Halford & Brough in the Morning - The Canucks Have Won Three In A Row (We Are So Back?)

Episode Date: January 30, 2025

In hour one, Mike & Jason look back at the previous day in sports (3:00), they talk yesterday's big Canucks win over the Nashville Predators that finds Vancouver on a three-game winning streak (6:00), plus the boys chat more about the Pettersson & Miller saga (27:00). This podcast is produced by Andy Cole and Greg Balloch. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

Whoa, wait a minute, huh? Hold up, what? Oh, okay. Did we just lose a f***ing Canucks? Da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da- You're listening to Halford and Brough. The bottom of the circle, cuts off the wall through to the back door, they score! Linus Carlson tips it in for his first NHL goal! Sometimes it packs of people, positive people can overcome. There's a very low percentage of this that is smiles and glory hopes I think if he was going to come he probably would have come by now

Good morning Vancouver 601 on a Thursday. Happy Thursday everybody Jerry Jones made an intro It is Alfred in his bra it is sports net 650 We are coming you live from the kin tech studios and beautiful fairview slopes in Vancouver Jason. Good morning. Good morning Hey dog. Good morning. Good morning. Adog, good morning. Good morning. Laddie, good morning. Hello, hello. And intern Ryan, good morning as well.

Good morning. Alfred and Bruff in the morning is brought to you by Vancouver Honda, Vancouver's premier destination for Honda customers. They have a friendly, knowledgeable staff that can help with anything you're looking for, sales, financing, service, or parts. We are in hour one of the program. Hour one is brought to you by North Star Metal Recycling Vancouver's premier metal recycler pays

the highest prices on scrap metal North Star Metal Recycling they recycle you get paid visit them at 1170 Powell Street in Vancouver we are coming to you live from the Kintec studio Kintec footwear and orthotics working together with you in step three guests today on the program. First hour is all uninterrupted Halbrows. We will look back on Vancouver, Connecticut's big victory in Nashville last night. Guest list begins at seven o'clock. Joshua Cloak from the athletic NHL writer is

going to join the program. We will talk to him about a feature piece he had out last week. In the NHL, boozing is out, Jason. Um in the NHL Boozing is out Jason Edible cannabis and video games are in what really nice. It's true So it's just some the headlines very grabby But there is some very interesting stuff in the piece about the sort of new style of NHL team bonding What guys do away from the rink to socialize and to unwind and the old guys are like no

No, drink more do this stuff. That's bad for your body Drink so we'll talk to Josh about that at 7 o'clock 730 Brandon Astle is gonna join the program Abbotsford Canucks play by play man the Halford and Breft Jinx is alive and well yesterday I said hey Abbotsford Canucks are on an eight game win streak They're in Coachella Valley tonight going for nine. They had a lead going into the third. Let's get Brandon on the show. They lost that game 5-2. So the eight game win streak is over however Abbotsford has vaulted itself back into a playoff spot

in the AHL. Been a great last couple weeks for the team so we'll check in with Brandon Astle about everything that's going on with the AHL Abbotsford Canucks at 7.30. Eight o'clock, Thomas Drantz from the Athletic Vancouver and Canucks talk right here on Sportsnet 650. We will look back on the big win last night. Third in a row for the Vancouver Canucks. First time since early November that they've done that.

We'll talk to the Drantz about that and everything involving JT Miller and Elias Pedersen. All the latest, Thomas Drantz will join us at everything involving JT Miller and Elias Patterson, all the latest. Thomas Drantz will join us at eight o'clock for that. Only a single giveaway today on the program. We are giving away a pair of tickets to the Clayton Public House and a $50 gift card to the Clayton Public House for the big football game

on Sunday, February the 9th. All you gotta do is be caller number nine at 815 this morning. The phone number here 604-280-0650. That number again 604-280-0650. Caller number nine at 815-815 this morning. We'll get a pair of tickets and a $50 gift card to the Clayton Public House for the big football game. Working in reverse real quick on the guest list. Eight oclock Thomas Drance 730 Brandon Astle 7 o'clock Josh cloak is going to join the program. That's what's happening on the program today laddie. Let's tell everybody what happened Hey, did you guys see the game last night?

What happens when you miss that? You miss that? What happens? What Happens is brought to you by the BC Construction Safety Alliance. Making safety simpler by giving construction companies the best in tools, resources, and safety training. Visit them online at bccsa.ca. Linus Carlson scored his first ever NHL goal. Vancouver Canucks beat the Preds 3-1 on Wednesday night. Demko 31 saves Hughes to assist. Here's the kicker, the Canucks have won three

straight for the first time since November 7th. A span of 40 games and they moved ahead of the Calgary Flames for the second and final wild card spot in the Western Conference. So back baby, so back. Okay the Canucks did open the scoring seven minutes into the first on one of their prettiest goals of the season. So back. After Elias Pedersen, great defensively, perfect positioning as usual, blocked a shot in his own end and he started a rush with Quinn Hughes and Nils Holglunder.

Petey passed it to Hughes, who passed it back to Pedy, who passed it back to Hughes, who passed it to Holglinder, who made a really nice move to get clean into the slot. Remember the slot? Slot's really important. Got to get to that slot. Slot shots. And he buried it past Saros while Linus Carlsen screened the Preds goalie. A lot of good stuff on that goal. Let's see more of that, fellas.

Now, unfortunately, the Preds answered back soon after that goal when Susie tried to pinch in and well he got caught. Leaving Juleson back to defend a two-on-one which is never a good thing. Demko stopped the original shot but Tommy Nowak was able to bury a big rebound when Pius, well he's not the fastest guy out there, suitor, was unable to get back and tie up Novak's stick. Early in the second though, Linus Carlsen, you mentioned it here, scored his first goal in the NHL. Great job by him at the tender age of 25 and just a terrific trade by Jim Benning. What's Jonathan Dahlon doing these days?

He over in Sweden? Yeah. Or maybe. Tyler Myers got the assist with his perfect cross-ice pass to Carlson as the Myers post suspension resurgence continues. Carlson was standing all by himself beside Sarros, but I think I threw this out on social media. Great job by Holglunder and Carlson to keep repositioning themselves around Saros. And I was thinking of what Ray was saying on our show earlier in the week where he was saying like,

it's not always just the guy passing the puck, it's the guys who are receiving the pass, they've got to keep their feet moving. They got to keep moving. What happened was the Preds got caught puck watching when Myers got it on the sideboards and the Preds were like, Myers, this guy's hot, we got to watch him. And they didn't realize that Carlson had moved himself right beside Soros.

You know, Meyers makes the pass and Carlson is wide open and he puts it in. Hughes, by the way, with another point on the play, Pedersen with another plus. Fatshah Demko held on after that and he was probably the biggest story of the game for the Canucks. Number one, the fact that he got the start when a lot of people were wondering if he'd get another start before the four nations break, but, uh, you know, he didn't allow another goal after Carlson scored and made some great saves in, in

the process, the Canucks did not have a great third period. They kind of sat back. He ends up stopping 31 of 32 shots in what was clearly his best start of the season. And suffice to say, if Demko can find his game, the Canucks have a way better chance of making the playoffs and in fact, this morning they wake up and they're in that second wild card spot.

Now we got Drantzer coming up later on the show and he might say like, yeah, but based on points percentage, Calgary still has it by a bit, but come on Drantz, stop being such a Drantz. The Canucks are in a second wild card spot right now. Yeah. So I think you're right of the numerous talking points in which we'll get to over the next

20 minutes or so, I think Demko was the number one story. I was very surprised when I saw Murph tweet out that Demko was going to over the next 20 minutes or so. I think Demko was the number one story. I was very surprised when I saw Murph tweet out that Demko was gonna be the starter in Nashville last night. He had lost four of his previous five starts. He was very sharp against the Predators and here's the key, very sharp to start the game. He turned aside 12 of 13 shots in the first period

and I don't know if everyone in Listener Land is aware of this or not, but this team collectively has had problems starting games well this season. Goalies are otherwise. So for Demko not just to have a strong game, but to hold down the forward early, that was a big step in the right direction.

I wanna play some audio now because he did a walk-off interview with Murph in the aftermath. See if he can pick up some of the interesting nuggets from this one. Here's Thatcher Demko talking to Dan Murphy after a big win in Nashville on Wednesday night. You know I think we've been kind of battling that consistency all year and um you know we had some internal meetings about it being that time of year we got to string some games together here and

getting the last three is huge for us so uh big test last leg of the trip here in Dallas and you know hopefully make it four. I know Nashville hasn't had the season they've wanted, but with power play out there, they've got a lot of different options who can really hurt you, don't they? Yeah, I mean, the league's funny that way. There's so many good players,

and sometimes it just doesn't go your way one season or another, but yeah, they got a lot of star power on that first unit and throughout their lineup. And obviously they got juice in it, solid every night. So it's not a team you can take lightly. You got to show up and do all the right things. You get the win and you draw the penalty that leads to the insurance power play goal, which I joke a little bit, but just what are the things you want to see more consistently from

your teammates or that you have seen in the last few games that are getting you guys in the right direction? Yeah, I think we've done a really good job just playing connected. You know, playing as five, it goes zone to zone. You know, the quicker we can get back for a breakout and help each other the better and goes through the neutral zone and on the offensive zone too. So just continue that stuff and obviously special teams is huge. Internal meetings, Thatcher, whatever could you guys be talking about in those internal meetings? Whatever the case, there has been a noted uptake

over the last three games in certain areas. It's not a perfect product by any stretch. And Tocket, I won't play the audio of that, but he acknowledged as such in the post-game media availability. Tocket didn't look super enthusiastic after the game. They relied on their goalie a lot for that one, a lot. And their goalie responded and Taka did give a tip of the cap to Demko.

I said he's a world-class elite goalie. This is what he's going to give you when he's on his game. You know who he was most enthusiastic about? Tyler Myers. Tyler Myers, yeah. His eyes lit up. Yeah. He's such a great guy. He said he loved you.

I said he loved Myzee. I love you. I mean, fair enough. He's been lovable the last few games ever since coming back from suspension. And again, I mean, we've had people text into the Dunbar Lumber text message in basket this morning being like, you know, Tyler Meise has been great over the last few games, but is any of this sustainable?

Is any of this sustainable probably goes for the entire team because we've been hoodwinked before. I'm trying to straddle that line between optimism, which is always a good thing. And you wanna try and be positive despite the general tone of this show. And then the other part of it, which is, well, one, the looming cloud over this team,

which is the J.T. Miller, Elias Pedersen situation, which has been exacerbated by what the president of Hockey Ops had to say this week. And the fact that for all the good performances this team has had this year, there's been an equal number of bad performances. And I know a three game win streak is good and I know they haven't done it in a long time. I know you have to go all the way back to November 7th.

Again, as I mentioned, a span of 40 games to find a stretch where they bank points like this, But you gotta build somewhere, and you gotta start with something. And if this is it, if this will be the start of where the team, at the very least, can put forth consistent efforts and not lay gigantic eggs and stinkers in between, then I'm a happy guy for at least one morning.

I do enjoy that this three game winning streak has made people go over and over and in their heads what was Jim Rutherford thinking when he did that interview? Was it just, take it as literal, like Jim Rutherford is sitting there, there's no solution, we're going to try to trade one of these guys or was it a 3D, 4D chess that Jim Rutherford was playing? Like he was sitting there going, okay, well, trademark it isn't very good right now. We don't love the offers.

So he was like laying out how grim it would be, even bringing into the equation, possibly losing Quinn Hughes and saying, listen, like, you know, if we trade one of these guys, we're going to have to get a center back, but it's probably not going to be a good center. It might even be a 3C. I mean, he went all the way to pretty much,

we were like, the team's going to suck for the next couple of years. We're paraphrasing at this point. Yeah, no, no, no. But he went that far. I don't think he said suck. Oh, man. Things are going to be bad.

He's like, well, it's not going to be bad for me, because I'm probably going to just retire. But you guys are going to be stuck with this awful team to the point where he whipped up such anger and frustration among certainly, you know, our show and a lot of the fans. Like, was that his whole point where people were going to shame Elias Pedersen and JTT. Miller into figuring out a solution for this.

Yeah, who knows what his MO was with the entire thing. Shame is a powerful motivator. It's true. That's how I was raised. Yeah. Shame. Shame. And I turned out great.

Yeah. Look at him now. You're Catholic too? Look at the heights that he's reached. Again, all I know is that there was an intentionality with what Rutherford was doing. There was very, there was no mincing of words. There was no ambiguity.

He was laying it out, he was laying it bare for all to see. And I wouldn't be surprised if part of the MO with that was, hey, we've reached everyone's breaking point, maybe everyone's low point. Let's just be bold and let's just throw it all out there. And here's the thing, maybe he didn't know what the end game was gonna be. Maybe it was like a choose your own adventure,

but let's see what happens here. But you gotta do something at that point. I think that might've been his mentality on this because here's the other side of the coin. Yesterday in Nashville, JT Miller was approached by Preds reporters, not Canucks reporters, because there's none of them on the road. Preds reporters asking about Jim Rutherford's recent remarks and if he had any response to them. The back and forth was kind of testy and rather brief.

Here it is now. JT Miller speaking to the Nashville media about what Jim Rutherford had to say to the Globe and Mail earlier this week. What's your reaction to Jim Rutherford's comments yesterday or this week on the situation with you and Petey? I don't know. You don't have any comments? No.

Is there still all good between you two guys? I don't have a comment. I didn't think JT Miller had his best game. Is there still an all good between you two guys? I'm not confident I got this. I didn't think JT Miller had his best game. I think he did win an important face off at the end of the game. But overall, didn't notice him, certainly as much as some other players out there. I did think Pedersen had a good game. It looked like he was trying to do what the coaching staff has been telling him to do and that's move his feet, have some energy with the puck, hold onto pucks, make plays.

Again, that first goal that he was actively involved in was one of the nicest goals. I've seen the Connect score all season. So, you know, I think that was promising. Um, but you also have to consider the opponent. Like Nashville has not been a very good team this year. And the previous opponent, St. Louis, they're likely to miss the playoffs this season.

And, you know, after that Canucks game, it was deemed that they were such a problem that, and we mentioned this yesterday, but Brandon Saad was put on waivers and the team got backscated. I mean, people in St. Louis were not happy with that, um, with that performance by the blues. Trying not to take credit away for the Canucks, but let's set up, let's set up their, their schedule, um, before they go into the four nations break,

when some things could happen. Mm-hmm. You know, that's a long time for guys to start talking trades. I don't know if there are any rules, roster freezes during the four nations, but you know, it's still time for things to be discussed. So Friday they play in Dallas against a very good Stars team, but is Heiskenen hurt? Is, I mean, he didn't. Well, he got hurt.

They still don't have word on what the medical diagnosis is yet on Heiskenen. Okay. Stars of one three straight, including two over Vegas. Now they're home after that for two games against Detroit and Colorado. And then they go down to San Jose to play the Sharks and then their last game before the four nations break is at home on a Saturday versus the Toronto Maple Leafs. Four o'clock start on that one guys, four o'clock start.

Hope you don't get too angry with that. Um, so, you know, I did think it was, uh, interesting, but also kind of entertaining that when that Jim Rutherford interview first came out, it was like, bombshell, this is crazy. He's actually saying all this and you know, the immediate reaction was obvious. Like, you know, for us, for me, it was like, trade both these guys. Yep. But now that it's been out there for a while and people have been able to, you know, mull it around in their brains and, you know, media guys have come on and said things like this. Have you heard this? Like, Jim Rutherford never does anything without intention.

Mm-hmm. You know? Yep. And people are like, oh, okay, well, what's his intention? Is he playing a different game here? Maybe he's so out of answers. Yep. Maybe he's so out of answers that this is him trying to galvanize the team around something. Yeah. Maybe it's galvanizing it around disdain for management. I don't know. The Preds last season,

the team the Canucks just played, they canceled a concert and everyone was like, there's your turnaround. Right? Sure. St. Louis Blues, when they won the Stanley Cup, they were a dead last team in the NHL and they had a fight in practice and that flipped everything around. Right? Sometimes those flash points happen. Here's where I'm going to tap the breaks on that. I'll even though I said after a three game winning streak, we are so, so back. This is not my theory, by the way. My theory.

I just want to throw that out there that a lot of people are saying about it and I have time to hear it, but I still think like, they're probably going to need to do something. Yeah. Because the last three games, while great and fun at times, I mean, and Brandon in Vancouver, kudos to you for texting in exactly what I was going to say in this moment. I think the biggest difference between winning and losing in those three games wasn't necessarily what the players did on the ice. It was the goaltending was exceptional. Like Lankton was solid, rock solid in his two starts. I say he was great against Washington on

Saturday night. Demco was fantastic last night. That was the sort of vintage Demco performance that you didn't get in that previous stretch where he lost four or five starts. So I don't think that, you know, there's, I don't think there's any correlation between what the president of hockey ops had to say to the Globe and Mail and then what the guys have done on the ice over the last few games. I still think that there's going to be an element of what's in the room is broken and it's not going to be fixed.

And it's a bit naive to suggest that wins are gonna fix it because the issue between Miller and Pedersen has gone on for so long. And I think the key to the Globe and Mail interview was that Rutherford acknowledged that they're not gonna fix it. And in the subsequent followup article, Gary Mason had another one in the Globe and Mail

and we can get into that on the other side of the break as well. He kind of dove a little bit deeper, Jim Rutherford that is, as to specifically what the club has done to try and fix it. Like, you know, the target has been tasked and might be a correlation between how exasperated he's looked at times this year to how much he's probably had to spend and expend a lot of energy working on an interpersonal relationship. Rutherford basically said meeting after meeting after meeting with these players, trying to figure it out. So imagine like an NHL head coach who has

a laundry list of things that he needs to get accomplished. You know, there's 23 guys on the roster. You've got to do a variety of things, meetings with your own coaches, and then you've got to take a lot of extra time and effort and energy to try and mend fences between two guys. Which is why there's been speculation out there. And I've certainly wondered it. I have no reason to believe it or believe it not, but like, I wonder if, if Taukett isn't back next

season, is it his decision as opposed to the Canucks? With all the stuff. Like if you're, if you're a head coach and Tocket would want a big contract extension, right, with term, lots of money, but also a chance to win. And if he's having all these constant conversations with these two players, like he's a grade six elementary school teacher, you know, and I don't know if he brought in the parents or anything like that, but, uh, you know, it's one of those things where they, can I, can I go to battle with these guys?

Like I want to win a Stanley Cup. I don't want to just get, get to the playoffs. You know, I, can I, can I win a cup with these guys? Can I compete with these guys on my team? And if not, I think I might have value somewhere else. And I could tell a pretty good story coach of the year. And then, you know, my players were, well, you know what the players were. It's out there and like, give me a job with guys that are all

committed and all in the same team. I don't care if they all love each other, but they have to work well together. And I think I can do some good things. I mean, I think that question was answered with what Rutherford said this week. Cause I'm pretty sure that at a certain point the major task masters in the organization, let's say the big three or Rutherford, Alvin and Tauke. And they would obviously be intimately

familiar with this situation. And you would think at a certain point, the three of them were like, okay, this isn't getting resolved. We've tried, we've put in a lot of time and effort and at a certain point, you're just chasing, you're just chasing bad energy with worse energy, trying to fix it.

So I still, like, I'm with you on this. Unless it's something in the neighborhood of a 20 game winning streak where they're like, well, we can't break this thing up now. We're on pace to set an NHL record. It always comes back to the same. It's like, don't be fooled by the mirage. Don't be fooled by a small sample size or a

heater or anything. Understand that there's a big issue here and it does need to be fixed. That's where I think that it was just a breaking point thing more than anything else. But we are happy to hear anyone who disagrees. You can text into the Dunbar Lumber Text Line at 650-650 Metro Vancouver's Trust of Choice for

Contractors and Rent-A-Warriors for over 50 years, visit them at one of their three locations to serve you or online at dunbarlumber.com. So we'll go up, we'll go into the follow-up piece. It's from the same interview. Gary didn't interview Rutherford again. It's just things that were left over that didn't

make the original story. He talked about what he said to Pedersen when he signed that contract. And he also goes into the Nikita Zdorov situation with Gary. So we'll talk about that. And we'll talk about some of the other stories around the NHL from last night.

And again, we'll dip into the Dunbar-Limber text line and we will read your texts on the Halferd and Bruff show on Sportsnet 650. Canucks talk with Jamie Dodd and Thomas Drance. We'll dive deep into all that's happening with the Vancouver Canucks. Listen 12 to 2 PM on Sportsnet 650 or wherever you get your podcasts. Three on two for the Caddocks. Patterson, left wing for Hughes. Back of the high slot, Hoglander scores! Niels Hoglander trailing the play, got a wrister on net with a good screen by Linus Carlsen in front.

And the Caddocks lead one to nothing. 6.30 on a thrash Thursday here on the Haliford & Breff show on Sportsnet 650. Haliford & Breff of the morning is brought to you by Vancouver Honda, Vancouver's premier destination for Honda customers. They have a friendly, knowledgeable staff that can help with anything you're looking for, sales, financing, service, or parts. We are in hour one of the program. No guests in hour one, it's just me, Halford, him, Ruff. Hour one of this program is brought to you by North Star Metal Recycling.

Vancouver's premier metal recycler pays the highest prices on scrap metal. North Star Metal Recycling, they recycle, you get paid. Visit them at 1170 Powell Street in Vancouver. You know why I think this story between Miller and Pedersen has blown up so much? Do you know how when we talk about food on this show, food, like everyone has an opinion, talk about food on this show. Food. Like everyone has an opinion.

Yes. We can talk about something sports wise and people are like, you know, I don't really know much about that. I don't really have an opinion on that. But when we talk about food, you know, when we say like, what are the best fast food restaurants, especially our listenership.

They're like. In box blows up. They're like, here's where I can participate. Yeah. It's the same thing with apples, although less cause they're healthy, but I see what They're like. In box blows up. They're like, here's where I can participate. It's the same thing with apples, although less, because they're healthy, but I see what you're saying. So Dan texts in and he goes, I don't get along with my ex-wife, but pay me 11 million and I will do her laundry. Grow up, look outside the box of the thousands that struggle to even feed themselves. And basically he's saying, figure it out. Sure.

And this is something that you came up with the other day and I was like, you got to say this on the show. My general thought on this is the reason that so many people are so attracted to this particular story is because everyone believes, everyone believes that they have either been in a toxic workplace environment, toxic relationship, toxic marriage, whatever. Everyone feels like they can relate to this particular story because they've all had to deal with someone they don't get along with. Yeah, someone that's just their opposite or what I was talking about the other day,

like someone that just. Your kryptonite. Triggers you. Yeah. Right? You can say, all right, I know that for the good of the situation, I need to keep my composure. As far as talking points go, if I'm to throw out

there and like, maybe it's time for Carson Soucy to sit a game, that resonates with some of you. But if I say, Hey, there's two guys on the Canucks that hate each other. And it's blown up to the point where it might be ruining the team in the workplace. All of you are like, that happened to me. Donna from accounting don't care for like those

things are out there. Yeah. And she, she showed up to work out of shape. Yeah. Didn't give for her. Like those things are out there. Yeah. She showed up to work out of shape. Yeah. Didn't give it her all. Carrying the responsibility she should have carried. But I was just trying to motivate Donna from accounting and then saying, Donna, you got to get

into shape. And for some reason she took that wrong. And now HR is involved. And in this case, HR is Rick Tocket, and to a certain degree, Jim Rutherford. But it is very interesting. And I know that was Ryan's what we learned yesterday, was I couldn't believe the volume of text

that we get in to the Dunbar Lumber text message in basket. And I said, look, to be clear, I think that this is a situation that is very unique because of that exact fact, that so many people are going to weigh in on this. And you really see it on social media, right? People will oftentimes relate it to their, it's a personal anecdote.

And you know, the workplace environment is one that always gets referenced. Relationships either like friends or romantic or otherwise, those sometimes get mentioned as well. Everyone, everyone though, much like the fast food conversation and the best Apple conversation, feels like they can weigh in on this one because everyone feels like they've gone through something like this. Now, the stakes are entirely different. The dynamics in a, especially with Patterson and Miller are incredibly unique, incredibly unique. But I think at its core, it's about

two people that can't get along and then how that negative energy can break down the like component parts around them. Cause that's what we're talking about. Yeah. You know? Should we talk about Rutherford's interview with Gary Mason and some of the leftover stuff that made a secondary column? So, um, Rutherford told Gary Mason that he

warned Pedersen when he signed that big contract in March, that it would only make things harder for him. And he said, he told Pedersen he would have to be more prepared, both mentally and physically as a result. And here's the quote from Rutherford. And he didn't get to that level coming right out of his contract and into training camp. But now he understands that with the talent he has and his understanding now of what it takes to Excel.

He'll get that at some point. Now you can also read this as Rutherford trying to salvage the asset value of the company. his understanding now of what it takes to excel, he'll get that at some point. Now you can also read this as Rutherford trying to salvage the asset value for Elias Pedersen. I'm not really buying that one from Jimbo because the, I think. I am 1000% buying the fact that Pedersen did not show up to camp in the type of shape that the

Canucks wanted because they have essentially said that and Rick, talk, and remember camp in the type of shape that the Canucks wanted because they have essentially said that. And Rick talk, and remember earlier in the season when it was like, we got a plan with PD and the plan is work. Um, now people will push back and say like, he had tendonitis and he said he had tendonitis. Why doesn't this team listen to him? Well, clearly there's a disconnect there.

There's a disconnect there. So that disconnect, if it hasn't been solved already, it will need to be solved. But you know, a lot of people have said, um, you know, like why, why, why does Petey look different out there? And you know, some will say it's the tendonitis and it's as simple as that.

You know, for me, he doesn't look like he's never been quote unquote powerful, but he doesn't look like he's never been quote unquote powerful, but he doesn't look like he has any burst. Now that could be the tendonitis, but it could also be he's not fit. He's not strong enough. He doesn't have the energy it requires to work throughout the length of a long shift. That's the president of hockey ops saying that

Pedersen didn't show up to camp in good enough shape. Yeah, that part's fine. It was more like the chronology of it, the timeline, because you've pointed out on a number of occasions, it wasn't when he signed the contract, when his game fell off the cliff, there were signs well before that. That's when they started leaning on him to sign

the contract. Sure, but even before that. It was at the All-Star game, right? That's the they started leaning on him to sign the contract sure but even before that mmm It was at the all-star game, right? Yeah, that's the turning point And that's when I think they really started to pressure him to sign yeah And then he had an incredible stretch in was it January when they went back yet, and the lotto line was together, okay? What okay? Let's put it this way I? Think that there were signs that something was amiss with the player prior to signing the deal.

Yes. Yes. Yes. And then the way that Rutherford's framing it here, to me, it made it sound like this was like more of a recent phenomena. Like it started this season, like coming into camp. I'm like, no, no, no. I think that it might've been institutional knowledge passed along to those guys, frankly. Yeah. I mean,, no, no, no. I think that it might've been institutional knowledge passed along to those guys.

Possibly. Yeah. I mean, and don't get me wrong. I mean, one thing he's bang on about is that the moment that Pedersen put pen to paper, uh, expectations changed, pressure heightened, and things were undoubtedly going to get harder. If the player didn't know that, that's a bit of

a red flag. And if the president of hockey ops is warning him, just be like, just so you know, and the player's like, no, I know, as opposed to just so you know, and the player's like, really? Like, it's a very, very, really is gonna get harder? That to me is-

There's gonna be more expectations when I'm a top five highest paid player in the league. Are people gonna refer to me solely by my cap hit moving forward? That's gonna happen to me? He didn't know that would happen. Right, but that's what I'm a top five highest paid player in the league. Are people going to refer to me solely by my cap hit moving forward? That's going to happen to me. He didn't know that would happen. Right. But that's what I'm saying. Like I think Rutherford had an institutional knowledge of the NHL, that this is how it works.

This is what happens when you sign these big money deals. You get identified by your contract. So did that contribute to the Pedersen Miller rift? I know we speculated on that on yesterday and, well, Canucks Reddit certainly ran with it. Yeah. As if it was pure fact. But, you know, I, again, I had heard a few things

that, but I got to hear so much crazy stuff right now. And I, you know, I do wonder if, okay. Remember when we talked about, this is probably last year and we had guests on the show, guys like Ray Ferraro, and we asked questions like, what does it mean to hold each other accountable? Right. And there would be stories told about players only meetings and guys, you know, being pretty honest in there and being pretty candid and saying like, you need to pick your game up. Okay?

You need to pick your game up. What did we all conclude? That is a good thing, holding each other accountable. And that's what leadership groups do. And that's what good dressing rooms do. They complete the sentence, they hold each other accountable. And sometimes that's uncomfortable.

The dynamic that was at play there though. I mean, there's like an obvious situation there where Miller is one of the leaders and maybe feels it's part of his job or has even been tasked with trying to hold Pedersen accountable and maybe he goes a little overboard with it. Well, the- And Pedersen doesn't like it. The important part you brought up there was the last part where you said he was tasked with it, because that's the one thing that we do sort of know that goes all the way back from that October

report from Elliott Friedman, where he was on 32 thoughts saying that this was pretty clear designation of tasks from Alvina Rutherford or Tocket who, and let's be honest, it's probably a salient move, wanted to hold Pedersen to account and push and prod him, but they didn't want it coming from up on high. They wanted it to come from the peer group, because I think they understood, having been around NHL teams before, that when it comes from your peers, it resonates more. Traditionally, historically,

and you mentioned the room back in 2011, that AV didn't have to go in there a lot, because of police itself, and it held each other to account. And I think a lot of, especially older NHL executives have looked to the past and said, the best room was the one that takes care of itself and the coach doesn't have to come in there and you know, fire the guys up or dress them down. So there was a little bit of a push from the management and the management group

and the coaching staff to have the players hold each other to account. Now in this particular instance, this is where the rift might've grown because I think hindsight being 2020 a more salient approach would have been like, don't have the guys that already have a fractured personal relationship, try and push one another, have one push the other. That might not be the right dynamic. That might be adding fuel to the fire.

And he's very enthusiastic about it. Right, like he loves, loves getting on his case. It's his favorite thing. He loves doing it. He asks us if he can do it more often. And it didn't work. It did not work. Could we have lockers installed in Roger's Arena

so I could shove a guy in the locker? It's very old school. That's what some of the renovations were about. Are we allowed to do swirlies? Is that still okay? Can we do those? But that's what I'm, I mean, that's, that is where, and again, we go back to the pushback

that a lot of people have had against how management has handled that. I do think that there is valid criticism there if you wanna poke holes in the approach. Is that, you know, you have to be very, you have to be very cautious of what a locker room dynamic is. And by that, I mean, oftentimes,

like if you're gonna say the room is going to handle itself, then the room's gotta handle itself. You can't step in every now and again and be like, you might want to try this. Or, you know, here's a suggestion. Here's an idea. Like let him figure it out. Means let him figure it out. And meddling doesn't often like jive with that.

And then Peter and Cloverdale texts in, did we get rid of the veteran good guys in the room too quickly? Possibly. I mean, Dolly Wells come on the show for the better part of what, a year and a half now, every Friday. And I've lost track of the amount of times that he said this wouldn't have happened with guys

like Tanev or Horvat or some of the veterans in the room. Ian Cole. What a leader. Luke Shen. Take your pick. Shenner. Take your pick. Great leader.

And this is why, this is why throughout the course of the Benning era, that he made the moves to go and overpay for character and leadership and veteran presence. Cause it is important, right? The problem there was that it was way too much money and it was on a team that quite frankly, wasn't even like high end enough

to try and keep everybody in line. Like it was just a bad hockey team. Okay. Well, one of those guys that a lot of people are pining for on the ice, but also in the room is Nikita Zadorov. And here's another thing that Jim Rutherford mentioned in his interview with Gary Mason and, you know, Rutherford acknowledged, yeah, the defense is not as good as it should be, but he was

asked what happened with Zdorov. And here's the story that Zdorov, that Rutherford said. At the end, Zdorov was talking close with Tauquet while Alveen was talking to his agent. Tauquet would ask him, what is it going to take you? What is it going to take to keep you here? And then he would say, well, I'men was talking to his agent. Tauke would ask him, what is it gonna take you? What is it gonna take to keep you here?

And Zdorov said he had to get his contract to five million annually and then he'd be set. So we got him to five million, but then there was still no deal. So Rick, Tauke said to him, what's going on? And then he said, well, if I can get to six years, then I'll stay. Same process.

We said, okay. So twice in that process, he said, give me that one more thing and I'll stay. And then we give it to him and then he goes to Boston. So. There's a decidedly different take on the negotiations. Yeah. I mean, there are very two sides to the story

because Nikita Zadorov said soon after he signed with the Bruins that he thought he was going to resign in Vancouver and he actually felt disrespected by the negotiations. He said, we wanted to stay at the start. We tried to sort it out, but there's points in negotiations when you check boxes and then a couple of things didn't go the way we wanted to,

kind of felt a little bit disrespectful too, it didn't work out. So he said, he said on that one. I think it's all perception though and perspective. Cause I have like back in the day when we actually used to chase stories and stuff like that, long, long time ago. You never chase stories.

I talk to agents every now and again, and I would marvel at the fact sometimes of how entrenched those guys could get in just their particular view of a situation or a scenario. Like their sole purpose, sole purpose was to find the best deal for their client. And nothing else really mattered aside from that, right? They weren't really

the big picture perspective kind of guys. They weren't really like, I'm interested in hearing, you know, alternate theories or ideas or whatever. Like they're very much entrenched in getting the best deal for their guys. And I do know that when you're talking about players that are this highly and well compensated and have the egos that they do,

like they don't like things like when they, the perception comes that they're not the number one priority or that they're being cast to the side or that teams might be doing things that they judge to be more important or have more value or take precedent above you. I got a feeling that the Canucks probably felt like from their perspective, they gave Zdorov what he wanted based on his asks.

And in Zdorov's position, I bet he was probably thinking like, I had to constantly go back and ask for this. Why did this take so long? Well, yeah, right? And both parties might be right based on their perspectives, but when you hear them talk about it, you're like, how could they be so far apart

when they really weren't that far apart? Because the contract that the Zdorov signed in Boston was six years 30 million Maybe the connects were just breaking up with Milstein could be You got to consider it They have cut ties they have become way less reliant on the gold star empire, right? Like it used to be how many milstein clients that they have at one point 12 13 lots. I'm not even joking I mean it was it was about that high. Oh, it was Kuzmenko, it was Mikhailov, a Milstein guy?

Yep. Yeah, yeah. Now they got Max Sassen. Yeah, and Klimovich. Right. Okay, that's it though. Yeah, he's got 14 guys for him. We were joking like Milstein was the assistant general manager for a while. He was in the running for it, if I'm not mistaken. Okay, so a couple other follow ups

that I wanted to get to from last night. One, in the interest of objectivity and fairness and the fact that we're not slanted media here on the Halford and Brough Show on Sportsnet 650, the Canucks won that game last night and I still want to point out, it was one of the most poorly officiated games I've seen in an awfully long time.

Jilane Abert, and I forget who the other referee was, were awful last night. They missed three high sticks, if I'm not mistaken. And here's what, is the rule, just to clarify it for me, folks, is the rule that you can only go to video review on a missed high stick call if there's clear blood present? Okay. Is that the rule?

You do we know? Because in the Blues game the previous night, Robert Thomas got clipped with a high stick. And look, I know the guy lost a tooth, but I've never seen anyone stay down for as long as he stayed down while the play was going on. That hurts. It hurts. But there was a there was a definite element.

I want to make sure that the referee see what's going on here. Right. He took forever. It hurts. But there was a definite element, I wanna make sure that the referee see what's going on here, right? He took forever to get up, he took forever to get to the bench. I'm putting it out there, I don't care. Skewer me, St. Louis radio. I'm putting it out there. Hit you in the face with a stick

and see how long you stay down. It obviously hurt, he lost a tooth. Let's do this, please. Yeah, please. We have a stream. It's an experiment, we're doing an experiment. We are streaming, we might as well. There was definitely an element of,

you missed a high stick on me, and I'm gonna take, this is gonna be very drawn out. And what happened, they went to Video Review, they gave us a double minor on the call, right? I don't know why the same rule couldn't have been applied last night on one of the numerous high sticks that happened. The Susie one is probably the most egregious, although the four board one wasn't good either.

And I know Sat and Vic were talking about it on the post game show. Also the cross check on Hronik that was missed. And there was a bunch of calls missed the other way as well. I just thought they had a terrible night altogether. What else happened in the NHL last night? Let's go through. Should we talk about the Kings falling on hard times? Well, I mentioned it yesterday.

Drew Doughty's back, that's how you describe it. No, yeah. Well, Drew Doughty is back. Brandt Clark, by the way, was a healthy scratch, which is interesting. And they lost three nothing to the Florida Panthers. And then all of a sudden, if you look at the standings, the Kings are just

two points up on the Canucks. Now they've got two games in hand, so their winning percentage or their points percentage is not significantly higher, but it's not just a tick higher, it's higher. But I do wonder what's going on with the Kings right now. but I do wonder what's going on with the Kings right now. So I mentioned this on Tuesday's show, coming in after they lost 5-2 in Detroit on Monday. And I was saying like, keep an eye on this one because whatever really good vibes they had through November and December, where they racked off a lot of wins,

and they were really good at the end of December, actually. It seems to have flatlined and their scoring's flatlined. And it was funny, like I was listening to one of the guys on SiriusXM, one of the Kings analysts talking, it's like they've kind of, it's a very, they've kind of turned into what happened last year. Like they had a good run, but then the style of play just flatlines. Like the, the really like low event. last year, like they had a good run, but then the style of play, just flat lines, like the really like low event, stop me if you've heard this one before,

the really low event, low scoring defensive style of play, the results aren't there because they're not finding the back of the net with regularity, right? And you look at their last few games and they scored four goals in their last three games. The one win that they've had was a very narrow two, one win over Florida. I'll be interested to see what the return of Doughty does to the lineup, because

obviously he's a great player, but he's been out for what 47 games. It's the most he's ever missed in a single season at his advanced age. It's a big ask to be like, Hey, jump back in and be the usual Drew Dowdy right away after that big an injury and that long of a layoff. Be curious to see what happens there. Cause yeah, you're right. That lead for, for third spot in the division is by no mean comes, no, no means comfortable for them. Another team that's struggling a tiny bit is the Toronto Maple Leafs.

They've lost three in a row. They lost at home five one to Columbus. Then they went to Ottawa and lost two to one. And last night they lost three to one to what is a shorthanded Minnesota wild team? Is that fair to say they've got a few injuries? Yeah. Well, Kuro Kaprizov, that was the announcement

earlier this week that he's going to be on an additional four weeks to undergo surgery on his injury. So now the Leafs are headed west. They play in Edmonton on Saturday, then Calgary, then Seattle. And then as mentioned earlier in the show, they're in Vancouver, Saturday, February 8th. It's the last game before the four nations break.

And it's funny, I've, I've texted a little bit with some Toronto guys and this was before the Canucks played in Toronto earlier in the month. And I said, you know, my question was like, Hey, could this be the year for, for the Leafs? Like, it doesn't look like there's a super dominant team in the East. It looks like the Leafs have some goal tending. What did he say? And he said, I don't think they're very good.

Three goals in their last three games. Yeah. They were propped up at the beginning of the year with the like Stollers was great. And then they were able to use wall not as much as they are right now. And that seemed to be the right like math for him. They had a good goaltending tandem. It was probably the best, excuse me, goaltending tandem in the league, but they are. Why can't they score goals? They have a can at times. I mean, they exploded the other day in, in

against Montreal, Montreal went up three nothing and Toronto rattled seven in a row off and they beat them seven to three. Like that's with the talent that the Leafs have, they should have be an explosive team that scores consistently. Do you remember, you remember that game where the Canucks went in there and shut them out three

nothing? Yeah. And it was listless to put it mildly. And then there was a debate within the Toronto room about whether they had a good performance or not. Oh, right. Right.

Yeah. Marno was like, I thought we played pretty well. Those performances. Tandem's like, we lacked energy. Yeah. We were terrible. Those performances happened, I wouldn't say with regularity, but they do have with that team

where they, they come out and there's nothing going on. And like there's no one sort of takes the game by the scruff of the neck. These offensive guys that you would expect to be able to break out. Cause you look at the last three games, five one to Columbus, two one to Ottawa,

three one to Minnesota, and there's just nothing there offensively. Okay, we are up against it for time here. Seven o'clock hour is on the horizon. We have a couple guests Josh cloak from the athletic is gonna join us He's got a pretty cool feature piece out on the athletic right now. The headline is in the NHL Boozing is out edible cannabis and video games are in it's a grabby headline for sure But there's more about like the culture and the social lives and what these players are doing in terms of team bonding away from the ice. It's pretty interesting piece.

We'll talk to Josh about that at seven and then at seven 30, we're going to go to Abbotsford play by play man for the Abbotsford can I Brandon Astle is going to join the program. The Abbotsford Canucks had their eight game winning streak snapped last night in Coachella Valley, but we'll talk to Brandon about the heater that this team was on and if they can get back to their winning ways because they returned to Abbott's for this weekend. We got a lot more to get to on the program.

Don't go anywhere. You're listening to the Halford and Brough show on Sportsnet 650.