Halford & Brough in the Morning - Could The Hughes Brothers Actually Be Re-United In Vancouver?

Episode Date: May 8, 2025

In hour two, Jason Brough and guest host Jamie Dodd talk the latest baseball news with MLB Network's Adnan Virk (1:20), they discuss likely trade partners for the Canucks this off-season (15:00), plus they chat playoffs with former NHL head coach & current Sportsnet hockey analyst Derek Lalonde (26:52). This podcast is produced by Andy Cole and Greg Balloch. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

It's time to chat with Adnan It's Adnan Ferkey's on the show We're gonna talk some baseball And take a trip to the silver screen That's right, it's time for Redman. Yesan and Ferg he joins us now. We'll head out to the ballgame and talk about all the filthy scene. All right welcome back to Hal for the Brough here net 650 Jamie dot here filling in for half bird How often a breath brought to you by sands and associates? BC's first and trusted choice for debt help with over three thousand five-star reviews visit sands dash trustee

Dot-com this hour brought to you by Jason dot mortgage if you love giving the banks more of your money Then don't let Jason shop around to find the perfect mortgage for you. That's Jason.mortgage. We are coming to you live from the Kintec studio, Kintec footwear and orthotics working together with you in step. Now joining us as you heard in the intro from the MLBN NHL network, he is Adnan Virk. Adnan, thanks for doing this as always. How are you?

Jamie, Jason, a pleasure. I want to hear more though about these weird 604 numbers you're getting. You, yeah, Dodd said that you got angry once when he gave out your number. This is going back a few years. I passed it along to a colleague and I got a text from you about it.

I don't remember this at all, but that's terrible. No, it's all good. Don't worry. It was understandable. I got it. I got it at the time Well, I live it like I want to know I want more details about no no no it was more just you were curious You were you were curious. Yeah, you were angry with me. Don't worry. I could I couldn't imagine me being angry I may have been as you said curious inquis, Hey Dodd, what's going on here? Who are these people pestering me? Yeah, exactly. It was more along those lines. Dodd's always giving out everyone's numbers and

it's just, yeah, he's, he's, he's caused a lot of scam artists to take advantage of people. Um, let's talk about these mariners because I got a text from you, someone gave you my number. Um, and I got a text from you about what these Mariners have done. How are they pulling this off? How have they suddenly turned into a team that can,

you know, hit? I take this so seriously, these weekly hits, and that's not an exaggeration. Bruff, you asked me an excellent question. You said, what turned this around? And I didn't know the answer and I was embarrassed. So when I found the answer and I said to Andy, you gotta give me a rough summary.

I gotta tell him the right answer. So I texted you as the Marrers, ever since the coaching change and the hitting change made last August 23rd, the Marrers are now fifth in runs per game. This is shocking. We've become so used to just thinking, oh, Seattle for all of eternity

and for all the rest of history, will always have great pitchings. There's a great pitchers park but nobody can hit there because Adrian Belcher couldn't do it or Richie Sexton couldn't do it and nobody could unless you're a Kenry for junior and J.P. or it was a Kingdome and yet all of a sudden this change in philosophy is completely working out I don't know about all of the blame Scott service but with a new manager a new hitting coach obviously the approach of Edgar Martinez is helpful, but these guys can hit now.

And Julio Rodriguez is off to, again, he always is off to slow starts. The last 10 games he's been good. But Polanco, well, one player of the week, he's been an absolute revelation for them, how good he's been. JP Crawford has been hitting the ball really well. Cal Raleigh is among the league leaders in home runs.

Rowdy Tlez had a big hit yesterday. Like they've got five guys down that line that are above average hitters. And that's about who they're really getting going. So it's kind of amazing. We still got a really good pitching. Obviously you're missing George Kirby, who's such a stud. But the starting pitching is there.

The offense has finally showed up. And it's not like guys, they're not like eking out four or three wins. No, they can score five, six, seven runs at a time. And that's a big reason why they're in first place in the American League West. So credit the coaching staff, credit the hitting staff for saying, hey, put the bat on the ball, let's get to work.

It seems crazy to me that all of this is due to a hitting coach. Were they holding the bat the wrong way or something? What's going on there in Major League Baseball? I guess the question is, is it sustainable? Well I don't think so necessarily. I don't think when I look at their lineup that this is going to be one of the elite offensive teams in baseball. I don't say to myself, this is a team that's going to be top five in run scored, but could

they be in the top half? And I think yes. And to me, if you regress from fifth in run scored to even 12th, if you're in the top half with the excellence of that starting pitching, that can be enough because that pitching is going to be top three top five at least in starters here in as long as the bullpen holds up you'll feel pretty good. And it's a weird division right now Jay like Houston again they did this last year they got to a slow start 500 team and eventually picked it up and surprised a lot of people but I don't really see it this year at Houston. I feel like now you know what it's a different

team they've lost bregman obviously uh... your numbers have been a real disappointment so far now he's hurt so that they call off also the final two vietnam but i do think now as a look at the watcher seattle should be the best it the rangers by the way have really good picture their office was so bad they fired their staff they got bread food back it brother of aaron boone

three-time all-star former silver slugger who was doing a podcast he's an old buddy of Bruce Boch and he was he you want to come to my head coach like yeah sure they banged out 16 hits in that first game Texas in terms of talent should be there with Seattle but they're not right now maybe booty turns around they're hitting but I don't think Seattle's hitting to this level is sustainable but do I think they can be division champion I do it's the Mariners and the Blue Jays starting, uh, this Friday in Seattle. Um, what, what's, what's going on with the Blue Jays?

What, what are they as a, as a team? They need a new hitting coach, apparently. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Get the Seattle guy. He's awesome. Apparently he's like, have you been holding the bat upside down because you got to hit it with the thick part of the bat.

That's very, very important in hitting. No, it's a hundred percent true. I mean, because this, this Jay's offense has been so atrocious. Um, it's kind of shocking to believe that, that they're even, even in a situation because they've been out of home work 51 to 25. That's the worst ratio in all of baseball. Vladimir Gura Jr. was given $500 million. He's on pace for in all of baseball Vladimir. Gura jr. Was given 500 million dollars

He's on pace for 19 home runs this season. Boba Shett has one home run and he hasn't been hurt He's playing every game. We're like almost in the middle of May. Anthony Santana. There was their big acquisition He's only in a couple of runs again notoriously slow starter George Springer had a nice story only his four home runs They don't not hit it all runs out of it and it's tough to watch and last night it was a heartbreaker all my god there are four to on the age of the range of pop and who's been really good but i need their closure and they give it up often gives about the angels walk it off by for the

night if you can't beat the angels good luck to you so the uh... the positive vibes what was a decent start the jay's a public or a a couple games at a first place now they're four or five games under 500 and even their pitching staff guys it's really led by their big three burrios who was excellent again last night it's him it's back it's Gossman Bowden Francis hasn't been nearly as good as he was a year ago and Max Scherzer who could have seen this coming on a one-year fifteen point five million dollar deal makes one start and hasn't pitched since then.

But now with a thumb injury, he's not going to be back until at least around May 29th. So two months of the season gone, $15.5 million for a number five starter, who's going to give you maybe four months. I don't want to take odds, yours is going to get hurt again. So you've got three fifths of a rotation

and a bad offense. There's your J's update. Are you a big run differential guy? Cause that's the one I use the most and the J's at minus 39 is not encouraging. Yeah. I, it's always funny, Jay, cause you'll get like one anomaly a year ago.

Well, for some reason they're minus five. It's still a playoff team and that happens, but I'm with you. Generally speaking, if you don't score more runs than you allow, you're not going to make the playoffs. At minus 39 is atrocious. And again, we've said this before with the Jays, what's the answer going to be? Who is this great call-up for getting? What trade are they going to make? There's nothing. This is the roster. These

are the guys you're relying on. It has to come internally. Alejandro Kirk has to hit. They have to hope that these guys are better than they are. Dalton Varsha now back in the lineup. And it's tough to really imagine. Kevin Sites are they got Kevin Sites are from Seattle. He's the heading coach. Get him over to the J's. Maybe Sites are his brother or something. Yeah.

So when someone who was a disciple, at least of him, who can come in and, uh, and help the J's now, believe it or not, the J's are not the most disappointing team in their division that has to go to the Baltimore Orioles, who probably the most disappointing team in Major League Baseball this year. I mean, this is a team. Are they rebuilding again? Yeah. They do nothing where they're getting bad and then good.

This was supposed to be this ascendant young, incredible team, right? They won the division a couple of years ago, playoff team last year. They're 13 and 22. You talk about run differential, minus 66 already. Like it's, there's no bright spot you can look at there for the Baltimore Orioles. What has happened in Baltimore Adnan? So glad you're bringing them up, Jamie. Cause I did MLB tonight last night with Chris young and normally we're fairly positive here at MLB network,

but all teams and when the Orioles loss came up, he was like, look at that record. I was like, ugh, like there's no way you could spin this in a positive prime of mine. Because as you guys pointed out for years, they were rebuilding right for years. They stunk. Okay. They're giving me like the Astros, like there's no way you could spin this in a positive frame of mind because as you guys pointed out for years they were rebuilding right for years they stunk okay they're gonna be like the Astros they're gonna be bad they're gonna draft well and all these picks so what's happened okay well some of the picks have worked out Gunnar Henderson's awesome but the other picks Ali Rutschman has been

bad now since last year's second half like I'm talking 600 OPS he's not even close to being an all-star catcherer holiday with the number one prospect all baseball and i think they fall flat on his face so far and that and then really much anything male another guy called it hasn't done much yet they're pitching is a huge disappointment a lot of draft picks went towards position players that it's a little bit cobbled together charlie morton was a free to signing

it's an area of ten he's been the what the worst starting pitcher in major league baseball this year. And they lost Corbin Burns, which perennially in the Cy Young conversation, and hasn't been great by the way for Arizona, but still he's an inning zero at the very least, and a guy expect to be great. So their pitching is in shambles. Their position players aren't anywhere close to what they thought. This is not going to turn around. And this went from years of losing and rebuilding a door they're going to be great and then division title and then no playoff success two years ago and then last year made the plus but no class success again

could you imagine if all it's very eerily similar to the Jays the Jay's are here come the Jays right the Jays are coming all the baby J's lad and bow and he's you and all these great young stars and then nothing they haven't won a playoff game yet and they always appear to be kind of like the Blue Jays. They're in trouble right now. Um, how much does culture play into baseball? Because we have talked about culture a lot in hockey. Is it, is it, is it the same in baseball or is it, is a little bit different

because in baseball and a lot of the times it's, it's just a lot of individual versus individual. Yeah, that's why I think it doesn't matter as much as in hockey because essentially Barry Bonds can be not particularly liked by half of the locker room, but who cares? Like as long as he goes up there and ranks, it doesn't matter. And I do think that winning overcomes the culture, meaning even if guys don't get along, if they're winning, they can all do what they want. Now I don't think you want if they're winning, they can all do what they want.

Now I don't think you want a Yankee situation years ago they famously said 25 players, 25 cabs. But if you go into most Major League Baseball locker rooms, it is kind of clinking. You got the Dominicans, you got the Puerto Ricans, you got the white players, you have the black players. But you know, it's honestly always based on race, but language is a part of it.

You do have guys who are more comfortable with each other. So I think over the course of a season, you don't want to have a bad, I would say this, Jay, it hurts more to have a bad locker room than it helps to have a good locker room. Like I've seen teams, the guys don't necessarily get along, who cares, they're winning. But if it's bad and becomes fractious, then yes, absolutely things can spiral quickly. Well, the reason I asked you is about Vladdy. How much is he as the team's highest paid player? By quite a bit.

How much is he responsible for setting the culture? Because we have so many conversations in hockey. It's like, you know, you watch Sidney Crosby play and, you know, all the other guys take their cues from him. And, you know, that's what we've been talking about a lot with the Canucks. Um, so what is the responsibility that Vlady has beyond doing the things that he does as an individual?

Well, I think it becomes intensified when he's not doing what he should be doing as an individual, right? If he goes out there and he's raking, like, well, Vlade's kind of a quiet guy, I'm like, all right, no problem. But if you're not hitting, you've got to be able to contribute in other ways. That's one of the reasons why Fernando Tatis is one of my favorite players because he's having an MVP type caliber a year,

but was pretty quiet in the series against the Yankees. Great showdown on the Bronx, didn't do much offensively, but still defensively made like three spectacular catches. So like he's always impacting the game in addition to having his flair and exuberance. So that's my concern with Vladi is that, okay, if you're not hitting, which clearly he isn't, not the way he should be,

what else does he bring on the table? No one's getting wowed by his defense or his base running and then as a leader when was the last time you heard a story about blotting this great leader like he has to lead by example he's not vocally grabbing guys by the throat and say okay let's turn this thing around and imagine if the jays start to spiral where does that leadership come from again bose are fairly soft-spoken guys well he's not your real rabble rouser is it a veteran guy like dalton varsho has to be the your real rabble rouser is it a veteran guy like Dalton Varsha who has to be the guy who kind of ride the troops is it a George Springer I think it'll become more of a question as the season goes on but yeah if you're getting paid 500

million dollars you have to do everything along with you know announce the scores and call the game and like this there's a lot of responsibility here on the squad. Run the scoreboard all of it. Adnan, thanks for doing this as always. We appreciate it and your number is safe with me. Not giving it out again, all right? That's what I was gonna say, I feel terrible about this. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no Thank you, Adnan. See you, buddy. Take care. That is Adnan Virk from NHL and MLB Network. Okay, so there's some things going on when it comes to coaching in the NHL.

No, none of them involve the Vancouver Canucks. Mike Sullivan is being introduced right now as the next head coach of the New York Rangers. And there's a report from Darren Drager on social media and he posts, we'll see how the day unfolds but indications are Joel Quinville is going to be the next head coach in Anaheim. Suggestion of announcement today. We had brought up Quinville's name as a candidate specifically for Anaheim because that's the type of market I think that Joel Quinville could go to.

Right. I don't think it would work very well in a Canadian market, or at the very least it would be challenging. Yes. Anaheim, not exactly, um, a hockey mad market, especially with where the Ducks are right now, this does seem like if Joel

Cuenville is going to return to the NHL to be a good fit for him. Um, what do you think about the idea of Cuenville to the Ducks and what do you think about the idea of Cuenville getting a job? Yeah, it's, it's an awkward one. Like he's been allowed back to the league. So I get it.

I in some ways. Bowman's already back in Edmonton. I have almost more of a problem with Quinville than Bowman. Cause I think he was closer to the situation. Yeah. Right. But I also understand that the league has kind

of made their ruling and made the decision on this, so it was going to happen and we all just kind of have to, have to go with it now. Uh, I do wonder. So it was going to happen and we all just kind of have to have to go with it. Now, uh, I do wonder how much this is going to be a bit of a domino falling for the rest of the coaching market. Now the he's been linked to this Anaheim job, so no great surprise here, but I wonder if maybe other coaches were waiting to see, okay,

is he actually going to go there? Cause I think the Anaheim job is really enticing. Like not just for Quenville. And you're right, going somewhere where, hey, maybe you're talking to one guy after practice, right? Rather than a big throng of media like you get in Canadian markets. But I think it's enticing for any coach who's

on the market. When you look at some of the young talent, they have the desire to improve all of that. I think that's a. I don't think they were very well coached. No, exactly. You know, like there's a, there's a, there's a lot of improvement to be had on that. I think that's a. I don't think they were very well coached in the last couple of years. No, exactly. You're like. You know, like there's a, there's a, there's a lot of improvement to be had on that.

If you were just, if your only priority was like, I want to go somewhere where I have the best chance of winning the Jack Adams next year. Yeah. You're like, if you get Anaheim to the playoffs. And I can. Jack Adams can. And I can golf all year.

Exactly. And we have flip flops to the rink. The number one thing that hockey people care about. There are also reports. I've read a few, I think Jimmy Murphy out of Boston is reporting that the Bruins would very much like to interview Rick Tauken as their next head coach.

The Boston job for me, I know he's got some familiarity with some of the players there with Lindholm and Zudoroff there. and I know the Bruins as an organization have been quite successful over the last decade or so, but to me, that team is, you know, if, if, if, if, if Toc had issues with down the middle in Vancouver, especially after JT Miller was traded, and he did because he was talking about it a lot

in the last press conference he held here. Is he going to feel a lot better about down the middle in Boston? I wouldn't think so. Gets to coach Nikita Zdorov again, but the Boston job. So that's nice.

Look, there are a lot of downsides to the Boston job. You do still have Posternak, McEvoy, Swamen under contract. That's a decent foundation at least. But I think the draw for taking the Boston job first and foremost for any coach would have to be, Hey, original six franchise, original six franchise with a lot of history. Yeah. Like that, that's really why you're going there and you're hoping you get a long

enough runway to, to be part of the turnaround and the retool or whatever they're going to do there. Cause the roster as it stands now is not that enticing, even with those players that I named, it's, there's a lot of problems on that roster. But there's been reports out as far back as the four nations that, Hey, Rick Tauke, next coach of the Boston Bruins, you're looking at him right

here kind of thing. Right? So there, I think there's going to be legs to that one. Talk it going to the Bruins. So did those, did those reports or rumors start coming out of Montreal or Boston when the four nations was there and talk was on the coaching staff? Yeah, I want to say it was, I'd have to go back

and double check, but it was, I believe somebody out of Boston who was putting it out there. And I think it was more than just speculation or more than, Ooh, would he be an interesting fit? So there is at least. Can actually be definitely hoping that he will go back East because the, when Frank came on our show yesterday and said that he'd had an

interview with Seattle, a lot of people are like, I thought, uh, it was like family reasons. He was going back East or just wanting to be back East. Is that, is that not a thing? Is it not happening? I like how we're just, we're trying to, we're trying to come up with anything that will help convince us that it wasn't just that he sees a dire future for the Canucks.

Do you know what I mean? That's like, well, I mean, I'm me. I've been like, he's a hero in Philly. This is a dream job, right? The, you know, I know the Flyers aren't in, in a perfect position, but he's, he's, he's the man there and he, and he's all about the Flyers. Then he just wants that job.

And as the days have been rolling by here, like any news on talking to the Flyers that would make me feel a tiny bit better about what's, what's happened here. LeBron said yesterday, they haven't even reached it out to him yet. Yeah. Now he did say that he expects that to change

this week, but it hasn't been the instant, oh yeah, he'll be in Philly next week. Like a lot of people expect it to be. They don't want it, they don't want it like doing to a tampering or something like that. Oh, whatever. I think that ship has sailed. Yeah.

He's got permission to speak with everyone. The Seattle, him ending up in Seattle would be the funniest possible outcome, certainly. And now who knows what he said to Jim Rutherford when they talked, but it's not like Tocket came out and said, oh, I want to be back East. You know what I mean? That was from Rutherford, that's secondhand. So he might've, like, he might've just, all he said

in his statement was I want to explore other opportunities or other challenges. That could be the Seattle Kraken. Okay. So we threw out this question and, uh, the, the Cuenville news, um, kind of took some of our time away, but if there's a team out there that you think is going to make some big changes this

off season that could involve the Vancouver Canucks in a trade. Which one do you think it is? Tony texts in and says, I could see Utah owner Ryan Smith wanting to make a splash this off season and they seem to have way too many centers and not enough young defensemen. Barrett Hayton is in the 96th percentile for speed bursts.

He is only 24 and Tony says he has good girth. Okay. Unfortunately, he is left-handed, but perhaps Sawyer Mineo and a pick might be enough. Uh, so that's one idea. Uh, Sam texts in Buffalo is our perfect trade partner. They are just as desperate as us.

I get that. Um, here's an interesting one from J dog, the car hog. I know no one is taking it seriously, but I really do think something could happen with New Jersey and Vancouver at the draft. If you read between the lines of everything that has gone on in New Jersey, the last 24 months with rumors of trading brat, cause he was too small. Then he got really good, but now Hughes is

always injured and he's small. I really do think they could be looking to exchange stars now, like Sat said yesterday, I'm going to have to trust you on this Jayhug. It would most likely be a three team deal, but I'm starting to seriously believe that there was little more than a joke. It was a little more than a joke when Rutherford

said, what if we bring his brothers here? I truly do think he is trying to pull something off. And furthermore, I now think that New Jersey are open to the idea because they really do want to get bigger and stronger. Okay. So I said this when Rutherford made this comment. I have heard that the Canucks have kicked this idea around. Now my response to that was not like, oh my god, really? It was,

yeah, of course they have. Of course they've had those conversations. They come up with the same ideas that we do. Some of them are maybe a little more refined, but why wouldn't you come up with that idea of, well, everyone's saying that Quinn is going to New Jersey. I don't, is there any way, I mean, obviously someone's asked that question. Is there any way we could bring his brothers here? Now, maybe the answer is like very quickly,

like, no, no, we can't do that. But I really do think they're going to, they're going to try. The question is really do think they're going to, they're going to try. The question is how much time are they going to waste on something if it's not doable? Well, especially because New Jersey might have all the doubts in the world about Jack Hughes, but if that's the thing that's going to get you

Quinn Hughes, it's like, well, okay, let's do that. We'll try to figure it out with Jack Hughes, right? Why are you going to be in a rush to trade him? So I see it as a non-starter. And I don't see any solutions to New Jersey's problems in Vancouver. Also, why would the devils do this when they could get Quinn Hughes for free?

Yeah. In two years or whatever it is. That's the whole thing. They could just wait a couple of years and get him for free. They don't need to make this trade. They have all the advantage. All right.

We can continue the conversation about potential trade partners for the Canucks later on in the show. But right now time for one to watch brought to you by Delaney's OK Tire. Looking at the schedule tonight, two games, the Hurricanes and the Capitals. I'm not going to focus on that game, believe it or not. Oilers and the Golden Knights. And I've done this guy as my one to watch on my show already, but I'm going back to the well. Jack Eichel, we see how dominant the Oilers can be with McDavid and Dry Settle at the top of their lineup.

The Golden Knights need not to neutralize them or anything, but they need their own superstar player at the top of their lineup to step up and have a monster game to get them back into this series. And Jack Eichel, my one to watch tonight for Vegas. Do you do one? No, I don't. Just me. All right. Nevermind. I was like, Oh, and then Brough will jump in. No, I was staring into space. Not spotting or throwing a break or something. It's time to put on your Toyo tires, whether you drive a car, light truck,

or van Toyo tires are designed to perform in all kinds of conditions. Visit Delaney's OK Tire in Langley and Aldergrove. Derek Lalonde, former NHL coach on the show next here on Halford & Brough Sportsnet 650. Hey, it's Vic Nazar. Have your say and join me on the People's Show with big takes and even bigger bets weekdays three to four on Sportsnet 650 or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome back to Halford & Brough Sportsnet 650 on a crash Thursday here on the show. Jamie Dodd filling in for Mike Halford. Halford & Brough brought to you by Sands & Associates. Learn how a consumer proposal reduces your debt by up to 80% with no more interest.

Visit sans-trustee.com. This hour brought to you by Jason.Mortgage. If you love paying too much for your mortgage then don't let Jason shop around to find the perfect mortgage for you. That's Jason dot mortgage. 650 650 is the Dumbar Lumber Text Line and a quick reminder here we've got a couple of giveaways coming up in the next hour. First a pair of tickets to the Vancouver Canadians for Saturday May 17th if you want to win those tickets be caller 5 at 815 the number is 604 280 06 50 and also a pair of tickets to see the who at Rogers Arena in September caller 5 at 8 for those tickets 604 280 06 50 now

joining us on the Power West hotline he is former NHL head coach and from doing great work on on the Hockey Net in Canada panels during these Stanley Cup playoffs. Very pleased to have on the show Derek Lalonde. Derek thanks for doing this. How are you? Thanks for having me guys. I'm good. Who doesn't want to go to a Who concert? Yeah absolutely. Although we were saying earlier in the show that is like I'm not sure the exact ages of everyone involved in the who at this point one of them is 81. Ageless. That's a good way to put it.

Rock and roll never dies they're ageless absolutely. So what do you think of the of the Leafs taking the two nothing series lead over the Panthers we were talking a bunch in the show earlier about Craig Barube and the job that he's done there and it really does feel like he has changed what do you want to call it the culture or how they approach the games the mentality whatever it is it feels like he's made a big difference on how the Leafs are doing in these playoffs. I can't be more impressed I've said it all along I said I saw it early on when we came in Detroit and played them in November it looked like they were taking on a different DNA I like it because I think that's what winning looks like. Giving up some offense for

keeping it out of the net. Ultimately every team you see at the end of the year it seems like it's that team that has done the best job at keeping it out of the net. Loved the balance of his lines. Even last night the way they bounced back down one nothing, down to one, they get tied three, three, and they respond with a quick goal. This team's looked poised throughout. Nothing has surprised me. I love the balance of their lines.

It's been impressive to watch from the get go. And I can't say I root for coaches, but I root for people that do things correctly and I just like what they've done, um, you know, on a player procurement. I liked how the deadline went with Carlo and Lawton. I've talked about a ton. I wanted Lawton for them when I worked the deadline day on sports net. And it's even went beyond expected. Uh, those guys being able to check and free up other lines.

You can even see it in this series so far. And they have a real chance on the road because of that depth. Chief has no problem matching fire on fire. Matthew's out against Barkov, no problem. He'll start line on a lot of D-zone starts and then that night have line check of Barkov or Bennett. and all of a sudden you find a Matthews or Tavares maybe against their bottom six, which you saw a couple

times at home, which was successful. So it's been fun to watch and we'll see how it goes on the road. So a lot of people were wondering if the Leafs would have some sort of response for Sam Bennett and they didn't really, they kept their focus and they kept their composure and they just went out and won the game.

As coach, how did you balance your desire, which I'm sure was there to see your players stick up for each other, but also maintain their composure and not play into the other team's hands? Well, I hope you've built that culture. Again, I really felt we took off in Tampa when we got a little heavier, just even having the Pat Maroons of the world around, but it was kind of just Pac mentality. Just like Blake Coleman plays that way, he's in your face.

Barclay Goodrow is that way. Picking up Luke Shen. All of a sudden we went from being light and scared to be pushing teams around. Even in Detroit, obviously we'd never had those type of players. But you establish a culture of just sticking up for each other and pack mentality and playing hard between the lines. And that first game, not so much last night, but that first game, I could not be more impressed with the physicality of Toronto. You push back in different ways and it was Nice with the big hit. It was, McCabe was a big hit. It was early on with Pachauretti in the big hit. You can see they were going

to play between the lines and not get caught up. And a lot of the gamesmanship in which Florida has, when they're good at it, it's part of their DNA. So again, one more box check on how they're handling things. So Derek, I want to ask you, I don't know how much attention you paid to what happened in Vancouver this year, but a lot of things happened and a lot of them weren't very good. There was a rift between JT Miller and Elias Pedersen that by all accounts didn't stay just with those two players.

It affected the entire room, the entire organization, and eventually JT Miller was traded away. What did you think about when you saw that and when you heard what was happening in Vancouver? Yeah, it's hard for me. Obviously you're not in those rooms. It's the reality of, I personally really like to keep things private within a room.

That was my motto in Tampa. That was my motto in Detroit. What happens in a room stays in a room, but sometimes, especially in a media market like that, it's just a reality of it. So I don't have a good enough field to have an opinion on it. Um, just, you love for those things to stay certainly in house. I had JT Miller in Tampa and I liked JT. I had a really good relationship with JT.

I understand what JT is. He's very emotional. He's a good player. He's, he's intense, but there's a good person in there. I've never really dealt with. Patterson at all. So it's hard for me to say it's just, but that's the reality of today's NHL. And people don't understand that, you know, one of the biggest projects of a

coach is managing that stuff day to day. And I don't think Rick Taka gets enough credit for the type of communicator he is, the type of relationship person he is. I know Taka a little bit, but getting to know him, his assistant in Arizona, Jay Farrity was my assistant here and those guys still have a very good relationship. And just for Tocket to want to work hard, want to know what players are like and the mentality and see them communicate. I don't think he gets enough credit for being a modern coach because today's app needs instant feedback and they want feedback and they

need to communicate and build relationships with them and I think he's done that and why he had success there especially two years ago you know I had PSSooter he wanted to know everything about PSSooter had a really good relationship with Connor Garland at world championships. And he worked hard on that relationship. We're playing Vancouver and Detroit. I come around the corner and him and Garland are having a long heart to heart conversation. I had a really good relationship with Philip Horonick.

He dug in on who Philip Horonick the person was, and obviously got the best out of him. So it's all about relationships and usually teams are successful. They work on those relationships. So I think Coach Taka did a really good job with it and why his players loved him so much when he walked out the door, as you saw. Can you tell us a little bit more about the daily grind of being an NHL head coach? Just all the things that you got to keep your eye on, having the relationships with individual

players and having to get to know the players on an individual basis so you know how to motivate them, you know how to get through them. But also you've got a pre-scout, you got to watch video and you got to deal with the media every day in a market like Vancouver, I'm sure there are times when you're just dreading coming out and talking to the media about all the challenges that you're having, especially when things aren't going well.

Yeah, Detroit was no different and I lived both ends of it. I had this team on a roll and the fact that we improved 17 points over two years, we got finished in a virtual tie with Washington Capitals a year ago and then it stalled. I went from the, hey, way to go, we've got their coach, this is unbelievable too, let's run this guy out of town. It's the reality of it. You block out noise.

It's, it's the reality of our profession. Um, and you just deal with those realities and you don't let it bother you. You stay resilient on those types of things, but you're bang on. Like it's a process. Obviously you're on top of the X's and O's. You're on top of the structure. You've worked really hard on that, but we'd come in in the morning, we'd work just as hard on relationships.

Player A, what's wrong with player A? How's he doing? Okay, coach, you're gonna go talk to player B. All right, it's my time to talk with him. It's the reality of the modern athlete and the coaches that have that ability to kind of balance accountability with likeability are the coaches that are having success right now. I feel I was lucky in that I got my chance and have done really well in this profession

because I came from college where it's so relationship based. And I know, you know, John Cooper was that type of guy that had that balance of holding guys accountable, but being able to build some trust with relationships. That's today's athletes. So, you know, everyone just looks at coaching as X's and O's and they are right. You got to be on top of that. You got to get the most out of your group. But it's a lot more of that, you got to get the most out of your group. But it's a lot more of that. And again, it's, it's the reality of today's NHL.

And those coaches that aren't adapting to that, as you can see, are finding themselves out of the lead. We're speaking with Derek Lalonde here on the Halford & Bruff show on Sportsnet 650. One thing I've always wondered is if you've got one player that responds well to, I don't know, let's simplify it here, but you know, you yell at him and he says, well, I'll show you coach.

But you've got another player that responds well to, um, encouragement and positivity and might shut down if you yell at him. Does that, could that create difficulties where one player says, you know, you never yell at this guy, but you're always yelling at me? Yeah, I think it's the reality of managing a team and the best coaches are finding that balance in

managing, but it's really understanding the player and holding different players accountable on who they are. and holding different players accountable on who they are. I, again, we had our best success. We finally got over the hump in Tampa because I really thought we started to understand the leadership group. Uh, and instead of forcing this person into what he wasn't, we worked with what he was, and that was a great lesson for me going forward.

And we saw that here in Detroit. I loved the growth I had with Dylan Larkin and the relationship and how he grew in the leadership because I really got to understand who Dylan Larkin was. And I think that's probably just a reality. You know, some players you can be hard on some players, you have to have a different approach and relationship. And that's just understanding today's athletes.

So, um, and the good coaches find that balance and it's not always perfect. Um, I go back to Jeff Halpern used to talk about in our Tampa room that good coaches nail six out of ten things, but you got to be assertive with them. And they say, you know, I've learned when I thought about that, and here's a Princeton graduate, such a smart guy, this is the reality to it. So it's not a perfect science in coaching, but it's becoming a lot different in today's day and age.

But it's again, the reality of the relationship and getting to each individual. And Derek one of the things we're talking a lot about out here in Vancouver with a coaching vacancy is the potential of a coach going from AHL to NHL bench boss and of course you were an assistant in Tampa but before that you were an AHL head coach also an ECHL head coach. What was the biggest difference, the biggest thing you had to learn going from coaching, having the head job in the AHL to eventually having the head job in the NHL? Probably a little difference in the accountability. In the AHL, you're trying to win, you better win, and any competitor wants to win and I think

winning speeds up development so there's always that balance there but you are a little more you're gonna err on development there and that's not a bad thing but obviously when you get to the next level it's the bottom line is winning yes today's NHL you have to develop on the fly and it's a reality of it. Uh, you just don't have the luxury and today's salary cap and the amount of contracts to let players kind of marinate for years, um, in the American hockey, you're still developing on the fly. You probably see you guys go to practices, you know, before and after

practice look like hockey schools with skilled coaches and skill. That's the reality of just developing guys on the fly. But I think it's just a different level of accountability, uh, focus a little more towards winning. Um, but that's what you guys, I, again, I appreciate, I think I got to where I was to become a head coach in national hockey league because I experienced every level and I was a career coach and I think that's real. And so there's a reason guys cut their teeth in the American hockey league.

It's the closest thing to the national hockey league and it's a little bit different. I'm just managing A to Z. Now you're dealing with a staff. Now you're dealing with those relationships I talked about. Now you're dealing with a staff, now you're dealing with those relationships I talked about, now you're dealing with an analytics team, now you're dealing with management. It's just, you have to cut your teeth as a head coach and it's also a great spot to do it.

What do you think about what's going on in Tampa Bay right now? Obviously not the first round they wanted and now they're out. Do they need big changes there or do you just keep coming back and trying? Obviously not the first round they wanted and now they're out. Do they need big changes there or do you just keep coming back and trying? Yeah, probably not. I'm not close enough to see it.

I will say this, it's a really good team. It's a really talented coaching staff. I've had this question a little bit. Here we are, you know, three years in a row, not getting out of the first round, but I really think they've been on the unfortunate side of a match up the last two years. I mean, Florida is as good as it gets. I've never kind of worried about the format, the two versus three in some of these divisions. One year when we won the Stanley cup in the pandemic situation,

we had to play, I believe Florida in the first round and Carolina second round. And that year those are arguably two of the best teams in the league. And we had to face those guys in the first two rounds. So watching Tampa get mounts in the first round, watching Colorado get guns in the first round, it's probably the first time. watching Colorado get bounced in the first round. It's probably the first time I have a little more time for the people, you know, loud about a one versus eight matchup because just it's unfortunate for those guys to get bounced in the first round. So that is a really good team in Tampa. I know the DNA of a lot of those guys, unbelievable core. We could have replayed this whole thing and they

could have won a Stanley Cup with that group. I just really think it was the reality of the matchup and the level of play Florida's at right now. Derek, looking ahead to one of the games on the schedule tonight, Edmonton versus Vegas, Edmonton trying to take a 2-0 series lead and they've won five games in a row now, comeback in all of them since dropping those first two against LA. What does Vegas need to do to, to stem the tide a little bit against Edmonton in game two tonight? Their identity and their depth. I know,

um, when they are rolling, they're rolling four lines and they're heavy. Um, I know just even working at Sportsnet, Kelly Rudy cut them towards the end of the year and he was talking about Michael Hurdle, Carl Savoy down the middle, the heavy in depth throughout their wings. That's who they have to be. I think this is a legit Stanley Cup contender. I gave full credit for Edmonton taking that first game. I did not see a performance like that. I know they have a chance to win this series. They have a chance to win this whole thing.

You never count a team out like that, which I say to McDavid, but, uh, I think it's more about what Edmonton did the other day and to watch that depth, just keep improving and playing. Brown, you know, he was on a buzz in the other day. I'm not surprised he made that play. Yeah, Pod Coles has had an impact. You know, Jan Mark Arvinsson, Frederick's starting to come around. It's been more about Edmonton playing at a really high level the other night than where Vegas was, but Vegas would have to get back to rolling four lines, probably trying to get a little more zone time, a little more identity of who they are,

spending some time in the zone, being heavy, a really good matchup. And it's a huge credit. You guys saw the same thing. I saw Edmonton down to nothing. Uh, I was actually working sports nuts and you know, sports net even really, you know, they live and die by their Canadian teams. And so around that office, around that studio, they're, they're rooting for those Canadian teams, but it did not feel good.

You know, they lost those two games and it did not look comfortable. The loss of Matthias Ekholm and that D-Core, you know, some of those right lefties were playing on the right side. It just looked really uncomfortable. I'm like, this team's in trouble. And for them to turn around like they did and the way they're playing at a high level right now is a huge credit to that staff and that group. Derek, thank you so much for taking some time to chat with us today. We really appreciate it and hopefully we can

chat again soon. Anytime guys. Good luck with everything. Thank you. Thanks Derek. That is Derek Lalonde, former NHL head coach, now doing great work on Sportsnet during the Stanley Cup playoffs and weighing in on what's

happening in the playoffs and also a little bit about his path and kind of bigger picture philosophical coaching conversations and an interesting hypothetical that, you know, you pulled purely out of thin air about if a coach yells at one player a lot, but doesn't yell at another player. Yeah. Interesting.

I never, it never occurred to me before. I was just curious about what might that be like. If such a situation ever developed. Could that cause a friction? Could that cause a, would you call it a rift maybe? Could it cause? Or like a blow up of some sort. I don't know.

A feud? Yeah, that Oilers performance against Vegas after falling behind 2-0. I don't know if I've seen the Oilers. That's terrifying. I don't know if I've seen the oilers. That's terrifying. I don't know if I've seen the oilers play better. No. Like this current group, I saw the 80s oilers play pretty well, but this current group, they were excellent.

Well, and they had- Everything was good about their performance. They had periods against LA also where it was like pure dominance. You know what I mean? Where LA could barely touch the puck and the shots, shots were 15 to one in the period or whatever, right? And you think, okay, it's LA and Jim Hiller, is he the right coach?

And then you look at Vegas, who I think everyone had as legitimate Stanley Cup contenders. One of the teams that could win that thing or win this thing. In Vegas too. In Vegas. Yeah. And you do it against them.

And that's a different story. That is, you know, we were talking about reasons to be scared about what the Leafs are doing if you're a Leafs hater. Well, if you're an Oilers hater, that gave you plenty of reason to be terrified as well. So right now, right now, if you were to make favorites on the Canadian teams, who'd be the

favored Canadian team to win the cup? Probably Edmonton. Yeah. Now Toronto's up to nothing. So that gives them a little bit of a leg up. team to win the cup. Probably Edmonton. Yeah. Toronto's up to nothing. So that gives them a little bit of a leg up. Winnipeg's down obviously, but I think it's got to be Edmonton. They're leading in their series and they've

looked terrifying. Yeah. Has any team looked better at any moment in these playoffs than Edmonton has at their best? I don't know. Probably not though, but I've also seen Edmonton. They've looked bad. Pretty low.

I just, my brain is going, they can't do it with Pickard. They can't do it with Pickard then. And you know, they can't do it with that blue line. But I don't know when they've got, you've got McDavid and Dreisaitl. And if. You can do an awful lot. And if Evander Kane is going to be a factor. And LaLonde mentioned Pod Colson and I think Pod Colson has been like the perfect kind of depth

player out there, it's just, he's actually has four assists and he's also been super physical. Yep. Very physical. And that was kind of at his best in Vancouver. He did a lot of good things. He just could not finish and he didn't have enough kind of individual swagger with the game, but if he, if he's, if he,

if you just tell him to play a very simple game, then, then he can do that. Um, yeah, I think, but for me, I think, I think if I was going to make odds, it'd be Toronto. Yeah. Cause I think Toronto being up two nothing in their series, that's obviously bigger than one nothing.

And I just feel like the, don't you think if they get past Florida, the Eastern Conference final matchup could be easier than the Western Conference final matchup? Yes, I do. I'm a little skeptical of both Washington and Carolina, whereas I think the Western Conference final is going to be, is going to be a war.

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