Halford & Brough in the Morning - The Best Of Halford And Brough 11/7/24

Episode Date: November 7, 2024

Mike & Jason look back at the previous day in sports, they set up tonight's Canucks road matchup at LA with Canucks Talk host and The Athletic Vancouver's Thomas Drance, plus the boys tell us what they learned. This podcast is produced by Andy Cole and Greg Balloch. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

You're listening to the best of Halford and Brough. You're listening to Halford and Brough. Scores! And it's Alex Oveckian and a feed from behind the net, Hannafin score two goals for Noah Hannafin he always passed in my balls because I never won a playoff game now I won two so you know

so probably he's stuck you're breaking my balls I said you're breaking my balls Mr. Thompson my balls good morning Vancouver 601 on a Thursday happy Thursday everybody it is Alfred I said you're breaking my balls, Mr. Thompson. My ball. Good morning, Vancouver. 6-0-1 on a Thursday. Happy Thursday, everybody. It is Alfred.

It is Brough. It is Sportsnet 650. We are coming to you live from the Kintex studios in beautiful Fairview Slopes in Vancouver. Jason, good morning. Good morning. A-Dawg, good morning to you. Good morning. Laddie, good morning to you as well.

Hello, hello. For the final day of this week, intern Ethan, good morning to you as well. Alfred and Brough for the morning is brought to you by Vancouver Honda, Vancouver's premier destination for Honda customers. They have a friendly, knowledgeable staff that can help with anything you're looking for, sales, financing, service, or parts. We are in hour one of the program. Hour one is brought to you by North Star Metal Recycling.

Vancouver's premier metal recycler pays the highest prices on scrap metal. North Star Metal Recycling, they recycle, you get paidler pays the highest prices on scrap metal. North Star Metal Recycling. They recycle. You get paid. Visit them at 1170 Powell Street in Vancouver. We are coming to you live from the Kintec studio. Kintec Canada's favorite orthotics provider powered by thousands of five-star Google reviews. So, Rafit, what are you waiting for?

Kintec. Got a big show today. Halford and Brough on Sportsnet 650. Guest list begins at 630. Nick Schuch, our good buddy from NFL.com, is going to join us. Good Thursday night or tonight. AFC North battle between the Ravens and the Bengals. We'll talk to Nick about that. We'll look ahead to the weekend's games as well.

No Seahawks to preview this weekend. They're on a bye. Thank God. But there's lots of other good football games. Need a weekend away from the Seahawks. Don't need to deal with it this weekend. We'll talk to Nick Shook about all that at 6.30. 7 o'clock, Adnan Virk from MLB Network.

MLB news still very much in the forefront because of all the potential free agents. Yeah, the Rays are going to sign Juan Soto. That's so funny to me that he took a tour. What's there to tour? He knows he's not going to sign there. We know he's not going to sign there. Here's our stadium.

It doesn't work anymore. It sucked before. It's now an open-air stadium. Adnan Virg's going to join us at 7. We'll also talk hockey because he is the host of Amazon's Monday Night NHL coverage. And this past Monday, he covered the Connor McDavid-Less Edmonton Oilers. Now, McDavid returned last night. And, of course, the Canucks will play the Oilers on Saturday.

So we'll talk to Adnan about that at 7 o'clock. 7.30, you heard him in the intro. Vanni Sartini, manager of your Vancouver Whitecaps. So it's a big 48 hours in the Vancouver versus L.A. rivalry, Jason, because tonight the Canucks are playing the Kings in Los Angeles. And tomorrow night, the Whitecaps are playing LAFC, also in Los Angeles. Beat LA.

Just destroy LA. Beat LA. Both fronts. I feel like we're in Boston here. Beat LA. We'll talk to Vanny at 7.30 about the task at hand there. 8 o'clock, Thomas Drantz, the Drantzer from the Athletic Vancouver and Canucks talk.

As mentioned, Canucks are in action tonight. 7.30, note the start time. Another late one for Vancouver and Canucks Talk, as mentioned, Canucks are in action tonight, 7.30. Note the start time. Another late one for your Vancouver Canucks. They'll be in LA at crypto.com to take on the Kings. We'll talk to Drance about that. Day four of five of the $100 gift card to Mucho Burrito Giveaway. It's a contest. At 8.15, you need to be caller numero ocho.

Number eight. The number 604-280-0650. That number again. 604-280-0650. Where's my burrito? Where's my burrito? You'll find out at 8.15. It could be yours.

It could be in your pocket. $100 gift card to Mucho Burrito Up for Grabs. It's a good sports night, finally. Very good sports night. Thursday night football. Ravens-Bengals. Canucks-Kings. One of 12 NHL games on the slate tonight.

So we got a lot to get into. Without further ado, Laddie, let's tell everybody what happened. Hey, did you guys see the game last night? No. What happened? I missed all the action because I was... We know how busy your life can be. What happened? You missed that what happened

what happened is brought to you by the bc construction safety alliance making safety simpler by giving construction companies the best in tools resources and safety training visit them online at bccsa.ca the vancouver canucks well they got back to practice yesterday and it was a sight for sore eyes for the Vancouver Canucks because goalie Thatcher Demko participated in practice with teammates for the first time this season. He took part in some drills, albeit in a limited fashion, along with Kevin Lankanen and Artur Silovs.

As mentioned, participation limited, but participation nonetheless. He also left the ice before practice was finished, so he didn't have to address any of the media. So the timeline now for Demko still up in the air. No one's sure when he's going to come back, but I think for the first time in a long time, we have seen a pretty clear progression in terms of taking steps forward. On Saturday, he took some shots from Dakota Joshua

after the morning skate in San Jose. Tuesday, took some more shots from Dakota Joshua after the morning skate in San Jose Tuesday took some more shots from healthy scratch no Juleson and skills coach Jason Krog and then yesterday the biggest step of all returning to practice albeit in a limited fashion of Demko's session

look it's part of the plan and we're just going to stick with it no timeline on Demko still and with Kevin Lankanen playing the way he's and we're just going to stick with it. No timeline on Demko still, and with Kevin Lankanen playing the way he's playing and with the Canucks getting a few wins in the last little while, there doesn't seem to be a lot of pressure on getting Thatcher Demko back in net right now.

Dakota Joshua was, I thought, curiously not at practice yesterday. And Tuckett said, look, there's been no setback for him. But then he said, we're taking a cautious approach with him, which I thought was just odd. Like, why was he not at practice? Why didn't he practice? Like, why not? Like, he? Why didn't he practice? Like, why not? Like, he's trying to get back into game shape.

What happened there? I mean, we don't know. I'm not asking you to come up with a question. You don't know. I have no answers. I just thought it was. He didn't skate. I just thought it was curious.

Yeah. You know? Hopefully, everything's going okay with his recovery. But, yeah, I thought that was weird. Because I thought he thought he'd be like itching to get back into the lineup. The only thing that came. I thought the Canucks would be like, all right, let's get you going. He's been out skating with the Canucks a lot as an extra, but he's been at all the practices. And, you know, this is a bit of, it's a bit odd and new for all of us

because this isn't, you know, a knee injury or ankle injuries. The only thing I thought of when I heard it was that when Talkett said, quote, we're taking a cautious approach, I do wonder if the sort of new look health and medical approach that the team is taking on all fronts. Remember, we saw JT Miller not participate in any of the preseason except for one game because he was, quote-unquote, dealing with something.

And here's the thing. I mean, could just be cautious. Maybe he's tired. I don't know. Thatcher Demko, they are obviously playing a long game with his return. And I think with Joshua, the other part of it, too, is when you look at the current forward group, you'd say we're not in any huge rush to get him back in.

If the strength of the team right now is the forward group, maybe if it's I'm not feeling great or I might have strained something or a little tweak or something like that, why rush it? Why take the rush? I'm just saying hopefully everything's going okay with his recovery. Derek Forbort, man, it's a tough time for him. He's out for a few weeks with an injury that was suffered in practice.

Of course, he had a personal leave because his father passed away. So it sounds like he could be out for a little while, a few weeks, maybe up to a month. So, you know, Eric Branstrom is going to keep playing and he's been good for the Vancouver Canucks, but I do feel badly for, uh, Derek Forbort. Um, other talk of things, uh, from his scrum yesterday after practice, um, said he, he liked how the Canucks were more connected against the Ducks. And he said, he been going over some video and, I don't know, yelling at guys,

telling them to be more connected. Now, tonight's game is obviously going to be a tougher test than what the Anaheim Ducks gave us. And I'm still thinking about the Ducks. And I don't know if that's what they're going to give on a nightly basis. And maybe they just had a really bad game. But, you know, i don't know that

that that team just looked in in disarray um he also talked about lankanen playing a lot and this is something that i've been thinking about because kevin lankanen has never been in this position really in the nhl unless i'm mistaken, where he's playing pretty much every game because the starter is hurt and the backup right now, Shelovs, is not playing well. And there haven't been back-to-back games for the Canucks. The schedule has not rewarded them, but it's been good for them in that way. Some back-to-backs are coming up in mid-November, but for now, Lankanen can play pretty much as much as he wants, and he was

asked about, Talkett was asked about how that has been for him, I imagine both physically and mentally. Yeah, here's the audio from Rick Talkett speaking about his new starting goalie. Talkett also lets it slip to Lankanen, will be starting tonight as well. For you poolies out there,

fantasy poolies here, Rick Talkin' from yesterday's practice in Los Angeles. I think that's what he does. He's staying in the moment. Like, he's not even, you know, he doesn't even think we're playing Saturday night.

Like, he's just, you know, obviously he's going to play tomorrow. And that's all he's thinking about. And he's thinking about his practice with Marco at 12.30 today. The goalie, the drills he uses. I talked to him. He doesn't think too far ahead.

And talk about staying in the moment. He is staying in the moment. And I think that's the best way for any player, but even for him. It's got to be a challenge for him. But right now he's feeling it. And he hasn't lost in regulation yet. So let's keep going and get a win tonight. Dude is playing until he either suffers an injury or starts playing poorly.

Can you imagine? No, no, no. But that's the risk right now. I think overplaying him is partly, if you ask the organization, or overworking him is why they're in this situation with Thatcher Demko. Sure. To a certain degree.

To a certain degree. Some of it was bad luck. Some of it was rushing them back for the playoffs. But it really does sound like that was one of the major disagreements that the management had with the goalie coach, Ian Clark,

who is no longer the goalie coach and probably not long for the organization. So the Canucks don't want to do anything that's going to risk Kevin Lankanen wearing out. And I think that was what IMAC was getting. I think it was IMAC who asked him the question. Sure. It's a fair question. He's like, hey, you know, you got this injury situation with Thatcher Demko.

You've got no real great backup right now, so maybe don't run the guy that's playing really well into the ground. And put it that way. He should have. That would have been funny. Yeah, but then you have to play the not great backup. It's true. Once in a while, man.

That's the conundrum. That's the conundrum. Yeah. No, no, no. Absolutely. That's the conundrum. That's the conundrum. Yeah. No, no, no. Absolutely. That's the conundrum. And the Canucks have two games coming up where these are going to be tests

where they don't really want to put Seeloffs in there. The Kings tonight and then the Oilers with Connor McDavid back sooner than expected on Saturday in Vancouver where everyone's going to be

looking forward to that game and I don't think that's going to be a game where their talk is going to be like, all right, let's go with Seelovs. Artie, you're up. I know you didn't expect this. I got a hunch. Hindsight is 9-0 Oilers. This was tough.

The hunch didn't go the way I thought it was going to. Hindsight being 20-20, he should have played Seelovs against the Ducks. He could have played Latty against the Ducks, and it would have been fine. It would have been close. Yeah, but you would have been okay. I like your reverse VH or regular VH, whichever one you play. I'm not sure.

Both? Yeah, but, you know, we're not cause for concern time yet because Lankanen's been great. Tuckett said his mental approach is perfect for what they're doing. It's only eight games. Lankanen has played a career high of 37 in a single season. That was back in his rookie year with Chicago.

So, I mean, that's not a huge workload, but it's not an insignificant one. He was honing in on 40 games, which is basically half an NHL season. So if you want to go from a historical context, you're not at any point of being concerned yet. The only reason that our you know antenna collective antennae are up or whatever is because of demko because we saw what happens when a guy now here's the thing is carrying a huge workload in terms of minutes played but also i think part of it was the way that demko pushed himself in practice or was pushed or was pushed however you

want to frame it so there's a couple different ways that you can get guys rest and a couple different ways that you can get guys ready for games so that's the Canucks story um hold on hold on hold on before we move along I did want to do for the second consecutive day in a row I wanted to talk about Kiefer Sherwood and I want to play the audio from Rick talking when are you getting a Kiefer Sherwood jersey I don't know know. I might get one. I can't. No, you can't because you've got your stupid rule. His stupid rule. It's not a stupid rule. It was a stupid rule. You're talking about the past tense.

It's a stupid rule right now. Should we explain this for people that might not know what we're talking about? It was a fine rule when you were like 30, but you're like 100 now. Halford's got this rule where he won't wear the name of a player on his back, whether it's a jersey or a jersey, who is younger than him.

That's right. So any player. So any player in the NHL right now. It has to be a retired player now. Again. Or a dead one. This was fine, I think. When you're 25, you know, you don't really want to be like.

It's always weird. There's no time this isn't weird. No, no, no. I think, I didn't think it was weird. I kind of felt the same way. When you're 25, you're like, I don't want to. This guy was in grade four when I was in grade eight. But now, it's a ridiculous rule because it limits you,

and all you can do is wear a throwback jersey. How can we even use a Sherwood stick? No, can't do it. Can't do it. I'm really regimented, yeah. Anyway. Anyway. You still love Kiefer Sherwood, and you know? No, can't do it. Can't do it. Can't do it. I'm really regimented, yeah. Anyway. Anyway. You still love Kiefer Sherwood, and so does this market.

I was actually wondering, the next time I'm at Rogers Arena, are we going to start seeing Sherwood jerseys around? Like, he has become real quickly a fan favorite in Vancouver, and for good reason. I wasn't expecting him to have so much offensive pop. Like, I just thought he'd run around hitting guys. Good point. He can score goals, too.

I'm glad you brought it up. Also, there's a nod to the teams that sort of passed him over, passed him by, or in the case of Nashville, just let him walk. And I want to bring that up because we'll talk about Nashville later in the show when we do our NHL wrap round because Nashville's in a bad way and it's hilarious that Barry Trotz is already talking about a rebuild. I'm like, dude, it's October or November 7th. Like you just built this team.

Anyway, Talk It was asked about Sherwood yesterday, including a question from IMAC about that history that Sherwood's had bouncing around the NHL. Talk It on Kiefer Sherwood from yesterday's practice. Well, I got to give credit to the, to the staff, our pro scouting staff, obviously Patrick Jim, you know, they identified, you know, what we, you know, what I like, which is great, but also what they like. And they, they try to go find those players. I mean, obviously he's, uh, you know, he's been, he's been a bright spot with our team because he just adds

that juice. Even when our team's a little quiet, he's chirping on the bench. He's getting people that usually don't talk much on the bench talking. So it's contagious. And, yeah, and obviously, you know, I talked to him this summer three or four times, and he said, you know, he had some offensive game to him. And you can see that he hasn't. Does he have a certain drive that maybe he's got because it hasn't been easy for him? You know, undraftrafted a bunch of

different teams three waivers free agent he's got a chip on his shoulder you know he's got he's he's kind of like garce you know they got that every day prove everybody wrong um and i think if you have that chip on your shoulder you know know, that chip, it makes you not comfortable. He doesn't want to be comfortable. And I like that. Well, I like him a lot too, Rick. I just, I think that, and we've talked about this a lot, filling out those bottom six forward roles

with guys on affordable contracts. It's finding diamonds in the rough. Hey, Doug, how old do you think Kiefer Sherwood is? Sorry, I was cutting audio. How old do you think Kiefer Sherwood is? Sorry, I was cutting audio. How old do you think Kiefer Sherwood is? 26. He's 29. How many NHL teams do you think he's been on?

Five. Okay, well, now you're just getting exaggerated. What is it? This is his fourth NHL. I was close. This is his fourth NHL organization. One number away. Okay, but my point is that he is kind of playing like he's a 23-year-old

being given his first opportunity in the NHL, which is a great thing for the team that acquires him and gives him a shot. Yeah. Because it can go one of two ways. It can be like, okay, well, like, you know, I got it. He's really been on a lot of, like, one-year, two-way deals. Like, he's been up and down as recently as 2023 so last year he was still playing american league games he's a point per game player in the american league

right so offensive flair it can go one of two ways like a nice goal he scored the other day you know a nice pass from from brandstrom to just put it right into that slot where he can hammer it but he did hammer it and you know he got up the ice really quickly yeah and it's good to find guys that i mean at 29 that still have that hunger and the guys that still want to be chip on his shoulder chip like cars that's but that's not yeah i mean it's funny because garland's in a different stratosphere especially financially and his established nhl role but he still does play like a guy that has probably been passed over a number of times in his youth and professional career because of his size.

It's funny about perceptions that you get of these players though. Like I mentioned, his AHL numbers, he scored at half a goal per game clip. He was scoring one goal every other game in the AHL. That's a pretty bonafide scorer right there. It definitely sounds like the evolution for him was, I'm going to go somewhere this offseason where I'm going to be maybe

not just appreciated a little bit more, but given more opportunity than what he had in National. If he had re-signed in National, where are you going to play with all the wingers that they've got now? We got a text into the Dunbar-Lumber text line, and just a reminder, Dunbar-Lumber text line, 650-650. The Bridge Street, Dunbar-Lumber, and

Ladner has moved to Progress Way in Tilbury's Industrial Park. Everyone must know this by now. But if you don't, more room, more product, more awesome. Details at DunbarLumber.com. Questioning, which NHL team has been the biggest surprise so far this season? Well, I think both teams from a good and a bad perspective met last night when the Washington Capitals defeated the Nashville

Predators 3-2. The Caps are now 9-3-0 and might be legitimately good. Now, if you look at their shooting percentage in PDO, yes, it's high. They've got the highest five-on-five shooting percentage in the NHL, so maybe there's a bit of regression coming. But if you look at their expected goals in terms of a percentage, they're third in the NHL at five-on-five, so they are playing some good hockey. In fact, the top four teams, if you go to natural stat trick, Carolina, which is crazy, they're at like 64%.

LA, who the Canucks are going to face tonight, then it's Washington, then it's Vancouver, then it's Edmonton. So those numbers aren't everything, but they do paint a pretty good picture of what's happening at five on five in terms of expected goals. So it doesn't take into account shooting percentage or goaltending or special teams, but for the most part, the teams that are at the top

of this list are usually pretty good teams in the NHL. The Caps might be for real. It's not just, you know, I know people look at the Caps and they're real. Like, it's not just, you know, I know people look at the Caps and they're like, oh, it's the OV story. This Connor McMichael kid is pretty good. He's even a kid still. He's been around for a while, but he's a good

player. He's kid adjacent. Let's put it that way. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's a Connor, right? So he's- He's got to be young. I mean, you might have to bring him into the

Connor group with McDavid and Bedard and Garland has forced his him into the Connor group with McDavid and Bedard and Garland has forced his way into the Connor group. And now maybe there's a Connor McMichael. They're a really funny team because they've got a bunch of very sort of unheralded players. Alexei Protis, every time I watch one of their games, he's doing stuff. They're doing this with a goaltending tandem of Charlie Lindgren and Logan Thompson. I'll also add to what you were talking about, the hot start to the season. They have played a lot of games at home, and they've been virtually unbeatable at home.

That win against Nashville last night was their seventh straight win on home ice. So you look at them and you're saying, is there a regression coming? Maybe. But at the same time, you win nine of your first 12. You've taken advantage of a soft schedule to start the season, and you've taken advantage of this really high shooting percentage because you played a lot enough defensively to win the games. Also, Ovi scored again last night.

Yeah, up to eight goals, tied with Connor McMichael. Eight goals. Nashville lost again, and they are now 4-8-1. And I want to play some Barry Trotz audio. He's of course the GM there now and he's the guy that went out and made all these moves letting Kiefer Sherwood go so that he could sign Jonathan Marcheseau

and Stephen Stamkos and I guess he was on Nashville Radio and was it radio or was it podcast? 102.5 The Game The Game! The Game in Nashville Where we talk Preds. This is Barry Trotz. Almost the type.

Yeah. Where we talk Preds for three minutes a week. This is Barry Trotz talking about what he might do if things don't improve soon. We will be limited a little bit because some of the contracts that we do have, you know, if we don't get it going, then I'm going to start our rebuild plan a little bit. You know, what we did in the summer was, as I say, fantasy hockey until we become a good team.

If we do not become a good team, then, you know, we're going to see a lot more of our kids start, you know, starting their process. What do you think steven stab goes thinking he went to the breads jonathan marsh or so goes from vegas they're like 12 games into the season and their gm's like we might rebuild so there's a lot to unpack that's just throughout the word isn't it well he said he playing the is one thing. The call goes on that he said he's already been reaching out and making calls across the league.

Remember last year. Everyone remembers what happened last year, right? The Preds were just middling along, not playing very well, and then Trotz and the head coach, Andrew Burnett, in conjunction made the bold move to take away their trip to Vegas to go see U2 at the Sphere and it jolted this team it led them

to I think they went unbeaten in 16 they went 14-0-2 if I'm not mistaken get these guys some Taylor Swift tickets right no yes and then take them away take them away but you might be onto something Trotz is this is a dangerous game that he's playing because sometimes when those things happen,

it's not necessarily that you sort of came with the whip and gave them the lashings. It's that you caught lightning in a bottle. Everything clicked and everything happened, and one didn't necessarily cause the other. You can't keep going back to the well on this. Publicly announcing on November 6th that you might start your rebuild plan. Like you've got it in a glass box somewhere that says break in case of

emergency. It's a hollow threat because what are you going to do? You just signed Stamkos, Marcia. So, and Brady Shea for tens of millions of dollars. Yeah. You can't just scrap that.

They're like, no, we have our money, we have our contracts, and we all have various no-movement clauses. So if you're going to do a rebuild plan, what are you going to move, Ryan O'Reilly? You're listening to the best of Halford & Brough. You're listening to the best of Halford & Brough. Thomas Drance joins us now on the Halford & Brough show on Sportsnet 650.

What up, Drancer? Gentlemen. Not much. How are you? Good. I know you just texted me about a fantasy football trade. I'll have to address that after the show. I am a professional.

We are doing business here. No, you should do it on the air right now. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Can't do it now. Do it. No, can't do it now. But we've got no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,'s description and from chatting with Harmon that, you know, sort of like a limited practice where he was out there with his teammates, but ultimately mostly doing individual work off to the side with goalie coach Marco Terranes,

still a sign of progress and a welcome sign of progress. I mean, obviously we all know sort of since he got hurt in that March game against the Winnipeg Jets and worked to get back so that he could be part of the playoff run and only gets one game, doesn't make it through that game healthy. And then everything that sort of transpired since, the unprecedented nature of his injury and some of the uncertainty that's going to come attached to his return, right? The fact that most of the descriptions suggest that this is something he's going to have to play through,

that we've never seen a hockey player, much less an NHL goaltender, deal with this injury, reportedly a popliteus sprain, a cute one. And so there's a ton of question marks here, right? Like when we're talking about players returning from ACLs or, you know, hamstring pulls, severe hamstring pulls, stuff like that. We kind of have a sense of what like the performance impact looks like, right? I mean, I spent an entire year talking about how it'll take maybe 18 months for Ilya Mikheyev's speed to come back just last season. But at least we have sort of an understanding of what the timeline looks like, what sort of performance impact to expect from a player coming back from that injury.

We don't know when it comes to Thatcher Demko, right? Sometimes you'll have an understanding of what the re-injury risk looks like. That's especially true for soft tissue injuries, right? Like, oh, you know, if it's a hamstring, like, man, that's going to, you know, look like this. Or there's going to be an elevated re-injury risk for several weeks or something like that. We have no idea. And then when it comes to a goaltender, right? Like, what sort of workload impact will this have?

And again, we have no idea. Like how often, how long will it take Thatcher Demko to ramp up to be an everyday guy? And, you know, this one looms large from the Canucks perspective, in my view, because, you know, you can sort of manage a player's, a goaltender's workload scrupulously you can you can deploy them as a 1a as opposed to a workhorse starter um or a 1b frankly given how well kevin lankanen has played but once you get to the playoffs it's every other night like it's every other night and you hope that it's for two and a half months and like that's, that's sort of gotta be where you're working toward with Demko is getting him to that spot because that's the path.

Like that's the path for this team to contend credibly for a Stanley cup. It's that your Demko on his game playing every other night for two months in the playoffs, two and a half months in the playoffs. So, you know, there's still a lot of questions here, but to begin to return to facing shots, you know, shot by your teammates at practice or sorry, morning skate earlier this week in Anaheim and then at practice yesterday at crypto.com. I mean, that's excellent to see given, you know, how, how indefinite and how uncertain this process has, has been since training camp began.

But I note, you know, the uncertainty is sort of just beginning. There's still so much we don't know and so much we can't know, given how unprecedented and rare Demko's ailment is. So for the record, there are 15 goalies in the NHL that have played more than Kevin Lankanen has this season in terms of time on ice. But is there any concern that the Canucks are going to overplay Kevin Lankanen because they don't trust Seeloffs? You know what? Yes, I suppose there is, but I don't think we get to that point for a bit.

You know what I'm saying? There's a reason why we track a goalie's pace, like on pace for 60 starts or what have you, but we don't, it doesn't really become something that I'm concerned about typically to like mid-December. You know, this is,

first of all, the Canucks have had a pretty spaced out schedule all told, right? There, there haven't been, I mean, have they played a back-to-back set yet? No, they haven't yet. Yeah, and that's why Lankanen's time on ice is lower compared.

The Canucks haven't played as many games as most teams. Games as everyone else, right? So it's been spaced out. There hasn't been a lot of condensed games. We haven't seen him do something like, you know, a four and seven. You know, like we haven't seen that. So that's part of it. And then again, you know, I think the overuse conversation

typically starts around Christmas time anyway, you know, and at least that's how I view it, just because, you know, we talked about the playoffs being every other night. Like, you know, we're talking about Lankanen playing every other third night, basically, over the last 24 days. So it hasn't been that prolonged, and it hasn't actually been that, about Lankanen playing every other third night, basically, over the last 24 days. So it hasn't been that prolonged, and it hasn't actually been that dense in terms of his start volume. So, you know, I'm not there personally just yet in terms of the overusing Lankanen thing.

The other thing that sort of tends to crop up when we talk about this, especially when we're talking about a goaltender like Lankanen, who's a career 906 guy reeling off a 923 at the moment, right? And I'm talking, say, percentage there. We'll say stuff like, well, as teams get more views, as they become more accustomed to the goaltender they're facing, there tends to be some diminishing returns incurred by the simple nature of, Hey, you're now the guy every night facing shots, you know, shot by the most lethal finishers on the planet.

And there, it becomes harder and harder to maintain that safe percentage. Right. And we're not, it's not uncommon for us to see spencer martin reel off a 930 across 13 games get excited about it and then it turns out that he's spencer martin the next season right like that we that's happened just in the last few years in the city right so we've seen that and we sometimes incur these diminishing returns or sort of career backups or average 1b types start to incur these diminishing returns as their usage spikes. And with Lankanen, one thing I'll say is I feel like because his game is so well-rounded, to sort of steal some of Kevin Woodley's analysis, right?

Like he's not a guy who has a clear hole to his game, right? It's not like there's something obvious that you'd look to exploit like he's got a strong glove hand right he's he's good down low he's good through traffic right he's there's not something obvious that teams are just going to start spamming when they necessarily shoot him now teams may still find the answers because these are NHL shooters we're talking about. They are exceptional at launching pucks and probing all opponents for weakness. That's what they do at a professional level,

better than anyone on the planet. But I think ultimately the book on Lankanen, because he's got this well-rounded game, is the same book that you'll get on the greats, like the legitimate bona fide starters, where it's like, get traffic, take his eyes. You know what I mean? And so that to me is at least perhaps an indication

that he's probably not going to sustain a 920. If he does, and if he plays 50 games, I mean, he might get Pesna votes. But he does seem to have a game that might allow him to perform at a higher level as this sample expands, especially given sort of his age, the defensive play in front of him, the fact that this might have been just a goaltender who was ready to take his game to another level anyway, as opposed to this being an unsustainable run. There does feel like there's some substance here.

Although I'm always very cautious when, when sort of trying to grade or rate goaltending performance. So the Canucks did score a power play goal against Anaheim and it was a pretty nice one. It was a nice, nice shot by a good, hard, low shot. Might've been a pass to, to from Quinn Hughes and Brock Besser tipped at home. But they went one for five on the power play. Their first power play did not look good. And if you look at the underlying numbers of the Canucks power play in terms of expected goals per 60 at five on four, they are dead last in the nhl it basically means if they were if they were to play the entire game on the power play five on four they would be expected to score five and a half goals which is right no bueno um

what do you see as the is there a main problem with the canucks power play or is it multiple issues that are all coming up um yeah, I think it's set up. Honestly, I think the issue is they're not getting set up efficiently. That's it. That's it. I said it. I don't actually need to add anything else. They're not getting set up efficiently enough, consistently enough.

And the underlying number, Bruf, that would concern me more, because one thing about expected goals especially the public avail publicly available versions right is it rates perimeter shots as being like it's based on shot location as opposed to like pre-shot movement right so it'll it'll ding a team for perimeter shots but we know that on a on a power play where you've got exceptional perimeter shooters on it like besser like quinn hughes like uh jt mill jt miller like elias petterson right if if they're getting a shot with you know if there's two seam passes and it's a jt miller shot and yeah sure it's from 80 feet out um that's still a dangerous shot like we know that with the right amount of traffic and jt miller

coming downhill from 60 feet out that's still an exceptionally dangerous scoring opportunity but expected goals will ding you for it right so the number that actually concerns me is the attempts rate and if you go check the shot attempts rate on the power play the canucks are the only team under 80 um in the league and by shot attempt rate it or by shot rate, it's under 40. And to me, the shot attempts is the one that I'd prioritize, especially because the sample's small. 80 shots per hour,

five on four, is nothing. Like, is nothing. You're not getting two shot attempts per power play opportunity. Like, that is a wildly low number and speaks to just the difficulty that this team is having frankly just getting set up doing the doing the getting to a place in the offensive zone where you're able to pass the puck around and and even apply pressure even have those power plays where you don't score but you build momentum

for your team by threatening consistently like those, those haven't even been there. Now, all of that said, one thing I would note is I do think the power plays looked a little cleaner overall on this California road trip. The Sharks game, for example, they didn't score, but at least they were more direct. At least it seemed to me the last couple games, like there's fewer of those sequences in the offensive zone where the puck goes to the

flank and one player skates with it for a couple seconds you're seeing more intentional fast puck movement side to side from the Canucks a power play one I think and so if that continues I mean there's no reason why this group's been like 22 percent like clockwork for four or five years here and and there's no reason for them to be struggling to this extent um in fact you know their actual power play percentage overrates what they've done because they're actually shooting something like 15 on the power play right like they've actually been fortunate to have a power play that's only just below average in terms of conversion rate in the early going as opposed to quite bad. So, yeah, I mean, definitely an area for concern,

and yet we know with the talent available to this team and their track record that they'll probably figure it out. And I do think we've seen some signs of it being better in terms of how it's looked and in terms, frankly, of the attempts generated over the last couple games. We're speaking to thomas drance from the athletic vancouver and canucks talk here on the halford and breath show on sports net 650

uh drance a moment to speak about keifer sherwood we've been singing his praises the last two days on the show and uh talking about among other things this offensive upside that he seems to have now i don't know if this is just a heater in a small sample size or whether the opportunity that he's got in Vancouver and the sort of development of his game means he could be more of an offensive producer. But let's go back to when they first signed him. Did you know enough of the profile of the player to expect this kind of offensive pop,

or is this just a huge surprise? Well, if you go back to an article I wrote, I think it was like 10 thoughts on the Canucks free agency class on July 2nd, ran it at the Athletic. I noted that there was interest in the organization and maybe seeing what sort of impact he could have offensively in a top nine at least, but maybe even a top six role. And I still won't be surprised if we see that eventually.

And by the way, part of the reasoning or the thinking internally at the time was if we could get a guy who's willing to do some of that identity dirty work does that help you know uh protect our or insulate a star player like alias petterson right like can he be in part a protector for for a skilled player like that um an old school thought but you know i think when you see sherwood get under like trevor ziegras's skin right when you think about sort of the way that he can play that pest game too uh you can understand why it would make sense um sherwood's a guy where you look at his profile i mean he had like a 90 point season in the american league uh not too long ago now he was older when he did it he was like 23 24 it wasn't you know uh

like if jonathan lekarimacki is a point per game guy in the american league that means more in terms of what your offensive upside is given that he's 20 but nonetheless i mean american league scoring can be uh for unproven players a bit of a sign you think about guys like you know i'm going very high end here so please excuse a sign you think about guys like you know i'm going very high end here so please excuse me but you think about guys like jonathan marcheseau and carter verhagey before they were jonathan marcheseau and carter verhagey they were unproven nhlers who just filled the net at a preposterous rate at the american league and it got ignored for years and years you know in marcheseau's case because of his size and in Berhage's case because of his wonky skating stride, right?

And it's just like, there's sometimes signal there if you're a dominant American League performer, and Sherwood is. Like, Sherwood has been preposterous at the American League level as an offensive piece in previous seasons. Now, he also has that game where in nashville he was able to play honestly i mean that mccarron line they used them as a checking line like they were a hard match line for jt miller they played a lot against vancouver's top five-man unit and you know in that role even sherwood was a 10 goal scorer last season so

you know there's evidence of offensive pop. Now, you're never sure, can a guy maintain that if his minutes tick up, as Sherwood's have here. But so far, so good. I don't think this is a mirage at all. I think this guy's a really talented finisher. I think he's got clear offensive instincts, especially when it comes to attacking off the rush,

which is something the Canucks obviously need and have done well in the early going this season. I mean, I do think that there's an ability to pot 15 or 20, especially if he's in the top nine role. And could there be more if he plays with even more skilled players? Because he's doing this with Bluger and Heinen who are good, you know, like, don't get me wrong. But if at some point an opportunity opens up for him to play even higher up the lineup, can he do even more?

I mean, I think that's a worthwhile question to ponder, honestly. Like, I think there's offensive chops to do, not special stuff, but certainly, like, score at a rate consistent with a second line forward. I wouldn't put that past, or I wouldn't declare that to be impossible or outside the realm of possibility for a player with Sherwood's production profile and skill set. How much attention are you paying to what Jonathan Leckermack is doing in Abbotsford right now? A lot. The shot rate. The shot rate is preposterous. I mean, he's averaging like 34 shots in six games.

Like, that's five shots a game you shoot like that if you're generating looks at that volume that's very exciting especially given that he's a draft plus three player i mean that's ridiculous if he's able to maintain it now i know a lot of it's coming on the power play from what i understand um you know he's still being outscored five on five maybe some defensive growth is going to be needed before you know and here's the other thing right it's not enough to be a ridiculous scoring forward if you're going to play for rick tockett as a winger i mean we've seen with daniel sprung through the first 12 games we've seen with nils hoaglander throughout uh hoaglander's working relationship with tockett we obviously saw with and Kuzmenko, like you can be as skilled as you want.

There's another side of the game that you have to be able to bring if you're going to get regular top of the lineup sort of minutes or deployment from Rick Talkit. And so I think there's probably going to be some growth there. And that's in evidence even early on in the season. But if you're generating looks at that volume, if you're a point per game guy at the age 20 in the american league i mean that's a very very good sign like he's torching that level frankly give especially adjusted for his age and that's really exciting should be really exciting for the canucks plus i guess i'd add this you know right-handed shooter

who's crushing it on the power play not exactly something that it sounds like the Canucks couldn't use at the moment. Right. I mean, just, just in and of itself. So I will be very interesting to see how he maintains it. That shot rate to me though, is the, you know, the indicator, the canary in the coal mine, but in a good way, where if that keeps up, if we're talking about a guy who at the age of 20 has arrived in the American league and is generating four or five shots a game right off the bat, that's an offensive profile that you'd expect to scale up

and potentially be really exciting for this team and maybe in the not-too-distant future. Drancer, if Quinn Hughes keeps up his level of play all season for the Canucks, will you get on board with Halford and I pushing not only Quinn Hughes for the Norris, but Quinn Hughes for the Hart? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, when was the last time a defenseman

won the Hart? Was it prior? 2000. Yeah, prior. Long time. So it's been 24 years. But for the most part, that's right. For the most part, that's as it should be

because forwards make a greater impact typically when it comes to driving play and carrying teams right like for the most part that's how it should be but Quinn Hughes makes the impact of an elite centerman like Quinn Hughes makes the sort of impact that you'd expect from an elite forward and that's what people don't understand right like that's what I think not not you guys but like i think that's what the general hockey commentary it doesn't understand they're judging quinn hughes relative to other defensemen in the league and there's other defensemen that are going to score more there's other defensemen that are bigger and when you watch them play in zone maybe they look a little

sharper in terms of the defensive side the thing is is that when you watch them they don't dominate games as if they're one of the best skaters and most impactful skaters and and most impactful drivers in the league the way Quinn Hughes does Quinn Hughes is one of one there's only one defenseman on the planet who's influencing games like this and he plays for Vancouver and he wears the C on his chest um period period and so I actually think you're right like the heart is where this should go because what we're seeing out of Quinn Hughes is special. It's unlike anything we're seeing from any other defenseman in the league. If you're paying attention to the league nightly. And he is without question Vancouver's most valuable player.

I mean, without question. And certainly, you know, I think in a tier with your McDavid class, your Kucherov class, in terms of the most impactful skaters in the league, period, but also to begin this season. So, you know, at some point, too, the splits are going to be so preposterous if they continue and are maintained that it's going to be a – he's going to have a really strong argument. I mean, the Canucks have outscored their opponents.

I think it's – so this is off the top of my head, so forgive me, but I think it's 13-4 with Quinn Hughes on the ice, and they've outscored their opponents in total 27-21, meaning without Quinn Hughes it's 14 to whatever it is, 14-17. So the good news is, but the bad news is. Well, no, yeah, exactly. I mean, but here's the thing, right? Like if you're

if you're playing without quinn hughes right this team's results are like consistent with columbus right with quinn hughes this is one of the best teams in hockey i mean that's well what's what's more like what's a more straightforward argument to make for MVP? Sorry? Sorry, me? I said, what's a more straightforward argument to make for MVP? Did you lose me? Yes, I did.

Okay. Yeah. You tell me what you're getting at there. Oh, excuse me. I'm just saying, if your team plays like Columbus without Quinn Hughes, and they're one of the best teams in the league with Quinn Hughes, I mean, what's a more straightforward argument to make for MVP? I have no idea.

I have completely lost you right now. Okay, fair enough. I'm just saying his impact's really big. Quinn Hughes rocks. Sorry about that. Quinn Hughes good. Quinn Hughes good. Quinn Hughes rocks. All right. Sorry about that. Quinn Hughes good. Quinn Hughes good. Quinn Hughes good.

Quinn Hughes good. Halford and Brough show, everyone. The finest analysis you're going to get on the radio. Drancer, thanks for doing this today, bud. Enjoy the game tonight. I'll get back to you in an hour about the trade. I've got to get a hold of Shep first. Yeah, you guys are welcome, and I'm sorry. Cheers.

See you, buddy. Thomas Drance from the Athletic Vancouver and Canucks talk here on the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet. Was that my fault? I think it was a combination of faults. I just heard what's the biggest or whatever he asked. You're like, hello. You're 20 minutes into a Drance set.

We're not going to blame you if he's owned out a little bit. Hello. We're not going to blame you. Jason here. Okay. He's just saying that Hughes is good. You know what? Okay, I want to do something actually

um someone's texting in and i think they're trying to be a little like smart and cheeky and maybe a little sarcastic but the individual is actually asking what is an expected goal because we talk about it a lot statistically right that's expected it's a mathematical equation okay i you know what i think from time to time it's not the worst thing to maybe explain some of these some of the jargon that we throw around right so to be fair like the guy said it was an expected goal just a shot on goal well no expected goal is just a shot on goal. Well, no. Expected goal is just a measure of the likelihood of a goal going in on a scale of zero to one, right?

So zero is it has virtually no chance, it's impossible to score, as to one which a player would be expected to score every single time, right? That takes into account a variety of different things like the distance that you're away from the goal right the angle to the goal the goalkeeper's positioning the type of shot pattern of play all this stuff comes in and what these models do it compares it to historical data based on situations that are similar yeah and it comes up with an equation of

how often that machine yeah go in the net. Yeah. Like a million instances in machine learning pumps out this number. So the idea would be that essentially not all shots on goal, dear listener, are created equal. Some of them have a higher probability of going in and some of them have a lower probability of going in. So when we talk about expected goals in a game,

you could pepper Kevin Lankanen with 35 shots tonight, LA Kings. But if they're all muffins from the blue line, the 35 shots don't count as, let's say, 35 shots where you're going cross ice, one-timer, open net, and Lankan is making an unbelievable save on it. Those are more expected to go in. Does that work for everyone? I'm still lost, man. I think I need some sleep. I had a beer league game last night and I slept like three hours. Inbox is not being friendly.

You weren't expecting a question at the time. Yeah, I was like, wrap it up, Drantz. It wasn't even a question. One texter's like, Ruff has glitched. Have you tried plugging him out and plugging him back in again? Yeah. We have to call Rogers Gable to get him fixed. It's like the Homer zooming brain.

Do, do, do, do, do, do. You're listening to the best of Halford and Brough.