Halford & Brough in the Morning - The Canucks Will Be Underdogs This Off-Season

Episode Date: April 22, 2025

In hour two, Mike & Jason chat with The Athletic New York's Arthur Staple (1:15) about the tumultuous season for the Rangers, also known as the "Canucks of the East", plus they talk a little 'Nucks with radio commentator Brendan Batchelor (28:33).  This podcast is produced by Andy Cole and Greg Balloch. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

Music 703 on a Tuesday. Happy Tuesday everybody. Halferd Brough, Sportsnet 650. Halferd Brough of the morning is brought to you by Sands & Associates. BC's first entrusted choice for debt help. With over 3,000 five-star reviews. Visit them online at sans-trustee.com. We are in hour two of the program. Arthur Staples is going to join us from New York in a moment here to talk a little Rangers and a little Isles.

Hour two of this program. It's brought to you by Jason Homominuk at Jason.mortgage. If you love giving the banks more of your money, then don't let Jason shop around to find the perfect mortgage for you. Visit him online at Jason.mortgage. We're coming to you live from the Kintec studio. Kintec footwear and orthotics.

Yeah, they've got them both. Both. Footwear and orthotics. Yep. And they work together with you. Get, and get this, in step. Well, that's orthotics. Yep. And they work together with you, and get this, in step. Well, that's quite clever. Yeah.

It's a foot pun. To the phone lines we go, Arthur Staple joins us now on the Halford and Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. Morning, Arthur, how are you? I'm good, guys. How we doing? We're well.

How are the Canucks of the East doing? Well, it's been pretty dismal around here. You know, there'sucks of the East doing? Well, it's been pretty dismal around here. You know, there's one of the main characters from the last few years, the Canucks, both of my team. So you'll have to be a little more specific. Are we talking about Bo Horvats, Islanders, or JT Miller's Rangers? I'm a little confused.

We're talking about JT Miller's Rangers. But an honorable mention for Bo and the Islanders. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, maybe we'll ask you a question about the Islanders at the end here, but I just want to get a sense of what it's looked like as the players have been interviewed and management has been interviewed and we were just talking about all the

crazy things that the Canucks are going to have to get done this off season and I imagine it's the same in New York. It sure looks that way. It's a mess and yeah, I think they're kind of neck and neck for biggest clean up on aisle five off season coming up in terms of west and east. But this, I think Vancouver's issues kind of came to light as the season unfolded. The Rangers were already

pretty firmly there when the season began. It kind of goes back to last summer and, you know, they dumped Mark the Good Row on waivers to be picked up by the Sharks and they tried to push Jacob Truba out. He pushed back. They started the season pretty well and then after a bad loss in Edmonton, then the stuff hit the fan when Chris Jury sent out his group chat text to the rest of the GMs in the league saying, please take Jacob Truba or Chris Kreider off my hands. And that was the beginning of the end. And all the way now to break up day and Peter Lavillette being gone and another coaching search. This is Drury's third in four years and kind of a half dismantled room.

Some additions, some subtractions, maybe some more subtractions. A lot of uncertainty. Yeah, it's going to be a very busy off season for a team that looked like they would be playing this time of the year for a lot of years to come last season. Okay, so I kind of saw it like this, like after the La Violette dismissal and then Drury meeting with the media and then the players meeting with the media, it seems like the main character now in the central figure is Drury because as you mentioned, he's in the process of hiring another coach. It's the third on his watch.

It's also going to be making up for the residual damage of all the moves that he made during the season. Your latest article in the Athletic, you wrote like Drury was correct in hindsight to identify the problem with his team. The kicker here, and I love this, the way he tried to fix it left a lot to be desired.

So how much pressure is on Drury right now to fix this, but also correct a lot of the mistakes and the self-inflicted wounds from what he did over the last few months? I think he's under more pressure than you would have, I mean, I think in a normal situation, if you're a GM has been on the job for four years and you're hiring your third coach, there's definitely pressure all throughout the year.

And I think the way that Chris Dury became the GM where James Dolan, the Rangers owner got rid of John Davidson. He got rid of Jeff Gordon, promoted Chris to that dual spot and kind of. They got rid of a few other longtime staffers. So it was definitely Chris was firmly entrenched as the GM right from day one and had the full faith of ownership. You know, I think, yeah, in a normal situation, you'd say the GM has got to be feeling some heat. And now I think, after not thinking that for a while, I think that

is true. I think he is feeling some heat from above. And, and, you know, I think some of the outside elements of what's going on with the Rangers story that Katie Strang had on our site about our Timmy Panarin last week, I'm sure doesn't contribute to good feelings at the garden. So there's a lot of stuff that's about their play and the content of their room. But I think a lot of stuff also is about what's going on behind the scenes with this team, but there's a lot of nervousness and there's a lot of turnover in terms of staff. And I don't

think I think the fact that it's kind of leaked into the locker room this year was was a pretty, you know, under the radar factor and how it fell apart so fast. I think a lot of support people being gone, people who helped the players and then the players are kind of the ones that are targeted next. And yeah, I mean, they're human beings and they should rise above, but they didn't in this case. And I think a lot of that traces back to Drury

and he's the one that's making all these decisions. So yeah, the focus definitely has to be on him at this point. I don't want to suggest that the Rangers were trying to lose games this year, but I wonder if the environment almost got, it's probably too strong a word, but mutinous. Like, I mean, they can't have been big fans of management with all that was going on this season you know I think it it boils more down to there's a reason that Jacob

Truva was the captain of this group you know he he wasn't the longest serving guy he wasn't the best player he was the guy that brought them together. And I think that was pretty widely acknowledged by everybody on the team, everybody around the team. And he was kind of the natural selection as the guy who had stepped up and kind of taken charge of them, especially during the pandemic seasons. And I think that was definitely appreciated by a lot of guys who are bigger names or maybe have been here longer, but aren't necessarily have that necessarily have that kind of personality to be able to wrangle the group. So you take him out, you take Barkley Goodyear out, who's not a rah rah guy, but is a very solid veteran guy who

knows how to lead by example and say the right things at the right times. And you're left with some veterans who maybe don't embrace that role and some younger guys who aren't really ready for it and shied away a little bit. And so then all of a sudden you've got a very fractured room and people looking around at each other to see who's going to grab the reins. And I understand that that's kind of the impetus for bringing in a guy like JT Miller and his closeness with Vincent Troszek is maybe the one guy here who really

Stepped up into that void. So those are your maybe kind of your new core guys But you're also falling off a cliff play Why you know they they're one of the worst defensive teams in the league even with one of the best goalies in the league They've got all these highly skilled guys. Nobody wants to defend or play hard or do the gritty things you need to kind of pick yourself off the mat. So even the impact of acquiring JT Miller and having a Vincent Trochek and having some potential leaders in the room is completely nullified by the fact that you're not playing well. And, you know, so I think that part is part of the room. I think for Peter Lavall And, you know, so I think that part is part of

the room. I think for Peter Lavieletta, you know, I understand that he from year one to year two or year two to year three, his, his track record is definitely, uh, you know, he, the, the, the impact of his system and the impact of his words lessons quite a bit, but this was, you know, I don't think Scotty Bowman could have gotten these guys to play good. So I know I don't think this one was completely on him this year. Um, so yeah, I think there was a lot of, a lot of the discontent came to the forefront, whether it was the players versus the general manager or the players versus the coach or even the coach versus the general manager who can say,

um, but all it, it all seemed to result in a lot of malaise through about two months of the season. And that's what ultimately cost them. Who are the candidates to be the next captain? I mean, I think it's Miller or Trocheck. It's probably Trocheck if they're going to pick one. You know, I think you look back at the last, maybe 15 years of Rangers captains and I don't know if I'd want that C stitched on my sweater.

I think he looked at Ryan Callahan was a guy who got ended up being traded in the middle of his captaincy. Ryan McDonough, same thing. Now Jacob Truba. I imagine that maybe the Rangers ownership when they when James Dolan gets upset with his group, there's one guy that it seems to be most upset with and it's the guy with the C on his sweater. So be careful what you wish for, I guess, would be the warning to either of those two guys. What have you seen and maybe more specifically heard from J.T. Miller since being acquired from the Canucks? You know, I think he said all the right things. He seems a lot, you know, obviously wasn't there in Vancouver, but he seems a lot more at ease with himself in this environment. It's somewhat familiar to him. There's still, even with all the staff turnover, there's still a couple people left

from when he was here the first time. You know, I think him coming back to a place where he started his career, he was a young guy who by his own admission, didn't really know a whole lot about the league or, you know, how to, how to blend in with locker room. He's certainly been in a lot of different places since then. So I think he's, he's much more at ease in his own skin. Having true check here, someone who's a, you know, a childhood friend is, uh, it's probably very important to him and their family is very close and rekindling that throughout the season is good. And I think he performed pretty well. He did

produce about a point a game after he got here. But I think jumping into this leaky lifeboat and thinking it was going to turn them around in whatever 25, 30 games, considering how the first 50 went, it was maybe a little over ambitious. And I think for him, maybe a bit of an eye opener that how, how deeply flawed or deeply dejected this group was. So, you know, there's going to be more change. He's not, he's going to be here. And I think maybe he gets the summer now after a very tumultuous couple of seasons in Vancouver and then including right up to the trade. I imagine that he'll come back and be a little bit more in command of the room and understand what needs to be done and obviously there'll be a new coach coming in and who knows, maybe it's his old coach

coming here, we can't really say is this coach. Can't rule it out yet. Can't rule it out yet. Uh, we certainly can't. Uh, so if that's a scenario, then obviously that kind of even more firmly entrenches him in the middle of this room and as a leader. Um, but whoever it is, it's, you know, there's

still going to be more change. And I think, uh, I think he has to be able to roll with it and help settle this group down because we know he'll be here and we know Vincent Trocek will be here and probably a couple of the guys. But I think a lot of the longer time guys, whether it's Mika Zabanajad or Chris Crider or even Panarin, who knows? This summer has a lot of intrigue to offer this team and we'll see where it all takes us. It is tough and I just I was actually going to ask you if you're going to

pick one big name up front that is going to be moved this offseason who would it be with the caveat that a lot of those guys have trade protection and pretty solid trade protection and there aren't a lot of guys that it sounds like don't want to be in New York. Yeah. I mean, I think, I think for, I got, you know, I, Zabana Jed and Panarin have full no move clauses so they'd obviously have to agree to go

somewhere and it doesn't seem like from all the things that Zabana Jed has said that he's got any interest in, in going anywhere, even if he could select that spot. Panarin I'm not so sure about. He's only got a year left, so I think there'd be some demand despite the news that came out last week. But I think the obvious candidate is Kreider, and given how incredibly detailed his, his injury list that he gave yesterday was where he's had a back issue pretty much all year long. Uh, he caught a virus around Christmas that turned into vertigo. Uh, he's got a hand injury

that might need surgery. I don't know if that was a, a warning to the 31 other general managers that they might not be getting such quality goods. But you know, Chris has been around a long time. He's a shrewd guy. And he's got two years left in his deal. He's only got a 15 team, no trade clause. I'm sure that they could work something out, but it's not going to be something, you know, this is a guy who scored 52 goals just a few years ago, down to 22 this year. I don't think anyone's going to be giving up any real assets for him. So anyone's going to be giving up any real assets for him so it might have to be something where the Rangers add an asset to unload him or retain some salary or take back another bad contract. So that

might give them some pause and just say we don't want to further royal this room because he is, even though he's not a guy who's a very vocal person and really has ever been someone who put himself up to be captain, he's an important guy in the room. He's the guy that kind of is the first, one of the first guys to welcome young guys in. He's out there working with some of the younger forwards after practice. He likes that part of being a veteran guy. And I don't know that taking that out of the equation when you want to plug some more young guys into the into the forward group guys like Gabe Perot or Brennan Hoffman. I don't know if you want to remove that Kreider factor so quickly,

just because of the decline in his play and whatever else is going on with him. So yeah, I mean, I guess Kreider is the obvious choice. I don't think Sab Jet is going anywhere. I don't know if they can really do anything with Panera and with just a year left. So yeah, it's, you know, if I understand that they kind of went part of the way through the year, unloading some players and veteran players and some contracts, you've got to get more flexible and get younger and do all that.

I don't know how much further they can go without really dismantling the room and maybe doing some of the same things in the summer that they started to do last summer that caused all the problems in the first place this year. Arthur, it's always good to catch up with you. I think we first met in 2014 in the Kings Rangers Stanley Cup final.

It seems like a long time ago, a hundred years ago, that the Rangers are in the Stanley Cup final. Henrik Lundqvist was in goal and we were in a Stanley Cup final, Halford and I. So it's always great catching up with you. You got it guys. Thanks a lot.

Anytime. See you. Arthur Staple from the athletic here on the Halford & Bruff Show on Sportsnet 650. Arthur's like a cool beat writer. Do you know what I mean? He always gives good restaurant recommendations on the road.

I always appreciated that. No, but he's got, you know how most hockey writers, not super cool. What are you suggesting, Jason? Are you suggesting that the industry lends itself to nerds? I'm just saying that Arthur Is a cool dude stood out because he was so cool. Yeah Okay, such a cool guy is he will dude. He's a cool cat. He's a cool new you guys called him art

I just think he's me. Yeah, I just put his hand backwards and It's not it's like, so I got a haircut. You're more of a grownup than I am. He was more of a grownup than both of us combined. So, uh, since we're on the topic of JT Miller, uh, being on the Rangers and I imagine if he's named the next captain of the Rangers, be interesting to first of all, see the reaction

to that in Vancouver and also how it works out for the Rangers. I was really struck by the tone and the admiration that the Canucks brass still used when talking about JT Miller yesterday. The language used. The Canucks brass still used when talking about JT Miller yesterday and Rutherford said it, it was a trade we didn't expect to make and it was a trade we didn't want to make. And the way they talked about him, I know, I think

they were just telling the truth. Well, they were like, they said they were like five guys in the league. It's like there's like five guys in the league that It's like, there's like five guys in the league that can do what Miller does. Yeah, that can. You can't replace them. That can't, they can play the way that Miller does.

Yeah. And he said we went from what we thought was a contending team to a team in transition. And then I think you look at the Canucks down the middle and you just see wild card after wild card because there's the guys that they have under contract and that's Pedersen and Hedl and we all know both those guys

come with major question marks. Pew suitor, he's a pending unrestricted free agent so he might not be, probably won't be back with the Canucks next season. You've got some guys down the line up that'll probably be back and Bluger and I thought Ratu showed well late in the season, but I don't expect any of those guys to be an answer in the

top six. And then you've got this to be named centre that the Canucks are going to go after and going to go after aggressively and they are going to spend assets to get this center because it's not gonna come in free agency, it's going to come via trade and I just like there's no names right now that just immediately popped to mind. I know we used to have a couple but they got traded for. You know, Dylan Cousins and Josh Norris got, got traded for each other. Maybe they could still go after Josh Norris.

Quinn Hughes' buddy. Quinn Hughes' buddy, right? In their like desperate attempt to keep Quinn Hughes. What about if we brought in your best friend? Then you wouldn't leave him, would you? That'd be pretty mean. Um, but I, I just think, you know, I know people are like, you guys always focus on Pedersen.

I'm like, mm-hmm, we do. First of all, it's a fascinating story, but second of all, you know, and I was listening to Donnie and Dolly in there and we've said it before and that's their a hundred percent right. Like nothing that the Canucks do will really matter if they keep Pedersen and he comes back and he plays like this season because the centre position

is so important. Okay. And he's still there 1C, he's still there 1C. Actually, that was a much larger issue than like positional need here though, that you kind of, you didn't gloss over it, but you brought the conversation to the table about, let's just work through this.

There was an acknowledged rift between the two players. Their solution in part aided by the fact that JT Miller stood up and said, I'd like to leave, was to break the pair up, a divorce if you will. In the aftermath of that divorce, they wanted to make it abundantly clear, like Rick talking in his media availability said, I don't think there's any bad guys in this scenario. Yesterday, they spoke glowingly about the departed fellow of the relationship,

which leads me to believe that if they truly believe everything that they're saying, that this rift really was about two players. As a matter of fact, the quote that caught me the most from Jim Rutherford yesterday was this. He said, I think a lot of things were personal. I don't believe that it was just down to two people. It filtered into the whole team or most of the team and it affected the chemistry of our team. That combined with the fact that they're

not playing the blame game. As a matter of fact, I feel like they're going out of their way to be complimentary. Miller leads me to believe what I said from the onset. It's not about picking one or the other. It's about moving both. That's how you solve that problem. Cause you can't tell me that there's no

residual effects from that rift. You can't tell me that slicing it in half has fixed it, that you've cut out the bad part. Well, Rutherford also hinted that it started to blow up again because Pedersen didn't come to the season in shape. But that is, I mean, that's probably the closest that they came to like playing the

blame game, maybe. Yeah, yeah. And even then. But if you know what else I want to wonder, I wonder how much did management empower Guys like JT Miller. Do you remember we heard that report from Freach sure earlier in the season? Well, it's important It is it is important when when when Freach said they've kind of tasked the players with toughening up

Pedersen so it was JT was like this is my specialty I think that's part of the reason and then he went too. But I think that's part of the reason that they're- And then he went too far. And then he went too far. I think that's part of the reason that they are talking about Miller in the terms and ways that they are now. Yeah.

Is that they know that they task the wrong personality with the wrong assignment and that falls on them and they're trying to be complementary in the aftermath because they know they're going to shoulder some of the blame, but they're not going to say it publicly. Yeah. They didn't shoulder any of the blame, but they're not gonna say it publicly. They didn't shoulder any of the blame publicly.

The point that is really frustrating to circle back on is that they didn't solve anything by trading Miller. It didn't make anything better, did it? No. Right, so the surgery wasn't complete. It's like getting half the surgery done. Yeah. It seems so blindingly obvious to me.

Oh, I left my car keys in there. Yeah, now we got to open you back up. Those can't stay there forever. And that's where I'm like, I just keep looking at this and I'm like, this seems blindingly obvious that this rift was not about breaking them up and having like, Miller's going to go on to great things in New York and Petey's Just gonna stay here and get better honestly Halford and you've got a read coming up here. I do I Honestly think you have to ask yourself

Because you seem to be acting like the Canucks could just trade Petey Anyway, I don't rated I could trade you tomorrow if I needed to okay, and I will I mean that's That's not a serious statement to make. Not anyone can be traded. Not anyone can be traded. They're not going to add assets to trade Pedersen, they're not going to retain salary to trade Pedersen.

They're just not going to do that. But right now, I don't know if there is a team that would take on his contract right now. Well, they better get working on it. They better start working a narrative and putting up the for sale side and, you know, accentuating the positives like a house that's got some, some character issues, you know, you turn those

frowns upside down. Yeah. You don't see their character issues, you just see their character. Well, there's like this house doesn't work hard enough. It's a fixer upper. Sometimes the walls sag a little bit.

It's got character. Okay, we got to do the one to watch brought to you by Delaney's OK Tire. We're going to focus on the entire battle of Florida because this series finally, finally gets underway tonight. All the other series have started. Some of them have two games in the book. Tonight, those guys, Florida and Tampa Bay will be facing off in the Stanley Cup Playoffs for the fourth time in the last five seasons. All eyes will be on Matthew Kichuck,

who's gonna take the morning skate this morning, but there's no real certainty that he's gonna play tonight. I suspect that he will, but he has not played since February the 8th for the Panthers, and of course, hasn't played any games since he got heard at the four nations face off. It'll also be the first time in Brad Marshawn's lengthy and storied

playoff career that he will play a playoff game, not for the Boston Bruins over 12 years and over a hundred playoff games, all with Boston. He will now suit up as a member of the Florida Panthers. So it should be a lot of fun to watch the one to watch tonight. The battle of Florida is's finally gets underway. It's time to put on your Toyo tires, whether you drive a car, light truck or van, Toyo tires are designed to perform in all kinds of conditions. Visit Delaney's OK tire in Langley and Aldergrove.

OK tire service, repair and tires. You're listening to the Halford and Bref show on Sportsnet 650. I think they're kind of neck and neck for the biggest cleanup on aisle five offseason coming up. Looks like there's gonna be a cleanup on aisle five. Hey it's Mick Nazar. Have your say and join me on the People's Show with big takes and even bigger bets weekdays three to four on Sportsnet 650 or wherever you get your podcasts.

It is Brendan Batchelor, Batchelor, Batchelor. 7.35 on a Tuesday. Happy Tuesday everybody. Halford Brough, Sportsnet 650. Halford and Brough in the morning is brought to you by Sands and Associates. Learn how a consumer proposal reduces your debt by up to 80% with no more interest. 80%? No more interest. Visit them online at sans-trustee.com.

We are in hour two of the program. Brendan Batchelor, as the music suggests, is gonna join us. I filled in for Batch yesterday at the press conference. He wasn't there? No, he wasn't there. And you were there, you took a seat? Yeah. How does it work?

I didn't realize it was you for a second when I was listening. It's like, I think that's Brough, but it sounded so like you're like doing golf play by play. Didn't have his radio voice on. Yeah. It's true. Hello. Hello. Yeah.

What's up with Pedersen? Yeah. That's the master's music. Exactly, yeah. That's what it was. What the hell's going on here? I've noticed that you've, actually, can we get the master's music here?

Oh no. We just, we just. We do a batch on hold of course. I don't care. Okay. You didn't show up yesterday. Yeah. T.S.

For you batch. I have a question for Jim and Patrick. It seems like you've been having trouble getting through to Elias Patterson. Is that, is that true? And also, on the knee tendonitis, how much of a factor was it? And is it still a factor for Elias Pedersen? Thank you. They're both looking around wondering where the music's coming from. Did he bring his own music? You are listening to the Haliford Impressor.

Both of Robert Thurman's temples at the same time. I'm glad that we were able to get some more Masters music out there. Usually we have to wait until next year. Well, it does make the questions sound a little less aggressive. You know what? It does. Actually, it kind of makes them sound way more aggressive. He's like, I'd love to answer your question, sir. Never felt so calm. You look up and Rutherford's asleep. Yeah.

We saw that coming. Look what you've done to him. Where'd that couch come from anyway? Okay, we are in hour two of the program. Brendan Batcher patiently waiting on hold here. Hour two of this program is brought to you by Jason Hominuk at jason.mortgage. If you love paying too much for your mortgage,

then don't let Jason shop around to find the perfect mortgage for you. Visit him online at j Jason.mortgage. If you love paying too much for your mortgage, then don't let Jason shop around to find the perfect mortgage for you. Visit him online at Jason.mortgage. To the phone lines we go. Brendan Batchelor joins us now in the Halford and Bref show on Sportsnet 650. Batch, I'm sorry first and thank you for joining us. Oh, I'll always wait for the master's music. That's fine. He does hit all the notes. So, look, let's just open this up to everything that was said yesterday.

And there was a lot. Did you have one particular favorite takeaway from Jim Rutherford and Patrick Alveen's media availability on Monday? Oh man, that's a hard question because there was so much there to parse through. The thing that jumped out at me first was Rutherford just openly coming out

and saying, we're not going to force Tauke to be here if he doesn't want to be here. We're not going to activate the extension clause that we have there, which, you know, very much leaves the ball in Rick Tauke's court and is going to be the first decision, it seems like, that is going to define this off season in terms of, you know, they said they expected answer later this week. So, you know, hopefully by the end of the week, we know is it going to be Rick Tauke it or is it not in which case you have to start a new coaching search and you know what you decide to do there could, you know, play a big factor in many of the other things we've talked about, like the future of Elias Pedersen, the future of Queen Hughes.

So, you know, I think a lot of these off season talking points that we're going to discuss are kind of tied together. And the first domino that's going to fall is the coaching decision. So that, that comes to the front of mind for me right away anyway, because that's going to set up what the off season is going to look like. And I think, you know, rightly or wrongly, it's kind of going to be a, you know, maybe referendum is not the right word on this management group and on the direction they're going. But I think some people in the fan base might interpret it that way, whether it's fair or

not, which is if Rick Taukett stays, that's him endorsing their vision and if he leaves, that's the opposite. Now, I don't know if that's fair to say, but optically, that's what it would look like if he ultimately decides to move on and look for other opportunities on the market, which there are now plenty of, especially after the firing in Seattle

yesterday. I think it's fair to wonder that. You know, like if he, because the Canucks have come out and said, like, we've made a very generous offer and we're going to a place where we've never really gone before in terms of money given to a head coach in Vancouver. Now that doesn't necessarily mean it's going to meet Rick Tuckett's price, but they are making, I would imagine, a pretty generous offer. And if he says thanks, but no thanks, that is, I

would say that's pretty close to a referendum from a key guy on what management has planned, because the plans are, let's face it, pretty optimistic in what they want to do this off season. Finding a top six centre would be one thing, but Rutherford said yesterday, like we've got to find three forwards. And I imagine three top six forwards considering what's potentially leaving the team in Brock Besser and Pugh Souter, and they already needed to find a top six center.

Like that's, that's going to be real tough with the limited number of quality free agents and all the other teams with cap space to bid for them and the limited number of assets that the Canucks have to trade with. Yeah. And, and that to me takes the conversation to the Queen Hughes part of things because, you know, we've talked all season long about, you know, make

Queen Hughes happy, do whatever you can to make Queen Hughes stay. But the fact that Rutherford was so blunt about, you know, he wants to play with his brothers, we're gonna make sure we can offer him a competitive deal, but ultimately that's out of our control. And then he got into, you know, maybe a line of conversation that he shouldn't have caught into talking about trying to bring the Hughes brothers here, which I think might've been more than a joke

than anything else. But, you know, coming out of that press conference, it changed my way of thinking about this off season where prior to that, I was saying, okay, do whatever you've got to do, be competitive next year, make sure that you get Quinn Hughes to stay. But the way Rutherford sort of described it makes me think, well, is there a chance that Quinn Hughes is going to leave anyway? And can you empty, can you afford to empty your cupboards if your captain is, you know, going to move on in a year or two anyway,

whether you trade him or whether he walks in free agency. So that makes this off season that much more difficult to manage. I think ultimately they're going to have to give up future assets to make some of these changes and bring in some of these top players to fill out the top of the lineup so that at the very least they can say, look, we did everything we could to try and keep the captain if he ultimately does decide to move on. But then you have to talk about what sort of situation that leaves them in if he does move on and if he isn't here in a couple of years and what things look like after that. So, you know, everything that this management group has to accomplish this off season is going to be very difficult. There's a fine margin or it's a tough needle that they're going to have to thread to do everything

that they want to do, accomplish the things that they want to accomplish and get back to being the kind of team that they want to be next year. I'm not saying it's impossible, but it's going to be difficult. It's going to take some creative thinking and it, I think, promises to be one of the most, if not the most eventful off seasons for the Canucks, potentially of the last decade or more, just because of the laundry list of business that they have to conduct. And that's not even entering into the possibility of trading a guy like Elias Pettersson or trading a guy like Thatcher Demko, which I think, you know, based on Alveen's comments yesterday, both of those things have to at least be on the table heading

into this summer. Yeah. Regardless of who the coach is, whether it's Rick Tauket or someone else, don't you feel like a lot of team building is required? Because it sounds like the room was not a good place last season. Yeah. And I mean, ultimately whether it got to a better place later in the year, they weren't specifically asked that question, but did they, by moving on from JT Miller,

did that improve things behind the scenes even if it didn't improve things on the ice as they went through injuries and ultimately missed the playoffs? We're not in the room so we don't know the answer to that. That's one thing you think about though is, I'm seeing comments, I think it was about the LA Kings. I saw something on Twitter last night about people saying, these guys are a band of brothers and they love each other and they go to war with each other. And you know, that is how I would have described the Canucks last season, but not necessarily how I would have described them this season. And that's important, right? You know, you have to want to fight for the guy next to you on that bench. And if there's uncertainty around, you know, any any off ice issues, and if there's any question about those sorts of things, then that's a serious thing that you have to address as an organization because, you know,

as much as you can put together a team of all-stars on the ice, if they aren't on the same page and they don't all buy in and they don't all see that vision that you see and agree, excuse me, agree, you know, with the way you have to play and what you want to do to try and accomplish your goals, then you're not going to get there even if you've got, you know, the 20 way you have to play and what you want to do to try and accomplish your goals, then you're not going to get there even if you've got, you know, the 20 best players in the world on the ice on your team. So, you know, I think diagnosing off ice chemistry issues, diagnosing,

you know, how you correct those, bringing in character people as well as good players is going to be incredibly important for this group. And I think it's something they did a really good job of last season, ultimately when things really worked out for this team. And, you know, they had a guy like Ian Cole in the room, who I think, you know, was really important to the success of that team, even though he wasn't a key player in terms of being a veteran guy that had been there before that could maybe calm some of the noise and get guys focused. You know, and they have some good character guys in that room still.

So it's not me calling out the team and saying that there aren't character guys, but you need to find the right mix. And clearly the mix was off this year, whether that's down to two players, not being able to get along or whether it's bigger than that, we don't know because we're not there, but yeah, absolutely. You have to have guys that are on the same page and want to fight for each other or you know it doesn't matter how many points they put up you know talking about Rutherford's comments you know tied to Elias Pettersson yesterday you want guys that will play the right way buy into winning and ultimately sacrifice things like individual

numbers potentially for the greater good of the team. Do you think Pettersson can see this as an opportunity to win back some respect from for his name and win back some respect from his teammates? Because it sure sounded like the way he came to camp inflamed the situation with JT Miller and I think we could all see how that would play out. The highest paid player doesn't come to the season in shape after, let's face it, having a pretty awful playoffs and you want this locker room culture where players hold each other accountable, well what do you think's going to happen? Yeah. And I, in a best case scenario, that is how Elias

Pedersen views this is okay. I've got to prove to everybody that I can still be the guy that I was, you know, at the start of last season, right? It hasn't actually been that long, although it feels like an eternity, like the first half of last season, he was tremendous and was a big part of the Canucks early season push to, you know, ultimately secure themselves a playoff spot by, you know, how well they played in the first half and how they weren't having to chase and in the second half, because we've seen a lot of that in this market and we know how that plays out. And we saw how it played out this year. So, you know,

that capability is in there for him. The question is, can he draw it played out this year. So, you know, that capability is in there for him. The question is, can he draw it out? And the question is, does he have the motivation to draw it out? Which, you know, I would never want to question a player's motivation or professionalism or anything like that, but you can't not do that when the organization is doing it, right? When all of the conversations from the head coach, from management are about preparation coming into the season, about understanding the things you have to do to be a top player.

And, you know, Rutherford's example, using Steve Iserman yesterday, where Scottie Bowman got him to buy into the way he had to play and sacrifice points for the betterment of the team. And ultimately they went on to win Stanley Cups together is a good example. So can Pettersson do that? Can he prove to everyone, literally everyone, I think at this point, that he has that in him, that he can come back and be a true number one center and be a guy that they can rely on and be a guy that pulls on the rope and helps this team turn things

around, you know, or not. And, you know, based on everything we're hearing out of the organization, the way he handles this offseason, the shape he's in coming into the year, the commitment he has to the plan and buy-in going forward is essentially how we're going to define that. So, you know, I hope that he's having a good start to the off season. I hope he continues it because, you know, there was a point in the year where, you know, Pederson came out with the media and we want him to do and that's a good start, but it's just a start and ultimately you know things didn't pan out. Pedersen didn't turn his game around and ultimately went out with injury and missed the end of the season. So I'm at a point where I'm gonna say I'll believe it when I see it because it's been too long now and these are too long stretches in this player's career where he's gone AWOL and now that he's making $11.6 million, this club can't afford

for that to happen anymore. Batch, this was great buddy. Thanks for taking the time to do it. As always, we appreciate it. We'll probably put a pause on the bi-weekly hits for a bit as things will likely dry up news-wise with Vancouver Canucks. But if something big breaks, you'll be one of our first calls. Rest assured, buddy.

We should have called him about that Manchester United win the other day. I texted him. Oh, okay. Well, that counts. It was a very subtle, like, this is a decent match. It was pretty good. It was crazy. It was pretty good. It's maybe the craziest soccer match I've ever watched. So thank goodness they won and we'll see what happens going forward. But yes, guys, I will be waiting next to my phone

for your call if there's breaking KEDAX News. Beautiful. Thanks, Batch. Appreciate everything this season, buddy. Thanks, guys. Have a good one. Yeah, you too. Thanks. Brandon Batchelor, Kedox Radio play-by-play man right here on Sportsnet 650. We got a text into the Dunbar Lumber text line. It says, it's unsigned, my office culture sucked. And then we upgraded the coffee machine and it all came together. Sometimes it's the simplest gestures. Sometimes the smallest ones. Has anyone checked out the coffee machine at Rogers Arena?

I don't know. Could be a problem there. We never know. Just install a really nice one at the new practice facility. Oh. And you'll be great. Oh, sorry.

That was actually, Rutherford handled that well yesterday. He handled it with some humor, but. He's been doing that the whole time he's been here. Yeah, yeah. And I guess Patrick Johnston from the province has been one of the guys that's kind of been on him a lot about it. So I think it was Peej that asked the question,

and Rutherford was like, can we not talk about this? Yeah. Can we just, by the way, can we just be straight here for a moment, is that Rutherford yesterday was electric. Like as far as media availability is go. Alvin barely talked.

Yeah, nor did he need to. We know Patrick Alvin is the straight man and Jim Rutherford is the color guy. He's gonna provide the anecdotes and the quotes and everything else. Look, I don't wanna get into this thing about like, sometimes we want people to be candid. And then when they're candid, we come back and we're like,

too candid. I don't want to be that guy. I loved yesterday. I thought it was great. It might be worrying for the future of the franchise, but in terms of entertainment value, which is what we're all here for. It's like that tweet. This is horrible for the country, but great entertainment. Great content. Like's like that tweet. This is horrible for the country, but great entertainment. But man, this is great content. Like, this is good. Like, and I'm not talking about some

soulless content machine. He went out there and made what is traditionally a mundane presser because let's not forget, 99% of anticipated press conferences usually end with a thud. We're like, well, that was disappointing. We didn't learn anything. That was very entertaining. And I do think that it's partly because Rutherford's been around for a long time. And I think there is like one of those like axis graphs where like the older you get, the less F's you give. And you're just willing to say stuff. I think he just enjoys it.

And he enjoys it. That's important. Some people want to go up there and say as little as possible so they don't get enough, so they don't get any it. I think he enjoys it. That's important. You know, some people want to go up there and say as little as possible so they don't get enough, so they don't get any attention. Other people like the spotlight. Like you remember a couple of years ago where Jim was like, you know, I think I've learned my lesson.

I'm going to talk less. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Remember that? Yeah. A long time ago, narrator. He did not learn his lesson. No, but I think he did. I think he learned the lesson and the lesson was if I say something, it's gonna blow up,

and he's like, I'll just lean into that. Yeah, he just doesn't care. He's like, whatever, who cares? Well, again, there was a lot to be taken from yesterday, and I think that the Hughes thing, regardless of the intention behind it, saying the quiet part out loud and acknowledging what everyone else is acknowledging anyway,

like, we got people texting in talking about how you know they damaged their leverage and this is harmful for the process. I'm like come on man everyone and their dog knew that that dynamic was out there. Yeah. He just said it. He's like you know what I'm just gonna say it. He's just preparing people for the fact that there might come a time where Hughes walks and just- But they're going to do everything they can. Right. To keep that from happening without any sort of major-

Yeah. And then if Hughes leaves, they'll be like, well, that's Pedersen's fault. I mean, there is a dynamic there and you laugh nervously like Patrick Alveen was laughing nervously, but there is a dynamic there and you laugh nervously like Patrick Alveen was laughing nervously, but there is a dynamic there and I think the one thing they better do if they keep Pedersen is make sure that whoever's

coaching gets everyone on his side because you cannot tell me that there weren't clear factions in the Canucks dressing room this year. I wanted to bring this up. I actually, I didn't have the argument ready in time. You got me. But when you said like the possibility of trading Pedersen, how low his value might be, we do have to remember that at the deadline they did have it.

And I know that maybe it was used as leverage so that Carolina could get a different deal, but they did go down the road with Carolina of moving them. And that was only a handful of months ago. Has his value decreased since then? Quite possibly. Well, Carolina could still be a team where, where they're interested in. And I'm actually kind of interested in how they

play in the playoffs this year because they have, I don't want to say, again, no road is easy, but they should be able to beat New Jersey. And then, you know, if they can't beat Washington or Montreal in the next round, there's going to be a lot of upset people there. So when people use that cliche, that tired line of anyone could be traded, even Gretzky was traded.

I like to use it as the both extremes. Like the greatest player on the planet and the greatest player to ever live can be traded. And then like the, one of the most problematic contracts, anything can be traded in the national hockey league, especially with the Capcom. You know who has very high trade value? Who's that Andy?

Quinn Hughes. Yes. He would net a pretty nice return. You want to go there. Well, I'm just saying if he's decided. They're not doing it this off season. No, no, I know. They might have to do it next season.

I know, but I'm just saying if it's already been more or less decided that, hey, I'm, look, I'm going to be going to New Jersey. Well, you know what? Whether you want me to or not, they might as well not a huge return for him. The first, the first. And another rebuild begins.

The first time when we can maybe honestly talk about that could be at the trade deadline. Because if the Canucks are out of it, let's say they haven't fixed their issues and they're not in a playoff position like this season. Oh sorry, you're talking about next year's trade deadline. No, I'm talking about taking a time machine back to. Going back to this year's trade deadline.

March of this year. Oh, okay, sorry. Okay. So the next trade deadline, because then you'd make the argument, well, we're not making the playoffs this year. How much more would a team pay to get Quinn Hughes and look at his cap at it, it's barely anything at a, uh, for two playoff series as opposed to just one,

you know, guaranteed. Can you imagine? But we don't need to worry about that because the Canucks are going to fix all their problems to solve. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's going to be great. Oh yeah, for sure.

Full faith. Yeah. Okay. Um, speaking of cleaning up messes, I need to tell you about Jan Pro. From the boardroom to the break room and everywhere in between, JanPro keeps workplaces tidy, clean, and disinfected. For a free quote, visit them online at JanPro.ca.

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