Halford & Brough in the Morning - Will Russell Wilson Be A Hall Of Famer?

Episode Date: August 26, 2024

In hour two, Mike and Jason talk to Mike Tanier about Russell Wilson and the latest in the NFL. They also catch up with Brendan Batchelor and talk about the mystery surrounding Thatcher Demko’s return and Ian Clark’s transition into a new role. This podcast is produced by Andy Cole and Greg Balloch. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests and do not necessarily reflect the position of Rogers Media Inc. or any affiliate.

what is the musical theme we've got going today what what did you type in for this we had kmart van halen on earlier. What was this? Well, I typed in Van Halen, and this is another one of the ones that came up. Yeah, it kind of... It's like 80s Van Halen. Should we do, like, 80s Monday? Do we have anything for Monday?

Do we do... We don't have a Monday theme. A musical theme? Mm-hmm. All right. Fake 80s Monday? It's pretty niche. It's pretty niche. It's pretty niche.

You are listening to the Halford & Brough Show on a Monday on Sportsnet 650. Halford & Brough in the morning is brought to you by Vancouver Honda. Vancouver's premier destination for Honda customers. They have a friendly, knowledgeable staff that can help with anything you're looking for, be it sales, financing, service, or parts. By the way, Sammy Hagar, unnecessarily vilified by a large contingent of the Van Halen fan base. Please explain. Wow.

He replaced David Lee Roth, and a lot of people didn't like that. But Sammy Hagar, I thought, sung his heart out for that band. God, I'm old. Coming to you live from the Kintec studio, Kintec, Canada's favorite orthotics provider. Powered by thousands of five-star Google reviews. Sore feet, what are you waiting for? First ever concert I went to, the Balance Tour, Pacific Coliseum, 1995. If you had to guess, how old do you think Sam Hager is?

He would be probably in the 60s now. Right? Really? Yep. 76 years old. Sammy Hager's 76? Yep. Have you got the right Sammy Hager? How many are there? I don't know. No, it's him. Oh my god. I did not realize

that he was also the founder of the Cabo Wabo tequila brand. I'm learning a lot from Wikipedia's probably done all right for himself. We need to get the stream up and running, Lena, by the way. There we go. Mike Tanier joins us now on the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. Good morning, Michael.

How are you? I'm doing great. You know, Steny Hagar still tours with Michael Anthony of Van Halen and sometimes Stephen Vai of David Lee Roth's band as Chickenfoot. And they might be coming to a state fair or whatever you guys have up there near you. You'll hear the Van Hagar hits. You'll hear I Can't Drive 55. Boy, that will take you back.

That will make you feel old. So if you're a big Van Hagar fan, go for it. If you're like the rest of us, it's fine. What do you mean by that? Were you not a Sammy Hagar fan, go for it. If you're like the rest of us, it's fine. What do you mean by that? Were you not a Sammy Hagar fan? You know what? Van Halen, the original David Lee Roth Van Halen is singular. It's unique.

Van Hagar had the hits. They had the hits. They had their moment. But I would never play a Van Hagar album, say, when I'm working out. I'll pull a Van Halen album on all the time. It was the first album I ever bought, 1984. Yes. I bought it.

It was a record. And you know what? Remember that was the one with the smoking baby on the front of it? They don't let babies smoke anymore, you know, and that's the sign of the times. They don't let babies smoke, and that went out with albums, and I'm just going to share a detail. My first kiss was a love interest kiss. That was playing in the background.

So if you can imagine trying to have your first kiss to, like, Panama, that's a formative moment in my life. He says romance. Hot shoes burning down the avenue. That's it. Hey, baby. Yeah. 14 years burning down the avenue. That's it. Hey, baby. Yeah. 14 years old on the beach.

Yes. Perfect. This is going to be the toughest radio transition of all time to try and talk about Russell Wilson. Okay. I'm going to try it anyway. So there's only a handful of available QB jobs that are still up in the balance. And I know that Russell Wilson, I guess, is the sort of nominal starter in Pittsburgh, even though a lot of people are saying that it should be Justin Fields.

We can get to the New England situation in a moment as well. But I almost wanted to not even talk about Russ with the Steelers. But one of the questions that you answered in your most recent mailbag, by the way, if anyone wants to check it out, Mike Tannier, Substack, the 2 Deep Zone. There was a question out there that asked, has there ever been a quarterback that was as good as Russell Wilson who became as bad as Russell Wilson is now this quickly? And then it also dovetailed off into where Russ's Hall of Fame candidacy is at.

For those that haven't had a chance to check out the mailbag yet, you did address this question. What sort of answers did you come up with about the current state of Russell Wilson? Well, first of all, quarterbacks start to fade around 32, 33, 34 often. It's pretty common. We get used to Tom Brady and Phillip Rivers and guys like that, and you don't realize that a lot of great quarterbacks, and also second-tier but very good for many years quarterbacks,

your Jay Cutler types, your Andy Dalton who you know make pro bowls and make the playoffs they're done at 32-33 guys like Donovan and McDabb were done at about 33 that's not unusual for Russell Wilson in terms of the Hall of Fame you know seven or eight years ago I would have been like yeah he's a shoo-in he's a champion he's a perennial pro bowler. He's a pioneer, so to speak. Now, when you look at how things have gone in the last three, four, five years, sort of the bad taste in that mouth that was left in Seattle, to a degree, the very

bad taste in the mouth of Denver fans, he's by no means any kind of shoe-in. He is somebody who will retire. Five years will pass. He'll come on the ballot and will probably have to very slowly work his way up into consideration. When you think about all the great position players, don't compare them to quarterbacks. Compare them to all the great position players, all the guys like the Aaron Donalds and Jason Kelsey's

who just retired and are going to be on the Hall of Fame ballots coming soon. It's going to be hard for a quarterback whose best years were already like 10 years ago, 8, 9, 10 years ago. It's going to be hard for a quarterback whose best years were like already like 10 years ago, eight, nine, 10 years ago. It's going to be hard for him to distinguish himself in that group. What's going to happen this year in Pittsburgh? Does he enter the season as the starter? And if so, how long does he hold it on to that job for? Yeah, he enters the season as the starter.

I think that's almost guaranteed. How long he holds on to it, I'm not sure. Folks who are advocating for Justin Fields probably saw the Justin Fields highlights from the preseason, not the Justin Fields games or every snap or whatever from the preseason where he's having a hard time fielding shotgun snaps and he's taking sacks and he's doing all the things that he did in Chicago, including once in a while produce this amazing play.

I would not be stunned. I would not be stunned if they didn't do a little bit of a Taysom Hill quarterback rotation type of thing where they gave fields a package. I would not be shocked if they did that. Tomlin sounded like he was hinting at it. Coordinator Arthur Smith loves that kind of thing. I don't think it's the best plan,

but I think it's a plan that the Steelers might pursue. Over in New England, there is still a, I guess it's a competition to be between Jacoby Brissett and Drake May, who will be the starter for day one. Who do you think that'll end up being when the Patriots open? Jarrett Mayo is talking himself into Drake May as we speak. Every time he gives a press conference or talks after the game, he changes his mind from his post-game comments where he said,

oh, Drake May is the second-best quarterback on this roster, to this morning's comments where he's like, well, you know, May has outperformed Brissette. Mayo is a defensive coach. He wants to go with Brissette. He wants to go with a veteran. That's a former teammate of his. He wants to put him out there.

He's talking himself out of that as we speak. I have a funny feeling that Brissette gets the start in the opener, but the hook is going to be really quick. I'm just looking for the final excuse to say, hey, you know what? This isn't working and turn it over to May. And that could be week two. That could be halftime of week one. We'll see. But I don't think there's any question. May has outperformed from what we've seen on the field, Brissette, this preseason. Of all the rookie quarterbacks, first-round guys that are going to be starting or could start, we'll include Drake May in this, who would you be most worried about when it comes to the team around them

and whether or not, for example, if they have the protection or if they have, you know, because I think we've seen some talented quarterbacks thrown to the wolves in recent years. And I always wonder how much that's affected their development and maybe in another situation with a little more patience or with a better team around them, could things have gone differently for some of these guys? Oh, you're absolutely right about that.

There are guys who have been thrown to the wolves. And I don't see any terrible situation like that where it's like, You're absolutely right about that. There are guys who have been thrown to the wolves. And I don't see any terrible situation like that where it's like, okay, we drafted you, we don't have a go-to receiver, our offensive line's a mess. There's none of that this year. Everybody sort of has some veterans and some safety blankets around these guys. Jayden Daniels for the commanders is the one that I look at.

Cliff Kingsbury is his offensive coordinator. This guy has been sort of bouncing from job to job, not being very impressive, failing his way upwards in the college football and the NFL, not a Kingsbury fan. They don't have a settled left tackle situation. They've been kind of auditioning guys throughout training camp. They do have some weapons around that offense, but some of the weapons are some really old guys.

You know, they have Zach Ertz. I don't know how much he's going to play. Austin Eckler, he's kind of on the downside of his career. Daniels is the guy who could find himself running for his life early in his career. I don't think Williams or Nix or even May are going to be in that situation. Are the commanders on

the right track in terms of the organization? They've got the new owner. I see that they're still debating the name. Could there be another name change? I know they're not going to go back to the old one, but could they're still debating the name. Could there be another name change? I know they're not going to go back to the old one, but could they move on from the Washington Commanders, say, once they get a new stadium and truly start over for real? I don't know.

This new stadium, Josh Harris has said, well, that's 2030. And I'm a little comfortable waiting a couple of years for that. But the name change thing keeps bubbling up from like the weirdest corners of the Internet. Like it's hard to actually find anyone on the record ever saying that. But there's always somebody saying that somebody said that. It's hard to say about the right track. With Dan Snyder, there was no track. That was a ditch.

That was a cliffside that Dan Snyder had the team on. So now they're operating as a professional organization that seems to have a lot of grown-ups in the room doing things. I say all that. Right now it's tricky because they're still in step one rebuilding mode. They did bring in dozens and dozens of free agents of various ages, including ready-to-retire type guys like Ertz and Bobby Wagner. And I think they had a good draft class. It's kind of a wait and see.

I would not be surprised if there's some growing pains along the way where it's like, yeah, Josh Harrison, the people he hired, Adam Peters, they know what they're doing. But this first group of guys that come in had a lot of guys that really weren't going to be long-term solutions, and they've got to figure things out before they get better. We're speaking to Mike Tan here, our NFL insider from Too Deep Zone here on the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. mike earlier in the show we were talking to seth emerson from

the athletic he had a piece up over the weekend uh football has never been more popular to watch but are there fewer players and our conversation dovetailed into high school football enrollment numbers participation numbers registrations all of that And I did notice in reading your mailbag over the weekend that you talked about the kickoff rule and then a spinoff as it pertains to safety at the high school level. I think you wrote that some of the most brutal injuries you've ever seen in the sport involved kickoffs at the high school level. Why were kickoff rules and the kickoff such a dangerous play,

especially at the lower levels of football? Well, if you talk to any old NFL player who ran special teams, they would talk about how they dreaded the kickoffs. And all these rules are based on the testimonials of the guys who were out there on the kickoff return units and the kick coverage units where guys are flying at each other at top speed and slamming into each other high-speed collisions. Now, take that down to the high school level where you don't know where that

kickoff is going to land. At the NFL level, it's going to head between the five-yard line and the end zone. It's going to be where the return is going to be. Everybody knows where to line up. You go to a high school field, that ball starts bouncing, and around the 30-yard line it's bouncing up and down. Here's some kid who's supposed to be a blocker. He's got to go catch that ball.

So he's got to go catch that ball. His eyes are on that ball. He's not really a good athlete in that way. And while he's doing that, the entire defense is running full speed in his direction. The blockers don't know where the kick went, so these guys are knifing past the blockers. You get ridiculous, ridiculous collisions at the prep level

and at the lower level, college level, on these plays. And, you know, I think what Emerson was saying is, yeah, there are less people playing high school college football now than there were 10, 20, 30 years ago for a variety of reasons. If you want to make the sport safer and maybe bring people who are nervous about it back to the high school field. Take those kickoffs, replace them with something, whether it's this or something else.

Don't put it in a position where your kid, who's just supposed to be a blocker, suddenly gets sandwiched between three defenders. So kickoff for the NFL season officially, Thursday, September 5th, 2024, Ravens and the Chiefs from Kansas City. I was thinking about that Baltimore team. And I, and I like to ask this question of pretty much any league at the start of the season, which team is under pressure, under the most pressure to win a championship in that season? Cause it's not cause like it could be the Ravens, right?

Like that could be a team where you're like, you know, it's time. It's time to do something in the postseason. Is there one that stands out more than any other for you? You know, it could be the Ravens, but if you look at the Ravens, no one's going to fire Harbaugh, no one's going to cut Lamar Jackson. The general manager situation is under control. If the Dallas Cowboys don't do it this year, Jerry's firing and getting rid of everything.

He's firing and getting rid of everything. He's firing, getting rid of everything. He's safe. His son is safe. Everyone else is in deep trouble. That's one of them. I also look at the Buffalo Bills and say, the expectations for the last three years have been high, and it looks like the window's closing a little bit, and you had to trade Stephon Diggs.

You can't just go out there and lose in the AFC championship again. Most teams, that's a win. We and lose in the AFC championship again. You know, most teams, that's a win. We made it to the AFC championship game. If the Bills get that far, that's a loss, and there's going to be some soul searching around that organization. How much pressure is on the Eagles this season? Oh, a lot. Absolutely a lot.

And you look at, and I wrote about it today at the Too Deep Zone, if you look at the changes they made, a lot of reason for optimism and a lot of aggressiveness there. And again, if you know the Eagles history over the last couple of years, if it doesn't work, Howie Roseman, the general manager, starts making trades. And he makes aggressive trades, wild trades. He doesn't care about your contract. He'll find ways of rewriting the roster.

And that's a distinct possibility. Nick Sirianni would be in jeopardy as well if that team doesn't, I would say if that team doesn't, you know, outperform the Cowboys and make another deep playoff run. It's the Jets and the 49ers. That's the first Monday night or September 9th. So not too far away now. Do we have any idea what Aaron Rodgers is going to look like? Have we seen him in action much?

Like he didn't play at all in the preseason. Are there even reports like how did he look at camp, assuming he showed up? Yeah, well, he showed up, and, like, I had one set of reports saying, you know, he's really looking gimpy out there. And then I heard another set of reports, and these are from, you know, writers on the sideline who kind of know what they're looking at. And it's like, no, no, no, he's fine. You know, he doesn't take unnecessary risks out there.

And that's what, you know, people are referring to. I cannot imagine that we're going to see a really mobile Aaron Rodgers. And Rodgers wasn't a scrambler, of course, but he would move around the pocket. He would move to the outside. He would buy time and extend throws. I have no idea what that's going to look like. And I think if I'm the Jets, I'm a little worried about what that looks like when you're going up against a team like the 49ers with Nick Bosa

with their defense in the very first game. The Cowboys open up against the Browns, and all the talk out of Dallas Cowboys camp and really the entire offseason is the future of Dak Prescott going in to the final year of his deal. By all accounts, he holds all of the leverage in these negotiations. I think he's got a no-f clause as well yeah 2025 uh it begs the question uh could this very well be the last year that dak prescott is the starting quarterback for the dallas cowboys it absolutely could be and i think unless we see or hear something in the next couple weeks uh it's it's

kind of like a super bowl or bust season for dak Prescott. I don't know if that makes sense. I don't know if that's fair. But I think that's what Jerry's doing. And one thing I would say, because like the Cowboys pessimism, we've been doing it for weeks and we've been on contract watch for C.D. Lamb and for Prescott and for Micah Parsons and for some of the other guys. It's great to be talking about the real games now because they're a few days away.

We can talk about the real games. Some of that you put a pin in it and say, how good is this Cowboys team right now? This Cowboys team right now looks really, really good. They are a Super Bowl contender. They're going to be definitely a playoff contender. So whatever happens with Prescott, we're going to really see what's happening in the next weeks and months.

It's time to kind of put 2025 and 2026 to bed and say what's happening right now with this team. Mike, what's the most interesting division for you? I'm not asking what the best one is necessarily, although it could be. What division do you look at and go, man, it's going to be interesting to see how that one plays out this year? I think it's the AFC North, and it is the best one as well. The odds makers say they have the best chance of having the most wins

and three teams or four teams making the playoffs. The Ravens, as you mentioned, not a lot of changes in the offseason, but they can be very enigmatic come the playoffs. You have Joe Barrow coming back from injury. Jamar Chase in this mega region contract-wise for the Bengals. We have the Browns, and we don't know. Deshaun Watson has arm soreness now. That's his latest malady, arm soreness.

And we don't know if they're going to have to go out there with Janus Winston and their defense to win some games. And we just talked about Russ and Justin Fields and the Steelers, and the Steelers are always competitive, no matter how weird the quarterback situation is. That is a hard division to to prognosticate that it could probably finish in uh 24 different draft orders I mean uh and and you know we wouldn't know which one to predict right now which will be the worst division the one where you're like I can't believe this team

is considered a division winner and gets like a home game oh you know it's the NFC Oh, you know it's the NFC South. You know it's the NFC South where we all penciled the Falcons and Kirk Cousins and it was like, yeah, they're going to win. But I'm not sure they will win because the Saints still have all those veterans and those veterans, as old as they are, still play well. And usually they go out there and play everybody tough and you still have a Buccaneers team that reached the playoffs last year. This is a bad division when we're talking about those teams because those teams would win like six or seven games

if they had to face the Bills and the Jets and the Dolphins twice a season. But they're there. They're not a mid-major. They're not Division II. They're out there, and they're competing for the Super Bowl as well. Mike, do you have any thoughts on the Seahawks? I know they're not top of the list in terms of the national conversation, but for me, there's two things that I'm going to be curious about. Number one is if the offensive line can hold up. I'm a little skeptical on that, but I'm

also just really curious to see what the defense looks like under Mike McDonald. People always say, oh, they brought in a defensive coach. Well, that's what Pete Carroll was, and they had a pretty good defense for a few years, but I don't know if the game passed Pete by, or they just didn't have the talent there, or whatever happened, but I'm going to be really curious to see what the defense looks like under Mike McDonald. I know he's not the defensive coordinator, but he essentially is. He's essentially the defensive coordinator. He's essentially is. He's essentially the defensive coordinator. He's bringing that system in.

And we haven't really seen a look at what it looks like. What we know is that there's good talent for that sort of three-man front thing that he prefers to run. I'm curious there. I'm as curious as you about the offensive line. I know we're waiting on some word on Abraham Lucas there, and we have not seen very much in the preseason. So I'm sorry, I don't have a lot of Seahawks thoughts, except that they're in that big mix. In the NFC, we do the 49ers and the Cowboys and the Eagles and the Lions, and then there's this other bunch,

and the Seahawks are kind of trapped in that other bunch, and I don't see a way of them getting out of it that doesn't involve the 49ers having to trade five guys or something like that. Mike, this was great, man. Thanks for taking the time to do it. We really appreciate it. Enjoy the rest of the week when we do this next week when we talk about football for real. Absolutely. Real football is great.

Enjoy the rest of your week. You too. Thanks, Mike. Mike Tanier, our NFL insider from the Too Deep Zone here on the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. I had a real fall moment on Saturday when I woke up, and it was a little chilly out, and then all of a sudden college football was on TV. And I know it was week zero, what they call week zero,

and the game was in, like, Ireland. Oh, the Notre Dame game? No, it wasn't Notre Dame. It was Georgia Tech and Florida State, and Georgia Tech upset Florida State, but they played it in Dublin. Right. And, you know, game day was there and and i'm like oh i just i just felt fall for the first time because normally i officially feel fall

on labor day weekend when all the cfl games are on like the traditional labor day games and i'm like interesting and i feel and i still feel that um sense of oh i got school on tuesday you know what mine is the u.s open that's always the signal that summer is over and the fall is here the tennis the tennis yeah that's all and that's coming this week u.s open really yeah it's yours yeah are you that into tennis no i do i always really did like the u.s open i remember when jimmy conners went on that crazy run when he was like 37 years old and yeah but michael chang weirdly enough i don't really pay attention to tennis outside of that i mean i know but just when it's on you're like oh it's

fall yeah right i know in wimbledon in the french but i couldn't even tell you what month those are in but for some reason it's like end of summer labor day tennis and you know what else it is too is they start the matches at like 10 o'clock at night. And they're playing until like 2 in the morning. So it's always like on at weird times. That must be hard for those players. What time is your game tonight? 11.

Yeah, I'll be playing tennis till 3 a.m. Super normal thing to do. Did you watch any of the Seahawks preseason game? No, I'm glad that you brought that up with Mike because... I watched the first possession with the starters on offense and it looked pretty good yeah it was fine and then they're all done right then they're all done but i mean gino his first pass was incomplete by a fair margin but then he made some plays and he made some nice throws and uh jackson smith and jigma made a nice catch um dk made a nice catch for a touchdown and gino made some plays but like I still watch that offensive line and you know when you watch an offensive line and you're just kind of like

it doesn't it looks like chaos there yeah that's what the offensive line looks like and Gino had to use his feet to make a on one player he found an open receiver and and yeah I don't know that's that for me is going to be uh probably the number one wild card for the seahawks and there's a lot of people talking about whether or not abluka is going to be able to like play football anymore so it was interesting i was thinking about this last night and i was like what's the what's the big picture conversation what's the one sort of overarching theme that you could have with the seahawks this year and by all accounts like if you're a seahawks fan you should be excited about what the future has in store.

And the Seattle times actually had an article out, summed it up quite nicely saying like Mike McDonald is now tasked with this like sort of Herculean thing where he's inheriting everything good, bad, and otherwise that Pete left behind, including legacy. And one thing thatol did was built a team with a core group of guys that were like easily identifiable and in certain instances

very likable and very like memorable right like legion of boom is probably the one that stands out the most on marshall yeah now like mcdonald was kind of tasked with that almost unfairly because it takes a lot to make that happen you have to get lucky you have to draft really well you have to have chemistry right and certain things have to break your way and sometimes as a coach you can't control that stuff and he's and it's weird because if you look at the current makeup of the team still a lot of the fingerprints from the previous regime on it including players and you gotta say well year one of the mike mcdonald era he's not really going to be able to say like this is my team like he's going to put the building

blocks in so in a way that's exciting sounds like he's running a lot tighter ship though than pete did yeah and i think that's by design oh yeah you know you go from you know the oldest coach in the nfl to the youngest there's going to be a lot of changes and let's face it there were some times where we wondered if some of those guys respected Pete. Yeah. And at the end of it, when you're watching Jamal Adams talk and you're watching DK Metcalf not only talk, but perform, you just wondered if Pete had that same level of respect.

Yeah. You know? Because there was always a line. Sure. Even with some of those Legion of Boom guys. I mean, they were individuals and they weren't afraid to speak out. But I always felt that Pete was in control of things. Well, I also think that early era Pete Carroll was a lot different than late era Pete Carroll.

Probably. I mean, I don't think he changed per se, but I think a lot of the things around him, the personnel, how the league worked. And let's be honest, they stopped, I think to a certain degree like their luck kind of ran out like russell wilson developing the way that he did at the beginning of the peak carol a lot of that was luck right a lot of it was good fortune and you know finding it was good drafting too it was a good draft pick sure but i mean you don't go in expecting that that pick is going to turn into an all-time franchise quarterback. So, okay, one final football note to pass along.

It is the CFL report brought to you by Securian Canada, the official life insurance partner of the CFL. We talked a lot already about the BC Lions, so I'll kind of gloss over their fifth straight loss. Real quick, week 12 CFL season now in the books. Argos win, slim 2019 win over Saskatchewan. So that puts them now. Walk off rouge.

We all love it. Six and four on the year, which in most years would put you atop the East division. But that's only good for third in the East because the East is the new West. The West is the new East. So speaking of the East, Montreal remains atop the East.

They went 21 to 17 over Edmonton. They're now nine and1 on the year, and they haven't lost a game on the road this year. They're a perfect 5-0 there. And then in the other game involving two teams with losing records on the year, the Bombers got their third win of the year, 26-23 over Hamilton.

Sorry about that, Laddie. I only mention this because with the win, Winnipeg won its third straight, and they are now tied with the Lions, who at one point were 5-1 and are now 5-6. So they're in a tie for second spot in the win. Winnipeg won its third straight and they are now tied with the Lions, who at one point were 5-1 and are now 5-6. So they're in a tie for second spot

in the West. And that was your Canadian Football Report brought to you by Security in Canada, the official life insurance partner of the CFL. Coming up on the

Halford & Brough Show, Brandon Batchelor is going to join the program and then at 8, a little more CFL talk with Bob the Moj Marjanovic. That's all coming up. We've got 90 minutes to go.

Don't go anywhere. You're listening to the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet 650. Bachelor, live from Rogers Arena, calling Canucks games. It is Brendan Bachelor, Bachelor, Bachelor. 734 on a Monday. Happy Monday, everybody. Halford, Braves, Sportsnet, 650. Halford and Braves of the Morning is brought to you by Vancouver Honda. Vancouver is premier destination for Honda customers. They have a friendly, knowledgeable staff that can help with anything

you're looking for, be it sales, financing, service, or parts. We are in hour two of the program. It's still August, but prior to going to break, you and I were talking about signs of

that looming fall. You had one over the weekend. It's not necessarily a bad thing by the way it's not like it's not i always get depressed when summer's over yeah yeah there's but you know there's a lot of good sports coming on i mean that's the thing my kids are going back to school that's nice there were a couple days during vacation where i was like i just want to watch some sports and then i i have one of those apps. It's like sports on TV today. Yeah. And it was like, I don't even know what kind of fighting that is. Some sort of mixed martial art, but I can't tell which one it is.

All right. I'll give it a go. Yeah. And then I watched it. It was depressing. So I am very excited to be back. We are very excited to be getting closer and closer to the fall. Joining us now to continue this conversation,

the play-by-play voice of your Vancouver Canucks here on Sportsnet 650, Brendan Batchelor joins us now on the Halford & Brough Show. Good morning, Batch. How are you? I'm doing well. Speaking of looking for sports to watch, I watched a few minutes of something called Pickle Pod on TV yesterday, which is like a mixture of pickleball

and squash that they play in like a glass pod, which I didn't know existed until yesterday. So that's the time of year we're at here in terms of sports. And luckily, hockey season's just around the corner. Yeah. And you also got to see Manchester United lose again. Yeah. But I mean, I'm used to that. That's part of the course. Is Brighton and Hove like the new Leicester? Do they have a chance to get into the Champions League? I think they do. And in terms of Manchester United in particular,

they're kind of like they're kryptonite a little bit. Like they're the one team that always has their number regardless of where they sit in the table. Although there's a lot of teams that have had Manchester United's number in the last few years. But they've got a poor record against Brighton, and we saw another disappointing loss for United at the weekend. But no, I've liked Brighton's program for a few years. I think some of the talent they have in their squad and the way that they play has allowed them to have more success than you might expect. And that certainly could, you know, play out again this season for sure.

All right, let's get to the Canucks talk, Batch. I'm sure you've been watching this soap opera, the latest soap opera around the Canucks. They've got good soap operas. Like when you're bringing in the goalie coach as one of the stars of the soap opera you know you got good writers behind the scenes what do you make of all this Ian Clark's departure combined with Thatcher Demko's injury status and I would probably add in the decision that the Canucks have to make in a year if they want to about whether or not to extend Thatcher Demko there's just all of a sudden a lot of uncertainty around the position yeah and you know it's it's hard to kind of parse through it

when we're not in the room because we don't know what went on in terms of the decision making process from Ian Clark's perspective to, you know, change roles. We also don't know details around Demco's summer and what has or hasn't happened and what procedures have or haven't happened and any sort of timeline. And it seems like, you know, from, from the reporting that's been done on it, that there isn't much of a timeline or there isn't a clear idea on when Demko could be back so when you have that uncertainty and then you've got you know changing

the position of goaltending coach although I think you know Marco Terenas is really highly thought of in goaltending circles and has been highly thought of within the organization for a number of years so you hope that that means that it can be a smooth transition. But, you know, nonetheless, it is a change. And, you know, these are things that will play out and we'll get more information on as we get closer to training camp and closer to the start of the season. But it is something, you know, in an ideal world, you wouldn't have all of this happening. You wouldn't have a change in goaltending coach in late August.

You wouldn't have uncertainty around your all-star starting goaltender heading into the season. But this is the Vancouver Canucks, and there's always something with this team. And it's, you know, they're never boring to follow. Let's put it that way. So this is just the latest edition of the soap opera, as you say. Do you think that it alters Rick Tockett's plans at all for training camp? Because before we knew this was all going down and when we assumed that

Thatcher Demko would be ready to roll for training camp, we thought that training camp would be focusing on the offensive side of things and maybe adding a little creativity, working on the power play, but at five on five, working on how to create a few more rush chances. Now there was always going to be this debate that you don't want to throw the baby out with the bath water and the Canucks weren't going to go into a run and gun scenario or anything, but I think Rick Tockett admitted at the end of the season that he needed to do a deep dive on how to create more scoring chances for the Canucks. But now with this uncertainty around the goaltending position,

maybe he's just going to be like, we're doing structure again. Well, yeah, and that's a tough balance that a head coach has to strike, where I think one of the main factors you could look at last year for the Canucks ultimately failing to advance beyond the second round of the playoffs is that that lack of offensive production. how consistent they were defensively. Now, just because you have an injury to your goaltender that, you know, we'll learn more about the severity of the injury, but, you know, you'll get Demko back at some point, you know, you would imagine in the fall.

So it's not like, you know, he's out for the year, you know, kind of situation where you might, you know, tear up all your plans and change everything. I think you probably stay the course. You know, Artur Shilov's played well enough in the playoffs last year that if you have to go on a run with him early in the year, you probably feel confident about that. Although, you know, understandably,

the organization also seems to be looking for some veteran help there as an extra level of security and insulation if indeed demco does miss some time here but um you know i i can't imagine that one injury even though it is to one of the most important players arguably the most important player on your team would drastically change the way that Rick Talkett wants to approach training camp. You know, I think with the way that he coaches and the way this team has played, there will always be a healthy dose of structure in the way that they operate. But a lot of the talk and a lot of the focus going into this training camp, in spite of

everything around goaltending, is going to be about offensive production, is going to be about getting more from the top of your lineup, from guys like Pedersen and who's going to play with him and what's the top six makeup going to look like. These are still all important storylines, regardless of whether Demko's ready to go to start the season or not. What I imagine they will hope, though, is that they can fall back on some of

that structure if they do have to miss him to help them through the early portion of the season while also finding a way to generate more offense so that they can bank some wins early like they did last year and not be caught chasing as we've seen from them in seasons past. Do you think Rick Tocco will be asked about his future with the Canucks? Because correct me if I'm wrong, he's only got a year left on his deal and then maybe a team option after that. Yeah. I'm not sure off the top of my head on the specifics of his deal,

but you know, this is an organization that wants to continue to take strides forward, wants to have success, wants to continue to grow. And, you know, I imagine that at some level, all of these questions will get asked. I mean, it's Vancouver, it's a it's a crazy hockey market. So yeah, I'm sure that'll that'll be a talking point at some point. But it's not one that would seriously concern me based on the success this team had last year, based on the trajectory that they're, you know,

sort of embarking on, and based on, you know, overall the work that Rick Talkett has done since arriving in Vancouver, you know, to get this team to game seven of the second round against the Stanley Cup runners-up without your starting goaltender, in hindsight, is a pretty incredible feat. And, you know, I imagine he and the whole group will want to build on that and try to continue to grow and have another great season.

But, you know, ultimately, how big some of these off-icelines are and i said this last year and it kind of applies to every single season is the off ice storylines are magnified when the team struggles and they're minimized when the team has success and you know you're not talking so much about demko being hurt if the team is winning you know in spite of whether he's in the lineup or not and you're not going to have as much conversation about Rick talk. It's future. If the team does well, except to say that if the team does well,

then there will be lots of campaigning and arguing that there should be an extension for him. And I guess we'll see how all of that plays out, but we know this is Vancouver. We know it's a crazy hockey market. We know all of these questions will get asked at some point during training camp or the preseason. How do you prep for training camp do you just show up and see what happens i mean

most of the vancouver sports media that's their plan just no crap but well i kind of have to mentally re-engage because i i sort of go away and and put hockey to the back of my mind for a large part of the summer so i have to come back and remind myself, oh, yeah, right. Like this is a talking point or this was, you know, one of the major storylines at the end of last season. And so that process will begin here in the next few weeks ahead of young stars and in training camp. But yeah, it's, you know, a lot of these storylines,

like we do see carry over from last season in terms of talking points. I'm sure there will be a lot of focus on, hey, you guys had a great start last year. How do you build on that or make sure that happens again in spite of whatever injury issues you might have you know pedersen and and his individual success and and how they set him up to recover from a disappointing finish the last season is going to be at the front of everyone's mind but ultimately after the first day or two what happens on the ice and what happens in the day-to-day takes over in terms of where the storylines and the talking points go and and that carries us through the entirety of the season. Batch, this was great, man.

Thanks for taking the time to do it. We really appreciate it. Enjoy the rest of the week. We'll do this again soon. Sounds good. Thank you. Thank you. Brendan Batchelor, play-by-play voice of the Vancouver Canucks here on the Halford & Brough Show on Sportsnet 650.

So Bill from Buffalo texted in, and it was kind of like a bragging text, but I'm not sure if he should be bragging about it. Okay. He wrote in, you may recall that I suggested trading Demko several months ago, always injured, and his next contract will be through the roof. It signs, your buddy Bill from Buffalo and PS. Welcome back, Jason. Thank you, Bill from Buffalo.

And I replied, and who would you start in goal? And he said, Seelov's. Like, it was the obvious one. And I replied, pretty risky, my friend. It is pretty risky. Like, I would not do that. Let's not get sucked in again, okay? Let's not get Spencer Martin'd, all right?

Let's not do it again. Artie Seelov played. It's a verb now? It's an action word? He got Spencer Martin'd. All right? Let's not do it again. Artie Seeloff played. It's a verb now. It's an action word. He got Spencer Martin'd. He played really well in the playoffs. And even though you might look at his numbers, and if you didn't watch that, you'd be like,

those numbers weren't terrific. He played really well considering the situation he was in. But he is not close to Demko in terms of how good he is. Now, the Canucks might have to make a decision at some, they will, next offseason they'll be like, all right, should we extend this guy or maybe keep him for one more year with the plan to lose him for nothing in free agency?

I mean, we'll go down that road and the Canucks will know more about Seelovs. But to throw Archer Seelavs into the starting role, I think would be reckless and dumb. Well, they just wouldn't do it. No, they wouldn't do it. They don't even entertain it. They wouldn't do that.

But Bill from Buffalo- Is entertaining it. Is entertaining it. And I was like, we haven't really seen that much from Seelavs. We just haven't. And there were some things, and Kevin Woodley was on our show last week talking about some of them. Like, he's had issues finding the puck at times.

And Laddie's going to join us now for the conversation. Yeah. That's the big thing. If you watch him over the course of a year, you get these highs and you get some lows as well. And if you want to be a regular in the NHL, you need to mitigate that. And I think throwing him into a starter's role next year is clearly not the answer.

Mark of the Office says, the Demko being unreliable is a legit convo. Oh, absolutely. It's unfortunate. Absolutely. I mean, I'm not sitting here saying, don't worry about Thatcher Demko. I am worried.

I'm just like, if you were going to trade him, I wouldn't be like see loves your guy I think it would be really unfair to seal offs because all of a sudden you're in this situation here's what happens with young players a lot of the time they get this adrenaline rush how many times do we see this at training camp or the preseason the beginning of the year these young guys come in they're super excited and then they have this adrenaline rush and they play well and you know they're going up against veterans that really aren't giving it 100 because they're like yeah i know i'm on the team i'm not gonna go and like kill myself here for to make the team like it's you're just you just don't you don't do

that you you kind of warm up and you start slow and then then then you're ready to roll. It's like Aaron Rodgers. He's like, I'm not even going to play any preseason games, right? Like that's how a lot of those guys, that's the attitude that they have. But, you know, it's always like, um, it's that line that Willie Desjardins had and say what you will about the job Willie did in coaching.

He was absolutely right about this when it comes to the NHL. A lot of the times the league gets hard. Yeah. You know, and you might have that adrenaline rush and things might be going well for a little bit. But then how do you deal with adversity? How do you deal with a situation where like, oh, you're the only guy now. There's no one behind you.

There's no Thatcher Demko there anymore. And not much of Ian Clarkark either who's worked a lot with arthur seal i was like i think that would be a ridiculous decision to make it wouldn't be made no it would not be made but the interesting point that mark at the office made is the conversation about demko being unreliable unreliable is maybe not the right word it almost feels too condemning but i get what he's saying. It's that there's a health concern now. He's injury prone.

Right. Some guys are. Some guys aren't. Some guys are very durable. And I'm sure there's discussion behind the scenes. At least that's what a lot of reporters have been hinting at about, you know, how much work should Demko be doing in terms of how many games he should be starting, and that's a decision for the head coach, but also how much work should he be doing with the goalie coach.

And one of the things that we all know about working with Ian Clark is it ain't easy. He's a demanding guy. Sure. And I think it sounds like there might have been, and this isn't a big deal by the way, like this is just like there might've been, and if you read some comments from Jim Rutherford,

he, he kind of said them jokingly, right? Like after Thatcher gets off the ice with, uh, with Ian Clark, he's, you know,

like he's already tired. Sure. Right. So maybe there were some discussions about that. And maybe the new guy, Marco Tarinius, is going to, I'm not going to say work not as hard with Thatcher Demko, but maybe be more aware of some of the physical risks that you engage when you work a guy really hard.

I mean, the most optimistic glass half full approach that I can take to this is everyone learned from last season is that the Canucks learned who they were and that their structure and their identity were solid enough that this year, and we've talked about this before on the show, this year they won't have to go out and be in prove-it mode as much as they were last year, which means not being so reliant on demco

understanding that we have the players surrounding him that will get us the requisite amount of they don't even need a goalie just put a cone or a shooter tutor or whatever or laddie i suppose or woodley or woodley but you you would hope from the organizational perspective um that everyone learned from that. We probably pushed and he probably put it, and he is Demko. Everyone probably pushed a little too much. And that's glass half full that if you take that step back

and you monitor things like excessive practice time or game load and management and how many that you've got a guy, because remember But the Canucks weren't wrong to push Demko to get him back for the playoffs. It's not a right and wrong thing. It's just learning from, like, some things went right last year.

A lot of things went right last year. He got nominated for a visit, but you know what didn't go right? The end of the year, where he was hurt. And I don't know if they even exist in a world where they think about do-overs, but would you have pushed him to play those last two games of the regular season before getting them in for the playoffs maybe maybe not but the idea is that you learn whatever you can from last year and the glass half full is and you implement those things moving forward which could also be a reason why they made this change uh at the goalie coach position it's like let's see if we can do things differently

maybe not necessarily in a right or wrong we're just like here was one approach it worked for us but there were some flaws here's another one moving forward the Demko thing has completely changed the way I thought I would be covering training camp and what we were talking about heading into training camp because it now seems like the lead story. It is. Whereas before it would have been like, all right, let's see if Pedersen has chemistry with DeBrusque and let's see if- Oh yeah, Petey. Yeah, right? Let's see if Hughes and Hronik are still going

to be together. Let's talk about the power play because it was dreadful in the playoffs. Now, I do think in hindsight, by the way, we have to credit the Edmonton Oilers because their PK was unbelievable. Yep. And not just do think in hindsight, by the way, we have to credit the Edmonton Oilers because their PK was unbelievable. Yep. And not just against the Canucks, right?

Their PK was better than their power play, which is crazy. Now, fortunately, they didn't win the Stanley Cup. But their PK was really good. But there's no question that the Canucks have to make some adjustments on the power play because they couldn't even get set it up. And there were a lot of issues, right?

There was Pedersen not playing well. There was no more Bo Horvat. And I think that was a massive adjustment for them. And then remember how they started the season and there was more movement and they were allowing the players to be creative and we were like, oh, this is good. This is great.

And then it stopped being great, but I don't know why. And then it got to the point where, remember that game against Pittsburgh where they actually split up the power play units? Miller was on one and Petey was on another. It got weird there for a bit. Well, when they talk about the league getting harder as the season goes along,

and you meant the Willie D quote about this league can get more difficult, I think that was played into it as well. Because at the beginning of the year, when the power play was cooking, it was like teams hadn't seen exactly what they had unfurled in terms of how they were going to go to the power play. It probably wasn't as much.

Teams adjust. Yeah, teams adjust, right? And it gets harder. They watch tape. Right, and it gets harder and harder to try and do the things that got you working at like a 35% clip in October, November. It's tougher when December and January hit, right?

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