Halford & Brough in the Morning - The Edmonton Oilers ARE NOT Canada's Team

Episode Date: June 5, 2024

In hour two, Mike & Jason chat with The Athletic Ottawa & Utah's Ian Mendes about what to expect from Utah Hockey this season (3:00), as well as the new-look Travis Green era Sens (15:00), plus they chat with the Miami Herald's Jordan McPherson on the latest around the Florida Panthers ahead of the Stanley Cup Final (27:00). This podcast is produced by Andy Cole and Greg Balloch. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

701 is it officially Eurodance Wednesdays? Euroclub Wednesdays come on help me beat drop very good those of you not watching the stream are really missing out right now all six of you watching it aren't

we're here live from Tomorrowland that's a young person reference youngish out right now. All six of you watching it aren't. We're here live from Tomorrowland. That's a young person reference. Young-ish. Young-ish? Young-ish. Oh, okay. Rep's in there, no shirt on, eating a candy necklace. Why are you putting that image in everyone's head right now?

Hour two of the program underway with good vibes. Hour two is brought to you by Vancouver Honda. Vancouver Honda is Vancouver's premier destination for Honda customers. They have a friendly, knowledgeable staff that can help with anything you're looking for. Sales, financing service,

or parts. We are, as mentioned, in Hour 2 of the program. Ian Mendez is going to join us in just a moment here. Hour 2 is also brought to you by Primetime Craft Beer. Meticulously brewed for quality and taste. Hour 2 is also brought to you by Primetime Craft Beer. Meticulously brewed for quality and taste. Primetime is full flavor without compromise. You can get some, get some at a liquor store near you.

Or you can visit the brewery and see how it's made. Someone texted in and said, wow, surprise, rough nose, Tomorrowland. Yeah, it's either that or Miami, the ultra music festival I like to go to. Have you ever been to Tomorrowland? What are you, out of your mind? You tried, they wouldn't let him in.

No, I don't think so. I'd like it if there was like an older person section of that. Like Tomorrow Tomorrowland. Like where you could get a nice dinner. Right. And you don't have to camp in fields or whatever. The music stops at 7.30. No, you get.

The volumes turn down quite a bit. Volumes turn down a little bit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. A nice bottle of wine or whatever. We're coming to you live from the Kintec studio, Kintec, Canada's favorite orthotics provider, powered by thousands of five-star Google reviews. So, Rafi, what are you waiting for?

Kintec, that's what you're waiting for. To the phone lines we go. Ian Mendez joins us now on the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. Morning, Ian. How are you? Hey, guys. Doing great. How are you?

Good. When did you pick up the Utah hockey beat? Oh, my gosh. Right? It's a short haul from Ottawa. Natural connection. Sure. Yeah. Yeah.

I don't even want to tell you. You know, Ottawa's a tough place. It's not like, you know, Vancouver, you get a lot of direct flights to North America, Toronto. Ottawa is unbelievable. It's so tough. So, you can only imagine the milk run that is Ottawa to Salt Lake City. So what's going on with the Utah Hockey Club and season ticket deposits? Yeah, so you know what?

Listen, I've kind of covered them from afar here because it's a brand new market. And to me, it's a fascinating story. So I've been there a few times and this week they just kind of had a zoom call with their, um, kind of, uh, their, their chief operating officer or chief, I forget his title, but anyway, they basically ran us through where their season tickets are at. And to me, this was remarkable. They're at 34,000 season ticket deposits, meaning these are people that have plunked down $100 to say, okay, I am super interested in being a season ticket holder.

And what I thought was fascinating, too, a couple of things. Number one, they said of those 34,000 people that have put in season ticket deposits, 92% of them are not utah jazz season ticket holders so i think a lot of us were thinking like oh they'll just lean on the jazz season ticket holders and those people will just you know turn around and they'll just have season tickets to both and that's not the case so it feels like they're kind of unlocking a brand new audience there of sports fans but the other thing that i think is really interesting now obviously they're coming from mullet arena right where in tempe they're playing in front of what you know whatever that was 4 500 people per night um this one is a little bit

interesting because the delta center uh which was i think 1991 is when it was built was specifically designed for basketball like the curvature of the arena bowl all of it is just for basketball so you know if you think about the challenges that the islanders had when they went to barclays because it was the home of the nets people would show up to the games they're like well i can't see one end of the ice or i can't see the corners or whatever like there was a lot of obstructive view seats in at barclays and that's what they're going to be dealing with at Delta Center for the first couple of years until they sort of reconfigure the ball. They're planning to go through

some massive renovations there. But this season, there's going to be 10,000 great seats. I can see the ice. No problem. But they're going to sell up to 6,000 what they're calling partial view seats. Meaning you're going to sit down and you're not going to be able

to see the entire 200 by 85 foot ice surface. There's going to be parts of it that are just, you're not going to be able to see. And it's going to depend, it's going to be schedule dependent on how much they open up those partial view seats. And to me, I think it's, you know, Crosby or McDavid or Matthews rolling the town they're probably going to go to the full 16 000 but yeah like listen i cover ottawa i have no problem

saying this the senators are probably not a team that would have a ton of appeal nationally or in a place like salt lake city maybe that number is closer to 11 or 12 000 and they don't open it up to 16 so it's going to be really interesting, but clearly the appetite is there when you have 34,000 people in line to get season tickets. So what is the timeline for the Renos and what about a new arena? Yeah, and so I think the idea of a new arena is still, I guess, potentially on the horizon. But I think what they've decided is, and they kind of did this at Madison Square Garden, didn't they? They just overhauled the building over years, and then finally they've gotten to this point where MSG is just a brand new

facility, not like what it was 10 or 15 years ago. That was a billion-dollar renovation. Yeah, absolutely. But if you're the Rangers, you think to yourself, okay, well, it's a billion dollars to renovate this place. How much is that land worth that we're sitting on, right? Like, we're never going to find a spot, you know, on 7th Avenue where we could just build a building. So I think that's what they're kind of thinking to it.

Delta said, like, man, we're right downtown. Like, we're not going to beat this. So what they want to do is create a complete arena district. And like Ryan Smith, the owner there, like he told me back in March, like he's kind of looked at like what they've done in Edmonton and maybe even to the smaller extent like Columbus, but like where you create this sort of hub downtown and they just don't think that there's a better spot

than the Delta Center for that. So it'll probably take, and they haven't really started, but the plans I think are in place, probably three years. But the NHL knew this. Like Gary Bettman knew this. The promise was we will get to 17,000 perfectly, you know, kind of calibrated seats to watch NBA and NHL, you know, in let's call it three years, four years. But yeah, that's kind of the timeline that they're looking at. I mean, it's ironic that we're talking about the same franchise

that went to Phoenix and played in a basketball arena with all sorts of uninstructive views. And then they were like, we need a new arena. Couldn't get one done in Scottsdale. So they went to Glendale and all was not happily ever after for the franchise when they did that. So we all know that the arena is a very, very, very important part of the success of a franchise.

I mean, you're in Ottawa. You know that. Do you have confidence that they can get this thing right? I think so. Like Ryan Smith, and I was really fortunate. I spent like an hour with him in the spring and just kind of sitting down. And when you listen to him talk, he just speaks with such a, I guess, clarity and passion. And like, like this isn't like for him, this isn't some

sort of like, you know, real estate play or like, he's just a passionate sports fan. Like he, it feels like he would be like how we would be, or a lot of people listening to this, if you're just a big sports fan, but you just happen to have billions of dollars in your bank account. You'd just be like, I'd be a really fun owner, and I'd do this and that. And that's what he seems like.

And so I don't doubt that he's got the financial backing to do this. I think that was the biggest problem in Arizona, wasn't it? Didn't you always feel like, ah, the Coyotes are like a house of cards, right? Like it always felt like they had some weird financial structuring and there's also like some sort of big weirdness that followed that franchise. And I think when they landed in Salt Lake City, that weirdness evaporated. Like it's just, it's finally in the hands, I think, of a capable, competent businessman and his family

who I just don't really doubt that they'll get this done when it comes to the arena. Well, speaking of franchises that have had questionable ownership, let's talk a bit about the Ottawa Senators. What a segue. What a segue. Now new ownership and now a new coaching staff, a name familiar to Canucks fans.

In fact, a few names familiar to Canucks fans. Travis Green is the head coach. His old right-hand man in Vancouver, Nolan Baumgartner, is an associate coach or an assistant coach, and so is Mike Yeo. What has the response been to the hiring of Travis Green as head coach in Ottawa? Yeah, and you know what? In fact, I feel like I should be asking you guys some questions here.

Yeah, go ahead. About Yeo and Baumgartner and Green. But I'll tell you, the reaction, if you went back, I want to say it was like the first week of May, so about a month ago when they hired travis green like i think it's very fair to kind of portray the reception as you know you know fairly negative from from a lot of fans who felt like are you kidding me like your your solution to fixing our seven-year playoff drought is a guy with a you know i think travis's career winning percentage is 477 or whatever, right? And so there was a lot of apprehension, skepticism,

negativity in the marketplace. You know, after Travis did his initial press conference in town, I would say that some of that skepticism and anger has sort of alleviated. I think a lot more people are willing to take, okay, let's just take a wait-and-see approach here on how it goes. And I do think that a lot of people are pretty happy with the bench staff in that, you know, Mike Yeo is a really accomplished coach in terms of, you know, what he did in Pittsburgh in the early years out of this salary cap, and then obviously being a head coach in places like Minnesota and St. Louis.

And, you know, Nolan Baumgartner, I think he's always kind of been Travis's right-hand guy, right, like Utica, Vancouver. But what I'm curious about and what I am going to ask you guys is in that four-year window with Green and Baumgartner, I think what a lot of Ottawa fans are curious about is like the deployment of the defense and kind of some of those things because, I mean, Tyler Myers is the guy that now Ottawa fans are like, ooh, is this guy coming here?

Like, you know, I think those are – or Tanev, for example, another guy who's potentially UFA. I think a lot of Ottawa fans are wondering, like, who are their favorite guys in that kind of four-year window? Well, I mean, there's a lot to unpack about the Travis Green era. And it was, I think, ultimately less about Travis Green than everything else. The pandemic affected the team in a major way. You know, it was harder to play in Canada than it was in the United States.

And they also lost some real key guys. In the bubble, they looked like they were a team that was going to be, you know, keep growing, and they had some young stars like Quinn Hughes and Elias Pettersson, and, you know, things looked good. And then the pandemic hit, and for whatever reason, maybe it was budget reasons or just poor management overall, they lost some really popular guys in the room, including, uh, Chris Tanev who goes to Calgary.

So does Jacob Markstrom, Tyler Toffoli, um, hadn't been with the Canucks for long, but he went away and then the all Canadian division happened and it just, it just fell apart. Like it, it just all fell apart. The culture fell apart. It just all fell apart. The culture fell apart. What I think is interesting about Travis Green being hired is that in the same offseason, Craig Berube got hired, and both those guys communicate a lot with Rick Tockett. I thought Craig Berube would actually be a perfect fit for Ottawa.

And I wonder if Ottawa Senators fans were hoping for a guy like Craig Berube because we've interviewed Craig Berube on this show before and so much of what he talks about is similar to what Rick Tockett talks about. I think Travis Green has some similar ideas. Like, Travis Green just wants guys that play hard, and that's what Rick Tockett wants. He wants guys that win battles, and he wants you to be a responsible player. He's not the type of guy that's just going to say, you know, like Bruce Boudreaux was, where it was like, just go play the game. Trust in yourselves and go play the game. The Canucks needed a coach that showed them how to do that. And I think Travis Green might bring that to Ottawa.

I don't know if he's going to have the same success as Rick Tockett had in Vancouver. Rick Tockett also got a bunch of new players that he was able to deploy. So I'm curious, what did Travis Green have to say in his press conference? Yeah, and you know what's funny, guys? I think, and I agree 100% with what you said, like I think Ottawa fans were really hoping for Berube when he was like the big fish on the market. But I think if you're Craig Berube, and you know, you go back six, eight weeks ago and you were looking around at the open chairs in the NHL and Ottawa was open, but so was, you know, Toronto was potentially going to be open and then New Jersey was open. Like there were some places where I think he could parachute in and kind of go right into wind now, right? Toronto for sure.

Probably New Jersey. Ottawa is going to be a little bit more maybe of a work in progress. So I don't blame Berube for, for, for going to a better spot and probably getting a bigger payday with a bigger market. But you know, it's funny because when Travis Green came in and spoke at his press conference, and this is why I said, I think there was some alleviation of the frustration when he,

after he spoke is that he said all of the things, like, if you had just removed, if you just took the quotes and you took out Travis Green's name and you said these were said by Craig Berube or Rick pocket, people would be like, yes, this is what we need. Accountability at a 200 foot game. And all, you know, he said all of those things. And so, and I, I tried to point kind of people back and, you know, I know Thomas Drance kind of did the same thing of, hey, listen, when Rick Tockett took over in Vancouver, like the anger in the marketplace,

it was ready to boil over and people were not happy because you're rolling in with a guy who had a 478 or whatever career winning percentage as a head coach in the league. And like, what had Rick, what had he ever done? Right. And so there's, there are absolutely some parallel tracks, but I think what Cockett really had this year is he had the best defenseman on the planet this year in, in Quinn Hughes. He had some unbelievable goaltending. You know,

Demko gives you a chance to win every night. And then you have your stars playing like stars up front. Ottawa hasn't had any of those things in the last couple of years. And so if they somehow get great goaltending, and if they get a Norris caliber defenseman, and if they get their top end players playing like top end players, yeah, absolutely, this could turn around this season under Travis Green. Do they have the right personnel? Because I think one of the things that really buried Travis Green and Nolan Baumgartner was actually responsible for the PK, and they didn't have the personnel for the PK. frankly, before this season. They just weren't capable penalty killers. And this past offseason, Canucks management went out and signed a bunch of guys that could kill penalties, and it made quite a big difference.

Does Ottawa have the type of players that can be good defensively? You know what? I think this all comes down to, and I hate to boil it down to such a simplistic, to such simplistic terms, but so much of this, guys, comes down to goaltending, doesn't it? And I'll tell you, I'll give you a stat here. I might be a little bit off on the numbers, but the core of what I'm about to say will resonate and is accurate. So Ottawa this season obviously played 82 games. In about half of the games that they played, they received sub-900 save percentage from their goaltending. So either Corpus Allo or Forsberg played in goal

and they had a sub-900, like 880 or whatever save percentage of the game. They won two of those games, okay? Two out of 41 games the other 41 where they you know had 900 save percentage there was something like 36 and four or something like their record was like almost the exact reverse and i think in ottawa people aren't even saying like give us 9 15 9 percentage. It's like, can you give us 905? And that, to me, will help alleviate a lot of the penalty killing issues and the defensive zone issues. Like, just average goal time.

What would this team look like with average? Like, people aren't even saying give us all world. Yeah, but it doesn't happen in a vacuum, right? Like, like I think that's what we've all learned, you know, we've all learned and we all kind of knew in our heads that if you have good defense in front of the goaltenders, if you have everyone on the same page knowing what to do in certain situations. And that's one thing that Taka drilled home to the Canucks,

like oftentimes at a very elementary level, but it needed to be done. And, you know, if the goaltenders know more about what's going on in front of them and everyone knows what to do, the goaltender is going to make more saves. So that's going to be the challenge for Travis Green, I imagine. Ian, I don't want to rush off this topic, but I do want to ask you about this latest article that you've published at The Athletic, and it is music to my ears because the headline is

why the Oilers are not Canada's team in the Stanley Cup final. You referenced the Boston pizza ad in the article, which infuriates me every time I see it, and I've seen it approximately millions of times. I apologize to a major sponsor of Rogers, but I think the whole

notion of cheering for the last Canadian team, if you're a hardcore hockey fan that wants your team, not some other Canadian team, to bring the Cup home to Canada, it's totally ridiculous. And the whole idea of Canada your team, not some other Canadian team, to bring the Cup home to Canada. It's totally ridiculous. And the whole idea of Canada's team, man,

I don't know if you're a truly hardcore, loyal fan of your own team, if you're able to suspend that fandom and go, go Oilers. I can't believe that this narrative still exists in 2024. And again, part of it is we're living in a 31-year drought of the cup in Canada. But I think there's this sort of weird perception in America that like, ha-ha, you guys haven't won the cup and you're so desperate to bring the cup back. And sure, there's probably some degree of like, it would be nice to have the cup and you're so desperate to bring the cup back and you know sure there's probably some degree of like it would be nice to have the cup back but you only want it in your city or for the team that you're cheering for like why would i care like what does it do like

vancouver's never won the cup you know they've been in the league 54 years they've never won the cup what does the drought kind of like you lose 10 of the drought because the oilers brought it back no you add to it you add to it your jealousy levels are off the off like off the charts if i saw toronto with the stanley cup brand i might retire like i just i'm done like and it's and it's almost close in in edmonton and calgary you know growing up as a kid i hated the flames absolutely hated them i didn't even hate the oilers because they were so good that it wasn't even worth

hating them. But the Flames, there was a game in 1989 against the Flames that made me cry. I'm not going to celebrate if they win the Stanley Cup. No, even in, if you think about 89 and that stupid Joel Otto goal, which I still think he kicked

in, but whatever. in but whatever one that made me cry yes and like and i always think about oh man if smeel puts that anyway now i'm gonna make you cry again but but like imagine in 1989 saying ah you know what we lost to calgary in a seven and ot but i was so happy they won the cup like good for them like no and just like this year you lose to edmonton in a seventh game where you just felt like if there was five more minutes in that game seven, they were going to tie it. Like, like it was just, it's just ridiculous. This idea that we would share. I likened it today.

I was like, it's like if your neighbor won the lottery, like would you feel like you'd feel jealous and you'd be like, well, unless they give me, unless they give me a million bucks for being a lottery, like, would you feel like you'd feel jealous and you'd be like, well, unless they give me, unless they give me a million bucks for being a neighbor, then maybe, maybe I'd be, maybe I'd be happy. But even then, you know, there'd be a jealousy factor. Yes. And I maintain this. So to me, when we talk about Canada's team, it's obviously Olympic level or FIFA, or,

you know, we rally around that. Like we have viewing parts, even though, and I brought this up, the Rapt Canada's team, it's obviously Olympic level or FIFA. We rally around that. We have viewing parts. And I brought this up, the Raptors in 2019. It felt like it was coast to coast. There was viewing parties in different places from Halifax to Victoria, and everybody got on board. I even looked this up. Cineplex Odeon, the movie theater, they opened up their theaters in 2019,

33 theaters across the country just to show Raptors games. Would you go, would you roll into Burnaby or Richmond and be like with your buddies, let's go watch the Oilers game on the Cineplex tonight? No. I mean, we have complicated relationships with, I mean, in Vancouver, I'm a huge Seahawks fan and I was a big Sonics fan. I don't cheer for the Kraken.

I hate the Kraken. Like that's one day I hope going to be one of my biggest, you know, or one of Vancouver's biggest sports rivals. It's complicated, but it is what it is. It's what's right, I feel in my heart, like, and I always think that, you know, these, this whole notion of Canada's team, it's coming from Americans for sure who don't understand, who don't understand. And it's, I think it's like, I don't want to

insult anyone, but it's like coming from casual fans. Like, wouldn't it be great if Canada, oh yeah, do you live and die with your team every day? Well, no. So you don't know what the hardcore hockey fan goes through. No, exactly. And to me, Canada has broken up into two trifectas, like Vancouver, Calgary, Edmonton, from the Smite days, everyone hates each other.

Ottawa, Toronto, Montreal, geographically, historically, they all hates each other ottawa toronto montreal geographically historically they all hate each other the one outlier that maybe you could talk me into but again i don't think that they have a national appeal right is winnipeg winnipeg's a little bit of an outlier i don't think anybody hates winnipeg per se we all feel a bit sorry for them but let's be honest but yes we do but i don't feel like if they were in the cup final, even then I don't think that we would be like, this is Canada's team. I don't think so.

Ian, this was great, bud. Thanks for taking the time to do it. You are the best. And thank you for writing that article. You are the best. Thank you. You got it, guys. Have a good one.

Ian Mendez from The Athletic in Ottawa and Utah, I suppose, on the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet. 6.50. Lots more to get to as we hit the halfway point of the show. 7.30, Jordan McPherson from the Miami Herald is going to join us, talk about the Florida Panthers. 8 o'clock, Dan Murphy, Sportsnet's very own intrepid golf slash hockey reporter is going to join us,

and we're giving away Snoop Dogg tickets. June 25th, Rogers Arena. A reminder, if you want to win tickets, you need to send in what we learned. It needs to be good. You need to hashtag it, WWL. You need to put a ticket emoji into your text. And you need to send it to the Dunbar Lumber text line at 650-650. You are listening to the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. Hey, it's Jamie Dodd and Thomas Drance. Get your daily dose of

Canucks talk with us weekdays from 12 to 2 on Sportsnet 650 or catch up on demand through your favorite podcast app. 7.32 on a Wednesday. Happy Wednesday, everybody. Halford Brough, Sportsnet 650. Halford Brough for the morning is brought to you by Pacific Honda. Pacific Honda is North Vancouver's premier destination for Honda vehicle sales and service.

They have a friendly, knowledgeable staff that can help you with anything you're looking for, be it sales, financing, service, or parts. We are in Hour 2 of the program. Jordan McPherson is going to join us in just a moment here to talk a little Florida Panthers. He, of course, from the Miami Herald. Hour 2 of this program is brought to you by Primetime Craft Beer. Meticulously brewed for quality and taste, Primetime is full flavor without compromise. You can get some at a liquor store near you, or you can visit the brewery to see how it's made.

We are inching closer and closer and closer to the start of the Stanley Cup Final. It will begin on Saturday in Florida. In front of all of those Panthers fans. Joining us now. In front of quite a few Oilers fans, too, I imagine. And probably some Oilers fans. Joining us now, Jordan McPherson from the Miami Herald here on the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. Morning, Jordan. How are you?

How are you doing? Sorry, do we have Jordan on the line there there i can't hear him jordan can you hear us okay i can hear you can you hear me yes we can hear you now that's perfect thank you for taking the time to do this today we really appreciate it i want to start with the atmosphere vibe check if you will in florida uh you wrote recently for the miami herald that extended playoff runs have been a boon for this flor Panthers team, both on and off the ice. And we should point out, this is the second consecutive Stanley Cup final that the Panthers have been in.

Have you noticed it resonating locally more with this being a Panthers town now, or maybe even, dare I say, taking something away from OTAs and football practices, that the Panthers are a hot story down in Florida? Yeah, you can definitely see it. I mean, just looking at what happened throughout this regular season, Panthers Arena fits almost 19,500. They had 17 sellouts during the regular season. Every game has been a sellout so far during the playoffs.

Their attendance is at an all-time high. Season tickets are at an all-time high. And you can see it throughout the town as well out of emirate bank arena you see at their two training facilities they have a complex in on the west side of the county and on the east side of the county both of them are packed on regular basis you see south florida you are winning a lot more and even going back four or five years, go back to pre-pandemic right before they started making this playoff run,

it wasn't always that way. It was you had a good year here, you had a good year there. Maybe fans started to see it. But in terms of a consistent basis, in terms of consistency of the appreciation for the sport, the appreciation for the team, it's the best I've seen it during my time down here I know that it's a big question to answer in terms of how does

Florida become a model franchise but it's also something that you wrote about that this has become a destination place obviously Matthew Kachuk chose to go there from Calgary and I know that you spoke to a couple different people about it. How has Florida gone about becoming a model franchise? Yeah, I mean, it starts at the top with general manager Bill Zito implementing what he wants a winning franchise to be. You've seen him over his four years, bit by bit, year by year, add more players and get them into the mindset of not just making the playoffs isn't the goal, it's getting far in the playoffs.

And you see it with the guys like that. They already have, first off, with the established guys, the Algander Barkovs, the Aaron Eklads, who have been here since day one, 10 and 11 years respectively, who have gone through the struggles and saw the way it takes to get up here. And then once they started winning, you see how they've just found these found players who have made it to the point where they want to be here in the prime of their career. Matt,

Senator Tarasenko at the trade deadline, waving his no trade contract only to come to the Florida Panthers to try to win a Stanley cup with them. The success stories that have come out of here with Gustav Forsling, with Carter Verhage, et cetera, his career reviving, Sam Reinhardt breaking out, and players seeing what is happening down here with players in our prime breaking out and having these big years.

And also, South Florida's a pretty good environment to play in. I mean, when you're in the middle of the season, when you're in December, January, February, and you're still able to wear shorts and flip-flops, what's not to love about that too, right? In the past with the Florida Panthers, has it been an issue ever of almost having not enough pressure on them? Because we always talk in Canada about all the pressure on the Canadian teams

and how it's difficult, how they live in a fishbowl and how a lot of the good players want to go down to environments like Florida. But I also remember teams like the Dallas Stars. There was a time when the Dallas Stars, actually one of the executives called the media because he wanted the media to write something bad about his players because he wanted the media to hold them accountable um is that is that a tough balance to strike in florida and do you have to make sure that you've got the right competitive guys on the roster so they don't feel like it's a country club down there i definitely think that's a fair point especially early on or in some of those years when they were in their downslope. That's definitely something that happened.

But now that you look at where they are now, especially, again, these last five years they've made the playoffs, it's gotten to the point where everybody understands that if you're here, the expectation is to make a deep run. They now understand what it takes and have that mindset of not just playoff robust, but playoff runs, making it to the Stanley Cup final the past two years, making it beyond the first round,

making it not just getting in and getting bouncing round one, which happened basically every year up until this current streak. They understand what it takes and what they're here to do. They know that, again, like I said, with that country club line, there is some fun, there are some great amenities down here with it, but that, to them, is more just icing on the cake. They know that what's being built around here with Bill Zito, with Bill Zito running the show,

with what Paul Maurice has implemented the last two years, they know that priority number one is what they're doing on that ice. Everything else is secondary and just bonus perks to them at this point. Did the success of the Tampa Bay Lightning drive the success of the Florida Panthers at all? I don't know if it necessarily drove it, but it definitely did lay a fire on them. I would say that again camp is being their cross-town rival them knocking four out of out of the playoffs two consecutive years that second time in 2022 when they got sweating and they got swept in the second round

that was a wake-up call for them again panthers won the president's trophy that year they played with that run and gun style offense high offense, high-opting offense, top-scoring offense in the league, and then they realized that they need to be better on the defensive end of the ice, and that sort of sparked a turn. That helped with the reasoning behind hiring Paul Maurice as the coach and being able to change their system defensively and figure out what it takes to not just succeed in the regular season but find ways to succeed in the playoffs.

And Paul Maurice's system, since he got here last year, they've become one of the best, if not the best, defensive team in the NHL. And it's paid off. And obviously watching what Tampa did, winning the back-to-back Stanley Cups, making it there for a third year, watching their crosstown rival do that,

that's tough to take, especially for a team that is trying to get to that level. And after these past two years, the Panthers have shown that they can be at that same level as Tampa, and if they're able to win it this year, they're going to be able to start taking that stepping stone and make this one-two punch in terms of the state of Florida about how they're able to compete with the big dogs in the NHL just shows that the Eastern Conference can run through the South. So Paul Maurice is an interesting character in all this. I remember when he was the head coach

of the Winnipeg Jets, I thought he did a pretty good job in almost all facets, but I always thought the Jets were a little bit of an undisciplined team. Now part of it was because they had some personalities on the team like Dustin Bufflin, who played on the line sometimes. But I always thought they took too many penalties. And when Paul Maurice went to Florida, especially last season, I thought the same. It's like, this team is undisciplined. This season has been a different story. They seem to be a little more cognizant of the fact that if they take unnecessary penalties it's going to hurt them and certainly if they take them against the edmonton oilers it's probably going to hurt them um has that been a talking point at all this season discipline and and

making sure you do play tough but not stupid yeah it has and again that's been a balancing act they've been trying to do for these for both the past year seeing what happened last year being if i remember correctly we're the most time the last team in the league last year this year they they understand what they and especially last year their penalty kill was probably their achilles heel last year which cost them a bunch but this year they're they are a lot more disciplined as you said but they are trying to figure out the strike that balance they are a physical aggressive team, as you said, but they are trying to figure out how to strike that balance. They are a physical, aggressive team, but they know how they understand where the line is.

Now, when you look at some of the guys, I want to just point out Matthew Kachuk's biggest example. In this playoffs, he only has two minor penalties. He was a guy who, from where he led the team in penalties, or at least minor penalties, last year. And the fact that he's found a way to still be his edgy, gritty, get-in-your-face self but not to the point where it's getting him into the box is something that he personally has taken on this of

and had an understanding of. And if he's able to do that, the rest of the team is able to recognize, okay, we can play like this, but we can still play and be ourselves and figure out ways for it not to cost us in the long run. Jordan, this was great, man. Thanks for taking the time to do it. We really appreciate it. Enjoy the start

of the series. For those that have forgotten, it begins on Saturday in Florida. And thanks again. We really appreciated this. Yeah, thank you guys so much. Thank you. That's Jordan McPherson from the Miami Herald here on the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. So let's go into the Dunbar Lumber text line for just a bit. Dunbar Lumber with three stores to serve you in Ladner on Bridge Street, Dunbar Lumber Express at Ladner Center, or our Budas in Vancouver,

online at DunbarLumber.com. The text line is 650-650. Send in your What We Learns. We'll read those in about 45 minutes. But Jay in North Delta texts in and asks, what do you guys think it would take to get Zgris and do you think he'd be a fit here? Jay in North Delta says he's liking the cap

hit. Trevor Zgris, if he played for a team that got some more attention, would be a real hot button topic because there's no question he's got talent, he's got skill, he's got personality. But I think what happened this season was they got a new coach in Greg Cronin and he was like, yeah, it's great. You can do the Michigan and all that. We need you to be a more serious hockey player.

And I think the results were mixed. He also had some injury issues, right? And that kept him out for a while. Trevor Zegres, I don't know if it's probable that he's going to get traded. Well, the reason his name has come up is because in his most recent piece for The Athletic, Pierre Lebrun wrote that Zegras trade chatter has resurfaced. He talked to Pat Verbeek about it, and obviously the general manager of the Anaheim Ducks wouldn't comment on a potential Zegras trade.

But according to other league sources of Pierre Lebrun, the Ducks are listening on him and would consider moving him in the right deal because they're now a little bit deeper up front and maybe all the cool stuff that he did when he came in as a rookie isn't so cool anymore. Zegers and Petey would be interesting, but it could also be a nightmare.

So I'm sort of in the middle there. Zegers is... We sound so old when we talk about him. We're like, I don't like his fancy moves. He's got to stick to the fundamentals. Yeah. He's too much of a skateboarder, surfboarder type for my liking, but he's got a ton of skill.

I don't think going to Anaheim at the beginning of his career has particularly helped him. That's my thought on it. No, because there weren't expectations. Unserious hockey franchise with an unserious player. I know that sounds harsh. I'm willing to accept any blowback for that. His first practice with Taka would be something else.

He'd be like, okay, well, got to play defense. Well, so for that matter would be Martin H.S. Yeah. Merritt brought up a great point, though. The confidence, dare I say cockiness, of a good head coach is I can fix him. I can change him. Oh, I'm not saying Zegers on the Canucks couldn't. It could be amazing.

It could be exactly what they need. But there is a certain risk there as well because of just how he's played so far, right? Yeah, there's a huge risk. I mean, we've seen – Maybe this is just who he is. It might be. Right, so. I mean, defensive responsibility, you need to have the hockey IQ to do it too.

It's not just teaching and being willing to play defense. It's actually understanding. You have an innate understanding of how to defend. And some people just don't get that. Some people don't want to get that. And they just want to score goals. Trevor Zegers is, you know, I guess it was Jay in North Delta that texted in. Trevor Zegres might also be one of those complicated guys

where if he comes to Vancouver and has success, then you're in a pickle with his contract. He's the offensive forward version of Phil Koronek. Well, it's what Besser went through. And maybe it's because Manco and Krakut just hates him. But the problem with targeting those guys who are 23 or 24 years old, if they're on a bridge deal out of their entry-level contract, which Trevor Zegers is,

then you're kind of damned if you do and damned if you don't because if they don't have success, if they show up and they're not successful, then it's bad because you've got a very unsuccessful player, right? For the record, to answer the question, I would say stay far, far away from Zeke's. But if they do have success, which Philip Peronic had this season, then you're in a pickle because you want to keep the player, but that player has a ton of negotiating leverage and not a lot of market value because the other teams are like, well, then we're going to have to work out a contract with them.

It's a dilly of a pickle. It is a dilly of a pickle. You sure can dangle, though. And if it worked out with Petey, if Petey got that winger he needed and it was Zechris, there's always that potential. J and OK Falls, hashtag WWL, what we learned, Joe Pavelski is retiring. Yeah, little Joe, as he was known during his time in San Jose, is going to hang it up.

It seemed like it was pretty obvious in the aftermath before he confirmed it yesterday because the Dallas Stars put together. Actually, sorry, it was Bleacher Report on behalf of the Dallas Stars put together a compilation video of Jamie Benn, Tyler Sagan, and Wyatt Johnson talking about Joe Pavelski after they lost game six to Edmonton, and they were all openly crying because everyone loves the guy so much, and I think that they all knew that it was over for him,

and they had fallen short of obviously winning the Stanley Cup, that he was never able to win. Such an interesting guy because I hate the Hall of Fame debate is always awful because it's so polarizing. It's either you're in or you're out, right? There's no gray area here on this. Yeah. And you almost got to rip down very good players if you don't think they

deserve to be in the Hall of Fame. You should never pick apart the career of Joe Pavelski. I believe he was drafted in a round like Yannick Hanson that doesn't exist anymore. He might be a seventh round pick. Was he a ninth round pick? I forget now. Anyway, he was a really late round pick. He was never expected to be in the NHL or amount to the kind of player that he was.

The second part of his career with Dallas was hilarious. Seventh round pick. Seventh round pick. Because when he was let go by San Jose, there was an understanding that he would just sort of coast off into the sunset and not become an impact player. And he was a great player for Dallas. And people in San Jose were mad because you know who got his cap space? Eric Carlson.

No, Evander Kane. Was it? I thought it was Eric Carlson. Either way, two guys that didn't end up working out for San Jose. Do you know why Pavelski was able to extend his career so long? Because he had the best hand-eye coordination in NHL history. That's part of it, yes. But he also liked to go in the offseason and work at goalie schools.

He would learn what goalies would learn. Yeah, he would learn what goalies would learn. He was like a spy? Well, you think about the way he scored, right? He did all the little things that would piss a goalie off so much, and he learned that by studying goalie stuff. One of the premier. I'm glad he missed you.

It's true. I thought it was a good fact. No, it is. And you know what he did in the offseason? He went to Korea to watch baseball. That's right. He laid down some bunts. Actually, you know, I bet Joe Pavelski.

I actually didn't know that. I bet Joe Pavelski would be awesome. Well, that's why he was so sneaky and deft, right? Because he knew all the little things that would just drive a goalie nuts. Would Joe Pavelski not be an awesome Korean baseball player? He could bunt with the best of them. Would Joe Pavelski not be the best bunter in the National Hockey League? He'd be pretty good. How's his speed, though?

Can he drag bunt? Oh, yeah. Just a sacrifice. By the way, the reason I'm talking about this is it's the Korean Baseball League All-Star Game that has the bunting competition, right? Which is the most electric competition. It's better than a home run derby. It very very cool yeah it's amazing um do you think the dallas stars are going to be looking to get a little bigger up front this offseason so this is

interesting with both i feel like they looked small with with both the stars and the rangers they have the exact same conversations going on right now and it's that can they play big boy hockey essentially or are their big boys going to show up when it that can they play big boy hockey essentially or are their big boys going to show up when it's time to play big boy hockey because the rangers big boys where i'm using no i'm using i i know i mean physically big so consider um florida for example as the florida's big guys are also their big scores kachuk bennett they were the ones that were doing the majority of the business um the Rangers' big three, which were Panarin, Kreider, and Zbigniew. No show against the Panthers.

They combined for two goals. And some of that you tip your cap. A lot of you tip your cap to guys like Barkov and Forsling, the ones who shut them down. Right. What the Stars found in their series was that they have the three duos, right? They got Ben and Sagan, the old guard. Yeah.

They have Robertson and Hintz, the current guard. And then they have the Stank Oven and Wyatt Johnson, the future. And they're all playing at the same time. Those young guys, none of them are big, though. No. The only big guy is Jamie Benn, and he can't really get around like he used to. Exactly. He's not much of an impact player.

What the Rangers and Stars are facing right now, the commonality between them is we have a very good team. We've had a lot of success recently. The Rangers have been to five conference finals in the last 13 years, and the stars have been perennial deep playoff runs do we just keep trying and trying and trying like the carolina hurricanes yeah or do we say no there's something that needs to fundamentally change because we get to a certain point and we never get to the point we want to be at and i don't i have a hard time looking at both those rosters and pointing out major deficiencies. Like if you're looking at two of the better built teams in the NHL,

and then it just comes back to the old cliche. Hockey is hard. It's hard to win, right? It's hard to win. You can be a really, really, really good team and you fall one game short of getting to the Stanley Cup final, which is what happened to the Rangers and to the Stars, right?

And maybe that's all it is at the end of the day. I mean, if you look at the teams that got knocked out alongside Vancouver in the second round, Carolina is a really good team. Boston's a really good team. They fell shorter than they expected as well. And it's just sometimes it's just and I hate saying it because it sounds so simple and so stupid, but it's really hard to win. Yeah, but I do think that there's a general feeling that we're almost turning, veering, not a complete 180, but we're veering back into the appreciation for the bigger, stronger players. That appreciation has always been there.

Don't get me wrong but i think we can all we can all say that in the last little while i don't know 10 15 years there's been more of a place for the smaller player and i don't think that's wrong i'm not saying that's wrong but if you look a lot of the teams that have won the Stanley Cup recently, they got some big boys, whether it's up front or on the back end or both. And there's a toughness there that you just have to accept. Hockey in the playoffs is really, really physical. And there are a lot of the guys that kind of struggled in the playoffs. Oftentimes, they are the smaller players.

Well, okay. For example, we just talked about Trevor Zegers, right? And someone just texted this in to the Dunbar Lumber text message in basket at 650-650. Trevor Zegers seems like a quote-unquote regular season player. Yes. I think there's such a thing for sure. I think Andre Kuzmenko might be one of those guys.

Can you say that without seeing them in the playoffs first? Do you have to wait? I feel like I can, and I just did. And I'm calling out Kuzmenko to me. He's a guy that I think is a lot of fun to watch during the regular season. He scored 39 goals in a regular season. I bet if you're going into the playoffs, you're like, I bet he's not going to score at the same kind of clip in the playoffs.

It's just different hockey. It is. I mean, there's a reason that Sam Bennett is so much more valuable into the playoffs, you're like, bet he's not going to score at the same kind of clip in the playoffs. It's just different hockey. It is. I mean, there's a reason that Sam Bennett is so much more valuable in the playoffs than in the regular season. He's a door off in the playoffs versus the regular season. Regular season, people were like, I like him, okay. He's all right. Playoffs was like, this guy's my hero.

Tyler's laughing. He said, Halford is giving the only one team can win speech. Yeah, I kind of did. I hate it, but it's also kind of true so there are exceptions to the rules um someone takes it in garland played big yeah look i'm not saying that like you have to rule out every small player but i'm saying and i'll be curious to see if this plays out of the draft at all you know there was such a need and you still do need puck movers on your back end but you know 20 30 years ago i don't know where quinn hughes would have been drafted i don't think it would have been top 10 though but you know now you get

an opportunity to get a guy like Quinn Hughes, you take him. And I don't think that's going away. You need a puck mover like you need a point guard in the NBA. It's just, that's what you need. But we're seeing more and more teams try and build their defense around, yeah, you've got one puck mover. The rest of the guys are giants. Because getting to the middle of the ice, you need to make that hard. So these things fluctuate, you know?

And eventually what might happen is everyone drafts these big guys, these big defensemen, and then you realize, well, wait a minute, it's easier to forecheck these guys because they don't move as fast as some of the smaller guys and they can't move the puck. So then you'll be like, ah, you need more puck movers, right? And then the small guys get another chance right now. I think the way the NHL is going though, and I think

what's going to be true forever, whether you like it or not, is like big, strong hockey players have an advantage in the playoffs. Coming up on the Halford and Brough Show on Sportsnet 650, Dan Murphy's going to join us, Sportsnet's very own.

And then at 8.30, we're going to give away a pair of tickets to the Best What We Learned to see Snoop and DJ Quick and Warren G. Yeah, that's right, on June 25th at Rogers Arena. If you want to win tickets, Best What We Learned, send it in. Dunbar Lumber text line is 650-650. You're listening to the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet 650.