Halford & Brough in the Morning - It's Lekkerimäki Time!

Episode Date: November 12, 2024

In hour one, Mike & Jason look back at the previous day in sports (3:00), they set up tonight's Canucks home matchup versus the Flames including the debut of top propsect Jonathan Lekkerimäki (6:00),... plus they chat the latest stories from around the NHL with ESPN Hockey's Greg Wyshynski (26:54).  This podcast is produced by Andy Cole and Greg Balloch. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

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Starting point is 00:00:25 Da-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na- fires touchdown Miami Tyreek Hill. So here I am early in the morning. I go to the bathroom. This is how my day started. I clogged the toilet. And I'm like, this is going to be a crappy day. The Stars numbers the other way. Marchman with Sagan. Fed there. Score! Tyler Sagan on the power play
Starting point is 00:00:36 and make it a half dozen here in the first for Dallas. Ha! Stop! He's already dead. Good morning. We're covering 601 on a Tuesday. Happy Tuesday, everybody. It is Halford, it is Brough, it is Sportsnet 650, and we are coming to you live from the Kintec Studios
Starting point is 00:00:54 in beautiful Fairview Slopes in Vancouver. Jason, good morning. Good morning. Adog, good morning to you. Good morning. Laddy, good morning to you as well. Hello, hello. Halford and Brough in the morning is brought to you by Vancouver Honda,
Starting point is 00:01:03 Vancouver's premier destination for Honda customers. They have a friendly, knowledgeable staff that can help with anything you're looking for, be it sales, financing, service, or parts.
Starting point is 00:01:13 We are in Hour 1 of the program. Hour 1 is brought to you by Northstar Metal Recycling, Vancouver's premier metal recycler. Oh, they pay the highest prices on scrap metal.
Starting point is 00:01:22 Northstar Metal Recycling, they recycle, you get paid. Visit them at 1170 Powell Street in Vancouver. We are coming to you live from the Kintec studio. Kintec, Canada's favorite orthotics provider, powered by thousands of five-star Google reviews. So, Rafit, what are you waiting for? Kintec, we got a big show ahead on a Tuesday.
Starting point is 00:01:39 Four guests today, beginning at 6.30, with the only of the four guests that did not play in the National Hockey League. Greg Wyshynski, what a loser. He's going to join us at 6.30 from ESPN NHL coverage. We'll go around what happened last night in the NHL. There's seven games tonight in the National Hockey League, one of which, of course, is the Canucks and Flames, 7 o'clock from Rogers Arena.
Starting point is 00:02:02 Got a bunch of other good games as well. Got the Battle of Ontario going on. Big goalie matchup in Madison Square Garden. Who is it? Shesterkin v. Hellebuck. That's not what I told you to say. You said Shesty versus Helly. Yeah, that's the goalie.
Starting point is 00:02:17 Shesty versus Helly. A little inside goalie from Greg there. So 6.30, Greg Wyshynski's going to join the program. Now, on to the former NHL player. 7 o'clock, Ray Ferynski is going to join the program. Now, on to the former NHL player. 7 o'clock, Ray Ferraro is going to join the program. 8 o'clock, his son, Landon Ferraro, is going to join the program. And at 8.30, to cap it all off, a Hockey Hall of Famer, Vancouver Canucks legend, Max Sundin, is going to join the program today.
Starting point is 00:02:44 What a show. What a guest list. Andy, some of your finest bookings ever. I wish I had a voice. You do. Oh, you mean like your voice is sore and not because you're sick. Matt, how you doing, sweetheart? You always have a voice, Jason, here at the Health and Rough Show.
Starting point is 00:03:00 You want to go out for a cigarette with me? Matt Sundin's like, who is this person I'm speaking with? So it's a big show. We got a lot to get into. Guest list is loaded. Without further ado, Laddie, let's tell everybody what happened. Hey, did you guys see the game last night? No.
Starting point is 00:03:15 What happened? I missed all the action because I was... We know how busy your life can be. What happened? You missed that? What happened? What Happened is brought to you by the BC Construction Safety Alliance. Making safety simpler by giving construction companies the best in tools, resources, and safety training.
Starting point is 00:03:36 Visit them online at bccsa.ca. As we look ahead to tonight's game between the Canucks and the Flames, 7 o'clock at Rogers Arena, we must look back to yesterday at Canucks practice ahead of tonight's Flames game. The team did practice with a little bit of wrinkle to their forward lines. It is Suter, Miller, and Jonathan Lechermacki, who is expected to make his NHL debut tonight when the Canucks take on the Flames. Second line of DeBrusque, Pettersson, and Garland. That leaves Heinen with Bluger and Sherwood. Bluger, the glue guy, the gluger of the line.
Starting point is 00:04:04 And then, of course, also expected to make his debut not tonight but possibly Thursday against Bo Horvat and the New York Islanders Dakota Joshua once again took line rushes with Atu Ratu and Nils Hoaglander defensive pairings remained essentially the same so unless you've got anything you want to say with your diminished voice we can dive right into some Rick talking audio from yesterday. Yeah, I think we should get into the Brock Besser update, which a few people got a little bit confused with yesterday because, you know, it originally was reported by a few people as day to day. But I want you to listen to this audio and tell me if it sounds like a regular day-to-day update. Because it didn't to me. Here's Brock Besser asked for an update.
Starting point is 00:04:51 Or, sorry, Rick Talkett asked for an update on Brock Besser. Do you have an update on Brock? I don't. I don't. I don't. Would you guys ever give us an update on Brock? Well, yeah. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:05:02 I think it's day-to-day. I haven't really talked to him today, to be honest with you. I haven't. Because these things, it's a day-to-day i i haven't really talked to him today to be honest i haven't because he's saying it's it's a day-to-day thing you feel better like i don't know all right that was clear these things are a day-to-day thing okay what does that mean he's got a concussion what are these things that are this thing yeah i think they are i mean look the canucks over the course of the p of the Pittsburgh era with Alvin and Rutherford in charge have been, I'd say pretty guarded, fairly closed off when it comes to the health and the more importantly,
Starting point is 00:05:37 um, revealing of information or the lack of reveal for information. Was there a follow up question? They play. Well, the follow up question was, are we ever going to get an update on Brock Bester? Well, no, but when he says day-to-day, would they not be like, sorry, is Brock day-to-day
Starting point is 00:05:49 or are the updates going to be day-to-day? Oh, yes. I didn't even think about that. That's right. That's the confusing part. Andy, you should have been in the scrum. That's what I want to know. So is Brock day-to-day?
Starting point is 00:05:57 Jim Benning is there like, I'd like to add something on the day-to-day thing. Jim, you're in a corner over there. What are you doing? Don't we all live day-to-day? Everything is day-to-day when you think about it. Jim, have you been here the whole time? Yeah. you doing? Don't we all live day to day? Everything is day to day when you think about it. Jim, have you been here the whole time? Yeah. Even on Scrum?
Starting point is 00:06:08 Installing a plaque that says just that. But no, no. What's the deal there? The deal is that they don't want any information given out about Brock Besser's health, and they don't feel that they need to give daily updates. Okay, so he's not day to day then. I have no idea, Andy. Neither does anyone.
Starting point is 00:06:22 I don't think Rick Taka does, and I don't think any of the assembled media do. The updates are day to day. I think it think Rick Taka does, and I don't think any of the assembled media do. The updates are day-to-day. I think it's pretty tough to give an update on a guy. If we're suspecting that he's got a concussion, and let's remember that he got hurt when Tanner Jeannot gave him a real cheap headshot, so kind of put two and two together there. Sure.
Starting point is 00:06:41 Concussions are tough to give a timeline on. That's just, I don't know. I don't have anything more to add the alternative is that I'm like what do you want to do the alternative is that he doesn't have a concussion he's got a different injury all we know right now factually speaking is that he's injured he's not skating with the team he's not going to play tonight against Calgary and they're not at a stage where they're even ready to give the designation that we normally get in hockey, which is either day-to-day, week-to-week, or month-to-month. So it's all very vague. And yesterday's Q&A session didn't do anything to clear any of that up.
Starting point is 00:07:16 I would say this. Don't expect Brock to play tonight. And I would not expect him to play Thursday either. Let's move on here. We've got some audio about JT Miller, who we talked about this yesterday on the show, is having a rough go of it lately for a variety of different reasons. The audio that we've got from Talk It is slightly different from the audio that we've got from Miller. And we'll actually paraphrase the Miller stuff.
Starting point is 00:07:44 He basically said he still feels fast. He acknowledges that he's not being as engaged physically. And then he said, for reasons. And then went on to say that he understands where the deficiencies are in his game. An interesting bit of the extrapolated quote talking about that it feels right now is that his line, when it's on the the ice isn't getting any sort of extended zone time and then all their shifts kind of feel like they're taking laps that it's just back and forth back and forth yeah the four check is off right and i think that goes directly towards him saying
Starting point is 00:08:12 i'm not as able to be as engaged physically as i'd like to be i.e getting in on the four check i think this was a quote that imac got okay um did you say there's audio of it no i got the audio on talking on miller so i think this might have been an exclusive quote that IMAC got from JT Miller. And if you want to read the article, it's up on sportsnet.ca. And the headline said, Miller's mild start limiting Vancouver's ceiling early.
Starting point is 00:08:40 And I think after the last game, there has been a lot of focus on JT Miller because that was, in Rick Tockett's words, his worst game of the season. And oddly enough, it was probably Elias Pettersson's best game of the season against the Edmonton Oilers. So I think there's naturally going to be a focus on JT Miller, who it hasn't been terrible by any means. I don't think his start has been comparable at all to, for example, Leah's Pettersson start.
Starting point is 00:09:10 Right. But some of the old bad habits have revisited themselves. A little too much gun slinging with the puck, few too many giveaways. And then we saw, you know, against the Oilers, there was a few times and granted he. And then we saw, you know, against the Oilers, there was a few times, and granted,
Starting point is 00:09:29 he was probably tired and gassed, but when he just wasn't moving his feet out there. And it's funny how it all starts with that, right? Like, you know, you hear, why is Petey struggling? Not moving his feet. Why did JT Miller have a tough game? Eh, wasn't really moving his feet. But Rick Tockett had some thoughts on JT Miller's game,
Starting point is 00:09:49 and this was them. Yeah, well, he's hard on himself. He knows there's another level. Yeah, we all know there's another level. You know, the last game was probably his worst game of the year. He'll tell you that. But he's had some good moments for us. You know, he'll round it out.
Starting point is 00:10:03 I'm not worried about him. But what I do love JT, some guys think they're playing well and they're okay he's he doesn't that's what i love about jt you know there's and i shouldn't even say playing well because i think he's playing fine um and he's trying to find that upper level like everybody else like our whole team it's no different than other guys so am i the only one that finds it confusing to keep track of who exactly is in the Canucks top six? I have to check every day. How exactly it's mixed around. The only line that's been a constant for the last little while has been the new third line of Heinen, Bluger, and Sherwood. Everything else has been in the blender for various reasons from injuries to mediocre play.
Starting point is 00:10:47 Again, it's hard to keep track of the top six. I had to check yesterday at practice. I was like, wait, Garland is back with Petey now? That's correct. But DeBrusque will stay with Petey. That is also correct. Okay, so Pettersson gets two pretty good players in Garland and DeBrusque
Starting point is 00:11:07 and Miller gets Suter, not the fastest guy in the world. Have they mentioned that? They've mentioned that before. And also a guy making his NHL debut in Lekaromaki. So JT Miller coming off
Starting point is 00:11:23 his worst game of the season gets the kid while Petey gets two pretty reliable players. It is an instructive thing that you're doing here because I think it underscores how much flux there's been for this team over the first 17 games of the season. I mean, we're and I'll go like we're we're move past the fact that Thatcher Demko hasn't played a single minute of competitive hockey for the team yet.
Starting point is 00:11:47 And move past the fact that the blue line's kind of been in a state of arrears where Eric Branstrom wasn't even on this team at the beginning of October. And now he's a full-fledged member of the Six. Derek Forbort's missed a ton of time with various things. Guys have been in and out there. If you look at this forward group, their leading goal scorer now brock besser out with an upper body injury uh dakota joshua still has yet to make uh his season debut you've had arsh deep baines and nils oman jumping up and down between the american hockey league and the national hockey league really since the start of the season baines has jumped all the way up to
Starting point is 00:12:22 the first line yep with jt miller and now he's down in the HL. He's played on two first lines this year, with Abbotsford and with Vancouver. Go look at the number of forwards that have dressed for games this year, and it's not a staggering amount by any stretch, but it's a lot for a team that you thought had everything kind of figured out after the offseason in which they brought in a number of guys. Also, you want to talk about Flux. The forward that scored the first goal of the season is now a member of the seattle kraken
Starting point is 00:12:49 right i mean that's how quickly things have changed over the course of 17 games into the season so did you see i saw him yesterday oh that was your that was uh original jason brough yeah i was out there for video i didn't know that i I was out at eight rinks for a kids hockey tournament and it was crazy out there. I don't know how Daniel Sprung found parking, but he did. Good for him. And he was out there practicing with, it looked like a guy, a few guys from the Cocoa Express.
Starting point is 00:13:16 And this is probably a work visa thing. Like he's, I don't know, waiting for paperwork to come through to go and play for the Kraken. But I thought it was interesting, just like me, thinking it was interesting that Sprung was still wearing his Canucks practice gear. What else are you going to wear? Yeah, what else are you going to put on? You going to hit up Sportcheck for a plain jersey?
Starting point is 00:13:38 A little bit of longing involved there. Don't these guys have old practice jerseys that they can throw on? Not with them, probably. They don't handle their own gear. That's the thing we don't understand about these guys. They never touch their gear most of the time, right? The only time they touch is when they're putting it on. I just thought, don't you think it would be weird?
Starting point is 00:13:53 I've been traded from this team, put the gear on in front of like... And by the way, there were a lot of people gawking. Maybe that's why he was wearing the gear. I was like, is this guy guy just gonna have a costanza sit in with the canucks or something he wrote sprung on the back and marker he's like just in case anyone wants to know this is reflection has single tears so anyway getting back to um the top six of the canucks i want to play some rick tockett audio on why he put lecker a mackie with jt miller and we can talk about it after that.
Starting point is 00:14:25 I like, I don't know. I just rather have Gar's back with Petey and Jake, and I think Millsy's forechecking, being able to get the puck, like how he gets the puck to Brock. You know, Lekker Amaki's got a great shot, and, you know, Seuss is that, you know, that Swiss Army net that can play that, you know Leonard Mackey's got a great shot and you know Seuss is that you know
Starting point is 00:14:46 that Swiss Army that can play that you know defensive game if we need him to help out so take less pressure on
Starting point is 00:14:52 Leonard Mackey Johnny so I think I just want Johnny to just go play the game and be who he is like we had these
Starting point is 00:14:59 two on ones he's trying to pass everybody that's not his job I want him to shoot the puck like these young guys
Starting point is 00:15:04 I always laugh like even Baines last year he had a couple two on ones he was trying to pass I everybody. That's not his job. I want him to shoot the puck. Like, these young guys, I always laugh. Like, even Baines last year, he had a couple two-on-ones, but he's trying to pass. I want these young guys to be selfish. That's what he is. He's a shooter. Shoot the puck every time, and Millsy won't be mad at you if you shoot. Trust me.
Starting point is 00:15:14 Okay. Yes? I remember that play when Baines had just been called up, and he went in on a two-on-one and forced a pass. And I remember thinking, that's a guy that is new to the NHL and is being too deferential to his teammates. Let's set an over-under on Lekker Mackey's shot total tonight. Ooh, I like it.
Starting point is 00:15:40 Shot on goal, not shot attempts. And by the way, we've been told repeatedly by our boss here, Canberra, that it is lecker Mackey. Yep. Lecker Mackey. So four syllables. Oh, on that note.
Starting point is 00:15:55 Not lecker Mackey. To give you an idea. Lecker Mackey. To give you an idea of the lecker Mackey fever taking over the city. The city news anchor came in this morning and asked for the proper pronunciation. The four syllables. Talk, it's got to work on his, though.
Starting point is 00:16:09 Yeah, it does. Well, that's why he kept calling him Johnny. He kept calling him Lettermackie. You know, Lettermackie's got a great shot. It's like Letter Kenny and Leckermackie combined into one. So, this is the biggest story of the night, right? Everyone is very excited about this. There's so many different wrinkles and avenues to this conversation because you got the sense from training camp that there was a push there was
Starting point is 00:16:32 a lot of praise being heaped on the 20 year old swedish sensation there were a lot of people within the organization talking them up people accused us of buying into the hype they said halford and brough are getting tricked by the hype yet again. And then he got sent down to Abbotsford. We were like, we did get tricked again. But now he's back up. I will say this. The fact that when Besser went down, they immediately were like,
Starting point is 00:16:57 Sprong, you're out of here. We're calling up Leckermackie. I think that this organization understands a couple things. One, they want to reward younger players who have shown an ability to stand out at the American League level. I think that's what the Baines recall was all about last year. Like, if you're doing the business there, we're showing that if you're a young player who's talented and works hard and looks like you can make the jump, we're going to give you that opportunity. And that's a good thing. But I think the first thing, as opposed to rewarding players and giving them a little, hey, way to go, here's an NHL paycheck
Starting point is 00:17:31 and some NHL experience for a bit, is can he help this team? And I think there's probably a belief within the organization that over this season, Lekker Mackey can help the team more than Daniel Sprong. And you hear Rick Talkett talking a lot about the details that Lekker Mackey's been working on. But once you get into the NHL,
Starting point is 00:17:55 it's a whole different ballgame of whether or not you can put it all together. Because when you're being tasked with the details, sometimes what can happen is you're so focused on that that you forget what got you to the nhl right and what got you um into this position of first round draft pick making his nhl debut. And I think Talkett probably remembered Baines' NHL debut and how he was a little deferential with the puck, which is why I want to set a Lekker-Mackie. Oh, I did it again.
Starting point is 00:18:37 Lekker-Mackie over-under for shot totals. Five. Ten. No, no, no. Ten. Fifteen. Oh, my God. Five.
Starting point is 00:18:44 Ten's too high. I was going to say three and a half. I Ten. No, no, five. Ten. Fifteen. Oh, my God. Five. Ten's too high. I was going to say three and a half. I think he's going to hit five. You want to set it over under three and a half is an appropriate total. Well, I don't want to push, so we're going to do a half. Yeah, three and a half is an appropriate total.
Starting point is 00:18:55 I think he's going to go over. I think he's going to have five shots on goal. I think he'll get half a shot. Have you ever seen gambling in your life? No, this works. Three and a half. It's when the puck breaks in half, and then half of it hits the goalie.
Starting point is 00:19:07 Over or under, A-Dog? Under. Under. So you think he's going to get three, two, or one shots? Yeah, if I'm being realistic. Or zero? Okay. Laddie, over or under?
Starting point is 00:19:16 Over. You're going to go, okay. I think he's going to end up with five shots on goal and a goal in his NHL game. Wow. Yeah. Why do you always have to hot take it? Like, every time.
Starting point is 00:19:29 Have you been on radio before? Have you been on radio before? You say he's going to score in his NHL debut? Have you been on? I don't know if that's a huge hot take. It's not a huge leap. It can happen. No, but it always has to be like, we're doing over-unders.
Starting point is 00:19:39 I also think he's going to get in a fight. Go big or go home. 40-how hat trick. I think he's going to fly. Alfred, you might as well just go for the hat trick at this point. If you want to listen to boring sports talk radio, we have plenty of programming for the rest of the day that will fill your needs.
Starting point is 00:19:51 I am on the excitement train. I'm trying to get pumped up. I'm trying to get pumped. It's 620 in the morning. One of their two prized prospects, which was the other point I was trying to get to, is going to make his debut tonight. The biggest difference between,
Starting point is 00:20:04 and we're using our Steve Baines maybe unfairly as a foil here, but the biggest difference between the Baines debut and the Laker-Mackie debut is the Baines debut was a nice story. He was undrafted. He clawed his way up. Local kid. Local kid.
Starting point is 00:20:18 This is a lot different. This is a guy that's coming in with very high expectations. This is a guy that's coming in with not a lot of AHL experience. And the AHL experience he had, he killed it. This is a guy that could be and is expected to be something of a difference maker at the NHL level, which is why in his first game, he's not expected to defer to everyone else. And the club wants him to go out and be a difference maker. They don't want him to go out there and kill the time and feel the ice.
Starting point is 00:20:44 You know what? I think he's going to score two. There we go. After that speech, he's going to score two. Can we take a second to imagine if Lekar Maki comes in and immediately it's clear that he's a pretty good player
Starting point is 00:20:58 and belongs in the NHL? Can we take a second to imagine what the Canucks lineup looks like? The depth just gets deeper? No, it does. That's a great thing with this. I don't know if there's a silver lining. I'm not trying to put pressure on him to do this.
Starting point is 00:21:14 It's not vital that he does it this season, but it would be nice, wouldn't it? Look, and I'm dropping a look early here, 6.21 in the morning on a Tuesday. There's two things to what you're speaking on here. One, there could be a silver lining to a Brock Besser injury here. And if you want to extrapolate this and pull us further down the road, we have talked at length about the contract situation with Besser moving forward and that they might have a ready-made solution to replace him.
Starting point is 00:21:42 If it doesn't work out in Jonathan Lekromackie. In a very weird way right now, in a very unfortunate way, because Besser's hurt, they're going to get a pretty good look at where he's at NHL-wise right now. In Brock Besser's spot. That is the silver lining of the whole thing. And I hate saying it like this, and I know I might sound like a callous jerk, but whatever.
Starting point is 00:22:01 That is a benefit to the club that they're going to get a look and see where he's at in terms of, are you ready to do this? They're literally putting him into Brock Besser's spot. He's going right there. And Taka is saying like, I want JT Miller to go
Starting point is 00:22:14 and get the puck on the forecheck like he does with Brock Besser. Right. And then Leck shoots it. Right. Calling him Leck now. Yeah. So there's that aspect of it for sure.
Starting point is 00:22:25 And I think it's a big part moving forward. And the other part of it is that when we talk about teams in their Stanley Cup window, oftentimes we talk about unique guys that are playing on value contracts. And usually a lot of those teams have one or two guys that are giving either decent or high-end production on entry-level deals. And right now... Which names come to mind when you think of those guys? The guys that have won cups and they won them when they were on. The one that jumps out to mind most recently for me was Byram in Colorado in 2022.
Starting point is 00:22:56 I think about like Toffoli and Tanner Pearson. That's a decade ago now, which is crazy. That makes me feel old. But those are guys too. Young guys that step in and can play important roles on your team. Didn't win the Cup, but Chris Kreider on the Rangers. I mean, that was a long time ago. I mean, his was crazy because he made the jump straight from college
Starting point is 00:23:18 to the NHL playoffs, right? But those guys are vitally important. They play a huge role, and they can not necessarily be like the make or break, but they can give you the kind of financial flexibility moving forward. The Canucks have two guys right now in the system that they are hopeful can be those type of contributors. One, we're going to see tonight in Lekker Mackey. Two, we're not going to see tonight.
Starting point is 00:23:41 Maybe we'll see him next year, and it's Tom Willander, right? And if you look at the state of this defense right now. Or he's going to be traded at the deadline for an upgrade on defense. Right. So he either represents the upgrade to defense himself or he's traded for that upgrade. But point being, those are the two guys right now. And that's why the Lekker-Mackie thing is really exciting for me anyway tonight.
Starting point is 00:24:00 Because I think that there's a lot riding on it. But I don't have that sense of dread that I normally do with the Vancouver Canucks. It's a good anticipation. We're going to talk to Greg Wyshynski next. We'll talk to him about that Pittsburgh loss, 7-1 at home to the Dallas Stars. But, Halford, I just wanted to give you an update from the world of sports. Yes. Shane Waldron is out as the bears offensive coordinator oh imagine that former
Starting point is 00:24:28 seahawks offensive coordinator and coordinate anything ah shane waldron that doesn't surprise me at all so uh before we go to break i will say the bears right now are in tailspin mode oh yeah because there is massive, maybe you want to talk about highly touted prospects that have a major influence on the future of your franchise. Caleb Williams was supposed to not just represent
Starting point is 00:24:53 a prized acquisition for the Bears, but really the anticipation that he was going to be the first franchise quarterback, maybe in franchise history. There was a possibility when he got drafted that a lot of people were saying this is the guy that could end up being the best quarterback in Bears history, there was a possibility when he got drafted that a lot of people were saying,
Starting point is 00:25:05 this is the guy that could end up being the best quarterback in Bears history, because there's not a great lineage of Bears quarterbacks. Do they consider Jim McMahon? He would be it, but almost like a de facto. It's Jim McMahon because there's not really somebody else. They were more of a running backs team. Right.
Starting point is 00:25:19 It's like when the options are Jim McMahon and then I guess Rex Grossman, it's not a huge list, right? It's not a Mount Rushmore of quarterbacks there. So that doesn't surprise me one bit. They've looked awful the last two weeks. Caleb Williams is getting hit left and right. And you're stunting his growth as a potential franchise quarterback. So there's a little bit of news from the NFL as we go around all of it here
Starting point is 00:25:41 on the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. As Brough mentioned, Greg Wyshynski coming up next. You're listening to the Halford and Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. As Brough mentioned, Greg Wyshynski coming up next. You're listening to the Halford and Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. Canucks Talk with Jamie Dodd and Thomas Drance. We'll dive deep into all that's happening with the Vancouver Canucks. Listen 12 to 2 p.m. on Sportsnet 650 or wherever you get your podcasts. 6.32 on a Tuesday. Happy Tuesday, everybody. Halford Brough, Sportsnet 650.
Starting point is 00:26:20 Halford and Brough for the morning is brought to you by Pacific Honda, North Vancouver's premier destination for Honda vehicle sales and service. They have a friendly, knowledgeable staff that can help with anything you're looking for, sales, financing, service, or parts. We are in Hour 1 of the program. Greg Wyshynski from ESPN
Starting point is 00:26:37 is going to join us in just a moment here. The highlight of Hour 1. Hour 1 is brought to you by North Star Metal Recycling. Vancouver's premier metal recycler pays the highest prices on scrap metal. North Star Metal Recycling. They recycle. You get paid. Visit them at 1170 Powell Street in Vancouver.
Starting point is 00:26:54 To the phone lines we go. Greg Wyshynski from ESPN joins us now on the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. Morning, Wish. How are you, bud? It's going well. How are you? Good. What are you laughing at?
Starting point is 00:27:06 Oh, nothing. Usual nonsense. We published a words watch today, and the leader for goals wasn't updated, so now I have all of Montreal very upset at me because Cole Caulfield is the one goal lead over, like, 17 guys. So I've disrespected the— Oh, Wish, you ain't seen nothing yet buddy because you didn't have quinn hughes as the leader for the norris trophy so wait till the vancouver fans well i know that
Starting point is 00:27:31 that's based on votes i just i just feel bad because i've disrespected a fan base for a team that outside of one covet outlier no one's cared about since 1993 so it's really upsetting that i allowed that to happen i'm glad you're doing this on Vancouver radio, not Montreal radio, by the way. Okay. They wouldn't understand anyway. I'm not saying it in French.
Starting point is 00:27:53 I like this. This is a good start. Okay. I want to lay out for everyone listening that this is not all on Greg. What you do with this awards watch at ESPN
Starting point is 00:28:03 is you take a wide selection of professional hockey writers, voters who vote on the awards at the end of the year. What's more, it's anonymous as well, so they don't have to take any scorn publicly. Cowards. Yes. And in their very cowardly fashion, they have decided. It allows for candor. I mean, one of the concerns with the NHL Awards at all times and the reason why many tried to keep it anonymous for years
Starting point is 00:28:31 was because of the backlash of fans harassing the voters, trying to bend them to their will. I know. I'm just joking. But I honestly do think that Quinn Hughes has been absolutely, well, I know this, he's been absolutely incredible this season and it might not show up in the point totals that Kael McCarr has,
Starting point is 00:28:55 but I struggle to think of a more dominant Canuck over this first stretch of games in franchise history. He has absolutely controlled the game. And if you ask me, he's playing better than he played last season when he won the Norris Trophy. And I know that Kael McCarr's point totals are off the charts. And obviously, that bears some mention and some consideration. He is an incredible player but i also remember that he had a few games earlier in the season when even he said like if i wasn't
Starting point is 00:29:32 out there it would have been better for the team that's how bad he was defensively so i think you're probably going to hear from some canucks fans on quinn hughes but don't be surprised it's canucks fans first of all that just means he's self-loathing. And who among us hasn't had our self-loathing moments? That's true. Feeling we could have been better. A couple things to unpack there. First of all, I do think that you have to take into account
Starting point is 00:29:58 how much offense plays into the Norris at all times. It's been a lament for all of us for many, many years. There should be a defenseman-defenseman award, yada, yada, yada. What McCarr did in the first month of the season, no one has done as a defenseman since Bobby Orr, which was have a share of the league leading points after one month in the season. And so the conversation started about, okay, well,
Starting point is 00:30:19 we assume this guy was going to try to go after the 100-point mark, being the first guy to do it since Carlson a couple of years ago. But what if it was beyond that? What if he becomes the second guy in NHL history to lead the league in points as a defenseman? Because the only other guy to do it was Orr, and he did it twice. So once those conversations start swirling around, it's hard to really, I think, focus on anybody else in the Norris conversation. Now, that'll all even out. I don't think anyone expects McCarr to lead the league in points. But to your point about the Quinn versus Cale argument, I do genuinely believe, especially
Starting point is 00:30:56 after last season, that there is a notion of Quinn is the much more complete defenseman, you know, 200-foot player. But it's hard to ignore the fact that we're watching one of the greatest offensive defense and ever play the game. And so is the, is the upside of his offense, meaning McCarr so high that it eclipses the great totality of, of, of Quinn's game. I don't think it does necessarily, but I think for some voters it's, you know, it's hard to ignore that. We're watching, you know,
Starting point is 00:31:28 maybe one of the all-time greats right now and my car and what he's able to do offensively. I'm having flashbacks to a couple of years ago when Eric Carlson won the Norris trophy. Cause that's what everyone was saying. Like, yeah, he doesn't really play his position in San Jose and they don't really care about winning, but look at all those points. Well, it was also, it was also a situation of like the cover for that was, well, he's playing on a team that's not asking him to play defense
Starting point is 00:31:52 because they just want to be as bad as possible. That was also the cover for him too. I think Quinn, to your point, not only has been the best all-around defenseman so far this season, but should probably have more than one vote in the heart race, which is yet. He had one of the him and Mark Stone were, were the other players besides, you know, the ones that I have listed here, Capri soft, Kucherov McKinnon to really get strong consideration for,
Starting point is 00:32:19 for the top spot. So I think he's been great and I think you're right. And I just think that he's pushing against someone who has a real prominent place on the hype train. We're talking like one of those tables in the dining car on the hype train, Kel McCarr. Let's talk about Eric Carlson's current team, the Pittsburgh Penguins, who lost at home to Dallas 7-1 last night.
Starting point is 00:32:46 They are now 6-9-2. Is this just going to be a long season for Pittsburgh? I think so because I was thinking about that after last night's result where now they're like a minus 21 in goal differential. They're only a couple percentage points ahead of the Chicago Blackhawks in the standings. Like, it's pretty dire. And you start to look at the numbers
Starting point is 00:33:12 and the games played in the Metro division, and you start to wonder whether there's even a path forward for them at this point in the season. But then I thought to myself, okay, well, they have their first- their, their first round pick, you know, the argument forever has been, well, this team is having a real hard time transitioning to the next thing. What with all these veterans on the roster, like there's a,
Starting point is 00:33:37 probably a reality of the multiverse where they all have these guys under contract beyond the season. They take a mulligan and just try it again next year. I mean, there's nothing else they can really do. Like if they were going to blow it up, they should have blown it up already. You know, clearly Mike Sullivan has favored nation status for someone in that organization to still be the head coach of this hockey team. It's a, it's a real conundrum as to what you do there. And again, like we talked about on the show before,
Starting point is 00:34:06 like the idea that Alex Ovechkin is pushing for the Skradsky record on a team that looks great, and it looks like it's going to be a playoff team in consecutive seasons and might be better than it was last year, while Crosby and Malkin and Letang are wilting on the vine for the Penguins. It's kind of remarkable to see the difference in the way that each of those extremely important franchises in the last 20 years of hockey have managed to bail water when they started to hit the iceberg.
Starting point is 00:34:38 We're speaking to Greg Wyshynski from ESPN here on the Halford & Brough show on Sportsnet 650. Let's turn our attention to a team that I don't think that we have discussed a single time this season, and it's November 12th, and that is the Minnesota Wild. And with, yeah, well, that's part of the story, right? The Kirill Kaprizov, in your awards watch, garnered 78% of the first place votes
Starting point is 00:35:02 for the Hart Trophy for the's mvp that's a pretty staggering amount this early in the season where there's a bunch of different contenders you could make a case for that early it's funny one voter said and you quoted him here uh making the minnesota wild exciting is the real hero stuff i had to laugh at that yeah you know so uh get us up to speed for exactly what kaprizov has done and if this Hart Trophy candidacy is legit. Oh, it is legit. I mean, he has points in the vast majority of their games. I mean, he's always been an offensive pace hitter.
Starting point is 00:35:34 Keep in mind, this is a player who I think was tied for like fifth or sixth in goals over the last three seasons with Nico Rantanen. You know, he's been over 40 in three straight seasons. He's, he's on track to, to be even better from a points perspective this season. He's never really gotten much MVP love because the wild have sort of been a bubble team or, or outside the picture. Um, but, but, you know, the way that he's played and the way that he's really energized the totality of their offense is palpable this year. And, you know, one of the things that we always look at with the Hart Trophy insofar as, like, what the voters pay attention to
Starting point is 00:36:13 is that gap between the top scorer on a team and the next guy. And there's no team in a playoff position right now that has a larger gap than the one that exists between Kirill Kaprizov and Matt, Matt Bolte. So like he's, he's, he's energizing the team. He's carrying the team. He's doing more than anyone else on the team. And it, I was a little surprised like you by the margin. He's a heavy favorite right now to win the heart over, over Kucherov with, with McKinnon coming up from behind
Starting point is 00:36:45 and then with McDavid lurking in the shadows. But I think it's warranted with the way he's played. So I'm looking at the Calder Trophy part of your article. The leader is Logan Stankoven for the Dallas Stars, Lane Hudson for the Montreal Canadiens, and Matvei Michkov for the Flyers or the finalists. What did you think of Torts scratching Calder Trophy finalists, maybe Matvei Michkov in two games?
Starting point is 00:37:16 I won my bet with Danny Breer. I interviewed him before the season at Flyers camp when I did a story about Michkov. I interviewed him before the season at Flyers camp when I did a story about Mitch Koff. And I said to Brier, I said, what's the over-under on Torts' healthy scratching Mitch Koff? I'm going to say under 15 games. Now, I didn't know if he took the over, in fairness.
Starting point is 00:37:39 I think I might have just made a bet with myself. But it was under 15 games. But, you know, the thing about felt mitch koff that's interesting is that he received a lot of support in the calder uh in the calder awards watch this uh this edition but i think a lot of it was sort of like as long as torch doesn't screw this guy up and you know when i talked to Breer before the season, he said, we understand there's going to be fireworks. Like we understand that there's going to be moments of tension between
Starting point is 00:38:13 Torch and Mitch Koff because there's moments of tension between Torch and everybody, and especially younger players. They see this as a long-term teachable moment type thing that I don't think they're all too worried about. And in fact, when he scratched Mitchkoff, Mitchkoff had one assist in five games. So it's not like he was lighting the world on fire. But it's interesting to see the voting because I think there's some people that are worried about the Mitchkoff-Torch relationship. And maybe that muted his support because I do think that he was probably the most dynamic rookie in the early part of the season.
Starting point is 00:38:43 But I also think there's the Macklin-Celebrini factor where you had a lot of voters basically say, look, I think Celebrini's the best rookie, right? But he's played four games. And so I can't, in good faith, put him on my ballot very high because the work rate's not there. But I think if it's two months from now and Celebrini's healthy, I think he's probably a significant favorite for this award, if his small sample size tells us anything.
Starting point is 00:39:11 On the subject of coaching and circling back to that Montreal team we were discussing right at the top of this hit. There was a report coming out of Montreal, courtesy of George Lorac, that Montreal GM Kent Hughes, and I believe now the report was that Marty St. Louis was also involved in the meeting that they were meeting with Gerard Gallant in Toronto for a potential spot on the Habs bench. Now, I think everyone has sort of emphatically shot this down in the aftermath,
Starting point is 00:39:39 but I think it speaks to two things. One, there has been a growing criticism of Marty St. Louis, really for the first time since he took that job in Montreal. And two, Montreal's not playing very well. So you can understand why there might be at least rumblings of a change. Do you have anything on this one? Do you know anything on this one about Gerard Gallant potentially resurfacing in Montreal? Well, and just poking around on the story yesterday, which, as you said, was pretty emphatically refuted by local media in Montreal, was that it may not necessarily be that they're looking to replace Sam Lillie. It may be that
Starting point is 00:40:12 they're looking to add someone to his bench. And that could easily be why, in theory, he's part of a clandestine meeting during all the same weekend in Toronto, where literally everybody in hockey is there and everyone is recognizable. So it may not be that they're looking to replace Sam Louie right straight away, but also when you add someone with Gallant's track record and success and experience to the bench, you pretty much have to start looking over your shoulder,
Starting point is 00:40:41 I think, if you're Marty Sam Louie. So I've always thought about the job in Montreal as being contingent on where they think the roster should be. I don't necessarily know if they think that this should be a playoff team this year, if this should be a team that is
Starting point is 00:40:57 close to a bubble spot this year. Lane Hudson's very young. They're still trying to figure out some things on that roster. It's not, it's not a great team. They have, they, they, in theory should have better goal hunting than they do. But I don't think when you look at this, the, the Atlantic division, you're like, oh, they should definitely be like fourth, you know?
Starting point is 00:41:16 So maybe they let it, let it play out for another season and then kind of reassess in the off season. But I thought that was, if true and if accurate, and there's no reason to believe that it is accurate, it would be an indication that they are taking this season seriously and want to see at least some upward mobility in the standings. So again, back to your article, the Awards Watch article. Vezina Trophy, the leader is Connor Hellebuck,
Starting point is 00:41:42 and I don't think anyone's going to complain about that. But one of the finalists, the two finalists are Igor Shosturkin for the Rangers. Okay. The other one is Lucas Dostal for the Anaheim Ducks, and the Canucks saw Dostal and the Ducks recently, and they beat them. And I have to say, and the Canucks have probably played every bad team
Starting point is 00:42:04 in the NHL this season. Yeah, like they've had a fairly easy strength of schedule. The Ducks were the worst team that I've watched. And I'm looking at the roster and I'm seeing all this young talent. And I'm just wondering where that franchise is right now because they were dreadful. They're a bad team, and they've got a goalie who might be a finalist for the Vezina Trophy. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:42:33 Right? That's bad, man. You got one first-place vote, and that could easily just be some hipster pick to not have to pick Hellebuck or Shishurkin, who I think are clearly the two favorites right now. But, yeah, I mean, I think to your point about Montreal, like Anaheim is what you are describing and with Montreal,
Starting point is 00:42:50 which is that you've got a ton of young talent on that roster. You've got some decent veteran guys like Troy Terry, for example, and they brought in Gudis to be an adult in the room on the back end. They should have some decent goaltending. And the team stinks. Like, they're horrible, man. They're terrible. So when we talk about, and again, like, the thing that worries me,
Starting point is 00:43:10 if I'm Greg Krohn and their head coach, is that you're there for one reason. It's not to win a Stanley Cup. It's not to win a conference title. It's to make young players better. And, you know, we saw that very early on when, you know, there was clashes between him and Zegres. And obviously, Zegres is no longer Zegres under Cronin's regime, whether that's because, I mean, who knows what the factors are.
Starting point is 00:43:37 But the fact remains is that his numbers, you know, fell off a cliff under this coach. He's there to teach them to be 200-foot players, and they're bad, like they're a bad hockey team. And so, I mean, I think he's clearly got the hottest seat right now in the league, if we're being honest. I know there's some other teams that are struggling right now, but if you think about Anaheim and where they are and where they would like to be, I don't think that there's anything
Starting point is 00:44:04 on the ice happening that tells you that this guy is necessarily long for this job. Speaking of struggling teams, the ones that the Canucks are going to see because Nashville is here on Sunday. So the Nashville Predators are 16 games into this new look, shiny, glitzy, fantasy hockey lineup. They're 5-9-2. They have 12 points.
Starting point is 00:44:24 They're dead last in the National Hockey League. They have a minus 14 goal differential. Their general manager has already said that he's toying with the idea of a rebuild, which is hilarious. They put a former first-round pick on waivers. I don't think I'm missing anything, but just how bad a shape are the Predators in?
Starting point is 00:44:40 And here's a better question. Who's on the hot seat in Nashville? Well, the rebuild comment, he walked back. The thing that's great about Barry Trotz is that he's a former coach rather than being a lifetime executive. Yeah, it was funny. He doesn't really know what to say. And so he said rebuild, and then he's like, well, by rebuild, I don't mean trading any of my core players because they're all safe. It means maybe getting some of the young guys for whom we tried to buy time
Starting point is 00:45:11 by signing these veteran players, maybe give them a shot earlier is kind of his rebuild comment. Now, you know, it's pretty easy to see how dominoes fall. If you give a young player more ice time, you're taking it away from a veteran player, and maybe that veteran player is no longer going to be on your roster if if that's the decision you make but that's kind of what he was getting at um i i saw them in tampa for stamp coast night there was a little bit of happy sunshine happening around the team where they
Starting point is 00:45:41 thought they were finally kind of figuring things out but it's it's tough man like it's it's tough to to graft the dna of of three really good veteran players because don't forget you know brady shea was part of that too onto a roster that maybe overachieved a little bit to begin with last year and and then the pieces don't necessarily fit as well as you'd like um in shea's case, I had a really interesting conversation with him about going from Carolina's defensive system to what they play in Nashville and really kind of having to relearn a lot of things and go against the instincts that have become ingrained when you play for a Rod Brendamore team versus an Andrew Brunette team. And so it's now been over a month of growing pains,
Starting point is 00:46:26 and you're wondering exactly when this is going to turn around. But I will say, you know, in fairness to Nashville, you know, all it takes is one U2 concert you don't let them go to, and all of a sudden they win, like, 20 in a row. We saw last year that this can be a very streaky group, and given, you know, what they have in goal, maybe they could be streaky again and dig themselves out of this. Wish, you're the best, buddy.
Starting point is 00:46:50 Thanks for doing this. As always, enjoy the rest of the week. We'll do this again next Tuesday. Anytime. Thanks. Thanks. Greg Wyshynski from ESPN here on the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet. 6.50. I think it's funny how we each have our own team that we're picking on this year. Like, you are picking on the Nashville Predators, and for good reason.
Starting point is 00:47:07 They're the last place team in the NHL. And I am picking on the Anaheim Ducks because I was actually offended on behalf of hockey with how bad they were against the Canucks. They're the 30th place team in the NHL, Anaheim. But I think they're the worst team. They are. Just watching them play. But I think they're the worst team. They are. Like, just watching them play.
Starting point is 00:47:27 Actually, Montreal deserves some mention in there. Montreal's real bad. How about that game yesterday against the Sabres, which they managed to win.
Starting point is 00:47:33 7-5. Were the goalies playing? They did. There were 12 shots allowed on, sorry, 12 goals allowed on 41 shots.
Starting point is 00:47:42 Yep. Both goalies got Both goalies got pulled. The Habbs pulled it out in the end but you know how there are teams like getting back to like you just you're i don't care about the anaheim ducks but i watched that game and i was like how can a team with this much young talent just play with such a lack of enthusiasm. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:48:06 And they're at home. Like they were bad, man. They were really bad. 31 goals scored. The fewest in the National Hockey League in 14 games. No answers. I mean, I'm just waiting for the email about Greg Cronin being fired. I mean, it seems mean to say that, but I don't know.
Starting point is 00:48:24 Ray Ferraro is going to join us next. And let's talk to Ray about a couple of things. We're going to have Matt Sundin on the show later on. So maybe we'll ask Ray about his memories of Matt Sundin, both as, well, a Leaf, Quebec Nordique, and a Vancouver Canuck for just a short time right at the end of his career. I also want to talk to him about Leckermackie making his NHL debut tonight and the attitude that you need when you're a goal scorer, even if you're very young. Because Rick Tockett made some comments
Starting point is 00:48:59 where he suggested, listen, I want this kid to shoot. I don't want him deferring to teammates. His shot got him into the NHL, so shoot. Remember, Ray Ferraro, 83-84 with the Brandon Wheat Kings, scored 108 goals in 72 games. Is that good? And he was in the NHL the next season with the Hartford Whalers.
Starting point is 00:49:23 So we'll talk to him about what it's like to go from the guy that everyone expects to score to into the NHL where, you know, you don't want to look selfish to your teammates, but you still have to shoot the puck. Ray Ferraro coming up next on the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet 650.

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