Halford & Brough in the Morning - The Best of Halford and Brough 11/12/25

Episode Date: November 12, 2025

Halford & guest host Jamie Dodd look back at the previous day in sports, including yesterday's Canucks loss to the Jets that resulted in Thatcher Demko leaving the game due to injury, they discuss Frank Seravalli's Demko injury update, plus they discuss what's next for the Canucks with analyst Randip Janda.  This podcast is produced by Andy Cole and Greg Balloch. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

You're listening to the best of Halford and Brough. You're listening to Halford and Brough. Thatcher Demko has left the game. Kevin Lankinen has replaced it. That's right. This is my nightmare. It is what it is. Helper hearing.

Guys are going to miss Gates. Guys are going to get injured. Passes into the slot for Larnie with a back-hander scores. That's it. Back to Winnipeg. Would you say it's time for our viewers to crack each other's heads open and feast on the gooing side? Yes, I would, Kent. Good morning, Vancouver, 601 on a Wednesday.

Happy Wednesday, everybody. It is Halford and his Brough. It is Sports Net 650. We are coming live from the Kintech Studios and beautiful Fairview Slopes in Vancouver. Although it's not Jason Brough this week, it's Jamie Dodd. Amy, good morning. Good morning. Adog, good morning to you.

Good morning. Laddie, good morning to you as well. Hello, hello. Halford and Bruff in the morning is brought to you by Sands and Associates. Only a licensed insolvency trustee can cut your debt by up to 80% with no upfront fees. To learn how, visit Sands dash trustee.com. We are in hour one of the program. Hour 1 is brought to by North Star Metal Recycling.

Vancouver's Premier Metal Recycler pays the highest prices on scrap metal. North Star Metal Recycling, they recycle. You get paid. Visit them at 1170 Powell Street. Vancouver. We are broadcasting live from the Kintech studio. Kintech Footwear and Orthotics, working together with you in step. Lots to get

into on a Wednesday show. We got four guests on the program. Today we have a Canucks game to recap. Just a ton of stuff to dive into over the next three hours. Guestless today begins at 630. David Amber Hockey Night in Canada, Sports Net, NHL host is going to join the program. We will

look back on a busy Tuesday night in the NHL, including the Canucks, 5-3 loss to the Winnipeg Jets. Rogers Arena tonight. Scotia Bank Wednesday night hockey, a double header on SportsNet. First, you got the Oilers taking on Rick Tocket and the Flyers in Philly.

Then North Vancouver's very own Connor Bernard and the Blackhawks hosting Jack and Luke Hughes and the Devils. Big Wednesday night double header. David's going to join us at 630 to look ahead to all that. 7 o'clock Frank Sarah Valley, our NHL insider from Victory Plus.

We'll whip around the league for some of the biggest news, notes, storylines, and trade rumblings as we get closer and closer. to American Thanksgiving. Frank is going to join us at 7 to go through all that. 7.30, Parker Burgess is going to join the program. Head coach of your Vancouver Giants.

Giants get back into action this Saturday, 7 o'clock at the Langley event center against the visiting Edmonton Oil Kings. Parker will join us at 7.30 to preview that game and give us an overview of the season thus far. Giants not doing so great right now. They're on a three-game losing street going into Saturday's game. Finally, at 8 a.m., Randy Jand is going to join

the program. Canucks color analyst right here on SportsNet 650. As mentioned, Canucks lost their second in a row last night, five, three to Winnipeg. The biggest story, though, wasn't the loss itself. It was the loss of Thatcher Demko, who exited after a three-goal first period with a lower body injury. Lots to get into with Randeep at 8 a.m. Lots to get into period on the show. Very quickly, working in reverse, which serves no purpose to nobody, but I like doing it. 8 a.m. Randip Jan to 7.30, Parker Burgess. 7 o'clock, Frank Sarah Valley, 630, David Amber. That's what's happening on the program today.

Greg, let's tell everybody what happened. Hey, did you guys see the game last night? No. What happened? I missed all the action because I was... We know how busy your life can be. What happened? Missed it?

You missed that? What happened? What happened is brought to you by the BC Construction Safety Alliance. Making safety simpler by giving construction companies. The best in tools, resources, and safety training. Visit them online at BC. D-C-S-A-D-C-SA. Josh Morrissey, a goal in two-assist.

Jets beat the Connucks 5-3 at Rogers Arena on Tuesday. But the biggest story, Jamie, not Josh Morrissey, not the loss, but the health of Thatcher, Demko. Imagine if we were leading with Josh Morrissey today. And I did it. And I still did it. The number one takeaway from that game, Josh Morrissey, pretty good, three points. No, the biggest storyline, look, there's a lot we could get into, right? We talked about special teams on the show yesterday.

We can talk about where the Canucks sit in the standings, all of that. But it's Demco. That's the biggest story. line after the game. It was the biggest storyline going into the game. We posed the question yesterday in our preview of the game. Will Thatcher Dempco play? Well, he played. Maybe we should have changed the question. How much will he play? Will he survive the game without leaving due to injury? The answer to that one is no. He only played the first period. Kevin Lankin and played the final 40 minutes. And there are, I think, big short term and long term questions

coming out of this game. So to catch everybody up after the game, Adam Foote spoke to the media. Of course, he was asked. He called it a lower body issue for Thatcher Dempco said he was asked straight up. Was he ready to play tonight after missing those games with maintenance? He said simply yes. And then he didn't know if he would be available for the road trip that they start on Friday. After that, so this wasn't from Adam Foot, but it was from a Canucks representative who talked to the media there. Okay. The update was that Thatcher Dempke lower body apparent lower body injury, which forced him to leave the game yesterday, unrelated

to the maintenance days, the preventative maintenance days that caused him to miss the weekend games. Oh, that's much worse. Yeah. That's much, much worse. To me, that doesn't sound better because now we have within a span of a week two separate issues cropping up for Thatcher Dempco. And in the short term, the Canucks start a road trip on Friday. They play three and four nights on the road in the Eastern Conference, you need two goalies. So I think we're about to find out, in all likelihood, barring a miraculous recovery from that injury for Thadredemco, we're likely to find out what Yuri Patera's got in store for this team.

Great. Which is great. Great. It's exactly where everyone wanted to be. Are you, but terrified? Well, I hate you just did that. I also, I guess that was pretty good, eh, dog. That's pretty good.

I'm excited to see Patera. Are you? I am. Why? Because he's not Paterable. Because I'm the kind of guy that tuned into the 6-0-0-Abbas-for-Connux loss last night. Seven-N-N-N-N-N-O-N-N-T-N-N-T. Who's a net for that one?

It started with Ty Young. He did not finish the game. All right. Lemieux came in after that. Lemieux? Yeah. I don't even know him. He was the E-C-H-L kid that just called up.

Okay. So they've got options is what you're saying. Good to go. It's not an e-bug. It's not an e-bub. Laddy's telling you they've got options. Okay. Please stop.

Please stop. Sorry. But I'll also come up with one more. before we go to break. Okay, the Demko situation, what do you say at this point? Dear listeners, what do you say? When it rains, it pours.

If anything bad can't happen, it will happen. Again, I was the one that came on the air yesterday and was trying, and this is a lesson to all you children out there, never be positive, but trying. Never try. To give some gleam of optimism that if this worked, if giving Demko the weekend off and listening to both him, and it turned him listening to his body

and listening to him listening to his body. If this was going to work, it would be a great, great thing, a proof of concept even that the plan would work. It's your fault for not making Demko the one to watch. If you would have made him the one to watch, he wouldn't have been injured. Yeah, I bet he would have been the one to watch exit

in the first period after allowing three goals. So as we're watching, just to give you an idea of the visceral reaction, as we're all watching this unfold. I think it was when Demko went across to stop Perfetti. If I'm not mistaken, that was the big save. Was that on Perfetti or I follow? I think it was on Profetti.

You could tell that he got up a little slow. But, hey, no problem. It was a big save. He sprawled out. There was a stoppage in play. So maybe he was just collecting himself and taking his time. Then, shortly thereafter, kudos to the Sportsnet cameraman,

who may be getting a reprimand, I'm not so sure, but managed to get as tight of a zoom shot as he could on Thatcher Demko's face behind the bars of his mask. While he was stretching out, whatever he appeared to tweak on that save. And I looked at Demko's face and I said, I know that look. That look of pain, I have it any time I try and do anything athletic. And in the aftermath, he's not feeling well. He's not feeling well.

This is science and medicine, all playing out in real time. And then, of course, first period ends. Demko exits the ice. And then we were all greeted at the start of the second. I think it was Batch's tweet. and then Shorty announced it on the broadcast that it was Kevin Lankin coming out to start the second period.

So just a gut punch in a game where Demko led in three goals in the first period but the game was still hanging in the balance. Canucks did reasonably well to put up more offense on the board

and at times look like a fairly dangerous offensive team but all of it gets overshadowed by the fact that again in a familiar refrain this season another thing that couldn't go wrong has gone wrong. And again, just to kind of reiterate

what's coming up on the schedule for the Canucks and how that plays into Thatcher Dempco. Going into last night, he had been off for a week. The previous game he had played was against Nashville, in Nashville, on November 3rd. And then, of course, he backs up Kevin Lankin against Chicago, misses a practice on Friday for preventative maintenance, doesn't dress over the weekend, and then comes back last night. So that was a week off for something that wasn't even really regarded as an injury by the team. Now, I know it didn't really crop up until later, but basically, that was a week between games

and no it's just preventative maintenance there's nothing wrong they gave him a week off this is being acknowledged as an injury right even in the vaguest terms possible but it lower body situation for Thatcher Demko so at least there is an acknowledgement

that this wasn't a newfound level of preventative maintenance where they're easing him back in and load management this is an injury no no no this isn't preventative maintenance this is much worse so if he was getting a week off

for something that wasn't even classified as an injury. What is it realistic to expect here? I mean, I would be Adam Foote said they'll know more tomorrow or today. I think they're going to travel today. I'd be shocked. I'd be really surprised if he plays on this road trip. It would seem deeply unwise. I have no idea what's going on, but just the facts as we know them right now, it would be really

surprising. So then you're looking at, I mean, when's the most realistic time that Thatcher Demko could possibly start for this team again? They've got these three games Friday, Sunday, Monday coming back for Dallas, that's best case scenario. If you're not going to risk playing him when he's maybe not necessarily feeling right

and it's preventative, you're definitely not going to play him after he suffered an injury. If you're going to handle him with bubble wrap and like he's made a glass and I don't mean that as any disrespect but that's how you have to treat him right now then you can't take any chances.

Exactly. And this is any... Okay, Laddie, we got two clips in the folder from Adam foot on the goaltending. one is just confirming that it's a lower body injury for Demco and the second one talking about the good goalie tandem and I kind of want to dive into this if only do get the official party line from the Canucks we'll start first and it's a brief clip

but here is Adam Foote talking about the injury for Thatcher Demko Yeah the lower body and you know we'll find out tomorrow Now quickly pivoting to the goalie tandem Because that's what is sort of part and parcel With every health related issue that Demko has is the company line is, well, we have a really good goalie tenem. This is the reason that we signed Kevin Lankin. And Adam Foote reiterated that after the game,

especially since Lankton came in to play two of the three periods yesterday and we'll presumably be playing a lot on this road trip. Here's Adam Foote, once again confirming that he believes the Canucks have a good goalie tandem. Well, I think if you know, you look at the league, anyone that's won, you know, gone deep in the playoffs, have a good goalie. And we've talked about this at being here. It's like football.

you need the quarterback and we have a good goalie tandem so um you know so it is what it is you know there's gonna guys are going to miss games guys are going to get injured so you can say you have a great goalie tandem but inherent in the word tandem like there's two of them yeah and both play right this is not what they envisioned when they signed both it wasn't that one was going to get hurt, another one was going to be forced to shoulder the load. It was that they were going to lessen each other's workload and work in tandem to create one solid unified goalie, like unit. And it's not going to happen now.

Lankin, what happens here is your insurance policy kicks in, which is a totally different thing than a tandem. And the issue with the insurance policy in this case is that you are going to overwork Lankin. There's no question about it. They're going to overwork Lankin. they have to because I think we already saw over the course of the weekend especially

doesn't seem like they have a lot of organizational faith despite Laddie's pleadings to put Patara in that and that's fine it's the third goalie in your organization they're not often guys that you're like we're really excited to go to him it's the insurance policy's insurance policy but they've got a big trip coming up

and they need more wins plain and simple I know yesterday in my analysis was Kevin Lankin needs to let in fewer goals today's is they need to let in fewer goals Today's is they need more wins. They need more wins. Well, and again, they've got this three-game road trip coming out. The schedule does lighten up a little bit temporarily after that. They've got two days off, then Dallas, two days off Calgary, two days off Anaheim. So you could, if you get through this three game road trip, there's a stretch where you can ride Kevin Lankin in there for a little bit.

Then you go into another back to back. But I still don't see how you can ask Kevin Lankton to play three games and four days on this road trip against really good teams on the road with travel in there. That just seems way too much and too irresponsible. I think you're going to have to give Uri Patera a game. but that's all short term there's also the long term side of this and Thatcher Demko leaving another game with an injury it's starting to feel a little bit like the Philippeal situation now and now it's very they're very different injuries right because Philippeal part of the conversation is

you know what's best for his his quality of life right his health all of that should he retire and we don't know we don't have enough information to to weigh in on that but that's the conversation it's not that for Thatcher Dempco but when I say it feels a little bit like the Philippeal situation, it's in the sense that from a team building and team planning perspective, any plan that involves counting on Philippeal or Thatcher Demko to be healthy is just kind of inherently flawed. If that, if you're going into the season and say this will work because Thatcher Dempco is going to be healthy and play 55 games at a high level for us and be good in playoffs, that's just a deeply, deeply flawed plan. This is something Demko could be

dealing with for the rest of his career. We can talk all about like, oh, this team is cursed and someone's got the voodoo doll. But Philippeel leaving with a concussion and Thatcher Demko getting injured, those are foreseeable problems. Those are foreseeable issues and they don't seem to be going anywhere anytime soon. What you do since Thatcher Demko is what? His extension hasn't even kicked in, has it? So he's got this year left at $5 million,

then three more years left at $8.5 million. I don't know what the team building implications are for that. But at this point, until we see a full, healthy season at a high level for Thatcher Dempco, I don't think you can go into any year and pencil that in as part of your plans. Right. Counting on someone is an important thing. On the subject of counting on people, the Canucks cannot count on anybody to kill a penalty right now. It is awful the situation at hand.

And last night wasn't any better as they allowed two goals on four power play chances to the Winnipeg Jets. Yet another night, Jamie, where the special. I hate saying this, but everyone says the special team's not so special. At least in terms of trying to kill penalties, this team just can't get it done with any regularity. And that penalty kill percentage keeps getting closer and closer to 60, which is a bad mark to be at. Yeah, it was 50% last night. Winnipeg went two for four in the Canucks. I mean, again, we highlighted the special teams battle. The Canucks got a power play goal. They went one for two on the power play. So that unit didn't look especially threatening. It was a rush goal on the power play. But still, they got the job done. They put the puck in the back. of the net, the penalty kill could not keep up their end of the bargain. And for all the talk about, you know, slight mistakes and hey, these guys, there's a lot of new guys here and young players getting reps, you look at it. And there's also Marcus Pedersons out there. He's supposed to be a really good defensive defenseman for you. Tyler Myers. I mean, how many minutes has Tyler Myers spent killing penalties in his NHL career? An awful lot. Philip Pronick has been a

horse on the penalty kill for you. Connor Garland was a mainstay last year and has been this year. Like, it's not, it's not just young, new, inexperienced players making mistakes. Now, Blugher and Forburt, of course, will help a lot. Although Teddy Blugher, Adam Foote also said yesterday, more likely but not that he won't play on this upcoming road trip. So his availability continues to be pushed back. Forbort hasn't skated with the team. We haven't really got a recent update on him. So, okay, it's great to say, well, Bluger and Forbort will make a big difference.

We don't know when they're going to have both of those guys back in the lineup. up and they can't afford to keep hemorrhaging goals like this. The Canucks don't have enough talent to spot the other team at least one goal on special teams going in to every night. And that's basically the situation right now. The penalty kill is so leaky. Teams have so much space to operate out there, so much room to make plays. And you know, the Gabe Volardi goal, it's a fantastic individual effort.

He also had a ton of time and space right in the slot, right in the bumper to make that play. And the notion that, you know, guys just need more. reps, and as you pointed out, it's young players learning the ropes in the National Hockey League, eventually that excuse, and I will call it an excuse, is going to fall completely flat because there's been no improvements, right? All these reps and all these mistakes that have happened in games prior keep reoccurring with the kind of regularity that can sink you in a regular season, right? It's not one-offs. It's, you know, you're looking at a power play. You're looking at a penalty kill that essentially gives up every second kill the puck's in the back of the net.

And that's a dangerous way to live in the National Hockey League, especially against some of these teams with the offensive prowess that they've played against lately. Now, I said yesterday that I think this is a personnel issue. I still kind of maintain that. I'm becoming less and less convinced, though, that Bluger and Forbort are like the white knights that they're going to ride in and save the day.

I think they'll make the unit better. But to what degree? I'm not sure. They're good penalty killers, but it's only two guys. And as you astutely pointed out, there's a lot of veterans that have had a lot of reps at the NHL level that aren't getting the job done right now, which leads me to believe that maybe this is a stylistic thing. This is a strategy thing. This is a way that they go about penalty killing rather than the deployment of the guys on it. The other question is, okay, even if you say there's some future point where we're going to get BlueGern Forward back and they're going to slide right in and they're going to dramatically change the fortunes of the penalty kill, even if you accept that all that's true, when's that going to happen? When's that going to be too late? Because I think the other takeaway from last night is we're rapidly approaching the quartermark of the season and American Thanksgiving and that magic number and all of that.

The Canucks have the 28th best points percentage in the NHL right now. There's only what, four or five teams below them in the standings by points percentage. Buffalo, St. Louis, Nashville, and Calgary. Now, that sounds worse than I think the picture actually is because it's still very early and the standings are very bunched up. And if the Canucks shock the world and win three games on this road trip, guess what? They'll be in a much better spot based on points percentage. But every other team that they're looking up at in the standings can say the same thing. And if you look around what happened in the Western Conference last night, you know, Seattle picks up a point, even though they lose in a shootout to Columbus.

San Jose gets two points. And that was a three point game against Minnesota. So both of those teams pick up points. L.A. wins. There was a lot of not great results for the. from a Canucks playoff perspective. I know it's early to be scoreboard watching, but it all adds up.

It all matters. And I just keep coming back to this idea. We can give them all the plotts and all the credit in the world for treading water and being around 500. And, you know, as they were saying on the broadcast last night, they're always in it. They fight to the death at every game. And they made it a one goal game late. And that's great. I don't want to take away from that.

That is important. But at some point, that has to be, that can't be the standard. They got to get hot. Like, you're going to need to rattle off a stretch of seven, eight wins in 10 games. And if you don't have that, your Dempco, it's very difficult to see this team doing that. But that's what it's going to take to kind of get out of this 500 around that malaise that they've been in for the whole season. Yeah, they don't have the components to go on a heater right now. I'll just say it.

They certainly don't seem to. And you want to know what the, what are you talking about, Halford? Well, they don't have their best goalie right now. They can't kill penalties with any regular. their number one center has three goals through 17 games and right now another good point you brought up this offensive surge that they've had has been reliant upon kefer sherwood who's scoring it i will say it at a probably unsustainable rate and a handful of other guys that are maybe contributing above their heads in terms of what they've done to the course of their NHL careers so they're

actually getting some really great depth scoring right now And they're not keeping their heads above water. They are the fifth worst team in the NHL, as you said, in terms of point percentage. That's kind of the issue with treading water is that as soon as it slips a little bit, suddenly your head's below water. And all of a sudden, things aren't in survival mode. You're drowning. That's the fine lines between the two.

It's not a healthy thing to tread water. You're barely sticking in it. But when things don't go your way and a couple things sort of conspire against you, suddenly you look and you're like, wow, we're down there with the buffaloes and the Calgary's and whoever else was Nashville and St. Louis's of the world, all of whom are off to crappy starts of the season. And when you start saying, well, wait until we get healthy, wait until we get all our guys back, wait until the schedule becomes less compressed. Everyone else in the NHL is saying that too. Because if you haven't paid attention, there's a slew of injuries across

the NHL and there's a lot of teams that are kind of stuck in the mushroom middle. So they are also looking to make that leap forward at some point during the season. The point about the scoring, so why, Kiefer Sherwood has 11 goals in 18 games now and the Knuckers are under 500 in that stretch. You're probably not going to get another segment where he has 11 and 18.

Drew O'Connor is off to a really good start. Brock Bessor is hot lately. Jake DeBrusk is really hot lately. You've had, that's four forwards who are consistently putting the puck in the back of the net and that's lined up together for what, a stretch of like a week 10 days and it hasn't

translated to anything more than 500. Yeah, I said on the show yesterday, Elias Pedersen, if this team is going to get hot at some point, he has to get red hot at some point. I know he had two points yesterday, one of which was the funniest credited assist of all time, as he sent a wayward pass all the way from the offensive zone, back to the defensive zone.

But hey, it went up on the score sheet. The depth scoring is going to go cold. Like, he for surewood's not going to score at this rate. Brock Bessor will hit a slump. Jake Debrusk will go cold. if that happens, I'm very concerned about what the record for this team looks like. Now, that being said, again, I just want to point out, this team works incredibly hard. And I think it has more resiliency and more fight.

And I think it's shown more over the first 18 games of this year than almost the entirety of last year's team, which was an unlikable group of players for a myriad of reasons. And I know that a lot of them came back. So it's like, how could someone go from being unlikable to likable? Well, it happens sometimes. guys change their attitudes the environment changes around them things improve i got no problem with the fight and will and grit of this team i mean yesterday think about the body blows that they suffered during that game right dempco returns gives up three goals in the first period exits after

the first period with an injury hughes gets knocked gets knocked out of the game with what looks to be a fairly significant upper body injury you know valiantly returns to the bench jumps onto the ice and starts playing it. I sure would look like he got hurt in the third period. So this team suffers a lot of adversity and is very determined and has a good fighting spirit. And it will probably keep them afloat for longer than they should. But at a certain point, guts and guile and everything else isn't going to make up for

the fact that so many things, big important things are stacked up against this team. And yeah, it's kind of unfair. And yeah, it sucks. But it's also the reality of it. They're not going to win a lot of games if Demko's not healthy. They're not going to win a lot of games if they're killing penalties at 60%. And they're not going to win a lot of games if they're top guys don't score at a better clip. And all those three things are happening right now.

And as a result, the Canucks are, what is it, 28th in the National Hockey League, as you mentioned, in points percentage. You're listening to the best of Halford and Brough. You're listening to the best of Halford and Brough. That's your Demko. According to Frank's reporting is going to miss the next two to three weeks. Now, here's the important part, I think. It's an injury unrelated to the Popliteus. It's unrelated to what kept him out over Saturday's game against Columbus

and Sunday's game against Colorado. And it's a new issue altogether. So that's something. I'll read Frank's tweet again here. And he posted just before he came on with us some relatively positive news for Knoxon, Thatcher Dempco this morning. Early indication is that Dempco is a. expected to miss two to three weeks with a minor injury. It's unrelated to his previous knee injury

and unrelated to why Demko took maintenance days last week. So there's some very good information in there from Frank. I also find the framing of it really interesting. And there's some people texting in when he reiterated that information on with us about this as well because he frames it as, look, relatively positive news. Two to three weeks. That's not a long term injury. And hey, it's not related to these other past injuries. And I can understand that framing. It's certainly a lot better than missing two to three months. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

On the other hand. That's an outsider's perspective, I feel. On the other hand is that it's hard to look at Thatcher Demko missing anywhere from five to nine games. If the two to three week timeline is accurate as a positive because it's just injury after injury after injury stacking up. And again, the idea that, well, hey, don't worry. It's not related to the poplite. is. It's like, okay, but the poplitea still happened. That injury is not wiped off the ledger because there's a new injury. Again, you're just adding another injury, another source of

concern going forward for Thatcher Dempco. So I get Frank's framing of, okay, hey, relatively positive. Not worst case scenario. That's definitely true. But there's still lots to be concerned about when it comes to Thatcher Dempco's health and what it means for this team going forward. There was two ways that Dempco's health and injury concerns were going to play out this year and one was that a proactive plan with maintenance or whatever else you want to call it was going to alleviate some of the past stresses that the organization thought it led to his health issues right everyone kind of drew a direct line between the amount that demko was playing and how aggressively he trained to the wear down effect on his body so the organization through i would

a fairly meticulous planning and the type of extension that they gave him were confident in saying we can manage this with load management and having a more open dialogue between the player and the staff and if he feels the need to step out

we'll be able to handle it. That was how, that was one direction which his injury thing was going to go. The other way it was going to go was that Demko's injury prone and there's nothing you can do about it. And that was a grim, very dark outlook, but it was always a possibility. The older he gets, and the more that we see this situation play out, the more I fear that it's the latter rather than the former, that it's just a guy that's a bandaid.

He's a guy that's going to get hurt now, and he's a guy that can't stay healthy. And no matter how thorough a medical plan you have or how much rest and maintenance you can provide, his body isn't going to be able to withstand the rigors of playing and here's the important part playing the amount he needs to play to make this a good tandem yes that's a scary proposition moving forward because as you mentioned earlier his extension hasn't even kicked in well and also like let's talk best case scenario here

with thatcher dampko on the team which is everything that you just laid out and then you get to the Stanley Cup playoffs and you want him playing every other night for two months that's a that's a grind as well Is his body going to be up for that, even in this best case scenario? Ian McIntyre, our colleague at Sportsnet, had a column last night writing off of this. And I think he makes a really good point. So if you go back into the long and lengthy history of Thatcher Dempco's injuries now,

back to the infamous Popliteus. So that spring of 2024 in that series against the National Predators, game one, the Popliteus injury. And then, of course, you remember over, oh, he might play game seven, right, against the Edmonton Oilers, of course doesn't. And the whole summer it's, this is a unique injury. They're trying to figure out what it is. They're trying to get a handle on it.

They don't really know. And it made training really difficult. And then he comes back eventually that next season, but other injuries hit. And part of the story was, well, he wasn't able to train properly in that summer because of the popliteas and it was so weird and they didn't really understand it. So his body wasn't ready to stand up to the rigors of an NHL season that next year. this year the story was completely different it was he's fully healthy has this incredible summer was able to do exactly what he needed to do yep to take care of his body that plus kevin lankinen

is going to equal thatcher demko who's able to stay healthy we've already had the maintenance issue and now a new issue crop up and we're what 18 games into the season so if the theory was him having a healthy summer being able to put that work and put that maintenance in and get fully ready for the season was going to prevent injuries. We are not getting proof of concept of that yet. No proof of concept. No proof of concept.

Damn it. And if you're, if this is the case coming off even an ideal summer with a goalie that to Adam Foote's credit, a goalie partner in Kevin Lankett and they've trusted him. They've put him in. It's not like they've overworked Dempco so far this year at all. In many ways,

this was the ideal situation for project, keep Thatcher Dempco healthy. and it's already running in to major issues. And again, so now he's on the shelf for two to three weeks. Is there going to be a return to performance lag time when he does get back in? How is that going to affect his ability to withstand the grind of the rest of the schedule? I think these are all very valid questions considering the history of what we're dealing with here with Thadred Dempco. A lot of texts coming into the Dunbar-Lumber text message in basket as you expect.

In case you missed it, again, and reporting from Victory Plus is Frank Sera Valley. just a few moments ago on this station first real tangible update we've gotten from any sort of NHL insider on the health status of Thatcher Demco Frank says it's two to three weeks for the Thatcher Demco now again as we pointed out the important part

is that Frank's reporting says this isn't related to the populace it isn't related to what happened over the weekend that caused the maintenance it's an entirely new injury. Nick and the Ridge texts in you'd have to be a complete dope to believe that timeline and that it was unrelated

Adam Foote literally said that he overcompensated. That means it's related. This is damage control like usual Nick. If this is damage control it's the worst damage control I've ever heard nobody says hey you know how we can quiet the noise and lessen the storm

is to introduce a new third injury to the pile. So while I appreciate your pessimism and your inherent skepticism Nick I do not believe that this is PR spin. I'm sorry I don't. I don't think that any good public relations agency would be like the best way to lessen concerns about

someone's health is to add a third injury to the list you know what you understand what I'm saying like sometimes it's not that complicated and it's not that deep it just it is what it is and there's no like great masking of the truth or conspiracy going on I know that history is suggested that This organization sometimes does a tap dance when it comes to dealing with the media and being cagey about players' health. But answer me this, Nick, what is good spin here? Yeah. Do you say that it's from an injury that existed already? Does that make it better?

There's no real way to spin this in a positive way because it's not a positive situation. I know maybe two to three weeks is an optimistic timeline, but even that, it's not going to like quell anybody's concerns about what's going on. And Ryan on the road makes an interesting point. He texts in, is Frank a doctor? That's not the interesting point. How would he know it's unrelated to the popliteus? This is the interesting point coming up here. It could easily be related because he's relying on other muscles to make up for the popliteus.

And I do think, we can't do this. No, but I do think that idea of you can say, well, this injury is separate and this injury is separate. But again, as Adam Foote, when he was talking about the maintenance days, injuries stack up. And what do you do? You start to compensate. compensate you start to move your body in different ways you're relying on other muscles and that creates more injury risk so it might be a completely different part of the body but if you're just looking at thatcher demko in total as a hockey player i i think it's kind

of fair to look at this and say these aren't like freak separate injuries this is all part and parcel of a goalie playing a really demanding position who has dealt with a ton of injuries and they're all stacking up yeah i mean and that's what i was trying to simplify it at the beginning of this like there's two ways this could have gone is that they could manage his health they couldn't really that's all it comes down to you can either try and keep them healthy or despite your best advances and plans and ideas it just doesn't work and that happens sometimes especially as you point out with a position that is physically taxing the issue is is that this was a major part of the everything needs to go right plan yes you know going into the year a playoff spot

or the goal of a playoff spot was predicated on them having one of the best goalie tandums in the NHL. Well, that hasn't even come close through the first 18 games. Keyword tandem. Not even close. They haven't really worked in tandem.

You know? And outside of a few really great games from Demko at the beginning of the year, the goaltending hasn't been anywhere near the top of the NHL. So that hasn't been close. And now it's not a tandem anymore for the next two to three weeks, right? Nobody on their bingo card had Uri Patera playing before game 20.

And it's probably going to happen. And if not, it's going to happen real close to game 20. So that's a bit of a problem. Again, just to run through the schedule here. So if we start the two to three week clock from last night, that would take him out at least until November 25th. The Canucks have five games in that stretch, of course, starting with the three games and four nights on the road on Friday,

and then two home games after that. So that two weeks would be November 25th. They play November 26 in Anaheim. That's the start of three games and four nights. And then they have a fourth game on that road trip on the Tuesday. That would be exactly three weeks, December 2nd. If I had to bet right now, I would bet that second road trip from late November to the second of December. You're probably not seeing Thatcher Demko.

Again, that's just a guess. That would be the end of the three week timeline. Then they have a couple of days off. and then they're back home for a back-to-back set against Utah and Minnesota. So if I had to guess right now, December 5th, Friday, December 5th seems like based on this timeline, a good bet. Now, as other, lots of people have texted in, what do timelines mean coming from the Canucks? We've heard a lot of vague ones, a lot of things get shifted, guys go for maintenance to day to day to week to week to kind of unheard of or unseen from for a long time. So who knows if the timeline holds, if it does, I think you're looking at probably,

December 5th. That's nine games. At that point, the Canucksville played 27 games. That's a third of the season. So we talked about it earlier, right? Before we even had the update about Thatcher Dempco, you got to get hot. You can't just keep treading water and calling it a success into December. So now you're in a position where over the next nine games, you have to not just stay at 500, ideally surge past that and you're probably going to have to do without the services of Thatcher Dempco. Randi Bjanaq's color analyst joins us now on the Halford & Brough Show on Sports 9-650. What up, Brandeep? Good morning, boys. How are you doing?

We're all right. No shortage of things to talk about this morning from last night's Canucks game, although one thing in particular has taken the radio by storm. And it's the health or lack there of of Thatcher Demko. A variety of reports out there. I don't know how up to speed you are, so I'll give you a brief overview. Frank Cerr Valley came on this program and said that it's two to three weeks Demco would be out with an injury that's not, related to the previous

Popliteus injury and not related to the injury that kept him out over the weekend in those games against Columbus and Colorado. Rick Dollywall then followed up by saying that no timeline yet Demko still needs to get evaluated medically, but also kind of confirming what Frank reported

that it's not related to the previous two injuries. Did you get all that? Also it's a groin injury. And it's a groin injury. All right. I got all that. Thank you very much for the download. I'd seen some of that. But there are potentially some questions answered, others still up in the air.

And most importantly for this team, guys, it's the timeline, right? If, you know, Frank's report, I know that maybe a little bit of, you know, still looking for confirmation on what that timeline is based on both of those reports, but if you do look at that two to three weeks, we're talking about the beginning of December, and there's some big matchups in the lead up to that, right? So for this team, Kevin Lankin, and it's go time in the short term

and maybe in the next two to three weeks potentially. Yeah, it's two to three weeks and it's short term. But even then, as you said, I mean, there's some big matchups there. If it's three weeks, that's probably nine games. And we're very quickly, Randy, getting to the point of the schedule where the math can start to turn against you in a hurry if you're not able to make up some ground and climb up the standings here. And, you know, let's say it is nine games. And you look at that, okay, you're missing Thatcher Demko for nine games.

If you find a way to go 500 there, you're probably feeling pretty good about yourself. And yet, at that point, it'd be 27 games into the season right around 500. That's a really, really difficult spot to mount a playoff push from. Yeah, and I think with this team at some point, and it felt like yesterday's game and maybe the Colorado game, leading into yesterday's game, I should say, the thought process was, all right, this team is getting healthy again, and now they're in a position to maybe put together a couple of wins, right?

Or put together a point streak. They had points in two straight games, you add to that? Can you start compiling a bit of a point streak here where you're saying you can make a move? If you're treading water for the beginning of the season, okay, can you start making an impact? And now

with the Thasher Demko injury, whatever the timeline is, guys, it's going to be something that is going to put a lot of stress on Kevin Lincoln. And I look at that short-term schedule. Let's look at the next three games. You've got three games in the next four nights. You've got a back-to-back in Tampa

and Florida, which are not easy plays. is a play with, you know, your number one goaltender, let alone, a goaltender that's going to be playing a back-to-back potentially on Sunday and Monday. I look at that and say, you know, yeah, putting together a streak like that's going to be difficult.

You're trying to get a, you know, move up the standings. You're trying to put together three or four wins in a row. And to your point, if you get to a game 27, 28, and you're still kind of treading water, like the NAA season doesn't get any easier. You're going to have more

injuries, you're going to have more wear and tear. And it's just, it's not a good situation from a goaltending perspective, you know, but one thing I will say about Kevin Lankton and guys, you know, last year gave him an experience of being the starter for a good chunk of the season. We saw the beginning of the year. It was very good. The second half, I think maybe the games got to him a little bit and that fatigue of never having played that many games, but the mentality is there, right? I remember talking about training camp and he said, I want to play every single game. I don't know what the breakdown of games will be, but from a, from a mentality perspective, he's got that starter's mentality. Now it's a question of whatever that

timeline may be, it could be a week, it could be two, three, whatever it is. You know, the fatigue, the stress of playing, of playing, you know, meaningful hockey games here, important hockey games. And guys, remember, those minutes on the PK matter to a goaltender as well, you're, you know, if you feel like, you know, you're giving up a high quality shots or you feel like you've got, you know, stress on that PK, like all minutes are not equal. And I think from a goaltender's perspective, like, Kevin Lankin is going to be so vital over the next potentially two weeks here. I do want to talk about the penalty kill in just a second, Randy, but that's the kind of short-term outlook on Thatcher Dempco. But I think there's a

bigger picture, longer term question and conversation to have here as well, which is, you know, the injury history just keeps stacking up for Thatcher Dempco. He's, I have to look at his exact age, but he's coming up on 30 for sure. At this point, I mean, can you realistically go into a season and count on having Thatcher Dempco healthy and performing well for a full 82 game season? Yeah, I think at this point, based on the most recent track record, you can't, right? Because even though this injury is not related to the previous one, the fact is that this is a player that over the last three or four years has been hurt, right? And that Vezna, you know, contending season where he was a finalist, it was very impressive.

But we have to kind of look at it in a sense that that's the high end of Thatcher Demko when he's available. But when is he available? That's going to be a question. So. Well, and even in that season, he wasn't available at the end of it or in the playoffs. Exactly. And that's a player that you got to remember. At that point, I think he played 51 games.

And it was not like, you know, in today's NHL, you're not playing 60, 65, 70 games. like the goalies in the past, but yeah, you're right. The availability was not there to end off the season. Now, I think with Thatcher, until we see it, guys, until we see him on the ice, taking the lion's share of games, being consistent in the sense that he's available on the ice, I think we have to look at this player as a, okay, you know, you have to essentially see him get to full health and put together 20, 30 games at the very least. like this year 10 games so far last year 23 he's got to hit that i think 30 35 game threshold

to even say you know he's in a position where he can make a meaningful difference uh for a team in the long term i'm not doubting his skill whatsoever he's an elite goaltender when he's right we've seen it in flashes this year but there is that you know i hate to say it there is an injury prone element to thatcher demko and more than anything you feel for thatcher because on his day he's one of the league's best but you know how many days is it that in a season. And that's really, I think, the unfortunate part here for the Vancouver Canucks because he is not only a key player for them, he's also a key leader for them.

All right. You mentioned the penalty kill and the stress that can put on goalies, and that's certainly going to be something to watch with Kevin Lankinen taking on the starters workload in the near term here. Another tough night for the penalty kill. They give up two goals on four opportunities against Winnipeg. Similar story against Colorado. And we've heard from Adam Foote and talk about, you know, hey guys are learning the role and they're getting reps and it's going to pay off in the long run

that's fair enough but there's also a lot of guys out there who've spent a lot of time on the penalty kill in their career especially the defenseman right Marcus Pedersen Tyler Myers Philopronic what is not working and failing so spectacularly for the Canucks penalty kill right now

yeah if you look at both of those goals last night something you know kind of different happened on both of them and Kiefer Sherwood who's been fantastic this year you know scores another goal he just simply rushes a play. Like he's got Kyle Connor maybe on his hip a little bit,

but he's got time. You can take a beat, he can take a second there, compose himself and send the puck down the ice guys. But he rushes that play, and it feels like, you know, on that play, it's that you're trying to make up for the previous mistakes.

He gets in the shooting lane. You get to stick in the shooting lane and deflects the puck past Dr. Demko, which is a no-no for players. Either, you know, fully commit to the block, you know, or get out of the way so your goaltender can see it. So that, to me, it was more of a, hey, I made a mistake there. I rushed to play, and then I got to make up for it, which actually does more harm.

The second one, and we talked a little bit about this on the post game. You know, Gabe Valardi, the pass is allowed in, which, you know, when a player's got their back to the net, if you close quick enough in the slot, like he shouldn't have all that time and space to make that shot. If the pass goes in, which is, you know, originally you allow that path to get into a danger area, okay, but he's got time and space, nobody closes on him quick enough as he lets go a leap back end there. But the fact is, there's no sticks there, there's no, you know, nobody rushing into that shooting lane. And to me on that play, it was extremely passive. And what this penalty kill is showing right now is it felt like it was kind of looking around and waiting for somebody else to make a play, which is a bit of lack of trust at the moment.

sometimes they're super aggressive. On that play, they're very passive. And you mentioned it. There's some players that have killed a lot of penalties in their crew. Marcus Pedersen, you know, at the beginning of year, I thought when they were playing well, he was key to why that penalty kill was, you know, nine for nine to kick off the season,

why last year they were a top three PK to end off the year. This year, it felt like even him. He's kind of scrambling a little bit in certain moments. And they kind of get caught between being super aggressive. and then just sitting back as well. And that gave Blarty goal was a classic example. Right now, it feels like a PK where you make one mistake and the mentality of the PK unit is so low right now

from a competence perspective that it feels like that one mistake is going to burn you. And they're compounding mistakes by trying to avoid that, you know, that first mistake and try to make for it up for themselves rather than trusting their entire system. So, you know, Jamie, I think it's part of, Partly a personnel issue too. Forbert and Bluger not on that.

Certainly make a difference, but I think there's a real lack of trust, maybe uncertainty in how to execute the plan. So, Randy, Mike and I have talked a lot this week about the need for the Canucks at some point to get hot as a team. And whether it's, you know, six wins in a row or eight out of ten or something like that, if they're going to make a real push at the playoffs,

they're going to have to have a stretch like that at some point. And it might even need to happen soon, considering how the standings are shaping up. You look at the roster right now, and we know, you know, no Philippeal, we know of a situation down the middle, now know Thatcher Demko, potentially for two to three weeks. We'll see what the ultimate timeline is. So it can be hard to see the path to getting hot and having that type of streak. Lay out the plan for me here.

Like what would need to happen over the next 10 games? What would it look like? What would the template be for the Canucks to get hot and have that type of stretch? Yeah, I think first and foremost, we just talked about there. You cannot be gifting teams one to two goals. on the PK every single night. That immediate need for the PK to improve is vital for this team to have success

in the short term and in the long term. And, you know, when you've got players like Marcus Pedersen and Tyler Myers who have made careers out of playing on the PK, hopefully he gets forward back and Teddy Blugher with the update with that, he may or may not, you know, play on the trip, but kind of leaning towards not is what Adam Fitt said last night.

Like, that's going to be really important. But, you know, Jamie, I think you look at that top six, and I understand Alias Pedersen got two points yesterday, one on a secondary assist, one on a primary. But, you know, five on five, sure, the shot share and the Corsi and all those underlying numbers are in the favor of that line. You're listening to the best of Halford and Brough.