Halford & Brough in the Morning - The Best of Halford and Brough 7/16/25

Episode Date: July 16, 2025

Mike & Jason look back at the previous day in sports, they discuss Tyler Myers' comments on the rumours of Quinn Hughes eventually leaving the Canucks, plus they talk with famed USA Today sportswriter Christine Brennan on her new book, "ON HER GAME: Caitlin Clark and the Revolution in Women’s Sports". This podcast is produced by Andy Cole and Greg Balloch. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

You're listening to the best of Halford and Brough. Daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa A.L. rallied in the game. NL has rallied in the swing. With the hat trick! Look out, Chappos! National League takes the lead 4-3. Huggy, you know, it was five years ago when I was like, wow, this guy is amazing. And it seems like every year since then,

he's only gotten better. What's going on? What's the asking price for Eric Carlson, Brian Rust, and Ricard Raquel? The answer is pretty high. Good morning, Vancouver 601 on a Wednesday. Happy Wednesday, everybody. It's Hal Ferdinand Brough, and it's Sportsnet 650.

We are coming to you live from the Kintec Studios in beautiful Fairview Slopes in Vancouver. Jason, good morning. Good morning is Sportsnet 650. We are coming to you live from the Kintec studios in beautiful Fairview slopes in Vancouver. Jason, good morning. Good morning, Michael. Adog, good morning to you. Good morning. And basketball fan, good morning to you as well. I'll copy that, good morning, Michael.

Halford and brother of the morning is brought to you by Sands and Associates, BC's first, and Trust the Choice for Net Help with over 3,000 five-star reviews. Visit them online at sans-trustee.com. We are coming to you live from the Kintec studio, Kintec Footwear and Orthotics, working together with you in step.

Big show ahead on a Wednesday. Guest list today begins at 6.30. Nick Kiprios is gonna join the program. Kipper's trade board 3.0 dropped yesterday, so he'll be joining us at 6.30. To break it all down, some big names on that list. Jason Robertson, Morgan Riley, Rasmus Anderson, Nazem Kadri, Eric Carlson, Brian Rust, Ricard Raquel, Jordan Cairo, Dougie Hamilton, and Marco Rossi, just to name a few, uh,

a little bit of news for the Vancouver Canucks on that trade board. So we'll talk to Kipper about all that at six 30 seven o'clock. Connor or is going gonna join the program. He is a senior writer for Sports Illustrated. Russell Wilson says he's still got it. So Connor decided to meet him in a New York City park for a game of catch, just a good old fashioned game of catch. And he tried to decide and figure out

if we should believe Russell Wilson has a new chapter now with the New York Giants. So we'll talk to Conor Orr about all that at seven o'clock. So we'll get a good laugh this morning. Maybe it's serious. Maybe this time it's going to be different for Russell. Don't forget. Do you think he asked if he wanted to interview him or if he just wanted to play catch?

Like you think he was like, do you want to play some catch in the park? Hopefully. Oh, and by the way also I will be interviewing you yeah yeah well he's an overcomer that's right big overcomer so that's gonna be at seven o'clock with Connor or senior writer for sports illustrate his new feature piece out on Russell Wilson 730 Christine Brennan is gonna join the program famed columnist for USA Today author of the new book on her game,

Caitlin Clark and the Revolution in Women's Sports. So we're going to discuss the phenomenon that is Caitlin Clark, how she's changed women's sports forever, and also the controversy that Christine was involved in, how the NBA clearly wasn't prepared to deal with the revolution that is Caitlin Clark and- The WNBA. The WNBA, sorry. The NBA was probably fine with it, the WNBA. And Christine Brennan, a longtime journalist, famed journalist, found herself in the middle of

a media controversy with the Caitlin Clark story, especially last year in the WNBA playoffs. So Christine Brennan is going to join us at 730. Eight o'clock, Thomas Drance from The Athletic and Canucks talk right here on Sportsnet 650. Peace out for Drance. Yesterday, what he's hearing about the Canucks free agent bargain bin plans.

Ooh, the bargain bin. And more, so we'll talk to Drance or all things Canucks. So you get your Canucks talk at eight o'clock this morning. Working in reverse on that guest list. Eight o'clock, it's Thomas Drance. 730, Christine Brennan. Seven o'clock, it's Thomas Drance. 7.30, Christine Brennan. Seven o'clock, Connor Orr. 6.30, Nick Kiprios.

That's what's happening on the program today. Ben, let's tell everybody what happened. Hey, did you guys see the game last night? No. What happened? I missed all the action because I was. We know how busy your life can be. What happened?

You missed that? What happened? You missed that? What happened? What happened is brought to you by the BC Construction Safety Alliance. Making safety simpler by giving construction companies the best in tools, resources and safety training. Visit them online at bccsa.ca. It was the big Schwab, Kyle Schwab, a three for three in the first ever all-star game

home run swing off last night. The NL beats the AL four three in the swing off after a six six tie following nine innings in what was Jason, maybe the most entertaining MLB all-star game I've ever seen. It was a lot of fun. I like calling it a swing off. It was a lot of fun. I like calling it a swing off. It was great. Sounds like something like an adult party. Swing off.

Put your keys in the bowl. It's time for the swing off. Do it in the suburbs a lot. Hi, you're for the swing off. Yeah. That impromptu way, though, is actually important to bring up because they clearly, clearly

had an idea of what they wanted to do for the swing off prior to going into it, but they didn't have a full idea. Sure they'll wear your pants. No one knew the rules. You've got gold chains, but no pants. The pants were, did we have to wear them? The answer was yes. So if you watched the broadcast last night, the games through nine innings was great,

right? There was a six run comeback after the seventh inning. The AAL put up a good fight, scored two in the ninth, including a nice little chopper from Steven, don't call me Cookie Kwan, to score the game tying run. And then at the end of nine, MLB decided in advance that if it was to go extras, because of the lack of pitchers available,

they're burning through pitchers almost every inning, a lot of the big stars checked out of the game midway through like Aaron Judge and Shohei Otani and Freddie Freeman. We're going to run out of players. Let's do a swing off. For those that have no idea what we're talking about, each team was responsible for picking three hitters. Three swingers.

And that was the thing. We need three best swingers. And that was the thing. We need our three best swingers. I'm trying to get through this. That was the thing, because it wasn't pitches taken, it wasn't how many jacks you could hit, it was how many swings you took. We got Marco over here. Hey.

He'll hit a jack. Kyle Schwerver was the king of the swings, if you will, connecting on all three. I want to play the audio from the third one. We played it in the intro. Ben, let's play it again here. Here's Kyle Schwab winning the All-Star game for the NL yesterday with his third jack on his third swing. So it was the first time this ever happened in MLB All-Star game history.

It's probably going to be the last time it'll ever happen in that format. I'm sure they'll try it again, but this was very sort of haphazard. You know, though, that there's some people watching and there's probably gonna be like a media story about this like do this during the regular season. Why not try it? Why not announce three swingers pregame that will have to finish games if they're tied going beyond the night. The genies out of the bottle anyway with regards to extra innings. Do you know what I mean? When they started to add the runner at second, it was kind of like, well... We're already going down the road. We're already going down the road anyway. It's kind of like the shootout with the NHL. It's funny. And then it was like all overtime during the regular season,

whatever. Let's do three on three. Let's do two on two. Let's do a swing off. They did, you know, the Associated Press story that came out in the aftermath did liken it to soccer, the baseball's equivalent of soccer's penalty kicks, which in a very weird way, I guess it kind of was, but entertaining nonetheless. Yeah, yeah. For a game that really didn't necessarily mean

a whole hell of a lot, but a good moment for Kyle Schwabert. It, I know you wanted to talk about this. It looked good with the players wearing their jerseys. That was great. So in case you missed that, for the last five years of Major League Baseball All-Star Games, the players have been wearing uniforms designed specifically for the event.

This year, in a throwback to the late 80s and early 90s, the home teams all won their whites and the road teams were, you know, mostly they're gray. Some guys were darks, but the idea was just wear the color and the uniform of the team that you play for. And it created this cool kaleidoscope and it harken back to like, they played a lot of clips of Bo Jackson quite famously.

I think it was the 89 All-Star game when Richard Nixon was in the booth on the call. Yeah, yeah, it was Rick Ruschel on the mound. It was Bo Jackson at the plate. For some reason, Richard Nixon was there. He was like, oh my. I am not a crook. That man's never drinking duff in his life.

So they were hearkening back. There was a great, great, great ceremony that they had involving, because obviously the game was played in Atlanta. Was the big dumper at the swing off? Big dumper was not in the swing off. Oh, that is unfortunate. And he was, so he was one of the guys that hung around

and would have been available for it. I'm not sure why he wasn't chosen. I didn't really understand the selection process all that much, but whatever the case. Other takeaways from yesterday, by the way, because there's a lot we got to get into here. Robo-Omps made their debut during the quote unquote regular season. And I was paying close attention to this because I wanted to see what it looked like in terms of how long it takes the challenge.

Did you see any of them? Yeah, I saw I saw the first one by Cal Rowley. Did you did you guys see it as well? They go lightning quick. I was shocked. Robo Ump's so humanity. But there's no. go lightning quick? I was shot a roblox So humanity, but there's no I was that I mean that was a strike I do hate to disappoint you. I'm here for the swing off. There was no actual robot

It wasn't like Rosie the maid and the Jetsons like there was no he wasn't going around boy balls and strikes It shows up on screen So all they do is they very subtly, they either tap their helmet or their hat. Hat, obviously, if you're a pitcher and you want to challenge a ball and strike. Helmet if you're a batter. And how many do you get?

See, yesterday there was five. I think it was three per team and not all of them were used, but they haven't implemented in regular season baseball yet. So I don't know what the rules would be. In the pre-season, it was two per team. The speed in which it was done was the key because it didn't interrupt the flow of the game at all, right? They had it at the ready and it's I mean balls the strikes is pretty simple They've got a predetermined strike zone courtesy of the robots and then if the ball even nicks the strike zone

There's no debate about it. It's either yeah, it's a striker. Yeah, it's a ball. So they got through them pretty quick Again, four of the five were successful, so it definitely paid off. And the speed in which they used it does make me wonder how long how much longer it's going to be before we start seeing this in regular season baseball. I'm sure I'm sure we'll see it soon. I mean, they had did you did you watch any Wimbledon? I mean, the UMPs are pretty much out at Wimbledon right now, so I'm sure

it'll be soon. Anything else from the All-Star game? No, I'll get into some of the other stuff later. Pete Alonso had an awesome rule change idea that involves hockey-style fighting, but we can get into that and what we learned because it's a pretty good idea and I want to explore it. Also, Rob Manfred said that MLB players are getting closer to Olympic participation in 2028 so we can get into that a little later because I know we want to get into the Tyler Myers stuff. Someone texted in that it wasn't Richard Nixon, it was Reagan, Ronald Reagan in the booth. Oh, it might have been Ronald Reagan. Well, he was president then.

Yeah, I was trying to, it was more about Bo Jackson hitting the jack off Rick Ruschel, so it might have been yeah Ronald Reagan Yeah, yeah, cuz he was a California guy. Yeah, there you go. That probably makes more sense. Yeah, Richard Nixon would be funnier though Okay Go that was well, that was well prepared though except for your blunder on on Republican presidents. Yeah, it was close I was close. They're kind of the same thing. Are they not? Yeah. We'll move on. So yesterday, Vancouver Connects defenseman Tyler Myers appeared on the Cam and Strict podcast that of course headed by Andy Strickland out of St. Louis and Cam Jansen, former NHL-er, to discuss a variety of topics. Two in particular that drew the attention of most in

the local market. Myers was asked about the JT Miller, Elias Pettersson drama from last season. And then the more recent rumors about Quinn Hughes potentially leaving to go play wherever, potentially with his two brothers in New Jersey. Let's play the audio first. Myers talking about the Miller-Pettersson riff from last year and how he, like some of his other teammates said,

maybe it wasn't as big a deal as everyone was led to believe. Here's Tyler Myers on the Miller-Peterson drama from last season. Well, it got, I mean, you mentioned it, but it got pretty crazy just publicly last year, way more than what it was. I'm not gonna sit here and say there wasn't tension,

but I've been on, I've been on a team where two players are in a full on fist fight after a game who I know are close friends. You know, there's going to be tension, you know, on anywhere you go. But, you know, on anywhere you go. But you know, Millsy and like Millsy and I got close and you know, it was a lot more than it needed to be made out to be.

But you know, it wasn't anything crazy. You know, we were figuring things out, you know, just like every other team does with different situations, but, um, you know, our locker room was great. I liked coming into the rink every day. The guys were really close and you know, we weren't too worried about it. Okay. I got a, I got a few things to say about that. Like I, I, I respect Tyler Myers and, um, I I respect Tyler Myers and I wasn't in the room like him.

So he's obviously got a perspective that I don't. But he mentioned, I mean, the first part he was like, you know, I remember seeing two guys getting into a fist fight and they were close friends. We're like, yeah. So they were close friends. Miller and Peterson weren't close friends. And I remember, you know, remember when this was kind of just bubbling to the surface and people would say, well, you know, you don't have to like each other, but you have to respect each other. They didn't respect each other. From what I've heard, they just, they didn't. And you know, for him to say that it got overblown, Tyler, one of them got traded. Like, so it

wasn't, it wasn't overblown. One of them got traded and then your president of hockey ops came out and said, that's why it was because of that. And you know, I get what he's saying where he's like, listen, it didn't affect us in the room. Like people assume I'm kind of paraphrasing him right now, but he got traded. And the other one was nearly traded to Carolina. So I would be doing the same thing if I was in Tyler Meyers' shoes. I'd be like, okay, let's downplay this because we got to move on from it. And maybe, you know, from Myers perspective, it, it didn't affect him as much, but again, like

Pedersen had a really down season and, um, you know, I, I'd have to assume that this whole thing had an impact on Pedersen's play on the ice and where he was mentally. So I get the downplaying from Tyler Myers, but with all due respect, it was a big deal. Okay, I want to pivot off that and play the second piece of audio that we've got, because there's another point we need to bring up with all of this. This is Myers on the Quinn Hughes speculation and all the noise emanating from that situation. Talking about how Huggie doesn't like all that speculation

that's out there. Here's Tyler Myers on his defensive mate, Quinn Hughes on the Kam and Strik podcast yesterday. Oh, Huggie doesn't like all that speculation and stuff. He's, you know, he loves his brothers, loves his family like everybody else, but he's not going around the room saying he wants to play with his brothers.

You know, I know it's a big story around the hockey world, but you know, but yeah, it's everyone makes up a lot more than this. So in an interview, consecutive questions asked about two of the bigger, more tumultuous stories regarding the team. Tyler Myers came out and said, possibly being blown out of proportion,

he doesn't like dealing with it, the players don't like dealing with it, and it's a lot of noise. To that I would say, a lot of this noise is being started in-house, Tyler. A lot of this noise is being generated from the highest reaches of the organization. Well, the next line from one of the guys in the podcast,

I'm not sure who it was, was, well, wasn't this rumor kind of starting from your GM or president of hockey operations and Myers didn't Even respond he just kind of laughed it off and they moved on yeah, but this is where it stems from so I mean This is how Jim Rutherford operates is he conducted an interview prior to trading JT Miller to tell everyone that wasn't a hundred percent sure that there was a big rift and that the only way they were gonna solve was to trade Miller then 100% sure that there was a big rift and that the only way they were going to solve it was to trade Miller. Then at the end of year meat availability,

he kind of got out in front of the Quinn Hughes thing and just said the quiet part out loud and that yeah, Quinn Hughes has two brothers, both of whom play on the same team on the other side of the continent and he's a free agent in not this summer, but the summer following and you have to be aware of that. So in a way, Rutherford was addressing what was already out there, but there is an obvious difference between, you know, social media posts and media talking heads and pundits sort of throwing things back around. The president of Hockey Ops openly saying it

in either an interview or a media availability. Almost lends credence to it, but it also. Almost, it does lend credence to it. And it adds fuel to the fire. It goes from idle speculation into like, well, he's on the record and that means they're thinking about it. As they should be.

And I wonder, I get the strategy. I do get the strategy. You may as well talk about it. It's already out there. But at the same time when the players kind of come out in this way and Myers without saying too much does kind of take a peek behind the curtain to say like there's a belief at least among some of the guys in the room that things are being blown out of proportion.

If you listen to enough people that's covered this team on the regular, Sat talks about it all the time, is that there seems to be an organizational want to silence or quiet the noise, yet there's also a push from the organization to make noise. It's almost like it's counterintuitive at times. Well, sometimes I wonder if they're just prepping Canucks fans for what might happen.

I think that's fair. When Jim Rutherford gave the interview to Gary Mason at the Globe and Mail about Miller and Pedersen, a lot of the insiders came out and said, you know, I think he's prepping Canucks fans for something that's going to happen. And not too long after JT Miller was traded, because you could imagine the shock in the market if all of a sudden like, we'd heard some rumors that things weren't going great. And then of course, JT Miller had his 10 game leave of absence. So maybe that would have caused a little less surprise if Miller was traded after that. But when he came out and shared like the reasons

for all this, then it prepared Canucks fans for the trade. And then you remember a few of the games that Miller played, it was like, Oh my God, this guy's checked out. And then he was traded. Okay. so I'm not saying that this is the exact same situation, but maybe they're putting it out there for a reason. Okay. I'm trying to, I get it. I get it. Like, there is, there is an element where it makes sense to prepare a fan base for what might come. Absolutely, right?

And I think that in the case of trading Miller, very much got ahead of what ended up being a fairly underwhelming return for the player. I think the issue with that one, if we're gonna take that one in a nutshell and in a vacuum, is that they continued to talk about Miller in exceedingly glowing terms after dealing him away. And it continued to add to a narrative that they built

in a very strange way to me, right? It's like continually heaping praise on Miller. And even Meyers said like, Millsy and I got close, right? Like it was very obvious there were a lot of people in that organization that were fond of them. And sometimes, and I go back to, remember I said if I was ever gonna start up my own PR company, my CalFord PR, my single piece of advice would be like, talk less.

Say less things. And I know it would be hell for the media because we love feasting on this stuff, but sometimes the best thing to say is nothing at all. Because they can't parse nothing. Well, Rutherford himself says, you know, I'm too honest sometimes. And it's why we love him as media, but it's also why at times even in Vancouver, he's had to take a step back from talking.

Unintended consequences are a big part of this too, right? So if you think about the Hughes part of this equation, you've got a you think about the Hughes part of this equation, you've got a president of hockey ops, he's like, I'm just gonna say the quiet part out loud and I'm gonna address this, brace the fans potentially for what might happen. I do wonder what Hughes thought of that, because he hasn't said anything.

He's just sitting there, he's like, I'm golfing, right? Yeah, yeah. Jim called me, I didn't answer. I wonder that too. If he saw that and he was like, Thanks. Great. Yeah. Now I get to deal with this all season. Yeah.

And that's exactly what happens. Can you imagine the road trip back East to New Jersey? Take your pick. First time he goes to Toronto, first time he goes to Montreal. Obviously the first time he goes to New Jersey and he's in the next Hughes of Palooza against his brothers. Yeah. It's a story. I mean, you got to remember remember Tyler Myers is being asked about it on a podcast based out of st. Louis Everyone is very cognizant of this story. Look people outside the Vancouver market You know the Kinnucks haven't been all that relevant for for for a little while. So except for this

now event for a little while, except for this. Now imagine there was a defenseman of Quinn Hughes' caliber that might be changing teams in a couple of years outside the market. Wouldn't you be interested in that? Well, see, it's funny you mention that. We talk about McDavid's contract situation. Of course, like Quinn Hughes, Tyler Meyers, another thing he said, the best player I've ever seen.

So I'm glad you brought that up because I did. One of the things that stood out for me last season was when Mike Sullivan at the foreign nations face off jumped the gun. He's like, Queen Hughes is coming. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And that was a shot across the tournament, specifically at Canada that was like, Hey, we got a game changer on the way. Now, ultimately it never came to fruition because Hughes wasn't healthy enough to play. But that, to me, was a real reminder of how much clout

and how much respect he has across the league. I mean, it's not like we take Quinn Hughes for granted in Vancouver. I don't think that's it. No, I don't think we do. I don't think that's it. Honestly, every game he plays, I'm kind of like, don't take this for granted.

This is incredible what he's doing out there. I think sometimes Vancouver can be a bit myopic in its view. We don't necessarily look at what's going on around the NHL and understand that a lot of other NHL markets are looking at Hughes on a nightly basis and saying, that's the best defenseman in the NHL. Or if they're not saying that,

then he's saying he's seconding Cale McCarr. By the way, there is also a thought out there that I've heard from a few people that Quinn Hughes may not want to go play with his brothers or may not be desperately wanting to go play with his brothers, but that also doesn't mean that he's going to stay with the Canucks. Right.

He might just want to be closer to family. And we've seen that before. You know, the late Johnny Godreau left Calgary and went to Columbus of all places just because, well, number one, it was back in the States. And number two, it was closer in proximity to his family. You're listening to the best of Halford and Brough. You're listening to the best of Halford and Brough. You're listening to the best of Halford and Brough.

Our next guest is a columnist with USA Today. She is the author of the new book on her game, Caitlin Clark and the Revolution in Women's Sports. Christine Brennan joins us now on the Halford and Brough show on Sportsnet 650. Good morning, Christine, how are you? Well, hello, great to be with you guys. Thanks so much for having me. And yeah, always fun to talk to one of my favorite people in one of my favorite

and one of the most beautiful cities. I'll just say on earth, forget North America. So thanks so much for having me. Well, thanks for coming on. We appreciate you taking the time to do this. And you know, this is a nice intro because you can introduce Vancouver and maybe some of our listeners that aren't entirely familiar with the Caitlin Clark phenomenon, not just changing the WNBA but changing the face of women's sports forever. Can you explain to our listenership exactly what the Caitlin Clark phenomenon is both from a sporting and cultural perspective? Well, absolutely guys and you know I, you certainly have perfected women's sports, hockey.

Ice hockey comes to mind and I'll be in at the Olympics in Italy in what is it, seven months. And we know we will have a US-Canada women's hockey final that will be an instant classic. But I mentioned that because among many other sports, rowing and obviously your basketball team is quite women's basketball. You know, women's sports in Canada is very, very important. Obviously, it's important in the United States. Truly a hallmark of both countries is making sure our girls as well as our boys play sports, right? That's been something that's happened over these years. And we have Title IX down here in the, uh, your small little neighborhood at the South and, um, you know, 53 years old now. And the, what, what it did was give the other half of our population the chance to learn about winning and losing at a young age,

teamwork, sportsmanship gave us all kinds of things. I'm sure there are some people who remember the 1999 women's world cup soccer. Um, of course, the Canada's team, the great Christine Sinclair, she wasn't on that team yet, but women's soccer was building. That was Brandy Chastain and the Rose Bowl filled the capacity for a women's sport. And that was 99, July of 99, US wins. Two and a half years later, a little girl is born in Des Moines, Iowa, and she turns out to be Caitlin Clark.

Why do I mention this? Because the climate in the country was all about, we want our daughters to play just like our sons, forget all the naysayers, forget all the stuff that women shouldn't play sports, we're all in. And that climate for young women born in the early part of this century,

really not only allowed girls, Caitlin Clark's family, she's an older brother, younger sister, younger brother as well and parents who were grew up in sports. So she was always going to play sports on the driveway and you know, ride her bike faster than her brother did and all that. But the difference was that the nation was also ready for it and wanted to see more and more. We'd fallen in love with what we created. Caitlin obviously rises through the ranks. Everyone starts to see her in college at Iowa. Why? What's going on with this particular athlete,

as opposed to all the other female athletes that haven't quite, you know, haven't crossed over into our culture where grandmothers and grandfathers are talking about her in the produce section at the grocery store, which they are, uh, with Caitlin Clark. It's the logo threes, you know, she's chucking it from the parking lot and it's going in and you watch it and you kind of what did I see? And you want to watch the replay and then you want to go on social media and make sure you see it again and again in her celebration.

It's the passes beautiful passes. The other day she had it connected over the fingertips of the opponents to Sophie Cunningham. It was about three quarter lane pass, just exquisite. And the announcer goes, touchdown Indiana Fever. Perfect, perfect call of that remarkable basketball play. And and just the high wire act. And when you've got that, when you've got an entertainer like Tiger Woods was in golf, here come the eyeballs.

Here comes the interest. The difference here guys, people lined up in January for hours to go into arenas to watch her play. The difference, we're talking about a woman who's playing basketball and that's the first certainly in this country. So explain how much did you do the current kind of culture wars in the United States as we,

as I understand them as a Canadian and they are confusing sometimes. But how does that play into this story? Because it seems like there's a lot of hot button issues all in play at the same time. Yeah, there sure are. And yes, there is, there are some political things going on in our country. And, you know, can I just say we love Canada. Can we just say that? We appreciate that. Thank you.

I love Canada. I grew up in Toledo. We listened to CKLW in Windsor. We went to ethnic vacations in Toronto. Our family, we looked North, Michigan and Canada all the time. My brother did hockey camp in Halberton. I would have played hockey if girls could play hockey back then. I played, you know, six other sports, but you know what I mean? Oh, no, no. We love Canada and you know how much I love Vancouver. One of the best Olympics ever, 2010. I've covered so many over the years. So, yeah, so for sure. You know, when you've got an election, a polarized election, a polarized society, racially polarized, and now Caitlin Clark, a white woman from Iowa, comes into a 74% black league. I deal with all this in

the book. By the way, the book on her game is Caitlin Carton Magic. I mean, you know, the logo threes are jumping up the page. She's quoted extensively. It's a book for adults, but 12 year old girls and boys can read it. Absolutely. The most minimal of any words that I know the kids know, but I don't necessarily want to write them. But yeah, really, really tame that way for the kids, but also adults, but also real and true. Someone's swearing a blue sweet streak. I, I just say some choice language. Um, and then there's a couple S words that Cheryl Reeve, the Olympic coach uttered about Caitlin Clark, which is another ridiculous moment for, for, um,

USA basketball and for, for the treatment of the greatest thing that's ever happened to women's basketball and women's team sports, which is Caitlin Clark, just stunning. But yeah, parents, grandparents, kids, this book is, if you've got a girl athlete in your life or a girl dad in your life, I wrote this quickly over about a four or five month period, but it is a story of America, it's a story of our culture, it's a story of North America, because a story of our culture. It's a story of North America.

Cause again, your girls are doing the same things, different sports maybe than our girls are. You know, we're one in the same in that way. And so you've got a 74% black league and here comes a white woman and she's the one that gets all the attention. I will never be no or be able to spend a second as a black person.

So I know what I know, I know what I don't know. And so I have incredible voices. I'm so honored that people talk to me at length to go into everything from just how great Caitlin Clark is or teammate and best friend Kate Martin spent a half hour with her. I was following the fever around in Indianapolis wherever they played. So I got to be immersed in the team and the opponents as well. But I also interview a man named Dr. Harry Edwards, who is a civil rights advocate, a black man,

actually fighting cancer now in the Bay Area in California. He's the man behind the Black Power Salute at the 1968 Mexico City Olympics that people might remember if you're of a certain age. He loves Caitlin Clark. How about that? He loves her, thinks she's great, and says in the book the WNBA failed the players.

What he is suggesting is when you've got something this extraordinary happening, that you have to see it, anticipate it, and if leadership in the WNBA did that, you have seminars, you have Zooms, you let Harry Edwards talk to players, you know, someone who might be a little missed, right? Why didn't this happen earlier? Hey, I'm missed as a journalist who's covered women's sports for so long, as well as men's, of course.

I wish this happened 20 years ago for the WNBA, right? I wish that they were household names back then, but they weren't. It didn't happen. I tried, covered them for the Washington Post, Lifetime TV, CNN when I got a chance to talk about the NBA. I would talk about the WNBA. It didn't stick. Here it is now. So we can understand how there might be hurt feelings, issues, you know, the new person

saunters into the workplace and you're like, who's that? Right. We've all felt, have a sense of that. Anyway, that's what the WNBA did not do. Did not help the players, not because they're damsels in distress. No, it's just, this is such an unusual moment of a person lifting up a league. Like no league has ever been lifted up before because it had so far to go. Right. Because no one cared really in the mainstream sports media and in our culture the way that they should have cared and we

would have hoped they would have cared. Anyway, WMA didn't do that. You've got a hip check, the cheap shot of Kennedy Carter. There's a whole chapter on that and the ramifications of that and on and on it goes. I really try to look into it, but jealousy is mentioned. Certainly racial issues are mentioned and it's a shame because that spotlight shining on Caitlin Clark shines on all those players who deserve detention, but never got it. Most of them black players and now they're getting it. And it seems to me the rising tide lifts all boats. You should look at that and say, this is a great thing.

We're making more money because of Caitlin Clark, which is the truth. Unfortunately, there seem to be other things at play as well. We're speaking to Christine Brennan here on the Halford and Brough show on Sportsnet 650. She's the author of the new book on her game, Caitlin Clark and the revolution in women's sports. A two-parter here for you, Christine. I think you answered part of it already, but was the WNBA prepared for the Caitlin Clark phenomenon? And the follow-up question would be, is can you actually really, truly prepare for a phenomenon? Well, they definitely were not prepared.

So you're right, sorry for the filibuster answer before, but there's a lot that goes into this. You know what I mean? You know, and people, you start to think about it like, oh, okay, I get it. You know, I'm seeing the issues here. At least I had the benefit of reporting on all of this. And so I, you know, I lived this for a year basically, right after the Paris Olympics.

I came Paris to Indianapolis. Everyone does that, right? And, but I love India and it's a great town. Direct flights all day. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. They're exactly the same. But actually I do love Indianapolis. It is a great city. Perfect for sports the same. But actually I do love Indianapolis.

It is a great city, perfect for sports and prefer for Caitlin Clark because they love basketball, totally ready for her. So to answer your second part of your question, Indianapolis is ready. Absolutely. Because it's the Pacers and the Fever. So you get the benefit of this NBA franchise. So you've got like two dozen social media people pump and step out, which really, I mean,

you look at the numbers on the Caitlin Clark, when they put pictures of Caitlin Clark or videos of Clark or even her teammates, they're all getting, now again, that spotlight that is shining on Caitlin is shining on them and they're becoming, they're also getting the grocery store openings and the gas station openings that Katelyn can't do.

All these other players, these fever players, they get it. They're getting in and you get a fee for that. You get an honorarium. I have no idea what it is. I mean, who's not jumping in to the Indiana fever to take the ones that Katelyn can't do, right? And make money off of that and become a superstar and have all these eyeballs on you. So the fever players get it for sure. And there are a lot of people who want to play for Indiana because you're going to be able to get the deals. Sophie Cunningham with that hard hit. Now she's got endorsements, you know, like for protecting the house. Cause she protected the house.

I mean, she's got a big, I think she's got the ring ring camera thing. I mean, you know, that's significant and that's like Major League men's sports stuff, right. So the Indiana Fever anticipated it, they knew. I don't know how as a league, you do not look at the lines in January, February in the US, and both in 2023, but really 2024, her senior year. And my nieces were in that line for all of us at the University of Maryland. When Iowa would come to a city, Columbus, Ohio, Evanston, Illinois, my alma mater, Northwestern, University of Maryland, and people in the

cold, in line for hours to get in. It looked like a Springsteen concert or a Taylor Swift concert. And it's for a woman's basketball player. How on earth, if you're the WNBA, you're not looking at, hey, this is coming in like a month, two months, whatever the date would have been, you know, obviously it was early April, she's drafted, are we ready? And where was the NBA too?

Because the NBA is the big brother. They own 60% or so of the WNBA, either individual owners owning or the league. And they were caught flat-footed. In fact, beyond flat-footed, I'm just completely unprepared. And this is the moment. You know, apparently she's injured. I mean, I was doing a book event in Iowa.

Perfect. The one Iowa right now talking to you guys. And I missed the game game but I'm certainly seeing all the aftermath looks like she's injured again. Last time early in the year when she was injured missed five games. When Caitlin Clark disappears over half the TV audience disappears. I mean we've met that's not Tiger that's not that's not even Gretzky right? Half or more than half of an audience never have we seen an athlete have that much,

be so important to an entity or a league as Caitlin Clark is to the WNBA. So Christine, I have to ask, I know every good journalist will say, I don't want to be part of the story. And the bad journalist will say, I really want to be part of the story. And I know you're a good journalist and you don't want to be part of the story, but you became part of the story at one point. Can you explain what happened there? Sure. Absolutely. I write about in the book, the chapter title of controversy, really innovative. We went to the guy, let's just call it controversy. But I wanted, I have to say it because otherwise I think people would be angry if I get mad at me

for ducking it or something, right? So the real strategy, the quickest of situation, explain it. Desheneh Carrington is an opponent of Caitlin Clark, plays for the Connecticut Sun. Connecticut was playing Indiana in the playoffs, two games, Connecticut won both. The playoffs were over, Caitlin's season was done. In game one, right at the beginning,

Dijonnet Carrington kind of swats at Caitlin as she's passing, not shooting, and her fingers end up going into Caitlin Clark's eye. There's 10 million replays, millions of tweets and posts and conversation over the next day or two about this, many of them accusatory, saying that DeGeneres Carrington tried to injure Caitlin Clark. Clark stayed in the game. She ended up with a bit of a black eye.

Her shooting was off. She said, typical Caitlin, always taking the high road. I mean, what a role model she is for every kid on earth. Just spectacular how she handled this herself. Wasn't because of that, even if it was, we'll never know, but she just said, and that was it, I just was a little off, but you couldn't help but think it was

because she just got hit in the eye. But okay, so that happens, huge issue. Now 48 hours later, we have immediate availability. Dijonet Carrington's there in front of like 20, 30 of us on the court after practice and the questions are coming and no one seems to be asking about this. This is journalism 101, you must ask. Every athlete knows it's coming and most athletes understand, hey, I get asked, I can then clear the air, right? I can hit it out of the park

But if a league hasn't helped the players that the agent hasn't helped the players Understand that a journalist isn't necessarily the enemy the journalists can facilitate your answer even though that's not my role I ask it but you can take that and hit it out of the park run with it any which way you want Anyway, so I say to Dijon at Carrington, when that happened, kind of swatted at Caitlin Clark, did you intend to hit her in the eye? Did you intend to or not? Either way, could you describe what happened? I have to ask specifically because that then takes it right to the point that she can then go with her answer. Great answer. No, she did not do it on purpose, went on for 10, 15 seconds, great answer. I then followed up, there was something else going all over the internet showing Marina Mabry, her teammate

at the time, and Dijonet Carrington doing something with three fingers into the eye, kind of into their head. Right. Now that's called Three to the Dome. That's what Carmelo Anthony's gesture was in the NBA. But I, who knows? Because people are wondering, are they laughing at the eye poke? So I asked about that. Were you laughing about it? And then Dijonnet Carrington, I couldn't laugh because I didn't mean to do it. Fine. And then I put it on, I put the video on line. I think there's 5 million, 6 million views now. Of course I did because it's a new story and I'm covering the story. Easy thing to do.

And anyway, they, Vigeny Carrington got mad. There's a lot of people mad at me. That's nothing new as a journalist. It happened all the time in the NFL, the Olympic world for sure. It happens. And then the Players Association wanted to ban me. That was a shocker a few days later

for asking a question in America in 2024. And they failed miserably. They totally embarrassed themselves. And yeah, I'm probably the longest covering person, still standing, person who's covered the WNBA. And they wanted to ban the person who's still around, who's covered the WNBA the longest all the way back to the 90s. Again USA Today, of course, you know, obviously put out a strong statement defending me.

Jake Tapper on CNN defended me, wonderful other friends and people, Boston Globe columnist, Tara Sullivan. And again, they failed miserably. I had credentials. I'll be credentialed for the All-Star Game in a few days. But that shows, I mean, to me, it just shows their utter lack of understanding of what national scrutiny is. I was embarrassed for them and obviously it impacted me, not at all, but that's the story and again I think another example of the WNBA

sadly, guys this gives me no joy to talk about this right? I want the coverage of women's sports to be robust, and I hope that these women get their due. They haven't for decades. And instead, we're seeing this. So anyway, there's the story. Well, I want to follow up on this, because for those that are unfamiliar

with your career prior to doing the WNBA stuff extensively, like you worked for the Washington Post, and you covered the Redskins, and you mentioned you've done a bunch of different Olympic games. So you've got a breadth of coverage and knowledge and experience covering different sports, but covering them, as you said, in a robust way. So you apply that same standard to your coverage of the WNBA. Was the pushback that this is a different league, so it needs to be treated differently

than all those other leagues and entities that you've covered? There certainly it seemed to be treated differently than all those other leagues and entities that you've covered? There certainly, it seemed to be that was the point. How dare you do this? Megan Rapinoe, the women's soccer player who I've known, and we've even done an event together where I moderated and we're friendly, said on her podcast that my questions felt racist. Oh my God, really? Well, you know, like- Yeah, people, yeah.

Did that ask me if that bothered me? I mean, I couldn't, I didn't even take it seriously because, I mean, what on earth? Megan has been asked tough questions and answered them. So is she? And I like Megan. And she can call me anytime or text me anytime and talk about it. It's fine, It's her opinion. She has every right to say that the question felt racist. I mean, you know,

go, go ahead. Um, but the, uh, and obviously, you know, clearly it wasn't, let's make that crystal clear. Are they saying that you ask different questions of black women and white women? Are they saying that I should ask different questions? The questions, I've asked much tougher questions of male athletes, right? Much tougher. And other female athletes too. Is the point of the Players Association that you've got to ask softer questions of women? Is that where they really, that women can't handle the same questions as men in 2024, which this was September of 2024. Was that their message?

Is that a message you want to send to girls around the world? It's funny, Christine, because you, you know, you bring up Megan Rapinoe and, um, you know, as a women's Canada fan, I could not stand the American team. I thought they were cocky and arrogant. I didn't think they were good sports. They were good. And I always said at the time, I was like, that's good for the sport that we can go beyond like good for them. The girls are playing too, right? Like it, it, it, and, and, you know, people, I remember saying like, I don't like Megan Rapinoe. She's got a huge ego. And it was just me, first of all, I kind of think she does.

But second of all, I'm a Canada fan, and I want Canada to win. I don't want the Americans to win. And I think when you get to that point, it's good for the sport. But I remember hearing from people, they were like, well, you wouldn't say that about a male athlete. I'm like, I would, and I do every day. Like we talk about these issues. We talk about players that we don't like and players that we do like, and why don't we like this player?

And a lot of the times it comes down for me, it's like ego or something like that. Yeah, heroes and villains. Yeah, yeah. And it's part of the narrative. And I think to your point, it's good for women's sports when we get to that, because we can't just be like, good for them, they're playing too. Yeah. Oh, you'd never want that. And you know, the rivalries are great.

Oh, absolutely. I mean, the old Soviet Union, US rivalry in the Olympics. I'm glad the Soviet Union is gone, but you know, that was huge. Red Sox Yankees, U.S. Canada and women's hockey, as I said. Well, you know, whatever the date is of that game in February, we'll all be watching. Presumably they get, obviously they both get there, which they should. Yeah. I mean, it's on and on on it I mean how about the Canadians and the Soviets and and hockey you know back in the 70s those incredible games that we all in the US Well, how about Canada US right now in hockey? That one too. That is it's incredible even Vancouver. I was in my room

Gearing up for the closing ceremony at the Olympics in 2010 and all I had to do was open my window And listen, you know if there was a head on in my TV too, but like, you know, oh, there's cheering in the streets of Vancouver. I think the Canadians just scored, you know, and that's, that's how cool. I mean, I wanted, I would have liked to see the U S win, but I didn't really care that much. I'm a journalist and I had, you know, bigger fish to fry and it was great for the Olympics that it was Canada winning that gold in men's hockey in Vancouver. But how fun is that? What a memory that is 15 years later that, you know, I could hear the cheering in the streets. I love that. Yeah. So that's, that's all fine. All of this is fine.

I mean, they looked ridiculous with the trying to ban a journalist. But there, but yes, the hatred of an athlete or you pick one and you don't like the other one. We want women's sports. I mean, we don't want hatred and we certainly don't want threats. And you know, on X, so many of these women, especially the black women just get pummeled on social media. That's terrible. That's awful. We do not want that for anyone, but it is a reality of the cesspool that is X, you know, there we are but sure oh you love Caitlin Clark, you love Angel Reese. Caitlin obviously is so much more popular than Angel Reese. Angel cannot sell out her arena in Chicago unless Caitlin Clark or a couple other players come in and sell it out.

You know so you know but Angel is a force and people have opinions. That's great. That's great. I'm all for opinions and I've given mine as you guys know for years so that's not the issue. But Angel is a force and people have opinions. That's great. That's great. I'm all for opinions and I've given mine as you guys know for years. So that's not the issue. The issue is trying to ban a journalist and as I said, it totally failed miserably. It was a disaster for them and unfortunately they should have hopefully thought it through, but they didn't. And I did deal with it and probably so. But these women are tough, strong women.

They can handle questions. And I'm not sure why the Players Association wants to coddle them other than the fact that they don't really know what national scrutiny is. I'm not saying I'm Edward R. Murrow here, guys. But I am saying that a lot of the writers, and I go into this, when you cover a beat and if you're a young writer, young media person, some of them I mentored and helped over the years,

they may be a little more protective of the beat than someone who's been covering sports for all these years. And the NFL writers on all the newspapers that have WNBA teams, the editors did not put their NFL writers on the beat, right? They did not, they often put interns on the beat. And I loved interns. I was an intern four times during my days at Northwestern. But an intern is probably not going to be

the next Bob Woodward right then, the way that you would have your baseball or football writer or your Olympic writer who would ask tough questions right then. So the WNBA never under probably never got a good, good blast or dose of what real national journalism really, you know, significant journalism was not hateful journalism, just, just asking questions that needed to be asked. So then I come in and ask them and they want to ban me.

That's another growing pace. The WNBA has to meet the moment you've got the person and don't blow it. Don't let this pass and we'll see how it plays out over the next few years. Christine, this was fantastic. Thank you very much for taking the time to join us today. We really appreciate it. A reminder for all our listeners, the book is on her game, Caitlin Clark and the Revolution in Women's Sports. Christine, thanks again. This was fantastic. Oh, Mike Jason, thanks so much for having me. Take care.

You too. Thanks. That's Christine Brennan, columnist from USA Today, bestselling author here on the Halford and Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. You're listening to the best of Halford and Brough.