Halford & Brough in the Morning - The Best Of Halford And Brough 3/10/25

Episode Date: March 10, 2025

Mike & Jason discuss a busy weekend in sports, they chat Friday's Canucks win over the Wild plus yesterday's loss to the Stars, they talk about what was a disappointing Trade Deadline for the 'Nucks, plus they speak with NHL.com & In Goal Magazine's Kevin Woodley. This podcast is produced by Andy Cole and Greg Balloch. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

You're listening to the best of Halford and Brough. Da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da Long shot blocked away by Lankin, they rebound, they score! Mikhail Granlund left circle. Just your analysis on where you think this one got away from you. It didn't get away from us, it's a 2-1 hockey game, we had a power play, we had some upper twos, hit the crossbar but just didn't have enough. You know, you need some goals, you can't, you know, we gotta score some goals, right? Sounds like somebody's got a case of the Mondays. Good morning, Vancouver. Six o'clock on a Monday.

Happy Monday, everybody. It is Alfred and his brother at Sportsnet 650. We are coming to you live from the Kintex Studios, a beautiful fair view of slopes in Vancouver. Jason, good morning. Good morning. Adog, good morning to you. Good morning.

Ladi, good morning to you as well. Hello, hello. Alfred and brother for the morning. What is that? I've got a cold my friend. I'm doing my best. I was out coaching minor hockey with a cold over the weekend and I lost my voice. What were you doing?

Not that. Good morning. Good morning. Good start. Good start. Good start. Alfred in Breath of the Morning is brought to you by a friend. I'm sorry, just caught me off guard.

You did to me too. I'm fine. Alfred Brev of the Morning is brought to you by Vancouver. I'm sorry, just caught me off guard. You did to me too. I'm fine. Halferd and Brev of the Morning. I am fine. He is fine. Halferd and Brev of the Morning is brought to you by Vancouver Honda, Vancouver's premier destination

for Honda customers. They have a friendly, knowledgeable staff that can help with anything you're looking for. Sales, financing, service, or parts. We are in hour one of the program. Hour one is brought to you by North Star Metal Recycling. Vancouver's premier metal recycler pays the highest prices on scrap metal. North Star Metal Recycling, they

recycle, you get paid. Visit them at 1170 Powell Street in Vancouver. Alright, here we go. We are coming to you live from the Kintec Studio, Kintec Footwear and Orthotics working together with you in step. We got a lot to get into on a Monday show. We got four guests today. Guest list begins at six thirty. OK, so here's the thing. There's a lot of drama in Canuckville right now. I think we can all firmly establish that after everything that did or didn't happen at the trade deadline on Friday going into the weekend. I thought maybe maybe it would be

therapeutic, cathartic if you will, if we dove into some of the other drama filled situations around North America and their sporting squadrons. So at 6.30, we're gonna go to Boston to talk to Joe Hagerty from the Boston Sports Journal about the Boston Bruins. In the aftermath of the Bruins massive sell off at the deadline, Carlo gone, Coyle gone, Brad Marchand, the last remaining member of the 2011 Stanley Cup team also gone.

Folks in Boston are pissed. They are none too pleased about the way Marchand was treated on the way out. The little return he got from Florida. We will talk to Joe Haggerty about all that at 6.30. Seven o'clock, Brady Henderson, our Seahawks insider from ESPN is gonna join the program. Now, if you thought, wait a minute, Halford and Brough, you just spoke to Brady Henderson on Thursday. One, you're right. Two, much has happened since then.

Since we last spoke to Brady, DK Metcalf was traded, Gino Smith was traded, and Aaron Rodgers might be the new Seahawks quarterback? No. What? No. What? No, thank you.

Well, we're gonna talk to Brady about all of that at seven o'clock this morning. Really? Big time drama out of Seattle this week. Think that could actually happen? Dead serious, not making it up. Was reported yesterday. It was a busy weekend.

Could you imagine? I kinda can now. I don't want Did you imagine? I kind of can now. I don't want to, but I'm kind of imagining it. We're going to talk to Brady Henderson about all that at seven o'clock this morning. 7.30, we're going to go to Toronto. Sam McKee is going to join us from Real Kipper and Bourne and Leafs Talk.

One of the most profound trades at this year's NHL trade deadline might've been a trade that didn't even come to fruition. We're going to get into the aftermath of the Leafs asking Mitch Marner to wave his no trade clause to go to Carolina for Miko Rantan. Marner declining to do so. And then the fallout for both Marner and the Leafs organization. Very dramatic times in a season that hasn't really had too many

exciting moments for the Leafs. Things got real spicy over the weekend. We'll talk to Sam McKee at 7.30 about that. Eight o'clock Kevin Woodley is going to join us. We will break down the Canucks results over the weekend. 3-1 win over Minnesota on Friday, followed by a 4-1 loss to Dallas last night. We'll also hopefully get some sort of update on Thatcher Demko, who still remains away from the team. It's now going on a month since he got hurt against Toronto in early February. Finally, we have not one, but two giveaways today. Halford and Brough showing how much they love the automotive

industry, Jason, because we're giving away first a four pack of tickets to the Monster Jam at Pacific Coliseum on Friday, March 21st. It's a four pack of tickets. We're giving it away. You get to see all your favorite trucks, Grave Digger, El Toro Loco, both of which are trademarks. So you can't buy your own truck and name them that. Truckasaurus. Sparkle Smash. Don't know much about that truck, but it's coming to Vancouver apparently.

So that's gonna be- Sparkle Smash? Sparkle Smash. Don't know anything about it, but it's- Truckasaurus. Again, don't think that's a real truck. I think that's from The Simpsons. March 21st is the date of the show. We're giving away a four packet tickets

to caller number seven at eight o'clock this morning. The number here is 604-280-0650. That number again, 604-280-0650. Sparkle Smash is a unicorn. I did not know that. It's a unicorn monster truck. Is that like Mr. Sparkle? No, it's a unicorn.

It's got the horn and everything. Sparkle was a guy. So monster truck giveaway at eight a.m. this morning. Be caller number 76042800650. At 8.15, we're giving away a four-pack of tickets to the Vancouver International Auto Show. That's going to be at the Vancouver Convention Center March 19th to 23rd.

More than 200 vehicles from over 30 manufacturers. If you wanna go, be caller again number 7 at 815 this morning. 604-280-0650, that number again 604-280-0650. Obviously with my rundown going as long as it has, we have a lot to get into on the show. So without further ado, laddie, let's tell everybody what happened. Hey, did you guys see the game last night? No. What happened? I missed all the action because I was... We know how busy your life can be. What happened?

Missed it? You missed that? What happened? What Happened is brought to you by the BC Construction Safety Alliance. Making safety simpler by giving construction companies the best in tools, resources, and safety training. Visit them online at bccsa.ca. Over the weekend we will start, although I don't know how much time we're going to spend on the actual games, but on Friday as mentioned, Kiefer Sherwood scored late in the third period,

Kevin Lanken in 37 saves, the Canucks beat the Wild 3-1 at Rogers Arena. That was good! On Sunday, as mentioned in the intro, Mikhail Granlin scored his first goal for the Dallas stars and the Dallas stars beat the Vancouver Canucks 4-1. That game was also at Rogers Arena. That was not so good. As a matter of fact, that one was bad. Yeah, as you mentioned, I'm not sure how much

we're going to discuss these games today because there's nothing really new to report about the Vancouver Canucks, especially after the trade deadline where they didn't do much of anything. This team still has a lot of trouble scoring and I'm not sure how that's going to change this season.

If they get Quinn Hughes back soon, that will obviously help. But the forward group is still the same forward group. And yeah, it was nice to see Pedersen rip home that one timer against the wild. And I guess he did hit the crossbar early against Dallas.

We keep hoping he'll break out and every little thing or big thing. I mean, that power play goal was nice. We hope that'll lead to more, but he hasn't broken out yet and the rest of the forward group isn't exactly making up for it. Last night against the stars, Derek Forbort was the only guy to beat Casey de

Smith because Derek Forebort got his feet moving and found the area. Noted sniper, Derek Forebort. Connor Garland gave him a nice pass, was a nice give and go between Derek Forebort and Connor Garland. Maybe that's a duo that could work for the Canucks. The Canucks, look, last night they did make a push in the third. They were down a goal playing at home and the

Stars were playing their second of a back to back. So they'd better have made a push. Dakota Joshua had some chances as Tauke had reunited the third line, which was nice to see. But Joshua also had a brutal turnover that led to the Stars third goal. So if you look at the guys that didn't get it done last night, Pedersen certainly wasn't alone.

None of the forwards scored. Besser wasn't good. DeBrusk wasn't good. Heedle, you know, Heedle had looked good early on in his tenure with the Canucks. I think he had a lot of adrenaline going through him, haven't noticed as much since. Um, their most effective sender last night was

Teddy Bluger, which is good for Bluger, but bad for the team. Did the Canucks play badly? No, not, not really, you know, they worked hard, but it's the same story we've seen for over a year now. They don't create many chances. There's not a lot of creativity in the lineup. They don't give up many chances either, which is why so many of their games seem like a coin flip.

They come down to the details and you hear things like, well, they got a, it's not much margin for error out there with the way the Vancouver Canucks play. Yeah, cause they can't score. And I know a lot of people are taking shots at the coach, Rick Tauket and Rick Tauket seems like a guy that is banging his head against the wall. It's like, what else? I'm out of answers.

And that's not a good place for a coach to be when you're kind of out of answers and you keep saying the same things over and over and over again, and people are saying, figure it out. And he's like, well, I can't because these guys aren't playing very well for me. Tauke was visibly frustrated last night in the game against Dallas.

So this is probably my biggest takeaway wasn't necessarily what happened during the game, but in the aftermath. So in the aftermath, and we will play the audio from Rick Tauket here. Jake DeBrasque, who leads the team in goals with 22, played a grand total of 12 minutes and 45 seconds and had a grand total of two shots. Brock Besser, who's been struggling real bad, and we'll get into a lot more with Brock Besser as it pertains to the trade deadline in a couple of minutes here. He had 1549 of ice and had one shot on net. And then there was

Elias Pettersson who in just 16 minutes of ice time, 16.05 if you want to be exact, had no shots on goal. So. I mean he did, he had the crossbar. Okay. So one, one shot on goal even though technically that doesn't count. Um, so you're talking about maybe your three best offensive forwards, none of them getting over 16 minutes and six seconds and combining for three, maybe four shots on goal, depending on what you think of the crossbar. And also out there for a few defensive

breakdowns as well. So Rick Tauke was asked about this in the aftermath and it was a short clip. So we're going to play the question as well, because I think you maybe need to hear Tauke and answer it as opposed to just the answer part. Question and answer is important here. Here's Rick Tocket talking about the low minutes for

Debrusk and Pedersen and Besser following a 4-1 loss to Dallas on Sunday night. In a game where you were trailing for a good portion of it, Debrusk was leading goal scorer, plays under 13 minutes, Pedersen 16 minutes,, plays under 13 minutes. Pedersen, 16 minutes. Besser, under 16 minutes. Do you think that, was that a reflection of how they were playing? You gotta earn your ice time.

Gotta earn it? Yeah, you gotta earn your ice time around here. That's how you win. So you guys can stir it up all you want. You have to earn your ice time. I don't care how long you've been here, you gotta earn your ice time. That's the way it works.

That's how you win Stanley Cups. So He was punctuating it. Did you hear that? You gotta earn your ice time He was super fired up behind the bench last like that's the most animated I think I've ever seen him behind a Canucks bench. Yeah, well right desperate man Yeah, he was and thank you for all the text about my voice. Yes. I am sick. What? Yeah. No, I am never would have known So yesterday we also had I thought he was just trying a new thing We had a barnburn over of a u9 hockey game There was many goals scored and it was a good win for the boys at the end and during the game

I was like you are ruining your voice right now by the with all the yelling and yes I did at any rate, but it was worth it. But it was worth it. For the kids. Yes. For the kids. If you've got any questions or comments about the Canucks or my voice, text into the Dunbar Lumber Text Line 650, 650 Metro

Vancouver's Trusted Choice for Contractors and Rental Warriors for over 50 years. Visit them at one of their three locations to serve you or online at dunbarlumber.com. So I just want to park the games for a bit. I think that's appropriate. Okay. We can get back to it later, but the story of the

weekend for the Canucks was that they didn't do anything at the trade deadline. And when we last left you, we were talking about, you know, there's, if there's one thing we want to see from this management group, it's them adding some creativity to the offense and then they didn't add anything to the offense. Like the sum total of what they did to the trade

deadline was trade away Carson Sousi for a third round pick and they tried to do a bunch of stuff. Um, I, the fact that they didn't make any moves was not for lack of trying. They weren't sitting there going, well, I'm pretty happy with this group right now. They dusted their hands and are like, let's sit back and wait for the weekend. We got two games. And I've got a theory on what happened. It's not a

unique theory by any means. And I'm sure a lot of you have probably come up with the same thing, but I think we are all trying to understand what happened on Friday. How could the Canucks make no moves? How could they keep all three of their pending UFAs? Well, I think it starts with the notion that the Canucks still view making the playoffs as important. I'm not saying they don't have any of the big picture in mind, but I think making the playoffs

is important to them. They don't want to take a step back from last season. They don't want to wave the white flag with where they are in the standings, which is one point out of a playoff spot today. I think they were more than willing to move better, but there needed to be a second part to that. They needed to replace a second part to that.

They needed to replace him with someone, probably a younger player where they had some term on the deal, whether it was Josh Norris or Dylan Cousins, or maybe a guy like Alex Tuck, but they needed to do it before the deadline. They weren't willing to lose Besser from the lineup and replace him with a prospect or draft picks. You know, we saw over the weekend how much trouble they've had scoring goals and it's been basically

a year now, maybe over a year where they've had trouble scoring goals. If they had traded Besser for draft picks and not replaced them with anyone, scoring goals gets that much more difficult. Yeah. I, I, your theory is probably pretty sound without knowing the exact inner workings behind

the scenes. It definitely sounds as though one thing needed to happen for the other thing to happen. In this case, you're right. Like if, if they were going to move forward without Besser and nothing coming back, I mean, I'd shudder to think what the offense would look like and it doesn't look great right now. And Besser's in one right now and not in a good one. He's in a bad one. He is struggling mightily right now. I have no idea what his

head must, where his head is at or what might be floating through his head right now. Because it's probably been a whirlwind last 72 hours. And I think on the subject of Besser, it's probably a good time to replay probably the most divisive, controversial audio from the weekend, and that was Patrick Alveen addressing the Brock Besser situation after Friday's deadline. The Connex General manager made it pretty clear

that they were entertaining the idea of moving Brock Besser. And then whether it was intentional or not, many people saw a borderline sewering of Brock Besser with the remarks that Patrick Alveen made about the offers they were getting for Besser. We're going to clip together two different bits of audio here into one just to give it a little bit more symmetry. Here's Patrick Alveen from Friday's Presser talking about the offers they were getting for Brock Besser and how not great those offers were. Yeah good question I think that's a question you might want to ask the other teams. I think it comes definitely leading up to today, my conversation with other teams made me aware that there might be a situation as we are here today that we didn't do any moves.

And I made some players, agents, aware of that. That this seems to be a market for some of the players. And you can also see that some of the players that were dealt they had certain playoff experience and some of the players had performed well in bigger games and I think that's what some of the teams are looking for. If I told you where I was offered for Brock Besser I think I would have to run out of here because you would not believe me. I'm going to let that one hang in the air there for a minute, because a lot of people

did not care for that remark. I didn't initially take that as Alvin criticizing Besser and I'm still not sure. I'm with you on that. I saw it as Alvin supporting his position that the offers weren't good enough and he'd prefer to keep the player. But.

But a lot of people thought it was unnecessary to put it that way or maybe even a way to scare Besser into signing with the Canucks as opposed to testing the market on July 1st going like, Hey, there wasn't a lot of interest for you at the trade deadline. And we told everyone about that. Do you really want to go to free agency?

To me, that felt and sounded like a guy that kind of stepped in it. Like maybe it was in the moment and maybe he was trying to talk off the cuff. And he said something that I would guess probably regrets because it does come off as Flipping at best and you know kind of undercutting a lot of different people Besser the agent the pot, you know the

Negotiations that you think would be moving forward. It feels like it hamstrings that to a certain degree and now you've got a guy Who you know, I mean take a step back and consider the situation. You're kind of reliant on Vessar as a top six forward and one of your best goal scorers to try and score goals for a team whose objective is clearly still to try and make the playoffs. You need him to not just snap out of this funk,

but also get back to some semblance of the guy that we saw last year. And you would not blame the player, or I wouldn't anyway right now, if he had his mind elsewhere, one foot out the door, thinking about what's next for his career. I mean, I'll say this. I don't think Besser has been treated like gold over the last little bit. I think that he would, I don't know if he was willing to entertain a trade. I don't know if he was maybe prepared to move. I don't know if he wanted to move, but that is a very, very delicate situation that I don't think was

handled great. And as we've seen in other markets, because we're going to talk in Boston and we're going to talk in Toronto about deals that went through and deals that didn't go through for core guys that went through and deals that didn't go through for core guys, important guys, and guys that mean a lot to their teams, there's a ripple effect, right? There's an aftermath to all of this.

And I don't know if one precedes the other, but I did think it was pretty telling that on Sunday, like that was the most visibly frustrated we've seen Rick talk at, I think, all year. All year, he was pissed off behind the bench at the officials, which he never does, was super demonstrative in yelling at them, which he's very loathe to do. And then after the game, he was pretty terse. In his remarks, I just, you get the sense that he's a guy that's frustrated because... Do you think he's lost the room? I don't know if

he's lost the room, but I think maybe he's looked... Do you think he's lost his star forwards? I don't know if he's lost the room, but I think maybe he's looked. Do you think he's lost his star forwards? I think maybe he thought that some semblance of a Calvary was coming on Friday, that they were going to make some moves and they were going to be busy. And then after Friday's deadline passed, he was left with pretty much the same lineup that he had prior to the deadline, except Carson Sousi wasn't there. Now Carson Sousi is scoring goals for the New York Rangers. Losing the room is a tricky one.

Um, I mean- If I was, if I was Rick Tocket, I'd be looking at this group and going, you better make big changes to it. Or I, I like, I don't know what else to do with this group. Don't you think, don't you think Tocket for all his, like I, I, I realized that there are some people

that want the system to change, but me personally, my opinion is, is that's not the issue. Like there is, there is a decided lack of creativity in the top six right now. And there's a decided lack of jam, of juice or whatever reason, whatever thing you want it. And I don't put that on the coach. I see it as a personnel decision. I see the personnel problem more than a coaching problem too. But you're either part of the solution or you're part of the problem. Right? If you're out of

answers and it feels like he does, he is, he's like, I can't keep saying the same things. I mean, it's coming down to basically like, try harder. You know, have, no, no, seriously, like try harder. Go pick up loose box, have some desperation. He said more hungrier, which is not great grammar because he was rattled. He said it twice.

We need to be more hungrier. Just hungrier, Rick. Just hungrier. Just hungrier. And, you, Rick. Just hungrier. Just hungrier. And, you know, get to those loose bucks, but that's not systems. Like that's just him looking at his players and going like, you guys aren't giving me enough

here and maybe they don't, I don't know, maybe they don't want to give enough or maybe they don't have enough in them. All I know is like, but after the trade down, I was like, Oh my God, we're going to, we're going to do this for another 20 games with this team. I mean, I've said on a few occasions here that you're hired as a head coach to solve problems

and come up with solutions, not point out the problem. There's a big difference there. I just want to, like, if you don't understand what I'm saying, going up after another loss and pointing out what the guys aren't doing is fine, but you're also the guy in charge of either getting them to do it or finding a different way to go about it.

I mean, at this point, like if you're not, if the guys aren't able to execute your plan and your strategy the way that you want, then maybe it is time to change the plan or the strategy or do something different because running it back with the same thing of like, as you said, they need to be more hungrier and they need to try or harder. Yeah. Move your feet and that sort of stuff. This type of stuff you, you know, I was yelling and it's right.

And it's my voice at U9 players. You gotta move your feet, guys. But it is, and it's right, and it's accurate, that if you do the things that he's saying exactly 100% to a tee, the results theoretically should be there, that's great. But it's not converting to what they need right now, which is finding more goals

at the most crucial time of the year. It's not the time to fall back on, well, the system is in place and the process is good. Trust the process. It's gotta be something more than that. And that's where you're getting the frustration point. Because I'm sure talking doesn't wanna go up there and continually say, you know,

we need to protect the guts of the ice. We need to be more creative. We can't just rely on point shots. The same talking points that we've heard through 60 plus games this year and the frustration levels high. I guarantee you from the top down in this organization, there's a high level of frustration, right? Try and pick someone that's not frustrated right now.

Think about it. Well, how about in the, in the, in the business department, trying to sell sponsorships and season tickets in a tough economy for a team that can't score. Right. Like last night was a hard fought hockey game and Dallas is a good team, but there wasn't a whole lot to cheer for.

Now someone astutely pointed. Derek Forborth, that was a nice goal. Someone astutely pointed out, just look at the Dallas roster. I did make note yesterday that despite the fact that they didn't have Heiskenen hints, obviously Tyler Sagan's out of the lineup, still a very talented team, still with a lot of really good hockey

players that can generate offense. So that's where I go back to the personnel argument. The top six right now is not good. Yeah. And there's no drivers. And when you are, again, if you go, if you were to step outside and you were saying you're leading goal scorer in Debrusk, your 40 goal scorer from

last year in Besser and your $11.6 million a year centre in Pedersen can't give you more than 16 minutes of ice time and collectively go pointless and put like four shots on that. Is that a system thing or is that your guys just woefully underperforming? minutes of ice time and collectively go pointless and put like four shots on that. Is that a system thing or is that your guys just woefully underperforming? I get so frustrated with the people that just continually make excuses for the Canucks players.

It's just like, man, is that how you live your life? Just zero accountability for the players and they just put it all on someone else, someone else, something else. How about just, you know, like, and I think that's probably where Tauke it is right now. Just banging his head against the wall. He's like, can coach any system we want right

now, if you're giving me that sort of effort, if you're giving me that sort of commitment and the buy in, it's not going to work. You're listening to the best of Halford and Brough. You're listening to the best of Halford and Brough. Everyone's always looking for someone to like

help Pedersen. You know, it's like, you gotta get him a new coach. You gotta get him a new, you gotta get him new line mates and all that sort of thing. That, that, that'll help them. You know, like it's gotta come from Pedersen. Well, he's gotta get, he's gotta get stronger. He's gotta get, if, if his knee is, if his knee is still an issue, like get that fixed, get it figured out over

the off season. Like that's where it's going to come from. It's not going to come from externally. It's going to come from internally. And that's what the Canucks have to decide on this guy, if he's got it within him to turn it around. Because the only guy that's going to turn it around is him.

He might, but I'm going to remain steadfast on this one. That the only way this thing gets rectified is via trade. I mean even if he can rediscover his game and get back on track I'm almost a hundred percent certain that it's gonna be in another market. I think that there's probably even Bruce Boudreaux said that the other day. Yeah. No I didn't I'm not stealing from Bruce. No no but I just want to make that abundantly clear. Well, yeah, Bruce said, you know, I can't remember where he was doing the interview, but I read it and he said like,

when this whole JT Miller, Lee's, Pedersen thing came out, he said, I think they should trade them both, which is actually what we said on our show, or I said, I don't know if you agreed with that, but I was like, I think you gotta trade them both, and I still feel that way. I feel like there's- I think this team needs a complete change of direction.

Yeah, I feel like there's a lot of residuals from not just the Miller situation, but everything that's happened over the last while. And I do wonder, and as I say wonder, I mean, I'm more and more going to the side of convinced and wondering that this is going to be rectified by moving the player. With the inherent risks of him completely rediscovering his form and being a 100 point guy

and being a bona fide one seat, all of it. Like I'm cognizant of how big a risk it is. And it's very likely that he might rediscover his game. I'm just not sure it happens here. And I think that this management group in particular, given their penchant for cleaning up their own mistakes, and also showing an incredible amount of patience with this situation so far and trying to placate Pedersen,

at some point has to say like, okay, it's not gonna work here, here. It might work elsewhere, but it's not going to work here. I don't need to go through the laundry list every time of every single thing that Alvin and Rutherford have done to try and fix the situation. I think it's fairly well established. Just know at a certain point, you run out of

fixes and the final fix is trade and figure it out somewhere else. So we got a text into the Dunbar-Lembert text line. So you want management to take risks, but now Marner is too risky. One risk would be trading away Pedersen and not resigning Brock Besser and not trying to

immediately replace them. I mean, if you're talking about moving those guys out and bring, and your big play is to make a play for Marner and Free Agency, yeah, fill your boots. You were more talking about like trying to find the next spark to reignite Pedersen. That was the kind of, you know, because that was the genesis of the conversation. Yeah. Right?

Yeah. Like I don't think Marner is, I don't think Marner is gonna, I don't think Marner and Pedersen would be. Yeah, like, yeah. But if you you wanna target Marner as a retooling and bringing an entirely new look to the forward group, fill your boots. Yeah. I don't think it's gonna happen. You will have his, I mean, there's gonna be teams

lined up on July 1 if he gets there. Marner I'm talking about. Oh yeah. There's gonna be teams lined up. Everyone has cap space. A lot of people texting in, just tuning in, is Bruff hung over? What's going on with his voice?

I have lost my voice a little bit. I apologize. You know what? I shouldn't have come into work today. I'll say this, you sound better in hour two than you did in hour one. You're getting better every hour. Yeah.

And that's important. You're not satisfied with just being mediocre. I'm working on it. Trying to get better every hour. Yeah. And imagine hour three, it's on the horizon. not satisfied with just being mediocre. I'm working on it. Trying to get better every hour. Yeah. And imagine hour three, it's on the horizon. The phone lines we go, Kevin Woodley,

nhl.com, Ingoll Magazine joins us now on the Halford and Brush Show on Sportsnet 650. I wanna turn our attention now to the hockey. What do we got on Thatcher Demko, anything? Well, obviously he's been skating. I had heard that it was soft tissue and wouldn't be long. It's been a month now You know, there's a couple back-to-backs coming up

Obviously a crucial one with Calgary on on Wednesday Yeah, and the fact he hasn't been practicing tells me he's probably not gonna be able available for that So there's the I mean that's the downside now. We haven't had eyes on him skating. That's the thing. Everything's been done sort of before we're in the building. So I mean he may be ramped up close to 100% and then the only question is how many practices does he need? They're supposed to practice today. I haven't checked this morning. There seemed to be some uncertainty as I came home around 11 p.m. last night whether it was a full practice or just a workout. He's gonna

need at least one if not two. So there's time to get him in for the weekend back to back with Chicago and Utah, but I would, you know, again, don't know for sure, but it certainly doesn't sound or look good based on the lack of a practice for him to play in a pretty important back-to-back this week in Calgary and that's listen at this point for him the focus has to be not rocking back for one game but making sure you're healthy enough to be back and play the rest you know for him in terms of a guy who's got one year left on his contract for him in terms of being able to show this team that he can be, you know, a guy that can be counted on to stay healthy. And that's probably, I guess, where he's at right now. And so until we see

that practice, you know, it still remains up in the air when he's going to be back. And it's too bad because like I said, the second question is how long it takes him to rediscover the form that he had shown the five games before he got injured because that was, you know, he could power Sartre Demko. That was the best goal. That five games was the best goal that is good as Lankton and has been. That was the best goaltending they've received all season and with zero margin for error. And let me tell you, that is a tough way

to play goal knowing that one or two is one or two too many the way this team is struggling to score they're gonna need both guys down the stretch it doesn't look like they'll have both at least for the first half or the first stretch of back-to-backs hopefully for the second by the weekend I was gonna say like the stretch of play that he had where he had we saw old Demko and we saw that there was an elite level. I mean, thank God it happened, because otherwise, if you look at this season,

it's a borderline disaster for the guy. 17 games total, and you gotta take into account the two of those games, he didn't even make it through them because he had to exit. And then, I've honestly, Kev, I've lost track of the amount of time that he's been out of the lineup, because it's happened with such regularity. It just feels like everything that could have gone wrong

did go wrong, except for the fact that he did have a brief glimpse, glimpse of the old Demko. Yeah, and it kind of feels like a lost season, right? And in retrospect, we probably shouldn't be totally shocked by that. Um, I was as guilty of anyone of sort of looking at, you know, past occurrences where, you know, he, he came back and rediscovered the form in my mind pretty quickly after extended absences, he has to take a few games.

You don't think of how long he was out with the groin injury. Um, and, and it took a few games, but not that many. And I was always really impressed by that. And, and I think lost sight of just how different this injury was and the timeline surrounding it. I mean, we, we, we saw Jeremy Swainman, right? Miss camp and take two months to really sort of rediscover his game. Thatcher missed his entire summer of training, missed his camp, and

then tried to basically catch a moving train in mid-December. And I just think the amount of time missed when you think of the detail and the amount of work he puts into his off seasons. Typically one of the first guys back in August to work with the goalie coach for a full month here, then training camp and preseason. Like he missed so much that it probably wasn't fair to assume we would see the old Dutch or Demko quickly. And now looking back in retrospect, you know, maybe it's going to take an entire off season for him to have a chance to reset his body fully and be healthy, you know, and have a season like he was having last year before this all started. And, you know, again, if you look at how it all started, uh, last year,

you know, it was a 65 game pace for six weeks coming out of the all star break followed by an injury and then, and then, you know, I would say rushing, but certainly hastening his return to be back in time for the playoffs. And it kind of was all downhill from there. So with that in your rear view mirror and Kevin Lankin and signed to a contract that you could argue shows you the writing on the wall for your future of this organization. My focus, I'm not saying this is his, but my focus would certainly make sure I'm a hundred percent before I get back

rather than rushing back and risking, risking another injury before this season's out. Cause that's the one thing, you know, from a, from a narrative standpoint that he absolutely can't afford right now is yet another injury this season when he's back, he needs to be back. And I wouldn't be surprised if that's the focus right now.

So what are the Canucks going to do about this in the off season? Like do the, it would be, you got to be able to rely on, even if Thatcher Demko is your backup, like you have to be able to rely on, even if that's your Demco's your backup, like you have to be able to rely on him to be available. Well, I mean, at the end of the day, if he has that, you know, has a full off season and again, remember this, at his peak, when he's healthy,

there, I can count on one hand, the number of guys who are better. And so that's your upside. Now moving him this summer, you're selling low. I can count on one hand the number of guys who are better and so that's your upside now Moving him this summer you're selling low Keeping him next season you have the potential for an elite tandem and if he shows he can get through a season at F say 45 game pace or even if they just split the workload and we've seen that with a lot of tandems around the league

If he proves that he can get through that You either have a tough decision to make or you have a really high value asset Because of how good he can be I would argue and I think you can make an argument based on the way this management staff not just here but in past Sort of on other teams before they arrived here in terms of how they allocate money to goaltending you know if Dempco has a really healthy season in my mind he goes right back into that Jeremy Swainman, Linus Almark like all the guys that they've got the eight and a quarter and given their history are they spending $13 million on on goal

tenning? Because that's what it costs to retain these two. Probably not. And a no move clause for Lankton in the first two years. So I don't I don't think you have to do a whole bunch of mental gymnastics to realize that the future is probably not long term here, even though I believe they've said they're still very open to that, unless it's at a discount. And hey, like, I don't know if they want to be open to that unless it's at a discount and hey like I don't know if they want to be the team that's that's in it at that number if he has

that season but at the end of the day none of it matters unless he has that healthy season and so you either reap the benefits by having elite goaltending next year and the way things have gone this year and the way they're struggling to score you might need it and you and it's at a reasonable cost to two of them at nine and a half. That's less than a lot of teams are spending on Tana. Well, not a lot of teams, but that's in the ballpark as the cap goes up. Even Washington, look at the bargain they had forever.

Now they're going to be in just a little under nine for their two guys next season. And you hopefully rebuild the asset. And what you do from there, I don't know my, I have, you know, history tells us that the hunch would be. You don't bring him back. Um, but you know, that's a decision for down the road. In the meantime, what you have to do is get him up and running and at sort of back to full strength and you go from there. Cause you can reap the benefits this season and next of having two really, really good goaltenders.

I know it's not Demko's fault, but you just look at the schedule that the Canucks have and you're like, man, is it unfortunate that they don't have him right now because in case anyone doesn't know it, yeah, I haven't looked ahead to the schedule. Tuesday, they host Montreal and then Wednesday, they play the next day in Calgary against the team that they're fighting for a playoff spot

with, Saturday, they host Chicago, but Sunday, they host Utah, another team they're in the playoff chase with. So you got two back to backs, each of these back to backs, including a very important game, one against Calgary and one against Utah. And oh yeah, when you play Saturday, Sunday against Chicago, Utah, you also play Tuesday

against Winnipeg. So that's three games in four days. Like it's just like all the stretches of all the weeks to not have Demco available. It's just like all the stretches of all the weeks to not have Demco available. This one stands out more than any other. Yeah. And like I said, like to me, if he's back at practice again, I haven't seen if they'd cancel

practice yet this morning or not, if they're going to, he needs probably one or two. Um, so I haven't ruled out this weekend in the Utah game and I get out this weekend in the Utah game and that gets you into the Utah Winnipeg stretch. I just I think it's unlikely and I shouldn't say that absolutely but I do think it's unlikely especially if there's no practice today that that he's an option for Wednesday in Calgary and that leaves you with an interesting choice because obviously Arturs had a great first start interestingly against Utah so there's a possibility there if Thatcher isn't ready

on the weekend but struggled against Anaheim got himself just locked in a little low and wide kind of look I had a goalie coach from another team sort of asked you know what would the deal was because it was like two different goalies Arthurs in Utah and Arthurs in Anahim just, you know, he looked more like he'd made some really good changes in the Utah game and he got back to sort of getting opened up and pulling his hands back and widened out off open releases and cost him in the Anaheim game. And so there may be some, some, an evolution going on there that maybe hasn't fully stuck. But I think for the Calgary game, I know a lot of people will be like, we'll just play

Lankin in both. And certainly goalies are capable of playing back to back games. And there's two days off before you go into another set of back to backs. But the one thing that we've seen with Kevin as good as he's been this season is when the starts have piled up. And I think last night was four straight the performance that's when the performance it hasn't happened often but when the performance has dipped it's when the games played in a row have piled up and

so he may still be your best choice I'm really curious to see what decision they make Saturday or sorry Wednesday going into Calgary because I can tell you the guy at the other end he's pretty good Dustin Wolf at this point is second has leap frog Igor Shishderkin and Connor Hellebuck into second place like everybody's talking about he should be in the Calder race he should be getting Vezna votes second in the NHL and goals saved above expected second in the NHL and goals saved above expected, second in the NHL and adjusted save percentage, that guy is playing, we saw it on Saturday night and the one nothing went over Montreal.

That guy is playing exceptionally well. So a team that's struggling to score is not going to get any breaks against us and we'll have fun on Wednesday. Um, non-goaltending category here. Any thoughts on the Canucks trade deadline and the fact where nothing changed really for the forward group and this is still a group that is

having all sorts of trouble creating chances, finishing chances, just scoring goals. Well, I mean, if it was just the finish, that'd be one thing, right? But it's, it's the creation. It's the generation since December 1st I just pulled up the numbers Dead last

like dead last in the NHL in High danger chances for expected goals off high data chances add all the chances up low and mids because they don't I give them credit They don't waste a lot on low danger either so they can be be a little bit tough as much as it's, they make low event teams seem high event like they are as low event as it comes right now because they have been good defensively too. They don't waste shots and that can be tough to watch, but it can also be tough on other goaltenders. But dead last in the NHL in all types of chances, expected goals for, I mean, I guess the good news is

Calgary is 31st since December 1st. So there's that on Wednesday, really exciting hockey. But yeah, listen, would we have been upset if they bought at the prices? Like. Well, I think they were trying to do both. I think they were trying to do both. I think they were trying to sell and buy. Yeah, that was the contradiction, right? Yeah.

Like the prices were so high, so why didn't you sell? The prices were so high. I understand why they didn't buy. I'm with you. Past behavior, being a predictor of future things, that's what they've done. They've sold them, then bought. And whether it was the Ratnan deal holding, holding the market up, you know, Carolina who was linked to Brock basically said they ran out of time

because of the Rantan deal taking so long to complete. Like that was pretty much what Tulski said. Uh, they ran out of time to do other things. And in terms of not selling, I may be more understanding of that than a lot of people in this market seem to be. And you can rip me and roast me for it all you want. And ripping and roasting it will be the right thing if they don't make the playoffs. But I do understand not dealing for a team that's struggling to score.

And I know Bester's been a part of that of late, but one of the few guys who actually has a history of doing so, I understand not dealing him. So I know it's not long-term thinking. I totally get that. But such a weird spot after the weirdest of years to be sitting there in a playoff spot and start selling. And we've seen other teams do it. We've seen other teams look long-term.

But I don't know many of them that were coming off the year this team was coming off of that have a player like Quinn Hughes and hopefully healthy at some point here in the near future, showing him that you want to win, that you want to be in the playoffs, as well as giving him that chance to be. There were a lot of circumstances here that maybe make me understand the decision, you know, and let's be honest, raising ticket prices last year and scheduled to do so the same this year, right?

Like you'd need to generate some momentum and, and nothing does that even, even if it is a first round exit, um, nothing does that in Vancouver, like playoff hockey. So, uh, I understand it's not a popular take, but I'm a little more understanding of the decision, um, even if it's not ideal from a long term vision perspective. Does it seem sometimes like Taked is out of

answers for this forward group? Like he said all he can say and you know, unless something changes with the players, this is what we're going to see for the rest of the season, a team that really struggles to score. Yeah. I mean, at the end of the day, there's, there's a, like at this point, who on that list of, of struggling players, and it's a long list, but like there's

really only one or two guys that you're like, they have a long history of being or a decent history of being scores of being play drivers, right? Like, and you know, and he singled two of them out last night, right? Like, like Patterson and Besser need to be better. Um, from a play style standpoint, as much as it's not pretty, like, I don't mind the way they're playing, the way they're defending. It's funny, Matt Deshane talked about their analytics, uh, last night post game about how good they're defending and their, and their, um, their, their exit rate was like, which kind of surprised me to hear that, but clearly they'd had some numbers

put before them going into the game about the strengths of this team. And he was talking about the Canucks just to be clear. Not the stars. Okay. Yeah. Yeah.

And, um, and how hard they are to score and generate against and how you have to play a patient game against them. So like all those elements are back and I think that's important because that's what tends to succeed come playoff time but you can score goals and you know when your number one center isn't driving play on a consistent basis and you know your number two center arguably should be a number three center on a competitive team. That's a problem and the power play last night, although Dallas stars like the power play

hasn't looked pretty and yet it's clicked at a somewhat decent rate up until last night and that's a number one penalty kill they're going up against. And by the way, I'm a goaltender in Casey De Smith, who for 1 million times, three years is top 10 in the league and adjusted save percentage right now. Now the caveat is we saw it last year. Casey's incredible in that pure backup role, but when you need him to do what they've needed Lankin to do, that's when things struggled last year, when you need him for a straight month.

But he's been exceptional in that role for them. Like, uh, like I said, top 10 in the entire league and adjusted say percentage. So not an easy, not an easy penalty kill to break through against, but it's funny. Like we talk about Besser and his struggles. And obviously there's been, you know, a lot of talk about Patterson and his struggles. Talk to talk this week about Besser getting to the dirty dirty areas getting to the net front and all those things. And he it's really it was interesting to hear that and it maybe it's just a

personal pet peeve but it's driven me nuts all year that they haven't used them consistently on a struggling power play or a power play that's never really found its groove as the net front guy. Because last year as the net front guy and a lot of it I get was the interplay between him and JT coming off the left flank especially when he got going downhill and how well they worked shots and screens together. But he produced elite top five in the NHL net front power play numbers in terms of traffic and understanding.

Because they scored, one of the reasons they scored a lot of goals with screens and point shots last year is because of how guys like him learn to move goalies around behind their screens. Like there was a real art to it. And I and I had discussions with him and with Miller about how they did it and what they were doing. And it was it was kind of really, you know, in a bowling geek, kind of high geek.

It was really kind of interesting and fun to watch in a boldly geek, kind of high geek, it was really kind of interesting and fun to watch that. And now he's not even a net front guy. And so that's confused me all year long, especially when talk talks about the importance of him getting to those areas more than he has, like there, you can put him there on the power play. So yeah, that, you know,'s not really enough versus where you can look at it. Yeah, this guy, this guy's a guy that scores. We just need him to score like he, there's only a handful of guys that you look at him and say, yeah, if he just plays like we expect him or how he normally plays, we're going to be fine. Jake has, and he's been fine all season,

no tough one last night, but he hasn't been the problem, but he's always been a streaky score. He's always run hot and cold and the rest of the guys it's work great. And that's the other troubling part, Jason for this week is take a look at their results in the second half of back to backs, as much as you're talking about the goal attending, this is a team that has to outwork its opponents to have a chance. Like so much of what they do right now is predicated on work rate. And I think their inability to sustain it on the second half of back-to-backs

is one of the reasons they can look like two very different teams on the front end and the back end. We saw that in Anaheim. Utah, you know, at least they defended, but I think that's one of the reasons they struggle in back to back because the work weight required to succeed with the way they're playing is so high and that's hard to do when you play two nights in a row.