Halford & Brough in the Morning - Is Mike Sullivan A Coaching Candidate For The Canucks If Tocchet Leaves?

Episode Date: April 28, 2025

In hour two, Mike & Jason get the latest around the Habs from Radio-Canada Canadians reporter Marc Antoine Godin (1:02), they discuss the Penguins firing Mike Sullivan and if he might be a potential coaching candidate for the Canucks if Rick Tocchet leaves (10:00), plus they chat the Jets Blues series with CJOB Winnipeg's Jim Toth (23:57). This podcast is produced by Andy Cole and Greg Balloch. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

Music 7.03 on a Monday. Happy Monday everybody. Halford Brub, SportsMed 650. Halford Brub of the morning is brought to you by Sands and Associates, BC's first and trusted choice for debt help with over 3,000 five-star reviews. Visit Sands-Trustee.com. For more, we are in hour two of the program. Hour two is brought to you by Jason Homonuck at Jason.Mortgage. If you love giving the banks more of your money, then don't let Jason shop around to find the perfect mortgage for you. Visit him online at Jason.mortgage. We are coming to you live from the Kintec studio, Kintec Footwear and Orthotics, working together with you in step.

Our next guest joins us from Montreal, Mark Antoine-Godin from Radio Canada joins us now on the Haliford and Brough show on Sportsnet 650. Good morning, Mark Antoine, how are you? I'm good guys, how are you? We're good, thanks for taking the time to do this this morning. Before we dive deep into the series, just set the stage and what the atmosphere is like in Montreal right now, the return of playoff hockey

to the Bell Center, of course this time with fans in attendance, what's that been like? Well the Bell Center is not out of practice, surprisingly, I mean it's been many years since there was a full building for a playoff game. I mean, we have to go back to 2017. The only remaining member of the Montreal Canadiens who lived that was Brendan Gallagher. So it was new for everybody else.

And so there was, it felt as though a whole generation of fans also had not, had not lived it. a whole generation of fans also had not had not lived it. And, you know, it's funny because there's been so much hype around the building, around the impact that the crowd may have on games, so much so that there's a hype on the hype, you know, but it's ultimately, it makes for a great playoff atmosphere. I mean, it might sound a bit chauvinistic or call it whatever you want, but I think that the NHL is in a better place when Montreal is in playoffs because it's a good window to the sport, to the passion of the fans. Whether it's the Montreal Canadians players or their opponents, everybody loves to play in that atmosphere.

Absolutely. You are 100% right. That being said, Washington is leading this series three to one. What's been the difference for you between Washington and Montreal? Well, you got to hand it to the Capitals for the way that they played defensively and really stifling Montreal's offense. The Canadians are not a powerhouse in this league by any stretch, but they're trying to come at you in waves and have four lines rolling.

But really, if you manage to quiet down the Nick Suzuki line, the pressure on the other lines to produce it and be a threat is a lot more significant. In that sense, the Capitals did a really good job in three games out of the four to shut down Suzuki's line and to greatly reduce the threats coming from the other lines. You saw at times the Dvorak line with Gallagher and Josh Anderson doing their buzzing a little bit in the offensive zone. But mainly for the Canadians, it's been special teams that's been where they've been impactful or they might have, you could argue that they've been

the better team throughout the series, but five on five, even yesterday. I mean, the Capitals were the better team five on five for the first 40 minutes, but the Canadians managed to kill a three on five and then they scored on the power play late in the second period. So they were up two to one at the end of the second period and the Capitals were totally deflated when they went back to their room. Spencer Carberry said that the guys had done such a great job at even strength. They started the game strong. They were not impressed by the atmosphere at the Bell Centre. They were ready for it this time. But the fact that the Canadians managed. They were ready for it this time, but the

fact that the Canadians managed to get the lead after 40 minutes was deflating to us. So, the Cavs managed to come back in the third period. The Canadians were not entirely up to the moment. They were a bit distracted and they lost their focus. So, defensively, to answer your question shortly, I think that defensively, the caps are strong, but you see also their experience showing up a great deal. Let's get some health updates here. Alex Carrier took a massive hit from Tom Wilson, one of the defining plays of the series. How is he and also what is the health of Montaumeau? of the series, how is he and also what is the health of Monta Bo?

Yeah. So while regarding Carrier, Carrier left the game twice yesterday, cause in the first period, he just nearly managed to escape Alex Avetskin hit that, that almost propelled Avetskin on the Canadian bench. But he seemed to tweak something in the leg and had to leave, you know, he had to leave maybe he might have missed the last seven or eight minutes of the first period, came back for the second and just really got his bell rung by Tom Wilson at the third period. He was not able to escape that one. You know, that was a hit that really changed the momentum of the game.

And second time, while Kariya had to leave, he had something, it seemed as though like a bag of ice on his neck. So he stayed on the bench for a while. And then at a TV timeout, he skated for a little bit and decided to go back into the room. So for now, we don't have any updates on him. You know, you would assume that if it would be out they would call it an upper body injury and nothing any more than that. But we'll know more about him today. He's an essential part of the Canadian Blue Line. His acquisition this year was really impactful because the Canadians needed an effective, a reliable right-handed defenseman and they found one in Carrier who was obtained only

for Justin Barron. And as for Montembourg, well, the fact that they had to call up Caden Primo, he was not able to dress as a backup yesterday. You know, it doesn't really bode well. For now, he's called being under day-to-day observation. So again, I think we'll know more today, but they might play this close to the chest and not even disclose anything regarding Motambu. But you know, as he was out yesterday, his backup, Jacob Dobesh, did an okay job, I guess. Okay, Mark Antoine, I know you got to go, but in five seconds,

Marten Solian Sanlui, did he pull the goalie too early? Uh, no, I don't think so. I don't think so. Uh, I mean, obviously over three minutes or something, it's likely the other team is going to touch the puck. My bigger beef would be with the fact that early in the third period, the Canadians had a power play placed the second one after only 58 seconds of a power play. And I thought, had he given the first unit potentially the full two minutes or at least a longer leash on that power play, they might have scored a third goal and put the game more out of reach of the Washington capitals. For me, if I have to second guess any of Marty St. Louis' decisions, I look more towards that than at pulling the goalie.

Mark Antoine, this was great. Thanks for taking the time to do this today. We really appreciate it. My pleasure. Take care, guys. You too. Thank you. That's Mark Antoine. I'm from Radio Canada in Montreal, here on the Halford & Brough show on Sportsnet 650. So, if you're just joining the show, big news out of Pittsburgh, the Pittsburgh Penguins have moved on from Mike Sullivan. He is no longer the head coach in Pittsburgh. So add Pittsburgh to the list of teams that's

going to be looking for a new head coach, but also add Mike Sullivan to the list of potential candidates. Now I did have a thought about this. Another thought. I've had a few thoughts. Thoughts. I like thoughts.

Could this in some ways work out for the Canucks because it might make Rick Tauke it wonder if he really does have a ton of leverage. You're going to need to explain that thought even further. Well, let's say he was going after, let's say, we're not saying this is what he's doing. Set the hypothetical for me.

Go. Let's say he wants the Rangers job. Tauke it. And he wants to wait it out and he's going to get the Rangers job because he's going to say no to the Canucks. Okay. Does he still feel that way?

And you could do this for any job out there, right? Maybe it's a Flyers job or whatever. Does he suddenly go like, Ooh, maybe I won't be a top choice because those teams are going to go after Sullivan. Right. You know, and maybe he's like, Ooh, should I just, should I just accept

this Canucks job? Because a lot of people have thought about it in a way of maybe Sullivan will come to Vancouver because of the Pittsburgh connection. And that's obvious. And maybe he will, but Sullivan might also not want to come to the West coast. He might look at jobs in Philly or New York or

Boston as more appealing to him. And then if suddenly, if you're talking, you're like, oh, I don't know. I mean, I do think it requires an exploration of these jobs and the markets and the team that the coach would be inheriting. And I guess part of that is always putting it up against the Vancouver job.

Like here's one, here's the other. But let's, we know what the Vancouver job is. We know what it entails. Good, bad, ugly, otherwise. These other gigs that are out there, we ran through them about a week ago. None of them are perfect. Aside from New York being New York and I guess

Boston being Boston, the status of the franchise, Original Six, everything that goes along with it, playing in a big market, coaching in a big market. They don't strike me as teams that are going in a really enticing upward trajectory. Yeah. Maybe the Rangers. Are you loving the depth down

the middle of any of those teams? I mean, the Rangers, I know, I know they have JT Miller now, but Zabana Jed was one of the reasons why they really struggled this year. And you have to wonder if his best years are behind him and in Boston, we all know the issue is down the middle there. So throw the Pittsburgh job into the mix for

sake of argument, the now vacant Pittsburgh Penguins job. The pros would obviously be like a reunion of sorts. Also you get the opportunity to be Sydney Crosby's head coach, but that is a team that has been not just on the outside of the playoff picture the last few years, but increasingly farther away. Like way, way outside of the playoff picture. And how many more years of sit are you going to get?

I think, I think one of Tauke's big concerns in Vancouver is how long he's going to have Queen Hughes here. I think that's obvious that he is probably just as unsure as some of us that Queen Hughes is going to resign. And what happens if Quinn Hughes strongly signals next summer that he's not going to come back?

At that point, aren't you obligated to at least look at a trade? Aren't you obligated for the better, better men of the franchise to look at trying to get some assets for Quinn Hughes, as opposed to letting him walk away for nothing. I think you are. And then, um, and then what are you as a head

of coach then? You're like, okay, well, who's, who's my leader here? Which is why, which is why when you take the step back and look at it, you kind of can understand why there's been no resolution. It's almost like you need to have some sort of resolution on that before you can have the resolution of taking or moving on from the job. But it's impossible to have that resolution right? I think you could probably get a good

in there's two figures here let's be honest it's Hughes and it's Pedersen and you want to get some level of clarity on both. At a certain point, there will be a drop dead decision time, deadline time. This has, we gotta go one way or the other here. Yeah. I do wonder if they're both parties, like we do have time. Like I understand that there's outside pressures, there's media, there's people wanting answers,

and there's an active coaching search going on across the National Hockey League But there is no huge rush say in the next Week, but every day that goes along more questions come up and every day that goes along more developments happen I did not anticipate coming in this morning And getting news that Mike Sullivan after ten years on the job and the second longest tenured coach in the NHL was gonna be out In Pittsburgh that I. That does alter things. It creates another job, it puts another very viable candidate on the market and because of the relationships

between Vancouver and Pittsburgh, there's a lot of different dynamics that you can unpack there that are at play. Peter in Cloverdale, why would Sullivan want to come to Vancouver? They can't even pay their top prospect an extra $200,000 if he hits his bonuses. Yeah, Tom Willander is still unsigned. It is a very uncertain situation in Vancouver.

And if you were interviewing as a new head coach or a head coach candidate, you know, that part of the interview where the interviewer goes, do you have any questions? You'd be like, ah, yes, I have a hundred questions about what the hell just happened in Vancouver this past season. What is going on here?

What is going on there? What's your plan to fix this? Every part of the organization from the captain on down all the way to the prospects seems uncertain right now and that could be seen if you were a Mr. Positive thinking as I see these things as an opportunity but they're also like hmm they could be challenges. Just to answer Peter and Clover Dale's text though why would Sullivan want to come to Vancouver he'd finally get a chance to coach Quinn Hughes.

Remember how excited he was at the prospect of flying him in for the foreign agents? Remember he jumped the gun and said, he's like, Quinn Hughes is on his way. Like there's a coach, there's a coach that wants to coach Quinn Hughes. You know Sullivan's gonna take the job and Quinn is gonna be like, actually.

I like talk it better. Yeah, I'm gonna try and follow him. Yeah, I wanted to argue with you about Sullivan to Vancouver because it's good sports radio and I'm having a hard time seeing how that would be a good fit because of all the things that you laid out. He's been at one job for too long, very much scarred from the Tortorella. And I know it was over a decade ago, but the vibes are way too similar. A guy that's been in one market for an awfully long time, it was at his heart and soul on that job, and then just kind of takes another job because it was available. That to me feels way too similar.

And I think the market, given the scars from that history and those memories, maybe it's best to go in a different direction there if you have to. I just don't see it. I want to go back to what you were saying about trying to find some certainty in for any coach, whether it's Tauket or a new head coach in Vancouver. How do you do that?

How do you, how do you, if you're a management group, how do you convince if you're a management group, how do you convince Tocket or any other candidate that things are going to be okay? That is a, that is a tough thing because how do you, let's go through the list here. Uh, I'm a head coach. I'm asking, I'm asking you, you're the manager. We'll do a little role playing here.

Okay. I love role play. Okay. I'm asking, I'm asking you, you're the manager. Yeah, sure. Let's do this. Okay. I love role play. Okay. I'll be talk it or whoever. Um, can you be certain that Quinn Hughes is going to be here in a, in two years or even a year? No, but we're going to try and we're going to tamper. Uh, can you be certain that Elias Peterson is

going to, uh, turn his game around? That he's going to put the work in this off season and he's going to be the difference maker that his contracts suggest he should be. No, but we're going to trade him. Can you be certain that you can trade Elias Pedersen? We're going to damn try. Okay.

That's your opinion by the way. Yeah, no. But we're doing role play. So when you trade Elias Pedersen, can you be certain that you can fix the centre position? Because if you trade Elias Pedersen, you definitely don't have a one C and you may not have a two C. No.

Can you be certain that Thatcher Dempko will be healthy and here for a long time or are we looking at a team where Kevin Lankinen is the number one goalie? We're looking at a team where Kevin Lankinen might be the number one goalie. You're being too honest here. I know.

But you gotta answer the questions. But you're Jim Rutherford, it's like, I don't like it yet. Yeah, I'll go and get another goalie, maybe one under contract. Do you know what I'm saying here, right? We've done this exercise. This is a new way of doing the same exercise.

But yeah, I do think that instead of off, you can't offer certainty on anything. I think what you can offer is honesty and clarity. There's no point in trying to sugar coat what the Canucks are. Your sales pitch as a management group is gonna be, we're gonna do everything in our power to keep Quinn Hughes. We've made that abundantly clear

by skirting the line of tampering at our end of year media availability. We have, and if you wanna try and toot your own horn a little bit, you could say we have made a lot of trades and a lot of transactions in our time on the job and if you wanna have a calling card as a management group you can say we inherited a really bad blue line

and our active NHL blue line one through six right now, we built that and we moved pieces on the chessboard. How'd you do that? Yeah, Rob Peter. Sullivan's like, okay, I'm fine with all of this, but please tell me about your practice facility. Right, yeah, yeah. Rather than like, no.

I was gonna make that joke, it was like, all right, you've convinced me, I'll take the job. Now, if you can just direct me to the practice facility and we'll get started. Right, about that. Right, yeah. Sign here first. I will say this, because so often, the success and failure of a coach comes down to the goaltending

I do think that you could spin a pretty nice narrative that You know if Demko is healthy and I think you could point to some different levels of optimism with him Understanding what his body can't can't do. And also like we've addressed the workload issue because we've got Lankinen. You could say like, you might have the best goaltending duo in the NHL. Sure. Right, and that's-

Hughes has suggested that. And that's not spin. If those two guys are healthy and going, and they can lessen the load on one another, you do have a very good goaltending tandem. Yep. And that is something that a lot of coaches will look at, because there have been plenty of coaches in the NHL who,

when they're walking out the door because they're fired, look at the goalie, and they're like, that's one of the reasons why. So I think there's that. Also, maybe everything works out. Maybe Hughes doesn't leave, Petey finds his game, Demko isn't injured anymore, and there we go. Yeah.

So that's always possible. I mean, it is possible. Sunshine and lollipops. Yeah. So you could sell, solve it on that. Like, look, regardless, you're going to be up for a challenge and there will be a challenge coaching this team, but maybe things will work out well. Yeah.

People that buy stocks when the stock market is down. Yeah. You know, sometimes get destroyed. Yes. But they won't sell it like that. It'll be like, but it might work. I like the suggestion in the Dunbar Lumbertex line to go with Coach GPT next season.

Coach GPT, that is a good one. Yeah, when will the first AI coach be? Soon. Every line go out on the ice at once. What? Coach GPT, that doesn't work. How far are you allowed to do that? I feel like you don't use chat GPT at all. What coach GPT that doesn't work I'm not allowed to do that. You don't use chat GPT. I've never used it. You've never used never used it never no Game just starts coach GPT says to pull the goalie We got to try it it's my gut it is going to work

Okay, before we got a break we go to break. We got gotta do one to watch brought to you by Delaney's OK Tire. Here's the first, I'm gonna be watching the guys behind the benches tonight when the Battle of Florida gets underway between the Tampa Bay Lightning and the Florida Panthers. Paul Maurice and John Cooper have entered the fold into what's been a pretty testy rivalry over the last few years,

chirping back and forth about who hits who and who has the puck. It's been a quiet series at times, but also a very loud series with the number of hits and the coaches getting involved. So it was a big win by the Florida Panthers, sorry, by the Tampa Bay Lightning the other night to cut the lead to 2-1.

We'll see if they can even the series at 2-2 tonight. So the ones to watch, John Cooper and Paul Maurice, as the Battle of Florida gets underway tonight. It's time to put on your Toyo tires, whether you drive a car, light truck, or van, Toyo tires are designed to perform in all kinds of conditions. Visit Delaney's OK Tire in Langley and Aldergrove.

OK Tire service, repair, and tires. Coming up on the other side of the break, we're gonna go to Winnipeg. Jim Toth, host of Jets at Noon on 680 CJOB and Winnipeg is gonna join us to talk about what's going on with Connor Hellebuck and what the final three games of this series will hold for the Winnipeg Jets.

You're listening to the Halford and Breff show on Sportsnet 650. Hey, it's Jamie Dodd. And Thomas Strance. Get your daily dose of Canucks talk with us weekdays from 12 to two on Sportsnet 650. Or catch up on demand through your favorite podcast app. 7.31 on a Monday. Happy Monday everybody. Halford Brough, SportsNet 650. Halford Brough of the morning is brought to you by Sands and Associates. Learn how a consumer proposal reduces your debt by up to 80% with no more interest. Visit them online at sands-trustee.com. We are

in hour two of the program. Jim Toth is going to join us out of Winnipeg in just a moment here. Hour two of this program is brought to you by Jason Hominuk at jason.mortgage. If you love paying too much for your mortgage, then don't let Jason shop around to find the perfect mortgage for you. Visit him online at jason.mortgage. Our next guest is the host of Jets at Noon and the Jim Toth Show on 680 CJOB in Winnipeg. Jim Toth joins us now on the Halferd and Breff Show on Sportsnet 650. Morning, Jim, how are you?

Good morning, gentlemen, I'm good. Thanks for having me back. Always fun, always good to talk to you. Yeah, it's great having you on the show. I gotta start with the big question though. What is up with Conor Hellebuyck? Well, I didn't see this coming. You guys didn't prep me.

I had no idea we were gonna talk about this. Look, if you go to my social media, I'm not very well liked right now because I don't blame Conor Hellebuyck, but he is part of the problem if that makes sense. I'm not a big guy on the whole, you know, a goalie and I get it, like I've seen goalies stand on their head and steal series, steal games and stuff like that. He needs to elevate, he needs to get better, he needs to be one of their best players because he is one of their best players. That being said, I don't think the team is helping him. And

Scott O'Neill said that in the post game show. He goes, I have a hundred percent confidence in Connor Hellebuck and yada, yada, yada. However, we, he helps us and we need to help him. And so what I see is a lot of coverage breakdowns and a lot of opportunities, um, allowing in front of them. And the last two games we've been talking about, well, which goal would you put on him? Which one? And clearly the one in game three, where he bobbled the puck behind the net is his fault. But there's a lot of tips going on. There's a lot of deflections going on. There's a lot of traffic in front of them. And he's got to fight, fight through it and become more elite. But I know what his playoff record is. I know that even last

year, going back to the Colorado Avalanche series, his numbers were horrific, but I also know that how that happened and the power plays that they gave up and the opportunities that if for a team that finished fourth last year in the national hockey league and second overall in the West in that five games of the playoffs, their goals from high danger chances or chances from high danger opportunities in front of the net doubled in that five game series from what it was in the regular season. And that's what's been happening in the last two games as well. Is there an appreciation for Robert Thomas? Because for me, I'm looking at that guy in a whole new way over the last year or so. Yeah, you know, and he had a down year last year, right? But he's a driver. Look, I've been impressed with the St. Louis Blues team. And I say that

because I don't think they're as good Louis Blues team. And I say that because I don't think they're as good as the Jets. I don't think they're as deep as the Jets. But what they are is they have that factor, right? Like Robert Thomas is a gamer, as Paul Marais used to say about players and how he describes Matthew Tuchuk. The one who's impressed me the most in this series is Pavel Bucznaiewicz. I've been aware of him. I've seen him throughout the years and things like that, but he is on another level. And it started in game one when about five minutes in, there was a scrum in front of the net and him and Shifely started pushing and he just shook the gloves at Shifely and

asked him if he wanted to go. And I thought right then I'm like, well, I get it. You're going to try and get Shifely off his game. But what he's done by that is also elevated his own game and he's playing angry and driven in that whole line. Right. Um, I still like Jordan Kyra as a player, but, but to me, Robert Thomas and, and Pavel have been the two guys that have sort of elevated

their play and driven this team. Um, health wise, are the Jets going to get Elers or Velardi or both of them back soon? I think Velardi is going to be back for game five. I think he could have played in game four and I should maybe say that he did skate. He's in a regular Jersey and he took the pregame skiing and warmups as well, but he didn't take the line rushes.

So that tells me they were going to give him one more game. Ehlers I'm not too confident about. He's not skating yet. He didn't go to St. Louis. So I'm hearing he's got a cast or a boot on one of his ankles.

I can't confirm that, but that's what I've heard. So when Scott O'Neill says he's week to week, we talked about this on Jets at New Alaska. I think Gabe Velarde will be back within this series and as early as Wednesday, and could have been probably in game four. For Nick Gielers, I think the week to week is probably four to six weeks in my opinion, but I can't confirm that anywhere. But the fact that he's not skating yet, I don't think he'll be in this series.

What do the Jets miss without those guys? Well, I mean, that's one of the things about this series that they took a two-nothing lead and the most impressive part I thought nobody was talking about is those are two guys in your top six and on your power play unit. And I think if you look around the National Hockey League and take two guys off your number one power play unit and two guys off your top six it's going to hurt you. I know everybody says injuries and I get that but if there were top six players in your bottom six then they wouldn't be in their bottom six and I think that injuries are a factor. It's not why

this team is losing though but they definitely need that finish. The yesterday's game is a prime example guys they played great for 29 minutes. Like the first period was outstanding for them. I liked what Scott O'Neill said after game three and everybody sort of clung to the whether we lost two, one or seven, two, it doesn't matter, it's just one game. Everybody clung to that quote.

I clung to the look, they obviously made adjustments and now we have to make adjustments and we'll go from there. They made adjustments and look great. They just adjustments and we'll go from there. They made adjustments and look great. And they just haven't been burying their opportunities. Cooper Fetty has gotten a ton of opportunities and he just can't find the back of the net. He found the back of the glove on one, but he can't find the back of the net. Vlad Nemesikov was really dangerous yesterday and had two great

opportunities and couldn't score. That's what they're missing with those two guys. They're missing some finish. When you get two to three chances in the playoffs, you have to bury one of them and nobody else seems to be stepping up. And the other guy I'll look at is Nino Niederreiter, such a great four checker, such a great guy along the boards and battles,

but he needs to start scoring. That's what killed him against the Avalanche last year as well. Mark Scheifele was a pointing game player, Kyle Connor was a pointing game player. Josh Morrissey showed up. They just couldn't get any secondary scoring. And the top third line in the national hockey league, although it's not been playing together because knee riders had to go up in

either spot. Um, and they put bear in there yesterday. They have one goal in the four games and it was an empty netter by Adam Lowry. That's not good enough. If your top players are producing, you need some secondary scoring. Not every game, but I think your secondary scoring has to win you a game or two or be the difference in a game or two in a seven game series. And they just haven't done that. So that's what they're missing with those two guys is just guys that can have elite skill and probably at least if they get three or four opportunities, bury one of

them over the course of two games. President's trophy winners now in a best of three with St. Louis to get out of the first round. Is there some panic in the fan base? I'll tell you what panic. This series is over and it's tied to two, according to the fans after yesterday's loss.

And, and, and I know there's the diehards, right? That go it's two, two. Um, a lot of people yesterday in our post game show, I was, I was on the broadcast and doing the pre and the postgame with Kelly Moore as well and a lot of people you know it was 50 50 there's a lot of people going we just need to relax they they haven't played well and if they play well they'll be okay they're coming back home and then the other half is just this is over this is deja vu right and I get it there's a lot of

PTSD with this team around the first round. And I sort of said this on the post game show, like Kelly was saying, this is game five is a must win. You cannot lose three in a row and go to St. Louis with the way this team's psyche could be around what they've not done. And I said, I'll extend this if they don't win this first round series, I don't know what the off season looks like because this is five years in a row now, six years in a row now that they failed to, you know, five to get out of the first round since 2018. Sorry, they did get out of the first round against Edmonton and then got swept by Montreal in that bubble year. But this is just a president's trophy team that throughout the regular season has shown that they exercised some demons, but it started in training camp, guys, and it went all season.

No matter what this team did, they could have went 82-0. In this fan base, it's about the playoffs. And so they won the President's Trophy, and I think it gave people a lot of confidence in the fashion in which they won it. They won games in different ways. There's a best defensive team in hockey. Defense as a forward unit has plagued this team. They've they've executed all those demons to win a president's trophy and back to back Jennings trophy.

But then you get to the playoffs and they go up to all and we see what's happening. To me, I agree. A seven to loss in game three is no different than a two one overtime loss. But it's the fashion in which they lost. That's what has this fan base, you know, just up in arms right now. And I honestly today in Winnipeg, there's a lot of people that feel this series is over and they don't have any pushback. And so that's why I think not only for the series, but I think for the future of

this core game five in this series is very, very interesting to me and important. And, you know, I don't know if you're going to run the Tony D'Amato speech from, from any given Sunday, I can't do it for you and we're in hell boys or what you're going to do, but, um, you know, you've got to galvanize yourselves as a team and elite. I called the off season, the long cold summer, because a lot of those guys, I think for the fourth year in a row have to go home and deal with not being able to elevate their game.

So we're going to find out on Wednesday, if it's going to be a long cold summer I think for the fourth year in a row have to go home and deal with not being able to elevate their game. So we're going to find out on Wednesday, if it's going to be a long, cold summer again, or if they can sort of elevate themselves and change the narrative about what's around this core the past five years. Could you really see them breaking up the core though? Just, you know, I don't disagree that it would be wildly disappointing, but the assumption is

probably that Ehlers has gone and free agency anyway. The other pending UFA that a lot of people were talking about was Neil Peonk, but they found a way to get him extended. Morrissey signed long-term, Hellebuyck signed long-term, Shifeley signed long-term. Now, Kyle Connor is a guy that has one year left after this one.

Then he can become pending UFA, but I don't know if you want to trade away Kyle Conner. So what kind of moves could be made? Well, to me, if they don't produce in this series, you have to improve your secondary scoring, which is already locked up, like Nemesikoff re-up, Niederreier re-up, and again, good players.

They've shown us the regular season that they're valuable players. But I'm with you on this point. This is a market. You can't change the core. I, we were talking last night, just amongst some of my friends and I'm like, I don't know how you run this back. They had to win the president's trophy to start

selling that barn out again. It wasn't, they sold out about 14, 15 games this year, but it wasn't until the last seven or eight that they started selling out again. They literally had to win the president's trophy for, I think, the fan base. And we've talked economy and ticket prices and all that. I get that. But they started getting consecutive sales once it was clear that this team could and

possibly would win the president's trophy. I do not know how you run this back again and sell it to the fan base. The president's trophy won't be good enough for them to buy into this group. But that being said, guys, you can't break it up in this market because even if you could find an equal trade partner, is that player coming here? And that's the problem in Winnipeg, right? That's why when the Neil Peonks resign at a discount and the Mark Scheifeleys and the Connor Hellebuck stay here, it shocks the hockey world because these are guys that have the opportunity

to go anywhere. So they have always been able to re-sign their core. They've never been able to attract a big fish and they never will probably. And so even if this, that's why I mean the, the emphasis of this series is massive because I don't know how you sell this back to the fan base if they lose in this first round after being up two nothing again. But then I don't know how you break up this core, even if you find a trade partner, because to get equal value for the high caliber players you have to change the, the, maybe the, the narrative, I don't know that they're coming.

Right. So it's, it's, there's so much Wayne on, on Wednesday in my mind, and there's so much Wayne on this off season, if they don't get out of this first round. Has Kyle Connor suggested that he'd like to stay in Winnipeg? He, you know, he's a quiet guy, right? And he just had a baby this year, a couple

of weeks ago. And so I think he's in with, so I don't know, we often call the Minnesota players that play here, the Minnesota mafia. Um, we don't know. We often call the Minnesota players that play here, the Minnesota mafia. Um, we don't have a name for this yet here, but the Connor Hallibugs, the Kyle Connors, the Dylan Sandbergs, the Neil Pionk, they go ice fishing after practice. They love the outdoors. They're hunters.

I excited to follow resigned here. He loves the outdoors and, and, and literally we'll leave the rink and go do something in nature. Um, so Kyle Con Kyle Connor is right in there with those guys. Those are the kinds of things he loves to do. That's why he loves Manitoba. And to be honest with you, such a quiet superstar that I think he loves the anonymity of living in Winnipeg. He's a star here, but he's not getting inundated with stuff. So I don't know. The Kyle Connor I know, I will want to stay.

And I don't know if he'll be take the discount that the Shifles, the Hellebucks, the Peonks have taken. But in my mind, I think if they can give them nine, nine and a half, I think he'll stay. But then again, it's hard to say, right? In my mind, he's no different than the guys that have resigned here and will stay in that core. And I think they can keep them.

They also have to sign Dylan Sandberg long term this off season. They have to sign Gabe Velarde, needs a contract long term. And that's why I do think they're out of money with the Ehlers. And to be honest with you, I think they're sort of, I felt around about this and my gut feeling is, is they're willing to letalers walk in the win as the cap space because they have the Brad Lambert's coming up and the things like that that they think they can play the wing. But it's an interesting market, right? Because their overused term in sports is blow it up. I don't think they're blow it up, but I don't think they can. But I also don't

know if this doesn't work out in this first round after winning a president's trophy and after being bounced in the first round last year, finishing fourth overall in the league, how you kind of sell this to the fan base. The hard cores think they can do this and I think that that's what's fascinating to me is it's like a movie. You pull out all the cliches, it's got check time,

it's go time here, but the weight of what's at stake if they don't get out here, I don't know what they do or how they try and sell it and run it back again. Right. So, I mean, again, let's just reiterate here. It's still a 2-2 series. It's now a best of three. Everything is pretty much- I think they got eliminated. Right. I'm like, we're already talking about Kyle Connor moving in the off-season. He's like, hold on, hold on, hold on. We need a Jets checker of the sky on the show today and not Jim Toff.

In these moments, everyone will point to the goaltending and we've already covered that point and everyone will look at the leading scores and everything. The jets are unique because the leader and the captain is Adam Lowry, who's not a high profile offensive guy by trade. They get like what 16 goals this year and that was a career high.

But in these moments, you're looking for those individuals. It's like, who's going to lead the charge or who's going to make a difference or who's going to rally the troops and everything. So how does Lowry fit into all of that and how's he been through the first four games of the series? Cause I know, I think it's just one goal and it was

an empty netter if I'm not mistaken. Yeah, you are correct there. So, so Lowry is the right captain for this team. And I know Shifely and Morris here there and I think Kyle Connor and a guy like Dylan DeMello are large in that room. That's the thing about this team compared to years past where they've had maybe some locker room issues of dislike amongst each other and stuff. They love each other. They really get along well.

And that's why I'm interested about this series as well. But Lowry is the perfect captain for this team. He knows hockey. He's one of the smartest players I've ever seen. He understands the game and he understands, you know, momentum and he understands this. I think he's the right guy to lead this team into Wednesday. But so I think and he'll lead by example, I'm not saying he's going to score, but he'll be all over the ice and, and, and, and everything like that. But even he's been a little frustrated in St. Louis cause the fashion I can see the fashion, which you're losing. Um, he took a penalty where he pulled the guy out of a scrum,

the guy fell and they gave him a roughing penalty for that. And five seconds later, you know, the power play had ended, but five seconds later, that's when Shen scored, right? Because it was, you know, two guys in front of the net and Helbuck got a stick on it, but nobody, you know, moved the player and sort of went in. And I kind of look at that, I'm like, those are the kinds of things you can't do.

So I think he'll come in and motivate it. I do believe he's the right player to lead this team and whatever needs to be done, um, get them going again. But you know, I, I don't know. I I've been perplexed on the only thing I come up with year after year guys, cause they're such good players and they're such a good team and there's, they have such elite talent in on this roster. They just have to find a way to elevate themselves, right?

They have to find another gear. I said, going into the playoffs, the MVP could, the con needs to be Mark Schifely. He's in a, in the Western conference and he's in a division with Nathan McKinnon. He's going against centers like Connor McDavid. And he was an absolute beast in the first two games. And then, you know, obviously Jim Montgomery being a good coach, he is, they've tried to make life miserable for him and he's been disciplined and he's still getting points on the road and stuff, but they need some sec.

To me, it's not Lowry. Um, I could, I could use some more from Connor Hellebuck. I could use some more from, from Josh Morrissey to be honest with you. And, and, and that's something that not a lot of people are talking about. But to me, those guys, you know, it might not be elite, but those guys will show up. You need me, those guys, you know, it might not be elite, but those guys will show up. You need some other production from some players.

And I don't know if it's a Dylan Sandberg couple of assists. And I don't know if Cole Profetti finally bangs one home or if Domestikoff or Nita Ryder got to go to the net and jam away at some rebounds. But they need more than, like Scott O'Neill said, and he's right, our best players have to be our best players and Connor Helbuck's one of our best players. All those guys can find another gear.

But if all those guys find another gear, they still need that secondary scoring, right? And that's kind of what I'm looking at here. They've got good depth, but they got to produce. Game five of this series, we got a couple of days off. No, it doesn't go until Wednesday. The series shifts back to Winnipeg for a very pivotal game five. Hey, Jim,

thanks for taking the time to do this today, man. We really appreciate it. Enjoy the rest of this series. I'm sure we'll touch base either in the next round or for the jets off season. Yeah, I really appreciate it. Always coming on guys. And I just want to let you know that like one in every nine people here is Filipino. So we just want to send our deepest condolences out to what happened in Vancouver and we here in Winnipeg and Manitoba are just

sad and shocked like everybody else. So all the best to everybody out there in the community and also just in the greater Vancouver area for what happened. Thanks, Jim. That's very thoughtful of you. It's been a, it's been a tough weekend in Vancouver and it's nice to know that the country

is supporting us. Yeah, we are. And it puts sort of this Game 5 in perspective. So we'll mourn with you guys for the next two days and then get to Game 5 then. But appreciate you having me on guys. Always a pleasure and enjoy the rest of the playoffs. Thanks, Jim. We appreciate you. That's Jim Toth from CJA OB Winnipeg here on the Halvard and Bref show on Sportsnet 650. I do like this text that came into the Dunbar Lumber text line.

These guys are complaining about winning a president's trophy and playing playoff hockey. Must be nice. Reminds me of us in 2012. That's what I always say when people say you like it when the Canucks are bad. Just gives you more content. It's easier to do the shows.

And I always reply, we can be negative about a good team too. Trust me, buddy. Brother, I can be negative about a good team too. Trust me buddy. Brother, I can be negative about anything. So I know that you were kind of nibbling around the edges over there, maybe even just taking a huge bite, but there's a potentially pivotal three game series coming up here as it pertains to the future of that team

because if you wanna make a laundry list of playoff failures in Winnipeg, this one would be, I remember Sam McKee earlier, by the way, download the Hour One podcast, you can hear Sam McKee talking about the Leafs from Fan 590, the cherry on a crap Sunday. This one with the best regular season in franchise history, the first president's trophy in franchise history,

and how poorly the last two playoffs had ended, and the hella buck thing. I know Jim didn't really wanna go down that road and didn't wanna put too much blame on the house. How about a two nothing lead? Right. All of this together, you do have to take a step back and be like, is it us?

Are we doing this? Is it the Blues? Is it the Golden Knights? Is it the and be like, is it us? Is it, are we doing this? Is it the blues? Is it the Golden Knights? Is it the Avalanche or is it us? Because this is the third year in a row where we've kind of flamed out spectacularly in the playoffs. I talked to Laddy about this before the show and he's got some very valid points about how they scouted Hellebuck

and how the Jets haven't played well in front of him in this series. But you can't tell me right now that there's something different about playoff Hellebuck than regular season Hellebuck and the people in the Dunbar Lumber text messaging. For me it goes to Hellebuck. Everything's Hellebuck.

Todd has bad takes, who always has good takes, by the way, texted into the Dunbar Lumber text message in baskets, said that Connor Hellebuck is this generation's Roberto Luongo. And that one sat with me for a little bit. I'm not going to lie. So St. Louis is what, Boston in 2011 or Chicago and before?

Take your pick buddy. Yeah. But the playoff demons are the demons until they're exercised. And when it goes that badly, that quickly, that's spectacularly in a single series like it has for Hellebuck now, 12, or sorry, 11 goals surrendered in two games. It's going to be tough to shake.

Okay. Get your what we learns into the Dunbar Lumber text line. We'll read them. I don't know, about half an hour or something like that. We're going to talk to Tyler Uremchuk next about the Edmonton Oilers, just an incredible series

between the Oilers and Kings. But before we go to break, here is Elliot Friedman from the most recent 32 Thoughts on the Rick Tocquet situation in Vancouver. So they met Friday and I was told no final decision as of, you know, we're recording this, this part of the podcast, Sunday afternoon,

Eastern time. I was told no final decisions yet. I still don't think this is going to be a very long time. I'll tell you something pretty interesting to me. For all the conversations about what matters and Hughes is one thing and contract is another thing. If you listen to Jim Rutherford's media conference when he spoke with Patrick Alveen a week ago, he had some interesting comments about their practice facility. Now the Canucks are the one team that doesn't have one, and I understand that was one of the reasons that Rutherford talked at length about that is because talk has brought that

up as a thing. And I would understand that. I think if you're the one team that doesn't have one in you and the nights where your main rink is not available and you kind of have to go into a public rink and it's a little bit different, I could see why that would drive a coach crazy. So I heard those things were not a coincidence that they didn't just come up out of nowhere. That was one thing that Takeda kind of brought up is that, uh, bothered him a bit

about the Vancouver situation. So is that negotiating or is that a real thing? Maybe it's a bit of both. Uh, but there's a reason we talk about this sort of stuff on the Halford and Bruff show. And it's the reason we're crazy about hockey in this city that everyone knows about the Canucks practice facility or lack thereof.

Tyler, your M-check coming up next, then we'll do what we learn. So get them into the Dunbar Lumber Text Line. You're listening to the Alfred and Brev Show on Sportsnet 650.