Halford & Brough in the Morning - The Best Of Halford And Brough 10/31/24

Episode Date: October 31, 2024

Mike & Jason look back at the previous day in sports, they talk last night's Canucks home loss to the Devils with Canucks Talk host & The Athletic Vancouver's Thomas Drance, plus the boys tell us what they learned. This podcast is produced by Andy Cole and Greg Balloch. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

You're listening to the best of Halford and Brough. You're listening to Halford and Brough. Welcome to the Halford and Brough studio of fries. Happy Halloween. Nico Giescher to the net, he scores! Nico Giescher right wing, shoots right on, stopped by Shelob's rebound, reverser, who scores? Pass into the crease, Jack Hughes scores!

Stop pummeling me! It's really painful! Breaking ball caught on a miss, strike three, ball game over, World Series over, Dodgers win. Good morning, Vancouver. Six o'clock on a Thursday. Happy Thursday, everybody. Happy Halloween, everybody.

You're listening to the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. We are coming to you live from the Kintex studio, which is haunted in beautiful Fairview slopes in Vancouver. Jason, good morning. Good morning. Hey, dog. Good morning to you. Good morning. Laddie, good morning to you as well. Hello, hello. Great job on the intro, dogs. Very well done. Thank you. Halford & Brough

in the morning is brought to you by Vancouver Honda. Vancouver's premier destination for Honda customers. They have a friendly, knowledgeable staff that can help with anything you're looking for. Sales, financing, service, or parts. We are in hour one of the program. What a day it's going to be. Hour one is brought to you by Northstar Metal Recycling.

Vancouver's premier metal recycler pays the highest prices on scrap metal. Northstar Metal Recycling. They recycle, you get paid. Visit them at 1170 Powell Street in Vancouver. We are coming to you live from the kintec studio kintec canada's favorite orthotics provider powered by thousands of five-star google reviews sore feet what are you waiting for kintec we got a big show today on a halloween thursday we got a big guest list as well it begins at 6 30 nick shook our good buddy from nfl.com is going to join us ahead of thursday night football aaron rogers and his cayenne pepper water one of the oldest quarterbacks in the.com is going to join us ahead of Thursday night football.

Aaron Rodgers and his cayenne pepper water. One of the oldest quarterbacks in the NFL is going to take on one of the youngest, C.J. Stroud and the Houston Texans. That goes tonight. Nick will preview that. We'll also look ahead to the week that will be in the National Football League. 7 o'clock, Adnan Virk is going to join the program. Folks, the Major League Baseball season is over.

Congratulations to the Los Angeles Dodgers, who in five games dispatched to the New York Yankees. They are your World Series champions. Adnan's going to join us at 7 o'clock to talk about what the Dodgers did and what the Yankees did not do. What a disappointment for the New York Yankees in that one. What a disappointment for the series overall. Yeah, very. We had that magical moment, Freddie Freeman,

that we'll all remember in game one, but then the Yankees kind of tried to make it interesting and then really blew it yesterday. The series didn't even last a week. Yeah. When we had A.J. Didn't even get back to L.A. That's disappointing.

When we had A.J. on from A.J.'s Pete's on East Broadway. Too bad we don't have him on today. We had him on before game one. He's disappointing. When we had A.J. on from A.J.'s Pete's on East Broadway. Too bad we don't have him on today. We had him on before game one. He's unreachable right now for some reason. Pre-game hit, game one. He didn't even make it to the end of the series. When he comes on, it's going to be old news that the Yankees lost in the World Series. Anyway, other guests today.

7.30 to St. Ricketts from the Vancouver Whitecaps is going to join the program. We will talk to him about the Whitecaps big game on Sunday, the second of, hopefully, three legs in their first round against LAFC. Whitecaps need a win, cannot lose again. We'll talk to Tose about that at 7.30. 8 o'clock, Thomas Drance, the Drancer from The Athletic Vancouver and Sportsnet 650. We'll talk to him about last night's debacle, which we got to take in.

I'm not feeling too bad. You feeling okay? I'm feeling all right. You feeling A-okay. Yeah. That's because you left in the second, right? We left after the first period. I was going to leave that part out of the conversation.

Tom Strand's going to join us at 8 to St. Ricketts at 7.30. At Nantverk at 7. Nick Shook at 6.30. It's a big show. We got a lot to get into. So without further ado, Laddie, let's tell everybody what happened. Hey, did you guys see the game last night? No.

What happened? I missed all the action because I was... We know how busy your life can be. What happened? You missed that? You missed that? What happened? What Happened is brought to you by the BC Construction Safety Alliance.

Making safety simpler by giving construction companies the best in tools, resources, and safety training. Visit them online at bccsa.ca. With Halford and Brough in attendance, the Vancouver Canucks were throttled 6-0 by the New Jersey Devils on Wednesday night at Rogers Arena. Here's a fun fact. It was their worst shutout loss

since 2006. So you could say Halloween came early for the Canucks last night after that scary loss to the Devils? Yes, Andy, you could say Halloween came early for the Canucks last night after that scary loss to the Devils? Yes, Andy, you could say that. And you should. It was also their most lopsided loss non-shutout division since 2017. So one of the worst performances in recent memory for the Vancouver Canucks on home ice.

We got to be there for it. What a lot of fun. Yeah, it started out really badly when tyler myers pinched in on a canucks offensive zone face off uh the puck went back to myers but unfortunately there was a new jersey devil there and he what talk would say dove in and boy did he dive. Wow. Myers was caught in no man's land. The puck went back the other way on a two-on-one. Dawson Mercer to Nico Heischer and Heischer had his 10th goal.

And, you know, it was a tough night for Arter Seelovs, but he was beaten cleanly on some really nice shots from the New Jersey Devils, and Rick Tockett said afterwards that they shot the puck really well, so maybe he was trying to protect his goalie a little bit, but you know, the second goal, this time it was Dawson Mercer that scored from Nico Heischer, was even more of a mess defensively than the first one because the Canucks were on the power play and JT Miller and Quinn Hughes were trying to do something or at least JT Miller was trying to do something. Quinn Hughes was too tired to do anything. You know, JT Miller just

left the puck for Quinn Hughes to get it and Quinn Hughes did not get it. A New Jersey player got it and they went down the ice and they scored. And, you know, after that, there's no real sense in going into all the goals. It was just, it started out bad and it got worse. Yeah. That was, that was, that was how it went. A few notable things after that. Well, JT Miller wasn't on the first unit power play the next time it went out.

So I don't know if Talkett was trying to send a message to JT Miller or he was just trying to switch things up. We'll see what the power play units look like the next time the Canucks practice, which will be on tomorrow, on Friday. They've got the day off today because they deserved it. And so we'll see what happens. Conor Garland, that was noteworthy that he dropped the gloves and got into a fight with

Eric Holla and that was a good, good tilt. Good tilt. You know, and it was disappointing that the Canucks couldn't take any energy from that fight because, you know, Conor Garland was willing to do whatever it took including dropping the gloves yesterday um i would say that that uh that i won't talk too much about pd i don't think but he had a shot right in the slot off of one face off and like took forever

to get the shot off and i think that just it's just his confidence his confidence is so low right now you know watching we watched from we were actually in the Canucks alumni suite which is right next to the press box so we had the kind of bird's eye view of it all it's tough to watch him play man is but it was tough to watch the whole team play last night so there's no sense in picking on one player um you know everyone pretty much had a tough night for the Canucks. It's to the point where you come in, you're kind of like, there's no sense in screaming and yelling about it. And I got that feeling from Rick Talkett afterwards. He's like, like, I'm not going to light them up. They know how badly they played. And Tyler Myers said afterwards, we should be embarrassed. And I'm

sure they were embarrassed with that performance. It was a dreadful, dreadful, dreadful performance. And I can tell you that early in the third period, Rogers Arena was half empty. People had gone home. They were just like, well, they're not coming back. They look terrible tonight. Let's go home and get some sleep.

Yeah, it was interesting because usually for games like this, you wait with a bated breath, anticipation about what the head coach is going to say. Because the day-to-day games, you know, there's 82 of them, so you get a lot of repetitive comments. The ones that stick out like a sore thumb in a good way or a bad way are usually the ones that you perk up a little bit for. Yet in response, Rick Talkett more subdued than I think one, a lot of people anticipated and two, that he's been after a lot of games this year, including the Carolina game earlier in the week where the Canucks showed a hell of a lot more life, got a point with a good rally in the third period.

Talkett was more critical of his team after the Carolina game than he was about last night's game for obvious reasons, as Jason pointed out. Still, I do want to point to a couple couple remarks that he had and the first one the only bit of real biting criticism that the head coach had and he used that word again you know connected but in this sense being disconnected we talked about this with imac yesterday and imac was trying to get to the root of what he means by connected i'm not sure knows. I'm not sure his players quite know yet, but he talked about it again. Here's Rick talking on disconnected play and terrible rush defense in yesterday's 6-0 loss to the New Jersey Devils.

Yeah, I think as an individual, yeah. I think you have to look at your game. What am I doing wrong? And some guys are doing some right things, don't get me wrong, but I think some guys are just, they're trying to go A to Z without going through the procession. Your job first on the forecheck is, like I said, you don't have to kill it, go through a guy.

So then the other guy does this, that. What we're doing is I'm going to try my own thing, and then all of a sudden you're disconnected. They hit the weak side and they get an odd man rush. Our odd man rush coverage was probably the worst I've ever seen since I've been here. It reminded me when I took over the team. That's how bad it was tonight. So we got to make sure we buckle in.

The rush against was not good. We were really, you know, we were just, I don't know, we were out of sorts tonight. I wonder how much Talkett is thinking about all the plans he had to not change the way the Canucks played because he never intended to do that. He wanted to add something to the way the Canucks played because of what happened in the playoffs last season. And, you know, he felt that they left some scoring opportunities on the table.

And we went into training camp this year and he was like, well, we don't want to throw the baby out with the bathwater, but we want to add a few things. And it just looks like the Canucks have maybe lost their identity a little bit that they had last season, possibly because they're trying to do other stuff. Now, sometimes it's worked out nicely. In the Pittsburgh game, you had all those rush goals against like three of them in one minute and Tocantin was pleased with that.

But I think that's a few games in a row now where the Canucks have gotten off to a pretty bad start. The Pittsburgh game, remember they were down two nothing to the Penguins. The Carolina game,olina was just all over them to start and then new jersey was new jersey uh and that was the worst of them all they seem like they're just a little bit lost right now well okay i i don't want to blame any one player but we do need to talk about this game in detail because a lot happened.

And I'm just going to say, before I say it, I'm not putting the blame on any one player for last night's performance. It was pitiful across the board. They were bad, right? Taka acknowledged it. In his remarks about flushing it down the toilet, lad, he's got the boosh all ready at the go.

You're going to try and pin this on Seelov's. I'm not going to pin it on Se it on sea loves but he can't play he can't play him right now he has a 797 safer it wasn't last night yeah he's he can't he can't stop pucks with the regularity that you need to stop them to be an NHL goalie he has a 797 safe percentage he's given up 15 goals in

three starts like if he stops that first shot could have been a completely different game. Here's the thing. He was beaten cleanly on a number of opportunities. Clean is a good word. But then Taco was like, they shot the puck well. Yeah, they did. The hit shot was good, but he still could have had it and it could have been a completely different game. What did I tell you about Silovs when he came

into the picture? I said he's going to have these flashes of brilliance. Yeah, that's what I said. I love him. I can't remember the other stuff. He's going to have flashes of brilliance, but it's the consistency throughout the month throughout the season he just doesn't have it yet it's it's not enough to be an nhl regular so if you want to talk about a game going completely off the rails you have a goal against in the first minute and then you have a four minute power play where you look in at like the power play on the four minute when hughes got clipped in the face and made him bleed his own blood

was really bad. And you could feel the energy, whatever was there, from people being all hopped up on Halloween candy and the two guys dressed up as Ricky Bobby and Buddy from Talladega Nights. Everyone was excited to be in the building. And it was flatlined after the early goal and the power play. And Tarkin spoke about the power play as well and how it's a mental thing now,

and the frustration is clearly a mental thing with the guys that are on whatever unit at this point. First unit, second unit, mix them up, doesn't matter. They've blown two double minors now. Like two. How do you not score? Well, here's Rick Tauket on the current state. I'm trying not to get scored against.

Yeah, that also helps. Rick Tauket on the current state of the power play after last night's loss to New Jersey. Yeah. Well, we're not shooting what we're supposed to shoot, and we're shooting when we don't. Like, it's just we're so caught in between. We're slowing the power play down when it's a frustrating thing right now

for us right now. It's a mental aspect right now for us right now. It's a mental aspect right now, and we're going to have to keep working at it. We're going to have to work with the mind more than the physical. So what do you do with the power play? I have no idea. He came out after the last game and said there might be some changes to the power play. And then there might have been some formation changes to the power play, but it was the same five guys out there,

and that was JT Miller, obviously, and Quinn Hughes, and Brock Besser, and Elias Pedersen, and Connor Garland, who has taken over from Jake Dabrowski, who was on the power play earlier in the season. So it was those same five guys out there. And then later on in the game, JT Miller was off the power play. And I think Garland might've been on off the power play unless he was still in the box for his fighting. I don't know.

But Miller was definitely off and that was noticeable in the rank. And we wondered if that was a disciplinary thing for the giveaway or if it was just splitting it up. I brought it up a few times on the show. Remember last year when they did split up the two units and they had Miller on one and Petey on another. I would probably try something like that. You almost have to get some guys with the work boots out there because, you know, put Sherwood out there if you want to do something. You know, get him out there creating some havoc. Winning some of those loose puck battles. Creating some broken plays.

Yeah, winning some battles. You know, I think they really need to totally rethink this one. I don't know if Petey deserves to be out there right now. He's not creating anything. He's not creating anything. He's not particularly aggressive. That isn't to say that the other guys have been playing well. You know, JT Miller, that was a bad, bad mistake that he made. And he, you know, deserved to be disciplined by Rick Tockett on that.

And he hasn't been great either. But I feel like he's at least trying to force the issue a little bit more than some other guys and you know petterson just does not have a shooting mentality right now he doesn't have an attacking mentality right now and that's that's a major issue if you're on the power play the first unit i didn't love the fact that connor garland went out there and it's we were joking as we were watching the game Conor Garland's officially in like fine I'll do everything mode because he has been one of

if not the team's best players through the first 8-9 games of the season and he's going out there fighting at 3-0 to try and get a spark. You didn't like that? I didn't like that nothing happened. Oh yeah I love the fact that Garland dropped the gloves that was the best part of the game otherwise I might have been quite disappointed with the performance last night.

I didn't like the fact that nothing happened afterwards. There was no spark. There was nothing tangible that came from it. And actually, it was JT Miller after the game who said that part of it really sucked. I think the quote was, someone went and got punched in the head for you. And you went out and responded like that. And that's, those little individual moments that you can find in games are of concern. I know that Tockett isn't thrilled having listened to his comments after the Pittsburgh game

and the Carolina game with the team's physical approach overall. And I think it's an intensity thing. I think right now he thinks his team is too perimeter oriented, too fancy, too fragile, and not enough guys are interested in engaging physically and doing the things that are going to set the table for the success. When he talks about being connected now, I'm kind of starting to see

what he's talking about like he wants someone to take the body on a forecheck or get a puck loose and let that be the first moment in a sequence that's going to lead to a good thing okay i i said that i wasn't going to pick on pd but this whole that sounds like something someone would say when they're about this whole beauty this whole butt check thing that he's doing. And he did that a few times last night. And it doesn't accomplish anything. And we had Landon Ferraro on the show. And he was saying, like, you got to go stick on puck.

Because the whole idea is to force the guy to make play. And then put the puck in. If you're F1, you just want to force the guy to make play and then put the puck in if you're f1 you just want to pressure the guy and and and maybe he makes a bad pass or maybe he even gives it up to you but the latter part is unlikely right but what pd has been doing is he's going in there with his butt check and he's just kind of rolling off the player and the player is like, I still got the puck. And you're like 10 feet away from me because you butt checked your way out, you know, like all the way down the ice.

Like that doesn't accomplish anything. That doesn't help anyone on the Canucks. It helps the other team because they're like, all right, well, I just rolled right off that and I still got the puck. And that can lead to a disconnection because then you're like, all right, well, I just rolled right off that and I still got the puck. And that can lead to a disconnection because then you're like, oh, well, then there's a five-on-four rush the other way

because Petey's still spinning away from the butt check. Yeah. It accomplishes nothing. So Dunbar-Lover text message in basket is 650-650. People are angry. People are very upset and they're angry. I understand it. It was a much ballyhooed game.

What with the 740 start, nationally televised, Hughes-a-palooza, probably incredibly disappointing for the captain, Quinn Hughes, to lose a game in that fashion with his entire family in attendance, including his mom and dad. So people are upset, and people are angry. We will read some of your texts throughout the show. We've got a lot of opportunities to circle back on everything Canucks,

everything that happened last night. We will look ahead to the weekend. The San Jose Sharks are on tap. They're usually a good elixir for what ails you, although they have played better recently. We'll get into all that. I do want to touch on a couple other things before we go to break, and we turn things over to Nick Shook on the other side.

I do want to carve out a couple minutes here to talk about the World Series, which ended yesterday as the Los Angeles Dodgers winning their eighth World Series in franchise history, first since 2020. If you want to talk about a frustrated fan base, Canucks fans, find a Yankees fan. Call one up. Go on Twitter. Well, we'll talk to one tomorrow.

Find one. Just how bitterly disappointed they are in that World Series because the Yankees didn't just lose in five games to the Los Angeles Dodgers. They constantly shot themselves in the foot at every level imaginable. There were bad managerial decisions from Aaron Boone going all the way back to game one when he decided to put Nestor Cortez in to face Freddie Freeman, which I think

really set the tone for the series. It certainly got Freeman off on the right foot as he was obviously named MVP of the World Series last night. Defensive issues. The play that Garrett Cole made or didn't make in the fifth yesterday where he just decided not to cover first base on that grounder,

which set off a five-run story. What was that run? Yeah. I mean, there were defensive issues throughout this. Base running errors throughout. I think that's pretty well established with the Yankees' base running in the entirety of the playoffs, not just the World Series, was bad. And then at the plate, I don't know what more to say

other than that Aaron Judge finally showed up last night, but it was way too little, way too late. It didn't cost them last game. What didn't? The bats. It was all the other errors. It was the fielding.

The bats showed up in the final game. The bats showed up in the final game of the World Series. Imagine having that, was it 5-0 lead? At home.

At home, and they're like, okay, well, we got this one. We got it back to L.A. Garrett Cole on the hill? I believe I saw a stat that the Yankees had not relinquished a 5-0 or a 5-run lead in the entirety of their postseason history,

which is pretty lengthy. First time in World Series history that a clinching, decisive game involved a 5-run comeback. It was out there in terms of an anomaly. Now, I'll say this because we got pretty deep into the playoff baseball as we often do we love playoff baseball we were very very excited and uh you know classic halbro fashion pumped up the world series although in our defense everyone else was everyone was pumping up this world series between new york and la it really

fell flat it's it's kind of a dud of an ending to, I mean, there were great moments in it. The Freddie Freeman story is terrific. That was an incredible, incredible streak of home runs that, that he had in that first home run in game one. That was magical.

That will go down in world series lore. Um, you know, right up there with, uh, I don't know if it's quite as crazy as the kirk gibson story but i mean to echo that kirk gibson story same part of the ballpark on a night where you know they're remembering fernando valenzuela that was a very special moment but i i know what

you mean after that it was kind of like when when we had that moment it was like this series is going to be incredible i think a lot of people like, this series is going to be incredible. I think a lot of people just anticipated that it was going to be Judge, Otani, and they were going to have this moment meeting at the apex where they were going to go toe-to-toe and bash dingers, and it was going to be these great individual performances. Now, there was one in the form of Freddie Freeman, but in terms of competitive balance,

it was leaned heavily in favor to the way of the Dodgers. And we only got five games of it. And it's disappointing. It felt like the World Series was over too quick. That was my takeaway from all of it. And now the offseason is upon us. You're listening to the best of Halford and Brough. You're listening to the best of Halford and Brough.

The bigger picture stuff is Pedersen. And I don't know what the answer is there, but it's a mystery that they're going to have to unlock. Do you think that's weighing on the team at all? Do you think they notice it, and do you think they feel the tension? I don't know if you've ever played on a team with a guy that's really been struggling.

You just kind of, I mean, you've got empathy, right? If you look around the room and you can't find the guy that's struggling, am I the guy? No, to this degree, no, because he's a star. I mean, he's paid like a star. He has been a star. He's responsible as one of the big three on the team to carry. Well, there was a Miller and Petey thing at practice, right? I mean.

What do you mean, though? Miller was like, let's go, get going. What are you talking about? What are you talking about? It was just a friendly exchange of words and ideas. Did we make a thing of that? What I'm saying is. I've got a short memory.

Was this covered by the media? What I'm saying is there probably maybe is something behind the scenes but obviously we're not privy to it but i'm sure the players are aware of it no it's not just it's not like it's not nothing catastrophic no it's just more just like uh like you get us you get us is he is he kind of his struggles bringing everyone down a little bit you know but i don't think it's like but that could be a bit of a frustration i don't think it's like cloak and dagger behind the scenes or in the room. I think it's fairly obvious that

there are three guys on the team that are responsible for leading the way. It's Pedersen, it's Hughes, and it's Miller. I've said it so many times, I feel like I'm taking crazy pills over here. Miller is the emotional heartbeat of the team. Hughes is the captain and the best defenseman and the leader. And Petey's their number one center. And he's the highest paid heartbeat of the team. Hughes is the captain and the best defenseman and leader. And Petey's their number one center.

And he's the highest paid guy on the team. Like, it's real paint-by-numbers stuff when you build a team who's leading the charge. You don't need to go around and identify them. It's not like the first day at school where you got name tags and you're trying to figure out who's going to be who. When your leader is struggling, your other players are going to notice that. Right.

Everyone knows. Everyone knows. He has one goal in nine games. He your other players are going to notice that. Right. Everyone knows. Yeah. Everyone knows. He has one goal in nine games. He has four points. He's minus three. It's not even close. Right?

He's being outscored and outplayed at the center position by Teddy Bluger. Right? It's great for Teddy, though. In terms of centers that have made more of an impact this season. Yeah. Right? I think Bluger, who's making a fraction of the money, has had a more impactful first nine games. So that part of it is a very difficult one to solve because then you go down the road of

who's responsible for it. And the answers are one, primarily the player. But his teammates are going to have to do some jostling. Tuckett is obviously being very, and let me repeat this and underline it three times, very cautious when it comes to the handling of Elias Patterson. Why do you think that is? Because he makes $11.6 million a year. Yeah, but besides that. Well, he's just, because he can't alienate his star player.

That's just a survival tactic as a coach. Petey looks so sad right now. Getting mad at him would almost be cruel. He says they have a plan. Do you think management's spoken to him? Just a friendly chat like, hey, how are things going? How are you doing? You know what I mean?

Hey, how are things going? Nothing like threatening an ominous. I think the last time we chatted, Elias, we were signing off on a $100 million contract for you. And I was just wondering if everything was okay. Because I've been noticing you have four points in nine games and you look like a shell of yourself. Is everything okay?

Just check it in, you know. Just check it in, trying to be a cool GM. Lumber. Turn the chair around. Yeah. Did you get the TPS report, Petey? We're going to need you to come in. I got four copies, yes.

Do a little extra work on the weekends. No. I'm just wondering. I'm just wondering if they've been like, hey, let's have a chat, friendly chat. How are things going? How are you doing? How are you doing? Scrapping them by the lapels.

Are you awake hello but as we need to get going here bud as we pivot back to trying to solve the problem um that's well that's why the conversation goes in this direction is because it does need everyone needs and i think the fans more than anyone else because they're on tilt right now especially the ones in. They need to have some idea of a resolution. Well, that's the frustrating part. It's funny because if you want to talk about like crises within the club, like the Thatcher Demko thing should be a crisis, but it's been mitigated by the fact that Lankan has been so good. So everyone can kind of take a deep sigh and be like, OK, you know. And to be honest, if the Canucks were winning games and not having clunkers like last night and Pedersen was failing,

it would still be a talking point. But less so. But it wouldn't be a boiling over point. And last night especially, because when we're talking about everyone having a clunker, it's like you'd like someone to pull them out of the mud and try and get them by the bootstraps and get them going. And the one guy that did it last night

was Garland via the fight. He tried to do it. Tried to do it, and it didn't work, right? At one point, you want Petey to be the guy that either has the big moments, scores a big goal, makes a big play, and does the thing that drags the rest of the team up, as opposed to the vice versa,

where the rest of the guys are trying to pull him up. Doesn't he seem like he's 600 miles away from doing that, though? That is the concerning thing. Right. And I know people were hoping, you know, he scores a goal the other night, and he takes off from there. He has not taken off from there.

To the phone lines we go. Thomas Drance joins us now on the Alfred and Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. What up, Drancer? Happy Halloween, gentlemen. Hope you have a spooky day.

The Dunbar Lumber text message in basket right now. It's spooky. It's a horror show. It's a horror show. It's not good. It's not good.

You know, we were at the game last night and it didn't start great. And then by the time it got to five five, nothing was where I was like,

it's going to be a long morning. And true to form, it has been. People are not where I was like, it's going to be a long morning. And true to form, it has been. People are not happy. I don't even know where to start, Dranzer. What did you have to think after the wake of a 6-0 loss to the New Jersey Devils last night at Rogers Arena? Well, I thought the 5-0 goal actually was the one that I noted the most to

just because it was such an ugly sequence. Now it was a power play goal for the Devils, but you know, it was like, Hirona gets away with an obvious hold, right? That probably gets called if it's a close game and, and would have gifted the Devils a five on three comes out of it with the

puck. And then it's just a pizza, right? And it's just a pizza right and it's just like man that is not something we saw from this team at any point last year you know that that i guess talking would be like the third mistake right you keep making the mistake um but there's just a certain i think coming out of the first month you know it's not like they've played badly right they've just played inconsistently but there's something

vibes wise where this team like it it feels way worse than the results are for some reason if you've been watching these games and i think that was the refrain from a lot of players too like we've been kind of cruising toward a result like this right like we just haven't played well and and it really seems this seems really seem to show whenever this team's played you know a high caliber opponent right with the exception of that third period in south florida where they sort of rallied to get their first win of the year. And it was a game that kind of took on a little bit of urgency. You know, Tampa Bay, Carolina, New Jersey, like this team's just felt like when they get into those games against some of the better teams in the East,

a little bit outclassed consistently, like all over the ice. And that's, I just think, given the expectations that surrounded this team, and also I think given just how good the vibe was last year, how frankly consistent this team was in playing to, you know, a pretty predictable identity and having that success it feels like a major departure even though this team will come out of the month of October like very well positioned uh with a ton of time to find their game right and no no NHL team that picks up points in seven of their first nine games in October will ever be defined by what

they did in October right Right. Like unless you, unless you come out of October with like two points, October doesn't define your season. Right. But it's, it's just such a different feel and such a maddening, like mystifying level of inconsistency surrounding this group. And, and, you know obviously some of their individual star players that it's I think pretty understandable that that fans are like what is going on here yeah I mean that that that's the big question we've been asking with

number 40 Elias Pettersson what is going there? And I wonder how much of that has impacted the team as a whole, because when one of your best players is struggling to the extent that Pedersen is struggling, it can have an impact on the rest of the team. Drancer, I want to ask you this because you're around the team a lot and you've been, you're around most of the scrums. Does Pedersen's health come up at all? Like, does he get asked, you know, like, how are you feeling health wise? Does the coaching staff get asked? How are you feeling health wise? Because you can just, if was injured i wouldn't be a surprise like i think it's mostly mental but i do want to know about his health because he just looks like there's no burst out there there's there's yeah there's nothing compared to what we saw before and i've said it before and i'll i'll keep saying i've never really seen anything like this before. Yeah, look, I think you're right. I also am completely at a loss. There's just no juice, right?

There's definitely been some tough bounces, right? Like he is carrying a low PDO, I think, even if there is no juice, and I think that's fair to note. I think that's fair to note, I think that's accurate to note, I still don't know if it's been as bad as it's looked or felt, but it hasn't been good. It hasn't been good, especially given the way that this player has pretty regularly picked his teeth with hard matchups five on five and produced wow moments right i mean this is it's it's not like we're talking about it's not like we're talking about you know a really good player or or you know a second line player and it's like man

he's only got two points in 10 games or three points in their nine games or whatever right whatever it is you Whatever it is. You know, this is a guy who we've seen dominate full seasons, right? 100-point seasons, near 40-goal seasons, you know, convince this market that Andre Kuzmenko is a star, right? Like, we've seen this guy do incredible things. And, man, it's tough right now without question um yeah and and then I you know I'd add this like the comparison felt especially stark last night with Nico Heischer right sort of picking his teeth with the Canucks right that was a that was a flame-throwing performance from the New Jersey Devils' second-line center.

And I think there's an extent to which, too, it's felt like Miller's been less than 100%. Pettersson, we have no idea what's going on, but we know something's off, very off. And when New Jersey's star centermen come to town and play like they did last night, and Vancouver's star centermen both feel like they're still finding their games, on different scales, by the way, obviously, but just at a sort of different level than they were last season, throughout last season. It's notable. It's noticeable. It sort of defined, for me anyway, the experience of watching that game last night.

Has the health thing been brought up? Have you asked him how he's feeling? Does Tocket get asked about his tendinitis? He was asked about it before the season and at training camp. And like most things, Pettersson's not particularly interested in sort of elaborating. And so personally, when I was asking about his game in Chicago, which was a week ago, and it was a pretty short, abrupt conversation. Like, he doesn't want to get into this stuff right um you can physically see him sort of start to give one shut down start to give

one word answers i did ask him sort of just about it and you know he feels fine but that's not you know the truth of the matter right that's just doesn't want to discuss it doesn't want to get into it so um yeah i i wish i could provide more insight for you rough but certainly i do think the burst the juice is lacking relative to where he's often been speaking to thomas drance from the athletic vancouver and canucks talk here on the halford and rough show on sports 9 650 i kind of wanted to circle back to what you're talking about the whole vibe thing and i know that we kind of laugh like doing a vibe check like it doesn't matter but it does matter and it's impossible to do but it's also like hard to ignore because when it's off it's off and when you can see it and feel it and you don't have anything i guess numerically to point to you're just talking about either anecdotal evidence or things that you're seeing, hearing, or feeling.

But it's an important thing to note because the vibes at time last year, especially to start the year, were immaculate because I think the team was in prove-it mode, for one. They wanted to show everyone that they could play and they were legit and that they were going to be a contender. And I think the other part of it was they weren't trying to incorporate so many different new things like there are new players they're trying to get up to speed and into the lineup and trying to figure

out their role on the team and there is wrinkles that Rick Tockett tried to work on in the preseason. I do wonder when we talk about identity and vibes, if the answer might be like just getting back to what made them successful last year as opposed to trying to force the evolution of what's next. Like solidify those vibes from last year, get back to it, and then maybe you can take that next step. Yeah, it's an interesting one i mean there were a lot of new bodies when this team did what it did last season too right i mean ian cole carson susie right like a philip peronic had only played four games right so

basically a half of their personnel on defense were new. You know, you add a little bit more continuity up front, but, you know, in terms of the integration side and the evolution side and that sort of question about it, I do think it makes more sense when you have a team that is good enough that there's real margin for error, right? Like think about some of the stuff that's gone wrong for the Canucks this season and where you would have expected to be.

If I told you a month ago, right? Like, Hey, Patterson's going to have four points and he's going to be a national subject conversation for his struggles. And we're going to be wondering what's going on um in sort of like hushed tones too right um it's going to look like JT Miller is less than 100 there's a two-game stretch where

he's not going to be able to take draws but he's still going to you know be out there doing JT Miller stuff Demko's not just not going to be back but we haven't seen him practice with right oh yeah by the way no Demko yeah yeah like if i told you all of that a month ago you'd be like whoo uh you know i i hope they i hope their season's not over at the end of october right like if i if i'd explain that to you jake debrusk is going to come in and have zero goals right he's going to have two five on five points in his first nine games with the canucks and they're both going to be secondary assists he's going to have lost his job on power play one and only Niels Amon will have a lower shot rate among Canucks forwards but I told you all of that a month ago you would have expected a lot worse

than it is right and and what I think that speaks to frankly um because this isn't negativity hit despite it being with me this what that does point to is a team that's at least of a level that hey a lot can go wrong and they're still going to be able to sustain it um you know i i do think a lot of it's just quinn hughes shooting laser beams um but also you know jt miller and brock besser still managing to be point per game even though the power play is appalling. There's enough baseline talent here that you can sort of zombie stumble through a month, and it's like, hey, they got points in 7 of 9. Yeah, they didn't look great against the elite teams they faced, but they figured out a way to, and in this case, not just tread water.

They're off to a good start in the standings. They're well positioned to get their game on track over the balance of the season. And when you're a team that's at that level, in my view anyway, like, again, you're not defined by what happens in October. You have time to get your game sorted out. The point's not to peak now, right? The point is to peak in April. And if this team had come back, run it back, and tried to do some of the defensive stuff

and sort of tried to reprise the identity from last year, well, look, there was a ceiling to it. Like, there was a real ceiling to what this team was last season to trying to play that type of controlled game the way they did. And that ceiling was, hey, when the chips are down, you know, they scored three goals

across two games with a chance to advance to the conference final. And it was wildly predictable given that they'd generated fewer shots on goal than just about any other playoff team that's ever played 13 games in NHL history like there wasn't enough juice offensively up and down the lineup for them to ultimately defeat teams like the Oilers or um you know what have you and and at the very least this season like I'd say there's a few things in this team's game

that have actually trended really well. And one of them for the most part, even if we didn't see it last night was this team is generating way better looks five on five, right? It's coming to cost in terms of their defense, it's coming to cost in terms of their identity,

arguably, but they have raised their ceiling in terms of what they can manufacture offensively and off of the rush at even strength, and that's going to be essential. Like, this is an offense wins league, or offense wins championships league right now, given that goalies are, you know, below 900 on average by save percentage. And the penalty kills look awesome.

Like, great. This is, you know, despite that sort of ugly giveaway on the 5-0 goal, like this is a team that has really come around in terms of their 4-on-5 play and has installed a new pressure game. And, man, that's looking good. So, you know, it's not all bad. And I don't think they should necessarily go back to the identity that they had because I think there were massive limitations to what that identity was.

It's just that we, it was sort of hidden from view and understanding by just how much went their way in the first three months of the season, especially from a finishing perspective. And as you got to the pointy end of the season, as you got to the Canucks' last 42 games, regular season games, right? They're like 24th in the NHL by offensive, by goal score, right? It's like, well, you're not winning a championship like that. So figuring out how to evolve and getting it done now

and getting it done now while the results are still kind of there, even though there's been a ton of mystifying individual performances and team level performances over the first month of the season like that's fine that's fine this team's got the time to to click into gear but but they do have to find it uh drancer the power play do you expect some changes to the personnel when they practice tomorrow ahead of their trip down to San Jose? You'd certainly hope so. I mean, the power play, honestly, is one of the toughest ones to explain just because there's no team in the league

that's generating shot attempts at a lower rate. They're the only NHL team in the month of October that generated fewer than 80 shot attempts per hour on the power play, um, you know, dead lasting shot rate as well. And,

and it's like not by a little bit, you know what I mean? Like they're like eight shots per hour behind the second worst team on the power play. Um, they look this bad on the power plan. They're shooting like 15%, 17%,

right? It's like, yeah, the stats suggest if they were on the power play the whole game, they'd score like five goals. Something like that. I mean, yeah, like it's... Well, it's just that if you continue to generate looks at that rate,

you either need to be incredibly lucky, right? Incredibly efficient with every single shot you take. Or if, if both of those things aren't in your favor, you're going to go a long stretch without scoring goals. And this group's probably too skilled to go that long, no matter how many shots they're generating, but we know what elite power plays look like. And they don't look like that. They just don't the the best power plays maybe they're not generating you know 140 shots an hour necessarily shot attempts an hour but they're they're certainly generating 100 or 110 um consistently like we we just know that the

power plays that don't generate shots aren't getting set up and the Canucks aren't getting set up consistently enough to be good on the power play. And then it is weird, right? Like it's, it's hard to understand just given how high the skill level that Vancouver's, you know, five man, uh, PP one has on it. Right. I mean, you're talking about Besser's unbelievable finisher and jt miller who's a killer quarterback and quinn hughes is legitimately one of the three best offensive

defensemen on the planet and elias petterson who's had 100 points and 40 goals i mean there's no there's no way to understand why that group is performing at a league-worst rate in terms of generating shots. That's completely mystifying. So, yeah, no, something's got to give. Something's got to give there. I'm not exactly sure what. And, you know, I do think we're now pretty far in to this core's tenure in Vancouver,

like this era that's kind of been defined by that Hughesughes besser miller petterson group and it's it's odd because usually if you get five years playing together as as like you know 80 of a first power play unit you begin to kind of figure some things out from from the perspective of like building that next layer of chemistry that teams so often don't even get an opportunity to build in the hard cap era, but you're seeing it in like New York, right? Where you're watching this Rangers power play this season. It's like those five guys have now been together for three years.

You know, three of the five have been together for longer than that. And you're seeing them like pick up on new nuances, right? Like, Oh, our tendency is this and teams are cheating to take away this and we have new answers for it. And it's just outrageous. To me, I just can't figure out why this group of players, given how intelligent they are on the ice, aren't, you know,

sort of hitting like those same level, hitting that same level of sort of like, you know, it's like uh opposite of diminishing returns like that exponential advantage of familiarity that we so often see teams that get a lot of run together on the power play like the dry sidle mcdavid drop right or some of what matthews marner and nylander are able to do passing it across the ice. It's odd to me that this power play looks in some ways more stagnant than ever, just given how much continuity Vancouver's had in terms of the sort of composition of their elite personnel. You're listening to the best of Halford and Brough.