Halford & Brough in the Morning - The Seahawks Are On Fire

Episode Date: December 9, 2024

In hour two, Jason and guest host Jamie Dodd chat with Too Deep Zone NFL insider Mike Tanier (1:10) about Week 14 action, including a 4-game win streak for the Seattle Seahawks, the boys go around the NHL with the latest news of the day (27:00), plus they talk Qunn Hughes' leadership style and what he means to the Canucks (40:00). This podcast is produced by Andy Cole and Greg Balloch. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

Welcome back to Chasing Zach Charbonnet. Welcome back to Halford & Brough here, Sportsnet 650. Jamie Dodd filling in for Mike Halford. Halford & Brough brought to you by the Dilawri family of Honda dealers. Experience the Dilawri difference today. Visit your nearest Dilawri Honda dealer today. This hour is for Jason.Mortgage. If you love giving the banks more of your money, then don't let Jason shop around to find the perfect mortgage

for you. That's Jason.Mortgage. We are coming to you live from the Kintec studio. Kintec, Canada's favorite orthotics provider, powered by thousands of five-star Google reviews. Sophie, what are you waiting for? Kintec! That's what you're waiting for. We nailed it that time. Now joining us to

talk a little NFL here, he writes the Too Deep Zone newsletter. He is NFL insider Mike Tanier. Mike, thanks as always for doing this. How are you today? I'm doing great. I got a hand at the Seattle Seahawks. They have worn me down for the last month.

Pretty impressive win down in Arizona. And the one thing that stood out for me was the offensive line play and that there were actual running gaps created for Zach Charbonnet. There haven't been many gaps created for the running backs in Seattle this year. Geno Smith was not sacked once, and that helps. What did you think of Seattle's performance? That's it. Getting Abe Lucas back at right tackle,

especially for us national guys, we lose track of which team is without a right tackle or a left guard or these other things that aren't like the quarterback or the fantasy guys. That offensive line, when you had Forsyth and the other guy back there, it was a mess. It was a mess. I'm not saying it's cured now, but when you replace an absolute turnstile,

an absolute empty void with a solid, capable player who's a good NFL starter, that makes a difference there. That was part of it. Again, early in the season, you had so many injuries up and down the defense. It's a more or less healthy defense now. And it definitely showed in the first quarter of that game where the line could get pressure now. And the secondary has everybody covered

now. And you can force Kyler Murray mistakes and make things easier for your offense by giving them the ball in the 25 yard line and asking Geno Smith to do a little less with the football. So what do you think about the rest of the division or the division in its entirety? The Seahawks obviously got a big win over Arizona. Good for the Seahawks, bad for Arizona.

The Rams upset the Bills. That was a wild game. So they improved to seven and six, one game back of the Seahawks and the Niners. I mean, that story was more about the Chicago Bears being dreadful, but the Niners I mean that story was more about the Chicago Bears uh being dreadful but the Niners got a win and they're six and seven so the division is still I would say anyone's to take although the Seahawks are in the driver's seat very much right now Seahawks are the driver's seat you got to watch out for that Rams team and I'm trying to figure out this is a Rams team I saw a couple weeks ago

lose to the Eagles pretty handily. A little bit before that, they lost to the Packers pretty handily. They lost to the Dolphins who nobody thinks of as a super powerhouse. Dolphins took pretty good care of them. Then they do that to the Bills. I just have to look at it and say that was a Bills

trap game. That is what that was. The Bills went across country, across the conferences, after like a seven-game win streak, after making snow angels and things like that, and they weren't quite ready for the Rams. Then you've got the 49ers who clearly want to take out the last six months of frustrations or 11 months going back to the overtime of the Super Bowl, take them out on the poor Bears who came walking in with no coach, no coordinator, rookie quarterback.

And like, yeah, we're the Niners. We're still going to do this stuff to you. They did it all at once. Let's see what happens Thursday night. We've got a big Thursday night game. You've got this Rams team that was on a sugar rush. You've got the Niners team that looks like it wants to play spoiler. I have a funny feeling that the Niners play spoiler to the Rams on Friday night.

They drag the Rams back down, and that gives the Seahawks an opportunity. By playing the football they're playing right now, which is kind of like don't make dumb mistakes, don't play down to the opponent, play decent complementary football and get the win, the Seahawks might have the formula right now to squeak away with the division. I think they'll then get hammered by the Vikings as a wild card, but I think they can squeak away with the division.

I'm just looking at the Bears schedule right now they've got two prime time game left they have four games left in the season their next game is a Monday nighter in Minnesota against the Vikings team you just mentioned a pretty good team they also play the Seahawks December 26th. That's Thursday night football. Could you imagine this season going any worse for Chicago? There was such optimism in that city before this season. They brought it upon themselves. Because you look at the tough losses going into last night. The Hail Mary loss to the Commanders where it looked like they had the game won.

You know, a really tight one against the Packers. You know, a comeback against the Vikings that looked like it was okay, you know, giving the Lions some trouble and then having all kinds of goofy stuff happen at the end of that game on Thanksgiving. This looked like a very competitive team, but when you fire your offensive coordinator

and then you fire your coach and so you take your passing game coordinator and say, you're now passing game and offensive coordinator and head coach and you've got this rookie quarterback and this team is now sort of directionless you put yourself in a position to be where you're at right now where you're going to go out on national television and potentially make Caleb Williams look foolish and make him take more hits and possibly take away the gains he was making earlier in the season so this is how bad organizations make things worse for themselves yeah the Bears were not going to make the playoffs this year but they could have fired Ibraflus and the coordinator in January and said okay we're a normally coached team uh Williams is getting

the information we need he needs you know the development he needs and we're not going to go out there and get spanked now their team is going to go out there and get spanked. Now they're a team that's going to go out there for a month and just get spanked. Where are you on the Kansas City Chiefs right now? I know we talk about this team a lot and rightly so.

They're the defending champs and they're also 12-1. They've also won back-to-back games 19-17. I don't know if that's ever happened in NFL history. Have they had a single blowout win this

season? And, you know, this is where the conversation goes. They're 12-1. That's amazing. But they're not blowing teams out. That's not amazing. But are we... They're a very confusing team, I will say.

Three wins by a combined seven points in the last three weeks. Two of them against bad teams. The Chargers are a good team, but they beat the Raiders and Panthers. I have surrendered. I have surrendered my skepticism about the Kansas City Chiefs. Here's the thing. You go back, and I wrote about it in a two-deep search. You can kind of go back to that Broncos win where they win on the block field goal

at the end of the game, like a block chip shot, and you say, this is not sustainable. This is a team that's going to lose some games. And if you keep saying that, and it keeps being wrong, you have to say, maybe it's my method that's incorrect. Okay, so we say the Chiefs

can't keep doing this. Okay, when are they going to stop doing this? And if your answer to that is against the Bills in the playoffs, let's get there. Let's get to the Bills in the playoffs, then we can talk about that. Until then, when they're facing the Browns next week, or they're facing a

Texans team that's super vulnerable, you just have to assume the Chiefs know what they're doing. They can control the clock. They can move the ball well enough. They get the stops they need a defense. Mahomes makes one or two plays. They know how to get wins like this. So that's where I am with the Chiefs. Do not lay any

points with them because they never cover. They never cover, but wait until the playoffs to worry about what they'll be able to do against the Steelers, or they'll face the Steelers in a couple weeks, but what they'll do against the Bills or these other teams, probably an arrowhead.

Yeah, that's the thing, right? The 12-1 run record, it doesn't just look good. It means teams are probably going to have to go through arrowhead on their way to the Super Bowl as well. You mentioned one of their upcoming opponents, the vulnerable Houston Texans. It's an interesting team, right, because they were a pretty trendy Super Bowl pick coming into the year.

Last year they took that massive step forward. The hype around C.J. Stroud was off the charts. And, you know, 8-5, but another team where, okay, the record's not bad, but only a plus-20 point differential. What has slowed the ascent down for the Houston Texans a little bit this year? Well, you know, Seattle Seahawks fans, you know, watched that offensive line and watched it had a big hole in the line and that caused all these other problems. Well, that's been the problem for the Houston Texans most of the year. Is it left guard or right guard?

It's left guard. For most of the year, they've been revolving guys in there. A kid that they drafted, Kenyon Green, they thought was going to be a star, has been ineffective. They replaced him with other guys at that guard position. Those guys were worse than the guy that they were trying to replace. That kind of impacts what the center does. That's what defenses try to do because defenses say you can rush right up the

middle on C.J. Stroud, or we can rush a quarterback up the middle. That impacts everything else he can do. You can stymie their running game because, you know, Joe Mixon really has to run outside to get anything done. And so that turns this Texans team into a team that can't sustain drives, can't just let their quarterback sit in the pocket and pick people apart. They also had some injuries at receiver, et cetera. So they're left as a team with a great pass rush,

really good young quarterback, some great pieces. Nico Collins is back at wide receiver. He was out for a while. But it doesn't add up to the sum of the parts because the offensive line has been so weak, it's left them vulnerable to anybody they play. Even these Jaguars teams that they play a lot in the AFC South can keep things close and maybe skim a win off them because they can't protect Stroud.

So I know it's Monday and we're supposed to be looking back on yesterday's action, but I want to look ahead to a few games coming up next week because there are some good ones. Start with the Bills and the Lions in Detroit. Detroit's two-and-a-half point favorite. What will be the key to this game? It's going to be whether the Bills can bounce back from what they did this week.

Again, it looked like a flat performance, but this will be their second straight road game. Their backs are to the wall in terms of them getting home field advantage, and how do they answer? I think the Lions are a stronger team, and I think the Lions are less likely to

make a mistake team, and the Lions also can't have no margin for error either. The Vikings are right behind them. It's one of those games where I first look at it and say, well, it's a Super Bowl preview maybe, but also it doesn't have a lot of super playoff implications because the teams are great as inter-conference. It does.

Because there's so much at stake for the Lions who can't afford to lose the division because of the Vikings and the Bills because of what they did this week. Let's move on to Steelers and Eagles. The Steelers are 10-3, Russell Wilson the quarterback. Eagles are 11-2. Philly's a five-point favorite in this one. They are the home team, and I get that,

but I'm just wondering what people think about the Steelers team. Obviously a great record, great defense. Russell Wilson is playing better, but do you think there's a sense out there that they're very good, but probably not great? Yeah, that's about it. That's what the analytics say. The analytics say what you just said. Fantastic defense. Offense is kind of middle of the pack. Russell Wilson making some plays, kind of overstating how great he is a lot of the time. You know, the running game helps the fact that they're, you know, playing with comfortable leads helps a lot.

But I look at that one. That's another one. Interconference, you know, both teams are probably playoff teams. Lean towards the Steelers on that. The Steelers' run defense can shut down the one thing that the Eagles do to just sort of, you know, erase their opponent, which is just run Barkley at them. And I have a feeling that looks like a game that's going to be the trip and trap for the

Philadelphia Eagles. One final one that I'm really looking forward to. It's the Sunday nighter. We already talked about the Seahawks, and they will host the Green Bay Packers. Now, Green Bay is going into Seattle as a two and a half point favorite. And that makes sense because I think most people would think first of all the Packers are the superior team but also the home field advantage in Seattle has largely disappeared the Seahawks are a bit like the Canucks actually Dodd right like they've got an amazing away record but they haven't been very good at home what's been the story of the Packers season Mike?

The Packers season story boils down to just not as good as the Lions. Like, that's like sort of the pressing reality of the NFC North. You know, in the NFC West, hey, you go around 500, you're a playoff team and you're still in it. You can make all these mistakes. NFC North, one mistake and the Lions just take it. So the Lions have swept the Packers and it's kind of, and the Vikings have been amazing. So all the great things the Packers have done. They won games without Jordan Love. They've won games with Jordan Love. Love had some injuries, but he battled back.

They've lost guys from all their super playmaker core, but the other guys have stepped up. Defense has been strong. All of these advantages boil down to the fact that 0-2 against the team you need to beat in the division, probably going in as a wild card, hoping to go in as a wild card and take out the Falcons or the Buccaneers or somebody like that, but you might not be in a position to do it.

You're right. I think the Packers are the better team than the Seahawks, but they have no margin for error. They can't afford to go in there and assume the Seahawks are going to roll over because the Seahawks have not been rolling over for anybody over the last month. Okay, one final question, and it's sadly about tonight's game between the Bengals and the Cowboys. Yet another primetime game for the Cowboys.

Boy, they are fun, aren't they? The Bengals are going into Arlington as five and a half point favorites, and yet the Bengals are four and eight. When you think about expectations for the season and you think about how things have gone, who's had the more disappointing season, Cincy or Dallas? Going with Cincy because Dallas can point to Prescott's injury. They can point to Parsons' injury. They can point to Parsons' injury.

They can point to Hank Lawrence and some of the other guys who were hurt. They can really claim an injury year. I don't 100% buy it, but it is partially true. And for the rest of the season, by the way, they have a 0.7% chance of making the playoffs. They can still get in. For the rest of the season, they can do house money stuff because, again, it's the back of quarterback, and it's like let's win one for Cooper.

The Bengals don't have these excuses. Yeah, Higgins was hurt for a while. Chase was in and out. Barrow's been healthy. Offensive line's been healthy. This has been more or less the team they intended to field, and their defense has been miserable. Their defense has forced Barrow to just go out there and play shootout ball

week after week after week, and he hasn't been quite up to it. They don't have the third option in the offense they were expected to have. So Cowboys have an excuse. They'll use an excuse. Bengals don't really have any excuses for where they are. I've actually got a follow-up question to this. Who is most likely to redeem themselves next season, the Bengals or the Cowboys?

That's a tough one because I have to really look at the Bengals' situation in terms of all those contracts. These are two teams that screw up every contract they possibly can. The Bengals because they don't have any money, and the Cowboys because Jerry likes to pretend he doesn't have any money. But Jerry spent the money. He spent it on C.D. Lamb. He spent it on Dak Prescott. Micah Parsons is out there saying, I'm a cowboy for life.

Low ball me, Jerry, low ball me. This kid just wants to stay there. And that's a team I can figure could turn it around pretty quickly. You know, if Prescott gets healthy and maybe they change coaches and maybe they draft well, the Bengals have a tendency to look at this and say, gosh, we don't feel like paying Jamar or whoever let's blow things up all right my Mike always a pleasure to speak to you about the NFL I love that on the too deep zone your sub stack you've actually got the question the Seahawks

good I'm telling you man when they went into their bye week at 4 and 5, I didn't think anyone would be writing that headline a month later. You guys have heard me every week coming on and like, no, don't believe this team. Don't believe this team. I say, believe it.

Keep believing it until you see otherwise. All right, Mike. That was awesome. Talk to you next week. Take care and enjoy your week. That was Mike Tanier, our Monday morning quarterback, brought to you by the Clayton Public House. Pre-game to post-game, the Clayton Public House is your home of football.

Catch all the action on 15 screens and two giant projectors, the ClaytonPub.com. Speaking of teams struggling at home, I believe the Cowboys 1 and 5 in Dallas they're just bad though yeah but they're 5 and 7 so like that what's that 4 and 2 on the on the road 1 and 5 at home

which is hilarious too because they have like the most the most gaudy expensive stadium you could possibly have do you have any theories on why the Canucks have struggled at home this season as compared to their record on the road I honestly think a huge part of it is strength of schedule now is I don't know if that's all of it right because like the Islanders aren't that good a team and they embarrass them at home right Blue Jackets dominated them in the

first period the Blue Jackets are better than people think yeah the Blue Jackets aren't like we still think of them as a bottom feeder. They're not that. They're just like a normal playoff striving team. Yeah. But you think about the New Jersey game. New Jersey's a good team, right? The Edmonton game, Edmonton's a good team.

Carolina, they're a good team. So I think a lot of it is just they've played more of the top teams in the league at home than they have on the road. Obviously, when they played Florida, they were missing Kachuk and Bark have on the road. Obviously, when they played Florida, they were missing Kachuk and Barkov on the road, so that's a different situation there. Maybe there's more to it than that. I don't know, but right now that's kind of my theory

is just they happen to have a much tougher schedule at home than they have on the road. They've had some timely scoring on the road too. Yep. And I think about that detroit game where was it brandstrom scored late and then they won in overtime so the bounces maybe have been going for them on the road a little bit more um although some of the games that they've lost at home has nothing to do with bounces no it's just been ugly right um so what are your expectations for this

week when it comes to the Canucks? Are you expecting Demko to start Tuesday against St. Louis? Are you expecting JT Miller to be back in the lineup? There's four games left on this homestand. It ends next Monday. Are you expecting him to be back in the lineup soon? I would be. We'll start with Demko.

I don't know. Miller, well, Demko, I don't know. Yeah, Miller, well, Demko, why wouldn't he start tomorrow? And I get that that's a loaded question, right? Considering how long he's been out of the lineup.

But like, he's backing up. He's got his own net at practice. They sent Shelovs down to Abbotsford. Yeah. Like, is he healthy or not? Why would he be backing up multiple games

if they weren't confident he could get in soon? And I understand he wanted to have a little practice time when they got back home. Okay, so that rules out Columbus. Weird start time on Sunday. Weird start time. So, okay, that's fine. What's the excuse? What's the reason that would keep him out of?

He has to play sometime. I'm scared of Jordan Cairo. Yeah, I know, but I just don't. Unless there's a, unless he's like, you know what? I need one more practice, which like, okay, I guess that would seem pretty odd. But I just don't see what the reason would be to keep him out to keep him from starting tomorrow night. Who knows? Again, look, if you haven't lost money yet, betting on him being out longer than he had, right?

You know, you haven't lost money betting on it continuing. So maybe I'll be wrong here, but it's just like I can't see the reason on the horizon that would prevent him from starting that game tomorrow. Yeah, if he doesn't start tomorrow. It's going to be really weird. Then you're like, oh. It's super weird. I mean, it already is.

Oh. Yeah, but like this, we're at the moment now. As you said, if he doesn't start, there's going to be some tough questions asked. Like, what's going on here? What, how do the stars need to align for this guy to get back into the crease? He's backing up. He's practicing. There's been no, like, re-injury or anything or setback that we've heard about.

Like, he's got to start. He's just got to tear the bandage off and start at a certain point. So as for JT Miller, what do we know, if anything? We've heard he's skating. That doesn't mean he's practicing with the team. He's skating. We know they have a plan. They have a plan.

Yes. Right? By the way, there's been two plans. Do you remember the Petey plan earlier? Yes. Remember they said there was like, we have a plan with Petey. Yes, that's right. Petey plan earlier? Remember they said there was like, we have a plan with Petey and it involved working harder

and getting more ice time before practice and after practice. Skating, moving his feet. And the plan is work at it. So that was the plan with Petey and we've seen some results from that. Maybe not enough

for a lot of people, including myself. And then the plan with JT Miller, I guess when they say there's a plan, that involves what? First, you skate by yourself, and then we reintroduce you to your team, and then maybe you practice, and then maybe you play a game.

I would say I would expect him at some point on this homestand there. The report from Cervalli specifically last week was Wednesday. Look for him to potentially rejoin the team at practice on Wednesday. They're not practicing today because they had a busy weekend, so it's a day off. So their next practice will be on Wednesday. So that's out there. Now, obviously, the team never said that, but that'll be very interesting to see if he is, in fact,

back with the team at practice on Wednesday. If he is, maybe Thursday is too quick, but why not Saturday then, right? Like if you get a couple practices in, a game day skate where you're on the ice with the team, you should be probably good to go by Saturday. I think it'll be interesting to hear what is said when he returns.

Yep. You know, it could be just like, no comment. He was having some personal issues. Not going to talk about it. Could be something completely different. Mm-hmm. He might talk about it. Who knows?

I mean, that's a good point, right? Part of him coming back is, like, if he's a practice, he's going to speak to the media. He's going to answer questions about this. And we really, I mean, obviously talk at his fielded questions. Rutherford and Alvin have spoken in kind of different circumstances a couple of times, but we haven't gotten a ton of detail on exactly what this looks like. We might not still, but he'll at least be asked questions about it. So I know I said this last week, but i didn't say it to you the number of people that come up to me with i heard this and it's not so much they're asking me like what do you think's happening they're saying like like they're giving me like a little inside

information right there's like hey i heard this and the confidence that they say it with, because they knew a guy, and this guy knew a guy, and this guy, you know, I don't know, is a waiter at one of the restaurants that Canucks all go to. You're walking your dogs and getting their bushes. He's obviously pretty down there, right? They just say it with such confidence.

I was like, well, see, this other guy told me with such confidence that it was this, and that's completely different to what you're telling me. So what do you think about that? I was like, all I know is my information is correct. It's a hundred percent. I know a guy who knows a guy who knows JT Miller's Butler. Is it Jimmy Aces?

Yeah. All right. We got an open segment on the other side. We're going to talk to Sat at eight o'clock. We'll talk about some of these themes that we've been discussing about the Canucks, and that's based on the feedback from you, the listener. And speaking of feedback from you, the listener, we got an open segment on the other side.

So text in any questions or comments you've got into the Dunbar-Lember text line, 650-650. It could be about the Canucks. It could be about some other NHL stories that we can get into. We can talk about the New York Rangers. We can talk about the Buffalo Sabres and the press conference that Kevin Adams

had the other day. Read the room, Kevin Adams. Yikes, that was bad, man. If you don't know what we're talking about, hey, stick around. You'll find out on the other side of the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. Hey, it's Jamie Dodd and Thomas Drance. Get your daily dose of Canucks talk with us weekdays from 12 to 2 on Sportsnet 650. Or catch up on demand through your favorite podcast app. When you're going to make a decision to build a franchise, sustainable success year after year,

you're going to have to go young. And you're going to have to give players the opportunity to battle through some of the ups and downs. I believe our roster is talented. We should be a team that is competing and in the playoffs. I've said that since the summer. I truly believe that. Welcome back to Halpern and Brough here on Sportsnet 650. It's Jamie Dodd filling in for Mike Halpern,

but Brough is back in action today. Halpern and Brough is brought to you by the Dilawri family of Honda dealers. Experience the Dilawri difference today. Visit your nearest Dilawri Honda dealer today. Hour 2 is for Jason.Mortgage. If you love paying too much for your mortgage, then don't let Jason shop around

to find the perfect mortgage for you. That's Jason.Mortgage. 650 is the Dunbar Lumber text line. Dunbar Lumber, Metro Vancouver's trusted choice for contractors and reno warriors for over 50 years. Visit them at one of their three locations

to serve you or online at dunbarlumber.com. We got an open segment here. We'll talk to Satyar Shah more about the Canucks coming up at 8, but open segment right now, so send your thoughts in. I should also mention, of course, you can get your What We Learned submissions in now, which we'll do at 8.30, hashtag WWL, what you've learned in the last 24 hours in sports.

We'll do some Canucks, we'll do some NHL, and we'll start with the Buffalo Sabres, and the voice you heard there was Buffalo Sabres GM Kevin Adams, who had a contentious series of comments, media availability a couple days ago now. And the Buffalo Sabres are going through it. What? They've lost six in a row right now. They are very much on the outside of the playoff picture looking in yet again.

Their playoff odds are pretty long and seems to be getting to Kevin Adams and the Buffalo Sabres right now. Yeah, and he held a press conference over the weekend. And I think he meant it with the best intentions. He meant it as a way to be accountable. The team's struggling. They had a really bad loss to Colorado on Tuesday where they had a four nothing lead and they ended up losing five four and one of the reporters I think it was Harrington I was like what do you have to say after one of

the most disgraceful losses in Buffalo Sabres history I was like yeah that's Mike Harrington he's still there uh and you know so so the Buffalo media in a lot of ways was looking for their pound of flesh. And I think some of the frustration they got after Kevin Adams was done was they didn't feel like they got it. Like the idea of the press conference was the buck stops with me and here I am to answer questions

and then he went up there and he was either dismissive or gave excuses or you know there was one one question that was asked about the age of the team and it being a young team and he said well I guess we could have signed Craig Anderson and then our average age would have gone up, which is kind of funny, right? I know what he was doing, but I don't think a lot of Sabres fans and the media that covers them are in the mood for like, that's a quirky little joke. They are upset. And after the press conference conference the Sabres went out and they lost again at home 5-2 to Utah they were down 5-1 at that point and Kevin Adams made a comment which really got to the people of Buffalo because the people of Buffalo are a little insecure about the place they live in. They haven't had a lot of sports success. People don't consider it especially picturesque. It snows there. They

have that crazy lake effect. You know, Halford and I have made fun of Buffalo. We said we went there for the draft one year and we were like, let's get out of here, right? We all know about Buffalo. And one of the things that Kevin Adams said was, hey, we don't have palm trees here. And he also talked about the high tax rates. We don't have palm trees, we've got taxes. We've got taxes. And it sounded like excuses.

And I think Kevin Adams was actually trying to make a point that we don't have that. So what we have to do is win. We have to turn into a contender. But he didn't paint the right picture. It sounded like he was making excuses, right? When he really, if you're going to have a press conference, come out there with some talking points and hold yourself accountable.

And if you're going to do this, don't go up there and make what looks to be excuses. Like when you hear that, right, it just sounds like, okay, well, you're basically saying you're comparing yourself to Florida. And why has Florida had success? Well, you know, Kachuk wanted to go there because he wanted the lifestyle.

And players want to go to places like Florida as well because of the state thing. You know, what he wanted to eventually get to was like, hey, we have to turn ourselves into winners first. And he used the Buffalo Bills as an example. You know, the Bills weren't a destination and now they are because, you know, they've got a really good team and people want to go play for these crazy fans

of the Bills Mafia. It's awesome, right? But I think it came across the wrong way. It came across unintended. I don't think it was excuse-making. I don't even think it was like, oh, from a certain interpretation, it's making excuses. I think it's just flat-out an excuse.

And the Florida thing, like, okay, yeah, Kachuk wanted to go there. That's great. But you know who didn't choose to go there who got traded there sam reinhardt one of your draft picks that you traded to the florida panthers and is an elite player in the league now yeah you don't think you could have kept sam reinhardt if you had before he really had his breakout in florida identified that that was coming and signed him to a long-term deal you absolutely could could have. Jack Eichel, they traded away. Now, obviously, he wanted to leave, but that's because Buffalo. But in some ways, they screwed up the relationship.

That's exactly, because they had mismanaged the relationship to the point where he was like, I hate this. I want out. So they've had talent. They have Rasmus Dahlien there right now, right? They've attracted talent, and it's not as if the winning formula in the NHL is go out and sign free agents. Like, go out and court free agents to come to your city.

What do you think is going on there? Like, you hear about all this talent that they've got there, and they've got obvious talent. And then you hear things like, you know, Olin Power actually hasn't been playing that well. Or Dylan Cousins hasn't actually been playing that well. What do you think's happening? I mean, the obvious answer, the cliche is answer, you got to get those veterans in there that can show the kids the way, how to be professionals.

But for me, I always think it actually starts with the young talent, the elite talent that you often get with the first overall picks, but it goes beyond the talent. It's these guys that come in and almost right away, they demand the respect of the room, not just because they're talented, but because of the way they go about their business. I think about a guy like Sidney Crosby from a very early stage of his career. You knew he was a leader. Nathan McKinnon took a little bit longer, but when he was young, he was a leader. And some would say a pretty harsh leader, right? To the point where he was

pushing it and maybe went over the line a few times. But, you know, if you're the first overall pick, you need to be more than just a good hockey player. Does that make sense to you? Yeah, absolutely. It's not going to come by signing, this guy is a worker, right? But he's a grinder. Well, how much?

He's a worker. I don't know if you can, I don't think that you've got that much in common with those types. How much did we see that in Vancouver, right? Where it's like, we're going to sign Jay Beagle to teach our team how to win because he just won a Stanley Cup. It's like, it's not happening. I was going to bring his name up, but I didn't want to.

Sorry, Jay Beagle. But it's like, it's just not going to happen. And I don't think it's a coincidence. There's a lot that went right for the Canucks last year, obviously. But I don't think it's a coincidence. There's a lot that went right for the Canucks last year, obviously. But I don't think it's a coincidence that their breakout season happened when Quinn Hughes became captain and really stepped into that role. And started to take accountability for all those things. And a leader. A real leader.

He became a good leader. And he's also their best player. And that's really important to have that. Now, having said that, as much as we can talk about some of the impressive young talent on Buffalo, like their second line right now, it's Ryan McLeod, Zach Benson, Jason Zucker. I have time for all those players, but you don't look at that and say like, oh, that's a clear cut playoff caliber second line. Right. So there's still a talent differential. And again, the idea that the only way you can add talent to your team is by being this destination city that everyone wants to go to. You don't think the Sabres could use Kiefer Sherwood or Pugh Suter or go down the list, Teddy Bluger in their lineup. Guys the Canucks have attracted here on bargain deals over the last couple of years. And the Canucks, credit to Jim Rutherford and Patrick Alvin they're not sitting around saying like oh man the tax is here we just can't get anyone to play here because of the taxes no they're going

out and they're finding guys that they can convince to play here that work that are that are underpriced that are undervalued and like that's that's the job yeah oh your job is tough yeah you're an NHL general manager. Figure out a way to do it or step aside and let somebody else do it. We got a few texts in about, this is Austin and Langley texting in, looking at Buffalo.

Look at that clip of Bedard the other night in Chicago. He dangles three guys, passes it to, I think it was Bertuzzi. Yeah. And he dumps the puck in uh austin asks i wonder if chicago is the next buffalo and then two guys missed it on the far side yeah god i hope so well chicago's got a long way to go before they're the next buffalo and by that i just they're starting on the road though but by that i just mean the years right

like it's it's been a long time. It's kind of like a time thing. Is this the 14th year? Is this the 14th year of no playoffs? Back in 2011, which is the last time they made the playoffs, the Blackhawks were still a good team, and they won Stanley Cups after that. So there's a long way to go before Chicago gets to Buffalo.

But I do worry about Bedard. Number one, I think a lot of it's going to fall on him. He's going to have to grow his game in certain ways, but I also worry about how Chicago is going to add the type of talent that you need to surround a guy like Conor Bedard with because free agency is just, it's like you point out, it's almost better as a way

to just find depth pieces. 100%. Because any player, now there are exceptions, of course there are exceptions, but most players that are so good do not reach free agency. No. because teams realize that they got to lock these guys up so they don't reach free agency and if they get close to reaching free agency

and they're not signed they get traded to a team that does sign them so maybe that's where buffalo might have to get involved, are trades like that, and maybe they give up some of their young talent. But I honestly think it's just going to start, and I think one of the big things that people might forget, but Rick Tockett and the management group talked a lot about, and we even kind of poked fun at it because they kept on saying it, was we need to empower the leadership group and tell this leadership group how to lead, essentially. And we knew that Quinn Hughes was speaking up more and more and wanted to be part of the leadership group.

We knew that JT Miller was always going to speak up, but maybe just had to be taught how to lead a little bit better and maybe how to channel his emotions. Pedersen, a bit of a different story. I never got the feeling that Talkett saw what he wanted to see from Pedersen in terms of speaking up. And maybe that's just his personality.

Some people are extroverts or some people are more comfortable putting themselves out. Other people aren't, and that's fine. Pedersen still got an A because he's one of their best players, one of the best, one of the obvious, well, he's their highest paid player. So he got an A. But the leadership group, you know, for me, it started with Quinn Hughes,

and he's only gotten better in that capacity because Quinn, first of all, his play on the ice is incredible he's always trying to get better he he identifies something that he wants to get better at he wants to score more goals all right you're going to work on your shot work on opening up shooting lanes he's done that he scored more goals right I didn't I you know it's very impressive I think he's also more willing to speak up in the room in case they need a kick in the butt and actually talk it made reference of Hughes standing up and saying something after the first period against Columbus and they came back to win that game but I also think the thing about Quinn Hughes is like I think he feels a real responsibility to make sure that all his teammates are feeling good about things.

And there's an empathy capacity to being a captain that I see in Quinn Hughes without being in the room, but you can kind of tell. Well, and I think he recognizes he doesn't have to be the loudest voice all the time, right? Because they have JT Miller. So if you're trying to, if you're trying to like, we got guy over here he loves to yell you know what I mean but if you're trying to like out emotion JT Miller that's a losing game very paying guy for that you have to take a different approach and honestly I mean that's typically what we've seen from captains in

Vancouver and I think over the last what like since Marcus Naslund certainly and I think there's a reason for sure yeah Henrik even Bo Anytime that Quinn gets asked about his latest accomplishment, first thing he says, great teammates. Yeah. And you're kind of like, you actually have it. Are you sure about that? You want to take some more of the credit here, buddy? They're not really doing much.

It's all about there. Just once I want to hear him be like. Are you watching the game or just too busy playing it? Just once I want to hear him be like, yeah, you know, I'm really good. I'm a really good player. But I think it's funny because – I am awesome. It's mostly me.

I'm doing everything out here. Are you watching? How often during, like, especially the Bo Horvath captaincy era, right, where they were losing a lot, would people get really frustrated that he wasn't that hard on his sleeve, raw, raw, yelling, emotion guy? And I just don't think that flies in Vancouver. Like, I don't think that's the way to be a good captain of this team.

And I think Quinn Hughes is taking a page out of Henrik's book. Marcus Naslin is just like, I'm going to be the calming voice. I'm going to be the guy who's super chill, who's not doing peaks and valleys, because everyone else in the city is doing peaks and valleys all the time. I'm going to be the opposite of that. When your team is in a bad spot, either midseason or let's say it's in the middle of a game, do you want a guy yelling at you and freaking out and smashing his stick in the dressing room?

Or would you prefer a guy that has a very quiet confidence and then says, guys, this is what we got to do. That's right. You can't have anyone freak out out there, okay? We've got to keep our composure. I mean, there's too far. There's too much to lose. We've got to just keep our composure. There's a reason that clip is so funny, right? I mean, there's a guy losing his composure saying you need to keep your composure. And with Quinn know, with Quinn Hughes, I mean, again, I don't know what he's like behind the scenes. Maybe he's a monster, but I don't think so.

That would be hilarious. I would much rather have a leader that is like, guys, and you know he's going to play well. You know that he's going to do his part, and he's not going to be yelling at you and then breaking all the rules himself. I'd much rather have a guy that has composure and a quiet confidence. Absolutely.

And to bring it back to the Buffalo Sabres, right? If you look at like the transformation of the culture and the leadership group here in Vancouver, a huge share of the credit goes to Quinn Hughes himself, right? He stepped up. He wanted to be captain. He wanted to be captain. He wanted to be a leader. He's gotten simultaneously at the same time that he's become a really good captain, at least as far as we can tell. He's also become arguably the best defenseman in the game, which is really impressive. Having said that, the management group and Rick Talkett, the coach they hired, had to create the environment where that could happen, right?

They had to recognize that he was the right choice for captain. They had to, as you say, empower him. Rick Talkett had to coach the team in such a way that he played his part in building the structure and the culture in the room as well. And more than anything, I think that's what needs to happen with the Buffalo Sabres. It's fine to look at Rasmus Deline and say, well, you're the captain and you're making $11 million a year. You need to figure out a way to lead. Of course he does. But the team has to put him in a position where he can have success in that role.

They have to empower him. They have to create the environment. They have to build a better team. Rasmus Dahlien can be the best leader of all time. And if the team's not talented enough, guess what? You're probably not going to make the playoffs. if you do make it you're not going very far once you get there so it really does have to be an all three levels thing where there are you know how much do we hear the word alignment right and it's like that's what the Canucks have from Quinn

Hughes to the coach to the executives they have alignment I don't think Buffalo has anything close to that right now uh this guy's texted in this question a few times, so we will reward him for his perseverance. Unsigned text, but it says, I'm curious to get your thoughts on the narrative that Petey needs to be, quote-unquote, the guy, the guy, to be at his highest level and whether you're concerned about his play regressing

when JT returns. I have all the time in the world for this conspiracy theory and I love it. It's very, very interesting. I read this during the break and I know, I think our next guest,

Sat, has talked about this, right? This idea that Petey really wants to be the premier player. And first of all, okay, people are saying- What about the premier forward? Well, yeah,

because I was like, even in Miller's absence, it's like, well, Quinn Hughes is the captain and the best player. He's still not the guy. You notice how much Petey is smiling right now? This looks like a big weight off his shoulder. He's so happy.

We all, this is not the first time that the idea of conflict between Patterson and JT Miller has been brought up, obviously, over the last number of years, right? And they've admitted they're not besties. We've all heard different theories about what's happened, relationship how it's impacting their play right frustration in this case hey does pd do better if he's the premier forward the phrase that comes to mind for me and this is something i tell my kids all the time like when they're squabbling over nonsense what i always come back is figure like this show pretty much. Figure it out.

Yeah. Like, oh, she took my toy out at first. I don't care. Figure it out and stop annoying me right now. And it's like these guys, I have no idea what the backstory is or if Pedersen does do better when he's the guy in the spotlight or if Miller's frustrated with that or whatever. I have no idea. Whatever's going on, figure it out and find a way

to play well on the same team together. It's really just those two guys need to figure it out. Do you think there's something to it? Like the Patterson one

specifically? Just something. Something about the dynamic there. I mean, yeah. Yeah. I would say so.

Like, you know where there's smoke, there's fire. How much smoke has there been? I usually tell the kids, by the way, figure it out or I'll figure it out for you.

But then I have no idea how to figure it out. I'm like, how about some iPad time? If you're threatening enough, it'll never get to that point. I will admit this was an empty threat. Do you think maybe they do need just some iPad time? Yeah, maybe just some screen time. All right, Petey, do you want some screen time? All right.

They're feeling big emotions. He deactivated all his accounts, right? He misses his screen time. That's true, actually. No, but he's like smiling. He's happier. That's what happens when you put down the phone. Maybe screen time's the problem.

Here's another text that came in. What's the over-under on Demko staying healthy for the remainder of the season? I don't know if I'd make it an over-under, just a bet on whether Demko stays healthy for the remainder of the season. I don't know if I'd make it an over-under, just a bet on whether Demko stays healthy for the remainder of the season. Man, I don't know. And I know Demko has said, you know,

part of the reason we're being patient is, like, I want to make sure that I put this injury through, I think he used the word hell. And I want to put it through hell in practice so I don't return and I'm, you know, I last two weeks and then I'm out. And that's, you know, that's great to hear that he's thinking about that.

But no matter what he says or how much hell he puts this injury under, I'm still going to be like, oh, every time he makes a big save or there's a goal, Mel's scrambling, guys are jamming away at the puck. I think I'm going to be nervous. It's kind of like, oh, every time he makes a big save or there's a goal, I'm going to scramble and guys are jamming away at the puck. I think I'm going to be nervous.

It's kind of like, you know, Christian McCaffrey with the Niners. He went through these injuries and it was a little bit curious and then he comes back and then he immediately gets hurt again. You're kind of like, oh, boy. I think we just have to accept that it's going to be a little nerve-wracking and in the back of our mind be grateful, I suppose, that Kevin Lankanen is with the team and he's he's playing well but you know this Demko return is so big for the Canucks obviously but it's also so big for Demko yes with his contract situation he's got one year left and then he's ufa he's already got a rep as a guy that gets injured

and can't stay healthy but here's the good news for demko gms have very short memories yep and if he comes back and he plays well and he stays healthy this year and he stays healthy next year like i don't think he's signing an extension this summer no just put it that way no but if he stays healthy next year then I think with his ability and as long as he's playing at a high level um he'll get paid but there's a bunch of big ifs oh with the Thatcher Demko story going forward huge stakes for him Sat is going to join us next uh more Canucks talk coming up on the Halford and Brough show on Sportsnet 650.