Halford & Brough in the Morning - Will Petey Waive?

Episode Date: January 23, 2026

In hour one, Mike & Jason look back at the previous day in sports, they hear from Elliotte Friedman and Elias Pettersson's agent JP Barry and discuss if Petey would welcome a trade out of Vancouver (3:00), plus they preview this weekend's NFC & AFC Championship with NFL.com's Nick Shook (29:41). This podcast is produced by Andy Cole and Greg Balloch. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

You're listening to Halford and Brough. Ladies and gentlemen, the weekend. Good morning, Vancouver, 601 on a Friday, sweet, sweet Friday. Happy Friday, everybody. It's Halford. It is Brough. It is Sportsnet 650. We are coming you live from the Kintech Studios and beautiful Fairview Slopes in Vancouver.

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We are coming to live from the Kintech Studio. Make 2026 your year to move better and step stronger with Kintech custom orthotics. Big guest list on a Friday. It is the Duick Morning Drive brought to you by the Duik Auto Group. It begins at 630. Nick Shook from NFL.com is going to join the program. This Sunday, the Super Bowl matchup will be set. AFC championship, Patriots, Broncos, NFC Championship Rams and your Seattle Seahawks.

Nick's going to break it all down for us. at 6.30. 7 o'clock, AJ from AJ's pizza is going to join the program. A reminder, it is Ask Us Anything Friday on the program. Dunbar number text line is 650, 650, hashtag your Ask Us Anything's AUA. Put a pizza emoji into your text. You'll be entered into the grand prize contest to win a $100 gift card to AJ's pizza on East Broadway. After AJ, Jonas Siegel is going to join the program. Maple Leafs reporter for The Athletic. He wrote a big Mitch Martiner profile last week when the Leafs were in Vegas, and now the return. Marner and the Vegas Golden Knights take on the Leafs in Toronto tonight.

We'll talk to Jonas about Mitchie's big return at 705. 730 Parker Burgess is going to join the show. Head coach to the Vancouver Giants. Giants away in Prince George this weekend for a two-game set. Parker recently named an assistant coach for Team West at the 2026 WHL Prospects game. Why do I mention that? They're playing at the Langley Events Center on February 18th. Lots to get into with Parker Burgess at 7.30.

8 o'clock Rick Dollywall is going to join the program. Intrepid Canucks reporter for Donnie and Dolly on Czech TV. For this, as always, we turn things over to our resident Dollywall nursemaid, Jason Brough. Well, we're going to start with J.P. Barry's comments on his show yesterday and what that could mean for the Elias Pedersen off season. Let's call it that. A reminder that Elias Pedersen and the Canucks are in action tonight. 7 o'clock from Rogers Arena against Jackie. Hughes and the New Jersey Devils.

It's a big show. We have a lot of guests and we have a lot to get into. So without further ado, Laddie, let's tell everybody what happened. Hey, did you guys see the game last night? No. No. What happened? I missed all the action because I was.

We know how busy your life can be. What happened? Missed it? You missed that? What happened is brought to you by the BC Construction Safety Alliance. Making safety simpler by giving me construction companies, the best in tools, resources, and safety training. Visit them online at BCCSA.

Although the Vancouver Canucks only had an optional practice yesterday ahead of tonight's game against the New Jersey Devils, there was no shortage of storylines from your Vancouver Canucks yesterday, many of them pertaining to number 40, Elias Pedersen, but very quickly, before we get into all that, as mentioned, was an optional practice yesterday. One of the participants in the practice, again, Philip Heedle, who could very well make his long-awaited return from injury

tonight when the Canucks think on the Devils, 7 o'clock at Rogers Arena. Yeah, Teddy Blugher's back, and now it's Philip Heedel's turn. As you said, he could make his return to the lineup tonight against New Jersey. I have no idea where Heidel fits in the Canucks future. I obviously wonder if he can stay healthy. And even if he can stay healthy, I wonder if he should be a center or a winger. I heard a few guys on the station kicking that around.

And obviously it's going to depend on needs. If they trade Elias Pedersen, which we'll get into later, do they get a center back? And if so, is that center better or lower in the lineup than Philippiol? Who knows at this point? Marco Rossi is also on the team. There's Atu Ratu. I honestly don't know really what the future holds for him, too.

So I just want to start. Let's just start our Philippeal watching with him staying healthy and not taking any massive hits. Fortunately, the Washington Capitals, we're no longer going to see the Washington Capitals. The Canucks went 2 and O against the Caps, but Wilson really delivered a big blow to not only Heedle, but to the Canucks in like Game 7 or something like that

when he put Heedle out with that hit. And I don't know if Heedle's going to be able to just change the way he plays. He's a straight-ahead guy, but you know, you got to keep your head up. You've got to be aware when you're carrying the puck through the middle of the ice and also right after you pass the puck through the middle of the ice that you might get lit up. And that's something that hockey players have been taught since, you know, they started playing hockey with body checking. And, you know, guys like Tom Wilson, they are rare, but they do exist. And in Philippa, we're all praying that if he does get a hit like that, that he's not automatic.

out with a concussion because I don't think you can play hockey that way. I don't think that it's that it's possible to go out there and go, I'll be okay as long as I don't get hit hard. Sure. And it goes beyond like players of Tom Wilson's ilk as well. We should make this abundantly clear. Like yes, Wilson was the latest of the individuals to hit hit, you know, but he's been shelved with concussions from a variety of different hits from a variety of different players. Some that don't make their bread and butter by headhunting or targeting guys. It's just the way that he's plays. Now, Heedle's in a very interesting position in terms of career.

I'll call it trajectory because next year, he's in the last of a four-year deal that pays $4.4 million annually. And not only does he need to prove that he can play and stay in the lineup with regularity and not, I would imagine,

not suffer another concussion, that's going to go a long way to deciding what his future is going to look like in terms of employment and getting a contract. Will it be in Vancouver? Will it be elsewhere? You had to imagine I like Heidel as a player. If he's healthy, I think he brings a lot to any lineup in the NHL. Yeah, it was just, it was a, it was damning.

It was an indictment almost to his style of play that going into the year, the only question, only question everybody had was, was he going to be able to stay healthy? And it just, it didn't happen. And it didn't happen early, right? And you do wonder about the players' long-term health. Now, Heedle had some media availability the other day, meeting with Kinex reporters, and he said he's got his family's full blessing to try this again and to go out and play hockey.

And he did acknowledge that there needs to be some more awareness shown by him when he's on the ice. But there didn't seem to be a long conversation about fundamentally altering his game. And I don't know two things. One, if he's capable of even doing it. And two, if he'd want to, and I know that sounds weird because of his injury concerns,

but it's also the thing that allowed him to be, a first round pick to make the NHL and when he's healthy, be an effective NHLer. Like, less we forget, when he's out there playing, he can be very effective doing what he does. So we'll see what happens with Philippeatel potentially tonight.

So with Bluger and Heedel now returning, assuming heedle plays tonight, it obviously makes you wonder when the Canucks are going to start thinning out this roster with some trades. Who comes out of the lineup to make way for Heedle because Atu-Ratu,

didn't play against Washington the other day because Teddy Bluger was playing. And that's not ideal for Atu-Ratu, and I know Adam Foote had some comments on that yesterday, and he said, you know, he'll be fine. Maybe he's going to play the wing a little bit, but he's a pro and, you know, basically saying nothing to see here. Now, look, it isn't the end of the world that Atu-Ratu isn't playing every game. But it's not ideal either. No.

You know, don't get me wrong. It's not ideal having Atu-Ratu sitting in the press box when you've said, yeah, we're rebuilding. Like who comes out of the lineup tonight? Is it going to be, I mean, Max Sasson was the low ice time guy against the Washington Capitals. I guess you could, you know, Nils Hoaglander again, they take him out. Yeah. But, you know, again, you don't want either of those guys out of the lineup.

Nils Hoaglander has to play his way back into being a good, hockey player again. Yeah, or a trade candidate. Well, that's what I'm talking about. And Max Sasson, I mean, I think Sasson's had a terrific year, but now all of a sudden is he getting squeezed out? The thing with Ratu is, and I was wondering this the other day, do you think they maybe partially made their mind up about what he is, what he's going to be and where he's

going to fit in this big rebuild? Maybe. They don't seem overly concerned about stunting his development. or growth, they've put him in the press box on, I mean, I've lost count of the number of occasions. And when pressed about the deployment and being in the lineup, Foot just kind of gave it a shrug. He didn't seem to think it was a big deal. And this is not the first time that he's done it. I think his skating is, I know he's worked on it and it's maybe improved a little bit, but his skating isn't great. Okay, let's get into this Elias Pedersen stuff because JP Berry was on what

Donnie and Dolly yesterday. And I listened to some of the comments that he made when it was about Elias Pedersen and the possibility that Alias Pedersen could be traded. And JP Barry, now look, he's a, he's a different personality than Alan Walsh, who is Philip Hironix agent, but it was just very different to how Hronix agent addressed the trade speculation. And in case you miss that, Alan Walsh took to social media and said, this is just wasted air.

Great players are in demand everywhere, but the NHL is not fantasy hockey. Why bring up players that are not available for trade? Vancouver management and coaches are happy with Phil, and Phil has no interest in going anywhere else. We're going to play the JP Barry audio now. You tell me if you sense a little bit of a different, different attitude.

Well, I mean, I take it with a grain of salt because, I mean, when a team isn't doing well, then everybody's going to be discussed. And we've talked about in the past, it's always hard for us when it's a player who has a no move, but that's the reality of, you know, where things are when things don't go well. So, you know, for us, we know it's not real unless, you know, the GM is calling us and saying that there's an actual team or a deal and would you consider it. So, you know, nine out of ten times, it's just a rumor. Is he happy?

I mean, he says he is. Is he happy on and off the ice in Vancouver, JP? Yeah, I think he's happy. I mean, no one's happy when they're losing. So, I mean, he committed, you know, to be there and try to make the best of it, and he's going to do that. And I'm sure there's going to be all kinds of discussions at the end of this year about every player on that team.

So we can't avoid that. J.P, if they do come to you and say, hey, will you wave? That's a decision you and Elis are going to have to at that time, I guess, start thinking about something. Yeah, where it gets problematic is when things get public in that area, like people think that the players should automatically waive to whoever they want to waive to. And the reality is that when you have the leverage to have a no move, like you're giving up a lot, you know, there's, there's an, you're basically purchasing that for sometimes a million dollars or more. Okay, so the player retains the right to go to a spot that he wants to go to,

and it'll open up that kind of dialogue, but that hasn't happened yet. But yeah, I mean, obviously it has to be a location that works for both sides. Obviously, it has to be a location that works for both sides. That is, in my opinion, pretty different to how Philip Peronix agent address the trade speculation. I thought it was telling that J.P. Berry didn't outright reject the idea of opening up a dialogue with the Canucks about a change of scenery for Petey.

That almost sounded like an invitation to suggest some potential locations. So we do have some more audio to play. And this is Elliot Friedman from the latest 32 thoughts podcast, which just got released. I haven't heard this clip. So here's Elliot on the Elias Pedersen situation. J.P. Berry was on with Dallowall on Thursday.

That's what that said to me. Give us a reason. Why would we agree? So that's for all the talk about who's interested or where he could be going, you've got to show me that there's something he's going to want to say yes to. That's not nothing that he said that. Yeah, but I think I think that's, well, he didn't really even go that far. That's the way I read it.

I see. But that's the way I always see these things. I don't, people say, always got a no trade clause. Yeah, he's going to know trade clause, so he has the power. But sometimes you reach a point. where you say, all right, there's diminishing returns here, or how much do I want to listen to myself being trade rumors here, or enough's enough here?

It happens to everybody, right? It happened to Marner at the top of the show we talked about here. But to me, you've got to give them a reason to say yes. Now, my, so we're now going to go from J.P. Barry's remarks to Frege's analysis of J.P. Barry's remarks to our analysis, to Frege's analysis of J.P. Barrier's remarks. I think that if this ultimately comes down to the Pedersen camp saying, we'd be open to hearing conversations about potentially waiving the no trade clause and the no movement clause.

But it, as Barry said, it has to be like mutually beneficial. I wonder what it's going to take, where it's going to happen, and what that list looks like. But don't you think this is an invitation to that process? I think it's an invitation to open. Yeah. I think that's it though. Okay. I ultimately think there's a long way to go for sure. There's a long way to go. Yeah. Yeah. Now it my takeaway from the entire thing is is this whole thing being positioned for the inevitable well we would like to move the player and we have options on the table, but the player is unwilling to move. Like is that what is is that the ultimate end game here. I kind of feel like it might be well maybe it won't that would get really ugly. Yeah. Real ugly. Now remember there has been messaging from. this organization that the contract they originally signed

Elias Pedersen 2 with the no movement clause wouldn't necessarily be that big of a deal because if things went pair shaped in Vancouver the organization was under the belief that the player would welcome a move as much as the organization would welcome trying to move him that if it went that badly EP40 might be more than willing to entertain a move elsewhere right I mean that was kind of the basic contract 101 language and interpretation of what was going on there. Now that we've to a certain degree reached that point,

I mean, let's not forget, when Elias Pedersen signed his monster 11.6 million a year contract, I can't even begin to tell you how dramatically different things were for this organization, its trajectory, who his teammates were at the time, right? He's the Will Smith meme from the Fresh Prince, just looking around the,

room. Like, oh, guys, I used to be here. The old leadership group, it's gone. So it's fundamentally different now. Was Will Smith going, was that my fault? Was it me? Was it me? Did I do something?

Or did everyone else just leave? So when you look at it in that regard, you could say, well, yeah, things have definitely changed for the player. And that one year window where the Canucks had to move him without the no movement clause is gone. But it's okay because the organization has kind of said. through back channels that, yeah, if things go bad, don't stress about the no movement clause because the player would be open to a move.

Well, that remains to be seen. Sometimes players aren't as open or receptive to leaving as you think. There's a comfort factor, as Greg Wysinski often points out, guys love being where their stuff is, right? They got a nest, they're settled, and they're just going to go out and play hockey. Now I'm not saying... Sounds like you don't think he's going to get traded. Because I think it's trending towards him getting traded.

I'm not guaranteeing it because I think, as we've already discussed, that it's complicated and you've got to find everything. You've got to find not only a team that wants them, but a team that's willing to give a return that you think is acceptable and then make sure that that team, Pedersen, is willing to go to that team. That's a lot of things to... Let me say what I'm thinking as clear as possible. I think there's going to be efforts made to move him.

I bet because it's something that I think is beneficial and want to happen, it won't happen. It's almost like the rainy cloud thing. So you don't think it's going to happen. What happens if they find a deal that works? Yep. And he doesn't wave? Yeah, and it somehow gets out. Would the Canucks do that to him?

Would the Canucks do that to themselves? You know, like, you found. Also, why wouldn't he want a change of scenery? Like, that's what I don't get. Like, after all he's been through over the last few years here and all, like, the drama surrounding the player. Well, Adog, who says he doesn't? I'm not saying.

Maybe he does. I'm saying counter to what Halford's saying. Like, I'm just shocked that, you know, I don't know if he does or not, but I'm just, I would be shocked that he wouldn't even entertain the idea of a change of scenery and a fresh start given what's gone on over the last few seasons. Maybe this is what's happening. Maybe this is what's happening. Maybe this is JP Barrett.

going, send us some options here, but don't forget, we have to approve those options. What I'm discussing is what happens if the Canucks find a potential option, and then PD says, no, I don't want to go there, and then it somehow gets out that he won't waive his no move clause, because just to move on, because we can get back to the Pedersen stuff. Yeah. There's a, the Mitch Marner situation in Toronto wasn't exactly identical, but there were some similarities there. Some parallels for sure.

And if you haven't read Friege's article on Mitch Marner, go to sportsnet.com and read it. The people that follow the leaves on a daily basis probably are like, yeah, I kind of figured most of that stuff. but if you don't, man, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, and there's two things that really stood out for me. Um, the first thing is that Mitch Marner apparently, or Mitch Marner's camp, um, held a grudge about Marner not receiving, uh, full entry level contract bonuses for

as long he was a leaf. Till the day he left. That was a grudge. Also a grudge that he didn't get to play in the NHL as an 18-year-old. Just to give you an idea of the petty grievances that run this league. And that was in comparison to Austin Matthews that got the bonuses and was playing in the NHL. The stuff that was more interesting to me was, and I'll just read this,

Marner became even more hypersensitive to what was being said about him after getting that new contract. He read too much social media. He checked replies to his post, search out reaction to his play. Players and staff worked with him to ease up or delete apps from his phone. There was also the problem that as a Torontoian, he was surrounded by family and friends who would text him or tell him what was said about him. So obviously that doesn't apply to Elise Pedersen. He's not a Vancouver kid playing for the Vancouver Canucks. But we all know that there has been some sort of issue with social media and Elias Pedersen and maybe a sensitivity to criticism or a sensitivity to what's said about him in general.

Yeah. Someone Austin and Langley just texted in and asking about this notion of what happens if they ask a player to wave and he shuts it down. He says it's very ironic with Dougie Hamilton in the New Jersey Devils in town because that's exactly what's going on with Douggy Hamilton right now. is that it's very well known that New Jersey Devils want to move on from Hamilton and his contract so that they can do other things like, I mean, we one day potentially try and acquire Queen Hughes. Hamilton has the right to do what he's doing. He signed a contract and his J.P. Barry pointed out in that clip with Donnie and Dolly, sometimes in the fine art of negotiation, getting that no movement clause can equate to what,

a million bucks in terms of salary. Like, we'll take some salary off the top. We'll knock down your A.A.V. will give you a certain level of security and the ability to say no to a move. And when that happens, you kind of got to understand how it works. No longer are you working of a field of 31 other potential landing spots for your client. In the case of Pedersen, you've got to go from 31 down to how many are actually willing and able to make a move. Of that group, how many are able to give the connection.

And this is important, the return that they want. Because they're clearly not giving them away for free. No. So the pool gets whittled down even further. Then after that, you've got to say, of this now whittled down pool, which one of these is Pedersen willing to waive his no movement clause for? And suddenly, you don't have a ton of suitors. This is where I'm coming at this thing from is I think it's going to be difficult already to move him.

Never mind the fact that he's got to fully agree to go somewhere. And I mean, I think that was the one big. takeaway from Barry yesterday. It was there like, we're open to any kind of conversation, but you got to show us something first. But with the value that centers have right now and the rarity of even half decent centers, but the return not be just insane, like much higher than it should be, considering how few there are available. Insane is pushing in a little bit. Well, insane relative to the players. They're going to be assuming a lot of risk in that contract. Well, they though in a couple years it won't seem so bad. The cap's going up a lot every year.

Yeah, because he's on a great trajectory right now. Well, that's, but that's what you're selling. You're selling the reclamation project. Yeah, but you're selling. I have a very skilled player. That's a large contract to try and reclaim, you know, like it's... Well, it is right now, but I'm saying in a couple years, not so much because the cap, it won't look so bad in a couple years. It won't look terribly to other...

Well, there's a good sales pitch. It looks horrible now, but if you buy it, it won't look so bad in a couple years. Compared to what other centers will be getting paid, though, at that time, you know, over the length of the deal. But all you're selling is that the contract won't look as bad in a couple years. Well, what you're selling is also the talent of the player. of course. And you're saying, like, maybe he turns it around. Right. So you're selling the hope that... It's an $80 million bet that you're making, man. That's a lot of money.

But there's not a lot of centers out there that are even half decent. And they're getting really overpaid right now, even the not very good ones. That's why I think there's going to be a team or two that's willing to take that bet. But is that going to match up with a team that Pedersen wants to play for? Bingo. And that's going to be the ultimate on this entire thing. I don't doubt that they'll be able to find a handful of teams to be like, we're ready to do this. That'd be funny if the Canucks went. If you don't wave, I will make this place so toxic.

And then Pedersen's like, yeah, it already is. It's kind of getting there if it's not there already. No, like we're actually going to release toxic gas. For those of you that think that we might be belaboring this subject, I will remind you that if the entire organizational ethos now is about the future and about rebuilding, then this contract and this player are, the, I would say the most fundamentally important parts of the entire thing. Because if he's here for it and he's going to stay throughout the duration of this rebuild,

Pederson I'm talking about, he becomes de facto a thing that he hasn't been over the last few years, which is one of the most important players on the team and whether he likes or not, part of the leadership group because he's a vested veteran, he's the highest paid player on the team. And he's going to be counted upon to be an important center. In terms of the rebuild, he is a fundamentally important part of this thing. And if he decides to go elsewhere, the assets that get back in return are a fundamentally important part of where the rebuild goes.

Okay, we're way up against it for time. I need to remind you that the Clayton Public House is your home for the big football party this year. We'll be doing our Friday, AFC and NFC Championship preview with Nick Shook coming up next. But the Clayton Public House is hosting the big football party on Sunday, February the 8th, it's hosted by SportsNet 650. We'll have more details next week. I believe we've got some giveaways on the show as well

to attend the big football party on Sunday, February of the 8th. Clayton Public House, good food, good people, good times. Coming up, Nick Shook from NFL.com is going to join the program. We will preview Championship Sunday in the National Football League. You're listening to the Halford & Brough show on SportsNet 650. I am going to create an environment that is so toxic. It's Canucks Central on SportsNet 650.

from exclusive interviews to insider scoops and post-game breakdowns, we've got it all. Tune in weekdays 4 to 6 p.m. on radio and on demand through your favorite podcast app. Hey, everybody, sweet, sweet Friday. It's a Fiesta Friday here on the Halford & Brough show on Sportsnet 650. Although the weather outside is not Muig Caliente right now, we're still in our Fiesta Friday mode. Halford and Brough of the morning is brought to you by Sands and Associates. Do you have credit card debt?

Yeah, you. Do you have credit card debt? If so, Sands and Associates could cut that debt by up to 80% with no upfront fees. For more, visit them today. It's hands dash trustee.com. We are an hour one of the program. Nick Shook from NFL.com is going to join us in just a moment. You're the highlight of hour one.

Hour one is brought to you by North Star Metal Recycling. Vancouver's premier metal recycler pays the highest prices on scrap metal. North Star Metal Recycling, they recycle. You get paid. visit them with 1170 Powell Street in Vancouver. To the phone lines we go. Nick Shook from NFL.com joins us now on the Halford and Brough Show on SportsNet 650.

Morning, Nick. How are you? Fantastic, guys. How are you? We're great. We've been doing this all year, Nick, and we're finally there two games away from the Super Bowl. It's championship Sunday. We're very excited for it here. And we're also still kind of very surprised

that Seattle Seahawks are one-win away from going to the Super Bowl. but that's where we're at. I know you wrote a bunch about this on NFL.com right now, looking at the three big storylines going into the NFC championship game. Walk us through number three. When it comes to coaching, what matters more? Experience or a hot streak?

It's what's weird about this whole matchup because first off, I know you're trying to live in the moment as Seahawks fans saying, hey, I can't believe we're back here. It's been so long since we've gotten to this point. But also, you've got to get rid of that act because you belong here. That's how good of a football team this is and a lot of it is because of what Mike McDonald has done.

But, you know, it's an interesting examination of you know, two coaches who are among the four youngest active coaches in the NFL. And two coaches who are kind of similar in nature in that they are both considered, you know, kind of

I don't know, Vunderkins, if not, you know, just straight up geniuses on their side of the football. You know, Sean McVeyoff defensively, Mike McDonald's defensively, and they're going to clash, and they have already seen each other twice this year and produced two excellent games. I mean, the scoring margin difference between these two games, you know, whether it was the two-point win that the Rams had or the one point win that the Seahawks had, it's about as narrow as it gets when you combine the two. And one point separates these two teams through two contests. But what I wrote that because I wondered, you know, just deep down, really what does matter more in such a,

matchup because it's not often that we see two coaches that that are still below 40 who get to this point and have such different tracks to this point. I mean, Sean McFey has been to coach the Rams for nearly 10 years.

The youngest coach, I think that we perhaps have ever seen in the NFL at the time that he was hired. He's already won 10 playoff games. He's been to two Super Bowls. It's just absurd to look at that when you compare against the resume of Mike McDonald, who has an excellent coach and has done great things.

And is, you know, among the youngest in the NFL as well, but just hasn't had that unique opportunity that the Rams gave McVeigh when he was so young to be able to pile up this sort of track record. So I just thought, you know, two teams that know each other really well, two excellent minds on their respective side of the football. And one trip to the Super Bowl is on the line. And what really does end up mattering is that the coach who's been through the fire in the playoffs so many times. The coach who just got his first playoff victory last week, but his team is on absolute fire and looks like the best team on the planet.

And that's what I think we're going to see solved. And I'm kind of leaning toward the ladder. Too often when you watch teams make Super Bowl runs, it's all about peaking at the right time. And only any team in the NFL is peaking better than the Seahawks right now. What is the best thing that the Seahawks defense does? Probably generate pressure organically without blitzing. The numbers are pretty, there's a lot of anomalies in the way the Seahawks defense operates statistically. Just like compared to how most defenses work, they just, they generate pressure with four.

Organically, it's really like where they're just base rushes, right? They don't blitz very often. They have five guys of 40 plus pressures. No guy with, you know, the total TV pressures in the top 25. So they have no one star, essentially. They are a group that is the, you know, a product of what they all do collectively. And it's kind of rare to see a team that's able to consistently get after quarterbacks, disguise coverages, and not have to, you know, kind of send extra rushers.

It's really a unique advantage or a rare advantage. and see very often that there's a huge strength for the Seahawks. And I think that that, you know, we saw what that kind of did against a lot of teams this year, against San Francisco. I wonder, you know, the Rams offensive line has gotten healthier since, you know, was late in the season. But it's such a luxury for what Mike McDonald is able to do when he can count on his front four to get pressure and not have to send extra guys and then can use the rest of those

guys in coverage. It just makes it that much more complex. because usually football is it's a sacrifice in one way or the other. Either, all right, if we're going to get to the quarterback and speed them up, we got to send extra guys, which means we haven't sacrificed those guys in coverage. McDonald's doesn't have to do that.

And so that's what makes them probably, you know, the best defense in the NFL and why they are such a difficult team to stop it. And then they married that with a running game. That's just been so much better since week 10 and has really just made them such a complimentary football team. But it all starts, the defense, and really all starts getting after the quarterback

without having a sense. extra guys. So if the Seahawks have been so great on defense, which I'm not disagreeing with, but why have the Rams have had success offensively against the Seahawks? The last time they played was that wild one that

the Seahawks won 38 to 37 in overtime, but Matt Stafford threw for 457 yards in that one. That's a lot of yards. I can hear you guys shake it in your boots all the way across. Yeah, I'm nervous. I'm nervous.

Like I think I think I would not have been as nervous if it was the Bears coming to Seattle because I think Caleb Williams, a quarterback, you know, I know he's kind of the master of the miracle play and he showed that against the Rams despite losing. But I still think that atmosphere and that defense would have been a little too much for him at this stage of his career. Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, there's a reason that they always say it's hard to be a team twice in the season. And I believe that the familiarity of it really did help the Rams in that second matchup.

I also felt like at that time that was when the Rams were really peaking. I felt they controlled most of that game until the Seahawks were able to kind of get up off the mat and, you know, ride an incredible comeback that was helped in part, or led in part by Sam Darnold, who kind of also put them there. But I also caution against thinking that, you know, that alone is the general indicator of what they're going to see, you know, in the playoffs. Because if you go back to the first game they played, Matthew Stafford had a season low in passing yards. It was an ugly game in L.A. And one that the Rams, you know, barely won.

They kind of stole it, if you think about it. You know, the fact that it did come down to a field that was missed by Seattle, right? So I wouldn't be as nervous or as worried that this is going to happen again as the more recent game would tell you to be worried. But they're also, you know, the NFL's number one scoring offense. But you're facing the NFL's number one scoring defense in Seattle. And one of those notes that I included in that what to watch for was historically, and I tend to not use these a lot because there are so many factors and circumstances that can change one year to the next. but historically, Matthew Stafford, when facing the number one scoring defense on the road

in the playoffs is 0 and 3. So I think that, you know, there's reasons to believe that McDonald will potentially get the upper hand on the Rams who also have struggled over the last couple of games to generate the offense that they were, you know, producing down the, well, really over the entire regular season. So I think that the week 16 game that they play will end up being the anomaly of the outlier

of these three matchups. But just because of how good Seattle's defense is and how the Rams defense is also playing well. So I wouldn't be as concerned. But again, he wasn't an NFL MVP candidate. He still could win the award. There's a reason for that. What did you see in Chicago last weekend that allowed the Bears to minimize the damage that the Stafford Nakua combo had? Because that was the one that killed the Seahawks in the game that Bruf was alluding to there.

Like 225 yards receiving? But also like 220 Kavis. Like he just opened the whole game and he only caught five balls against the bears. I mean, watch that game as closely as I could. And I'm thinking like the one thing that's not happening here is Stafford can't get the ball in his hands whenever he wants like he has been able to in previous games. Now, was that something Chicago did? Was that a factor of the weather and, you know, being on the road and tough conditions? What did you see last week that allowed Stafford and Nakuta look like mere mortals against the bears?

It was a combination of three factors last week. It was the weather helped or didn't help. Stafford, that finger injury, I'm still curious if that's not the first than he's letting on, especially because he went through a stretch in the second half for he was just terrible in his accuracy. We know that's a serious strength. But it was also what the Bears did. Bears had a great game plan for that game. They came in and committed to bringing pressure at Stafford from angles that he's not entirely accustomed to seeing this season.

a lot of defensive backblitzes, a lot of commitment to, all right, we're going to stand an extra rush here, we're going to send an extra rush here, it's going to force them off his spot, it's going to force to make a quick decision. And the Rams were slow to adjust. They were also still to adjust

because Sean McVeigh, for some reason, refused to roll the football on a cold, snowy day in Chicago, the playoffs in January, until essentially the fourth quarter. And that's what balanced out their offense and was able to kind of unlock the ability to make that march,

that scoring march that gave them the 17-10 lead in the fourth quarter. So I think, you know, McVeigh has had fun to learn from this game. The difference, though, is that I don't think it's applicable to what the Seahawks are going to do because of what I said earlier, which is that Seahawks don't need to blitz to generate pressure. But it definitely affected the way that Stafford was able to, you know, kind of sit back and pick apart a defense and get to guys like Puka. But again, late in that game, he still returned to Puka.

I mean, there was a third and six conversion that he took for like 13, 15 yards in overtime that helped them set up the game winning field goal. And I would expect a healthy dose of him. Again, it's just that, you know, it's obviously a focus of an opposing defense's game plan, too. We're speaking to Nick Shook from NFL.com here on the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. Nick is a presentation of the Clayton Public House. Reserve your spot for the big football party of the Clayton Public House hosted by SportsNet 650. Email info at the Clayton Pub.com for more Clayton Public House.

Good food, good people, good times. One more on this game, Nick, and that's the absence of Zach Charbonnet. So can Kenneth Walker handle a bigger share with Charbonnet out of the backfield duties and maybe replace Charbonnet all by himself? Can he? Yes. Will he? I don't necessarily think so. This is where the game really gets interesting and where the scale could potentially tilt back toward the middle, if not in favor of the Rams. Look, I mean, the Seahawks have been an incredible rushing attack since, you know, really the start of the second half of the season, but over the last four weeks, really, the last month or so. I mean, it averaged 172.3 yards and two rushing gusts per game since week 16. That's absurd. It's just absurd for a team that also happens to have the best defense or one of the best two defenses in the NFL. And that's why they look so strong. But I think that was also a product to the fact that you had Kenneth Walker, you had Zach Sharman,

he had this nice little two-headed combo that when married with proper run blocking, which I think has gotten much better for them over the course of this season, the addition of Graves Able, you know, through the draft, and nobody's going to overlook that or go without mentioning that because he's been excellent for them, especially since he came back from injury. It's really helped

them, you know, kind of put that run game together, but I think when you take one half of that running back, you know, the backfield out of the equation, it just puts too much, not too much, but more, too much perhaps, yeah, a responsibility on the remaining guy.

And I think Walker's built for it, but I think it's going to kind of force Kibati to turn back towards Sam Darnal a little bit more than they have over the last month or so. That's the funny thing about this team is, you know, you've watched them continue to win, and if you compare it to where they were earlier

than the season, like, let's juxtapose it with that shootout game against the Buccaneers. It's like, well, they haven't really needed Sam Darlane to be that great for them to win these games recently. It's because of the running game. You take that part out it takes away a little bit of the strength of your offense in a big game, and especially in a game that you're going to want to try to control possession because that's always important, especially in playoff games.

So Walker can, you know, he's had 100 plus scrimmage yards in each of his last three games against the Rams, which includes rushing and receiving. Yep. But it's a little bit more difficult to do so when you can't spell them a Charbonnet and have the power back like Charbonnet to, you know, hand off the ball to you for the really rugged runs that you're going to need. Yeah, we had Brady Henderson on from ESPN, our Seahawks Insider, yesterday.

You point out, especially around the goal line, that's where they really value Charbonnet, because Walker's not the fourth or, you know, short yardage guy that can punch it in. And I'll be curious to see that as well. I guess we should talk about the AFC championship game. We haven't done that yet, and we have four minutes left in the hit. But there's a reason that we've kind of parked it here for just a few minutes. And I think it's an almost impossible task for what the Bronzer who's want to do here.

I know that, you know, we've seen backup quarterbacks come in and surprise and everything, but, you know, Jared Stidham isn't exactly like some other backup quarterbacks who you kind of like and you'd be willing to go to. Maybe if your starter was struggling, he's just a journeyman guy that's never really played a significant game in his NFL career. How tall a task is this? Not necessarily for Stidham, but for Peyton and the coaching staff to try and manufacture a game plan to pull out a win here?

I don't think it's as challenging as we believe it is. And you can call me crazy, but... No, I won't do that. But we also consider the fact that the Broncos has advanced to the AFC championship game with a second-year quarterback. A second-year quarterback that most teams and most people laughed at the Broncos were taking as highly as they did in the draft,

who fits what Sean Payton wanted to do perfectly and has also developed, but isn't perfect. There's nowhere... You know, it's still very far from being a world-beater of a quarter. quarterback that a lot of these other youngsters are. And yet that's where they got here. And he had to play his role. It wasn't just like the defense was the only thing that got them there.

Right. And the reason that I think it's, I don't think it's as unlikely as people believe is, this is crazy. Stick with me here. Stidham, Doug, have a little bit of regular season playing experience from his time with the Raiders. He started with the Patriots. That was a Patriots of Old. But he also had a lot of, you know, big time college football experience.

which is crazy. I know this is crazy, but stick with me. And he was the first move that Sean Payton made when he took over in Denver. He was like, hey, you know, we got to go get this guy as my backup. So there's a lot of confidence in him for good reason.

And we started to see signs of that confidence, why that Sean Payton wanted to sit him so desperately when he was, you know, first game with the Broncos. And I saw the preseason. It's crazy. It was crazy. But he was the best player in the NFL

the preseason. I was stunned. I was like, Jared Stinnettan looks incredible. And I know it's the preseason, familial defense, and everything else. But he looks incredible. Do not be surprised if he handles this job a lot better than everybody expects him to and that we get a really good game. Because I know, it's like, oh, you lose your starting quarterback. They're worth the most in the NFL. But don't be surprised he comes in there and does better than most expect. Okay. I like that. I want to know, on the defensive side of things,

Do you think the Broncos should go into this with a ton of confidence that they can force Drake May into turning the ball over, be it with picks or, like we saw against Houston, fumbling the football? Yeah, the numbers would say that. You know, the Broncos lead the NFL in sacks, and they're excellent getting next to the quarterback, and they force Josh Allen to do a bunch of turn numbers. I don't know if I would necessarily bank on it,

but it would be a goal of the game plan for sure. The thing about the Patriots, what made them kind of annoying in this playoff run, is that May hasn't had to be like the star, that we saw him be throughout most of this season. He just made enough big plays in the right spots to propel this Patriots team forward. And, you know, we can always look back at last week and think, well, if C.J. Stroud played like C.J. Stroud

of, I don't know, even his rookie year, if the offense could run the football at all and protect him at all and receivers could get open, you know, if that offense had any sort of a pulse, you know, we could be looking at the Houston, Texas thing, in the championship game. So because it's like, you look at the Patriots story, you're like, this is great.

You know, it's very fun to watch and everything else, but May has also gotten away with a lot of turnovers, especially in that last game. There are flaws. Every team in this playoffs are flawed. Every team in the NFL was this year. There was no perfect team or close to perfect team, which made the season so captivating.

But I do believe that the Broncos will have a chance to turn Drake May over, but it's not going to be about that as much as it's going to be about the four-quarter effort. You know, can you prevent him from kidding you with a deep shot, like hitting Kisham-Buddy for a fourth-quarter touchdown against. of Texans last week. That's going to be most important we're playing against Drake, and making sure that when you do force those turnovers,

you get points out of them. Nick, this was great, as always. Thanks for taking the time to do it. We appreciate it. When we do this next, we'll be previewing the Super Bowl. Enjoy the games this weekend, bud. Oh, yeah. It's not music to my ears. Super Bowl preview. Let's do it. Have a good one, guys.

See you, Nick. That's Nick Shook from NFL.com here on the Halford & Bruff Show on Sportsnet, 650. I've got some kind of sports-related breaking news. Kind of sports related. Breaking news. Okay. That Ryan wedding guy got arrested.

Canadian snowboarder turned. Oh, the drug guy. Cocaine, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. They got him. I don't, there's, and no details have been shared. He was top 10 on like the FBI wanted. Yeah.

So there's, Joe, we did it. There's, um, there's a press conference this morning at some point. They'll go over all the details about how he was, arrested, I imagine, where he was arrested, but that is a fascinating story. Well, they were calling him the Canadian El Chapo. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Anyway, just some news to pass along. You actually described that perfectly. It is sort of sports related and it was breaking news. Yeah. Very well done. That's why he's on the radio, folks. And he's on the radio for two more hours. People say we don't talk enough about snowboarding. It's true. And we just

got some snowboarding news in there. Check. I noticed when you guys discuss Snowboarding is always drug-related. You know, either sports scores related to it or? Nope, just right. That's snowboarding's fault, though. Yeah, between Ross or Beggleady and this guy. Oh, yeah.

Yeah, yeah. See, there you go. Okay. Very similar. What a billing though. Apologies to Ross, by the way. I just lumped you in there. What a billing.

Canadian former Olympics snowboarder turned alleged drug kingpin. And that's a title. That's a good headline. This is going to be a movie, isn't it? Probably. They're going to make a movie out of this. Oh, yeah, for sure. Big time.

I'll watch it too. It's going to be a Hallwarr Christmas movie. We didn't see that coming. Okay, we got to go. We got to go. We're up against it for time. Coming up on the other side, AJ from AJ's pizza is going to join us.

Jonas Siegel from the athletic is going to join us. And Parker Burgess, head coach of the Vancouver Giants is going to join us. You're listening to the Halford-embroft show on SportsNet 650.