Halford & Brough in the Morning - The Importance Of Team Culture

Episode Date: December 16, 2025

In hour three, Mike & Jason chat with New York Rangers reporter Jim Cerny (2:35), as the Blue Shirts get set to host Vancouver this evening, plus the boys tell us what they learned (27:00). This podcast is produced by Andy Cole and Greg Balloch. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

8.0.801 on a Tuesday, everybody, everybody, Halford, Brough, Sportsnet 650. Halford, Bradford and the Morning is brought to you by Sands and Associates, score a debt freedom hat trick, one, no more interest, two much lower payments, and three, financial peace of mind. Visit them online at sands dash trustee.com. We are now in Hour three of the program. Hour three is brought to by Campbell and Pound, real estate appraisers.

Trust the expertise of Campbell and Pound. Visit them on the internet at Campbell-Dash Pound.com. Today. We are coming live from the Kintech Studio. Now is the time to maximize the... the benefits of custom orthotics before the year runs out, visit kintech.net. We are in the process of trying to get Jim Cerney on the line. He, of course, the executive editor of blue shirts.com, one of the finest New York Rangers analysts out there.

Canucks are playing the Rangers tonight, 4 o'clock from MSG. They continue on this tour of playing former teammates, J.T. Miller and the New York Rangers tonight, Bo Horvatt, the New York Islanders on Friday. They're also getting another team on the second of a back-to-back because the Devils had played the day before. That's correct. Right? Yes.

Yeah. And the Rangers played last night against Anaheim. And believe it or not, they lost on home ice. What? Not the Rangers. And they had trouble scoring. It was also, everything else that was going on last night, it was the return of Chris Crider and Jacob Truba to New York.

I know. Crider got a huge ovation. And for Trubo, it was like, like, yeah, nice. Tipper my score 40 again this year. Yeah, he's having a really good year. He's such a good player. Yeah, he's such a good player.

Does he go to the Olympic team? I wonder. That was the shocking part when that memo came out and Kreider was part of it. Like, I understood Truba, even though he was the captain. Sure. But Criter? I know.

And he's proven them all wrong in Anaheim where they score lots of goals. Okay, we got Jim on the line. Is this, are we confirmed here? Okay. To the phone lines we go, as mentioned our next guest, one of the finest New York Rangers analysts out there. executive editor of Forever Blue Shirts. Jim Surny joins us now on the Halford & Brough Show on SportsNet 650.

Good morning, Jim. How are you? Good morning, boys. How are you? We're well. Thanks for taking the time to do this. We appreciate it. No shortage of storylines to get into with this New York Rangers do. I don't even know where to begin. I think I want to begin with the Mika Zabinajad story. I was trying to make it into a big story this morning, but I don't know how big it truly is. That's why we ask you, because your boots on the ground there. what's going on with Mika Zabinajad?

Is this a one-time issue, or is this a thing that maybe happened before? Is it going to matter long term? What's going on with Mika Zibinajad? I don't think it's as big a story, you know, if some want to make it out to be, but we don't know. And rightfully so, you know, Mike Sullivan is not exactly doling out all the information. You know, he was asked point blank last night. post game, if this is a recurring issue, has this happened before with Zabanajad?

And surprisingly, he didn't provide any clarity on that. You would think that if there's one-time thing, that the coach would just say, hey, listen, he got caught in traffic, he lives in the city, you know, we practice in Westchester, which if you know, New York is, you know, north of Manhattan, and, you know, it's the holiday season. and bad weather, and, you know, he probably just got caught in traffic. You know, that's the way Sullivan made it seem before the game, pregame, when he announced that Meek it was going to be a healthy scratch for missing a team meeting. But then when asked directly about it after the game, he just said, I'm not going to talk about it.

You know, there's no more information. But in both instances, and this is where I think there's not a bigger problem here, he made sure to emphasize, you know, what a terrific leader, Mika is, what a terrific human being Mika is. I don't know. I think if he was really angry with him, I don't know that he would go over the top in sharing these other, you know, positive thoughts about Mika. So I tend to think that it's just a one-time thing. We move on. He's going to play tonight against Vancouver.

So I don't think there's anything more there. And I'm sure Mika is, you know, extremely embarrassed. He's a true professional. He really is. And, you know, I'm sure he's embarrassed by this. And I would look for him to certainly come out with a big effort tonight against the Kinex. Okay. So give us the big picture of the New York Rangers season.

They've now played 34 games. They're two points out of a playoff spot. But as we all know, if you win like three straight games, in the Eastern Conference, you can pretty much be first in your division. It seems like that at times, at least. Yeah, so the thing with the Rangers is, you know, if you just look at the points, it probably looks a little bit better than it really is, because they've played more games than every other team in the conference so far.

So most teams have a couple games in hand on the Rangers. You know, everyone has at least one game in hand on the Rangers. Some have two or three. So, you know, there's that value factor in as well, and points percentage. You know, they're on the lower end in the conference. The bottom line is the NHL this season, specifically the Eastern Conference, is jam-packed with parity and, I'd argue, mediocrity. And the Rangers, boy, they fit that mold right there. You know, they have talent, for sure.

Their defensive structure is a hell of a lot better than last. season. Their goal-tending with Shistercant and Quick is grade A. But yet, they're a mediocre team. They don't seem capable of reeling off a five-game winning streak and putting the Pittsburghs and the Phillies and the Detroits and the Ottawa's in their rearview mirror. And the big part of that is they just do not score enough. You know, they'll have an outburst. here and there, and you're like, okay, yeah, here we go. You know, Panarin and Miller and, you know, Zadnajad, and yeah, here they go. And then, you know, then they'll be shut out the next game or they'll be held to one goal

by Lucas Ostahl as they were last night. And they get good looks, you know, but it's not consistent pressure, you know, offensively. And when they get their chances, they're just not cashing in enough and their special teams have not been good. So maybe I'm getting in the weeds a little bit here because you talk about big picture. But yes,

can they make the playoffs for sure. But I can make that argument for almost every team in the Eastern Conference right now. It's crazy. Yeah. Who's really the elite teams in the Eastern Conference? And what happens when, oh, say the Florida Panthers get fully healthy

again, you know, when Kajok and maybe Barkov by the end of the season or back? there could be teams flying past the Rangers, too. But in a very, very mediocre Eastern Conference, the Rangers are a mediocre team, but yes, they're smack dab in the playoff race, and I wouldn't be surprised if they make it,

and I wouldn't be surprised if they don't. I can't help but thinking about how big the stakes are for the Rangers this season, because they made some big moves, including bringing in Mike Sullivan as head coach, and trading for J.T. Miller and making him captain. But then I look at the immediate future and they might miss the playoffs this season.

They can't score and their best scorer are Temi Panarin or the guy who leads the team. He's an unrestricted free agent who they might not be able to keep. What's going to happen if they can't keep Panarin? I mean, all of a sudden you go from a team that can't score to a team that really can't score? Right. Well, the

one thing Sully has done has really instill a commitment, a team-wide commitment to playing a strong defensive game in five-man units, five-man groupings. And so there might be, you know, a little

shifting of the mindset here, not even a little shift, you know, a big shift in the mindset of what this team is you know they may have to beat you going forward this season and you know down the road they might have to win these games two one three two um you know they they really don't profile uh and we're now we're talking about moving forward as a really explosive team i mean ben erin for sure is their best offensive player but even he has been you know very streaky this year, very up and down.

He's had, I think, three, four-point games, but yet at the end of the day, he's averaging slightly under a point per game. He's basically a point-per-game player, 11 goals, 22 assists in 34 games. But he's had the explosive moments, but the consistent scoring hasn't been there. You know, Mika's had some really good moments offensively.

J.T., who started slowly, has come on offensively, but hasn't, you know, the consistency is just not there. So they really need to rely heavily on Schisturkin and quick and that better defensive structure to win these games. And certainly, you know, Panarin is allowed to walk at the end of the season or if they choose to move him even before the deadline, if they think, you know, he's not part of the long-term answer because, you know, next year is going to be. Panarren's age 35 season.

He's probably the most attractive score on the market. But if he's for, you know, let's say five years and, you know, 10, 11 million a year, ha, that's a tough ask, you know, for the Rangers to fill, despite, you know, the tremendous success he's had in New York, you know, as an offensive player.

And there's not much behind him. So we talk about Panarin heading into his age 35 season next year. You know, JT is going to be 33, Trochecks going to be 33, Zabanajad's going to be 33, Gavricab's going to be 31. And there's not a lot of really good young talent behind it, especially offensively. Gabe Perot's 20. He's in the minors. He's leading Northford in scoring.

But I think the Rangers really thought that. they were going to land a big fish in free agency in the summer of 2026 because there were so many great options out there, even if Connor McDavid might have been the dream. But hey, if not, Connor, there's the other Connor. There's Kyle Connor. There's Jack Eichol. There's Martin Aches. You know, they're all these guys. Uh-oh. Now they've all re-signed with their teams. Now the best possible free agent out there is the scorer is the guy you've got already, but he's turning 35. next season. It's going to be fascinating to see what they can do.

They have a ton of salary-capped space next off-season, and they may be left literally holding the bag, the bag of money, because who do you want to spend it on? And again, they've, you know, they have two first-round picks this coming season or this upcoming draft. Great. But that's not immediate help, you know, in most cases.

So, you know, that's developmental. You've got to still develop those kids. Again, circling back, they are going to have to win a lot of games. I think moving forward this season and beyond in that, you know, being a really, really good defensive team. And to Sully's credit, I think he's laying that groundwork right now. We're speaking to New York Rangers reporter Jim Sernie here on the Halford and Breft Show on Sportsnet 650. Set the table nicely for my next question, Jim.

How would you grade the job that Mike Sullivan's done? his first year as the head coach of the New York Rangers? I think you've done really well. You know, I know, you'll look at the record, 16, 14, and 4, and you'll say, come on, you're going to be better than that. But he's a very steady, firm hands. There is no doubt right from day one, you know, this guy's the boss. These guys, the players are falling in line.

And again, this has not been a good defensive team in a number of years. And they are vastly, vastly improved defensively. And the addition of Ladisab Gavrakov is a big part of that. He is really steady things on the back end for them. Great free agent signing. But you need buy-in from your players. And I think Sully's got that gravitas that these guys are buying in. Zabanajad, it's a great example.

He, you know, he didn't sniff the defensive zone last season, and yet he is played very hard, very committed to playing the 200-foot game. So I think that alone shows you what a good job Sullivan has done. He cannot put the puck in the net for them. It's a little mind-boggling. You look at the great scoring opportunities, these talented offensive players, and there is talent there that they've had in the first two, three months of the season, that they just don't finish on. And I'm not sure that's on the coach. The opportunities are there.

The guys got to finish. Now, the one spot that I think, and it may change tonight against Vancouver, but since Adam Fox went on LTIR, and he's been out six games now, the Rangers gone with a five-forward top power play unit, and it really has not been good. They've had some opportunities, but they've yet to score on the power play with that five-forward group out there,

and they've allowed two shorthanded goals, including one last night, in a game where they were the better team early on, but fell behind one-nothing because they allowed that shorty. I think, and I know he doesn't trust, or doesn't trust, doesn't believe that they have another offensive defenseman to quarterback the power play. He doesn't trust the rookie Scott Morrow, who was scratched last night. And, you know, I don't think he sees Braden Schneider or Gabrikov as that guy,

that defenseman to play the quarterback spot here in Fox's absence. but I think that they have to think about going back to that and maybe giving the Kid Morrow, who is an offensive defenseman, a chance here because, you know, the Rangers are getting caught, you know, chasing back the other way, short-handed chances against. It's just not working out great with Panarin or Zadadad as the quarterback on the prior play. So he's been very stubborn about that through six games here. And that might be the one fault that I have found in his coaching so far this season.

Okay, one more for you. Nope, no more for you. That was perfect. Jim's out. You know what? We're up against it for time anyway. Call him back and let him know that we thank him for taking the time today. But by the time we get him back, we're going to be up against it for time.

What was your one more? I wanted to know about J.T. Miller's Olympic participation. Is it a lock? Is it a story in New York? Is the story that his head coach also, the head coach of the Olympic team, even a thing? I think he's going. So I don't really think it's like a pressing burning. question. Like, I think he would have to do something pretty dramatic would have to happen.

I think he'll be on the fourth line for the Americans. Yeah. And, you know, he, he was a very spirited contributor at the four nations. Like, there's no denying that. And I think given his leadership role on that American team and what he meant, he's a veteran leader in that group, right? He was part of the text thread. Ultimately, he'll be there. I'll be curious to see if, if he even really cares if he's playing in a lesser role. Right. No, he won't. I don't think he cares if he was playing in a lesser role. He just probably wants to be on the team. Because it's not like you're sitting behind bad players when you're born to this term.

It's the elite of the elite. It's a lot of good players. So, anyway, so by the way, Dale Weiss is going to join us at 830. And we thank Jim Serney from Forever Blue Shirts for joining us earlier. Dale Weiss is going to join us at 830. So that means we're not doing what we learns. We're going to try and get a few in now, if I'm not mistaken. Yeah. If you've gotten them in front of you, Dunbar Lumber, text message in basket. 650, 650.

Okay, I learned that Gavin McKenna is very motivated to show that he is still the likely first overall pick in the draft. We all know that McKenna's time at Penn State has been a challenge, which was the whole point of going to Penn State, giving himself a challenge. He's got 18 points in 16 games, which isn't terrible, but I think a lot of people wanted him to go to college hockey

and essentially put up the same numbers that he was putting up in junior. And I think he has, by certain accounts, he has struggled at times with the bigger, stronger players. And he mentioned that he wants to spend a lot of time in the gym. And that was one of the reasons to go to Penn State in that they play fewer games and you can spend more time in the gym. And he also had this quote in the Canadian press ahead of the world juniors. And he said, sometimes getting people pumping your tires all the time

isn't the best thing for you. People have been waiting for me to fail. It fires me up. And he said, of playing in the NCAA, defensively, it's a lot harder. There's less time and space. Guys are quicker. It's a skilled league as well.

but it's just more straightforward hockey, crash and bang, trying to get to those dirty areas to find ways to score. The World Juniors, from a Canadian perspective, it's always interesting to us because we want Canada to win. But I'd say there's three really good reasons to watch this year. First of all, the last two years have been embarrassing for Canada. That's right. And we'd kind of like, they've been out in the quarterfinals,

haven't meddled, and we kind of like for that to end. especially since it's in the States. The second reason, I think, is Gavin McKenna to see what he's like. And the third reason is Brayton Coots for the Canucks. I want to see what kind of role he's going to have. Apparently, he's devoted to a third-line wing position at practice today. Okay, well, at least he's still in. He's not on the fourth line.

Top nine. Top nine. There's still going to be cuts. Yeah. Right? So I, I, this world juniors, I'm pretty curious to watch. Maybe more so. than most years, especially since there's

a Canucks prospect playing for Team Canada. Mook how that man. Well, I also have a bit of news from the world of NCAA athletics. Not hockey, though. Okay. Football, it's official. Arch Manning returning to the University of Texas.

His father, Cooper Manning, said yesterday in a text to ESPN that Arch will return to play football at the University of Texas next year, even though he could have declared for the NFL draft, despite being a redshirt sophomore. Speaking of seasons that were tougher than many expected. Right?

Because some similarities there. They might have a chip on their shoulder. And in Archer's case, it's, I'm going to go back to school and prove everyone in the NCAA wrong. Now, I will say his season started poorly. I think by, I think, some unrealistic expectations of what he was going to do. But his season started poorly. They actually went pretty well in the second half of the season.

Texas finish 6 and 1 They made a late push to get into the playoff He ended up finishing with 24 touchdowns and 7 interceptions Which are pretty good numbers For a guy in his first tour of duty In the NCAA landscape I think a lot of people just assume that Almost regardless of what he did at college football this year

He might go to the NFL because of the pedigree Someone's going to take the chance Yeah, he would get picked but then he'd be thrown to the wolves Right, I mean maybe you sit for a year there But he is going to go back and play college football That doesn't happen enough in the NFL No I mean, I think it's the right decision.

It should happen more. The Mannings have always been a very pragmatic family. You know, they know, I mean, there's a reason that the families had such athletic success and they're cultivating the young guy's career in the right way. Another year at Texas, an opportunity to do a lot more than he did this year, including being a Heisman candidate next year. So Arch Manning got his way back to Texas. Mookalmi.

All right? I was actually just thinking, we've got a couple of minutes here. Yes. I was thinking about that Canadian. team. Laddie, you follow the dub a little closer than I do. Uh, I know, and I know, uh, Berkeley Caton isn't in the dub. He's, he's, he's with the Seattle Cracken, but he's been hurt recently, right? Uh, he's been, last I saw, I they call him Hurtle cat. Yeah. Well, the, the Giants were thankful he's still not with Spokane because they just played them and beat them. But yeah, I,

he played 22 games last night check. So he's, he's well past the, the 10 game sample size. Is he out? I think he's, I think he's, I think he's, I think he's, he's, he's, he's kind of banged up right now. But a couple of weeks ago, the Cracken had suggested that they won't lend him to Canada. Got the article right in front of me as a matter of fact. Is he? Yeah, okay.

It says, uh, why Seattle Crackens, Berkeley Caton is unlikely to play at the world. Okay. And then he wouldn't be lent, lent out to team Canada. Here's, here's, here's, one to want to bring up. Okay. When was that? That was a couple weeks ago? December 1st.

Okay. Have you noticed that the Cracken stink? Yes. Right now? Yes. Very poor. Like I wonder if they're going to think twice about that and if he's healthy to go. I wonder if they would. Is it too late for that? It can't be too late for them to send him. Send him on the eve of the tournament. He's a quality player. We haven't paid. We haven't paid much attention to the story because it's the Cracken and I don't even know if people in Seattle are paying attention to it. Sorry, we always take cheap shots at the Cracken. But it's fun. There are no crack in vans to complain. But they are, they hit this kid's big time. They're bad, man. They haven't won in regulation since November 20th. Yep. That's almost a month. Oh.

They've had two overtime wins since then. They're coming off a 3-1 loss to Buffalo. Who loses to Buffalo at home? I know. Horrible teams. Embarrassment. Embarrassment to society. Yeah, they've had, they are not in a good way right now.

But they were in a good way a little while ago. They were 11, 5, and 5 before they went on this horrific losing streak. I watched their game against L.A. where they won in overtime, and it was an entertaining affair. They can't score, man. They can't score. They can't score. They really struggling to score.

They're leading scorer, Jordan Eberley, with 19 points in 30 games. I have, I can't say never. But if there's a team in the NHL that just screams, we need a star player. Yeah, big time. We need a superstar player. It's the Seattle Cracken. They've taken swings.

Not big enough. Not big enough. Caco was a big swing. Not big enough. Stevenson wasn't a big enough swing. Montour wasn't a big enough swing. We need stars. Bringing a Chanandler Stevenson.

Yeah. Brandon Montour. Tolvinen had some pedigree when they brought in. They should have been front of line offering whatever they could have got to get Quinn Hughes. That's a team that would, Like, I know Minnesota said, and they probably... If Quinn had any choice in it, which apparently he did, he wouldn't have gone to Seattle.

But I'm just saying, like, that's a team when you're talking about when a superstar player becomes available, a rantan, a Quinn Hughes, guys that have appeared, that's where Seattle should be front of line. Like, we'll give you everything. Yeah, at the very least leak to the media that they're interested in it. We'll give you everything we got, right? Anything you want, you can have it. We need some star power here. Okay, we're up against it for time. It is a Canucks game day.

Canucks Game Day is brought to by Panago. Game Day of the Panago way. Get any large pizza plus cheesy bread for only 2499. Use code Canucks at Panago.com and Panago for it. Restrictions may apply. Dale Weiss coming up next. Yeah, Dale Weiss on the Halford & Brough Show on SportsNet 650. Canucks talk with Jamie Dodd and Thomas Drance.

We'll dive deep into all that's happening with the Vancouver Canucks. Listen 12 to 2 p.m. on SportsNet 650 or wherever you get your podcast. Lapier after the park comes out from behind the net puts it to the crease they scored Dale Weiss has his first of the year

and at 914 to the third jury and the Canucks take a one-nothing lane 834 on a Tuesday, happy Tuesday everybody Halford Brough Sportsnet 650 Halford Brough of the morning

is brought to by Sands and Associates score a deaf freedom hat-truth One, no more interest, two much lower payments than three. Financial peace of mind. Visit them online at Sands dash trustee.com. We are in our three of the program. Our three is brought to by Campbell and Pound, real estate appraisers. Trust the expertise of Campbell and Pound.

Visit them on the internet at Campbell-Dash Pound.com today. We did play a Dale Weiss clip coming back from break because we are efforting, one of my favorite words. Former Vancouver Canuck Dale Weiss. We're trying to get them on the program to talk about culture. The culture of the Vancouver Canucks when he played was set by Daniel and Henrik Sidion, and he talks glowingly about that time. He's done a few podcasts in the last couple months.

What's the one that he was on? He was on. Slang in the bizkit? Yeah, slang in the bizkit. Slang in the bizkit. It's a limp biscuit podcast. We definitely need. It's a limp biscuit podcast.

It wasn't even about hockey. We definitely need more hockey podcasts. Dale's a big biscuit guy. Anyway, so what was their song? Something about the Nookie? Did it all for the Knuckie? Break yourself? So many classics. You could get that cookie.

I saw, now that we're on this, now that we're on, I saw a clip yesterday of a recent Limp Biscuit concert in Peru. Recent? Yes. Like within the last couple months. Fred Durst looks weird now, though. Whatever. Let me tell you, Peru is still very much down with the biscuit.

It was crazy. I don't know. Like, maybe they just got the music a little while ago. I'm not sure. How would you describe limp biscuit? Like what are? New metal. New metal. New metal. New metal. Frat boy, new metal.

So South America loves metal. Correct. And they love Limbiscuit. Yeah. I don't know what. They played break stuff. Yeah. Which is actually, it's a good pump-up song.

They got a few songs. Roll in my way or the highway. Don't sell them short, bro. Okay. Let's not call them good songs. Let's find a better descriptor for that. I actually do like one song off their biggest album, the last track on the album. I want to say it's called Boiler Room. I legit like that song

I think that's the only song I've heard that I've like Yeah, that's pretty good Anyway The rest of them are just like Yeah, it's Frat Boy New Metal man So let's dial this back Wear a hat backwards

Listen to some Limbiscuit Let's dial this back Dale Weiss was on a podcast Called the Slang in the Bizkit Which is not a limp biscuit podcast Anyway, he was talking about culture Talking about how it was great When he was in Vancouver with the city

And how it wasn't great at other stops In his NHL career Including Philadelphia team led by Jacob Vorichek And Claude Giroux And we thought you know what in light of all the culture conversations that have gone on with the Vancouver Canucks

recently, see if we can reach out to him. If he doesn't, A dog, it's fine if he doesn't reach out. Yeah, we're running low on time. We can, um, we can just read some of the quotes that he had here. And he was talking about the Cedines and he said they were so good at creating a culture and making everyone feel a part of it. They made a guy like me who when I was there my first year, I was on the fourth line playing five minutes a night.

They made me feel like I was a superstar. I just have so much respect for those two. They're just the nicest people. And this is something I actually wanted to get into with him because here's another quote. In Vancouver, we get on the road and the Siddins would be leading the charge telling guys, okay boys, go get changed.

Everybody in the bus in 15 minutes. The whole team would go out together, go have some drinks, we'd have some fun. What I wanted to ask him about is that, Is that still relevant in today's NHL when so many of the younger players, number one, drink less? Yeah. And number two, seem to want to hang out and, I don't know, remember that was there was that big article in the athletic? It's like, yeah, they just want to go home and play video games and maybe take a weed gummy or something.

Okay. To which I'd be like, that sounds good. Maybe ignore the dinner part of it, but the first part of it where they were like, like simple things like, let's go get changed. I know it was a precursor going out for dinner. The Siddons were the parents. I was like, don't forget to brush your teeth. So when you talk about setting culture, Shane O'Brien was like, I brushed my teeth already. And the scenes were like, let me see your toothbrush. And he was like, it was with a piece of licorice. And then I, Shane, you didn't just run your toothbrush under the water, did you?

And he was like, yes, yes, I did. I think that when it comes to setting culture, when we talk about it. We always talk about the big picture thing, and we used a lot of adjectives and descriptors. Like, you know, you have to be accountable. Yeah. And you have to be mature and you have to be responsible. But when you start getting, you dial it down, you dig to the nitty gritty of what it actually means. Like, you actually have to talk about the practices. And I'm not talking about like the actual on ice practice, but the practices that you have as a leader. Daily habits. Daily habits. But like the finite, minute things. You know, I remember when we talked to Manny Malhotra last year

and he was talking about Atu Ratu and he was saying how he's got a great attitude and he's got a great work ethic and finally I was like but those just describe his personality like what are some actual examples of that and he said one of them was

when we introduce a drill he jumps to the front of the line to want to be able to do it some guys will hang back because they're like I don't want to be the first one to do it and what if I screw up yeah then I look like a loser out here like an idiot it. He said not only does he, he eliminates that fear by jumping to the front, but he also wants to show the coaching staff that if you deliver a message to me and give me instructions, I'm the guy that's going to be able to carry them out to a T right away. And that's an important thing for a coach. And look what I got him. Healthy scratch. Right. Maybe not the best example in this current climate, but you got what I'm saying. So when it comes to building a culture in a room, there are, are things like, hey, showing up two minutes early for a meeting is actually late.

Or if you miss a meeting, there's no, well, we'll give you a hall pass this time. And you know what you have to do then is you have to be the guy that's there 15 minutes early. You have to be the guy that's first to the wait room or is on the ice early or is on the ice late. I just want to say one thing because I wonder if okay Patrick Alvin when I asked about the culture

he seen him taken aback and I wonder if there's an honest disconnect between what the fans in the media see and what the Canucks see internally because while

from the outside looking in it looks like this team has major issues considering the rift between Pedersen and Miller, the fact that Talkett chose not to return, and the fact that Quinn Hughes ultimately said, I don't want to be a part of this team anymore. Looks bad, right?

But I wonder if there are players like Tyler Myers and Brock Besser and Thatcher Dempco that will say, like, we're actually really a tight group. Yes. And we have stuck together through some tough things. And these these issues we tried to solve

and we just couldn't solve them so I just wanted to throw that out there because I bet there are people on the Canucks in that room and said like we don't have a culture problem we all get along really well but there's a big difference I'll just push back there's a big

difference between getting along and having a good culture I think there's a gulf between those two things right I think sometimes getting along can be work against having a good culture because I think part of holding people accountable is not always being their buddy and part of being a leadership group is being able to have tough conversations with people

that sometimes friends just don't want to have sometimes people can correlate friendship and comfort with good chemistry and good camaraderie. And I look at it and I'm like, if you can't give guys crap and hold them accountable and have tough moments,

then all you really are is a group of buddies. You're not constantly pushing one another and you're not saying here's the standard. We need to meet it collectively. But it also doesn't mean if someone's not if someone's not playing well or they're not practicing well or they seem to be a little off.

The first thing you do is not, you don't yell at them. I think a good culture, you find out, Hey man, what's going on? Is everything okay and you and you lift each other up? Now, sometimes if a guy gets too big a head or starts thinking that he's so good that he doesn't need to practice anymore, that's when you might need to bring the hammer down and humble him a little bit. But it's all about just, it's all about just doing the right things for the group and not yourself. Yeah.

That's, at the end of the day, it's about the group. And I think in some ways, what might have turned people a little bit against Quinn Hughes in his final time with the Canucks was, hey man, is this about the team or is this about you now? That's fair. I wouldn't push back against that. And it might be natural because it might be like, I got to get out of here. Yeah, me. I need to escape this. This is not fun.

I've been a team guy for a long time. hasn't worked, I got to take care of number one now. And that is a big part of professional sports. Yeah, it is. You only get one career. Yeah, and you've got to look out for yourself and I understand that. There will be people that will resent Hughes for that until the day his career is over

and that's fine. You know what? Because at the end of the day, this is sort of like a fun entertainment playground and you cast heroes and villains and they can switch. Yeah, yeah. Right? So if you want to say that, and like I have fun with the quit Hughes things, I'll have more fun with it as we move along. Sure.

Right. So there's that part of it. But when it comes to the group and where they're at, like I find the Canucks in terms of the standard that they have internally as a bit of a rudderless ship. Like I don't know who's in charge. I don't know where the standard is. And that's also on a coaching front too, right? You get a lot of positive speak at the end of poor performances.

Yeah. You get a lot of. while we're learning on the job when there's been more than enough instances to have already learned. And at this time, with the captaincy void, it doesn't get any easier, right?

And your best player is just gone. Who's the number one spokesman now? I have no idea. No idea. I think if you're talking about someone... If you're talking about someone to meet with the media and probably have the most presence, it's probably Myers,

because of his veteran presence. That would have my pick. Jake DeBresk is always game to talk but don't give me I mean yeah yeah I know the DeBresque playbook is like

shouldering a lot of the responsibility himself and saying that he's got to be better which is true yeah but you're not you're not that guy you're not that guy you're not that guy guy you're not that guy he's not a front line guy he's a complimentary player

he's going to score 25 with consistency by being an erratic score but don't you think that the problem with the Canucks right now is that they don't have that guy they don't have I think it's one of the problems I think everyone you look to

is you're just like you might be a good player you're not that guy though no and that I mean that's what the that's what that's what that's what that's what Quinn had right say what you will you can nipick around certain things

or even launch some fair criticism that wasn't nitpicking like he is a hell of a player yep and when you asked who the best player was. The Canucks don't have anything close to that right now

and frankly they don't have anyone right now that projects to be a superstar. Hopefully Zeev Bouyam could be that guy. Hopefully Braden Kutz could be that guy but there's no slam dunk. Wow, this guy's going to be a superstar

and they got a lot of vets that are signed long term and they are what they are. They're fine. They're good players but they will not be the guys on a Stanley Cup winning team.

And I will go back and this is going to sound like a broken record but the way you find those guys are draft a bunch of them reasonably high in the first round and see which one emerges. Yep. Instead of pinning it,

to two or three guys, which is what they're going to do. They're going to make a few draft picks, and they're going to bring in a few guys, they're going to be like, here's our core, this all has to work out. That's exactly what's going to happen.

They're going to add to William and Rossi and... The 2026 draft is like, that's it. There you go. And you can add Coots, and when they write the letter, Wielander and Petterson will be in there as well, and Coots will be in there as well. And it's like,

we got the guys. we got enough of them, if it all works out. Go, go, go, go, go, go. And they all get great, we're going to be great. And that's how it's going to work. I'm telling you right now, that's how it's going to work. They'll make a bunch of picks of this year's draft. Maybe they'll flip one for another 22, 23-year-old guy that they really like,

and that'll be the group, and they'll move forward with it. But you know what? It might just work this time. Maybe. It's going to be hard to do that, though, when their highest-paid player doesn't lead by example. And I know Pete's not. not Hughes. I know he's not like, I know he doesn't want to be a captain, nor does he have that style of personality. But at the same time, he still is their highest paid guy.

And there has to be some accountability there. And if he doesn't have that, if he doesn't lead by example in his work habits and work ethic and all that stuff, what kind of message, it's a trickle-down effect, right? What kind of message is that said? Do you know how many times I felt like I was taking crazy pills last year when multiple people from the organization were saying, yeah, he doesn't really practice that hard. and people were still finding a way to defend him. Do you know how crazy that is that you give? Well, first of all, that you gave a contract

to someone who didn't practice hard enough? Yeah. Or did he stop practicing? What's the timeline here? He's got to work on his practice habits. You made him the highest paid player in franchise history? That guy? I realize the fear that would go into training a player

and a talent like Elias Pedersen but that decision to give him that contract when there were so many red flags out there that is the one that Jim Rutherford really owns right now and how do you set a team culture though when Patterson is the leader whether he wants to be the leader or not he kind of is the leader now in terms of like how he's paid and how he plays and his

skill set he is that guy whether he wants it or not and I'm sure he probably doesn't and I feel bad for him for that but nevertheless he is in that position now with he was gone and I know we could spend another seven hours talking about this but like how do you set a culture when that guy is your leader and I'm not coming back to the scene I'm not trying to attack him like I like I like I like peterson but it's just like that's the that's why I get hung up on this whole culture thing Because it's like, where do you start? Like, where's the starting point if that guy is at the very top? Your point is well made.

And I don't even think it's good enough for him to be like an average practicer. No, he has to be the leader. He has to be the hardest worker. You know, the Siddins, they're still up, you know, doing the grouse grind. Like, they're crazy. They're insane. But that's what you need. That's what you need.

You need these guys who, are obsessed with getting better every day. And it's not because they're just willing to grind. It's because they actually kind of enjoy the process. They actually enjoy that stuff. There are some people that love to practice. They love to work on things. They love to get better.

They love to push themselves to the limit every day. That's just how they're driven. And then at the end of the day, they're like, wow, I feel good about myself. Right. It's actually just a way of life. Apparently, I've heard. I don't know. So they say.

Right. So they say. I want to do this before we leave. Fire at the dot matrix real quick. I'm going to read like one. What we learned, Hew and our edition brought to as always by AJ's Pizza on East Broadway, homemade dough, premium local ingredients and authentic cooking methods. AJ's is for diehard pizza people.

Dine in or order online at AJ's. Dot pizza tambo and east van. Hashtake DWO what we learned. I learned that Brady Kachek has now taken a high stick to the face in five straight games after taking another one from Luke Shen last night. He also got the OT winner. I mean, he's got a very high stickable face. Have you seen it?

You know who else does? His brother. I will also add. The Jets, get Connor Hellebuck back, win a game on the weekend. Shocking. Right back to losing last night, though. Who was in net? I think it was Comrie.

There's your answer. Stephen Langley, what we learned, is it weird that I am way more disappointed when Miller got traded than I am right now? I was so dejected as it was the first domino to fall. This trade is a nail in the coffin. Trade everyone not named Horonik and Petey. Steve, I'm with you, except for the Petey part. I do think that it should be the time where this is a domino effect

of one trade after another after another but I've been around too long I'm too old and I've seen too many things and I know how this is going to turn out and I wish that it wouldn't but I think I already know how it's going to and I think that what everyone wants to see and the mass overhaul that everyone is

hoping to have isn't going to happen I mean they'll trade Sherwood it's going to be Sherwood and it's probably going to be it's probably going to be it And if Bluger gets healthy, maybe him. But he's so hurt right now, you can't even tell. But it's not going to be the big dramatic overhaul that you think, or quite frankly, I think that they need.

You think Myers is sticking around? Yeah. I think Heronica can stick around. I think Garnel will stick around. I think Heserone will stick around. I mean, Alvian's talking about making these moves and bringing in NHL-ready guys, like Zeev, Booiam, and Ogren, and Rossi,

mostly Booiam and Rossi, as a message to those guys that extended that they want them to stick around they want them to stick around and I apologize to Rager who I really upset by saying that out loud he told me to just stop talking

just stop talking and now I'm going to because the show is over thank you all for listening thank you all for contributing as always it's been another fun show and congrats to our final

Palbro 12 days of Christmas winter it was a fun fun experiment it was great to give out gifts Can we tell them what they want? I don't know I don't have it in front of me We'll do it tomorrow No no no I can tell them real quick

Oh do it A dog The winner won a Toronto Blue Jays jersey From Rogers Hey very nice What a way to go out Almost the World Series champions In their jersey To a lucky winner

Mary says on the front We got to say goodbye We'll find out what happened To Dale Weiss too Yeah Great mystery of today's show What happened to Dale Weiss Anyway music means

We got to say goodbye Apparently being on time Wasn't part of the culture Signing off I have been Mike Alford. He's been Jason Brough. He's been A-Dog and he's been Lattie. This has been the Halford & Brough show on Sportsnet, 650.