, and I appreciate that because so am I. I love it. I love it.

I love it. Well, hey, listen, Matt and Danny decided that they wanted me to give this a shot. I wasn't sure if I could do it. I gave it one episode. They're your positive reinforcement. They are my positive reinforcement. I gave it a shot, and I feel like the first. All done, Danny.

The first one went well. We'll just continue to try to get better. But anyway, Mark O'Donnell Operations Excellence, that is it for Good News York, sponsored by Ads on the Go, get Ads on the Go. Dot com. We will be back tomorrow. Again, Mark O'Donnell Operations Excellence.

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