Halford & Brough in the Morning - A Handshake Brouhaha

Episode Date: May 29, 2025

In hour two, Mike & Jason chat the latest baseball news with MLB Network's Adnan Virk (1:25), plus they look ahead to tonight's Oilers Stars matchup with NHL Network's Mike Kelly (29:15), as Edmonton looks to book their second straight trip to the Stanley Cup Final. This podcast is produced by Andy Cole and Greg Balloch. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

It's time to chat with Adnan It's Adnan Ferkey's on the show We're gonna talk some baseball And take a trip to the silver screen That's right, it's time for Red Nen. Yes, Ed and Ferg, he joins us now. We'll head out to the ball game and talk about all the filthy scene. Seven o'clock on a Thursday. Happy Thursday everybody. Halford Brough, Sportsnet 650. Halford and Rev of the Morning is brought to you by Sands and

Associates, PC's first and trusted choice for net help with over 3,000 five star reviews. Visit them online at sans-trustee.com. We are in hour two of the program. Adnan Burke from MLB network is going to join us in just a moment here to kick off hour two. Hour two is brought to you by Jason Hominuk at jason.mortgage. If you love giving the banks more of your money, then don't let Jason shop around to find the perfect mortgage for you. Visit them online at jason.mortgage. We are coming to you live from the Kintec studio,

Kintec footwear and orthotics working together with you in step. Our next guest comes courtesy of the hotline powered by Power West Industries. It's Adnan Virk from MLB network here on the Halford and Brough show on Sportsnet 650. Morning Adnan, how are you? Doing great, Mike J. Hope you guys are well. Um, I was just looking at some numbers about Juan Soto. I mean, this is stunning. Fellas. He's now hitting 130 with runners in scoring position. The Mets are hitting as a team, the worst than nationally,

two 17 runners in scoring position. So enjoy your 765 right now. Juan Soto looking like Juan Nocho. I like how the Mets manager said that Soto still passes the eye test. I don't even know what that means. It's like he still knows how to swing a bat or as long as he still looks like a baseball player, but like the results aren't there. I'm sure he still looks like a good player and is, you know, he's swinging the bat the correct way. It's just, he's not hitting the ball. It's crazy. I went, what do you think's going on there?

Is this just a slump or is he feeling the pressure or did he always just want to be a Yankee and he feels this, like he feels this pull. He's like, I went for the money. I don't even want to be a Met because those stories are out there. Yeah. I answered DJ all the above. I think it's certainly, as you said, slumps happen and he's had those issues, but it kind of looks like the solo that we saw with the San Diego Padres when

yeah, he's getting his walks and he's getting on base, but he's really not being a major contributor to a team that has aspirations of winning a division and going deep. And he's in the Harley or it's not like Mendoza's benched him or slot him down the order. He's still giving him lots of chances, lots of it. That's at least he does have that batter's eye. But yeah, I mean, this last 16 games, he's in 147. He's slugging 150, which is atrocious.

Like he's not hitting the ball with any sort of power. The stories coming out from Michael K, of course, the Yankees play a play guy, Bob Clapfish, who covers New York sports saying that he really just wanted to stay with the Yankees, but it was kind of pushed by his agent, Scott Boris. And by family decisions, they wanted to sound the mess. They really wish he was with the Yankees, but it was kind of pushed by his agent Scott Boris and by family decisions. They wanted him to sound the mess. They really wished he was with the Yankees. So he's got 14 and a half years to get over his buyer's remorse. He's got lots of money to keep him company. I do think he'll inevitably turn it around, but the fact he's this bad right now, it's definitely worth talking about. And certainly in New

York, they're building them right now. They don't care how much they're paying, what a star he is. He's going to produce and he's hearing some boos right now at city field. Maybe Juan Soto can be motivated by the heroics of Bo Bichette yesterday. Now we're not talking quite Kirk Gibson in the 1988 World Series or anything, but, but it was a regular season game against Texas.

They fought through a bad back and we all know how tough those can be. It popped off the bench as a pinch hitter and hit the two run Jack to go ahead for the J's yesterday. Now John Schneider tried to put it in context, but he also said, sometimes the way you break out of a funk is you just get something to go your way. That wasn't expected to go your way. Broken bat single. Maybe it's a guy that wasn't supposed to play popping off the bench to hit a very important home run. What did you make of Bo Bichette's heroics last night

over the Rangers? Well, it was great to see. I mean, it was not expected such a pitchers to although I probably should have, because it's not necessarily that both these teams might give great pitching. It's just that both their offenses are atrocious. I mean, the Rangers are bottom five in terms of run score. They finally got Corey's Tigger back to course. He's their best player. And he's a big part of it, but he's been out.

Simian has been terrible. He has, I mean, former blue jay was an all star. He had 40 home runs in the Jays. He's got one of the worst OPS is in baseball, many regular, it's under 500. So the Rangers really struggled to score runs. Well blocked the troll and it's not nearly enough for a month on time. Dare was their big freeze in acquisition has done nothing so far. So for Bow to hit, yeah, pinch it to a home run like that. When five final pitchers combined on a one hitter, we'll take it.

Uh, Bow is out of the star line because the lower back's thrown in so clearly you can do it just put your back into it nice win for the Jays and good to see Bo get going. Again the home runs are still a challenge for this team they're bottom five in the most home runs hit and in terms of home run difference I believe the Jays are the worst if not for the Rockies but good news we're talking blow yours that talks Vlad on base streak now is at 28 games longest active of the majors, two singles, and a walk for the J's. So both those guys, not with the power,

but at least getting on base, that's a good sign there from Vlad. And as long as they keep hanging around, they're going to be all right because the AL East is so bad. We had Rob Longley on from the Toronto Sun yesterday and I asked him and I'll ask you the same question. Are you surprised at how subpar the AL East is this year? I am. If you look at every single division, Mike, the largest division lead right now in the majors is the Yankees and the AL East.

They're going to cruise to the division. They're 16 and four in their last 20 games. They're starting pitching has been outstanding. Clark Schmidt, six strong innings freed right now as a front runner to win the American league. Salyon. We all know judge is the favorite to win the MVP. Volpe is like fifth in doubles. Ben Rice is the fifth and hardest hit rate. Like they, and honestly, Golds gets an amazing, he's hitting 533 against lefties this year, which is a crazy stat. So Yankees juggernaut, okay, a little bit surprising if they're losing one,

so it doesn't matter. But after that, which of those teams are going to challenge the Yankees? Nobody like the Razor, the only other team above 500 the Jays are your classic win to lose three win three win lose to the Red Sox are disaster in that They've lost five straight games You've had Liam Hendricks complaining about not being used enough by his manager Alex Cora then complaining about death threats He got on social media get the whole Raphael Deaver situation He wanted to play third base. They told the note to pack your glove. Then can you play first base? No, not playing first base and playing DH. And he's their best player. You've got issues with him. Reagan's on the lineup right now. So the

Red Sox are a mess. And then you got the Orioles who are absolutely awful. I mean, they're going to throw in place for 104 losses. They lost 110 games back in 2021. Their pitching is atrocious. Only the Rockies have a better, a worse starter ERA than the Orioles. That tells you how bad it is for Baltimore. So yeah, the Yankees are legit good team. I think the Tigers are a great team. Those are the two teams that really stand out the American League. After that, it's awash and mediocre.

There's really no great teams. The Mariners got off to a good start. They've slowed a little bit. They still have the division lead right now, just a half thing over Houston. I do think Houston will overcome them and step it up a little bit, but that's about it fellas. The rest of those teams, especially the Ailes, as you said, Mike, disappointing so far. And then I know we've talked about this before,

the Pittsburgh Pirates. Well, they got a nice stadium and that's about it. What, how are they already going to trade Paul Skeens? Like how, how is, how are the rumors going to trade Paul Skeens? Like how, how is, how are the rumors? Is it, is this his second year there? Like, do they not get them for a little bit at least? Like it's crazy that I'm already seeing these rumors here.

Can you explain the financials of this? Like why we're already seeing trade rumors here? They've got a good player. Why not keep them? I'm with you, Jay. I think it's ridiculous. I'm with John Heyman today, who completely goused pulled water on the story and was telling me, like, oh, this is ridiculous.

There's zero chance they'll trade him. 0.0. This guy's the reigning NL Rookie of the Year. He's not allowed more than six hits in any of his 35 starts. That is a major league record to begin a career. Think about that. Six hits or less. Every single time he goes out there, He'd be shut out ball into the seventh yesterday. They romp over the D backs 10 to one. I suppose the thought

process would be this Jay that the practice is such a bad team and he's such an incredible player. If you trade him into Herschel Walker trade, embarrassment of riches, but no, I'm with you. He's the best, one of the best pitchers in the game. Keep them for the full six years. And we all know, yeah, he's going to get a $300 million contract or $400 million go to Dodgers, Yankees, comes, whatever. We'll figure that out. Like enjoy them while you can.

Like there's no, there's no rush on this. They've had star pitchers in the past that Garrett Cole eventually moved on. And obviously the really nice thing would be if they actually built around him in the next four years and actually built a team with some, with some passion, some heart, with some offense and they scored 10 10 yesterday but they just are one of the worst offenses in baseball and you know specifically they're still spending free agency. Haven said to me today he goes the last the last agents to sign a multi-year contract of the Pirates was Yvonne Nova in 2016. I'm like that can't be right but

it's true they don't send anybody for more than one year and again with respect to Yvonne Nova he's not exactly Ron Gingery So it's like when they're gonna sign a guy they do but it's not like he's a superstar So I suppose the rumors are there because they don't spend and so it feels inevitable schemes will leave why not deal now? But I'm 100% with you keep him enjoy him. He's an absolute stud He'll go down as an all-time great pirate give you it's only six years. And yes, that is one of the best parks in baseball That's something the Pittsburgh can hang their hat on for now.

Well, maybe you just touched on it there, but like, can you explain why these rumors are coming up already? Is it just like a sell high situation and the offer could be so big that, I'm just trying to figure out why these rumors are coming up just in like, what, the second year of his career.

Yeah. No, a hundred percent. It's definitely not coming from Skiing because he's been open about that. Like, no, I want to be here. I want to build something special. As I said, he just started like it's second season. Like, bro, he's not in a rush to go anywhere. He seems to like it.

It's not like he's a guy who's clamoring for a major market tomorrow. This is not like a Eric Wendrotach situation in terms of phenom who didn't want to go to Quebec and then horses a trade from our cello boot like that. It's game that's happening in Pittsburgh. He's got his lovely girl, Libby. Don is in the cover of sports illustrated. She's hosting about their social media exploits and living their lives. So yeah, I think the whole thought process is so high.

This guy's so special. He's so talented. Imagine him in a major market. Imagine what the Dodgers, the Mets, the Cubs, the Yankees will give up for him. That's it. It's not coming from schemes. It's from the outside world who's thinking, hey, how much more juicy would it be if he wasn't in Pittsburgh? We're going to get there, but not anytime soon.

Let's wait five more years. We're speaking to Adnan Verk from MLB Network here on the Halford & Brough show on Sportsnet 650. Adnan, it's time for our weekly check-in on Shohei Otani's return to pitching. So it does seem as though this is going to happen sooner than I think a lot of people expected. And there's a really interesting conversation that's going on right now talking about, you know,

are the Dodgers trying to maximize their return on investment of $700 million for Otani? Do you run the risk of him potentially getting injured again, given that he's having such an amazing season at the plate? Or do you have to acknowledge that, you know, even in these sort of sim games that he's throwing, he's hitting close to 97 miles an hour with his fastball, despite the fact that he's not trying to throw his hardest as he works his way back up to MLB speed, there's a lot of different dynamics at play here. What are you hearing? What do you make sense of Otani's return to pitching right now?

Yeah, the first time I heard anybody saying they don't think he'll pitch, there's no doubt. Former Rockies executive was with me last weekend and I'll be saying, I don't see what happened. I'm like, what do you mean? The whole reason they gave him $700 million is to pitch and to hit. He's like, yeah, but he's too valuable as a hitter

and they just can't risk injury, so that's just where it's gonna be. But I completely disagree. No, I think the whole reason he went to Dodgers is because he wants to build a pitch and hit and they gave him $700 million and every year they can be in the the Dodgers because he wants to build a pitch and hit and again, $700 million every year. They can be in a world series and he wants to start and win a world series game. So I think it's happening no matter what.

It looked great in that same game, throwing 22 pitches, Mark Pryor's pitching coach did say there's still a long ways to go, but the rumors I'm hearing is post all star break, definitely July 31st trade deadline. He's back now. It's interesting because of times's all those guys who again, cause you're coming back from this major injury, they're only going to pitch them once a week. So Saki again, coming from Japan, but they only pitch once a week. Um,

Yamamoto guy needs a lot of rest. Only pitches once a week. So it's going to be interesting how they cobble this thing together. Again, we keep staying on the Dodgers. If healthy, their rotations amazing. They have not been healthy. They've had 11 different pictures in the I L. So in a perfect world, on Tony's pitching pitching once, let's say in the ALCS, or the NLCS, because he's just not a guy that's gonna bounce back that quickly.

So he's not gonna pitch once, and model will pitch once. Snell could be a guy that bounces back. Last time, again, he's had to overcome injuries. So if you've got those five guys theoretically going, it would be a gauntlet for any opposing offense to go through. But I'm with you, Mike.

I can't see him not pitching. He loves to pitch. It's one of his favorite things. He's super competitive. He knows the risks and injuries, et cetera. But Nathan, they've all, they came back from two time Tommy John. They don't call it Tommy John. They keep saying an elbow procedure. We all know what it was, but bottom line is I think he wants to pitch. He thrives on pitching. He'll be out there. Now, maybe there's a situation he gives him a handful of starts.

And then Dave Roberts says, Hey, for the playoffs, I can't have you out there as a starter, maybe you're a reliever, perhaps there's that conversation, but I don't know, fellas, he's uber competitive, they're giving him the keys to kingdom, what Otani wants he gets, and he wants to pitch, he's gonna pitch. Adnan, you're the best, buddy, thanks a lot for doing this today,

we really appreciate it, enjoy all the games this weekend, and tonight and Friday, of course, we'll do this again next week. You guys too, thanks boys. Talk soon. Yep. Thank you buddy. That's Adnan Virk MLB Network's very own here on the Halvard and Brush show on Sportsnet 650. So Brad Treleving is meeting with the media right now in Toronto. A couple quotes coming out on the Florida Panthers.

They've set the bar in our division. They've set the bar in our league. Sounds like you got the notes from Rod Brindemore last night. Um, on the second round series with Florida, Trav Living said that series is going to stay with me for a long time. The way it ended is going to stay with me a long time.

When you think you have a chance to win and you don't, it stays with you for a long time. Long time. He also said there will be change moving forward for the Toronto Maple Leafs. Sounds like he's got the keys to the castle, eh? Yeah, for sure. Yeah, because Peli, yesterday in his interview with,

what was it called, 100% Hockey? Yeah. The Foosball podcast. It's him and Barube. Right. He said Brad and Craig, like, a thousand times. Yeah. This is like, Brad and Craig, Brad and Craig like a thousand times. Yeah, this is like Brad and Craig Brad and Greg just mix them together Yeah, it sounds like Brad and Craig just answer now right to Pelly. Mm-hmm

So they just I don't think they're gonna have a president Yeah, and it'll be and Pelly kind of made it very clear that he's not a hockey guy by trade like he likes hockey Yeah, he's not a hockey executive. So I wouldn't be surprised if Brad tree living has like, he's like, I still don't get icing. Yep. Can someone explain to me what's called the interference? Does anyone know? Right. We're with you, Keith. We don't know either. OK. Speaking of the Florida Panthers, I want to play some audio from yesterday. So at the end of the Florida Carolina series, many of you noticed this.

Some of you already texted into the Dunbar Lumberumber text message in basket at 650, 650 about it. At the end of the series, the traditional end of series handshake did not include Florida Panthers head coach, Paul Maurice. And at Maurice's begging, did not include Carolina Hurricanes head coach, Rod Brindemore. Caught on camera was an awkward

kind of animated exchange between Maurice and Brindemore, the left. Everybody's saying, what was going on there? What were you guys talking about over by the benches while all the players were doing their end of series handshake? So after the game, Paul Maurice was asked about it and reporter just kind of said, hey, what was that interaction? Were you about to fight Rod Brindamore?

That was a wish. Oh, it was a wish. It was a wish. I did not hear that. Okay, so Greg Wyshinski. Unnamed reporter. Yeah, unnamed reporter named Greg Wyshinski. He was gonna be on the show tomorrow, by the way,

asked Paul Maurice about his interaction with Rod Brindemore now in true Paul Maurice fashion. It's a long answer. So we'll play the entire audio. We'll pick it up on the other side. Here's Paul Maurice on Rod Brindemore his interaction with Rod Brindemore and Handshakes following a series. Hey Paul two quick ones There seemed like you and Rod had an animated discussion at the end of the game. Was that just the handshake line? That's all it was. It's a personal belief and I really appreciate what he did because I understand the risk that there's a bit of a risk.

The story goes like this. I don't believe that the coaches should shake players' hands at the end. There's this long list of people in suits and track suits. We had like 400 people on there. So they're all really important to our group, but not one of them was in the game. There's something for me visually with the camera on of just the men who played,

block shots who fought for each other. It's the end of one season, it's excitement for the other. The last thing that a player on the Carolina Hurricanes deserves is 50 more guys in suits they have. They have no idea who they are, and that's not a negative. It should be something really kind of beautiful about just the camera on those men who played shaking hands, and we should respect that. So we talked to Craig Berube on the ice in Toronto

and figured if I could sell it in Toronto, and he understood it because he's played, and Roddy's played. So they both kind of get it. I don't know where it changed. When I first got in the league, you would never go shake the players hand. Some coach wanted to get on camera,

is the only thing I can figure out, right? And he was like, I don't know, maybe you want to shake Wayne Ggeresky's hand or something. I don't know when it changed, but I don't think it's right. I think there's a really nice kind of beautiful part of our game when just the players shake hands at the end. When you think of all the wars, that's not the right word. All the great competitions on the ice, I mean, hard, going after each other,

and yet they shake hands like that. That's special. They're not sending Christmas cards to each other. This is nasty out there. Something very special to it. So I appreciate the risk that he took, because he's concerned that somebody here is gonna be upset that he didn't shake

our players hands. I asked him not to. And he said, and he, and he understood it. So that's what happened. Okay. There's two things here. The first is the actual sentiment and what Maurice is talking about the handshake line and the sanctity of it and coaches and maybe non-players being involved with it. I don't have a problem with that. Take, I get what he's saying. The players play, the coaches coach, the trainers tape.

Um, and you know, if the players want to shake hands afterwards. The trainer should have to shake hands with the other trainers. Yeah. And the coaches should take, shake hands with the coaches. And then that's just, that's fine.

And. That's how I remember it too, by the way, the coaches. And then that's just, that's fine. And. That's how I remember it too, by the way. The coaches would always just shake each other's hands and the players would shake their hands. And here, okay, now I'm leading up to a preface. This is all a big preface here. Yeah, yeah, but. No, no, I'm not even gonna do the but yet.

Also, I've been to enough of these post-game media availabilities and you are thinking and responding in the moment. You don't know what questions are gonna come forth. You don don't have things planned out and prewritten. You haven't thought about it a lot, I don't think, because you're not sure what the questions are going to be. Now, Maurice has obviously thought about this particular situation before, but this is the second consecutive series where like Paul Maurice has kind of gotten up there and lectured everyone about respecting the game. The only way that Paul Maurice knows how.

and lectured everyone about respecting the game, the only way that Paul Maurice knows how. You know what I was gonna say? Has Maurice reached the point where we want him to lecture us? Like, you know how when John Cooper talks, you're like, thanks for the advice, Dad. Yeah, please deliver. And then he delivers.

And again. As Paul Maurice, because I, as Paul Maurice jumped the shirt. No, I kind of went I was like I was like It's a bit It's a bit like all right ball. It's two series in a row Yeah, right and the first was like those poor guys in Toronto that we just sent packing for the summer Man, they got a lot of pressure on them and now like the idea of Paul Maurice jumping the shark though

It's kinda. You see on a surfboard. We Photoshopped Paul Maurice on our surfboard. Look. I do like the sentiment though. I understand it. But there's a couple texts that came in. They were like. The greatest timing.

You know, if Maurice doesn't want to make it about the coaches, why wouldn't he get it established before the series and not in the moment when the cameras are rolling? Well, maybe it's a little bit tough to reach out to the other coach during a series and be like, hey, when this series is over, let's just let the players shake hands.

But here's an idea. How about you just let Rod Brindamore do whatever he wants to do? Like it's great if you don't want to participate in the handshake. Yeah. Okay, here's the thing. Britain more after that game has had a miserable. I know that's what I was thinking.

He's mentally fried. They've their season is just ended. And then you go up there with your Johnny feel good pulpit story about how we need to honor the sanctity of the players. Ross, we're like, I don't know. I wasn't thinking about this. Like, I'm not prepared to really have this conversation right now.

Can we not just go do the thing that no one's gonna think about? No one's gonna think about it if the coaches shake hands. I get why Maurice said, let's not do it. And it's great, but there are certain times when you need or want to teach a lesson. And I think sometimes you need to read the room. I'm not saying don't be candid, like it would be

very hypocritical for me, especially. I'm always like, be more transparent, more candid, be more colorful. Speak your mind. But this is two series in a row where it's been like, how much do you really respect the game? Do you respect it as much as me, Paul Maurice? And I'm like, OK, great. Someone texted in, I'll give this guy the overthinking award. Yeah.

That's a, that's a good comment. That's another text too. Or it was like, well, how much do you think this is just about one other coach that made a big deal about shaking hands and Paul is just trying to get at him by doing this whole scene and poor Rod is just kind of caught in the middle of it because Maurice is just trying to make a statement to this other coach. It's like, Oh, who cares? Exactly.

Well, are you talking about John Cooper? Maybe. I don't know who the coach is. Was Coop a big handshake guy? I don't know. There has to be one. I did wonder that personally. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

If this was a shot at Coop's like very low key. Cause he was like, you know, Craig understands cause he played the game and so did Roddy. And then there was John Cooper who's a lawyer. It's gotta be, right? Unnamed ex lawyer coach. Is there a beef with Cooper, who's a lawyer. It's gotta be, right? Unnamed ex-lawyer coach. Is there a beef with the two Florida coaches? Yes.

There's gotta be. Yes, from Dave, they didn't. And Coop was like, how dare you lecture people? That's my thing. You're stealing my bit. And I sound better than you lecturing. I mean, again. They should have a lecture off.

Some people are gonna hear this right now and they're like, it's comical that you two guys who talk for a living or and come up with ideas on the fly or mocking someone for doing the exact same. I'm offended because I'm the one who lectures. I like to lecture. Yeah, this is pot meeting kettle big time. I get it. But I'm saying it seems kind of full of themselves. At any rate, I have some thoughts. Pretty pretty high on himself.

I don't know. I mean, again, I don't I don't want to make this a super polarizing he's right, he's wrong kind of thing, because I do think there's some merit to what he's saying. And he explained it. But again, two series in a row where you're out there like the and the Leafs one was more nauseating than this. Right. The pity party that they all collectively had for Toronto, which everyone, whether it was intentional or not, everyone saw through it as being like, you know, you guys want your do and you want you don't, you know,

you're trying to pivot off Toronto collapsing, saying that, you know, oh, there's so much pressure. But hey, like, we're also a pretty good team here. And then yesterday was just sort of like okay Paul we get it at the end of The day is it that? Disrespectful for a coach to want to get in the handshake line and be like you guys were great You want a great series like it? Oh, how dare he get in the line and do that? I don't I don't think he's saying that though. I don't think he's saying that I think he's just says like there's it's not

He's not talking about the head coach He's talking about all the healthy scratches that would come out in the suits and the trainers. And like, I think he just wants the guys that played the game to shake hands. And I actually, I agree with him on that. I maybe disagree with how he went about doing that. And I think your point was the best one for once. Thanks. And I think your point was the best one for once. And it's like, you're asking Rod Brindamore, like he's just lost a very painful series.

Where he's been visibly frustrated. He's got so much, I mean, his eyes are bigger than we've ever seen. And then all of a sudden you're just hitting him with that where he's kind of like, he's thinking like, oh man, like, well, what's going to happen here? I'm probably going to have to go, you know, I got

to talk to my players and tell them, I love them. I'm proud of you. But I'm also going to have to go to the, the, the, the media conference. I got to do all this stuff. And then Paul Maurice is suddenly like, Hey, don't go out on the ice because I've got this idea. Couldn't we talk about this before you knew you

were going to win. All right. Uh, we got to go to break. We got a lot more to get to in the hell for the rough show on sports net six 50. Uh, Mike Kelly is going to join us on right. We got to go to break. We got a lot more to get to in the Hellford and Brough show on Sportsnet 650. Mike Kelly is going to join us on the other side of the break. NHL analyst for Amazon and for the NHL network.

Before we go to break, I do need to do the one to watch brought to you by Delaney's OK Tire. Tonight's one to watch. This is a polarizing one for the city of Vancouver. Corey Perry, everybody. Yes. The ageless wonder, Corey Perry. He stepped up big time in game four

after Zach Hyman went down to injury. The 40-year-old, yes, 40-year-old Corey Perry scored a goal and an assist to help the Oilers to a 4-1 win and move within a single game of advancing to their second straight Stanley Cup final. So that second period goal that he scored, that made Perry the fifth player in NHL history, age 40 or older, to score a goal in a conference final.

It was his 60th career playoff goal. He's now tied with Brendan Shanahan, Joe Mullen, and Doug Gilmore for the most all time. And finally, with six goals, he has six goals this playoff, which is really impressive for his guy his age. He ties a handful of Hall of Fame elite players who have scored that many goals age 39 or older, including John Beliveau,

Ron Francis, Timu Solani and Dr. Mark Recchi, all of them scored that many goals 39 years or older in the playoffs. It's time to put on your Toyo tires, whether you drive a car, light truck or van. Toyo tires are designed to protect in all kinds of conditions. Visit Delaney's OK Tire in Langley and Aldergrove. OK Tire Service Repair and Tires. You're listening to the Halford and Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. Hey, it's Mick Nazar.

Have your say and join me on the People's Show with big takes and even bigger bets. Weekdays three to four on Sportsnet 650 or wherever you get your podcasts 733 on a Thursday. I forgot it was Thrash Thursday here on the Help of the Breast. Oh yeah. Have we played any Thrash yet? No, it's all guest intros today. Right. Except for this one. I got a Metallica vibe going on. on the help of the Breaststroke. Oh yeah. Have we played any thrash yet? No, it's all guest intros today. Right.

Except for this one. I got a Metallica vibe going on. I did get a request from a friend of the show and musical authority, Jay Swing. Oh yeah, he texted me too. Yeah, yeah. Hair metal, man. Oh, he texted you too.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I floated. He texted everyone, but the person in charge of the music. Way to go, Jay. I floated the idea to Laddie, and he shot me down he shot me down Shot it down. Yeah, shoot it down. I Respect it though cuz he likes the threat But there are lots I'd love to hear what unlicensed skid row sounds

There's lots of sub genres of metal though, and I'm I am a lover of all of these sub genres So if we throw some hair in there once in a while, it's fine. All right There's a song called like 23 and life to go? Yeah, right. I'm trying to think of the like team move version of Skid Row that we would have to play during the program. Okay, we'll discuss the music later. We got a lot to get into on the program.

We're at the midway point of the show, by the way. You are listening to the Haliford and Bruv show on Sportsnet 650. Haliford and Bruv of the morning is brought to you by Sands and Associates, BC's first and trusted choice for debt help with over 3,000 five-star reviews. Visit them online at Sands-Trustee.com. We are now in hour two of the program.

Mike Kelly from NHL Network and Amazon Prime is going to join us in just a moment here. Hour two of this program is brought to you by Jason Hominock at Jason.Mortgage. If you love giving the banks more of your money, then don't let Jason shop around to find the perfect mortgage for you. Visit them online at Jason.mortgage. To the Power West Industries hotline we go, Mike Kelly joins us now on the Haliford and Brough show on Sportsnet 650. Good morning, Michael. How are you? Hey guys, I'm doing good. Good to catch up with you. How are you doing? We're well. Thanks for taking the time to do this. Hey, before we get into the nitty gritty of what's going on in these two series,

we just talked about this. Do you want to take a stab at what Paul Maurice had to say about handshake lines and decorum and etiquette and his conversation with Rod Brendemore yesterday? Because we were talking about it at length in the previous segment and we said, look, probably agree with the sentiment. It's a very noble and you know, it's a great gesture

about letting the players shake the hands because the players are the ones out there doing the battle, but maybe Palm Rees his timing was off a bit, uh, curious to get your thoughts on it. Cause I know it was a major talking point following the game yesterday. I mean, I, it's the first I've kind of thought about it or heard of it.

So it was surprising. Like when, when he had that long conversation and it was shown on the broadcast, um, my first thought was something might've happened that Maurice wanted to explain that maybe Rod was a little upset about in the game, uh, nothing, you know, where there was animosity or anything, but just trying to explain something anyways, it's kind of bizarre. Like I, what Paul Maurice is saying, I think there's logic in it. You can understand that.

All right. Like I don't, it's not like I flat out disagree with it. Um, I think it's an odd time to, if that is the first time he brought it up, it's a bit of an odd time to say a FYI, can we kind of change how things are done and what's about to happen in 10 seconds? Um, it's a, it's a little weird. Um, I, again, I don't hate what Maurice is saying. I think there's definitely logic in it.

Now he, I mean, the coaches were in the handshake lines, I believe in the cup final last year and another playoff series recently that Maurice has been a part of what if Rod in the moment said moment said, no, I want my guys to shake the, it was a little strange, I guess. So I don't know what happens in the Stanley Cup final. To be determined, I suppose. It's a bit of a bizarre thing. And the other side of it, I guess too,

like I get the whole idea of, you know, a bunch of guys in the suits and trainers and stuff, and these guys just lost a series on the other side, and maybe they want to get out of there and, and all that. Um, hockey is such a small community and people move around all the time. What if it's your old coach and you want to shake his hand and, you know, so there's a bit of another side to it too.

Um, I'm assuming if you asked all 32 coaches, you'd get somewhat of a split of, yeah, we want it to happen or no, we actually like Paul's theory on this. Um, but Hey, I guess if you're winning, you can kind of try to dictate these things. And there you go. Well yeah, that, and that was the thing is he started dictated it to Brendan Moore, who in the moment I think had about a million other things on his mind other than this new wrinkle to the handshake line.

And one of them was in Bryndamore explained this in his postgame media availability was that the Florida Panthers went out there and played a pretty similar style to the Carolina Hurricanes. They just did it a hell of a lot better. And your breakdown and analysis of everything that happened over the five games in that series, is that a fair assessment from Bryndamore that the Panthers played a similar style? They just played an awfully lot better. Is that a fair assessment from Bryndamore that the Panthers played a similar style? They just played an awfully lot better in a general sense. Yes. And you know, Rod kind of alluded to this and he's right.

He's like Carolina kind of created a lot of what so many teams are trying to do now. So they're, you know, you can call them pioneers in a way in that sense of we're going to mitigate risk by not carrying the puck as much as other teams. We're going to chip it in. We're going to work to get it back. We're going to get it back. We're going to have zone time. We're going to recover rebounds and shot attempts and really play that kind of chaotic, frenzied, aggressive style of play. So sure. Now Florida, and this is where I get the panther so much credit, right? Because how many times do we see often Brad Tree Living speaking

right now, and I was listening to some of his press conference, and he talked about changing the way that that team plays. They bring in Craig Berube, a coach he felt could help them change the way they play. He talked about lessening the risk. And really what he was saying is look at Florida. We want to be more like that. And that's fine. They're the Stanley cup champions, right? For so long, that team in particular, but other teams as well.

It's like, what really changes when you consistently don't get the result that you want. Probably not enough. The years where I give Florida a ton of credit, they went, I think it was 58 games, right? Just dominate a regular season a few years ago. Um, and then in the second round against Tampa, they got swept. They score three goals.

Tampa obliterated them. They recognized in that moment, how far off they were from completing their ultimate goal, which is to win a Stanley Cup. It wasn't, oh, well, look at our regular season. Like we're still pretty good. Obviously they went out and traded 115 point leading score in Jonathan Huberto to bring in Matthew Kachuk. They had Bennett, which was a great obviously trade that they had made as well. They, and then Paul Maurice comes in and in his opening press conference, he made a reference

to being able to drive in the mud. You got this Ferrari, but you got to be able to drive in the mud. And what he was talking about was we need to be able to play a different brand of hockey that brought in players that could help them do that. And they've kind of perfected it. So to bring it back to Brendan Moore. Yeah, they started playing that way earlier, but they're now having the same result consistently, which is we're a really good regular season team.

We can win a round or two in the playoffs, but when we get to the final four, and this was kind of always the issue I've had with Carolina. And I think they do have to make changes to the way that they play the way they, their D zone coverage is, I think gets picked apart by teams that have the talent to move the puck a little bit quicker and Florida moved the puck quicker in both ends than New Jersey and then Washington. And that creates problems for Carolina. And the other thing too, is you talk about high end talent.

Like if you got two really good checking teams and Carolina and Florida might be the templates for this in the league. If that cancels itself out, what's the deciding factor? Which team has the higher end talent and which team has the better goaltending? Well, that's Florida and that's Florida. So Carolina, like they've had trouble getting and they've had trouble retaining high end talent and part of it is baked into the way that they play.

I know with Rantanen, like any winger in Gensel, what these guys are thinking so often is like, how do we play? That's fine. Who's my center? All home is a great center, but there's a big hole in the second line center for that team. And that's where I think they need to make some pretty, you know, more significant changes than they've made in the past. Mike, tell us a little bit more about moving

the puck in the offensive zone. That's a conversation we were having yesterday. And it came up because the Dallas Stars against the Edmonton Oilers in the second and third yesterday and it came up because the Dallas stars against the Edmonton Oilers in the second and third period of their last game looked like they were just trapped on the outside. Four shots in the third period.

And as Canucks fans, we were like, that looks familiar. And because so many times the Canucks would actually get, you know, whether it's dumping it in most of the time or carrying it in, they would actually get possession of the puck in the offensive zone. But it looked like they just, I described it yesterday as they were trying to break into a house with no windows or doors.

Like they just couldn't do anything with the puck and it eventually just ended up at the point and someone would fling it on goal with, you know, maybe we'll get a tip or rebound, but there was never any playmaking in the offensive zone. Is that what you're talking about with the Florida Panthers and the defensive coverage of

the Carolina Hurricanes? Well, Carolina, um, you know, if you're, if they they kind of play a man on man, and if you, if you're doing that, uh, I get, if you're, if they, they kind of play a man on man, and if you, if you're doing that, uh, I get, like I said, against a team that has the skill to work around it, um, all it takes is for one guy to get beat and, and you've got problems, right? The, you know, as it relates to kind of being stuck on the outside, like if you're talking about that Dallas Edmonton series, I think one of Stuart Skinner has been unreal in a series and this is the second time in as

many years he's been unreal against Dallas and not great against everyone else, right? Coincidence, maybe. The layer I can find beyond that that helps explain some of it I think is Dallas is a little bit more of like a low to high kind of work the puck in the offensive zone as opposed to an East West and, and Edmonton the defensively has done to your point, such a great job of taking away some of those plays, but those East West plays where you get the goalie moving, um, they're really tough for goalies to stop. The, uh, the two opponents that Edmonton had in the first two rounds were averaging about

three, just over three shots a game by their forwards on these East-West passes that are tough to stop. Skinner allowed five goals in, in total in those two series. Dallas is averaging about one a game and they've scored once on these East West passes. So part of the explanation to me, and I don't even know that it's a huge part, but part of it is that Dallas is not able to do what is given this particular goalie and we'll give any goalie to a degree problems. Um, and I credit Edmonton's defense for that in a big way, but also it's some of how Dallas plays. Uh, yeah, at the end of the day, you've got to be able to get to the inside.

Um, I, I liken it to empty calories. You see teams with lots of zone time. Um, you'll even hear coaches sometimes talk about, ah, you know, we didn't win, but we had a lot of zone time. And if you're not getting into the inside, it's empty calories. I've never been a big proponent of shot attempts. Um, I just think a lot of it can be meaningless if you're firing pucks from the outside, but never getting anything on the inside.

That's at the end of the day, what matters the most. The play that Barkov made on the winning goal yesterday was the perfect example of first of all, getting to the inside, but also what big time individual players in big moments and when they show up, they can do for you. You know, he takes on Orlov one on one, complete mismatch, takes it to the front of the net.

I think it was Eric Robertson kind of reached, he was panic reaching on Barkov and then that of course leaves Carter Verhege wide open, east-west pass across the middle of the crease, across the crease and Carter Verhege has an empty net. Half the time I'm just kind of like, is it the system or is it just like players like Barkov are able to make those individual plays that open up the East West plays and then

you get a guy that finishes and you got a goal? Yeah. Yeah, both of it, right? Like, Carolina doesn't have a game breaker. That's, that's, it's always been a problem. I had an instruction to call him in the first couple of rounds. Like he's the closest thing they have. And then the first couple of rounds, you're like, yeah, he's doing it.

Right. Now it's going to get harder. And boy, for most of that series, he got pushed right out of it. He had a chance at the end though, that was right in the slot and he missed the net. I was like, Oh man, that, Oh, that must just be like, come on man. That was your moment right there. It's a great point. And it's not to say that you can't do that in that instance.

He didn't right. And there's other guys like, and for Haiti score series winning goals, like they're going out of style. He's, he's a clutch player. There's something to it for sure. And then, yeah, that goal that you mentioned, like, you know, I, a friend of mine says this all the time. He's like, the net hasn't moved in a hundred years and Robinson left good ice for bad ice. He was right on that far post wherever Hagee was.

And a player like Barkov can pick you apart like that. And he did. And that was a huge goal. Uh, I don't don't, to me, I was less of like a, our coverage doesn't work in more of just a bad read, but it's not a coincidence to me that in the end, Florida's got these guys that are just difference makers, right? And if they're going to play a certain way in Carolina, maybe invented it in a way,

but the other team has guys that can execute and finish at a higher rate. Like you're never going to, what's your, what's your B plan? Right. I think Carolina has got such an identity as to how they play and it can overwhelm most teams. But if Florida takes that away, what's your plan B? And they don't have the high end talent to say, you know what, I'm just going to go ranting in and score four points this period and we're going to win. Um, that's, that's an issue for me. Yeah.

Well, the, the Leafs, uh, I mean, you were talking about watching Brad, you're living and the Leafs have this just really interesting decision to make and it might not even be a decision for them to make if Mitch Marner has anything to do with it. Um, because he might just want to leave the Leafs. But Mitch Marner had 102 points this season and you can say, well, he wasn't getting it

done in the playoffs and we'll move on from him and we'll use the cap space. But there's going to be a lot of teams with cap space this off season. Not all of them are going to use that cap space wisely. Just to get your thoughts on the situation that the Leafs are in with Mitch Marner. Yeah, I think Marner's had a lot of opportunities to kind of hint that he would want to come back and he hasn't done it. I mean, he's even talking the past tense about like,

I enjoyed my time here and things like that. So I don't know, if you read the tea leaves, it seems like he's on his way out. Um, and maybe, and maybe that's his preference at this point. So like I'm in the camp of, can you, I think you can win with Mitch Murna. It's not that I don't think, I think he can't win with them. I do. But again, what are, what are, how much of your cap is he eating up and what are you expecting to get out of

him? That series against Florida, like we talk about playing on the outside, he barely touched the puck in the home plate slot area. Barely. That's a problem. And he can make plays on the outside and everything, but I looked at the same puck touch maps that I have and everything on guys like Kucherov and comparable players and they're in there. And he wasn't. So it might be best for both sides at this point, just to go in a different direction. Like it's been so many years where it hasn't worked. And I, I, Marne is an unbelievable

player. Like the way he impacts the game defensively with his stick as well as playmaking, like he's, any team should want him at the right number. If he's going to be getting a raise, I don't see how that can happen in Toronto. So I would say that's, that's probably likely. And then if you're a Maple Leafs at that point, you just, you've lost Marner for nothing, but you've acquired Capspace. And you're not going to replace them by bringing in one guy, but you can try to do it by committee and maybe that can make them stronger in the end.

There's going to be such a race for talent this off season as the cap goes up and there are teams looking to be aggressive. I know you're a Vancouver guy, but I don't know what the Canucks are on your radar right now. Any thoughts on the task ahead of the Canucks this off season and trying to remake their forward group? Yeah, well that's going to be interesting as well.

I think the big thing for Vancouver right now as you go into the off season is obviously what is going to happen with Brock Desser. Is he coming back or not and if he is what's the number? I've been obviously pretty locked in on the playoffs and what's going on so if there's been any kind of news or anything about that, I haven't seen, forgive me, but I don't know what you guys think the odds of him coming back are. Probably low. Low.

I think they really want to remake their forward group. They need to add some speed. And I mean, anyway, if you're going to catch up on the Canucks, there's a lot to catch up on what they need to do. If you're not locked in, it's tough because like they got problems all over the top six, um,

wingers, centers, uh, it's a whole thing. Um, so. I'm like, what are you going to get out of Pedersen? Like if Pedersen can get even remotely close back to what we know he can be and has been in the past, that that that's going to be the biggest change of anything. And that's no change.

It's just the guy that's here that's going to be here for a long time or should be anyways. I mean, he's under contract for a long time. So, uh, again, it's kind of similar with that. Like, I don't think best there's a guy you have to overpay to bring him back. Can he score goals? Absolutely. Can you make that up in a couple other places and maybe balance things out a little bit? I think he can. Great player, but if he's not coming back, I don't think that's crushing the team. You can figure that out. But because he's a UFA and Studer's a UFA,

you can start looking at resigning guys, July 1st their UFA is next year, like Garland or whatever, but there's not going to be, I don't think, you guys are the experts in the market, it's not gonna be a massive turnover this year, right? I think there will be in the forward group. I think there will be in the forward group, yeah. I don't think Buster's gonna be back. and I think they're just gonna try and reshape the

top six but I just think it's gonna be very difficult with all the teams looking to make changes and being aggressive. But we'll catch up later when the Canucks do actually make some moves and then we'll ask you, Mike Kelly, what do you think of these moves? Who do you guys like as far as like UFAs that you think could come into that for you? We looked at the list already, next. None of them. There's not a lot, none of them.

And I think it's gonna be tough to attract the UFAs to Vancouver, you know? I mean, Ehlers would make sense because they need to add, they need to add some speed and some goal scoring. But then you're like, okay, well, he might even resign in Winnipeg. And if he doesn't resign in Winnipeg, you know, there are probably a bunch of other teams that are

going to be interested in him. So it's a big time challenge for the Canucks this off season. Yeah. Well, he can move the puck through the neutral zone as well as just about anybody. So, but what's the price? Like, I think this is going to be a UFA year where I think there's going to be some

bad deals handed out. We look back in a few years, but, um, anyways, yes, we will recap once it's all said and done, if you like. Sounds good, Mike, let's try and do this either before or during the Stanley cup final and the matchup is set. I know we're only one game away from an Edmonton, Florida rematch, which everybody is eagerly anticipating. So thanks for doing this today and let's get caught up again real soon.

Yeah, sounds great guys. Good catching up with you. Yeah, you too, thanks. See you, Mike. That's Mike Kelly from NHL Network here on the Halford and Brough show on Sportsnet 650. We stumped him on the Canucks thing. Yeah. Are you in the middle of the playoffs? You are.

Oh. Mike's like, it looks like the Canucks have a lot of work to do this on. Yeah, he was like, oh, whoa. Hell yeah. That was very triggering, Mike, be careful. We ran out of time there. I'll ask him next time.

I did want to talk about the series of picks that were being set in game four of the Dallas Edmonton series, because that is one way to try. They got Perry on one, didn't they? But they didn't get Perry on the first one, which led to the dry, subtle goal. Yeah, and then he was emboldened. Yeah, and then he got Perry on one didn't they but they didn't get Perry on the first one which led to a dry subtle goal Yeah, and then he was emboldened. Yeah, but yeah, then he got called for one and then Mason Marchman said when he's like

Don't I get a free one before you call the penalty and the referees were like no No, you don't you're going right to the penalty box because that is a way to open things up in the offensive zone Is you just kind of have guys rubbing off picks? The guys are setting actually funny. I was watching. My strength as a beer leaguer, I get in the way. See, it's an important thing. There's a guy that is. Like you just stop moving and stand there? Yeah, just in the way. There's a skill to it, yeah.

There's a guy of a similar frame and height. Off to my teammates that are like, get out of the way, bro. Please move. There's a guy of a similar frame and height, Jason. Oh, here's the goal right here, amazing timing. I was watching Inter Miami and Messi play yesterday. See that pick?

You know people can't see it. People can't see it, though. I'm watching Inter Miami and Messi play yesterday. See that pick? You know people can't see you pointing it though. I'm talking to you. Okay. So yesterday in the Miami Montreal match, Busquets got the ball at around the top of the 18. And because him and Messi have played for so long, they're always looking for one another. Yeah.

So he gave up the ball and I called it out right away. I'm like, he's going to stand there and set a pick. Cause he and Messi knows to run off them. Sure enough, Busquets lays the ball off and then stands there and sets a very obvious pick on the Montreal defender. Right. Messi gets the ball, scoots around him. Busquets hits with his left foot, bang,

goal back in the net. Now, part of the reason that there was no foul called is because I don't think the referee had the balls to call it. But it was clear as day. I'm not calling back a Messi goal. And this is like Messi and Bus boost gets are old now, right? Like they don't have the quick bursts that they used to.

So they need to kind of make these like little plays not unlike a 40 year old Cory, Cory Perry to make themselves effective. And I saw it, I'm like, it's a brilliant play when you watch it because it's two guys that understand in that moment, like here's how we're gonna create space. We're gonna set a pick. Is it illegal?

Yes. Are they gonna call it? Well, let's see, right? And in the Edmonton Dallas game, it got a very important one, nothing goal out of it. And then the referees clamped down and started calling it everywhere. So, and you know, Mike wrote about it

and said it's a slippery slope with officials. You can kind of do a bit of an Uncle Leo out there. I was just like, I'm an old man. I'm confused in the offensive zone. I'm sorry, I'm in everyone's way. I just I find myself. I'm always in the way these days So that's exactly what Busquets did kind of threw his arms up like well. I'm now just here like I'm standing here This is the space that I exist in right now. What am I gonna? Do like I can't move so all very interesting stuff. They were way up against it for time

I apologize We got to go to break when we come back Thomas Drance from the athletic Vancouver and Canucks talk is going to join us here on the Halford and Bref show on Sportsnet 650