Halford & Brough in the Morning - Is The Canucks D-Core Better Now Than It Was Last Season?

Episode Date: August 13, 2024

In hour one, guest hosts Jamie Dodd & Josh Elliott-Wolfe look back at the previous day in sports (3:00), plus they break down the Canucks d-core and discuss if it will be good enough this season (27:00). This podcast is produced by Andy Cole and Greg Balloch. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

Da-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na- pitch and Jimenez gives it a pretty good ride to center field it's back at the wall and it's gone here's Neal and Rapai does stay in the zone and across Matthews when when Houston was going through that downturn yeah did Did the Mariners not put them away? It was 10 games. Isn't that put away for most of it? I don't think you can put a team like this away. They'll put themselves away. Good morning. It is Halpern Brough here on Sportsnet 650.

Jamie Dodd and Josh Elliott-Wolfe still filling in for the guys. Josh, how's it going, man? Good morning. How are you? I'm doing good. I'm doing fantastic. Adog, good morning. Good morning.

Basketball Ben, good morning. Good morning. And I got to say, Ben, I admire you dug deep to fill out the intro because we are in the full-on post-Olympic,-NFL regular season pre-NHL training camp lull it was a light light sports calendar last night I was driving in today and I was like what am I going to do dude was like oh Leo Jimenez home run baby and then I saw some the Jays hit a home run some Astros and Mariners stuff I I'm like, that's going to work too. That's perfect. Here we go. What everyone's talking about. To a degree, it is.

We are, however abrupt, brought to you by the Dilawri family of Honda dealers. Experience the Dilawri difference today. Visit your nearest Dilawri Honda dealer today. And we are coming to you live from the Kintec studio. Kintec, Canada's favorite orthotics provider, powered by thousands of five-star Google reviews. Soar feet, what are you waiting for?

Kintec, that is what you're waiting for. 650-650, of course, the Dunbar Lumber text line. Never too early to send a What We Learned our way. We've already got a couple in the inbox, so of course, we'll do those at 8.30. You can get your submissions in now. Hashtag WWL, What You Learned in the last 24 So, of course, we'll do those at 830. You can get your submissions in now. Hashtag WWL.

What you learned in the last 24 hours in sports. And as I mentioned, we'll read them at 830. Big guest list today coming up at 7. So we've got a full hour before our first guest to really dive in to everything that's happening. Really tackle the hot topics of the day. We needed all that time to get to everything that's going on right now. Ryan Dixon from Sportsnet will join us at 7.

We booked Ryan really before there was any news in the hockey world. We were just going to kind of shoot the breeze with him, maybe look ahead to the Four Nations tournament coming up in February. But then, of course, as we'll get to, the Leafs made it. Well, they haven't made the announcement yet, but they're going to make an announcement today. So we'll talk to Ryan about that. 7.30, Mike Lefkoe, Seattle Sports Radio. He does the Mariners pre- and post-game show for Seattle Sports Radio. We'll talk about Seattle, the race with the Houston Astros with him at 7.30 at 8 o'clock. BC Lions wide out. Aiden Eberhardt joins the show. Get his thoughts on

the three-game losing streak the team is in right now. What they need to change to get out of it. And also just a little bit about his career, his path to the CFL. So, of course, working in reverse, 8 o'clock Aiden Eberhardt, BC Lions

wide receiver. 7.30, Mike Lefkoe from the Seattle Sports Radio does the Mariners pre- and post-game. 7 o'clock, Aiden Eberhardt, BC Lions wide receiver, 7.30, Mike Lefkoe from the Seattle Sports Radio does the Mariners pre- and post-game. 7 o'clock, Ryan Dixon from Sportsnet.ca will join the show. Before we do any of that, however, let's get into what happened. Hey, did you guys see the game last night? No. What happened? I missed all the action because I was busy.

We know how busy your life can be. What happened? You missed that? What happened is brought to you by the BC Construction Safety Alliance, making safety simpler by giving construction companies the best in tools, resources, and safety training. Visit bccsa.ca. So in terms of what happened in actual sports, in actual contests between teams last night, not much. I guess we'll go to Major League Baseball where the Mariners were idle, but the Astros won. So now the Astros have a half-game lead,

and the AL West continues to be very, very close. I believe that's a six-game win streak as well for the Houston Astros have a half game lead in the AL West continues to be very very close I believe that's a six game win streak as well for the Houston Astros so Mariners will have their chance to get continue their winning streak again tonight as well but the Jays did play they beat the Angels 4-2 they're out west win game one of that series Vladdy starts a new hit streak he goes two for four with a double uh probably the bigger news from a Jays perspective, though, of course, this season is a wash. It's over. They're really just playing out the string. But one of the things that fans will be monitoring is the performance of some of their young players,

and especially the crop of players they acquired in the big sell-off at the trade deadline. And the news before the game last night was that they had called up infielder Will Wagner, one of the players they got from Houston in the Yusei Kikuchi deal. And Will Wagner steps up, hits a double in his first plate appearance, then follows that up with a couple of more hits. So he's 3-for-3 in his first three at-bats.

He ends the night 3-for-4. And it's a really feel-good story, right? For a number of reasons. I mean, it's a guy making his Major League debut. He's 26, so he's done his time in the minors. He was kind of blocked in Houston, right, with Bregman at third, Altuve at second. There was not a clear path to him really making it to the major leagues. I also love this.

His dad is Billy Wagner, former closer. He already has more hits in his career now. I was even surprised that a closer had two hits to be perfectly honest. Like they don't get a lot of plate. Even when you're like, even obviously pitchers don't hit anymore, but when they were hitting, it's like,

man, you weren't like the starters. You don't leave your relievers in for at bats a lot. Yes. Yeah. But anyways, Billy Wagner, he had two hits in his career.

Will Wagner now has three. So he's out hit his dad in his major league career. So it is a really good story but it's also the kind of thing you know i think a lot of sports fans have been through this process right where it's a it's a lost season but you've still got a big chunk of the schedule left you're a hardcore fan so you're looking for reasons to tune in you're you're looking for things to get excited about and you're trying to look for optimism down the stretch and going into next season. And one of the things that can do that is performances from young players.

And I think the Jays fans now are firmly in that mode. I'm excited for Wagner. Who knows? He's got some interesting AAA numbers. He is pretty old for a prospect. Maybe he goes on to be a you know a meaningful contributor for the jays for the next few years but watching you know wagner the joey loperfito guy that they got uh at the deadline as well that's nice to see them in the majors and loperfito hasn't been very

good maybe he turns it around but caring about their stat lines it reminds me more than anything of like when Canucks fans were trying to talk themselves into Nikolai Goldobin yeah it's a sign and there's no disrespect to those players no it's not saying that they can't be good that they can't play a role in the major leagues or anything like that but it's just it's a bad sign for you as a fan when you're in that position when you're really like squinting at kind of marginal prospects or guys with really obvious flaws and trying to see how trying to be okay now but he's with our team he's going to figure things out he's got this

opportunity he never had and oh wow i think there's a lot more ceiling than we expected i get it it's what sports fans do i'm i definitely have been guilty of it in the past but it's also a tough spot to be in and the reason you're doing it is because there's not a lot going right for your team yeah and with the jays like it's it's you basically described it there's no there's nothing else to hold on to right now and there's no vladi or bo bichette coming that you can be like okay this guy's legitimate true stud the true like needle moving guy and going to make an impact and you can actually put some stock into what they're going to do and maybe they do call up someone who can do that later in the season but odds are it's probably going to be a lot of these guys for a while and honestly for the whole season for the jays it's kind of been that like davis schneider for me is in that that camp where i'm

like he could be fine but why are we putting this much stock into davis schneider or whoever it is so yeah it definitely it's it's hard to kind of like find something to hold on to from the season if you're a jays fan and in baseball it's kind of like unique in that way too because man there's a game every day they play so much and it's just it's so hard to go through the slog of like okay who's in the lineup today hope i can get pumped about this guy and hopefully he makes an impact the one thing i will say about baseball though is sometimes a guy just kind of comes out of nowhere and does just show up late in the season and then all of a sudden next year he's an impact player too so maybe they are like auditioning guys you find someone who does end up being that

i brought up davis schneider he kind of was that last season for the jays and turned into something a little bit more this season but for the most part it's it's these are just guys yeah and that's okay and again that's a you know i know they uh they have the phrase on this show right hearkening back to some of the dark days for the canucks the sea of gremlins right and that's kind of what it feels like it's like if you're trying to differentiate between these guys and really get hyped for one you're kind of missing the forest for the trees the big picture is as you said guys at the level of Bo and Vladdy who they don't have coming up uh in the system it reminds me a little bit you go back a few years uh to the 2019 jays when they were giving a ton of at bats to guys like you know like brandon drury right and billy mckinney he's like oh he's this athletic

you know if he put if he figures out his hit tool a little bit more he's gonna be really good and it's like these guys are nothing why are we giving so many at bats why are we watching this so much and again harken back to some of the the darker days for the canucks and it's like why are we giving so much so many minutes to Marcus Gramblin? What's happening here? Remember Josh Levo? Yeah, exactly. Dude, I thought Josh Levo was going to hit.

Well, you were just excited about Josh on the team. He had a good name. Josh Levo, also known as The Answer. Yeah, exactly. Ben Hutton, too. The Franchise. Josh the Franchise Levo. Yeah.

I believe that was his nickname Is there a you're a Jays fan As well so I'll put it to you is there anything That could happen in the Remainder of the season for the Jays That would like meaningfully change What you think about The team going into next season not on

The field like it would have to be an extension For for the Shatter Vladdy and even then i'd just be like well they're on the team next year and i don't have to spend the the winter wondering if they're going to move them or what's going to happen with them so i i don't know there isn't really anything i look at even if a guy goes on like a major run to end the season here it's going to be hard to put stock into it especially when teams like it's it's harder in baseball to take a team lightly but it can still happen um it's

yeah it's it's gonna be hard yeah i'm trying to like think of something that would uh get me excited but and it's tough because we've seen it with the cadets we've seen both you know the late season surge that doesn't mean anything. It doesn't carry it all over to next year. And then obviously we've seen the opposite with Rick Talkett, right, where they did make the change and that had a major impact on how they started the next season. The Canucks aren't hiring the baseball equivalent of Rick Talkett, right?

They've declined to do that. So that kind of goes to your point. If they had made some sort of big off-field change, maybe then you have a reason to kind of rethink what you're expecting going into next season but as it is it's like okay vladi had a great year that's kind of in the books right now boba shett's injured there's probably nothing he can do even if he comes back to really change what we think about his season and yeah those are the guys those are the guys that matter more than anybody else on this team. 650-650.

I also wanted to throw this out there. Since we're talking about, you know, Goldobin and everything, who are the guys that you spent way too long believing in? Way too long trying to talk yourself into, you know what, I think if he just gets the right opportunity, he's really going to be something for this team. I think Nikolai Goldobin is the answer for a lot of fans here in Vancouver. Another guy that comes up immediately to mind, Jack Rathbone. Yeah.

People for a long time were like, man, if you just played some games. Yeah, that's a good answer. Jack Rathbone is exactly what we're talking about. This level of player where it's like, yeah, nothing against the guy. Can he contribute in an NHL organization? Maybe in the perfect circumstances, yes. But it's just the hype and the interest was driven by the lack of quality around him more than the actual excitement generated by his play in particular.

That's a good show. Pod Colson's kind of getting to that point. Oh, Ben, spicy. You're right, though. Ben's like, last week. He's kind of flirting with it where it's like, are you actually going to be part of this team moving forward? Where do you fit in?

You know, the exact wording you said there, Jamie, like, oh, if you play some games and get some experience, like that's going to help him like that. That name really jumps forward as someone on this team who kind of fits that. It's a good show because you look at what they've done and especially when they signed Daniel Sprung, it's really easy to put a 12 forward lineup together that does not include a silly pod colson like he's going easier to have him out of he's going

to have to beat out established nhl veterans to get into the lineup and if you're being completely fair he hasn't necessarily shown a lot uh that that he's capable of doing that i still like pod colson's game. I do think that, again, I'm like doing the process I'm just talking about. But I do think there is a path to him being a contributing NHL player, not a star, but a contributing NHL player. But Ben's right. Like at a certain point, you get to this age,

you get to this long past your draft season, and the clock starts ticking pretty loudly. I do think Pod Colson's into that stage. Somebody text in Hunter Shankaric. That's absolutely one for me. And the guy who was traded for, Sven Berchi. Yeah, Sven Berchi. I wasn't as big on him. To be honest.

And he was older, so it was harder. It's not the same, right? That whole run of drafts from Jordan Schrader, who I think was 09, I want to say or oh eight uh oh nine i think he was the one after hodson through like brendan gauntz nick jensen and then yeah hunter shinkaric there was a lot of hope for those guys and it just never ever panned out brendan for any of them yeah brendan gauntz exactly um 650 650 you can text in. Who did you try to talk yourself into

for way too long as a prospect or a young player? Okay, moving on to the NHL. And I mean, Josh, I can't believe we didn't start the show with this. Really, some of the most momentous, earth-shattering, meaningful news. I stopped what I was

doing yesterday when i heard this the biggest news in hockey history dropped yesterday that's right the toronto maple leafs are changing captains no longer will john tavaris wear the sea for his hometown leafs austin matthews is taken over the leafs are going to announce it officially today, but widely reported yesterday. I believe the press conference is going to be at 8 a.m. Pacific time. So this is always interesting, right? When a team changes captains like this, early reports say that, you know, Tavares fully on board. He consulted with Treliving, all of that.

But stripping a veteran of the sea is always inherently awkward. There is no unawkward way to do it. And especially in this situation where the Leafs have been desperate for a change of some sort. They made the coaching change. They brought in Craig Berube. But as much as you can talk to Tavares

about it and do everything to get him on board and you know where it is, he's going to be there at the press conference. He's going to be symbolically passing it over to Matthews you're still fundamentally saying to Tavares your leadership is lacking and it's been holding us back like there is no way to avoid that that is part of the message part of what you're telling a very accomplished player who came to your team in free agency and right now Tavares can say you know what look Austin Matthews one of the best players in the league, our most important player. You know, he's matured now.

Of course, we have to give him the C. But deep down, he's got to know that Brad Treliving is saying, you're not cutting it as captain. You are one of the reasons we have failed over and over and over again. And I'm basically publicly making that known now. Again, it doesn't mean it's going to tank their season, but that's got to be a tough pill for John Tavares to swallow as well. Yeah, I mean, it's got to be difficult. I don't know if it's a, like, hey, we don't trust you situation

or, like, hey, you're the reason that, or one of the big reasons that this isn't working. It doesn't have to be one of the big reasons, but you don't make this move unless you think it's one of the reasons that they're failing. Yeah, I think it's maybe you make this move because you're like austin matthews is clearly the main guy in toronto and that's why you do it the the thing i would have it was weird when they gave tavarez the c to me personally like i would have just waited waited and then austin matthews was clearly going to be your guy anyway at a certain point.

So just wait until you're ready to give it to him. So that's kind of the weird part to me. I don't know. Like, I don't think that when you strip a guy of a seat, it's awkward for sure. But I don't know if this is a situation that you look at and you're like, oh, this is maybe going to cause, like, issues with Tavares and the team or anything like that. I think it's just an awkward moment for sure that might be weird to get through and might be weird to start the season. But I doubt there's going to be any changes

within their locker room or how things operate. Well, that's the thing with the CL, which is always fascinating, right? It seems like it's so much of a bigger deal for everyone observing the team than it is inside of the team and it almost like it's almost the kind of thing where it can create awkward situations like this in a way it doesn't in other sports right because you think about the nfl like okay your quarterback's a captain but then does anybody pay any attention like they change 17 if they change like the guy who's the you know the special teams

captains going into this season, nobody's like, oh, wow, is there controversy in the dressing room? And often most years it's like, hey, you're this year's captain. Yes, exactly. It's not a year-to-year thing where you're guaranteed to be the captain next year, whereas in hockey it is unique that way. But, again, at least you can have an A on your jersey and it'll be fine. This one, Keith the Water Guy says,

You're wrong. The captaincy in the NHL is kind of meaningless these days. It's based on who is the best player on the team at the moment, not the best captain. That's from Keith the Water Guy. Well, I disagree that teams are rapidly cycling through captains. You still want, ideally, to choose someone who's going to give you a minimum of five years of service as a captain.

I don't think anyone's setting out and saying like, oh, well, Hey, we'll just change it to the other best player next year. No big deal. I do take his point that the captaincy thing is kind of overrated. Yes.

The, well, who was the, the Panthers captain? That was like a fourth liner. Are you thinking of a, wasn't Derek Dorsett, the cat?

No, it was a McKzie was the captain in columbus as he didn't play much right there was somebody in florida who was also a captain i forget who but it was the guy before barkov and it was like well this guy clearly is not going to be the captain for very long because you are a bottom six player so it's weird what like in situations like that you will see like transitional captains kind of yeah where they're kind of taking care of it until the hot young player steps up and and is ready for it but i think that's a different situation and look i'm not trying to rip tovar's here yeah derrick mckenzie in columbus i'm not trying to rip tovar's here and look i'm sure he

is on board to a certain extent as my as much as it might sting a little bit uh to have this happen publicly as well. I do think, though, that the people who deserve the most questioning and criticism here are Leafs management. Because remember, you go back to them losing again in the first round against Boston, and the messaging from Bradtree Living was very much no more business as usual. We are not afraid. We are going to really change things up.

They made the coaching change, which is the easiest thing to do in hockey, right? I don't think you get a lot of credit at this point for making a coaching change when, what, 25 of the 32 coaches have less than two years service. Everyone changes their coach all the time. That's not hard to do. I like the Craig Berube hire for them, but still, there's only so much credit you get for making a coaching change. And instead of taking any big swings on the roster, instead of, you know, figuring out a way to make the Mitch Marner move,

doing anything that would really change what this team looked like, it's been business as usual. And so now I think they're kind of trying to pretend that transferring the C from John Tavares to Austin Matthews counts as a big change, right?

That that's enough to satisfy their own standard of, we're not going to do things like we usually have. We know things need to change. And that's just ridiculous. Again, like I agree with the people texting in, the captaincy is overrated. If you're expecting this move to really move the needle for your team, change the outlook of your team going into the season,

it's just not going to happen. And that speaks, I think, to the failure and the lack of creativity from Leafs management more than anything else. I do agree with that. Going into this offseason, it was like, hey, you have to trade one of these four guys. Obviously, something isn't working right now. Taveras was the obvious option because, A, this would have made this captaincy switch way easier.

And, B, he's the oldest of their core four. And he only has a year left on his deal. He probably would have had to eat some of the money or it would have been a difficult trade to pull off. But that being said, you had to do something. And you didn't do something. And even with Mitch Marner right now, you don't do something and even with mitch marner right now like you don't have an extension in place for him you're going into this season kind of like what's gonna happen with mitch marner and does it even matter what happens during the regular season

because it he obviously hasn't shown up in the playoffs for them so let's see what happens in the postseason and i don't know they're they're a weirdly operated team yeah that feels like they it feels like they they kind of buy into the hype of being the biggest market so they look at their players and they kind of overvalue those players to an extent as well and i do think that could be their downfall here though that being said, you look at the moves they made. You bring in Chris Tanev, you gave him a lot of term, and you bring in Oliver Ekman-Larsen, too. And though I have my issues with those contracts,

I do think they're going to be an overall better team. Though still, I'm not like, hey, this is a cup favorite team. Yeah, and again, it's not changing. No one's changing their preseason projections of the Leafs because they made this change. Right. Do you imagine? I'm like, hey, you know what? All right.

They're going to win the cup. Now, guys, Tavares, he was the problem. I will say the repeated process of running it back in Toronto, it does really make me appreciate one of the big strengths of Jim Rutherford and Patrick Alvin, which is their willingness to take big swings, right? Their refusal to just sit on their hands. They are always looking to make that deal, to find that move, which can help their team. And, you know, with the Leafs example in particular, I think of the Bo Horvat deal.

That's a really tough trade to make. And I know we had talked about it a lot. We probably all saw it coming, the circumstances of the team and the way he was scoring, the rejected contract offer. But you still traded your captain midseason, right? That's a really difficult move to make in a Canadian market. And I think it came from a recognition that sometimes you just have to shuffle the deck, right? Was it a perfect trade? I like the trade, but there's always things you can nitpick and say,

oh, well, maybe they could have done this better, or they could have set themselves up in a different way. But that doesn't matter. You have to be willing to actually make the move and to change things up. And I think it's especially difficult to do in a Canadian market when there is always going to be so much criticism and so much blowback if things go wrong. And I think that's one of the things that has really paralyzed the Leafs is they're constantly second guessing themselves and worried about the worst case scenario and a potential move.

And you just look at it like when was the last time another Canadian team made a move as bold as the Horvat deal? You could point to like the Matthew Kachuk trade in Calgary, but that was driven by him. They didn't choose to do that. He basically said, trade me or I'm going to leave in a year. So I don't really give Trey Living a lot of credit for doing that deal in Calgary. It's tough to find examples of Canadian teams really being willing to take bold swings like they have. The Senators have certainly made a lot of moves that have kind of felt like bold swings, but obviously haven't worked out and also i have

not been nearly to the level of the boahorvat train the kachok one is probably the the most obvious example because even then it still like takes guts to move a guy or and especially when he's as talented as matthew kachok and at the time i I think we were all like, hey, this is a good trade. It worked out. And then it definitely did not work out. But that being said, it still took guts to make that trade. And I would have liked to see, even just from a casual fan's point of view,

a big change with the Maple Leafs, just because it would have been fun. It would have been entertaining. Yeah. Like a Mitch Marner trade, I would have wanted to blow up in their face so bad. It would have been so fun. But here we are. have been fun. It would have been entertaining. Yeah, like a Mitch Marner trade. I would have wanted to blow up in their face so bad. It would have been so fun. But here we are. It's fine.

But I feel like that's why they don't do it because they know there's people out there waiting for it to blow up in their face. But they shouldn't care about that. They shouldn't care about us or everyone rooting for them to fail. Yeah, exactly. They should be like, no, screw you guys. We're going to do the deal and it's going to work and then you're going to have to deal with it.

Instead, they're scared of taking that big swing. 650-650 is the Dunbar-Lumber text line. Lots of good thoughts coming in. Get ready for the ultimate sports fan trip to Michigan from September 27th to October 1st. Experience games at the Big House, Comerica Park, and Ford Field. Contact Neil Chark at neilc at uniglobecarefree.ca for details. Open segment on the other side. We'll read some of those texts coming in.

And yesterday on the show during our open segment, we talked the Canucks forward group, how it's changed, what our expectations are going into this season. Today we'll put the microscope on the blue line, the defense core, how it's changed, and what we expect to see on the Canucks blue line in this upcoming season. That's coming up next year on Halford & Brough, Sportsnet 650. Welcome back to Howl from the Brough here on Sportsnet 650.

Jamie Dodd, Josh Elliott. Whoa! Filling in for Howl from the Brough. Oh, man. Big band Tuesday? Big Band Tuesday. It is. This kind of feels like a little band.

Are we calling this Big Band? There's been some slippage on the Big Band definition. You just got to accept the fact that it's broadened its horizons now. How many pieces do you think are in this band? Just make pieces, man. The first category says it's Big Band, and I was like, that's kind of fun. I disagree. Yeah, it's good. Don't get says it's a big band, and I was like, that's kind of fun. I disagree. Yeah, it's good.

Don't get me wrong. I like it. Josh likes it. I mean, a band is playing right now, and they could be big. It doesn't sound like a lot of elements. No, it could just be one guy and a Casio keyboard. One guy, yeah. Stone out of his mind.

I don't want to tell you what actually goes on with the big band. Songs in our royalty-free website, but I goes on with the big band songs in our royalty free website but i guarantee there's no big bear no yeah that's true uh 650 650 is the dumb bar lumber text line you send your what we learns in now the bridge street dumb bar lumber and ladner has moved to progress way in tilbury's industrial park more room more product more awesome details at dumb bar lumber.com halvin and brough is brought to you by the delari family of honda dealers experience the delari difference today visit your nearest delari honda dealer today so we want to get into a little bit more

canucks talk there's a there's a point i want to make related to the leafs captaincy discussion as well we want to talk about their blue line. Before we do that, Josh, we have an honest-to-goodness trade in the NHL. Yeah. And it's a weird one. It sure is. Go ahead and give us the details. So the Pittsburgh Penguins have acquired a second-round pick in 2026 and a third-round pick in 2025 from the St. Louis Blues

for a 2025 second-round pick and a 2026 fifth round pick. That's the trade. Not Sidney Crosby? Not Sidney Crosby. No, it does not involve Sidney Crosby. Oh, okay. They did not trade him for a second and third round pick to the St. Louis Blues.

That's too bad. We also probably would have led with that. Wouldn't have done the whole big damn thing. That would have been a lot of content on a Tuesday in August. Oh, that would have been nice. Dude, that would have carried us through the thing. That would have been a lot of content on a Tuesday. That would have been nice. Dude, that would have carried us through the week. It would have been great. So the Blues get a second round pick in 2025 at the cost of going from a third to a fifth.

That's essentially what happened. And they get rid of their 2026 second round pick. Yes. happened and they get they get rid of their 2026 second round pick yes so it's they swap second round picks and the blues paid a premium to do that so do the blues think the blues think that the penguins are going to be now i want to see confirmation that this is all just their picks right that there's no like oh we had this pick from so and such team the blues don't have a second round pick next year they had two third round picks though so now they're they're gonna have one second round pick next year one third round pick okay they don't have or sorry they

only have one second round pick in 2026 so yeah so they're basically like kicking the can down the road this just feels like pure boredom on the part of the general oh it's a stupid trick hey listen we haven't done it i haven't made a transaction in a long time do you want to just like we'll figure out the the least amount of value that differential here that we can do and let's just make a deal let's just make something happen i need it you need it let's get this done this is truly one of the more perplexing uh more irrelevant deals uh that i have seen oh in a long time and also i believe it's the blues reacquiring their own second round pick it's this is harder to do without um cap friendly because it shows you what like who whose pick it is and whatever. This, I'm trying to go off Puckpedia, and it just says,

it says one second round pick. But if I am reading this correctly, it is the Blues reacquiring their second round pick from the Pittsburgh Penguins. So maybe that's part of the cause. That's why they're like, we want that pick back. Give us our pick back. And it's Ottawa's 2025 third round pick going to Pittsburgh.

That's great. Liam in Calgary says, so the Crosby to Canucks rumors still going strong, though? We must manifest. I mean, look, it would be irresponsible not to speculate. Is this the first domino to fall in a Crosby to Vancouver transaction? Is this Kyle Dubas setting the table to trade Sidney Crosby to Vancouver transaction. Is this Kyle Dubas setting the table to trade Sidney Crosby to the Vancouver Ducks? They're acquiring picks.

They're moving up in the draft. You gotta ask the question. Somebody points in maybe St. Louis needs its own pick back to use for an offer sheet. That's an interesting interpretation. I'd be a little surprised if that was the case, but at least it gives some sort of motivation for this.

Because otherwise, it's just truly a wild, wild deal. Okay, okay. This is from Frank's Hair Valley. The St. Louis Blues have tendered offer sheets to both Philip Broberg and Dylan Holloway of the Edmonton Oilers. Wow, the double offer sheet from the St. Louis Blues to the Edmonton Oilers.

So shout out to the inbox for sniffing that one out. It is, in fact, that St. Louis needs its own pick back to use for an offer sheet. And in fact, they have offer sheeted two players from the Edmonton Oilers. So the St. Louis Blues putting the screws to the Edmonton Oilers to a Canucks division rival a little bit here. And by the way, it was Adam from Poco who texted that in first. So congratulations to Adam from Poco. Well, that's fascinating.

Do you have the terms here for either of them? So the latest from Sarah Valley is just that they tendered offer sheets. I would have to assume that. Now, does that mean the players have signed the offer sheets or they have so seven days to match the okay so they have signed offer sheets yes okay that's fun that's super I felt

like I was crapping on st. Louis for a minute there and then they ended up doing the one thing that I want more G that is actually more exciting and it's like you know what never mind you know what you got a st. Louis you guys made a good trade. Now, Edmonton, I believe, currently shown on Puckpedia as being slightly over the cap already with more of an $88 million in salary committed to next year.

Now, of course, there's always things you can try to do, right? Whether it's LTIR, whatever it is, sending guys down. I believe there was a report the other day that they believe that Evander Kane is going to be the start of the season. So that makes it pretty easy. But that being said, we don't know the numbers of these offer sheets yet. Maybe them combined is to a level that's like even with Evander Kane on LTIR, it's too difficult to make work.

But we'll have to see what happens that's fun though I wonder if there's any retribution Like who do the Blues have that's An expiring RFA soon well I don't know that Edmonton's really in a position to be doing Yeah or even in the future Really so I guess if you're gonna offer

Sheep players from any team Edmonton is a good team to do it because They kind of have to just worry about mcdavid and dry sidle soon and then trying to surround those guys so i i the the dylan holloway and philip broberg have been two very popular like hey yeah gm should offer sheet these guys options so it's uh it's exciting that it's happening and i hope it opens the door to more but we'll see we'll see and somebody texts in who wants evander kane for a first round pick i mean as you said there was the report also that uh he's still pretty injured he's he's a candidate

to start the season on ltir i wonder if that report comes out maybe edmonton knew this was had reason to expect this This was coming down. So they might not have to make a deal here. Also, Kane does have a modified no trade clause, still two years at over $5 million left on his deal. But you make a good point. It's not just potentially awkward for Edmonton for this upcoming season to be cap compliant, potentially forcing them to a move.

I mean, we're also like, Leon Dreisaitl has been eligible for an extension for what, seven weeks here, six weeks. And he hasn't signed one. And Evan Bouchard as well. And he's going to get a big, big raise going into next season. Yeah, Evan Bouchard as well. So even if it is something they can manage for this year in a relatively straightforward way,

and maybe it's as simple as throw Evander Kane on LTI and then figure it out when the season gets going. If it's big raises for them more than you want going into next year, right, the 2025-26 season, that could make it really difficult for them as well. So the double offer sheet from St. Louis to Edmonton is going to be really interesting to see how the Oilers play this one. The other thing to keep in mind, so the Oilers made that very fun draft day trade, end of round one, when they traded their first round pick for the upcoming year for the last pick of the first round, this past draft.

That's how that trade went, right? Anyway, they don't have a first round pick in 2025. So if they're going to move off salary, they only have two first rounders available to move. So that plays a part in it as well. And man, they're in a difficult spot. And it's nice to see a team at least try to take advantage of the spot that they're in. But again, I don't know.

We don't know the details of the offer sheets. The salaries, exactly. So what the compensation would be. And again, it's possible, right, that they match one, let the other guy walk. It's possible. We'll see. Typically, nine times out of ten, teams are matching offer sheets, right?

Yes. Or at least nine times out of ten. It's very rare. Unless you do it in weird, like we saw with Kokunemi. Yeah. Where it was just like a weird offer. Kind of a poison pill type contract. Yeah.

I don't know if the blues are gonna do that because i'm like do you want to give up a first round pick for either of these guys no no so you kind of have to like work within the the second rounder kind of territory um which would be let me just find it here so a second round pick would be between 2.29 to 4.58 would be what you have to give up a second round pick for in terms of an offer sheet so obviously the blues reacquiring their second round pick you would have to assume at least one of these offer sheets are within this range if i had to bet i would say they probably have Broberg within that range. And then Dylan Holloway, probably a third round pick range where it's 1.5 to 2.29.

So somewhere within that. And then maybe, maybe. See, but if it's that range for Dylan Holloway, isn't that just like an instant match for the Oilers? You know what I mean? So like, if you, look, I get he had nine points in 38 games last year, right? Nine points in 51. So it's not as if he's had a breakout here.

But he was a 14th overall pick. So if you're a believer in Dylan Holloway, he's 22. And if you really have designs on getting Dylan Holloway, I think you have to push above the bracket you're talking about into the second round bracket here now I get it it gets complicated then well you only have one second round pick to give up so you're probably using that one for Broberg but that just feels like an instant match for the for the Oilers if it's outside of that bracket the offer to the Blues just put this out on their website the offer to Broberg is a two-year contract at 4.58 basically it no it's the the maximum for a second round pick and then the offer sheet for dylan holloway is 2.29 the maximum for

the third round pick so also a two-year contract so basically they've committed to paying both of these guys 6.7-ish million combined. So that does take it out of the realm of Evander Kane on LTI can cover it, right, because he's making 5.125. Now, there might be other things you can do, right? Teams always get creative with the salary cap going into the year to make everything fit, but that's interesting that it takes it out of the Evander Kane salary range. And, you know, Philip Broberg, I mean, that would make him

the third highest paid defenseman on the Oilers next year, right? Like more of an Evan Bouchard, more than Cody Ceci. For a guy who was often their seventh defenseman. Now, he's probably better than that. He would have a bigger role than that going into next year. But that's a tough situation for the Edmonton Oilers to deal with and uh man stan bowman who's been on the job for what like three weeks he's all of a sudden guys i was just enjoying some time off what are you doing to me uh he's got some difficult decisions to make here as well uh okay 650 650 is the dumb bar lumber

tech sign we'll keep you up to date on any new developments, whether Edmonton matches, anything else happens as a result of the St. Louis Blues signing Dylan Holloway and Phillip Broberg to these offer sheets, but we did want to talk a little Canucks here. We've still got some time left in this segment. Ryan Dixon joins us at 7, so

we'll get his thoughts on this as well. We looked at the Canucks forward group going into next year yesterday, Josh. Now we can take well. We looked at the Canucks forward group going into next year yesterday, Josh. Now we can take a turn to look at the Canucks blue line. And I think probably one of the most controversial elements of the Canucks offseason was the changes they made on the blue line. Yes. So in terms of like, let's just do a recap again. They gained Derek Forbort and Vinny DeJarne.

And they re-signed Tyler Myers, obviously, and extended Philip Peronic. They lost Ian Cole and the big name Nikita Zdorov that people, like, you're going to miss his presence. And we saw it a lot in the playoffs. That's going to be someone that the Canucks miss a lot. And I don't think any of us are going to make the argument that they filled that with Derek Forbort or Vinny DeJarne. So the biggest storylines to me going into this season is people talk about Zdorov, and I agree, it's a big loss. But I feel like the loss of Ian Cole is kind of going underrated as well,

mainly because of his post season it wasn't as good as some people would like some notable gaffes and that's fine but throughout the season he was pretty consistently a top four defenseman for the Vancouver Canucks so two big pieces out and I think the big question is how do the Canucks handle that? And can Suse, Carson Suse, Tyler Myers be a legit second pair for this team on a team that expects to be good? And I have a lot of questions about that. And when you look at this team as well, when we're talking about, hey, potentially making trades, all that,

defense is obviously going to be the priority as the season goes on yeah and i think there's the the thing with how the caducks defense is set up now is that they're going to try it this way but you read between the lines about what they've said and you know what's been reported about their strategy they're very clearly not married to this setup right they are willing to if it doesn't work, if they're not getting the results they need, they're going to be willing to look for other options to explore a plan B. And I think that's really important. I don't know if it's actually as big a shift as it necessarily looks on paper, right? Because I know we have the vision of Nikita Zdorov and what he was doing in

the playoffs. But if you look at average time on ice amongst the Canucks defenseman just in the regular season, you know, Zdorov was below Carson Soucy, well below Ian Cole, well below Tyler Myers, right? Like he was very much when he was in the lineup deployed as a third pairing guy. Ian Cole, you mentioned, started the season really, really strong, started to flag a little bit down the stretch. And then we saw what happened in the playoffs. But you're absolutely right that early in the season, you know, he was being played

as a top four guy. But again, like Ian Cole, Nikita Zdorov, kind of awkward fits as top four defensemen on contenders at this point. So how big is the drop off really, you know, going from a bottom four with Carson Soucy, Tyler Myers, Nikita Zdorov, and Ian Cole to a bottom four of Carson Soucy, Tyler Myers, Nikita Zdorov, and Ian Cole to a bottom four of Carson Soucy, Tyler Myers, Derek Forbort, and Vinny Desjardins. I still think you've kind of got two really good third pairs, but are kind of missing a second pair, right?

Yeah. But that was the configuration they had last year, and they showed they can have success with it. I think you ideally want to go find that clear-cut number three defenseman that you can kind of build your second pair around but again they've shown that they can with the if you have pairs set up like this with the physical element with the size they've shown they can at least have success with it i and the the other thing that kind of plays into this as well and there's two things for me. The one that Patrick Alvinas talked about,

I think maybe Rick Tockett spoke about as well at times after the season was like, hey, they want to maybe see what Philip Peronick looks like on his own pair. And if you do that, who's playing with Quinn Hughes? And the question that comes up for me is Vinny Deharnais is he someone that they look at as potentially a guy who can fill that role and it there's a lot of question marks around him we'll have to see how he fits in the Canucks system because in Edmonton

he was always just a bottom pairing guy seventh defenseman kind of in and out of the lineup at times especially in the postseason but that being said like you put them in a system and we we've seen it in vancouver where guys have come from and it's weird to say because it's happened so quickly guys have come from other teams and all of a sudden they're in vancouver and they're playing better defensively they've been a better fit you look at the door off for example he's a great example and they end up getting paid after it. Is Deharnais someone they identified as a guy that could fit really well into the system and potentially not consistently play with Quinn Hughes,

but potentially at times play up on a top four pairing for the Canucks if needed? And the other thing that's going to come up it's like hey injuries happen you're going to have to find one of these guys that can play yep on your second pair or potentially with Quinn Hughes or something like that as the season goes on so it's the the question for me is who kind of emerges from that those bottom four guys. Carson Soucy, I think, is clearly a cut above. Yes. The other question that comes up is, what is Tyler Myers going to be this season?

And the thing for me that concerns me the most, as you said, is, okay, it's great to want to split up Quinn Hughes and Phillip Hronick and at least try it out, but your right shot options behind Hronick are Tyler Myers, Vinny Desjardins, and I guess Noah Juleson. Right. And so how much confidence do you really have to roll for any length of time, even for entire games with one of those guys next to Quinn Hughes? Or is it going to be a situation where, you know, they take line rushes with Quinn Hughes, but then Hughes takes half his shifts with Hronik throughout the game anyways? I think you would love to have a better option than they do have available

and i think as a result you're going to end up still seeing mostly quinn hughes and philip pronick and i do think the you know one of the biggest in-season storylines to monitor is can they find that guy who slots in between philip pronick and carson soucy on the depth chart right where and you know carson soucy becomes your fourth best defenseman instead of your third best defenseman you find that number three find someone whether it's who can play with Quinn Hughes and then you move for Heronic down next to Susie or it's just somebody to play with Carson Susie find that guy who gives you a legitimate really good second pair that you feel strongly about because I think right now and again look Rick Chalkin and Adam Foote have done really

impressive things with the Canucks blue line. So I understand why they're making this bet, why they're saying, okay, what more can we get from Vinny Desjardins, right? Can we move Philip Pronick around the lineup and get a little bit more out of the group? But I think until that question is answered really clearly, affirmatively, you're always going to be wondering, okay,

who's out there? Who's on the market that they could go chuck in? And the nice thing for the Canucks, especially with the moves they made on the forward group, is it's clearly going to be a defenseman. That's the priority to add as the season goes on. Like, you don't have to add up front. It would be a luxury if you were to find another piece

for your bottom six or a 3C, whatever. Your clear need is a defenseman. So when a defenseman becomes available as the season goes on, you're able to make that move without much hesitation. Yeah, absolutely. It's clearly going to be a target for the Canucks.

650-650 is the Dunbar-Lumber text line. Send your thoughts in. The Roar is back at BC Place for the BC Lions 70th season. Get your tickets now at bclions.com. Ryan Dixon from Sportsnet. All of a sudden, there's all this news happening around the NHL, so we'll get Ryan Dixon's thoughts on that.

Again, if you're just joining us, St. Louis Blues have offer sheeted not one but two Edmonton Oilers players, Dylan Holloway and Phillip Broberg, to matching two-year deals, although the Broberg one is more. But both two-year deals, they've signed those players to offer sheets for. So Edmonton now with seven days to decide what to do. We'll talk about that. We'll talk about the Leafs making a change in their captaincy

and a lot more coming up with Ryan Dixon next here. Halford & Brough, Sportsnet 650.